March 11, 2021 • 52 mins
The Texans new head coach talks with Steve and Jim about why he’s hopeful to have Deshaun Watson as his starting QB for the 2021 season (02:56). Culley also describes his first experience in the head coach interview cycle in 27 seasons as an NFL coach and why he thinks the Texans hired him (11:54). Culley coached Lamar Jackson in Baltimore and he describes why Jackson is on the verge of making a big leap forward with his game (33:59). And, Culley tells why his dad’s validation makes his long journey to his new job worth it (26:21).
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Episode Transcript
Available transcripts are automatically generated. Complete accuracy is not guaranteed.
Speaker 1 (00:00):
Coming up on Huddling Flow. Basically with us, everything that's
concerned with us inside this building, with the way we
are going about our business right now, is is that
it is positive. I'm excited to be here. One of
the reasons I'm excited to be here is because of
Deshaun Watson, and regardless of what's happening outside this building,
(00:21):
which quite frankly fellas I don't hear or read or
listen to what happens outside this building. I don't. I
have people come up to me all the time and
asked me about this and asked me about this situation.
But the point is, inside this building, inside this organization,
we feel positive about moving forward with this football team
(00:43):
with Deshaun Watson. That's next on Huddling Flow. We are
(01:04):
back once again at the heart on the Flow podcast,
brought to you by Into It, the proud makers of
Turbo Tax, QuickBooks and Mint. I am Steve White here
with my brother Jim Trotter. We are two thirds of
the Howard University mob our producer Thomas Warren on the
ones and twos he completes the puzzle and Jim today
this is this is an incredible day, right We get
(01:26):
We get to talk to a man who's involved in
the biggest offseason story that there is. That is Houston
Texans head coach David Culley. Steve, you know, there are
times when you you set up interviews and you don't
know quite what to expect. And I had not personally
spoken to David Culley before this interview. But man, I
(01:49):
walk away from this and I have to say, this
is one of my favorite interviews. This guy's energy, it's
sixty five years old, um, his mindset, his positivity, d
everything is just like wow. And that is not to
say that the Houston Texans are going to go and
have a successful season. But I can tell you this,
(02:09):
if I were a player and I had the opportunity
to play for this man, based on this interview, I
would love the opportunity to play for this man. That's right, Jim.
We've done the interview and we're not gonna We're not
gonna beliaebor the point much longer. Here we hit on
everything from DeShawn Watson to David's path to this point
to some extra special stuff including the interview, the head
(02:31):
coaching interviewing process, which is absolutely fascinating. So Jim, let's
get right to it and let's bring in Houston Texans
head coach David Culley. All right, Jim, Now we're joined
by our special guest, Houston Texas head coach David Culley. Coach,
thanks for joining the hudd On Flow podcast. Steve, glad
(02:52):
to be here, looking forward to it. Coach. We're happy
to have you. Look, we're not gonna insult your intelligence here.
We're gonna jump right into the big question of the
day with the Houston Texas is Deshaun Watson. Have you
spoken to him or have you spoken to his reps?
I have spoken to him when I did speak to him, Uh,
(03:12):
And and let me just say this too, I've spoken
to him. I've also spoken to some other guys on
this football team also other than the Shaun. But the
conversation that I've had with him and the conversation that
I've had with the other players that I've spoken to
was a private matter. Uh. It was a matter that
was between he and I and the other players that
(03:32):
I talked to, and in respect for them, I'm gonna
keep it that away. But yes, we have spoken. I
completely understand that and respect that. What I will ask
you is based on that conversation, do you expect Deshaun
Watson to be a Houston Texans this season? You know,
Deshaun Watson is our starting quarterback. I mean, he is
(03:52):
our starting quarterback, and I expect him to be our
starting quarterback as a matter of fact, at this point
right now, he's the only quarterback on our roster right
now that I have signed. So yes, I expect him
to be our quarterback. I'm just I'm just trying to
be here or clear on this. Coach, you know, paint
you until a corner. As you know, and I know
you've been around a long time, so you know how
to kind of definitely side steps some of this. Will
(04:16):
Deshaun Watson be the starting quarterback for the Houston Texas
in one He is our starting quarterback as of right now.
He is our starting quarterback. Things happened between now and then,
and then we'll see what happens. Because you just right now,
just right now, exactly exactly you've been around, coach, you
(04:38):
know better, Uh, he is our starting quarterback right Okay,
that's right right now and hopefully in the future. But
because you know, we have seen the report and we
know they're they're coming from some credible sources that said
he he told you in your meeting, and he's let
it be known to other people. UM that he does
(04:58):
not want to return to the Houston Texans. In fact,
we had a good friend of his, Jail and Rams
Yawn last week. They're represented by the same age, and
he said he doesn't think the Sean is gonna shoot
up for the Texans again. Um, the feeling in the building,
I mean, is it is it? You sound positive, but
everything we're hearing is sounding negative in terms of his
(05:19):
relationship and wanting to return. Well, this is how I
answer that, is that basically with us, everything that's concerned
with us inside this building, with the way we are
going about our business right now, is is that it
is positive. I'm excited to be here. One of the
reasons I'm excited to be here is because of the SHAWNE.
Watson and regardless of what's happening outside this building, which
(05:44):
quite frankly fellas I don't hear or read or listen
to what happens outside this building. I don't. I have
people come up to me all the time and asked
me about this, and asked me about this situation. But
the point is inside this building, inside this are gonna zation.
We feel positive about moving forward with this football team
(06:05):
with DeShawn Watson coach. You know, I gotta hit you
with the with the outside question here. Why do you
feel positive? Let me lay this out for you for
a minute. You guys have cap issues. You have personnel issues,
including a quarterback who has let it be known that
he does not want to be there. There are trust
factors that that he feels have been broken. You also
(06:25):
have a culture problem where some have issues with one
of the men at the top and Jack Easterby. So
I would ask you why was this job attracted to you?
Knowing all of those things. It's a tough spot you're in.
I mean to be frank well, I couldn't wait, listen,
I couldn't wait to be able to get on this
job right here, because first of all coming into this job.
(06:47):
First of all, this is the youngest franchise that that's
in the NFL right now. They've had some success here, uh,
with and without different guys here that's been here and
basically those things right there. Because when I first got here,
I didn't see I didn't feel that I didn't feel
that in the building. I didn't feel that during the interview. UH,
(07:08):
I haven't felt that. Another thing I felt good about
being here was with Nick in the general manager. I've
known Nick a long time. UH. I know what Nick
is all about. I know what his philosophy is, and
I'm aligned with the same way that he is as
as far as going and building a football team and
being successful. And that was the most attractive thing to
me once I end up becoming the head coach of
(07:31):
the Houston Texans. I felt good about that. Even with
all the other situations that the noise going around outside
about the sean, about UH, salary cap and those kinds
of things. Everything here and we're working through all of
those things right now, and that's what the off season
is for, to work through those things and then as
we move forward, UH, We'll see what happens. But as
(07:52):
of right now, I feel really good about it. And
this this is no smoke. This is for real. I
really believe that, and I feel that way and moving
forward that that That's how I'm looking at it, and
I feel good about that. Even after my discussion that
I had with the Sean, I felt good. I felt
positive about things because basically the meeting was basically just
(08:12):
they get to know him, get him, get to know me,
and that's basically what it was about. I felt good
about that. With the other guys that I called also
that I had had zoom meetings with that, I felt
the same way about that. And I felt the same
way about the excitement that they have about moving forward
from where they were to where we are right now.
