December 15, 2021 • 46 mins
Host Andrea Kremer takes us back to 2010 when NFL Films Steve Sabol interviewed San Francisco 49ers Head Coach Mike Singletary. The future Hall of Famer discussed why it is so difficult for a great player to become a great coach and who his influences were along the way both on and off the field. . Looking back to his intense playing days, Mike explores his relationships with coaches like Mike Ditka and Buddy Ryan and why his Super Bowl winning team was never able to capture a 2nd championship. We also get an inside glimpse of what happened in Mike's first game as interim head coach when he ordered TE Vernon Davis to the showers during the 3rd quarter after an unnecessary roughness penalty. Enjoy this trip inside the NFL Films Vault to hear this fascinating conversation for the first time in its entirety.
The Tales from the Vault podcast is part of the NFL Podcast Network.
Learn more about your ad-choices at https://www.iheartpodcastnetwork.com
See omnystudio.com/listener for privacy information.
Mark as Played
Transcript
Episode Transcript
Available transcripts are automatically generated. Complete accuracy is not guaranteed.
Speaker 1 (00:05):
Welcome to NFL Films Tales from the Vault. I'm your host,
Andrea Kramer. When I started my career at NFL Films
as a producer, the lead Steve Sable was my boss
and mentor. Every week on this podcast, we bring you
the best of Steve if you will digging into the
NFL Films Vault, where there are over fifty thousand cans
(00:27):
of film and over two interviews between Steve and some
of the greatest figures in NFL history. What's really cool
to me These are raw, unedited conversations, none of which
have ever been heard before in their entirety, so we
get to capture the essence of Steve Sable as a
master interviewer. Today we feature an interview from with then
(00:50):
head coach of the San Francisco forty Niners Hall of
Famer Mike Singletary. Ye. Mike Singletary is best known for
(01:11):
his Hall of Fame career as the middle linebacker on
what many believe is the greatest defense of all time,
the Chicago Bears. When I think of Singletary, I conjure
up those classic shots of him in the NFL Films Library,
his eyes bulging at the line of scrimmage, ready to
attack his prey. But in my years covering and working
(01:32):
with Singletary, what always stood out for me was that
he was very deliberate and thoughtful when he spoke. Literally,
every word that came out of his mouth seemed to
do so with intent and meaning. But Mike also had
this intensity when he played, and he brought that intensity
to his coaching. He spent twenty four years in the NFL,
(01:53):
twelve as a player and twelve as a coach. The
interview you're about to hear took place at Mike's house
in the summer of a year and a half after
he took over as head coach in San Francisco. Now, look,
we're all products of our life experiences, and as you'll
hear in this interview, Mike Singletary had many influences. The
(02:14):
coaches he played for and coached with help shaped his
performance as a player and his philosophy as a head
coach and for someone who epitomizes what you think of
as the quintessential tough football player. For Singletary, perhaps the
two most influential people in his life were strong, tough women.
(02:34):
His late mother Rudel and his wife Kim. So let's
go to the vault for Steve Sable and Mike Singletary. Alright, alright,
all right, Mike. I have a theory about players International
Football League and why they play. I think there's usually
for reasons. One is that your father or your brother played. Two,
(02:59):
you've dreamed about playing in the National football like your
whole life. The third reason might be money, and the
fourth reason is just like physical contact. For you, which
of those four was it or was it something else
or a combination of those. It may may be a
combination of of all of those things. UM. Certainly I
(03:21):
didn't have a father or brother play. It was against
our religion growing up. My father with the penal constal
pastor so UM that wasn't happening. Um. By me being
the last of ten kids, I was the only one
that had a chance to play. UM. The other thing was, um,
when my mom and dad got a divorce when I
(03:42):
was twelve, I really I was playing football. I loved
the game, and um it was it was a way
for me to identify myself in terms of, um, this
is who I am, that this is who I I
want to be and uh. And at the same time,
(04:05):
as as a teenager. UM, you know when you're going
through adolescens and some of those other things that it
gives you a chance to work out maybe some of
the um, the ignorance of youth that you have at
that time. UM. You know you kind of upset, angry
at the world and things like that because you're trying
to figure things out. Why why why, you know, why
(04:28):
is my dad not here? Why is mom have to
work so hard? All of those things, and and then
that the probably the last one is just really um
looking at football as as something a way to to
help my my family, to help my mother, UM, sisters
and brothers. UM, to go to the next level on
(04:50):
my own family. You said, your mother gave you the
greatest pep talk that you've ever had in your life.
What what was that? Well, at twelve years old, she
just said, UM, son, I need you to I need
you to grow up. I need you to be the
man of the house. UM. There is greatness in you,
and it's just a matter of you finding it. Uh.
(05:12):
It takes time, it takes work, UM, but it's there
and if you're willing to find it, um, you know
that's the challenge for you and you know, life is
hard for everybody's son, but um, you gotta keep fighting,
you gotta keep swinging, and that's the way you're gonna
get there. Did that sinking at the time or did
that Oh it hit home, It definitely did. Um. You
(05:36):
know the series of questions at that time. You know,
she and my my father had just divorced. My brother
Grady was killed in an automobile accident about six months later,
and uh, you know, you felt like nothing was going right.
You felt like this is ridiculous, how could this be happening? Um,
So there was just that feeling of how do I
(05:58):
get out of this? And uh, that day when she
sat me down and talked to me and asked me
to become the man of the house, it gave me
an opportunity to focus on something bigger than me, um,
and focus on her and and focus on the home
at that time and in my future. Why was your
father against you playing football? My father was a Pene
(06:22):
Coastal pastor and in the Pente Coastal um religion. UM,
anything that anywhere near any any type of violence of
hitting each other, anything that could take your focus off UM,
love and and God was not something that was good.
(06:45):
Is there is there a vestige of that still in you?
From from what your father is saying, I think. Uh.
The thing that my father came to realize many years
later was that you know, there there's certain gifts that
each of us are given and when one had the
(07:05):
opportunity to um, to take those gifts and and do
the best that we can with those gifts. Um. And
for me, it was all about going out and expressing
my thanks for the gift that that God had given me.
One was football, and um, you know, every time I
had the opportunity to go out and play, it was
(07:26):
an opportunity for me to say thank you Lord for
for the gift that you gave me. So you wrote
down goals when you were young, right, I mean that
do you actually have Do you still have that piece
of paper that you didn't? But do you remember what
what some of the things were that and you and
you actually took a piece of paper and a pencil
and you wrote these goals one by one. Yes, I did. Um.
(07:49):
It was the same day that my mom talked to me.
It was after that conversation that I went to my room. Now,
granted I had these thoughts in my mind all the time.
I was always sitting around looking at the clouds, looking
in the sky, praying and asking the Lord what is
my purpose? What what what am I to do with
my life? Or why am I here? And um, so
(08:10):
I had some ideas, but I never had the courage
to write them down. And after that conversation that that
my mom had with me, um about being a man
at the house, then, uh, that that pushed me over
the edge. Um too. It was a call to action.
And so at that time, that's when I went in
the room. I knew what they were and I just
(08:31):
began to write out. Um, get a scholarship to college.
That was number one. Become an All American in college
that was two. And then of course get my degree,
get drafted and go to the NFL. Um by my
mom a house, become an all pro, go to the
Super Bowl, and own my own business. A coach was
(08:53):
not on your list, No, no, it was not. Of course.
Long before he went into coaching single r he was
the captain of the Bears defense. Remember he dubbed himself
Samurai Mike in the famous Super Bowl shuffle. You know
some of those lyrics I can sort of still hear them,
I stopped them cold. I'm setting a style nobody messes
(09:13):
in my neighborhood. Blame me, Singletary single. Darry's saying that
a lot better than I just tried to recite it.
But look, you have to understand the dynamic that Singletary
was dealing with at that time. Defensive coordinator Buddy Ryan
and head coach My Ditka famously did not get along.
It was Dicka's team, but Buddy's defense. In fact, when
(09:35):
the Bears won the Super Bowl, it was the first
time a defensive coordinator, along with the head coach, was
carried off the field on the shoulders of his players.
So Singletary's loyalties were to the team, but also to
Buddy Ryan. In fact, following the firing of Bears coach
Neil Armstrong, which led to Dickas hiring the entire defense,
(09:58):
including Singletary, wrote a letter to ownership petitioning to keep
Ryan as defensive coordinator. Singletary successfully straddle the line between
Ditka and Ryan, all the while inching closer to becoming
a coach himself. When you were with the Bears, you
were your last couple of years, you were sort of
a player coach at that point, could you call yourself
(10:20):
a player coach? Um, you can call it that. But
I were a liaison between the team and Cuss, Yes, Sir,
I would say that I was. I would be the
guy that if something was wrong, you want to come
to me and say what's wrong or how do we
get it straight? Um, So that that's something that that
you go to Micro to Buddy. I would go to
(10:42):
whoever I needed to go to. If it was a
defensive deal, I would go to Buddy. If it was
um more of an offensive or a bigger thing team whatever,
I would go to coach Dita. You know when you
you talk about football teams and there's such a talk
now of chemistry and camaraderie and but and you look
at that Bears team and sometimes to an outsider, I mean,
(11:04):
it looks like chaos. I mean, the two coaches didn't
seem to get along. And yet that team to this
day is still considered by many the greatest team ever.
