In this inspiring episode of NFL Players: Second Acts, hosts Roman Harper and Peanut Tillman sit down with Hall of Fame Chicago Bears linebacker Mike Singletary. Known for his intense presence on the field and relentless leadership, Mike opens up about the journey that shaped him—from growing up as the youngest of 10 children, to becoming the heart and soul of the 1985 Super Bowl–winning Bears defense. But this conversation goes far beyond football. Mike shares the pivotal moments that tested his faith, the values that grounded him, and how he's found deeper meaning in life after the NFL—as a coach, mentor, and advocate for character development in young athletes. With honest reflection and powerful insight, Singletary talks about what drives him today, the lessons learned through adversity, and why legacy means more than just wins and losses.
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Episode Transcript
Available transcripts are automatically generated. Complete accuracy is not guaranteed.
Speaker 1 (00:00):
I didn't like running backs when I came to the NFL.
I had no respect for running backs. And I don't
mean that in a nasty way.
Speaker 2 (00:10):
I couldn't tell because your face was so straight. I'm
glad you.
Speaker 3 (00:14):
Got to break care say that. Okay, he's the greatest.
Speaker 4 (00:19):
US Like I don't like running backs. I was like,
damn you, I'm glad you laughing now, thank you?
Speaker 3 (00:27):
Holy yeah.
Speaker 1 (00:29):
Yeah. But anyway, I was.
Speaker 4 (00:40):
What's up, everybody, I'm Peanut Tohiman, and this is the
NFL Player's Second Act podcast and with me as always
as my trusty co host, Roman Harper.
Speaker 3 (00:50):
What's up? What's up? Peanut? I'm doing great, man.
Speaker 5 (00:51):
I want to jump right into this, uh this next guest, man,
I know he can't be here forever. Plus, he's my
favorite defensive player of all time, especially growing up. I
just want to say that right now, So get to
it his so then we can actually, you know, pan
over to my favorite defensive player Hall.
Speaker 3 (01:07):
Of Fame, Mike Linebacker.
Speaker 4 (01:09):
He was basically the face of that nineteen eighty five
defense aka Chicago Defense Monsters of the Midway, considered the
greatest defense of all time.
Speaker 1 (01:21):
UH.
Speaker 4 (01:21):
Nicknamed Samurai Samurai Mike in college. After football, he was
a coach in the NFL. Ladies and gentlemen, please welcome
to the pod Mike Singletary.
Speaker 3 (01:35):
Greatness. Yeah, okay, coach, it's okay, we call you coach. Coach.
Speaker 5 (01:43):
So I played with you on techno ball, right, So
I played with Mike Singletary on every single snap.
Speaker 3 (01:49):
So you made every play in the past. Absolutely, you
made every play in the run game. Do you ever
remember tech.
Speaker 1 (01:56):
All the time? I guess Airport?
Speaker 2 (02:00):
Then you are a beast and like it was you.
Speaker 5 (02:04):
Yes, this is like my experience is my first football
game that I was like really into. And that's saying
you were my first guy, okay, And so this is
in the honor to have you, have you sit here
in front of us.
Speaker 3 (02:16):
And being our pre and being in the presence of
you today. So I just greatness.
Speaker 5 (02:19):
I know you probably hear this a lot, but thank you,
thank you for getting you.
Speaker 3 (02:23):
You help me win a lot of games.
Speaker 1 (02:25):
Thank you.
Speaker 4 (02:26):
Now I'm spoiled because I played for the Bears for
twelve years and my entire time there defense Marcell's main
ways takeaways, like that's what that's what I know. So
I got there in O three, and it was basically
it was what you and the rest of the other
defensive grades, the Hampton's, the Dance, the earl Ackers, the
(02:48):
Marshall like it was what you all built. And for that,
I am forever grateful and just man like, Chicago was
known for its defenses. I don't care about offense. And
you know this, like it's just they kind of still
know it's a defensive city. Why don't well, you can't
say that, man Like I don't don't take a little
digs at my team.
Speaker 3 (03:07):
I don't do that with them.
Speaker 4 (03:08):
Sorry Saints, I don't don't take I don't fight back
when you say sorry.
Speaker 1 (03:11):
Though I.
Speaker 3 (03:14):
Still live there. I still live there.
Speaker 4 (03:17):
But one of the things I want to talk about,
and it's it's I don't want to say it's made
you famous, but it's it's made you and it shows
the type of person and it shows the character that
you have. Talking about the Vernon Davis situation, you know,
something happened, Vernon did something. He didn't react the way
(03:39):
he was supposed to as far as a champion or
a character or a guy with good character at the time.
And then you went to the media and you addressed it.
And people have made memes off of this, but it was,
you know, I want winners. I can't live with them,
can't play with them, don't want them. I want winners.
(04:23):
Can you talk about just that moment, that situation.
Speaker 1 (04:27):
Well, I think first and foremost, when I stepped into
the San Francisco situation, it was a lot of hardheads
that were doing their own thing and not only really
listening to the coach. And I had a conversation with
Vernon when I became the head coach and I said, Vernon,
I said, I want you to understand something. What you've
(04:50):
been doing will not work. We can't do that going forward.
I said, this is the team and everybody is going
to work as a team, even myself. I am not
above the team. And I said, I want you to
understand that that goes for everybody on our team. If
you do anything that violates that, then I'm going to
(05:15):
have to take, you know, steps that will make you
understand that these are the boundaries. And so, you know,
he tested it. You know, it's like like a kid
that you tell them, hey, if you do this, you
know here or here are the consequences. And he tested
that and so I don't know what he was thinking about.
(05:37):
I don't know what he thought I was going to do,
but I told him probably if something like that happens you,
you will not be a part of this team. And
so I said that, I followed through with it, and
you know, the rest is what it is.
Speaker 4 (05:54):
The best part about it, though, is he apologized. And
he later said, like, Yo, that moment, that moment changed
my life. And that's a testament to you, the character
you are and what you said. It's about the team.
It's always about the team. I'm not above the team.
You're not above the team. And when Vernon's when he's
(06:15):
talking about that, he commenceds like, yeah, man, I just
have it was a bad culture. It's just he was
trying to do something and I wasn't feeling it. But
looking back on it now, like yeah, I was one
percent of the wrong and I just I commend you
for that, just like letting him know like you were
trying to establish a new culture and let him know
it was about the team. And this is obviously you're
(06:35):
an old school guy. You even said a envous like
I'm from the old school. It's always about the team.
So I appreciate what you brought to the forty nine
ers and that that mentality and the culture that you
were trying to change.
Speaker 1 (06:45):
Thank you.
Speaker 5 (06:46):
Well, I want to piggyback on this same situation because
I think we all get focused up on the the
big the big saying was you can't win with him,
rather play with ten like it was great, Like this
is what this is what young people remember? You asked,
I remember you from Technmobo with the eyes and the
highlights and all the big hits and when we actually
showcased all the hard, hard hits.
Speaker 3 (07:08):
In the NFL films.
Speaker 5 (07:09):
But when you started off, you first apologized for when
you got there, you apologized to the San Francisco media
and you said it will change and that this team
wants to be champions, which they later on became.
Speaker 3 (07:23):
We got close to it, that.
Speaker 5 (07:24):
Same team with a lot of those same core guys
that you were there with. You like, these guys want
to be great. But it still comes down to three things.
Speaker 3 (07:33):
In the game.
Speaker 5 (07:33):
Number one, you got to out hit the team. That's
Mike's singletary. Number Two, it's not a charity. We can't
give the ball the game away. We can't give the
game away, not a charity out here for anybody. And
then number three, you said, it's all about execution, and
we didn't do that today, And so I think those
are the words that none of us get to actually hear.
(07:54):
And I want to make sure all of our viewers
get to actually hear the sayingness that was Mike's singletary
in that moment when we all see the real that
seems a little insane, and that's what we repeat. But
you caught your breath once two times in this whole interview.
We watched the whole thing, and to me, it was like, man,
this guy was right on point and the most important time,
I didn't hear all that in the SoundBite, but that's
(08:16):
when I went back.
Speaker 3 (08:17):
I want to make sure everybody hears the whole thing.
Speaker 5 (08:19):
So you get to hear the whole true story of
what Mike Singletary was in the most the biggest moment,
what some people may remember him as as San Francisco
head coach in that moment. But your actual words were
dead on and impactful.
Speaker 1 (08:33):
Well, I think you know, first and foremost, it's it's
interesting that when I stepped out of playing the game,
you know, I remember as a player being the leader
of our team, what we have to deal with, you know,
And so many times the players put the coaches in
(08:54):
difficult situations and it makes the coach have to follow
through with some of the things they said they were
gonna do, and then oftentimes, you know, the coach ends up.
You know, if we want to win this game, we
got to have this player. So if I do this,
if I really follow through and do what I said
(09:15):
I was gonna do, We're going to lose the game.
And so but but to me, it's always you may
win that game, but in essence, it's just like your
kids at home. You're gonna lose their trust because you said,
if this happens, this is what I'm gonna do, but
(09:36):
you didn't follow through because it was the different guy.
You didn't think it was going to be that guy,
the most important guy. And the way you build a
team is the most important guy must be the guy
both on the field and off the field, and if
he's not that guy, then you got to find another guy.
Speaker 5 (09:58):
Now, what did this whole situation, How did it impact
you as a coach going forward?
Speaker 3 (10:03):
Were you more confident?
Speaker 5 (10:04):
Did you know now like that this is what I'm
supposed to be doing, or did it make you question
your decision about what I did with Vernon, or just
question even being in the coaching game, like just overall.
Speaker 1 (10:19):
Not that day, I didn't What I didn't realize is
how far removed you know, when you were a player
and you're playing the game, it's one thing. The coach
is the same thing. That's great, okay, and you're not
really that much invested in what's happening in life. You
hear it, but you're focused on football. You're focused on
(10:42):
when you're focused on being all pro the best you
can be. But when you become a coach, particularly the
head coach, then you begin to see the whole picture.
And so the thing that I guess, the thing that
I was most really concerned about after I became a coach,
(11:07):
you begin to see where the game has gone, how
much the game has been removed from what it used
to be. I remember when I first started playing the game,
when I sat down, I had coaches talk to me
about this is what football is all about. This is
(11:27):
what even the position is all about, the position of
middle linebacker. When you're the middle linebacker, you have to
be the leader you have to set the standard for
how we practice, how we prepare, when we get on
that field, what we do, how we get there, all
of those things. As the middle linebacker, that's what you do.
(11:48):
So to me, when I became a head coach, it's going,
you know, miles ahead forward. I was the head coach,
So I'm setting the standard. And to kind of get
a slap on the wrist, Hey, wait a minute, that's
a grown man. You don't do that to a grown man.
I'm hearing all these people talk about it, but I said, yes,
(12:10):
he's a grown man. But when you become a part
of a team, just like when you become a part
of the family, there can't be rules that are here
for some people and they're set at a different level
for others. When you do that, then we got a problem.
That's the way it is in our society. That's the
way it is on different teams, different organizations, And to me,
(12:35):
it has to be whenever you have a team of
any kind, this is the team. This is the culture,
and it's for everybody, and it starts with the leader
and it goes down. It trickles down to everybody else.
If it's not going to be there, then you don't
have a team because there's no consistency. A team is
(12:55):
consistent across the board. That's how you develop the culture.
Speaker 4 (13:00):
Yeah, so there are a lot of people that know
you for that that rant, and you're so much more
than that. Right as Roma saying, you know segon ball
like you're you were a dominant player. If no one
has ever seen film on you and you had to
describe yourself and your style of play to a person,
(13:24):
how would you describe yourself your style of play?
Speaker 1 (13:29):
I would say my style of play, you know the
Samurai Warrior, that that is my style of play. It
is it is all out, it is reckless, it is abandoned.
But at the same time, there is a respect for
my opponent. I'm never gonna dog my opponent. I'm not
(13:52):
trying to take his heart. What I'm trying to do
is compete, compete to win at the very highest level,
but in such a way that when that game is over,
that competition is over. I can walk up to that
person and shake his hand and say, next time.
Speaker 5 (14:10):
How did you become How did they name you the
Samurai war Like? Were you into martial arts?
Speaker 4 (14:16):
Have anime or something like that.