(08:32):
And tru David, so they're saying, you know, Nick and
you and you're you're aligned with him, what is the
philosophy and and putting together this roster and let's just
keep it in the short term for the season. Well,
the thing is this, we're looking right now in free
agency because we know we've got to bring in some
other players. But competition. Competition, to me, has always been
(08:55):
one of the things that have made successful football teams successful,
you know, in building and doing things. And right now
you talked about earlier about salary cap issues. We've already
Nick has already made some moves and already gone through
the process right now of of doing things to to
make that better for us, and it has already started
(09:16):
to happen. You're starting to see us now to sign
some players, UH, to fill in some some roles that
we feel like we have and and and moving forward
with that that he knows that right now, and I
feel the same way as is that exactly what we're
doing right now during this process. And it's no different
than any other team going through the off season when
(09:37):
you have to make changes. You've got people leaving, you've
got people free agents, you got unrestricted restricted, and then
you have to make moves to be able to take
care of that. And we're in the process right now
doing that, and I feel good about where we're headed
and and doing that right now. You know, Coach, I
wanted to ask you about if I could transition for
a second to you being the only black coach hired
(10:00):
UM during this hiring cycle, and I read a quote
from you at one of your press conferences where you said,
I think the league is doing a great job. I
think the franchises and everybody is doing a wonderful job
of trying to get that to happen in terms of
leveling this playing field a little bit. And if I
could respectfully push back a little bit, I'm looking at
(10:21):
the last four hiring cycles there have been twenty seven
head coaching vacancies. Only three of those were filled by
a black person. So from my advantage point, I don't
see where the progress is there, and in fact, I
would argue that what we're seeing is a rollback if
you will. Why do you feel that progress is me
(10:46):
being made with those numbers, Because even when I look
at the last seven hiring cycles, only once in those
last seven hiring cycles were more than one black hired
in the same year. So why do you feel progresses
being made? Well, I think because of all of the
people that have been interviewed. You know, there's been more
and more African Americans have been interviewed each year now.
(11:09):
As far as as who gets who gets hired and
why they get hired, you know, I'm not sure why
that is. All I know is that in order to
have a chance to get hired, you have to have
that opportunity, and those opportunities have basically been there from
from the numbers and everything, and that's where that's where
I see that. That's why I think progress has been made,
(11:30):
is that there's been numbers of number of candidates that
have been interviewed for for jobs across this league and
again in the situation here with the Texans, I think
all but one, all but a couple were African Americans
that have been interviewed for the job here. So when
I say progress, that when I look at it from
that standpoint, is the fact that the opportunities are being there.
(11:53):
And I take myself for example, this was my first
time in twenty seven years of this league having an
opportunity to interview for a head coaching job. Now, quite frankly,
when I got into this situation and and UH got
offered the the opportunity to interview for this job, I've
said here, the first thing that went through my mind
(12:14):
was this, I've never been a coordinator. I've never had
an interview for a job UH as a head coach
in in the at this level. And then all of
a sudden, why me, you know, and and and and
when I talked to Nick and the guys here was
I said, well, look, if you hire me, here's the
first thing that I said. I said, if you hired me,
how do you justify hiring me? When I look around
(12:37):
all of these other UH candidates that have been coordinators,
some have been a head coaches before UH, they've been
interviewed multiple times UH in the league for jobs, sometimes
two and three years and and not getting jobs. But
I said, how do you justify that? And and and
the thing? And because I wanted to know, because I
did not want to be an interview e because of
(13:00):
the Rooney route. I did not want an interview to
say that I an interviewed for a job. I didn't
need that. I didn't want that. And before I took
the interview, I wanted to make sure that I wasn't
a part of that. And they assured me that they
that they were looking for h the best head coach
to fit this situation. And from doing all the research
on me, through talking to all the people that I've
(13:23):
coached with, and and and basically I go back to
John Harball the two years I spent with him in Baltimore,
being a big advocate of David Culley being a possible
head coaching candidate without having had any of the experience
that all these other guys have. Then you know, when
that happened and and I got the got the chance
to interview for the job, meant I had no I
(13:45):
had no idea that I was gonna be sitting in
this position that I'm in the day. But what I
was told when when I went through this process of
doing this, and I've had a lot of my buddies
that interviewed not only for this job, guys that I've
worked with, but for other jobs that I said, man,
you look at the qualifications, and I've said, man, my
chances of getting this job are very slamming none because
(14:08):
of of the criteria that everybody always says you gotta
have to be a head coach. I didn't fit that
from those standpoints. But what I did fit from listening
to John Harball and Ozzy Newsome was was that I've
been around pro I've been around franchises in this league
that have built before I was in Philadelphia nine. I
(14:29):
went from Philadelphia when Andy to Kansas City in I
went to to Buffalo with with Sean McDermott UH and
and I think it was twenty seventeen, and and then
I go to to UH Baltimore with John Harbaugh who's
basically at that point had been there and done that,
but had made a made a move in that franchise
(14:49):
UH to really flip that franchise back to again to
a situation where they've been before in making Lamar Jackson
the starting quarterback. The point being this was I had
been around franchises that had built, that had started, that
had had issues of whatever it may have been about, okay,
when it hadn't been what it should be. So when
(15:10):
I got that opportunity, I was told, go be yourself.
And when I went in those interviews, after talking to
Ozzie and John, I went in with the with the
with the philosophy of here's what I believe in, here's
what this twenty seven years have been in the NFL,
and the sixteen years have been in college that I
have seen, and all the franchises that I have been
around that have been winners, here's the here's the process,
(15:33):
here's what it has taken. And I've seen four of
those happened and I've been a part of that. And
so from when you, Jim, when you asked me about
the progress in this league, uh, I look at myself
as an example of saying, Okay, I'm African American. I
didn't have all those qualifications qualifications, but I got hired.
I got hired first of all, I think simply because
(15:54):
they felt like I was the most qualified to do
what this franchise needed to be done to get me
the to to move it forward again. The second thing
being an African American rate wonderful, but I never looked
at it that way, and from that standpoint for me
being hired here, I think it's progress from the standpoint
(16:14):
of saying, okay and African American in the situation that
I've been in, don't think that you don't have a chance.
And don't think simply because you're sixty five years old
and got your a A r P card that you
don't have the opportunity to be able to bring a
franchise and do what you needed to do. And I
felt that a way, and I looked at it from
that standpoint. Go ahead, Jim coach. Let me say this
(16:36):
to you, though you're speaking to my point here when
you say you didn't have those qualifications, that's where I
feel fundamentally the process is flawed. People trying to attach
certain positions to whether or not you're going to be
a successful head coach, which is foolish to me. You
don't have to be a coordinator, you don't have to
be a QB coach. You have to first and foremost
be a leader. Of men to be successful as a
(16:59):
head coach, and everything else flows from there. So the
fact that that you had to wait almost three decades
to even get an interview for a head coaching job
says to me that the process is flawed and the
way that they go about it is wrong, and add
on your college coaching experience, it also speaks to that.
(17:19):
So that's why I say, for me personally, I hate
to hear you say you didn't have those qualifications because
that feeds into this narrative that you have to be
a coordinator or you have to be this to to
be a head coach. You don't. You have to be
a leader of men. And as Tony Dungee has said
to us even on this podcast, owners don't know how
(17:41):
to hire coaches because they fall into that trap of
looking for all of these things that people talk about
but can never identify exactly what they believe it is
that the traits that are necessary to be a head coach.
