December 19, 2022 • 39 mins
Actress, activist, and OG Mommy blogger Elisabeth Rohm joins the coven with Hilaria and Michelle.
While most recognize her from star-studded films like American Hustle and Joy, we know Elisabeth as a mom on a mission.
In this episode we discuss the highs and lows of sharing motherhood experiences on social media, as well as the pressure
many moms feel when it comes to the "Bottle vs. Breast" decision.
Elisabeth comes with empowering solutions and encouraging words, we're here to listen!
See omnystudio.com/listener for privacy information.
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Transcript
Episode Transcript
Available transcripts are automatically generated. Complete accuracy is not guaranteed.
Speaker 1 (00:01):
Which is anonymous with the Laria Baldwin and Michelle Campbell
Mason and I heart radio podcast Hey, which is welcome back.
I'm e Laria, and I'm Michelle. Hi. I'm Elizabeth Rome.
I am an actress and director and author. And I'm
so happy to be here to talk about the launch
(00:21):
of Emulay with Hilaria and Michelle. We're so happy to
have you now. I am always wanted to get right
into the whole mom conversation because I heard that you're
you were like an original mom blogger. Oh yeah, tell
me everything. I'm so much older than you, guys, And
yes I was. And it was really cool because um,
(00:43):
you know, I had a new child and babies, mom
and mom and babies, you know, with people was sort
of becoming and they reached out and asked me if
I would write a couple of blogs, and the blogs
took off, and I basically did it for three years.
In fact, it was such a joy. They're also mean,
these women, and also so judgmental and and yet so
(01:06):
wonderful and and you kind of just fault, you sort
of tumble head first into this dialogue with them, and
and I realized they were mostly critical of me when
I wouldn't like really be vulnerable, and so as I
the more truth, I began to tell of my own
personal experience, my own self doubts or this, and then
it really took off the blog and actually led to
(01:28):
me writing my book about um my journey with infertility
and having my child. So the whole blogging experience with
people was really it actually was a great joy for
several years, many years. Actually, I love I love the
the parenting section on people. So you you started a
good thing. I mean, so you say they were so
(01:50):
they were so mean and those are sort of people
who like critics and trolls. They would kind of like
come after you. Yeah, you know, it's really funny. I
think when it comes to parenting, it's I mean, I
don't know, I feel I feel it for sure. Around
the topic of fertility, people are so judgmental. And that's
why I understandably. You know, you you see not that
many people coming out of the closet about their fertility
(02:14):
journey because you know, who wants to be vulnerable about
this topic When you yourself feel like you know, you're
sort of failing at like you know what you should
be doing inherently it should be like your natural born
gift to be able to bring a child into the world.
And when it's not, it feels devastating and so personal,
maybe even humiliating, because you're like, why is my body
(02:35):
not cooperating this end? It feels you feel entirely powerless, right,
because bringing a child into the world is the greatest
thing of all, right, that's ultimate power. So UM, I
think that parents in general, mothers in general have I've found,
you know, tend to be very judgmental of one another
(02:56):
as opposed to supportive. UM, and that was unfortunate in it.
I guess ultimately we're all just sort of running scared
in life, and we all, um can come from a
fear based place. And the more truth I began to
tell with the blogs, I think I ingratiated myself with them,
and they felt I was more of a trusted voice
as opposed to just somebody to be criticized for my judgment. Well,
(03:19):
I think the more that we have these conversations and
and you know, I mean we all stand on each
other's shoulders, like you know, I feel that my working
is my working is whether my contributions or just my
presence in the mom community has a lot of been
standing on pure shoulders. And even if I didn't know
(03:39):
I was standing on your shoulders, your actions and your
openness made a step that therefore I could make the
next step forward. And we always have to be you know,
I mean here on which is anonymous. We're very focused
on history and how we're interconnected through so many different generations.
So you know, I want to say thank you. I
think something that you're saying right now also really really
(04:02):
touches me right now, which is that people thought that
it may and correct me if I'm wrong, But the
people are writing and saying you're not being open, and
I'm wondering if open equals just sharing the bad parts. Well,
that's really interesting that you hone in on that, because
misery loves company, and I think that is a terrible
trait um and and I think there is some truth
(04:25):
to that. When I first was writing the blogs, and
I was coming from this place of I've figured it
all out, and you know, look at me in my
perfect life. You know, I every I was booed off
the stage. But when I came with my questions and
I came with my I don't know, and I came
with myself doubt or my worry or things we might
perceive as the negative things or whatever. I would say,
(04:48):
they're the human things. But you're right. That is when
the audience started to get built, because I became a
voice that was to be trusted as opposed to I
don't relate to her and her perfect life or whatever
and anyway, and all those questions were true, and they
were part of my journey, and I didn't know how
to do some parenting stuff. I mean, it was really
(05:09):
a hard time for me because my mom died when
my child was almost two and I was in my thirties,
and and it was just a really scary time because
I didn't have this matriarch that and then my mom's
sister died two years later, so I lost too matriarchs
sort of in one fell swoop. And as I was
blogging as a you know, mom blogger, I was also
(05:31):
sort of lacking and having, you know, the women, the
matriarchs in my life had all passed away very suddenly.
So it was a crazy time. And I I'm glad
that I started to blog from the perspective of what's
my question, what's my insecurity. What don't I know versus
what I did think I knew, you know what I
felt I knew because that didn't reach anybody. We pulled
(05:53):
that a quote from from your book Baby Steps. When
women stopped talking, women stopped being heard. And I think
that next to everything we're trying to talk about here
so much so with motherhood and infertility, but in every
aspect of your life, because I see, you know, the
negative side of drolling, in which it's almost it's easy
to just you don't want to say anything, you don't
(06:14):
want to engage because it's it's sometimes a very fruitless conversation.
But at the same time, as to your quote, when
you stop talking, your voice goes away. So it's an
interesting juxtaposition of the two things. Did you engage with
it or did you just keep telling your story? I
never I never did. I never did. I just like
really always taken the high road. I'm not interested in
(06:36):
having commenting, you know, back, I just want to, you know,
make sure I always this is a prayer I always
say to myself before I do anything. Is it good?
Is it true? Is it necessary? And if I feel
like those boxes are checked, like I'm like full on
full steam ahead, but I don't need to comment on it.
And it's like, you know, with the Respect Project, for instance,
(06:58):
I have this talks Rea's um and I asked myself
that when I'm doing them, you know, is this good?
Is this true? Is it necessary? Does it put something
into the world that you know can make an impact?
And you you know, can say, oh, that sounds really
fru fru and whatever, like, who are you to decide
if it makes an impact? I just mean from my perspective,
do I feel like I'm putting something authentic in the
(07:20):
world that can help other people? Or is it about
my ego? You know? And if it feels clear, then
I think it's worth it, like you said, Michelle, because
people need to keep talking and we have to tell
the truth on behalf of each other, not just ourselves.
If I say I had fertility issues and here's what
I learned, I'm helping out future mothers and future families.
(07:43):
If I keep my secrets locked up, how am I helping,
you know, the reproductive generation sorted out? You know, Yeah,
we talked about that here because we're always talking about
kind of like grounding spiritual practice to help sometimes just
cope with all of these things, UM, and that to
me to want I always deal, which is kind of
a Buddhist philosophy of right thought, right action, right mind,
(08:04):
and just that all wrapped up with intention and intention
to serve others through your actions. And I think, being
that you start on so many levels, could you kind
of give us your background because obviously so many people
know you from Law and Order and you have this
amazing career with so many different facets, so I can
would be best coming from you? Yeah? Sure, I mean,
(08:26):
I'm I'm. I was born in Europe. I'm still a
German citizen. I was raised in New York City. UM.
I went to Sarah Lawrence College. My mother went to
Sarah Lawrence College. I pursued acting right out of school,
and did you know, I was very lucky to develop
a TV career. Then I left Law and Order and
I began to develop more of a movie career. I
(08:48):
did movies like American Hustle and Joy and started, you know,
a collaborative relationship UM as an actor with the director
David oh Russell. And now I'm directing. UM. I just
came back from New York directing Law and Order, which
was a really fun and you know, such a sweet return.
