January 5, 2022 • 36 mins
Host Andrea Kremer takes us back to 2000 when NFL Films Steve Sabol interviewed Hall of Fame QB Dan Marino. Dan talks about growing up in Pittsburgh and how he learned to throw a football by aiming at passing buses. Dan talks about being a pure passer but how that doesn't mean that he couldn't run at all. As the years passed, Dan explains how injuries affected him and how he changed as a player. Steve asks Dan about his defining moment as a player and the games that the quarterback not only remembers, but would like to erase from the archives. Dan also reveals the ONE question that he never wants to hear again and the only time he cried after a game.
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Episode Transcript
Available transcripts are automatically generated. Complete accuracy is not guaranteed.
Speaker 1 (00:05):
Welcome to another episode of NFL Films Tales from the Vault.
I'm your host, Andrea Kramer. When I started my career
as a producer at NFL Films, my boss and mentor
was Steve Sable, the heart and soul of NFL Films.
Steve wasn't just a creative genius, he was a brilliant conversationalist,
(00:27):
and this podcast showcases some of the greatest interviews Steve
ever did, none of which have ever been heard before
in their entirety. The coolest part about this show is
that it's like a time copsule, and I get to
guide you back in time. Today, we head to the
Vault for Steve's interview with Dan Marino from two thousands.
(00:55):
Ye Dan, Marie, you know, has long been considered the
best quarterback never to win a Super Bowl, and the
stats bear that out, but you could argue, and many
people do, and Steve even mentions it in this interview
that he's the best pure passer of all time. Yes,
of course, Brady has all the rings and now all
(01:17):
of Dan's records. But when Marino came into the league
in that vaunted quarterback class of three, he took quarterbacking
to another level. In his second season, he threw forty
eight touchdown passes. The record at the time thirty six
held by y A. Tittle and George Blanda. I mean
he didn't just break records, he shattered them. So a
(01:40):
quick little personal ast side here. I've only played fantasy
football one time in my life. It was and my
partner was our NFL Films editor in chief Bob Ryan.
I drew the Ace of spades for the first pick
in the draft, and I took Dan Marino. That's the
year he threw for five thousand, eighty four yards and
(02:01):
forty eight touchdowns. So thanks Danny for letting me retire
as a fantasy football champion and providing a little extra
money around the holidays. Now back to Marino on the field.
He played seventeen seasons with the Dolphins, and in March
of two thousand, he retired with the most passing yards
and most touchdown passes of all time. In June of
(02:23):
that year, Steve Sable went to visit Marino in his
Miami home and yes, please be patient with the planes
and the birds and the wind. This is yes, another
outdoor interview. Just three months removed from his retirement announcement.
Marino and Steve talked about some of the finer points
of quarterbacking, some of Dan's favorite teammates like the Marx brothers,
(02:43):
Duper and Clayton, and of course Dan's childhood in the Burg,
the South Oakland neighborhood in Pittsburgh. And yes, as you'll hear,
he never lost that Iron City twang. But Steve always
liking to store the pod a little bit, gets this
interview off on an interest foot so to speak. I'm sorry, Dan,
(03:04):
so this will be one of the erratic interviews that
you've ever got because I'm not a professional in this.
I'm just I'm an interested fan. So it isn't it
won't follow any structure. So okay, all set. First question,
could you name three teammates past and present that you
(03:26):
could beat in a foot race? Oh? Yeah, Bernie Cosar,
that's for sure. I can beat Bernie. Not now, but
but past and president. That's that's the one guy comes
to mind. You have to be a great athlete to
play a quarterback, you do, really, you have to have
a great feet. Now you're you're saying, maybe I can't
beat someone in a foot race. But you know, as
(03:46):
far as quickness and making people missing a pocket and
moving and creating things on you, and you have you
have to do that, and to do that, you have
to be a good athlete. Bill Walsh want somebody were
doing an interview and we're talking about quarterbacks, and he said,
the most important thing of a quarterback is his footwork.
Why is that? Well, so you maintain your balance when
to make a good throw, to make people miss, and
(04:08):
stay with inside the pocket, within yourself so you can
make a good throw. For example, of Bruce Smith's coming
and I and I happened to get out of his way,
I can still get my my feet together, my body
together to make a throw. When my dad always told
me when I was younger to jump broke, And you
know I always jump broke when I was younger, and
did it all through the pros and it was something
I thought that helped me a lot. You know, as
(04:28):
far as having quick feet and be able to move
into pocket when you were little, did you have any
kind of practice that you would ever throw it anything
when you were I used to throw it everything just
whatever was moving. Uh. City bus that came by our
house in front of our house every twenty five minutes.
So would you just sit there a wait in the corner?
Throw at the bus? Would you throw a football? Football?
(04:49):
Did the guy ever stop and get out and yell
at you for that? Yeah? Sometimes? The first of all,
did you hit the bus? Yeah, I'm good enough to
hit the bus. The did that? I mean that? And
just we played a lot of games, pick up games
just right in the street, you know, and you'd have
to play in between the cars, and you know there's
a lot of news traffic. But I never had a
(05:09):
regiment where, you know, my dad would say you go
out through a hundred passes, through a through a tire,
or or take so many drops. I mean, I just
played the game. And you know, I think where I
grew up was pretty competitive too. There was a lot
of street games and and uh we with a snowball.
Yeah that was pretty good picture baseball to really. Yeah,
(05:30):
I thought you were a shortstopper. Well, I played shortstop
picture and I was drafted by the Kansas City Royals
my senior year high school to play. They projected me
to be a third baseman, but they had a guy
named George Brett, so I think it had been a
little tough. You know, when you came into the NFL,
was there one older player that that sort of took
you aside and said, damn, look, this is what you
(05:50):
gotta do about this, and you gotta do this, or
that was somebody that sort of was your mentor in
the beginning. Well, when I was drafted here, David Woodley
was the starting quarterback and Dont Rock was the backup.
And uh, I came to camp and Don wasn't in camp.
He usually held out of camp. So I got to
meet him aout halfway through camp, you know, and I
asked him, you know, if he can help me in
(06:11):
any way, I'd appreciate it. And I think at that point,
you know, he kind of took me on his wing
a little bit and helped me a lot. And he did.
You know, he was there for six years with me
as I you know, as we first started, and we're
still friends today. What did he teach you that? What?
What can you think one specific thing that he might
have looked at and said, Dan, you're doing this wrong.
This is what you gotta do. He didn't teach me
(06:32):
so much. How the physical part of the game when
I learned from him, was you know, how how you
learn the game mentally, how you work, how you watch films,
you know, taking notes and one thing he always that
he took notes. He made his own game plans. And
I think that all came from when Coachula he was
he was around when Greasy was there too, and they
used to call their own place so they didn't have
to make their own game plans up. And I think
(06:53):
that that kind of you know, helped me because I
looked at his studying techniques and how you know, he
worked during the week to get a get in a
picture in his mind of what he wanted to do
on the weekend. Do you consider yourself a student of
the game. Yeah, I worked, you know, I worked hard
at it. I mean, uh, you know, watching a lot
of films, extra films, and uh. I always used to
take notes and and and it was important to me.
(07:15):
Did you did you ever make up place in the huddle?
Call would come in and you say, look, we're not
doing this. There's no doubt. But I did a lot
with Coach Shuler. He would give me freedom to do that.
When I felt I felt good about something, I could,
you know, I could change the play in the huddle
or change with the line where I would tell duper Clayton.
I mean, for example, if you know we get a
certain coverage, you know, we get a certain coverage, I
(07:36):
want you to you know, we'll take a shot, we'll
go deep, and we'd use hand signals and sometimes they
just do it. So that's what you would be. It's
just something look would almost be like you're back on
the street. Plan Look, you go deep here you kind
of cross is after the way it would be in
the huddle what I would always do sometimes and how
to we had a strong side play where you have
flair control and a couple of you know, you know
progression strong side. Dooper's on the week side and we
(07:57):
get a certain coverage and he's got one on one,
you know, I'll just go to him. So it's just
like playing It's just like playing touch. So that was
but in the huddle it would just be, uh, it
would would be a lot of intacly know he would
look for a handsOn because he could see what the
coverage might be too. Towards the end of your career,
there's so many times in television that would be an
incomplete pass. Account would come to you and you just
(08:18):
reman out somebody. Did that ever concern you that, you know,
correcting a receiver I got in public that you might
be an embarrassing the guy or did that ever come back?