So I'm off my soapbox online, but it just felt me.
Let me reiterate what you just said when you would
you said so true when you said about not having
(18:02):
the qualifications and whatnot, Well, I'll say this. I got
hired here because of those things. Of what you just said,
it has nothing to do with that I get. So
from that standpoint, I'm saying this franchise the McNair family.
When I interviewed with him, and when I interviewed with Nick,
that was what it was all about. I can't remember
(18:22):
before I Jim, before I got this interview, before when
Nick called me, uh, we were actually uh getting ready
to play a Buffalo in the playoff game, and and
all of a sudden it says, well, when this thing
is over with, we like to talk to you. So
when you think you might be ready to do that,
I said, I'm not sure I'm ready because I gotta
get all my books. I gotta get my book together.
(18:43):
I gotta get my my information together to be able
to do that. The first thing he said to me says,
I don't care about a book. He says, I don't
care about a book. That's not what we're looking for.
You know, we're looking for somebody to lead this football team.
And again that being said, I got so excited Jim
and Steve simply because way back when I put together
(19:05):
that book, I've said with Leslie Fraser and Eric b
Enemy and I've said with some of these guys, and
we've gotten all these things together about Okay, this is
what everybody has put together to be able to when
you go into the interview, you need to show these
general managers, you need to show these owners these things. Man.
All I took into that interview with me was myself.
I didn't have one piece of paper with me when
(19:26):
I went into that, not one piece of paper with
me into that interview. And when when I sat out
with John Harball and Ozzy Newsome, who I have the
ultimate respect for is I went and they said be yourself.
And then I said, look, I'm not paper and pencil,
you know, I'm not that. That's not who I am,
you know. So again I go back to Jim to
(19:46):
get your point. I can't answer what you're saying about
why it hasn't happened. But I just knew though in
the example that I had to me was an example
of again you're looking for leaders of men, and Tony
is so right. And again that's what I feel like
I've always been now, prior to getting this opportunity, all
(20:07):
the other opportunity and listen, I've been around guys probably
during the last probably ten fifteen years that I feel
like I helped get jobs, you know, I mean, and
and all of a sudden I'm sitting there saying, wait
a minute, uh, you know, I see this happen, and
see that happen, and then you start to think about it.
But let me go back to why I feel like
(20:29):
I'm here now. Is this is that I've always been
taught and told coming through this business, is that the
best thing you can do forgetting your next job is
to be the best that you can be at the
job that you're at, in whatever position that is. And
I've taken that, and I've used that. Now have there
been times when I've sat here and said, I can't
(20:49):
use the words right here, but could I say go
for it? I'm not going to you, but but why
why not me? Why can't I it an opportunity to
do this? But again, I always went back to that,
that thing of being the best that you can be
at what you're doing. And again I got to the
point where it wasn't like I was looking for one,
(21:12):
and it wasn't like if it never happened that I
would be disappointed. During my career. I wasn't. I was
completely happy that with where I was at, with what
I was doing, and still believe at some point, especially
when I came to Baltimore with John Harbaugh, he reassured me.
And going back to Jim to what you said earlier
(21:33):
about qualifications, Andy Reid would didn't call plays when he
became a head coach. Prior to Andy Reid becoming a
head coach, we were told you needed to be a coordinator. Well,
he wasn't a coordinator. He got hired, So then that
one got throughout the window because he got coase. There
are so many of those have been thrown out the
window and exit made for those and and and that's
(21:55):
part of the frustration here. Have always been told you
have to all of this path, and they follow that path,
and then they're not afforded the opportunity well to have
a shot at being a head coach. I was one
of those have been told that and then find and
then again I'm gonna go back and use John Hardball.
John Harball wasn't a coordinator when he got the job.
(22:15):
When Ozzi Knewsome hired John Harball. John Harball was a
defensive back coach, and the reason he went to be
a defensive back coach, and I'm just gonna get tell
you this here too is because he said, you know
they're not hiring special teams coaches. Well, here's here's the
guy that's not African American and saying, look, I'm a
special team's coach. They're not gonna hire me. So he
goes and he says, look, I want to be a
head coach someday. They're not hiring special teams coaches. Well,
(22:37):
he's he goes to John and says, look, I want
to coach secondary because I want to have a chance
some day have not I'm gonna go to Stanford and
be a defense coordinator from my brother and have a
chance to get a job someday. Well, point being is
those two examples right there which changed changed. Jim and
Stephen y'are saying about how this process is going. I
(22:57):
feel good about it simply because here is someone that
and and I and I go back to Steve that
I can remember you doing in the interview talking about
all the potential head coaches that were African Americans that
we're been looking And I don't feel bad about this,
but I wasn't one of those guys you had on.
I know that's right. And my point being is go ahead, no, no,
(23:20):
And I'll say this, Jim and I don't say these
things off the top of our head. We talked to
the lines, we talked to all these other people, and
they helped us. Right, So right, it's not it's not
just us. I mean so in terms of the whole process,
your your name, I mean, I'm being honest, wasn't one
that popped up right and and and I understand that,
I understand that completely. But what I'm saying is this
(23:42):
is that I was fully confident and when I got
this interview that if what they're looking for, if the
things they're looking for is what they're told me they're
looking for, I felt like I fit that bill, and
I had to come in and convince them that I
fit that bill. And I'll say this, during the interview process,
(24:04):
my first process was was a zoom. Then after the zoom,
after the zoom, now I didn't hear anything for about
six days. So I'm sitting there saying, I'm waiting on
that call back to say, hey, look I'm moving forward,
and I'm getting ready. At that time, we were getting
ready to going on vacation in Baltimore a little earlier,
and we expected and and so I got my dog,
my cat, and my wife and we're getting ready to
drive to Tennessee to go see my family. And then
(24:26):
next thing, you know, I get a phone call and
I tell John, I said, John, listen as that call
come in. And he said he had a call just
came in, he said, but it ain't the call we expected.
They want you for a second interview. Once I got
that call, I didn't and listen to this fellas. I
didn't change my plans now because I'm sitting here saying, look,
I'm going down here for an interview. I'm gonna be
on here for today, I'm gonna come back and then
(24:47):
when it's over it, I'm I'm gonna probably be in
Tennessee somewhere, driving down to forty eight to Tennessee from Baltimore,
and you know they're gonna tell me that you know
it's it's over. Well, it didn't happen that way. I
didn't make that trip to Sparta, Tennessee. I did. I
got a dad, it's ninety four years old, that's still
hanging in there, and I got to make that trip
(25:08):
a week later after they named me the head coach
of the Houston Texans. Let me tell you something. So
I'm sitting here saying, Jim and and and Steve, is
that that process it's not It hasn't been right, has
not been right. But I do know this from my experience.
And I told Leslie and Eric and some of those
guys we've been on conversations before that. Listen, Hey, I
(25:30):
don't know. I don't know why it was me. You know.
All I know is I knew what they were looking for.
And obviously I had enough in me to convince him
that that I was the right guy to do that.
And I felt one confident to do that, and when
I did it, and they gave me the job. And
listen to men, of all those things, y'all just asked me.
Whether it's about Deshaun, Steve or or a Jim, or
(25:51):
whether it's about the personnel or no kind of thing. Man,
that stuff doesn't doesn't scare me at all. Listen to me.