Speaker 1 (14:20):
First of all, it was the energy, was the intensity. Yeah,
you know, there's a certain intensity. I'm this way right now.
But if I were to play a game, that would
be something that would change.
Speaker 3 (14:32):
There.
Speaker 1 (14:33):
There's a change is that's going to happen. There's going
to be a transfer. I'm stepping outside of the line
and I'm talking to you and it'asy hey man, how
you doing? What's going on? But when I step inside
the line, it's different. You know what it's on. So
that that really is the to me, that's that's the difference,
(14:56):
knowing how to do that.
Speaker 5 (14:58):
Okay, So this is exactly what I wanted to hear.
So because growing up, first of all, the nostalgia to
be a Chicago Bears defense at the time when you
guys were there doing what you guys were doing playing
for the forty six, Like all these words in football
jargon have become legendary because of what you guys were
(15:18):
able to do, and you were a vital part of that.
You know, when we see you guys on all the
highlights where you can see the smoke coming from up
underneath the helmets and when.
Speaker 3 (15:26):
You're barking out orders and blah.
Speaker 5 (15:28):
Blah, blah blah and always see you know, yeah, Scoop,
your eyes are I don't even know if you blink.
Speaker 3 (15:35):
Did you ever blink?
Speaker 5 (15:36):
Okay, so you know, so I could see this so
vividly as a young kid.
Speaker 3 (15:45):
This is all I ever wanted to do. I wanted
to play at Soldier Field.
Speaker 5 (15:48):
I wanted to play in cold weather because I could
see the steam coming out of my now when I
played in cold weather.
Speaker 1 (15:52):
I changed.
Speaker 3 (15:55):
Once I did that, I changed my mind.
Speaker 5 (15:57):
But these are all things that I picked up as
a young man and watching the NFL's hardest hits with
you and the rest of your teammates and all these
other things. And this defense that you guys ran so
just that is the encapsulation of what we all felt.
I don't know if you ever thought that you were
presenting that picture or what you actually thought that you
(16:19):
were presenting.
Speaker 3 (16:20):
I'd love to know that from you.
Speaker 5 (16:22):
It was this just who Mike Singletary has always been
as a person and as a player.
Speaker 1 (16:27):
Well, it was it was really the first time that
you didn't just come on the field, buddy Ryan. That
defense came out of all of our linebackers getting hurt
at some point in time, before I got the ball,
Before I got to the Bears, everybody had gotten hurt,
(16:47):
all the linebackers, so Buddy had to use DB's so
he had to protect them. And so now you got
six defensive linemen across the board, and then you got
a couple of line backers behind. Well, he used DB's
but he had to cover him up, Doug Plank and
Gary Fencing. So that's where forty six came from. Doug Plank,
(17:09):
that was his number, So that that's where the forty
six came from. So when I started, when when I started,
you know, playing on first down and second down, well,
I wasn't playing at the time. I was middle linebacker.
Most middle linebackers came out of the game on third down.
(17:30):
So I'm thinking, I'm not coming off the field on
third down. You know, if I'm good enough on first
and second down, I got to figure out what am
I gonna What do I need to do to become
the third down guy. So that was a conversation for
Buddy and I and we went back and forth for
a year before that happened, and finally, you know, he
(17:53):
had cursed me out enough told me not to talk
to him about it. It ain't happening because it's too complicated.
So finally I asked him again and I said, Buddy,
I'm getting ready to go home, back to Houston's off season.
If I were to play on the forty six, well
would I have to do if I to play it
(18:13):
on every down? The nickel every down and that forty six.
That guy that was that middle line back on the
forty six, on every play, he had to do about
five or six things depending on the keys. And so
for me, it was going home. Buddy said, hey, you
(18:34):
need to lose You need to get down to like
two twenty five to twenty six. Um, really, yeah, you
need to get down by two twenty five because you
gotta cover receiver, you gotta cover backs, you gotta cover
tight ends down the field. You got to go out
there and cover wide house as they come across the field.
You take them as they come across. So he said,
(18:55):
and you can't do that. So I said, okay. So
when I came back, I was two twenty five to
twenty six. Buddy was pissed up. In a minute. He
saw when I came back from art seat, and he said,
why'd you lose that weight? I said, because I want
to play third down. I told you you're not playing
third down. Okay. A couple of weeks later, a Nickel
(19:17):
guy got hurt and I ran on the field, but
it was cursing me out, and I was working with
the Nickel guys. I was going down there working on uh,
working with the corners and the safeties and all that. Well,
he got pissed when I went down there and did that,
why are you going down there and working with them?
So I just need to work on myself. But so
I'm covering I'm covering Willie Gaulton, I'm covering Dennis Gentry,
(19:38):
the f i astest guys, quickest guys. Yeah, all the time,
covering Walter. And that's all I wanted to cover. And
so when that happened, Buddy that Monday, Buddy called me
in the office. It's okay, here's what we're gonna do.
(19:59):
I'll put you in on four six, and you make
one mistake, you're out. You understand what mistake? Yes, So
never mistakes. Never mistake. Just it just increase the amount
of film work that I put in. It just increased
the amount of That's what I wanted. That's that's what
(20:20):
has as a leader. That's what you want. You want
your your leader on your team to say, give it
to me, give it all to me. What else is
that it? Okay, let's go, that's what you want. When
you have that, you've got a chance.
Speaker 3 (20:34):
Stay tuned in.
Speaker 2 (20:35):
We'll be right back after a quick break.
Speaker 3 (20:39):
Yeah.
Speaker 4 (20:39):
So when I got to Chicago, obviously they give you
like a little class with the rookies and they talk
about the defense, and you know it's one of the
oldest franchises in the NFL, so you're thinking like, okay, yeah,
this is cool. Then I get out there for my
first mini camp with the with the Vets.
Speaker 2 (20:55):
Well, you know, rookies, you're good. Get out there with
the Vets, and you're just.
Speaker 4 (20:58):
Like, oh, snap, that's that's Brent Rocker, that's Mike Brown,
that's you know, you're You're running through all these names
and I'm like, man, am I supposed to be here
or not? My question for you when you got drafted,
you get to Chicago, at what point did you know, Yo,
I can lead this defense, I can lead us to
be champions. How long did that take or was that
(21:20):
like an immediate thing that you just knew I'm the
mic backer.
Speaker 3 (21:23):
Y'all gonna play on my level.
Speaker 1 (21:25):
Here is Here is the thing. This is what really
caused the rift between Buddy and I. When I from
the first day I got there, I was in there.
I was in the huddle as a rookie and Dan
Hampton who was All Pro, and Alan Page was future
Hall of Famer, who were in the huddle. And I'm
a rookie. I'm getting in the huddle and Dan and
(21:49):
Alan Page a talking. So I get in the huddle
and I'm calling the defense and they're jacking around whatever,
and I look at him and say, hey, what are
you doing. Let's be quiet in the huddle. Buddy. Buddy
was walking by with his pipe and he's a wait, wait, wait, wait,
hold on, you know, he said, do you know who
that is? He's going to Alan Page. I said, no,
(22:11):
I know who he is, but I don't care who
he is. He's a huddle and when you in my huddle,
you be quiet. Buddy said, we're gonna have a problem.
So that was the beginning of our relationship. So I
came to Chicago thinking that I don't know where they are.
I know they haven't they haven't won in a number
(22:33):
of years. Oh, we're gonna win. We're gonna win. So
I went to Chicago. When I when I stepped in
the huddle that first day, it was with the intent
to start. It was with the intent to go to
the super Bowl. It was with the intent of becoming
an All pro, It was with the intent of being
a Hall of Famer, all of those things. When I
stepped in the huddle the first day.
Speaker 3 (22:52):
Those are your goals when you came in.
Speaker 1 (22:56):
Those are my goals at twelve years old.
Speaker 3 (22:58):
Oh, tell me about that? How did that? How did
those become your goals?
Speaker 5 (23:02):
Not everybody has such lofty goals.
Speaker 3 (23:06):
What led you to that point?
Speaker 5 (23:07):
What gave the young Mike Singletary that type of confidence
to say, you know what? You know, I really truly
I'm gonna shoot for the stars and hopefully land.
Speaker 3 (23:15):
On the moon.
Speaker 1 (23:16):
First of all, I'm the last of twelve kids. I
mean I'm the last of ten kids, and so I
was the smallest of the ten and the least talented.
We were a Pentecostal family. My father was a Pentecostal pastor,
and so we could not play sports.
Speaker 3 (23:39):
Your uncle, your brothers a pastor as.
Speaker 1 (23:41):
Well, Right, Well, no, they were a couple of them
are Christian, but not the castas so so the being
a Pentecostal or no football was allowed at all, and
so I wish my brothers would have been able to play.
But anyways, my father and my mom divorced when I
(24:04):
was twelve. And before they divorced about when I was
nine ten years old, there were some tapes that came
to my house, and those tapes for Norman Vincent Peel
tapes the amazing results of positive thinking. So when I
got those tapes, you know, my family was kind of chaos, disarrayed, Dad,
(24:24):
mom fighting all the time, all these kind of things
and other than and out of jail, sister, that baby's
out of wedlock. It was tough. And so I got
these tapes and I put these tapes on and Norman
Vincent Peele taught me how to close my eyes and
visualize myself in what I wanted to be. I saw
(24:48):
the Dallas Cowboys play. Roger Starbat was the guy that
I saw that he captured my eyes and I wanted
I want it to be that guy. He was the
team leader, he always said the right thing. He looked
like he was the spiritual leader on the field. Guys
(25:11):
believed in him, and he willed that team to win.
So when I saw him, that's what I want to be.
Right away, I knew I wouldn't have quartered by, but
I wanted to be a leader, and that's the one
thing that I know I am. And so when I
(25:32):
had the opportunity to look at the Cowboys play, I
w was sneaking watch the Cowboys play on Sundays, and
that was hard to do. Sometimes I was sick and
I stay home and watch the Cowboys. So fast forwarded.
My mom and dad divorced. My brother Grady moved back
(25:53):
home when I was twelve years old, and he was
killed in an automobile accident six months after my dad left.
So I'm thinking, you know, I don't know about this
God thing. I don't know about you know, being the
best that I can be, and all this other kind
of stuff. God let me down, God let us down.
Mom got to go to work and work two and
three jobs, and Grady is home, he's trying to do
(26:15):
the right thing, and he's now dead. So where am I?
So I made the decision that basically just kind of
meander through life. My mom challenged me that day, a
couple of weeks after the funeral, my brother's funeral, and
she said, son, I want you to know that there
is greatness in you. I want you to know that
(26:36):
I'm gonna ask you something that's unfair, but I need
to know if you can do this. She said, I
need to know if you can be the man at
the house. And in a moment, I was like me,
you want me to be the man at the house,
I'll still suck at my thumb and so so. But
(27:01):
I said, okay, I can do that. I walked in
my room. And keep in mind, I've been listening to
him and Vincent Peale about what I wanted in life,
what I wanted to be in life. So I walked
in my room. I got out a sheet of paper.
I got a book coming out that has all this senate.
But I got out of sheet of paper and I
(27:23):
began to write out But I knew what I didn't
know then but I know now was my vision statement.
It was find a way to get a scholarship, to
go to college, get my degree in which I'd be
the first in my family to do so, become an
All American, get drafted and go to the NFL, buy
(27:43):
my mom a house and take care of her for
the rest of my life. Become an all pro, go
to the Super Bowl, and own my own business. I
wrote that out, and I put it on the wall,
and I looked at that every day and every morning,
every day, before I went to before I went to
bed at night, I looked at it. And before I
went to school in the morning, I looked at it.
(28:05):
That was my driving force. And I wasn't even playing
football at the time. I had to beg my mom
to let me play.
Speaker 3 (28:13):
So what age did she let you play?
Speaker 1 (28:14):
Twelve?
Speaker 5 (28:15):
Okay, so when you became the man in the house,
you got to play football.
Speaker 3 (28:19):
Yes, that is awesome.
Speaker 5 (28:23):
I don't know how many times you've shared that story,
but I'm glad we got that today.
Speaker 3 (28:29):
Yeah, what's the name of the book.
Speaker 1 (28:32):
The name of the book is greatness. Hold on, we
just came up with the name of last week, greatness.
I'll think of it.
Speaker 3 (28:43):
It's fine, let's talk about sweetness.
