May 14, 2025 • 64 mins
Jason and Rosie recap the stunning conclusion of Andor season two and share their theories on the truth behind one hidden character.
Jason’s Movie List: Andor Season 2 Syllabus, or How to Resist an Empire
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Episode Transcript
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Speaker 1 (00:00):
Warning.
Speaker 2 (00:02):
Today's episode contains spoilers for the final chapter and Or
season two episodes ten through twelve, so big spoilers be warned.
Speaker 3 (00:29):
Hello.
Speaker 2 (00:30):
My name is Jason Concepcion and I'm Mersey Night and welcome.
Speaker 4 (00:34):
Back to x Ravision, the podcast where.
Speaker 2 (00:35):
We dive the video favorite shows, movies, comics of pop culture,
comedy romyra podcast.
Speaker 4 (00:40):
We'll bring you three episodes a week every Tuesday, Wednesday,
and Thursday.
Speaker 1 (00:44):
Plus this episode. I can't believe it's already here. It
doesn't feel real. It is the final episodes of Andor,
and that means the final episodes full stop.
Speaker 3 (00:57):
I kept watching the show and thinking, oh, we'll see
these characters. No wrong, this is the final episode of
a who knows, who knows?
Speaker 4 (01:06):
Whether we.
Speaker 3 (01:08):
Yeah, you know, I would. There's lots of people I
like to see it.
Speaker 4 (01:12):
Claia, Claia.
Speaker 3 (01:14):
We'll talk about that and more once we get into
our recap of the final three episodes of Andor.
Speaker 2 (01:23):
Okay, episode two ten and Or season two. It is
one year before the Battle of Yavin. A message alert
flashes at Luthen's shop. Meanwhile, Lannie is heading into the
office while Luthen and Claire are also preparing for some
sort of operation. It's clear that a bunch of different
(01:46):
strands are converging. And remember this is now some time
after mon Mathma has been spirited off the planet. The
Empire is really cracking down now, particularly on Coruscant, the capitol,
and everybody is on edge. Luthan and Clea are armed,
(02:07):
and Luthan all but says goodbye to her, like every
time they part. You get the feeling certainly that Luthan thinks,
who knows, maybe I don't come back, maybe we don't
come back.
Speaker 4 (02:17):
Because it's so tense right now. He goes to meet Lonnie.
Speaker 2 (02:20):
Lonnie says Deirdre is about to launch a mission aimed
at finding spies, namely Luthan's network, who they're focused on.
And worse, Lonnie says, I'm burned. It's only a matter
of time before, like a matter of hours really before
they before they know it's me, and I need to
(02:41):
get out. I need to get out now, because we've
got maybe I don't know, an hour to an hour
and a half before they know it's me. And he's like,
I need to get out of here. We need to
discuss my exit strategy, which you had promised me, and you.
Speaker 4 (02:55):
Need we need to discress.
Speaker 2 (02:56):
I got to get my family out and tells me right,
and he tells Luthen, here's here's what's going on. I've
had Deirdre's computer codes for a year. I've been in
across all of her messages, everything on her computer. I
didn't tell you because I knew if I told you, you
would have pushed me to use it sooner. Which, by
the way, Lonnie, you probably should have told him, because
(03:18):
maybe what happens now would not have happened any.
Speaker 1 (03:21):
If you'd have given him a little bit more leeway,
like yea little bit more lead in a little bit
more knowledge.
Speaker 2 (03:26):
So Lonnie found something huge, like physically huge and uh
and in terms of galactic politics huge. Uh it is
we were about to found out find out the shadow
of the Death Star in information and intelligence.
Speaker 4 (03:44):
And he says.
Speaker 2 (03:46):
Basically because Luthan is like, well, how do you know
that they're not on you right now? And he says,
if they were on me right now, I'd be dead,
I'd be gone. And so then Luthen pushes, what is
this thing? What did you find? What are you talking about?
And so Lonnie in a rush puts all the pieces together. Gorman,
what did we need on Gorman, the calkite Jetta, the crystals,
(04:08):
the kyber on Jetta, what did we need that for?
Scaref is involved in this. Also, there's an imperial and
scientist named Galen Er. So it all ties back to
some massive weapons project, some huge super weapon that the
Empire is making, and they needed all these ingredients from
these different planets in different places to put this all together.
(04:32):
And then Luthen tells Lannie, Okay, I'll get.
Speaker 4 (04:34):
You to Yavin.
Speaker 2 (04:35):
We'll get you out of here once I get what
I need, he says, and then off camera he kills Lannie.
Speaker 4 (04:42):
He shoots him.
Speaker 2 (04:43):
And you know, I mean, luthn Is has been ruthless.
He killed Tay, He's done stuff. This is the first
time where I'm like, wow, I don't know about this one, Luthan,
I really don't. I really don't know about this one,
because Lannie he is part of the Empire now every
(05:05):
turn he has been there, and every turn. You know,
it was him that put Luthan on the double agent
in bail Organa's group that was gonna arrest man Mathma
before she could make the speech right afterwards, and it
was him feeding him information all the time about Gorman,
(05:25):
letting him know something's going on Gorman. And now here
he is giving you all the evidence you need to
put together the Death Star project to understand that the
Empire is working on this super weapon, and you kill him.
Speaker 4 (05:38):
I think it's pretty tough. I think it's pretty great.
Speaker 1 (05:41):
I think it's brutal, But I will say Luthen at
this point has realized like, this is the thing, this
is the thing I gotta make sure no one else
finds out about. And they know that they have this
torture instrument and the doctor who can torture info out
of people. And I think this is a tying up,
loose sentence, but it is incredibly.
Speaker 3 (06:03):
Ruthless and shows you just how committed.
Speaker 2 (06:06):
I also think is we saw him begin to crack
up in the previous three episodes, the pressure getting to him,
the way he's arguing with Claya, the way he's was
saying to her, you know, I told you it was
bad idea to put the bug in there. And the
pressure is only ratcheted up now. And I think he's
in such a fatalistic mood that he doesn't think any
(06:28):
of them are getting.
Speaker 3 (06:28):
Out, Yeah, exactly.
Speaker 2 (06:31):
Claia and Luthen discuss this, that they're pulling on these threads,
but they're not really sure where they go, and they
separate and say, okay, we're gonna meet up later. Luthen
goes back to the shop to destroy the communications equipment,
pouring acid on it.
Speaker 4 (06:47):
But then the doorbell rings and it's Deirdre. Oh this bitch, Oh,
this fucking bitch.
Speaker 2 (06:52):
And he puts on his mask, you know, that aristocratic
art dealer mask, and he goes out and he's making
chit chat. And then she takes out an Imperial StarPath unit,
a navigator for hyperspace travel, which Luthan has been trafficking
to the rebellion for some time, has been setting all,
(07:14):
you know, like helping coordinate and manage the theft of
imperial hardware to use for its use by the rebellion.
And dejs elated at this moment. She's been waiting for this,
she's been waiting to catch access. She never got to
do it, and here she is now finally putting, putting
(07:36):
it all together, and it's and you could see how
thrilled she is.
Speaker 1 (07:40):
She's got the man speaking of people who are cracking up.
Like the absolute just desperate obsession that Deirdre has is
shining through in every moment here, like you know that
this is not going to go well for you if
you are smart. Yes, actually she is not smart, and
(08:02):
Denise Goff brings her to life with such an unbelievable
kind of watery eyed, like edgy desperation where you can tell,
if you've watched the show, you're like, wait a minute,
this feels like it's jumped, like quite exponentially from the
last place we've seen Dedra that she would be able
to now command this grade.
Speaker 3 (08:25):
And as we'll find out, that is not necessarily.
Speaker 2 (08:28):
The mistake on her part, I think, and we'll talk
about it later, but yes, I'm glad you brought that up,
because the depiction of the Empire is a complete snake
pit where where that is run by ambition by two
powerful forces. One the ambition of all of these players
(08:51):
who are looking to move up the hierarchy to get
closer to the emperor yep. And two that desire to
please the emperor and not the target of his anger
leads to this intense backstabbing type of environment that Deirdre
does not truly realize that she is in it turns it.
(09:12):
She tells Luthen the shop surrounded, you're not getting out
of here, and that's it. And then Luthen takes a
victory lap anyway, which I love for him, where he
basically says, it's too late.
Speaker 4 (09:24):
You know, you got me. That's fine.
Speaker 2 (09:26):
Rebellion is spread. It's everywhere now, it's everywhere around the galaxy.
They all see you, they know who you are. You
you know, like you can't do anything about it. And
Deirdre notices that the comms have been that they're smoking
in the other room. She runs over there to go
see what's happened, and when she turns back, Luthen is
like cut his like a samurai has taken in that
(09:48):
one of the ancient blades from his shop room and
like cut open his belly.
Speaker 4 (09:54):
Menex rush him away.
Speaker 2 (09:56):
Deirdre is desperate in her hope that he lives. And
in the crowd, Claya is.
Speaker 1 (10:02):
Watching all of this, Yeah, because Dedra, like the thing
that's important to recognize here as well, is this is
about access. It is about the imperial stuff that's being
kind of, you know.
Speaker 3 (10:14):
Shipped around. But Dedra has always known.
Speaker 1 (10:17):
That it is likely a kind of rebel, kind of
circuit that is the origins of the rebel and rebellion.
Speaker 3 (10:25):
And honestly, she's not wrong.
Speaker 1 (10:26):
And so she needs Lutheran alive because she wants him
to tell her everything. She doesn't just want to catch
the guy who's been selling Imperial you know, secrets.
Speaker 2 (10:37):
She wants she has exact evidence.
Speaker 4 (10:41):
Unless she brings him in, she has no trophy. And
it's that pride that brings her down.
Speaker 2 (10:47):
So Partigas complaints absolutely to Dedra, like, okay, this raid
went poorly.
Speaker 4 (10:52):
This guy is almost dead. Who told you to do
this on your own authority?
Speaker 2 (10:58):
And then he gets the news that Lannie is dead,
and you know, the ISB is like going through the shop.
Speaker 4 (11:05):
Dedri doesn't really realize that she's in trouble at this point.
Speaker 3 (11:09):
I think she's still one.
Speaker 2 (11:10):
She thinks she's she's like riding a high, even though
she realizes this is like if he doesn't live, it's
a it's a problem. Clay goes to the safe house,
where she is utterly devastated, and now we get a flashback.
We hear we hear Imperial radio chatter about like an
ongoing massacre that the Empire is doing. You just hear
(11:30):
them talking about wiping out pockets of resistance here and there,
and it's luthen Is in some sort of command ship,
you know, uh, at the comms and listening to all
of this and clearly like shaken, And this is Clay's reminiscence.
Luthen Is is clearly upset and tortured at the sounds
(11:51):
of this massacre. He's a sergeant in the Imperial Army,
and he's making every excuse to not take part in this, like,
oh I came into. I came in to like change
my shoes. Oh I had to I had to reboot
the thing, you know, Like he's making all kinds of excuses.
Speaker 1 (12:07):
Yeah, And also like there's this moment where he's basically
just like crying in the and he's like.
Speaker 3 (12:13):
Just make it stop, just make it stop.
Speaker 1 (12:15):
Like you can tell that he is struggling with his
role in this space.
Speaker 2 (12:21):
So he finds in a very Aliens type moment, he
finds Alien in a like event of his ship, a
young girl who's hiding from this masker, and he keeps
her safe back at the safe house. Present, Claya gets
some gear that's hidden like in the safe house, and
(12:41):
she heads out to go to the hospital to At
the time, I was very hopeful that she's trying to
rescue Luthan.
Speaker 3 (12:49):
Yeah, but she is had. I had a realization.
Speaker 1 (12:54):
Very early on, like as they were doing the flashbacks,
and I was like, oh, she's going to save her
Like sorry, get that.
Speaker 3 (12:59):
And then I was like, oh, no, what would what
would Luthan?
Speaker 4 (13:02):
What would Luthen do? What would her father? Yes?
Speaker 2 (13:06):
Exactly, So he is alive. Luthen is alive. He's clinging
to life in the hospital. They're pouring the bacta into
onto his abdomen and but sadly for Deeterer, he's he's
unable to be interrogated at this time. They think maybe tomorrow,
maybe in a couple of days. Claya fakes an injured arm.
She gets in the hospital. She it's it's a uh.
(13:28):
We get to see her in action, which is like wonderful.
She's a excellent spy with incredible nerves. And Deirdre meanwhile,
she reports the part of gas that he'll be ready
for He'll be ready for interrogation tomorrow, Luthen will, but
unfortunately she is being arrested by a party gas and
(13:51):
here's where she messed up. You know, I think it's
it's it's so interesting that like people have been lauding
this character for like being a girl boss.
Speaker 4 (14:01):
And the thing.
Speaker 2 (14:03):
About the empire is don't outshine your boss. That's the
that's the rule. And has told her this multiple times. Yeah,
he's like, keep me in the loop. Don't out shine
because if you outshine your boss, now, your boss is
(14:23):
gonna be gonna run, feel that you're a threat, and
also be unable to protect you when you step out
of line. And this is what she has done. This,
this mission of hers, this rate of hers, has gone sideways,
and someone is to blame. And it turns out that
and rebellion spy has had access to her computer. There's
(14:46):
all sorts of evidence that points at Dedra and it's bad.
Speaker 4 (14:50):
So she's arrested.
Speaker 2 (14:52):
Meanwhile, we get another flashback to Lutheren and Clay now
on the run, living by their wits across the galaxy
and Claia is a little older now they see imperials
rounding up prisoners, partisans. It turns out like like you know,
just rebels who went into the hills to take pot
(15:14):
shots at the empire or whatever. And maybe they're truly
that or maybe they're not. It doesn't matter. The empire
just like guns them down. They're mostly kids, but the
empire executes them. And Claia, against Luthan's admonitions, is like,
I need to watch. She wants to watch him, kind
of like in the way that when you lose the
(15:36):
NBA Finals you want to watch the winning game. You
got to get that anger in your heart, you know.
And she catches up with Luthan and she's furious, of course,
it's seeing kids her age gun down. And she says,
when do we start fighting back? You you never want
to fight back? When do we do it? And he says,
I think the thing that is the core of his
philosophy we fight to win. That means we lose and lose,
(16:00):
and lose and lose until we're ready. And that is
that is Luthen in a nutshell. We can't if we
strike back now, they'll crush us and we can't win.
We need to be careful and we need to be quiet,
and we need to get strong, and that means we
need to take this.
Speaker 1 (16:18):
We need to wait for the moment that's going to
be worthwhile.
Speaker 2 (16:24):
Claia, it like, eventually gets into Luthen's room and she
does this by you know, killing killing a bunch of stormtroopers,
them slowing up some stuff, and she gives Lutha a
(16:45):
tender kiss on the forehead and it's very emotional, and
then she unhooks life saving equipment and she stands there
for a moment to make sure that he's dead.
