February 23, 2022 • 42 mins
Host Andrea Kremer takes us back to 1997 when NFL Films Steve Sabol interviewed Hall of Famer Bill Parcells. Bill discusses his decision at the time to leave the New England Patriots for the New York Jets. Steve explores Parcell's philosophy of having total control as a head coach and GM of a franchise and why there are only so many people that can handle the responsibility. Bill looks back to some of his fondest memories with the Giants and digs even deeper to when he coached against Steve Sabol's college team. Bill refutes tales of not wanting to draft certain players and counter's Steve quoting Winston Churchill with a Churchill quote of his own. Steve and Bill exchange some good natured ribbing at each other while we also learn that Parcell's real name....actually isn't Bill.
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Episode Transcript
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Speaker 1 (00:04):
Welcome to NFL Films Tales from the Vault. I'm your host,
Hall of Fame journalist Andrea Kramer. On this podcast, we
take you back in time as we journey into the
NFL Films Vault to find some of the greatest interviews
ever conducted by the legendary Steve Sable. In his five
decades as President of NFL Films, Steve interviewed hundreds of
(00:26):
players and coaches. Those conversations have never been heard in
their entirety until now, and I'm here to guide you
through them, providing context, insight, and the occasional anecdote of
my own. Today, we had to visit with one of
Steve's favorites, the inimitable Bill Parcels. The interviews we've been
(01:01):
bringing you typically fall into one of two categories, a
comprehensive career retrospective or simply a snapshot in time of
a player or coaches career. This interview is a little
bit of both. In June, Bill Parcels had just been
named head coach and general manager of the New York Jets.
Remember that the season before he took the Patriots to
(01:23):
the Super Bowl, and just a week after losing to
Green Bay, Parcels stunned the NFL by resigning from New England.
After some negotiations which amounted to four draft picks and
a three hundred thousand dollar charitable donation to the Patriots
by the Jets, Parcels was returning home to New Jersey,
and make no mistake, he is a Jersey guy through
(01:46):
and through. Now, Remember, in he was a decade removed
from the first of his two Super Bowl wins with
the Giants and was still nearly a decade away from retiring,
ultimately coaching three years with the Jets and then four
more with Dallas after that. In fact, I was on
the sidelines for what turned out to be his final
(02:09):
game as a head coach, ty wild card loss to Seattle,
when Tony Romo bobbled the hold on what could have
been the game winning field goal for Parcels. That bitter
defeat encapsulated something He's always told me that the losses
hurt more than the winds felt good. In fact, one
(02:29):
of the things I've relished most about talking with Parcels
to this day is that he speaks his mind, sharp
tongue and all. He's got a quick wit, and he's
never bereft of opinions. One of the things that's so
entertaining about this interview is the verbal jousting that will
hear between Steve and Bill. Now, before we begin, let
(02:50):
me set the scene for you. Pictures Steve and Bill
sitting outside Parcel's house in northern New Jersey pull in
the background on a beautiful and sunny June day. Oh
and I've already alluded you to be ready for some
playful banter between Steve and Bill, especially regarding Parcels treatment
of NFL films cameramen. He was notorious for chasing their
(03:13):
cameras away on the sidelines, especially cameras belonging to the
lead director of photography on this shoot, Hank mcgelwie. So
let's go to the vault for Steve Sable and Bill Parcels. Alright,
the last time that we were here, Bill, the last
time we were here, this whole the swimming pool, this
whole house, this was just a big hole in the ground.
(03:36):
You were just starting out with the Patriots. Now we're back,
got a beautiful home. The Patriots. You took him to
the Super Bowl, but you're starting all over again with
a new team. What happened. Well, you know it's uh,
sometimes opportunity comes along and um, you know you just
I wanted to come back home. This is my home,
(03:57):
this is where my family is. I would have left
the team in New England. I enjoyed it there. I
enjoyed those players. Um they accomplished something I think special, um,
particularly for them. And I like living in New England.
But this is my home and my families here and
(04:21):
in New York and this is New Jersey, so everybody knows.
But had it not been a New York franchise, I
wouldn't be going on. This just is the right place
for me. Now. Earlier we were kidding around but with
about our cameraman and you know, kidding around about you. Now, Uh,
that's what you call those guys. Yeah, these guys here,
(04:43):
you know, the guys that you treat with such respect
during the course of the season. You know all these
you know, all these guys here that you know that
hasn't changed. You still accord us the same respect court reality.
We love to come film now we'll be looking forward
to that. I that I give them this, commiserate with
their with their abraceive nous in interfering with my coaching operation. Now, now, Hank, Hank,
(05:09):
how many times coach Parcel has thrown you off the field?
At least a dozen times? Now do you remember doing that?
I don't remember any of them. But well, when we
when you let us in your locker room after you
want the super Bowl the Giants, you said something. The
rest of your life, the rest of your life, man,
(05:32):
nobody can ever tell you that you couldn't do it,
because you did. Now, first of all, who is they? Well,
you know, there's there's a there's a kind of cynicism
that sometimes um raises its head in sports. I think
it's born of a little bit of jealousy on the
(05:58):
part of of of people against success. I think it
builds up eventually teams that have been successful over a
period of years. The forty Niners, they're successive. You see
it in basketball, the Chicago Bulls. I want somebody else
to win. And you know, women is a very precious thing.
(06:19):
And to be called the champion, you know, it's why
we do these things. It's why I do it. I
think it's why a lot of players play is to
see if you can achieve on the highest level and
to be called one one day is a very special thing. Now,
I'm not naive enough to to to think that it
represents anything substantial in the spectrum of things in this world,
(06:44):
but in this particular industry, the National Football League, it
does mark the pinnacle and for a short time, those
that get to enjoy that, I think deserve a measure
of credit. It is a precious thing, and it's something
that you keep with you forever and they can't take
it away. Well, if we were going to go back
(07:07):
to our film library and we have we've covered you
from from when you started and and every game, and
we were gonna put it on a on a reel
and run it through for you, Uh, what scene or
what scenes would you like to rerun if we were
going to take your whole career and and and put
it on a VCR here for you. Is there a
certain scene that yeah, sure, of course they're all. Uh.
(07:31):
I think there there's two or three different ones. I
think we had a Monday night game in Washington to
open the season some some years back, and it was
around midnight and the fog was rolling in in RFK
and the Redskins had had caught us. We were ahead,
(07:53):
and the majority of the game. They had caught us
and had gotten the lead. Late in the game. We
came back to hie it up and then we got
one more possession and with two seconds left, role the
leg Grade kicked the fifty three r field goal to
beat them, and the stadium turned from from sixty thousand
(08:19):
wild you know how r f k is into a
mausoleum and a turner got ten seconds. So that's one
scene that I vividly recall um the NFC Championship game,
Theason beating San Francisco. At that time, I think consensus
(08:39):
where this might be the greatest team of all time.
If they yeah, if they three this kind of this,
this might be the greatest team of all time. We
had our backup quarterback Jeff Hosteller playing, who wound up
being an outstanding quarterback in the league, but at that
time he was relatively unproven, UH, and he was able
(09:01):
to lead us to that win. So that would be
Now you have in your dead a picture of Matt
Barr of bars when he yeah, that meant a lot
to me. That was I think that was probably the
UH one of the two or three greatest moments. Again,
I think probably the very next week the Super Bowl,
(09:23):
Buffalo the offense of the nineties, you know, averaging thirty
five points a game, had beaten the Raiders fifty one
to three, and then our team just kind of slugging
it out with him and winning that game. So there,
you know, there are times that if I was going
to be one of your players, one thing that be
(09:47):
Lawrence Taylor. Well you I'm talking about now in the
perspective of history, the one thing to me that that
I would strive to be with, to be referred to
by you as one of your guys. You talk about
my guys. How do I earn if I'm a player,
how do I earn the the recognition of being, quote,
(10:11):
one of your guys? Well, I think the frame of
reference is a little misrepresented there in terms of I
think probably when I said my guys, I've said that
several times, I'm referring to the team and and the
total composition of the team. However, I think within that structure,
the teams that I've had that have been any good,
(10:34):
there have always been about ten or fifteen guys that
were the core, the heartbeat, the soul, the spirit um,
the nucleus of the success of the team. And it
was true in New York with the Giants, and it
was certainly true in New England with the Patriots, and
(10:54):
hopefully it'll be true with the Jets. But it's just
it's just a group that are proud of that jersey
that they're wearing, and and that winning games for that
franchise and that moment for that group, it's important to them.
