October 14, 2025 • 58 mins
Gregg Rosenthal is joined by Jourdan Rodrigue to react to the news from around the NFL including the Titans firing Brian Callahan (02:00), an injury update for Puka Nacua (13:40), Brian Branch's suspension (15:30), and the Vikings' quarterback situation going into Week 7 (21:00). Also, Gregg and Jourdan play a game of Would You Rather involving A.J. Brown and Christian Gonzalez (26:00), which franchise you would want to take over between the Titans, Jets, Dolphins and Giants and more. Finally, Gregg and Jourdan wrap the show with a look ahead to the Steelers playing the Bengals on Thursday Night Football.
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Transcript
Episode Transcript
Available transcripts are automatically generated. Complete accuracy is not guaranteed.
Speaker 1 (00:05):
Welcome to NFL Daily, where we're just pumped at sweater
season again. I'm Greg rosenthalm here in the Chris Westling
podcast studio. Yes, I know a rainy Los Angeles day
with my friend Jordan Rodrieg.
Speaker 2 (00:18):
I know you walked in in your green sweater as
my gray sweater on. We both got like the subconscious memo,
it's below what sixty eight degrees in LA right now?
Speaker 1 (00:28):
Chris, You know, no one likes to hear Los Angeles
people like celebrate when it actually gets a little cooler,
a little rainier. But it's beautiful here. It's a beautiful
time in the season. Like we think we know some things,
we don't know anything. I was gonna mention what's coming
up on the news, but those things aren't really beautiful.
It's like injuries and a head coach losing his job.
(00:50):
But we're going to talk a little TNF with the
Steelers and the Bengals later and we're going to play
a game. Jordan, I know you love to play games.
In this game is would you?
Speaker 2 (01:01):
I do love to play games, Greg.
Speaker 1 (01:03):
Like, what kind are you? Like? A board game?
Speaker 2 (01:06):
So I am I'm a big time settlers of Catan
fan slash player. My sister, my twin sister, Maddie. She's
actually the reigning champion. Between myself and her, I have
been training. She's abroad on a research vessel. She's a scientist,
so for most of the year, so I can get
my reps in and you can play online and stuff
(01:26):
like that, just to get your your practices and all
of that. That's my number one board game.
Speaker 1 (01:32):
I think I love a lot of people who are big,
you know, board game people. I'm not one of those people.
But I did play one game of Sellers of Catan
when I was younger.
Speaker 2 (01:41):
I feel like that that game would just make you
really mad.
Speaker 1 (01:44):
I don't have the patience I liked to risk. That
was when I was like twelve.
Speaker 2 (01:48):
I'll tell you this, fans, fans of Settlers of Catan
will exactly what I'm talking about when I say this.
Greg Rosenthal and I will never play against each other
and Settlers of Kids and because of that, we will
have a long and beautiful friendship.
Speaker 1 (02:02):
Okay, I'm looking forward to never playing with you. Let's
talk news. We mentioned it on the doubleheader night. It
just felt like Brian Callahan's firing with the Titans. Did
not deserve to be sandwiched into this glorious night of
football upsets, and so we decided we'll talk about it here.
One of the least surprising firings. At least we knew
(02:26):
it was coming at some point this season. We didn't
know when it happens on a Tuesday afternoon. It comes
from the team itself. I find that interesting. Absolutely no
national reporters had it, no local reporters had it. In fact,
Adam Schefter was like on air being asked about it
like half an hour before or something like that and said,
I don't see that happening, And so that indicates to me,
(02:47):
maybe it comes from from the very top. And no
one really had a bet on what ownership was thinking there.
It was not ownership though that spoke about Brian Callahan's firing.
Let's listen to team president and president of football operations,
Chad Brinker.
Speaker 3 (03:04):
We were looking for growth in this football team. And
that's what this is about right now, is we're not
seeing enough growth from this football team. We're one to
five and we got to be better in this and
I want to acknowledge the fact that we're all frustrated.
We understand that you the fan, You're frustrated with everything
(03:24):
that's going on, but I can We're doing everything we can.
We will do everything we can to build a football
program that you can be proud of.
Speaker 1 (03:33):
So I don't know if Chad Brinker ultimately made this decision.
We don't know. He's the one that's answering all the questions.
Adam Amy. Adam Strunk was not there at the press conference,
which is typical. Owners aren't often there at the firings.
Mike Burganzi was there the general manager. I do though,
by the conspiracy theory that they did it before Mike
(03:55):
Rabel came to town, specifically, like they did not want Mike
Rabel to be coming in there and reminding them of
past dysfunction while Brian Callahan was still there. So maybe
they get the fired coach bump this week to try
to take out their old faux Mike Rabil. Yeah.
Speaker 2 (04:13):
I buy that. Actually, I do buy that. I think
that from listeners and viewers who think Noah team couldn't
possibly be thinking about that specific type of detail when
making massive and potentially franchise altering decisions, Yes they can,
and they often do. This was interesting to me. I
think that the players probably knew something was up before
(04:36):
any of the rest of us did, because I don't
think Jeffrey Simmons, who's been a cornerstone of that franchise
for a little while now, who is still a great player,
would come so far out as to say how flat
the team felt, how pointing fingers without overtly he didn't
do the to a thing for example.
Speaker 1 (04:54):
Well maybe he helped, you know, put it over the
top by saying, I.
Speaker 2 (04:57):
Just feel like a player like that knows when people
and can feel when other people are starting to get
checked out or starting to feel a little nervous. It
also some sort of awkward. Brian Callahan's father, Bill is
on the staff and reportedly left the team as well
in light of the news that is his son the
head coach got fired. So kind of awkward dynamics all
(05:18):
around there. But now you know, the Titans are back
to where they've been multiple times over the last couple
of seasons, especially an achronus with their GM higher, with
their quarterback draft. Everything is like it's sort of Bearsian
of the last several seasons where you would almost get
everything lined up and then something would happen and you
won't be lined up with all three positions of power
(05:39):
for in this case, including the quarterback.
Speaker 1 (05:41):
Yeah, they've they've never been lined up. They're you know,
in the on the shortlist of the most dysfunctional franchises
in the league. Let's go through it. John Robinson and
Mike Rabil have a power struggle and they fired John
Robinson pretty soon after the AJ Brown trade, which to
me really kickstarted this dysfunction going into overdrive. So that
(06:03):
AJ Brown trade, which you know, led to that team
kind of falling apart, and Mike Rabel clearly didn't seem
too happy about it. Okay, you get rid of the
GM who had had a lot of success there. Just
thirteen months later, they fired Mike Rabel after he has
a power struggle with the new GM ran Carthon. And
you know, they ownership chose the new GM ran Carthon.
(06:27):
That is when they hire Brian Callahan. That that's only
a year and a half ago. Ran Carthon lasts one year,
which is almost unprecedented. So that's that's ownership saying that
they made a pretty big mistake. They announced that Brian
Callahan was involved in the hiring of the new GM
Mike Borganzi, so as recently as January, unless they were
(06:50):
selling us a bill of goods, which is possible in
these situations, it could have always been this guy Chad Brinker,
who ultimately.
Speaker 2 (06:57):
Common denominator of all of this, even.
Speaker 1 (07:00):
He only goes back a couple of years. But yes,
he admitted he has full personnel control. So it's not
the GM Borganzh who comes from the Chiefs. He has
been there the whole time. And then they decide to
bring in Borgonzhi and then yeah, ten months later they
fire Callahan. That is a rough two and a half
three year stretch for a team just to not be aligned.
(07:23):
And then it's like, oh, it's not my fault. I
didn't draft him or I didn't hire him, and it's
just like an endless cycle.
Speaker 2 (07:29):
Yeah, And that's part of the reason why failure compounds
in buildings that just seem so out of sync and
can't get it right year over year over year. The
other part of it is if you are evaluating players,
he's saying, we're doing everything we can to get on
the right track to make this a football team that
fans can be proud of, and all of these things
(07:49):
and noting that they haven't seen improvement. Part of that
is because you're changing your entire evaluation language internally every
two years, even every one year, not even giving one
person the rand carthon who's there for a year, even
install in event.
Speaker 1 (08:04):
You've got that's crazy, But I don't.
Speaker 2 (08:08):
Think people understand. And I sort of saw this firsthand
doing this Fighting RAM series where I was embedded with
the Scouting and Talent ID department with the RAMS for
a year. It's like the continuity matters. Continuity matters so
much because you can develop a way to scout and
identify players that specifically fit within the language of how
a head coach is teaching his scheme and deploying his
(08:30):
plays and concepts on the head coach, the defensive, all
of these things that trickle into the different parts of
the building. If you cannot get actual continuity on that
side of the ball, in your you might have the
same scouts year over year, but they're being told to
do different things by whoever the new GM or director
of personnel is that's coming into the building. You're changing
analytics programming, You are changing the types of traits that
(08:54):
that people prioritize in every single position on the field.
You are either listening to a new coach who and
tells you exactly what he wants in his players, or
in some cases, in some buildings, you are dictating to
that coach what types of players he will be given.
It's just not It does not spell success when failure compounds.
The number one reason is because they are not developing
(09:18):
a language over enough time that integrates through every single
piece of the fabric of that building. And that is
a huge issue here. You saw it in Carolina for
a while, You've seen it in Chicago for a while.
It's part of the reason why gms who maybe aren't
doing as great as you would like get extensions and
continue to get shots Ryan Pole like Ryan Poles because
(09:42):
what they see on the other side of it is okay.
But you're you're establishing at least a bench a bunch
of benchmarks for how you're evaluating players. You're not just
shifting it and changing it up all over again and
giving the next person who comes into coach an impossible task.
Speaker 1 (09:57):
So they make Mike McCoy the interim head coach. I
think more than anything, it was just Brian Callahan didn't
have it like we're making all the reasons why the
Titans as an organization hasn't had it for a while.
Speaker 2 (10:11):
Yeah. Yeah, he is a fault for some of this too.
I mean he did not.
Speaker 1 (10:14):
I mean, yeah, he's at fault more than anyone. I
never really understood the hire to begin with. He clearly
impressed them in the interview process and everything, and he
comes from a great lineage and he got to bring
his dad, who was a great offensive line coach. Although
the offensive line I would say is the most single
most disappointing part of the entire team right now. So
it didn't work with Tennessee. But you just you never
(10:35):
saw an imprint. You saw very predictable play calling, Like
the Raiders knew exactly what was coming last week. There
was a play Devin White talked about it afterwards like
we knew exactly what they were doing on different and
you saw that again and again that it was just
a really poorly run offense. They didn't win games, they
didn't show progress, So all that like makes sense. Mike
McCoy if if you happen to remember the final days
(10:58):
of the San Diego charge he was the coach, was
a very depressing time. The last couple of years he
was put in a tough spot. He did have a
winning record one year when he started out, and then
the last couple of years they thought they were leaving
San Diego. I was at what they thought was the
last game in San Diego Chargers history, and Eric Weddle
goes around the stadium and it's very emotional and it's
(11:19):
like this beautiful thing with the fans. And then the
next year they're like, actually, we are coming back. And
then so they do it again the next year and
it's kind of, you know, again not official, and they
fire Mike McCoy right afterwards, and he's just kind of
been passed around since. Not an inspiring hire. But ultimately
this keeps all the rest of the staff at the
same position. And I did notice how Paul Koharski, who
(11:42):
covers them locally, kept getting messages from different Titans fans
who were getting texts from the team to buy season
tickets now that they've fired Brian Callahan, because previously they
said we'll consider buying some tickets when you fire Brian Callahan,
and so is them circling back, And to me, I
think that that's it more than anything is just total
(12:05):
apathy and just trying to give the fans something that
they are happy about.
Speaker 2 (12:09):
They're gonna now now obviously early on here, and you're
going to see this probably with at least one to
two other teams. Before the season is done, coaching search
cycle starts all over again, so you see you'll see
a lot of names put into the running quote unquote.
Agents are really good at that this time of year,
floating the names of their clients as possible candidates for
(12:31):
jobs like this. You'll see probably them look in a
lot of different areas, including college football. With some of
the movement that's happening and will continue to happen with
that big Penn State job coming open, there will be
movement all across college football because of that. You're going
to see the Titans. Really this will be interesting because
they're first, so in your first you know, that's part
(12:51):
of it too. I think why they move the way
they did when you're first, you get a head start
on everybody and to try to get it right.
Speaker 1 (12:57):
Well, we'll see if they can. Obviously, we hope, hope
the best for cam Ward, but he's got eleven more
games to go in his rookie season. There's so much
more and uh, they're keeping the same play caller Bo
Hart agree, even though he's not the offensive coordinator, which
that's confusing to Dinard Wilsone coach, Right.
Speaker 2 (13:15):
Yeah, who's doing that?
Speaker 1 (13:16):
I know that you figure they get the bum from
getting rid of Callahan, but also like how much can
you really change in that quick of a of a period.
And Mike McCoy seems seems like a nice guy. Definitely
not like a fun interim head coach. He's not part
of that genre of coaches which I love, like like
(13:37):
Dan Campbell, Like Dan Campbell with the Dolphins back in
the day, who's got to make speeches and got to
get everyone fired up. Mike McCoy is, you know, kind
of the Brian Callahan of interim head coaches. He's he's
just kind of there. But maybe he's learned a lot
over the last decade. We'll see, all right, let's just
fly through the rest of this news. Puka Akua is
expected to miss some time. According to Ian Rappaport, McVeigh
(14:00):
will not go that far and just says he's day
to day. They're going into a bye week, so it
does make sense that they would let his ankle heal
and see if he can come back after the bye.
How do you think they look offensively without him? We'll
preview the show. But just on the Puka front.
Speaker 2 (14:17):
Well, you need Jordan Winning to step up because he's
kind of the one who plays in a little bit
more of that Puka role, specifically some of the more
hybrid tight end stuff that Puka does, less so the
pure receiver stuff that Puka does. So you really need
more from Jaywitt, who had a couple bad plays last
week in a big drop that he should have had.