And yet when you talk about you know, teamwork and
everybody pulling together, to people on the outside that it
doesn't seem that way. Well, I think we're both right,
(11:26):
the people on the inside and people on the outside.
I think, Uh, the greatest thing that I learned about
that experience and that team is that when you want
to win a championship, you can put a group of
guys together and they can win a championship. When you
want to form a dynasty, you have to have chemistry.
(11:50):
That's the difference. So you didn't think you had the
chemistry because that you never had the dynasty. So you're
saying that you didn't have the chemistry, but you had
the talent. We had the talent. We had the talent
for one year um, but after that we did not
have the maturity or the wisdom um to pull it
(12:10):
back together and say, hey, look, it's about the team.
Let let's stay together, let's stay focused on we didn't
have them. Must have been frustrating for you. It was
very frustrating. Yes it was, Yes, it was frustrating, But
to me also fascinating the idea that one of the
greatest players on one of the greatest defenses of all
(12:30):
time is able to articulate why the Bears of the
eighties never became a dynasty. And believe me, you heard
this all the time. How could that Bears team with
that defense only win one Super Bowl. But remember Buddy
Ryan was off to Philadelphia the following season, just one
factor why the team was never the same. When we
(12:52):
come back, Steve digs into Singletary's coaching career with the
forty Niners, including one of the most memorable press conferences
in NFL history. Welcome back to Tales from the Vault.
When Mike Singletary became the forty Niners head coach in
two thousand and eight, he made an immediate splash. This
was a Hall of Fame player joining a team that
(13:14):
was an arch rival in his playing days. In his
very first game as head coach, he made national news.
Not only did he just bench star tight end Vernon Davis,
he sent him to the locker room after committing a
personal foul penalty that Singletary deemed to be selfish. This
is how I believe. Okay, I'm from the old school.
I believe this. I would rather play with ten people
(13:39):
and just get penalized all the way until we got
to do something else, rather than play with eleven When
I know that right now that person is not sold
out to be a part of this team. It is
more about them than it is about the team cannot
play with him, cannot win with him, cannot coach with him,
can't do it. I want of news. I want people
(14:02):
that want to win. This press conference may have unwittingly
defined Singletary's head coaching career, but look, he was all
about tough love, something he learned from Buddy Ryan in
his very first game as a Bear in and as
Steve is about to explore. This experience in singletaries first
(14:23):
game as a player may have set the stage for
how he handled his first game as a head coach.
I'm gonna make a big jump. Now you're with the Bears.
Your first play you're in I think you're playing the Chargers,
and you're smiling, so you must remember. Tell me what
happened on that play. It was my first start. Buddy Ryan,
(14:45):
um uh, he he didn't like rookies, and he certainly
didn't like me. And uh it was a long year
long training camp and and uh he was letting me play.
But but finally I was going to get a chance
to start. So he said, look, I'm gonna I'm gonna
let you start this week. But let me tell you something.
(15:06):
When you go in that game, you do exactly I
mean exactly what I say, and anything different than that,
you're gonna be back over there with me, yes, sir.
So we go out and we're playing the the high
flying UH San Diego Charger at that time, number one
offense in the league, and um, Buddy called the first defense.
(15:28):
UM two Z you know uh for three two Z? Okay, fine,
we we make the play. I make the play and
and um we get back in the huddle and I'm
I'm calling Buddy signaled in the call is three zy.
Gary Fensick thinks that is Tuesday again, and I said, no,
it is not Tuesday. It is three C. And so
(15:50):
Gary was arguing with me in the huddle. And I'm
from the school that the middle linebacker makes the call
and that's what it is. Um. So I called time
out because I'm not going to do anything different than
what Buddy says. I'm very literal. So I called time out,
and of course Buddy swearing at me the whole way
him on my way to the sideline, and I'm not
(16:11):
sure if I want to go now, But when I
get over there, I'm trying to explain to him, Buddy,
I'm doing exactly what you need to get over there
and sit down. Not quite that way, but get over
there and sit down, and uh, he went with a
totally different defense, which was a bunch of dbs. Um,
and I didn't play another play in the game. Is
(16:34):
there any way you can relate that to what you
did the Vernon Davis, you know, in in your first
year when you coached him and you and you took
him out of the game. Is there any Carl Earry
there or are you thinking this was done to me
once and to straighten this get out, I'm gonna I'm
gonna sit him down or is or is there no
correlation at all? You know, with with the way the
(16:55):
mind works. I really don't know. I don't think so.
I think what what happened between Vernon Davis and myself
was um um. It was just something that I would
do to my son. You know. Every time I talked
to our players, I have them understand I'm gonna love
you like I love my son. I'm gonna be honest
(17:15):
with you. Um. But if there's ever a time when
you overstep your boundaries, you hit that line, I'm gonna
deal with it, um, and in a very stern way,
because I want you to understand where I'm coming from.
I do mean what I say. Um, so that was
you know, Vernon just overstepped his boundaries. And you know,
(17:39):
I just I just made a call. When you say
overstepped his boundaries, what was he challenging your authority or
what was the reason that? Really it came down to
not thinking about the team. You know, the team is
the most important thing at all times. And uh, he
had just made a decision on the field that was
(18:00):
not a team decision. It was about him, and uh,
he exploded, couldn't have control his emotions, and um, really
put us in a bad situation. So he comes to
the sideline and I'm asking him what happened? And um,
you know he's talking about himself. You know, why is this? Well,
you know, why is this guy talking to me like this?
(18:20):
Why are there? It's wait wait, wait, this is not
about you. This is about our team. You just cost
us on the field. Well, coach, wait a minut you
don't understand where So I said, Okay, you're done, You're done,
And that was gonna be the extent of it. Just
go over there, inside down. Well, he goes on the
bench and he he continues to talk and another teammate.
For now, he's distracting the team. So I went over
(18:40):
and I asked our equipment guy. I said, is there
any rule whatsoever that would inhibit him from going into
the shower, because we don't need him out here. He's
done and all right, equipment guys said no. I said, okay, fine,
Bernon go in, you're done. And UM, and you know,
(19:01):
I really wasn't thinking about whatever became of it. Everybody's, oh,
he can't do that. Why what do you do that?
Why would he embarrass why? And you know what they UM,
I just believe that. Um, when you're on a team,
you have to think about the team. I don't care
who you are. Um, just like a family. When you're
(19:21):
in a family, the family is not about individual. It's
not about you. It's about the family. And so UM,
that's the only thing that that was about. But you
talked to Vernon down this was a huge thing and
his career now, I mean that that incident changed his
career around with a certain extent. Um. You know, I
(19:43):
I look at that and really, yes, yes, but but
I look at that, and there are a lot of
things that go into that. First of all, Vernon I've
told people this. I told people before that incident and
after that incident. Vernon is one of the nicest in
the visual you want to be around. Um. But I
(20:03):
just think he had a tough time finding the boundaries.
And I think, um, you know, as as the head coach,
one of the most important things for me to do
was established the boundaries and then keep them consistent for everyone.
And um, so I think that's what he had to understand.
And I think that's what all the players need to know,
(20:24):
is where the boundaries. And um, once they know what
the boundaries are, then then they can act accordingly. Okay,
So jumping in here with a little pop quiz. What
fun fact did we tell you about Steve Sable in
last week's podcast. If you don't remember, you need to
go back and listen. But but in all sincerity, Steve
(20:45):
was a movie aficionado dating back to his childhood and
as an adult he tried to see movies weekly. So,
in classic Steve fashion, he uses a current movie to
frame a coaching question to Singletary. I love how he
incorporates the premise of this movie and get Singletary really
thinking there's a movie out that just came out called inception.
(21:08):
Have you heard about it? Where they can put a
thought into your mind. You go to sleep and you're
a dreamer, and there's a they can put something into
your mind that makes could change your personality. If if
you had that power as a coach for your whole team,
what one thought would you want to implant? Put that
(21:29):
inception in every one of your players if you had
that power. If if I had that power, I think, um,
the thought that I would want to put into you know,
each player's mind would be the ability to trust one another. Um,
If if I can trust you, that would save me
(21:52):
so much time and energy. Well, I don't have to
think about are you going to do your job? Can
I depend on you? I know what your job is,
We've gone through the playbook, But are you really going
to do that? Because if I'm your teammate, and I've
been in this situation once before where I was on
a team where everybody could trust the other guy. And
(22:15):
when you can trust that guy next to you to
do his job, that makes your job. You can play
that much faster and you can think about what you're
doing and and your job without having to think about
is he gonna be there, so that that is probably
in a team sport, that is probably the number one
thing is the trust factor that I have for everybody
(22:37):
around me, that they can trust me to do my job. Um,
when you decided you wanted to become a coach, knowing
you the way I do, you must have really researched
that out. You must have made some phone calls. You
must have talked to other coaches. What, for instance, did
you call like a Bill Walls? Sure, did you talked
to with Joe Gibbs and and asked them about what
(23:00):
what is this going to do to my life? And
what did they say? Well? Um, you know, first and foremost,
the whole coaching thing came about and my wife and
I were praying about it. MHM. And I came home
one day from work and my wife looked at me
with tears in her eyes and said, Mike, it's time
(23:23):
to get out of the house. It's time to coach.
