Dune: Awakening and The Last of Us get official release dates. Murderbots, the Hugo Award Winning series by Martha Wells is coming to Apple TV+ with Alexander Skarsgård. Marvel Rivals production company NetEase's layoffs continue troubling trends in the gaming industry. Rosie and Jason sit down with Your Friendly Neighborhood Spider-Man showrunner Jeff Trammell. He tells us about the Easter eggs no one's noticed and answers a question that's driving fans of the series nuts.
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Episode Transcript
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Speaker 1 (00:00):
On today's news episode, we're also talking to your friendly
neighborhood spider Man showrunner Jeff Tremmel and more, and he
drops a juicy nugget in this interview, so stay tuned.
Speaker 2 (00:10):
Here we go.
Speaker 1 (00:25):
Hello, my name is Jason Young and I'm Mersey Night,
and welcome back to the X revision of the podcast
where we dive deep for dear favorite shows, movies, comics,
and pop culture. Coming over our podcast or we're bringing
you three huge episodes every single week's news on the weekends.
Speaker 3 (00:39):
Yes, and in today's previously on news episode, we are
catching up on all the biggest geek news of the week,
including we got a premier day the Last of Us
season two were and we're also cl some first pictures
from the adaptation of Martha Well's Murder Box that's going
to be on Apple TV.
Speaker 2 (00:58):
Plus.
Speaker 3 (00:58):
I feel like that could be a set level here
if they get it right. We got some Doom news,
Marvel Rivals layoffs chat, and that aforementioned interview with your
friendly neighborhood spider Man right Jeff Trumout, which does include
some spoilers for the season one finale and the series,
but also includes a nice interesting scoop for season two,
(01:21):
so make sure you stay listening.
Speaker 4 (01:23):
But first, let's talk about news.
Speaker 1 (01:27):
First up, the Last of Us Season two on HBO
gets its premiere date. For those of you who have
been upset because it appears that Catherine Devor did not
get into the gym get swollen, it ripped for Abby, well,
you're gonna have to be satisfied with this news about
the release date, which is April thirteenth, nine pm Eastern.
(01:51):
Not long to wait, guys, here it comes on HBON Max.
We're gonna be covering the show and we're super excited.
Speaker 4 (01:58):
Yes, I'm very too about it. I'm excited about it.
Speaker 1 (02:01):
I'm scared about it. I'm worried about it. Yeah, trepidacious
the whole thing.
Speaker 3 (02:05):
I think that Catherine Deava has the chops. I don't
think she needs to get buff to be Abby. I
think she just needs to be menacing and paralyzing. We
need you to get just like It's fine, like the
characters important. Jason, were you a fan of the Last
(02:26):
of Us Part two?
Speaker 4 (02:26):
The game?
Speaker 3 (02:28):
I was.
Speaker 2 (02:29):
Yes.
Speaker 1 (02:31):
It was absolutely grim and gritty and morally questionable and
emotionally hard hitting and ultra ultra violence. And a incredible story.
Speaker 3 (02:43):
Truly an unbelievable experience to play that game, and I'm
very interested to see how that translates to the season.
I also saw that they had a great poster with
Pedro Pascal as Joel and it says the tagline is
something like every choice has consequences, and I think that
that is going to be so interesting to see how
(03:04):
that plays out.
Speaker 4 (03:05):
Can't wait for that show.
Speaker 3 (03:07):
Yep, we'll be covering it and it is going to
be coming up much sooner than it feels possible. So
if you want to replay the game, great time to
start now, and you know we'll be chatting about it
in the discord. There's lots of conversation about Last of
Us Season two in there.
Speaker 1 (03:19):
Next up, Apple TV plus has unveiled a couple of
images two images from its highly anticipated upcoming sci fi
thriller series murder Bots, which is, of course the adaptation
of Martha Well's Hugo and Nebula Award winning book series.
(03:40):
Very very readable, great book series about a robot who
is fascinated by human emotion. Yeah, I'll just say that,
and it stars Alexander Alexander Scarsguard of Succession true Blood,
big littleized others, and if they get this right, this
(04:02):
is gonna be huge.
Speaker 3 (04:03):
It feels like this could be another massive breakthrough hit.
We were talking in the group chat and super producer
Carmen mentioned, you know, I only ever see memes from
Apple Plus TV that are about Severance.
Speaker 4 (04:15):
And I was thinking about it, and I was like,
that is.
Speaker 3 (04:17):
Their first massive breakthrough hit where people who have never
watched Severance know who Milchick is, people who have never
watched Severance are using inyan auiti as colloquial.
Speaker 4 (04:28):
Terms about going to work.
Speaker 3 (04:29):
Like it has really had that cultural smash hit feeling.
Speaker 4 (04:34):
And I'm very interested.
Speaker 3 (04:37):
To see how they adapt this book because Martha Wells
has such a light touch when it comes to comedic
sci fi kind of dystopia, and she is murder Bot
is definitely her.
Speaker 4 (04:54):
Most popular series.
Speaker 3 (04:55):
She also writes fantasy stuff like The Witch King and
other books. But I think that getting that tone right
is going to be the most important thing. And also
like the breeziness of the books, as you said, Jason,
feels very readable. I'm interested to see if they're going
to be able to capture that in a prestige TV setting.
But I have to say, until this reveal of the photos,
(05:18):
I didn't know that it was Alexander Scarsguard starring in this.
Speaker 4 (05:22):
And I think he absolutely has the chops.
Speaker 2 (05:24):
He can be.
Speaker 3 (05:24):
Funny, he can be scary, he can be weird, he
can be emotionless, he can be vulnerable. I think that
with a writing team that includes Academy Award nominees, you know,
created by Chris and Paul White who did About a
Boy and Mozige in the Jungle, I'm interested and I
think this could potentially become Prestige TV magic.
Speaker 4 (05:48):
But it will be interesting to see.
Speaker 3 (05:49):
Because Apple has had some huge properties that they've managed
to adapt, they have not necessarily hit the lofty heights
of severance. But I can't wait to see this, and
I think Scarsguard is a Kia Costing.
Speaker 5 (06:01):
I agree.
Speaker 1 (06:02):
We're gonna take a break, be right back, Yeah, and
we're back. Video game fans, Dune Awakening has just released
(06:25):
a trailer announcing its release date. The game is coming
out on PC May twentieth. It is a massively multiplayer
online style game of survival game a lot of sandworm action.
In the trailer, dune heads, get ready, this looks right
(06:46):
up your alley.
Speaker 3 (06:47):
You can do spice, you can get the blue eyed glow.
Speaker 4 (06:51):
You can And also a very.
Speaker 3 (06:53):
Important point here, thank you to whom stever amongst you
mentioned this in our show notes. But the main character
is very hot, and that is very important in a
modern game, whether it is Balder's Gate Anasterian, whether.
Speaker 4 (07:09):
It is the recent billion dollar.
Speaker 3 (07:12):
Making romance game Love and Deep Space, which if you know,
you know, and just made its creator a billion dollars
for the first time, one of the most popular boyfriend
sim games.
Speaker 4 (07:24):
You gotta have a hot video game character.
Speaker 3 (07:26):
And I feel like in an era where Zendaa and.
Speaker 4 (07:30):
Timmy Shallo may are your leads in Dune.
Speaker 3 (07:33):
Alongside stars like you know, Oscar Isaac, Famous Daddy and
other hotties. Austin Bala he wasn't looking too hot, but
you know he's got his fans. He's got his fans,
even with that fair, bold head. But I feel like
having a hot main character is very important. Also absolutely
obsessed with a power waiting to be harneched power like
(07:55):
that's it's so silly, You're.
Speaker 4 (07:59):
Gonna have those heavy drums. But twenty and the game.
Speaker 1 (08:04):
Will launch on Xbox some some point.
Speaker 3 (08:09):
Coming soon, But yes, I am. I'm intrigued about this.
Speaker 1 (08:14):
It seems like yeah.