And actually it's kind of the other way around. If
it happened more when I was younger in my career.
Later in my career, the TV used to just come
right on my face and it would seem that I
was throwing it. You know, Yeah, upset it a wider.
(08:41):
So it was more upset a myself for the circumstances
or not getting to play in the play calling or
things like that. But I did you know, when were
younger in my career with Stuper and Clayton some of
the other guys, we would get in some shouting matches
at times. What would you argue about because they didn't
run the pattern of why I wanted them to, or
you know, they didn't make the adjustment according to the coverage. Uh,
(09:03):
you know there's a there's a story one time Duper,
I mean, he didn't die for a ball in the
end zone. He could have could have caught it for
a touchdown. There was a little out in front of them,
and I said, why didn't you die. He says, you're
making all the money, why didn't you hit me in
the chest? You know, and it just pissed him up,
and then we started had a little argument, and you
know it goes from there. Well, are what are ways
that a receiver can make a quarterback and look bad?
(09:23):
Let's see, Let's see an average fan is watching the
game on television and it's an incompletion and it might
be the receiver's fault. What are the things that receiver
could do to make a quarter Sometimes, you know, if
a receiver doesn't if he doesn't get the normal depth
that he needs to get in a in a pattern,
you know, if if you know it needs to be
eighteen yards and around in at twelve yards, it cuts
down the air you can throw into um you know,
(09:45):
going across the middle, if you lead him across the middle,
and sometimes you know they don't go in their full speed,
the defensive back jumps right in front of it. You know,
there are things coming out of their brakes. You know,
when you're running a you know, an out pattern or
a deep comeback. It's important, you know, for them to
come downhill out of their breaks. What do you think
your most underrated talent. Everybody talks about the well a
quick release and the greatest pastor, and is there something
(10:07):
that you're really proud of that you don't read a lot,
or that some something that an underrated skill that you have.
I went, well, there's there's a skill, and there's another
thing that I could talk to you about. I think
the underrated, underrated skill that that I always had as
people thought that I wasn't fast or quick. And I've
always been saying, we're still upset about the first question, Yes,
kissing me off. Well, you know, after an Achilles operation
(10:30):
is six knee operations, uh anle You know, it's it's
hard to beat anybody in a race now, but at
one time I actually could run a little bit. But uh,
I think my movement and my movement into pocket and
uh I've always thought that I was very good at
that and being able to create within a small space,
make people miss and still be able to get off
(10:52):
a good throw and make place. And that doesn't necessarily
mean like John Elway. John could make people missing and
run for fifteen yards, which I do that occasionally, not
very often, but I could do it and give myself
in a position to make a play throw in the football.
And I think a lot of times people didn't give
me a lot of credit for that, and you said
there's something else or the other thing. That was just
I was proud of. I think just the consistency factor
(11:14):
of of you know, I want to stretch there. One
time we played a games from row, you know, and
and uh, this past year Bret Farr broke that record.
But the record was a hundred and sixteen, but they
didn't count mine because two strike games. I don't know,
And that's you know, I know it's not a big deal.
You know, it's not a big deal. But but I've
always I was always proud of the fact that I
was consistent. My teammates could rely on me each week
(11:37):
to be there as a player. Deep sigh on the
audio quality, but hey, look, this plane gives me the
opportunity to jump in here. One of the beauties of
this podcast, the time capsule form, is that it allows
us to look at more current events with a different perspective.
So when I heard this upcoming exchange, it harkened back
to the Brew Haha O deflated footballs and why the feel,
(12:02):
weight and touch of a football is so personal and
important to each quarterback, So keep that in mind. As
we returned to Steve and Dan. This is sort of
a strange question. I just encourage to me, they see
pictures in baseball and they're rubbing up the wall. Is
there a field a football? At the certain games, you
could be warming up and you'd feel the ball, and
(12:22):
you could feel it, and you say, wait a second,
this this's got too much air in it, or it
doesn't how you can feel it. You know, you could
feel it when it's it's not right. But but to
pick a ball right out of the box the way
it's made, you can't. It's impossible to throw us slicked
if it's like a powder on there, so you do
have to beat it up and use it a little bit.
So what would you want to feel on a ball?
Feel really good? You know, I feel like you can
just throw it through a brick wall. That's that's the
(12:44):
important thing. When you grab the ball and you feel
like you can just really throw it, then it's good.
When you hear Dan Marinos say you feel like you
could throw it through a brick wall, he might not
have been exaggerating. There have been few, if any quarterbacks
to ever throw up us as hard as he did.
Kind of makes you feel sorry for all those city
busses he used to target. When we come back, Dan
(13:07):
and Steve talk about some of the best pass rushers
Marino ever faced and what it's like to get sacked
by them. Stay tuned, Welcome back to Tales from the Vault.
As legendary as Dan, Marino's fastball was perhaps even more extraordinary,
and I mean that in the truest sense of the
word was his quick release. He was an absolute nightmare
(13:30):
to try and sack. He's tied with Peyton Manning for
the lowest sack grate of any quarterback in NFL history.
As a point of reference, in Marino through six hundred
and six passes and was sacked six times, six times.
And as we told you earlier, we're not exactly talking
(13:51):
about Patrick Mahomes or Lamar Jackson in terms of mobility,
but there was one player who tormented Marino and sacked
him fifteen times in his rear more than any other player.
Who's the best pass rusher you ever played, um Bruce
Smith allout a doubt, and I played him so often.
I mean, he was just incredible, and especially in Buffalo
I mean with the crowd noise up there, and you
(14:12):
know on turf, he just it's like he turned it
up a notch and uh, he was just an incredible
pass rusher. Could you describe what that feels like when
you get hit. It's because you're you're different than a
running back receiver. You're standing still and you're getting getting
you know, you have your adrenalines going, so you don't
actually feel the impact until after you try to get up.
You know, if you're trying to get up, that's when
(14:32):
it's tough. And I was hit by Greg Lloyd one
time and and he just just nailed me real good,
you know, and the whole wind and everything went right
out of me. And I try to get up and
I couldn't and I wanted to say something to him.
I couldn't talk, And what do you want back then?
I don't think we could use it. But yeah, the impact,
(14:55):
yeah you feel it, but you don't, you know, you
don't until you try to get up and and I'll
get back in the huddle or get back on in
your feet. That's yeah, lose your your air. Well, now
what you said you wanted to say something? Greg, like
the most quarterbacks would get hit like I wouldn't want
to say anything to piss the guy off, but you
were gonna say something that was gonna Yeah, I guess
(15:16):
I don't know it. I probably, uh, you know, I
don't never talk a lot more in the game. But
you know, if I think a guy sometimes they takes
a shot at you more than he should, then he
should know it, you know. And it didn't happen very often.
And I'm not sure that it was illegal hit that
time too. It's just you know, it's just and the
and then in the heat of a game, it pisses
(15:37):
you off, well when you get hit that hard. Yeah,
but don't you expect that. I mean, yeah, you have
to expect that. It's part of the game. But do
you think the NFL should do more to protect quarterbacks.
I think they're doing a lot right now to protect
quarterbacks and are doing a good job of it. I mean,
it's it's gonna be besides not let them get hit
at all. I don't understand what else they can do.
(15:57):
But it isn't that part of the miss steak of
the position that that that you have to be tough,
you have to be able to stand in the in
the in the you know. I mean that's part of
you're actually doing it right now. But I think the
speed of the game is changing. Whereas guys are hitting
with their helmet and they're running four four and they're
coming after full speed, and they're they're twice as big
as you are, I mean, there can be some real
damage done, you know. So I think with the one step,
(16:21):
the step and a half rule, that's a good rule.
