April 6, 2020 • 18 mins
Laura Nirider talks with Daniel Villegas about what it was like waiting for the jury to announce its verdict, how he prepared his children for the possibility he might not be coming home, and how it feels to finally focus on the future.
If you haven't heard his full story, it's right here in the podcast Feed. Just under this bonus episode. And if you've yet to watch Daniel's exoneration video, check it out on Instagram @wrongfulconviction. It's an incredible opportunity for all of us to bear witness to freedom
To donate, learn more, or get involved, go to: http://www.law.northwestern.edu/legalclinic/wrongfulconvictions/
Wrongful Conviction: False Confessions is a production of Lava for Good™ Podcasts in association with Signal Co No1.
Learn more and get involved at https://www.wrongfulconvictionpodcast.com
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Episode Transcript
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Speaker 1 (00:03):
Hey guys, it's Laura and I writer. Welcome to a
special bonus episode of Wrongful Conviction, False Confessions. We've gotten
an overwhelming response to this week's story about Daniel Viegas
and to the video we posted on Instagram and Twitter
showing the moment he learned the jury's verdict, so we're
releasing a bonus episode a conversation I had with Daniel
(00:25):
when I sat down with him in Austin, Texas two
months ago. You know, after everything we've been through together,
Daniel is not just a former client, he's a friend.
We talked about what it was like waiting for the
jury to announce its verdict, how he'd prepared his children
for the possibility he might not be coming home, and
how it feels to finally focus on the future. If
(00:49):
you haven't heard his full story, it's right here in
the podcast feed, just under this bonus episode. And if
you've yet to watch Daniel's exoneration video, check it out
on Instagram at un Full Conviction. It's an incredible opportunity
for all of us to bear witness to freedom. Daniel.
(01:14):
I'm so glad you're here with us today. Yes, I'm
glad to be here too, Thank you. Yeah, So tell
me what's going on for you right now in your life.
You've been out how many years? Six years? Now? Six years?
And tell me what you're doing with your life. At
this point in the stage in my life, it's you know,
we're not dealing with the hecticness of trial and all
that stuff. So now I'm focusing on what I'm going
to do for the future. So you were acquitted about
(01:35):
fourteen months ago, and so you've had that time to
finally move on from this case. That's dog you your
whole life exactly right. So what have you what have
you been doing? Are you working? Yes, I'm working with
Membella Contractors do their deliveries with Membella Contractors. So this
is John Benbella's Yeah, John Embella that helped me out
to Yeah, so you're working with John BenBella all these years.
(01:56):
You know, John Embella is like a family member. You know,
he didn't just help get me free, you know, he's
always been there for me, you know, like a backbone
and a counselor. You know, he's always been someone that
I can go to, you know, for anything, you know,
even if it's just to hang out. You've been a
counselor yourself too. You're telling me before we sat down,
y that you know, you're working at Membella Construction doing
deliveries and things for them, but you're also working with
(02:18):
a lot of the other guys. Yes, work there. Yeah,
we do construction, so it's a lot of you know,
you're gonna have a lot of comics and stuff there.
So a lot of these guys, you know, they got
problems and issues, and you know they look up to me.
So Membella hires people who used to be incarcerated. It's
a lot of folks there. And these guys, you know,
just like anybody getting out of prison, have their struggles,
(02:38):
you know, the situation when they get out. Stuff they
have to figure out, and they come to you exactly,
you know, and they come to me and ask me,
you know, from my advice, you know, because one of
the hardest things to transition into you know, what we
call the free world is you know, we have to
leave everything in prison behind us. And a lot of
times a lot of people can do that because you're
(02:59):
so used to you know, thinking and moving in that way,
so it's it's hard to put that behind you and
then live basically a whole different life. It's hard. I
mean I don't never, like I always tell her, but
I don't think it'll ever get away from us, That
it won't ever escape us and we'll always have it.
But the good thing is that as time progresses, you know,
(03:19):
as we grow, it's a lot easier to deal with.
Like before, you will get mad and it was so
hard for you to calm down. After a while, when
you're start getting mad, you'll start catching yourself going through
the stages of going from zero to a hundred, and
you can stop it before it goes to a hundred?
What do you tell yourself to stop it? Personally? Like
I always check myself. You know, it's not that bad,
(03:40):
you know, look at the bigger pitcher. Well, and you're not.