Speaker 3 (08:16):
Game that if you get it right, it could become
huge and if you get it right.
Speaker 1 (08:22):
No early reviews yet obviously, but just looking at the trailer,
it the feel to me is like Mass Effect. So
as a fan of the Mass Effect series, I'm very
intrigued and I think I'll be there a super producer,
and Spice Lord Taboo is of course wanting to know
(08:44):
if we're going to do a Dune Awakening hang. Yes,
of course we're going to do a Dune Awakening hang,
but that's after we do the Marvel Rivals hang. That
has yet to happen. Speaking of Marvel Rivals. Speaking of
Marvel Rivals.
Speaker 2 (08:57):
Please.
Speaker 1 (08:59):
So late stage capitalism news from net Ease, the maker
of Marvel Rivals. On February eighteenth, Marvel Rivals revealed the
power sets and the look of Fantastic Force, Human Torch
and the Thing that Are. They released February twenty first Friday,
So those are out now and playable if you are
a fan of the game and very fun.
Speaker 3 (09:22):
Looks great, nothing could go wrong. This is a very
popular game.
Speaker 1 (09:25):
And then it announced that they were shutting down the
US support division of Marvel Rival is a game that
has made hundreds of millions of.
Speaker 4 (09:33):
Dollars and has been massively successful in North.
Speaker 1 (09:36):
America, extremely extremely successful. This group includes level designers, people
that work work on maps, and some support for the
team that is based in China. Now, this is we
can blame Neti's for this, but this is also this
is a sad fact of how the industry works, and
(09:59):
this particular division is like not the Also, yeah, this
is not the harm division. This is this is the
overseas contractor in a reversal of many of the kind
of tech stories that we think and know about, whether
it's in movies and TV and video games of animators
that are based somewhere overseas because they're cheaper and then
you can just lay them off. Well that's the thing
(10:20):
that happened here to these American contractors.
Speaker 3 (10:24):
Yeah, we found outvia LinkedIn faddyus. Sessa, who is a
game director that worked on Budgets and sat and staff, said,
this is such a weird industry and my stellar talent
team just helped deliver an incredibly successful new franchise in
Marvel Rivals for Netty's Games. And we're just laid off.
We also leveled designer Jack Burrows confirmed the layoff. WELP,
(10:44):
just got laid off for my job. Was enormous pleasure
to work with my American coworkers who joined me in
this sad culling. Turns out the size of the US
team was actually it was six people, but as noted,
Hit Natties has twenty nine, one hundred and twenty eight employees,
so it felt like a huge hit here because we
were like, wait, Marvel Rivals is so successful, been the
(11:07):
grand scheme of things.
Speaker 4 (11:09):
It was not a huge.
Speaker 3 (11:11):
Set of layoffs, but it is a classic video game situation,
classic tech spased situation.
Speaker 1 (11:17):
Really, up next, we're gonna speak to your friendly neighborhood
Spider Man showrunner Jeff Trammel is just a wonderful guy
and he's gonna provide some great insights into a really
fun series, including dropping some really interesting news about season two.
Jeff tremil back.
Speaker 3 (11:37):
After this, Hey, Jeff, thanks so much for joining us
(11:58):
on the X ray vision with excited to have you
here with big fans of your friendly neighbhood.
Speaker 5 (12:03):
Spider Man as our discord.
Speaker 3 (12:06):
I just want to start seeing as we're talking to
you so soon after the show has ended. How you
feeling now the first season is out there and people
have watched it, and you're getting those responses.
Speaker 6 (12:17):
Back, feeling great? I mean, I think there was a
you know, a little trepidation with the show from fans,
which I get. You know, there's a very high bar
for Spider Man series. But I like to think that we,
you know, we're able to kind of meet that. People
were excited about seeing the show, and I think so
(12:37):
many people have messaged me about how much they've loved it.
So it's been really cool to kind of see that
gradual rollout and people really start to appreciate it.
Speaker 1 (12:46):
Tell us a little bit about the genesis of this show,
how you arrived at the approach and the look and
the feel and the tone of it, because it really
is such a singular take on Spider Man, something that's
very hard to do after what has it been sixty
years of Spider Man. Uh yeah, tell us about it.
Speaker 6 (13:12):
Yeah, So, like, very early on, we kind of had
a very core concept of what the show could be,
so and it was kind of evolving that out to like, Okay,
what's something that would be exciting for me as a fan,
what's something that's exciting for the studio, but also just
like if you're watching and you're a longtime fan, what's
something that's going to kind of prepeak your interest as
(13:35):
well as like if you're completely new to Spider Man,
what's going to get you to stay here? So for me,
it was like finding that mixture of I'm a longtime fan,
I would love this, whether that's the look, whether that's
the feel of the characters, whether that's you know, just
changing who Peter interacts with just to kind of like
immediately change his worldview, or you know, being able to
(13:55):
pull in newer characters, and you know, honestly just more
diverse characters as well, because you know, coming from Creak
of the Creek, I want to make sure that our
show has that representation and making sure that people can
kind of see themselves in the characters. So and honestly
became like, you know, we have this character like Lonnie
Lincoln who's very attached to Spider Man Cannon, but still
(14:18):
out of room to build in a character for him
even beyond what we know or where we know he
ends up in the comics. And then on that same foot,
being able to take a character like Nico Monoru who
is not as vintage of a character, but still be
able to like take her introduce her to a new
audience as well as like a Pearl as well as
like a reinvention on a Harry or Norman. So honestly,
(14:40):
it's a lot of like kind of mixing and matching
of just kind of like classic elements and new fun twists.
Speaker 3 (14:45):
Yeah, I'm really glad you brought Lonnie because that was
I mean, you know, I was dming you about it
like that was like a seriously, in my opinion, like
a seriously incredible arc that you crafted for him. Like
in our disc we had people saying, I don't want
to see where this goes. I know who Lonnie is,
Like this is you know, we're going to get this
(15:08):
story about the reality of being a kid in New
York and gangs. But you guys managed to take that
on a really unexpected journey and end up with Lonnie
and Peter still working together. Could you talk a little
bit about Lonnie and his journey.
Speaker 6 (15:23):
Yeah, I mean Lonnie is a character that we really,
I really wanted to dig into, and I think one
of the great kind of like pros of the show
is that everyone is coming to it for better or worse,
with a oh I know how this goes, and being
able to like live have that expectation and play with it,
(15:44):
I think, and keep you on your toes. It's one
of the greatest strengths of the show because again, like
I've been saying this all you know for weeks now,
but like the second you hear like Peter's working with Norman,
your brain is like, Nope, that's not going don't do it,
don't but you know, knowing that and then still trying
to like, Okay, well, what can we do to make
(16:05):
sure that, like you aren't constantly suspicious of Norman, you know,
like they could be a suspicion there, but like maybe
you don't know this dude. You're coming up with preconceived notions.
Maybe it's not so bad. And the same for Lannie,
Like I think even more so with Lonnie because we've
never really dug into his past to this level. So
the fact that you can like see this guy immediately
(16:26):
kind of like take one glance at him through Peter's
lenses and be like, well, he's tall, he's popular, he's
with the girl, I like, this guy.
Speaker 5 (16:34):
Sucks, and you're.
Speaker 6 (16:36):
Like, no, actually, this guy is actually really dope. Please
don't become what you've become in the comics. So being
able to kind of again play with those expectations has
made it really I think engaging, because it would have
been I think it would have been really easy to
just like make him Tombstone and the audience not care,
(16:57):
but to kind of like get the audience on board
of like, no, please don't go down that path, and
then to see that but then it's still not go
the way you think it's going to go. I think
it's just a really fun twist, and just like I
think there's something so cool about that episode nine, like
team up and a shot of like the two faces
and lighting because they've been on the same path this
(17:18):
whole time. Just very different, you know, variables along the way.
