Pees in a Pod: Dean Pees shares stories from two decades coaching in the NFL | Part 2

In the second episode of the two-episode series, Dean Pees and Tori McElhaney continue their conversation about his coaching career. In the early 2000s, Bill Belichick hired Pees to join his Patriots staff. After a couple Super Bowls wins, one that included a blackout in New Orleans, four teams, two retirements and two decades in the league, Pees reflects on all the lessons learned and memories made along the way.

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Episode Transcript

Speaker 1 (00:00):
Hello everyone, and welcome back to another special edition of
a podcast brought to you by the Falcons Podcast Network.
I'm Tory mclhaney. I'm joined by defensive coordinator Dean Peas,
and I want to start the podcast off by saying
that I think that we maybe have found a name,
or perhaps figured out a name for this special edition podcast,

(00:22):
and I wanted to run it by you before we
made anything official. We were thanking Peas in a pod.
I think that's fantastic. I love a good pun, I
love a good word play. And our digital team was like,
we think this works. Do you like that? Whatever you guys? Okay,
I'm fine, Okay, fantastic Because we were like peas in

(00:43):
a pod, it just makes sense and like with the podcast,
we're good. So if you didn't join us for the
very first episode, go back and listen to it, because
we talked a lot about Coach's history getting into the
game at the high school level and then on to college.
But today we're actually gonna move into you and your

(01:04):
career making the jump to the professional league. You did
so around the two thousands, which is a time of
horrible fashion but otherwise great football. Now I wanted to
start off. You know, you were the head coach at
Kent State and then you go to the New England
Patriots at the turn of the two thousands. For you,

(01:28):
why did you want to make the jump from college
to professional Well, you know, in all honesty, Tory, I
don't know that I did want to. It's kind of
like when I left high school and went to college.
I didn't really go to college going Okay, this is
what I want to do. I want to get out
of high school coaching and go to college. The situation

(01:51):
presented itself that I could go to a college and
try it, and if I didn't like it, I thought
I'll go back to high school football. And kind of
the same thing happened with the NFL. I'd been the
head coach at Kent for six years. Things were starting
to move in the right direction over there, and then

(02:11):
all of a sudden I had an opportunity from Coach
Belichick called and said, you know, I got this opening
on my staff. Are you interested, And all honesty, I
kind of before I wasn't as interested because I had
with six kids, we had kids in college all the time,
and it was kind of nice because most of them

(02:32):
went to the college that I was coaching for, and
so it was kind of nice that I was around,
right and so, but then all of a sudden, we're
empty nesters and able to kind of pick up and go.
And I thought, Okay, well, now is the time to
do it. If I don't like it, I'll go back

(02:54):
to college. I'd never tried it, so, you know, I mean,
it's a little later in my career for most coaches.
I mean I'd already been coaching thirty years, right, Yeah,
when I go to the NFL, so I said, hey,
well let's see what it's like. Yeah, I don't know
what it's like. I hear rumors of what it's like,
and uh so let's give it a shot. And obviously

(03:17):
being with New England at that point in time wasn't
a bad choice. No, so I thought, I got an
opportunity here. Um talked to her Worth, my wife, let's
do it. And that's what started the NFL career. What
was kind of the initial I don't know what the
work like culture shock of making the jump from college

(03:38):
to professional coaching, because I feel like there's a jump
from like there's a there's differences from the high school
level to the college level. And I'm sure there's differences
between the college level to the professional level for you
kind of what was initially that aha moment I'm in
the NFL. Well, there's sometimes I still pinch myself after
fifty years and how do we ever get here? I'm

(04:01):
from Elmwood High School in Ohile. But you know, I
think that's that's the I think that's the approach you
don't want to take as a coach, is that I
don't think I coached in college any different than I
coached in high school. At least I hope I didn't.
I hope that if somebody walked in it was on
my high school team or one of my college teams,

(04:23):
and watched me coach today, they would say, yeah, that's
the same guy that coached me, because I coached him
the same way. And like we talked about the other
day about teaching and learning, and everybody learns at a
different rate, which just because a guy has now become
a pro, well just two months earlier, he wasn't a pro.

(04:43):
Our rookies were in college, you know, six months ago,
and so they didn't all of a sudden transform into
a professional athlete. In six months. They're still the same
guys that were in college six months ago. So don't
I need to really approach them the same way and
same way with college kids they were just in high school,

(05:05):
you know. And I think if you approach it that way,
you just you teach. Don't assume that because the guys
are pro. Okay, well boy, he knows all this stuff.
He doesn't. He's an elite athlete because he's reached the
next level. He's one of those two percent guys that
makes it. But that doesn't mean that he doesn't learn

(05:27):
the same way that all the other guys learned. It
doesn't mean that you still shouldn't coach him the same
way and tell him here's how you'd like to have
it done, and also get back his feedback. Now, as
guys become season pros and they've been in the league
for six eight years, they've seen the game from a
different view than you've seen it as a coach. They've

(05:49):
played it, you've coached it. You know, how you see
it on film may not be how they see it
on it. So you get you start at getting more
input from them. I've told I've told all of our players,
and I told the coaches. I've learned more football from
players sometimes than I have from other coaches, because they
see it, they played it, they did it, you know,

(06:10):
and it makes sense to them then, and so you
got to see it from their eyes. So I don't
think that there was a moment I really went in
to New England, even though they were, you know, at
the top of their game, and I'm walking in there
and I'm coaching four linebackers. I'm coaching Teddy Bruski, William McGinnis,

(06:30):
Mike Vrabel, guy named Ted Johnson, and these guys, I
mean junior say out, I mean the names that I got.
I really felt like, Okay, I need to be the
same guy up in the front of the linebacker room
because I wasn't the coordinator at first two years linebacker
coach before I became a coordinator. I need to be
the same guy in front of that room that I
was as a college coach. And I was, and so

(06:52):
I approached it no different. I didn't assume they knew anything.
I just did it. And they didn't look at me like,
come on, don't you know who you're talking to? Not
at all, you'd be shocked. It's like guys always talk
about what was like to coach ray Lewis. You know
ray Lewis wanted to be coached. Now, did he know
a lot about the game? Absolutely, guy played forever and