Speaker 1 (28:46):
Go ahead.
Speaker 5 (28:47):
I don't think I've ever got to ask anybody what
it was like to be his teammate. I've never got
to meet or sit down with one of his teammates.
He was my second favorite player. I mean, I played
with you guys on technobol, So.
Speaker 3 (29:01):
What was that like?
Speaker 5 (29:02):
I remember the videos of him with the pumas running
up the hills.
Speaker 1 (29:05):
Any accolades that he received he deserved, I didn't. I
didn't like running backs when I came to the NFL.
I had no respect for running backs. And I don't
mean that in a nasty way.
Speaker 2 (29:23):
I couldn't sell because your face was so straight.
Speaker 4 (29:25):
I'm glad you said that.
Speaker 1 (29:28):
I was.
Speaker 3 (29:31):
The greatest. Was like, I don't like running backs. I
was like, damn, I'm.
Speaker 2 (29:38):
Glad you laughing now, thank you?
Speaker 3 (29:40):
Holy Yeah.
Speaker 1 (29:42):
But anyways, I was, I was. I was telling. When
I first met Walter, everybody was telling me how crazy
he was, the prankster and all that. And I went
up to Walter when I first got there, the rookie,
and I said, Walter, I said, I really respect you
and I appreciate you as a person, but whatever you do,
(30:04):
don't pull a prank on me. I don't take those well.
And I you know, I don't laugh a whole lot either.
So Walter was like, okay, that was that was my
first Yeah, okay, but I I really have any opportunity
to watch him and see him. He was an amazing individual.
(30:29):
First of all, I don't think I've ever seen him
say no to an autograph. People would be lined up,
I don't know how long, and Walter would stand there
and sign every one of them. He was what you
want in an athlete. The attitude of an athlete toward
(30:50):
the fans, that's what you want, because he realized and
recognized the importance of being this this figure, and people
loved him, and it was it was a beautiful thing
to see. When I get first got there, you know,
(31:10):
no one was asking for my grab, and I'm thinking, like, man,
that's that's a long line man all the time. So
but it was it was really cool. As a player,
he could do anything. He could throw the ball ninety yards.
A matter of fact, he played. He played quarterback one
(31:30):
game we got all our I ran the back. Yeah,
he started played quarterback in one game that I.
Speaker 2 (31:38):
Do like a couple half back passes.
Speaker 1 (31:40):
Now, he started and played quarterback in one of our games.
Speaker 3 (31:45):
So what was that like that whole week of practice. Oh,
it was cool.
Speaker 4 (31:49):
Cool, you'll just show up like that, like.
Speaker 1 (31:55):
Yeah, it was really it was the first it was
the first sign of a wildcat. Right, yeah, but yeah,
he startedn't play quarterback. Every quarterback we had was done
toast and he started.
Speaker 3 (32:10):
We all have signature plays. I got a signature play.
I mean, rings you, it doesn't matter. I think your
signature play is.
Speaker 4 (32:18):
Don't worry about it. We've worried about Mike Marshawn Lynch.
You trying to like make the tackle twice.
Speaker 3 (32:23):
I don't think that's that's.
Speaker 4 (32:26):
I do your signature, your signature play thirty one, Eric
Dirickson MC title game.
Speaker 3 (32:34):
Let's talk. Can you talk us through that play?
Speaker 1 (32:38):
It was it was like we're in college again when
I was a Baylor and he was at s m U. Yeah,
we've had we've met many times like that.
Speaker 3 (32:49):
And we already know your opinion on running backs.
Speaker 2 (32:54):
Don't respect him, don't like him.
Speaker 1 (32:57):
Now, you know what, there's nothing more beautiful than than
watching a running back and in their in their greatness running.
I love to see a great running back. But when
I'm playing against them, I don't like them.
Speaker 4 (33:10):
Absolutely yeah, say less, yeah, do you remember the play?
Speaker 1 (33:16):
You know it was it was a routine play. It
was a third one, and you know they they normally
if he's lining up on the right, he's gonna probably
come across the ball. Running left, he's line up on
the other side, he's gonna come across one. But more
than anything, it was just sometimes you you you just
(33:39):
gotta go on blind faith. Eric is such a big guy.
A lot of people don't realize how big he is,
and so just his his lean is gonna get him
a first down if you got a third one. So
I knew that I made up in my mind, you
gotta go the minute you if there's end, if this
(34:02):
guy moved, this guard moves just a bit just to
show me, Yes, if the guard moves just that much,
I gotta go now.
Speaker 3 (34:14):
So you know, I.
Speaker 5 (34:17):
Read something that you had talked about after winning that
Super Bowl. You know, you're the one defensive MVP that year,
you were all pro went to another Pro Bowl. You
guys had just won a Super Bowl, and I think
the word that you said was that you you had
felt emptiness at that time in your life, like you
(34:39):
were just incomplete because you maybe talk about how just
because because I remember I became personally I kind of
went through something very similar in my life where you know,
we had won a super Bowl, I just became the
highest paid person in my position, and I was living
in la and I felt sometimes the most alone out
(34:59):
of failed my life. And I literally had everything under
the sun that I ever wanted as a young man,
and it just was missing. And I think that's when
I was called the faith. And so could you maybe
share about your journey and your story at that point
in time and.
Speaker 3 (35:15):
How you were feeling.
Speaker 1 (35:16):
Absolutely that was another marker that I had in my
vision statement going to the Super Bowl, and I just
envisioned the night before what that was going to be, like,
how amazing, the feeling of being the world champion and
all of that. And right after the game, the confetti's
coming down and everybody is laughing and crying, and right
(35:41):
away I felt this loneliness, like this anger, frustration and
loneliness at the same time, and I'm like, Lord, what
in the world is this? You know, where did this
come from? And there was this small quiet voice in
me because I didn't I didn't like my dad and
(36:05):
I had this thing with my dad. I hadn't talked
to him in a while, didn't want to be around him,
and and this small voice said, you need to forgive
your father I'm like, no, no, I'm, I'm I'm. We
don't talk, we don't argue, we don't do anything. So
I'm good, no need to forgive your father. So that
(36:28):
voice didn't go away for several days, and finally I
picked up the phone and called my father from Chicago
and he was in Houston, and I said, Dad, I
I you know. He picks up the phone and the Dad,
I just want you to know, I forgive you for
everything that happened. And he said, hey, forgive me for what?
You know. I put clothes on your back, food on
(36:50):
the table, what what what? What? What are you talking about?
Rough over your head? What else is there? And so
needless is saved. For the next hour and a half,
you know, were screaming, I'm crying, and well, the next
step was for me to go to Houston. Get on
the plane, and go to Houston. A couple of weeks later,
so I'm sitting across with my dad like this, and
(37:12):
you know, on the way down to Houston, I'm just
imagining the things that I was gonna say to him.
I was gonna tell him what I really felt about him.
But yet, when I get there and I'm sitting across
with my dad, and I started talking to him, you know,
why did you why did you treat mom the way
you did? Why did you treat us the way you did?
Why did you act like this? Why did you why
(37:33):
were you angry all the time? Why were you so
I As I began to ask him those things, He's
looking at me and he really didn't have an answer.
And I in that conversation, I begin to understand he
got kicked out of his house at thirteen, he got
he married my mom at like sixteen, and next thing,
(37:55):
you know, you got ten kids. So I began to
realize that he didn't have the tool. You had no
tools whatsoever. You're still a kid. And I'm looking at him.
He's seventy something years old, and I'm looking at him,
but he's still thirteen. He had the tools of a
thirteen year old. How do you deal with issues? How
(38:16):
do you deal with disagreements? How do you deal with
you know, when you can't pay the bills, when money
is not coming in, how do you deal with that? Well,
it turns the emotion, and normally that emotion is going
to be anger. So that was a tremendous opportunity for
me to get to know my father. And at the
(38:38):
end of that conversation that I was having with my dad,
I asked him. At the end, I said, Dad, I
know that I'm a lot like you. I said, can
you help me not to be like you? Can you
help me? I don't want to wreck my family, want
(39:00):
to wreck my kids. I don't want to do that.
What can you tell me to help me? That was
the beginning of our relationship as it begins to grow.
And I'm the only one, the only kid and out
of the ten that actually forgave my dad and and
really became friends with him.
Speaker 3 (39:20):
Did he have an answer for you when you ask?
Speaker 1 (39:23):
He just said, you know, it's it's like you're driving
down this this highway and you know you need to exit,
but you just never do just keep going. So exit, Yeah,
you need to exit, and and just slow slow down
and kind of you know, think about where you are
(39:43):
and being able to ask for forgiveness, being able to
say I'm sorry, being able to reflect. You know. I
I begin to read like crazy about family and relationships
and those kinds of things, began to really get in
my Bible like I'd never had before, and begin taking
(40:05):
those steps towards being all the things that I knew
my father could have been.
Speaker 4 (40:11):
Yeah, yeah, What emotions did you feel after you basically
said I forgive you and then you got to know
him and you understood, like, man, he's seventy, but he's thirteen. Like,
what emotions did you feel after the whole entire conversation?
Speaker 1 (40:28):
After the entire conversation, you know, you begin to realize
as you begin to look around, the more I begin
to read and understand America, our history, and particularly being
an African American father growing up in the South, all
of those things, the amount of frustration that he felt,
(40:52):
the dreams that he had that simply because he was
an African American he could never do, and being a
part of something great. I know, I'm a lot like
my dad, and and there's nothing. If I'm gonna do something,
oh it's it's gonna be great. If I can't make
(41:13):
it great, then I don't need to be a part
of it. Whether it's being a husband, whether it's being
a father, whether it's whatever job I'm in, whatever that is,
it's gonna be all out because I feel that's the
only way that I can represent God and say that
I'm a believer. I shouldn't have to say it. You
should be able to look at me and see by
(41:36):
my action that man is a believer, that man loves God,
that man without me saying a word. And if that's
not it, then something's wrong.
Speaker 3 (41:46):
We'll be back in a minute.
Speaker 5 (41:48):
So do you think all your personal turmoils from the
childhood trauma? Which childhood trauma usually hurt people, hurt other people.
That is this is what life has taught us. If
you read and then you researched, this is what happens.
Did all these emotions bottle up? Like now, hearing all
your stories and everything else, I totally understand why you
(42:10):
were the player that you were, who you were in
between the white lines versus outside the white lines. This
whole blurred vision of who Mike's singletary was as being
the man since twelve years old in his own household,
growing up all these other things did that kind of
make you the coach you were the way that you
you know, played on the emotions you understand and coach
(42:33):
the same way in a way, in the same kind
of veins the way you played. And ray Lewis had
a great quote when he described you when you were
the linebackers coach in Baltimore. It was good, you know, right, yeah, right,
was celebrated his birthday. He was praising the Lord the
other day's birthday. Ray and Girl came a long way.
So he said this about you. Singletary helped him Girl
(42:57):
as a player and a person. He understands this is
about people more than anything else. Lewis says, that's what
makes coach so powerful. For him, coaching is almost like fatherhood.
Teaching the game is one thing, but giving a man
tools and understanding that's bigger than the game.
Speaker 3 (43:14):
That's deep.
Speaker 1 (43:17):
He I mean, he knows that that's who I am.
My thought process if I'm going to coach and really
do what I believe coaching was always meant to be
(43:40):
is if I'm coaching someone, it winning is kind of
a byproduct of helping you to become a man. If
I'm winning championships and you know five years later, you
know you're in a situation where you're beating your wife,
(44:02):
or you know you're jumping on your kids, or you're
doing something matter, then I fail as a coach. My
job is to help you understand the football that that's gravy.
That's you know, I got skilled, I got talent, I
got it. That's gravy. That's something that I should do.
(44:27):
But being a man, that's something that takes a lot
of work. It does takes a lot of discipline, take
a lot of sacrifice. And if I'm not gonna have
you go through that, and I'm gonna I'm setting you
up for failure because you think you're winning, but you're
(44:49):
losing because you know, the time that you play football,
that's a short span of life, but you have the
rest of your life. And you know, the last thing
that I would want my players to say about me
is why didn't coach teach me that? You know, sometimes
(45:10):
the coaches are the last line of defense. You're the
last opportunity to help that man get what he needs
before he goes into real life.
Speaker 3 (45:19):
So anyways, do you still want to coach?