Speaker 1 (17:23):
There's so many wonderful spins on characters, as you mentioned
that people are very conversant with. You mentioned Lannie, of
course Peter, but there's a take on doctor Octopus here
that I think is so dashing and charming and like
wonderfully modern as well. The Scorpion is more brutal and
(17:49):
scary than I can remember him being tell us about
how you took what you looked at and saw his
classic elements and how you decided to add these little dashes.
Speaker 6 (18:02):
You know, Honestly, we can lean a lot on our
visual elements for that classic look, and that's been awesome,
like having our team led by Leonardo Romero, who is
just phenomenal, but like, yeah, being able to take like
the classic doc doc look with like the Eric Larson
starbursts on the glasses and like uh sunbursts, uh star wars.
Speaker 5 (18:30):
Yes with the candies. Yeah, but yeah, being.
Speaker 6 (18:34):
Able to like take a character that looks so classic
and then tweak him a bit so he's a little
more uh debonair. He's a little more you know. And
that's the thing too, like we really wanted to dig
into these characters and make sure that they don't feel
really one note and they feel multi layer, like oh,
I think you know, we all kind of expect what
(18:54):
we see when we see OC to kind of be like, Okay,
he's annoyed. He's annoyed all the time. He's constantly and
to a degree he is, but also like he's got
that salesmanship of like, oh Meela's here, looking for tech. Yeah,
and like that was a thing where we dug into like, okay,
what if we kind of treat him like, knowing what
now that we're at the end of the season, knowing
(19:15):
that he used to work with Norman and they split.
What's the thing that he thinks Norman has that he doesn't.
Maybe it's a salesmanship attitude. Maybe it said used car
salesman kind of vibe. So he's trying to turn that
on when he's you know, selling his wares, and then
the second his person is gone that he bought the stuff,
he drops it. And to me, I think that's fun
(19:36):
because it again shows how doc Ock and Norman complimented
each other, like one of them was the salesman, one
of them was the scientists, and without them each having
that other part, they each kind of have to overcompensate
to kind of fill the void that the other one fell.
Speaker 3 (19:52):
Speaking of Norman, you know, there has to be and
as Jason mentioned things that comics readers are conversant in
that has long been a conversation about Norman and his
waves that he's drawn with in the comic, And here
we get black Norman kind of cininically with his culturally
appropriate hairstyle and his delightful son Harry. So could you
(20:15):
talk a little bit about that choice, because the way
you bring Norman to life in this me and Jason
in those middle episodes when we were talking about we
really were like, hey, maybe he's benevolent, maybe he's maybe
maybe in his universe, Norman really doesn't have machinations.
Speaker 4 (20:31):
So could you talk a little bit about that balance
and kind.
Speaker 3 (20:34):
Of holding the truth about Norman till that last couple
of episodes.
Speaker 6 (20:39):
Yeah, I mean, honestly, the Norman of it all was
a mixture of you wanting to shake things up, you
wanting to like, okay, again, if we're going to introduce Norman,
you're gonna come with so many preconceived notions, especially if
he is like exactly how you've always seen it. So
even just changing that, I think visually you're like, Okay,
well I know the name Norman Osborne, but this guy
(21:02):
is a completely different guy. So I think that helps.
It's also, you know, going back to my previous statement
about like wanting New York to feel a bit more real,
a bit more like accurate to kind of modern day,
and I think like being able to come tomorrow and
be like, hey, I'd be down to like gender swap
these characters if you guys are or race swap these characters.
(21:25):
Is that something I can do with Norman and them
to immediately be on board them like yeah, sure.
Speaker 4 (21:29):
Like for many years they're like, well this makes sense.
Speaker 5 (21:35):
Yeah, oh good, he brought it up.
Speaker 6 (21:37):
No, but no, like I think so many things like
the same way that we're able to like lean on
doc Ock or lean on like a classic Scorpion and
then kind of ratchet up. This was the other version
where it's like, Okay, we can take elements from Norman,
but at the end of the day, this is a
different guy. So am I unfairly judging this guy based
(21:59):
on the actions of another Norman Osborne? So honestly, that
I think was the kind of just having that and
knowing that's what we wanted to do made sense to
also kind of change up Norman because so much of
our world is different, and then extending that to Harry
and then just like digging into how it's Harry different
in this world. And one of the things that I
thought was cool is like, Okay, well he's a super
(22:21):
popular kid in this world. What does that mean for him,
does that mean he's kind of very closed off? And
if so, like he's going to value having Peter as
a friend. Because what I didn't want to do is like, Okay,
here's Harry and here's Peter and here's Norman, and they're
both fighting for Norman's love, and it's like this Norman, he.
Speaker 5 (22:41):
This is his son. He's like, ooh, new son.
Speaker 6 (22:47):
So like even that, you know, it was like, okay, well,
if we're not doing that, what do they appreciate about
each other? And I think Harry appreciates something about Peter,
even beyond the power. It's just that he's a nice,
likable guy that is seen as well liked and has
a community that like Harry doesn't have. And on the
other hand, Peter is very much like Harry's super cool,
(23:08):
he's popular, he's kind of Debonair's wild, He's all these
things that I don't have. So they both have something
to appreciate the same way that, like Norman and Atto
each kind of could take something from one another, Peter
and Harry could theoretically have a similar.
Speaker 1 (23:23):
Bump another Norman question, because I love this moment. As
Rosie mentioned, you know, we spent a lot of the
series after the introduction of Norman being like, oh, maybe
he's yeah, maybe he's good, Like he seems like a
really cool guy, and it is not.
Speaker 4 (23:40):
When Norman is so real.
Speaker 1 (23:42):
It's like a partnership. It seems beneficial to everybody, and
it's really not until you know there's inklings. But it's
not until he gives Peter the advice that with great
power comes great respect. Then you're like, oh shit, tell
us about that moment and that really wonderful inversion of
like the classic Spider Man philosophy.
Speaker 6 (24:05):
Knowing that we weren't going to do the kind of
like classic Uncle Ben's story, that opened it up immediately.
So it was like, okay, well, eventually Peter needs to
hear the line, right, you know, everyone everyone wants it,
everyone's craving it. And as we were like going down
the story, going to the path, it was like, okay, well,
(24:25):
you know, it makes sense to Norman's a lot in
a lot of ways. It's mentor it makes sense for
Norman deliver it. But Norman wouldn't say this, Like it
would feel forced if Norman said it, and like no
one would be happy if Norman said it. So then
it was like, okay, well, if I'm Norman, if I'm
this guy that's literally like started from nowhere and now
(24:47):
I have one of the tallest buildings in New York
and like this is my company and I've like done
all it takes to kind of like escalate my value
in the eyes of the world. What would I value
the most? And it's clearer than it's respect. So then
it was just like trying to find the verbiage to
find it, and the second like with great power comes
(25:07):
great respect clicked. It was like, Okay, yep, we got it.
Speaker 5 (25:11):
The show. The show's done. We figured it out.
Speaker 6 (25:14):
But no, like honestly like that, I think that speaks
true to like Norman's entire like journey, and it does
feel like something you believe in. But also we as
the audience are like, that's the You're that's not it.
It's icky, and I don't like it.
Speaker 4 (25:30):
Yeah, you're like, we know this is not gonna be good.
Speaker 6 (25:35):
Yeah. So like it's also the kind of thing that
like would leave an impact on a young person, let
alone a young hero. So it's like, Okay, you're getting
bad advice at the worst possible time to get it.
What does this mean for Peter. So that was always
like an exciting thing that I really wanted to like
dig into and how that affects Peter, because I didn't
(25:56):
want it to be like, oh, well Norman's bad to
Peter's bad, and it's very like one note. But like
that to me is like you're slowly watching Peter become
more confident and in a lot of ways less confident,
so like Norman catches him at the right time to.
Speaker 5 (26:10):
Impart this knowledge in him.
Speaker 3 (26:12):
Yeah, I love that as well, because we all know
that even though Peter gets that advice from Uncle Ben
in the classics story like Great Power Cone's Great Suppose Billy,
he still messes up at the beginning and depending on
the version, allows you know, Uncle Ben to be killed.