And uh so I think probably that would be the
best way to refer to my guys. Now, do you
(11:17):
give like a psychological or written test for players when
you scout them? I mean, is that something that you do? Yes? Yeah,
Well what would would I have to get if I
was a player and wanted to play for you? What
would be things that you would look for and that
written exam that would that would I will give you
an example. I would ask Steve Sable what are the
(11:39):
three most important things in his life? And if the
answers to those questions, well, maybe your family is one,
or your religion or whatever it would be. If football
wasn't in there somewhere, wasn't in the top three one
in the top three, I might I might have a problem,
(12:00):
you know, I want the guy's job and and his
what he's working at. I wanted in there somewhere. Doesn't
have to be right at the top of the list,
but it needs to be in there. Somewhere is in
there with me. I wanted in there with the guys
that I'm coaching. Now, do you cook? You mean in
a culinary and a culinary sense, do you cook? I
(12:22):
mean would you come out here and barbecue or something.
I'm not that domestic sting. I I really don't have
ability and in any domestic area, so that my wife
has has has had to learn to make her life
on her own in this in the environment of the house.
So you don't buy groceries and I, I mean I
(12:45):
went with her a couple of times. But you're very awful. Now.
The reason I asked you that is that you had
that phrase after during the Super Bowl that if you're
going to cook, you want to buy the groceries. And
I thought that was sort of strange because I didn't
think that you were the kind of guy that went
out and bought groceries or so where did that Probably
it was just, you know, it was just and I
didn't mean it in a negative way. I just I
(13:09):
meant it in this respect. In the situation that I
was in at that point in time, I was by
far the most experienced person there, and um so I
just made reference to you know, if they're gonna ask
you to cook the dinner, they ought to allow you
at least a shop for some of the groceries. That's
(13:31):
that was what I said, And I think people people
confuse that in in I think any the only thing
I've ever wanted as a coach is someone to get
me players. Just get me players. That's that's what the
general manager's job. When I when I was with the
Giants that had a general manager that got me players,
we were able to be successful. So that's all I
(13:52):
ever wanted as a coach, is not so much about control,
but about getting me The recal was in place. But
it's important to you. I mean it is. I mean,
even when we did this, one of you you had
to know the names of the guys here. You wanted
to know the name of our crew, You had to
know how many people are gonna be here. Said come on,
that's the control is it's important to you. That's why
(14:14):
I think that's a word that that that's a little ambiguous.
It in being informed doesn't necessarily mean that U and
I didn't tell you where to stand up, set up
these cameras here to do this interview. I didn't tell
you what locations were in a bad location here. I
probably would have changed the location myself. You know that
(14:36):
you have the expertise. I'm gonna let you fail on
your own. But now to get back to coaching, So
you think that the head coach should have the final
decision as to what players that he's going to require.
Not necessarily. I think if the head coaches is UH
(14:57):
experience the capable, I think he should have input. I
don't necessarily think the final decisions not important. I never,
I don't. I really didn't ever care about that myself,
as long as I was confident in the guy that
was bringing me the players. If I'm confident in the
guy that's bringing me the players, that's fine. I'm sure
I can come to some agreement with him. I I
(15:19):
know I couldn't. Ron Wolfe was bringing me players, no problem,
no problem, no problem ever. But you want to be
able to decide who that player, who that guy is,
who's bringing you the players. I have experienced in this industry,
and and and I know the guys and how they
(15:40):
work and what guys are going to be successful doing
those kinds of things. So I want some of them
around me so when he can help me do win
that you want total control. That's what you mean is
that you don't necessarily want to pick the players yourself,
but you want someone you trust to pick the players. Absolutely.
I got someone out. His name is Nick Haley, and
(16:00):
I'm looking forward to him. I think if you've asked,
if you could ever ask all the people that I've
worked with coaching staff, someone have been with me seventeen
eighteen years um administrators, will Bill Parcelves listen? The answer
would be yes, he will listen. So someone comes to
me with an idea, and it's a good one. I
(16:22):
don't think I'm now minded enough to dismiss it. Now
here's some guy off the streets and and and you
got an opinion, and I don't know who you are
or where you come from, and you're just saying, hey, Parcels,
draft this guy. I might not pay too much attention
(16:44):
on that one. To further the metaphor used by Parcels
when he first got to New England, he didn't exactly
shop for the groceries, but he did provide the list
and he was well accommodated. At that point, New England
wasn't disarray. Owner James orth Wine was threatening to move
the team to St. Louis, and Parcels was there to
(17:05):
provide stability. But when Robert Kraft took ownership of the team,
he decided to limit Parcels control. Sort of ironic considering
how much control Bill Belichick has today. But back to Parcels.
Remember his infamous quote from his resignation press conference, they
want you to cook the dinner. At least they ought
(17:26):
to let your shop for some of the groceries. Okay,
this quote exemplifies one of Bill's most endearing and enduring traits.
What I call parcels is ms quotes that are so
memorable they make it into the NFL vernacular, like you
are what your record says you are? How many times
(17:47):
have we heard coaches say that? Look few turn of
phrase like Bill Parcels. And I will be dropping a
few more of my favorites throughout this podcast. But when
we come back, a philosophical discussion between Steve and Bill
about the merits of having total control and whether or
not it effects the ability to coach. Stay tuned, Welcome
(18:08):
back to Tales from the Vault. The thing about being
the one who picks the players is you're always going
to be second guest. Conversely, if you're the one who
questions the decisions of management, you're also going to be
second guest. Seems about to talk to Parcels about two players,
both of whom Parcels was accused of questioning, both of
(18:29):
whom worked out. The first was running back David Meggatt,
selected by the Giants in the fifth round in ninety nine,
who played ten seasons for Parcels with the Giants, New
England and the Jets. The second player is the late
Terry Glenn, who Parcels was critical of, but who also
led all rookies in receiving in after being drafted with
(18:51):
the seventh pick. Now here's another great Parcels is um
and it applies to young, highly touted players. Bill said,
let's put away the anointing oil. Don't put him in
the Hall of fame just yet. For Parcels, a player
really had to prove his worth. Now, what can you
think in your in your recent past of players that
(19:12):
maybe you didn't want to take that you were convinced
that you should take in the draft. Well, there have
been a couple of references about that. One of them
was referring to David meghat Bill Parcels did not want
David Megatt. That's not true what I was going to
ask this whole scenario. This is exactly what happened. I
(19:33):
had a five seven running back at the time named
Joe Mars, who was a pretty good player. I was
looking at David Meggott in the respect, well, what is
David Meggatt gonna do for me as a backup running back? Okay,
and five seven guys usually don't play special teams. So
I asked the scouting group that was there recommending this player,
(19:53):
can this player be my starting punt return? Can this
player be my starting kickoff return? And it was a
n animus, Yes he can. As soon as they said
that to me, I said, let's draft David Megan. Now
what about Terry Glenn. Terry Glenn I always liked as
a player. Anyone who looked at Terry Glenn would not
(20:16):
not like Terry Glenn. I had no feelings about not
wanting Terry Glenn. I just felt like New England's defense
needed more attention. Now, as it turned out, retrospectively, Terry
Glenn was ann outstanding. I think he's reminds me of
Paul Warfield, you know, And I think he's a guy
(20:38):
that's gonna could be a great player. I'm not stupid
enough not to use them. I used them, and retrospectively,
I'm glad we picked Terry Glenn. I just feel like
I felt like at the time the defense needed uh
uh some attention, and it does. Believe me, I know
that defense it does need attention. But if you're gonna
(20:59):
be in essence like control and be in essence the
general manager and the head coach. People always say, well,
head coach, he has to win now. The general manager
he can look down the future and he's building for
the future. Do you think there's a there's this one
and the same. For me, I'm fifty five years old.