So that's one thing. This is DeVante Adams now and
(14:41):
him and Matthew Stafford missed a couple of plays together
this last game, a couple of like just out of
sync kind of timing stuff. So you really got to
get that locked in. This is one of those two
where it would not surprise me at all if Puka
tries to go like if they say, oh, we'll leave
it all the way up until game time, first of all,
because that's just who he is. Second of all, they're
playing the Jacksonville Jaguars, Sean McVay disciple, Liam Cohen, Lesnie disciple,
(15:05):
James Gladstone of course they're going to try to play it,
you know, funny the entire way through. But it also
to me would not be smart to play him because
if you get hurt overseas, that's a long plane ride
back and a brutal one to have an injury on
and then you have the bye week on the other side.
Speaker 1 (15:22):
Yeah, they got they got to think long term and
think that, hey, if we're the team that we think
we are, we could go win a game overseas against
the Jaguars without pukuin Akua. So that will be interesting
to see because he's been as valuable as any player
in the league. Brian Branch, we talked about the fight
that happened after the Chiefs Lions game. I threw it
(15:44):
out there wondering like, is there a chance he would
get suspended and it did happen. I think some of
his previous infractions might have played a factor here, maybe
even Dan Campbell's words after the game where he had
no quarter essentially for Brian Branch, no, you know, saying
like we we will not stand for that thought it
was a cheap shot. So they lose Brian Branch for
(16:06):
a tough matchup for the Lions.
Speaker 2 (16:08):
Are depleted in the secondary too. That's tough.
Speaker 1 (16:10):
They are down their top two cornerbacks and now they're
down Brian Branch for a game. Who do they have
this week? I forget, off the top of my head,
they have the Tampa Bay Buccaneers before their bye week.
So the Bucks getting a bunch of receivers. Yeah, getting
a little bit of injury luck on the other side,
which which they also had last week in San Francisco,
(16:32):
So sometimes it works both ways. Speaking of you know,
coaches that are under you know, the microscope, Aaron Glennon,
I wouldn't say he's on the hot seat, but he
he is zero and six and I don't think he's
done himself a ton of favors for how he's handled
the postgame press conferences throughout the course of the season.
Let's listen to him being asked after the game about
(16:55):
justin fields justice numbers are knock good on? This team
is going to be next week?
Speaker 4 (17:00):
Or come on, man, what kind of question is that
not a good game? I think there's a number of
guys that you know, I mean, sometimes this league is
like this and there are guys that have bad games.
That doesn't mean you just bench them. Come on, you
know better than that?
Speaker 1 (17:14):
Hmmm does he? That's a totally fair question. I think
the better questions is like, why didn't you Benjamin that game?
Like it was one of the many things I wish
I had said about that that performed, Like if you
put Tyrod Taylor into the game late in that game,
I think they win it. And I think there's a
lot of players on the team that probably think that too.
Speaker 2 (17:31):
Yeah, first of all, I don't think justin Field is
over all the problem here with with what's happening in
the Jets right now and has continued to happen to them.
But a game like that where he has the third
worst EPA per drop back of the season and the
second worst from a couple of weeks ago against Buffalo,
but that this game specifically the third worst, and was
not throwing the ball downfield lowest average distance of throw
(17:55):
in the NFL since the season began of any team
of any quarterback. So yeah, you want to throw the
ball down the field, you have to throw the ball
down the field a little bit more. And either they
weren't letting him, or he's not trusting what he's seeing,
or guy all of the above. And he's holding the ball,
he's taking sacks. I think, to me, this is more
like a beat writer who already knows the head coach
(18:17):
really well, the head coach who already knows the beat right.
I don't know who it was, but it was very blunt.
It was very like I think sometimes we think that
things are being antagonistic, when sometimes that's just the way
people communicate with each other because they know each other
really well, and it happens to get picked up at
the wrong time by the cameras. Now, I will say
locally and fairly. So there is pushback on his comments
(18:39):
overall in terms of the strategy of them, because you
do need to think about whether or not you need
to make a move at quarterback well.
Speaker 1 (18:47):
In that game. But I think it speaks to where
he struggled and where Tanner Engstrom struggled too, Like calling, yeah,
a drop back pass when you needed five or six
more yards to win the game and you just ran
the ball pretty well and you call it pass on
first down. I think it's a totally fair question.
Speaker 2 (19:04):
Oh, I agree, that's what I'm saying. I don't know
that a ton should be made about the question. The
answer itself, I just because I think it's a fair question.
And honestly, I think, to me, if he's really looking
at this game, and I think he is, he's seeing
a lot of problems with his own situational management, with
the play calling on the offensive side, with the play
calling on the defensive side. Like, there's a lot of
(19:25):
other issues, That's what I'm saying that aren't necessarily it
feels had a bad game, let's not sugarcoat that. But
there's a lot of issues strategically and situationally with this
team that don't get fixed by benching the starting QUARTERBA.
Speaker 1 (19:36):
One thing I've just noticed is in his post game
he just refuses to He's just I think so angry
after the game that he refuses to give anything. And
I think he would be under a little less heat
there if not for.
Speaker 2 (19:54):
Shoot, look at Jacksonville, like.
Speaker 1 (19:55):
The higher expectations, which the.
Speaker 2 (19:57):
Positions right switch the positions we're having to say conversation
about Liam Cohen, who has done a great job so
far but has had some sloppy stuff on offense. If
you switch those two markets in those two coaches right now,
we're not even talking about this. We are talking about
you got to figure your you know what out in
terms of the game management, to play calling, get better
play out of the quarterback, have a better plan for
(20:18):
the quarterback. But quarterback has to play better.
Speaker 1 (20:22):
We are Liam Cohen might have some wins though, that's
the main thing.
Speaker 2 (20:24):
But that's the thing we're we're not like that's the tone. Yeah,
we're talking a lot about the tone. I don't I
just don't really, I don't really see the point of it.
Speaker 1 (20:32):
I think it's it's it's more representing maybe maybe how
that locker room is feeling, or maybe just like giving
a little bit to that Farah.
Speaker 2 (20:43):
Wilson was pretty open about how disappointed he was about
that late second quarter into halftime strategy. Like he said,
I know, once I learned what the plan was, I
was disappointed and as he as he should be. It
was a cowardly way to coach a football game.
Speaker 1 (20:57):
Yeah, I think when when you're the kind of a
CEO head coach, you have to have that part of
the game and part of it is game management buttoned down,
and part of it is handling the media afterwards. The
Minnesota Vikings are not letting us know who the starter
is at quarterback. This week, Kevin O'Connell says he wants
(21:18):
to see how this week looks for JJ McCarthy. He
also mentioned Carson Wentz will be practicing. Does feel like
Carson Wentz has a good chance to start again, a
little bit of a soft benching. I feel like for
JJ McCarthy.
Speaker 2 (21:34):
There is somebody who you are not thinking about in
this conversation that I think the local media there has
been thinking about since training camp. We all should be
thinking about and talking about as it pertains to can
Carson Wentz actually like not Carson Wentz up a game,
you know or has he heard it? Like it banged
up Max Brosmer, their backup who basically they he was
(21:57):
the only backup that stayed on the team. They overhauled
their higher quarterbacks room late into training camp to bring
Carson Winson. They kept Max Brosmer in when I was
there for training camp. Not only was he throwing the
ball really well, but like the coaching staff like this
kid's got something and the coaching staff is buying in
on his development.
Speaker 5 (22:16):
Now.
Speaker 2 (22:16):
I'm not saying he's gonna come out here and be
the future. I'm not saying that at all. Please don't
be in my comments section, But and I put him
on the Future Hits list for that reason, and I
got I caught heat for it, because why the hell
am I putting don't don't I know JJ McCarthy's on
this team, Why the hell am I putting Max Brosmer
for the Minnesota Vikings choice and all of that fair.
But he's got something to him and the coaches see
(22:37):
it and they like it, and they want him to
keep They want him to stick around, and they want
to develop it.
Speaker 1 (22:41):
I was getting excited in London when when he was
worming up on the sideline, we thought it was Bras time,
but it didn't happen. Wentz stayed in that game. The
more interesting part for me is if JJ McCarthy is
back on the practice field, and maybe they'll use the
injury as an excuse. They're bringing him back slowly, but
if he is on the practice field and he's not starting,
(23:04):
it is really taking a more aggressive Hey, we're trying
to develop this kid long term, but we kind of
decided he is not ready to go right now and
he is not going to be starting games when he
is able, which was kind of my suspicion over the
last couple of weeks anyways, and it's different, but I
think we have to support quarterbacks having different development arcs,
(23:24):
yes and timeline, So we definitely would have been surprised
going into the season to find out that this is
how it was going. But we'll see. Maybe it will
be McCarthy this week and this will all be a
waste of time. Surprising news this week, Eagles pass rusher
Zadarius Smith retired out of nowhere and he signed with
the team four weeks ago. Made a big impact, i
(23:46):
would say, in the first couple of games and has
been playing plenty there without Nolan Smith, so they are
very thin in terms of their edge rush group. It
is becoming a major problem for them. They have a
Zizo Jalari, they have Jlyx Hunt, but they are just
not getting much heat. So it just makes you think
that Howie Roseman's going to make a move there, maybe
a move at cornerback. More than that in a little bit.
(24:08):
And then finally I noticed Chauncey Gardner Johnson was released
from the practice squad, and since we are the official
podcast tracking all the doings of CJ GJ are Great, producer,
Eric decided he'd put together something combining a couple of
clips from the last few weeks. Let's be real, every
(24:31):
team that's gotten Chauncey Gardner Johnson since has gotten sick
of him pretty quickly.
Speaker 2 (24:36):
But it's always it's getting shorter and short, it's getting shorter.
Speaker 1 (24:40):
The Eagles had him for a year and then they
let him go to the Lions, who had him for
a year, and to be fair to you know, CJGG,
the Eagles took him back once getting add a little
spicy defense you CJ. Gardner Johnson who did not play
well or fit in in Houston. Yeah, but you don't
go to the Ravens kicking that noise.
Speaker 2 (24:58):
How many weeks is he there?
Speaker 1 (25:00):
I feel like he's gonna have learned and he's a
good player. Oh yeah, I'm gonna say, all right, there
we go weeks left. We'll be there through this left
and then I'm gonna give him one more year, thirty
weeks left. I just think it's a solid year.
Speaker 2 (25:12):
And at any point but.
Speaker 1 (25:13):
This is and then it'll kind of expire. That second
clip was from seven days ago, so I was only
twenty nine weeks off. That was rough.
Speaker 2 (25:24):
That's okay, you know what his agents, we start the
counter is the agent.
Speaker 1 (25:27):
Told Pro Football Talk that they wanted a spot with
a clearer path to plane, and once the Ravens made
another trade for a safety Aloie Gilman, the path to
plane was really no longer there, and so he gone.
Speaker 2 (25:41):
I need someone to not let me put off getting
a haircut for quite long in the future. Real shaggy
September over here.
Speaker 1 (25:49):
I mean, yes, that those two clips from September and
quiet October, so much happens. I love a little shaggy September.
Let's take a break. We're going to play a little
game of would you wrap there? In just a few minutes,
tak a little TNF two back on NFL Daily and
we're gonna play a quick game of would you rather?
(26:12):
And we're approaching the trade deadline. We're still pretty far
away November fourth, but I've already gotten a lot of trades.
Speaker 2 (26:19):
Mm h. This is great for you. You love this.
Speaker 1 (26:22):
I love trade season. And if you think about this
season in particular, there's a lot of teams at the
bottom definite sellers. Titans, Raiders, Saints, Browns, Jets. That's a
lot of potential sellers. Considering we're only six weeks in.
We still got a few more weeks. There's more possible
teams out there, Like would the Ravens and Bengals ever
(26:43):
be sellers? I mean if the Ravens Cardinals, Yeah, if
they took on some l so we're gonna play some
Would you rather mine were somewhat focused on jamming some
some trade content?
Speaker 2 (26:54):
So I'm gonna shocked by this information.
Speaker 1 (26:57):
I'm just gonna throw out one which has just like
a little bit of backing, you know, information behind it,
but is more just spicy and fun. Would you rather
Aj Brown? Or actually, let's go AJ Brown and a
fourth round pick? Or Christian Gonzales of the Patriots?
Speaker 2 (27:19):
Whoa, oh man.
Speaker 1 (27:23):
This is partly informed by Mike Rabel and the Patriots
seeming to be like a little annoyed all the time
about Christian injuries, about injuries and about injured players in general.
Speaker 2 (27:34):
This wasnese not actually humanly helped. Let's be annoyed about that.
Speaker 1 (27:39):
And yeah, and Mike Rabel made it pretty clear in
Tennessee he would get sick of and sometimes get rid
of players who would miss practice with soft tissue injuries,
which is what christ so to me, it doesn't make
a ton of sense to trade him. But if you would,
the Patriots have been connected with AJ Brown. And this
is just a way of the large your conversation and look,
(28:02):
teams are having it around the league, like could AJ
Brown be available? I think there's a lot of teams
that think either AJ Brown or DeVante Smith could be
available at some point. To me, AJ Brown would make
more sense of those two. And so there's an interesting
need combo here. I think the Eagles would do that trade.
(28:22):
But which would you rather?
Speaker 2 (28:23):
I would rather have? If I'm a team that's in
contention possibility like at a Hey, I'm a buyer and
I'm looking to see if you know, after the deadline
I can make a real run. Would I would take
AJ Brown? If I had a quarterback and if I
had a pass heavy or even balanced attack like I'm
looking at. You know, there's a couple teams in Los
(28:44):
Angeles that might be into having AJ Brown on their roster.
There are teams all over the NFC. There's a Buffalo
Bills team.
Speaker 1 (28:53):
If he was available, he'd have a fantastic market.
Speaker 2 (28:56):
Yes, there'd be a Buffalo Bills team that might be
super interested in having a receiver finally, a number one
receiver like AJ Brown on the team, and maybe even
having a player such as that on your roster kills
the entire section of the playbook that's all gadget plays.
How about that? Wouldn't that be something for the Buffalo Bills. Yeah,
I think I would pick AJ Brown. I love Christian Gonzales,
(29:19):
you know this, but I think that I would rather.
If I'm looking to actually make a push, I'm looking
at scoring points, run blocking, I pick Aj a little.