You're not dealing with it alone either, right, you got
John Midilla, but you've also got a wonderful family. Oh yes,
you know, like my wife too, I mean everyone for her.
I mean I don't know what I would have done, yeah,
she she When I first came out, you know, basically
a forty year old with a sixteen year old mentality,
you know, got locked that when I was a kid.
So I never really grew up. I wasn't never had
(04:03):
a structure. I never I never really came out and was,
you know, have my own family or anything. You know.
So coming down and and and dealing with society as
an adult was very, very very very hard, you know,
because it was so much I didn't know, and it
was so frustrating because everybody knows that like second nature,
and you feel like you're out of the loop. You
feel like an alien, like you got dropped into another planet.
(04:25):
Yeah right, you know. So Amanda has always been there too,
like she's always all right, you got your wallet, you
got your keys, you got yeah, those basic things of life.
But the stuff you forget right when you've been locked
away for so long exactly exactly Manda's watching mature. Hey man,
we all need somebody like Amanda exactly. Trust men. And
(04:46):
you have a beautiful You've got a beautiful family. You've
got kids. Yes, we have four kids. I have my
oldest daughter who's twenty five, Priscilla, and then my daughter
who's tan Kayla that's Amanda's daughter, and my stepdaughter, and
then we have two kids together. Once for Le's plicitly,
I know Jude and then um named after your dad.
(05:07):
You're named after my dad and a man of the brother.
And then we have the little little baby, the little rugrat.
We have the newest addition to the family. That's Emory Hope.
She's the hell Raiser. There you go, how old she's
going on two years old in a couple of months,
she's almost two. And but that's the little hill Raiser. Yeah,
(05:28):
that's great, that's great. So you know, what would you
tell your kids? You know, some of them are obviously
too young to talk about what happened, But what do
you tell your kids who are old enough to start
to think about what happened to you? What do you
tell them about what happened to you? You know, I
really don't try to focus so much of what happened
to me, but what they can do now to avoid that,
(05:50):
you know, like I always tried to tell them, you know,
like you know, when they get first, I'm always trying
to time. You know, it's not that bad. You know,
you're you're you're you're getting too caught up in this
little drama going on at school or whatever, and it's
not that tough. You know, it's not gonna be the
end of the world. And you know, I just try
to give them my perspective as far as you know,
thinking of how to deal with problems and stuff and
(06:13):
issues that come in their life. And that's mostly what
I focus on, because I feel like, you know, life
is ten percent of what happens, how you react to that.
I don't want to so much teach him about my
experience as much as teach him about how to deal
with your problems now from that experience. So let me
(06:39):
talk to you a little bit about what it was
like to to walk out of prison six years ago.
Right you were released un bond. H he released un bonds.
And you know, when I talked to my other clients
who have come out of prison, you know, people always
have stories about the little things, the things they didn't
realize they missed until they were back out and they
(07:00):
remembered things right that they've missed for so long. What
were those things for you? Those things you didn't realize
that you've been missing. Smell, you know, the way the
pavement of the street smell. You know, we take that
again after a while you're walking and you know, especially
people living downtown or whatever. You know, they don't even
smell the roses no more. And that's one of the
main things that a lot of us when we come out,
we notice these smells because we've been smelling nothing but
(07:22):
disinfected our whole life. So you know, you have actual nature,
and you have like payment, you have like you know,
the birds chipping, and then you have cars and you
have like horns, and you know, it's a whole different
orchestra of music, and so to speak, compared to prison,
where it's nothing but just a lot of yelling and screaming.
(07:43):
It's a beautiful orchestra of music, but hard to get
used to it first too. It's not so much it's
hard to get used to it, just it's hard to
concentrate on something now because you're so focused on on
on hearing every sound and everything. It's amazing, amazing, every
sound from the orchestra of life. I think that's gorgeous.
So I want to take you back for a moment too,
if I can um that moment fourteen months ago when
(08:06):
you were acquitted. It's your third trial right over the
course of twenty plus years, and this was this was
the moment of your vindication. Yes, um, it's an incredible
moment for us all to listen to. When you were
sitting there at in that courtroom. You know, Amanda and
(08:26):
your family members are right behind you, all your supporters
are right behind you. You were sitting there with your
lawyers and the judge read out the verdict. Can you
tell me what it was like waiting for that verdict?