Speaker 4 (26:27):
So I love that.
Speaker 3 (26:28):
Here his moment is that fight with Scorpion where he
almost goes too far, but then you have Lonnie come
in and say like, that's that's not who you are.
I love that so much. Another kind of Norman centric
thing that I thought was really cool is my nephew
is eleven, and he really got into Spider Man through
obviously the old movies.
Speaker 4 (26:48):
He likes weird stuff, so he loves Spider Man.
Speaker 3 (26:51):
Three, but he loves he loves doing the dance, but
he loves the video games.
Speaker 4 (26:57):
So I've played them pretty extensively with him. It was
really cool to see.
Speaker 3 (27:02):
Video game stuff built in here, from the suits to
the visualization of how you go across New York to
collecting the little things that you need to that are
impacted by.
Speaker 4 (27:13):
Gamma radiation, etc.
Speaker 3 (27:15):
Could you talk a little bit about building that in
and kind of the way that you guys understood that
for a lot of kids, that is there in was
actually the games rather than the movies or the comics.
Speaker 6 (27:29):
You know, that's a It's funny because so many so
many people on our show are you know, of course
fans of Spidey, and as we've talked about, there's sixty
years of Spidey. So there's like, in a lot of ways,
weird lead no blind spots because everyone is like, oh,
I loved this or I grew up with this version.
I love the games, or I love the films, or
(27:50):
I love Spider Man three.
Speaker 5 (27:52):
You know, so what happens.
Speaker 6 (27:54):
It becomes a thing where like we're all like, oh,
we should try this thing, or we should do this,
or we should do that, and like, I'm such a
fan of the games as well, it was like it
was kind of a no brainer because it's like they're
fantastic and we can like, really, there's something nice about
being rewarded as a fan for watching a thing and
(28:15):
not in a way where it's like ostracizing to people
that don't get it, but just like a oh, I
picked up on that, you know, whether it's like a
pizza time side at the pizza shop in the first episode,
or whether it's just like the pose that Peter hits
when he scorpion efforts thing is just yeah, that's a
video game holding screen, Like you know, like those things
(28:35):
I think are so even just talking about them like
makes me get goosewomps because it's so it's to me,
like the perfect payoff of I love this character. I
love these stories, and it's not just like referential for
referential sake, but you know, building them into the story
in a way that feels satisfying. Like one of my
favorite ones that I haven't I've seen a few people
(28:57):
talk about, but honestly not a ton is like in
the finale when Peter webs the alien goes, you got
to go Home Man that is from But it's like,
I just love that moment so much, and there's something
so nice about like linking all these characters together through
every incarnation and having the opportunity to do so, because
(29:19):
it's also like in a lot of ways us paying
respect to everything that's come before us. So, I mean,
I feel like I might have answered that question, but.
Speaker 3 (29:27):
Yeah, it's great to know like all the different Yeah,
we can feel all the different inspirations. But it's really
lovely when you speak to someone and they're like, oh, yeah, no,
those were on Papa's It wasn't the fluid.
Speaker 1 (29:37):
Yeah, let's talk about the ending, because I found it
truly a jaw dropper as a time fan of Spidey
and Spidey stories. And for if anybody has not finished
Your Friendly Room Spider Man, spoiler.
Speaker 7 (29:55):
Stop now, spoiler warning, put your ammas on. Spoiler amas interview. Now,
go finish it and then come back. I'm gonna give
you a three count to get out of here. Three
two one, Okay, here we go. The reveal that Richard
Parker is here, is in this world, that he is
in jail for something opens up so many crazy possibilities.
(30:19):
Tell us about the decision to add Richard Parker to
this story.
Speaker 6 (30:24):
So much of this show is you know, same bit different, similar,
bit different, And when I was trying to figure out, like, okay,
what is our season one? What's the story I want
to tell? What's this world? There was something very interesting
to me about like, oh, there's there's something that we
shouldn't know that the character should And for me, I'm like, okay,
(30:47):
well we aren't doing the typical Uncle Ben moment. We're
taking that off screen and then we're going to feel
Ben's kind of like guidance through Peter throughout the season.
But also like there's something so interesting to me about
like digging into a world where like Peter is Spider Man,
but there's character, there's a character around that's never around
(31:09):
when he's Spider Man, because what does that mean for
like just you know the intersection of it. So then
it became like, okay, well Richard will be really interesting.
And then it was just kind of like figuring out
a story that really worked for that character and then
kind of like finding ways to hint at it without
saying it outright so it doesn't feel like, oh my god,
(31:32):
what happened this guy's here, and like there's little moments
like in episode six where they're talking about their families
and Peter purposely says my mom passed away a while
ago and doesn't say my parents. And I'm like, okay,
that's a little if you catch it cool, if you don't, like,
you're not going to overthink it either.
Speaker 4 (31:52):
You're just kind of exactly you start to find this exactly.
Speaker 6 (31:57):
So I love having Richard out there. I'm really excited
to dig into Richard, and I think it's a fun,
fun place.
Speaker 2 (32:07):
Oh yeah, the discord.
Speaker 4 (32:09):
The discord was going crazy. Okay, just before you go,
you just drop.
Speaker 3 (32:14):
The Gwen Stacy and Spider Gwen images as a tease
for season two, could you just do like a little
fun ties, not necessarily about Gwen, but about where these
characters are going to go next and kind of where
you guys are at on season two.
Speaker 6 (32:28):
We're pretty deep into season two. I know a few
weeks ago, Brad Wonderbaum mentioned in an interview that, like
where near the end of writing, we've already started getting
a little animation back, so you know, the wait for
season two shouldn't be as long as season one was.
We're kind of like building the world. But even that,
we're like continuing to build upon and push even further
(32:51):
in terms of the Gwen of it all. She is
in the show and that's kind of all.
Speaker 5 (32:57):
I feel comfortable, well perfect, It's true. Come find Yeah,
I'll say this.
Speaker 6 (33:08):
Everyone was asking me where did that spider go in
the first episode. I think now we have an idea.
Speaker 5 (33:13):
For the.
Speaker 1 (33:16):
Exciting, exciting side. Well, Jeff t showrunner, your friendly neighborhood
spider Man. Watch it now on Disney Plus. Thank you
so much for joining us. It is wonderful to have
you here.
Speaker 5 (33:26):
Thank you guys for having me.
Speaker 4 (33:27):
It was so great to have you.
Speaker 3 (33:28):
Where can people find you online, Jeff if they want
to follow you, and you will if you.
Speaker 6 (33:31):
Want to follow me. I am on some social Media's
at mister Jeff Trammel. Two f's, two m's, two l's.
Speaker 5 (33:41):
Yeah.
Speaker 6 (33:42):
Please, if you you know, reach out to me. Tell
me how much you enjoy the show. Please don't yell
at me about thanks.
Speaker 1 (33:49):
You every day.
Speaker 3 (33:55):
If you've got nice things to say, like many and
not this quote, do Jeff.
Speaker 1 (33:59):
Let me on Tuesday, it's our first book club. Wednesday,
we continue our weekly coverage Severance. Yes, We're doing that weekly.
Send us your theories, let us know what you think
Luman is up to. And then on Thursday, the Road
to Born Again continues with the first season recap of
Daredevil season one. Formerly on Netflix, you can find it
(34:20):
now on Disney Plus. That's it for this episode. Thanks
for listening well. But x ray Vision is hosted by Jasoncepcion.
Speaker 4 (34:32):
And Rosie Night and is a production of iHeart Podcasts.
Speaker 3 (34:35):
Our executive producers are Joe Alminique and Aaron Kaufman.
Speaker 1 (34:39):
Our supervising producer is Abu Zafar.
Speaker 4 (34:42):
Our producers are Common Laurent Dean Jonathan.
Speaker 3 (34:45):
And Fay Wax.