I'm not gonna be a head coach when i'm seventy. Okay,
(21:23):
So it's one and the same for me. I want
to win now and I'm but I'm gonna make decisions
that I think give give me the best chance to
compete now, but I also have to take the long
term view, because when I'm finished coaching, I might be
to still be the general manager. So I've got both
(21:43):
shoes to look at this, bellow, And you've been since
you've been in the game in the early eighties. Look
how the responsibilities of the head coach have changed. I mean,
now you've got all the things with free agents. You
have somebody now they call a capologist. Do you have
a cap bologists? Sure do, that's an important but eight
(22:05):
years old. He's a young capologist. But don't you think
that to take all of this responsibility is you might
be over It might affect your ability to be a coach.
No not, if not, if not, If I look at this,
isn't that hard. I mean you got to get the
(22:25):
you gotta get the natural resources, so to speak. If
you have somebody to get that for you, the scouting department, okay,
and then you have to have someone to kind of
keep up with the economics of it. All right, I
have someone to do that, and those people are competent people.
I don't think it's that hard. But what you want,
(22:46):
and see if this is right, is that you want
the finals. Say, like in my business, a director would
ask for the final cut and when this is in
the interview is over, I'm going to decide what we're
gonna use and what we're not going to use. So
what you're asking for now is a head coach, is
you want the final cut, so to speak, that if
there's a question or decision you can you make the
(23:07):
You're you're the final say, Is that right? Yeah? I
am the final say right now. But every head coach
doesn't have that. But I had the final say for
three years in New England. I think it went pretty
well there. So I want to ask you again about
being about this concept of the coach having total control.
Do you think that it's possible, with all the how
(23:27):
complex the businesses now, that your role as head coach
could be compromised by having to worry about all these
other other aspects of running a team, well, acquiring the town.
You know, I'll tell you what you ought to do.
You ought to go back. Now you're telling me what
to do. I'm telling you what to do. I've done this,
I want you to go back. You know, no one
(23:50):
ever really reflects on the records of these personnel people
and these general managers, and that these guys that say
that that that the job is too complex for the coach.
So here's what I want you to do. I want
you to go back to the nineteen four draft, that's
only three years ago draft and the n Draft, and
(24:13):
I just want you to go down the first round. Okay,
the twenty eight players in the ninety four draft. Um,
they're eight players in the draft, and we went to
the expansion then there's thirty players, so you've got about
maybe ninety four players. Okay. Now, I want you to
go back and redraft those players as they were drafted
(24:35):
by those teams, and also put the economic tag on
those players that were drafted, where they were drafted and
how much they cost, and see how those gurus are doing. Okay,
see if it was See how how prudent they were
(24:58):
in the dollar expenditure. Okay, because I've gone back and
I've done that, and they're probably well over of those
players that were drafted and paid for if they had
the opportunity to do it again. I don't think they
do it based on what's happened. But do you think
(25:20):
that a coach would have done better making those decisions?
In a general manager? But I mean not necessarily, not necessarily.
What's going on. In college, you've got games that you're
you're there's there's no possible way for a coach to
The coach has to gather the information from people he
has confidence in and then look at the players and
(25:43):
do his homework and study the films. And the personnel
people have to understand the philosophy the coach so that
they bring players to the coach that fit that type
of philosophy. And that's where the conflict is. In football.
You're a general managine, well that guy's gone talent, Yeah,
but he does and fit into my system. As the coach,
well yeah he's got talent, Well he doesn't fit into
(26:04):
my systems. It doesn't make any difference what happened. If
it doesn't work, it's no good for anyone. So the
general manager needs to try to bring players to the
coach that fit into his system. And the coach needs
to try to develop players that the general manager brings
to him and and and and give them the opportunity
to try to play. And if you can do that,
(26:25):
it can work out. The problem is new coach, he
wants different players. Okay, fire that personnel department. Okay, now
here comes the guy. This coach didn't win. Okay, Now,
different coach, same personnel department. Okay, he wants different guys,
and it's a circle. It's a circle. And you could
(26:46):
their franchises in this league that have been going on
that Merrow, Merrow go around for a long time unsuccessfully,
and then you see other guys that go places. You know,
let's take pat Riley, let's take Yeah. I want to
take him because just coincidentally, wherever he goes, I don't
know why, wherever he goes, all of a sudden, there
(27:07):
seems to be a good team there. I mean, when
he was in the Lakers, it was a good team there.
When he came to the nixt it was a good
team there. The same thing about yourself. No, no, I'm
not I'm not trying to relate it throughout. Now he
goes to Miami and here's a good team there. Not
to me, he's got something to do with those good
teams being there, you know, because they were there before
(27:28):
he got there, and then in some cases they're not
there after he left. To button up the value Bill
places on good coaching, I present to you another classic
parcels is, um, you don't have to get hit in
the face with the skunk before you smell it. Now.
As for the question of whether or not Parcels was
(27:48):
good at shopping for the groceries, in his three seasons
as both coach and general manager, Parcels drafted one player
who would eventually become an All Pro linebacker, James Farrier,
but it took Farrier leaving the Jets for Pittsburgh for
that to happen. However, after Parcels resigned as head coach
(28:09):
following the season, he remained as general manager in charge
of player personnel, and in two thousand the Jets remarkably
had four first round picks and hat on all of them.
Defensive end Shawn Ellis, linebacker John Abraham, quarterback Chad Pennington,
and tight end Anthony Becked. Not one of them played
(28:30):
fewer than eleven seasons, and Abraham and Ellis they combined
for seven Pro Bowls. By the way, how did the
Jets get four first rounders under Parcels, Well, it started
by trading Bill Belichick to New England for one and
then really trading star wide receiver Keyshawn Johnson to the
Buccaneers for two more. Pretty bold moved by Parcels now,
(28:52):
of course, it should be noted that Belichick won the
Super Bowl in two thousand one and Johnson won in
two thousand two, and the Jets, so I think they're
still searching for their first super Bowl since the nineteen sixties.
But let's not let that ruin a good story here.
When we come back, though, Steve and Bill go toe
to toe about Steve's playing days in college when Parcels
(29:14):
was only opposing Sideline. Stay tuned, Welcome back to Tales
from the Vault. Let's talk nicknames, all right, So we
know that Bill Parcels is called the Tuna. But why
let's go back to a press conference with Parcels and
I quote, I think it goes back to my first
(29:35):
time with the Patriots. There was an old commercial from
Star Kissed with Charlie the star Kissed Tuna. So my
players were trying to con me on something one time,
and I said, you must think I'm Charlie the Tuna,
you know, a sucker. And that's kind of how it started.
We started with it that year, and Charlie and the
other fish used to wear those little tuna helmets, you know,
tuna pictures on their helmets. That's where it all started. Well,
(30:00):
Steve Sable had a unique nickname himself. When he was
a fullback at Colorado College. He actually nicknamed himself sudden
Death Sable. Now, if you really want to dig into
the print vault and read something from another time, google
the Fearless Tot from Possum Trot and read about Steve's
(30:21):
exploits in an unbelievable Sports Illustrated profile from nineteen sixty. Well,
in nineteen sixty four, when Steve was a fullback at
Colorado College, he went up against Hastings College from Nebraska,
whose linebackers coach was Bill parcels Now, if I was
(30:41):
a player and I was going to be playing for
the Jets this season, you know, I remember you when
you were a player. I know I coached against the
team that you played on average six yards I think
it was four point one rounded off the five all
I don't know what, school of economics. Also the public
(31:03):
relations department vividly recollect Yeah, yeah, I vividly Colorado School.