Speaker 1 (29:29):
Maybe I'm overrating Christian Azal because I threw in a
fourth with AJ Brown, Because I just figured Gonzalez is
going to get a big contract after this season. He'll
be eligible, yeah, for the first time. So the big
contract wait the Patriots out is coming. But the big
contract would be coming for AJ Brown too. You can't
trade for him and not give him even another upgrade,
(29:49):
although he just got one. He's already getting paid a
lot of money. But the difference in years I just
think about. Yes, I guess what top like number one
wide receivers are earth on the market a little bit
more than number one cornerbacks. But I think if you
were just putting cornerbacks on the open market in a vacuum,
everyone's just available. I would guess Christian Gonzalez would be
(30:13):
a top five cornerback in the entire NFL, and maybe
AJ Brown is a top five receiver too, But at
that age and you have cost control for him, like
for five six years, I would think that would be
like an extremely attractive trade target that Patriots fans would
go crazy if they traded him.
Speaker 2 (30:29):
But if you are again you're talking trade deadlines, yesally Greg,
So you're not really thinking necessarily about twenty twenty six.
If you're a team that is aggressive to buy at
the trade deadline, you are thinking about this January and
potentially this February. That's what you're thinking about. All the
other stuff can come after that, but that's what you're
thinking about. Is breaking through that final window of contention,
(30:51):
that final little ceiling and getting into like the real
contention area versus playoff contention. You have to make some
big moves in order to get to that point. And
that's why I think a team would and and potentially
will even make this move if he's available, because he
could take he can take your receiver's room from an
(31:12):
A to an A plus a B to an A
plus hell a C to an A depending on your
passing attack and your quarterback. If you bring him into
your building.
Speaker 1 (31:22):
Well, imagine AJ Brown is the one you're talking about.
You need to get quarterback. How would Drake May? He
would he would qualify. Think, Oh, I mean I want
this to be in the trade. This is that's yes,
that's the trade. That's what I'm saying. Which, so you're
so back I think that, I think I could see
that happening. I wouldn't want it. I actually would rather
have Christian Gondals personally because of the long term, long
(31:44):
term thing. Hard to find a good young cornwork. All right,
give me one.
Speaker 2 (31:48):
Okay, this is kind of related to not just this
head coaching vacancy, but a couple of others who have
been on shaky ground over the last year or so.
Would you rather you're starting in twenty twenty six. You're
not coming in now, You're starting in twenty twenty six.
Rosters as is okay, so don't do the free agent
math or anything. Rosters are as is. Would you rather
(32:09):
take over the Tennessee Titans, the New York Jets, the
Miami Dolphins, or the New York Giants?
Speaker 1 (32:18):
In Ownership counts.
Speaker 2 (32:20):
Ownership, everything counts, But you are making roster and coaching decisions.
Speaker 1 (32:25):
Oh I'm drunk with power. Yeah, well you'd like this one. Yeah,
you can eliminate the Dolphins and the Jets quickly. I
think because they don't have quarterbacks that I would want
Jackson Dart is a consideration ownership. You know, these are
teams that have done a lot of losing. Ultimately, I
(32:47):
think you'd feel better about the Giants ownership, like over
the you know, the longest of stretches, so that that's
a positive for them. You know, I'm gonna have a
lot of confidence that I'm going to be the one
to really fix things, and I can fix some camboard.
I think I would take over the Titans of it
just because of camboard.
Speaker 2 (33:05):
That's that's an interesting one. I actually thought you would
pick that one. I actually would pick the Dolphins because
I if I'm looking at the roster as is what
I see. If I am a GM or whoever the
person in control is going to be, I will get
to hire my own head coach at that point, and
intern there hasn't already been a move to make that
(33:26):
move prior to twenty twenty six. Okay, I will I
see a roster full of big time tradable assets from
the quarterback to the edge rushers to the receivers. Still
if you want to.
Speaker 1 (33:39):
But you said, like for the rest of this season
or next no, no, next season, Well those guys are
all gone.
Speaker 2 (33:43):
But I'm saying you have this whatever core is there, now,
this is what you have to work with. That's what
I'm saying. Don't think agency or whatever. Like I see
a complete rebuild, and I see a huge load of
picks coming in, draft picks coming in because of all
of these players who would then be deemed as tradable
(34:05):
to completely overhaul and rebuild that entire proce.
Speaker 1 (34:07):
See we we we see things differently because they would
be last on my list. I don't see any players
that I really want long term. There are not many
like Jalen and Waddle. Like there's one Patrick Paul, somebody,
there's two.
Speaker 2 (34:20):
Somebody would trade for Tua, sure.
Speaker 1 (34:23):
But not not that much. And you'd have to you
have to take a dead cap hit and everything to
get rid of him. I don't think you're going to
get much the pass rushers, even pretending they're on the
team next year, which they're not going to be.
Speaker 2 (34:35):
This is the parameter, right, But even then he gave
me a J Brown, a fourth round pick. You play
in the parameters of my game, So I will never
play settlers of Cata.
Speaker 1 (34:44):
I would put him, you know, even if you're getting
the stuff that you would get for him, like this year,
for instance, because I think Chubb and Jalen Phillips will
be available in trades. I just I don't know if
it's much. The longer I thought about it, though, after
I answered quickly because my initial instinct is just just
take the team with the best quarterback. Yeah, I don't
think that's right, because I think the Jets and the
Giants ultimately have way more foundational pieces that I like.
(35:12):
I kind of like the Jets offensive line, like their vacuum.
They're two young tackles, that's like a really nice starting point.
You have Garrett Wilson, you have Sauce Gardner. It's a
lot to overcome. The Giants I think are the pick. Actually,
though for me, now that I came all the way
back around, I'm not sure how I feel about Jackson Dart,
but I get to see what happens, and you know,
(35:34):
you took them late enough that you can still have
eyes wide open at quarterback. But you have Molik Neighbors,
you have Andrew Thomas, you have Abdell Carter, you have
Brian Burns, you have Dexter Lawrence. Ultimately, you have at
least a history that they used to win some games.
Speaker 2 (35:51):
That was my second pick.
Speaker 1 (35:52):
Blue.
Speaker 2 (35:53):
The Giants were my second pick because of all of
the players that you just said, minus perhaps Jackson Dark
because I would not want it to take over a
team and inherit a quarterback who wasn't like a lights
out Jayden Daniel's superstar, like you know.
Speaker 1 (36:07):
We'll see how he looks the rest of the year
and then we'll just replace him.
Speaker 2 (36:10):
And yeah, that's what I'm saying, is like you could
always you could always move from somebody who isn't necessarily
a top five pick. You can always reputationally and optically
move on from that player. So it's good. I just
wouldn't want to inherit the quarterback.
Speaker 1 (36:21):
That's fair. Although after that last game, I mean my
mind is open. That game was good enough to change.
Speaker 2 (36:28):
We don't know if he's gonna make it to next year. Cope,
he stays healthy.
Speaker 1 (36:32):
That one game. That one game was good enough though
to change I think, like the math of Jackson Dark.
Like if we were redoing the draft right now just
based off that one game, I think it would be
like you have to move off your points. That game
was good enough at an NFL level, and he did
so many different really good things in that game, like
he would be a top five pick. He would no
(36:53):
longer be a late pick.
Speaker 2 (36:54):
I love this because I remember, and fairly so. I
think at the time you comped him to Tim Tebow
because because.
Speaker 1 (37:00):
I just went that was a team TEPO performance. You
mean in terms of the stack.
Speaker 2 (37:04):
Eric's been great to sun up some of the tapes
we could we could go through the transcript, so yes,
later on, but I remember texting you during this this
last game that their their win and saying, see not
Tim Tebo.
Speaker 1 (37:16):
Yes, I mean very much not Tim Tebow in that game.
I'm going to do a little different type of would
you rather We're going to go back to the trade candidates.
But first this is more of just a life one,
all right, you have the option.
Speaker 2 (37:30):
Remember I'm already getting hit twenty times in my lifetime
by Miles Garrett.
Speaker 1 (37:34):
It's closer to that one. All right, you have the option,
and we actually have a drop ready here. You have
the option to listen to this drop in a soundproof booth.
Speaker 2 (37:46):
Baker Ball Cathe sod rolling manbe baker Ball Caith Sadrobe
no baker Bole Cathe.
Speaker 1 (37:56):
So just keep that plane.
Speaker 2 (37:59):
Listen to this keeps while in a soundproof booth baker
Ball for.
Speaker 1 (38:05):
Twenty four hours straight, while watching the Baker Mayfield Scramble
from Sunday on a huge television in which the soundproof booth,
you will be given exactly two salads from the huddle
at ten hour intervals. You can choose the ingredients of
the salads. I know you like that, okay or okay.
Speaker 2 (38:28):
Ball yeah, please stop?
Speaker 1 (38:31):
Okay. So it would be twenty three hours fifty nine
minutes more of that, but then you're watching the scramble
or you're back in the soundproof booth for twenty four hours,
but you have to listen to a specially curated podcast
by Eric collecting every single mention and discussion of Drake
(38:51):
may since the inception of NFL Daily. You don't have
to clap for when you like good points, but every
time you do a bag of trapper beef jerky magically
appears for sustenance, So it's which would you rather?
Speaker 2 (39:09):
This is so personally curated. I don't know whether to
be horrified or feel very special? Right, thank you? Oh
I do love a huddle sour.
Speaker 1 (39:20):
Okay, I thought that would be.
Speaker 2 (39:22):
Playing the sound. Stop playing the sound.
Speaker 1 (39:27):
It's twenty four hours. What if I threw in with
the drake May deal. You can also get the bucks,
you know every Sunday as like an assience. I picked that, Okay,
so good. I just think that I want you to
have to listen to all the drake May the beef jerky.
Anytime you clap, you have to clap to a good point.
Speaker 2 (39:42):
But yeah, good job, Greg, Thank you right the whole time, Greg,
Drake May Drake May.
Speaker 1 (39:49):
Greg. No, No, we've got We've got time to go.
All right, you're up.
Speaker 2 (39:53):
Oh that was so fun. Okay, I took your This
is another like very person only detailed one. I you know,
I cherish our friendship, and so I thought about you
specifically when designing this one, mostly based on your stature.
Speaker 1 (40:11):
Would you like to talk about that a lot?
Speaker 2 (40:12):
Complete? A pass behind attempt to pass behind the Raiders
offensive line or against the Broncos defensive line.
Speaker 1 (40:22):
Oh wait, you have to complete complete a pass behind
behind the Raiders offense.
Speaker 5 (40:29):
One.
Speaker 2 (40:29):
I'd rather either do that or attempt to pass against
the Broncos defensive.
Speaker 1 (40:36):
Okay, well, I would just go Raiders because I would
hope that you know, we're playing the Titans or something
like that. I don't know who we're playing.
Speaker 2 (40:42):
Jeffrey Simmons right in your face.
Speaker 1 (40:43):
I mean, that wouldn't be great.
Speaker 2 (40:44):
I mean interior pressure for a lower stature quarterback.
Speaker 1 (40:48):
But basically, the Browns defense is a worst case scenario.
If you're picking the defensive line, I least want to
go against. You know, they're in the top five certainly,
So I just feel like I'm going to roll with
the Raiders. I feel like silver and black I would
look good. It's slimming, it's cool. I feel like you
put sixty percent G on the back of a Raiders jersey.
(41:10):
That's selling. Yeah, you know.
Speaker 2 (41:12):
I also feel like, because you I would know that
you would want to just for a minute, put yourself
into Geno Smith's shoes, his cleats, feel his I mean,
not this year. You'd want to feel just a small
percentage of his pain. Take that away from him, you know,
take it upon your shoulders. It was in that moment.
You know, you only see one pair of footprints leaving
(41:33):
the field that day, Greg, It's in that moment that
you carried him.
Speaker 1 (41:36):
I would do anything to help him out because he
is not having fun playing football right now. You can
see it. They got the shackles on him. It's not
going well. And yeah, you can kind of. Yeah, just
imagine what it's like for you know, watching Dylan Gabriel
every week and then like subtract like four or four
more inches he's what five ten, five eleven, Yeah, it
(41:58):
would it would be comical. I will wrap up with
a more of a trade deadline. He won again because
they didn't want to get you know, some talking in this.
There's a lot of interesting players potentially available, and so
I just thought I would give you some of the
offensive skill guys who would you want the most? So
I'll give you Chris Olava or Jacoby Myers or Breese
(42:25):
Hall or Rashid Shaheed. Those are some of the most
interesting skill position players I think will be available for
various prices during the trade deadline.
Speaker 2 (42:38):
Jalen Waddle an option at all, No, you.
Speaker 1 (42:40):
Could throw that in if you really want.
Speaker 2 (42:42):
Okay, I'd probably take Jalen Waddle. Okay, Chris o Lave
would be good. I worry about the the concussion history,
obviously as a human, I worry about that. For him.
Rashid Shaheed's got some pop. I think I would take
Jalen Waddle though, if I was going to choose, especially
if I'm looking at the parameters in context of the
trade deadline, like I said, buying to win now, Yeah,
(43:06):
that's I think I would want that speed and versatility
on my on my roster.
Speaker 1 (43:11):
I think I think they'll wind up not really making
him available, but I'm I'm making him available to you,
so that that's a totally fair answer. I could see that.
It's interesting to watch a lobby and Shaheed. Shaheed's running
more diverse routes these days. Like he beat Carlton Davis,
you know, on press coverage last week with a really
(43:32):
nice move and we were talking about too too out.
Well before the show, you're saying you can't you know,
you can't teach that sort of speed. Well, like Brashid
Shaheed's got that sort of speed. Literally the fastest player
in the NFL this year. In terms of, you know,
miles per hour on the on that long touchdown, and
some size to him and a little bit of versatility.
(43:52):
Albbs happens to be coming off one of the worst
games of his career, so maybe it's tough, but it
had me go back to watch those targets because he
is not He's not bringing in the contested catches he had.
I would say three drops in that game, like PFF
for instance, only gave him one. He's not quite as
explosive or maybe as confident as he used to be.
His yards per catch under ten. He's an interesting player.