Speaker 1 (34:46):
Our theme song is by Brian Vasquez, with alternate theme
songs by Aaron Kaufman.
Speaker 3 (34:50):
Special thanks to Saul Rubin, Chris Lord, Kenny Goodman, and
Heidi Our disc called Moderate th
On today's news episode, we're also talking to your friendly
neighborhood spider Man showrunner Jeff Tremmel and more, and he
drops a juicy nugget in this interview, so stay tuned.
Speaker 2 (00:10):
Here we go.
Speaker 1 (00:25):
Hello, my name is Jason Young and I'm Mersey Night,
and welcome back to the X revision of the podcast
where we dive deep for dear favorite shows, movies, comics,
and pop culture. Coming over our podcast or we're bringing
you three huge episodes every single week's news on the weekends.
Speaker 3 (00:39):
Yes, and in today's previously on news episode, we are
catching up on all the biggest geek news of the week,
including we got a premier day the Last of Us
season two were and we're also cl some first pictures
from the adaptation of Martha Well's Murder Box that's going
to be on Apple TV.
Speaker 2 (00:58):
Plus.
Speaker 3 (00:58):
I feel like that could be a set level here
if they get it right. We got some Doom news,
Marvel Rivals layoffs chat, and that aforementioned interview with your
friendly neighborhood spider Man right Jeff Trumout, which does include
some spoilers for the season one finale and the series,
but also includes a nice interesting scoop for season two,
(01:21):
so make sure you stay listening.
Speaker 4 (01:23):
But first, let's talk about news.
Speaker 1 (01:27):
First up, the Last of Us Season two on HBO
gets its premiere date. For those of you who have
been upset because it appears that Catherine Devor did not
get into the gym get swollen, it ripped for Abby, well,
you're gonna have to be satisfied with this news about
the release date, which is April thirteenth, nine pm Eastern.
(01:51):
Not long to wait, guys, here it comes on HBON Max.
We're gonna be covering the show and we're super excited.
Speaker 4 (01:58):
Yes, I'm very too about it. I'm excited about it.
Speaker 1 (02:01):
I'm scared about it. I'm worried about it. Yeah, trepidacious
the whole thing.
Speaker 3 (02:05):
I think that Catherine Deava has the chops. I don't
think she needs to get buff to be Abby. I
think she just needs to be menacing and paralyzing. We
need you to get just like It's fine, like the
characters important. Jason, were you a fan of the Last
(02:26):
of Us Part two?
Speaker 4 (02:26):
The game?
Speaker 3 (02:28):
I was.
Speaker 2 (02:29):
Yes.
Speaker 1 (02:31):
It was absolutely grim and gritty and morally questionable and
emotionally hard hitting and ultra ultra violence. And a incredible story.
Speaker 3 (02:43):
Truly an unbelievable experience to play that game, and I'm
very interested to see how that translates to the season.
I also saw that they had a great poster with
Pedro Pascal as Joel and it says the tagline is
something like every choice has consequences, and I think that
that is going to be so interesting to see how
(03:04):
that plays out.
Speaker 4 (03:05):
Can't wait for that show.
Speaker 3 (03:07):
Yep, we'll be covering it and it is going to
be coming up much sooner than it feels possible. So
if you want to replay the game, great time to
start now, and you know we'll be chatting about it
in the discord. There's lots of conversation about Last of
Us Season two in there.
Speaker 1 (03:19):
Next up, Apple TV plus has unveiled a couple of
images two images from its highly anticipated upcoming sci fi
thriller series murder Bots, which is, of course the adaptation
of Martha Well's Hugo and Nebula Award winning book series.
(03:40):
Very very readable, great book series about a robot who
is fascinated by human emotion. Yeah, I'll just say that,
and it stars Alexander Alexander Scarsguard of Succession true Blood,
big littleized others, and if they get this right, this
(04:02):
is gonna be huge.
Speaker 3 (04:03):
It feels like this could be another massive breakthrough hit.
We were talking in the group chat and super producer
Carmen mentioned, you know, I only ever see memes from
Apple Plus TV that are about Severance.
Speaker 4 (04:15):
And I was thinking about it, and I was like,
that is.
Speaker 3 (04:17):
Their first massive breakthrough hit where people who have never
watched Severance know who Milchick is, people who have never
watched Severance are using inyan auiti as colloquial.
Speaker 4 (04:28):
Terms about going to work.
Speaker 3 (04:29):
Like it has really had that cultural smash hit feeling.
Speaker 4 (04:34):
And I'm very interested.
Speaker 3 (04:37):
To see how they adapt this book because Martha Wells
has such a light touch when it comes to comedic
sci fi kind of dystopia, and she is murder Bot
is definitely her.
Speaker 4 (04:54):
Most popular series.
Speaker 3 (04:55):
She also writes fantasy stuff like The Witch King and
other books. But I think that getting that tone right
is going to be the most important thing. And also
like the breeziness of the books, as you said, Jason,
feels very readable. I'm interested to see if they're going
to be able to capture that in a prestige TV setting.
But I have to say, until this reveal of the photos,
(05:18):
I didn't know that it was Alexander Scarsguard starring in this.
Speaker 4 (05:22):
And I think he absolutely has the chops.
Speaker 2 (05:24):
He can be.
Speaker 3 (05:24):
Funny, he can be scary, he can be weird, he
can be emotionless, he can be vulnerable. I think that
with a writing team that includes Academy Award nominees, you know,
created by Chris and Paul White who did About a
Boy and Mozige in the Jungle, I'm interested and I
think this could potentially become Prestige TV magic.
Speaker 4 (05:48):
But it will be interesting to see.
Speaker 3 (05:49):
Because Apple has had some huge properties that they've managed
to adapt, they have not necessarily hit the lofty heights
of severance. But I can't wait to see this, and
I think Scarsguard is a Kia Costing.
Speaker 5 (06:01):
I agree.
Speaker 1 (06:02):
We're gonna take a break, be right back, Yeah, and
we're back. Video game fans, Dune Awakening has just released
(06:25):
a trailer announcing its release date. The game is coming
out on PC May twentieth. It is a massively multiplayer
online style game of survival game a lot of sandworm action.
In the trailer, dune heads, get ready, this looks right
(06:46):
up your alley.
Speaker 3 (06:47):
You can do spice, you can get the blue eyed glow.
Speaker 4 (06:51):
You can And also a very.
Speaker 3 (06:53):
Important point here, thank you to whom stever amongst you
mentioned this in our show notes. But the main character
is very hot, and that is very important in a
modern game, whether it is Balder's Gate Anasterian, whether.
Speaker 4 (07:09):
It is the recent billion dollar.
Speaker 3 (07:12):
Making romance game Love and Deep Space, which if you know,
you know, and just made its creator a billion dollars
for the first time, one of the most popular boyfriend
sim games.
Speaker 4 (07:24):
You gotta have a hot video game character.
Speaker 3 (07:26):
And I feel like in an era where Zendaa and.
Speaker 4 (07:30):
Timmy Shallo may are your leads in Dune.
Speaker 3 (07:33):
Alongside stars like you know, Oscar Isaac, Famous Daddy and
other hotties. Austin Bala he wasn't looking too hot, but
you know he's got his fans. He's got his fans,
even with that fair, bold head. But I feel like
having a hot main character is very important. Also absolutely
obsessed with a power waiting to be harneched power like
(07:55):
that's it's so silly, You're.
Speaker 4 (07:59):
Gonna have those heavy drums. But twenty and the game.
Speaker 1 (08:04):
Will launch on Xbox some some point.
Speaker 3 (08:09):
Coming soon, But yes, I am. I'm intrigued about this.
Speaker 1 (08:14):
It seems like yeah.
Speaker 3 (08:16):
Game that if you get it right, it could become
huge and if you get it right.
