September 16, 2021 • 42 mins
They sit stoically at each end of the field. Jetting into the air, their arms outstretched to count every single game-winning kick! They are the goalposts. In this episode of the NFL explained. podcast, Mike and Aditi tell you all they know about these unsung heroes of the gridiron, and enlist the help of a couple experts. Aditi tells the story of Neil Gilman and Gilman Gear. Later, Baltimore Ravens kicker Justin Tucker joins the conversation as he tells the tale of a kick that changed the game!
Learn more about your ad-choices at https://www.iheartpodcastnetwork.com
See omnystudio.com/listener for privacy information.
Mark as Played
Transcript
Episode Transcript
Available transcripts are automatically generated. Complete accuracy is not guaranteed.
Speaker 1 (00:06):
NFL Explained is a production of the NFL in partnership
with I Heart Radio. Welcome to NFL Explained, a production
of the NFL in partnership with I Heart Radio. America's
most reliable network is going Ultra with Verizon five G
Ultra wide ban and more and more places with up
to ten times faster speeds. You can download a movie
(00:26):
in mere minutes. What Yes, Verizon is going ultra so
you can too. Five G Ultra wide ban available and
select areas most reliable based on rankings from the Root
Metrics US ROOT Score report dated first half, excluding c
ban and not specific to five G networks. Your results
may vary. Not an endorsement speed comparison to median Verizon
four G LTE speeds downloads vary based on network conditions
(00:47):
and five G content optimization. Up Work is the world's
work marketplace. Empower your business and hire the world's most
in demand developers, designers, project managers and more at www.
Dot up work dot com. D line to me, brown,
(01:11):
look at him go gets primostrophe. It almost figures touch show,
Oh my god, flagg Let me turn to the number.
Every four A four hundred and twenty five pounds on
(01:39):
the football field, and no, I am not talking about
a player. Welcome to NFL, explained, it's the podcast where
we answering your questions on topics, where you just learn
exactly sure who to turn to for those answers. I'm like,
yeam along with the d D King Kabwala add what's
good today? What's great is goal posts. People are pausing
saying goal post today. Let me just tell you this.
(01:59):
When the texts are fast and furious from add and
she's dropping emojis, I realized that her excitement on today's
podcast is through the roof. Initially did he? I said,
how many questions are there around goal posts? Like? They're there,
we see them. They function as basically markers on the
football field and help us score points. There's actually a
lot more to it that I didn't even realize. Well,
(02:19):
but that's the point here, Mike, right, you cannot play
a game without goal post. You can't mimic the goal
post with a cone. I mean, that doesn't quite do it.
And if you stop to think about it, there's a
million questions. Why are they yellow? Why are the uprights
thirty five ft in the air? How often do you
have to replace these things. Does somebody paint them? I mean,
what happens if water gets inside a goal post? What
(02:41):
happens when Antonio Brown does a crazy celebration against a
goal post? Or Jimmy Graham decides to dunk a football
a fake football or a real football? Was it a
real football that he dunked on the goal post? Real?
But it actually is a dunk because of the height
of it, which is another thing that I had learned.
But look, we don't have all the answers on this
particular subject, so we actually had to go to some
(03:03):
of the experts. A little bit later in this show,
Ravens kicker Justin Tucker is going to be joining us.
He has the most incredible story about a field goal
that had Bill Belichick absolutely go nuclear and led to
a major change in the sports. So Justin is gonna
be joining us a little bit later in the show.
And indeed, I can't help but think back to that
Monday night matchup that we just saw, a classic game
(03:24):
with the Raiders in Las Vegas and the near game winner,
I mean, it almost was a game winner. And of
course that game goes over time and Baltimore loses, but
I couldn't help but think of the conversation we are
going to have with Justin and just watching that thing
go through the upright, so pure. Yeah, And if that
had held, Mike, that would have been a seventeen game
winning field goal. But I guess number seventeen we'll just
(03:46):
have to come later on in the year. It'll happen.
And as far as can I call the other guy
that you talked to, like the guru of goal posts,
well I think he is. I mean I called the
guy who's been making goal posts for the NFL since
the early nineteen eighties, whose family has been in the
business of making football equipment since the nineteen twenties. Neil
Gilman out of Gilman, Connecticut, gave me so much good information.
(04:10):
And listen to this, Mike. We were on the phone
for an hour and fifteen minutes. WHOA, there is a
lot to learn about goal posts. So let's just get
into the basics, right. I think it's a good way
to start, because I think a lot of ways you
have to understand the evolution of goal posts because they're
always haven't looked the way that they look right now.
And just for context, the measurements are actually really important
(04:31):
and vital. Those uprights d you made reference to it.
They extend thirty five ft above the crossbar. They're no
less than three inches and no more than four inches
in diameter, And I think all of us sort of
take a look at those colored ribbons at the top
of each post to understand how windy it is. It's
the first thing I do every Sunday to figure out
which way the winds are swirling. Those things there are
(04:52):
four inches by forty two inches. I never would have
imagined that there as long as they are. The crossbar
is eighteen feet six inches in length and the top
of the face of it is ten ft above the ground,
which is why when you say someone's dunking, that's also
the height of a regulation NBA RIM So they really
do mean it. But the history add behind this stuff
(05:12):
is is really fascinating. Wait wait, wait, one more part
though much and that's the goose neck. The goose neck
is the actual posts that attaches that you um sort
of making letters with my fingers here, that attaches the
U into the ground. It goes into a concrete footing,
and we are going to be referencing that gooseneck it's
the thing that you know, Antonio Brown kind of did
(05:35):
something profane against at one point. It's the thing that
has padding, didn't Did Joe Horn hide a cell phone inside? Yes?
So sharpie was a sharpie hidden in there once too.
I thought the sharpie was out of the sock. Okay,
I'm sorry, bad reference right there. But the goose neck,
it is a vital part of the goal post. It is,
and I'm glad you made reference to that as it
(05:56):
will continue to pop up because even that gooseneck wasn't
actually there at the start and the history behind it.
You gotta go back to n the NFL's first season,
the goal post were actually located on the goal line
and they look like the letter H, So you actually
had two posts that were sticking into the ground. That
changed in seven when the n C Double A moved
them back to the end line. And in those days,
(06:17):
the NFL actually just followed the college rule books, so
the league basically just mimic what they were doing. But
a dd that change resulted in a reduction of field
goals and tied games. Who the hell wants a tie game?
No one does, and the league said, we definitely don't
want this, so they created their own rule book. In
nineteen thirty three, they moved the goal post back to
the goal line. Not surprisingly, the field goals increased twofold
(06:40):
and the number of tie games way down, which is
certainly big time for fans that like results. Not much
changed a d D for thirty three years until nineteen
sixty six. The NFL goes, you know what, let's move
those goal posts. They should be offset from the goal line,
and they're actually painted bright yellow. And those uprights sitting
above the crossbar. Do you know why they were painted yellow?
(07:03):
I would imagine just from a visual standpoint with TV.
Maybe that's right because the NFL started having greater interest
in playing games at night, and the yellow showed up
much better than the white did in a dark sky.
But you know how they came up with yellow as
opposed to like neon pink. I was just gonna ask,
what why yellow as opposed to just any sort of
(07:23):
neon color that you could have chosen. Well, Neon is
a key here, because the NFL did actually really want
a neon color, and they went to a company in
Cleveland called day Glow and said, okay, show us all
your colors. And the pink was, you know, bright and prank.
The orange was really a nice day Glow orange. But
the problem with orange for the NFL is that that
was the Brown's color, and it was also the Bengals color,
(07:45):
and the NFL wanted a color that no team was using,
and so nobody is using Saturn yellow. But here, let
me give you something else about the color. And this
is what Neil Gilman of Gilman Gear told me is
that initially this Saturn yellow paint had to be bought
from day Glow in Cleveland. And what teams would have
to do, or what Gilman Gear or whatever goal post
(08:07):
manufacturers would have to do, is paint all the aluminum
posts with a white primer. Then they would paint them
the saturn yellow, and then they would do a third
cote of clear lacquer, which was supposed to seal it.
But what happens in the sun, things sort of melt
and chip away and they fade. Remember when we talked
about faded uniforms in the Arizona Cardinals, And if you
don't remember, then you need to go listen to one
(08:29):
of our first episodes. But anyway, the paint would fade,
and Neil Gilman told me that every year he'd get
a call from some groundskeeper somewhere saying, I have an
ugly set of goal posts. So then it was actually
Neil Gilman who figured out, let me take a chip
from one of these goal posts to Sherwin Williams, and
he asked them, can you color match this in a
(08:50):
powder coating. So now all of the goal posts have
a powder coating, which means that they are baked on.
They do not fade. They are not supposed to chip.
And if you are replacing a goal post, it is
not because the color has faded. It's for another reason,
which of course we will get into. Sherwin Williams coming
up big for us. I love it so actually it
(09:12):
sounds like I shouldn't say it sounds like it really
is reality. Nineteen sixty six a huge year for the
NFL as it pertains to goal posts. But dd that
next year, nineteen sixty seven, the league actually made the
decision to require the slingshot type of posts, as opposed
to the letter H one that was back in the
day that actually had two posts sticking into the ground.
Because it was the letter H, the league was a
(09:33):
little more concerned about safety, and you can understand with
an extra post sitting at that goal line like that
becomes a little bit of an issue. But then in
the league they make the push, they take the goal
post and they move them back to that end line.
And that change was made to encourage offenses to score
more touchdowns as opposed to field goals. Right, we all
like t D as opposed to the f G. And
(09:54):
it worked in a big way. And a d D
maybe the most important thing about all this. It eliminated
the most heart wrenching moments you can have in the
game of football, like this one from Super Bowl seven.