Uh and uh, you know, letting a guy throw the
ball away is a good rule to But other than that,
I don't think they can do much more. It's interesting
to hear Marino just say, and remember this was back
in two thousand, that he didn't understand what else the
league could do to protect quarterbacks. Well, fast forward to
two nine, when the roughing the pastor rule was expanded
(16:44):
to prohibit rushing defenders from hitting quarterbacks below the knee,
the so called Tom Brady rule that went into effect
after Bernard Pollard ended Brady's season with a torn a
c l or. Remember in two thousand seventeen, after Anthony
Are hit Aaron Rodgers and broke his collar bone, the
league adopted the Aaron Rodgers Rule, which prohibits defenders from
(17:07):
landing on a pastor with their entire body weight. Can
you imagine the numbers Marino would put up today with
those quarterback protections. But despite his iron man streak, Marino
did have a few significant injuries in his career. He
suffered a non contact achilles injury that ended his consecutive
game streak at a hundred and forty five. Over the
(17:30):
final six seasons of his career, Marino played all sixteen games,
in only three of them. As his body began to
break down, it became tougher and tougher to come back
as the same quarterback everyone expected him to be every
time of your career. Then when you doubted your your ability,
you're going into a game and you weren't. There are
(17:50):
times where I think they're related to injury. For me,
there's two times that I wasn't sure. I wasn'ta be
able to play at the level that I wanted to
play at. I returned from injury, and that was coming
back from my achilles. That was that was tough, and
I end up having a great year, you know, But
but you go through that whole off season and you're
not sure if you're ever gonna be able to be
(18:10):
like you were before and do the things that you
did before, and in this past year too, and you know,
I had the next problem and the nerve problem that
you know, coming back and I couldn't throw at all,
and then coming back from I canna be able to throw,
you know, as well as I did before. When you
saw films you yourself coming back from the from the Achilles,
and we could see in the films that you were
you were actually the limp helt. I mean, no, no,
(18:31):
I was for sure. My achilles actually didn't come back
the way you know, the doctors expected it to the
way I expected it too, and you know, in surgery
it got elongated and uh so it didn't take the
way it should. So still to this day, I cannot
do a toe raise on my right foot. So I
played six years without being able to go up on
(18:51):
my toe and that's when I that's when I made
the brace, and we kind of did some things and
worked a boot around to help support that and then
and helped me, you know, help me do some things
later on. Did that affect your throwing motion? No, no,
let me tell you it did. And that's why I
was saying that that was the toughest part is you know,
coming back from that injury and it and it affected it.
But your body has a way of adjusting somehow, you know.
(19:13):
And as time went on, you know, my body adjusted
to the fact that my achilles wasn't working the way
it needed to work. Talking about your body and the
longer you played, and you realize, why didn't you start
to realize that you were getting old? Well, was there
something that was happening the way, a certain pattern that
that you couldn't throw or I don't throwing the ball
(19:34):
had never been a problem. It's more it was more
physical physical with my legs, you know, moving, you know,
getting in sometimes getting a position I need to get
in and I couldn't. And that was the over the
last couple of years that happened. But it was more
like the arm was never popped and at times I
couldn't throw it. You know, later my correcting throat is
far down the field. Maybe it's it's sometimes you need
(19:55):
to throw it, but uh, I still throw the ball
sixty five yards down the field, and that's any far enough.
You think that's overrated that when you hear now saying, well,
a guy doesn't have the arm strength, right, you think
that's open? Overall you need arm strength. Distance is overrated.
Arm strength is important. You have to have to throw
with a velocity and accuracy or you've never gonna have
a chance. When people talk about you, they talk about
(20:17):
Dan Marino, and it's usually followed by the greatest pure
passer in the history of the sport now, Steve Young
says that the definition of a pure passer is someone
who can't run. Okay, do you have any any any retort?
Steve has been hitting the head too many times? Could you?
(20:41):
Would you go ahead? Yeah? I mean, well, I guess
the guy that can't run. Yeah, to a certain extent. Yeah,
that's the definition of it. And I can't run like Steve.
I can run well enough to get out of people's way.
Would you tolerate it when someone else spoke in the huddle? No? No, no,
(21:02):
what would happen up? So you know, late, uh, tell
him to shut up, be quieter, get out. I always
thought that, you know, when you got in the huddle
because at the time, the essence of time and you
needed to, you know, to communicate what you need to communicate.
There's crowd noise, everything, So you can't have that. And uh,
to be honest with there's not a lot of that happening.
You know, it does happen sometimes, and and if you
(21:24):
know you gotta control it, you have to. How did
you respond to to losing? I mean when you lost,
were you like, did you have insomnia? Did you did
you did you stop eating? Did you eat more? I mean,
how did that affect you? How do I said? Or
is that something you just shrug off? You said? Well?
How long I have won things? For sure? I mean
the sleep You know, I couldn't go to sleep because
I would sit up and think about everything that I
(21:46):
could have done in that game to help us win
that I maybe didn't do, or what I could have
did differently. So I'd come home and I, you know,
I sometimes I'll be up all night thinking about it.
So that that's one thing for sure. Um. And and
then a lot of times it would last almost into
the middle of the week, you know, you know, And
and then if you play the team again, you end
(22:07):
up thinking about it. You know, there would would happen
a month later. Um. If if we could go back
into the NFL Films Library and banish and totally destroy
one game, one play that will never will never show
again in your career. Is there one play or one
game that you personally would like to come up into
(22:30):
the archives and torch it and just say, get it
the hell out of I don't want ever want to
see it again. Well, there's one that maybe the last
game we played in Jacksonville. You know, I play off game.
It's like we didn't even have a chance. It was
you know, it was just it's like we didn't even
show up. But I didn't, you know, I didn't really
play a lot in that game. Trying to think what else? Um, anytime,
(22:52):
if you have something, you know, when I throw in
the reception and there's where I'm trying to make it tackle,
you need to get rid of that because shoot, there's
some ugly shots there because I remember some ugly situation.
Going back to that last game, did you was there
a point in that game? And actually, when you look
at last that's interesting you brought that up because you
(23:12):
look at a lot of great athletes. Ted Williams the
last time he hit a home run, the last at bat,
Michael Jordan's hit the winning basket in the NBA Championship,
and then when you think back at your last game,
what do you think of? Well, I just try to
think of the game before that, which is we played
in Seattle and and I took the team on. You know,
(23:34):
you are drive to win the game, you know, so
just trying to put that out of my mind because
you know, it just didn't happened. And uh, you know,
sometimes it's not as bad. If if it would have been,
it would have lost by three points, it might have
been a lot worse, you know. I mean we were
out of that game in the second quarter. When did
you decide to retire? I mean, did you ever think
damn that? You know, you were everybody here you're thinking,
(23:57):
we just we just didn't want to see you play
in another We didn't want to see like Joe Namath
as a ram Johnny Anditus is a Charger. That felt
that Oh yeah, that that endered my mind, And that
was that was a factor in my decision because of
the relationship here in the community. Seventeen years playing for
Dolphins and all the success I've had. H that was
(24:17):
a part of it. That was But I did, let
me tell you, you you know, you're a football player first,
and when someone's interested in you you know, your instincts are, hey,
let's go play. You know it's and I thought about
it seriously. Was there something that that that finally clicked
in and said, all right, this is head, I'm not
going to play anymore. Well, I kept thinking back to
like a couple of days after, you know, after we lost,
(24:38):
how it felt, you know, how it felt physically? Remember
it last year during the season, how I felt physically?
And you know, did I did? I want to go
through that all again? And and uh. And then after
a while, your body starts feeling better, and you know,
and some coaches are calling and you think you can
still do it, which I think I can. But but
(25:00):
then then you keep thinking. The health factor goes back
because last year when I hurt my neck and my
nerve and I couldn't throw the ball and then all
those things and my legs being swore, that all comes
into play and it affects, you know, what affects your thinking?
Do you want to keep playing? Why is it so
important to play in pain? I mean that that's one
of those credos that you hear in professional football. But
the guy while he played in pain, he played, So
(25:22):
why why is that so important? Because you don't have to.
But you probably wouldn't play very often if you didn't,
you know, I mean if so another it's a shame
that the people are realize that most players on the
field are in paint and some yeah, there's all You
always have to deal with something. There's always a bruise
and your ankles sore, or you know, you have a
(25:42):
cracked rib you have to play with, or your arm,
I mean your arms go. You go through all summer
camp and you and you play, you know, your practice
all year and your arm doesn't feel quite as good
as you wanted to. But you know, if everybody played
when era, you know, trying to play on a percent healthy,
you wouldn't You wouldn't be able to put everything on field.