Speaker 1 (08:22):
No early reviews yet obviously, but just looking at the trailer,
it the feel to me is like Mass Effect. So
as a fan of the Mass Effect series, I'm very
intrigued and I think I'll be there a super producer,
and Spice Lord Taboo is of course wanting to know
(08:44):
if we're going to do a Dune Awakening hang. Yes,
of course we're going to do a Dune Awakening hang,
but that's after we do the Marvel Rivals hang. That
has yet to happen. Speaking of Marvel Rivals. Speaking of
Marvel Rivals.
Speaker 2 (08:57):
Please.
Speaker 1 (08:59):
So late stage capitalism news from net Ease, the maker
of Marvel Rivals. On February eighteenth, Marvel Rivals revealed the
power sets and the look of Fantastic Force, Human Torch
and the Thing that Are. They released February twenty first Friday,
So those are out now and playable if you are
a fan of the game and very fun.
Speaker 3 (09:22):
Looks great, nothing could go wrong. This is a very
popular game.
Speaker 1 (09:25):
And then it announced that they were shutting down the
US support division of Marvel Rival is a game that
has made hundreds of millions of.
Speaker 4 (09:33):
Dollars and has been massively successful in North.
Speaker 1 (09:36):
America, extremely extremely successful. This group includes level designers, people
that work work on maps, and some support for the
team that is based in China. Now, this is we
can blame Neti's for this, but this is also this
is a sad fact of how the industry works, and
(09:59):
this particular division is like not the Also, yeah, this
is not the harm division. This is this is the
overseas contractor in a reversal of many of the kind
of tech stories that we think and know about, whether
it's in movies and TV and video games of animators
that are based somewhere overseas because they're cheaper and then
you can just lay them off. Well that's the thing
(10:20):
that happened here to these American contractors.
Speaker 3 (10:24):
Yeah, we found outvia LinkedIn faddyus. Sessa, who is a
game director that worked on Budgets and sat and staff, said,
this is such a weird industry and my stellar talent
team just helped deliver an incredibly successful new franchise in
Marvel Rivals for Netty's Games. And we're just laid off.
We also leveled designer Jack Burrows confirmed the layoff. WELP,
(10:44):
just got laid off for my job. Was enormous pleasure
to work with my American coworkers who joined me in
this sad culling. Turns out the size of the US
team was actually it was six people, but as noted,
Hit Natties has twenty nine, one hundred and twenty eight employees,
so it felt like a huge hit here because we
were like, wait, Marvel Rivals is so successful, been the
(11:07):
grand scheme of things.
Speaker 4 (11:09):
It was not a huge.
Speaker 3 (11:11):
Set of layoffs, but it is a classic video game situation,
classic tech spased situation.
Speaker 1 (11:17):
Really, up next, we're gonna speak to your friendly neighborhood
Spider Man showrunner Jeff Trammel is just a wonderful guy
and he's gonna provide some great insights into a really
fun series, including dropping some really interesting news about season two.
Jeff tremil back.
Speaker 3 (11:37):
After this, Hey, Jeff, thanks so much for joining us
(11:58):
on the X ray vision with excited to have you
here with big fans of your friendly neighbhood.
Speaker 5 (12:03):
Spider Man as our discord.
Speaker 3 (12:06):
I just want to start seeing as we're talking to
you so soon after the show has ended. How you
feeling now the first season is out there and people
have watched it, and you're getting those responses.
Speaker 6 (12:17):
Back, feeling great? I mean, I think there was a
you know, a little trepidation with the show from fans,
which I get. You know, there's a very high bar
for Spider Man series. But I like to think that we,
you know, we're able to kind of meet that. People
were excited about seeing the show, and I think so
(12:37):
many people have messaged me about how much they've loved it.
So it's been really cool to kind of see that
gradual rollout and people really start to appreciate it.
Speaker 1 (12:46):
Tell us a little bit about the genesis of this show,
how you arrived at the approach and the look and
the feel and the tone of it, because it really
is such a singular take on Spider Man, something that's
very hard to do after what has it been sixty
years of Spider Man. Uh yeah, tell us about it.
Speaker 6 (13:12):
Yeah, So, like, very early on, we kind of had
a very core concept of what the show could be,
so and it was kind of evolving that out to like, Okay,
what's something that would be exciting for me as a fan,
what's something that's exciting for the studio, but also just
like if you're watching and you're a longtime fan, what's
something that's going to kind of prepeak your interest as
(13:35):
well as like if you're completely new to Spider Man,
what's going to get you to stay here? So for me,
it was like finding that mixture of I'm a longtime fan,
I would love this, whether that's the look, whether that's
the feel of the characters, whether that's you know, just
changing who Peter interacts with just to kind of like
immediately change his worldview, or you know, being able to
(13:55):
pull in newer characters, and you know, honestly just more
diverse characters as well, because you know, coming from Creak
of the Creek, I want to make sure that our
show has that representation and making sure that people can
kind of see themselves in the characters. So and honestly
became like, you know, we have this character like Lonnie
Lincoln who's very attached to Spider Man Cannon, but still
(14:18):
out of room to build in a character for him
even beyond what we know or where we know he
ends up in the comics. And then on that same foot,
being able to take a character like Nico Monoru who
is not as vintage of a character, but still be
able to like take her introduce her to a new
audience as well as like a Pearl as well as
like a reinvention on a Harry or Norman. So honestly,
(14:40):
it's a lot of like kind of mixing and matching
of just kind of like classic elements and new fun twists.
Speaker 3 (14:45):
Yeah, I'm really glad you brought Lonnie because that was
I mean, you know, I was dming you about it
like that was like a seriously, in my opinion, like
a seriously incredible arc that you crafted for him. Like
in our disc we had people saying, I don't want
to see where this goes. I know who Lonnie is,
Like this is you know, we're going to get this
(15:08):
story about the reality of being a kid in New
York and gangs. But you guys managed to take that
on a really unexpected journey and end up with Lonnie
and Peter still working together. Could you talk a little
bit about Lonnie and his journey.
Speaker 6 (15:23):
Yeah, I mean Lonnie is a character that we really,
I really wanted to dig into, and I think one
of the great kind of like pros of the show
is that everyone is coming to it for better or worse,
with a oh I know how this goes, and being
able to like live have that expectation and play with it,
(15:44):
I think, and keep you on your toes. It's one
of the greatest strengths of the show because again, like
I've been saying this all you know for weeks now,
but like the second you hear like Peter's working with Norman,
your brain is like, Nope, that's not going don't do it,
don't but you know, knowing that and then still trying
to like, Okay, well, what can we do to make
(16:05):
sure that, like you aren't constantly suspicious of Norman, you know,
like they could be a suspicion there, but like maybe
you don't know this dude. You're coming up with preconceived notions.
Maybe it's not so bad. And the same for Lannie,
Like I think even more so with Lonnie because we've
never really dug into his past to this level. So
the fact that you can like see this guy immediately
(16:26):
kind of like take one glance at him through Peter's
lenses and be like, well, he's tall, he's popular, he's
with the girl, I like, this guy.
Speaker 5 (16:34):
Sucks, and you're.
Speaker 6 (16:36):
Like, no, actually, this guy is actually really dope. Please
don't become what you've become in the comics. So being
able to kind of again play with those expectations has
made it really I think engaging, because it would have
been I think it would have been really easy to
just like make him Tombstone and the audience not care,
(16:57):
but to kind of like get the audience on board
of like, no, please don't go down that path, and
then to see that but then it's still not go
the way you think it's going to go. I think
it's just a really fun twist, and just like I
think there's something so cool about that episode nine, like
team up and a shot of like the two faces
and lighting because they've been on the same path this
(17:18):
whole time. Just very different, you know, variables along the way.
Speaker 1 (17:23):
There's so many wonderful spins on characters, as you mentioned
that people are very conversant with. You mentioned Lannie, of
course Peter, but there's a take on doctor Octopus here
that I think is so dashing and charming and like
wonderfully modern as well. The Scorpion is more brutal and
(17:49):
scary than I can remember him being tell us about
how you took what you looked at and saw his
classic elements and how you decided to add these little dashes.