That was excruciating pain that I would not wish on anybody.
That was terrible. But you know when I was going
through that, you know, when they was in the back
of side of the courthouse and I was like having
(08:49):
an intimate moment with my daughter, my youngest daughter. She
was at that time, she was about six months and uh,
you know, I really I didn't think, you know, I
know she understand what I'm saying. So I was just
praying that you know, that Parmarama experience happens during this
It's true where you live your whole life flashes before
you get out of your body and see yourself exactly.
(09:11):
So I figured, you know, if if anything, you know,
I'll talk to her and she will remember that on
that day when she you know, because I couldn't, you know,
there's no other she was too young, So I was
just explaining to her. You know, I'm just telling you, you
you know, baby, you know I'm not guilty, just saying
who I am. People gonna tell you stuff about me,
and I'm just like explaining things to that, you know
(09:32):
that I'm hoping one day she'll she'll kind of remember that,
she'll come back to that. And uh, I did this
to each of my kids. I set each of them
downs by themselves and I would explain things to him
and and that was my last one. And right when
I was doing that, they tell us that the verdict
is on. We got the verdict, and I'm like, holy crap.
So I were running into the courthouse. And then the thoughts,
(09:55):
like I said, since I was having that intimate moment
where her, you know, one of the thoughts that came
into my mind that were more prevailing than anyone. I
was thinking to myself, and did we make the right decision,
you know, not accepting the offer plea? And I was like,
I know in my heart, you know that we made
the right decision, and I know Amanda stands by me
on that, but I was saying, did we actually do
(10:15):
it the right decision for our kids? You know, even
if you know you're right, you know, are we making
a right decision? Because this is my kids right exactly.
And if you look at the video, you'll see me
and my Lord's talking and you see me shaking me
and that's when I was telling them, you know, I'm pleading, man,
tell me we made the right decision here, that we
made the right decision not only for on me, but
(10:35):
did we make the right decision for my children? You know?
Did we fight this on on prior? Did we fight
this for justice? You know, you you second guess everything
at that moment, you know, and then you second guess,
you know everything that trials coming through your head and
you're like, man, we should have done this, We should
have done that. You know that was coming to your thoughts,
and that's killing you too. So you got all these
it's like a million thoughts just blazing down on you.
(10:59):
And then you wanted to judge your hep and tell
you not guilty and guilty and you wait for the
jury to come in an order and you're just sitting
there dying. I mean, so you're sitting there in that moment,
waiting for the verdict to come back, and you're thinking
back on the offered play on that decision, which which
Amanda guided you, through which Jason Baldwin from The West
(11:19):
Member three guided you threat um and then the verdict
comes back, yes, not guilty exactly. And it was not
before he said not guilty. I already knew when he said, um,
he said it was a form B, right, and I
already had had the pizza paper, you know, like Form
A was guilty, Form B was not guilty. You know.
(11:40):
So when I had the paper in front of me
and then I heard form B, I right away looked
at the pizza paper. I said, oh, it's not guilty.
But it was just a couple of seconds, like you're saying,
you know, and that's when I just it was like
I was, like I said, I was so tense. I
mean that time period, that whole year was probably the
worst year in my life. And uh, I was so
tense that when that verdict not guilty happened, it was
(12:01):
just like you know, like a ball full of rubber
rubber bands. It was like you just take one in it,
I'll just fall apart. And that's exactly what happened, you know,
that not guilty just pulled that one string and everything
fell apart. And I just hit the ground. I hit
the table with my hand. It didn't even hurt Tilly here.
On the next thing, I was just so you know,
out of there. Yeah, yeah, And you got out of there,
(12:22):
didn't you right away? As soon as you could. Never
to return. We left too fat that Like, as I
was telling me and a man that we had all
this little speech that we're going to do afterwards, you know,
to the news or whatever. And when that man said,
the judge said, you know what, not guilty. You are
free to go there. You are no longer under any
(12:42):
conditions of this court anymore. Yeah, that whole speech that
we had, it was out my head. I totally forgot.