It's time to coach. So Um, I didn't really do
any research. I had done my research prior to retiring,
and it was at that time that I decided not
to coach, simply because I wanted to be a father
and I wanted to be a husband, uh, and I
wanted my kids to know who I was. UM, and
(23:46):
so I decided not to coach at that time. But
then after um uh several years, UM, my wife and
I begin to think about it and begin to pray
about it. And and when I came home him that day,
she said, Mike, Okay, it's time. It's time. So we
put a house on up for sale four days later.
(24:08):
But you didn't know where you were going to coach.
I didn't know I was going to coach. It's a
pretty risky decision, right, I mean, just put your head.
You didn't know what you had. No, you didn't know
where you're going to coach. You don't know what city
you were going to coach. You didn't know whether you
get a job. Right about that. I did know this.
I didn't know this. If God called us to coaching,
(24:28):
he was gonna work it out. And that that's all
I knew at that time, and that's all I needed
to know. And UM, so I talked about trust a
little while ago. I know that I can trust him,
so UM, I had no UM, it was a sense
of relief to know that I had we had been
called to uh such a great opportunity. Um, but it
(24:52):
was we knew that that he was going to be
faithful to lead us what we needed to go. So
Mike Singletary began his coaching path starting in Baltimore, where
he was hired in two thousand three to be Brian
Billicks linebackers coach. Mike Nolan was the Ravens defensive coordinator
at the time, and after just two seasons, Nolan was
hired by the forty Niners as head coach and took
(25:15):
Singletary with him to be his assistant head coach and
linebackers coach. When Nolan was fired midway through the two
thousand eighth season, Singletary was named interim coach. But that
Vernon Davis incident wasn't the only thing that happened in
his first game. There was another memorable moment that I'm
sure Singletary wants to forget, and truthfully, thank goodness, this
(25:37):
was two thousand and eight, predating the ubiquity of cell phones,
because can you imagine how this video would have gone viral?
At halftime in that same game, in which the Niners
were down twenty to three, Singletary, in a show of
disgust dropped his pants in the locker room. Now, look,
he was wearing boxers, but it got the attention of
(25:58):
the team, the media and for our purposes. Steve Sable, like,
when you took over the team, what was your first assessment.
I mean, you had a great press conference. I know
that they're the fire that burned in my heart for
this team to be successful, and that fire he's unconquerable
(26:20):
and it will not die. That seems so spontaneous and
so sincere at the time. I mean, what did what
did you see that when you first took over the
team that that that affected you that way. I think
after Mike Nolan and I talked um. You know, Mike
had a frustration with um, you know a number of things,
(26:42):
really trying to have the guys understand um that this
is the NFL and and guys, we we gotta go
to the next level and it's not about you, It's
about the team. And Mike really stressed that point, um.
And so when I had the opportunity to become the
(27:02):
head coach, one of the things that that he and
I talked about was, you know, just just be yourself,
just be who you are and trust your instincts, um,
And so that's that's what I did. I'm gonna be me.
And after that game, and I realized that we are
(27:23):
not doing the things that it takes to be a
great team. We're we're not on the right track. We're
going in the wrong direction. Um, I don't know where
it it. Uh, you know where we gotta start. But
for me, it's gonna start today, and it's gonna start now.
And I really want I'm big on communicating and making
sure that if I'm talking to someone, you understand exactly
(27:47):
what I'm saying. There is no misunderstanding about what we
have to do and what we're gonna do in time.
But um, you know, I don't want to hear a
whole lot of excuses, and I don't want to hear
a whole lot of songs than that. I just want
you to get out there and let's do it now.
When you dropped your pants in the locker room, now,
it was funny because I had a college coach that
(28:08):
did the same thing and got everybody's attention in a
way that was funny. But we really knew, we really
got the point. And then we went on and won
our next three games. After that, when you make a
decision like that, do you realize the humor in it?
Or it's this it's something that that's just totally spontaneous.
And then after you did it, you always oh, my god,
(28:30):
I shouldn't have done that. Well, the thing that I
learned that day very valuable lesson, Uh, you know, a
picture is worth a thousand words, um, is that the
media has grown so big. Um. You know, there were
things that coach Ditka did that I will not talk about,
but it was one of those things that they didn't
(28:52):
mention that I had on underwear, uh afterwards, and so
let's first call I get was from my wife, what
are you doing? Sweetheart? Come on? But so I said, okay,
I won't do that again. But it was a great
learning experience that day. And and of course for me,
you only have a couple of minutes at at halftime
to say what you need to say. So, you know,
(29:13):
a picture, here's worth a thousand words. Here's what it
looks like, here's what we're doing out there. So but
it was good. I found other ways to communicating out
to that I was in the locker room once were
loose Saban when he was at the Broncos. So upset,
he just tore his shirt off and he said, I'm
fifty five years old. I'll take on anybody in the
locker room right now. Come on up here. All you
(29:35):
guys are chicken ship. I'll fight you one at a time.
And I mean football is a game of grand passions
and bold gestures. I bet if we had ten other
players here, every guy would have a story of a
coach that did something like that to get their attention.
Singletary definitely got his players attention when he first got
the job in San Francisco, at the team's practice facility,
he had hundred tons of dirt trucked in and built
(29:59):
a hill of the players who nicknamed it the pain
that hill. That that sort of a statement in a way,
do you do you look at that as I mean,
when if you're trying to bring in free agents and
stuff and rookies, and I mean and they see that,
Uh that to me if I was a young player,
that that's that's that's a statement about the work ethic
(30:20):
that's going to have to take place in this in
this camp. Do you see it that way? Is it
is it a statement or or maybe as am I
reading a little too much into it. Um, maybe you
could say it's a statement. I think. Uh. I think
our players know and they understand, and they fully expect
that we're gonna outwork our opponent. We're going to do that.
(30:43):
I mean that that's square one before we do anything else.
We may not be as smart, we may not be
as talented, But I tell you what work here. Does
that mean the head coach has to sleep on the
couch at night? And uh, now I'm gonna sleep at home.
I'm going to sleep in my bed with my wife,
with my kids at home. UM. I believe there's only
(31:06):
so many hours in a day, and every coach has
their own philosophy and I have mine. Um, I don't
believe that to be a coach that if I'm going
to be a great coach, it has to be at
the expense of my family. I don't think so. You
may have noticed that throughout this interview, Singletary consistently referred
(31:31):
to his wife Kim. You know that's saying behind every
great man as a great woman. Well, for Kim and Mike,
it's more like, beside every great man is this great woman.
When Singletary was inducted into the Pro Football Hall of Fame.
Kim became the first wife to ever introduce her husband
into the Hall. It's a true partnership between Mike and Kim,
(31:53):
who he refers to as his accountability partner to this day,
thirty seven years and going strong. When we come back,
Steve and Mike talk about the biggest influences that shape
Singletary as a head coach. Welcome back. Mike Singletary at
(32:15):
his core is a student of football, and is the
case with most great students. He had a lot of
impactful teachers. Buddy Ryan, his defensive coordinator in Chicago, Brian Billick,
who was the head coach in Baltimore when Singletary got
his first assistant coaching job, Dave McGinnis, who was the
Bears linebackers coach for the last seven years of Singletary's career,
(32:38):
and of course Mike did get the Bears head coach
for eleven of Singletary's twelve seasons. I think all head
coaches are sort of a mixture of all the people
that they played for, and I just wanted to go
through a couple that who have you've learned from? And
I wanted to start with Buddy Ryan. Buddy, UH taught
me a discipline. Uh. That was the number one thing. Um,
(33:02):
you have to be disciplined to play on that defense,
particularly running the forty, because everybody had their job and
we had to execute, and if one person messed up,
then defense not only look like chaos, Uh, it was chaos.
So UM, we really really had to do that. That
was the number one thing discipline. The other side of
(33:24):
that was ownership. I learned the value of ownership. Buddy
trusted me as I earned the right, uh to have
that trust in in being able to make certain adjustments
on the field. And UM, when you give a player ownership,
(33:46):
you're telling him that I trust you. I'm putting my
career in your hands, and you go out there and
you make these adjustments. Make sure you know what the
heck you're doing, because I'm standing over here and I'm
I'm saying, you make the call. So UM, that went
a long way for UH. It said to me that
(34:07):
I needed to do all that I could do to
make sure that I prepared and UH make darn sure
that when I called something, I knew why I was
calling it. And that was extremely important for me to
about Brian Billick. Brian Billy organization. Organization was key for
Brian Billick. I thought Brian was tremendous UH as an organizer. UM,
(34:32):
he knew what everybody was supposed to be doing. He
knew the description of their jobs, he knew the time
in which they were supposed to be doing it. And
he cut out all of the dead time and made
sure that if you said, if you're saying that you're
supposed to do this by, then here's the deadline. I
don't want to hear anything else. That's what you have. Now.