You're trying to take I'm the one that's supposed to
be asking the Colorado College nineteen sixty's aren't you a
stumbling fullback of sorts? I was slow but every step
slow and friendly. All right. Let me let me get
(31:26):
back to the thing. If I was a player and
I was going to play for Bill Parcels as if
I was gonna try to make the Jets team, what
advice would you give me getting condition? Getting condition first?
It's gonna be a hard camp getting condition. Uh, put
all your problems behind you. I don't I don't like
(31:48):
players that have six or seven other things going on.
You know, get your personal problems, your family problems, your
girlfriend problems, your money problems. Get get it all behind you,
and come to camp with the idea that we're trying
to win some games. Because that's what we're trying to do.
And if I don't feel like you as a player
(32:09):
or physically up to trying to do that, or mentally
up to do that, then I don't want to fool
with you. So that's what I would say. Get in
shape and let's go play some football. What's the the
nicest thing that any one of your former players could
say about you? He wanted to win a lot of
(32:30):
them have said that. That means more to me than anything. Well,
he was a pain in the neck. Well he was this,
Well he was that but we knew he wanted to win.
And I think every player deserves a chance to win.
They're out there, they work hard, they work harder than
people know, and if you don't give him a chance
to win, you're cheating them. And that's how I would
(32:54):
like to be remembered if there is, and I'm not
saying there will be any legacy. And someone said, hey,
this guy wanted to win. I went back and I
saw that your real name is Dwyane Charles Parcels. How
did you get Bill? How did that happen? Well, when
I moved from hasmur Kites, New Jersey to another town,
(33:18):
I wasn't enamored with the name Dwayne because when I
was in about the third grade, my school teacher, who
happened to be a woman at the time, called the
role the first day and said, Dwayne Parcels, is she there?
Is she here? So I kind of got the idea
that some people got confused, that's whether that was the
boys or a girl's name. So I wasn't all that
(33:40):
enamored with the name. So conveniently, when I moved to
another town, there was another guy that moved in the
same time named Bill, and they used to see us
together once in a while, and they used to confuse us.
They started calling me Bill. So I just kind of
let it go. Anything left, yea, I think we got
(34:01):
it all because I want to be out of here
in time. So when Coach thinks of us again, he
knows that as you said to us before, you told
me before these guys under control, I said that our
crew is you know what you want to do. You
want to go out to Mount Rushmore. I ain't got
a roll for this. Uh tell you guys want to
go out to Mount Rushmore? Okay, and with those guys
(34:24):
that are up there on that facade, I guess would
be the the mountainside it. You want to get sables
face and put them up there, you know what I mean?
Just film them, put them right there, them right up there.
The only on the last thing that I ask is
that Newsweek just did a poll about the most stressful
(34:44):
jobs in the in the country. I didn't say that. Yeah, well,
maybe it's just as well that you didn't, because your
job was listed as the sixth most stressful job that
you could have, and that's a head of policeman, ahead
of air traffic controllers. Do you think your job is
that ful. At one point in time, it was very
stressful to me. But I've learned to do better. It's
(35:06):
not as stressful now I've learned again. It's maturity, it's experienced,
it's confidence, it's understanding, it's it's it's still not without
high emotional volatility. But and the greatest thing about this
job is you don't There aren't any quarterly reports, you know,
(35:30):
there aren't any what we're kind of doing better, you know,
you know it's over. We want and we lost. That's it.
It's not what we're doing better. Our sales are up
ten percent. We don't have that in my industry. It's
black or white. You want or you lost. If you want,
everything's gonna be okay. If you're lost, devastation, yeah, but
(35:51):
we have shots to you after you've won games and
you're walking off the field and you don't look happy
at all. Oh yeah, but that's because my team played lousy.
But you still want. But that's okay, that's okay for them.
Just win the games. That's right, Just win the games.
But that's for me to deal with. But that's my
own little personal uh windmill that I have to fight
that my team didn't play to its potential. You know,
(36:12):
the results of games are very important to the psychological
makeup of the team because the team teaches itself what
it is every year. So you know, you can play
poorly and win, and pretty soon the team says, we
can get by playing poorly big era in judgment, or
(36:33):
we can play very very well and lose. Now that's
a difficult thing for a coach to deal with because
your team did just about everything you want them to do,
but they didn't get the carrot. And that's when you
really have to to keep the air in your team
and point out the things that you did well and
(36:53):
when you know, they gave you everything they had and
they just came up a little short. So the psychology
of results, I've spoken about that very a lot in sports.
I think it's it's very important. But here's an interesting
quote I wanted you and I have talked about history,
and Winston Churchill once said that power corrupts. I think
(37:14):
I'm better to do that again because this is a
good quote, you know, and I want to Winston Winston
Churchill for you in a minute. All right, Well, okay, well,
let me get my quote in first Winston Churchill said,
power corrupts. Absolute power corrupts completely. Now what's your opinion
of that, because what you and I are talking about,
(37:36):
I think that absolute power, well you see, I don't
look at it that way. But you're saying you want,
you have to have the ability to make the final
decision is up to you at this point in time.
I think I'm the best one to do it in
my in this situation at this point in time. But
(38:00):
Winston Churchill had another quote. Do you know what Winston
Churchill's definition of a pacifist was no, feed some to
the alligators, so they eat you last. There's about ten
owners in this league. They fed a few coaches to
the alligators this year, you know. And now it's just
Hunky Dorry and those where they had a new coach.
(38:21):
You know, everybody's happy, you know what I mean. They
fed those coaches, satisfied the public. They're getting eaten last,
see what I mean. So I I realized that I've
got to win as a coach. I realized that no
matter what your other titles are, if coaches one of them,
(38:43):
you have to win. If you don't win, they're feeding
you to the alligators. So in that way what we're saying,
that's that's the stress and that. But were you were
talking about coaching and that. I remember Chuck Nole talking
to me once about what he enjoyed about coaching most
was teaching and that and that I agree with that.
Preparing the team, trying to get it ready, trying to
(39:05):
get the team to play this potential. That's my goal
every year. But that doesn't that's not separate and distinct
from these other things that are going You know, these
other things that are going on are made out to
be overly complex. What other things, well, this salary cap,
this free agency. First of all, this free agency thing,
(39:25):
how many teams are dealing with? How many free agents
every year? I mean, what are we talking about? Five guys?
Six guys? Okay? So how hard is that? I mean,
it's not. It's just identifying what you want to do
and trying to go do it. Okay, Now, sometimes there's
a little logistical problem, is economic problems you just have
to work through that. It's not like but it's not.
(39:45):
It's not more than than the common every day job
that you have. You have decisions to make in your
industry too. But don't you think that because of free
agency and everything that that that the players have changed,
their attitude changed a little bit. They could say, well,
look i'll play for coach parcel Look, I don't like
the way he treats me. I'll wait till next year
(40:06):
and I'll go someplace else. I think that I think
that that can be what you try to do is
not get guys like that on your team. I told
you what I want. The jersey has got to be
important to those guys, what they're wearing. They gotta be
trying to win. You also, right now, green is important. Okay.
If it's not green, we don't like it. You got me.
(40:28):
If we're playing the Red Shirts or the Blue Shirts, okay,
we don't like the blue Shirts. You guys need gas
money back to Philly. After all was filmed, maybe we do.
All right, get out of here. I'm gonna go out
on a limb and say, if Bill Parcels had a
(40:49):
list of his guys in the media world, Steve Sable
would be at the top of it. Look, Parcels can
bust your chops with the best of them, but it's
a sign of endearment. I'll tell you this to definitively
Parcels coaching tree is hugely meaningful to him. Seventeen of
his assistants have become head coaches in the NFL or
n c a A, and nine of his coaches or
(41:11):
executives have gone on to become general managers. In fact,
to this day, he remains a strong behind the scenes
mentor for many an NFL coach and some players as well,
in addition to some young athletes that no one knows about.