Second down seven ago, the redskin just short of the
ten yard line. Earlier in this half, they reached the
(10:15):
seven team. This has been their deepest beneface for the game, Dummer.
And then the end gong and hit the goal boat.
Jerry Smith, the tight end looked like he was open
cutting behind the goal post deep in the end zone.
I know I'm not the only one thinking it a
d D. I have a topic from one of our
next episodes, the evolution of play by play broadcasters. Can
(10:36):
you imagine a Super Bowl game? This is Super Bowl seven,
It's the fourth quarter. You got Billy Kilmer, the Washington quarterback.
He misses and it's sort of mentioned there, but a
wide open Jerry Smith in the end zone. The ball
actually bounces off of the post. That Dolphins win that
game fourteen to seven. So where's the excitement there? Add
(10:57):
we have to do an evolution of play by play
voices for the NFL. I feel like you've got a
little more excitement right now than was felt in that moment.
Marty Clickman is going like what someone needs to get
coached up here in a big way. Look, it's fascinating
here because once you make the move a D D
and you move those goalposts back to that end live uh.
(11:18):
Former Brown's coach Paul Brown, and we actually chronicled that
story one of our last episodes, but he told Sports
Illustrated in vo the whole end zone is open for
pass patterns. Now. The goal posts were in effect another
safety man. When you get inside the twenty, you couldn't
run or pass around them. It was hard to punk
or pass coming out of the end. So, I mean,
this is a pivotal moment for the NFL. Just that
(11:40):
one change, and maybe we're talking about a different result
in Super Bowl number seven. But the only other thing
I want to add here a d D because I
know I did it when I was a kid. You're
playing football, Can you just imagine this. You're a wide receiver,
you're running acrossing route. You actually could grab the pole,
spin around quickly and go in the opposite direction. I mean,
(12:01):
like that was like an actual thing. Can you imagine
seeing that now in the modern day NFL game? It
be sort of comical because the guys are so damn
fast and they cut so well. But that was happening
back in the day in the NFL. Well. I think
that this is again justin Tucker will talk to us
later about a decision that he thinks was a no brainer.
I think moving the goal post back is one of
those no brainers. For sure, it is, but a d D.
(12:22):
The conversation that you had that led to some of
these most incredible stories around goal posts, and yes, they
are incredible. Do you want to tease one of them here?
Because you had the conversation. I don't even know what
the most teasable thing is because I will be hearing
all of these stories for the first time when we
do it. Kickers are a very special breed. One of
my favorite stories that Neil Gilman told me was about
(12:44):
Chip low Miller. Chip Low Miller was a kicker. He
was a kicker for the Rams in ninet when they
had freshly moved from l A to St. Louis. Chipp
Loow Miller went out to the stadium to these brand
new goal posts and he said to the grounds crew,
m something's wrong with this crowds bar. And the grounds
cree said uh. He said, no, no, no, something's wrong
(13:06):
with this crossbar. The grounds crew brought out of tape
measure and guess what the crossbar was? One in short,
according to what Neil Gilman told me, so, hey, you
can always trust a kicker's eyes spatial awareness. I don't
know how else to describe that. That is absolutely amazing.
That one inch when it's ten ft up. That's something
(13:29):
that you would be able to pick out with just
your naked eye. That is an unbelievable story. And there's
more of those covering up next here on NFL explaining
build the team that will build your business. With upwork,
you can find top developers, designers, project managers and more
who can start today so your business can succeed. Tomorrow
higher at home or in a hundred and eighty countries
(13:51):
around the world to find the right talent for whatever
your business needs. Up Work the world's work marketplace. Learn
more at www dot up work dot com. America's most
reliable network is going ultra with rise in five g
old your wide band in more and more places, so
you can do more with up the ten times faster speeds.
You can download a movie in mirror minutes. What Yes,
(14:13):
that's faster than your morning coffee run lights camera coffee.
And while you're at it, go on and download a
whole series in minutes or a new song in seconds
A one, A two one to Oh, it's done. Stock
up on all that entertainment. And sure you can download
work files faster too if you have to, so you
can quickly get back to all these great movies, shows
and songs you've just gotten your hands on. Verizon five
(14:35):
G Ultra wide band is now in more and more places.
Verizon is going ultra so you can to five G
Ultra wide band available in select areas. Most reliable based
on rankings from the Root Metrics US ROOTS Score report
dated first half one excluding C band and not specific
to five G networks. Your results may vary. Not an
endorsement speed comparison to Media and Verizon four G LTE
speeds downloads very based on network conditions and five G
(14:57):
content optimization. He heavy William More ragged under the end
zone by Jimmy Graham on the touchdown strike a purty
four yard Jimmy Graham all fired up in the end
zone and he does it use the little dunk. But
it was like that time he was kind of hanging
(15:18):
on the rail. I really thought the gold posts were
gonna come down. Look like it, Deman donan look like
a little cocka do you right now? You know that?
Welcome back to NFL, explained my Kam and a da
kin kawaala with you coming up in just a couple
of minutes, Ravens Kicker, he's a Super Bowl champion. Justin
Tucker is going to be stopping by an awesome conversation
(15:39):
with him. But I now officially have an expert on
all things skull posts. I think when you spend an
hour fifteen minutes on the phone with the Guru of
goal posts, you're gonna be able to drop some significant knowledge.
Is there one thing before we get into some of
the details. One thing from your conversation with Neil Gilman
from Gilman Gear that stood out to you the most
(15:59):
just how passionate he was about it. So the Gilman
family had a textile mill in the town of Gilman, Connecticut,
back in the eighteen nineties. So Neil Gilman's grandparents were
running this textile mill and then his dad, Marty, was
playing football at Yukon. He was an offensive lineman. And
(16:19):
this is in the nineteen twenties. And Neil tells me that,
you know, in the nineteen twenties, when you're playing football,
what do you use as a tackling dummy? You use
your teammates. You know that there's a blocking dummy. There's
nothing like that. So his dad is really smart. Dad
one day comes home to his parents textile mill and
he grabs this big canvas bag and he starts stuffing
it with these by products from the mill. He asks
(16:41):
his parents to sew it back up and it's a
blocking dummy. So he takes it to his coach and
he says, hey, coach, I don't want to hit anybody.
I don't want anybody to hit me while we're practicing.
I'm just gonna hit this, and the coach says to him,
that's wonderful. Can you make me six more So that
Marty Gilman finishes playing football, graduates at Yukon, goes home
to work at the textile mill, and he creates a
(17:03):
whole new sideline which is football training equipment. And you know,
he said, this is his calling in life. He went
on to invent the blocking and the tackling sled, the
pop up dummy, all of that. Then his son, Neil
goes on to be a football player at Harvard. He
was a defensive back, not quite as big as his dad,
I guess. And then he graduated and he joined the
(17:25):
company in nineteen seventy seven. And I think I said
this earlier. His family has been making goal posts for
the NFL since the early nineteen eighties. At one point,
Gilman gear made twenty four of the thirty one NFL
stadium's goal posts. Neil Gilman is the guy that came
up with the idea of putting a hinge on a
(17:45):
goal post. Surely you remember, Mike, like back in the
nineteen eighties when fans would rush the field, You're a
pack twelve guy. Where I mean Wasn't that a big
deal at Stanford? Didn't that happen all? Yeah, you know,
you get the Well, the game obviously between conship is
certainly the big one. The bands on the field, which
is a very different call and than we heard earlier
in the podcast with a pass it hit the goal post, right,
(18:07):
So you have all these students rushing the field and
they're trying to take the goal post down. And as
Neil Gilman says it to me, well, you know what
if we take away the reason to take the goal
post down, which is creating a hinge so that the
groundscrew can come out and immediately sort of topple the uprights,
well then maybe people won't be trying to attack goal posts.
(18:27):
And then a few years later, George Wiley, who was
a retired Pasadena police officer who had turned into an inventor,
went one step further and he devised a mechanism that
uses hydraulics to actually bring the goal post down, and
he can do it in less than ten seconds, and
so that way you don't even need the two ground
screw guys to pull it down. And one notable thing though,
(18:48):
pay attention to this when you watch this season, Mike.
Those hydraulics make the gooseneck that much bigger to get
that system attached to the goose neck. So the pads
around the goose necks in San Francisco and Foxborough are
much thicker than any place else. And two stadiums in
the f felled San Francisco and New England both have
(19:08):
this hydraulic system to their goal posts. So note to
Patriots fans and forty Niners fans, don't rush the field.
It just won't work, didn't They don't want anyone rushing
the field. Safety, safety for everyone involved. But how often
are these things even replaced? Like I would imagine you've
got like this four pounds goal post. You stick that
bad boy into the ground like you're good for decades. Well,
(19:31):
you should be good for about twenty years. Right. They're
made of aluminum. The reason that they are made of
aluminum is so that they don't rust, so that they're
you know, somewhat lightweight, such that people can actually put
them up. You don't need a crane to take them
up and down, which you would with steel. Lightweight four
pounds I mean relatively speaking as compared to steel, which
(19:53):
would require so much more rebar and things that I
don't necessarily know so much about. But in any case,
they are made of aluminum. They don't rust. Now that
we know that they're powder coated, they shouldn't really fade
in color. But you know, natural disasters happen, and apparently
in a place like Miami, where there are a lot
of hurricanes, those uprights need to be replaced fairly frequently.
(20:16):
And in a place like Buffalo, where there is indeed
bad weather and where you know the lake effects, snow
can do some weird things. Helped create one of the
improvements in gold posts, and that again this is courtesy
of Neil Gilman telling me this story. Once there was
so much snow, moisture got inside the uprights, and then
(20:37):
the uprights started shaking, vibrating, almost like a tuning fork.