(34:54):
When you finish, you do what you have to do,
but make sure that that job is done. That an
ability and organization to me, UM spoke volumes to me. Uh.
Dave McGinnis, Dave McGinnis, UM, friendship, loyalty, Uh Dave McGinnis.
When he came to the Bears, UM he and UH
(35:18):
coach Tobin it was it was great. I mean he
was a guy that UM, you know, trying to get
it all all down and he he UM he had
this this linebacker that MS has been all pro and
UM m v P and and UM, you know, Dave
comes in and says, Hey, this is the way, we're
(35:40):
gonna do it, and we're gonna work this way. And
he questions and he but he always he always sat
me down and he was always straight to me, Mike, I,
I you know, I know you're all pro and I
know this, but you got to get this done. This
isn't happening like you want it. And he always kept
me abreast of where I was and never let me
(36:04):
get into the the public all of the stuff that
was happening. He always kept it real, said, this is
where you are. I don't care what they say. This
is where I see you. Now, you're gonna work to
get to this next level. Are you gonna earn what?
What they're saying that you're a great player? Are you
gonna earn that? So what part of your career was that?
That was? Well, he was there the rest of my
(36:26):
career after Buddy left in and I retired in ninety two,
So you were still at the top of your game.
So when when I but Coach McGinnis really challenged me
all the time. Um, you know one of the questions
that he would ask, um, if you want to know
the truth, Yes, I want to know the truth. Well,
(36:48):
it's not what you think it is, but here it is, UM.
And I really really appreciated that. I needed that. And
he could have been the guy that said, hey, Mike,
you're the greatest. Let's go out there and do your job.
You're you're the best. He didn't do that, and UH,
I will always value that relationship and that friendship and
that honesty that he had with me. Coach Didka. What
(37:09):
what did you take away from him? Is there a
part of Coach Didka that takes the field with you
on Sundays UM when I I'm trying to cut it
down or more. UM. But the thing about Coach Didka
to me is he was a true visionary. He knew
(37:31):
what it was supposed to look like. You couldn't con
him as a team UM to make him think that
you were working hard. UM. He knew when we got
in a good day and he knew when we did not. Uh.
He was always honest with us, very straightforward. UM. Did
not take any excuses. UM. I thought when his first
(37:55):
three years with the Bears, I thought that he was
on his way to be in there the greatest coach ever. UM.
And unfortunately, the other thing that I learned from Coach
Ditka and I talked to him about this as well.
Was was how distractions can take you away from the
very thing that you love. Um. You know, the city
(38:18):
of Chicago was so great and we won and and
yes we had the characters and everything else, but none
of us had the wisdom to UH, to realize how
difficult it was gonna be to to bring all of
these egos and all of this pride back underneath this
(38:38):
umbrella and say let's do it again. It got so
far out there then it was just next thing impossible
to bring it back in. Um and um So coach
and I have talked about it many times, and there
are a number of things that he would do differently,
but I I think that the thing that he taught
me the most was be astionate about what you're doing
(39:01):
and have a vision for what it is that you're
trying to do, and be focused on it. Um. That's
in now Here's a question that it comes up a lot,
is that it seems when you look at the history
of the game, it's so difficult for great players to
be great coaches. And I mean you can go through
(39:21):
a litany starting with Bob Waterfield, Norm van Brocklin, Otto
Graham bart Star, Joe Schmidt. I'm sure you've heard it.
There's that maybe three that I could think of. Of course,
coach did Ray Berry took an team to the super Bowl,
and Forest Gregg. Why do you think, Mike, it's so
hard for a great player to become a great coaches
(39:45):
that the great player does things so instinctively that it's
hard for him to teach or or or their standards
so high that everybody's so uncomfortable that they can't perform.
And I think I was very fortunate it uh to
be a guy that that really had ability, not great ability,
(40:08):
but had just enough ability that if he were to
work his tail off, he could be become an elite
player if he was to to out work and and
i'll think out smart all these other things, the the
added uh things that would make a great player. Um,
I was willing to do that. And that was the
(40:29):
question that I had for all of my coaches, and
they all realized, I mean, I didn't have great talent,
but my question was how do I become the best?
And so they would give me as I don't think
about me, don't think about my ability, Just tell me
how do I become the best. Okay, well, Mike, there's
(40:51):
a lot of stuff. How do I become? So they
would answer that and just list it out. And so
the challenge was on me to answer the question as
to whether I was gonna do it or not. Was
I gonna pay lip service to it, or was I
going to actually do it? And so I think for me,
when I talked to our players, the thing that I
(41:12):
want them to understand is don't sit down and tell
me what you can't do, but really really be honest
with me and tell me what you don't want to do.
That's a big difference. So I had to work to
get it. I have to work to earn it, and
I know it can be done. Um, So it's just
(41:34):
a matter of a guy being willing to work. So
I'm not asking a guy to be magic. I'm not
asking him to uh, you know, jump stool buildings or
anything like that. I'm just asking him to become the
best that he can be. I did an interview with
Lombardi once and he said that a great coach has
to be one half teacher and one half son of
(41:55):
a bit. Well, um, I know that I'm one half teacher. Uh.
The other part I would say is um I would
I would just say that I'm I'm one half teacher
and maybe one half dad. That would be a so
(42:17):
you you you what you're doing is to recognize or
has to be a maybe a tough side and a
demanding side. It get that goes along with a teacher, absolutely. Uh.
It's it's the combination of love and discipline. I think
if you have too much love, uh, then you're gonna
have problems. If you have too much discipline, you're gonna
(42:39):
have problems. And I think every coach has to look
at his team and look at the balance of what
he has. Uh. Does you have a lot of guys
that you know you have to bring about discipline or
do you have a lot of guys where you have
to bring about the other side of it? But when
you find that balance because you know your team, um,
then the a chance you can get it right. You
(43:02):
seem to me a coach in a in a in
a throwback way about motivation. And that's sort of an
interesting subject because Chuck Nold would say that I don't
have these meta professionals. If they can't motivate themselves, then
they don't beat, they don't they don't belong here, and
that there other k coaches like Lombardi was certainly one
that that motivated every day. And where do you put
(43:24):
yourself as far as motivation? Well, I look at it
this way. I think, Um, the better the player, the
less you have to motivate. And when I look at
Chuck Nol, I agree. One, But what do you have
to say? Why in the heck are the motivating? You
got Joe Green, you got Lambert, you got I mean
everybody out there in the Hall of Fame. No, I
don't have to. So they motivated themselves. Bingo, Um you
(43:48):
were you were a self motivator, right, yes, yes, Um,
but I I think you look at Bill Belichick, you
know they're now they're there's a different deal. Now you
have a team, you have amstry, you have those things
when he was winning those championships. Um. So I think
it's it's up to the coach that you have to
(44:08):
look at what you have. What do I have to
do more? Do I have to motivate these guys? Um?
Or do I have to um really manage the situation
and make it sure that they don't kill each other?
To me, the best thing that I can have that happen. UM. Two.
The players that I coach is when they're done and
(44:32):
when they moved on that they're successful fathers, they're successful husbands,
and their men of integrity. UM, they work hard. So
those are the things that any player that comes through
the forty nine and organization UM, a few years down
the road, I would hope that that's a tread that
(44:55):
they would have UM, because that to me is is
that's the ending right there. This interview was conducted in August. Unfortunately,
Mike Singletary would be fired just a few months later,
prior to the last game of the season. He's since
(45:15):
been an assistant coach in the NFL and even was
a high school head coach, but hasn't returned to the
sidelines of an NFL team as a head coach. Look
Singletary's passionate intensity were very much on display in this interview,
but for me, the question that I just found most
fascinating was Steve asking why great players aren't successful as
(45:37):
head coaches. Keep in mind that since the only former
NFL players to win the Super Bowl as head coaches
have been back up quarterbacks, and there's only two of them.
Gary Kubiak of the Broncos and Doug Peterson with the Eagles.
Singletary's knowledge of the game as a player was never
in question, but he never seemed to have the ability
(45:59):
to train slate that knowledge to being a successful head coach.
Next week, we've got a real special one for you.
I dug deep into the vault. I went to the
top shelf. In fact, yeah, I need a ladder for that,
but I found another defensive Hall of Famer gem Steve's
(46:20):
four interview with Deacon Jones is a classic you won't
want to miss. I sure hope you'll join me. Thanks
for listening. I'm Andrea Kramer.