(07:15):
was great at what he did. But he also didn't
want you to be a guy says hey, go do
what you need to do. He wanted you to tell
him this is what we need to do, this is
how we need to do it. He may have it.
He may come back at me and say to me, well,
you know I've done it this way. What do you
think about that? And that's great, right, Grady Jared does that.
I mean, all the good ones do that. They want

(07:36):
to still be coached. It's just from a coach's perspective.
Maybe in high school, I didn't listen to somebody want
to do it their way because I knew they didn't
know this guy. I do listen to him because they've
done it. But like the rookies, they're still college guys.
To me, I really like how you're talking about getting

(07:59):
input from these guys, guys like ray Lewis, Guys like
Grady chair right now, and I know that the signal
callers meeting that you do on Wednesdays, Yes, Wednesdays. When
did you start doing that? And was that kind of
an extension of wanting to get these players input on
the game that they're playing? Well? Really it really I

(08:22):
didn't start it until I got to Baltimore. Okay, I
did not do it at New England, but the idea
came from New England because it was it was I
remember going back one time and talking to him like
I coached with in college, and he asked me, what's
it like coaching at New England and coaching in the NFL?
And I said, you know what, coaching the guys at

(08:44):
New England were like coaching coaches that know how to
play that can still play because they're very knowledgeable and
they see things and they can make adjustments and they
can tell you. Then I'll go, why why did you
do that? Well, that's why you learned that as a coach.
Well that sounds pretty good. So I started thinking, you know,
you need with all that expertise out there on the field,

(09:07):
then you need to bring that into a meeting. And
so what I'm gonna do is I'm gonna give you
guys my game plan first and see what you guys
think and you can tell my body language. You know,
if somebody's sitting there kind of like this, then you know, well, okay,
that's he's not buying it. So I thought, why not
do that? And then the other thing is those guys

(09:29):
are kind of your team leaders. And so if you
take one from each group and some guys, like last year,
I brought in a couple of guys that were young
because I wanted to be with the older guys because
I want them to assume that role in the future.
And so it wasn't so much I was looking for
input for them. I wanted them to see how other
guys gave me input so they would end up being

(09:49):
that in the future. And the thing that is is
that if you're standing up in front of a group
and you got four guys out there who are you're
probably your top players or your top leaders, and they're
sitting there and not on their head. Yes, what do
you think the guy next to him is gonna do?
He's gonna not. Yeah, I agree, that must be good. Now,

(10:09):
if they're sitting there going, boy, I don't know about that.
That's not going to breed confidence. And the guys that
are sitting next to him we need all eleven believing
in what we're doing. So, you know, it's like anything else.
If you take the top guys and you make them believe,
the other guys are going to follow him. Yeah, when
it comes to I guess your time with the Patriots.

(10:32):
I know we talked a little bit about it yesterday
and how it was almost like just go in and
don't mess it up, Like just don't mess anything up.
How did you kind of evolves as a when you
did become the defensive coordinator? How did you evolves as
a coordinator during that time. Well, I think I had
been a coordinator for majority of my life in high

(10:53):
school in college, so I knew what was like having
the responsibility being the coordinator. But you know, I listened
to Romeo Cornell, who was the coordinator when I was
there at New England, and I just kind of watched
him and stuff, and you know, you always have your
own way of doing things and your own stuff. And
I will I will say this about Coach Belichick. He

(11:14):
was very good at letting you do your thing. Now
it was still within the parameters of what he wanted
to do. He's still the head coach, but I'm saying
it wasn't so rigid about you got to do it
this way and you got to act this way. He
let you be you, which is how successful coaches should be.
Nobody should. I've seen guys back in the day try

(11:35):
to be Boschem Beckler. There's only one. There was only
one Woody Hayes, there's only one Bill Belichick, there's only
one Nick Saban. They are who they are. Don't be them.
Be yourself. Yeah, you can take things from them, but don't.
But but be yourself. And that's why I just feel
tory that I just have always thought that, and um,

(11:59):
you know, just it's kind of funny how things evolved.
Like I'll give you an example to like for example,
but my wife in college. You know, I told you
that we had all the players come over to our
house and have dinner. Well, also she used to make
brownies and cookies and stuff for the college players all

(12:20):
the time. She'd even had there had been some time
she brought popsicles out to practice. I'm really they loved them.
Oh I'm sure, I'm going on, come on, come on, really,
And she did it and they loved it. So we
go to New England and all of a sudden, she's
making brownies for me to take in on Saturdays when

(12:43):
we had our kind of last day a walk through
before the game, and I'm going, really, I mean, he
cats are grown men, families and stuff. Really, come on.
They fought over him. And she did the same thing
in Baltimore, does the same thing here in Atlanta. And
it's amazing. How like if she's gone and I don't
bring them in, it's like, what's up, where's the brownie? Yeah?

(13:04):
And we had guys at Baltimore used to tell on
each other and they go to her and say, you know,
this guy took too brownies instead of well, I mean,
it's like, I go there. It just shows you, though,
that they're still young men. Yeah, they're not. They haven't
been seasoned, and they aren't forty and fifty year old

(13:26):
guys that have been seasoned. There's still young men and
they still want to be treated like that and special.
And I you know, I've always admired her for doing
all that stuff and she's so involved in it, but
that that was kind of a it kind of plays
into what you're talking about, is just don't treat them
any different, right, Yeah, I think it becomes and I

(13:47):
think it's something that we've talked about before, but it
becomes disingenuous, and you want genuine people around you. It's
something that I always said in my job, it's like
I want to present who these people are as people.
It's I think it's so easy for people to watch

(14:07):
these professional athletes and see them, you know, with their
helmets on, and see them doing these amazing athletic feats,
but to actually know that there's a person underneath the
helmet and there's a person there who is a genuine person,
who want who has goals and ambitions and dreams and
families and friends. That's always been something that I've carried

(14:28):
into my job, and I feel like that's very much
something that as a coach. It's like, you know these
players as good as anybody, and it's always kind of like,
I don't know, making sure that you're the last point
of defense, like no one's getting to these players, these
are my guys. Is that always? I know you've talked

(14:49):
so much in press conferences and everything about loving your
players and that's why you do this, But for you,
is that kind of how you see your role even
as a coordinator of now almost fifty years. Yeah, it's
I think it's just the more you know people care
about you, the more you're going to do for them.