I've been doing this for forty three years. There's nothing
happening in this league right now that I haven't seen,
and that I'm also not surprised that nothing surprises me
in this league. It's not like I hear something and
they say, man, can you believe they did that? Yeah,
(26:12):
I can believe they did that, because it's happened before
you know, I got hold of I got two questions
for I want to follow up on that. But first
I want to ask you this. When you go back
to Sparta and you meet with your nine year old
father and you tell him you are the head coach
of the Houston Texans, what is that moment like and
what is that conversation like. Listen to this. It meant
more to me to me for him to be able
(26:35):
to say, David, I'm so proud of you. You know,
he says, I'm telling you, and it's almost like right
now he is saying like he's ninety four. He's sitting
there saying that now I believe I can make it
to a hundred because of the way I feel right now,
because of what's just happened to you. And I'll say
this here too, to both of you. I was not
(26:55):
going back to Baltimore before after I got this job.
I was not gonna go back to Baltimore before I
went there first, simply because you never know it ninety four.
What's gonna happen. So this franchise right here, they're making
their families said, listen, you take the next you you
take the plane. They sent me and my wife to
Tennessee right then. As soon as I got off of
(27:18):
that private plane it wasn't commercial, it was private. As
soon as I got off of that plane, I went
directly to my dad's house. He was sleep. I woke
him up and we stayed up from twelve o'clock to
two o'clock talking about what just happened. And to me,
it was I felt so now. I felt validated. I
(27:38):
felt validated that my dad, my dad had seen that.
So again, I couldn't be I couldn't be more elated
to be in this position. And I'll tell you this,
I don't know if I win one football game here,
but i'll tell you what, I'm gonna do everything in
my power to be able to do that. They've they've
given me what I need to be able to do,
what I need to do for this, for this franchise
(28:00):
to do. They trust in what I'm doing, they trust
in the direction I'm going, and I'm gonna take it
and go that direction, you know. And and I believe
in what we're doing. I believe in it, you know,
and they're gonna have they're gonna have to throw me
out of here. Look, we could sit here and talk
to Sean, we could sit here and talk personal everything else.
But that conversation, just just thinking about it between you
(28:23):
and your father, to me, it gives me goose bumps. Man,
that was everything, Coach. I mean, I'm telling you, Coach,
We've had a lot of great conversations on this podcast.
Right what you just took us through is so human
and so loving and so special. I'm sitting here like
(28:44):
I mean that that's just awesome. I mean, for any
of us to be able to experience something like that,
it's just awesome. That's real. That's real. And let me
do that's bigger than football, you know. And I'll tell
you what what when I go back there now I've
only been back, uh one time since then. I mean
(29:04):
the feeling that that that that they get from me
being in the position that I am, being African American,
also being listen, I bring this up again being sixty
five years old with that card that I use, and
I use it, Man, when I go to Burger King
and McDonald and I use it. I still use it.
I'm not stayed to use it now. So my point
(29:26):
is it, it just makes me feel so good to
know that. And I think about through the history of
when I first came into this league too. I've gotten
calls from from James Harris, from Doug Williams. I've gotten
calls from coaches that have been in this business for
a long time that have mentored me. Jim Skipper, guys
that have been here before I ever got when there
was only one of us on the staff, you see,
(29:49):
that have mentioned to me about being proud of where
I'm at at this point and because of my journey
and where I come from. But listen, man, I never
felt like it was a big journey because you know
what during that whole time, Jim and Steve, I love
what I do. I love what I do. My wife
kiss asking all time when you're gonna retire as a
retire why you want to retire doing something that you
(30:09):
love doing, And not only that you love doing that,
you're pretty good at doing that. You've been pretty good
at it, and if you weren't pretty good at it,
they would have retired you. So that's my plan right now, Coach,
how does this moment compare two even when you went
to Vanderbilt and you became the first black quarterback at
Vanderbilt University. The significance of that, the significance of this moment,
(30:32):
are they comparable. Uh, it's it's comparable. But here here's
the difference. At that time. At that time, I was
eighteen years old. All right, when I went in there,
I was eighteen years old. I went there Jim and
Steve because and the reason I didn't go to Tennessee
or someplace else was simply because they weren't gonna play
me as a black quarterback. There was a recruited crue
(30:54):
to me as a quarterback. But when I came there,
Steve Sloan, who was a head coach at that time,
and Bill Parts said, was who was recruiting me at
that time? And speaking of this, Romeo Cornell was recruiting
me also, but from another team at that time. So
my point being is is that all those those three
people said you're gonna be a quarterback. You're gonna play
(31:14):
quarterback for us, And that's why I went there to
be able to do that. Now, I didn't play quarterback
as much as I liked to have played quarterback, but
they kept me at quarterback because that's what I was
when I came out. That's what I was gonna be.
And because listen to this, I said. One time at
Vanderbilt University or actually Tennessee Staateon Gramlin used to play
(31:35):
football games at our stadium because they would have so
many people come to the game that their stadium would
hold them, so they would come to They would come
to Vanderbilt to play. Listen, I saw I saw Joe
Gilliam and James Harris through a driving range rain throw
for like five hundred yards apiece on a night when
nobody could throw. And I said, here, and you're saying,
(31:57):
this is why I want to be a quarterback. And
then I go back later and see those guys in
the NFL and listening, and I'm going back to the
history that motivated me right there to see those guys
doing what they did and said here and saying, is man,
that could be me someday. That wasn't me throwing because
I wasn't known where near near as good as as Joe,
(32:17):
Joe and and and James were at that time. But
I'm gonna tell you something right now, to to be
in this position watching those kind of guys. And and
again I'm going back to watching those hbc U schools
played during that time, not just for the halftime show,
all right, but do those things I'm telling you motivated me.
(32:39):
Motivated me throughout my whole career. So so that's awesome.
So now that you're sitting in this chair, do you
talk about just those two schools, Eddie Robinson and John
Merritt like two of the greatest coaches ever. I mean,
since we're talking about history here at hbc USED and
those two schools you saw, those are two of the
greatest coaches ever. And listen to this, John Merritt recruited
me also at that time. John was there at that time.
(33:01):
And let me tell you something talking about living legend.
And again, obviously when you talk about Adian Robinson, you
go to a whole different level right now with that.
But the point is you're exactly right. And and and Jim,
going back to to what you said about what did
it mean back then? It meant more to me back
then to be playing that position, having looking at at
those guys playing at those schools and me being at
(33:23):
Vanderbilt being able to do the same thing. That's what
it meant to me. But this here, being the head
coach of the Houston Texas at this point in my career,
to me, you know, validates all of those things that
I went through back in nineteen seventy three when I
first went to school. It validates everything that I went
through as a coach, going through their college ranks, uh,
(33:45):
going through the NFL ranks. I mean it validates because
basically what I did was I believed in myself. I
happened to get around some people that trusted me and
believed that someday this could happen. And then it happened,
you know, and then here I am. I'm curious if
you ever had conversations with Lamar, who in many ways
faced some of what you faced in terms of others
(34:06):
not believing that he could play the position I did have,
you know, I did, Steve. I had conversations with him,
and we sat down and we talked about that and listen.
And the one thing I mentioned to him was this listen.
And he was so motivated because people kept saying to him,
was this is that, Oh, here's a running back playing quarterback.
Here's uh, you know, here's an athlete right here that
(34:28):
that basically all he could do is run and and
the one thing I said to him was this, I said, listen,
you're obviously the franchise quarterback at this place. When John
Harriba made the decision to go with you, he saw
a quarterback that could take this franchise to the next
level to win a Super Bowl. And basically, with that
being said, just remember, you're not gonna be judged on
(34:49):
what you do with your legs. You're not gonna be
judged on what you do with your arms. You're gonna
be judged on a quarterback is how many games you win.