And I've directed several movies for lifetime. My most recent
(09:10):
one was the Last um Performance of Anne Hash. I
directed that in May, and I really went through a
really intense journey with her. And one thing I will
say in regards to telling our stories on behalf of
other people, she was very vocal about the abuse she
had experienced in childhood. She was a very brave soul,
(09:31):
and she was really committed to, you know, being on
a platform to use her voice to stop violence against women.
And that was why she wanted to do this movie.
And so it was sad, very very sad. You know
that her addiction and her issues, you know, you know
ran the day that faithful day and um, but I
(09:53):
know for her, her intention was to get out there
and tell her story and support this film, but really
to support other women and men who are experiencing abuse.
So so you know that that's what's happening with me currently.
About three years ago, I started a nonprofit called the
Respect Project, where I moderate conversations with a diverse panel
(10:18):
of people to punt essential topics of the time and
try to with respect find solutions by listening to each
other and respecting that we really are all different and
we're all going to come from a different point of view.
And recently I became a shareholder in a company that
I'm really excited to talk to you guys about called Emulay,
(10:39):
and it's the first ever baby bottle company to hit
the market that truly, truly completely with scientific data um
and our scientific advisory board confirming that it's the first
bottle to emulate you know, breastfeeding testing closes the gap
between breast and bottle feeding, which, as you know, Hilaria,
(11:01):
is very tricky. Yeah. Right now, my first daughter and
this my most recent daughter, they don't love bottles, and
so that is like I will be very curious to try,
and it's it's they will take one if they're starving,
but other than that, they're like nope. And then I'm thinking,
(11:22):
I'm storing up all this milk and you're not taking
a bottle. It's yeah, yeah, Well, there are a lot
of issues around bottle feeding. I mean also, you know,
one is emotional. You know, as a mom, you're like,
you don't want to do the bottle because you don't
want nipple confusion, right, I mean, you don't want them
to prefer the bottle and then not you and you
(11:44):
love breastfeeding, and so it becomes really an emotional journey.
So what's cool about emi lay is that, um, it's
an app. It takes you, you line it up to
your breast and it takes it with data points. It
basically I identifies the shape of your nipple, the texture
and the color and through scientific research, and it doesn't
(12:07):
take a photograph. It just creates data points. So you're
your you know, your privacy is protected and there is
no image floating around of your breast. It's just these
data points that basically you know how a nipple has texture,
it has hills and valleys and so forth. You know.
So that and also of course we're not all the
(12:27):
same skin, skin tone, you know, and so therefore you know,
having some white bottle if you're a dark skinned woman,
it just doesn't feel you don't feel represented. And so
through this app, it collects these data points and gives
you five options of color as as well as shape
and texture. The the nipple part of the bottle is
(12:50):
very thin and it's very elastic, so it feels almost
like the pull on an actual nipple, and inside the
nipple on the bottle, there are I wish I could
show it to you, but there are little strings. So
it actually feels like it has the texture of like
suckling on the nipple, that it has that texture in it. Yeah.
(13:13):
So there are many reasons why we say we're closing
the gap between breast and bottle feeding and making it
a more hopefully supporting women and their mental health and
their journey as new moms with in the feeding process,
right because you need rest, you have lots of babies,
and like you need to rest and you're pumping like
crazy and you don't want the bottle to become a
(13:34):
problem for you. Right. Well, it's also I mean you're
touching on something that we all know very well, which
is we've been put into I feel like we're starting
to come together in terms of the women in our group,
the breastfeeders and the bottle feeders, right, either d formula
or your breastfeeding, right, and and you know a breast
(13:55):
is best. They have all of that kind of thing.
And then the then people start to say, don't you
dared do that? Because you're making me feel bad about this,
and I don't necessarily I don't so it's so divided.
And I had a similar experience with you, but for
different reasons. Where um my first son, Rafa, who's my
(14:18):
second kid. He I got pregnant with Leo when Ruffle
was six months old, and my milk started to dry up.
And at this point, this is one of the reasons
that I got so obsessed with pumping, is because I
didn't have a storage back then, but a little bit
but not a lot. And I was thinking, oh my god,
I have to start to feed in formula ten months old.
(14:38):
I'm a failure because they because I kept on hearing
breast is best, I'm a failure. I was so upset
about it. It's my fault. I got pregnant during this.
I should have been more careful, and now it's my
poor son. And he was born a month early, so
I worried about him anyway, and I mean, he's totally fine,
but like you know, he it was something that I
(15:00):
felt so bad about it. And then I remember giving him,
after obsessing about which formula him the first thing formula,
and I was sure that something bad was going to
happen to him. And I looked at I was like,
it's the same thing and I was like, all that fear,
all of that like drama of this camp and this
camp of women, and it's the same thing. So that
(15:21):
and that doesn't mean that I didn't breastfeed my other kids. Well,
but in also to your point, Hilary, and I think
it's a really important one. It's like, stop all the hating.
It's like, who cares. I know women who don't want
to breastfeed, and you know what their phenomenal parents or
they didn't they just didn't want to. It's also very
the latching on process can sometimes not happen easily. That's
(15:43):
intense of your nipples. It's painful. Yeah, So that's another
thing about Emulae. If let's say you're not a match
with your baby and there's some latching on problems, you
could actually um with our app which launches um this sweek.
I think on the on the and at apple um,
(16:04):
you can identify another nipple shape that would work with
your baby. So we're creating possibilities for women as opposed
to judgments. And so you don't want to, you don't
want to breastfeed, use the ball great. You could actively
have it match your breast and feel like you're having
an intimate relationship with your child. Why should I feel
bad if I don't want a breastfeed. I can actually
(16:26):
create a bottle through Emula that's going to be as
close to my nipple and you know the experience of
breastfeeding as possible. And then moms like you, we're trying
to find balance and you know also you need to
get rest, and you know, we all know it's important
we have to take care of ourselves. There's that. So
we really think that Emula, our our hashtag is yours
(16:49):
come a truly because it's going to be the closest
match to you, whatever your journey is. We are available
for pre order and you can and then we're launching
March eighth, so we appreciate definitely. Well, well, well that's
I'll definitely be first in line for that. So we're
(17:18):
talking before before speaking with you about another baby idea,
which is multiple projects and you know something that Michelle
has many many babies in in in this way no, Michelle,
well this and I touched on this a little bit
when we were talking the other day and really, um,
how multifasketed everybody is in life, right and your knowledge
(17:39):
in creating this scientifically based alternative for the bottle is phenomenal,
but there's so much more tat than that, and one's
ability to reinvent and where many hats, without deluding their skills,
set their intention and their purpose in any of their
other careers. I think is a very important thing to
discuss because you are an actor and a director, and
(18:02):
obviously sometimes as someone who does wear a lot of hats,
I find us being judged for being almost, you know,
kind of distracted or scattered. And I know it doesn't
seem fair to call it a gendered experience, but I
know a lot of men with multiple investment companies and
I don't hear them getting the same flak. And I
(18:22):
wonder if that's something you've experienced as well, coming from
being acting and having these curts differ. Absolutely, I do
think it's uh. I think, you know, we don't get this.
We're not treated the same for sure, and I think
we have to be very careful and more you know, humble,
you know than men you know in general. Um, I
(18:44):
think that you know, if your triple threat, you know
you're going to meet some criticism in a way where
a guy wouldn't write, you know, they're celebrated for it.