Speaker 1 (45:25):
You know what I think, in all honesty, there are
so many the needs now in our society are so great.
I'm not sure that if I were coaching now that
I'd be looking back outside of the lines realizing I
(45:45):
need to be out there where the fight is. And
I'm not quite sure if I'm not a dinosaur now
in the game. Because my thought process isn't going to change.
I'm not going to say it's okay, you know, say
what you want to say and do what you want
to do. I'm not gonna be okay with that. Now
(46:06):
I'm violating the game. To me, there's a the game
is there's there's there's a respect that comes to the game.
You don't just play the game because you're great. You
play the game because there's a code of ethics that
you play by and you live by. When I was
(46:28):
in junior high and high school, the athletes were the
role models. You say, hey, you know, need to be
like Jimmy man making got three point oh.
Speaker 3 (46:40):
You study and even doing that, right.
Speaker 1 (46:42):
The athlete, that's that's that's what you want. Well, it's
not that way anymore. And now there's a reason why
that is so so easy to lose. Focused sometimes.
Speaker 5 (46:53):
Okay, I got I got one of that. I'm wanna
back it up with one. What keeps you busy?
Speaker 3 (46:57):
Right now?
Speaker 1 (46:59):
What keeps me busy? Studying? Man? I study. I'm always
studying about health, brain, health, hard health. Energy, graphene graphite
carbon graphene is just a form of energy and making
(47:20):
batteries with it. So graphene, graphite, you know, those kinds
of things, methane, carbon, those are things that the new energy,
you know, we got to find a way to have
this this uh, this country continued to run, and those
are some of the things that you know are going
(47:41):
to be a problem if we don't do something about it.
So that's something that I'm I'm involved in and study
a lot. The health is huge, particularly mental health is huge,
So I study a lot about that. And and knowing
that you played this game, and you played it at
(48:03):
such a level, I'm probably broke more helmets than anybody.
Speaker 5 (48:07):
That is exactly what I wanted to go to. This
is my backup. Well, I mean, your career Baylor is legendary. Okay,
you were a two time All American. Your sophomore year,
you had two hundred and thirty two tackles. I don't
really know how you accomplished that.
Speaker 3 (48:24):
I don't either two tackles to play.
Speaker 5 (48:27):
So one game you had thirty five tackles. You also
had three other games with thirty plus tackles.
Speaker 3 (48:34):
They actually third other co tackles in one game.
Speaker 5 (48:37):
Yes, this young man did, and they actually tried to
dispute it, and they actually went through the film and
they said no, it was correct and so and then
the other thing was you actually broke eight helmets in
college over three year, over your three year career. Was
that your helmet or somebody else's helmet?
Speaker 1 (48:55):
Both? Oh?
Speaker 3 (48:56):
Okay? Both with an F okay? So like, when you're
doing these things, how how did you bring it up?
How intimidating is that? When?
Speaker 5 (49:13):
I can't imagine because you I don't think you thought
yourself is anything bigger than anything. You probably just just
Mike singletary. But how much fear do you think you
struck another?
Speaker 3 (49:25):
People? And was that a goal?
Speaker 1 (49:27):
It really wasn't you know? I never I never set
out to intimidate anyone. You know. I've had guys ask me, man,
what's wrong with you? But what are you mad at?
I'm mad at anything you know? Or what are you taking?
I'm not taking anything? Man? Also, you know what you're
gonna tell me what you're taking? The guys are mad
(49:48):
at me because I'm not taking anything, you know. But
in all honesty, football was just and everybody was always
telling me it was too small. You know, you're you're
not big enough you're not fast enough, you're not mean enough,
You're not And so for me it was I always
(50:14):
believe that, you know what, Lord, I'm going to give
everything I have to you and you take it and
do whatever you want to do with it. I'm just
going to give you my best. That's all I can do.
And so I always had, whether it was a coach
or a mentor that I was able to ask how
(50:38):
do I become the best? And they would always give
me this list. How do I become an all pro?
How do I become you know, Devons a Player of
the Year, how do I become MVP? How do I
do it? So I always would find someone that would
be honest with me and tell me, Okay, you need
to do this every day, you need to do that
(50:58):
every day, you need to do this every day. You
need to do this. Twice a week, you need to
do that, and whatever it was. At the end of that,
I would always add a little bit more and say, okay, Lord,
here's my Christmas list, and I'm gonna go after it.
I'm gonna work at it, and I'm gonna do the
very best that I can to bring you glory. And
(51:19):
at any time I accomplish any of these it's because
of you. And you know I mean that from the
bottom of my heart.
Speaker 4 (51:28):
You are very accomplished in all the things that you do.
So we asked this question to a lot of our guests.
You get four picks who would be on your personal
Mount Rushmore from the time you were born till today,
of people that have of people that have had influence
(51:50):
and just poured into you over your life.
Speaker 1 (51:54):
Obviously number one is my mom. Number two.
Speaker 3 (52:01):
I would have to say, well, let me see why Mom?
Speaker 1 (52:05):
Why Mom?
Speaker 3 (52:06):
Yeah, this is.
Speaker 1 (52:09):
Let me put it this way. My mother was everything.
She was amazing. She was the one that, you know,
when the doctors told her to abort me because she
was in her forties, I had several miscarriages. She said, no,
(52:32):
not doing that. God's gonna God's got something special in here.
She's the one that sat me down across from me
and with the Bible and just went through the Bible
every day. Taught me about how to be a man,
how to be a godly man, how to stand when
(52:56):
nobody else will, even if you're the only one. Don't
be afraid to die for the right thing. Those kinds
of things are things that I sat there said yes, yes, yes,
ma'am okay, I got it. So that's that's why mom uh.
(53:20):
Coach Brown. Coach Brown was my high school coach. Coach
Brown believed in me. Coach Brown was tough man. Coach
Brown had a board, pop you on your tail. You
don't know what you're doing.
Speaker 3 (53:33):
And in practice, oh yeah, it was always after practice.
Speaker 1 (53:36):
No in practice doing practice, so you you needed to
know what you were doing. It was really a track coach,
but he did yeah, so you have to know what
you were doing. But he always talked to me about
you know, he was say singletary when when when you
get to college. He would always talk to me as
(53:59):
as if I had already done those things. So when
you get to college, there will be all kinds of distractions.
You gotta make sure you stay focused, stay focused on
it's too easy. A lot of guys that are more
talented than you, vaster, bigger, all that they're not gonna
make it. Know why they're not gonna make it because
(54:21):
they don't have what you have heart heart. So when
you get to college, and he said, when you leave,
do not come back here. I don't want to see
you until you got your paper when you got your degree,
that's what I want to see you. So that was
coach Brown and then number three, oh man, I only
(54:48):
got four. Number three would be coach taff Coach grantaff
my head coach in college. My freshman year, Coach Taft
would come by the door and knock on my door
say I want you to go with me. I'm going
to go speak to a church. I'm going to go
(55:09):
speak to a council meeting. I'm gonna go do this.
I'm gonna go do that. And I'm like, yes, sir,
I'll go. And one day he called me and he said, Mike,
I'm supposed to go to this church and speak, but
I can't go. I need you to go for me.
(55:32):
I'm like, go where. So I need you to go
to this church and I need you to speak to them.
By God, you've heard me. Do it. I want you
to do it, Yes, sir, So I'd go. And that's
that's kind of really how I started speaking and training
myself to get better at that speaking. And he helped
(55:56):
me to become the leader that God was calling me
to be. And there were times to Coach Tafford come
into my dorm and say. He would be crying. Said,
you know what, Mike, I told this kid, if you
do this again, if I catch you stealing again, I'm
(56:17):
gonna send you home. And I said, so, what's the problem, coaching.
I called him again and I said, what's the problem.
I gotta send him home? I said, what's the problem.
I promised his mom that I was gonna get make
(56:38):
sure that he got his degree. He come from nothing,
He come from nothing. And I said, well, coach, you
held up. You're part of the bargain. I said, but
if you say yes to the kid, if you don't
say anything, you're the kid. You failed him, and you
fell a team. Okay. And then the other coaches would
(57:06):
come to me and say, who in the hell do
you think you are to tell him that? I said,
he asked my opinion, You asked my opinion. I'm gonna
give it to you. I didn't go to him. He
came to me. So, but that was coach Taff and
the leadership role that he put on on me the
(57:27):
last one.
Speaker 5 (57:30):
Mm hmm.
Speaker 1 (57:32):
Now I got to give it to my girl, my wife. Yeah.
My wife is by far my best friend. She she
was with me when when I was hard when I
was tough, when the way I played the game was
(57:53):
the way I lived at home. I'm focused, man, you know,
I'm focused, not relaxing, still trying to become a man,
and she would just it's okay, I know. It's like
I got it. I got it, I got it, and
she just kept loving me through it. Until one day
(58:19):
I really began to realize. I took a step back
and I really looked at her, said, Wow, God loves
me so much to give me somebody with the patience.
Because I knew I was a different I was stubborn,
a hard headed, knucklehead. But because she loved me the
(58:43):
way she loved me, never gave up on me, always
building into me. It helped me become. It helped me
refine myself and become all that God has created me
to be. And I'm still working. But it's because I
heard that. I feel that I'm the luckiest man in
(59:04):
the world. Yeah, yeah, my best friend. Man, that's beautiful.
It is beautiful. That's all the questions we got for
a coach. That was beautiful.
Speaker 3 (59:14):
We got to end it on that. Hey, yeah, man,
that was Uh that was great. Coach. You're probably the
most passionate guest.
Speaker 2 (59:20):
We you ever had, not probably you are. I was
trying to this is not a hot seat, but you
made it a hot seat.
Speaker 4 (59:28):
Were trying to have fun and laugh, and I got
you to laugh a couple of times.
Speaker 2 (59:32):
Yeah, okay, that we gotta go to comedy, showed inn.
Speaker 5 (59:36):
No, that's not that's not what he told Walter Payton.
That was not Walter Payton. You said some great things there.
You know what you your mom told you about don't
be afraid to die for the right thing. I think
you still live your life full speed ahead, just like that.
And so I'm appreciative of you spending this time with
(59:59):
us because for a long time I was just a
fan of Mike Singletary of the player. And we got
to meet Mike's singletary of the man, and we got
to hear about his journey, his path, the things that
created this enigma, this phenomenon that was in between the
white lines wearing number fifty for Chicago Bears. And I
(01:00:20):
got to look up your stats in Baylor, and I
got to know you more personable. And you know, some
of the great things that were told to you were
told to me my dad when I left school told me,
don't you come back home? That's all I got for you.
That's the only advice he had for me. And I
haven't been back since. And so it's always beautiful to know,
like when you've been set on the right path yourself,
(01:00:42):
because you see other great ones that are out there
in front of you, that are still fighting the good fight.
Speaker 3 (01:00:47):
And so I thank you for that.
Speaker 5 (01:00:49):
I thank you for your passion, your emotions, and your
genuine realness. You're just a different breed, and you truly
are a different breed and you should never oologize for that.
I'm honored to say I got to meet you at
your finest and you know you want to say anything
else before, I thank of you.
Speaker 4 (01:01:07):
Yeah, I'm being a Chicago guy, being in being on
you know, I plan on some great defenses, and I've
seen you around. I've never had an opportunity to sit
down and talk to you. I wanted to when we
did The Bears one hundred, but it was, you know,
you with your your old teammates. I was with mine,
so I kind of wanted to give you your space and
just kind of let you be. But I am a
(01:01:30):
fan first and foremost. Thank you for coming on our
podcast and just pouring in us. And I'm glad my daughter,
my daughter's in the back. I'm glad she was here
to see me work and just hear me and hear
your story. So yeah, thank you, thank you for that.
I'm very appreciative of that. Thank you very much, man.
Speaker 3 (01:01:53):
Great job man.
Speaker 5 (01:01:54):
All of our viewers and listeners out there wherever you
pick up your podcast, where it's Apple Podcast.
Speaker 3 (01:01:58):
iHeartRadio.
Speaker 5 (01:01:59):
App uh give us a five star rating, lead review, click, follow,
h comment, share, subscribe, subscribe, all that other stuff that
Peanut always tells you.
Speaker 2 (01:02:08):
Tell her friend, to tell her friend, to tell her what.
Speaker 3 (01:02:11):
Tell a friend. Yeah, to make sure you tune.