Speaker 6 (18:02):
You know, Honestly, we can lean a lot on our
visual elements for that classic look, and that's been awesome,
like having our team led by Leonardo Romero, who is
just phenomenal, but like, yeah, being able to take like
the classic doc doc look with like the Eric Larson
starbursts on the glasses and like uh sunbursts, uh star wars.
Speaker 5 (18:30):
Yes with the candies. Yeah, but yeah, being.
Speaker 6 (18:34):
Able to like take a character that looks so classic
and then tweak him a bit so he's a little
more uh debonair. He's a little more you know. And
that's the thing too, like we really wanted to dig
into these characters and make sure that they don't feel
really one note and they feel multi layer, like oh,
I think you know, we all kind of expect what
(18:54):
we see when we see OC to kind of be like, Okay,
he's annoyed. He's annoyed all the time. He's constantly and
to a degree he is, but also like he's got
that salesmanship of like, oh Meela's here, looking for tech. Yeah,
and like that was a thing where we dug into like, okay,
what if we kind of treat him like, knowing what
now that we're at the end of the season, knowing
(19:15):
that he used to work with Norman and they split.
What's the thing that he thinks Norman has that he doesn't.
Maybe it's a salesmanship attitude. Maybe it said used car
salesman kind of vibe. So he's trying to turn that
on when he's you know, selling his wares, and then
the second his person is gone that he bought the stuff,
he drops it. And to me, I think that's fun
(19:36):
because it again shows how doc Ock and Norman complimented
each other, like one of them was the salesman, one
of them was the scientists, and without them each having
that other part, they each kind of have to overcompensate
to kind of fill the void that the other one fell.
Speaker 3 (19:52):
Speaking of Norman, you know, there has to be and
as Jason mentioned things that comics readers are conversant in
that has long been a conversation about Norman and his
waves that he's drawn with in the comic, And here
we get black Norman kind of cininically with his culturally
appropriate hairstyle and his delightful son Harry. So could you
(20:15):
talk a little bit about that choice, because the way
you bring Norman to life in this me and Jason
in those middle episodes when we were talking about we
really were like, hey, maybe he's benevolent, maybe he's maybe
maybe in his universe, Norman really doesn't have machinations.
Speaker 4 (20:31):
So could you talk a little bit about that balance
and kind.
Speaker 3 (20:34):
Of holding the truth about Norman till that last couple
of episodes.
Speaker 6 (20:39):
Yeah, I mean, honestly, the Norman of it all was
a mixture of you wanting to shake things up, you
wanting to like, okay, again, if we're going to introduce Norman,
you're gonna come with so many preconceived notions, especially if
he is like exactly how you've always seen it. So
even just changing that, I think visually you're like, Okay,
well I know the name Norman Osborne, but this guy
(21:02):
is a completely different guy. So I think that helps.
It's also, you know, going back to my previous statement
about like wanting New York to feel a bit more real,
a bit more like accurate to kind of modern day,
and I think like being able to come tomorrow and
be like, hey, I'd be down to like gender swap
these characters if you guys are or race swap these characters.
(21:25):
Is that something I can do with Norman and them
to immediately be on board them like yeah, sure.
Speaker 4 (21:29):
Like for many years they're like, well this makes sense.
Speaker 5 (21:35):
Yeah, oh good, he brought it up.
Speaker 6 (21:37):
No, but no, like I think so many things like
the same way that we're able to like lean on
doc Ock or lean on like a classic Scorpion and
then kind of ratchet up. This was the other version
where it's like, Okay, we can take elements from Norman,
but at the end of the day, this is a
different guy. So am I unfairly judging this guy based
(21:59):
on the actions of another Norman Osborne? So honestly, that
I think was the kind of just having that and
knowing that's what we wanted to do made sense to
also kind of change up Norman because so much of
our world is different, and then extending that to Harry
and then just like digging into how it's Harry different
in this world. And one of the things that I
thought was cool is like, Okay, well he's a super
(22:21):
popular kid in this world. What does that mean for him,
does that mean he's kind of very closed off? And
if so, like he's going to value having Peter as
a friend. Because what I didn't want to do is like, Okay,
here's Harry and here's Peter and here's Norman, and they're
both fighting for Norman's love, and it's like this Norman, he.
Speaker 5 (22:41):
This is his son. He's like, ooh, new son.
Speaker 6 (22:47):
So like even that, you know, it was like, okay, well,
if we're not doing that, what do they appreciate about
each other? And I think Harry appreciates something about Peter,
even beyond the power. It's just that he's a nice,
likable guy that is seen as well liked and has
a community that like Harry doesn't have. And on the
other hand, Peter is very much like Harry's super cool,
(23:08):
he's popular, he's kind of Debonair's wild, He's all these
things that I don't have. So they both have something
to appreciate the same way that, like Norman and Atto
each kind of could take something from one another, Peter
and Harry could theoretically have a similar.
Speaker 1 (23:23):
Bump another Norman question, because I love this moment. As
Rosie mentioned, you know, we spent a lot of the
series after the introduction of Norman being like, oh, maybe
he's yeah, maybe he's good, Like he seems like a
really cool guy, and it is not.
Speaker 4 (23:40):
When Norman is so real.
Speaker 1 (23:42):
It's like a partnership. It seems beneficial to everybody, and
it's really not until you know there's inklings. But it's
not until he gives Peter the advice that with great
power comes great respect. Then you're like, oh shit, tell
us about that moment and that really wonderful inversion of
like the classic Spider Man philosophy.
Speaker 6 (24:05):
Knowing that we weren't going to do the kind of
like classic Uncle Ben's story, that opened it up immediately.
So it was like, okay, well, eventually Peter needs to
hear the line, right, you know, everyone everyone wants it,
everyone's craving it. And as we were like going down
the story, going to the path, it was like, okay, well,
(24:25):
you know, it makes sense to Norman's a lot in
a lot of ways. It's mentor it makes sense for
Norman deliver it. But Norman wouldn't say this, Like it
would feel forced if Norman said it, and like no
one would be happy if Norman said it. So then
it was like, okay, well, if I'm Norman, if I'm
this guy that's literally like started from nowhere and now
(24:47):
I have one of the tallest buildings in New York
and like this is my company and I've like done
all it takes to kind of like escalate my value
in the eyes of the world. What would I value
the most? And it's clearer than it's respect. So then
it was just like trying to find the verbiage to
find it, and the second like with great power comes
(25:07):
great respect clicked. It was like, Okay, yep, we got it.
Speaker 5 (25:11):
The show. The show's done. We figured it out.
Speaker 6 (25:14):
But no, like honestly like that, I think that speaks
true to like Norman's entire like journey, and it does
feel like something you believe in. But also we as
the audience are like, that's the You're that's not it.
It's icky, and I don't like it.
Speaker 4 (25:30):
Yeah, you're like, we know this is not gonna be good.
Speaker 6 (25:35):
Yeah. So like it's also the kind of thing that
like would leave an impact on a young person, let
alone a young hero. So it's like, Okay, you're getting
bad advice at the worst possible time to get it.
What does this mean for Peter. So that was always
like an exciting thing that I really wanted to like
dig into and how that affects Peter, because I didn't
(25:56):
want it to be like, oh, well Norman's bad to
Peter's bad, and it's very like one note. But like
that to me is like you're slowly watching Peter become
more confident and in a lot of ways less confident,
so like Norman catches him at the right time to.
Speaker 5 (26:10):
Impart this knowledge in him.
Speaker 3 (26:12):
Yeah, I love that as well, because we all know
that even though Peter gets that advice from Uncle Ben
in the classics story like Great Power Cone's Great Suppose Billy,
he still messes up at the beginning and depending on
the version, allows you know, Uncle Ben to be killed.
Speaker 4 (26:27):
So I love that.
Speaker 3 (26:28):
Here his moment is that fight with Scorpion where he
almost goes too far, but then you have Lonnie come
in and say like, that's that's not who you are.