Always a great actor, he's a great producer, he's a
great director, he's an entrepreneur, he's running a company, he's
just raised five hundred million dollars, he's gonna sort of
you know, and all these things are celebrated. But a woman,
it's like, you know, it's overly ambitious or you know, oh,
(19:07):
have you retired from acting now that you're directing? And
I'm like, no, I haven't. You know, so it's like,
why are you being asked these questions? I haven't like
thought about it beyond just feeling like that. That just
does feel distinctly female, that you would be criticized for
being um, you know, maybe too much or something in general,
(19:28):
maybe you're too much of an opinion or sorry. That
takes us back to right, like that takes us back
to like broader which theory and the word just demonizing
people because in the end, it's like you're threatening because
you are, You're annoying because you had too many things
to say or too many things that you were doing
or whatnot that you know, it was one of the
(19:50):
many buckets in which a which was put um. So
I also think something that I'd love to explore with
you is how procedural draw as life Law and Order
and being on a show like that for such a
long time, how they how they portray women, and how
how sometimes my perspective, as I don't know yours, they
(20:14):
have seemed quite replaceable and just not as developed in
some sub shows. Not saying Law in Order in particular,
I'm just saying other procedurals. And it's, uh, you always
know who the male stars, but the women seemed to cycle,
and I find that to be a bit jarring. Did
you have that perception at all? Or well, I will
just say, yeah, you can easily become like just a
(20:36):
bond girl kind of a person on on you know,
as as one of the a d s on Law
and Order. However, um, I sort of broke the mold.
I was like wanting to wear red lipstick and cut
my bangs and life was totally feminine. And I think
like I bumped up against a lot of fan criticism
because I was so different from you know what, But
(20:57):
eventually they embraced me. It was the world will embrace you,
you know, but you have to sort of take ownership
of that. So I think as an actor, that's your
job to build a character. Um. It was really fun
to go back to Law and Order with Odelia, who's
starring in the role that you know was my role
back then, and really focus on um being a director,
(21:23):
but a female director written. The screenplay was written by
two women, and it was about the Tinder swindler, so
it was about dating and you know, to really and
it was really focused on Odelia and Cameron's characters the most,
and it was so much fun for me to put,
you know, push them into the spotlight, let the guys
(21:44):
hang back a little bit because it was the women's
show and that's unique because Law and Order generally it's
Sam Waterston who's slaying dragons and so forth. Um, And
it was really Odelia and Cameron. They were really an
incredible um asset to the ace and their voice was
particularly strong. Their voices were particularly strong in that episode.
(22:06):
So I'm all about girl power and and wanting to
push women forward. UM, and you know, hoping, I hoping
I get it back. UM, you know, I'm not sure.
I feel women can be very critical and competitive unfortunately.
And why do you think that is? What do you
think is is our driving force? Behind that. I don't
(22:26):
really know, um, except for we're much more emotional and
we're you know, we're much more I feel like we're
we're very sensitive and tuned in, and so I don't know,
maybe it's really just are very um, possessive and protective
over what's hours, you know, as the Mama bear, and
(22:49):
so I don't know, maybe it comes from that place.
But you know, I have found for me, Michelle, you know,
most of my really good friends or women, so I
don't suffer from that. You know, that's not like in
my world as much, but you know, I mean we've
all seen it, right right, yeah, No, I mean that's
why that's why we started this space is and you know,
(23:10):
we we um for people who have listened to the
podcast a lot. We we bonded over a book called
Women's and Humanity to Women. And while I have amazing girlfriends,
you know, a lot of the the cruelty that I've
received in my life, and I think with most women,
has been from other women. But of course there's been
men along the way, Yes, absolutely, And I think sometimes
(23:32):
you know, you say that about the lipstick and the
bangs and stuff like that, and then eventually you were embraced.
I think that sometimes we have been given so many
rules growing up with well, that's just what you do.
And then we almost start pleasing each other, and even
though we all want out of the cage, we're pleasing
each other and holding each other back, whereas rather than
(23:55):
just being like, hey, let's pick the lock together and
all fly away free. Um, so we are kind of like, well,
but you're not supposed to do that. Well, that's not
what that's not what a police officer looks like. They
wouldn't be wearing that, and you're just trying to be like, well,
I don't even know what they were saying to you,
but that's my mind goes there, you know, right, well,
you know, I think, you know, look, we're all trying
so hard to get through life sometimes that we're unwilling
(24:18):
to pull the veil off. It's like it's not that
special and it's not that mysterious. We all actually have
so much more uncommon. And you know, I created the
Respect Project because I wanted to take that mask off,
you know, and maybe because I had been this mommy
blogger and I had really enjoyed um actually just telling
a narrative that was truthful on behalf of other people,
(24:41):
as opposed to portraying the legend. Like you add to
lunch and you bring your legend there, right, you put
on your manoliblogics or whatever and your lipstick and you're like,
here's my legend. My marriage is amazing, I have this,
I have that, you know, and you tell all the
good stuff. Right. You don't want to go there and
like dump all your bad stuff on people, so you
come with or good stuff, but that's part of your legend.
(25:02):
You're like, hey, nice to meet your legend, as opposed to,
you know, really telling your true story and being vulnerable.
And I think the idea of doing the Respect Project
was let's tell the truth on behalf of each other
in an honest, respectful way so that we can all
suffer less, you know, and you're not alone in this
(25:22):
journey in life. Hopefully you build that community within your
friends and your you know, loved ones and so forth,
but I think we can build that community also amongst others.
So I guess ultimately it's about like trying to make
your tone and the way you move out there publicly
um speak to other people and help help them feel
(25:45):
more peace about their own you know sort of journey.
So at least with that, I've tried to, you know,
make sure that you know, we're all sort of bringing
our bringing our best self forward. But like the truth
full part of ourself as most of the one that
knows all the answers, maybe the one that doesn't right. Well,
(26:05):
that goes back to even when you talked about when
you were writing for people right as soon as you
were more open, you know, spilling both sides of your story,
the light and the dark, that resistance falls away. And
I think that that's because we're so lucky to have
such a supportive group of female friends and then Hilaria
and I as well with one another. But those relationships
(26:26):
don't get forged without fruit, fansparency. You never really go
deeper or get to know someone if you don't show
the darker side. So back to the Respect project, do
you think, like, what's one of the most powerful conversations
you've had on there? Um? You know, I think about
like I did a very you know, powerful woman talk
(26:47):
with my friend Lisa Henson whose dad was Jim Henson,
and you know, and she's just like this powerhouse. And
our friend Robbie Runner was on it and so on. Sorry,
and um the Doberman is like in and out and
in and out. Sorry. Um. And what was really refreshing is,
(27:07):
you know, you're asking these powerful women to talk about like, well,
you know, what's your mantra? Like, what's the thing you know?
How do you do it? How do you wake up
every day? How are you gentle with yourself? How you know?
How are you strong? How do you how do you?
How are you a good leader? You're asking all these
questions to these incredibly powerful women. Um, you know, one
of them runs like a horse sanctuary. And again it
(27:29):
was like Lisa and Robbie and just really incredible panel
of successful, bright, you know, beautiful and just awesome, dynamic
women and they all just answered it honestly like I'm sorry,
I don't know what you mean. I'm still suffering and
trying to be a good leader. I don't know, I'm
not feeling really that great or I'm still suffering over
(27:52):
my parents death or what have you. And suddenly you're realizing,
you know, God, we're all just trying to get through
to you know, we're all just trying to get by.