(15:10):
You want to satisfy them. It's like parents. You know,
parents love you, and so you want it your you.
You want to make them proud of you. Okay, Well
players are kind of the same way to me two coaches.
I wanted to make my coaches proud of me. And
but you know, it's something as simple as even in society,
of working with somebody and knowing their name, and it

(15:31):
doesn't matter what their job is, and it could be
a custodian or something. But it's just like, how would
you feel like it is? How much different is in
the press conference when I say yes Tory rather than
go hey, yeah, like you don't sure I know your name?
How much difference does it make to you when I
call you by name and say your name. It's respect

(15:54):
and so it's like you're doing your job. I respect
you doing your job. I know your name. I've taken
some kind of interest in the fact that I've learned
your name. Well, it's that way with players. It's just
more dynamic. Yeah, I also want to go back to
your talking about your wife, and I know the life
of a coach's wife is a very interesting one to lead.

(16:18):
How has she been your partner in these fifty years? Well,
I think the thing with mel is the fact that
she has taken an interest in my job and not
just made it my job off over here and I
got my own thing. Yes, she has her own thing,
but she's made that part of her interests to getting

(16:42):
to know the players, getting to know about the job
and that kind of stuff. She even gives me advice
on calls sometimes. But you know, how much do you
actually take it to account? You really? I'm not saying
because she might listen to this. So the truth of
it is, though she's taken it, it's I'm so lucky
to have her because she is taking such an interest

(17:05):
in my job. And like I say, whether it's doing
the brownies, the pop sit whatever that is. But it's
the other thing, it's it's all of our kids, our grandkids.
You know, in all three Super Bowls, we've taken our
entire family to the Super Bowl. We took twenty six
people to the last Super Bowl. She even took a
couple of babysitters. But it's it's all the kids too.

(17:26):
All of our kids have done their part. I mean
they've all taken off one jersey and put on a
new one, and that's who they root for. And I
can remember the year I retired and one of the
grandkids said, one of my daughter says, who do we
root for now? It didn't really hit me until he
said that, Like they're the grandkids are part of everybody's

(17:48):
a part of this job. And if you don't make
it that way, then I think it becomes a job.
It becomes more cumbersome. While we got to move, we
got to do this, we got to do that. You know,
Dad's gone, you know whatever. I think they've all taken
such an interest in it because there's there's good sides
and bad size to every profession of right, I mean,

(18:09):
military people move all over the country. There's there's But
the good side is is that they've been around some incredible,
incredible athletes and players and people and seen them as people,
not just as this professional guy that's on TV. They
understand that that guy is just like the rest of

(18:31):
us and wants to be treated like the rest of us.
So I think for the family, and especially for my
wife She's taken such an interest and a part in it.
That's been a blessing for me. Yeah. You talk about
kind of getting to know people, and someone who I
have not had the pleasure of getting to know is
Bill Belichick. And I feel like the perception of Bill

(18:53):
Belichick is very different perhaps than the person of Bill Belichick.
So I was just curious for you. You've worked with him,
you worked with him for years, kind of who who
is this guy? And what's kind of some stories of
of who he was as a head coach to coach
under Well. I think the thing about Bill is that

(19:15):
all the guys that I've been around, so many successful
guys with him, Loui Holds, Nicky saving all those guys,
they all have one thing in common. They're all very
attention to detail. Their their work ethic is just unquestionable.
I mean, it's remarkable. Bills just is you know, people

(19:39):
want to I don't know what people really leave with him.
All I can do is I can see those guys
from the perspective that I see him, and they're they're
good bosses when they need to be a boss, and
they're good friends when they need to be a friend.
It's the best way I can tell you, it's they're
all personalities are different. Some are more vivacious than the
other ones, some are very much more you know, ab dude,

(20:01):
But all of them, including Bill. He when we're at work,
he's the boss and it's his program and he's going
to run it his way and it's obviously worked very
very well than anybody else has ever done. Yeah, But
when he's away from that, he's a good friend. And

(20:23):
it's not like all of a sudden he's going to
change his personality from the media. He's he's he's guarded
in some ways with the media because he's he doesn't
let information out and that's why he does. But he's
not going to be one of these guys gonna stand
up and tell a bunch of jokes and be you know,
a boy. Really what a personality this guy is. That's

(20:46):
not what he wants to be. But he's also not
that way as a person. But he is a good
friend and a really good person. I can tell you
that he treated me, my family and all of us
with the utmost respect, and that's why he's very loyal
to him. And I am to Nick, and I was
the coach Holtz, and they all have treated my family great.

(21:08):
I love that. Now I want to get into your
years at Baltimore and making the move from the Patriots
to the Ravens for you, what entreats you about heading
to Baltimore in to begin of it? Almost every job
I've ever taken has been about people. Yeah, you know,

(21:28):
I've always told you I didn't. I've never really interviewed
for a job because only one right, one interview. Yeah,
and so because people said something to some other person
that got that that person called me and offered me
a job. Sometimes I hadn't even met the guys. I'd
never met Nick Saven, I'd never met Elliott User. Like
a Navy I'd never met those guys, and so I

(21:51):
get these calls. I'd never met Lou Holtz. So people,
it's still a people business. That's why I try to
get away from I get off on a tangent on
analytics and stuff because it's not a computer game, it's
not mad in football. It still is dealing with people.
Just like we talked about the players, treat them like people,

(22:11):
not like an object out there playing football. Well, it's
the same thing, you know, going back, is this that
you know, going to New England was it's or going
from New England to Baltimore. Excuse me with about John Harball.
John Harball played for me in college. So what a

(22:33):
unique situation to go coach for a guy that you
once coached. Yeah, I think the world to John Harball.
I thought the world of him as a player. I
knew his dad, I knew his family, and so you know,
he was having success at Baltimore, but he was a
young coach. I think it was only like this maybe