Speaker 4 (16:56):
And then he dies, and then she.
Speaker 3 (16:57):
Has a single tear rolling down her face.
Speaker 2 (17:00):
We get a flashback Luthen and Clia in nicer clothes.
Speaker 1 (17:04):
Now she's very amidala coated. At this point, it looks like,
you know.
Speaker 3 (17:09):
They're on the way, young woman.
Speaker 4 (17:11):
Yeah, they're on the way. The rebellion, for all we know,
might just be them, you know.
Speaker 3 (17:17):
Like I think at this point it definitely could be.
Speaker 4 (17:20):
This is the nascent years.
Speaker 2 (17:22):
This is like them and maybe Saw, but like they're
not communicating in any kind of way, and they're scouting
Imperial troops that are guarding a bridge.
Speaker 4 (17:30):
She wants to strike.
Speaker 2 (17:31):
She wants to They've planted some explosives out there, and
she wants to blow it up. Lutheren says, patience. They
argue about it. She calls him a coward for not
doing it. He knows that she's just angry and she
just wants to strike out. He's trying to teach her
about patients. He gives her the detonator, but she hesitates,
and then he reaches for it and he takes as it.
He presses it. The explosions happen on the bridge, and
(17:52):
then he coaches her, don't look yet now, yeah, you know,
don't know how to do it before because she wanted
to see them explode.
Speaker 1 (18:00):
I thought that was such a good, good moment. He's like,
don't look because then they're fucking.
Speaker 4 (18:06):
No, they'll know then look now look after.
Speaker 1 (18:08):
It's exploded and everybody's screaming, and.
Speaker 4 (18:11):
And then he's like, okay, now it's the time to leave.
They're in this.
Speaker 1 (18:14):
And he's also like he was like, you you made
this choice. You wanted to strike so okay, I'm doing it.
You can't take it back now, like this is the war.
Speaker 2 (18:23):
And then we go back to the hospital. Cleya detonates
some explosives that she planted in a locker is a distraction.
Speaker 4 (18:31):
She gets up. She shoots a couple of stormtroopers, which
is great.
Speaker 2 (18:33):
Goes in unhooks Luthen's back to life saving equipment, kisses
him on the forehead, make sure like she stands there
for a minute to make sure that he's dead, and
then she escapes and it's rip to absolutely one of
the heroes of the Rebellion, secret.
Speaker 1 (18:53):
Hero, true secret here is the Rebellion.
Speaker 2 (18:56):
Also, like his name will never be said, he will
never get a mess said.
Speaker 1 (19:00):
It would just be us saying Lotha was right, Like
he was hard he was hard core, but he knew
what you had had to be done. He understood that
this was the information, This was the moment, Like can
we stop this this weapon? You know? Also, can I
just say, like I truly we we talked about Tony Gilroy,
you know, as we call him the tone Zone.
Speaker 4 (19:20):
He never misses ever, never once.
Speaker 1 (19:23):
I want to know how he pitched this to Disney
and was like, Hey, so we got three episodes left,
we're leading into Rogue one and the first episode isn't
going to have and or in it.
Speaker 3 (19:31):
How'd you feel about that? Like, it's an unbelievable kind.
Speaker 1 (19:36):
Of almost it's not a bottle episode because it is
so directly connected to everything going on, but it really
is about Claya in a way we haven't focused on
her before, and it is about Luthen and it's about Deddra,
And by the end of it, I was just so
emotionally invested in Claia and in this character and in
the complexity because we've never known Lutheran as like a
(19:58):
loving person. In fact, Clayre constantly complains about working in
the shop and her hatred for just like being there
and the same people she sees every single day coming through,
and I always thought that was kind of a reservation
about what they were doing, but actually it's she was
angry because she wants to be out.
Speaker 4 (20:17):
Killing people more active.
Speaker 1 (20:19):
Yeah, but Lutheran obviously wouldn't let her because he loves
her and because he's trained her ever since she was
a child, so she's an incredibly useful asset.
Speaker 3 (20:27):
For him to have so close. And I just thought, like,
what an unbelievable episode.
Speaker 1 (20:31):
When the credits rolled on her kind of crying, I
was just like, oh man, this show has got the juice.
Speaker 3 (20:38):
Like it's never was questioned, but it's juicy as hell.
It's juicy, it's saucy, it it's doing it.
Speaker 2 (20:59):
Episode eleven, moments after Clea's raid on the hospital. It's
a fucking debacle over there. The suspect is dead, no witnesses.
The raid was so effective that they think maybe three
people did it.
Speaker 3 (21:17):
I know.
Speaker 1 (21:17):
I love it that, like we're guessing, we're thinking about
three people by how it happened, and I'm being that
just one bad ass guys that wasn't you want?
Speaker 3 (21:25):
Ready for her?
Speaker 2 (21:26):
And Officer Heart of the ISB wants to place this
who's was working closely with Lonnie previously in the season,
wants to place this entire thing at Deirdre's at Dedra's feet.
And one thing that I love about this show and
(21:46):
the storytelling you said it, Tonzo never misses, is this contrast,
this duality between the way this nascent rebellion is is
training and becoming better with each passing generation, and the
way the Empire is becoming more incompetent with each passing generation.
(22:09):
Because the rebellion needs good people, people who not just
want to fight and have the will to fight, have
that rebellious spirit, but eventually people who like understand what
it takes, are patient enough or ruthless enough, who understand
of when the moment is right to strike and there's
(22:32):
this naturally almost like a sharpening of the blade process
as people die, as Luthen dies, but the information he
passed on to Cassian, to Clay, etc. Makes them better,
makes them stronger, and makes them a better weapon for
the rebellion.
Speaker 4 (22:46):
Meanwhile, on the.
Speaker 2 (22:47):
Imperial side, because it's such a snake pit, you're watching
and incompetent, like heret try to pin it all on Dedra. Now,
to be fair, Deadra was politically inept.
Speaker 3 (23:02):
I don't know this was DEDs scheme.
Speaker 2 (23:07):
She's clear yet politically inept, but good at hunting, like
good at yes, Like there's a world in which, right,
there's a world in which you'd be like, well, Dead's
good at this.
Speaker 4 (23:16):
Let's just take all the other stuff off her plate.
Speaker 1 (23:18):
And we get this good moment that come that's coming
up soon where she kind of is like, yeah, I'm
a fucking scavenger bitch like I had to be because
you motherfuckers will never give me anything because.
Speaker 2 (23:30):
Because of this this backstabbing. Everybody climb over each other,
you know, put your boot on the other person's head
as you climb up the ladder type of atmosphere. All
that you're getting is the most ruthless and the most incompetent.
They can't wait to kill somebody and move them out
(23:51):
of the way so they can move up, and that's cure.
And he very effectively places this the entire blame for
everything on Dedra, who is in acceluating interrogation. Krenick enters
herself and he just says, who else knows? She's like,
what what are you talking about? And he's like, what
what would I be talking about? Why would I be
(24:12):
here saying cryptic shit?
Speaker 4 (24:15):
Like? Who else knows knows about? What? What's the only
thing that I'm working on?
Speaker 5 (24:19):
Shit?
Speaker 1 (24:20):
She's like, do you mean Axis? And he's like, shut
the fuck up, I'm shit. No, He's like, I am
Ben Mendelssohn. Do you know how much they have to
pay me to bring me into this show? Do you
know how important.
Speaker 3 (24:32):
This must be?
Speaker 1 (24:33):
Well?
Speaker 3 (24:33):
Am I connected to me?
Speaker 4 (24:34):
And I'm like, come on, what?
Speaker 3 (24:36):
And she's like oh, and he says, say say the
fucking words.
Speaker 2 (24:39):
Yeah, and she's like death Star and he's like, that's right. Oh,
who else knows about it? And he thinks she's a
rebel spy.
Speaker 1 (24:47):
I just have to say I love this moment because
This is so presciently in conversation with the audience. From
the first time we met Dedro, we were all like,
why is she so obsessed with this? Like why is
she specifically connected to Axis? Like is she And there
(25:08):
was a lot of conversation, is she a rebel spy?
Is she like so deep undercover and she's forgotten it?
And I love that. Actually the answer is no, she
is a fascist, but she became so obsessed with the
rebellion that she was keeping things to herself.
Speaker 3 (25:23):
As we find out.
Speaker 1 (25:25):
She has been keeping secrets from the empire and even
the man that she would love to impress, Krenick think
she's a rebel spy because of her behavior. I mean,
that's such brilliant storytelling, because there's no you would never be.
Speaker 3 (25:40):
Like, oh, he's so dumb, She's so loyal, why would
he think that. No, she's consistently been.
Speaker 1 (25:44):
Going against the orders of the empire, not for a
good reason, and again.
Speaker 3 (25:49):
She loves glory.
Speaker 2 (25:50):
And again it's this great contrast between like, you know,
Luthen was similarly a secret didn't tell people about anything,
didn't tell Cassie, and then he went to visit Bit.
But that was by necessity in this very small, tight
knit group, whereas in the bureaucracy that Deirdre finds herself
(26:11):
and the fact that she knew all this stuff that
she wasn't passing on because she, I think naturally felt like, well,
if I tell, if I'd move this information on, it
will just get lost in the shuffle.
Speaker 4 (26:23):
That's but that's not your job.
Speaker 1 (26:26):
Credit, Yes, And I love the fact as well that
we learn here that Dedre is not the most like
loyal kind of servant that she would portray herself to
be because she accidentally, as we know from season one,
ended up with all this intel, which is how she
found access and how she became so obsessed with it.
Speaker 3 (26:45):
But now we learn that that intel.
Speaker 1 (26:47):
Was also talking about Galen Erso, also talking about the
death stuff, and she never told part of guys. And
now she's in trouble because they essentially see her almost
as a whistleblower. But she didn't blow the whistle, but
she has that exaction that's dangerous.
Speaker 2 (27:05):
That's actually exactly right. Galen Arso has been disappeared off
the face of the galaxy. Nobody knows about him, and
that he's working. That's nickers I love it, but Dedra knows,
and because Lannie has had for a year access to
her computer, the rebellion probably knows now too, which she
is mind blown about this.
Speaker 1 (27:26):
Yes, and they have his login to her, uh you know,
her info. They're like, he was there for three hours
And Kranick has like this fucking his finger on her
head and he's like, what do you think what do
you think that he was getting out of there? What
do you think Lannie was getting from there? And it's
so scary, like and Denise Gov's acting is so good
(27:48):
in this moment that I couldn't tell. I was like,
does Krenick use the force? Like it looks like he's
physically harming her, but I think it's just for not
for the first time, she is understanding like, oh, I
was meant to catch these people, but now I've given
them the information that they needed and I've failed to
a level that I could never have even imagined. She
(28:10):
is so scared in that moment, She is so horrified,
and she's so upset because she's not going to get
that glory she's been seeking this entire time.
Speaker 2 (28:20):
So Krenick is like, why did you go to you know,
if you knew that it was this important. Why did
you confront Luthen alone? That was dumb And Deirdre's like, well,
we need to look for Claya the assistant and all this,
and she thinks I think at that point she still
thinks she's getting out of this cell, which she never will.
Speaker 1 (28:36):
Yeah, yeah, she's like, I know what's next, guys, I'm
gonna go.
Speaker 4 (28:40):
She's still thinks she's good.
Speaker 2 (28:42):
She thinks she's still running this investigation, which here goes
to the hospital where he's now running point on the investigation,
and we see his methods. Now he's suspicious of everyone.
He's he's threatening everyone with the rest if they get
in the way. He's and he is just like a sledgehammer.
No subtlety at all to this guy. The idea Claire eventually.
Speaker 1 (29:04):
I was gonna say, but he is the only one
who understands and spots her out, like there's something to
his methods. He's the one who's like, there's not three people,
it's just her, Like we need to find this woman.
But yeah, it's very interesting to see the difference between
him and Dedra because they have a similar obsession with
gaining traction in the empire.
Speaker 3 (29:27):
But he is. Yeah, he's not keeping any secrets.
Speaker 1 (29:29):
He's telling everyone like just do this, do that, and
this is the person we need to catch.
Speaker 3 (29:33):
He he did tell Dedra earlier.
Speaker 1 (29:35):
I believe last episode or maybe in the last chunk
of episodes, he said, did you ever consider the reason
that Park has made me in charge of this is
because I don't care about the glory? And I thought
that was a very interesting I think this is a
man driven by just hatred.
Speaker 3 (29:49):
He just wants to kill Clay.
Speaker 4 (29:50):
And he's no, I don't even think it's said. He's
just an attack dog. He is.
Speaker 2 (29:55):
To put the thing about a dog is it's loyal
and you can kick it in it come right back, Dedra.
Don't want to be in charge of the dogs. You know,
she wanted to be the boss. She wanted to.
Speaker 4 (30:07):
Move up the dog and that was ultimately her downfall.
Speaker 2 (30:14):
Cleia digs some old coms gear like out of the
walls and takes a huge risk to send a message
of a like a distress message to the rebellion. We
go to Yavin, where you know the rebellion is gathering strength.
People are arriving all the time. Will Uh comes home
(30:35):
to Drina telling him, Hey, what's this box in your bed.
Speaker 4 (30:39):
That's like beeping? And Will's like, oh, ship, that's the
distress message.
Speaker 2 (30:44):
Specifically or from the network on Corousont, but likely Yeah.
Speaker 4 (30:49):
So Cassian is in his tent.
Speaker 2 (30:51):
He's playing cards with Melchie and K two and they're
having a great time and they're teaching, you know, K
two is learning about humans. It's a wonderful Then Will
comes in and basically says, hey, we got to we
got to stress signal from the network on Courson isb
armed with Claya's ID, put her face all over the
galactic news everywhere, everywhere, everywhere, Critics like I want her found,
(31:15):
Search every farmhouse, hand house, out house, and doghouse until
you find her or else.
Speaker 4 (31:20):
And he looks here and he's like, it's your fucking ass.
Speaker 2 (31:23):
You're gonna be it'd sell next look fucking DEDERM.
Speaker 3 (31:26):
I am not.
Speaker 1 (31:27):
In any way like this is what you get for
being a fascist, But this episode I was like, man,
you guys are fucked, Like this is the this is
how it is. You're never gonna rise up the ranks,
You're never gonna get credit for anything you do. You're
gonna commit horrific acts and have to live with them
and then probably get either killed or put in a
fucking prison cell by the very people you are trying
(31:48):
to impress.
Speaker 3 (31:48):
Maybe there's a lesson here, guys.
Speaker 1 (31:50):
Maybe obviously nothing reliable to this in real life, but
and maybe there's a lesson about this.