Speaker 4 (01:02:13):
In and check us out on the NFL's YouTube channel
on Penut Best.
Speaker 2 (01:02:17):
Rumor and that is Samurai Mike.
Speaker 4 (01:02:21):
And this is the NFL Player's second Act podcast.
Speaker 3 (01:02:24):
We all, thank you all,
I didn't like running backs when I came to the NFL.
I had no respect for running backs. And I don't
mean that in a nasty way.
Speaker 2 (00:10):
I couldn't tell because your face was so straight. I'm
glad you.
Speaker 3 (00:14):
Got to break care say that. Okay, he's the greatest.
Speaker 4 (00:19):
US Like I don't like running backs. I was like,
damn you, I'm glad you laughing now, thank you?
Speaker 3 (00:27):
Holy yeah.
Speaker 1 (00:29):
Yeah. But anyway, I was.
Speaker 4 (00:40):
What's up, everybody, I'm Peanut Tohiman, and this is the
NFL Player's Second Act podcast and with me as always
as my trusty co host, Roman Harper.
Speaker 3 (00:50):
What's up? What's up? Peanut? I'm doing great, man.
Speaker 5 (00:51):
I want to jump right into this, uh this next guest, man,
I know he can't be here forever. Plus, he's my
favorite defensive player of all time, especially growing up. I
just want to say that right now, So get to
it his so then we can actually, you know, pan
over to my favorite defensive player Hall.
Speaker 3 (01:07):
Of Fame, Mike Linebacker.
Speaker 4 (01:09):
He was basically the face of that nineteen eighty five
defense aka Chicago Defense Monsters of the Midway, considered the
greatest defense of all time.
Speaker 1 (01:21):
UH.
Speaker 4 (01:21):
Nicknamed Samurai Samurai Mike in college. After football, he was
a coach in the NFL. Ladies and gentlemen, please welcome
to the pod Mike Singletary.
Speaker 3 (01:35):
Greatness. Yeah, okay, coach, it's okay, we call you coach. Coach.
Speaker 5 (01:43):
So I played with you on techno ball, right, So
I played with Mike Singletary on every single snap.
Speaker 3 (01:49):
So you made every play in the past. Absolutely, you
made every play in the run game. Do you ever
remember tech.
Speaker 1 (01:56):
All the time? I guess Airport?
Speaker 2 (02:00):
Then you are a beast and like it was you.
Speaker 5 (02:04):
Yes, this is like my experience is my first football
game that I was like really into. And that's saying
you were my first guy, okay, And so this is
in the honor to have you, have you sit here
in front of us.
Speaker 3 (02:16):
And being our pre and being in the presence of
you today. So I just greatness.
Speaker 5 (02:19):
I know you probably hear this a lot, but thank you,
thank you for getting you.
Speaker 3 (02:23):
You help me win a lot of games.
Speaker 1 (02:25):
Thank you.
Speaker 4 (02:26):
Now I'm spoiled because I played for the Bears for
twelve years and my entire time there defense Marcell's main
ways takeaways, like that's what that's what I know. So
I got there in O three, and it was basically
it was what you and the rest of the other
defensive grades, the Hampton's, the Dance, the earl Ackers, the
(02:48):
Marshall like it was what you all built. And for that,
I am forever grateful and just man like, Chicago was
known for its defenses. I don't care about offense. And
you know this, like it's just they kind of still
know it's a defensive city. Why don't well, you can't
say that, man Like I don't don't take a little
digs at my team.
Speaker 3 (03:07):
I don't do that with them.
Speaker 4 (03:08):
Sorry Saints, I don't don't take I don't fight back
when you say sorry.
Speaker 1 (03:11):
Though I.
Speaker 3 (03:14):
Still live there. I still live there.
Speaker 4 (03:17):
But one of the things I want to talk about,
and it's it's I don't want to say it's made
you famous, but it's it's made you and it shows
the type of person and it shows the character that
you have. Talking about the Vernon Davis situation, you know,
something happened, Vernon did something. He didn't react the way
(03:39):
he was supposed to as far as a champion or
a character or a guy with good character at the time.
And then you went to the media and you addressed it.
And people have made memes off of this, but it was,
you know, I want winners. I can't live with them,
can't play with them, don't want them. I want winners.
(04:23):
Can you talk about just that moment, that situation.
Speaker 1 (04:27):
Well, I think first and foremost, when I stepped into
the San Francisco situation, it was a lot of hardheads
that were doing their own thing and not only really
listening to the coach. And I had a conversation with
Vernon when I became the head coach and I said, Vernon,
I said, I want you to understand something. What you've
(04:50):
been doing will not work. We can't do that going forward.
I said, this is the team and everybody is going
to work as a team, even myself. I am not
above the team. And I said, I want you to
understand that that goes for everybody on our team. If
you do anything that violates that, then I'm going to
(05:15):
have to take, you know, steps that will make you
understand that these are the boundaries. And so, you know,
he tested it. You know, it's like like a kid
that you tell them, hey, if you do this, you
know here or here are the consequences. And he tested
that and so I don't know what he was thinking about.
(05:37):
I don't know what he thought I was going to do,
but I told him probably if something like that happens you,
you will not be a part of this team. And
so I said that, I followed through with it, and
you know, the rest is what it is.
Speaker 4 (05:54):
The best part about it, though, is he apologized. And
he later said, like, Yo, that moment, that moment changed
my life. And that's a testament to you, the character
you are and what you said. It's about the team.
It's always about the team. I'm not above the team.
You're not above the team. And when Vernon's when he's
(06:15):
talking about that, he commenceds like, yeah, man, I just
have it was a bad culture. It's just he was
trying to do something and I wasn't feeling it. But
looking back on it now, like yeah, I was one
percent of the wrong and I just I commend you
for that, just like letting him know like you were
trying to establish a new culture and let him know
it was about the team. And this is obviously you're
(06:35):
an old school guy. You even said a envous like
I'm from the old school. It's always about the team.
So I appreciate what you brought to the forty nine
ers and that that mentality and the culture that you
were trying to change.
Speaker 1 (06:45):
Thank you.
Speaker 5 (06:46):
Well, I want to piggyback on this same situation because
I think we all get focused up on the the
big the big saying was you can't win with him,
rather play with ten like it was great, Like this
is what this is what young people remember? You asked,
I remember you from Technmobo with the eyes and the
highlights and all the big hits and when we actually
showcased all the hard, hard hits.
Speaker 3 (07:08):
In the NFL films.
Speaker 5 (07:09):
But when you started off, you first apologized for when
you got there, you apologized to the San Francisco media
and you said it will change and that this team
wants to be champions, which they later on became.
Speaker 3 (07:23):
We got close to it, that.
Speaker 5 (07:24):
Same team with a lot of those same core guys
that you were there with. You like, these guys want
to be great. But it still comes down to three things.
Speaker 3 (07:33):
In the game.
Speaker 5 (07:33):
Number one, you got to out hit the team. That's
Mike's singletary. Number Two, it's not a charity. We can't
give the ball the game away. We can't give the
game away, not a charity out here for anybody. And
then number three, you said, it's all about execution, and
we didn't do that today, And so I think those
are the words that none of us get to actually hear.
(07:54):
And I want to make sure all of our viewers
get to actually hear the sayingness that was Mike's singletary
in that moment when we all see the real that
seems a little insane, and that's what we repeat. But
you caught your breath once two times in this whole interview.
We watched the whole thing, and to me, it was like, man,
this guy was right on point and the most important time,
I didn't hear all that in the SoundBite, but that's
(08:16):
when I went back.
Speaker 3 (08:17):
I want to make sure everybody hears the whole thing.
Speaker 5 (08:19):
So you get to hear the whole true story of
what Mike Singletary was in the most the biggest moment,
what some people may remember him as as San Francisco
head coach in that moment. But your actual words were
dead on and impactful.
Speaker 1 (08:33):
Well, I think you know, first and foremost, it's it's
interesting that when I stepped out of playing the game,
you know, I remember as a player being the leader
of our team, what we have to deal with, you know,
And so many times the players put the coaches in
(08:54):
difficult situations and it makes the coach have to follow
through with some of the things they said they were
gonna do, and then oftentimes, you know, the coach ends up.
You know, if we want to win this game, we
got to have this player. So if I do this,
if I really follow through and do what I said
(09:15):
I was gonna do, We're going to lose the game.
And so but but to me, it's always you may
win that game, but in essence, it's just like your
kids at home. You're gonna lose their trust because you said,
if this happens, this is what I'm gonna do, but
(09:36):
you didn't follow through because it was the different guy.
You didn't think it was going to be that guy,
the most important guy. And the way you build a
team is the most important guy must be the guy
both on the field and off the field, and if
he's not that guy, then you got to find another guy.
Speaker 5 (09:58):
Now, what did this whole situation, How did it impact
you as a coach going forward?
Speaker 3 (10:03):
Were you more confident?
Speaker 5 (10:04):
Did you know now like that this is what I'm
supposed to be doing, or did it make you question
your decision about what I did with Vernon, or just
question even being in the coaching game, like just overall.
Speaker 1 (10:19):
Not that day, I didn't What I didn't realize is
how far removed you know, when you were a player
and you're playing the game, it's one thing. The coach
is the same thing. That's great, okay, and you're not
really that much invested in what's happening in life. You
hear it, but you're focused on football. You're focused on
(10:42):
when you're focused on being all pro the best you
can be. But when you become a coach, particularly the
head coach, then you begin to see the whole picture.
And so the thing that I guess, the thing that
I was most really concerned about after I became a coach,
(11:07):
you begin to see where the game has gone, how
much the game has been removed from what it used
to be. I remember when I first started playing the game,
when I sat down, I had coaches talk to me
about this is what football is all about. This is
(11:27):
what even the position is all about, the position of
middle linebacker. When you're the middle linebacker, you have to
be the leader you have to set the standard for
how we practice, how we prepare, when we get on
that field, what we do, how we get there, all
of those things. As the middle linebacker, that's what you do.
(11:48):
So to me, when I became a head coach, it's going,
you know, miles ahead forward. I was the head coach,
So I'm setting the standard. And to kind of get
a slap on the wrist, Hey, wait a minute, that's
a grown man. You don't do that to a grown man.
I'm hearing all these people talk about it, but I said, yes,
(12:10):
he's a grown man. But when you become a part
of a team, just like when you become a part
of the family, there can't be rules that are here
for some people and they're set at a different level
for others. When you do that, then we got a problem.
That's the way it is in our society. That's the
way it is on different teams, different organizations, And to me,
(12:35):
it has to be whenever you have a team of
any kind, this is the team. This is the culture,
and it's for everybody, and it starts with the leader
and it goes down. It trickles down to everybody else.
If it's not going to be there, then you don't
have a team because there's no consistency. A team is
(12:55):
consistent across the board. That's how you develop the culture.
Speaker 4 (13:00):
Yeah, so there are a lot of people that know
you for that that rant, and you're so much more
than that. Right as Roma saying, you know segon ball
like you're you were a dominant player. If no one
has ever seen film on you and you had to
describe yourself and your style of play to a person,
(13:24):
how would you describe yourself your style of play?
Speaker 1 (13:29):
I would say my style of play, you know the
Samurai Warrior, that that is my style of play. It
is it is all out, it is reckless, it is abandoned.
But at the same time, there is a respect for
my opponent. I'm never gonna dog my opponent. I'm not
(13:52):
trying to take his heart. What I'm trying to do
is compete, compete to win at the very highest level,
but in such a way that when that game is over,
that competition is over. I can walk up to that
person and shake his hand and say, next time.
Speaker 5 (14:10):
How did you become How did they name you the
Samurai war Like? Were you into martial arts?
Speaker 4 (14:16):
Have anime or something like that.
Speaker 1 (14:20):
First of all, it was the energy, was the intensity. Yeah,
you know, there's a certain intensity. I'm this way right now.
But if I were to play a game, that would
be something that would change.
Speaker 3 (14:32):
There.
Speaker 1 (14:33):
There's a change is that's going to happen. There's going
to be a transfer. I'm stepping outside of the line
and I'm talking to you and it'asy hey man, how
you doing? What's going on? But when I step inside
the line, it's different. You know what it's on. So
that that really is the to me, that's that's the difference,
(14:56):
knowing how to do that.