Welcome to NFL Films Tales from the Vault. I'm your host,
Andrea Kramer. When I started my career at NFL Films
as a producer, the lead Steve Sable was my boss
and mentor. Every week on this podcast, we bring you
the best of Steve if you will digging into the
NFL Films Vault, where there are over fifty thousand cans
(00:27):
of film and over two interviews between Steve and some
of the greatest figures in NFL history. What's really cool
to me These are raw, unedited conversations, none of which
have ever been heard before in their entirety, so we
get to capture the essence of Steve Sable as a
master interviewer. Today we feature an interview from with then
(00:50):
head coach of the San Francisco forty Niners Hall of
Famer Mike Singletary. Ye. Mike Singletary is best known for
(01:11):
his Hall of Fame career as the middle linebacker on
what many believe is the greatest defense of all time,
the Chicago Bears. When I think of Singletary, I conjure
up those classic shots of him in the NFL Films Library,
his eyes bulging at the line of scrimmage, ready to
attack his prey. But in my years covering and working
(01:32):
with Singletary, what always stood out for me was that
he was very deliberate and thoughtful when he spoke. Literally,
every word that came out of his mouth seemed to
do so with intent and meaning. But Mike also had
this intensity when he played, and he brought that intensity
to his coaching. He spent twenty four years in the NFL,
(01:53):
twelve as a player and twelve as a coach. The
interview you're about to hear took place at Mike's house
in the summer of a year and a half after
he took over as head coach in San Francisco. Now, look,
we're all products of our life experiences, and as you'll
hear in this interview, Mike Singletary had many influences. The
(02:14):
coaches he played for and coached with help shaped his
performance as a player and his philosophy as a head
coach and for someone who epitomizes what you think of
as the quintessential tough football player. For Singletary, perhaps the
two most influential people in his life were strong, tough women.
(02:34):
His late mother Rudel and his wife Kim. So let's
go to the vault for Steve Sable and Mike Singletary. Alright, alright,
all right, Mike. I have a theory about players International
Football League and why they play. I think there's usually
for reasons. One is that your father or your brother played. Two,
(02:59):
you've dreamed about playing in the National football like your
whole life. The third reason might be money, and the
fourth reason is just like physical contact. For you, which
of those four was it or was it something else
or a combination of those. It may may be a
combination of of all of those things. UM. Certainly I
(03:21):
didn't have a father or brother play. It was against
our religion growing up. My father with the penal constal
pastor so UM that wasn't happening. Um. By me being
the last of ten kids, I was the only one
that had a chance to play. UM. The other thing was, um,
when my mom and dad got a divorce when I
(03:42):
was twelve, I really I was playing football. I loved
the game, and um it was it was a way
for me to identify myself in terms of, um, this
is who I am, that this is who I I
want to be and uh. And at the same time,
(04:05):
as as a teenager. UM, you know when you're going
through adolescens and some of those other things that it
gives you a chance to work out maybe some of
the um, the ignorance of youth that you have at
that time. UM. You know you kind of upset, angry
at the world and things like that because you're trying
to figure things out. Why why why, you know, why
(04:28):
is my dad not here? Why is mom have to
work so hard? All of those things, and and then
that the probably the last one is just really um
looking at football as as something a way to to
help my my family, to help my mother, UM, sisters
and brothers. UM, to go to the next level on
(04:50):
my own family. You said, your mother gave you the
greatest pep talk that you've ever had in your life.
What what was that? Well, at twelve years old, she
just said, UM, son, I need you to I need
you to grow up. I need you to be the
man of the house. UM. There is greatness in you,
and it's just a matter of you finding it. Uh.
(05:12):
It takes time, it takes work, UM, but it's there
and if you're willing to find it, um, you know
that's the challenge for you and you know, life is
hard for everybody's son, but um, you gotta keep fighting,
you gotta keep swinging, and that's the way you're gonna
get there. Did that sinking at the time or did
that Oh it hit home, It definitely did. Um. You
(05:36):
know the series of questions at that time. You know,
she and my my father had just divorced. My brother
Grady was killed in an automobile accident about six months later,
and uh, you know, you felt like nothing was going right.
You felt like this is ridiculous, how could this be happening? Um,
So there was just that feeling of how do I
(05:58):
get out of this? And uh, that day when she
sat me down and talked to me and asked me
to become the man of the house, it gave me
an opportunity to focus on something bigger than me, um,
and focus on her and and focus on the home
at that time and in my future. Why was your
father against you playing football? My father was a Pene
(06:22):
Coastal pastor and in the Pente Coastal um religion. UM,
anything that anywhere near any any type of violence of
hitting each other, anything that could take your focus off UM,
love and and God was not something that was good.
(06:45):
Is there is there a vestige of that still in you?
From from what your father is saying, I think. Uh.
The thing that my father came to realize many years
later was that you know, there there's certain gifts that
each of us are given and when one had the
(07:05):
opportunity to um, to take those gifts and and do
the best that we can with those gifts. Um. And
for me, it was all about going out and expressing
my thanks for the gift that that God had given me.
One was football, and um, you know, every time I
had the opportunity to go out and play, it was
(07:26):
an opportunity for me to say thank you Lord for
for the gift that you gave me. So you wrote
down goals when you were young, right, I mean that
do you actually have Do you still have that piece
of paper that you didn't? But do you remember what
what some of the things were that and you and
you actually took a piece of paper and a pencil
and you wrote these goals one by one. Yes, I did. Um.
(07:49):
It was the same day that my mom talked to me.
It was after that conversation that I went to my room. Now,
granted I had these thoughts in my mind all the time.
I was always sitting around looking at the clouds, looking
in the sky, praying and asking the Lord what is
my purpose? What what what am I to do with
my life? Or why am I here? And um, so
(08:10):
I had some ideas, but I never had the courage
to write them down. And after that conversation that that
my mom had with me, um about being a man
at the house, then, uh, that that pushed me over
the edge. Um too. It was a call to action.
And so at that time, that's when I went in
the room. I knew what they were and I just
(08:31):
began to write out. Um, get a scholarship to college.
That was number one. Become an All American in college
that was two. And then of course get my degree,
get drafted and go to the NFL. Um by my
mom a house, become an all pro, go to the
Super Bowl, and own my own business. A coach was
(08:53):
not on your list, No, no, it was not. Of course.
Long before he went into coaching single r he was
the captain of the Bears defense. Remember he dubbed himself
Samurai Mike in the famous Super Bowl shuffle. You know
some of those lyrics I can sort of still hear them,
I stopped them cold. I'm setting a style nobody messes
(09:13):
in my neighborhood. Blame me, Singletary single. Darry's saying that
a lot better than I just tried to recite it.
But look, you have to understand the dynamic that Singletary
was dealing with at that time. Defensive coordinator Buddy Ryan
and head coach My Ditka famously did not get along.
It was Dicka's team, but Buddy's defense. In fact, when
(09:35):
the Bears won the Super Bowl, it was the first
time a defensive coordinator, along with the head coach, was
carried off the field on the shoulders of his players.
So Singletary's loyalties were to the team, but also to
Buddy Ryan. In fact, following the firing of Bears coach
Neil Armstrong, which led to Dickas hiring the entire defense,
(09:58):
including Singletary, wrote a letter to ownership petitioning to keep
Ryan as defensive coordinator. Singletary successfully straddle the line between
Ditka and Ryan, all the while inching closer to becoming
a coach himself. When you were with the Bears, you
were your last couple of years, you were sort of
a player coach at that point, could you call yourself
(10:20):
a player coach? Um, you can call it that. But
I were a liaison between the team and Cuss, Yes, Sir,
I would say that I was. I would be the
guy that if something was wrong, you want to come
to me and say what's wrong or how do we
get it straight? Um, So that that's something that that
you go to Micro to Buddy. I would go to
(10:42):
whoever I needed to go to. If it was a
defensive deal, I would go to Buddy. If it was
um more of an offensive or a bigger thing team whatever,
I would go to coach Dita. You know when you
you talk about football teams and there's such a talk
now of chemistry and camaraderie and but and you look
at that Bears team and sometimes to an outsider, I mean,
(11:04):
it looks like chaos. I mean, the two coaches didn't
seem to get along. And yet that team to this
day is still considered by many the greatest team ever.
And yet when you talk about you know, teamwork and
everybody pulling together, to people on the outside that it
doesn't seem that way. Well, I think we're both right,
(11:26):
the people on the inside and people on the outside.
I think, Uh, the greatest thing that I learned about
that experience and that team is that when you want
to win a championship, you can put a group of
guys together and they can win a championship. When you
want to form a dynasty, you have to have chemistry.
(11:50):
That's the difference. So you didn't think you had the
chemistry because that you never had the dynasty. So you're
saying that you didn't have the chemistry, but you had
the talent. We had the talent. We had the talent
for one year um, but after that we did not
have the maturity or the wisdom um to pull it
(12:10):
back together and say, hey, look, it's about the team.