(22:55):
third year I think when I went there and he
offered me a job, and I thought, you know what, Yeah,
I'm gonna do it. I'm gonna go work for this guy. Plus,
there a couple of the guys in the staff that
I knew really well. One of them was just a
great friend who was actually the coordinator at the time,
and he wanted me to come and be his linebacker coach.
And I thought, you know, what a good transition. I

(23:16):
need a little change up here. I've been in New
England for six years. So I went to Baltimore. Two
years later I became a coordinator. But it was a
unique situation coaching for John, having him once been my player.
How do you how did you balance that in your
head to kind of be like, this is now my

(23:37):
head coach. I was once his coach, he's now my coach.
He's my boss. Yeah, you know, And I mean he was,
he was my boss, and so I'm gonna do what
he wants to do. But I knew that he had
enough faith in me. He evidently must have liked me
enough as a coach to have me want to go
coach for him. So um, it was a matter of well,

(23:59):
you know, it just it was an open dial. It
was easy. It really really was easy to talk to John,
but always remembering this guy is now he's my boss,
and what he says we're gonna do, and we're all
going to do it together and we're gonna I can disagree,
but when at the end of the day, whatever he
wants is what we're doing, and I'm gonna be totally

(24:19):
on board. It's just like when I went to Tennessee
and coach for Mike Rabel. Yes, he was a former
player of mine in New England and he used to
yell at me all the time because I'd say what coach,
and he go, I'm Mike, don't call me coach, I said,
but you are coach. He goes, but I'm Mike. You
were my coach, I said, but you're now my coach.

(24:42):
So and so it was hard for me to ever
call him Mike. Yeah. I'm just so used to call
him the head coach. Coach. Yeah, and I you know John,
I'd call him John once in a while, but a
lot of times I just called him coach, hardball man.
So great so at Baltimore, I think that Super Bowl
winning year was a very I mean, if you go

(25:05):
back and you look at that year for y'all, it
was such an interesting year. And I know you've talked
about it before about how many players that y'all really
didn't have access to in terms of like injuries or
other things coming up. I feel like, and this is
just me thinking from the outside looking in, but it
almost felt like that year for someone who's a coordinator

(25:29):
had to have been a very stressful but also maybe
rewarding year because you probably had to be more flexible
because of the situation. When you look back on that
year and kind of how it unfolded, even before you
get to the Super Bowl, are you proud of kind
of what you were able to do in terms of
being able to even put a game plan together a

(25:52):
week in and week out with all the turnover that
was happening. Well, I think it's it's a couple of
things came out of that year. Is Yeah, you're proud
of it. You're proud of the coaching staff and the
job that everybody did, and really really proud of the
players because we had to adapt every week. I mean,
people don't realize we didn't have ray Lewis for ten
weeks that year. We didn't have Sugs for either six
or eight weeks. I can't remember what it was, but

(26:13):
it was quite a while. Well, those are two big
parts of the puzzle to keep on winning, so you
had to change your game plan. And then we went
through a bunch of corners that year, and so we
had to change coverage almost every week. In some ways,
I think though, Tori, that it was like it kept
you so busy trying to think about what do we
need to do to beat this team? How are we

(26:33):
going to beat them? That you almost said, I don't
know if it was a lot of stress because you
were really just kind of more focused on how are
we going to do this? And who do we put here,
and how do we do this? And how do we
do that? And I give the players so much credit
because you know, we changed stuff every week to try
to figure out how to win, and they did it,

(26:54):
and so I give them the credit and the coaching
staff the credit for doing that. And then what happened
is what was nice then when we made it to
the playoffs, all of a sudden, we have sugs and
a fresh ray Lewis back and we get on that
four game run and win the Super Bowl. So it
was kind of fun though as a coach, because it

(27:14):
wasn't like, Okay, well, we're just so much better than
everybody else, we can just go out there and line
up and just beat them. You had to actually adapt.
But what it also taught me that as a coach, well,
if this is so good to do this, why shouldn't
I continue to do it even when I do have
good players. You know. That's why you know, everybody talks

(27:38):
about our system being so complex and we have so
much Yeah it is. But the good thing is is
that if somebody gets hurt in the course of a game,
we have something else to go to. What if you
don't have something else to go to. What if they
keep running the same play and you can't stop it,
what are you gonna say, hey, play it better. Well,
at some point in time, they're probably playing it as
best they can. You can't stop it. I need to

(27:58):
have something to go to to stop. But I don't
think you can be that vanilla. And it's also fun. Yeah,
it's also fun for the players, and it's fun for
the coaches. Your mind's working all the time. It's not like, oh, Okay,
we're gonna go on and do the same thing. We're
just so much better than everybody else going to do
the same thing every week. It's fun to think up
things and new things and trum and think them out

(28:20):
and try to get them to work. And yeah, it
was a very very rewarding year. Yeah, I'm glad that
you brought up the playbook, your playbook, because there was
something that you said at the beginning of last season,
and I can't remember the exact quote, so if I'm
misquoting you, definitely tell me. But you said something along
the lines of like only a certain percentage of the

(28:41):
playbook had been installed at this point because it was like,
I'm not going to give guys things that they can't handle.
And then later in the season, I think you were
asked like, well, what percentage is do you have installed now?
And I think people probably thought on the outside looking in, like, oh,
ninety percent of the playbook. You said something along the
lines of like seventy percent maybe, And I found that

(29:06):
so very interesting because I think a lot of times
people think like, you have a playbook, you give them
to the players, and they have to know it completely
by the time training camp starts or winever. But I
feel like that's not necessarily the case. And I would
love to get your perspective on this, because I think
people when they heard like, oh, he only has so

(29:26):
much of the playbook installed, what does that say about
the players or what does that say about the team?
I actually was like, I think that's purposeful and it's
something that this team needed at this time. For you,
when you're installing a playbook, in terms of percentages and
how much you're installing, how does it change from team

(29:46):
to team or even year to year. Well, it'll change
a lot from year to year depending on how many
new players you got and how many guys you got
coming back, and if you've got a bunch of guys
coming back. You know, now you can expand even more
because they already know the first part of it. The playbook.
The way things are done is when we talk about