I ran out that courtroom. I was like, I grabbed
a man. I was like, let's go and get me
out of here. But you are actually going to be
in the courtroom again, I think in a couple of days. Right,
what's your plan for when you're here in Austin. I'm
here ofting. I want to go to the capitol, and
(13:03):
I want to go see the courts of criminal Appeals
and I would love to see if I can talk
to one of the judges. So you want to go
to the Texas Court of Criminal Appeals. This is the
courts that affirmed your grant of a new trial, that
affirmed your conviction being thrown out. Um, and you want
to just go in that building. Tell me why. One
of the main things I want to go because when
we're going to courts criminal peal, they're telling us about
the judges and they were saying that we have to
(13:24):
get a majority rule, and they were saying three of
the judges were not going to go for us. They
never go for the inmate. And they were like, so
don't even worry about those three. We know we're not
going to get them. But at the end of the day,
you know, we had an anonymous vote. Even the judges
that they said we're not going to vote voted, and
that was like the first time it happened in Texas history.
So that's what I was like, you know, maybe I
(13:45):
won't be able to talk to judge, but I would
love to, you know, ask you know what what made
this case so different that all you are in agreement
with it? What was so special that shot to your faith?
You know? What was it? Do you think it will
still be worthwhile to go there even if you can't
talk to the judges just to be in the building.
What would what would it be just to be in
the building, just to be in the building if they
would let me walk into the when where they actually
make decisions. I would you like to just sit there,
(14:06):
you know, and just I think this is where they
made decisions on letting you go. Yeah, you know, it
would be awesome. This is where it all turned around. Yeah,
this is the place I used to curse that every
every Wednesday, waiting for the answer. Daniel, I just want
(14:35):
to ask you, you know, what is what's your what
are your hopes for the future that I'm not totally
certain about that right now, I haven't figured out where
my direction is actually going to go. Because one thing
I've I've realized about life is that I have my plans,
but the universe has its own plans, and somehow another
I always end up doing what the universe wants me
(14:56):
to do rather than what I want to do. So
I'm trying to figure out my nick and right now,
you know, meanwhile, I'm just trying to do as much
I can to help you know, other people try to
figure out what my my true calling is going to be. Well,
one day at a time is pretty good right now.
Thank you so much for sitting down with me. It's
been an absolute pleasure. Daniel Viegas, thank you, thank you.
(15:19):
Oh and also like thank you for helping me on
my appeal. I mean, Laura, she's on my case. It's
just so it's it's so bad as it's so awesome
to have all you guys with us. But you know,
you guys never get the things, you know, and that's
one thing that you know, I want to really focus,
you know, I want to really you know, put out
there two about our lawyers. And you know that that
help us because you gotta understand that normally with a
(15:41):
client and and the lawyer situation goes once the court
is over, you're not going to see that lawyer hardly
ever again, you know. And in this situation with a
round for conviction, we are so close to our lawyer.
We're so close to you guys. You guys become a family.
You know that even when we come out, you don't
give up on It's not like okay, well we got
your free by I have a good life. You guys
are they're helping us thought. You guys are still there
(16:02):
making sure that you know, we're we're we're being entered
back into society, but successfully, you know, and that you
guys need to get them. Thanks for that, because I
don't feel like you guys get the things for that.
I don't feel like the networks get the things that
the innocent networks, that all these different organizations that work
so hard to get us free, because when we get free,
the game is not over yet. We still it's still
(16:24):
a whole new game. Now. Now the game is how
do we get this man who's been locked up for
twenty years in prison? Then nothing else but how to
be an amen? How do we get him to become
a productive member in society. And that's what you guys
do too. Well, that's what you've done. So congratulations on that.
All right. We believe in you, you believe in us.
(16:44):
Thanks so much, Daniel, Thanks for listening to the special
bonus episode of Wrongful Conviction, False Confessions. You can listen
to Daniel's story right here in this feed and come
back on Wednesday to hear our next door read about
a California man who was wrongfully convicted of terrorism based
(17:04):
on a confession about and I kid you not pole
vaulting Ninja Turtles. Wrongful Conviction, False Confessions is a production
of Lava for Good Podcasts in association with Signal Company
Number One and PRX Special thanks to our executive producer
(17:26):
Jason Flom and the team at Signal Company Number One,
Executive producer Kevin Wardenes, Senior Producer and Pope, and additional
production and editing by Connor Hall. Special thanks to jog
Hammer for additional script editing and for wrangling and writing
like a madwoman. Our music was composed by j Ralph.