It's not I'm not a negative person. I guess maybe
I'm not as positive as I think I am what
I really am as a realist, and I think that
you know, it takes a pound of flesh to get
(28:13):
through this life, and you know, we need to be
there for each other and build community around that as
opposed to tearing each other down, because everybody knows it's
far hard to be human being. It's also beautiful, and
i'd like we all want to skip through the meadow
like enjoy it. But you know, it's it's it's life
is life e And as David O. Russell like to say,
(28:36):
life is lifey and it's it's challenging, and I think,
you know, stopping there's no mystery about it, right, It's
just it's it's a very gritty, it's almost blue collar,
this life thing, you know. Talking about it from that perspective,
I think helps one another. So in other words, there's
nothing wrong with you if you don't feel so great,
or you don't feel clear or supported or whatever. You know,
(29:00):
welcome to the club. We're all feeling it. How can
we change that? And that's what the Respect Project was
has always been about for me. How how can we
change the narrative and just make it easier for each other. Absolutely,
and that's I mean, I I've listened to a lot
of your talks and that's hopefully what we're going to
be accomplishing here to do. But I think that's a
great point to make because no matter how successful we
(29:22):
are perceived as in any career, like we all suffer
from the Robbies to the people that are just starting
out in the business, like debilitating imposter syndrome every day,
right and really like overcoming that to be able to
have these conversations because we all feel it constantly, and
like I feel every time I sign on to do
this like okay, and I think I think it really
(29:44):
is showing the light and the dark because I find
we have to get to a point where we can
hold our girlfriends when they're going through something difficult and
be a safe space for it and don't be like, oh,
don't complain. And also if they're experiencing great, ay, be
happy for them. But it is a really fair point
(30:04):
at the same time to acknowledge that sometimes it's really
hard for us to see something when when it's what
we want. Um, I was, you know, not in that
headspace at this point I've definitely, you know, had that
of you know, envy, jealousy, you know, feeling that I'm
I'm not enough and people are more I mean definitely
in that situation it wasn't. But I think that is
(30:26):
what she said was a very very very common feeling
mm hmmm, and also takes us back to like, you know,
other women and the dynamic are they're not being enough
for everyone, like someone else having that experience taking away
from the ability to you to have it or to
feel comfortable with not being in the same life phase
(30:47):
or that moment. And um, you know, I think we
can see the same patterns applied to every very part
of social interaction because we're raised to think that if
someone else has it, we can't and so we're just
have to lead by the example and women that that
shared and just ignore the noise. Well, it's such a
it's such an important lesson to learn in life, you know,
(31:09):
to not covet what other people you guys are like
a coven, right, Like, let's not covet what other people
have and and realize that there's enough out there for everybody.
So just you know, stay in your lane, right like,
just you know, and I think that that creates more
mental health and well being with your who with yourself
and your you know, immediate family. And also so just
(31:33):
leave everybody else alone. They're not your concern, right, So,
like I do a lot. I think a lot of
ignoring over all the years of all the stuff, you
know what I mean, Like you choose, choose carefully, choose wisely.
You're not going to always make the right decision, but
you know, you try to and like stay in your lane.
Like you know, I try to stay in my lane
and just not concern myself with all the other stuff
(31:55):
that's out there. Oh she's fat, Oh is she did
chequate acting? Oh this so that or whatever. Oh that's
not good parenting. Oh you know, all the opinions, and
just try to just keep you know, sort of doing
the next right thing when you see the positive, the
(32:21):
positive in people, rather than focusing on the negative. And
I M my sound so like woo woo annoying. But
I find whenever I'm going through something difficult, if I
give and I put myself to something that feels meaningful,
um and they could be giving to yourself by the
way you can give to other people, you can give
to yourself. You can. It's just that the action of
(32:42):
doing something positive, it heals my mind, um and therefore
heals my body because the body has a reaction to
all of our thoughts. And I you know, I find
that the more and I've done it, but this, this
podcast has made me do it so much more on
us talking about creating this podcast, it's been over a
year now, where when I meet somebody, when I would,
(33:04):
you know, even like a snarky thought, I checked myself.
Which doesn't mean that they don't happen. Okay, Like I'm
not perfect. Okay, we're all human, but I try to
switch it to be positive and check that myself. That's
that's what I mean about, you know, not coveting other
people's stuff, actually putting out into the universe. The vibration
(33:25):
is is that there isn't enough for you because you're
too busy coveting everybody else. Don't worry about everybody else.
Why Because there's there's a chemical reaction to that. Like
what you're saying, which is if I if I show
kindness and love and I'm giving to others, I'm gonna
attract more of that back. Well, the same thing goes
with if I don't worry about Okay, they have this,
they have that, and I just focus on my lane
and like what I'm doing, what I'm putting out there.
(33:47):
Suddenly you begin to see all this good and you
know fortune, you know, in all the myriad ways coming
towards you, because you're just focused on what you're doing
and putting out there. You know, like energetically you're drawing
things to yourself in a positive way as opposed to
comparing yourself to others and having like you know, the
(34:10):
the syndrome of like wanting wanting what everybody else has. Yeah,
like takes it back to I mean, obviously what you
think about is your reality. So just really reframing every
thought and we are training ourselves better with our thoughts
of negativity to other people. But you know, just in
general our self talk, every little negative thing that pops
(34:31):
up and being able to squash it. But all of
that said, you brought up the coven and we are
coven and Liz and I and we're all in a
great little friend coven that I am so grateful for
and having you on. But we do this this piece
every week on the show called Coveting in the coven
in this Okay covening, Okay, kevining the coven you have,
(34:55):
like we just want to share the light with somebody
else and and um, so we you know, we present
something that we're not super connected to, and UM, just
talk about what's making us happy. So well, I'm coveting
m My stepmother and sister went to Maraval and they
went to a spa and like they spat out, and like,
(35:17):
I'm coveting um doing that. Like Robbie and I talked
about it all the time. We're like we need to
go the Four Seasons. I want to go for a
week and I want to like be pampered every single
day multiple times, like the Golden Door, and be fed
well and be exercised and you know all the stuff.
And I feel like that goes hand in hand with
(35:37):
some of the mother's stuff, woman stuff, because I'm older
than you guys, and I've gone through menopause already, and
it's like then you've got all this, you know, the
weight stuff is like legit and so I and also
I've been working a lot um this year directing, and
so I'm like, ready, I'm coveting other people having these
great spa experiences coverting self care right exactly, Michelle, what's yours?
(36:02):
I mean mine is always skincare because I'm addicted. So
this week I have Olivia Palermo's Like you can't see
it because this is audio, but it's really pretty and
it's like this spray that you put on before like
going out, and it just like makes your skin really
like Matt and professional. And I did it today even
(36:22):
though I have seven hundred ring lights on. It's not
like it would make a huge difference. But it's a
really cool product and the packaging is stunning. I love that,
all right. What I'm coveting is, um, everybody knows I
wear these shiny pants, and my shiny pants are Carbon
thirty eight, and I am that person who has like
(36:43):
twenty yoga pants and and the carbon thirty at the
Takara leggings the high Rise because I've had a hundred children,
so the high Rise um in. I don't I forget
what I think it's called Takara Shine, but I'm obsessed
with them. People always, people literally stop me on the street.
You're like, what are those leggings that you're constantly wearing?
And so then these are then people ask me, because
(37:03):
I wear them over my heels and if that's like
a different version, it's just because I'm short, so they
like reach over the heels. But it makes me feel cozy.
They're very cute and shiny. Never keeping bell, Liz, I'm
so happy that spied you filming in my old apartment,
um when you're correcting law on order, because that caused
(37:23):
us to reconnect directly instead of at a holiday party
or a birthday party. And it's been such a pleasure
having you on there. And I can't wait to see
what you're doing next and to potentially be working together
and all of the things. And congratulations on that. Thank
thank you guys, Thank you so much for supporting emulay.
And actually, if you want to know anything more about it,
(37:44):
you can go to the website. Um, but Hilaria, if
you want to talk more about emulay, because your wheelhouse,
you know, we can sort of sidebar about that. But
thank you guys. This was really fun. Thank you Liz,
Thank you so much. Bye. Well, So, I feel so
fortunate that we got Liz on not only to have
a friend, but someone who's so brilliant and always really
(38:07):
acting to serve others. I think it's like, you know,
that is my goal in life, is that like everything
you do like connect to a bigger picture of really
trying to support women. And Liz is a beautiful example
of that and just being a great I'm passionate human
being and like her work with the Special Olympics, her
extreme talent, like being one of the few female directors
on Law and Order, Like there's so many things that
(38:29):
she does that are so deeply impressive. So and now
helping helping everyone with breast feeding. So she's that she's
the epitome of of what we all strive to be
here on which is anonymous um. You know, and you know,
these are the conversations everybody that I really love to have,
of ones that we're all like, yeah, what we it
(38:49):
is and we get involved, you know, we what we
really want our community to be super involved and and
talk about all these things that we're thinking and we
are not necessarily saying or we're not saying enough. So
thank you all so much for joining us this week.