(30:11):
a percentages or arbitrary, I don't know if it was
sixty percent or seventy, I don't know what it was.
It's just is. I don't know if you ever have
all of it in, but you kind of you keep
building on it. The more you have a veteran team,
the more you can build on it. The more you
have a young team that doesn't. For example, let's say
you put in a coverage and those guys need to

(30:32):
perfect that coverage before you can tweak it. It's not
so much you're changing a whole different calls, just maybe
the way you'll play a certain coverage. It's still the
same coverage, all right, Cover two, it's cover two. You
got two deep guys, you got five guys underneath. All right,
that's cover two zone. Well, there's a hundred different ways

(30:53):
to play covered two zone. But until you learn to
play the first cover two zone correctly, then you can't
really go to the next cover to zone. It's going
to be the same, I know it may or may
not be making sense, but it's it's like it's not
like you're changing all new calls. It's like you're changing
other calls and you're tweaking them a little bit to

(31:16):
give a quarterback a different look or something like that.
But you're not helping your players. If they don't yet
understand the first one, it's hard to go to the
second one. It's hard to learn how to subtract if
you haven't learned how to add, or learn how to multiply.
If you haven't learned how to add and subtract. Everything's
in an order, and so it's kind of the same way.

(31:40):
You can keep adding that. If they get that, oh man,
they got that, Okay, we can go onto this. Then
we can add this a little bit. But until they
get that. Well, when you're a new team coming in,
a new coaching staff coming in, like we were here
in Atlanta and our scheme was a lot different than
the old defensive scheme doesn't make a good or bad.

(32:00):
It doesn't make it better or worse. People believe in
what they believe in it. There's all these different offenses,
all these different defenses, and they all work if you
have the personnel to do them. But I'm not going
to sit there and try to throw everything at these
guys when it's so different than what they just got
done playing. So until they perfected that, then we could

(32:21):
move on. So like, yeah, early on, we didn't have
a lot in As the season went on, we added more.
Did we ever get to one hundred percent? No, But
I don't know if I've ever gotten to everything in
the playbook right at any place. So when you're I mean,
when you're dealing with sixty seventy percent of your playbook,
you're dealing with a lot of stuff. Yeah, yeah, especially yours.

(32:43):
And yeah it is because if you accumulated all these
years of stuff, Yeah, and so and I throw nothing out.
That's the problem. It's just it all it is. I'm
a hoarder, so so it's it's that percentage is really irrelevant.
The percentage is only good. What percentage of stuff can

(33:04):
they learn? Yeah, and that's what's important. Okay, I got him.
I'm glad that we got off on that tangent because
I feel like that was a lot of like I
got I got a lot of questions. It was like,
what do you mean they only had this percentage in
and I'm like, I think you're overthinking this. You are,
and it's and it really doesn't have it to do
with all the players can't handle. It's no, it's it's
not that. It's you know, we got a lot of

(33:27):
stuff in. Even thirty forty percent of somebody's playbook is
a lot of right. Yeah, I don't think people understand
how much. It's just like, you've all the stuff I
had in the playbook. I have all the stuff from
New I have all the stuff in college. I have
all this stuff from New England. I have all this
stuff from Baltimore, all the stuff that we changed at Tennessee. Well,
the thing just keeps getting bigger, you know. So when

(33:49):
it was like this at New England, that was pretty easy.
Well then Baltimore gets like, you know, it just keeps
getting bigger. You can't expect the guys from Atlanta to
know everything that we've done coaching wise and all last
forty years. There's no way, right, But that's the playbook. Yeah,
so there's sixty percent. It's still the same thing that
the New England guys had, the same thing the Baltimore
guys had, same thing. The Tennessee guys. Had it's just

(34:13):
it's it's all kinds of the same. Yeah, this may
be a I don't know and in off the wall question.
But how do you store your playbook? Like? Is it
in file cabinets? Do you write to steal? Literally, I'm
not going to try and steal it. I'm I promise
you I won't steal it, but I may come by

(34:33):
and just have a peak one time, just run by
the office. Hey, it's it's actually it's in every book
that I have. I have a New England book, I
have a Baltimore book, a Tennessee book, I have an
Atlanta book. Okay, So I don't keep any all of
it in one book. It's just whatever we're going to
use for Atlanta. I take out of these other ones
and I transferred over. Okay, same thing when I left
New England. Some of the stuff went to Baltimore. Some

(34:55):
of the stuff. You know, Baltimore was really playing good
teefens long before I got there, right, And the same
thing with New England. So New England's book is kind
of most of the stuff is the stuff that I
inherited and then I added to it Baltimore. Same thing
they were already doing well at Baltimore. So it's Baltimore
what they were doing at Baltimore, plus the stuff that
I brought from New England, plus the other stuff that

(35:16):
we've kind of change. Yeah, it just keeps adding on
like that. So I just leave it in that book.
It's not one big book. So then the stuff that
I wanted to play here in Atlanta, that came from
New England, that came from Baltimore, that came from Tennessee,
all went into the Atlanta book. Okay, that makes sense.
See that's the part of the think that I don't know,

(35:37):
the interesting quirks of the job. I like hearing how
people store everything and write out their notes and all
that kind of stuff. Well, there's a lot of stuff then,
for example, that's in the Atlanta book over here, and
then here's the New England book over here that never
has gotten to the Atlanta book. These guys don't even know.
I've never even tried to put it in. Yeah, same
thing with the Baltimore book. So it's just there's stuff
in these books that once in a while I'll be

(36:01):
watching a film on another team and going, Okay, this
pressure will work. This is a pressure. I ran clear
back there. So I'll take it out of that book
and bring it over to the Atlanta book and stuff
like that. Love it. Okay, I do want to ask
this question because it's something that I've always been curious about.
The Super Bowl with the Ravens. Was that the blackout Bowl?