(17:48):
You can follow me on Instagram or Twitter at Laura
ni Writer, and you can follow Steve on Instagram at
Steven Drizzen or on Twitter at s Risen. For more
information on the show, visit Wrongful Conviction podcast dot com
and be sure to follow the show on Instagram at
Wrongful Conviction, on Facebook at Wrongful Conviction Podcast, and on
(18:09):
Twitter at wrong Conviction m
Hey guys, it's Laura and I writer. Welcome to a
special bonus episode of Wrongful Conviction, False Confessions. We've gotten
an overwhelming response to this week's story about Daniel Viegas
and to the video we posted on Instagram and Twitter
showing the moment he learned the jury's verdict, so we're
releasing a bonus episode a conversation I had with Daniel
(00:25):
when I sat down with him in Austin, Texas two
months ago. You know, after everything we've been through together,
Daniel is not just a former client, he's a friend.
We talked about what it was like waiting for the
jury to announce its verdict, how he'd prepared his children
for the possibility he might not be coming home, and
how it feels to finally focus on the future. If
(00:49):
you haven't heard his full story, it's right here in
the podcast feed, just under this bonus episode. And if
you've yet to watch Daniel's exoneration video, check it out
on Instagram at un Full Conviction. It's an incredible opportunity
for all of us to bear witness to freedom. Daniel.
(01:14):
I'm so glad you're here with us today. Yes, I'm
glad to be here too, Thank you. Yeah, So tell
me what's going on for you right now in your life.
You've been out how many years? Six years? Now? Six years?
And tell me what you're doing with your life. At
this point in the stage in my life, it's you know,
we're not dealing with the hecticness of trial and all
that stuff. So now I'm focusing on what I'm going
to do for the future. So you were acquitted about
(01:35):
fourteen months ago, and so you've had that time to
finally move on from this case. That's dog you your
whole life exactly right. So what have you what have
you been doing? Are you working? Yes, I'm working with
Membella Contractors do their deliveries with Membella Contractors. So this
is John Benbella's Yeah, John Embella that helped me out
to Yeah, so you're working with John BenBella all these years.
(01:56):
You know, John Embella is like a family member. You know,
he didn't just help get me free, you know, he's
always been there for me, you know, like a backbone
and a counselor. You know, he's always been someone that
I can go to, you know, for anything, you know,
even if it's just to hang out. You've been a
counselor yourself too. You're telling me before we sat down,
y that you know, you're working at Membella Construction doing
deliveries and things for them, but you're also working with
(02:18):
a lot of the other guys. Yes, work there. Yeah,
we do construction, so it's a lot of you know,
you're gonna have a lot of comics and stuff there.
So a lot of these guys, you know, they got
problems and issues, and you know they look up to me.
So Membella hires people who used to be incarcerated. It's
a lot of folks there. And these guys, you know,
just like anybody getting out of prison, have their struggles,
(02:38):
you know, the situation when they get out. Stuff they
have to figure out, and they come to you exactly,
you know, and they come to me and ask me,
you know, from my advice, you know, because one of
the hardest things to transition into you know, what we
call the free world is you know, we have to
leave everything in prison behind us. And a lot of
times a lot of people can do that because you're
(02:59):
so used to you know, thinking and moving in that way,
so it's it's hard to put that behind you and
then live basically a whole different life. It's hard. I
mean I don't never, like I always tell her, but
I don't think it'll ever get away from us, That
it won't ever escape us and we'll always have it.
But the good thing is that as time progresses, you know,
(03:19):
as we grow, it's a lot easier to deal with.
Like before, you will get mad and it was so
hard for you to calm down. After a while, when
you're start getting mad, you'll start catching yourself going through
the stages of going from zero to a hundred, and
you can stop it before it goes to a hundred?
What do you tell yourself to stop it? Personally? Like
I always check myself. You know, it's not that bad,
(03:40):
you know, look at the bigger pitcher. Well, and you're not.
You're not dealing with it alone either, right, you got
John Midilla, but you've also got a wonderful family. Oh yes,
you know, like my wife too, I mean everyone for her.
I mean I don't know what I would have done, yeah,
she she When I first came out, you know, basically
a forty year old with a sixteen year old mentality,
you know, got locked that when I was a kid.
So I never really grew up. I wasn't never had
(04:03):
a structure. I never I never really came out and was,
you know, have my own family or anything. You know.