I love that so much. Another kind of Norman centric
thing that I thought was really cool is my nephew
is eleven, and he really got into Spider Man through
obviously the old movies.
Speaker 4 (26:48):
He likes weird stuff, so he loves Spider Man.
Speaker 3 (26:51):
Three, but he loves he loves doing the dance, but
he loves the video games.
Speaker 4 (26:57):
So I've played them pretty extensively with him. It was
really cool to see.
Speaker 3 (27:02):
Video game stuff built in here, from the suits to
the visualization of how you go across New York to
collecting the little things that you need to that are
impacted by.
Speaker 4 (27:13):
Gamma radiation, etc.
Speaker 3 (27:15):
Could you talk a little bit about building that in
and kind of the way that you guys understood that
for a lot of kids, that is there in was
actually the games rather than the movies or the comics.
Speaker 6 (27:29):
You know, that's a It's funny because so many so
many people on our show are you know, of course
fans of Spidey, and as we've talked about, there's sixty
years of Spidey. So there's like, in a lot of ways,
weird lead no blind spots because everyone is like, oh,
I loved this or I grew up with this version.
I love the games, or I love the films, or
(27:50):
I love Spider Man three.
Speaker 5 (27:52):
You know, so what happens.
Speaker 6 (27:54):
It becomes a thing where like we're all like, oh,
we should try this thing, or we should do this,
or we should do that, and like, I'm such a
fan of the games as well, it was like it
was kind of a no brainer because it's like they're
fantastic and we can like, really, there's something nice about
being rewarded as a fan for watching a thing and
(28:15):
not in a way where it's like ostracizing to people
that don't get it, but just like a oh, I
picked up on that, you know, whether it's like a
pizza time side at the pizza shop in the first episode,
or whether it's just like the pose that Peter hits
when he scorpion efforts thing is just yeah, that's a
video game holding screen, Like you know, like those things
(28:35):
I think are so even just talking about them like
makes me get goosewomps because it's so it's to me,
like the perfect payoff of I love this character. I
love these stories, and it's not just like referential for
referential sake, but you know, building them into the story
in a way that feels satisfying. Like one of my
favorite ones that I haven't I've seen a few people
(28:57):
talk about, but honestly not a ton is like in
the finale when Peter webs the alien goes, you got
to go Home Man that is from But it's like,
I just love that moment so much, and there's something
so nice about like linking all these characters together through
every incarnation and having the opportunity to do so, because
(29:19):
it's also like in a lot of ways us paying
respect to everything that's come before us. So, I mean,
I feel like I might have answered that question, but.
Speaker 3 (29:27):
Yeah, it's great to know like all the different Yeah,
we can feel all the different inspirations. But it's really
lovely when you speak to someone and they're like, oh, yeah, no,
those were on Papa's It wasn't the fluid.
Speaker 1 (29:37):
Yeah, let's talk about the ending, because I found it
truly a jaw dropper as a time fan of Spidey
and Spidey stories. And for if anybody has not finished
Your Friendly Room Spider Man, spoiler.
Speaker 7 (29:55):
Stop now, spoiler warning, put your ammas on. Spoiler amas interview. Now,
go finish it and then come back. I'm gonna give
you a three count to get out of here. Three
two one, Okay, here we go. The reveal that Richard
Parker is here, is in this world, that he is
in jail for something opens up so many crazy possibilities.
(30:19):
Tell us about the decision to add Richard Parker to
this story.
Speaker 6 (30:24):
So much of this show is you know, same bit different, similar,
bit different, And when I was trying to figure out, like, okay,
what is our season one? What's the story I want
to tell? What's this world? There was something very interesting
to me about like, oh, there's there's something that we
shouldn't know that the character should And for me, I'm like, okay,
(30:47):
well we aren't doing the typical Uncle Ben moment. We're
taking that off screen and then we're going to feel
Ben's kind of like guidance through Peter throughout the season.
But also like there's something so interesting to me about
like digging into a world where like Peter is Spider Man,
but there's character, there's a character around that's never around
(31:09):
when he's Spider Man, because what does that mean for
like just you know the intersection of it. So then
it became like, okay, well Richard will be really interesting.
And then it was just kind of like figuring out
a story that really worked for that character and then
kind of like finding ways to hint at it without
saying it outright so it doesn't feel like, oh my god,
(31:32):
what happened this guy's here, and like there's little moments
like in episode six where they're talking about their families
and Peter purposely says my mom passed away a while
ago and doesn't say my parents. And I'm like, okay,
that's a little if you catch it cool, if you don't, like,
you're not going to overthink it either.
Speaker 4 (31:52):
You're just kind of exactly you start to find this exactly.
Speaker 6 (31:57):
So I love having Richard out there. I'm really excited
to dig into Richard, and I think it's a fun,
fun place.
Speaker 2 (32:07):
Oh yeah, the discord.
Speaker 4 (32:09):
The discord was going crazy. Okay, just before you go,
you just drop.
Speaker 3 (32:14):
The Gwen Stacy and Spider Gwen images as a tease
for season two, could you just do like a little
fun ties, not necessarily about Gwen, but about where these
characters are going to go next and kind of where
you guys are at on season two.
Speaker 6 (32:28):
We're pretty deep into season two. I know a few
weeks ago, Brad Wonderbaum mentioned in an interview that, like
where near the end of writing, we've already started getting
a little animation back, so you know, the wait for
season two shouldn't be as long as season one was.
We're kind of like building the world. But even that,
we're like continuing to build upon and push even further
(32:51):
in terms of the Gwen of it all. She is
in the show and that's kind of all.
Speaker 5 (32:57):
I feel comfortable, well perfect, It's true. Come find Yeah,
I'll say this.
Speaker 6 (33:08):
Everyone was asking me where did that spider go in
the first episode. I think now we have an idea.
Speaker 5 (33:13):
For the.
Speaker 1 (33:16):
Exciting, exciting side. Well, Jeff t showrunner, your friendly neighborhood
spider Man. Watch it now on Disney Plus. Thank you
so much for joining us. It is wonderful to have
you here.
Speaker 5 (33:26):
Thank you guys for having me.
Speaker 4 (33:27):
It was so great to have you.
Speaker 3 (33:28):
Where can people find you online, Jeff if they want
to follow you, and you will if you.
Speaker 6 (33:31):
Want to follow me. I am on some social Media's
at mister Jeff Trammel. Two f's, two m's, two l's.
Speaker 5 (33:41):
Yeah.
Speaker 6 (33:42):
Please, if you you know, reach out to me. Tell
me how much you enjoy the show. Please don't yell
at me about thanks.
Speaker 1 (33:49):
You every day.
Speaker 3 (33:55):
If you've got nice things to say, like many and
not this quote, do Jeff.
Speaker 1 (33:59):
Let me on Tuesday, it's our first book club. Wednesday,
we continue our weekly coverage Severance. Yes, We're doing that weekly.
Send us your theories, let us know what you think
Luman is up to. And then on Thursday, the Road
to Born Again continues with the first season recap of
Daredevil season one. Formerly on Netflix, you can find it
(34:20):
now on Disney Plus. That's it for this episode. Thanks
for listening well. But x ray Vision is hosted by Jasoncepcion.
Speaker 4 (34:32):
And Rosie Night and is a production of iHeart Podcasts.
Speaker 3 (34:35):
Our executive producers are Joe Alminique and Aaron Kaufman.
Speaker 1 (34:39):
Our supervising producer is Abu Zafar.
Speaker 4 (34:42):
Our producers are Common Laurent Dean Jonathan.
Speaker 3 (34:45):
And Fay Wax.
Speaker 1 (34:46):
Our theme song is by Brian Vasquez, with alternate theme
songs by Aaron Kaufman.
Speaker 3 (34:50):
Special thanks to Saul Rubin, Chris Lord, Kenny Goodman, and
Heidi Our disc called Moderate th
Hosts And Creators
Jason Concepcion
Rosie Knight
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