(36:25):
It was? Please walk me through what you're thinking. Has
the coordinator when I guess, like the lights go out?
Like where were you? What were you doing? It was
like a thirty four minute time period in which y'all
had to just stop everything. Well, I was in the
press box. Yeah, I'll calling the defense, and then all
of a sudden the lights went on. We just kind

(36:46):
of figured it was short or somebody had there was
an accident somewhere or something, somebody hit a pull and
blew up something that it would come right back on,
and we didn't know how long it was going to happen.
And then I can remember sitting in the press box
and we could still communicate down to the field with

(37:06):
the headsets. So the lights were off, but we still
had communication through the headsets, and I remember Coach Harball
going off on the officials because they were talking about
the lights coming no, I take that back. The headsets
did go down, and he was talking about we had

(37:30):
a walkie talkie that we could only use, and that
if the lights came back on, they were going to
restart the game, whether the headsets weren't on or not.
And he goes, well, wait, my coordinator is in the
press box. That's not fair. So then we're trying to
figure out can we come down. Well, we couldn't come
down because the electric is off. There's no elevators, so
it was like, we don't know what the heck is

(37:50):
going to happen here. And so then finally they had
said no, that if they do that, that they would
give us time to come down and do all that stuff,
and it wouldn't be that because John was livid, and
then we just kind of just sat there. I just
waited till the lights came back on and started up again.
I think that's so that that part of that Super

(38:14):
Bowl is honestly what makes that Super Bowl almost as
memorable as what it was, because that was something that
had never happened before. It was crazy. So I'm glad
that I finally was able to ask you that question,
because that wasn't something that's been on my mind for years. Yeah,
that's crazy. Um So okay, let's fast forward now to
going to Tennessee. And yeah, I know you talked about,

(38:37):
you know, with Mike Rabel, getting to coach with a
player that who's now a coach you coached, like all
those all the words um for. But that was also
was that the first time that you met Arthur Smith
was at Tennessee? Yes, what were your first impressions of him?
Very good? He was a tight end coach at that

(38:57):
time in the offensive coordinators tight ends coach, and I
remember doing you know what happens is you're you're really
not around the offensive guys a lot. You know him
because you're in a staff meeting with them and stuff,
but you're not corresponding with them every day and all
that kind of stuff. And so, you know, I met
Arthur and knew him and stuff like that. And but
the first time then we had a we did a

(39:21):
we had to do a press conference together, he and
I and it happened to be I don't know, just
I think probably everybody had to do a press conference
and hey, this day, Dean's gonna be you and Arthur Smith.
And I remember being there at the press conference and
watching him talk as a tight end coach, and I
got this guy is sharp. This guy is really sharp.

(39:42):
This guy is a good young coach. And that's that
was my first real impression of him, because we've maybe
been there for three four weeks or something like that.
And it also told me something about Arthur in that
when you go through coach changes, most head coaches come

(40:02):
in and want to bring their guys in, the guys
that there's a comfort level with, and I know what
he does and there's they're they're guys. Yeah, this guy
keeps staying on with all these different head coaches tells
you something about the guy and the respect that the
new guy has coming in for him to keep him,

(40:25):
because it's just it's pretty easy. Most coaches think, if
my head coach gets fired, we're all gone. So I'm
sure Arthur thought I'm gone, but he never was. He
kept staying on with all these different head coaches, including Mike,
and I'm going that tells you a lot about what
people think to him, What people in the building have
said about him, what loyalty and what respect people must

(40:47):
have for him, told me a lot about him. Your
time at Tennessee. What kind of was different about it
in comparison to your time with the Patriots and the Rays.
I don't know if there was any difference. There was
one thing about the Patriots and then the Ravens. There's

(41:10):
a there's an aura of success. There is. I mean,
I'm not trying to smoke or anything else or belittle
anybody else, but there was an expectation in New England
to win. I mean the year that we went undefeated
in oh seven. Yeah, the offense was number one a league,
but I think we were third or fourth on defense,

(41:32):
So it was like both sides of the ball were good.
There was just an expectation when you walked in the
building of winning, and that Baltimore it was the same
way with John there was just a spacially on defense.
There was just because they have been good since two
thousand in defense, I mean, there's just not many down

(41:52):
years in there all the way up through, and it's
just the expectation was there. Didn't quite feel the expectation
at Tennessee, even though they'd been nine and seven in
the year before and won a game in the playoffs.
Mariota took them to the playoffs and they beat Kansas
City the first round and got beat and so but

(42:13):
I didn't quite feel the aura, you know. And then
the other thing a little bit about it is it's
like in Baltimore, it's such a blue collar town. Football
is everything. The thing about Nashville is it's Nashville. Yeah,
there's a lot going on ine and it doesn't have
to do with football. It's kind of a destination city,

(42:34):
you know. More when we play other teams that would
come in, they'd have as many fans as we did.
Because if you're in Buffalo, you want to go to
Nashville for the weekend and enjoy your weekend. Or Philadelphia
or any of those northern places that did getting undated
by people coming in and they want to go to
Nashville for the weekend. So there's some it's an entertainment
city more than it was a football city. Baltimore is

(42:57):
a football city, you know. There's certain cities that are
New England became that because they started winning so much.
It became New England, not the Boston Patriots anymore, the
New England Patriots. So Tennessee was a little different in
that aspect. But players were the players. I mean it
was the same thing. There wasn't maybe as many big
name guys as there was, like a Baltimore, but you know,

(43:19):
the Joel Caseis and those guys, I mean, they were
a great players. I had. I had fun. Yeah, I
had fun, just as much fun, you know as I've
had at those other two places. The same way here
I'm having fun here. Yeah. Well it's it's funny too
because you talk about having fun and um, you know,
I think a lot of people know this about you.