This is all a part of Bill Parcel's Hall of
Fame legacy coming up next week. So you think you've
(41:36):
heard everything about Tom Brady, well not until you've listened
to Steve Stable's interview with him from two thousand two
when he was just the baby goat, right after Brady
won his first Super Bowl. You won't want to miss this.
Thanks for listening. I'm Andrea Kramer. One
Welcome to NFL Films Tales from the Vault. I'm your host,
Hall of Fame journalist Andrea Kramer. On this podcast, we
take you back in time as we journey into the
NFL Films Vault to find some of the greatest interviews
ever conducted by the legendary Steve Sable. In his five
decades as President of NFL Films, Steve interviewed hundreds of
(00:26):
players and coaches. Those conversations have never been heard in
their entirety until now, and I'm here to guide you
through them, providing context, insight, and the occasional anecdote of
my own. Today, we had to visit with one of
Steve's favorites, the inimitable Bill Parcels. The interviews we've been
(01:01):
bringing you typically fall into one of two categories, a
comprehensive career retrospective or simply a snapshot in time of
a player or coaches career. This interview is a little
bit of both. In June, Bill Parcels had just been
named head coach and general manager of the New York Jets.
Remember that the season before he took the Patriots to
(01:23):
the Super Bowl, and just a week after losing to
Green Bay, Parcels stunned the NFL by resigning from New England.
After some negotiations which amounted to four draft picks and
a three hundred thousand dollar charitable donation to the Patriots
by the Jets, Parcels was returning home to New Jersey,
and make no mistake, he is a Jersey guy through
(01:46):
and through. Now, Remember, in he was a decade removed
from the first of his two Super Bowl wins with
the Giants and was still nearly a decade away from retiring,
ultimately coaching three years with the Jets and then four
more with Dallas after that. In fact, I was on
the sidelines for what turned out to be his final
(02:09):
game as a head coach, ty wild card loss to Seattle,
when Tony Romo bobbled the hold on what could have
been the game winning field goal for Parcels. That bitter
defeat encapsulated something He's always told me that the losses
hurt more than the winds felt good. In fact, one
(02:29):
of the things I've relished most about talking with Parcels
to this day is that he speaks his mind, sharp
tongue and all. He's got a quick wit, and he's
never bereft of opinions. One of the things that's so
entertaining about this interview is the verbal jousting that will
hear between Steve and Bill. Now, before we begin, let
(02:50):
me set the scene for you. Pictures Steve and Bill
sitting outside Parcel's house in northern New Jersey pull in
the background on a beautiful and sunny June day. Oh
and I've already alluded you to be ready for some
playful banter between Steve and Bill, especially regarding Parcels treatment
of NFL films cameramen. He was notorious for chasing their
(03:13):
cameras away on the sidelines, especially cameras belonging to the
lead director of photography on this shoot, Hank mcgelwie. So
let's go to the vault for Steve Sable and Bill Parcels. Alright,
the last time that we were here, Bill, the last
time we were here, this whole the swimming pool, this
whole house, this was just a big hole in the ground.
(03:36):
You were just starting out with the Patriots. Now we're back,
got a beautiful home. The Patriots. You took him to
the Super Bowl, but you're starting all over again with
a new team. What happened. Well, you know it's uh,
sometimes opportunity comes along and um, you know you just
I wanted to come back home. This is my home,
(03:57):
this is where my family is. I would have left
the team in New England. I enjoyed it there. I
enjoyed those players. Um they accomplished something I think special, um,
particularly for them. And I like living in New England.
But this is my home and my families here and
(04:21):
in New York and this is New Jersey, so everybody knows.
But had it not been a New York franchise, I
wouldn't be going on. This just is the right place
for me. Now. Earlier we were kidding around but with
about our cameraman and you know, kidding around about you. Now, Uh,
that's what you call those guys. Yeah, these guys here,
(04:43):
you know, the guys that you treat with such respect
during the course of the season. You know all these
you know, all these guys here that you know that
hasn't changed. You still accord us the same respect court reality.
We love to come film now we'll be looking forward
to that. I that I give them this, commiserate with
their with their abraceive nous in interfering with my coaching operation. Now, now, Hank, Hank,
(05:09):
how many times coach Parcel has thrown you off the field?
At least a dozen times? Now do you remember doing that?
I don't remember any of them. But well, when we
when you let us in your locker room after you
want the super Bowl the Giants, you said something. The
rest of your life, the rest of your life, man,
(05:32):
nobody can ever tell you that you couldn't do it,
because you did. Now, first of all, who is they? Well,
you know, there's there's a there's a kind of cynicism
that sometimes um raises its head in sports. I think
it's born of a little bit of jealousy on the
(05:58):
part of of of people against success. I think it
builds up eventually teams that have been successful over a
period of years. The forty Niners, they're successive. You see
it in basketball, the Chicago Bulls. I want somebody else
to win. And you know, women is a very precious thing.
(06:19):
And to be called the champion, you know, it's why
we do these things. It's why I do it. I
think it's why a lot of players play is to
see if you can achieve on the highest level and
to be called one one day is a very special thing. Now,
I'm not naive enough to to to think that it
represents anything substantial in the spectrum of things in this world,
(06:44):
but in this particular industry, the National Football League, it
does mark the pinnacle and for a short time, those
that get to enjoy that, I think deserve a measure
of credit. It is a precious thing, and it's something
that you keep with you forever and they can't take
it away. Well, if we were going to go back
(07:07):
to our film library and we have we've covered you
from from when you started and and every game, and
we were gonna put it on a on a reel
and run it through for you, Uh, what scene or
what scenes would you like to rerun if we were
going to take your whole career and and and put
it on a VCR here for you. Is there a
certain scene that yeah, sure, of course they're all. Uh.
(07:31):
I think there there's two or three different ones. I
think we had a Monday night game in Washington to
open the season some some years back, and it was
around midnight and the fog was rolling in in RFK
and the Redskins had had caught us. We were ahead,
(07:53):
and the majority of the game. They had caught us
and had gotten the lead. Late in the game. We
came back to hie it up and then we got
one more possession and with two seconds left, role the
leg Grade kicked the fifty three r field goal to
beat them, and the stadium turned from from sixty thousand
(08:19):
wild you know how r f k is into a
mausoleum and a turner got ten seconds. So that's one
scene that I vividly recall um the NFC Championship game,
Theason beating San Francisco. At that time, I think consensus
(08:39):
where this might be the greatest team of all time.
If they yeah, if they three this kind of this,
this might be the greatest team of all time. We
had our backup quarterback Jeff Hosteller playing, who wound up
being an outstanding quarterback in the league, but at that
time he was relatively unproven, UH, and he was able
(09:01):
to lead us to that win. So that would be
Now you have in your dead a picture of Matt
Barr of bars when he yeah, that meant a lot
to me. That was I think that was probably the
UH one of the two or three greatest moments. Again,
I think probably the very next week the Super Bowl,
(09:23):
Buffalo the offense of the nineties, you know, averaging thirty
five points a game, had beaten the Raiders fifty one
to three, and then our team just kind of slugging
it out with him and winning that game. So there,
you know, there are times that if I was going
to be one of your players, one thing that be
(09:47):
Lawrence Taylor. Well you I'm talking about now in the
perspective of history, the one thing to me that that
I would strive to be with, to be referred to
by you as one of your guys. You talk about
my guys. How do I earn if I'm a player,
how do I earn the the recognition of being, quote,
(10:11):
one of your guys? Well, I think the frame of
reference is a little misrepresented there in terms of I
think probably when I said my guys, I've said that
several times, I'm referring to the team and and the
total composition of the team. However, I think within that structure,
the teams that I've had that have been any good,
(10:34):
there have always been about ten or fifteen guys that
were the core, the heartbeat, the soul, the spirit um,
the nucleus of the success of the team. And it
was true in New York with the Giants, and it
was certainly true in New England with the Patriots, and
(10:54):
hopefully it'll be true with the Jets. But it's just
it's just a group that are proud of that jersey
that they're wearing, and and that winning games for that
franchise and that moment for that group, it's important to them.