Don't forget to rate, review, subscribe, share your with your friends.
(39:10):
We love to grow our coven and um follow us
on Instagram and we'll see you next time, which is
thank you, which is h
Which is anonymous with the Laria Baldwin and Michelle Campbell
Mason and I heart radio podcast Hey, which is welcome back.
I'm e Laria, and I'm Michelle. Hi. I'm Elizabeth Rome.
I am an actress and director and author. And I'm
so happy to be here to talk about the launch
(00:21):
of Emulay with Hilaria and Michelle. We're so happy to
have you now. I am always wanted to get right
into the whole mom conversation because I heard that you're
you were like an original mom blogger. Oh yeah, tell
me everything. I'm so much older than you, guys, And
yes I was. And it was really cool because um,
(00:43):
you know, I had a new child and babies, mom
and mom and babies, you know, with people was sort
of becoming and they reached out and asked me if
I would write a couple of blogs, and the blogs
took off, and I basically did it for three years.
In fact, it was such a joy. They're also mean,
these women, and also so judgmental and and yet so
(01:06):
wonderful and and you kind of just fault, you sort
of tumble head first into this dialogue with them, and
and I realized they were mostly critical of me when
I wouldn't like really be vulnerable, and so as I
the more truth, I began to tell of my own
personal experience, my own self doubts or this, and then
it really took off the blog and actually led to
(01:28):
me writing my book about um my journey with infertility
and having my child. So the whole blogging experience with
people was really it actually was a great joy for
several years, many years. Actually, I love I love the
the parenting section on people. So you you started a
good thing. I mean, so you say they were so
(01:50):
they were so mean and those are sort of people
who like critics and trolls. They would kind of like
come after you. Yeah, you know, it's really funny. I
think when it comes to parenting, it's I mean, I
don't know, I feel I feel it for sure. Around
the topic of fertility, people are so judgmental. And that's
why I understandably. You know, you you see not that
many people coming out of the closet about their fertility
(02:14):
journey because you know, who wants to be vulnerable about
this topic When you yourself feel like you know, you're
sort of failing at like you know what you should
be doing inherently it should be like your natural born
gift to be able to bring a child into the world.
And when it's not, it feels devastating and so personal,
maybe even humiliating, because you're like, why is my body
(02:35):
not cooperating this end? It feels you feel entirely powerless, right,
because bringing a child into the world is the greatest
thing of all, right, that's ultimate power. So UM, I
think that parents in general, mothers in general have I've found,
you know, tend to be very judgmental of one another
(02:56):
as opposed to supportive. UM, and that was unfortunate in it.
I guess ultimately we're all just sort of running scared
in life, and we all, um can come from a
fear based place. And the more truth I began to
tell with the blogs, I think I ingratiated myself with them,
and they felt I was more of a trusted voice
as opposed to just somebody to be criticized for my judgment. Well,
(03:19):
I think the more that we have these conversations and
and you know, I mean we all stand on each
other's shoulders, like you know, I feel that my working
is my working is whether my contributions or just my
presence in the mom community has a lot of been
standing on pure shoulders. And even if I didn't know
(03:39):
I was standing on your shoulders, your actions and your
openness made a step that therefore I could make the
next step forward. And we always have to be you know,
I mean here on which is anonymous. We're very focused
on history and how we're interconnected through so many different generations.
So you know, I want to say thank you. I
think something that you're saying right now also really really
(04:02):
touches me right now, which is that people thought that
it may and correct me if I'm wrong, But the
people are writing and saying you're not being open, and
I'm wondering if open equals just sharing the bad parts. Well,
that's really interesting that you hone in on that, because
misery loves company, and I think that is a terrible
trait um and and I think there is some truth
(04:25):
to that. When I first was writing the blogs, and
I was coming from this place of I've figured it
all out, and you know, look at me in my
perfect life. You know, I every I was booed off
the stage. But when I came with my questions and
I came with my I don't know, and I came
with myself doubt or my worry or things we might
perceive as the negative things or whatever. I would say,
(04:48):
they're the human things. But you're right. That is when
the audience started to get built, because I became a
voice that was to be trusted as opposed to I
don't relate to her and her perfect life or whatever
and anyway, and all those questions were true, and they
were part of my journey, and I didn't know how
to do some parenting stuff. I mean, it was really
(05:09):
a hard time for me because my mom died when
my child was almost two and I was in my thirties,
and and it was just a really scary time because
I didn't have this matriarch that and then my mom's
sister died two years later, so I lost too matriarchs
sort of in one fell swoop. And as I was
blogging as a you know, mom blogger, I was also
(05:31):
sort of lacking and having, you know, the women, the
matriarchs in my life had all passed away very suddenly.
So it was a crazy time. And I I'm glad
that I started to blog from the perspective of what's
my question, what's my insecurity. What don't I know versus
what I did think I knew, you know what I
felt I knew because that didn't reach anybody. We pulled
(05:53):
that a quote from from your book Baby Steps. When
women stopped talking, women stopped being heard. And I think
that next to everything we're trying to talk about here
so much so with motherhood and infertility, but in every
aspect of your life, because I see, you know, the
negative side of drolling, in which it's almost it's easy
to just you don't want to say anything, you don't
(06:14):
want to engage because it's it's sometimes a very fruitless conversation.
But at the same time, as to your quote, when
you stop talking, your voice goes away. So it's an
interesting juxtaposition of the two things. Did you engage with
it or did you just keep telling your story? I
never I never did. I never did. I just like
really always taken the high road. I'm not interested in
(06:36):
having commenting, you know, back, I just want to, you know,
make sure I always this is a prayer I always
say to myself before I do anything. Is it good?
Is it true? Is it necessary? And if I feel
like those boxes are checked, like I'm like full on
full steam ahead, but I don't need to comment on it.
And it's like, you know, with the Respect Project, for instance,
(06:58):
I have this talks Rea's um and I asked myself
that when I'm doing them, you know, is this good?
Is this true? Is it necessary? Does it put something
into the world that you know can make an impact?
And you you know, can say, oh, that sounds really
fru fru and whatever, like, who are you to decide
if it makes an impact? I just mean from my perspective,
do I feel like I'm putting something authentic in the
(07:20):
world that can help other people? Or is it about
my ego? You know? And if it feels clear, then
I think it's worth it, like you said, Michelle, because
people need to keep talking and we have to tell
the truth on behalf of each other, not just ourselves.
If I say I had fertility issues and here's what
I learned, I'm helping out future mothers and future families.
(07:43):
If I keep my secrets locked up, how am I helping,
you know, the reproductive generation sorted out? You know, Yeah,
we talked about that here because we're always talking about
kind of like grounding spiritual practice to help sometimes just
cope with all of these things, UM, and that to
me to want I always deal, which is kind of
a Buddhist philosophy of right thought, right action, right mind,
(08:04):
and just that all wrapped up with intention and intention
to serve others through your actions. And I think, being
that you start on so many levels, could you kind
of give us your background because obviously so many people
know you from Law and Order and you have this
amazing career with so many different facets, so I can
would be best coming from you? Yeah? Sure, I mean,
(08:26):
I'm I'm. I was born in Europe. I'm still a
German citizen. I was raised in New York City. UM.
I went to Sarah Lawrence College. My mother went to
Sarah Lawrence College. I pursued acting right out of school,
and did you know, I was very lucky to develop
a TV career. Then I left Law and Order and
I began to develop more of a movie career. I
(08:48):
did movies like American Hustle and Joy and started, you know,
a collaborative relationship UM as an actor with the director
David oh Russell. And now I'm directing. UM. I just
came back from New York directing Law and Order, which
was a really fun and you know, such a sweet return.