Let let's stay together, let's stay focused on we didn't
have them. Must have been frustrating for you. It was
very frustrating. Yes it was, Yes, it was frustrating, But
to me also fascinating the idea that one of the
greatest players on one of the greatest defenses of all
(12:30):
time is able to articulate why the Bears of the
eighties never became a dynasty. And believe me, you heard
this all the time. How could that Bears team with
that defense only win one Super Bowl. But remember Buddy
Ryan was off to Philadelphia the following season, just one
factor why the team was never the same. When we
(12:52):
come back, Steve digs into Singletary's coaching career with the
forty Niners, including one of the most memorable press conferences
in NFL history. Welcome back to Tales from the Vault.
When Mike Singletary became the forty Niners head coach in
two thousand and eight, he made an immediate splash. This
was a Hall of Fame player joining a team that
(13:14):
was an arch rival in his playing days. In his
very first game as head coach, he made national news.
Not only did he just bench star tight end Vernon Davis,
he sent him to the locker room after committing a
personal foul penalty that Singletary deemed to be selfish. This
is how I believe. Okay, I'm from the old school.
I believe this. I would rather play with ten people
(13:39):
and just get penalized all the way until we got
to do something else, rather than play with eleven When
I know that right now that person is not sold
out to be a part of this team. It is
more about them than it is about the team cannot
play with him, cannot win with him, cannot coach with him,
can't do it. I want of news. I want people
(14:02):
that want to win. This press conference may have unwittingly
defined Singletary's head coaching career, but look, he was all
about tough love, something he learned from Buddy Ryan in
his very first game as a Bear in and as
Steve is about to explore. This experience in singletaries first
(14:23):
game as a player may have set the stage for
how he handled his first game as a head coach.
I'm gonna make a big jump. Now you're with the Bears.
Your first play you're in I think you're playing the Chargers,
and you're smiling, so you must remember. Tell me what
happened on that play. It was my first start. Buddy Ryan,
(14:45):
um uh, he he didn't like rookies, and he certainly
didn't like me. And uh it was a long year
long training camp and and uh he was letting me play.
But but finally I was going to get a chance
to start. So he said, look, I'm gonna I'm gonna
let you start this week. But let me tell you something.
(15:06):
When you go in that game, you do exactly I
mean exactly what I say, and anything different than that,
you're gonna be back over there with me, yes, sir.
So we go out and we're playing the the high
flying UH San Diego Charger at that time, number one
offense in the league, and um, Buddy called the first defense.
(15:28):
UM two Z you know uh for three two Z? Okay, fine,
we we make the play. I make the play and
and um we get back in the huddle and I'm
I'm calling Buddy signaled in the call is three zy.
Gary Fensick thinks that is Tuesday again, and I said, no,
it is not Tuesday. It is three C. And so
(15:50):
Gary was arguing with me in the huddle. And I'm
from the school that the middle linebacker makes the call
and that's what it is. Um. So I called time
out because I'm not going to do anything different than
what Buddy says. I'm very literal. So I called time out,
and of course Buddy swearing at me the whole way
him on my way to the sideline, and I'm not
(16:11):
sure if I want to go now, But when I
get over there, I'm trying to explain to him, Buddy,
I'm doing exactly what you need to get over there
and sit down. Not quite that way, but get over
there and sit down, and uh, he went with a
totally different defense, which was a bunch of dbs. Um,
and I didn't play another play in the game. Is
(16:34):
there any way you can relate that to what you
did the Vernon Davis, you know, in in your first
year when you coached him and you and you took
him out of the game. Is there any Carl Earry
there or are you thinking this was done to me
once and to straighten this get out, I'm gonna I'm
gonna sit him down or is or is there no
correlation at all? You know, with with the way the
(16:55):
mind works. I really don't know. I don't think so.
I think what what happened between Vernon Davis and myself
was um um. It was just something that I would
do to my son. You know. Every time I talked
to our players, I have them understand I'm gonna love
you like I love my son. I'm gonna be honest
(17:15):
with you. Um. But if there's ever a time when
you overstep your boundaries, you hit that line, I'm gonna
deal with it, um, and in a very stern way,
because I want you to understand where I'm coming from.
I do mean what I say. Um, so that was
you know, Vernon just overstepped his boundaries. And you know,
(17:39):
I just I just made a call. When you say
overstepped his boundaries, what was he challenging your authority or
what was the reason that? Really it came down to
not thinking about the team. You know, the team is
the most important thing at all times. And uh, he
had just made a decision on the field that was
(18:00):
not a team decision. It was about him, and uh,
he exploded, couldn't have control his emotions, and um, really
put us in a bad situation. So he comes to
the sideline and I'm asking him what happened? And um,
you know he's talking about himself. You know, why is this? Well,
you know, why is this guy talking to me like this?
(18:20):
Why are there? It's wait wait, wait, this is not
about you. This is about our team. You just cost
us on the field. Well, coach, wait a minut you
don't understand where So I said, Okay, you're done, You're done,
And that was gonna be the extent of it. Just
go over there, inside down. Well, he goes on the
bench and he he continues to talk and another teammate.
For now, he's distracting the team. So I went over
(18:40):
and I asked our equipment guy. I said, is there
any rule whatsoever that would inhibit him from going into
the shower, because we don't need him out here. He's
done and all right, equipment guys said no. I said, okay, fine,
Bernon go in, you're done. And UM, and you know,
(19:01):
I really wasn't thinking about whatever became of it. Everybody's, oh,
he can't do that. Why what do you do that?
Why would he embarrass why? And you know what they UM,
I just believe that. Um, when you're on a team,
you have to think about the team. I don't care
who you are. Um, just like a family. When you're
(19:21):
in a family, the family is not about individual. It's
not about you. It's about the family. And so UM,
that's the only thing that that was about. But you
talked to Vernon down this was a huge thing and
his career now, I mean that that incident changed his
career around with a certain extent. Um. You know, I
(19:43):
I look at that and really, yes, yes, but but
I look at that, and there are a lot of
things that go into that. First of all, Vernon I've
told people this. I told people before that incident and
after that incident. Vernon is one of the nicest in
the visual you want to be around. Um. But I
(20:03):
just think he had a tough time finding the boundaries.
And I think, um, you know, as as the head coach,
one of the most important things for me to do
was established the boundaries and then keep them consistent for everyone.
And um, so I think that's what he had to understand.
And I think that's what all the players need to know,
(20:24):
is where the boundaries. And um, once they know what
the boundaries are, then then they can act accordingly. Okay,
So jumping in here with a little pop quiz. What
fun fact did we tell you about Steve Sable in
last week's podcast. If you don't remember, you need to
go back and listen. But but in all sincerity, Steve
(20:45):
was a movie aficionado dating back to his childhood and
as an adult he tried to see movies weekly. So,
in classic Steve fashion, he uses a current movie to
frame a coaching question to Singletary. I love how he
incorporates the premise of this movie and get Singletary really
thinking there's a movie out that just came out called inception.
(21:08):
Have you heard about it? Where they can put a
thought into your mind. You go to sleep and you're
a dreamer, and there's a they can put something into
your mind that makes could change your personality. If if
you had that power as a coach for your whole team,
what one thought would you want to implant? Put that
(21:29):
inception in every one of your players if you had
that power. If if I had that power, I think, um,
the thought that I would want to put into you know,
each player's mind would be the ability to trust one another. Um,
If if I can trust you, that would save me
(21:52):
so much time and energy. Well, I don't have to
think about are you going to do your job? Can
I depend on you? I know what your job is,
We've gone through the playbook, But are you really going
to do that? Because if I'm your teammate, and I've
been in this situation once before where I was on
a team where everybody could trust the other guy. And
(22:15):
when you can trust that guy next to you to
do his job, that makes your job. You can play
that much faster and you can think about what you're
doing and and your job without having to think about
is he gonna be there, so that that is probably
in a team sport, that is probably the number one
thing is the trust factor that I have for everybody
(22:37):
around me, that they can trust me to do my job. Um,
when you decided you wanted to become a coach, knowing
you the way I do, you must have really researched
that out. You must have made some phone calls. You
must have talked to other coaches. What, for instance, did
you call like a Bill Walls? Sure, did you talked
to with Joe Gibbs and and asked them about what
(23:00):
what is this going to do to my life? And
what did they say? Well? Um, you know, first and foremost,
the whole coaching thing came about and my wife and
I were praying about it. MHM. And I came home
one day from work and my wife looked at me
with tears in her eyes and said, Mike, it's time
(23:23):
to get out of the house. It's time to coach.
It's time to coach. So Um, I didn't really do
any research. I had done my research prior to retiring,
and it was at that time that I decided not
to coach, simply because I wanted to be a father
and I wanted to be a husband, uh, and I
wanted my kids to know who I was. UM, and
(23:46):
so I decided not to coach at that time. But
then after um uh several years, UM, my wife and
I begin to think about it and begin to pray
about it. And and when I came home him that day,
she said, Mike, Okay, it's time. It's time. So we
put a house on up for sale four days later.
(24:08):
But you didn't know where you were going to coach.