And uh so I think probably that would be the
best way to refer to my guys. Now, do you
(11:17):
give like a psychological or written test for players when
you scout them? I mean, is that something that you do? Yes? Yeah,
Well what would would I have to get if I
was a player and wanted to play for you? What
would be things that you would look for and that
written exam that would that would I will give you
an example. I would ask Steve Sable what are the
(11:39):
three most important things in his life? And if the
answers to those questions, well, maybe your family is one,
or your religion or whatever it would be. If football
wasn't in there somewhere, wasn't in the top three one
in the top three, I might I might have a problem,
(12:00):
you know, I want the guy's job and and his
what he's working at. I wanted in there somewhere. Doesn't
have to be right at the top of the list,
but it needs to be in there. Somewhere is in
there with me. I wanted in there with the guys
that I'm coaching. Now, do you cook? You mean in
a culinary and a culinary sense, do you cook? I
(12:22):
mean would you come out here and barbecue or something.
I'm not that domestic sting. I I really don't have
ability and in any domestic area, so that my wife
has has has had to learn to make her life
on her own in this in the environment of the house.
So you don't buy groceries and I, I mean I
(12:45):
went with her a couple of times. But you're very awful. Now.
The reason I asked you that is that you had
that phrase after during the Super Bowl that if you're
going to cook, you want to buy the groceries. And
I thought that was sort of strange because I didn't
think that you were the kind of guy that went
out and bought groceries or so where did that Probably
it was just, you know, it was just and I
didn't mean it in a negative way. I just I
(13:09):
meant it in this respect. In the situation that I
was in at that point in time, I was by
far the most experienced person there, and um so I
just made reference to you know, if they're gonna ask
you to cook the dinner, they ought to allow you
at least a shop for some of the groceries. That's
(13:31):
that was what I said, And I think people people
confuse that in in I think any the only thing
I've ever wanted as a coach is someone to get
me players. Just get me players. That's that's what the
general manager's job. When I when I was with the
Giants that had a general manager that got me players,
we were able to be successful. So that's all I
(13:52):
ever wanted as a coach, is not so much about control,
but about getting me The recal was in place. But
it's important to you. I mean it is. I mean,
even when we did this, one of you you had
to know the names of the guys here. You wanted
to know the name of our crew, You had to
know how many people are gonna be here. Said come on,
that's the control is it's important to you. That's why
(14:14):
I think that's a word that that that's a little ambiguous.
It in being informed doesn't necessarily mean that U and
I didn't tell you where to stand up, set up
these cameras here to do this interview. I didn't tell
you what locations were in a bad location here. I
probably would have changed the location myself. You know that
(14:36):
you have the expertise. I'm gonna let you fail on
your own. But now to get back to coaching, So
you think that the head coach should have the final
decision as to what players that he's going to require.
Not necessarily. I think if the head coaches is UH
(14:57):
experience the capable, I think he should have input. I
don't necessarily think the final decisions not important. I never,
I don't. I really didn't ever care about that myself,
as long as I was confident in the guy that
was bringing me the players. If I'm confident in the
guy that's bringing me the players, that's fine. I'm sure
I can come to some agreement with him. I I
(15:19):
know I couldn't. Ron Wolfe was bringing me players, no problem,
no problem, no problem ever. But you want to be
able to decide who that player, who that guy is,
who's bringing you the players. I have experienced in this industry,
and and and I know the guys and how they
(15:40):
work and what guys are going to be successful doing
those kinds of things. So I want some of them
around me so when he can help me do win
that you want total control. That's what you mean is
that you don't necessarily want to pick the players yourself,
but you want someone you trust to pick the players. Absolutely.
I got someone out. His name is Nick Haley, and
(16:00):
I'm looking forward to him. I think if you've asked,
if you could ever ask all the people that I've
worked with coaching staff, someone have been with me seventeen
eighteen years um administrators, will Bill Parcelves listen? The answer
would be yes, he will listen. So someone comes to
me with an idea, and it's a good one. I
(16:22):
don't think I'm now minded enough to dismiss it. Now
here's some guy off the streets and and and you
got an opinion, and I don't know who you are
or where you come from, and you're just saying, hey, Parcels,
draft this guy. I might not pay too much attention
(16:44):
on that one. To further the metaphor used by Parcels
when he first got to New England, he didn't exactly
shop for the groceries, but he did provide the list
and he was well accommodated. At that point, New England
wasn't disarray. Owner James orth Wine was threatening to move
the team to St. Louis, and Parcels was there to
(17:05):
provide stability. But when Robert Kraft took ownership of the team,
he decided to limit Parcels control. Sort of ironic considering
how much control Bill Belichick has today. But back to Parcels.
Remember his infamous quote from his resignation press conference, they
want you to cook the dinner. At least they ought
(17:26):
to let your shop for some of the groceries. Okay,
this quote exemplifies one of Bill's most endearing and enduring traits.
What I call parcels is ms quotes that are so
memorable they make it into the NFL vernacular, like you
are what your record says you are? How many times
(17:47):
have we heard coaches say that? Look few turn of
phrase like Bill Parcels. And I will be dropping a
few more of my favorites throughout this podcast. But when
we come back, a philosophical discussion between Steve and Bill
about the merits of having total control and whether or
not it effects the ability to coach. Stay tuned, Welcome
(18:08):
back to Tales from the Vault. The thing about being
the one who picks the players is you're always going
to be second guest. Conversely, if you're the one who
questions the decisions of management, you're also going to be
second guest. Seems about to talk to Parcels about two players,
both of whom Parcels was accused of questioning, both of
(18:29):
whom worked out. The first was running back David Meggatt,
selected by the Giants in the fifth round in ninety nine,
who played ten seasons for Parcels with the Giants, New
England and the Jets. The second player is the late
Terry Glenn, who Parcels was critical of, but who also
led all rookies in receiving in after being drafted with
(18:51):
the seventh pick. Now here's another great Parcels is um
and it applies to young, highly touted players. Bill said,
let's put away the anointing oil. Don't put him in
the Hall of fame just yet. For Parcels, a player
really had to prove his worth. Now, what can you
think in your in your recent past of players that
(19:12):
maybe you didn't want to take that you were convinced
that you should take in the draft. Well, there have
been a couple of references about that. One of them
was referring to David meghat Bill Parcels did not want
David Megatt. That's not true what I was going to
ask this whole scenario. This is exactly what happened. I
(19:33):
had a five seven running back at the time named
Joe Mars, who was a pretty good player. I was
looking at David Meggott in the respect, well, what is
David Meggatt gonna do for me as a backup running back? Okay,
and five seven guys usually don't play special teams. So
I asked the scouting group that was there recommending this player,
(19:53):
can this player be my starting punt return? Can this
player be my starting kickoff return? And it was a
n animus, Yes he can. As soon as they said
that to me, I said, let's draft David Megan. Now
what about Terry Glenn. Terry Glenn I always liked as
a player. Anyone who looked at Terry Glenn would not
(20:16):
not like Terry Glenn. I had no feelings about not
wanting Terry Glenn. I just felt like New England's defense
needed more attention. Now, as it turned out, retrospectively, Terry
Glenn was ann outstanding. I think he's reminds me of
Paul Warfield, you know, And I think he's a guy
(20:38):
that's gonna could be a great player. I'm not stupid
enough not to use them. I used them, and retrospectively,
I'm glad we picked Terry Glenn. I just feel like
I felt like at the time the defense needed uh
uh some attention, and it does. Believe me, I know
that defense it does need attention. But if you're gonna
(20:59):
be in essence like control and be in essence the
general manager and the head coach. People always say, well,
head coach, he has to win now. The general manager
he can look down the future and he's building for
the future. Do you think there's a there's this one
and the same. For me, I'm fifty five years old.