Speaker 2 (31:56):
Critic is very, very disappointed with ISB, which is dans
now for part Now, party Gas is feeling heat and
he comes up with a story about how they can
put Claya's face out there. He's like, she's got some
crazy disease and anybody who comes into contact her with
her will get it and die.
Speaker 4 (32:16):
Perfect go with that.
Speaker 1 (32:18):
I'm like, pot of Gas, you are spin master General.
That was incredible too, because uh, he can't just.
Speaker 3 (32:24):
Didn't know what to do.
Speaker 1 (32:25):
And in that moment, Krenik's looking for an answer and
pas like, I'm an old hand. She's got an infetious
disease and she's gonna kill anyone.
Speaker 3 (32:31):
Everyone will be calling in like get away from me.
She's sick. She's sick, and Cretic's like, yeah, this is
my guy, my white guy, this is the guy.
Speaker 2 (32:39):
Kreanig then leans on party Gas and it's basically like
you better fucking find her. Okay, listen, here's how the
hierarchy works. Okay, the Emperor electrocutes Darth Vader, Darth Vader
strangles me. I shit on, you go fucking find her.
Speaker 1 (32:57):
Yeah.
Speaker 2 (32:58):
On Yavin, their discuss seeing the message, which they can't read.
They don't know what it is, but they know where
it's from.
Speaker 1 (33:03):
Also, I just have to say, like this sequence with
KS two O and Melchie and and Or, and you
just see them kind of hanging out, and you see
this friendship that they've managed to create in Yavin while
they've been hiding.
Speaker 4 (33:16):
From It was an important scene.
Speaker 3 (33:18):
I love it so much.
Speaker 1 (33:19):
I love the Melchie stuff, I love getting a little
bit more insight into who he is before Oguan, and
I just think like Kwo s is already one of
my favorite droids, but the level of personality and time
we get to spend with him here is so fantastic.
And the absolute horror of what a K two so
(33:39):
so droid can do that we see here in a
way that was not portrayed in and Or as obviously horrific,
and we get to cheer him on. I just I
truly thought that was like one of the most important
and best scenes, because again it's about how it's kind
of like the whole of Avatar The Last Airbender. The
question is how do you find happiness in a world
where war has to and everything a paw, And in
(34:01):
that moment we get to see them experiencing that happiness,
ripping joking like it's it. I thought it was very moving.
Speaker 2 (34:09):
So the message comes through again while they're arguing, and
Cassiine immediately understands what it is. So he's like, I
need a ship, we need an off the bookship, and
we need to leave and we can't tell anybody. And
of course Cassine is already on thin ice with Draven
and with the rebel leadership about taking ships and leaving
and not telling any where he's going. But he's done
it again and they're fucking pissed again. Heret goes to
(34:31):
visit Dedra in her little cell and he says, Luthen
is dead, Clay is on the run.
Speaker 4 (34:35):
And this is a.
Speaker 2 (34:37):
Very interesting scene because Parrot, again incompetent, not as smart
as Dedra, doesn't know what he's doing, but he's much
more ruthless.
Speaker 4 (34:47):
He's the reason.
Speaker 2 (34:48):
Basically, he's one of the reasons that she's in this cell,
and he starts out by bullying her, but then he's
basically comes out with.
Speaker 4 (34:57):
But like like what do I do? Help me? How
do I find?
Speaker 2 (35:00):
I don't know what to do? And he asks about
the Crenic project, like what is it that chief stole
because like they seem.
Speaker 1 (35:08):
Really and why is it so important?
Speaker 2 (35:10):
Dedah now paranoid is like is this a test that
I would that I would talk about it. I don't
know what's going like he doesn't understand what dangerous ground
he's treading on, and Dejah basically says, you know, look
for old discontinued radio frequencies. That's probably how they're communicating.
Will tells Draven on Yavin what's going on, like, we've
(35:32):
got this message and we need to get the and
it's maybe it's Luthen and we need to go back there.
Speaker 4 (35:37):
Draven is fucking pissed.
Speaker 2 (35:38):
He's like and I and I get it, because what
if the Empire figures out there on Yavin. They're not
ready for that kind of fight and that could be disastrous.
Speaker 1 (35:49):
Yeah, also as well, it's a very interesting situation because
the let's say, like the respectable side of the rebellion
is now running things, but you still have these leftovers
of these people who were raised under Luther, and Will,
who is mentored by Sore, who's clearly still addicted to
(36:12):
to ridiom, and and like, I think it's very interesting
to see the way already they're playing into the notion.
And then we saw this last episode with pretended chunk
of episodes when they.
Speaker 2 (36:26):
Pretended gold Squadron that saved her not not I think it's.
Speaker 1 (36:32):
Very interesting to be in a position where we're already
seeing the and they're not wrong. Like I get it, Momothma,
bail Or Ghana, like I understand what they're talking about,
and Yavin, but also like Will Cassie, and they have
lost everything, they have committed everything to this fight, and
they are already kind of being like sign out of
(36:53):
the story and sidelined, And I think that's really heartbreaking.
Speaker 4 (36:56):
I agree with you. I think that there is To me, there's.
Speaker 2 (37:01):
It's kind of like the natural progression of the rebellion
as it becomes more of a legitimate fighting for us, right,
I think that this is some of this is natural.
I also think clearly from an organizational standpoint, why is
it's like the rebellion has a political leadership, and the
political leadership is is in charge of the military leadership,
which is the ships, the infantry, et cetera. But there
(37:23):
seems to be like no connection with the intelligence, like
there's no rebellion intelligence chief. It's still just these pockets.
And I think organizationally, this doesn't make like you guys
need to figure out like put Casting in charge of
the spies or something. Put Clayer or Vell or somebody
in charge of the spies, Like why are you doing
(37:45):
it like this?
Speaker 1 (37:45):
Anyway, it's a very it's a it's a confusing question
because also, you know, I was thinking about a lot.
I don't know if you ever watched this show with
Kifa Sutherland Designated, where it's like about who would.
Speaker 2 (37:58):
Everybody was in the one room and they all got.
Speaker 1 (38:03):
Jason. Well please, there are so many planets. I get it,
but like, let's split them up a little bit because
one uh one little bee and I don't.
Speaker 4 (38:12):
Disagree with you. Well, they don't know about that.
Speaker 2 (38:14):
They don't know about the super weapon yet, so I
think it makes sense right now, but they don't know
about the super weapon yet. So unfortunately, the Empire fixed
picks up Clay's feed and they figure out where she is.
They get to fix on her location and they start
heading there at the same time that Cassian and Melchie
(38:35):
are also heading there. K two, who still has Imperial
radio frequencies like as part of his like operational abilities,
picks up on these communications. He knows the Empire is there, uh,
closing in on the safe house, so he swings into
action and starts, you know, taking out Imperial forces to
(38:56):
try and get in there. He's getting the drop on
Imperial as he's It's awesome.
Speaker 1 (39:03):
So good. It basically is like a Star Wars horror movie.
I think it leans towards that, where it's almost this
slasher movie where you're just seeing kay my baby k
to so absolutely destroying everyone boom, throwing him into a wall, boom,
throwing him over a bridge, boom. And I love the
notion that he was essentially brainwashed and programmed by the
(39:27):
Empire and what the rebellion did. They didn't fill him
with some mysterious programming. They just took that away and
then treated him like some propaganda.
Speaker 4 (39:36):
Did choose to believe in this case, I don't.
Speaker 1 (39:39):
Choose to bellion, so I choose to believe K to
is choosing to kill.
Speaker 2 (39:47):
Cassie and gets into the safe house with Melchie and Clay.
And Clay are just like in a rush. It's like
telling him like all the information, like and heart.
Speaker 1 (40:00):
She's had to kill She's had to kill Alida. And
then she shows up and essentially sounds like a racing
on the tick because she's just been going over in
her head this is the thing we need, this is
the thing we need. And I thought that was really
heartbreaking and also really realistic. I love the way they
dealt with like who would believe her and who would
go on a mission based on what she's saying.
Speaker 2 (40:22):
And so they argue about this, and because Clay doesn't
think she's getting off the planet, She's like, you need
to leave now and bring this information to the Relion
and Cassian's like, no, you need to come with us. Meanwhile,
the Empire is closing in and they have no idea
that the Empire is closing in, And we go to
episode twelve. Yeah, episode twelve, Cassian continues to try and
(40:59):
convince Clay to come to Yavin. They need to tell
the rebel leadership about the death Star. They they don't
understand that the empires right outside the door, but the
is s B doesn't understand that K two is on
their ass and he's all in them. Like, Party Gas
is in the control room, like why am I? Why
(41:20):
can't I contact anybody? Like what's happening? K two gets
up there and with K two's help, Melchie and Cassian
take out the tag team like and it's it's it's
fucking nuts with K two like picking up like by
(41:41):
the nape of the neck and using him as like
a body shield.
Speaker 4 (41:44):
It's nuts. Party Gas is freaking out.
Speaker 1 (41:46):
He is like, you know that I I recently bought
a very fun bootle like shirt featuring one of the
Creature commandos with GI Robot and it says would you
like to kill Nazis with g I Robot? And now
I'm like, we need a K two s No. One
because this motherfucker is absolutely destroying them. It's almost like
a monster movie. It's really because also they do this
(42:08):
great moment in the opening, which is so tells you
so much about the rebellion and the people who are
truly loyal to it, which is they just send Melchie
out to like stand in front of them and count
how many of them there are, and then he quickly
runs away, you know, but it's so dangerous and reckless,
but you can tell that it's also part of how
(42:29):
they do this and why they make it work. And
I think that the melchie K too, and and or
I never really saw this little trio coming, but now
it's very much. I would die for them energy, Like
they fucking smashed through this, like army of ISB agents
and stormtroopers, like it's crazy.
Speaker 2 (42:48):
On Yeavin, the rebel leadership draven Man Bail Organa are
in communication with Saw, who is on Jedda and it's
been there for a little while, and they're trying to
tell him listen, the Empire is on your ass, like
be careful. They've got this destroyer parked over Jetta lay Low,
(43:10):
stop doing shit, be careful. But Saw is at this
point totally paranoid. His drug addiction is seems like it's
gone too far, and he sees enemies everywhere, and he
thinks maybe even the rebellion people are spying on him
and they're trying to set him up. So it's going nowhere, honestly.
Speaker 1 (43:28):
Like I'm not gonna say that he's wrong, like that
is I think even though, SOA is paranoid. You know,
we are saw ger eras are you guys know we're
sore apologists. But I will say in this moment, while
the intensity of his paranoia is very clear to see,
and it's definitely his addiction has made it that the
(43:49):
horrible things he's had to do.
Speaker 5 (43:51):
Also, I get it because he is that old god
Luthen but more brutal side of the rebellion, who are
fucking like jump in like what he said to Will,
He's like, dive into the rebellion, baby, like we'll go
back to Lutheran.
Speaker 1 (44:03):
Don't be a porn. So I think I understand his
feel but.
Speaker 4 (44:06):
I understand his fear also.
Speaker 2 (44:08):
But I also feel like, you know, everything, uh, everything
has its has its time, and I think his time
sadly has at this point it's past. Like he's not
he's not effective anymore. News of the U Wing hits
the rebel leadership, the stolen U Wing that is now
(44:32):
coming back from correusconting about to land carrying Claya and
Melchian Cassian. Bail is furious because what if again, what
if the Empire followed them here and then we're fucking
fucked in an unsupervised mission. We don't even know what
this is. We don't know who's on there. Do we
shoot it down?
Speaker 4 (44:48):
What do we do?
Speaker 2 (44:49):
Ratus goes to handle the air defenses, and it's very,
very tense. Draven receives the U wing when it lands,
and he's pissed and he brings Cassian to the leadership
and calls him to the carpet, and Cassian briefs them
on everything he's heard. You know, Jedda Gorman, Galen or
so Death Star, et cetera. Bail is being an absolute
(45:11):
fucking bitch about everything.
Speaker 1 (45:13):
They all like that. They're so obsessed at this point
with the concept of like doing things properly, but it's like, babe,
you're not and listen to this man, Like listen.
Speaker 2 (45:24):
Right after this, I went and watched Brogue one, and
it is notable to me that at every turn the
political leadership and I listened, they were important because the
legitimacy that they gave to the rebellion was extremely important.
At the same time, at the same time they were
they had to be dragged, kicking and screaming into every
(45:46):
like they didn't want to go to scare It was
because Ratus and fucking Gin and a bunch of other
yahoos were like, no, we have to go fight that.
That happened here, you're seeing it again. They're having they're
having to be dragged into this, and I get it
also because it's natural that they would be much more
conservative with Again, it's that conversation of like people with
(46:08):
something to lose, they had, this rebellion is just getting started,
and their fear is like, we can't lose it before
we even start. I get it, But they're also like not,
they're not respecting the expertise of people who have been
in the trenches from day one whatever. Bail, you know,
(46:30):
wonders if Cassian's judgment is flawed. There's this the whole conversation,
Cassian says, and it's clear they don't respect Luthen's contribution
at all. They're not really respecting or at least they're
not being there. They're acting like, who the fuck is Luthen?
What's this sounds like? Asian points out that like, I'm
(46:53):
being lectured right now by people who have given a
fraction of what Luthen has given to this rebellion. Bail
thinks that lu And stayed on course not too long,
which I understand because he doesn't understand the importance of
this information that Luthen had to stay there to get
what if he's been turned, which is again like, but
that's a good you know, I get.
Speaker 1 (47:11):
It, I get it, I get it. But we have
the dramatic irony effected.
Speaker 4 (47:17):
There's all these things they can find.
Speaker 2 (47:19):
Cassi into quarters, but he requests, He's like, may I
have permission to go see Claia in the infirmary, and
mon immediately grants it before Draven or any of the
other or bail Yes or any of the other fucking
cowards has an opportunity to say no. Draven then tells
Cassian about saw and Jedda and the very troubling zoom
(47:42):
conversation that they had with him, and they tells him
about the Imperial destroyer above Jedda and it's urgent there.
Cassian apologizes to Clea for the fact that the rebel,
the rebel leadership has received them with like very cold shoulders,
and he promises, like, whatever happen, and it's like Luthen's
sacrifice will be worth it, even if it's just us.
(48:03):
Then understands that Mathma goes to see Vell cousin Bell
Luthen is dead, she tells her, and Cassian is grounded,
but she asks for Bell's advice, like what you know,
what do I do here? And they basically come to
the conclusion that they need to find out if this
information is correct either way, like we just need to
(48:24):
it whether it's bait or not, or reel or not.
Speaker 4 (48:27):
We need to find out.