It just just wouldn't happen. When you think of great quarterbacks,
(26:04):
you think of what they call defining moments. What do
you think is your defining moment? I think, well, my
second year, it's not particularly one game, but it's pretty defining.
That year we went to the Super Bowl and we
broke all the records and forty eight touchdowns, which is
an awful lot of touchdown paths. And if it's a
(26:24):
defining moment and probably just that season instead of just
one particular game. When when you sit down to do
an interview like this, is there one question that you
feel ship here? It comes? How many times am I
gonna have to answer the same guy damn question? And
you just know it's coming, and you just what questions
(26:45):
have you know? What's what's my relationship? Like with Jimmy Johnson?
I gotta ask that question for the last three years
so many times, even by our beat writers everybody, and
after a while, just I just don't want to deal
with it anymore, you know. So when they would ask
you that, what would you say? It's great? Which it was.
It was fine. It's it's any coach player relationship. It
(27:06):
was fine, you know, but they always were trying to
make something out of it, always trying to make something
out of it. Now, when you were uh Pitt, what
was you were a communications major? Right? Sure, you were right? Okay?
Now I heard a story by some reporter here that
said that when they first met you and they found
out you were communications major, and you met them and
(27:26):
and you said, you shook his hand, you said, Jesus,
it's really nice to meet you. I'm glad to meet
you know, your reporter, but you're not going to get
shipped from me. Okay, is that true? That might have
happened here? I don't remember that could have happen. Now,
why would you now you saying well, maybe it did it,
but you're saying that could have happened. Why would you
have said that? I mean, was that if you're a
communications major, you would have thought, yeah, well, there's two
(27:48):
ways of looking at it. I mean, as as as
a quarterback in college, sometimes you don't want to say
the wrong thing, so you just you know, you say
the company line, whatever it is. That's that's why. That's
why I think I would have said that at the time.
Do you think can you look back in your career
and think you ever did say the wrong thing? Whoever
time you're upset you said, something came out and you
figured out, oh yeah, there's there's times that's happened. I mean,
(28:10):
I can't think of anyone in particular. But you know,
it's hard. After you play a game and you just
leave everything on the field and then you get a
guy asking a question, it just doesn't really make sense.
You know. It's it's sometimes it's tough to you know,
deal with and you gotta you gotta find a way
to do that. We're talking about plays that in your
career that are rememberable. What about the play against the
(28:32):
Jets when you you know, it was towards the end
and your motion like you're gonna, you know, throw go
through this that described that was that something you would practice?
Was that a spontaneous decision or first of all came
we had to come back from like twenty eight down
and we didn't, and uh, we're losing by twenty eight
at halftime and we end up throwing four touchdowns all
(28:53):
to mark Ingram in the second half to win the game.
But we had practiced that in practice. And as burning
Kozars played from Cleveland, believe it on, he came over
and when we would run our two minute drills, he
made the suggestion, you know, to Coachula, we had to
put this play in and uh, we actually tried it
earlier in a year against Minnesota and luckily no one
had seen it on film. I guess it didn't work,
(29:14):
but it was just a perfect situation. We had a
you know, field goal to tie. It was second down.
You know, we had to stop the clock and and
it just seemed like the right time. We're on the
six yard line and uh, and so I just took
a shot at it. And what you do if it's
not there and then you just throw it out a bound?
Describe what you did again? So well, coming up play
a clock clock. You know we're gonna call time out.
(29:34):
Everybody's everybody just lining up real slow and the clock
play clock play. But so you were you were yelling
at you yell and clock play clock play as long
as I can. But mark Ingram knows over there that
he's gonna run a pattern. He's gonna run a quick
out or a quick fade, and uh, and he knows
that I'm kind of looking at him a little bit,
and everybody and just took the snap come back and
he takes off and surprisingly Aaron Glenn covered him, I mean,
(29:57):
which you know, no one else is. Everybody else was
just standing around and he covered him and he actually
I threw it behind him and he come back and
made a great play. So it just it just worked perfect.
It was the perfect situation. Did anybody from the Jets
come up after that happened and and say anything to
I think they were in shock all the players, solid players,
and all the seventy two thousand fans. It was just quiet.
(30:20):
Marino takes the snap from center, He's looking, my goodness.
Has any one play ever been so associated with one
player more than Marino and the clock play against the Jets. Well,
this wasn't the first or the last time Marino silenced
and saddened Jets fans. And when we come back, the
(30:42):
only time Marino cried after a game in his career.
Welcome back to Tails from the Vault. Several years ago,
I was talking with Marino about how a player knows
when it's time to hang up the cleats, and he
told me, when the word retire starts to enter your
mind while you're playing, it feels like it's the right time.
(31:04):
Marino told me he started to think about it after
the season. Was he going to do all the little
things that always made him so good? So when he
actually announced his retirement in March of two thousand, it
wasn't one of those teary goodbye speeches you often see
from one of the game's grades. Excuse me, Troy Aigman,
excuse me sorry, how to clear my throat there? Instead,
(31:27):
Marino simply said I'm gonna missing about it. My experience
interviewing Dan Marino was he was cocky and would not
shy away from letting you know how he felt, but
he wasn't going to show you how he felt. Do
you ever cry? Yeah? Yeah, h w um. I remember
(31:51):
after the a f C championship game we played in Miami,
uh and I think it was Buffalo beat Us and
uh and I really felt real good about our chances
that year. You know, and when you see it, you know,
slip away, it gets emotional. What what did you What
was in the locker room after the game? That one?
(32:13):
A little bit there you hold it back, you know,
but you know when I got home that night, just
just sitting by myself, you know, you didn't want you
said you didn't want to cry because you don't want
to else to see you, or it just as part
of it really so you would have felt up a
little bit, Yeah, a little bit. When you look back
on on football on the whole career, what do you
(32:34):
think the game taught you? I mean, what what what
could what did Dame? Did you learn about yourself from
playing football? But maybe you never would have learned about
yourself if you were never a player. Wow. Um, you
know when you have a passion for something that you
love doing, and I guess it's it's not to take
(32:54):
it for granted, you know, not not to take it
for granted because it's something that you love doing and
you work at it every day. And I think I
learned that in my life and all the good things
that you have that you enjoy doing in your family
and like football for example, because a lot of people
don't get that chance to do that. Don't take that
for granted. What is it about football that the PLC
(33:16):
that attracted you and that kept you in the game
playing with all the injuries. Yeah, you know what it is.
It's the It's just the fact that it's just one
game Sunday at one o'clock. It's not like baseball or
basketball or anything else where you're playing a number of games.
And it's so important and every play is so important,
and it's the preparation during the week and when you
(33:37):
when you you know, when you work on a play
and you think it's gonna work in practice, and then
when it happens in the game, it just happens perfect,
just like you thought it wouldn't. How you imagined it.
I mean, that's you know, that's what it's all about.
What are you gonna be doing one pm Sunday, September
three this year? Well, uh, I thought, maybe I'll call
(33:58):
Duper and Clayton see if they want to come over
some beers and will throw it around a little bit.
At Dan's Hall of Fame induction in two thousand five,
he did exactly that. After delivering his speech, he had
Mark Clayton run out for a past during the ceremony
and delivered a strike to his old teammate. Of course,
(34:20):
in the end, every quarterback wants one more thing. He
wants one more Sunday in front of his fans with
a football in his hand, with one last chance to
go deep. And I'm going deep, and Clayton turned around
and you go deep right there. Despite his magnificent career,
for me, Marino always remains a cautionary tale to all
(34:44):
young players. He went to the Super Bowl in his
second year, losing tots and never made it back again.
I always tell the guys who are going to the
Super Bowl for the first time, never take it for
granted that you're going back. Marino told me he always
wanted to know what it would feel like to walk
off the field saying you're a super Bowl champion. I
(35:05):
have one final word on Dan's retirement that you might
not know. You know how we told you he retired
in March of two thousand. Well, it turns out he
actually never filed his retirement papers with the NFL until
February of seventeen. That's when he signed a one day
contract so he could officially retire as a Miami Dolphin.