(44:14):
I think as a trade deadline approaches, if I was
picking one of these players to most likely actually get dealt,
I think it would be Jacoby Myers, just because he's on.
Speaker 2 (44:21):
The well and he there was all that buzz beforehand
before the season you wanted to get to be traded.
So yeah, I have no reason to believe that won't
eventually happen with the Raider season going the way that
it is.
Speaker 1 (44:33):
Our friend Adam as you know, he's got good connections
and yeah, look, I think any Saints player, for the
most part, except for the really young players, are going
to be available for the right price. But there's a
couple of guys on that team, like Pete Werner, their linebacker,
or Carl Granderson who you almost expect to get dealt
I don't think a guy like Shaheed or even a
(44:54):
Lave would go unless someone comes in and gives a
big price.
Speaker 2 (44:58):
Unless two two out Well is not available move and
I believe he will be.
Speaker 1 (45:01):
Yeah, he would be available, but he would have cost
second rounder minimum maybe at first. I mean, he's gonna
get a big contract, good big second contract. I wondered
if Jordan Addison could ever be available, just because the
contracts structure. They need him this year, but also you
know he's had the suspensions and things that are always
popping up. David and Joku I think will be available.
Speaker 2 (45:23):
I see that one.
Speaker 1 (45:24):
There's some interesting offensive linement like the entire Rounds interior
line I think could be available. Kevin Zeitler or the
Titans I think could be available. It'll be interesting. We'll
get into it more when we get clear.
Speaker 2 (45:35):
Your favorite to the deadline, Your favorite time of year?
Great Season, Part two.
Speaker 1 (45:40):
Our TNF preview. It is in Cincinnati Thursday night. Steelers
are five and a half point favorites going to Cincinnati,
and yeah, Joe Flacco who started for the Bengals only suddenly, yes,
six days after arriving there is gonna start another game
(46:01):
four days after the first start. It's outrageous, at least
according to Mike Tomlin.
Speaker 5 (46:05):
You know, to be honest, it was shocking to me.
Andrew Berry must be a lot smarter than me or us,
because it doesn't make sense to me to trade a
quarterback that you think enough of to make your opening
day starter to a division opponent that's hurting in that area.
But that's just my personal feelings.
Speaker 1 (46:25):
Who Okay, someone is not a fan of Andrew Berry
because I feel like Mike Tomlin would not make that
point at a criticism for something that is worthy of
being critique this specific move if you want to from
Mike Tomlin, if he didn't have a little more of
something there that he's just not a fan of how
Andrew Berry and the Browns do business.
Speaker 2 (46:45):
Someone wanted to face Jake Browning.
Speaker 1 (46:48):
Come on, that's fair.
Speaker 2 (46:49):
He knows Joe Flaco so well at this point that
dude wanted Jake Browning ball. I know you're still a believer.
Speaker 1 (46:55):
No, I'm not I'm definitely not.
Speaker 2 (46:57):
No, but he that guy really wanted Jake Browning.
Speaker 1 (47:00):
I don't think it's that. I think he's questioning like
the integrity of the Browns and how they operate. And
I saw a lot of people answered it's like, oh,
well you got something for Joe Flacco, like that's a
clear win, Like of course you would do that. Like
what are you even talking about? You can't be worried
you're not gonna win your division anyways. Okay, let's calm
down about Oh they got something, they got something about, Hey,
(47:20):
we got trade research. You got a fifth to a
sixth round pick swap that's worth nothing, like that is
worth next to nothing and whatever people make a big
deal of like, oh we got something for him, and
it's some like pick swap that you're gonna give up
a million times on Day three of the draft when
you're just like moving, it's just like calm down. I
kind of like Mike Tomlin saying, like, are we even
(47:41):
trying to win at playing football here? Or we just
are we just like playing math?
Speaker 2 (47:46):
Yeah, because he sometimes he does make comments about other organizations,
but it's never over like it's always very there's a
lot of like subtext to wade through, and there's like
hints and clues, bits and pieces, but never like I'm
going to call you by your name kind of a
thing like that was wild to me. I still, I
(48:07):
do think there's something too, not really wanting to see
the more veteran quarterback, especially one who's so familiar with
the Steelers and the defense they have always run. That's
changing a little bit now, but still is Mike Tomlin's
defense twenty five times, twenty two in the regular season
and three times in the playoffs. These Joe Flacco has
faced the Steelers.
Speaker 1 (48:26):
Wow.
Speaker 2 (48:27):
Blaco is eleven and eleven in the regular season against
the Steelers and one to two in the playoffs. In
the twenty two regular season meetings. This courtesy of my
colleague Mike de Fabo at the Athletic he's completed sixty
one percent of his passes with twenty seven touchdowns and
twelve interceptions for a passer rating of eighty five point four.
When he's at a passer rating of ninety eight or higher,
(48:48):
he's been seven to zero including the playoffs against the Steelers.
So yeah, I think he wanted Jake Browning.
Speaker 1 (48:54):
Yeah, I mean let's calm down though, Like I know.
Speaker 2 (48:57):
It's like Joe Flacco, It's like seventy year old Joe.
Speaker 1 (49:00):
Get that. No, I mean, let's come down. Those numbers
are doing a lot of work from you know, ten
to fifteen years previous when they were.
Speaker 2 (49:08):
Seventy year old Joe Flago. But he still he knows
this group.
Speaker 1 (49:11):
He played well last week. I think the Bengals are
putting a lot into what happened in the second half
of last week. But he did show up there and
that Jamar Chase touchdown was a thing of beauty. And
we find out after the game that it was inaudible
called by Jamar Chase. I mean, I haven't heard that happen.
I love. It also makes you wonder, like what exactly
(49:31):
is Zach Taylor doing there that the wide receiver is
going into the huddle and just calling plays because Flacco
and Chase and Higgins. Flacco was saying it was so
cool to see how good they are on the field,
like he literally had in practice with them, He had
twelve practice snaps with them during the week and to
see what they could do on the field, and they
were just talking about, hey, this could work, that could
work and they're out there just like calling plays by themselves.
(49:53):
And I think he got rid of the ball very
quickly in the second half of that game. He was
decisive and he looked better in that one half than
he had at any point for the Browns this season.
Speaker 2 (50:02):
Yeah, he gives the great receivers a chance, and he's
not really like he's playing kind of like fit mode
football right now. He literally has nothing to lose. These
teams are trading him around basically being like, can you
help us get the ball to our pass catchers so
that they don't stop showing up to our building? Like,
get these guys the ball. And that's what he's going
(50:23):
to do. And with as sort of banged up and
limited as they've been the Steelers have been in the secondary,
Joey Porter Junior obviously came back last week, still a
little bit banged up from the injury. Jalen Ramsey was
dealing with the hamstring but played really well last week
on a short week. I think that, Yeah, you're probably
kind of annoyed that this is the guy who's at
least going to give his pass catcher a shot, right.
Speaker 1 (50:45):
I do think he's an upgrade ultimately, they have so
many other problems on their team, and so I'm curious
what you think about Aaron Rodgers coming off potentially this
game in years. Yeah, potentially his best game since the Packers.
He did have some great box score games with the
Jets last year, but eye test wise, I thought he
kept stacking really good play after really good play. He
(51:06):
had the wow plays, but overall he was just really composed.
And he's going up against a Bengals defense which might
not have Trey Hendrickson and just benched their inside linebacker
Logan Wilson, who had gotten multiple long term contracts and
is only twenty nine years old, and they benched them
for a rookie, Barrett Carter. So they're playing two rookies
at linebacker, neither of Rogers, neither of whom played well
(51:30):
last week. By the way, Demetrius Knight really hasn't played
well all season. So how about that chess match for
Rogers against this al Golden defense which has been playing
hard but not consistent.
Speaker 2 (51:40):
When I went back and watched the Steelers this Alto
into the Steelers this last game, yeah, I agree with you.
I think other than that sort of garbage time of
the season, Rams game where the Rams came to the
Metal Lands when he was still a jet and made
it kind of a game at the end of the game.
Other than that game, this is the best game I've
seen from Rogers in a while, and it really was
(52:03):
the second half. And what I saw from Aaron Rodgers
in that game was a lot of the last couple
of years have really been punctuated by like there have
been mistakes all over the field, himself included, and he's
always looking around and getting angry, and he's angry at
the sideline, and he's angry at team and he's just angry. Well,
in this game, early on, he misses a long pass
(52:25):
attempt to DK Metcalf. It was wildly underthrown, like egregiously underthrown.
So that's the thing where you're like, Okay, this is
probably why in part he's not really throwing the ball
down down the field anymore. But he didn't. He got mad.
He was mad at himself, clearly, like he sort of
internalized it in a way that to me, I've only
been watching him externalize it for the last couple of years,
(52:48):
and instead he folded back into what the game plan
clearly was and will be moving forward, which is hit
yak plays and get the ball out fast, which he
always does, but depend on the guys to get yards
after the catch, whether it's DK Metcalf who's touchdown later
in the game was off of a yards after the
catch play on a quick throw by Aaron Rodgers where
(53:08):
he was excuse me, on a movement throw by Aaron
Rodgers where he was bootlegging out, which is great because
he looks better moving now than he has in quite
some time. He doesn't look twenty, but he definitely looks
better than we've.
Speaker 1 (53:20):
A lot of plays a last week.
Speaker 2 (53:21):
A lot of plays on the move. They're moving his
spot around and he's getting yards after catch plays to
guys like Jalen Warren who is playing a little yards
after the catch receiver as well as running the ball
and DK Metcalf, And I think, and especially including the
tight ends and the way that they're protecting, especially last week,
and the way that they're moving his launch point, I
think that that bodes well. This bodes well for Aaron
(53:42):
Rodgers and the Steelers. If he again he had the
confidence and he'd let that thing sail and it was
several feet before where he intended to put it, and
I think seeing that and then being like, Okay, I
got to come back to Arthur Smith's game plan here
and actually adhering to it, I think it worked.
Speaker 1 (54:01):
And the play has essentially ended for Rogers this year
when he's gotten pressure quickly, even last week, like the
numbers under pressure have been bad. And I don't think
their offensive line played well at all against Cleveland pass
pro wise, but that's a much tougher matchup and they
game planned around it so well. We talked to Miles
Garrett talked about it in the post game that it
(54:21):
didn't matter. So if you have a bad pass protection
group and I'm still waiting to see what the Steelers
group is, like, I mean, this is the perfect matchup
for you. The Bengals just have no juice if Hendrickson
is not on the field, and even if he is
on the field, they don't have a ton of juice.
And you mentioned the tight ends. They have gone to
the Darnel Washington offense like he love it. He's dominating snaps.
(54:44):
Pat Freiremouth is tight end three there now by quite
a distance. So it's Washington playing eighty percent of the snaps.
John Wis Smith's gonna be on the field quite a bit,
and they're using Washington really as an extra offensive lineman,
but also detaching him. And I really think he is
the third most important person on that offense to DK
Metcalf and Aaron Rodgers, and he might be just as
(55:05):
important as DK Metcalf. It's it's crazy. So it's an
uphill battle for the Bengals. Although you know, Thursday night
in the division at home, if you're into those sort
of numbers, it is pretty rare for like a team
to go on the road winning the division on these
short rest, especially in the AFC North. Yeah, the Bengals
have complained about it for years, and they got a
(55:25):
home game here this week.
Speaker 2 (55:26):
And I will say I did get a kick out
of Aaron Rodgers' response to Evan Washburn, who asked him,
what was it like for you to come down and
you know, experience some AFC North football after this last game,
And Rogers sort of looks at him and is like, well,
I've been playing NFC North football for woo and so
it's like, okay, So he's not I think I think
(55:47):
he's feeling it a little bit, and he's not really
phased by any of this. They already have such a
gap thanks in part to some of the injuries around
the division, especially at quarterback, they already have such a gap.
These are games you cannot losebous, so you cannot play
down to your opponent. If they can literally just hit
the floor of their potential in this game, I think
they have no problems in this team.
Speaker 1 (56:06):
Five and a halfs a lot. I would maybe take
the Bengals there. And yeah, if the Steelers win this game,
they should win the division. I mean they should win
the division regardless.
Speaker 2 (56:16):
They have a seventy two percent chance right now before
this game of winning the.
Speaker 1 (56:19):
Division, right, And like, yeah, he isn't really raiding the
AFC North because he showed up for just in time
for Joe Burrow to get hurt, Lamar Jackson to get hurt,
for both those teams defenses to absolutely stink, and for
the Browns to be the Browns, but a particularly depressing
version of the Browns. And oh, by the way, the
Steelers defense has been getting better and better Nick Kerberg.
(56:42):
No matter how good you think Nick Kerberg is, he's
probably better. There's a pretty strong argument to be made
that like He's not just the best pass rusher on
this team. I think that's I think that's clear right now.
He's better than TJ. Watt, but he you know, he's
top five in the league just in terms of that,
like pure skill set.
Speaker 2 (56:57):
They're sending more blitzes. Jalen had a couple of hits
quarterback hits because of the blitzes that they're starting to
do safety blitzer or send that slot player in for
extra pressure too. That actually really compliments Nick Herbig super well.
You could see how well that those two kind of
work off of each other. It's not just how he
works with the rest of the defensive line and they
(57:19):
I know, they were like really penalized last week too.
I don't really mind that. I just saw more like
juice from this defense, you know, and getting guys back
helps obviously, but I just saw just more from them
and like just that like that feeling that kind of
jumps off the screen that you can't really quantify.
Speaker 1 (57:36):
Yes, I saw that too in London that you know,
their defense came out to a slow start, to put
it nicely, to start the season, but I think they've
been getting better and better as they go. Who knows
Bengals defense is you know that I know the webin
on the text thread with the Wesleyan brothers, and you
know they've noticed that DJ Turner is playing well, like
(57:58):
Dax Hill is playing well, like they've been hard. I
think they can make this thing interesting. But yeah, ultimately
it'd be surprising if the Steelers did not win. We
will be recapping that game on Thursday. Yeah, let's forget
even playing the music out.
Speaker 2 (58:14):
I picked the other one.
Speaker 1 (58:16):
We will be back.