Speaker 5 (14:58):
Okay, So this is exactly what I wanted to hear.
So because growing up, first of all, the nostalgia to
be a Chicago Bears defense at the time when you
guys were there doing what you guys were doing playing
for the forty six, Like all these words in football
jargon have become legendary because of what you guys were
(15:18):
able to do, and you were a vital part of that.
You know, when we see you guys on all the
highlights where you can see the smoke coming from up
underneath the helmets and when.
Speaker 3 (15:26):
You're barking out orders and blah.
Speaker 5 (15:28):
Blah, blah blah and always see you know, yeah, Scoop,
your eyes are I don't even know if you blink.
Speaker 3 (15:35):
Did you ever blink?
Speaker 5 (15:36):
Okay, so you know, so I could see this so
vividly as a young kid.
Speaker 3 (15:45):
This is all I ever wanted to do. I wanted
to play at Soldier Field.
Speaker 5 (15:48):
I wanted to play in cold weather because I could
see the steam coming out of my now when I
played in cold weather.
Speaker 1 (15:52):
I changed.
Speaker 3 (15:55):
Once I did that, I changed my mind.
Speaker 5 (15:57):
But these are all things that I picked up as
a young man and watching the NFL's hardest hits with
you and the rest of your teammates and all these
other things. And this defense that you guys ran so
just that is the encapsulation of what we all felt.
I don't know if you ever thought that you were
presenting that picture or what you actually thought that you
(16:19):
were presenting.
Speaker 3 (16:20):
I'd love to know that from you.
Speaker 5 (16:22):
It was this just who Mike Singletary has always been
as a person and as a player.
Speaker 1 (16:27):
Well, it was it was really the first time that
you didn't just come on the field, buddy Ryan. That
defense came out of all of our linebackers getting hurt
at some point in time, before I got the ball,
Before I got to the Bears, everybody had gotten hurt,
(16:47):
all the linebackers, so Buddy had to use DB's so
he had to protect them. And so now you got
six defensive linemen across the board, and then you got
a couple of line backers behind. Well, he used DB's
but he had to cover him up, Doug Plank and
Gary Fencing. So that's where forty six came from. Doug Plank,
(17:09):
that was his number, So that that's where the forty
six came from. So when I started, when when I started,
you know, playing on first down and second down, well,
I wasn't playing at the time. I was middle linebacker.
Most middle linebackers came out of the game on third down.
(17:30):
So I'm thinking, I'm not coming off the field on
third down. You know, if I'm good enough on first
and second down, I got to figure out what am
I gonna What do I need to do to become
the third down guy. So that was a conversation for
Buddy and I and we went back and forth for
a year before that happened, and finally, you know, he
(17:53):
had cursed me out enough told me not to talk
to him about it. It ain't happening because it's too complicated.
So finally I asked him again and I said, Buddy,
I'm getting ready to go home, back to Houston's off season.
If I were to play on the forty six, well
would I have to do if I to play it
(18:13):
on every down? The nickel every down and that forty six.
That guy that was that middle line back on the
forty six, on every play, he had to do about
five or six things depending on the keys. And so
for me, it was going home. Buddy said, hey, you
(18:34):
need to lose You need to get down to like
two twenty five to twenty six. Um, really, yeah, you
need to get down by two twenty five because you
gotta cover receiver, you gotta cover backs, you gotta cover
tight ends down the field. You got to go out
there and cover wide house as they come across the field.
You take them as they come across. So he said,
(18:55):
and you can't do that. So I said, okay. So
when I came back, I was two twenty five to
twenty six. Buddy was pissed up. In a minute. He
saw when I came back from art seat, and he said,
why'd you lose that weight? I said, because I want
to play third down. I told you you're not playing
third down. Okay. A couple of weeks later, a Nickel
(19:17):
guy got hurt and I ran on the field, but
it was cursing me out, and I was working with
the Nickel guys. I was going down there working on uh,
working with the corners and the safeties and all that. Well,
he got pissed when I went down there and did that,
why are you going down there and working with them?
So I just need to work on myself. But so
I'm covering I'm covering Willie Gaulton, I'm covering Dennis Gentry,
(19:38):
the f i astest guys, quickest guys. Yeah, all the time,
covering Walter. And that's all I wanted to cover. And
so when that happened, Buddy that Monday, Buddy called me
in the office. It's okay, here's what we're gonna do.
(19:59):
I'll put you in on four six, and you make
one mistake, you're out. You understand what mistake? Yes, So
never mistakes. Never mistake. Just it just increase the amount
of film work that I put in. It just increased
the amount of That's what I wanted. That's that's what
(20:20):
has as a leader. That's what you want. You want
your your leader on your team to say, give it
to me, give it all to me. What else is
that it? Okay, let's go, that's what you want. When
you have that, you've got a chance.
Speaker 3 (20:34):
Stay tuned in.
Speaker 2 (20:35):
We'll be right back after a quick break.
Speaker 3 (20:39):
Yeah.
Speaker 4 (20:39):
So when I got to Chicago, obviously they give you
like a little class with the rookies and they talk
about the defense, and you know it's one of the
oldest franchises in the NFL, so you're thinking like, okay, yeah,
this is cool. Then I get out there for my
first mini camp with the with the Vets.
Speaker 2 (20:55):
Well, you know, rookies, you're good. Get out there with
the Vets, and you're just.
Speaker 4 (20:58):
Like, oh, snap, that's that's Brent Rocker, that's Mike Brown,
that's you know, you're You're running through all these names
and I'm like, man, am I supposed to be here
or not? My question for you when you got drafted,
you get to Chicago, at what point did you know, Yo,
I can lead this defense, I can lead us to
be champions. How long did that take or was that
(21:20):
like an immediate thing that you just knew I'm the
mic backer.
Speaker 3 (21:23):
Y'all gonna play on my level.
Speaker 1 (21:25):
Here is Here is the thing. This is what really
caused the rift between Buddy and I. When I from
the first day I got there, I was in there.
I was in the huddle as a rookie and Dan
Hampton who was All Pro, and Alan Page was future
Hall of Famer, who were in the huddle. And I'm
a rookie. I'm getting in the huddle and Dan and
(21:49):
Alan Page a talking. So I get in the huddle
and I'm calling the defense and they're jacking around whatever,
and I look at him and say, hey, what are
you doing. Let's be quiet in the huddle. Buddy. Buddy
was walking by with his pipe and he's a wait, wait, wait, wait,
hold on, you know, he said, do you know who
that is? He's going to Alan Page. I said, no,
(22:11):
I know who he is, but I don't care who
he is. He's a huddle and when you in my huddle,
you be quiet. Buddy said, we're gonna have a problem.
So that was the beginning of our relationship. So I
came to Chicago thinking that I don't know where they are.
I know they haven't they haven't won in a number
(22:33):
of years. Oh, we're gonna win. We're gonna win. So
I went to Chicago. When I when I stepped in
the huddle that first day, it was with the intent
to start. It was with the intent to go to
the super Bowl. It was with the intent of becoming
an All pro, It was with the intent of being
a Hall of Famer, all of those things. When I
stepped in the huddle the first day.
Speaker 3 (22:52):
Those are your goals when you came in.
Speaker 1 (22:56):
Those are my goals at twelve years old.
Speaker 3 (22:58):
Oh, tell me about that? How did that? How did
those become your goals?
Speaker 5 (23:02):
Not everybody has such lofty goals.
Speaker 3 (23:06):
What led you to that point?
Speaker 5 (23:07):
What gave the young Mike Singletary that type of confidence
to say, you know what? You know, I really truly
I'm gonna shoot for the stars and hopefully land.
Speaker 3 (23:15):
On the moon.
Speaker 1 (23:16):
First of all, I'm the last of twelve kids. I
mean I'm the last of ten kids, and so I
was the smallest of the ten and the least talented.
We were a Pentecostal family. My father was a Pentecostal pastor,
and so we could not play sports.
Speaker 3 (23:39):
Your uncle, your brothers a pastor as.
Speaker 1 (23:41):
Well, Right, Well, no, they were a couple of them
are Christian, but not the castas so so the being
a Pentecostal or no football was allowed at all, and
so I wish my brothers would have been able to play.
But anyways, my father and my mom divorced when I
(24:04):
was twelve. And before they divorced about when I was
nine ten years old, there were some tapes that came
to my house, and those tapes for Norman Vincent Peel
tapes the amazing results of positive thinking. So when I
got those tapes, you know, my family was kind of chaos, disarrayed, Dad,
(24:24):
mom fighting all the time, all these kind of things
and other than and out of jail, sister, that baby's
out of wedlock. It was tough. And so I got
these tapes and I put these tapes on and Norman
Vincent Peele taught me how to close my eyes and
visualize myself in what I wanted to be. I saw
(24:48):
the Dallas Cowboys play. Roger Starbat was the guy that
I saw that he captured my eyes and I wanted
I want it to be that guy. He was the
team leader, he always said the right thing. He looked
like he was the spiritual leader on the field. Guys
(25:11):
believed in him, and he willed that team to win.
So when I saw him, that's what I want to be.
Right away, I knew I wouldn't have quartered by, but
I wanted to be a leader, and that's the one
thing that I know I am. And so when I
(25:32):
had the opportunity to look at the Cowboys play, I
w was sneaking watch the Cowboys play on Sundays, and
that was hard to do. Sometimes I was sick and
I stay home and watch the Cowboys. So fast forwarded.
My mom and dad divorced. My brother Grady moved back
(25:53):
home when I was twelve years old, and he was
killed in an automobile accident six months after my dad left.
So I'm thinking, you know, I don't know about this
God thing. I don't know about you know, being the
best that I can be, and all this other kind
of stuff. God let me down, God let us down.
Mom got to go to work and work two and
three jobs, and Grady is home, he's trying to do
(26:15):
the right thing, and he's now dead. So where am I?
So I made the decision that basically just kind of
meander through life. My mom challenged me that day, a
couple of weeks after the funeral, my brother's funeral, and
she said, son, I want you to know that there
is greatness in you. I want you to know that
(26:36):
I'm gonna ask you something that's unfair, but I need
to know if you can do this. She said, I
need to know if you can be the man at
the house. And in a moment, I was like me,
you want me to be the man at the house,
I'll still suck at my thumb and so so. But
(27:01):
I said, okay, I can do that. I walked in
my room. And keep in mind, I've been listening to
him and Vincent Peale about what I wanted in life,
what I wanted to be in life. So I walked
in my room. I got out a sheet of paper.
I got a book coming out that has all this senate.
But I got out of sheet of paper and I
(27:23):
began to write out But I knew what I didn't
know then but I know now was my vision statement.
It was find a way to get a scholarship, to
go to college, get my degree in which I'd be
the first in my family to do so, become an
All American, get drafted and go to the NFL, buy
(27:43):
my mom a house and take care of her for
the rest of my life. Become an all pro, go
to the Super Bowl, and own my own business. I
wrote that out, and I put it on the wall,
and I looked at that every day and every morning,
every day, before I went to before I went to
bed at night, I looked at it. And before I
went to school in the morning, I looked at it.
(28:05):
That was my driving force. And I wasn't even playing
football at the time. I had to beg my mom
to let me play.
Speaker 3 (28:13):
So what age did she let you play?
Speaker 1 (28:14):
Twelve?
Speaker 5 (28:15):
Okay, so when you became the man in the house,
you got to play football.
Speaker 3 (28:19):
Yes, that is awesome.
Speaker 5 (28:23):
I don't know how many times you've shared that story,
but I'm glad we got that today.
Speaker 3 (28:29):
Yeah, what's the name of the book.
Speaker 1 (28:32):
The name of the book is greatness. Hold on, we
just came up with the name of last week, greatness.
I'll think of it.
Speaker 3 (28:43):
It's fine, let's talk about sweetness.
Speaker 1 (28:46):
Go ahead.
Speaker 5 (28:47):
I don't think I've ever got to ask anybody what
it was like to be his teammate. I've never got
to meet or sit down with one of his teammates.
He was my second favorite player. I mean, I played
with you guys on technobol, So.
Speaker 3 (29:01):
What was that like?
Speaker 5 (29:02):
I remember the videos of him with the pumas running
up the hills.
Speaker 1 (29:05):
Any accolades that he received he deserved, I didn't. I
didn't like running backs when I came to the NFL.