And I've directed several movies for lifetime. My most recent
(09:10):
one was the Last um Performance of Anne Hash. I
directed that in May, and I really went through a
really intense journey with her. And one thing I will
say in regards to telling our stories on behalf of
other people, she was very vocal about the abuse she
had experienced in childhood. She was a very brave soul,
(09:31):
and she was really committed to, you know, being on
a platform to use her voice to stop violence against women.
And that was why she wanted to do this movie.
And so it was sad, very very sad. You know
that her addiction and her issues, you know, you know
ran the day that faithful day and um, but I
(09:53):
know for her, her intention was to get out there
and tell her story and support this film, but really
to support other women and men who are experiencing abuse.
So so you know that that's what's happening with me currently.
About three years ago, I started a nonprofit called the
Respect Project, where I moderate conversations with a diverse panel
(10:18):
of people to punt essential topics of the time and
try to with respect find solutions by listening to each
other and respecting that we really are all different and
we're all going to come from a different point of view.
And recently I became a shareholder in a company that
I'm really excited to talk to you guys about called Emulay,
(10:39):
and it's the first ever baby bottle company to hit
the market that truly, truly completely with scientific data um
and our scientific advisory board confirming that it's the first
bottle to emulate you know, breastfeeding testing closes the gap
between breast and bottle feeding, which, as you know, Hilaria,
(11:01):
is very tricky. Yeah. Right now, my first daughter and
this my most recent daughter, they don't love bottles, and
so that is like I will be very curious to try,
and it's it's they will take one if they're starving,
but other than that, they're like nope. And then I'm thinking,
(11:22):
I'm storing up all this milk and you're not taking
a bottle. It's yeah, yeah, Well, there are a lot
of issues around bottle feeding. I mean also, you know,
one is emotional. You know, as a mom, you're like,
you don't want to do the bottle because you don't
want nipple confusion, right, I mean, you don't want them
to prefer the bottle and then not you and you
(11:44):
love breastfeeding, and so it becomes really an emotional journey.
So what's cool about emi lay is that, um, it's
an app. It takes you, you line it up to
your breast and it takes it with data points. It
basically I identifies the shape of your nipple, the texture
and the color and through scientific research, and it doesn't
(12:07):
take a photograph. It just creates data points. So you're
your you know, your privacy is protected and there is
no image floating around of your breast. It's just these
data points that basically you know how a nipple has texture,
it has hills and valleys and so forth. You know.
So that and also of course we're not all the
(12:27):
same skin, skin tone, you know, and so therefore you know,
having some white bottle if you're a dark skinned woman,
it just doesn't feel you don't feel represented. And so
through this app, it collects these data points and gives
you five options of color as as well as shape
and texture. The the nipple part of the bottle is
(12:50):
very thin and it's very elastic, so it feels almost
like the pull on an actual nipple, and inside the
nipple on the bottle, there are I wish I could
show it to you, but there are little strings. So
it actually feels like it has the texture of like
suckling on the nipple, that it has that texture in it. Yeah.
(13:13):
So there are many reasons why we say we're closing
the gap between breast and bottle feeding and making it
a more hopefully supporting women and their mental health and
their journey as new moms with in the feeding process,
right because you need rest, you have lots of babies,
and like you need to rest and you're pumping like
crazy and you don't want the bottle to become a
(13:34):
problem for you. Right. Well, it's also I mean you're
touching on something that we all know very well, which
is we've been put into I feel like we're starting
to come together in terms of the women in our group,
the breastfeeders and the bottle feeders, right, either d formula
or your breastfeeding, right, and and you know a breast
(13:55):
is best. They have all of that kind of thing.
And then the then people start to say, don't you
dared do that? Because you're making me feel bad about this,
and I don't necessarily I don't so it's so divided.
And I had a similar experience with you, but for
different reasons. Where um my first son, Rafa, who's my
(14:18):
second kid. He I got pregnant with Leo when Ruffle
was six months old, and my milk started to dry up.
And at this point, this is one of the reasons
that I got so obsessed with pumping, is because I
didn't have a storage back then, but a little bit
but not a lot. And I was thinking, oh my god,
I have to start to feed in formula ten months old.
(14:38):
I'm a failure because they because I kept on hearing
breast is best, I'm a failure. I was so upset
about it. It's my fault. I got pregnant during this.
I should have been more careful, and now it's my
poor son. And he was born a month early, so
I worried about him anyway, and I mean, he's totally fine,
but like you know, he it was something that I
(15:00):
felt so bad about it. And then I remember giving him,
after obsessing about which formula him the first thing formula,
and I was sure that something bad was going to
happen to him. And I looked at I was like,
it's the same thing and I was like, all that fear,
all of that like drama of this camp and this
camp of women, and it's the same thing. So that
(15:21):
and that doesn't mean that I didn't breastfeed my other kids. Well,
but in also to your point, Hilary, and I think
it's a really important one. It's like, stop all the hating.
It's like, who cares. I know women who don't want
to breastfeed, and you know what their phenomenal parents or
they didn't they just didn't want to. It's also very
the latching on process can sometimes not happen easily. That's
(15:43):
intense of your nipples. It's painful. Yeah, So that's another
thing about Emulae. If let's say you're not a match
with your baby and there's some latching on problems, you
could actually um with our app which launches um this sweek.
I think on the on the and at apple um,
(16:04):
you can identify another nipple shape that would work with
your baby. So we're creating possibilities for women as opposed
to judgments. And so you don't want to, you don't
want to breastfeed, use the ball great. You could actively
have it match your breast and feel like you're having
an intimate relationship with your child. Why should I feel
bad if I don't want a breastfeed. I can actually
(16:26):
create a bottle through Emula that's going to be as
close to my nipple and you know the experience of
breastfeeding as possible. And then moms like you, we're trying
to find balance and you know also you need to
get rest, and you know, we all know it's important
we have to take care of ourselves. There's that. So
we really think that Emula, our our hashtag is yours
(16:49):
come a truly because it's going to be the closest
match to you, whatever your journey is. We are available
for pre order and you can and then we're launching
March eighth, so we appreciate definitely. Well, well, well that's
I'll definitely be first in line for that. So we're
(17:18):
talking before before speaking with you about another baby idea,
which is multiple projects and you know something that Michelle
has many many babies in in in this way no, Michelle,
well this and I touched on this a little bit
when we were talking the other day and really, um,
how multifasketed everybody is in life, right and your knowledge
(17:39):
in creating this scientifically based alternative for the bottle is phenomenal,
but there's so much more tat than that, and one's
ability to reinvent and where many hats, without deluding their skills,
set their intention and their purpose in any of their
other careers. I think is a very important thing to
discuss because you are an actor and a director, and
(18:02):
obviously sometimes as someone who does wear a lot of hats,
I find us being judged for being almost, you know,
kind of distracted or scattered. And I know it doesn't
seem fair to call it a gendered experience, but I
know a lot of men with multiple investment companies and
I don't hear them getting the same flak. And I
(18:22):
wonder if that's something you've experienced as well, coming from
being acting and having these curts differ. Absolutely, I do
think it's uh. I think, you know, we don't get this.
We're not treated the same for sure, and I think
we have to be very careful and more you know, humble,
you know than men you know in general. Um, I
(18:44):
think that you know, if your triple threat, you know
you're going to meet some criticism in a way where
a guy wouldn't write, you know, they're celebrated for it.
Always a great actor, he's a great producer, he's a
great director, he's an entrepreneur, he's running a company, he's
just raised five hundred million dollars, he's gonna sort of
you know, and all these things are celebrated. But a woman,
it's like, you know, it's overly ambitious or you know, oh,
(19:07):
have you retired from acting now that you're directing? And
I'm like, no, I haven't. You know, so it's like,
why are you being asked these questions? I haven't like
thought about it beyond just feeling like that. That just
does feel distinctly female, that you would be criticized for
being um, you know, maybe too much or something in general,
(19:28):
maybe you're too much of an opinion or sorry. That
takes us back to right, like that takes us back
to like broader which theory and the word just demonizing
people because in the end, it's like you're threatening because
you are, You're annoying because you had too many things
to say or too many things that you were doing
or whatnot that you know, it was one of the
(19:50):
many buckets in which a which was put um. So
I also think something that I'd love to explore with
you is how procedural draw as life Law and Order
and being on a show like that for such a
long time, how they how they portray women, and how
how sometimes my perspective, as I don't know yours, they
(20:14):
have seemed quite replaceable and just not as developed in
some sub shows. Not saying Law in Order in particular,
I'm just saying other procedurals. And it's, uh, you always
know who the male stars, but the women seemed to cycle,
and I find that to be a bit jarring. Did
you have that perception at all? Or well, I will
just say, yeah, you can easily become like just a
(20:36):
bond girl kind of a person on on you know,
as as one of the a d s on Law
and Order. However, um, I sort of broke the mold.