I'm not gonna be a head coach when i'm seventy. Okay,
(21:23):
So it's one and the same for me. I want
to win now and I'm but I'm gonna make decisions
that I think give give me the best chance to
compete now, but I also have to take the long
term view, because when I'm finished coaching, I might be
to still be the general manager. So I've got both
(21:43):
shoes to look at this, bellow, And you've been since
you've been in the game in the early eighties. Look
how the responsibilities of the head coach have changed. I mean,
now you've got all the things with free agents. You
have somebody now they call a capologist. Do you have
a cap bologists? Sure do, that's an important but eight
(22:05):
years old. He's a young capologist. But don't you think
that to take all of this responsibility is you might
be over It might affect your ability to be a coach.
No not, if not, if not, If I look at this,
isn't that hard. I mean you got to get the
(22:25):
you gotta get the natural resources, so to speak. If
you have somebody to get that for you, the scouting department, okay,
and then you have to have someone to kind of
keep up with the economics of it. All right, I
have someone to do that, and those people are competent people.
I don't think it's that hard. But what you want,
(22:46):
and see if this is right, is that you want
the finals. Say, like in my business, a director would
ask for the final cut and when this is in
the interview is over, I'm going to decide what we're
gonna use and what we're not going to use. So
what you're asking for now is a head coach, is
you want the final cut, so to speak, that if
there's a question or decision you can you make the
(23:07):
You're you're the final say, Is that right? Yeah? I
am the final say right now. But every head coach
doesn't have that. But I had the final say for
three years in New England. I think it went pretty
well there. So I want to ask you again about
being about this concept of the coach having total control.
Do you think that it's possible, with all the how
(23:27):
complex the businesses now, that your role as head coach
could be compromised by having to worry about all these
other other aspects of running a team, well, acquiring the town.
You know, I'll tell you what you ought to do.
You ought to go back. Now you're telling me what
to do. I'm telling you what to do. I've done this,
I want you to go back. You know, no one
(23:50):
ever really reflects on the records of these personnel people
and these general managers, and that these guys that say
that that that the job is too complex for the coach.
So here's what I want you to do. I want
you to go back to the nineteen four draft, that's
only three years ago draft and the n Draft, and
(24:13):
I just want you to go down the first round. Okay,
the twenty eight players in the ninety four draft. Um,
they're eight players in the draft, and we went to
the expansion then there's thirty players, so you've got about
maybe ninety four players. Okay. Now, I want you to
go back and redraft those players as they were drafted
(24:35):
by those teams, and also put the economic tag on
those players that were drafted, where they were drafted and
how much they cost, and see how those gurus are doing. Okay,
see if it was See how how prudent they were
(24:58):
in the dollar expenditure. Okay, because I've gone back and
I've done that, and they're probably well over of those
players that were drafted and paid for if they had
the opportunity to do it again. I don't think they
do it based on what's happened. But do you think
(25:20):
that a coach would have done better making those decisions?
In a general manager? But I mean not necessarily, not necessarily.
What's going on. In college, you've got games that you're
you're there's there's no possible way for a coach to
The coach has to gather the information from people he
has confidence in and then look at the players and
(25:43):
do his homework and study the films. And the personnel
people have to understand the philosophy the coach so that
they bring players to the coach that fit that type
of philosophy. And that's where the conflict is. In football.
You're a general managine, well that guy's gone talent, Yeah,
but he does and fit into my system. As the coach,
well yeah he's got talent, Well he doesn't fit into
(26:04):
my systems. It doesn't make any difference what happened. If
it doesn't work, it's no good for anyone. So the
general manager needs to try to bring players to the
coach that fit into his system. And the coach needs
to try to develop players that the general manager brings
to him and and and and give them the opportunity
to try to play. And if you can do that,
(26:25):
it can work out. The problem is new coach, he
wants different players. Okay, fire that personnel department. Okay, now
here comes the guy. This coach didn't win. Okay, Now,
different coach, same personnel department. Okay, he wants different guys,
and it's a circle. It's a circle. And you could
(26:46):
their franchises in this league that have been going on
that Merrow, Merrow go around for a long time unsuccessfully,
and then you see other guys that go places. You know,
let's take pat Riley, let's take Yeah. I want to
take him because just coincidentally, wherever he goes, I don't
know why, wherever he goes, all of a sudden, there
(27:07):
seems to be a good team there. I mean, when
he was in the Lakers, it was a good team there.
When he came to the nixt it was a good
team there. The same thing about yourself. No, no, I'm
not I'm not trying to relate it throughout. Now he
goes to Miami and here's a good team there. Not
to me, he's got something to do with those good
teams being there, you know, because they were there before
(27:28):
he got there, and then in some cases they're not
there after he left. To button up the value Bill
places on good coaching, I present to you another classic
parcels is, um, you don't have to get hit in
the face with the skunk before you smell it. Now.
As for the question of whether or not Parcels was
(27:48):
good at shopping for the groceries, in his three seasons
as both coach and general manager, Parcels drafted one player
who would eventually become an All Pro linebacker, James Farrier,
but it took Farrier leaving the Jets for Pittsburgh for
that to happen. However, after Parcels resigned as head coach
(28:09):
following the season, he remained as general manager in charge
of player personnel, and in two thousand the Jets remarkably
had four first round picks and hat on all of them.
Defensive end Shawn Ellis, linebacker John Abraham, quarterback Chad Pennington,
and tight end Anthony Becked. Not one of them played
(28:30):
fewer than eleven seasons, and Abraham and Ellis they combined
for seven Pro Bowls. By the way, how did the
Jets get four first rounders under Parcels, Well, it started
by trading Bill Belichick to New England for one and
then really trading star wide receiver Keyshawn Johnson to the
Buccaneers for two more. Pretty bold moved by Parcels now,
(28:52):
of course, it should be noted that Belichick won the
Super Bowl in two thousand one and Johnson won in
two thousand two, and the Jets, so I think they're
still searching for their first super Bowl since the nineteen sixties.
But let's not let that ruin a good story here.
When we come back, though, Steve and Bill go toe
to toe about Steve's playing days in college when Parcels
(29:14):
was only opposing Sideline. Stay tuned, Welcome back to Tales
from the Vault. Let's talk nicknames, all right, So we
know that Bill Parcels is called the Tuna. But why
let's go back to a press conference with Parcels and
I quote, I think it goes back to my first
(29:35):
time with the Patriots. There was an old commercial from
Star Kissed with Charlie the star Kissed Tuna. So my
players were trying to con me on something one time,
and I said, you must think I'm Charlie the Tuna,
you know, a sucker. And that's kind of how it started.
We started with it that year, and Charlie and the
other fish used to wear those little tuna helmets, you know,
tuna pictures on their helmets. That's where it all started. Well,
(30:00):
Steve Sable had a unique nickname himself. When he was
a fullback at Colorado College. He actually nicknamed himself sudden
Death Sable. Now, if you really want to dig into
the print vault and read something from another time, google
the Fearless Tot from Possum Trot and read about Steve's
(30:21):
exploits in an unbelievable Sports Illustrated profile from nineteen sixty. Well,
in nineteen sixty four, when Steve was a fullback at
Colorado College, he went up against Hastings College from Nebraska,
whose linebackers coach was Bill parcels Now, if I was
(30:41):
a player and I was going to be playing for
the Jets this season, you know, I remember you when
you were a player. I know I coached against the
team that you played on average six yards I think
it was four point one rounded off the five all
I don't know what, school of economics. Also the public
(31:03):
relations department vividly recollect Yeah, yeah, I vividly Colorado School.
You're trying to take I'm the one that's supposed to
be asking the Colorado College nineteen sixty's aren't you a
stumbling fullback of sorts? I was slow but every step
slow and friendly. All right. Let me let me get
(31:26):
back to the thing. If I was a player and
I was going to play for Bill Parcels as if
I was gonna try to make the Jets team, what
advice would you give me getting condition? Getting condition first?