I had no respect for running backs. And I don't
mean that in a nasty way.
Speaker 2 (29:23):
I couldn't sell because your face was so straight.
Speaker 4 (29:25):
I'm glad you said that.
Speaker 1 (29:28):
I was.
Speaker 3 (29:31):
The greatest. Was like, I don't like running backs. I
was like, damn, I'm.
Speaker 2 (29:38):
Glad you laughing now, thank you?
Speaker 3 (29:40):
Holy Yeah.
Speaker 1 (29:42):
But anyways, I was, I was. I was telling. When
I first met Walter, everybody was telling me how crazy
he was, the prankster and all that. And I went
up to Walter when I first got there, the rookie,
and I said, Walter, I said, I really respect you
and I appreciate you as a person, but whatever you do,
(30:04):
don't pull a prank on me. I don't take those well.
And I you know, I don't laugh a whole lot either.
So Walter was like, okay, that was that was my
first Yeah, okay, but I I really have any opportunity
to watch him and see him. He was an amazing individual.
(30:29):
First of all, I don't think I've ever seen him
say no to an autograph. People would be lined up,
I don't know how long, and Walter would stand there
and sign every one of them. He was what you
want in an athlete. The attitude of an athlete toward
(30:50):
the fans, that's what you want, because he realized and
recognized the importance of being this this figure, and people
loved him, and it was it was a beautiful thing
to see. When I get first got there, you know,
(31:10):
no one was asking for my grab, and I'm thinking, like, man,
that's that's a long line man all the time. So
but it was it was really cool. As a player,
he could do anything. He could throw the ball ninety yards.
A matter of fact, he played. He played quarterback one
(31:30):
game we got all our I ran the back. Yeah,
he started played quarterback in one game that I.
Speaker 2 (31:38):
Do like a couple half back passes.
Speaker 1 (31:40):
Now, he started and played quarterback in one of our games.
Speaker 3 (31:45):
So what was that like that whole week of practice. Oh,
it was cool.
Speaker 4 (31:49):
Cool, you'll just show up like that, like.
Speaker 1 (31:55):
Yeah, it was really it was the first it was
the first sign of a wildcat. Right, yeah, but yeah,
he startedn't play quarterback. Every quarterback we had was done
toast and he started.
Speaker 3 (32:10):
We all have signature plays. I got a signature play.
I mean, rings you, it doesn't matter. I think your
signature play is.
Speaker 4 (32:18):
Don't worry about it. We've worried about Mike Marshawn Lynch.
You trying to like make the tackle twice.
Speaker 3 (32:23):
I don't think that's that's.
Speaker 4 (32:26):
I do your signature, your signature play thirty one, Eric
Dirickson MC title game.
Speaker 3 (32:34):
Let's talk. Can you talk us through that play?
Speaker 1 (32:38):
It was it was like we're in college again when
I was a Baylor and he was at s m U. Yeah,
we've had we've met many times like that.
Speaker 3 (32:49):
And we already know your opinion on running backs.
Speaker 2 (32:54):
Don't respect him, don't like him.
Speaker 1 (32:57):
Now, you know what, there's nothing more beautiful than than
watching a running back and in their in their greatness running.
I love to see a great running back. But when
I'm playing against them, I don't like them.
Speaker 4 (33:10):
Absolutely yeah, say less, yeah, do you remember the play?
Speaker 1 (33:16):
You know it was it was a routine play. It
was a third one, and you know they they normally
if he's lining up on the right, he's gonna probably
come across the ball. Running left, he's line up on
the other side, he's gonna come across one. But more
than anything, it was just sometimes you you you just
(33:39):
gotta go on blind faith. Eric is such a big guy.
A lot of people don't realize how big he is,
and so just his his lean is gonna get him
a first down if you got a third one. So
I knew that I made up in my mind, you
gotta go the minute you if there's end, if this
(34:02):
guy moved, this guard moves just a bit just to
show me, Yes, if the guard moves just that much,
I gotta go now.
Speaker 3 (34:14):
So you know, I.
Speaker 5 (34:17):
Read something that you had talked about after winning that
Super Bowl. You know, you're the one defensive MVP that year,
you were all pro went to another Pro Bowl. You
guys had just won a Super Bowl, and I think
the word that you said was that you you had
felt emptiness at that time in your life, like you
(34:39):
were just incomplete because you maybe talk about how just
because because I remember I became personally I kind of
went through something very similar in my life where you know,
we had won a super Bowl, I just became the
highest paid person in my position, and I was living
in la and I felt sometimes the most alone out
(34:59):
of failed my life. And I literally had everything under
the sun that I ever wanted as a young man,
and it just was missing. And I think that's when
I was called the faith. And so could you maybe
share about your journey and your story at that point
in time and.
Speaker 3 (35:15):
How you were feeling.
Speaker 1 (35:16):
Absolutely that was another marker that I had in my
vision statement going to the Super Bowl, and I just
envisioned the night before what that was going to be, like,
how amazing, the feeling of being the world champion and
all of that. And right after the game, the confetti's
coming down and everybody is laughing and crying, and right
(35:41):
away I felt this loneliness, like this anger, frustration and
loneliness at the same time, and I'm like, Lord, what
in the world is this? You know, where did this
come from? And there was this small quiet voice in
me because I didn't I didn't like my dad and
(36:05):
I had this thing with my dad. I hadn't talked
to him in a while, didn't want to be around him,
and and this small voice said, you need to forgive
your father I'm like, no, no, I'm, I'm I'm. We
don't talk, we don't argue, we don't do anything. So
I'm good, no need to forgive your father. So that
(36:28):
voice didn't go away for several days, and finally I
picked up the phone and called my father from Chicago
and he was in Houston, and I said, Dad, I
I you know. He picks up the phone and the Dad,
I just want you to know, I forgive you for
everything that happened. And he said, hey, forgive me for what?
You know. I put clothes on your back, food on
(36:50):
the table, what what what? What? What are you talking about?
Rough over your head? What else is there? And so
needless is saved. For the next hour and a half,
you know, were screaming, I'm crying, and well, the next
step was for me to go to Houston. Get on
the plane, and go to Houston. A couple of weeks later,
so I'm sitting across with my dad like this, and
(37:12):
you know, on the way down to Houston, I'm just
imagining the things that I was gonna say to him.
I was gonna tell him what I really felt about him.
But yet, when I get there and I'm sitting across
with my dad, and I started talking to him, you know,
why did you why did you treat mom the way
you did? Why did you treat us the way you did?
Why did you act like this? Why did you why
(37:33):
were you angry all the time? Why were you so
I As I began to ask him those things, He's
looking at me and he really didn't have an answer.
And I in that conversation, I begin to understand he
got kicked out of his house at thirteen, he got
he married my mom at like sixteen, and next thing,
(37:55):
you know, you got ten kids. So I began to
realize that he didn't have the tool. You had no
tools whatsoever. You're still a kid. And I'm looking at him.
He's seventy something years old, and I'm looking at him,
but he's still thirteen. He had the tools of a
thirteen year old. How do you deal with issues? How
(38:16):
do you deal with disagreements? How do you deal with
you know, when you can't pay the bills, when money
is not coming in, how do you deal with that? Well,
it turns the emotion, and normally that emotion is going
to be anger. So that was a tremendous opportunity for
me to get to know my father. And at the
(38:38):
end of that conversation that I was having with my dad,
I asked him. At the end, I said, Dad, I
know that I'm a lot like you. I said, can
you help me not to be like you? Can you
help me? I don't want to wreck my family, want
(39:00):
to wreck my kids. I don't want to do that.
What can you tell me to help me? That was
the beginning of our relationship as it begins to grow.
And I'm the only one, the only kid and out
of the ten that actually forgave my dad and and
really became friends with him.
Speaker 3 (39:20):
Did he have an answer for you when you ask?
Speaker 1 (39:23):
He just said, you know, it's it's like you're driving
down this this highway and you know you need to exit,
but you just never do just keep going. So exit, Yeah,
you need to exit, and and just slow slow down
and kind of you know, think about where you are
(39:43):
and being able to ask for forgiveness, being able to
say I'm sorry, being able to reflect. You know. I
I begin to read like crazy about family and relationships
and those kinds of things, began to really get in
my Bible like I'd never had before, and begin taking
(40:05):
those steps towards being all the things that I knew
my father could have been.
Speaker 4 (40:11):
Yeah, yeah, What emotions did you feel after you basically
said I forgive you and then you got to know
him and you understood, like, man, he's seventy, but he's thirteen. Like,
what emotions did you feel after the whole entire conversation?
Speaker 1 (40:28):
After the entire conversation, you know, you begin to realize
as you begin to look around, the more I begin
to read and understand America, our history, and particularly being
an African American father growing up in the South, all
of those things, the amount of frustration that he felt,
(40:52):
the dreams that he had that simply because he was
an African American he could never do, and being a
part of something great. I know, I'm a lot like
my dad, and and there's nothing. If I'm gonna do something,
oh it's it's gonna be great. If I can't make
(41:13):
it great, then I don't need to be a part
of it. Whether it's being a husband, whether it's being
a father, whether it's whatever job I'm in, whatever that is,
it's gonna be all out because I feel that's the
only way that I can represent God and say that
I'm a believer. I shouldn't have to say it. You
should be able to look at me and see by
(41:36):
my action that man is a believer, that man loves God,
that man without me saying a word. And if that's
not it, then something's wrong.
Speaker 3 (41:46):
We'll be back in a minute.
Speaker 5 (41:48):
So do you think all your personal turmoils from the
childhood trauma? Which childhood trauma usually hurt people, hurt other people.
That is this is what life has taught us. If
you read and then you researched, this is what happens.
Did all these emotions bottle up? Like now, hearing all
your stories and everything else, I totally understand why you
(42:10):
were the player that you were, who you were in
between the white lines versus outside the white lines. This
whole blurred vision of who Mike's singletary was as being
the man since twelve years old in his own household,
growing up all these other things did that kind of
make you the coach you were the way that you
you know, played on the emotions you understand and coach
(42:33):
the same way in a way, in the same kind
of veins the way you played. And ray Lewis had
a great quote when he described you when you were
the linebackers coach in Baltimore. It was good, you know, right, yeah, right,
was celebrated his birthday. He was praising the Lord the
other day's birthday. Ray and Girl came a long way.
So he said this about you. Singletary helped him Girl
(42:57):
as a player and a person. He understands this is
about people more than anything else. Lewis says, that's what
makes coach so powerful. For him, coaching is almost like fatherhood.
Teaching the game is one thing, but giving a man
tools and understanding that's bigger than the game.
Speaker 3 (43:14):
That's deep.
Speaker 1 (43:17):
He I mean, he knows that that's who I am.
My thought process if I'm going to coach and really
do what I believe coaching was always meant to be
(43:40):
is if I'm coaching someone, it winning is kind of
a byproduct of helping you to become a man. If
I'm winning championships and you know five years later, you
know you're in a situation where you're beating your wife,
(44:02):
or you know you're jumping on your kids, or you're
doing something matter, then I fail as a coach. My
job is to help you understand the football that that's gravy.
That's you know, I got skilled, I got talent, I
got it. That's gravy. That's something that I should do.
(44:27):
But being a man, that's something that takes a lot
of work. It does takes a lot of discipline, take
a lot of sacrifice. And if I'm not gonna have
you go through that, and I'm gonna I'm setting you
up for failure because you think you're winning, but you're
(44:49):
losing because you know, the time that you play football,
that's a short span of life, but you have the
rest of your life. And you know, the last thing
that I would want my players to say about me
is why didn't coach teach me that? You know, sometimes
(45:10):
the coaches are the last line of defense. You're the
last opportunity to help that man get what he needs
before he goes into real life.
Speaker 3 (45:19):
So anyways, do you still want to coach?
Speaker 1 (45:25):
You know what I think, in all honesty, there are
so many the needs now in our society are so great.
I'm not sure that if I were coaching now that
I'd be looking back outside of the lines realizing I
(45:45):
need to be out there where the fight is. And
I'm not quite sure if I'm not a dinosaur now
in the game. Because my thought process isn't going to change.
I'm not going to say it's okay, you know, say
what you want to say and do what you want
to do. I'm not gonna be okay with that. Now
(46:06):
I'm violating the game. To me, there's a the game
is there's there's there's a respect that comes to the game.