I was like wanting to wear red lipstick and cut
my bangs and life was totally feminine. And I think
like I bumped up against a lot of fan criticism
because I was so different from you know what, But
(20:57):
eventually they embraced me. It was the world will embrace you,
you know, but you have to sort of take ownership
of that. So I think as an actor, that's your
job to build a character. Um. It was really fun
to go back to Law and Order with Odelia, who's
starring in the role that you know was my role
back then, and really focus on um being a director,
(21:23):
but a female director written. The screenplay was written by
two women, and it was about the Tinder swindler, so
it was about dating and you know, to really and
it was really focused on Odelia and Cameron's characters the most,
and it was so much fun for me to put,
you know, push them into the spotlight, let the guys
(21:44):
hang back a little bit because it was the women's
show and that's unique because Law and Order generally it's
Sam Waterston who's slaying dragons and so forth. Um, And
it was really Odelia and Cameron. They were really an
incredible um asset to the ace and their voice was
particularly strong. Their voices were particularly strong in that episode.
(22:06):
So I'm all about girl power and and wanting to
push women forward. UM, and you know, hoping, I hoping
I get it back. UM, you know, I'm not sure.
I feel women can be very critical and competitive unfortunately.
And why do you think that is? What do you
think is is our driving force? Behind that. I don't
(22:26):
really know, um, except for we're much more emotional and
we're you know, we're much more I feel like we're
we're very sensitive and tuned in, and so I don't know,
maybe it's really just are very um, possessive and protective
over what's hours, you know, as the Mama bear, and
(22:49):
so I don't know, maybe it comes from that place.
But you know, I have found for me, Michelle, you know,
most of my really good friends or women, so I
don't suffer from that. You know, that's not like in
my world as much, but you know, I mean we've
all seen it, right right, yeah, No, I mean that's
why that's why we started this space is and you know,
(23:10):
we we um for people who have listened to the
podcast a lot. We we bonded over a book called
Women's and Humanity to Women. And while I have amazing girlfriends,
you know, a lot of the the cruelty that I've
received in my life, and I think with most women,
has been from other women. But of course there's been
men along the way, Yes, absolutely, And I think sometimes
(23:32):
you know, you say that about the lipstick and the
bangs and stuff like that, and then eventually you were embraced.
I think that sometimes we have been given so many
rules growing up with well, that's just what you do.
And then we almost start pleasing each other, and even
though we all want out of the cage, we're pleasing
each other and holding each other back, whereas rather than
(23:55):
just being like, hey, let's pick the lock together and
all fly away free. Um, so we are kind of like, well,
but you're not supposed to do that. Well, that's not
what that's not what a police officer looks like. They
wouldn't be wearing that, and you're just trying to be like, well,
I don't even know what they were saying to you,
but that's my mind goes there, you know, right, well,
you know, I think, you know, look, we're all trying
so hard to get through life sometimes that we're unwilling
(24:18):
to pull the veil off. It's like it's not that
special and it's not that mysterious. We all actually have
so much more uncommon. And you know, I created the
Respect Project because I wanted to take that mask off,
you know, and maybe because I had been this mommy
blogger and I had really enjoyed um actually just telling
a narrative that was truthful on behalf of other people,
(24:41):
as opposed to portraying the legend. Like you add to
lunch and you bring your legend there, right, you put
on your manoliblogics or whatever and your lipstick and you're like,
here's my legend. My marriage is amazing, I have this,
I have that, you know, and you tell all the
good stuff. Right. You don't want to go there and
like dump all your bad stuff on people, so you
come with or good stuff, but that's part of your legend.
(25:02):
You're like, hey, nice to meet your legend, as opposed to,
you know, really telling your true story and being vulnerable.
And I think the idea of doing the Respect Project
was let's tell the truth on behalf of each other
in an honest, respectful way so that we can all
suffer less, you know, and you're not alone in this
(25:22):
journey in life. Hopefully you build that community within your
friends and your you know, loved ones and so forth,
but I think we can build that community also amongst others.
So I guess ultimately it's about like trying to make
your tone and the way you move out there publicly
um speak to other people and help help them feel
(25:45):
more peace about their own you know sort of journey.
So at least with that, I've tried to, you know,
make sure that you know, we're all sort of bringing
our bringing our best self forward. But like the truth
full part of ourself as most of the one that
knows all the answers, maybe the one that doesn't right. Well,
(26:05):
that goes back to even when you talked about when
you were writing for people right as soon as you
were more open, you know, spilling both sides of your story,
the light and the dark, that resistance falls away. And
I think that that's because we're so lucky to have
such a supportive group of female friends and then Hilaria
and I as well with one another. But those relationships
(26:26):
don't get forged without fruit, fansparency. You never really go
deeper or get to know someone if you don't show
the darker side. So back to the Respect project, do
you think, like, what's one of the most powerful conversations
you've had on there? Um? You know, I think about
like I did a very you know, powerful woman talk
(26:47):
with my friend Lisa Henson whose dad was Jim Henson,
and you know, and she's just like this powerhouse. And
our friend Robbie Runner was on it and so on. Sorry,
and um the Doberman is like in and out and
in and out. Sorry. Um. And what was really refreshing is,
(27:07):
you know, you're asking these powerful women to talk about like, well,
you know, what's your mantra? Like, what's the thing you know?
How do you do it? How do you wake up
every day? How are you gentle with yourself? How you know?
How are you strong? How do you how do you?
How are you a good leader? You're asking all these
questions to these incredibly powerful women. Um, you know, one
of them runs like a horse sanctuary. And again it
(27:29):
was like Lisa and Robbie and just really incredible panel
of successful, bright, you know, beautiful and just awesome, dynamic
women and they all just answered it honestly like I'm sorry,
I don't know what you mean. I'm still suffering and
trying to be a good leader. I don't know, I'm
not feeling really that great or I'm still suffering over
(27:52):
my parents death or what have you. And suddenly you're realizing,
you know, God, we're all just trying to get through
to you know, we're all just trying to get by.