And so Neil Gilman says that the groundskeeper they're called
him and said, oh my gosh, the gold post is
vibrating like a tuning fork. And they figured out what
had happened is that moisture had gotten inside the upright
and it would expand and detract, expand to track. That's
(20:58):
what was making it vibrate. So now gold posts I'll
have a wheep hole inside the goose neck, you know,
that part that goes into the round, so that any
moisture that gets in can actually bleed out. So in theory,
a goal post should indeed last for twenty years. A
goal post should be able to withstand seventy mile per
hour winds. And because it is in four parts, the
(21:22):
two uprights, so are the parts that are replaced the
most frequently. So I'm actually glad that you brought up
the winds because I looked this up because I had
seen some numbers that indicated anywhere from like seventy five
to a hundred miles an hour is what those goal
posts should be able to withstand. So I'm like, well,
what happens if tornado comes through? Does that thing going
to rip down one of those goal posts? I didn't
(21:43):
even realize there were different categories of tornadoes A F one,
F two, three, four, and five. The low end one
is the F one, and that just kind of a
peels roofs off of you know, some homes maybe just
like not completely off but can move some cars slightly
on the road. And F one a moderate tornado is
roughly seventy three two hundred and twelve miles per hour,
(22:04):
so goal post should be okay. Once you get to
F two and greater adity, there's pretty good chance you're
not going to see that thing stuck in the ground. Okay.
So that's making me think of two things. One, have
you previously worked at the Weather Channel? No, I would
be awful at that anything green screen, Like I keen.
Even sometimes when I do new ships for NFL Network
and I have to straighten my tie and I'm looking
at my monitor view, I'm always going in the wrong direction.
(22:26):
So I would be the world's worst weather person. But
I was sort of fascinated by it. I mean, that's
very fair. And now we know that you're not aiming
for Jim Cantory's job where someone has to hold onto
your leg and you stand in I'm very content being
a co host of NFL explained with you. Which leads
me to my other question about goal posts. If they're
(22:48):
not getting replaced all that often, I would imagine the signal,
like just even moving something that large logistically is you know,
it's not like you know, I can order one of
these things on Prime and next day it's they're ready
to go. There's got to be some nuance here well,
for sure, And there's two pieces to this. You talk
about weather. So in general, the way that Gilman Gear
(23:09):
does it is that they have the parts. They have
aluminum always there, and if they needed to, if they
had all the ingredients, as Neil Gilman put it to me,
then they could indeed make a goal post in about
three days. And of course you have a lot of
experts working on it. You have your welders, you have
your role benders, and the secret sauce and all of this,
(23:31):
of course is the bending, because you have to make
sure that you have the perfect contours inside the pipe
and that everything is at the exact right angle. And
as we talked about earlier, your inches, your measurements better
all be perfect. You mentioned whether so. Neil Gilman's actually
said that the quickest he had to turn around a
goal post was when Hurricane Katrina devastated New Orleans, and
(23:53):
as we all know, the Superdome was turned into an
evacuation shelter, the Saints had moved to San Antonio, and
then when New Orleans was coming back for that very
first game of the two thousand six season, for whatever reason,
nobody real is that the goal posts weren't necessarily in
pristine shape, and this is how important they are. It
really mattered to the NFL that everything looked as beautiful
(24:14):
as possible, and so there was this big rush to
get the Super Dome ready. And at the time the
NFL wanted new goal posts, shiny new goal post and
Neil Gilman said he got a call from a vice
president there. He was told, we don't care what it cost,
but we need you to express it. And so fortunately
they had the parts in three days. They put it
(24:35):
together and yes they did indeed need a very very
special truck. But once Neil Gilman had to send goal
post to Australia for an NFL game there that was
a little bit different. That was sort of an unmovable
what do I call it? It was like it was
mounted on a steel plate, like a roll away goal post.
You know how you have like a rollaway basketball hoop
(24:56):
in your driveway. They made a goal post like that.
They shipped it via air freight and Neil kilb actually said,
I think we left them there. There's no idea where
they are now. They also airfraided the first goal post
to London the first game that was at Wimbley Stadium
in London. Gilman gear did that and uh Neil Gilman
(25:18):
said he actually went out there just to make sure
that they were set up correctly. But you know, when
you talk about replacing goal posts, part of why we
are going to talk to Justin Tucker is that Justin
Tucker forced the replacement of every single upright in the NFL.
You do know this, right, Oh, I'm aware, and we're
going to relive the moment that sparked all of that
(25:39):
when he joins us in a couple of minutes. But
you're kind of touching on this, right. So thirty ft
two then five more, that's got to be a real
hassle to add those extra feet across the board around
the NFL. So really quickly, let's tell everybody the story
so that Justin doesn't have to waste his time telling
us exactly this. It's a Raven's Patriots game, two thousand
twelve season, and he kicks not one of his prettiest kicks,
(26:01):
and the ball goes so high that there seems to
be some sort of question as it's over the upright
whether it would have been inside the upright if it
extended or if it was wide. Now, Patriots coach Bill Belichick,
you know what he thought. He thought it was wide,
and as you said earlier, he lost his mind over it.
(26:24):
So Bill Belichick and the Patriots proposed a rule change,
and they said, instead of thirty foot uprights, let's make
them forty. He wanted them ten ft higher. So the
NFL called Neil Gilman and said can we do this?
And Mike, do you know what the answer was? Well,
(26:44):
the answer was we could, but it would cost way
more money because the way that the goose neck is
in the ground, the weight that the crossbar can support,
you could only go up five additional feet. If you
wanted to replace the entire field goal and dig new
holes and put in more concrete and whatever that whole
(27:05):
process of creating a post is, then sure you could
go forty feet. But if you wanted to leave the
goose neck and leave the crossbar and just replace the uprights,
then the engineer said you could only go up five ft,
five ft more from the original thirty. So that was
the compromise. Five ft. It is we're all about the
Benjamin's right. So the Tucker rule officially kind of in place,
(27:27):
and we'll actually hear more about this from Justin Tucker,
so I'm going to classify it as a wardrobe malfunction
kind of that change the course of history. Only a
few people know the story until now. So a Super
Bowl champion, the Ravens kicker Tucker, is gonna be joining us,
so'll explain what happened in what is arguably one of
the most iconic kicks in NFL history. This podcast is
(27:53):
sponsored by Kindrel. Kindrel Designs builds, manages, and modernizes the
mission critical technology systems that the world depends on every day.
Working side by side with their customers, they imagine things ply.
By forging new strategic partnerships, they unlock new possibilities, creating
a world powered by healthy digital systems. Align with opportunity,
(28:14):
oxygen to innovation, and energy to change the world. Kindrel
the heart of progress. Kindrel Designs builds, manages, and modernizes
the mission critical technology systems that the world depends on
every day. Working side by side with their customers, they
imagine things differently. By forging new strategic partnerships, they unlock
new possibilities, creating a world powered by healthy digital systems
(28:37):
alive with opportunity, oxygen to innovation and energy to change
the world. Kindrel the heart of progress times trust them
talker for the wish favorite. Wilford took his helmet off
(29:03):
spre right for the official. This one go over the
upright and was really close. Well, I'll tell you why
the upbrings extend through the heavens, so be kicking over
the top of it. It's good. One of those magical
(29:25):
moments in football, especially if you were a Ravens fan,
to hear the call in that tent twelve, that game
winning field goal against the Patriots of Super Bowl champion
of four time Pro Bowler the Ravens kicker Justin Tucker
who put it through the sort of through the uprights.
He joins us right now, just to appreciate you giving
us some time. Man, you tell me, I don't know
if you remember the details of all your kicks, That
(29:46):
one to me sort of stands out. But what do
you remember from that ball game and certainly those final
moments It definitely went through first and form both U. Hey, man, Like,
if if one of the worst kicks in my career
was a game winner on Sunday Night football, I'll totally
just have to settle with that, that's okay, But that
one in particular was definitely like a funny kick. Came
(30:07):
off my foot a little awkwardly. A lot of people
don't know this, but on my drive step with my
right foot too, you know, jump into the ball, my
shoe like split in half, like the soule split off
the bottom of the shoe, so it just kind of
like dangling there. And I think that might have made
my foot position at ball contact just a little bit
more awkward, thus sending the ball right from where I
(30:31):
was aiming it. But I mean, here's the thing. Only
two people in the world know exactly where that ball went,
because we had like the best vantage point and that
Sam Cook who was holding the ball, and myself, and
the TV copy makes it look like that ball went
over the upright or almost even wide. But I can
assure you it was good by about six inches, which
(30:51):
is way below our standard. You know, we want to
split everything right down the middle. But I can't assure
you that that kick was in fact through the uprights,
just an in is in first of all. Second of all,
I really hope you got a new shoe deal out
of that, or at least have a new shoe acre.
So I don't want to uh disparage the manufacturers of
the shoes because you know, it was just a flukey incident.
(31:13):
But we're all set. I appreciate the guys putting no
swushes on my feet right well, and there's a plug
right there, you know, even though I don't actually have
a formal deal with them, you know, but like maybe
you guys can help me broker deal with those guys
in organ We will do this. We will make sure
that they download this episode. Whole takeaway, right, the whole
takeaway from all of this, though, Justin, is that you've
(31:36):
got so under Bill belichick skin that he wanted to
rip up the way kicking has been measured for decades.
What is the feeling knowing that you compelled a major
rule change. I think it was about time, you know.
To be perfectly honest, He's absolutely right that the goal
post needed to be extended higher just due to the
(31:59):
nature of the evolution of kicking over time. I mean,
guys are hitting the ball with more force and more height,
and as are just continuing to get better and better.