Speaker 2 (58:18):
I chose the Bear.
Speaker 1 (58:19):
You will be back, Jordan, and this Baker. This drop
will probably be back too, because we'll be talking about
the Buccaneers and every single game other than TNF, previewing
it all from the studio on Wednesday.
Speaker 2 (58:32):
We will see that Baker. Oh my god, that's really annoying.
Ball Keith sun rolling Ben
Welcome to NFL Daily, where we're just pumped at sweater
season again. I'm Greg rosenthalm here in the Chris Westling
podcast studio. Yes, I know a rainy Los Angeles day
with my friend Jordan Rodrieg.
Speaker 2 (00:18):
I know you walked in in your green sweater as
my gray sweater on. We both got like the subconscious memo,
it's below what sixty eight degrees in LA right now?
Speaker 1 (00:28):
Chris, You know, no one likes to hear Los Angeles
people like celebrate when it actually gets a little cooler,
a little rainier. But it's beautiful here. It's a beautiful
time in the season. Like we think we know some things,
we don't know anything. I was gonna mention what's coming
up on the news, but those things aren't really beautiful.
It's like injuries and a head coach losing his job.
(00:50):
But we're going to talk a little TNF with the
Steelers and the Bengals later and we're going to play
a game. Jordan, I know you love to play games.
In this game is would you?
Speaker 2 (01:01):
I do love to play games, Greg.
Speaker 1 (01:03):
Like, what kind are you? Like? A board game?
Speaker 2 (01:06):
So I am I'm a big time settlers of Catan
fan slash player. My sister, my twin sister, Maddie. She's
actually the reigning champion. Between myself and her, I have
been training. She's abroad on a research vessel. She's a scientist,
so for most of the year, so I can get
my reps in and you can play online and stuff
(01:26):
like that, just to get your your practices and all
of that. That's my number one board game.
Speaker 1 (01:32):
I think I love a lot of people who are big,
you know, board game people. I'm not one of those people.
But I did play one game of Sellers of Catan
when I was younger.
Speaker 2 (01:41):
I feel like that that game would just make you
really mad.
Speaker 1 (01:44):
I don't have the patience I liked to risk. That
was when I was like twelve.
Speaker 2 (01:48):
I'll tell you this, fans, fans of Settlers of Catan
will exactly what I'm talking about when I say this.
Greg Rosenthal and I will never play against each other
and Settlers of Kids and because of that, we will
have a long and beautiful friendship.
Speaker 1 (02:02):
Okay, I'm looking forward to never playing with you. Let's
talk news. We mentioned it on the doubleheader night. It
just felt like Brian Callahan's firing with the Titans. Did
not deserve to be sandwiched into this glorious night of
football upsets, and so we decided we'll talk about it here.
One of the least surprising firings. At least we knew
(02:26):
it was coming at some point this season. We didn't
know when it happens on a Tuesday afternoon. It comes
from the team itself. I find that interesting. Absolutely no
national reporters had it, no local reporters had it. In fact,
Adam Schefter was like on air being asked about it
like half an hour before or something like that and said,
I don't see that happening, And so that indicates to me,
(02:47):
maybe it comes from from the very top. And no
one really had a bet on what ownership was thinking there.
It was not ownership though that spoke about Brian Callahan's firing.
Let's listen to team president and president of football operations,
Chad Brinker.
Speaker 3 (03:04):
We were looking for growth in this football team. And
that's what this is about right now, is we're not
seeing enough growth from this football team. We're one to
five and we got to be better in this and
I want to acknowledge the fact that we're all frustrated.
We understand that you the fan, You're frustrated with everything
(03:24):
that's going on, but I can We're doing everything we can.
We will do everything we can to build a football
program that you can be proud of.
Speaker 1 (03:33):
So I don't know if Chad Brinker ultimately made this decision.
We don't know. He's the one that's answering all the questions.
Adam Amy. Adam Strunk was not there at the press conference,
which is typical. Owners aren't often there at the firings.
Mike Burganzi was there the general manager. I do though,
by the conspiracy theory that they did it before Mike
(03:55):
Rabel came to town, specifically, like they did not want Mike
Rabel to be coming in there and reminding them of
past dysfunction while Brian Callahan was still there. So maybe
they get the fired coach bump this week to try
to take out their old faux Mike Rabil. Yeah.
Speaker 2 (04:13):
I buy that. Actually, I do buy that. I think
that from listeners and viewers who think Noah team couldn't
possibly be thinking about that specific type of detail when
making massive and potentially franchise altering decisions, Yes they can,
and they often do. This was interesting to me. I
think that the players probably knew something was up before
(04:36):
any of the rest of us did, because I don't
think Jeffrey Simmons, who's been a cornerstone of that franchise
for a little while now, who is still a great player,
would come so far out as to say how flat
the team felt, how pointing fingers without overtly he didn't
do the to a thing for example.
Speaker 1 (04:54):
Well maybe he helped, you know, put it over the
top by saying, I.
Speaker 2 (04:57):
Just feel like a player like that knows when people
and can feel when other people are starting to get
checked out or starting to feel a little nervous. It
also some sort of awkward. Brian Callahan's father, Bill is
on the staff and reportedly left the team as well
in light of the news that is his son the
head coach got fired. So kind of awkward dynamics all
(05:18):
around there. But now you know, the Titans are back
to where they've been multiple times over the last couple
of seasons, especially an achronus with their GM higher, with
their quarterback draft. Everything is like it's sort of Bearsian
of the last several seasons where you would almost get
everything lined up and then something would happen and you
won't be lined up with all three positions of power
(05:39):
for in this case, including the quarterback.
Speaker 1 (05:41):
Yeah, they've they've never been lined up. They're you know,
in the on the shortlist of the most dysfunctional franchises
in the league. Let's go through it. John Robinson and
Mike Rabil have a power struggle and they fired John
Robinson pretty soon after the AJ Brown trade, which to
me really kickstarted this dysfunction going into overdrive. So that
(06:03):
AJ Brown trade, which you know, led to that team
kind of falling apart, and Mike Rabel clearly didn't seem
too happy about it. Okay, you get rid of the
GM who had had a lot of success there. Just
thirteen months later, they fired Mike Rabel after he has
a power struggle with the new GM ran Carthon. And
you know, they ownership chose the new GM ran Carthon.
(06:27):
That is when they hire Brian Callahan. That that's only
a year and a half ago. Ran Carthon lasts one year,
which is almost unprecedented. So that's that's ownership saying that
they made a pretty big mistake. They announced that Brian
Callahan was involved in the hiring of the new GM
Mike Borganzi, so as recently as January, unless they were
(06:50):
selling us a bill of goods, which is possible in
these situations, it could have always been this guy Chad Brinker,
who ultimately.
Speaker 2 (06:57):
Common denominator of all of this, even.
Speaker 1 (07:00):
He only goes back a couple of years. But yes,
he admitted he has full personnel control. So it's not
the GM Borganzh who comes from the Chiefs. He has
been there the whole time. And then they decide to
bring in Borgonzhi and then yeah, ten months later they
fire Callahan. That is a rough two and a half
three year stretch for a team just to not be aligned.
(07:23):
And then it's like, oh, it's not my fault. I
didn't draft him or I didn't hire him, and it's
just like an endless cycle.
Speaker 2 (07:29):
Yeah, And that's part of the reason why failure compounds
in buildings that just seem so out of sync and
can't get it right year over year over year. The
other part of it is if you are evaluating players,
he's saying, we're doing everything we can to get on
the right track to make this a football team that
fans can be proud of, and all of these things
(07:49):
and noting that they haven't seen improvement. Part of that
is because you're changing your entire evaluation language internally every
two years, even every one year, not even giving one
person the rand carthon who's there for a year, even
install in event.
Speaker 1 (08:04):
You've got that's crazy, But I don't.
Speaker 2 (08:08):
Think people understand. And I sort of saw this firsthand
doing this Fighting RAM series where I was embedded with
the Scouting and Talent ID department with the RAMS for
a year. It's like the continuity matters. Continuity matters so
much because you can develop a way to scout and
identify players that specifically fit within the language of how
a head coach is teaching his scheme and deploying his
(08:30):
plays and concepts on the head coach, the defensive, all
of these things that trickle into the different parts of
the building. If you cannot get actual continuity on that
side of the ball, in your you might have the
same scouts year over year, but they're being told to
do different things by whoever the new GM or director
of personnel is that's coming into the building. You're changing
analytics programming, You are changing the types of traits that
(08:54):
that people prioritize in every single position on the field.
You are either listening to a new coach who and
tells you exactly what he wants in his players, or
in some cases, in some buildings, you are dictating to
that coach what types of players he will be given.
It's just not It does not spell success when failure compounds.
The number one reason is because they are not developing
(09:18):
a language over enough time that integrates through every single
piece of the fabric of that building. And that is
a huge issue here. You saw it in Carolina for
a while, You've seen it in Chicago for a while.
It's part of the reason why gms who maybe aren't
doing as great as you would like get extensions and
continue to get shots Ryan Pole like Ryan Poles because
(09:42):
what they see on the other side of it is okay.
But you're you're establishing at least a bench a bunch
of benchmarks for how you're evaluating players. You're not just
shifting it and changing it up all over again and
giving the next person who comes into coach an impossible task.
Speaker 1 (09:57):
So they make Mike McCoy the interim head coach. I
think more than anything, it was just Brian Callahan didn't
have it like we're making all the reasons why the
Titans as an organization hasn't had it for a while.
Speaker 2 (10:11):
Yeah. Yeah, he is a fault for some of this too.
I mean he did not.
Speaker 1 (10:14):
I mean, yeah, he's at fault more than anyone. I
never really understood the hire to begin with. He clearly
impressed them in the interview process and everything, and he
comes from a great lineage and he got to bring
his dad, who was a great offensive line coach. Although
the offensive line I would say is the most single
most disappointing part of the entire team right now. So
it didn't work with Tennessee. But you just you never
(10:35):
saw an imprint. You saw very predictable play calling, Like
the Raiders knew exactly what was coming last week. There
was a play Devin White talked about it afterwards like
we knew exactly what they were doing on different and
you saw that again and again that it was just
a really poorly run offense. They didn't win games, they
didn't show progress, So all that like makes sense. Mike
McCoy if if you happen to remember the final days
(10:58):
of the San Diego charge he was the coach, was
a very depressing time. The last couple of years he
was put in a tough spot. He did have a
winning record one year when he started out, and then
the last couple of years they thought they were leaving
San Diego. I was at what they thought was the
last game in San Diego Chargers history, and Eric Weddle
goes around the stadium and it's very emotional and it's
(11:19):
like this beautiful thing with the fans. And then the
next year they're like, actually, we are coming back. And
then so they do it again the next year and
it's kind of, you know, again not official, and they
fire Mike McCoy right afterwards, and he's just kind of
been passed around since. Not an inspiring hire. But ultimately
this keeps all the rest of the staff at the
same position. And I did notice how Paul Koharski, who
(11:42):
covers them locally, kept getting messages from different Titans fans
who were getting texts from the team to buy season
tickets now that they've fired Brian Callahan, because previously they
said we'll consider buying some tickets when you fire Brian Callahan,
and so is them circling back, And to me, I
think that that's it more than anything is just total
(12:05):
apathy and just trying to give the fans something that
they are happy about.
Speaker 2 (12:09):
They're gonna now now obviously early on here, and you're
going to see this probably with at least one to
two other teams. Before the season is done, coaching search
cycle starts all over again, so you see you'll see
a lot of names put into the running quote unquote.
Agents are really good at that this time of year,
floating the names of their clients as possible candidates for
(12:31):
jobs like this. You'll see probably them look in a
lot of different areas, including college football. With some of
the movement that's happening and will continue to happen with
that big Penn State job coming open, there will be
movement all across college football because of that. You're going
to see the Titans. Really this will be interesting because
they're first, so in your first you know, that's part
(12:51):
of it too. I think why they move the way
they did when you're first, you get a head start
on everybody and to try to get it right.
Speaker 1 (12:57):
Well, we'll see if they can. Obviously, we hope, hope
the best for cam Ward, but he's got eleven more
games to go in his rookie season. There's so much
more and uh, they're keeping the same play caller Bo
Hart agree, even though he's not the offensive coordinator, which
that's confusing to Dinard Wilsone coach, Right.
Speaker 2 (13:15):
Yeah, who's doing that?
Speaker 1 (13:16):
I know that you figure they get the bum from
getting rid of Callahan, but also like how much can
you really change in that quick of a of a period.
And Mike McCoy seems seems like a nice guy. Definitely
not like a fun interim head coach. He's not part
of that genre of coaches which I love, like like
(13:37):
Dan Campbell, Like Dan Campbell with the Dolphins back in
the day, who's got to make speeches and got to
get everyone fired up. Mike McCoy is, you know, kind
of the Brian Callahan of interim head coaches. He's he's
just kind of there. But maybe he's learned a lot
over the last decade. We'll see, all right, let's just
fly through the rest of this news. Puka Akua is
expected to miss some time. According to Ian Rappaport, McVeigh
(14:00):
will not go that far and just says he's day
to day. They're going into a bye week, so it
does make sense that they would let his ankle heal
and see if he can come back after the bye.
How do you think they look offensively without him? We'll
preview the show. But just on the Puka front.
Speaker 2 (14:17):
Well, you need Jordan Winning to step up because he's
kind of the one who plays in a little bit
more of that Puka role, specifically some of the more
hybrid tight end stuff that Puka does, less so the
pure receiver stuff that Puka does. So you really need
more from Jaywitt, who had a couple bad plays last
week in a big drop that he should have had.
So that's one thing. This is DeVante Adams now and
(14:41):
him and Matthew Stafford missed a couple of plays together
this last game, a couple of like just out of
sync kind of timing stuff. So you really got to
get that locked in. This is one of those two
where it would not surprise me at all if Puka
tries to go like if they say, oh, we'll leave
it all the way up until game time, first of all,
because that's just who he is. Second of all, they're
playing the Jacksonville Jaguars, Sean McVay disciple, Liam Cohen, Lesnie disciple,
(15:05):
James Gladstone of course they're going to try to play it,
you know, funny the entire way through. But it also
to me would not be smart to play him because
if you get hurt overseas, that's a long plane ride
back and a brutal one to have an injury on
and then you have the bye week on the other side.