(35:26):
Marino said, the fact that I've been a free agent
for sixteen years and no one's called is kind of
upsetting to me. And no doubt Marino can still sling
it even to this day. Next week, we bring you
part one of a truly remarkable interview by Steve In
with Hall of Fame running back Jim Brown. I hope
(35:48):
you'll join us, Thanks for listening. I'm Adrea Kramer.
Welcome to another episode of NFL Films Tales from the Vault.
I'm your host, Andrea Kramer. When I started my career
as a producer at NFL Films, my boss and mentor
was Steve Sable, the heart and soul of NFL Films.
Steve wasn't just a creative genius, he was a brilliant conversationalist,
(00:27):
and this podcast showcases some of the greatest interviews Steve
ever did, none of which have ever been heard before
in their entirety. The coolest part about this show is
that it's like a time copsule, and I get to
guide you back in time. Today, we head to the
Vault for Steve's interview with Dan Marino from two thousands.
(00:55):
Ye Dan, Marie, you know, has long been considered the
best quarterback never to win a Super Bowl, and the
stats bear that out, but you could argue, and many
people do, and Steve even mentions it in this interview
that he's the best pure passer of all time. Yes,
of course, Brady has all the rings and now all
(01:17):
of Dan's records. But when Marino came into the league
in that vaunted quarterback class of three, he took quarterbacking
to another level. In his second season, he threw forty
eight touchdown passes. The record at the time thirty six
held by y A. Tittle and George Blanda. I mean
he didn't just break records, he shattered them. So a
(01:40):
quick little personal ast side here. I've only played fantasy
football one time in my life. It was and my
partner was our NFL Films editor in chief Bob Ryan.
I drew the Ace of spades for the first pick
in the draft, and I took Dan Marino. That's the
year he threw for five thousand, eighty four yards and
(02:01):
forty eight touchdowns. So thanks Danny for letting me retire
as a fantasy football champion and providing a little extra
money around the holidays. Now back to Marino on the field.
He played seventeen seasons with the Dolphins, and in March
of two thousand, he retired with the most passing yards
and most touchdown passes of all time. In June of
(02:23):
that year, Steve Sable went to visit Marino in his
Miami home and yes, please be patient with the planes
and the birds and the wind. This is yes, another
outdoor interview. Just three months removed from his retirement announcement.
Marino and Steve talked about some of the finer points
of quarterbacking, some of Dan's favorite teammates like the Marx brothers,
(02:43):
Duper and Clayton, and of course Dan's childhood in the Burg,
the South Oakland neighborhood in Pittsburgh. And yes, as you'll hear,
he never lost that Iron City twang. But Steve always
liking to store the pod a little bit, gets this
interview off on an interest foot so to speak. I'm sorry, Dan,
(03:04):
so this will be one of the erratic interviews that
you've ever got because I'm not a professional in this.
I'm just I'm an interested fan. So it isn't it
won't follow any structure. So okay, all set. First question,
could you name three teammates past and present that you
(03:26):
could beat in a foot race? Oh? Yeah, Bernie Cosar,
that's for sure. I can beat Bernie. Not now, but
but past and president. That's that's the one guy comes
to mind. You have to be a great athlete to
play a quarterback, you do, really, you have to have
a great feet. Now you're you're saying, maybe I can't
beat someone in a foot race. But you know, as
(03:46):
far as quickness and making people missing a pocket and
moving and creating things on you, and you have you
have to do that, and to do that, you have
to be a good athlete. Bill Walsh want somebody were
doing an interview and we're talking about quarterbacks, and he said,
the most important thing of a quarterback is his footwork.
Why is that? Well, so you maintain your balance when
to make a good throw, to make people miss, and
(04:08):
stay with inside the pocket, within yourself so you can
make a good throw. For example, of Bruce Smith's coming
and I and I happened to get out of his way,
I can still get my my feet together, my body
together to make a throw. When my dad always told
me when I was younger to jump broke, And you
know I always jump broke when I was younger, and
did it all through the pros and it was something
I thought that helped me a lot. You know, as
(04:28):
far as having quick feet and be able to move
into pocket when you were little, did you have any
kind of practice that you would ever throw it anything
when you were I used to throw it everything just
whatever was moving. Uh. City bus that came by our
house in front of our house every twenty five minutes.
So would you just sit there a wait in the corner?
Throw at the bus? Would you throw a football? Football?
(04:49):
Did the guy ever stop and get out and yell
at you for that? Yeah? Sometimes? The first of all,
did you hit the bus? Yeah, I'm good enough to
hit the bus. The did that? I mean that? And
just we played a lot of games, pick up games
just right in the street, you know, and you'd have
to play in between the cars, and you know there's
a lot of news traffic. But I never had a
(05:09):
regiment where, you know, my dad would say you go
out through a hundred passes, through a through a tire,
or or take so many drops. I mean, I just
played the game. And you know, I think where I
grew up was pretty competitive too. There was a lot
of street games and and uh we with a snowball.
Yeah that was pretty good picture baseball to really. Yeah,
(05:30):
I thought you were a shortstopper. Well, I played shortstop
picture and I was drafted by the Kansas City Royals
my senior year high school to play. They projected me
to be a third baseman, but they had a guy
named George Brett, so I think it had been a
little tough. You know, when you came into the NFL,
was there one older player that that sort of took
you aside and said, damn, look, this is what you
(05:50):
gotta do about this, and you gotta do this, or
that was somebody that sort of was your mentor in
the beginning. Well, when I was drafted here, David Woodley
was the starting quarterback and Dont Rock was the backup.
And uh, I came to camp and Don wasn't in camp.
He usually held out of camp. So I got to
meet him aout halfway through camp, you know, and I
asked him, you know, if he can help me in
(06:11):
any way, I'd appreciate it. And I think at that point,
you know, he kind of took me on his wing
a little bit and helped me a lot. And he did.
You know, he was there for six years with me
as I you know, as we first started, and we're
still friends today. What did he teach you that? What?
What can you think one specific thing that he might
have looked at and said, Dan, you're doing this wrong.
This is what you gotta do. He didn't teach me
(06:32):
so much. How the physical part of the game when
I learned from him, was you know, how how you
learn the game mentally, how you work, how you watch films,
you know, taking notes and one thing he always that
he took notes. He made his own game plans. And
I think that all came from when Coachula he was
he was around when Greasy was there too, and they
used to call their own place so they didn't have
to make their own game plans up. And I think
(06:53):
that that kind of you know, helped me because I
looked at his studying techniques and how you know, he
worked during the week to get a get in a
picture in his mind of what he wanted to do
on the weekend. Do you consider yourself a student of
the game. Yeah, I worked, you know, I worked hard
at it. I mean, uh, you know, watching a lot
of films, extra films, and uh. I always used to
take notes and and and it was important to me.
(07:15):
Did you did you ever make up place in the huddle?
Call would come in and you say, look, we're not
doing this. There's no doubt. But I did a lot
with Coach Shuler. He would give me freedom to do that.
When I felt I felt good about something, I could,
you know, I could change the play in the huddle
or change with the line where I would tell duper Clayton.
I mean, for example, if you know we get a
certain coverage, you know, we get a certain coverage, I
(07:36):
want you to you know, we'll take a shot, we'll
go deep, and we'd use hand signals and sometimes they
just do it. So that's what you would be. It's
just something look would almost be like you're back on
the street. Plan Look, you go deep here you kind
of cross is after the way it would be in
the huddle what I would always do sometimes and how
to we had a strong side play where you have
flair control and a couple of you know, you know
progression strong side. Dooper's on the week side and we
(07:57):
get a certain coverage and he's got one on one,
you know, I'll just go to him. So it's just
like playing It's just like playing touch. So that was
but in the huddle it would just be, uh, it
would would be a lot of intacly know he would
look for a handsOn because he could see what the
coverage might be too. Towards the end of your career,
there's so many times in television that would be an
incomplete pass. Account would come to you and you just
(08:18):
reman out somebody. Did that ever concern you that, you know,
correcting a receiver I got in public that you might
be an embarrassing the guy or did that ever come back?
And actually it's kind of the other way around. If
it happened more when I was younger in my career.