So I mean it was only a matter of time
until something needed to be done. But to me, it
makes all the sense, the whole idea of the uprights
extending into the heavens, and if a ball goes over
the upright, it's considered good and it makes sense. But
(32:20):
if you can just kind of take a little bit
of the guesswork out of it for the officials, then
you might as well make that change. Just you know,
you strike me as a technical kicker, someone who knows
every single minute detail with your craft, the goal post
in particular. You know, I've heard other athletes and other
sports talk about equipment, their manufactured, they're all supposed to
(32:41):
be identical. Is that your read on goal posts when
you go to the various stadiums. We definitely emphasize being
a detail oriented here when it comes to, you know,
making kicks. Every little thing does matter, Nothing is inconsequential
as far as we're concerned. At the same time, the
field is a hundred yards long, and it's fifty three
and a third or whatever the number is yards wide,
(33:04):
and the hash marks are always where they are. You
pick a target line in between those uprights based on
the wind, based on the field conditions, and then you
aim at that target point as central as possible. The
uprights just kind of happened to be there. And granted,
they are important because you have to hit the ball
through them to get credit for anything that you're doing
out there if you're a kicker. Yeah, I mean, that's
(33:25):
one of the things I love about my job descript
and it's so black and white. You know, the kicks
are either do it or they're not. And obviously the
goal posts are a determining factor. But I'd rather be
less familiar with the goal post than more, because if
you get to know the goal post too well, then
you know you're doing the balls off of them, and
that's no fun for anybody. I mean, that's a very
very fair point. And it's funny because I've actually talked
(33:47):
to some kickers who can tell if the crossbar is
an inch too short or if the upright leans in
a little bit. But having said that, I mean, are
there any stadiums where the goal posts are kind of
the wonkiest, where it does feel like the wind shakes
the uprights too much or you have become two from
elier with the uprights? I mean, I want to say,
(34:08):
league wide, they are the same, you know, and they
have to be right. I mean, Um, I don't know.
Maybe you guys are bringing up some points. Maybe I
don't have to, you know, study the structural integrity of
the uprights every time I go to a new stadium,
but justin I don't know. In Cleveland, it looks like
those upright shake a lot. Well they do, because you know,
(34:29):
it's December, it's the A S. C. North. I mean,
the wind is whipping around anywhere we happen to play.
I feel like any time I happen to take the field,
it can be like it can be today at practice
an hour ago. It can be totally calm and still
the whole practice, and then as soon as you know,
the field goal unit is called onto the field, those
(34:49):
little flags at the top the upright, all of a
sudden they just start moving around and it's like clockwork
every single time. But but at the end of the day,
you know you were still aiming in the center of
the uprights, even if they are being jostled around by
the wind. Justine, you're not territorial with the goalposts, are you.
Like if someone happens to be celebrating near your goal post,
or maybe just doing a little bit of dunk celebration,
(35:12):
that doesn't irk you doesn't. Absolutely not. Okay, that is
not a thought that has ever crossed my mind. They're
just a part of the field. I'm glad that they
continue to be a part of the field. You know,
you've got some TV analysts that say they want to
rip them down and take kickers out of football. So
you know, maybe from that standpoint, I'll be territorial of
the upright, not from opposing players dumping over the goal post,
(35:33):
but sports media members who want to figuratively take them down. Well,
what did you think last year? Surely you saw this
right when Oklahoma States threw up on its video board
yellow bars when the Texas kicker was kicking. Uh, it's
low Kia savage move. But I kind of love it though,
(35:54):
Um really I love it from like the competitive standpoint,
Like is it ethical? Probably not. I mean, like it's
already tough enough to make kicks as it is, Like,
why are we gonna throw up some of diffal uprights?
I don't think it's maybe, I mean, who knows, maybe
it is legal, um, because it's not like the right
thing to do. I mean, you want guys to do well,
you know you don't. You don't want to like just
(36:15):
outwardly root against them, you know, and you know, like
the like, just let the players and the coaches settle
it out on the field. You don't need the video
department in the booth throwing anything into the mix that
doesn't need to be there. Mike, you can totally see
Justin calling up the M and T video board operator
after this, right like hey, we were hey, we would
(36:35):
we would never It's tough enough to make kicks in
our stadium for for anybody else, you know, like like hey,
like I said, let the players in the coaches just
settle it on the field. What about that, which is
the toughest stadium in the NFL to kick in? In
your mind? I've said this before. I do believe our
stadium is the toughest place to make kicks in the
National Football League. I don't know if you guys know,
but like the way the schedule is kind of constructed
(36:57):
year in and year out, if you play with one
team for eight consecutive years, you will complete your thirty
two stadium tour of the NFL. Like you will play
in every single stadium. Now, granted, a couple get built
here and there, or a team may you know relocate.
So at this point, the only stadium I have not
kicked in is so Fi Stadium out in l A.
(37:18):
But I've been very fortunate to kick in every single
stadium that the league's teams have to offer, and I
would the toughest stadiums to kick in ore, you know,
mostly in our division. I mean I would just say,
like every single one in our division, and then, uh,
Buffalo's Stadium is a really really tough place to kick
those lakes, is what it is? Just the last one
(37:40):
from uh, the last one from us. You said that
you did like the idea of the uprights going taller.
Is there any other change you would like to make
to the goal posts? Um, I've heard the idea of
narrowing the goal post, and maybe that would create an
advantage for some over others. But it's already tough enough
(38:01):
to make kicks, you know what I'm saying. Like the
hallmark of a true professional in any aspect of sport
is they make their jobs look easy because they do
them exceedingly well with a high level of consistency. Right,
And I've heard people say to me before, like, oh,
you make it look easy out there. It's it's never easy.
It's just a matter of a lot of hard work
coming together in a positive way. So as far as
(38:24):
changes to the uprights, like, do we need to make
it any harder, I don't think so. Do you need
to make it any easier? Absolutely not. I think those
strange yellow uprights are perfect just the way they are. Well,
we'll take them. They're beautiful to see on the football field.
And Justin, if you, I'm disappointed that you didn't get
the shoe deal that you were hoping for, especially after
(38:45):
all the attention Zion Williamson had when he was at
Duke and he split his sneaker open, uh during a game.
I feel like there would have been something like that
for you. That was wild. Justin, We're gonna work on
this for you. We're gonna get this done. We're okay.
I mean, I'm open. I'm open to the idea. You know,
maybe I could be Maybe I could be a Jordan guy.
I just I bought like my first parent this offseason.
(39:05):
I'm feeling like, you know, I gotta keep up with
the swag of this team. You know, I'm the thirty
one year old dinosaur dad. It feels like just behind
Sam Cook, you know he's been I think he's going
into his forty seventh year in the NFL. We uh,
I got to keep up with all these guys man
Like my swag has got to be taken to the
next level. And maybe you guys could broken the deal
(39:27):
with the Jordan guys. I don't know. I love how
you go from no deal to like the best possible
do that you could have with Jordan Brand. We will
work on that. Hey, justin appreciate the insight and the
time my friend, and and looking forward to having another
conversation with you more on the specifics of of kicking
down the road sounds great. Thanks for having you got
thanks just so there are no going that is good
(39:53):
water performers. Tell me the truth, Mike, you do know
more about goalposts now, right? Are you kidding me? Like
the education that I just gapped as epic and would
love to hear any kicking stories that people have, maybe
their best field goal moment, their worst one, something that
sort of resonates with them. You can hit us up
on Twitter at my underscore yam at a kick kabwala
(40:14):
and of course used that hashtag. NFL explained. I will
leave you with this have you ever kicked a field goal? Ad?
Can we save that for another episode? We totally can.
I'll tell you mine because I had to do it
in Salt Lake City at a Utah football practice. I
was there and they had me fielding punts one year.
It became kind of like a running joke. Uh. Kyle Whittingham,
(40:36):
who's still their head coach. He had Dennis Erickson on
his staff, and of course Dennis's, you know, Hall of famer,
a guy that coached the NFL a bunch of years,
coach in college a bunch of years. He's talking smack
to me. He said, you can't go and kick this
field goal, And of course they They literally pushed me
out there. The team is circled around me like a
half circle. They set it up. My good friend Anthony
(40:56):
Heron with the bad snap, my really good friend Jogi
Roth with a good hold, put it right through the
uprights from no it was really from twenty five. But
the point is I got it through. I mean it
was a little bit of a worm burner, but it
got through a d D. And that, to me is
the best field goal moment that I can possibly think of.
It's a lady I you know what, I feel like
(41:17):
it didn't happen. If there's not video, there is video proof,
and I will send you that video proof. Believe me,
we got that one of it. There's enough bloopers of
me that if there's something positive, I think I might
even have that one on my phone because I'm gonna
hold on to that one forever. But it looks if
anyone's got a cool video, I would love to see
some of those once again. Use that hashtag NFL Explain.
(41:37):
You can follow the NFL Explained podcast wherever you listen
to podcasts. And always appreciate you guys taking part in
our conversation and send us your questions. We will do
our best to answer them later. Guess America's most reliable
(41:59):
network is going ultra with the rise in five G
Ultra wide band and more and more places without the
ten times faster, you can download a movie in mere minutes.
What Yes, Verizon is going ultra so you can to
five G ultra wide ban available and select areas most
reliable based on rankings from the Root Metrics US Roots
Score report dated first half excluding c ban and not
(42:19):
specific to five G networks. Your results may vary not
an endorsement speed comparison to median Verizon four G LTE speeds,
downloads vary based on network conditions, and five G content optimization.
Brought to you by upwork, where you can build the
team that will build your business. Learn more at upwork
dot com.