Speaker 1 (15:22):
Yeah, they got they got to think long term and
think that, hey, if we're the team that we think
we are, we could go win a game overseas against
the Jaguars without pukuin Akua. So that will be interesting
to see because he's been as valuable as any player
in the league. Brian Branch, we talked about the fight
that happened after the Chiefs Lions game. I threw it
(15:44):
out there wondering like, is there a chance he would
get suspended and it did happen. I think some of
his previous infractions might have played a factor here, maybe
even Dan Campbell's words after the game where he had
no quarter essentially for Brian Branch, no, you know, saying
like we we will not stand for that thought it
was a cheap shot. So they lose Brian Branch for
(16:06):
a tough matchup for the Lions.
Speaker 2 (16:08):
Are depleted in the secondary too. That's tough.
Speaker 1 (16:10):
They are down their top two cornerbacks and now they're
down Brian Branch for a game. Who do they have
this week? I forget, off the top of my head,
they have the Tampa Bay Buccaneers before their bye week.
So the Bucks getting a bunch of receivers. Yeah, getting
a little bit of injury luck on the other side,
which which they also had last week in San Francisco,
(16:32):
So sometimes it works both ways. Speaking of you know,
coaches that are under you know, the microscope, Aaron Glennon,
I wouldn't say he's on the hot seat, but he
he is zero and six and I don't think he's
done himself a ton of favors for how he's handled
the postgame press conferences throughout the course of the season.
Let's listen to him being asked after the game about
(16:55):
justin fields justice numbers are knock good on? This team
is going to be next week?
Speaker 4 (17:00):
Or come on, man, what kind of question is that
not a good game? I think there's a number of
guys that you know, I mean, sometimes this league is
like this and there are guys that have bad games.
That doesn't mean you just bench them. Come on, you
know better than that?
Speaker 1 (17:14):
Hmmm does he? That's a totally fair question. I think
the better questions is like, why didn't you Benjamin that game?
Like it was one of the many things I wish
I had said about that that performed, Like if you
put Tyrod Taylor into the game late in that game,
I think they win it. And I think there's a
lot of players on the team that probably think that too.
Speaker 2 (17:31):
Yeah, first of all, I don't think justin Field is
over all the problem here with with what's happening in
the Jets right now and has continued to happen to them.
But a game like that where he has the third
worst EPA per drop back of the season and the
second worst from a couple of weeks ago against Buffalo,
but that this game specifically the third worst, and was
not throwing the ball downfield lowest average distance of throw
(17:55):
in the NFL since the season began of any team
of any quarterback. So yeah, you want to throw the
ball down the field, you have to throw the ball
down the field a little bit more. And either they
weren't letting him, or he's not trusting what he's seeing,
or guy all of the above. And he's holding the ball,
he's taking sacks. I think, to me, this is more
like a beat writer who already knows the head coach
(18:17):
really well, the head coach who already knows the beat right.
I don't know who it was, but it was very blunt.
It was very like I think sometimes we think that
things are being antagonistic, when sometimes that's just the way
people communicate with each other because they know each other
really well, and it happens to get picked up at
the wrong time by the cameras. Now, I will say
locally and fairly. So there is pushback on his comments
(18:39):
overall in terms of the strategy of them, because you
do need to think about whether or not you need
to make a move at quarterback well.
Speaker 1 (18:47):
In that game. But I think it speaks to where
he struggled and where Tanner Engstrom struggled too, Like calling, yeah,
a drop back pass when you needed five or six
more yards to win the game and you just ran
the ball pretty well and you call it pass on
first down. I think it's a totally fair question.
Speaker 2 (19:04):
Oh, I agree, that's what I'm saying. I don't know
that a ton should be made about the question. The
answer itself, I just because I think it's a fair question.
And honestly, I think, to me, if he's really looking
at this game, and I think he is, he's seeing
a lot of problems with his own situational management, with
the play calling on the offensive side, with the play
calling on the defensive side. Like, there's a lot of
(19:25):
other issues, That's what I'm saying that aren't necessarily it
feels had a bad game, let's not sugarcoat that. But
there's a lot of issues strategically and situationally with this
team that don't get fixed by benching the starting QUARTERBA.
Speaker 1 (19:36):
One thing I've just noticed is in his post game
he just refuses to He's just I think so angry
after the game that he refuses to give anything. And
I think he would be under a little less heat
there if not for.
Speaker 2 (19:54):
Shoot, look at Jacksonville, like.
Speaker 1 (19:55):
The higher expectations, which the.
Speaker 2 (19:57):
Positions right switch the positions we're having to say conversation
about Liam Cohen, who has done a great job so
far but has had some sloppy stuff on offense. If
you switch those two markets in those two coaches right now,
we're not even talking about this. We are talking about
you got to figure your you know what out in
terms of the game management, to play calling, get better
play out of the quarterback, have a better plan for
(20:18):
the quarterback. But quarterback has to play better.
Speaker 1 (20:22):
We are Liam Cohen might have some wins though, that's
the main thing.
Speaker 2 (20:24):
But that's the thing we're we're not like that's the tone. Yeah,
we're talking a lot about the tone. I don't I
just don't really, I don't really see the point of it.
Speaker 1 (20:32):
I think it's it's it's more representing maybe maybe how
that locker room is feeling, or maybe just like giving
a little bit to that Farah.
Speaker 2 (20:43):
Wilson was pretty open about how disappointed he was about
that late second quarter into halftime strategy. Like he said,
I know, once I learned what the plan was, I
was disappointed and as he as he should be. It
was a cowardly way to coach a football game.
Speaker 1 (20:57):
Yeah, I think when when you're the kind of a
CEO head coach, you have to have that part of
the game and part of it is game management buttoned down,
and part of it is handling the media afterwards. The
Minnesota Vikings are not letting us know who the starter
is at quarterback. This week, Kevin O'Connell says he wants
(21:18):
to see how this week looks for JJ McCarthy. He
also mentioned Carson Wentz will be practicing. Does feel like
Carson Wentz has a good chance to start again, a
little bit of a soft benching. I feel like for
JJ McCarthy.
Speaker 2 (21:34):
There is somebody who you are not thinking about in
this conversation that I think the local media there has
been thinking about since training camp. We all should be
thinking about and talking about as it pertains to can
Carson Wentz actually like not Carson Wentz up a game,
you know or has he heard it? Like it banged
up Max Brosmer, their backup who basically they he was
(21:57):
the only backup that stayed on the team. They overhauled
their higher quarterbacks room late into training camp to bring
Carson Winson. They kept Max Brosmer in when I was
there for training camp. Not only was he throwing the
ball really well, but like the coaching staff like this
kid's got something and the coaching staff is buying in
on his development.
Speaker 5 (22:16):
Now.
Speaker 2 (22:16):
I'm not saying he's gonna come out here and be
the future. I'm not saying that at all. Please don't
be in my comments section, But and I put him
on the Future Hits list for that reason, and I
got I caught heat for it, because why the hell
am I putting don't don't I know JJ McCarthy's on
this team, Why the hell am I putting Max Brosmer
for the Minnesota Vikings choice and all of that fair.
But he's got something to him and the coaches see
(22:37):
it and they like it, and they want him to
keep They want him to stick around, and they want
to develop it.
Speaker 1 (22:41):
I was getting excited in London when when he was
worming up on the sideline, we thought it was Bras time,
but it didn't happen. Wentz stayed in that game. The
more interesting part for me is if JJ McCarthy is
back on the practice field, and maybe they'll use the
injury as an excuse. They're bringing him back slowly, but
if he is on the practice field and he's not starting,
(23:04):
it is really taking a more aggressive Hey, we're trying
to develop this kid long term, but we kind of
decided he is not ready to go right now and
he is not going to be starting games when he
is able, which was kind of my suspicion over the
last couple of weeks anyways, and it's different, but I
think we have to support quarterbacks having different development arcs,
(23:24):
yes and timeline, So we definitely would have been surprised
going into the season to find out that this is
how it was going. But we'll see. Maybe it will
be McCarthy this week and this will all be a
waste of time. Surprising news this week, Eagles pass rusher
Zadarius Smith retired out of nowhere and he signed with
the team four weeks ago. Made a big impact, i
(23:46):
would say, in the first couple of games and has
been playing plenty there without Nolan Smith, so they are
very thin in terms of their edge rush group. It
is becoming a major problem for them. They have a
Zizo Jalari, they have Jlyx Hunt, but they are just
not getting much heat. So it just makes you think
that Howie Roseman's going to make a move there, maybe
a move at cornerback. More than that in a little bit.
(24:08):
And then finally I noticed Chauncey Gardner Johnson was released
from the practice squad, and since we are the official
podcast tracking all the doings of CJ GJ are Great, producer,
Eric decided he'd put together something combining a couple of
clips from the last few weeks. Let's be real, every
(24:31):
team that's gotten Chauncey Gardner Johnson since has gotten sick
of him pretty quickly.
Speaker 2 (24:36):
But it's always it's getting shorter and short, it's getting shorter.
Speaker 1 (24:40):
The Eagles had him for a year and then they
let him go to the Lions, who had him for
a year, and to be fair to you know, CJGG,
the Eagles took him back once getting add a little
spicy defense you CJ. Gardner Johnson who did not play
well or fit in in Houston. Yeah, but you don't
go to the Ravens kicking that noise.
Speaker 2 (24:58):
How many weeks is he there?
Speaker 1 (25:00):
I feel like he's gonna have learned and he's a
good player. Oh yeah, I'm gonna say, all right, there
we go weeks left. We'll be there through this left
and then I'm gonna give him one more year, thirty
weeks left. I just think it's a solid year.
Speaker 2 (25:12):
And at any point but.
Speaker 1 (25:13):
This is and then it'll kind of expire. That second
clip was from seven days ago, so I was only
twenty nine weeks off. That was rough.
Speaker 2 (25:24):
That's okay, you know what his agents, we start the
counter is the agent.
Speaker 1 (25:27):
Told Pro Football Talk that they wanted a spot with
a clearer path to plane, and once the Ravens made
another trade for a safety Aloie Gilman, the path to
plane was really no longer there, and so he gone.
Speaker 2 (25:41):
I need someone to not let me put off getting
a haircut for quite long in the future. Real shaggy
September over here.
Speaker 1 (25:49):
I mean, yes, that those two clips from September and
quiet October, so much happens. I love a little shaggy September.
Let's take a break. We're going to play a little
game of would you wrap there? In just a few minutes,
tak a little TNF two back on NFL Daily and
we're gonna play a quick game of would you rather?
(26:12):
And we're approaching the trade deadline. We're still pretty far
away November fourth, but I've already gotten a lot of trades.
Speaker 2 (26:19):
Mm h. This is great for you. You love this.
Speaker 1 (26:22):
I love trade season. And if you think about this
season in particular, there's a lot of teams at the
bottom definite sellers. Titans, Raiders, Saints, Browns, Jets. That's a
lot of potential sellers. Considering we're only six weeks in.
We still got a few more weeks. There's more possible
teams out there, Like would the Ravens and Bengals ever
(26:43):
be sellers? I mean if the Ravens Cardinals, Yeah, if
they took on some l so we're gonna play some
Would you rather mine were somewhat focused on jamming some
some trade content?
Speaker 2 (26:54):
So I'm gonna shocked by this information.
Speaker 1 (26:57):
I'm just gonna throw out one which has just like
a little bit of backing, you know, information behind it,
but is more just spicy and fun. Would you rather
Aj Brown? Or actually, let's go AJ Brown and a
fourth round pick? Or Christian Gonzales of the Patriots?
Speaker 2 (27:19):
Whoa, oh man.
Speaker 1 (27:23):
This is partly informed by Mike Rabel and the Patriots
seeming to be like a little annoyed all the time
about Christian injuries, about injuries and about injured players in general.
Speaker 2 (27:34):
This wasnese not actually humanly helped. Let's be annoyed about that.
Speaker 1 (27:39):
And yeah, and Mike Rabel made it pretty clear in
Tennessee he would get sick of and sometimes get rid
of players who would miss practice with soft tissue injuries,
which is what christ so to me, it doesn't make
a ton of sense to trade him. But if you would,
the Patriots have been connected with AJ Brown. And this
is just a way of the large your conversation and look,
(28:02):
teams are having it around the league, like could AJ
Brown be available? I think there's a lot of teams
that think either AJ Brown or DeVante Smith could be
available at some point. To me, AJ Brown would make
more sense of those two. And so there's an interesting
need combo here. I think the Eagles would do that trade.
(28:22):
But which would you rather?
Speaker 2 (28:23):
I would rather have? If I'm a team that's in
contention possibility like at a Hey, I'm a buyer and
I'm looking to see if you know, after the deadline
I can make a real run. Would I would take
AJ Brown? If I had a quarterback and if I
had a pass heavy or even balanced attack like I'm
looking at. You know, there's a couple teams in Los
(28:44):
Angeles that might be into having AJ Brown on their roster.
There are teams all over the NFC. There's a Buffalo
Bills team.
Speaker 1 (28:53):
If he was available, he'd have a fantastic market.
Speaker 2 (28:56):
Yes, there'd be a Buffalo Bills team that might be
super interested in having a receiver finally, a number one
receiver like AJ Brown on the team, and maybe even
having a player such as that on your roster kills
the entire section of the playbook that's all gadget plays.
How about that? Wouldn't that be something for the Buffalo Bills. Yeah,
I think I would pick AJ Brown. I love Christian Gonzales,
(29:19):
you know this, but I think that I would rather.
If I'm looking to actually make a push, I'm looking
at scoring points, run blocking, I pick Aj a little.