It's gonna be a hard camp getting condition. Uh, put
all your problems behind you. I don't I don't like
(31:48):
players that have six or seven other things going on.
You know, get your personal problems, your family problems, your
girlfriend problems, your money problems. Get get it all behind you,
and come to camp with the idea that we're trying
to win some games. Because that's what we're trying to do.
And if I don't feel like you as a player
(32:09):
or physically up to trying to do that, or mentally
up to do that, then I don't want to fool
with you. So that's what I would say. Get in
shape and let's go play some football. What's the the
nicest thing that any one of your former players could
say about you? He wanted to win a lot of
(32:30):
them have said that. That means more to me than anything. Well,
he was a pain in the neck. Well he was this,
Well he was that but we knew he wanted to win.
And I think every player deserves a chance to win.
They're out there, they work hard, they work harder than
people know, and if you don't give him a chance
to win, you're cheating them. And that's how I would
(32:54):
like to be remembered if there is, and I'm not
saying there will be any legacy. And someone said, hey,
this guy wanted to win. I went back and I
saw that your real name is Dwyane Charles Parcels. How
did you get Bill? How did that happen? Well, when
I moved from hasmur Kites, New Jersey to another town,
(33:18):
I wasn't enamored with the name Dwayne because when I
was in about the third grade, my school teacher, who
happened to be a woman at the time, called the
role the first day and said, Dwayne Parcels, is she there?
Is she here? So I kind of got the idea
that some people got confused, that's whether that was the
boys or a girl's name. So I wasn't all that
(33:40):
enamored with the name. So conveniently, when I moved to
another town, there was another guy that moved in the
same time named Bill, and they used to see us
together once in a while, and they used to confuse us.
They started calling me Bill. So I just kind of
let it go. Anything left, yea, I think we got
(34:01):
it all because I want to be out of here
in time. So when Coach thinks of us again, he
knows that as you said to us before, you told
me before these guys under control, I said that our
crew is you know what you want to do. You
want to go out to Mount Rushmore. I ain't got
a roll for this. Uh tell you guys want to
go out to Mount Rushmore? Okay, and with those guys
(34:24):
that are up there on that facade, I guess would
be the the mountainside it. You want to get sables
face and put them up there, you know what I mean?
Just film them, put them right there, them right up there.
The only on the last thing that I ask is
that Newsweek just did a poll about the most stressful
(34:44):
jobs in the in the country. I didn't say that. Yeah, well,
maybe it's just as well that you didn't, because your
job was listed as the sixth most stressful job that
you could have, and that's a head of policeman, ahead
of air traffic controllers. Do you think your job is
that ful. At one point in time, it was very
stressful to me. But I've learned to do better. It's
(35:06):
not as stressful now I've learned again. It's maturity, it's experienced,
it's confidence, it's understanding, it's it's it's still not without
high emotional volatility. But and the greatest thing about this
job is you don't There aren't any quarterly reports, you know,
(35:30):
there aren't any what we're kind of doing better, you know,
you know it's over. We want and we lost. That's it.
It's not what we're doing better. Our sales are up
ten percent. We don't have that in my industry. It's
black or white. You want or you lost. If you want,
everything's gonna be okay. If you're lost, devastation, yeah, but
(35:51):
we have shots to you after you've won games and
you're walking off the field and you don't look happy
at all. Oh yeah, but that's because my team played lousy.
But you still want. But that's okay, that's okay for them.
Just win the games. That's right, Just win the games.
But that's for me to deal with. But that's my
own little personal uh windmill that I have to fight
that my team didn't play to its potential. You know,
(36:12):
the results of games are very important to the psychological
makeup of the team because the team teaches itself what
it is every year. So you know, you can play
poorly and win, and pretty soon the team says, we
can get by playing poorly big era in judgment, or
(36:33):
we can play very very well and lose. Now that's
a difficult thing for a coach to deal with because
your team did just about everything you want them to do,
but they didn't get the carrot. And that's when you
really have to to keep the air in your team
and point out the things that you did well and
(36:53):
when you know, they gave you everything they had and
they just came up a little short. So the psychology
of results, I've spoken about that very a lot in sports.
I think it's it's very important. But here's an interesting
quote I wanted you and I have talked about history,
and Winston Churchill once said that power corrupts. I think
(37:14):
I'm better to do that again because this is a
good quote, you know, and I want to Winston Winston
Churchill for you in a minute. All right, Well, okay, well,
let me get my quote in first Winston Churchill said,
power corrupts. Absolute power corrupts completely. Now what's your opinion
of that, because what you and I are talking about,
(37:36):
I think that absolute power, well you see, I don't
look at it that way. But you're saying you want,
you have to have the ability to make the final
decision is up to you at this point in time.
I think I'm the best one to do it in
my in this situation at this point in time. But
(38:00):
Winston Churchill had another quote. Do you know what Winston
Churchill's definition of a pacifist was no, feed some to
the alligators, so they eat you last. There's about ten
owners in this league. They fed a few coaches to
the alligators this year, you know. And now it's just
Hunky Dorry and those where they had a new coach.
(38:21):
You know, everybody's happy, you know what I mean. They
fed those coaches, satisfied the public. They're getting eaten last,
see what I mean. So I I realized that I've
got to win as a coach. I realized that no
matter what your other titles are, if coaches one of them,
(38:43):
you have to win. If you don't win, they're feeding
you to the alligators. So in that way what we're saying,
that's that's the stress and that. But were you were
talking about coaching and that. I remember Chuck Nole talking
to me once about what he enjoyed about coaching most
was teaching and that and that I agree with that.
Preparing the team, trying to get it ready, trying to
(39:05):
get the team to play this potential. That's my goal
every year. But that doesn't that's not separate and distinct
from these other things that are going You know, these
other things that are going on are made out to
be overly complex. What other things, well, this salary cap,
this free agency. First of all, this free agency thing,
(39:25):
how many teams are dealing with? How many free agents
every year? I mean, what are we talking about? Five guys?
Six guys? Okay? So how hard is that? I mean,
it's not. It's just identifying what you want to do
and trying to go do it. Okay, Now, sometimes there's
a little logistical problem, is economic problems you just have
to work through that. It's not like but it's not.
(39:45):
It's not more than than the common every day job
that you have. You have decisions to make in your
industry too. But don't you think that because of free
agency and everything that that that the players have changed,
their attitude changed a little bit. They could say, well,
look i'll play for coach parcel Look, I don't like
the way he treats me. I'll wait till next year
(40:06):
and I'll go someplace else. I think that I think
that that can be what you try to do is
not get guys like that on your team. I told
you what I want. The jersey has got to be
important to those guys, what they're wearing. They gotta be
trying to win. You also, right now, green is important. Okay.
If it's not green, we don't like it. You got me.
(40:28):
If we're playing the Red Shirts or the Blue Shirts, okay,
we don't like the blue Shirts. You guys need gas
money back to Philly. After all was filmed, maybe we do.
All right, get out of here. I'm gonna go out
on a limb and say, if Bill Parcels had a
(40:49):
list of his guys in the media world, Steve Sable
would be at the top of it. Look, Parcels can
bust your chops with the best of them, but it's
a sign of endearment. I'll tell you this to definitively
Parcels coaching tree is hugely meaningful to him. Seventeen of
his assistants have become head coaches in the NFL or
n c a A, and nine of his coaches or
(41:11):
executives have gone on to become general managers. In fact,
to this day, he remains a strong behind the scenes
mentor for many an NFL coach and some players as well,
in addition to some young athletes that no one knows about.
This is all a part of Bill Parcel's Hall of
Fame legacy coming up next week. So you think you've
(41:36):
heard everything about Tom Brady, well not until you've listened
to Steve Stable's interview with him from two thousand two
when he was just the baby goat, right after Brady
won his first Super Bowl. You won't want to miss this.
Thanks for listening. I'm Andrea Kramer. One
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