NFL Explained is a production of the NFL in partnership
with I Heart Radio. Welcome to NFL Explained, a production
of the NFL in partnership with I Heart Radio. America's
most reliable network is going Ultra with Verizon five G
Ultra wide ban and more and more places with up
to ten times faster speeds. You can download a movie
(00:26):
in mere minutes. What Yes, Verizon is going ultra so
you can too. Five G Ultra wide ban available and
select areas most reliable based on rankings from the Root
Metrics US ROOT Score report dated first half, excluding c
ban and not specific to five G networks. Your results
may vary. Not an endorsement speed comparison to median Verizon
four G LTE speeds downloads vary based on network conditions
(00:47):
and five G content optimization. Up Work is the world's
work marketplace. Empower your business and hire the world's most
in demand developers, designers, project managers and more at www.
Dot up work dot com. D line to me, brown,
(01:11):
look at him go gets primostrophe. It almost figures touch show,
Oh my god, flagg Let me turn to the number.
Every four A four hundred and twenty five pounds on
(01:39):
the football field, and no, I am not talking about
a player. Welcome to NFL, explained, it's the podcast where
we answering your questions on topics, where you just learn
exactly sure who to turn to for those answers. I'm like,
yeam along with the d D King Kabwala add what's
good today? What's great is goal posts. People are pausing
saying goal post today. Let me just tell you this.
(01:59):
When the texts are fast and furious from add and
she's dropping emojis, I realized that her excitement on today's
podcast is through the roof. Initially did he? I said,
how many questions are there around goal posts? Like? They're there,
we see them. They function as basically markers on the
football field and help us score points. There's actually a
lot more to it that I didn't even realize. Well,
(02:19):
but that's the point here, Mike, right, you cannot play
a game without goal post. You can't mimic the goal
post with a cone. I mean, that doesn't quite do it.
And if you stop to think about it, there's a
million questions. Why are they yellow? Why are the uprights
thirty five ft in the air? How often do you
have to replace these things. Does somebody paint them? I mean,
what happens if water gets inside a goal post? What
(02:41):
happens when Antonio Brown does a crazy celebration against a
goal post? Or Jimmy Graham decides to dunk a football
a fake football or a real football? Was it a
real football that he dunked on the goal post? Real?
But it actually is a dunk because of the height
of it, which is another thing that I had learned.
But look, we don't have all the answers on this
particular subject, so we actually had to go to some
(03:03):
of the experts. A little bit later in this show,
Ravens kicker Justin Tucker is going to be joining us.
He has the most incredible story about a field goal
that had Bill Belichick absolutely go nuclear and led to
a major change in the sports. So Justin is gonna
be joining us a little bit later in the show.
And indeed, I can't help but think back to that
Monday night matchup that we just saw, a classic game
(03:24):
with the Raiders in Las Vegas and the near game winner,
I mean, it almost was a game winner. And of
course that game goes over time and Baltimore loses, but
I couldn't help but think of the conversation we are
going to have with Justin and just watching that thing
go through the upright, so pure. Yeah, And if that
had held, Mike, that would have been a seventeen game
winning field goal. But I guess number seventeen we'll just
(03:46):
have to come later on in the year. It'll happen.
And as far as can I call the other guy
that you talked to, like the guru of goal posts,
well I think he is. I mean I called the
guy who's been making goal posts for the NFL since
the early nineteen eighties, whose family has been in the
business of making football equipment since the nineteen twenties. Neil
Gilman out of Gilman, Connecticut, gave me so much good information.
(04:10):
And listen to this, Mike. We were on the phone
for an hour and fifteen minutes. WHOA, there is a
lot to learn about goal posts. So let's just get
into the basics, right. I think it's a good way
to start, because I think a lot of ways you
have to understand the evolution of goal posts because they're
always haven't looked the way that they look right now.
And just for context, the measurements are actually really important
(04:31):
and vital. Those uprights d you made reference to it.
They extend thirty five ft above the crossbar. They're no
less than three inches and no more than four inches
in diameter, And I think all of us sort of
take a look at those colored ribbons at the top
of each post to understand how windy it is. It's
the first thing I do every Sunday to figure out
which way the winds are swirling. Those things there are
(04:52):
four inches by forty two inches. I never would have
imagined that there as long as they are. The crossbar
is eighteen feet six inches in length and the top
of the face of it is ten ft above the ground,
which is why when you say someone's dunking, that's also
the height of a regulation NBA RIM So they really
do mean it. But the history add behind this stuff
(05:12):
is is really fascinating. Wait wait, wait, one more part
though much and that's the goose neck. The goose neck
is the actual posts that attaches that you um sort
of making letters with my fingers here, that attaches the
U into the ground. It goes into a concrete footing,
and we are going to be referencing that gooseneck it's
the thing that you know, Antonio Brown kind of did
(05:35):
something profane against at one point. It's the thing that
has padding, didn't Did Joe Horn hide a cell phone inside? Yes?
So sharpie was a sharpie hidden in there once too.
I thought the sharpie was out of the sock. Okay,
I'm sorry, bad reference right there. But the goose neck,
it is a vital part of the goal post. It is,
and I'm glad you made reference to that as it
(05:56):
will continue to pop up because even that gooseneck wasn't
actually there at the start and the history behind it.
You gotta go back to n the NFL's first season,
the goal post were actually located on the goal line
and they look like the letter H, So you actually
had two posts that were sticking into the ground. That
changed in seven when the n C Double A moved
them back to the end line. And in those days,
(06:17):
the NFL actually just followed the college rule books, so
the league basically just mimic what they were doing. But
a dd that change resulted in a reduction of field
goals and tied games. Who the hell wants a tie game?
No one does, and the league said, we definitely don't
want this, so they created their own rule book. In
nineteen thirty three, they moved the goal post back to
the goal line. Not surprisingly, the field goals increased twofold
(06:40):
and the number of tie games way down, which is
certainly big time for fans that like results. Not much
changed a d D for thirty three years until nineteen
sixty six. The NFL goes, you know what, let's move
those goal posts. They should be offset from the goal line,
and they're actually painted bright yellow. And those uprights sitting
above the crossbar. Do you know why they were painted yellow?
(07:03):
I would imagine just from a visual standpoint with TV.
Maybe that's right because the NFL started having greater interest
in playing games at night, and the yellow showed up
much better than the white did in a dark sky.
But you know how they came up with yellow as
opposed to like neon pink. I was just gonna ask,
what why yellow as opposed to just any sort of
(07:23):
neon color that you could have chosen. Well, Neon is
a key here, because the NFL did actually really want
a neon color, and they went to a company in
Cleveland called day Glow and said, okay, show us all
your colors. And the pink was, you know, bright and prank.
The orange was really a nice day Glow orange. But
the problem with orange for the NFL is that that
was the Brown's color, and it was also the Bengals color,
(07:45):
and the NFL wanted a color that no team was using,
and so nobody is using Saturn yellow. But here, let
me give you something else about the color. And this
is what Neil Gilman of Gilman Gear told me is
that initially this Saturn yellow paint had to be bought
from day Glow in Cleveland. And what teams would have
to do, or what Gilman Gear or whatever goal post
(08:07):
manufacturers would have to do, is paint all the aluminum
posts with a white primer. Then they would paint them
the saturn yellow, and then they would do a third
cote of clear lacquer, which was supposed to seal it.
But what happens in the sun, things sort of melt
and chip away and they fade. Remember when we talked
about faded uniforms in the Arizona Cardinals, And if you
don't remember, then you need to go listen to one
(08:29):
of our first episodes. But anyway, the paint would fade,
and Neil Gilman told me that every year he'd get
a call from some groundskeeper somewhere saying, I have an
ugly set of goal posts. So then it was actually
Neil Gilman who figured out, let me take a chip
from one of these goal posts to Sherwin Williams, and
he asked them, can you color match this in a
(08:50):
powder coating. So now all of the goal posts have
a powder coating, which means that they are baked on.
They do not fade. They are not supposed to chip.
And if you are replacing a goal post, it is
not because the color has faded. It's for another reason,
which of course we will get into. Sherwin Williams coming
up big for us. I love it so actually it
(09:12):
sounds like I shouldn't say it sounds like it really
is reality. Nineteen sixty six a huge year for the
NFL as it pertains to goal posts. But dd that
next year, nineteen sixty seven, the league actually made the
decision to require the slingshot type of posts, as opposed
to the letter H one that was back in the
day that actually had two posts sticking into the ground.
Because it was the letter H, the league was a
(09:33):
little more concerned about safety, and you can understand with
an extra post sitting at that goal line like that
becomes a little bit of an issue. But then in
the league they make the push, they take the goal
post and they move them back to that end line.
And that change was made to encourage offenses to score
more touchdowns as opposed to field goals. Right, we all
like t D as opposed to the f G. And
(09:54):
it worked in a big way. And a d D
maybe the most important thing about all this. It eliminated
the most heart wrenching moments you can have in the
game of football, like this one from Super Bowl seven.
Second down seven ago, the redskin just short of the
ten yard line. Earlier in this half, they reached the
(10:15):
seven team. This has been their deepest beneface for the game, Dummer.
And then the end gong and hit the goal boat.
Jerry Smith, the tight end looked like he was open
cutting behind the goal post deep in the end zone.
I know I'm not the only one thinking it a
d D. I have a topic from one of our
next episodes, the evolution of play by play broadcasters. Can
(10:36):
you imagine a Super Bowl game? This is Super Bowl seven,
It's the fourth quarter. You got Billy Kilmer, the Washington quarterback.
He misses and it's sort of mentioned there, but a
wide open Jerry Smith in the end zone. The ball
actually bounces off of the post. That Dolphins win that
game fourteen to seven. So where's the excitement there? Add
(10:57):
we have to do an evolution of play by play
voices for the NFL. I feel like you've got a
little more excitement right now than was felt in that moment.
Marty Clickman is going like what someone needs to get
coached up here in a big way. Look, it's fascinating
here because once you make the move a D D
and you move those goalposts back to that end live uh.