Later in my career, the TV used to just come
right on my face and it would seem that I
was throwing it. You know, Yeah, upset it a wider.
(08:41):
So it was more upset a myself for the circumstances
or not getting to play in the play calling or
things like that. But I did you know, when were
younger in my career with Stuper and Clayton some of
the other guys, we would get in some shouting matches
at times. What would you argue about because they didn't
run the pattern of why I wanted them to, or
you know, they didn't make the adjustment according to the coverage. Uh,
(09:03):
you know there's a there's a story one time Duper,
I mean, he didn't die for a ball in the
end zone. He could have could have caught it for
a touchdown. There was a little out in front of them,
and I said, why didn't you die. He says, you're
making all the money, why didn't you hit me in
the chest? You know, and it just pissed him up,
and then we started had a little argument, and you
know it goes from there. Well, are what are ways
that a receiver can make a quarterback and look bad?
(09:23):
Let's see, Let's see an average fan is watching the
game on television and it's an incompletion and it might
be the receiver's fault. What are the things that receiver
could do to make a quarter Sometimes, you know, if
a receiver doesn't if he doesn't get the normal depth
that he needs to get in a in a pattern,
you know, if if you know it needs to be
eighteen yards and around in at twelve yards, it cuts
down the air you can throw into um you know,
(09:45):
going across the middle, if you lead him across the middle,
and sometimes you know they don't go in their full speed,
the defensive back jumps right in front of it. You know,
there are things coming out of their brakes. You know,
when you're running a you know, an out pattern or
a deep comeback. It's important, you know, for them to
come downhill out of their breaks. What do you think
your most underrated talent. Everybody talks about the well a
quick release and the greatest pastor, and is there something
(10:07):
that you're really proud of that you don't read a lot,
or that some something that an underrated skill that you have.
I went, well, there's there's a skill, and there's another
thing that I could talk to you about. I think
the underrated, underrated skill that that I always had as
people thought that I wasn't fast or quick. And I've
always been saying, we're still upset about the first question, Yes,
kissing me off. Well, you know, after an Achilles operation
(10:30):
is six knee operations, uh anle You know, it's it's
hard to beat anybody in a race now, but at
one time I actually could run a little bit. But uh,
I think my movement and my movement into pocket and
uh I've always thought that I was very good at
that and being able to create within a small space,
make people miss and still be able to get off
(10:52):
a good throw and make place. And that doesn't necessarily
mean like John Elway. John could make people missing and
run for fifteen yards, which I do that occasionally, not
very often, but I could do it and give myself
in a position to make a play throw in the football.
And I think a lot of times people didn't give
me a lot of credit for that, and you said
there's something else or the other thing. That was just
I was proud of. I think just the consistency factor
(11:14):
of of you know, I want to stretch there. One
time we played a games from row, you know, and
and uh, this past year Bret Farr broke that record.
But the record was a hundred and sixteen, but they
didn't count mine because two strike games. I don't know,
And that's you know, I know it's not a big deal.
You know, it's not a big deal. But but I've
always I was always proud of the fact that I
was consistent. My teammates could rely on me each week
(11:37):
to be there as a player. Deep sigh on the
audio quality, but hey, look, this plane gives me the
opportunity to jump in here. One of the beauties of
this podcast, the time capsule form, is that it allows
us to look at more current events with a different perspective.
So when I heard this upcoming exchange, it harkened back
to the Brew Haha O deflated footballs and why the feel,
(12:02):
weight and touch of a football is so personal and
important to each quarterback, So keep that in mind. As
we returned to Steve and Dan. This is sort of
a strange question. I just encourage to me, they see
pictures in baseball and they're rubbing up the wall. Is
there a field a football? At the certain games, you
could be warming up and you'd feel the ball, and
(12:22):
you could feel it, and you say, wait a second,
this this's got too much air in it, or it
doesn't how you can feel it. You know, you could
feel it when it's it's not right. But but to
pick a ball right out of the box the way
it's made, you can't. It's impossible to throw us slicked
if it's like a powder on there, so you do
have to beat it up and use it a little bit.
So what would you want to feel on a ball?
Feel really good? You know, I feel like you can
just throw it through a brick wall. That's that's the
(12:44):
important thing. When you grab the ball and you feel
like you can just really throw it, then it's good.
When you hear Dan Marinos say you feel like you
could throw it through a brick wall, he might not
have been exaggerating. There have been few, if any quarterbacks
to ever throw up us as hard as he did.
Kind of makes you feel sorry for all those city
busses he used to target. When we come back, Dan
(13:07):
and Steve talk about some of the best pass rushers
Marino ever faced and what it's like to get sacked
by them. Stay tuned, Welcome back to Tales from the Vault.
As legendary as Dan, Marino's fastball was perhaps even more extraordinary,
and I mean that in the truest sense of the
word was his quick release. He was an absolute nightmare
(13:30):
to try and sack. He's tied with Peyton Manning for
the lowest sack grate of any quarterback in NFL history.
As a point of reference, in Marino through six hundred
and six passes and was sacked six times, six times.
And as we told you earlier, we're not exactly talking
(13:51):
about Patrick Mahomes or Lamar Jackson in terms of mobility,
but there was one player who tormented Marino and sacked
him fifteen times in his rear more than any other player.
Who's the best pass rusher you ever played, um Bruce
Smith allout a doubt, and I played him so often.
I mean, he was just incredible, and especially in Buffalo
I mean with the crowd noise up there, and you
(14:12):
know on turf, he just it's like he turned it
up a notch and uh, he was just an incredible
pass rusher. Could you describe what that feels like when
you get hit. It's because you're you're different than a
running back receiver. You're standing still and you're getting getting
you know, you have your adrenalines going, so you don't
actually feel the impact until after you try to get up.
You know, if you're trying to get up, that's when
(14:32):
it's tough. And I was hit by Greg Lloyd one
time and and he just just nailed me real good,
you know, and the whole wind and everything went right
out of me. And I try to get up and
I couldn't and I wanted to say something to him.
I couldn't talk, And what do you want back then?
I don't think we could use it. But yeah, the impact,
(14:55):
yeah you feel it, but you don't, you know, you
don't until you try to get up and and I'll
get back in the huddle or get back on in
your feet. That's yeah, lose your your air. Well, now
what you said you wanted to say something? Greg, like
the most quarterbacks would get hit like I wouldn't want
to say anything to piss the guy off, but you
were gonna say something that was gonna Yeah, I guess
(15:16):
I don't know it. I probably, uh, you know, I
don't never talk a lot more in the game. But
you know, if I think a guy sometimes they takes
a shot at you more than he should, then he
should know it, you know. And it didn't happen very often.
And I'm not sure that it was illegal hit that
time too. It's just you know, it's just and the
and then in the heat of a game, it pisses
(15:37):
you off, well when you get hit that hard. Yeah,
but don't you expect that. I mean, yeah, you have
to expect that. It's part of the game. But do
you think the NFL should do more to protect quarterbacks.
I think they're doing a lot right now to protect
quarterbacks and are doing a good job of it. I mean,
it's it's gonna be besides not let them get hit
at all. I don't understand what else they can do.
(15:57):
But it isn't that part of the miss steak of
the position that that that you have to be tough,
you have to be able to stand in the in
the in the you know. I mean that's part of
you're actually doing it right now. But I think the
speed of the game is changing. Whereas guys are hitting
with their helmet and they're running four four and they're
coming after full speed, and they're they're twice as big
as you are, I mean, there can be some real
damage done, you know. So I think with the one step,
(16:21):
the step and a half rule, that's a good rule.