And that's the bottom line. And obviously you're off to
a great are to doing that. And eventually at this
point in your career, if you go back and look
at him at his at this point in his career
and you look at, uh, some of these other quarterbacks
that have gone on to become a Hall of Fame
(35:11):
type quarterbacks where they were at that point in their career,
he is at least there or maybe ahead of some
of those guys. So the point being is that he
understands that, and then no, at no point that was
it ever a thought on him to be any other
other thing other than the quarterback and being not only that,
just a quarterback. And then' that's how he's perceived there,
(35:31):
that's how he's looked at there. And again, uh, I
felt good. That was one of the reasons why I
went to Baltimore with John Harbor was because two reasons,
actually three reasons. Ozzy Newsome, who if you don't remember this,
I hosted Ozik Newsome on the recruiting visit when he
was a senior in high school at Vanderbilt University. Listen
(35:53):
and about this sometimes and then I'll tell you this.
I told him this. I said, I was a heck
of recruiter back then for the university. But I think
you did the right thing in going where you did.
He made a good but and then the other one
was was John Harball. John Harball, and then because I
(36:14):
worked with John Harball for eight years in Philadelphia, and
John Harball had always talked about working together and I
had the utmost respect for him, and he had dealt
nost respects for me, and he saw me in the
same light that he saw himself as a head coach
and when he brought me there with him and we
finally got it worked out. Then I could you know
it's happened. And then Lamar Thomas I told him, I said,
(36:34):
Lamar time, I said, we have a chance every time
we go on the football field to win a football
game because of this young man at your quarterback right here?
You mean Lamar Jackson? Right? Yes, who'd I say, Thomas?
You know why I say Lamar Thomas. Lamar Thomas I
coached him at Tampa Bay Buccaneers. He recruited Lamar Jackson
to Louisville. Okay, for you one wide receiver apgociate those
(37:02):
two because he recruited Lamar Jackson to Louisville. Wow, okay, great.
So so the question you talk about Lamar Jackson, you
were the passing game coordinator. We've heard so much about
Lamar's inability to do certain things in the past game,
but you design things around his strength, right, Yes, we
did talk about what what about his ability? Because so
(37:22):
many people want to put limitations on what he can't do.
Then then there is no limitations on him. And you're
gonna see that as time goes along. You're gonna see
the listen, it's the it's the scheme that they're doing
right there, right now. The scheme fits what they're all
about in Baltimore. The scheme fits what they want to
do in the running game. And again as as as
the passing game starts to progress, you gotta remember now
(37:43):
you know he's going into his third year, getting ready
going to the fourth, third or fourth year now is
again now things are going you're gonna see him progress
to the point not only him, it's not just him now,
it's the it's is everybody else around him, you know,
has to get to that level the where you understand
and get to that point understand this. When they get
(38:03):
to that point to where he's gonna do that. Other
than playing in the Houston Texas, I think they could,
they could beat anybody that they could beat because of
that young man at quarterback. And he's and he's he's
he's the total quarterback. You can see he's doing what
they've asked him to do. And then and what and then,
I'm gonna say this, as a defensive coordinator, if you
ever asked him not to do the things that he's
doing as a quarterback right now, as a defensive coordinator
(38:26):
who you're gonna say, please, don't run, please, don't you
know you know, I'm just saying, now, I thank you
so much. And then what ends up happening is now
they're sitting there saying, let's make him throw. I've been
in ball games there where they made him throw and
he won football games. So again, the all of that
stuff they said about those kind of guys at that
(38:47):
position in quarterback, haven't been one myself, and in the
situation that he's in now, I couldn't run like him,
couldn't throw like him. But I know this that a
quarterback is a quarterback and that guy is a quarterback. Well, coach,
if I could bring it back full circle to to
the Texans, you made a comment where you said you've
been a coach in this league nearly three decades, you've
(39:08):
seen everything. Compare a situation that you've seen in the
past of what you are currently facing with the Houston Texans.
I haven't seen this exact thing happened, but I've seen
guys that have been unhappy where they've been. I've seen
guys that that at some point, uh and and I've
seen things get worked out, especially in situations. The one
(39:31):
situation I haven't been in. Is a situation where you
go in, I haven't been a head coach, come in
and you come in a situation and you know, you
hear all these stories about the franchise quarterback, don't want
to be here, don't want to be there. I haven't
seen that situation. But I've been around situations in this
league where guys have been unhappy in their particular situation
for a variety of reasons, and and sometimes those reasons
(39:54):
been legit, sometimes not being legit. From the standpoint of
I go back to this is that when you get
in those situations like that, the one thing that you
want to make sure as a football team that you
have is you want your football team to be about
the team, not about you, not about me. And then
what ends up happening is this, when it gets to
(40:16):
the point what I've seen, Jim, and going to answer
you a question about seeing everything, what I have seen
is this is that I have not seen a football
team in this league be successful year in a year
out when it is about one guy, or it's about
this guy, or it's about this guy. It is always
and always has been and always will be about the team.
(40:38):
And then as a team. Your teammates look at it
the same way. Now, obviously at the quarterback position, that
being deposition on offense and on your team, the most
visible position, then obviously that's where it starts. But the
point there is this is that at some point, when
it gets to that point where decisions have to be
made and listen, he's our quarterback and I feel right
(41:00):
about him being our quarterback. And if he is he
as I said before, he is our quarterback, and and
when it gets to that point where we're there with that,
then I'm ready to go with that. I'm ready to
go with that. If if it gets to the point
where that's not the case, then we're still going to
be ready to go, and we're gonna make adjustments and
we're gonna move on, just like coaches do in this business.
(41:22):
But right now, we're not in that situation where we
have to worry about that. We're in a coach go ahead,
go ahead. No. The way I was gonna ask you
is frame it this way. How confident are you that
this situation with Deshaan can be worked out to where
he will be your starting quarterback Week one of the
NFL season. I'm very confident. I'm very confident. I'm very confident.
(41:46):
So because here here's here's to follow that up. You're confident,
But he doesn't seem to have an issue with you.
You're new you guys. You guys are just potentially starting
a relationships. Issue seem to be above you or somewhere
else besides you. So Howard confident are you that those
relationships or whatever is going on can be reconciled. I'm
(42:08):
remember this now. We're moving forward. You know, we're moving forward.
And my all our conversations have been with all of
our players here is that we are moving forward and
that we're gonna go forward, and we're gonna go forward
with everybody that is all in with us that wants
to go and I I like to think and I
(42:28):
feel like that as we move forward, as we're going,
we're gonna move forward all in with everybody that's all
in with us and I and I feel like that
everybody's gonna be all in, including him, including everybody else
that's been here, that we're moving forward and we're going
with it, and we're gonna go with that way. I
just want to say I'm not a member of the
(42:50):
Houston Texans, but I'm ready to suit up and play
for coach college. I'm telling you, don't you guys go
too far. Now. I know how old you are, listen.