I didn't know I was going to coach. It's a
pretty risky decision, right, I mean, just put your head.
You didn't know what you had. No, you didn't know
where you're going to coach. You don't know what city
you were going to coach. You didn't know whether you
get a job. Right about that. I did know this.
I didn't know this. If God called us to coaching,
(24:28):
he was gonna work it out. And that that's all
I knew at that time, and that's all I needed
to know. And UM, so I talked about trust a
little while ago. I know that I can trust him,
so UM, I had no UM, it was a sense
of relief to know that I had we had been
called to uh such a great opportunity. Um, but it
(24:52):
was we knew that that he was going to be
faithful to lead us what we needed to go. So
Mike Singletary began his coaching path starting in Baltimore, where
he was hired in two thousand three to be Brian
Billicks linebackers coach. Mike Nolan was the Ravens defensive coordinator
at the time, and after just two seasons, Nolan was
hired by the forty Niners as head coach and took
(25:15):
Singletary with him to be his assistant head coach and
linebackers coach. When Nolan was fired midway through the two
thousand eighth season, Singletary was named interim coach. But that
Vernon Davis incident wasn't the only thing that happened in
his first game. There was another memorable moment that I'm
sure Singletary wants to forget, and truthfully, thank goodness, this
(25:37):
was two thousand and eight, predating the ubiquity of cell phones,
because can you imagine how this video would have gone viral?
At halftime in that same game, in which the Niners
were down twenty to three, Singletary, in a show of
disgust dropped his pants in the locker room. Now, look,
he was wearing boxers, but it got the attention of
(25:58):
the team, the media and for our purposes. Steve Sable, like,
when you took over the team, what was your first assessment.
I mean, you had a great press conference. I know
that they're the fire that burned in my heart for
this team to be successful, and that fire he's unconquerable
(26:20):
and it will not die. That seems so spontaneous and
so sincere at the time. I mean, what did what
did you see that when you first took over the
team that that that affected you that way. I think
after Mike Nolan and I talked um. You know, Mike
had a frustration with um, you know a number of things,
(26:42):
really trying to have the guys understand um that this
is the NFL and and guys, we we gotta go
to the next level and it's not about you, It's
about the team. And Mike really stressed that point, um.
And so when I had the opportunity to become the
(27:02):
head coach, one of the things that that he and
I talked about was, you know, just just be yourself,
just be who you are and trust your instincts, um,
And so that's that's what I did. I'm gonna be me.
And after that game, and I realized that we are
(27:23):
not doing the things that it takes to be a
great team. We're we're not on the right track. We're
going in the wrong direction. Um, I don't know where
it it. Uh, you know where we gotta start. But
for me, it's gonna start today, and it's gonna start now.
And I really want I'm big on communicating and making
sure that if I'm talking to someone, you understand exactly
(27:47):
what I'm saying. There is no misunderstanding about what we
have to do and what we're gonna do in time.
But um, you know, I don't want to hear a
whole lot of excuses, and I don't want to hear
a whole lot of songs than that. I just want
you to get out there and let's do it now.
When you dropped your pants in the locker room, now,
it was funny because I had a college coach that
(28:08):
did the same thing and got everybody's attention in a
way that was funny. But we really knew, we really
got the point. And then we went on and won
our next three games. After that, when you make a
decision like that, do you realize the humor in it?
Or it's this it's something that that's just totally spontaneous.
And then after you did it, you always oh, my god,
(28:30):
I shouldn't have done that. Well, the thing that I
learned that day very valuable lesson, Uh, you know, a
picture is worth a thousand words, um, is that the
media has grown so big. Um. You know, there were
things that coach Ditka did that I will not talk about,
but it was one of those things that they didn't
(28:52):
mention that I had on underwear, uh afterwards, and so
let's first call I get was from my wife, what
are you doing? Sweetheart? Come on? But so I said, okay,
I won't do that again. But it was a great
learning experience that day. And and of course for me,
you only have a couple of minutes at at halftime
to say what you need to say. So, you know,
(29:13):
a picture, here's worth a thousand words. Here's what it
looks like, here's what we're doing out there. So but
it was good. I found other ways to communicating out
to that I was in the locker room once were
loose Saban when he was at the Broncos. So upset,
he just tore his shirt off and he said, I'm
fifty five years old. I'll take on anybody in the
locker room right now. Come on up here. All you
(29:35):
guys are chicken ship. I'll fight you one at a time.
And I mean football is a game of grand passions
and bold gestures. I bet if we had ten other
players here, every guy would have a story of a
coach that did something like that to get their attention.
Singletary definitely got his players attention when he first got
the job in San Francisco, at the team's practice facility,
he had hundred tons of dirt trucked in and built
(29:59):
a hill of the players who nicknamed it the pain
that hill. That that sort of a statement in a way,
do you do you look at that as I mean,
when if you're trying to bring in free agents and
stuff and rookies, and I mean and they see that,
Uh that to me if I was a young player,
that that's that's that's a statement about the work ethic
(30:20):
that's going to have to take place in this in
this camp. Do you see it that way? Is it
is it a statement or or maybe as am I
reading a little too much into it. Um, maybe you
could say it's a statement. I think. Uh. I think
our players know and they understand, and they fully expect
that we're gonna outwork our opponent. We're going to do that.
(30:43):
I mean that that's square one before we do anything else.
We may not be as smart, we may not be
as talented, But I tell you what work here. Does
that mean the head coach has to sleep on the
couch at night? And uh, now I'm gonna sleep at home.
I'm going to sleep in my bed with my wife,
with my kids at home. UM. I believe there's only
(31:06):
so many hours in a day, and every coach has
their own philosophy and I have mine. Um, I don't
believe that to be a coach that if I'm going
to be a great coach, it has to be at
the expense of my family. I don't think so. You
may have noticed that throughout this interview, Singletary consistently referred
(31:31):
to his wife Kim. You know that's saying behind every
great man as a great woman. Well, for Kim and Mike,
it's more like, beside every great man is this great woman.
When Singletary was inducted into the Pro Football Hall of Fame.
Kim became the first wife to ever introduce her husband
into the Hall. It's a true partnership between Mike and Kim,
(31:53):
who he refers to as his accountability partner to this day,
thirty seven years and going strong. When we come back,
Steve and Mike talk about the biggest influences that shape
Singletary as a head coach. Welcome back. Mike Singletary at
(32:15):
his core is a student of football, and is the
case with most great students. He had a lot of
impactful teachers. Buddy Ryan, his defensive coordinator in Chicago, Brian Billick,
who was the head coach in Baltimore when Singletary got
his first assistant coaching job, Dave McGinnis, who was the
Bears linebackers coach for the last seven years of Singletary's career,
(32:38):
and of course Mike did get the Bears head coach
for eleven of Singletary's twelve seasons. I think all head
coaches are sort of a mixture of all the people
that they played for, and I just wanted to go
through a couple that who have you've learned from? And
I wanted to start with Buddy Ryan. Buddy, UH taught
me a discipline. Uh. That was the number one thing. Um,
(33:02):
you have to be disciplined to play on that defense,
particularly running the forty, because everybody had their job and
we had to execute, and if one person messed up,
then defense not only look like chaos, Uh, it was chaos.
So UM, we really really had to do that. That
was the number one thing discipline. The other side of
(33:24):
that was ownership. I learned the value of ownership. Buddy
trusted me as I earned the right, uh to have
that trust in in being able to make certain adjustments
on the field. And UM, when you give a player ownership,
(33:46):
you're telling him that I trust you. I'm putting my
career in your hands, and you go out there and
you make these adjustments. Make sure you know what the
heck you're doing, because I'm standing over here and I'm
I'm saying, you make the call. So UM, that went
a long way for UH. It said to me that
(34:07):
I needed to do all that I could do to
make sure that I prepared and UH make darn sure
that when I called something, I knew why I was
calling it. And that was extremely important for me to
about Brian Billick. Brian Billy organization. Organization was key for
Brian Billick. I thought Brian was tremendous UH as an organizer. UM,
(34:32):
he knew what everybody was supposed to be doing. He
knew the description of their jobs, he knew the time
in which they were supposed to be doing it. And
he cut out all of the dead time and made
sure that if you said, if you're saying that you're
supposed to do this by, then here's the deadline. I
don't want to hear anything else. That's what you have. Now.
(34:54):
When you finish, you do what you have to do,
but make sure that that job is done. That an
ability and organization to me, UM spoke volumes to me. Uh.
Dave McGinnis, Dave McGinnis, UM, friendship, loyalty, Uh Dave McGinnis.
When he came to the Bears, UM he and UH
(35:18):
coach Tobin it was it was great. I mean he
was a guy that UM, you know, trying to get
it all all down and he he UM he had
this this linebacker that MS has been all pro and
UM m v P and and UM, you know, Dave
comes in and says, Hey, this is the way, we're
(35:40):
gonna do it, and we're gonna work this way. And
he questions and he but he always he always sat
me down and he was always straight to me, Mike, I,
I you know, I know you're all pro and I
know this, but you got to get this done. This
isn't happening like you want it. And he always kept
me abreast of where I was and never let me
(36:04):
get into the the public all of the stuff that
was happening. He always kept it real, said, this is
where you are. I don't care what they say. This
is where I see you. Now, you're gonna work to
get to this next level. Are you gonna earn what?