Uh and uh, you know, letting a guy throw the
ball away is a good rule to But other than that,
I don't think they can do much more. It's interesting
to hear Marino just say, and remember this was back
in two thousand, that he didn't understand what else the
league could do to protect quarterbacks. Well, fast forward to
two nine, when the roughing the pastor rule was expanded
(16:44):
to prohibit rushing defenders from hitting quarterbacks below the knee,
the so called Tom Brady rule that went into effect
after Bernard Pollard ended Brady's season with a torn a
c l or. Remember in two thousand seventeen, after Anthony
Are hit Aaron Rodgers and broke his collar bone, the
league adopted the Aaron Rodgers Rule, which prohibits defenders from
(17:07):
landing on a pastor with their entire body weight. Can
you imagine the numbers Marino would put up today with
those quarterback protections. But despite his iron man streak, Marino
did have a few significant injuries in his career. He
suffered a non contact achilles injury that ended his consecutive
game streak at a hundred and forty five. Over the
(17:30):
final six seasons of his career, Marino played all sixteen games,
in only three of them. As his body began to
break down, it became tougher and tougher to come back
as the same quarterback everyone expected him to be every
time of your career. Then when you doubted your your ability,
you're going into a game and you weren't. There are
(17:50):
times where I think they're related to injury. For me,
there's two times that I wasn't sure. I wasn'ta be
able to play at the level that I wanted to
play at. I returned from injury, and that was coming
back from my achilles. That was that was tough, and
I end up having a great year, you know, But
but you go through that whole off season and you're
not sure if you're ever gonna be able to be
(18:10):
like you were before and do the things that you
did before, and in this past year too, and you know,
I had the next problem and the nerve problem that
you know, coming back and I couldn't throw at all,
and then coming back from I canna be able to throw,
you know, as well as I did before. When you
saw films you yourself coming back from the from the Achilles,
and we could see in the films that you were
you were actually the limp helt. I mean, no, no,
(18:31):
I was for sure. My achilles actually didn't come back
the way you know, the doctors expected it to the
way I expected it too, and you know, in surgery
it got elongated and uh so it didn't take the
way it should. So still to this day, I cannot
do a toe raise on my right foot. So I
played six years without being able to go up on
(18:51):
my toe and that's when I that's when I made
the brace, and we kind of did some things and
worked a boot around to help support that and then
and helped me, you know, help me do some things
later on. Did that affect your throwing motion? No, no,
let me tell you it did. And that's why I
was saying that that was the toughest part is you know,
coming back from that injury and it and it affected it.
But your body has a way of adjusting somehow, you know.
(19:13):
And as time went on, you know, my body adjusted
to the fact that my achilles wasn't working the way
it needed to work. Talking about your body and the
longer you played, and you realize, why didn't you start
to realize that you were getting old? Well, was there
something that was happening the way, a certain pattern that
that you couldn't throw or I don't throwing the ball
(19:34):
had never been a problem. It's more it was more
physical physical with my legs, you know, moving, you know,
getting in sometimes getting a position I need to get
in and I couldn't. And that was the over the
last couple of years that happened. But it was more
like the arm was never popped and at times I
couldn't throw it. You know, later my correcting throat is
far down the field. Maybe it's it's sometimes you need
(19:55):
to throw it, but uh, I still throw the ball
sixty five yards down the field, and that's any far enough.
You think that's overrated that when you hear now saying, well,
a guy doesn't have the arm strength, right, you think
that's open? Overall you need arm strength. Distance is overrated.
Arm strength is important. You have to have to throw
with a velocity and accuracy or you've never gonna have
a chance. When people talk about you, they talk about
(20:17):
Dan Marino, and it's usually followed by the greatest pure
passer in the history of the sport now, Steve Young
says that the definition of a pure passer is someone
who can't run. Okay, do you have any any any retort?
Steve has been hitting the head too many times? Could you?
(20:41):
Would you go ahead? Yeah? I mean, well, I guess
the guy that can't run. Yeah, to a certain extent. Yeah,
that's the definition of it. And I can't run like Steve.
I can run well enough to get out of people's way.
Would you tolerate it when someone else spoke in the huddle? No? No, no,
(21:02):
what would happen up? So you know, late, uh, tell
him to shut up, be quieter, get out. I always
thought that, you know, when you got in the huddle
because at the time, the essence of time and you
needed to, you know, to communicate what you need to communicate.
There's crowd noise, everything, So you can't have that. And uh,
to be honest with there's not a lot of that happening.
You know, it does happen sometimes, and and if you
(21:24):
know you gotta control it, you have to. How did
you respond to to losing? I mean when you lost,
were you like, did you have insomnia? Did you did
you did you stop eating? Did you eat more? I mean,
how did that affect you? How do I said? Or
is that something you just shrug off? You said? Well?
How long I have won things? For sure? I mean
the sleep You know, I couldn't go to sleep because
I would sit up and think about everything that I
(21:46):
could have done in that game to help us win
that I maybe didn't do, or what I could have
did differently. So I'd come home and I, you know,
I sometimes I'll be up all night thinking about it.
So that that's one thing for sure. Um. And and
then a lot of times it would last almost into
the middle of the week, you know, you know, And
and then if you play the team again, you end
(22:07):
up thinking about it. You know, there would would happen
a month later. Um. If if we could go back
into the NFL Films Library and banish and totally destroy
one game, one play that will never will never show
again in your career. Is there one play or one
game that you personally would like to come up into
(22:30):
the archives and torch it and just say, get it
the hell out of I don't want ever want to
see it again. Well, there's one that maybe the last
game we played in Jacksonville. You know, I play off game.
It's like we didn't even have a chance. It was
you know, it was just it's like we didn't even
show up. But I didn't, you know, I didn't really
play a lot in that game. Trying to think what else? Um, anytime,
(22:52):
if you have something, you know, when I throw in
the reception and there's where I'm trying to make it tackle,
you need to get rid of that because shoot, there's
some ugly shots there because I remember some ugly situation.
Going back to that last game, did you was there
a point in that game? And actually, when you look
at last that's interesting you brought that up because you
(23:12):
look at a lot of great athletes. Ted Williams the
last time he hit a home run, the last at bat,
Michael Jordan's hit the winning basket in the NBA Championship,
and then when you think back at your last game,
what do you think of? Well, I just try to
think of the game before that, which is we played
in Seattle and and I took the team on. You know,
(23:34):
you are drive to win the game, you know, so
just trying to put that out of my mind because
you know, it just didn't happened. And uh, you know,
sometimes it's not as bad. If if it would have been,
it would have lost by three points, it might have
been a lot worse, you know. I mean we were
out of that game in the second quarter. When did
you decide to retire? I mean, did you ever think
damn that? You know, you were everybody here you're thinking,
(23:57):
we just we just didn't want to see you play
in another We didn't want to see like Joe Namath
as a ram Johnny Anditus is a Charger. That felt
that Oh yeah, that that endered my mind, And that
was that was a factor in my decision because of
the relationship here in the community. Seventeen years playing for
Dolphins and all the success I've had. H that was
(24:17):
a part of it. That was But I did, let
me tell you, you you know, you're a football player first,
and when someone's interested in you you know, your instincts are, hey,
let's go play. You know it's and I thought about
it seriously. Was there something that that that finally clicked
in and said, all right, this is head, I'm not
going to play anymore. Well, I kept thinking back to
like a couple of days after, you know, after we lost,
(24:38):
how it felt, you know, how it felt physically? Remember
it last year during the season, how I felt physically?
And you know, did I did? I want to go
through that all again? And and uh. And then after
a while, your body starts feeling better, and you know,
and some coaches are calling and you think you can
still do it, which I think I can. But but
(25:00):
then then you keep thinking. The health factor goes back
because last year when I hurt my neck and my
nerve and I couldn't throw the ball and then all
those things and my legs being swore, that all comes
into play and it affects, you know, what affects your thinking?
Do you want to keep playing? Why is it so
important to play in pain? I mean that that's one
of those credos that you hear in professional football. But
the guy while he played in pain, he played, So
(25:22):
why why is that so important? Because you don't have to.
But you probably wouldn't play very often if you didn't,
you know, I mean if so another it's a shame
that the people are realize that most players on the
field are in paint and some yeah, there's all You
always have to deal with something. There's always a bruise
and your ankles sore, or you know, you have a
(25:42):
cracked rib you have to play with, or your arm,
I mean your arms go. You go through all summer
camp and you and you play, you know, your practice
all year and your arm doesn't feel quite as good
as you wanted to. But you know, if everybody played
when era, you know, trying to play on a percent healthy,
you wouldn't You wouldn't be able to put everything on field.
It just just wouldn't happen. When you think of great quarterbacks,
(26:04):
you think of what they call defining moments. What do
you think is your defining moment? I think, well, my
second year, it's not particularly one game, but it's pretty defining.