So coming down and and and dealing with society as
an adult was very, very very very hard, you know,
because it was so much I didn't know, and it
was so frustrating because everybody knows that like second nature,
and you feel like you're out of the loop. You
feel like an alien, like you got dropped into another planet.
(04:25):
Yeah right, you know. So Amanda has always been there too,
like she's always all right, you got your wallet, you
got your keys, you got yeah, those basic things of life.
But the stuff you forget right when you've been locked
away for so long exactly exactly Manda's watching mature. Hey man,
we all need somebody like Amanda exactly. Trust men. And
(04:46):
you have a beautiful You've got a beautiful family. You've
got kids. Yes, we have four kids. I have my
oldest daughter who's twenty five, Priscilla, and then my daughter
who's tan Kayla that's Amanda's daughter, and my stepdaughter, and
then we have two kids together. Once for Le's plicitly,
I know Jude and then um named after your dad.
(05:07):
You're named after my dad and a man of the brother.
And then we have the little little baby, the little rugrat.
We have the newest addition to the family. That's Emory Hope.
She's the hell Raiser. There you go, how old she's
going on two years old in a couple of months,
she's almost two. And but that's the little hill Raiser. Yeah,
(05:28):
that's great, that's great. So you know, what would you
tell your kids? You know, some of them are obviously
too young to talk about what happened, But what do
you tell your kids who are old enough to start
to think about what happened to you? What do you
tell them about what happened to you? You know, I
really don't try to focus so much of what happened
to me, but what they can do now to avoid that,
(05:50):
you know, like I always tried to tell them, you know,
like you know, when they get first, I'm always trying
to time. You know, it's not that bad. You know,
you're you're you're you're getting too caught up in this
little drama going on at school or whatever, and it's
not that tough. You know, it's not gonna be the
end of the world. And you know, I just try
to give them my perspective as far as you know,
thinking of how to deal with problems and stuff and
(06:13):
issues that come in their life. And that's mostly what
I focus on, because I feel like, you know, life
is ten percent of what happens, how you react to that.
I don't want to so much teach him about my
experience as much as teach him about how to deal
with your problems now from that experience. So let me
(06:39):
talk to you a little bit about what it was
like to to walk out of prison six years ago.
Right you were released un bond. H he released un bonds.
And you know, when I talked to my other clients
who have come out of prison, you know, people always
have stories about the little things, the things they didn't
realize they missed until they were back out and they
(07:00):
remembered things right that they've missed for so long. What
were those things for you? Those things you didn't realize
that you've been missing. Smell, you know, the way the
pavement of the street smell. You know, we take that
again after a while you're walking and you know, especially
people living downtown or whatever. You know, they don't even
smell the roses no more. And that's one of the
main things that a lot of us when we come out,
we notice these smells because we've been smelling nothing but
(07:22):
disinfected our whole life. So you know, you have actual nature,
and you have like payment, you have like you know,
the birds chipping, and then you have cars and you
have like horns, and you know, it's a whole different
orchestra of music, and so to speak, compared to prison,
where it's nothing but just a lot of yelling and screaming.
(07:43):
It's a beautiful orchestra of music, but hard to get
used to it first too. It's not so much it's
hard to get used to it, just it's hard to
concentrate on something now because you're so focused on on
on hearing every sound and everything. It's amazing, amazing, every
sound from the orchestra of life. I think that's gorgeous.
So I want to take you back for a moment too,
if I can um that moment fourteen months ago when
(08:06):
you were acquitted. It's your third trial right over the
course of twenty plus years, and this was this was
the moment of your vindication. Yes, um, it's an incredible
moment for us all to listen to. When you were
sitting there at in that courtroom. You know, Amanda and
(08:26):
your family members are right behind you, all your supporters
are right behind you. You were sitting there with your
lawyers and the judge read out the verdict. Can you
tell me what it was like waiting for that verdict?
That was excruciating pain that I would not wish on anybody.
That was terrible. But you know when I was going
through that, you know, when they was in the back
of side of the courthouse and I was like having
(08:49):
an intimate moment with my daughter, my youngest daughter. She
was at that time, she was about six months and uh,
you know, I really I didn't think, you know, I
know she understand what I'm saying. So I was just
praying that you know, that Parmarama experience happens during this
It's true where you live your whole life flashes before
you get out of your body and see yourself exactly.