It's not I'm not a negative person. I guess maybe
I'm not as positive as I think I am what
I really am as a realist, and I think that
you know, it takes a pound of flesh to get
(28:13):
through this life, and you know, we need to be
there for each other and build community around that as
opposed to tearing each other down, because everybody knows it's
far hard to be human being. It's also beautiful, and
i'd like we all want to skip through the meadow
like enjoy it. But you know, it's it's it's life
is life e And as David O. Russell like to say,
(28:36):
life is lifey and it's it's challenging, and I think,
you know, stopping there's no mystery about it, right, It's
just it's it's a very gritty, it's almost blue collar,
this life thing, you know. Talking about it from that perspective,
I think helps one another. So in other words, there's
nothing wrong with you if you don't feel so great,
or you don't feel clear or supported or whatever. You know,
(29:00):
welcome to the club. We're all feeling it. How can
we change that? And that's what the Respect Project was
has always been about for me. How how can we
change the narrative and just make it easier for each other. Absolutely,
and that's I mean, I I've listened to a lot
of your talks and that's hopefully what we're going to
be accomplishing here to do. But I think that's a
great point to make because no matter how successful we
(29:22):
are perceived as in any career, like we all suffer
from the Robbies to the people that are just starting
out in the business, like debilitating imposter syndrome every day,
right and really like overcoming that to be able to
have these conversations because we all feel it constantly, and
like I feel every time I sign on to do
this like okay, and I think I think it really
(29:44):
is showing the light and the dark because I find
we have to get to a point where we can
hold our girlfriends when they're going through something difficult and
be a safe space for it and don't be like, oh,
don't complain. And also if they're experiencing great, ay, be
happy for them. But it is a really fair point
(30:04):
at the same time to acknowledge that sometimes it's really
hard for us to see something when when it's what
we want. Um, I was, you know, not in that
headspace at this point I've definitely, you know, had that
of you know, envy, jealousy, you know, feeling that I'm
I'm not enough and people are more I mean definitely
in that situation it wasn't. But I think that is
(30:26):
what she said was a very very very common feeling
mm hmmm, and also takes us back to like, you know,
other women and the dynamic are they're not being enough
for everyone, like someone else having that experience taking away
from the ability to you to have it or to
feel comfortable with not being in the same life phase
(30:47):
or that moment. And um, you know, I think we
can see the same patterns applied to every very part
of social interaction because we're raised to think that if
someone else has it, we can't and so we're just
have to lead by the example and women that that
shared and just ignore the noise. Well, it's such a
it's such an important lesson to learn in life, you know,
(31:09):
to not covet what other people you guys are like
a coven, right, Like, let's not covet what other people
have and and realize that there's enough out there for everybody.
So just you know, stay in your lane, right like,
just you know, and I think that that creates more
mental health and well being with your who with yourself
and your you know, immediate family. And also so just
(31:33):
leave everybody else alone. They're not your concern, right, So,
like I do a lot. I think a lot of
ignoring over all the years of all the stuff, you
know what I mean, Like you choose, choose carefully, choose wisely.
You're not going to always make the right decision, but
you know, you try to and like stay in your lane.
Like you know, I try to stay in my lane
and just not concern myself with all the other stuff
(31:55):
that's out there. Oh she's fat, Oh is she did
chequate acting? Oh this so that or whatever. Oh that's
not good parenting. Oh you know, all the opinions, and
just try to just keep you know, sort of doing
the next right thing when you see the positive, the
(32:21):
positive in people, rather than focusing on the negative. And
I M my sound so like woo woo annoying. But
I find whenever I'm going through something difficult, if I
give and I put myself to something that feels meaningful,
um and they could be giving to yourself by the
way you can give to other people, you can give
to yourself. You can. It's just that the action of
(32:42):
doing something positive, it heals my mind, um and therefore
heals my body because the body has a reaction to
all of our thoughts. And I you know, I find
that the more and I've done it, but this, this
podcast has made me do it so much more on
us talking about creating this podcast, it's been over a
year now, where when I meet somebody, when I would,
(33:04):
you know, even like a snarky thought, I checked myself.
Which doesn't mean that they don't happen. Okay, Like I'm
not perfect. Okay, we're all human, but I try to
switch it to be positive and check that myself. That's
that's what I mean about, you know, not coveting other
people's stuff, actually putting out into the universe. The vibration
(33:25):
is is that there isn't enough for you because you're
too busy coveting everybody else. Don't worry about everybody else.
Why Because there's there's a chemical reaction to that. Like
what you're saying, which is if I if I show
kindness and love and I'm giving to others, I'm gonna
attract more of that back. Well, the same thing goes
with if I don't worry about Okay, they have this,
they have that, and I just focus on my lane
and like what I'm doing, what I'm putting out there.
(33:47):
Suddenly you begin to see all this good and you
know fortune, you know, in all the myriad ways coming
towards you, because you're just focused on what you're doing
and putting out there. You know, like energetically you're drawing
things to yourself in a positive way as opposed to
comparing yourself to others and having like you know, the
(34:10):
the syndrome of like wanting wanting what everybody else has. Yeah,
like takes it back to I mean, obviously what you
think about is your reality. So just really reframing every
thought and we are training ourselves better with our thoughts
of negativity to other people. But you know, just in
general our self talk, every little negative thing that pops
(34:31):
up and being able to squash it. But all of
that said, you brought up the coven and we are
coven and Liz and I and we're all in a
great little friend coven that I am so grateful for
and having you on. But we do this this piece
every week on the show called Coveting in the coven
in this Okay covening, Okay, kevining the coven you have,
(34:55):
like we just want to share the light with somebody
else and and um, so we you know, we present
something that we're not super connected to, and UM, just
talk about what's making us happy. So well, I'm coveting
m My stepmother and sister went to Maraval and they
went to a spa and like they spat out, and like,
(35:17):
I'm coveting um doing that. Like Robbie and I talked
about it all the time. We're like we need to
go the Four Seasons. I want to go for a
week and I want to like be pampered every single
day multiple times, like the Golden Door, and be fed
well and be exercised and you know all the stuff.
And I feel like that goes hand in hand with
(35:37):
some of the mother's stuff, woman stuff, because I'm older
than you guys, and I've gone through menopause already, and
it's like then you've got all this, you know, the
weight stuff is like legit and so I and also
I've been working a lot um this year directing, and
so I'm like, ready, I'm coveting other people having these
great spa experiences coverting self care right exactly, Michelle, what's yours?
(36:02):
I mean mine is always skincare because I'm addicted. So
this week I have Olivia Palermo's Like you can't see
it because this is audio, but it's really pretty and
it's like this spray that you put on before like
going out, and it just like makes your skin really
like Matt and professional. And I did it today even
(36:22):
though I have seven hundred ring lights on. It's not
like it would make a huge difference. But it's a
really cool product and the packaging is stunning. I love that,
all right. What I'm coveting is, um, everybody knows I
wear these shiny pants, and my shiny pants are Carbon
thirty eight, and I am that person who has like
(36:43):
twenty yoga pants and and the carbon thirty at the
Takara leggings the high Rise because I've had a hundred children,
so the high Rise um in. I don't I forget
what I think it's called Takara Shine, but I'm obsessed
with them. People always, people literally stop me on the street.
You're like, what are those leggings that you're constantly wearing?
And so then these are then people ask me, because
(37:03):
I wear them over my heels and if that's like
a different version, it's just because I'm short, so they
like reach over the heels. But it makes me feel cozy.
They're very cute and shiny. Never keeping bell, Liz, I'm
so happy that spied you filming in my old apartment,
um when you're correcting law on order, because that caused
(37:23):
us to reconnect directly instead of at a holiday party
or a birthday party. And it's been such a pleasure
having you on there. And I can't wait to see
what you're doing next and to potentially be working together
and all of the things. And congratulations on that. Thank
thank you guys, Thank you so much for supporting emulay.
And actually, if you want to know anything more about it,
(37:44):
you can go to the website. Um, but Hilaria, if
you want to talk more about emulay, because your wheelhouse,
you know, we can sort of sidebar about that. But
thank you guys. This was really fun. Thank you Liz,
Thank you so much. Bye. Well, So, I feel so
fortunate that we got Liz on not only to have
a friend, but someone who's so brilliant and always really
(38:07):
acting to serve others. I think it's like, you know,
that is my goal in life, is that like everything
you do like connect to a bigger picture of really
trying to support women. And Liz is a beautiful example
of that and just being a great I'm passionate human
being and like her work with the Special Olympics, her
extreme talent, like being one of the few female directors
on Law and Order, Like there's so many things that
(38:29):
she does that are so deeply impressive. So and now
helping helping everyone with breast feeding. So she's that she's
the epitome of of what we all strive to be
here on which is anonymous um. You know, and you know,
these are the conversations everybody that I really love to have,
of ones that we're all like, yeah, what we it
(38:49):
is and we get involved, you know, we what we
really want our community to be super involved and and
talk about all these things that we're thinking and we
are not necessarily saying or we're not saying enough. So
thank you all so much for joining us this week.
Don't forget to rate, review, subscribe, share your with your friends.
(39:10):
We love to grow our coven and um follow us
on Instagram and we'll see you next time, which is
thank you, which is h
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