I don't know. And I know I know, Steve, you
was a former quarterback. You know. Yeah, I don't know
if y'all can do the things that you used to
do to be able to help us get where we
(43:10):
need to get. But I will say this though, I
would like to have your experience, I like to have
your knowledge right here. But as far as putting you
on the football field, man, I can't do that. Okay,
you can, Jim, Jim, why is it our last two
guests they say something where it's like, Okay, time to
go listen to you. Guys are very good at doing
(43:34):
what you do, very good at doing what you do. David, David,
this we've had again, we've had some incredible conversations on
this podcast. But from where you took us through this
last thirty forty minutes has been an amazing, an amazing
journey from you from taking this job to everything you
(43:55):
had to go through to seeing James Harris and and
and Joe Gillen play at Vanderbilt University hearing that story
about your father. Man, I mean, Jim, this is like,
this is great, this is fantastic. I said, I had
never met Coach, but based on this conversation, he is
someone I would have loved to have played for. Well, listen,
(44:18):
back back then when you guys were where y'all should
be playing, I would have loved to have you playing
for me too. I appreciate that. Coach. There you go, well, Coach,
we we can't thank you enough. This, this has been
absolutely fantastic. We appreciate you. We wish you the best
of luck, We wish your father the best of luck.
And you listen. I'm gonna go when I'm gonna call
(44:39):
him a little bit later on and tell him I've
been on with you two guys. He'll be excited. Well,
held him up. You know what he's gonna say to me.
He says, you finally made it now, you made it
long before, friend before. Thank you very much. Well, thanks
so much, coach. Appreciate you, Thank you both appreciate it.
(45:08):
Like I said, Steve, how can you listen to that
and not want to suit up for this man? So
I know de Shaan has some some some issues with
some folks at the top of the organization. But man,
David Culley, to me, based on what I heard, this
man understands how to lead men and just just a
(45:32):
fantastic guy. Fantastic interview, and I can only wish him success. Yeah,
and Jim, look, look, you know one thing we didn't
really get to in here, because to me would have
taken away from just a de fascinating interview was the
fact that David Culley, who everyone was going into a
hopeless situation, still might be. But he's put together a
fantastic staff. I mean, he's got Lovey Smith at Pep
(45:54):
Hamilton's and on a lot of really good people on
the staff. They don't know who are what they're going
to be working with when he comes to molding the
plato that's being assembled down there in Houston. But David
Culley has, you know, his relationships that he talked about
some you know in that interview have really come well
into play. But I think some of the fascinating things
that that he really showed us his one he I
(46:18):
don't think he's really sure he may he's optimistic or
positive about DeShawn Watson being back. I didn't necessarily take
that um from his comments. I mean, this is gonna
be intriguing, but I think we're gonna have an answer
to this very quickly. I think sooner rather than later.
I definitely think before the draft. And and this is
the first time, more than at any point, that I
truly believe Deshaun Watson will be traded. From this standpoint,
(46:41):
when you use terms like right now he's on the
roster or we want guys who are all in and
knowing how de Shan feels about the organization, I can't
see how that works. So from my standpoint, my vantage point,
whether it was intended or not, in this interview, I
walked away thinking Deshaun Watson will not be a Houston
(47:03):
Texans next season. Yeah, And I'm glad both of us
were able to bring the clarity of like, hey, you
you don't have any issues with him, He doesn't have
any issues with you. It's other people, sure, right, and
and and and that's and that's the issue. But Jim,
just what a fascinating interview to hear him talk about
Joe Gilliam. For all you guys don't know, he's one
of the greatest quarterbacks you ever played. Black quarterback for
(47:23):
the Pittsburgh Steelers took Terry Bradshaw's spot for a while, okay,
to talk about Shack Harris in a driving rain and
seeing them throw bullets through a driving rain. You know,
it's in Vanderbilt Stadium. It's just phenomenal, phenomenal. So I
could have listened to those type stories all day, just
(47:45):
just you know, you're trying not to set expectations on
interviews when you have your guests and whatnot, and I
didn't in this case, but man, he blew me away.
I just got me on. He blew me away, and
Jim and you know, and look, and you really drove,
just to me, just a fascinating line of information to
when you were asking about the process of the head
(48:05):
coaching hiring. And I just thought it was fascinating where
he's just saying I didn't have the qualifications. I've been
here all this time, no one's brought my name up before,
yet here I am. And I thought just that whole
line of whoa hey, I didn't I didn't bring a
binder into the interview. You know, I didn't have all
of this working for me, and so it was almost
(48:28):
like listening and I'm sorry folks, if you get offended
listening to a white coach talk about all of the
things that worked for him, his relationship with nikiss Ario,
the fact that that's really what drove it. This is
what we want. You don't have to be a play caller.
You're gonna get an opportunity because we've seen so many
white coaches kind of go through that type of They
(48:48):
weren't sixty five when that happened. They were probably thirty five.
But I just thought that was just captivating stuff. And
I really hope you the listeners, uh took a lot
out of that. I'm right there with you, Steve. I
couldn't have said it any better. Just, um, there was
so much meat on the bone. There about so many
things that you could chew on all day. So you know,
(49:14):
it's not like a broken record here, but just it
was fascinating, man, it was. He just impressed me to
no end, um no end. So but I'm never going
to forget out of everything we talked about there. I'm
never gonna forget the visual image I have of just
him going back and spending two hours with his father
(49:36):
after being named the head coach, and just what that
conversation meant and to have a son talk about feeling
validated in that moment. You know, um damn it just
it it does. It gives me goose bumps. So yeah,
I am. I am really hoping. I don't care who's
listened to this story. We can we can claim exclusivity
(49:59):
on this when it had things that once everyone gets vaccinated,
everyone feels comfortable. That Jim Trotter is sitting in the
living room in Sparta, Tennessee. Count on it first game
with him. That to me, the way you can storytell
and and just observe. Oh my god, Jim, I am
(50:20):
that better happen. Count on it. Count on it. So
if I get the vaccination, count on it. Well, you
know we we but we both have our a r
PEA cars to gym, but we're not quite old enough
to get the vaccination yet in California. I gotta start
using it at Burger King and McDonald's. You know, I
don't need that though, I don't need that. I gotta
find someplace else. I don't need that stuff. I feel.
(50:45):
I feel so good, But glad you go ahead and
bring us home. That was a spectacular man. Yeah, we
we thank you all for listening. We thank you for
subscribing UM and we asked that you continue to leave
us messages about who you want to hear from, what
picks you want to hear touched on. That way, we
can continue to give you more of what you're funking for.
(51:08):
That's right to give you more. Next week, we're going
to have our first repeat guest on the Huddling Flow
podcast as producer, storyteller, reporter, and Twitter beast. Soul of
Dad O'Brien makes a return Jim. That's gonna be fantastic
to get her back on, But until then, please stay safe.
(51:31):
Please remember to support our sponsor Into It, who is
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us rocking and rolling right here for Jim Trotter our
producer Thomas Warn On the Ones and twos, I am
Steve White. We are the Howards Mob, and we are
(51:52):
out
Coming up on Huddling Flow. Basically with us, everything that's
concerned with us inside this building, with the way we
are going about our business right now, is is that
it is positive. I'm excited to be here. One of
the reasons I'm excited to be here is because of
Deshaun Watson, and regardless of what's happening outside this building,
(00:21):
which quite frankly fellas I don't hear or read or
listen to what happens outside this building. I don't. I
have people come up to me all the time and
asked me about this and asked me about this situation.