(43:41):
But you retired in twenty nineteen and then took the
twenty twenty season off and then came out of retirement
to come here to Atlanta. Right, what was that year
like in retirement? How how did you know that you
wanted to get back in and how quickly did you
know that you wanted to get back in. Well, there's

(44:01):
there's two things about that year. One the good thing
about being office. It was the COVID year. Yes, that's right.
So every coach that I talked to said they were
miserable because of all zoom meetings and all this and
staying in the hotels and it just wasn't like football
and you're playing in front of empty stadiums. So that

(44:21):
part of it I didn't miss, because everybody told me,
you picked a good year to retire. Yeah. The part
that I did miss is that I was doing a
radio show on Fridays in Nashville talking about the opposing
team's offense. And so the Titans were nice enough to
give me film and a computer that I could watch

(44:42):
the other teams, like if they were playing Indianapolis, I
could watch Indianapolis games and I could break it down
so I could talk on a radio and actually sound
like I knew what I was talking about. That's why
he's so good on the podcast. He has this experience. No. So,
but what happened and was as I started watching this
film going I wouldn't do that. I wouldn't do that. No,

(45:05):
what are they doing? You know? And it's like all
of a sudden, they started missing it. Yeah, and then
Melan I went to one home game when they finally
started opening it up. I couldn't take it. I couldn't.
I couldn't sit there and watch the game. And it's
like driving me nuts. I missed it so much being
down there with the players and calling the game and
stuff like that. And I really missed it. But at

(45:25):
the same time, I was retired and my wife had
bought me a golf membership, so I was playing golf
a couple of times a week, and so I was
enjoying that. You know, we had thought about what we
were going to travel a lot, but obviously COVID put
an end to that, that whole thing. So you know,
you're I kind of I'm sitting around and not I'm

(45:47):
doing puzzles for the first time in my life, and
I'm doing puzzles and I'm doing this this radio thing
and I'm really missing it. Yeah. But at the same time,
I had gotten a call from a couple of other
guys that were going to be were interviewing for head coaches.
They hadn't gotten jobs, but they weren't interviewing. Would you
be interested if I did get the job of coming

(46:09):
out of retirement and I said, I don't think so.
So then when Arthur and I talked, it was different.
It's all about people, and I told you that's that's
I went to Tennessee because it was Mike Vrabel. I
went to Baltimore because it was Johnah Harball. I went
to New England because it was New England and Bill. Yeah,

(46:30):
but I also had known Bill for years and years.
I coached with his father at the Naval Academy, so
I knew Bill. Every job I've ever taken, it took
because I kind of in the NFL has been because
I knew the guy that was the head coach, and
I just had so much respect for Arthur. I said,
this will be a good situation, and so mel and

(46:51):
I talked about it and discussed. It wasn't a very
long discussion, and so it's great. And that's the other
thing about her, She's been great. You know, here I
am coming on retirement twice, and you know, it's like
some people wouldn't have been real tolerable. And she goes, hey,
if that's what you want to do, and let's we'll

(47:13):
do it. Yeah, that was gonna be My question is
how did she What was that conversation like with her,
because I mean, honestly, I'm sure you're around a lot
more in that year. That might have been the reason
why she wanted me to go back. But the first
one when the two weeks I was returning, consider that no,
and then because she just that that one though at

(47:34):
first she was a little bit about like I thought
we were going to travel because COVID wasn't then, right, Yeah.
The other one was after with COVID around, it was
kind of like, yeah, we aren't going anywhere, we aren't
doing anything, and we are together, and it was Roy.
I think it was Roy. Last year was a little
bit different for her because it was still kind of

(47:55):
COVID last year. Yeah, we were in the stands, but
you couldn't have like get together. There's after the game
like we used to always have with all the players
and she'd meet the players wives and the players kids
and the other coaches wives and coaches kids, and she
runs a bubble Bible study with coaches wives, which is good.
But I think she, excuse me, really missed it last

(48:16):
year too, because it's just she couldn't get us involved.
So I'm hoping now this next year, now, yeah, that'll
that'll change. Yeah, I hope said too. It's funny because
I have been in this job for about a year,
because you know, I was with the athletic for the
COVID year and then now I'm here and I hadn't
gotten into the building until like two months ago, like

(48:38):
at all. Like I was in the building for like
one week and then they shut it down and I've
actually been working out of the dorms. That's why. That's
where I've been working for the last like for like
the six months of the season. It's it's been different.
It's crazy. Yeah, um well, I did want to kind
of wrap all this up talking about the team, of

(48:59):
which you know we're here for. By the way, by
the way, we shouldn't maybe talk about the Falcons. I
think it's really interesting because you talk about the memorable
teams that you've worked with and how when it's a project,
it almost makes it more fun, it makes it almost

(49:21):
more memorable, more meaningful. And I feel like that's what
this is. I feel like where this organization is right now,
it's a project and it's a it's a built, it's
building for you. Was that something that intrigued you? I know,
obviously coming and working with Author Smith was priority numero uno, right,
But was that something that intrigued you as well? Absolutely?

(49:43):
Yeah it did. And I also the other thing I
knew about Arthur's Arthur's not going to take a job
that he doesn't feel like he can get turned around
and be successful. He wasn't going to take a job
because it's all I need to be a head co down, Well,
you got to take a job. Interviewed for all of them, right, Yeah,
So it's not like he was just gonna, you know,

(50:04):
I gotta be a head coach. It's it's gonna be
I'm gonna pick the place that I feel like, great ownership,
great organization, I have a chance to win, turn this
thing around. Obviously, if you're an interviewing the programs down
because you know they're not usually changing head coaches. Lets
the guy go somewhere else. I mean all that's just
part of the business. So yeah, it was because Ars Smith,

(50:27):
but yeah, yeah, part of that was. And I will
also say that even going seven and ten last year,
I could not have been more proud of the defense.
I love these guys. These guys gave it what they had.
They played their hearts out. Could I really thought like
we probably had a chance to win a couple more games,

(50:47):
and maybe we were. We were right there at the
end up ntil a couple of games to go. We
were still had a child at making the playoffs. Once
you get in the playoffs, who knows. But I just
really I really love coaching this team last year, and
I love coaching it right now too. I really feel
like we are about to turn a corner. It's gonna
make everybody proud. And I think the people and the

(51:08):
fans are hungry for it, and I like that. Um
and I just think that our players are very hungry.
They're very coachable. I enjoy going into that meeting room
every day. Yeah, how much I've talked to a few
assistants about this over the course of the draft process.
How much are you in the meetings in terms of, Hey,

(51:30):
I would like to acquire this guy, this guy's on
the free agency market, I like him, or Hey, this
guy I saw him at the combine, I really like him.
How much are you in those conversations? Well, very much. Yeah,
we all of us, all the coaches are, I mean
Terry and and and Art take all of our input

(51:52):
along with the head scouts, Kyle and all those guys.
It's it's really a collaboration of everybody. You know, they
don't they don't want to bring in somebody that we
really don't want right and then, but also what we
our jobs as coaches? Look at the guy, does he
fit our system? Will he be the guy we want?
They got to do all the other groundwork as far