Speaker 2 (48:29):
Cassian then tells Will that Luthan is dead. Well goes
to I have a hug. Bell goes to talk to
Cassian to kind of take his temperature, but also to
see what he has to say. They toast to the
dead Sinta, the gores Cassian's mom, you know Luthen et cetera.
(48:51):
Bell asks, you know, is the Luthen story real? He's
like yeah, and Cassian's like, and by the way, the
rebellion none of this, ye haven't and none of this
shit happens without him, and he lays out the story again.
Claya wakes up and as we as she's waking up,
there's this incredible transition where we hear Nemeck from season
(49:12):
one his incredible manifesto on freedom versus tyranny, and we
realize as the transition happens that on course on party
Gas is listening to this manifesto.
Speaker 1 (49:27):
I love this moment because I think that nemeic we
are Nemic lovers here. I think the writing around Nemes
manifesto is so incredible and I love that we see
here and we kind of confirm that they released that shit,
like that shit is everywhere. That's Nemes mixtape is the
number one mixtape in the galaxy. Like if pot of
(49:48):
Gas can listen to it, so can everyone else. And
I think that's amazing because I do think that Neme's
kind of freedom and tyranny talk, it is a it's
a battle cry, and it will inspec I have people
to remember that one little action is better than none,
you know. And I love that speech so much. And Potas,
Oh baby, he realizes.
Speaker 2 (50:09):
He knows that he's in it now, he knows that
his ass is in the shopper.
Speaker 4 (50:13):
It's all gone sideways.
Speaker 2 (50:15):
They lost Luthen, The entire cell has managed to get
off of the planet. The ISB tag team that they
sent in has been taken out piece by piece, and
now they look like incompetence. Krenik is calling for him
and party, Gaz asks for a moment to collect his thoughts,
(50:38):
and everybody knows that he's going to kill himself. Like
everybody understands that he's taking the honorable way out, and
basically they're letting him because nobody wants to deal with that.
Speaker 1 (50:47):
Yeah, he's the guy who called him is obviously he
knows what he means.
Speaker 4 (50:50):
Yeah, I know what he's doing.
Speaker 1 (50:52):
There's a great moment where he stands outside with the
stormtroopers and you hear the gun go off and the
stormtroopers are ready to go in, and he's like, it's
very it's okay, yes, it's we are getting there. It's
interesting to see who thinks that they are that important
because also, like part I Gas, he just doesn't want
to go to prison, and we treat it the way
that other people are treated. But he could have survived this,
(51:14):
but he's like, oh, oh, rebellions come in that I'm
going to be the first one up against the wall.
Let me do this myself. Brutal moment, but very in
line with and Or and what the tone zone has
been putt in.
Speaker 2 (51:24):
Well, then on Yavin tells Cassian, you know you should
reconnect with Bicks. Maybe that this is and he's like,
not yet, when this is all over, I'll do that. Well,
then find Claya wandering around in the rain and they commiserate.
Draven finally releases k Twu and Melschie and then comes
to see Cassian. He says, we've gotten a flash message
(51:49):
from Tivik aka the guy Cassian shoots and kills Spoiler
at the beginning of Rogue one after receiving intel about
Galen or So and other stuff, and he's got important information.
He'll only give it to Cassian. He's the only when
he trusts. He's on Caffriine for one day only.
Speaker 4 (52:04):
You got to go.
Speaker 2 (52:05):
Also, there's that Imperial destroyer of Jetta and saws there,
and there's a lot of things are bubbling, and we've
got to be careful because it really feels like war
is imminent at this point. And they both wonder like
if this is a trap, and if it is a trap,
I think they both agree, well that it's so well
designed that they have to take the risk.
Speaker 4 (52:25):
Man, And what can you do.
Speaker 1 (52:27):
It's like it's made, it's made.
Speaker 2 (52:28):
It's almost too good, yeah, man, and Draven Cassian then
has a dream of his life before all this and
we see in this moment, and super producer Joel pointed
it out. He's talking to his sister that we met
in when there were kids in season one, and it's
(52:51):
the same girl who sneaks into Luthan's ship to hide.
So shouts to Joel Claia.
Speaker 1 (53:01):
Yep, Joelle and Justin, unbeknownst.
Speaker 2 (53:05):
To each other, are brother and sister. I wonder if
Luthan knew.
Speaker 1 (53:09):
That is we are making it a ninety nine percent.
We are sure about this, But I think this.
Speaker 4 (53:15):
Is so I thinks. I think.
Speaker 1 (53:20):
I think. I think he puts you and two together,
and he did, That's why he kept them apart.
Speaker 2 (53:25):
Well, I think he put two and two together, which
is why he's working with both of them, but didn't
tell them because he knew it might yeah, fuck up.
Speaker 1 (53:32):
And he loves to keep a secret. You know, he
loves to keep a secret. Also, you know there is
also a chance that Claia knows because Lutheran loved to
tell one person a secret and make them keep it
from everyone else. But I don't think so. But you
know what, I will say, I love this. I also
think it adds a lot of weight to the moment.
(53:52):
Where Cassian is so desperate to bring Claire, even though
in the past he has left people behind, in that moment,
he will not leave her. There's something about how he
needs her to come with him, and not just to
tell the story because he tells the story himself, because
she is so messed up. But I think like there
is a connection there that even if they don't know,
they know, you know. And I really love that. And
(54:14):
when Joel text did that to me, I was like,
that shit blew my mind because I was like, oh
my god. Yeah, they're on the same island, same girl,
but it's obviously a connection there.
Speaker 2 (54:23):
K Two wakes casting up from his dream to tell
him that Bail Organa is here to see him, and
Bail basically says, hey, get back out there.
Speaker 4 (54:33):
You're back in the game.
Speaker 2 (54:36):
Draven has his orders, we have ours, and it's time
to start really fighting back. We see Melchie training the recruits.
We see we get these wonderful little kind of vignettes
of the rebellion growing and getting stronger. We see on
Coruscant that Paren has already moved on. Now he's in
(54:57):
full with Manow.
Speaker 4 (54:58):
He's fully my god.
Speaker 2 (55:00):
I mean, I said, actually because it's pathetic.
Speaker 1 (55:05):
What he's a good moment, He literally is just sitting drinking. Mom,
She's no mom, are you mad? But and he's so depressed.
You can see the kind of resignation of what his life,
the emptiness of his life. His wife is just pure
(55:26):
surface now, you know, just pure Like can you wanted
to enjoy the good times while you can? Okay, empty drinking.
Speaker 2 (55:34):
Through empty luxury that you're living in. We see Claya recovering.
We see Tetra in prison. Sorry, babe, she.
Speaker 1 (55:44):
Is in the exact same prison so as Angel. So
you know she's getting getting spicy and she ain't never
getting out. Watch good luck, babe, like and she just crying.
Imagine if you didn't just love fascism, you could also
you could have just been happy with Cyril. But now
(56:06):
you in prison forever RPTU because you're gonna die in that,
because you're an imperative.
Speaker 2 (56:10):
So Cassian heads out to his meeting with Tivik and
we see him go past the Force Healer. They lock
eyes and it's clear the Force Healer is again since
the importance of this person in what's going to happen
in the next few months.
Speaker 4 (56:26):
In this moment she's seeing the moment she saw on Jetta.
Speaker 2 (56:30):
We see Krenick overseeing the growing death star, and then.
Speaker 4 (56:35):
We look at and we go to Big Wheat for
the finale. The final moments on.
Speaker 2 (56:38):
Big Wheat, b two has friends now, which is wonderful.
B has like a robot little joy friend no crew,
and Bix is with him, which is going to make
him feel good. And Bix is holding her child with
Cassian as she walks through Big Wheat.
Speaker 1 (56:57):
And Wow, what an episode. I love how somehow and
kind of this is very reflected in Rogue one as well,
but like, how do you make an ending that is
hopeful out of such a bleak, heartbreaking show? But you
get that moment with you know, you see Will and
Drina eating like those even there, they get their quiet
moments together. They find love, they find connection, and Bix
(57:20):
looks healthy, safe and has a chubby little baby with her,
So we know that the rebellion will continue, The rebellion
will keep on. Something me and Joel are discussing too
that I think is so interesting is who they leave
us with, Because Joel made a great point where it's
like it's Clayer, it's Bis, it's more Mothma. Like the
future of the Rebellion and this franchise, if they decide
(57:43):
to carry on from here, is in the hands of women.
There are multiple different women that could lead whatever the
next series is going to be, you know. And I
feel so much for people who haven't seen Rogue One
who watch this because the ending is so hopeful. You
see and or fling off, You're like, yeah, I can't
wait for this, and then you put on Rogue One,
(58:03):
like me and Jason both immediately did one. I mean
we were already Rogue One fans, but after this show,
it is like.
Speaker 4 (58:13):
So much richer now.
Speaker 1 (58:15):
That opening of Cassie and killing that guy. I always
loved it because I did feel like, yeah, there's got
to be that in The Rebellion, but now like the
weight of it and the reason he goes in so brutal,
being that Luthan died for this and this is the
chance they have oof Man, that opening just absolutely changes everything.
(58:35):
And yeah, and obviously I love to see more sore
legendary cast I you know. Okay, So Jason, let me
ask you a question. This is a fun question because
the show is essentially like pretty much perfect. If there
was one character from Rogue One that you would have
loved to see in the finale make an appearance to it.
Speaker 4 (58:51):
It be gosh, that's good. Who didn't Yeah?
Speaker 1 (58:55):
Who we didn't get to see.
Speaker 3 (58:57):
You know.
Speaker 2 (58:57):
I I've always because he's so great in the comics,
I've always thought, and but he's in it.
Speaker 4 (59:03):
Ratus is in both Rogue One.
Speaker 2 (59:05):
Admiral Rowy, Yeah, hero of the Battle of Scaif at
least that designed the air attack and uh and the
crucial improvised move of using the Hammerhead corvette to take
out the destroyers that then opened up the gate Mahamahad Corbett.
Speaker 3 (59:25):
And he's in.
Speaker 4 (59:27):
I think he's in. He's in parts of you.
Speaker 1 (59:31):
Like minutes a couple of minutes with him, but you
would like to.
Speaker 2 (59:34):
But I always think that he's a real one, you know,
he's like, he's one of the real ones.
Speaker 4 (59:39):
And one of the things.
Speaker 1 (59:40):
He never questioned and l he didn't say, like this
plan sounds a fake. He was like, I'm right.
Speaker 2 (59:44):
One of the things you notice that doesn't get remarked
upon that much is uh. You know, this is a
very human centric rebellion and obviously a human supremacist empire, right,
there are no there are no alien races in the Empire.
Speaker 4 (01:00:03):
It's US humans.
Speaker 2 (01:00:05):
And then you know the rebellion, You've got Ratus, You've
got a few others, but it is you know, primarily
the humans who are running things. And you contrast that
with Saw and the first band of outlaws who wanted
to be out there doing it, and it's the most
diverse group of creatures.
Speaker 4 (01:00:23):
Like you've ever seen. And I think that because of that, I've.
Speaker 2 (01:00:28):
Always liked learning more about about the non humans in
the rebellion.
Speaker 4 (01:00:34):
Yea, what is that?
Speaker 1 (01:00:36):
Like?
Speaker 4 (01:00:37):
What? What were there?
Speaker 2 (01:00:38):
What were the things that they did that helped, you know,
move the rebellion towards victory written out of history, written
out of history, just as we're about to see all
of these, you know. I think that's one of the
lessons of Rogue one is like, it's going to be
like the here man Mathma deserved hero of the Rebellion,
but it's gonna be Bale Organa and Luca who shots
(01:01:01):
the bail Organo, who did harbor Lea. That was very important,
but in terms of like moving the pieces around, not
a big not a big guy Okay, sorry, Draven. He
was important a little bit kind of you know, kind
of you know, and then John de Donna, which I
still don't know what he did.
Speaker 1 (01:01:21):
You so much Lucas, send an email, tell us.
Speaker 2 (01:01:23):
Explain, explain somebody, somebody tell us what Didonna did, because
it didn't seem it seemed like he just came in.
And then by episode four is like leaning over the
you know, the displays and standing in front of the
screens and saying stuff that it's like, okay, but what
we just watched his I'm not sure what you guys
like he's writing like the missives, He's like John Dennna
(01:01:46):
was really powerful, like he was sill a great job.
Speaker 1 (01:01:50):
Definitely let him look over No. I love that answer.
I think you're right. The creature work has always been
such a key part of Star Wars, and it's very
interesting to see the kind of alien dynamics and the
thing is as well. I think it's fun to imagine
them and want to see more of them in a
space like this where Tony Gilroy is so thoughtful. It's
not that there's a lot of suspicious alien activity and
(01:02:13):
analogy in George Lucas's Star Wars. I think that's a
great answer for me, I'm not gonna surprise anyone here.
I would have you know what, I don't need them
to be in it, like fully in it, because I
think I unders like the story they have in roguee
is so amazing, But I would have liked to see
a little trut and bas just chillin on Jedi. You
know Donnie Yen in Star Wars as like a blind
(01:02:34):
Master who isn't a Force user but is connected to
the Force. Like that relationship between the two of them
was so powerful to me. I literally have like so
many Rogue one spinoff novels because they wrote a lot
about chur and Bays And yeah, I love the Jedda crew.
I love saw, I love a kind of ragtag found family,
(01:02:54):
So that definitely would have been my one like wish
fulfillment thing. But also I don't need to be fan
serviced because I'm being sad and this is fantastic TV.
Speaker 2 (01:03:04):
The next few episodes of X Ray Vision. On Friday,
we're bringing back the Jedi Council for another roundtable, the
final three episodes of and Or season two, and then
on Monday, we're celebrating the fortieth anniversary of the Empire
Strikes Back and on Tuesday, we returned with the last
of US episode six plus stick Around and did the
weeks that follow as we prep for Mission Impossible, the
Final Reckoning.
Speaker 4 (01:03:24):
That's it for this episode. Thanks for listening.
Speaker 1 (01:03:26):
It's Summer of I p mcgeddon Baby, We're covering the Mole.
We're covering a moll like Pokemon Go.
Speaker 2 (01:03:31):
To catch.
Speaker 4 (01:03:37):
X Ray.
Speaker 2 (01:03:37):
Vision is hosted by Jason Sepsion and Rosie Night and
is a production of iHeart Podcasts.
Speaker 1 (01:03:42):
Our executive producers are Joe Alminique and Aaron Kleman.
Speaker 4 (01:03:46):
Our supervising producer is Abuza par.
Speaker 1 (01:03:48):
Our producers are Common Laurent Dean Jonathan and Bai wag.
Speaker 2 (01:03:52):
Our theme song is by Brian Vasquez, with alternate theme
songs by Aaron Kaufman.