But the point is, inside this building, inside this organization,
we feel positive about moving forward with this football team
(00:43):
with Deshaun Watson. That's next on Huddling Flow. We are
(01:04):
back once again at the heart on the Flow podcast,
brought to you by Into It, the proud makers of
Turbo Tax, QuickBooks and Mint. I am Steve White here
with my brother Jim Trotter. We are two thirds of
the Howard University mob our producer Thomas Warren on the
ones and twos he completes the puzzle and Jim today
this is this is an incredible day, right We get
(01:26):
We get to talk to a man who's involved in
the biggest offseason story that there is. That is Houston
Texans head coach David Culley. Steve, you know, there are
times when you you set up interviews and you don't
know quite what to expect. And I had not personally
spoken to David Culley before this interview. But man, I
(01:49):
walk away from this and I have to say, this
is one of my favorite interviews. This guy's energy, it's
sixty five years old, um, his mindset, his positivity, d
everything is just like wow. And that is not to
say that the Houston Texans are going to go and
have a successful season. But I can tell you this,
(02:09):
if I were a player and I had the opportunity
to play for this man, based on this interview, I
would love the opportunity to play for this man. That's right, Jim.
We've done the interview and we're not gonna We're not
gonna beliaebor the point much longer. Here we hit on
everything from DeShawn Watson to David's path to this point
to some extra special stuff including the interview, the head
(02:31):
coaching interviewing process, which is absolutely fascinating. So Jim, let's
get right to it and let's bring in Houston Texans
head coach David Culley. All right, Jim, Now we're joined
by our special guest, Houston Texas head coach David Culley. Coach,
thanks for joining the hudd On Flow podcast. Steve, glad
(02:52):
to be here, looking forward to it. Coach. We're happy
to have you. Look, we're not gonna insult your intelligence here.
We're gonna jump right into the big question of the
day with the Houston Texas is Deshaun Watson. Have you
spoken to him or have you spoken to his reps?
I have spoken to him when I did speak to him, Uh,
(03:12):
And and let me just say this too, I've spoken
to him. I've also spoken to some other guys on
this football team also other than the Shaun. But the
conversation that I've had with him and the conversation that
I've had with the other players that I've spoken to
was a private matter. Uh. It was a matter that
was between he and I and the other players that
(03:32):
I talked to, and in respect for them, I'm gonna
keep it that away. But yes, we have spoken. I
completely understand that and respect that. What I will ask
you is based on that conversation, do you expect Deshaun
Watson to be a Houston Texans this season? You know,
Deshaun Watson is our starting quarterback. I mean, he is
(03:52):
our starting quarterback, and I expect him to be our
starting quarterback as a matter of fact, at this point
right now, he's the only quarterback on our roster right
now that I have signed. So yes, I expect him
to be our quarterback. I'm just I'm just trying to
be here or clear on this. Coach, you know, paint
you until a corner. As you know, and I know
you've been around a long time, so you know how
to kind of definitely side steps some of this. Will
(04:16):
Deshaun Watson be the starting quarterback for the Houston Texas
in one He is our starting quarterback as of right now.
He is our starting quarterback. Things happened between now and then,
and then we'll see what happens. Because you just right now,
just right now, exactly exactly you've been around, coach, you
(04:38):
know better, Uh, he is our starting quarterback right Okay,
that's right right now and hopefully in the future. But
because you know, we have seen the report and we
know they're they're coming from some credible sources that said
he he told you in your meeting, and he's let
it be known to other people. UM that he does
(04:58):
not want to return to the Houston Texans. In fact,
we had a good friend of his, Jail and Rams
Yawn last week. They're represented by the same age, and
he said he doesn't think the Sean is gonna shoot
up for the Texans again. Um, the feeling in the building,
I mean, is it is it? You sound positive, but
everything we're hearing is sounding negative in terms of his
(05:19):
relationship and wanting to return. Well, this is how I
answer that, is that basically with us, everything that's concerned
with us inside this building, with the way we are
going about our business right now, is is that it
is positive. I'm excited to be here. One of the
reasons I'm excited to be here is because of the SHAWNE.
Watson and regardless of what's happening outside this building, which
(05:44):
quite frankly fellas I don't hear or read or listen
to what happens outside this building. I don't. I have
people come up to me all the time and asked
me about this, and asked me about this situation. But
the point is inside this building, inside this are gonna zation.
We feel positive about moving forward with this football team
(06:05):
with DeShawn Watson coach. You know, I gotta hit you
with the with the outside question here. Why do you
feel positive? Let me lay this out for you for
a minute. You guys have cap issues. You have personnel issues,
including a quarterback who has let it be known that
he does not want to be there. There are trust
factors that that he feels have been broken. You also
(06:25):
have a culture problem where some have issues with one
of the men at the top and Jack Easterby. So
I would ask you why was this job attracted to you?
Knowing all of those things. It's a tough spot you're in.
I mean to be frank well, I couldn't wait, listen,
I couldn't wait to be able to get on this
job right here, because first of all coming into this job.
(06:47):
First of all, this is the youngest franchise that that's
in the NFL right now. They've had some success here, uh,
with and without different guys here that's been here and
basically those things right there. Because when I first got here,
I didn't see I didn't feel that I didn't feel
that in the building. I didn't feel that during the interview. UH,
(07:08):
I haven't felt that. Another thing I felt good about
being here was with Nick in the general manager. I've
known Nick a long time. UH. I know what Nick
is all about. I know what his philosophy is, and
I'm aligned with the same way that he is as
as far as going and building a football team and
being successful. And that was the most attractive thing to
me once I end up becoming the head coach of
(07:31):
the Houston Texans. I felt good about that. Even with
all the other situations that the noise going around outside
about the sean, about UH, salary cap and those kinds
of things. Everything here and we're working through all of
those things right now, and that's what the off season
is for, to work through those things and then as
we move forward, UH, We'll see what happens. But as
(07:52):
of right now, I feel really good about it. And
this this is no smoke. This is for real. I
really believe that, and I feel that way and moving
forward that that That's how I'm looking at it, and
I feel good about that. Even after my discussion that
I had with the Sean, I felt good. I felt
positive about things because basically the meeting was basically just
(08:12):
they get to know him, get him, get to know me,
and that's basically what it was about. I felt good
about that. With the other guys that I called also
that I had had zoom meetings with that, I felt
the same way about that. And I felt the same
way about the excitement that they have about moving forward
from where they were to where we are right now.
(08:32):
And tru David, so they're saying, you know, Nick and
you and you're you're aligned with him, what is the
philosophy and and putting together this roster and let's just
keep it in the short term for the season. Well,
the thing is this, we're looking right now in free
agency because we know we've got to bring in some
other players. But competition. Competition, to me, has always been
(08:55):
one of the things that have made successful football teams successful,
you know, in building and doing things. And right now
you talked about earlier about salary cap issues. We've already
Nick has already made some moves and already gone through
the process right now of of doing things to to
make that better for us, and it has already started
(09:16):
to happen. You're starting to see us now to sign
some players, UH, to fill in some some roles that
we feel like we have and and and moving forward
with that that he knows that right now, and I
feel the same way as is that exactly what we're
doing right now during this process. And it's no different
than any other team going through the off season when
(09:37):
you have to make changes. You've got people leaving, you've
got people free agents, you got unrestricted restricted, and then
you have to make moves to be able to take
care of that. And we're in the process right now
doing that, and I feel good about where we're headed
and and doing that right now. You know, Coach, I
wanted to ask you about if I could transition for
a second to you being the only black coach hired
(10:00):
UM during this hiring cycle, and I read a quote
from you at one of your press conferences where you said,
I think the league is doing a great job. I
think the franchises and everybody is doing a wonderful job
of trying to get that to happen in terms of
leveling this playing field a little bit. And if I
could respectfully push back a little bit, I'm looking at
(10:21):
the last four hiring cycles there have been twenty seven
head coaching vacancies. Only three of those were filled by
a black person. So from my advantage point, I don't
see where the progress is there, and in fact, I
would argue that what we're seeing is a rollback if
you will. Why do you feel that progress is me
(10:46):
being made with those numbers, Because even when I look
at the last seven hiring cycles, only once in those
last seven hiring cycles were more than one black hired
in the same year. So why do you feel progresses
being made? Well, I think because of all of the
people that have been interviewed. You know, there's been more
and more African Americans have been interviewed each year now.