Speaker 1 (29:29):
Maybe I'm overrating Christian Azal because I threw in a
fourth with AJ Brown, Because I just figured Gonzalez is
going to get a big contract after this season. He'll
be eligible, yeah, for the first time. So the big
contract wait the Patriots out is coming. But the big
contract would be coming for AJ Brown too. You can't
trade for him and not give him even another upgrade,
(29:49):
although he just got one. He's already getting paid a
lot of money. But the difference in years I just
think about. Yes, I guess what top like number one
wide receivers are earth on the market a little bit
more than number one cornerbacks. But I think if you
were just putting cornerbacks on the open market in a vacuum,
everyone's just available. I would guess Christian Gonzalez would be
(30:13):
a top five cornerback in the entire NFL, and maybe
AJ Brown is a top five receiver too, But at
that age and you have cost control for him, like
for five six years, I would think that would be
like an extremely attractive trade target that Patriots fans would
go crazy if they traded him.
Speaker 2 (30:29):
But if you are again you're talking trade deadlines, yesally Greg,
So you're not really thinking necessarily about twenty twenty six.
If you're a team that is aggressive to buy at
the trade deadline, you are thinking about this January and
potentially this February. That's what you're thinking about. All the
other stuff can come after that, but that's what you're
thinking about. Is breaking through that final window of contention,
(30:51):
that final little ceiling and getting into like the real
contention area versus playoff contention. You have to make some
big moves in order to get to that point. And
that's why I think a team would and and potentially
will even make this move if he's available, because he
could take he can take your receiver's room from an
(31:12):
A to an A plus a B to an A
plus hell a C to an A depending on your
passing attack and your quarterback. If you bring him into
your building.
Speaker 1 (31:22):
Well, imagine AJ Brown is the one you're talking about.
You need to get quarterback. How would Drake May? He
would he would qualify. Think, Oh, I mean I want
this to be in the trade. This is that's yes,
that's the trade. That's what I'm saying. Which, so you're
so back I think that, I think I could see
that happening. I wouldn't want it. I actually would rather
have Christian Gondals personally because of the long term, long
(31:44):
term thing. Hard to find a good young cornwork. All right,
give me one.
Speaker 2 (31:48):
Okay, this is kind of related to not just this
head coaching vacancy, but a couple of others who have
been on shaky ground over the last year or so.
Would you rather you're starting in twenty twenty six. You're
not coming in now, You're starting in twenty twenty six.
Rosters as is okay, so don't do the free agent
math or anything. Rosters are as is. Would you rather
(32:09):
take over the Tennessee Titans, the New York Jets, the
Miami Dolphins, or the New York Giants?
Speaker 1 (32:18):
In Ownership counts.
Speaker 2 (32:20):
Ownership, everything counts, But you are making roster and coaching decisions.
Speaker 1 (32:25):
Oh I'm drunk with power. Yeah, well you'd like this one. Yeah,
you can eliminate the Dolphins and the Jets quickly. I
think because they don't have quarterbacks that I would want
Jackson Dart is a consideration ownership. You know, these are
teams that have done a lot of losing. Ultimately, I
(32:47):
think you'd feel better about the Giants ownership, like over
the you know, the longest of stretches, so that that's
a positive for them. You know, I'm gonna have a
lot of confidence that I'm going to be the one
to really fix things, and I can fix some camboard.
I think I would take over the Titans of it
just because of camboard.
Speaker 2 (33:05):
That's that's an interesting one. I actually thought you would
pick that one. I actually would pick the Dolphins because
I if I'm looking at the roster as is what
I see. If I am a GM or whoever the
person in control is going to be, I will get
to hire my own head coach at that point, and
intern there hasn't already been a move to make that
(33:26):
move prior to twenty twenty six. Okay, I will I
see a roster full of big time tradable assets from
the quarterback to the edge rushers to the receivers. Still
if you want to.
Speaker 1 (33:39):
But you said, like for the rest of this season
or next no, no, next season, Well those guys are
all gone.
Speaker 2 (33:43):
But I'm saying you have this whatever core is there, now,
this is what you have to work with. That's what
I'm saying. Don't think agency or whatever. Like I see
a complete rebuild, and I see a huge load of
picks coming in, draft picks coming in because of all
of these players who would then be deemed as tradable
(34:05):
to completely overhaul and rebuild that entire proce.
Speaker 1 (34:07):
See we we we see things differently because they would
be last on my list. I don't see any players
that I really want long term. There are not many
like Jalen and Waddle. Like there's one Patrick Paul, somebody,
there's two.
Speaker 2 (34:20):
Somebody would trade for Tua, sure.
Speaker 1 (34:23):
But not not that much. And you'd have to you
have to take a dead cap hit and everything to
get rid of him. I don't think you're going to
get much the pass rushers, even pretending they're on the
team next year, which they're not going to be.
Speaker 2 (34:35):
This is the parameter, right, But even then he gave
me a J Brown, a fourth round pick. You play
in the parameters of my game, So I will never
play settlers of Cata.
Speaker 1 (34:44):
I would put him, you know, even if you're getting
the stuff that you would get for him, like this year,
for instance, because I think Chubb and Jalen Phillips will
be available in trades. I just I don't know if
it's much. The longer I thought about it, though, after
I answered quickly because my initial instinct is just just
take the team with the best quarterback. Yeah, I don't
think that's right, because I think the Jets and the
Giants ultimately have way more foundational pieces that I like.
(35:12):
I kind of like the Jets offensive line, like their vacuum.
They're two young tackles, that's like a really nice starting point.
You have Garrett Wilson, you have Sauce Gardner. It's a
lot to overcome. The Giants I think are the pick. Actually,
though for me, now that I came all the way
back around, I'm not sure how I feel about Jackson Dart,
but I get to see what happens, and you know,
(35:34):
you took them late enough that you can still have
eyes wide open at quarterback. But you have Molik Neighbors,
you have Andrew Thomas, you have Abdell Carter, you have
Brian Burns, you have Dexter Lawrence. Ultimately, you have at
least a history that they used to win some games.
Speaker 2 (35:51):
That was my second pick.
Speaker 1 (35:52):
Blue.
Speaker 2 (35:53):
The Giants were my second pick because of all of
the players that you just said, minus perhaps Jackson Dark
because I would not want it to take over a
team and inherit a quarterback who wasn't like a lights
out Jayden Daniel's superstar, like you know.
Speaker 1 (36:07):
We'll see how he looks the rest of the year
and then we'll just replace him.
Speaker 2 (36:10):
And yeah, that's what I'm saying, is like you could
always you could always move from somebody who isn't necessarily
a top five pick. You can always reputationally and optically
move on from that player. So it's good. I just
wouldn't want to inherit the quarterback.
Speaker 1 (36:21):
That's fair. Although after that last game, I mean my
mind is open. That game was good enough to change.
Speaker 2 (36:28):
We don't know if he's gonna make it to next year. Cope,
he stays healthy.
Speaker 1 (36:32):
That one game. That one game was good enough though
to change I think, like the math of Jackson Dark.
Like if we were redoing the draft right now just
based off that one game, I think it would be
like you have to move off your points. That game
was good enough at an NFL level, and he did
so many different really good things in that game, like
he would be a top five pick. He would no
(36:53):
longer be a late pick.
Speaker 2 (36:54):
I love this because I remember, and fairly so. I
think at the time you comped him to Tim Tebow
because because.
Speaker 1 (37:00):
I just went that was a team TEPO performance. You
mean in terms of the stack.
Speaker 2 (37:04):
Eric's been great to sun up some of the tapes
we could we could go through the transcript, so yes,
later on, but I remember texting you during this this
last game that their their win and saying, see not
Tim Tebo.
Speaker 1 (37:16):
Yes, I mean very much not Tim Tebow in that game.
I'm going to do a little different type of would
you rather We're going to go back to the trade candidates.
But first this is more of just a life one,
all right, you have the option.
Speaker 2 (37:30):
Remember I'm already getting hit twenty times in my lifetime
by Miles Garrett.
Speaker 1 (37:34):
It's closer to that one. All right, you have the option,
and we actually have a drop ready here. You have
the option to listen to this drop in a soundproof booth.
Speaker 2 (37:46):
Baker Ball Cathe sod rolling manbe baker Ball Caith Sadrobe
no baker Bole Cathe.
Speaker 1 (37:56):
So just keep that plane.
Speaker 2 (37:59):
Listen to this keeps while in a soundproof booth baker
Ball for.
Speaker 1 (38:05):
Twenty four hours straight, while watching the Baker Mayfield Scramble
from Sunday on a huge television in which the soundproof booth,
you will be given exactly two salads from the huddle
at ten hour intervals. You can choose the ingredients of
the salads. I know you like that, okay or okay.
Speaker 2 (38:28):
Ball yeah, please stop?
Speaker 1 (38:31):
Okay. So it would be twenty three hours fifty nine
minutes more of that, but then you're watching the scramble
or you're back in the soundproof booth for twenty four hours,
but you have to listen to a specially curated podcast
by Eric collecting every single mention and discussion of Drake
(38:51):
may since the inception of NFL Daily. You don't have
to clap for when you like good points, but every
time you do a bag of trapper beef jerky magically
appears for sustenance, So it's which would you rather?
Speaker 2 (39:09):
This is so personally curated. I don't know whether to
be horrified or feel very special? Right, thank you? Oh
I do love a huddle sour.
Speaker 1 (39:20):
Okay, I thought that would be.
Speaker 2 (39:22):
Playing the sound. Stop playing the sound.
Speaker 1 (39:27):
It's twenty four hours. What if I threw in with
the drake May deal. You can also get the bucks,
you know every Sunday as like an assience. I picked that, Okay,
so good. I just think that I want you to
have to listen to all the drake May the beef jerky.
Anytime you clap, you have to clap to a good point.
Speaker 2 (39:42):
But yeah, good job, Greg, Thank you right the whole time, Greg,
Drake May Drake May.
Speaker 1 (39:49):
Greg. No, No, we've got We've got time to go.
All right, you're up.
Speaker 2 (39:53):
Oh that was so fun. Okay, I took your This
is another like very person only detailed one. I you know,
I cherish our friendship, and so I thought about you
specifically when designing this one, mostly based on your stature.
Speaker 1 (40:11):
Would you like to talk about that a lot?
Speaker 2 (40:12):
Complete? A pass behind attempt to pass behind the Raiders
offensive line or against the Broncos defensive line.
Speaker 1 (40:22):
Oh wait, you have to complete complete a pass behind
behind the Raiders offense.
Speaker 5 (40:29):
One.
Speaker 2 (40:29):
I'd rather either do that or attempt to pass against
the Broncos defensive.
Speaker 1 (40:36):
Okay, well, I would just go Raiders because I would
hope that you know, we're playing the Titans or something
like that. I don't know who we're playing.
Speaker 2 (40:42):
Jeffrey Simmons right in your face.
Speaker 1 (40:43):
I mean, that wouldn't be great.
Speaker 2 (40:44):
I mean interior pressure for a lower stature quarterback.
Speaker 1 (40:48):
But basically, the Browns defense is a worst case scenario.
If you're picking the defensive line, I least want to
go against. You know, they're in the top five certainly,
So I just feel like I'm going to roll with
the Raiders. I feel like silver and black I would
look good. It's slimming, it's cool. I feel like you
put sixty percent G on the back of a Raiders jersey.
(41:10):
That's selling. Yeah, you know.
Speaker 2 (41:12):
I also feel like, because you I would know that
you would want to just for a minute, put yourself
into Geno Smith's shoes, his cleats, feel his I mean,
not this year. You'd want to feel just a small
percentage of his pain. Take that away from him, you know,
take it upon your shoulders. It was in that moment.
You know, you only see one pair of footprints leaving
(41:33):
the field that day, Greg, It's in that moment that
you carried him.
Speaker 1 (41:36):
I would do anything to help him out because he
is not having fun playing football right now. You can
see it. They got the shackles on him. It's not
going well. And yeah, you can kind of. Yeah, just
imagine what it's like for you know, watching Dylan Gabriel
every week and then like subtract like four or four
more inches he's what five ten, five eleven, Yeah, it
(41:58):
would it would be comical. I will wrap up with
a more of a trade deadline. He won again because
they didn't want to get you know, some talking in this.
There's a lot of interesting players potentially available, and so
I just thought I would give you some of the
offensive skill guys who would you want the most? So
I'll give you Chris Olava or Jacoby Myers or Breese
(42:25):
Hall or Rashid Shaheed. Those are some of the most
interesting skill position players I think will be available for
various prices during the trade deadline.
Speaker 2 (42:38):
Jalen Waddle an option at all, No, you.
Speaker 1 (42:40):
Could throw that in if you really want.
Speaker 2 (42:42):
Okay, I'd probably take Jalen Waddle. Okay, Chris o Lave
would be good. I worry about the the concussion history,
obviously as a human, I worry about that. For him.
Rashid Shaheed's got some pop. I think I would take
Jalen Waddle though, if I was going to choose, especially
if I'm looking at the parameters in context of the
trade deadline, like I said, buying to win now, Yeah,
(43:06):
that's I think I would want that speed and versatility
on my on my roster.
Speaker 1 (43:11):
I think I think they'll wind up not really making
him available, but I'm I'm making him available to you,
so that that's a totally fair answer. I could see that.
It's interesting to watch a lobby and Shaheed. Shaheed's running
more diverse routes these days. Like he beat Carlton Davis,
you know, on press coverage last week with a really
(43:32):
nice move and we were talking about too too out.
Well before the show, you're saying you can't you know,
you can't teach that sort of speed. Well, like Brashid
Shaheed's got that sort of speed. Literally the fastest player
in the NFL this year. In terms of, you know,
miles per hour on the on that long touchdown, and
some size to him and a little bit of versatility.
(43:52):
Albbs happens to be coming off one of the worst
games of his career, so maybe it's tough, but it
had me go back to watch those targets because he
is not He's not bringing in the contested catches he had.
I would say three drops in that game, like PFF
for instance, only gave him one. He's not quite as
explosive or maybe as confident as he used to be.
His yards per catch under ten. He's an interesting player.
(44:14):
I think as a trade deadline approaches, if I was
picking one of these players to most likely actually get dealt,
I think it would be Jacoby Myers, just because he's on.
Speaker 2 (44:21):
The well and he there was all that buzz beforehand
before the season you wanted to get to be traded.
So yeah, I have no reason to believe that won't
eventually happen with the Raider season going the way that
it is.