That year we went to the Super Bowl and we
broke all the records and forty eight touchdowns, which is
an awful lot of touchdown paths. And if it's a
(26:24):
defining moment and probably just that season instead of just
one particular game. When when you sit down to do
an interview like this, is there one question that you
feel ship here? It comes? How many times am I
gonna have to answer the same guy damn question? And
you just know it's coming, and you just what questions
(26:45):
have you know? What's what's my relationship? Like with Jimmy Johnson?
I gotta ask that question for the last three years
so many times, even by our beat writers everybody, and
after a while, just I just don't want to deal
with it anymore, you know. So when they would ask
you that, what would you say? It's great? Which it was.
It was fine. It's it's any coach player relationship. It
(27:06):
was fine, you know, but they always were trying to
make something out of it, always trying to make something
out of it. Now, when you were uh Pitt, what
was you were a communications major? Right? Sure, you were right? Okay?
Now I heard a story by some reporter here that
said that when they first met you and they found
out you were communications major, and you met them and
(27:26):
and you said, you shook his hand, you said, Jesus,
it's really nice to meet you. I'm glad to meet
you know, your reporter, but you're not going to get
shipped from me. Okay, is that true? That might have
happened here? I don't remember that could have happen. Now,
why would you now you saying well, maybe it did it,
but you're saying that could have happened. Why would you
have said that? I mean, was that if you're a
communications major, you would have thought, yeah, well, there's two
(27:48):
ways of looking at it. I mean, as as as
a quarterback in college, sometimes you don't want to say
the wrong thing, so you just you know, you say
the company line, whatever it is. That's that's why. That's
why I think I would have said that at the time.
Do you think can you look back in your career
and think you ever did say the wrong thing? Whoever
time you're upset you said, something came out and you
figured out, oh yeah, there's there's times that's happened. I mean,
(28:10):
I can't think of anyone in particular. But you know,
it's hard. After you play a game and you just
leave everything on the field and then you get a
guy asking a question, it just doesn't really make sense.
You know. It's it's sometimes it's tough to you know,
deal with and you gotta you gotta find a way
to do that. We're talking about plays that in your
career that are rememberable. What about the play against the
(28:32):
Jets when you you know, it was towards the end
and your motion like you're gonna, you know, throw go
through this that described that was that something you would practice?
Was that a spontaneous decision or first of all came
we had to come back from like twenty eight down
and we didn't, and uh, we're losing by twenty eight
at halftime and we end up throwing four touchdowns all
(28:53):
to mark Ingram in the second half to win the game.
But we had practiced that in practice. And as burning
Kozars played from Cleveland, believe it on, he came over
and when we would run our two minute drills, he
made the suggestion, you know, to Coachula, we had to
put this play in and uh, we actually tried it
earlier in a year against Minnesota and luckily no one
had seen it on film. I guess it didn't work,
(29:14):
but it was just a perfect situation. We had a
you know, field goal to tie. It was second down.
You know, we had to stop the clock and and
it just seemed like the right time. We're on the
six yard line and uh, and so I just took
a shot at it. And what you do if it's
not there and then you just throw it out a bound?
Describe what you did again? So well, coming up play
a clock clock. You know we're gonna call time out.
(29:34):
Everybody's everybody just lining up real slow and the clock
play clock play. But so you were you were yelling
at you yell and clock play clock play as long
as I can. But mark Ingram knows over there that
he's gonna run a pattern. He's gonna run a quick
out or a quick fade, and uh, and he knows
that I'm kind of looking at him a little bit,
and everybody and just took the snap come back and
he takes off and surprisingly Aaron Glenn covered him, I mean,
(29:57):
which you know, no one else is. Everybody else was
just standing around and he covered him and he actually
I threw it behind him and he come back and
made a great play. So it just it just worked perfect.
It was the perfect situation. Did anybody from the Jets
come up after that happened and and say anything to
I think they were in shock all the players, solid players,
and all the seventy two thousand fans. It was just quiet.
(30:20):
Marino takes the snap from center, He's looking, my goodness.
Has any one play ever been so associated with one
player more than Marino and the clock play against the Jets. Well,
this wasn't the first or the last time Marino silenced
and saddened Jets fans. And when we come back, the
(30:42):
only time Marino cried after a game in his career.
Welcome back to Tails from the Vault. Several years ago,
I was talking with Marino about how a player knows
when it's time to hang up the cleats, and he
told me, when the word retire starts to enter your
mind while you're playing, it feels like it's the right time.
(31:04):
Marino told me he started to think about it after
the season. Was he going to do all the little
things that always made him so good? So when he
actually announced his retirement in March of two thousand, it
wasn't one of those teary goodbye speeches you often see
from one of the game's grades. Excuse me, Troy Aigman,
excuse me sorry, how to clear my throat there? Instead,
(31:27):
Marino simply said I'm gonna missing about it. My experience
interviewing Dan Marino was he was cocky and would not
shy away from letting you know how he felt, but
he wasn't going to show you how he felt. Do
you ever cry? Yeah? Yeah, h w um. I remember
(31:51):
after the a f C championship game we played in Miami,
uh and I think it was Buffalo beat Us and
uh and I really felt real good about our chances
that year. You know, and when you see it, you know,
slip away, it gets emotional. What what did you What
was in the locker room after the game? That one?
(32:13):
A little bit there you hold it back, you know,
but you know when I got home that night, just
just sitting by myself, you know, you didn't want you
said you didn't want to cry because you don't want
to else to see you, or it just as part
of it really so you would have felt up a
little bit, Yeah, a little bit. When you look back
on on football on the whole career, what do you
(32:34):
think the game taught you? I mean, what what what
could what did Dame? Did you learn about yourself from
playing football? But maybe you never would have learned about
yourself if you were never a player. Wow. Um, you
know when you have a passion for something that you
love doing, and I guess it's it's not to take
(32:54):
it for granted, you know, not not to take it
for granted because it's something that you love doing and
you work at it every day. And I think I
learned that in my life and all the good things
that you have that you enjoy doing in your family
and like football for example, because a lot of people
don't get that chance to do that. Don't take that
for granted. What is it about football that the PLC
(33:16):
that attracted you and that kept you in the game
playing with all the injuries. Yeah, you know what it is.
It's the It's just the fact that it's just one
game Sunday at one o'clock. It's not like baseball or
basketball or anything else where you're playing a number of games.
And it's so important and every play is so important,
and it's the preparation during the week and when you
(33:37):
when you you know, when you work on a play
and you think it's gonna work in practice, and then
when it happens in the game, it just happens perfect,
just like you thought it wouldn't. How you imagined it.
I mean, that's you know, that's what it's all about.
What are you gonna be doing one pm Sunday, September
three this year? Well, uh, I thought, maybe I'll call
(33:58):
Duper and Clayton see if they want to come over
some beers and will throw it around a little bit.
At Dan's Hall of Fame induction in two thousand five,
he did exactly that. After delivering his speech, he had
Mark Clayton run out for a past during the ceremony
and delivered a strike to his old teammate. Of course,
(34:20):
in the end, every quarterback wants one more thing. He
wants one more Sunday in front of his fans with
a football in his hand, with one last chance to
go deep. And I'm going deep, and Clayton turned around
and you go deep right there. Despite his magnificent career,
for me, Marino always remains a cautionary tale to all
(34:44):
young players. He went to the Super Bowl in his
second year, losing tots and never made it back again.
I always tell the guys who are going to the
Super Bowl for the first time, never take it for
granted that you're going back. Marino told me he always
wanted to know what it would feel like to walk
off the field saying you're a super Bowl champion. I
(35:05):
have one final word on Dan's retirement that you might
not know. You know how we told you he retired
in March of two thousand. Well, it turns out he
actually never filed his retirement papers with the NFL until
February of seventeen. That's when he signed a one day
contract so he could officially retire as a Miami Dolphin.
(35:26):
Marino said, the fact that I've been a free agent
for sixteen years and no one's called is kind of
upsetting to me. And no doubt Marino can still sling
it even to this day. Next week, we bring you
part one of a truly remarkable interview by Steve In
with Hall of Fame running back Jim Brown. I hope
(35:48):
you'll join us, Thanks for listening. I'm Adrea Kramer.
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