(11:18):
Former Brown's coach Paul Brown, and we actually chronicled that
story one of our last episodes, but he told Sports
Illustrated in vo the whole end zone is open for
pass patterns. Now. The goal posts were in effect another
safety man. When you get inside the twenty, you couldn't
run or pass around them. It was hard to punk
or pass coming out of the end. So, I mean,
this is a pivotal moment for the NFL. Just that
(11:40):
one change, and maybe we're talking about a different result
in Super Bowl number seven. But the only other thing
I want to add here a d D because I
know I did it when I was a kid. You're
playing football, Can you just imagine this. You're a wide receiver,
you're running acrossing route. You actually could grab the pole,
spin around quickly and go in the opposite direction. I mean,
(12:01):
like that was like an actual thing. Can you imagine
seeing that now in the modern day NFL game? It
be sort of comical because the guys are so damn
fast and they cut so well. But that was happening
back in the day in the NFL. Well. I think
that this is again justin Tucker will talk to us
later about a decision that he thinks was a no brainer.
I think moving the goal post back is one of
those no brainers. For sure, it is, but a d D.
(12:22):
The conversation that you had that led to some of
these most incredible stories around goal posts, and yes, they
are incredible. Do you want to tease one of them here?
Because you had the conversation. I don't even know what
the most teasable thing is because I will be hearing
all of these stories for the first time when we
do it. Kickers are a very special breed. One of
my favorite stories that Neil Gilman told me was about
(12:44):
Chip low Miller. Chip Low Miller was a kicker. He
was a kicker for the Rams in ninet when they
had freshly moved from l A to St. Louis. Chipp
Loow Miller went out to the stadium to these brand
new goal posts and he said to the grounds crew,
m something's wrong with this crowds bar. And the grounds
cree said uh. He said, no, no, no, something's wrong
(13:06):
with this crossbar. The grounds crew brought out of tape
measure and guess what the crossbar was? One in short,
according to what Neil Gilman told me, so, hey, you
can always trust a kicker's eyes spatial awareness. I don't
know how else to describe that. That is absolutely amazing.
That one inch when it's ten ft up. That's something
(13:29):
that you would be able to pick out with just
your naked eye. That is an unbelievable story. And there's
more of those covering up next here on NFL explaining
build the team that will build your business. With upwork,
you can find top developers, designers, project managers and more
who can start today so your business can succeed. Tomorrow
higher at home or in a hundred and eighty countries
(13:51):
around the world to find the right talent for whatever
your business needs. Up Work the world's work marketplace. Learn
more at www dot up work dot com. America's most
reliable network is going ultra with rise in five g
old your wide band in more and more places, so
you can do more with up the ten times faster speeds.
You can download a movie in mirror minutes. What Yes,
(14:13):
that's faster than your morning coffee run lights camera coffee.
And while you're at it, go on and download a
whole series in minutes or a new song in seconds
A one, A two one to Oh, it's done. Stock
up on all that entertainment. And sure you can download
work files faster too if you have to, so you
can quickly get back to all these great movies, shows
and songs you've just gotten your hands on. Verizon five
(14:35):
G Ultra wide band is now in more and more places.
Verizon is going ultra so you can to five G
Ultra wide band available in select areas. Most reliable based
on rankings from the Root Metrics US ROOTS Score report
dated first half one excluding C band and not specific
to five G networks. Your results may vary. Not an
endorsement speed comparison to Media and Verizon four G LTE
speeds downloads very based on network conditions and five G
(14:57):
content optimization. He heavy William More ragged under the end
zone by Jimmy Graham on the touchdown strike a purty
four yard Jimmy Graham all fired up in the end
zone and he does it use the little dunk. But
it was like that time he was kind of hanging
(15:18):
on the rail. I really thought the gold posts were
gonna come down. Look like it, Deman donan look like
a little cocka do you right now? You know that?
Welcome back to NFL, explained my Kam and a da
kin kawaala with you coming up in just a couple
of minutes, Ravens Kicker, he's a Super Bowl champion. Justin
Tucker is going to be stopping by an awesome conversation
(15:39):
with him. But I now officially have an expert on
all things skull posts. I think when you spend an
hour fifteen minutes on the phone with the Guru of
goal posts, you're gonna be able to drop some significant knowledge.
Is there one thing before we get into some of
the details. One thing from your conversation with Neil Gilman
from Gilman Gear that stood out to you the most
(15:59):
just how passionate he was about it. So the Gilman
family had a textile mill in the town of Gilman, Connecticut,
back in the eighteen nineties. So Neil Gilman's grandparents were
running this textile mill and then his dad, Marty, was
playing football at Yukon. He was an offensive lineman. And
(16:19):
this is in the nineteen twenties. And Neil tells me that,
you know, in the nineteen twenties, when you're playing football,
what do you use as a tackling dummy? You use
your teammates. You know that there's a blocking dummy. There's
nothing like that. So his dad is really smart. Dad
one day comes home to his parents textile mill and
he grabs this big canvas bag and he starts stuffing
it with these by products from the mill. He asks
(16:41):
his parents to sew it back up and it's a
blocking dummy. So he takes it to his coach and
he says, hey, coach, I don't want to hit anybody.
I don't want anybody to hit me while we're practicing.
I'm just gonna hit this, and the coach says to him,
that's wonderful. Can you make me six more So that
Marty Gilman finishes playing football, graduates at Yukon, goes home
to work at the textile mill, and he creates a
(17:03):
whole new sideline which is football training equipment. And you know,
he said, this is his calling in life. He went
on to invent the blocking and the tackling sled, the
pop up dummy, all of that. Then his son, Neil
goes on to be a football player at Harvard. He
was a defensive back, not quite as big as his dad,
I guess. And then he graduated and he joined the
(17:25):
company in nineteen seventy seven. And I think I said
this earlier. His family has been making goal posts for
the NFL since the early nineteen eighties. At one point,
Gilman gear made twenty four of the thirty one NFL
stadium's goal posts. Neil Gilman is the guy that came
up with the idea of putting a hinge on a
(17:45):
goal post. Surely you remember, Mike, like back in the
nineteen eighties when fans would rush the field, You're a
pack twelve guy. Where I mean Wasn't that a big
deal at Stanford? Didn't that happen all? Yeah, you know,
you get the Well, the game obviously between conship is
certainly the big one. The bands on the field, which
is a very different call and than we heard earlier
in the podcast with a pass it hit the goal post, right,
(18:07):
So you have all these students rushing the field and
they're trying to take the goal post down. And as
Neil Gilman says it to me, well, you know what
if we take away the reason to take the goal
post down, which is creating a hinge so that the
groundscrew can come out and immediately sort of topple the uprights,
well then maybe people won't be trying to attack goal posts.
(18:27):
And then a few years later, George Wiley, who was
a retired Pasadena police officer who had turned into an inventor,
went one step further and he devised a mechanism that
uses hydraulics to actually bring the goal post down, and
he can do it in less than ten seconds, and
so that way you don't even need the two ground
screw guys to pull it down. And one notable thing though,
(18:48):
pay attention to this when you watch this season, Mike.
Those hydraulics make the gooseneck that much bigger to get
that system attached to the goose neck. So the pads
around the goose necks in San Francisco and Foxborough are
much thicker than any place else. And two stadiums in
the f felled San Francisco and New England both have
(19:08):
this hydraulic system to their goal posts. So note to
Patriots fans and forty Niners fans, don't rush the field.
It just won't work, didn't They don't want anyone rushing
the field. Safety, safety for everyone involved. But how often
are these things even replaced? Like I would imagine you've
got like this four pounds goal post. You stick that
bad boy into the ground like you're good for decades. Well,
(19:31):
you should be good for about twenty years. Right. They're
made of aluminum. The reason that they are made of
aluminum is so that they don't rust, so that they're
you know, somewhat lightweight, such that people can actually put
them up. You don't need a crane to take them
up and down, which you would with steel. Lightweight four
pounds I mean relatively speaking as compared to steel, which
(19:53):
would require so much more rebar and things that I
don't necessarily know so much about. But in any case,
they are made of aluminum. They don't rust. Now that
we know that they're powder coated, they shouldn't really fade
in color. But you know, natural disasters happen, and apparently
in a place like Miami, where there are a lot
of hurricanes, those uprights need to be replaced fairly frequently.
(20:16):
And in a place like Buffalo, where there is indeed
bad weather and where you know the lake effects, snow
can do some weird things. Helped create one of the
improvements in gold posts, and that again this is courtesy
of Neil Gilman telling me this story. Once there was
so much snow, moisture got inside the uprights, and then
(20:37):
the uprights started shaking, vibrating, almost like a tuning fork.
And so Neil Gilman says that the groundskeeper they're called
him and said, oh my gosh, the gold post is
vibrating like a tuning fork. And they figured out what
had happened is that moisture had gotten inside the upright
and it would expand and detract, expand to track. That's
(20:58):
what was making it vibrate. So now gold posts I'll
have a wheep hole inside the goose neck, you know,
that part that goes into the round, so that any
moisture that gets in can actually bleed out. So in theory,
a goal post should indeed last for twenty years. A
goal post should be able to withstand seventy mile per
hour winds. And because it is in four parts, the
(21:22):
two uprights, so are the parts that are replaced the
most frequently. So I'm actually glad that you brought up
the winds because I looked this up because I had
seen some numbers that indicated anywhere from like seventy five
to a hundred miles an hour is what those goal
posts should be able to withstand. So I'm like, well,
what happens if tornado comes through? Does that thing going
to rip down one of those goal posts? I didn't
(21:43):
even realize there were different categories of tornadoes A F one,
F two, three, four, and five. The low end one
is the F one, and that just kind of a
peels roofs off of you know, some homes maybe just
like not completely off but can move some cars slightly
on the road. And F one a moderate tornado is
roughly seventy three two hundred and twelve miles per hour,
(22:04):
so goal post should be okay. Once you get to
F two and greater adity, there's pretty good chance you're
not going to see that thing stuck in the ground. Okay.