What they're saying that you're a great player? Are you
gonna earn that? So what part of your career was that?
That was? Well, he was there the rest of my
(36:26):
career after Buddy left in and I retired in ninety two,
So you were still at the top of your game.
So when when I but Coach McGinnis really challenged me
all the time. Um, you know one of the questions
that he would ask, um, if you want to know
the truth, Yes, I want to know the truth. Well,
(36:48):
it's not what you think it is, but here it is, UM.
And I really really appreciated that. I needed that. And
he could have been the guy that said, hey, Mike,
you're the greatest. Let's go out there and do your job.
You're you're the best. He didn't do that, and UH,
I will always value that relationship and that friendship and
that honesty that he had with me. Coach Didka. What
(37:09):
what did you take away from him? Is there a
part of Coach Didka that takes the field with you
on Sundays UM when I I'm trying to cut it
down or more. UM. But the thing about Coach Didka
to me is he was a true visionary. He knew
(37:31):
what it was supposed to look like. You couldn't con
him as a team UM to make him think that
you were working hard. UM. He knew when we got
in a good day and he knew when we did not. Uh.
He was always honest with us, very straightforward. UM. Did
not take any excuses. UM. I thought when his first
(37:55):
three years with the Bears, I thought that he was
on his way to be in there the greatest coach ever. UM.
And unfortunately, the other thing that I learned from Coach
Ditka and I talked to him about this as well.
Was was how distractions can take you away from the
very thing that you love. Um. You know, the city
(38:18):
of Chicago was so great and we won and and
yes we had the characters and everything else, but none
of us had the wisdom to UH, to realize how
difficult it was gonna be to to bring all of
these egos and all of this pride back underneath this
(38:38):
umbrella and say let's do it again. It got so
far out there then it was just next thing impossible
to bring it back in. Um and um So coach
and I have talked about it many times, and there
are a number of things that he would do differently,
but I I think that the thing that he taught
me the most was be astionate about what you're doing
(39:01):
and have a vision for what it is that you're
trying to do, and be focused on it. Um. That's
in now Here's a question that it comes up a lot,
is that it seems when you look at the history
of the game, it's so difficult for great players to
be great coaches. And I mean you can go through
(39:21):
a litany starting with Bob Waterfield, Norm van Brocklin, Otto
Graham bart Star, Joe Schmidt. I'm sure you've heard it.
There's that maybe three that I could think of. Of course,
coach did Ray Berry took an team to the super Bowl,
and Forest Gregg. Why do you think, Mike, it's so
hard for a great player to become a great coaches
(39:45):
that the great player does things so instinctively that it's
hard for him to teach or or or their standards
so high that everybody's so uncomfortable that they can't perform.
And I think I was very fortunate it uh to
be a guy that that really had ability, not great ability,
(40:08):
but had just enough ability that if he were to
work his tail off, he could be become an elite
player if he was to to out work and and
i'll think out smart all these other things, the the
added uh things that would make a great player. Um,
I was willing to do that. And that was the
(40:29):
question that I had for all of my coaches, and
they all realized, I mean, I didn't have great talent,
but my question was how do I become the best?
And so they would give me as I don't think
about me, don't think about my ability, Just tell me
how do I become the best. Okay, well, Mike, there's
(40:51):
a lot of stuff. How do I become? So they
would answer that and just list it out. And so
the challenge was on me to answer the question as
to whether I was gonna do it or not. Was
I gonna pay lip service to it, or was I
going to actually do it? And so I think for me,
when I talked to our players, the thing that I
(41:12):
want them to understand is don't sit down and tell
me what you can't do, but really really be honest
with me and tell me what you don't want to do.
That's a big difference. So I had to work to
get it. I have to work to earn it, and
I know it can be done. Um, So it's just
(41:34):
a matter of a guy being willing to work. So
I'm not asking a guy to be magic. I'm not
asking him to uh, you know, jump stool buildings or
anything like that. I'm just asking him to become the
best that he can be. I did an interview with
Lombardi once and he said that a great coach has
to be one half teacher and one half son of
(41:55):
a bit. Well, um, I know that I'm one half teacher. Uh.
The other part I would say is um I would
I would just say that I'm I'm one half teacher
and maybe one half dad. That would be a so
(42:17):
you you you what you're doing is to recognize or
has to be a maybe a tough side and a
demanding side. It get that goes along with a teacher, absolutely. Uh.
It's it's the combination of love and discipline. I think
if you have too much love, uh, then you're gonna
have problems. If you have too much discipline, you're gonna
(42:39):
have problems. And I think every coach has to look
at his team and look at the balance of what
he has. Uh. Does you have a lot of guys
that you know you have to bring about discipline or
do you have a lot of guys where you have
to bring about the other side of it? But when
you find that balance because you know your team, um,
then the a chance you can get it right. You
(43:02):
seem to me a coach in a in a in
a throwback way about motivation. And that's sort of an
interesting subject because Chuck Nold would say that I don't
have these meta professionals. If they can't motivate themselves, then
they don't beat, they don't they don't belong here, and
that there other k coaches like Lombardi was certainly one
that that motivated every day. And where do you put
(43:24):
yourself as far as motivation? Well, I look at it
this way. I think, Um, the better the player, the
less you have to motivate. And when I look at
Chuck Nol, I agree. One, But what do you have
to say? Why in the heck are the motivating? You
got Joe Green, you got Lambert, you got I mean
everybody out there in the Hall of Fame. No, I
don't have to. So they motivated themselves. Bingo, Um you
(43:48):
were you were a self motivator, right, yes, yes, Um,
but I I think you look at Bill Belichick, you
know they're now they're there's a different deal. Now you
have a team, you have amstry, you have those things
when he was winning those championships. Um. So I think
it's it's up to the coach that you have to
(44:08):
look at what you have. What do I have to
do more? Do I have to motivate these guys? Um?
Or do I have to um really manage the situation
and make it sure that they don't kill each other?
To me, the best thing that I can have that happen. UM. Two.
The players that I coach is when they're done and
(44:32):
when they moved on that they're successful fathers, they're successful husbands,
and their men of integrity. UM, they work hard. So
those are the things that any player that comes through
the forty nine and organization UM, a few years down
the road, I would hope that that's a tread that
(44:55):
they would have UM, because that to me is is
that's the ending right there. This interview was conducted in August. Unfortunately,
Mike Singletary would be fired just a few months later,
prior to the last game of the season. He's since
(45:15):
been an assistant coach in the NFL and even was
a high school head coach, but hasn't returned to the
sidelines of an NFL team as a head coach. Look
Singletary's passionate intensity were very much on display in this interview,
but for me, the question that I just found most
fascinating was Steve asking why great players aren't successful as
(45:37):
head coaches. Keep in mind that since the only former
NFL players to win the Super Bowl as head coaches
have been back up quarterbacks, and there's only two of them.
Gary Kubiak of the Broncos and Doug Peterson with the Eagles.
Singletary's knowledge of the game as a player was never
in question, but he never seemed to have the ability
(45:59):
to train slate that knowledge to being a successful head coach.
Next week, we've got a real special one for you.
I dug deep into the vault. I went to the
top shelf. In fact, yeah, I need a ladder for that,
but I found another defensive Hall of Famer gem Steve's
(46:20):
four interview with Deacon Jones is a classic you won't
want to miss. I sure hope you'll join me. Thanks
for listening. I'm Andrea Kramer.
Popular Podcasts
Stuff You Should Know
If you've ever wanted to know about champagne, satanism, the Stonewall Uprising, chaos theory, LSD, El Nino, true crime and Rosa Parks, then look no further. Josh and Chuck have you covered.
Dateline NBC
Current and classic episodes, featuring compelling true-crime mysteries, powerful documentaries and in-depth investigations. Follow now to get the latest episodes of Dateline NBC completely free, or subscribe to Dateline Premium for ad-free listening and exclusive bonus content: DatelinePremium.com
On Purpose with Jay Shetty
I’m Jay Shetty host of On Purpose the worlds #1 Mental Health podcast and I’m so grateful you found us. I started this podcast 5 years ago to invite you into conversations and workshops that are designed to help make you happier, healthier and more healed. I believe that when you (yes you) feel seen, heard and understood you’re able to deal with relationship struggles, work challenges and life’s ups and downs with more ease and grace. I interview experts, celebrities, thought leaders and athletes so that we can grow our mindset, build better habits and uncover a side of them we’ve never seen before. New episodes every Monday and Friday. Your support means the world to me and I don’t take it for granted — click the follow button and leave a review to help us spread the love with On Purpose. I can’t wait for you to listen to your first or 500th episode!