(09:11):
So I figured, you know, if if anything, you know,
I'll talk to her and she will remember that on
that day when she you know, because I couldn't, you know,
there's no other she was too young, So I was
just explaining to her. You know, I'm just telling you, you
you know, baby, you know I'm not guilty, just saying
who I am. People gonna tell you stuff about me,
and I'm just like explaining things to that, you know
(09:32):
that I'm hoping one day she'll she'll kind of remember that,
she'll come back to that. And uh, I did this
to each of my kids. I set each of them
downs by themselves and I would explain things to him
and and that was my last one. And right when
I was doing that, they tell us that the verdict
is on. We got the verdict, and I'm like, holy crap.
So I were running into the courthouse. And then the thoughts,
(09:55):
like I said, since I was having that intimate moment
where her, you know, one of the thoughts that came
into my mind that were more prevailing than anyone. I
was thinking to myself, and did we make the right decision,
you know, not accepting the offer plea? And I was like,
I know in my heart, you know that we made
the right decision, and I know Amanda stands by me
on that, but I was saying, did we actually do
(10:15):
it the right decision for our kids? You know, even
if you know you're right, you know, are we making
a right decision? Because this is my kids right exactly.
And if you look at the video, you'll see me
and my Lord's talking and you see me shaking me
and that's when I was telling them, you know, I'm pleading, man,
tell me we made the right decision here, that we
made the right decision not only for on me, but
(10:35):
did we make the right decision for my children? You know?
Did we fight this on on prior? Did we fight
this for justice? You know, you you second guess everything
at that moment, you know, and then you second guess,
you know everything that trials coming through your head and
you're like, man, we should have done this, We should
have done that. You know that was coming to your thoughts,
and that's killing you too. So you got all these
it's like a million thoughts just blazing down on you.
(10:59):
And then you wanted to judge your hep and tell
you not guilty and guilty and you wait for the
jury to come in an order and you're just sitting
there dying. I mean, so you're sitting there in that moment,
waiting for the verdict to come back, and you're thinking
back on the offered play on that decision, which which
Amanda guided you, through which Jason Baldwin from The West
(11:19):
Member three guided you threat um and then the verdict
comes back, yes, not guilty exactly. And it was not
before he said not guilty. I already knew when he said, um,
he said it was a form B, right, and I
already had had the pizza paper, you know, like Form
A was guilty, Form B was not guilty. You know.
(11:40):
So when I had the paper in front of me
and then I heard form B, I right away looked
at the pizza paper. I said, oh, it's not guilty.
But it was just a couple of seconds, like you're saying,
you know, and that's when I just it was like
I was, like I said, I was so tense. I
mean that time period, that whole year was probably the
worst year in my life. And uh, I was so
tense that when that verdict not guilty happened, it was
(12:01):
just like you know, like a ball full of rubber
rubber bands. It was like you just take one in it,
I'll just fall apart. And that's exactly what happened, you know,
that not guilty just pulled that one string and everything
fell apart. And I just hit the ground. I hit
the table with my hand. It didn't even hurt Tilly here.
On the next thing, I was just so you know,
out of there. Yeah, yeah, And you got out of there,
(12:22):
didn't you right away? As soon as you could. Never
to return. We left too fat that Like, as I
was telling me and a man that we had all
this little speech that we're going to do afterwards, you know,
to the news or whatever. And when that man said,
the judge said, you know what, not guilty. You are
free to go there. You are no longer under any
(12:42):
conditions of this court anymore. Yeah, that whole speech that
we had, it was out my head. I totally forgot.
I ran out that courtroom. I was like, I grabbed
a man. I was like, let's go and get me
out of here. But you are actually going to be
in the courtroom again, I think in a couple of days. Right,
what's your plan for when you're here in Austin. I'm
here ofting. I want to go to the capitol, and
(13:03):
I want to go see the courts of criminal Appeals
and I would love to see if I can talk
to one of the judges. So you want to go
to the Texas Court of Criminal Appeals. This is the
courts that affirmed your grant of a new trial, that
affirmed your conviction being thrown out. Um, and you want
to just go in that building. Tell me why. One
of the main things I want to go because when
we're going to courts criminal peal, they're telling us about
the judges and they were saying that we have to
(13:24):
get a majority rule, and they were saying three of
the judges were not going to go for us. They
never go for the inmate. And they were like, so
don't even worry about those three. We know we're not
going to get them. But at the end of the day,
you know, we had an anonymous vote. Even the judges
that they said we're not going to vote voted, and
that was like the first time it happened in Texas history.