So that's making me think of two things. One, have
you previously worked at the Weather Channel? No, I would
be awful at that anything green screen, Like I keen.
Even sometimes when I do new ships for NFL Network
and I have to straighten my tie and I'm looking
at my monitor view, I'm always going in the wrong direction.
(22:26):
So I would be the world's worst weather person. But
I was sort of fascinated by it. I mean, that's
very fair. And now we know that you're not aiming
for Jim Cantory's job where someone has to hold onto
your leg and you stand in I'm very content being
a co host of NFL explained with you. Which leads
me to my other question about goal posts. If they're
(22:48):
not getting replaced all that often, I would imagine the signal,
like just even moving something that large logistically is you know,
it's not like you know, I can order one of
these things on Prime and next day it's they're ready
to go. There's got to be some nuance here well,
for sure, And there's two pieces to this. You talk
about weather. So in general, the way that Gilman Gear
(23:09):
does it is that they have the parts. They have
aluminum always there, and if they needed to, if they
had all the ingredients, as Neil Gilman put it to me,
then they could indeed make a goal post in about
three days. And of course you have a lot of
experts working on it. You have your welders, you have
your role benders, and the secret sauce and all of this,
(23:31):
of course is the bending, because you have to make
sure that you have the perfect contours inside the pipe
and that everything is at the exact right angle. And
as we talked about earlier, your inches, your measurements better
all be perfect. You mentioned whether so. Neil Gilman's actually
said that the quickest he had to turn around a
goal post was when Hurricane Katrina devastated New Orleans, and
(23:53):
as we all know, the Superdome was turned into an
evacuation shelter, the Saints had moved to San Antonio, and
then when New Orleans was coming back for that very
first game of the two thousand six season, for whatever reason,
nobody real is that the goal posts weren't necessarily in
pristine shape, and this is how important they are. It
really mattered to the NFL that everything looked as beautiful
(24:14):
as possible, and so there was this big rush to
get the Super Dome ready. And at the time the
NFL wanted new goal posts, shiny new goal post and
Neil Gilman said he got a call from a vice
president there. He was told, we don't care what it cost,
but we need you to express it. And so fortunately
they had the parts in three days. They put it
(24:35):
together and yes they did indeed need a very very
special truck. But once Neil Gilman had to send goal
post to Australia for an NFL game there that was
a little bit different. That was sort of an unmovable
what do I call it? It was like it was
mounted on a steel plate, like a roll away goal post.
You know how you have like a rollaway basketball hoop
(24:56):
in your driveway. They made a goal post like that.
They shipped it via air freight and Neil kilb actually said,
I think we left them there. There's no idea where
they are now. They also airfraided the first goal post
to London the first game that was at Wimbley Stadium
in London. Gilman gear did that and uh Neil Gilman
(25:18):
said he actually went out there just to make sure
that they were set up correctly. But you know, when
you talk about replacing goal posts, part of why we
are going to talk to Justin Tucker is that Justin
Tucker forced the replacement of every single upright in the NFL.
You do know this, right, Oh, I'm aware, and we're
going to relive the moment that sparked all of that
(25:39):
when he joins us in a couple of minutes. But
you're kind of touching on this, right. So thirty ft
two then five more, that's got to be a real
hassle to add those extra feet across the board around
the NFL. So really quickly, let's tell everybody the story
so that Justin doesn't have to waste his time telling
us exactly this. It's a Raven's Patriots game, two thousand
twelve season, and he kicks not one of his prettiest kicks,
(26:01):
and the ball goes so high that there seems to
be some sort of question as it's over the upright
whether it would have been inside the upright if it
extended or if it was wide. Now, Patriots coach Bill Belichick,
you know what he thought. He thought it was wide,
and as you said earlier, he lost his mind over it.
(26:24):
So Bill Belichick and the Patriots proposed a rule change,
and they said, instead of thirty foot uprights, let's make
them forty. He wanted them ten ft higher. So the
NFL called Neil Gilman and said can we do this?
And Mike, do you know what the answer was? Well,
(26:44):
the answer was we could, but it would cost way
more money because the way that the goose neck is
in the ground, the weight that the crossbar can support,
you could only go up five additional feet. If you
wanted to replace the entire field goal and dig new
holes and put in more concrete and whatever that whole
(27:05):
process of creating a post is, then sure you could
go forty feet. But if you wanted to leave the
goose neck and leave the crossbar and just replace the uprights,
then the engineer said you could only go up five ft,
five ft more from the original thirty. So that was
the compromise. Five ft. It is we're all about the
Benjamin's right. So the Tucker rule officially kind of in place,
(27:27):
and we'll actually hear more about this from Justin Tucker,
so I'm going to classify it as a wardrobe malfunction
kind of that change the course of history. Only a
few people know the story until now. So a Super
Bowl champion, the Ravens kicker Tucker, is gonna be joining us,
so'll explain what happened in what is arguably one of
the most iconic kicks in NFL history. This podcast is
(27:53):
sponsored by Kindrel. Kindrel Designs builds, manages, and modernizes the
mission critical technology systems that the world depends on every day.
Working side by side with their customers, they imagine things ply.
By forging new strategic partnerships, they unlock new possibilities, creating
a world powered by healthy digital systems. Align with opportunity,
(28:14):
oxygen to innovation, and energy to change the world. Kindrel
the heart of progress. Kindrel Designs builds, manages, and modernizes
the mission critical technology systems that the world depends on
every day. Working side by side with their customers, they
imagine things differently. By forging new strategic partnerships, they unlock
new possibilities, creating a world powered by healthy digital systems
(28:37):
alive with opportunity, oxygen to innovation and energy to change
the world. Kindrel the heart of progress times trust them
talker for the wish favorite. Wilford took his helmet off
(29:03):
spre right for the official. This one go over the
upright and was really close. Well, I'll tell you why
the upbrings extend through the heavens, so be kicking over
the top of it. It's good. One of those magical
(29:25):
moments in football, especially if you were a Ravens fan,
to hear the call in that tent twelve, that game
winning field goal against the Patriots of Super Bowl champion
of four time Pro Bowler the Ravens kicker Justin Tucker
who put it through the sort of through the uprights.
He joins us right now, just to appreciate you giving
us some time. Man, you tell me, I don't know
if you remember the details of all your kicks, That
(29:46):
one to me sort of stands out. But what do
you remember from that ball game and certainly those final
moments It definitely went through first and form both U. Hey, man, Like,
if if one of the worst kicks in my career
was a game winner on Sunday Night football, I'll totally
just have to settle with that, that's okay, But that
one in particular was definitely like a funny kick. Came
(30:07):
off my foot a little awkwardly. A lot of people
don't know this, but on my drive step with my
right foot too, you know, jump into the ball, my
shoe like split in half, like the soule split off
the bottom of the shoe, so it just kind of
like dangling there. And I think that might have made
my foot position at ball contact just a little bit
more awkward, thus sending the ball right from where I
(30:31):
was aiming it. But I mean, here's the thing. Only
two people in the world know exactly where that ball went,
because we had like the best vantage point and that
Sam Cook who was holding the ball, and myself, and
the TV copy makes it look like that ball went
over the upright or almost even wide. But I can
assure you it was good by about six inches, which
(30:51):
is way below our standard. You know, we want to
split everything right down the middle. But I can't assure
you that that kick was in fact through the uprights,
just an in is in first of all. Second of all,
I really hope you got a new shoe deal out
of that, or at least have a new shoe acre.
So I don't want to uh disparage the manufacturers of
the shoes because you know, it was just a flukey incident.
(31:13):
But we're all set. I appreciate the guys putting no
swushes on my feet right well, and there's a plug
right there, you know, even though I don't actually have
a formal deal with them, you know, but like maybe
you guys can help me broker deal with those guys
in organ We will do this. We will make sure
that they download this episode. Whole takeaway, right, the whole
takeaway from all of this, though, Justin, is that you've
(31:36):
got so under Bill belichick skin that he wanted to
rip up the way kicking has been measured for decades.
What is the feeling knowing that you compelled a major
rule change. I think it was about time, you know.
To be perfectly honest, He's absolutely right that the goal
post needed to be extended higher just due to the
(31:59):
nature of the evolution of kicking over time. I mean,
guys are hitting the ball with more force and more height,
and as are just continuing to get better and better.
So I mean it was only a matter of time
until something needed to be done. But to me, it
makes all the sense, the whole idea of the uprights
extending into the heavens, and if a ball goes over
the upright, it's considered good and it makes sense. But
(32:20):
if you can just kind of take a little bit
of the guesswork out of it for the officials, then
you might as well make that change. Just you know,
you strike me as a technical kicker, someone who knows
every single minute detail with your craft, the goal post
in particular. You know, I've heard other athletes and other
sports talk about equipment, their manufactured, they're all supposed to
(32:41):
be identical. Is that your read on goal posts when
you go to the various stadiums. We definitely emphasize being
a detail oriented here when it comes to, you know,
making kicks. Every little thing does matter, Nothing is inconsequential
as far as we're concerned. At the same time, the
field is a hundred yards long, and it's fifty three
and a third or whatever the number is yards wide,
(33:04):
and the hash marks are always where they are. You
pick a target line in between those uprights based on
the wind, based on the field conditions, and then you
aim at that target point as central as possible. The
uprights just kind of happened to be there. And granted,
they are important because you have to hit the ball
through them to get credit for anything that you're doing
out there if you're a kicker. Yeah, I mean, that's
(33:25):
one of the things I love about my job descript
and it's so black and white. You know, the kicks
are either do it or they're not. And obviously the
goal posts are a determining factor. But I'd rather be
less familiar with the goal post than more, because if
you get to know the goal post too well, then
you know you're doing the balls off of them, and
that's no fun for anybody. I mean, that's a very
very fair point. And it's funny because I've actually talked
(33:47):
to some kickers who can tell if the crossbar is
an inch too short or if the upright leans in
a little bit. But having said that, I mean, are
there any stadiums where the goal posts are kind of
the wonkiest, where it does feel like the wind shakes
the uprights too much or you have become two from
elier with the uprights? I mean, I want to say,
(34:08):
league wide, they are the same, you know, and they
have to be right. I mean, Um, I don't know.