Speaker 1 (01:03:57):
Special thanks to Saul Rubin, Chris Lord, Kenny Go and
Heidi Our discored moderator
Speaker 2 (01:04:10):
M HM
Warning.
Speaker 2 (00:02):
Today's episode contains spoilers for the final chapter and Or
season two episodes ten through twelve, so big spoilers be warned.
Speaker 3 (00:29):
Hello.
Speaker 2 (00:30):
My name is Jason Concepcion and I'm Mersey Night and welcome.
Speaker 4 (00:34):
Back to x Ravision, the podcast where.
Speaker 2 (00:35):
We dive the video favorite shows, movies, comics of pop culture,
comedy romyra podcast.
Speaker 4 (00:40):
We'll bring you three episodes a week every Tuesday, Wednesday,
and Thursday.
Speaker 1 (00:44):
Plus this episode. I can't believe it's already here. It
doesn't feel real. It is the final episodes of Andor,
and that means the final episodes full stop.
Speaker 3 (00:57):
I kept watching the show and thinking, oh, we'll see
these characters. No wrong, this is the final episode of
a who knows, who knows?
Speaker 4 (01:06):
Whether we.
Speaker 3 (01:08):
Yeah, you know, I would. There's lots of people I
like to see it.
Speaker 4 (01:12):
Claia, Claia.
Speaker 3 (01:14):
We'll talk about that and more once we get into
our recap of the final three episodes of Andor.
Speaker 2 (01:23):
Okay, episode two ten and Or season two. It is
one year before the Battle of Yavin. A message alert
flashes at Luthen's shop. Meanwhile, Lannie is heading into the
office while Luthen and Claire are also preparing for some
sort of operation. It's clear that a bunch of different
(01:46):
strands are converging. And remember this is now some time
after mon Mathma has been spirited off the planet. The
Empire is really cracking down now, particularly on Coruscant, the capitol,
and everybody is on edge. Luthan and Clea are armed,
(02:07):
and Luthan all but says goodbye to her, like every
time they part. You get the feeling certainly that Luthan thinks,
who knows, maybe I don't come back, maybe we don't
come back.
Speaker 4 (02:17):
Because it's so tense right now. He goes to meet Lonnie.
Speaker 2 (02:20):
Lonnie says Deirdre is about to launch a mission aimed
at finding spies, namely Luthan's network, who they're focused on.
And worse, Lonnie says, I'm burned. It's only a matter
of time before, like a matter of hours really before
they before they know it's me, and I need to
(02:41):
get out. I need to get out now, because we've
got maybe I don't know, an hour to an hour
and a half before they know it's me. And he's like,
I need to get out of here. We need to
discuss my exit strategy, which you had promised me, and you.
Speaker 4 (02:55):
Need we need to discress.
Speaker 2 (02:56):
I got to get my family out and tells me right,
and he tells Luthen, here's here's what's going on. I've
had Deirdre's computer codes for a year. I've been in
across all of her messages, everything on her computer. I
didn't tell you because I knew if I told you, you
would have pushed me to use it sooner. Which, by
the way, Lonnie, you probably should have told him, because
(03:18):
maybe what happens now would not have happened any.
Speaker 1 (03:21):
If you'd have given him a little bit more leeway,
like yea little bit more lead in a little bit
more knowledge.
Speaker 2 (03:26):
So Lonnie found something huge, like physically huge and uh
and in terms of galactic politics huge. Uh it is
we were about to found out find out the shadow
of the Death Star in information and intelligence.
Speaker 4 (03:44):
And he says.
Speaker 2 (03:46):
Basically because Luthan is like, well, how do you know
that they're not on you right now? And he says,
if they were on me right now, I'd be dead,
I'd be gone. And so then Luthen pushes, what is
this thing? What did you find? What are you talking about?
And so Lonnie in a rush puts all the pieces together. Gorman,
what did we need on Gorman, the calkite Jetta, the crystals,
(04:08):
the kyber on Jetta, what did we need that for?
Scaref is involved in this. Also, there's an imperial and
scientist named Galen Er. So it all ties back to
some massive weapons project, some huge super weapon that the
Empire is making, and they needed all these ingredients from
these different planets in different places to put this all together.
(04:32):
And then Luthen tells Lannie, Okay, I'll get.
Speaker 4 (04:34):
You to Yavin.
Speaker 2 (04:35):
We'll get you out of here once I get what
I need, he says, and then off camera he kills Lannie.
Speaker 4 (04:42):
He shoots him.
Speaker 2 (04:43):
And you know, I mean, luthn Is has been ruthless.
He killed Tay, He's done stuff. This is the first
time where I'm like, wow, I don't know about this one, Luthan,
I really don't. I really don't know about this one,
because Lannie he is part of the Empire now every
(05:05):
turn he has been there, and every turn. You know,
it was him that put Luthan on the double agent
in bail Organa's group that was gonna arrest man Mathma
before she could make the speech right afterwards, and it
was him feeding him information all the time about Gorman,
(05:25):
letting him know something's going on Gorman. And now here
he is giving you all the evidence you need to
put together the Death Star project to understand that the
Empire is working on this super weapon, and you kill him.
Speaker 4 (05:38):
I think it's pretty tough. I think it's pretty great.
Speaker 1 (05:41):
I think it's brutal, But I will say Luthen at
this point has realized like, this is the thing, this
is the thing I gotta make sure no one else
finds out about. And they know that they have this
torture instrument and the doctor who can torture info out
of people. And I think this is a tying up,
loose sentence, but it is incredibly.
Speaker 3 (06:03):
Ruthless and shows you just how committed.
Speaker 2 (06:06):
I also think is we saw him begin to crack
up in the previous three episodes, the pressure getting to him,
the way he's arguing with Claya, the way he's was
saying to her, you know, I told you it was
bad idea to put the bug in there. And the
pressure is only ratcheted up now. And I think he's
in such a fatalistic mood that he doesn't think any
(06:28):
of them are getting.
Speaker 3 (06:28):
Out, Yeah, exactly.
Speaker 2 (06:31):
Claia and Luthen discuss this, that they're pulling on these threads,
but they're not really sure where they go, and they
separate and say, okay, we're gonna meet up later. Luthen
goes back to the shop to destroy the communications equipment,
pouring acid on it.
Speaker 4 (06:47):
But then the doorbell rings and it's Deirdre. Oh this bitch, Oh,
this fucking bitch.
Speaker 2 (06:52):
And he puts on his mask, you know, that aristocratic
art dealer mask, and he goes out and he's making
chit chat. And then she takes out an Imperial StarPath unit,
a navigator for hyperspace travel, which Luthan has been trafficking
to the rebellion for some time, has been setting all,
(07:14):
you know, like helping coordinate and manage the theft of
imperial hardware to use for its use by the rebellion.
And dejs elated at this moment. She's been waiting for this,
she's been waiting to catch access. She never got to
do it, and here she is now finally putting, putting
(07:36):
it all together, and it's and you could see how
thrilled she is.
Speaker 1 (07:40):
She's got the man speaking of people who are cracking up.
Like the absolute just desperate obsession that Deirdre has is
shining through in every moment here, like you know that
this is not going to go well for you if
you are smart. Yes, actually she is not smart, and
(08:02):
Denise Goff brings her to life with such an unbelievable
kind of watery eyed, like edgy desperation where you can tell,
if you've watched the show, you're like, wait a minute,
this feels like it's jumped, like quite exponentially from the
last place we've seen Dedra that she would be able
to now command this grade.
Speaker 3 (08:25):
And as we'll find out, that is not necessarily.
Speaker 2 (08:28):
The mistake on her part, I think, and we'll talk
about it later, but yes, I'm glad you brought that up,
because the depiction of the Empire is a complete snake
pit where where that is run by ambition by two
powerful forces. One the ambition of all of these players
(08:51):
who are looking to move up the hierarchy to get
closer to the emperor yep. And two that desire to
please the emperor and not the target of his anger
leads to this intense backstabbing type of environment that Deirdre
does not truly realize that she is in it turns it.
(09:12):
She tells Luthen the shop surrounded, you're not getting out
of here, and that's it. And then Luthen takes a
victory lap anyway, which I love for him, where he
basically says, it's too late.
Speaker 4 (09:24):
You know, you got me. That's fine.
Speaker 2 (09:26):
Rebellion is spread. It's everywhere now, it's everywhere around the galaxy.
They all see you, they know who you are. You
you know, like you can't do anything about it. And
Deirdre notices that the comms have been that they're smoking
in the other room. She runs over there to go
see what's happened, and when she turns back, Luthen is
like cut his like a samurai has taken in that
(09:48):
one of the ancient blades from his shop room and
like cut open his belly.
Speaker 4 (09:54):
Menex rush him away.
Speaker 2 (09:56):
Deirdre is desperate in her hope that he lives. And
in the crowd, Claya is.
Speaker 1 (10:02):
Watching all of this, Yeah, because Dedra, like the thing
that's important to recognize here as well, is this is
about access. It is about the imperial stuff that's being
kind of, you know.
Speaker 3 (10:14):
Shipped around. But Dedra has always known.
Speaker 1 (10:17):
That it is likely a kind of rebel, kind of
circuit that is the origins of the rebel and rebellion.
Speaker 3 (10:25):
And honestly, she's not wrong.
Speaker 1 (10:26):
And so she needs Lutheran alive because she wants him
to tell her everything. She doesn't just want to catch
the guy who's been selling Imperial you know, secrets.
Speaker 2 (10:37):
She wants she has exact evidence.
Speaker 4 (10:41):
Unless she brings him in, she has no trophy. And
it's that pride that brings her down.
Speaker 2 (10:47):
So Partigas complaints absolutely to Dedra, like, okay, this raid
went poorly.
Speaker 4 (10:52):
This guy is almost dead. Who told you to do
this on your own authority?
Speaker 2 (10:58):
And then he gets the news that Lannie is dead,
and you know, the ISB is like going through the shop.
Speaker 4 (11:05):
Dedri doesn't really realize that she's in trouble at this point.
Speaker 3 (11:09):
I think she's still one.
Speaker 2 (11:10):
She thinks she's she's like riding a high, even though
she realizes this is like if he doesn't live, it's
a it's a problem. Clay goes to the safe house,
where she is utterly devastated, and now we get a flashback.
We hear we hear Imperial radio chatter about like an
ongoing massacre that the Empire is doing. You just hear
(11:30):
them talking about wiping out pockets of resistance here and there,
and it's luthen Is in some sort of command ship,
you know, uh, at the comms and listening to all
of this and clearly like shaken, And this is Clay's reminiscence.
Luthen Is is clearly upset and tortured at the sounds
(11:51):
of this massacre. He's a sergeant in the Imperial Army,
and he's making every excuse to not take part in this, like,
oh I came into. I came in to like change
my shoes. Oh I had to I had to reboot
the thing, you know, Like he's making all kinds of excuses.
Speaker 1 (12:07):
Yeah, And also like there's this moment where he's basically
just like crying in the and he's like.
Speaker 3 (12:13):
Just make it stop, just make it stop.
Speaker 1 (12:15):
Like you can tell that he is struggling with his
role in this space.
Speaker 2 (12:21):
So he finds in a very Aliens type moment, he
finds Alien in a like event of his ship, a
young girl who's hiding from this masker, and he keeps
her safe back at the safe house. Present, Claya gets
some gear that's hidden like in the safe house, and
(12:41):
she heads out to go to the hospital to At
the time, I was very hopeful that she's trying to
rescue Luthan.
Speaker 3 (12:49):
Yeah, but she is had. I had a realization.
Speaker 1 (12:54):
Very early on, like as they were doing the flashbacks,
and I was like, oh, she's going to save her
Like sorry, get that.
Speaker 3 (12:59):
And then I was like, oh, no, what would what
would Luthan?
Speaker 4 (13:02):
What would Luthen do? What would her father? Yes?
Speaker 2 (13:06):
Exactly, So he is alive. Luthen is alive. He's clinging
to life in the hospital. They're pouring the bacta into
onto his abdomen and but sadly for Deeterer, he's he's
unable to be interrogated at this time. They think maybe tomorrow,
maybe in a couple of days. Claya fakes an injured arm.
She gets in the hospital. She it's it's a uh.
(13:28):
We get to see her in action, which is like wonderful.
She's a excellent spy with incredible nerves. And Deirdre meanwhile,
she reports the part of gas that he'll be ready
for He'll be ready for interrogation tomorrow, Luthen will, but
unfortunately she is being arrested by a party gas and
(13:51):
here's where she messed up. You know, I think it's
it's it's so interesting that like people have been lauding
this character for like being a girl boss.
Speaker 4 (14:01):
And the thing.
Speaker 2 (14:03):
About the empire is don't outshine your boss. That's the
that's the rule. And has told her this multiple times. Yeah,
he's like, keep me in the loop. Don't out shine
because if you outshine your boss, now, your boss is
(14:23):
gonna be gonna run, feel that you're a threat, and
also be unable to protect you when you step out
of line. And this is what she has done. This,
this mission of hers, this rate of hers, has gone sideways,
and someone is to blame. And it turns out that
and rebellion spy has had access to her computer. There's
(14:46):
all sorts of evidence that points at Dedra and it's bad.
Speaker 4 (14:50):
So she's arrested.
Speaker 2 (14:52):
Meanwhile, we get another flashback to Lutheren and Clay now
on the run, living by their wits across the galaxy
and Claia is a little older now they see imperials
rounding up prisoners, partisans. It turns out like like you know,
just rebels who went into the hills to take pot
(15:14):
shots at the empire or whatever. And maybe they're truly
that or maybe they're not. It doesn't matter. The empire
just like guns them down. They're mostly kids, but the
empire executes them. And Claia, against Luthan's admonitions, is like,
I need to watch. She wants to watch him, kind
of like in the way that when you lose the
(15:36):
NBA Finals you want to watch the winning game. You
got to get that anger in your heart, you know.
And she catches up with Luthan and she's furious, of course,
it's seeing kids her age gun down. And she says,
when do we start fighting back? You you never want
to fight back? When do we do it? And he says,
I think the thing that is the core of his
philosophy we fight to win. That means we lose and lose,
(16:00):
and lose and lose until we're ready. And that is
that is Luthen in a nutshell. We can't if we
strike back now, they'll crush us and we can't win.
We need to be careful and we need to be quiet,
and we need to get strong, and that means we
need to take this.
Speaker 1 (16:18):
We need to wait for the moment that's going to
be worthwhile.
Speaker 2 (16:24):
Claia, it like, eventually gets into Luthen's room and she
does this by you know, killing killing a bunch of stormtroopers,
them slowing up some stuff, and she gives Lutha a
(16:45):
tender kiss on the forehead and it's very emotional, and
then she unhooks life saving equipment and she stands there
for a moment to make sure that he's dead.