Speaker 1 (44:33):
Our friend Adam as you know, he's got good connections
and yeah, look, I think any Saints player, for the
most part, except for the really young players, are going
to be available for the right price. But there's a
couple of guys on that team, like Pete Werner, their linebacker,
or Carl Granderson who you almost expect to get dealt
I don't think a guy like Shaheed or even a
(44:54):
Lave would go unless someone comes in and gives a
big price.
Speaker 2 (44:58):
Unless two two out Well is not available move and
I believe he will be.
Speaker 1 (45:01):
Yeah, he would be available, but he would have cost
second rounder minimum maybe at first. I mean, he's gonna
get a big contract, good big second contract. I wondered
if Jordan Addison could ever be available, just because the
contracts structure. They need him this year, but also you
know he's had the suspensions and things that are always
popping up. David and Joku I think will be available.
Speaker 2 (45:23):
I see that one.
Speaker 1 (45:24):
There's some interesting offensive linement like the entire Rounds interior
line I think could be available. Kevin Zeitler or the
Titans I think could be available. It'll be interesting. We'll
get into it more when we get clear.
Speaker 2 (45:35):
Your favorite to the deadline, Your favorite time of year?
Great Season, Part two.
Speaker 1 (45:40):
Our TNF preview. It is in Cincinnati Thursday night. Steelers
are five and a half point favorites going to Cincinnati,
and yeah, Joe Flacco who started for the Bengals only suddenly, yes,
six days after arriving there is gonna start another game
(46:01):
four days after the first start. It's outrageous, at least
according to Mike Tomlin.
Speaker 5 (46:05):
You know, to be honest, it was shocking to me.
Andrew Berry must be a lot smarter than me or us,
because it doesn't make sense to me to trade a
quarterback that you think enough of to make your opening
day starter to a division opponent that's hurting in that area.
But that's just my personal feelings.
Speaker 1 (46:25):
Who Okay, someone is not a fan of Andrew Berry
because I feel like Mike Tomlin would not make that
point at a criticism for something that is worthy of
being critique this specific move if you want to from
Mike Tomlin, if he didn't have a little more of
something there that he's just not a fan of how
Andrew Berry and the Browns do business.
Speaker 2 (46:45):
Someone wanted to face Jake Browning.
Speaker 1 (46:48):
Come on, that's fair.
Speaker 2 (46:49):
He knows Joe Flaco so well at this point that
dude wanted Jake Browning ball. I know you're still a believer.
Speaker 1 (46:55):
No, I'm not I'm definitely not.
Speaker 2 (46:57):
No, but he that guy really wanted Jake Browning.
Speaker 1 (47:00):
I don't think it's that. I think he's questioning like
the integrity of the Browns and how they operate. And
I saw a lot of people answered it's like, oh,
well you got something for Joe Flacco, like that's a
clear win, Like of course you would do that. Like
what are you even talking about? You can't be worried
you're not gonna win your division anyways. Okay, let's calm
down about Oh they got something, they got something about, Hey,
(47:20):
we got trade research. You got a fifth to a
sixth round pick swap that's worth nothing, like that is
worth next to nothing and whatever people make a big
deal of like, oh we got something for him, and
it's some like pick swap that you're gonna give up
a million times on Day three of the draft when
you're just like moving, it's just like calm down. I
kind of like Mike Tomlin saying, like, are we even
(47:41):
trying to win at playing football here? Or we just
are we just like playing math?
Speaker 2 (47:46):
Yeah, because he sometimes he does make comments about other organizations,
but it's never over like it's always very there's a
lot of like subtext to wade through, and there's like
hints and clues, bits and pieces, but never like I'm
going to call you by your name kind of a
thing like that was wild to me. I still, I
(48:07):
do think there's something too, not really wanting to see
the more veteran quarterback, especially one who's so familiar with
the Steelers and the defense they have always run. That's
changing a little bit now, but still is Mike Tomlin's
defense twenty five times, twenty two in the regular season
and three times in the playoffs. These Joe Flacco has
faced the Steelers.
Speaker 1 (48:26):
Wow.
Speaker 2 (48:27):
Blaco is eleven and eleven in the regular season against
the Steelers and one to two in the playoffs. In
the twenty two regular season meetings. This courtesy of my
colleague Mike de Fabo at the Athletic he's completed sixty
one percent of his passes with twenty seven touchdowns and
twelve interceptions for a passer rating of eighty five point four.
When he's at a passer rating of ninety eight or higher,
(48:48):
he's been seven to zero including the playoffs against the Steelers.
So yeah, I think he wanted Jake Browning.
Speaker 1 (48:54):
Yeah, I mean let's calm down though, Like I know.
Speaker 2 (48:57):
It's like Joe Flacco, It's like seventy year old Joe.
Speaker 1 (49:00):
Get that. No, I mean, let's come down. Those numbers
are doing a lot of work from you know, ten
to fifteen years previous when they were.
Speaker 2 (49:08):
Seventy year old Joe Flago. But he still he knows
this group.
Speaker 1 (49:11):
He played well last week. I think the Bengals are
putting a lot into what happened in the second half
of last week. But he did show up there and
that Jamar Chase touchdown was a thing of beauty. And
we find out after the game that it was inaudible
called by Jamar Chase. I mean, I haven't heard that happen.
I love. It also makes you wonder, like what exactly
(49:31):
is Zach Taylor doing there that the wide receiver is
going into the huddle and just calling plays because Flacco
and Chase and Higgins. Flacco was saying it was so
cool to see how good they are on the field,
like he literally had in practice with them, He had
twelve practice snaps with them during the week and to
see what they could do on the field, and they
were just talking about, hey, this could work, that could
work and they're out there just like calling plays by themselves.
(49:53):
And I think he got rid of the ball very
quickly in the second half of that game. He was
decisive and he looked better in that one half than
he had at any point for the Browns this season.
Speaker 2 (50:02):
Yeah, he gives the great receivers a chance, and he's
not really like he's playing kind of like fit mode
football right now. He literally has nothing to lose. These
teams are trading him around basically being like, can you
help us get the ball to our pass catchers so
that they don't stop showing up to our building? Like,
get these guys the ball. And that's what he's going
(50:23):
to do. And with as sort of banged up and
limited as they've been the Steelers have been in the secondary,
Joey Porter Junior obviously came back last week, still a
little bit banged up from the injury. Jalen Ramsey was
dealing with the hamstring but played really well last week
on a short week. I think that, Yeah, you're probably
kind of annoyed that this is the guy who's at
least going to give his pass catcher a shot, right.
Speaker 1 (50:45):
I do think he's an upgrade ultimately, they have so
many other problems on their team, and so I'm curious
what you think about Aaron Rodgers coming off potentially this
game in years. Yeah, potentially his best game since the Packers.
He did have some great box score games with the
Jets last year, but eye test wise, I thought he
kept stacking really good play after really good play. He
(51:06):
had the wow plays, but overall he was just really composed.
And he's going up against a Bengals defense which might
not have Trey Hendrickson and just benched their inside linebacker
Logan Wilson, who had gotten multiple long term contracts and
is only twenty nine years old, and they benched them
for a rookie, Barrett Carter. So they're playing two rookies
at linebacker, neither of Rogers, neither of whom played well
(51:30):
last week. By the way, Demetrius Knight really hasn't played
well all season. So how about that chess match for
Rogers against this al Golden defense which has been playing
hard but not consistent.
Speaker 2 (51:40):
When I went back and watched the Steelers this Alto
into the Steelers this last game, yeah, I agree with you.
I think other than that sort of garbage time of
the season, Rams game where the Rams came to the
Metal Lands when he was still a jet and made
it kind of a game at the end of the game.
Other than that game, this is the best game I've
seen from Rogers in a while, and it really was
(52:03):
the second half. And what I saw from Aaron Rodgers
in that game was a lot of the last couple
of years have really been punctuated by like there have
been mistakes all over the field, himself included, and he's
always looking around and getting angry, and he's angry at
the sideline, and he's angry at team and he's just angry. Well,
in this game, early on, he misses a long pass
(52:25):
attempt to DK Metcalf. It was wildly underthrown, like egregiously underthrown.
So that's the thing where you're like, Okay, this is
probably why in part he's not really throwing the ball
down down the field anymore. But he didn't. He got mad.
He was mad at himself, clearly, like he sort of
internalized it in a way that to me, I've only
been watching him externalize it for the last couple of years,
(52:48):
and instead he folded back into what the game plan
clearly was and will be moving forward, which is hit
yak plays and get the ball out fast, which he
always does, but depend on the guys to get yards
after the catch, whether it's DK Metcalf who's touchdown later
in the game was off of a yards after the
catch play on a quick throw by Aaron Rodgers where
(53:08):
he was excuse me, on a movement throw by Aaron
Rodgers where he was bootlegging out, which is great because
he looks better moving now than he has in quite
some time. He doesn't look twenty, but he definitely looks
better than we've.
Speaker 1 (53:20):
A lot of plays a last week.
Speaker 2 (53:21):
A lot of plays on the move. They're moving his
spot around and he's getting yards after catch plays to
guys like Jalen Warren who is playing a little yards
after the catch receiver as well as running the ball
and DK Metcalf, And I think, and especially including the
tight ends and the way that they're protecting, especially last week,
and the way that they're moving his launch point, I
think that that bodes well. This bodes well for Aaron
(53:42):
Rodgers and the Steelers. If he again he had the
confidence and he'd let that thing sail and it was
several feet before where he intended to put it, and
I think seeing that and then being like, Okay, I
got to come back to Arthur Smith's game plan here
and actually adhering to it, I think it worked.
Speaker 1 (54:01):
And the play has essentially ended for Rogers this year
when he's gotten pressure quickly, even last week, like the
numbers under pressure have been bad. And I don't think
their offensive line played well at all against Cleveland pass
pro wise, but that's a much tougher matchup and they
game planned around it so well. We talked to Miles
Garrett talked about it in the post game that it
(54:21):
didn't matter. So if you have a bad pass protection
group and I'm still waiting to see what the Steelers
group is, like, I mean, this is the perfect matchup
for you. The Bengals just have no juice if Hendrickson
is not on the field, and even if he is
on the field, they don't have a ton of juice.
And you mentioned the tight ends. They have gone to
the Darnel Washington offense like he love it. He's dominating snaps.
(54:44):
Pat Freiremouth is tight end three there now by quite
a distance. So it's Washington playing eighty percent of the snaps.
John Wis Smith's gonna be on the field quite a bit,
and they're using Washington really as an extra offensive lineman,
but also detaching him. And I really think he is
the third most important person on that offense to DK
Metcalf and Aaron Rodgers, and he might be just as
(55:05):
important as DK Metcalf. It's it's crazy. So it's an
uphill battle for the Bengals. Although you know, Thursday night
in the division at home, if you're into those sort
of numbers, it is pretty rare for like a team
to go on the road winning the division on these
short rest, especially in the AFC North. Yeah, the Bengals
have complained about it for years, and they got a
(55:25):
home game here this week.
Speaker 2 (55:26):
And I will say I did get a kick out
of Aaron Rodgers' response to Evan Washburn, who asked him,
what was it like for you to come down and
you know, experience some AFC North football after this last game,
And Rogers sort of looks at him and is like, well,
I've been playing NFC North football for woo and so
it's like, okay, So he's not I think I think
(55:47):
he's feeling it a little bit, and he's not really
phased by any of this. They already have such a
gap thanks in part to some of the injuries around
the division, especially at quarterback, they already have such a gap.
These are games you cannot losebous, so you cannot play
down to your opponent. If they can literally just hit
the floor of their potential in this game, I think
they have no problems in this team.
Speaker 1 (56:06):
Five and a halfs a lot. I would maybe take
the Bengals there. And yeah, if the Steelers win this game,
they should win the division. I mean they should win
the division regardless.
Speaker 2 (56:16):
They have a seventy two percent chance right now before
this game of winning the.
Speaker 1 (56:19):
Division, right, And like, yeah, he isn't really raiding the
AFC North because he showed up for just in time
for Joe Burrow to get hurt, Lamar Jackson to get hurt,
for both those teams defenses to absolutely stink, and for
the Browns to be the Browns, but a particularly depressing
version of the Browns. And oh, by the way, the
Steelers defense has been getting better and better Nick Kerberg.
(56:42):
No matter how good you think Nick Kerberg is, he's
probably better. There's a pretty strong argument to be made
that like He's not just the best pass rusher on
this team. I think that's I think that's clear right now.
He's better than TJ. Watt, but he you know, he's
top five in the league just in terms of that,
like pure skill set.
Speaker 2 (56:57):
They're sending more blitzes. Jalen had a couple of hits
quarterback hits because of the blitzes that they're starting to
do safety blitzer or send that slot player in for
extra pressure too. That actually really compliments Nick Herbig super well.
You could see how well that those two kind of
work off of each other. It's not just how he
works with the rest of the defensive line and they
(57:19):
I know, they were like really penalized last week too.
I don't really mind that. I just saw more like
juice from this defense, you know, and getting guys back
helps obviously, but I just saw just more from them
and like just that like that feeling that kind of
jumps off the screen that you can't really quantify.
Speaker 1 (57:36):
Yes, I saw that too in London that you know,
their defense came out to a slow start, to put
it nicely, to start the season, but I think they've
been getting better and better as they go. Who knows
Bengals defense is you know that I know the webin
on the text thread with the Wesleyan brothers, and you
know they've noticed that DJ Turner is playing well, like
(57:58):
Dax Hill is playing well, like they've been hard. I
think they can make this thing interesting. But yeah, ultimately
it'd be surprising if the Steelers did not win. We
will be recapping that game on Thursday. Yeah, let's forget
even playing the music out.
Speaker 2 (58:14):
I picked the other one.
Speaker 1 (58:16):
We will be back.
Speaker 2 (58:18):
I chose the Bear.
Speaker 1 (58:19):
You will be back, Jordan, and this Baker. This drop
will probably be back too, because we'll be talking about
the Buccaneers and every single game other than TNF, previewing
it all from the studio on Wednesday.
Speaker 2 (58:32):
We will see that Baker. Oh my god, that's really annoying.
Ball Keith sun rolling Ben
Host
Gregg Rosenthal
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