Maybe you guys are bringing up some points. Maybe I
don't have to, you know, study the structural integrity of
the uprights every time I go to a new stadium,
but justin I don't know. In Cleveland, it looks like
those upright shake a lot. Well they do, because you know,
(34:29):
it's December, it's the A S. C. North. I mean,
the wind is whipping around anywhere we happen to play.
I feel like any time I happen to take the field,
it can be like it can be today at practice
an hour ago. It can be totally calm and still
the whole practice, and then as soon as you know,
the field goal unit is called onto the field, those
(34:49):
little flags at the top the upright, all of a
sudden they just start moving around and it's like clockwork
every single time. But but at the end of the day,
you know you were still aiming in the center of
the uprights, even if they are being jostled around by
the wind. Justine, you're not territorial with the goalposts, are you.
Like if someone happens to be celebrating near your goal post,
or maybe just doing a little bit of dunk celebration,
(35:12):
that doesn't irk you doesn't. Absolutely not. Okay, that is
not a thought that has ever crossed my mind. They're
just a part of the field. I'm glad that they
continue to be a part of the field. You know,
you've got some TV analysts that say they want to
rip them down and take kickers out of football. So
you know, maybe from that standpoint, I'll be territorial of
the upright, not from opposing players dumping over the goal post,
(35:33):
but sports media members who want to figuratively take them down. Well,
what did you think last year? Surely you saw this
right when Oklahoma States threw up on its video board
yellow bars when the Texas kicker was kicking. Uh, it's
low Kia savage move. But I kind of love it though,
(35:54):
Um really I love it from like the competitive standpoint,
Like is it ethical? Probably not. I mean, like it's
already tough enough to make kicks as it is, Like,
why are we gonna throw up some of diffal uprights?
I don't think it's maybe, I mean, who knows, maybe
it is legal, um, because it's not like the right
thing to do. I mean, you want guys to do well,
you know you don't. You don't want to like just
(36:15):
outwardly root against them, you know, and you know, like
the like, just let the players and the coaches settle
it out on the field. You don't need the video
department in the booth throwing anything into the mix that
doesn't need to be there. Mike, you can totally see
Justin calling up the M and T video board operator
after this, right like hey, we were hey, we would
(36:35):
we would never It's tough enough to make kicks in
our stadium for for anybody else, you know, like like hey,
like I said, let the players in the coaches just
settle it on the field. What about that, which is
the toughest stadium in the NFL to kick in? In
your mind? I've said this before. I do believe our
stadium is the toughest place to make kicks in the
National Football League. I don't know if you guys know,
but like the way the schedule is kind of constructed
(36:57):
year in and year out, if you play with one
team for eight consecutive years, you will complete your thirty
two stadium tour of the NFL. Like you will play
in every single stadium. Now, granted, a couple get built
here and there, or a team may you know relocate.
So at this point, the only stadium I have not
kicked in is so Fi Stadium out in l A.
(37:18):
But I've been very fortunate to kick in every single
stadium that the league's teams have to offer, and I
would the toughest stadiums to kick in ore, you know,
mostly in our division. I mean I would just say,
like every single one in our division, and then, uh,
Buffalo's Stadium is a really really tough place to kick
those lakes, is what it is? Just the last one
(37:40):
from uh, the last one from us. You said that
you did like the idea of the uprights going taller.
Is there any other change you would like to make
to the goal posts? Um, I've heard the idea of
narrowing the goal post, and maybe that would create an
advantage for some over others. But it's already tough enough
(38:01):
to make kicks, you know what I'm saying. Like the
hallmark of a true professional in any aspect of sport
is they make their jobs look easy because they do
them exceedingly well with a high level of consistency. Right,
And I've heard people say to me before, like, oh,
you make it look easy out there. It's it's never easy.
It's just a matter of a lot of hard work
coming together in a positive way. So as far as
(38:24):
changes to the uprights, like, do we need to make
it any harder, I don't think so. Do you need
to make it any easier? Absolutely not. I think those
strange yellow uprights are perfect just the way they are. Well,
we'll take them. They're beautiful to see on the football field.
And Justin, if you, I'm disappointed that you didn't get
the shoe deal that you were hoping for, especially after
(38:45):
all the attention Zion Williamson had when he was at
Duke and he split his sneaker open, uh during a game.
I feel like there would have been something like that
for you. That was wild. Justin, We're gonna work on
this for you. We're gonna get this done. We're okay.
I mean, I'm open. I'm open to the idea. You know,
maybe I could be Maybe I could be a Jordan guy.
I just I bought like my first parent this offseason.
(39:05):
I'm feeling like, you know, I gotta keep up with
the swag of this team. You know, I'm the thirty
one year old dinosaur dad. It feels like just behind
Sam Cook, you know he's been I think he's going
into his forty seventh year in the NFL. We uh,
I got to keep up with all these guys man
Like my swag has got to be taken to the
next level. And maybe you guys could broken the deal
(39:27):
with the Jordan guys. I don't know. I love how
you go from no deal to like the best possible
do that you could have with Jordan Brand. We will
work on that. Hey, justin appreciate the insight and the
time my friend, and and looking forward to having another
conversation with you more on the specifics of of kicking
down the road sounds great. Thanks for having you got
thanks just so there are no going that is good
(39:53):
water performers. Tell me the truth, Mike, you do know
more about goalposts now, right? Are you kidding me? Like
the education that I just gapped as epic and would
love to hear any kicking stories that people have, maybe
their best field goal moment, their worst one, something that
sort of resonates with them. You can hit us up
on Twitter at my underscore yam at a kick kabwala
(40:14):
and of course used that hashtag. NFL explained. I will
leave you with this have you ever kicked a field goal? Ad?
Can we save that for another episode? We totally can.
I'll tell you mine because I had to do it
in Salt Lake City at a Utah football practice. I
was there and they had me fielding punts one year.
It became kind of like a running joke. Uh. Kyle Whittingham,
(40:36):
who's still their head coach. He had Dennis Erickson on
his staff, and of course Dennis's, you know, Hall of famer,
a guy that coached the NFL a bunch of years,
coach in college a bunch of years. He's talking smack
to me. He said, you can't go and kick this
field goal, And of course they They literally pushed me
out there. The team is circled around me like a
half circle. They set it up. My good friend Anthony
(40:56):
Heron with the bad snap, my really good friend Jogi
Roth with a good hold, put it right through the
uprights from no it was really from twenty five. But
the point is I got it through. I mean it
was a little bit of a worm burner, but it
got through a d D. And that, to me is
the best field goal moment that I can possibly think of.
It's a lady I you know what, I feel like
(41:17):
it didn't happen. If there's not video, there is video proof,
and I will send you that video proof. Believe me,
we got that one of it. There's enough bloopers of
me that if there's something positive, I think I might
even have that one on my phone because I'm gonna
hold on to that one forever. But it looks if
anyone's got a cool video, I would love to see
some of those once again. Use that hashtag NFL Explain.
(41:37):
You can follow the NFL Explained podcast wherever you listen
to podcasts. And always appreciate you guys taking part in
our conversation and send us your questions. We will do
our best to answer them later. Guess America's most reliable
(41:59):
network is going ultra with the rise in five G
Ultra wide band and more and more places without the
ten times faster, you can download a movie in mere minutes.
What Yes, Verizon is going ultra so you can to
five G ultra wide ban available and select areas most
reliable based on rankings from the Root Metrics US Roots
Score report dated first half excluding c ban and not
(42:19):
specific to five G networks. Your results may vary not
an endorsement speed comparison to median Verizon four G LTE speeds,
downloads vary based on network conditions, and five G content optimization.
Brought to you by upwork, where you can build the
team that will build your business. Learn more at upwork
dot com.
Popular Podcasts
On Purpose with Jay Shetty
I’m Jay Shetty host of On Purpose the worlds #1 Mental Health podcast and I’m so grateful you found us. I started this podcast 5 years ago to invite you into conversations and workshops that are designed to help make you happier, healthier and more healed. I believe that when you (yes you) feel seen, heard and understood you’re able to deal with relationship struggles, work challenges and life’s ups and downs with more ease and grace. I interview experts, celebrities, thought leaders and athletes so that we can grow our mindset, build better habits and uncover a side of them we’ve never seen before. New episodes every Monday and Friday. Your support means the world to me and I don’t take it for granted — click the follow button and leave a review to help us spread the love with On Purpose. I can’t wait for you to listen to your first or 500th episode!
Stuff You Should Know
If you've ever wanted to know about champagne, satanism, the Stonewall Uprising, chaos theory, LSD, El Nino, true crime and Rosa Parks, then look no further. Josh and Chuck have you covered.
Dateline NBC
Current and classic episodes, featuring compelling true-crime mysteries, powerful documentaries and in-depth investigations. Follow now to get the latest episodes of Dateline NBC completely free, or subscribe to Dateline Premium for ad-free listening and exclusive bonus content: DatelinePremium.com