Speaker 4 (16:56):
And then he dies, and then she.
Speaker 3 (16:57):
Has a single tear rolling down her face.
Speaker 2 (17:00):
We get a flashback Luthen and Clia in nicer clothes.
Speaker 1 (17:04):
Now she's very amidala coated. At this point, it looks like,
you know.
Speaker 3 (17:09):
They're on the way, young woman.
Speaker 4 (17:11):
Yeah, they're on the way. The rebellion, for all we know,
might just be them, you know.
Speaker 3 (17:17):
Like I think at this point it definitely could be.
Speaker 4 (17:20):
This is the nascent years.
Speaker 2 (17:22):
This is like them and maybe Saw, but like they're
not communicating in any kind of way, and they're scouting
Imperial troops that are guarding a bridge.
Speaker 4 (17:30):
She wants to strike.
Speaker 2 (17:31):
She wants to They've planted some explosives out there, and
she wants to blow it up. Lutheren says, patience. They
argue about it. She calls him a coward for not
doing it. He knows that she's just angry and she
just wants to strike out. He's trying to teach her
about patients. He gives her the detonator, but she hesitates,
and then he reaches for it and he takes as it.
He presses it. The explosions happen on the bridge, and
(17:52):
then he coaches her, don't look yet now, yeah, you know,
don't know how to do it before because she wanted
to see them explode.
Speaker 1 (18:00):
I thought that was such a good, good moment. He's like,
don't look because then they're fucking.
Speaker 4 (18:06):
No, they'll know then look now look after.
Speaker 1 (18:08):
It's exploded and everybody's screaming, and.
Speaker 4 (18:11):
And then he's like, okay, now it's the time to leave.
They're in this.
Speaker 1 (18:14):
And he's also like he was like, you you made
this choice. You wanted to strike so okay, I'm doing it.
You can't take it back now, like this is the war.
Speaker 2 (18:23):
And then we go back to the hospital. Cleya detonates
some explosives that she planted in a locker is a distraction.
Speaker 4 (18:31):
She gets up. She shoots a couple of stormtroopers, which
is great.
Speaker 2 (18:33):
Goes in unhooks Luthen's back to life saving equipment, kisses
him on the forehead, make sure like she stands there
for a minute to make sure that he's dead, and
then she escapes and it's rip to absolutely one of
the heroes of the Rebellion, secret.
Speaker 1 (18:53):
Hero, true secret here is the Rebellion.
Speaker 2 (18:56):
Also, like his name will never be said, he will
never get a mess said.
Speaker 1 (19:00):
It would just be us saying Lotha was right, Like
he was hard he was hard core, but he knew
what you had had to be done. He understood that
this was the information, This was the moment, Like can
we stop this this weapon? You know? Also, can I
just say, like I truly we we talked about Tony Gilroy,
you know, as we call him the tone Zone.
Speaker 4 (19:20):
He never misses ever, never once.
Speaker 1 (19:23):
I want to know how he pitched this to Disney
and was like, Hey, so we got three episodes left,
we're leading into Rogue one and the first episode isn't
going to have and or in it.
Speaker 3 (19:31):
How'd you feel about that? Like, it's an unbelievable kind.
Speaker 1 (19:36):
Of almost it's not a bottle episode because it is
so directly connected to everything going on, but it really
is about Claya in a way we haven't focused on
her before, and it is about Luthen and it's about Deddra,
And by the end of it, I was just so
emotionally invested in Claia and in this character and in
the complexity because we've never known Lutheran as like a
(19:58):
loving person. In fact, Clayre constantly complains about working in
the shop and her hatred for just like being there
and the same people she sees every single day coming through,
and I always thought that was kind of a reservation
about what they were doing, but actually it's she was
angry because she wants to be out.
Speaker 4 (20:17):
Killing people more active.
Speaker 1 (20:19):
Yeah, but Lutheran obviously wouldn't let her because he loves
her and because he's trained her ever since she was
a child, so she's an incredibly useful asset.
Speaker 3 (20:27):
For him to have so close. And I just thought, like,
what an unbelievable episode.
Speaker 1 (20:31):
When the credits rolled on her kind of crying, I
was just like, oh man, this show has got the juice.
Speaker 3 (20:38):
Like it's never was questioned, but it's juicy as hell.
It's juicy, it's saucy, it it's doing it.
Speaker 2 (20:59):
Episode eleven, moments after Clea's raid on the hospital. It's
a fucking debacle over there. The suspect is dead, no witnesses.
The raid was so effective that they think maybe three
people did it.
Speaker 3 (21:17):
I know.
Speaker 1 (21:17):
I love it that, like we're guessing, we're thinking about
three people by how it happened, and I'm being that
just one bad ass guys that wasn't you want?
Speaker 3 (21:25):
Ready for her?
Speaker 2 (21:26):
And Officer Heart of the ISB wants to place this
who's was working closely with Lonnie previously in the season,
wants to place this entire thing at Deirdre's at Dedra's feet.
And one thing that I love about this show and
(21:46):
the storytelling you said it, Tonzo never misses, is this contrast,
this duality between the way this nascent rebellion is is
training and becoming better with each passing generation, and the
way the Empire is becoming more incompetent with each passing generation.
(22:09):
Because the rebellion needs good people, people who not just
want to fight and have the will to fight, have
that rebellious spirit, but eventually people who like understand what
it takes, are patient enough or ruthless enough, who understand
of when the moment is right to strike and there's
(22:32):
this naturally almost like a sharpening of the blade process
as people die, as Luthen dies, but the information he
passed on to Cassian, to Clay, etc. Makes them better,
makes them stronger, and makes them a better weapon for
the rebellion.
Speaker 4 (22:46):
Meanwhile, on the.
Speaker 2 (22:47):
Imperial side, because it's such a snake pit, you're watching
and incompetent, like heret try to pin it all on Dedra. Now,
to be fair, Deadra was politically inept.
Speaker 3 (23:02):
I don't know this was DEDs scheme.
Speaker 2 (23:07):
She's clear yet politically inept, but good at hunting, like
good at yes, Like there's a world in which, right,
there's a world in which you'd be like, well, Dead's
good at this.
Speaker 4 (23:16):
Let's just take all the other stuff off her plate.
Speaker 1 (23:18):
And we get this good moment that come that's coming
up soon where she kind of is like, yeah, I'm
a fucking scavenger bitch like I had to be because
you motherfuckers will never give me anything because.
Speaker 2 (23:30):
Because of this this backstabbing. Everybody climb over each other,
you know, put your boot on the other person's head
as you climb up the ladder type of atmosphere. All
that you're getting is the most ruthless and the most incompetent.
They can't wait to kill somebody and move them out
(23:51):
of the way so they can move up, and that's cure.
And he very effectively places this the entire blame for
everything on Dedra, who is in acceluating interrogation. Krenick enters
herself and he just says, who else knows? She's like,
what what are you talking about? And he's like, what
what would I be talking about? Why would I be
(24:12):
here saying cryptic shit?
Speaker 4 (24:15):
Like? Who else knows knows about? What? What's the only
thing that I'm working on?
Speaker 5 (24:19):
Shit?
Speaker 1 (24:20):
She's like, do you mean Axis? And he's like, shut
the fuck up, I'm shit. No, He's like, I am
Ben Mendelssohn. Do you know how much they have to
pay me to bring me into this show? Do you
know how important.
Speaker 3 (24:32):
This must be?
Speaker 1 (24:33):
Well?
Speaker 3 (24:33):
Am I connected to me?
Speaker 4 (24:34):
And I'm like, come on, what?
Speaker 3 (24:36):
And she's like oh, and he says, say say the
fucking words.
Speaker 2 (24:39):
Yeah, and she's like death Star and he's like, that's right. Oh,
who else knows about it? And he thinks she's a
rebel spy.
Speaker 1 (24:47):
I just have to say I love this moment because
This is so presciently in conversation with the audience. From
the first time we met Dedro, we were all like,
why is she so obsessed with this? Like why is
she specifically connected to Axis? Like is she And there
(25:08):
was a lot of conversation, is she a rebel spy?
Is she like so deep undercover and she's forgotten it?
And I love that. Actually the answer is no, she
is a fascist, but she became so obsessed with the
rebellion that she was keeping things to herself.
Speaker 3 (25:23):
As we find out.
Speaker 1 (25:25):
She has been keeping secrets from the empire and even
the man that she would love to impress, Krenick think
she's a rebel spy because of her behavior. I mean,
that's such brilliant storytelling, because there's no you would never be.
Speaker 3 (25:40):
Like, oh, he's so dumb, She's so loyal, why would
he think that. No, she's consistently been.
Speaker 1 (25:44):
Going against the orders of the empire, not for a
good reason, and again.
Speaker 3 (25:49):
She loves glory.
Speaker 2 (25:50):
And again it's this great contrast between like, you know,
Luthen was similarly a secret didn't tell people about anything,
didn't tell Cassie, and then he went to visit Bit.
But that was by necessity in this very small, tight
knit group, whereas in the bureaucracy that Deirdre finds herself
(26:11):
and the fact that she knew all this stuff that
she wasn't passing on because she, I think naturally felt like, well,
if I tell, if I'd move this information on, it
will just get lost in the shuffle.
Speaker 4 (26:23):
That's but that's not your job.
Speaker 1 (26:26):
Credit, Yes, And I love the fact as well that
we learn here that Dedre is not the most like
loyal kind of servant that she would portray herself to
be because she accidentally, as we know from season one,
ended up with all this intel, which is how she
found access and how she became so obsessed with it.
Speaker 3 (26:45):
But now we learn that that intel.
Speaker 1 (26:47):
Was also talking about Galen Erso, also talking about the
death stuff, and she never told part of guys. And
now she's in trouble because they essentially see her almost
as a whistleblower. But she didn't blow the whistle, but
she has that exaction that's dangerous.
Speaker 2 (27:05):
That's actually exactly right. Galen Arso has been disappeared off
the face of the galaxy. Nobody knows about him, and
that he's working. That's nickers I love it, but Dedra knows,
and because Lannie has had for a year access to
her computer, the rebellion probably knows now too, which she
is mind blown about this.
Speaker 1 (27:26):
Yes, and they have his login to her, uh you know,
her info. They're like, he was there for three hours
And Kranick has like this fucking his finger on her
head and he's like, what do you think what do
you think that he was getting out of there? What
do you think Lannie was getting from there? And it's
so scary, like and Denise Gov's acting is so good
(27:48):
in this moment that I couldn't tell. I was like,
does Krenick use the force? Like it looks like he's
physically harming her, but I think it's just for not
for the first time, she is understanding like, oh, I
was meant to catch these people, but now I've given
them the information that they needed and I've failed to
a level that I could never have even imagined. She
(28:10):
is so scared in that moment, She is so horrified,
and she's so upset because she's not going to get
that glory she's been seeking this entire time.
Speaker 2 (28:20):
So Krenick is like, why did you go to you know,
if you knew that it was this important. Why did
you confront Luthen alone? That was dumb And Deirdre's like, well,
we need to look for Claya the assistant and all this,
and she thinks I think at that point she still
thinks she's getting out of this cell, which she never will.
Speaker 1 (28:36):
Yeah, yeah, she's like, I know what's next, guys, I'm
gonna go.
Speaker 4 (28:40):
She's still thinks she's good.
Speaker 2 (28:42):
She thinks she's still running this investigation, which here goes
to the hospital where he's now running point on the investigation,
and we see his methods. Now he's suspicious of everyone.
He's he's threatening everyone with the rest if they get
in the way. He's and he is just like a sledgehammer.
No subtlety at all to this guy. The idea Claire eventually.
Speaker 1 (29:04):
I was gonna say, but he is the only one
who understands and spots her out, like there's something to
his methods. He's the one who's like, there's not three people,
it's just her, Like we need to find this woman.
But yeah, it's very interesting to see the difference between
him and Dedra because they have a similar obsession with
gaining traction in the empire.
Speaker 3 (29:27):
But he is. Yeah, he's not keeping any secrets.
Speaker 1 (29:29):
He's telling everyone like just do this, do that, and
this is the person we need to catch.
Speaker 3 (29:33):
He he did tell Dedra earlier.
Speaker 1 (29:35):
I believe last episode or maybe in the last chunk
of episodes, he said, did you ever consider the reason
that Park has made me in charge of this is
because I don't care about the glory? And I thought
that was a very interesting I think this is a
man driven by just hatred.
Speaker 3 (29:49):
He just wants to kill Clay.
Speaker 4 (29:50):
And he's no, I don't even think it's said. He's
just an attack dog. He is.
Speaker 2 (29:55):
To put the thing about a dog is it's loyal
and you can kick it in it come right back, Dedra.
Don't want to be in charge of the dogs. You know,
she wanted to be the boss. She wanted to.
Speaker 4 (30:07):
Move up the dog and that was ultimately her downfall.
Speaker 2 (30:14):
Cleia digs some old coms gear like out of the
walls and takes a huge risk to send a message
of a like a distress message to the rebellion. We
go to Yavin, where you know the rebellion is gathering strength.
People are arriving all the time. Will Uh comes home
(30:35):
to Drina telling him, Hey, what's this box in your bed.
Speaker 4 (30:39):
That's like beeping? And Will's like, oh, ship, that's the
distress message.
Speaker 2 (30:44):
Specifically or from the network on Corousont, but likely Yeah.
Speaker 4 (30:49):
So Cassian is in his tent.
Speaker 2 (30:51):
He's playing cards with Melchie and K two and they're
having a great time and they're teaching, you know, K
two is learning about humans. It's a wonderful Then Will
comes in and basically says, hey, we got to we
got to stress signal from the network on Courson isb
armed with Claya's ID, put her face all over the
galactic news everywhere, everywhere, everywhere, Critics like I want her found,
(31:15):
Search every farmhouse, hand house, out house, and doghouse until
you find her or else.
Speaker 4 (31:20):
And he looks here and he's like, it's your fucking ass.
Speaker 2 (31:23):
You're gonna be it'd sell next look fucking DEDERM.
Speaker 3 (31:26):
I am not.
Speaker 1 (31:27):
In any way like this is what you get for
being a fascist, But this episode I was like, man,
you guys are fucked, Like this is the this is
how it is. You're never gonna rise up the ranks,
You're never gonna get credit for anything you do. You're
gonna commit horrific acts and have to live with them
and then probably get either killed or put in a
fucking prison cell by the very people you are trying
(31:48):
to impress.
Speaker 3 (31:48):
Maybe there's a lesson here, guys.
Speaker 1 (31:50):
Maybe obviously nothing reliable to this in real life, but
and maybe there's a lesson about this.
Speaker 2 (31:56):
Critic is very, very disappointed with ISB, which is dans
now for part Now, party Gas is feeling heat and
he comes up with a story about how they can
put Claya's face out there. He's like, she's got some
crazy disease and anybody who comes into contact her with
her will get it and die.