(52:13):
as things off the field, you know, as he is
the guy been in trouble? Has he been? All of
this guy? The other part of it is that we
play no part in it is financial. We don't. I
don't know. I don't know what the salary cap is.
I don't even I don't care. What Why should I
want to know what some guy's making. I don't really care.
He should be playing because he's the best player, whether

(52:34):
he's making ten million, one million, or twenty five you know,
one hundred. I mean, I'm gonna play the best guy
that playing in that position at the time. So we
can sit there and say, hey, we really like this
guy as a free agent. I did last year. He
even can't afford him. What do you want me to say, Okay,

(52:56):
can't afford Yeah, I'll go to the next one. So
but are they gonna ask us, yeah, are we going
to give us our opinion? Yes, then it's just a matter.
There's other parts to it that we don't have. And
it's the same thing with Art, like when they go
into the draft. Okay, he ain't undraft. I want all
defensive players. They were going once all offensive players. Well,

(53:18):
that can't be and we need special teams players. So
there's a lot of decisions that have to be made.
You got two guys up here that are fairly equal
that you want to take us first round picks, Well,
they got to make a decision which one is really
more valuable to the team. Yeah, I want the defensive guy.
Offensive guys want the offensive guy. But they got to
make a decision. This guy's the best fit right now

(53:39):
for what we need. Yeah, and so there's just there's
a lot of things. But yes, we are very heavily involved. Yeah.
I think it's interesting because that's something that the salary cap.
I feel like it's just this mythical thing that everyone
talks about. It's really, I think convoluted and difficult for

(54:00):
some people to get their minds around. I know when
I first started covering the league, like I spent a
week just trying to understand, like, Okay, what's dead money?
Like what are all these terms and what do they
mean and why are they important? And I think it's
interesting because you have people in the building who specifically
work CAP. You have these CAP crunchers, and then you

(54:23):
have the scouts that are constantly thinking about like, Okay
is talking about can we afford this person? How much
are you cognizantly thinking about that? I mean, I think
about the Grady Jared extension that we just saw happen.
How much are you sitting there like, Okay, please find
the money to bring this guy beat. That's but that's

(54:44):
about all it is for us. We're just hoping right
that we have the money. We really as coaches, do
you sit back and you kind of take that totally
on the equation would you like to have this player? Yes? Yeah, period.
That's all I need to say. I can't. I don't
know about the rest of it. I don't want to
know about the rest of it. You know, do I

(55:05):
want Grady Jarrett to be get extensions? When they asked me,
absolutely you want this guy back? Yes? Yeah, forever. You know,
I don't want him to ever leave Atlanta. That's all
I can say. The rest of it's up to them,
whether they can get them the negotiations and all that
stuff done. Our job as coaches is do you want
this guy as a player? Do you not want this

(55:25):
guy as a player? Yes? Or no? And that's I
feel like that's all we give them. Then it's up
to them to hopefully negotiate it out if they can.
There you go. I think it's really you said something
a couple of minutes ago about really feeling like this
organization is turning a corner, and something that I keep
telling people is and especially when y'all first came in here,

(55:48):
when Terry and Arthur first came in here, I wrote
so many times, it's like, look, this is a process.
This is not a It's not something that's going to
happen overnight. And we actually had a J. Terrell on
the fouth Can Find a Whistle podcast not too long ago,
and I asked him a word to describe twenty twenty
two and he said marathon. He was like, this organization,

(56:09):
we're in a marathon. We're not in a sprant. We're
in a marathon. We want to have long term success.
For you, when you're thinking about where this organization is,
what does excite you about the future of it. I
just think we're getting the right people well, and I'm
not saying that the other people that were here were

(56:31):
the wrong people. I'm just saying that every head coach
has a personality and that team should reflect his personality
and you want people around you that reflect your personality
and buy into what you're trying to do. If we're
coaching for Arthur Smith, we all need to be in
Arthur Smith's you know, wheelhouse or what he wants and

(56:55):
what does he want. I can't have like, well, I
want to do it my way on Deva, I'm going
to do he hired me to do the defensive job.
But if he wants something a certain way, we need
to buy in and do it. And we need players
the same way. And I love it's called a culture
and everybody has their own and they're all different and

(57:16):
so but you've got to be what the guy wants
you to be. And I just feel like we are
making tremendous strides that way, and we just I can
just feel it in the players that they're buying into
everything that we want to get done and they're trying
their best to do it. That's all you can really have.

(57:37):
Somebody to do it. Just give it, give it your best.
We want tough guys, we want physical guys, we want
smart guys, but we also want good character guys. You
want guys that are out in the community and are
doing community service and the people fans can relate to
and you're not reading about them in the headlines all
the time for the bad reasons. And so we're doing

(58:00):
Arthur's doing that, and I think it's interesting too. There
are just so many young guys that you kind of
can mold and into what you kind of hope that
they become and having visions for them. And I almost
feel like those guys are they come in and they're
like sponges and they're just like they're so jazzed just

(58:21):
to be in the league at large, and that they're
just like, let's just go, just throw me out there
and go and with this team, it is a young team.
Do you feel that youth when you're around these guys? Yeah,
I do, I feel. But also that's why the Grady
Jarrets and those guys are so valuable, because if you
don't have a guy like that that the d lineman
come in and watch him work every single day on

(58:44):
how he works and how he prepares that there's their examples.
As a coach, I grew up watching other coaches as examples. Yeah,
you know, kids watch their parents, you know, they're good examples.
That's how you become a good parent, right, it's so
it's no different. And that's why those guys, even though

(59:06):
there's are a lot of youth, the guys that are
the Jake Matthews, the Grady Jarrets, those kind of guys
are so important because they are going to be the
examples to these guys. This is how you do it
absolutely well. That wraps up our final pas in the
pod segments. I hope that you do like this name.

(59:27):
We're gonna stick with it because I think it's fantastic.
But thank you so much for joining us for the
last gosh two hours of chats. I've really really appreciated,
and I think the fans are really gonna love it too,
So thank you. Thanks for having me absolutely