You don't just play the game because you're great. You
play the game because there's a code of ethics that
you play by and you live by. When I was
(46:28):
in junior high and high school, the athletes were the
role models. You say, hey, you know, need to be
like Jimmy man making got three point oh.
Speaker 3 (46:40):
You study and even doing that, right.
Speaker 1 (46:42):
The athlete, that's that's that's what you want. Well, it's
not that way anymore. And now there's a reason why
that is so so easy to lose. Focused sometimes.
Speaker 5 (46:53):
Okay, I got I got one of that. I'm wanna
back it up with one. What keeps you busy?
Speaker 3 (46:57):
Right now?
Speaker 1 (46:59):
What keeps me busy? Studying? Man? I study. I'm always
studying about health, brain, health, hard health. Energy, graphene graphite
carbon graphene is just a form of energy and making
(47:20):
batteries with it. So graphene, graphite, you know, those kinds
of things, methane, carbon, those are things that the new energy,
you know, we got to find a way to have
this this uh, this country continued to run, and those
are some of the things that you know are going
(47:41):
to be a problem if we don't do something about it.
So that's something that I'm I'm involved in and study
a lot. The health is huge, particularly mental health is huge,
So I study a lot about that. And and knowing
that you played this game, and you played it at
(48:03):
such a level, I'm probably broke more helmets than anybody.
Speaker 5 (48:07):
That is exactly what I wanted to go to. This
is my backup. Well, I mean, your career Baylor is legendary. Okay,
you were a two time All American. Your sophomore year,
you had two hundred and thirty two tackles. I don't
really know how you accomplished that.
Speaker 3 (48:24):
I don't either two tackles to play.
Speaker 5 (48:27):
So one game you had thirty five tackles. You also
had three other games with thirty plus tackles.
Speaker 3 (48:34):
They actually third other co tackles in one game.
Speaker 5 (48:37):
Yes, this young man did, and they actually tried to
dispute it, and they actually went through the film and
they said no, it was correct and so and then
the other thing was you actually broke eight helmets in
college over three year, over your three year career. Was
that your helmet or somebody else's helmet?
Speaker 1 (48:55):
Both? Oh?
Speaker 3 (48:56):
Okay? Both with an F okay? So like, when you're
doing these things, how how did you bring it up?
How intimidating is that? When?
Speaker 5 (49:13):
I can't imagine because you I don't think you thought
yourself is anything bigger than anything. You probably just just
Mike singletary. But how much fear do you think you
struck another?
Speaker 3 (49:25):
People? And was that a goal?
Speaker 1 (49:27):
It really wasn't you know? I never I never set
out to intimidate anyone. You know. I've had guys ask me, man,
what's wrong with you? But what are you mad at?
I'm mad at anything you know? Or what are you taking?
I'm not taking anything? Man? Also, you know what you're
gonna tell me what you're taking? The guys are mad
(49:48):
at me because I'm not taking anything, you know. But
in all honesty, football was just and everybody was always
telling me it was too small. You know, you're you're
not big enough you're not fast enough, you're not mean enough,
You're not And so for me it was I always
(50:14):
believe that, you know what, Lord, I'm going to give
everything I have to you and you take it and
do whatever you want to do with it. I'm just
going to give you my best. That's all I can do.
And so I always had, whether it was a coach
or a mentor that I was able to ask how
(50:38):
do I become the best? And they would always give
me this list. How do I become an all pro?
How do I become you know, Devons a Player of
the Year, how do I become MVP? How do I
do it? So I always would find someone that would
be honest with me and tell me, Okay, you need
to do this every day, you need to do that
(50:58):
every day, you need to do this every day. You
need to do this. Twice a week, you need to
do that, and whatever it was. At the end of that,
I would always add a little bit more and say, okay, Lord,
here's my Christmas list, and I'm gonna go after it.
I'm gonna work at it, and I'm gonna do the
very best that I can to bring you glory. And
(51:19):
at any time I accomplish any of these it's because
of you. And you know I mean that from the
bottom of my heart.
Speaker 4 (51:28):
You are very accomplished in all the things that you do.
So we asked this question to a lot of our guests.
You get four picks who would be on your personal
Mount Rushmore from the time you were born till today,
of people that have of people that have had influence
(51:50):
and just poured into you over your life.
Speaker 1 (51:54):
Obviously number one is my mom. Number two.
Speaker 3 (52:01):
I would have to say, well, let me see why Mom?
Speaker 1 (52:05):
Why Mom?
Speaker 3 (52:06):
Yeah, this is.
Speaker 1 (52:09):
Let me put it this way. My mother was everything.
She was amazing. She was the one that, you know,
when the doctors told her to abort me because she
was in her forties, I had several miscarriages. She said, no,
(52:32):
not doing that. God's gonna God's got something special in here.
She's the one that sat me down across from me
and with the Bible and just went through the Bible
every day. Taught me about how to be a man,
how to be a godly man, how to stand when
(52:56):
nobody else will, even if you're the only one. Don't
be afraid to die for the right thing. Those kinds
of things are things that I sat there said yes, yes, yes,
ma'am okay, I got it. So that's that's why mom uh.
(53:20):
Coach Brown. Coach Brown was my high school coach. Coach
Brown believed in me. Coach Brown was tough man. Coach
Brown had a board, pop you on your tail. You
don't know what you're doing.
Speaker 3 (53:33):
And in practice, oh yeah, it was always after practice.
Speaker 1 (53:36):
No in practice doing practice, so you you needed to
know what you were doing. It was really a track coach,
but he did yeah, so you have to know what
you were doing. But he always talked to me about
you know, he was say singletary when when when you
get to college. He would always talk to me as
(53:59):
as if I had already done those things. So when
you get to college, there will be all kinds of distractions.
You gotta make sure you stay focused, stay focused on
it's too easy. A lot of guys that are more
talented than you, vaster, bigger, all that they're not gonna
make it. Know why they're not gonna make it because
(54:21):
they don't have what you have heart heart. So when
you get to college, and he said, when you leave,
do not come back here. I don't want to see
you until you got your paper when you got your degree,
that's what I want to see you. So that was
coach Brown and then number three, oh man, I only
(54:48):
got four. Number three would be coach taff Coach grantaff
my head coach in college. My freshman year, Coach Taft
would come by the door and knock on my door
say I want you to go with me. I'm going
to go speak to a church. I'm going to go
(55:09):
speak to a council meeting. I'm gonna go do this.
I'm gonna go do that. And I'm like, yes, sir,
I'll go. And one day he called me and he said, Mike,
I'm supposed to go to this church and speak, but
I can't go. I need you to go for me.
(55:32):
I'm like, go where. So I need you to go
to this church and I need you to speak to them.
By God, you've heard me. Do it. I want you
to do it, Yes, sir, So I'd go. And that's
that's kind of really how I started speaking and training
myself to get better at that speaking. And he helped
(55:56):
me to become the leader that God was calling me
to be. And there were times to Coach Tafford come
into my dorm and say. He would be crying. Said,
you know what, Mike, I told this kid, if you
do this again, if I catch you stealing again, I'm
(56:17):
gonna send you home. And I said, so, what's the problem, coaching.
I called him again and I said, what's the problem.
I gotta send him home? I said, what's the problem.
I promised his mom that I was gonna get make
(56:38):
sure that he got his degree. He come from nothing,
He come from nothing. And I said, well, coach, you
held up. You're part of the bargain. I said, but
if you say yes to the kid, if you don't
say anything, you're the kid. You failed him, and you
fell a team. Okay. And then the other coaches would
(57:06):
come to me and say, who in the hell do
you think you are to tell him that? I said,
he asked my opinion, You asked my opinion. I'm gonna
give it to you. I didn't go to him. He
came to me. So, but that was coach Taff and
the leadership role that he put on on me the
(57:27):
last one.
Speaker 5 (57:30):
Mm hmm.
Speaker 1 (57:32):
Now I got to give it to my girl, my wife. Yeah.
My wife is by far my best friend. She she
was with me when when I was hard when I
was tough, when the way I played the game was
(57:53):
the way I lived at home. I'm focused, man, you know,
I'm focused, not relaxing, still trying to become a man,
and she would just it's okay, I know. It's like
I got it. I got it, I got it, and
she just kept loving me through it. Until one day
(58:19):
I really began to realize. I took a step back
and I really looked at her, said, Wow, God loves
me so much to give me somebody with the patience.
Because I knew I was a different I was stubborn,
a hard headed, knucklehead. But because she loved me the
(58:43):
way she loved me, never gave up on me, always
building into me. It helped me become. It helped me
refine myself and become all that God has created me
to be. And I'm still working. But it's because I
heard that. I feel that I'm the luckiest man in
(59:04):
the world. Yeah, yeah, my best friend. Man, that's beautiful.
It is beautiful. That's all the questions we got for
a coach. That was beautiful.
Speaker 3 (59:14):
We got to end it on that. Hey, yeah, man,
that was Uh that was great. Coach. You're probably the
most passionate guest.
Speaker 2 (59:20):
We you ever had, not probably you are. I was
trying to this is not a hot seat, but you
made it a hot seat.
Speaker 4 (59:28):
Were trying to have fun and laugh, and I got
you to laugh a couple of times.
Speaker 2 (59:32):
Yeah, okay, that we gotta go to comedy, showed inn.
Speaker 5 (59:36):
No, that's not that's not what he told Walter Payton.
That was not Walter Payton. You said some great things there.
You know what you your mom told you about don't
be afraid to die for the right thing. I think
you still live your life full speed ahead, just like that.
And so I'm appreciative of you spending this time with
(59:59):
us because for a long time I was just a
fan of Mike Singletary of the player. And we got
to meet Mike's singletary of the man, and we got
to hear about his journey, his path, the things that
created this enigma, this phenomenon that was in between the
white lines wearing number fifty for Chicago Bears. And I
(01:00:20):
got to look up your stats in Baylor, and I
got to know you more personable. And you know, some
of the great things that were told to you were
told to me my dad when I left school told me,
don't you come back home? That's all I got for you.
That's the only advice he had for me. And I
haven't been back since. And so it's always beautiful to know,
like when you've been set on the right path yourself,
(01:00:42):
because you see other great ones that are out there
in front of you, that are still fighting the good fight.
Speaker 3 (01:00:47):
And so I thank you for that.
Speaker 5 (01:00:49):
I thank you for your passion, your emotions, and your
genuine realness. You're just a different breed, and you truly
are a different breed and you should never oologize for that.
I'm honored to say I got to meet you at
your finest and you know you want to say anything
else before, I thank of you.
Speaker 4 (01:01:07):
Yeah, I'm being a Chicago guy, being in being on
you know, I plan on some great defenses, and I've
seen you around. I've never had an opportunity to sit
down and talk to you. I wanted to when we
did The Bears one hundred, but it was, you know,
you with your your old teammates. I was with mine,
so I kind of wanted to give you your space and
just kind of let you be. But I am a
(01:01:30):
fan first and foremost. Thank you for coming on our
podcast and just pouring in us. And I'm glad my daughter,
my daughter's in the back. I'm glad she was here
to see me work and just hear me and hear
your story. So yeah, thank you, thank you for that.
I'm very appreciative of that. Thank you very much, man.
Speaker 3 (01:01:53):
Great job man.
Speaker 5 (01:01:54):
All of our viewers and listeners out there wherever you
pick up your podcast, where it's Apple Podcast.
Speaker 3 (01:01:58):
iHeartRadio.
Speaker 5 (01:01:59):
App uh give us a five star rating, lead review, click, follow,
h comment, share, subscribe, subscribe, all that other stuff that
Peanut always tells you.
Speaker 2 (01:02:08):
Tell her friend, to tell her friend, to tell her what.
Speaker 3 (01:02:11):
Tell a friend. Yeah, to make sure you tune.
Speaker 4 (01:02:13):
In and check us out on the NFL's YouTube channel
on Penut Best.
Speaker 2 (01:02:17):
Rumor and that is Samurai Mike.
Speaker 4 (01:02:21):
And this is the NFL Player's second Act podcast.
Speaker 3 (01:02:24):
We all, thank you all,
Hosts And Creators
Jamie Erdahl
Jason McCourty
Kyle Brandt
Peter Schrager
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