Speaker 4 (32:16):
Perfect go with that.
Speaker 1 (32:18):
I'm like, pot of Gas, you are spin master General.
That was incredible too, because uh, he can't just.
Speaker 3 (32:24):
Didn't know what to do.
Speaker 1 (32:25):
And in that moment, Krenik's looking for an answer and
pas like, I'm an old hand. She's got an infetious
disease and she's gonna kill anyone.
Speaker 3 (32:31):
Everyone will be calling in like get away from me.
She's sick. She's sick, and Cretic's like, yeah, this is
my guy, my white guy, this is the guy.
Speaker 2 (32:39):
Kreanig then leans on party Gas and it's basically like
you better fucking find her. Okay, listen, here's how the
hierarchy works. Okay, the Emperor electrocutes Darth Vader, Darth Vader
strangles me. I shit on, you go fucking find her.
Speaker 1 (32:57):
Yeah.
Speaker 2 (32:58):
On Yavin, their discuss seeing the message, which they can't read.
They don't know what it is, but they know where
it's from.
Speaker 1 (33:03):
Also, I just have to say, like this sequence with
KS two O and Melchie and and Or, and you
just see them kind of hanging out, and you see
this friendship that they've managed to create in Yavin while
they've been hiding.
Speaker 4 (33:16):
From It was an important scene.
Speaker 3 (33:18):
I love it so much.
Speaker 1 (33:19):
I love the Melchie stuff, I love getting a little
bit more insight into who he is before Oguan, and
I just think like Kwo s is already one of
my favorite droids, but the level of personality and time
we get to spend with him here is so fantastic.
And the absolute horror of what a K two so
(33:39):
so droid can do that we see here in a
way that was not portrayed in and Or as obviously horrific,
and we get to cheer him on. I just I
truly thought that was like one of the most important
and best scenes, because again it's about how it's kind
of like the whole of Avatar The Last Airbender. The
question is how do you find happiness in a world
where war has to and everything a paw, And in
(34:01):
that moment we get to see them experiencing that happiness,
ripping joking like it's it. I thought it was very moving.
Speaker 2 (34:09):
So the message comes through again while they're arguing, and
Cassiine immediately understands what it is. So he's like, I
need a ship, we need an off the bookship, and
we need to leave and we can't tell anybody. And
of course Cassine is already on thin ice with Draven
and with the rebel leadership about taking ships and leaving
and not telling any where he's going. But he's done
it again and they're fucking pissed again. Heret goes to
(34:31):
visit Dedra in her little cell and he says, Luthen
is dead, Clay is on the run.
Speaker 4 (34:35):
And this is a.
Speaker 2 (34:37):
Very interesting scene because Parrot, again incompetent, not as smart
as Dedra, doesn't know what he's doing, but he's much
more ruthless.
Speaker 4 (34:47):
He's the reason.
Speaker 2 (34:48):
Basically, he's one of the reasons that she's in this cell,
and he starts out by bullying her, but then he's
basically comes out with.
Speaker 4 (34:57):
But like like what do I do? Help me? How
do I find?
Speaker 2 (35:00):
I don't know what to do? And he asks about
the Crenic project, like what is it that chief stole
because like they seem.
Speaker 1 (35:08):
Really and why is it so important?
Speaker 2 (35:10):
Dedah now paranoid is like is this a test that
I would that I would talk about it. I don't
know what's going like he doesn't understand what dangerous ground
he's treading on, and Dejah basically says, you know, look
for old discontinued radio frequencies. That's probably how they're communicating.
Will tells Draven on Yavin what's going on, like, we've
(35:32):
got this message and we need to get the and
it's maybe it's Luthen and we need to go back there.
Speaker 4 (35:37):
Draven is fucking pissed.
Speaker 2 (35:38):
He's like and I and I get it, because what
if the Empire figures out there on Yavin. They're not
ready for that kind of fight and that could be disastrous.
Speaker 1 (35:49):
Yeah, also as well, it's a very interesting situation because
the let's say, like the respectable side of the rebellion
is now running things, but you still have these leftovers
of these people who were raised under Luther, and Will,
who is mentored by Sore, who's clearly still addicted to
(36:12):
to ridiom, and and like, I think it's very interesting
to see the way already they're playing into the notion.
And then we saw this last episode with pretended chunk
of episodes when they.
Speaker 2 (36:26):
Pretended gold Squadron that saved her not not I think it's.
Speaker 1 (36:32):
Very interesting to be in a position where we're already
seeing the and they're not wrong. Like I get it, Momothma,
bail Or Ghana, like I understand what they're talking about,
and Yavin, but also like Will Cassie, and they have
lost everything, they have committed everything to this fight, and
they are already kind of being like sign out of
(36:53):
the story and sidelined, And I think that's really heartbreaking.
Speaker 4 (36:56):
I agree with you. I think that there is To me, there's.
Speaker 2 (37:01):
It's kind of like the natural progression of the rebellion
as it becomes more of a legitimate fighting for us, right,
I think that this is some of this is natural.
I also think clearly from an organizational standpoint, why is
it's like the rebellion has a political leadership, and the
political leadership is is in charge of the military leadership,
which is the ships, the infantry, et cetera. But there
(37:23):
seems to be like no connection with the intelligence, like
there's no rebellion intelligence chief. It's still just these pockets.
And I think organizationally, this doesn't make like you guys
need to figure out like put Casting in charge of
the spies or something. Put Clayer or Vell or somebody
in charge of the spies, Like why are you doing
(37:45):
it like this?
Speaker 1 (37:45):
Anyway, it's a very it's a it's a confusing question
because also, you know, I was thinking about a lot.
I don't know if you ever watched this show with
Kifa Sutherland Designated, where it's like about who would.
Speaker 2 (37:58):
Everybody was in the one room and they all got.
Speaker 1 (38:03):
Jason. Well please, there are so many planets. I get it,
but like, let's split them up a little bit because
one uh one little bee and I don't.
Speaker 4 (38:12):
Disagree with you. Well, they don't know about that.
Speaker 2 (38:14):
They don't know about the super weapon yet, so I
think it makes sense right now, but they don't know
about the super weapon yet. So unfortunately, the Empire fixed
picks up Clay's feed and they figure out where she is.
They get to fix on her location and they start
heading there at the same time that Cassian and Melchie
(38:35):
are also heading there. K two, who still has Imperial
radio frequencies like as part of his like operational abilities,
picks up on these communications. He knows the Empire is there, uh,
closing in on the safe house, so he swings into
action and starts, you know, taking out Imperial forces to
(38:56):
try and get in there. He's getting the drop on
Imperial as he's It's awesome.
Speaker 1 (39:03):
So good. It basically is like a Star Wars horror movie.
I think it leans towards that, where it's almost this
slasher movie where you're just seeing kay my baby k
to so absolutely destroying everyone boom, throwing him into a wall, boom,
throwing him over a bridge, boom. And I love the
notion that he was essentially brainwashed and programmed by the
(39:27):
Empire and what the rebellion did. They didn't fill him
with some mysterious programming. They just took that away and
then treated him like some propaganda.
Speaker 4 (39:36):
Did choose to believe in this case, I don't.
Speaker 1 (39:39):
Choose to bellion, so I choose to believe K to
is choosing to kill.
Speaker 2 (39:47):
Cassie and gets into the safe house with Melchie and Clay.
And Clay are just like in a rush. It's like
telling him like all the information, like and heart.
Speaker 1 (40:00):
She's had to kill She's had to kill Alida. And
then she shows up and essentially sounds like a racing
on the tick because she's just been going over in
her head this is the thing we need, this is
the thing we need. And I thought that was really
heartbreaking and also really realistic. I love the way they
dealt with like who would believe her and who would
go on a mission based on what she's saying.
Speaker 2 (40:22):
And so they argue about this, and because Clay doesn't
think she's getting off the planet, She's like, you need
to leave now and bring this information to the Relion
and Cassian's like, no, you need to come with us. Meanwhile,
the Empire is closing in and they have no idea
that the Empire is closing in, And we go to
episode twelve. Yeah, episode twelve, Cassian continues to try and
(40:59):
convince Clay to come to Yavin. They need to tell
the rebel leadership about the death Star. They they don't
understand that the empires right outside the door, but the
is s B doesn't understand that K two is on
their ass and he's all in them. Like, Party Gas
is in the control room, like why am I? Why
(41:20):
can't I contact anybody? Like what's happening? K two gets
up there and with K two's help, Melchie and Cassian
take out the tag team like and it's it's it's
fucking nuts with K two like picking up like by
(41:41):
the nape of the neck and using him as like
a body shield.
Speaker 4 (41:44):
It's nuts. Party Gas is freaking out.
Speaker 1 (41:46):
He is like, you know that I I recently bought
a very fun bootle like shirt featuring one of the
Creature commandos with GI Robot and it says would you
like to kill Nazis with g I Robot? And now
I'm like, we need a K two s No. One
because this motherfucker is absolutely destroying them. It's almost like
a monster movie. It's really because also they do this
(42:08):
great moment in the opening, which is so tells you
so much about the rebellion and the people who are
truly loyal to it, which is they just send Melchie
out to like stand in front of them and count
how many of them there are, and then he quickly
runs away, you know, but it's so dangerous and reckless,
but you can tell that it's also part of how
(42:29):
they do this and why they make it work. And
I think that the melchie K too, and and or
I never really saw this little trio coming, but now
it's very much. I would die for them energy, Like
they fucking smashed through this, like army of ISB agents
and stormtroopers, like it's crazy.
Speaker 2 (42:48):
On Yeavin, the rebel leadership draven Man Bail Organa are
in communication with Saw, who is on Jedda and it's
been there for a little while, and they're trying to
tell him listen, the Empire is on your ass, like
be careful. They've got this destroyer parked over Jetta lay Low,
(43:10):
stop doing shit, be careful. But Saw is at this
point totally paranoid. His drug addiction is seems like it's
gone too far, and he sees enemies everywhere, and he
thinks maybe even the rebellion people are spying on him
and they're trying to set him up. So it's going nowhere, honestly.
Speaker 1 (43:28):
Like I'm not gonna say that he's wrong, like that
is I think even though, SOA is paranoid. You know,
we are saw ger eras are you guys know we're
sore apologists. But I will say in this moment, while
the intensity of his paranoia is very clear to see,
and it's definitely his addiction has made it that the
(43:49):
horrible things he's had to do.
Speaker 5 (43:51):
Also, I get it because he is that old god
Luthen but more brutal side of the rebellion, who are
fucking like jump in like what he said to Will,
He's like, dive into the rebellion, baby, like we'll go
back to Lutheran.
Speaker 1 (44:03):
Don't be a porn. So I think I understand his
feel but.
Speaker 4 (44:06):
I understand his fear also.
Speaker 2 (44:08):
But I also feel like, you know, everything, uh, everything
has its has its time, and I think his time
sadly has at this point it's past. Like he's not
he's not effective anymore. News of the U Wing hits
the rebel leadership, the stolen U Wing that is now
(44:32):
coming back from correusconting about to land carrying Claya and
Melchian Cassian. Bail is furious because what if again, what
if the Empire followed them here and then we're fucking
fucked in an unsupervised mission. We don't even know what
this is. We don't know who's on there. Do we
shoot it down?
Speaker 4 (44:48):
What do we do?
Speaker 2 (44:49):
Ratus goes to handle the air defenses, and it's very,
very tense. Draven receives the U wing when it lands,
and he's pissed and he brings Cassian to the leadership
and calls him to the carpet, and Cassian briefs them
on everything he's heard. You know, Jedda Gorman, Galen or
so Death Star, et cetera. Bail is being an absolute
(45:11):
fucking bitch about everything.
Speaker 1 (45:13):
They all like that. They're so obsessed at this point
with the concept of like doing things properly, but it's like, babe,
you're not and listen to this man, Like listen.
Speaker 2 (45:24):
Right after this, I went and watched Brogue one, and
it is notable to me that at every turn the
political leadership and I listened, they were important because the
legitimacy that they gave to the rebellion was extremely important.
At the same time, at the same time they were
they had to be dragged, kicking and screaming into every
(45:46):
like they didn't want to go to scare It was
because Ratus and fucking Gin and a bunch of other
yahoos were like, no, we have to go fight that.
That happened here, you're seeing it again. They're having they're
having to be dragged into this, and I get it
also because it's natural that they would be much more
conservative with Again, it's that conversation of like people with
(46:08):
something to lose, they had, this rebellion is just getting started,
and their fear is like, we can't lose it before
we even start. I get it, But they're also like not,
they're not respecting the expertise of people who have been
in the trenches from day one whatever. Bail, you know,
(46:30):
wonders if Cassian's judgment is flawed. There's this the whole conversation,
Cassian says, and it's clear they don't respect Luthen's contribution
at all. They're not really respecting or at least they're
not being there. They're acting like, who the fuck is Luthen?
What's this sounds like? Asian points out that like, I'm
(46:53):
being lectured right now by people who have given a
fraction of what Luthen has given to this rebellion. Bail
thinks that lu And stayed on course not too long,
which I understand because he doesn't understand the importance of
this information that Luthen had to stay there to get
what if he's been turned, which is again like, but
that's a good you know, I get.
Speaker 1 (47:11):
It, I get it, I get it. But we have
the dramatic irony effected.
Speaker 4 (47:17):
There's all these things they can find.
Speaker 2 (47:19):
Cassi into quarters, but he requests, He's like, may I
have permission to go see Claia in the infirmary, and
mon immediately grants it before Draven or any of the
other or bail Yes or any of the other fucking
cowards has an opportunity to say no. Draven then tells
Cassian about saw and Jedda and the very troubling zoom
(47:42):
conversation that they had with him, and they tells him
about the Imperial destroyer above Jedda and it's urgent there.
Cassian apologizes to Clea for the fact that the rebel,
the rebel leadership has received them with like very cold shoulders,
and he promises, like, whatever happen, and it's like Luthen's
sacrifice will be worth it, even if it's just us.
(48:03):
Then understands that Mathma goes to see Vell cousin Bell
Luthen is dead, she tells her, and Cassian is grounded,
but she asks for Bell's advice, like what you know,
what do I do here? And they basically come to
the conclusion that they need to find out if this
information is correct either way, like we just need to
(48:24):
it whether it's bait or not, or reel or not.
Speaker 4 (48:27):
We need to find out.
Speaker 2 (48:29):
Cassian then tells Will that Luthan is dead. Well goes
to I have a hug. Bell goes to talk to
Cassian to kind of take his temperature, but also to
see what he has to say. They toast to the
dead Sinta, the gores Cassian's mom, you know Luthen et cetera.