So that's what I was like, you know, maybe I
(13:45):
won't be able to talk to judge, but I would
love to, you know, ask you know what what made
this case so different that all you are in agreement
with it? What was so special that shot to your faith?
You know? What was it? Do you think it will
still be worthwhile to go there even if you can't
talk to the judges just to be in the building.
What would what would it be just to be in
the building, just to be in the building if they
would let me walk into the when where they actually
make decisions. I would you like to just sit there,
(14:06):
you know, and just I think this is where they
made decisions on letting you go. Yeah, you know, it
would be awesome. This is where it all turned around. Yeah,
this is the place I used to curse that every
every Wednesday, waiting for the answer. Daniel, I just want
(14:35):
to ask you, you know, what is what's your what
are your hopes for the future that I'm not totally
certain about that right now, I haven't figured out where
my direction is actually going to go. Because one thing
I've I've realized about life is that I have my plans,
but the universe has its own plans, and somehow another
I always end up doing what the universe wants me
(14:56):
to do rather than what I want to do. So
I'm trying to figure out my nick and right now,
you know, meanwhile, I'm just trying to do as much
I can to help you know, other people try to
figure out what my my true calling is going to be. Well,
one day at a time is pretty good right now.
Thank you so much for sitting down with me. It's
been an absolute pleasure. Daniel Viegas, thank you, thank you.
(15:19):
Oh and also like thank you for helping me on
my appeal. I mean, Laura, she's on my case. It's
just so it's it's so bad as it's so awesome
to have all you guys with us. But you know,
you guys never get the things, you know, and that's
one thing that you know, I want to really focus,
you know, I want to really you know, put out
there two about our lawyers. And you know that that
help us because you gotta understand that normally with a
(15:41):
client and and the lawyer situation goes once the court
is over, you're not going to see that lawyer hardly
ever again, you know. And in this situation with a
round for conviction, we are so close to our lawyer.
We're so close to you guys. You guys become a family.
You know that even when we come out, you don't
give up on It's not like okay, well we got
your free by I have a good life. You guys
are they're helping us thought. You guys are still there
(16:02):
making sure that you know, we're we're we're being entered
back into society, but successfully, you know, and that you
guys need to get them. Thanks for that, because I
don't feel like you guys get the things for that.
I don't feel like the networks get the things that
the innocent networks, that all these different organizations that work
so hard to get us free, because when we get free,
the game is not over yet. We still it's still
(16:24):
a whole new game. Now. Now the game is how
do we get this man who's been locked up for
twenty years in prison? Then nothing else but how to
be an amen? How do we get him to become
a productive member in society. And that's what you guys
do too. Well, that's what you've done. So congratulations on that.
All right. We believe in you, you believe in us.
(16:44):
Thanks so much, Daniel, Thanks for listening to the special
bonus episode of Wrongful Conviction, False Confessions. You can listen
to Daniel's story right here in this feed and come
back on Wednesday to hear our next door read about
a California man who was wrongfully convicted of terrorism based
(17:04):
on a confession about and I kid you not pole
vaulting Ninja Turtles. Wrongful Conviction, False Confessions is a production
of Lava for Good Podcasts in association with Signal Company
Number One and PRX Special thanks to our executive producer
(17:26):
Jason Flom and the team at Signal Company Number One,
Executive producer Kevin Wardenes, Senior Producer and Pope, and additional
production and editing by Connor Hall. Special thanks to jog
Hammer for additional script editing and for wrangling and writing
like a madwoman. Our music was composed by j Ralph.
(17:48):
You can follow me on Instagram or Twitter at Laura
ni Writer, and you can follow Steve on Instagram at
Steven Drizzen or on Twitter at s Risen. For more
information on the show, visit Wrongful Conviction podcast dot com
and be sure to follow the show on Instagram at
Wrongful Conviction, on Facebook at Wrongful Conviction Podcast, and on
(18:09):
Twitter at wrong Conviction m
Hosts And Creators
Lauren Bright Pacheco
Maggie Freleng
Jason Flom
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