(48:51):
Bell asks, you know, is the Luthen story real? He's
like yeah, and Cassian's like, and by the way, the
rebellion none of this, ye haven't and none of this
shit happens without him, and he lays out the story again.
Claya wakes up and as we as she's waking up,
there's this incredible transition where we hear Nemeck from season
(49:12):
one his incredible manifesto on freedom versus tyranny, and we
realize as the transition happens that on course on party
Gas is listening to this manifesto.
Speaker 1 (49:27):
I love this moment because I think that nemeic we
are Nemic lovers here. I think the writing around Nemes
manifesto is so incredible and I love that we see
here and we kind of confirm that they released that shit,
like that shit is everywhere. That's Nemes mixtape is the
number one mixtape in the galaxy. Like if pot of
(49:48):
Gas can listen to it, so can everyone else. And
I think that's amazing because I do think that Neme's
kind of freedom and tyranny talk, it is a it's
a battle cry, and it will inspec I have people
to remember that one little action is better than none,
you know. And I love that speech so much. And Potas,
Oh baby, he realizes.
Speaker 2 (50:09):
He knows that he's in it now, he knows that
his ass is in the shopper.
Speaker 4 (50:13):
It's all gone sideways.
Speaker 2 (50:15):
They lost Luthen, The entire cell has managed to get
off of the planet. The ISB tag team that they
sent in has been taken out piece by piece, and
now they look like incompetence. Krenik is calling for him
and party, Gaz asks for a moment to collect his thoughts,
(50:38):
and everybody knows that he's going to kill himself. Like
everybody understands that he's taking the honorable way out, and
basically they're letting him because nobody wants to deal with that.
Speaker 1 (50:47):
Yeah, he's the guy who called him is obviously he
knows what he means.
Speaker 4 (50:50):
Yeah, I know what he's doing.
Speaker 1 (50:52):
There's a great moment where he stands outside with the
stormtroopers and you hear the gun go off and the
stormtroopers are ready to go in, and he's like, it's
very it's okay, yes, it's we are getting there. It's
interesting to see who thinks that they are that important
because also, like part I Gas, he just doesn't want
to go to prison, and we treat it the way
that other people are treated. But he could have survived this,
(51:14):
but he's like, oh, oh, rebellions come in that I'm
going to be the first one up against the wall.
Let me do this myself. Brutal moment, but very in
line with and Or and what the tone zone has
been putt in.
Speaker 2 (51:24):
Well, then on Yavin tells Cassian, you know you should
reconnect with Bicks. Maybe that this is and he's like,
not yet, when this is all over, I'll do that. Well,
then find Claya wandering around in the rain and they commiserate.
Draven finally releases k Twu and Melschie and then comes
to see Cassian. He says, we've gotten a flash message
(51:49):
from Tivik aka the guy Cassian shoots and kills Spoiler
at the beginning of Rogue one after receiving intel about
Galen or So and other stuff, and he's got important information.
He'll only give it to Cassian. He's the only when
he trusts. He's on Caffriine for one day only.
Speaker 4 (52:04):
You got to go.
Speaker 2 (52:05):
Also, there's that Imperial destroyer of Jetta and saws there,
and there's a lot of things are bubbling, and we've
got to be careful because it really feels like war
is imminent at this point. And they both wonder like
if this is a trap, and if it is a trap,
I think they both agree, well that it's so well
designed that they have to take the risk.
Speaker 4 (52:25):
Man, And what can you do.
Speaker 1 (52:27):
It's like it's made, it's made.
Speaker 2 (52:28):
It's almost too good, yeah, man, and Draven Cassian then
has a dream of his life before all this and
we see in this moment, and super producer Joel pointed
it out. He's talking to his sister that we met
in when there were kids in season one, and it's
(52:51):
the same girl who sneaks into Luthan's ship to hide.
So shouts to Joel Claia.
Speaker 1 (53:01):
Yep, Joelle and Justin, unbeknownst.
Speaker 2 (53:05):
To each other, are brother and sister. I wonder if
Luthan knew.
Speaker 1 (53:09):
That is we are making it a ninety nine percent.
We are sure about this, But I think this.
Speaker 4 (53:15):
Is so I thinks. I think.
Speaker 1 (53:20):
I think. I think he puts you and two together,
and he did, That's why he kept them apart.
Speaker 2 (53:25):
Well, I think he put two and two together, which
is why he's working with both of them, but didn't
tell them because he knew it might yeah, fuck up.
Speaker 1 (53:32):
And he loves to keep a secret. You know, he
loves to keep a secret. Also, you know there is
also a chance that Claia knows because Lutheran loved to
tell one person a secret and make them keep it
from everyone else. But I don't think so. But you
know what, I will say, I love this. I also
think it adds a lot of weight to the moment.
(53:52):
Where Cassian is so desperate to bring Claire, even though
in the past he has left people behind, in that moment,
he will not leave her. There's something about how he
needs her to come with him, and not just to
tell the story because he tells the story himself, because
she is so messed up. But I think like there
is a connection there that even if they don't know,
they know, you know. And I really love that. And
(54:14):
when Joel text did that to me, I was like,
that shit blew my mind because I was like, oh
my god. Yeah, they're on the same island, same girl,
but it's obviously a connection there.
Speaker 2 (54:23):
K Two wakes casting up from his dream to tell
him that Bail Organa is here to see him, and
Bail basically says, hey, get back out there.
Speaker 4 (54:33):
You're back in the game.
Speaker 2 (54:36):
Draven has his orders, we have ours, and it's time
to start really fighting back. We see Melchie training the recruits.
We see we get these wonderful little kind of vignettes
of the rebellion growing and getting stronger. We see on
Coruscant that Paren has already moved on. Now he's in
(54:57):
full with Manow.
Speaker 4 (54:58):
He's fully my god.
Speaker 2 (55:00):
I mean, I said, actually because it's pathetic.
Speaker 1 (55:05):
What he's a good moment, He literally is just sitting drinking. Mom,
She's no mom, are you mad? But and he's so depressed.
You can see the kind of resignation of what his life,
the emptiness of his life. His wife is just pure
(55:26):
surface now, you know, just pure Like can you wanted
to enjoy the good times while you can? Okay, empty drinking.
Speaker 2 (55:34):
Through empty luxury that you're living in. We see Claya recovering.
We see Tetra in prison. Sorry, babe, she.
Speaker 1 (55:44):
Is in the exact same prison so as Angel. So
you know she's getting getting spicy and she ain't never
getting out. Watch good luck, babe, like and she just crying.
Imagine if you didn't just love fascism, you could also
you could have just been happy with Cyril. But now
(56:06):
you in prison forever RPTU because you're gonna die in that,
because you're an imperative.
Speaker 2 (56:10):
So Cassian heads out to his meeting with Tivik and
we see him go past the Force Healer. They lock
eyes and it's clear the Force Healer is again since
the importance of this person in what's going to happen
in the next few months.
Speaker 4 (56:26):
In this moment she's seeing the moment she saw on Jetta.
Speaker 2 (56:30):
We see Krenick overseeing the growing death star, and then.
Speaker 4 (56:35):
We look at and we go to Big Wheat for
the finale. The final moments on.
Speaker 2 (56:38):
Big Wheat, b two has friends now, which is wonderful.
B has like a robot little joy friend no crew,
and Bix is with him, which is going to make
him feel good. And Bix is holding her child with
Cassian as she walks through Big Wheat.
Speaker 1 (56:57):
And Wow, what an episode. I love how somehow and
kind of this is very reflected in Rogue one as well,
but like, how do you make an ending that is
hopeful out of such a bleak, heartbreaking show? But you
get that moment with you know, you see Will and
Drina eating like those even there, they get their quiet
moments together. They find love, they find connection, and Bix
(57:20):
looks healthy, safe and has a chubby little baby with her,
So we know that the rebellion will continue, The rebellion
will keep on. Something me and Joel are discussing too
that I think is so interesting is who they leave
us with, Because Joel made a great point where it's
like it's Clayer, it's Bis, it's more Mothma. Like the
future of the Rebellion and this franchise, if they decide
(57:43):
to carry on from here, is in the hands of women.
There are multiple different women that could lead whatever the
next series is going to be, you know. And I
feel so much for people who haven't seen Rogue One
who watch this because the ending is so hopeful. You
see and or fling off, You're like, yeah, I can't
wait for this, and then you put on Rogue One,
(58:03):
like me and Jason both immediately did one. I mean
we were already Rogue One fans, but after this show,
it is like.
Speaker 4 (58:13):
So much richer now.
Speaker 1 (58:15):
That opening of Cassie and killing that guy. I always
loved it because I did feel like, yeah, there's got
to be that in The Rebellion, but now like the
weight of it and the reason he goes in so brutal,
being that Luthan died for this and this is the
chance they have oof Man, that opening just absolutely changes everything.
(58:35):
And yeah, and obviously I love to see more sore
legendary cast I you know. Okay, So Jason, let me
ask you a question. This is a fun question because
the show is essentially like pretty much perfect. If there
was one character from Rogue One that you would have
loved to see in the finale make an appearance to it.
Speaker 4 (58:51):
It be gosh, that's good. Who didn't Yeah?
Speaker 1 (58:55):
Who we didn't get to see.
Speaker 3 (58:57):
You know.
Speaker 2 (58:57):
I I've always because he's so great in the comics,
I've always thought, and but he's in it.
Speaker 4 (59:03):
Ratus is in both Rogue One.
Speaker 2 (59:05):
Admiral Rowy, Yeah, hero of the Battle of Scaif at
least that designed the air attack and uh and the
crucial improvised move of using the Hammerhead corvette to take
out the destroyers that then opened up the gate Mahamahad Corbett.
Speaker 3 (59:25):
And he's in.
Speaker 4 (59:27):
I think he's in. He's in parts of you.
Speaker 1 (59:31):
Like minutes a couple of minutes with him, but you
would like to.
Speaker 2 (59:34):
But I always think that he's a real one, you know,
he's like, he's one of the real ones.
Speaker 4 (59:39):
And one of the things.
Speaker 1 (59:40):
He never questioned and l he didn't say, like this
plan sounds a fake. He was like, I'm right.
Speaker 2 (59:44):
One of the things you notice that doesn't get remarked
upon that much is uh. You know, this is a
very human centric rebellion and obviously a human supremacist empire, right,
there are no there are no alien races in the Empire.
Speaker 4 (01:00:03):
It's US humans.
Speaker 2 (01:00:05):
And then you know the rebellion, You've got Ratus, You've
got a few others, but it is you know, primarily
the humans who are running things. And you contrast that
with Saw and the first band of outlaws who wanted
to be out there doing it, and it's the most
diverse group of creatures.
Speaker 4 (01:00:23):
Like you've ever seen. And I think that because of that, I've.
Speaker 2 (01:00:28):
Always liked learning more about about the non humans in
the rebellion.
Speaker 4 (01:00:34):
Yea, what is that?
Speaker 1 (01:00:36):
Like?
Speaker 4 (01:00:37):
What? What were there?
Speaker 2 (01:00:38):
What were the things that they did that helped, you know,
move the rebellion towards victory written out of history, written
out of history, just as we're about to see all
of these, you know. I think that's one of the
lessons of Rogue one is like, it's going to be
like the here man Mathma deserved hero of the Rebellion,
but it's gonna be Bale Organa and Luca who shots
(01:01:01):
the bail Organo, who did harbor Lea. That was very important,
but in terms of like moving the pieces around, not
a big not a big guy Okay, sorry, Draven. He
was important a little bit kind of you know, kind
of you know, and then John de Donna, which I
still don't know what he did.
Speaker 1 (01:01:21):
You so much Lucas, send an email, tell us.
Speaker 2 (01:01:23):
Explain, explain somebody, somebody tell us what Didonna did, because
it didn't seem it seemed like he just came in.
And then by episode four is like leaning over the
you know, the displays and standing in front of the
screens and saying stuff that it's like, okay, but what
we just watched his I'm not sure what you guys
like he's writing like the missives, He's like John Dennna
(01:01:46):
was really powerful, like he was sill a great job.
Speaker 1 (01:01:50):
Definitely let him look over No. I love that answer.
I think you're right. The creature work has always been
such a key part of Star Wars, and it's very
interesting to see the kind of alien dynamics and the
thing is as well. I think it's fun to imagine
them and want to see more of them in a
space like this where Tony Gilroy is so thoughtful. It's
not that there's a lot of suspicious alien activity and
(01:02:13):
analogy in George Lucas's Star Wars. I think that's a
great answer for me, I'm not gonna surprise anyone here.
I would have you know what, I don't need them
to be in it, like fully in it, because I
think I unders like the story they have in roguee
is so amazing, But I would have liked to see
a little trut and bas just chillin on Jedi. You
know Donnie Yen in Star Wars as like a blind
(01:02:34):
Master who isn't a Force user but is connected to
the Force. Like that relationship between the two of them
was so powerful to me. I literally have like so
many Rogue one spinoff novels because they wrote a lot
about chur and Bays And yeah, I love the Jedda crew.
I love saw, I love a kind of ragtag found family,
(01:02:54):
So that definitely would have been my one like wish
fulfillment thing. But also I don't need to be fan
serviced because I'm being sad and this is fantastic TV.
Speaker 2 (01:03:04):
The next few episodes of X Ray Vision. On Friday,
we're bringing back the Jedi Council for another roundtable, the
final three episodes of and Or season two, and then
on Monday, we're celebrating the fortieth anniversary of the Empire
Strikes Back and on Tuesday, we returned with the last
of US episode six plus stick Around and did the
weeks that follow as we prep for Mission Impossible, the
Final Reckoning.
Speaker 4 (01:03:24):
That's it for this episode. Thanks for listening.
Speaker 1 (01:03:26):
It's Summer of I p mcgeddon Baby, We're covering the Mole.
We're covering a moll like Pokemon Go.
Speaker 2 (01:03:31):
To catch.
Speaker 4 (01:03:37):
X Ray.
Speaker 2 (01:03:37):
Vision is hosted by Jason Sepsion and Rosie Night and
is a production of iHeart Podcasts.
Speaker 1 (01:03:42):
Our executive producers are Joe Alminique and Aaron Kleman.
Speaker 4 (01:03:46):
Our supervising producer is Abuza par.
Speaker 1 (01:03:48):
Our producers are Common Laurent Dean Jonathan and Bai wag.
Speaker 2 (01:03:52):
Our theme song is by Brian Vasquez, with alternate theme
songs by Aaron Kaufman.
Speaker 1 (01:03:57):
Special thanks to Saul Rubin, Chris Lord, Kenny Go and
Heidi Our discored moderator
Speaker 2 (01:04:10):
M HM
Hosts And Creators
Jason Concepcion
Rosie Knight
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