(11:09):
As far as as who gets who gets hired and
why they get hired, you know, I'm not sure why
that is. All I know is that in order to
have a chance to get hired, you have to have
that opportunity, and those opportunities have basically been there from
from the numbers and everything, and that's where that's where
I see that. That's why I think progress has been made,
(11:30):
is that there's been numbers of number of candidates that
have been interviewed for for jobs across this league and
again in the situation here with the Texans, I think
all but one, all but a couple were African Americans
that have been interviewed for the job here. So when
I say progress, that when I look at it from
that standpoint, is the fact that the opportunities are being there.
(11:53):
And I take myself for example, this was my first
time in twenty seven years of this league having an
opportunity to interview for a head coaching job. Now, quite frankly,
when I got into this situation and and UH got
offered the the opportunity to interview for this job, I've
said here, the first thing that went through my mind
(12:14):
was this, I've never been a coordinator. I've never had
an interview for a job UH as a head coach
in in the at this level. And then all of
a sudden, why me, you know, and and and and
when I talked to Nick and the guys here was
I said, well, look, if you hire me, here's the
first thing that I said. I said, if you hired me,
how do you justify hiring me? When I look around
(12:37):
all of these other UH candidates that have been coordinators,
some have been a head coaches before UH, they've been
interviewed multiple times UH in the league for jobs, sometimes
two and three years and and not getting jobs. But
I said, how do you justify that? And and and
the thing? And because I wanted to know, because I
did not want to be an interview e because of
(13:00):
the Rooney route. I did not want an interview to
say that I an interviewed for a job. I didn't
need that. I didn't want that. And before I took
the interview, I wanted to make sure that I wasn't
a part of that. And they assured me that they
that they were looking for h the best head coach
to fit this situation. And from doing all the research
on me, through talking to all the people that I've
(13:23):
coached with, and and and basically I go back to
John Harball the two years I spent with him in Baltimore,
being a big advocate of David Culley being a possible
head coaching candidate without having had any of the experience
that all these other guys have. Then you know, when
that happened and and I got the got the chance
to interview for the job, meant I had no I
(13:45):
had no idea that I was gonna be sitting in
this position that I'm in the day. But what I
was told when when I went through this process of
doing this, and I've had a lot of my buddies
that interviewed not only for this job, guys that I've
worked with, but for other jobs that I said, man,
you look at the qualifications, and I've said, man, my
chances of getting this job are very slamming none because
(14:08):
of of the criteria that everybody always says you gotta
have to be a head coach. I didn't fit that
from those standpoints. But what I did fit from listening
to John Harball and Ozzy Newsome was was that I've
been around pro I've been around franchises in this league
that have built before I was in Philadelphia nine. I
(14:29):
went from Philadelphia when Andy to Kansas City in I
went to to Buffalo with with Sean McDermott UH and
and I think it was twenty seventeen, and and then
I go to to UH Baltimore with John Harbaugh who's
basically at that point had been there and done that,
but had made a made a move in that franchise
(14:49):
UH to really flip that franchise back to again to
a situation where they've been before in making Lamar Jackson
the starting quarterback. The point being this was I had
been around franchises that had built, that had started, that
had had issues of whatever it may have been about, okay,
when it hadn't been what it should be. So when
(15:10):
I got that opportunity, I was told, go be yourself.
And when I went in those interviews, after talking to
Ozzie and John, I went in with the with the
with the philosophy of here's what I believe in, here's
what this twenty seven years have been in the NFL,
and the sixteen years have been in college that I
have seen, and all the franchises that I have been
around that have been winners, here's the here's the process,
(15:33):
here's what it has taken. And I've seen four of
those happened and I've been a part of that. And
so from when you, Jim, when you asked me about
the progress in this league, uh, I look at myself
as an example of saying, Okay, I'm African American. I
didn't have all those qualifications qualifications, but I got hired.
I got hired first of all, I think simply because
(15:54):
they felt like I was the most qualified to do
what this franchise needed to be done to get me
the to to move it forward again. The second thing
being an African American rate wonderful, but I never looked
at it that way, and from that standpoint for me
being hired here, I think it's progress from the standpoint
(16:14):
of saying, okay and African American in the situation that
I've been in, don't think that you don't have a chance.
And don't think simply because you're sixty five years old
and got your a A r P card that you
don't have the opportunity to be able to bring a
franchise and do what you needed to do. And I
felt that a way, and I looked at it from
that standpoint. Go ahead, Jim coach. Let me say this
(16:36):
to you, though you're speaking to my point here when
you say you didn't have those qualifications, that's where I
feel fundamentally the process is flawed. People trying to attach
certain positions to whether or not you're going to be
a successful head coach, which is foolish to me. You
don't have to be a coordinator, you don't have to
be a QB coach. You have to first and foremost
be a leader. Of men to be successful as a
(16:59):
head coach, and everything else flows from there. So the
fact that that you had to wait almost three decades
to even get an interview for a head coaching job
says to me that the process is flawed and the
way that they go about it is wrong, and add
on your college coaching experience, it also speaks to that.
(17:19):
So that's why I say, for me personally, I hate
to hear you say you didn't have those qualifications because
that feeds into this narrative that you have to be
a coordinator or you have to be this to to
be a head coach. You don't. You have to be
a leader of men. And as Tony Dungee has said
to us even on this podcast, owners don't know how
(17:41):
to hire coaches because they fall into that trap of
looking for all of these things that people talk about
but can never identify exactly what they believe it is
that the traits that are necessary to be a head coach.
So I'm off my soapbox online, but it just felt me.
Let me reiterate what you just said when you would
you said so true when you said about not having
(18:02):
the qualifications and whatnot, Well, I'll say this. I got
hired here because of those things. Of what you just said,
it has nothing to do with that I get. So
from that standpoint, I'm saying this franchise the McNair family.
When I interviewed with him, and when I interviewed with Nick,
that was what it was all about. I can't remember
(18:22):
before I Jim, before I got this interview, before when
Nick called me, uh, we were actually uh getting ready
to play a Buffalo in the playoff game, and and
all of a sudden it says, well, when this thing
is over with, we like to talk to you. So
when you think you might be ready to do that,
I said, I'm not sure I'm ready because I gotta
get all my books. I gotta get my book together.
(18:43):
I gotta get my my information together to be able
to do that. The first thing he said to me says,
I don't care about a book. He says, I don't
care about a book. That's not what we're looking for.
You know, we're looking for somebody to lead this football team.
And again that being said, I got so excited Jim
and Steve simply because way back when I put together
(19:05):
that book, I've said with Leslie Fraser and Eric b
Enemy and I've said with some of these guys, and
we've gotten all these things together about Okay, this is
what everybody has put together to be able to when
you go into the interview, you need to show these
general managers, you need to show these owners these things. Man.
All I took into that interview with me was myself.
I didn't have one piece of paper with me when
(19:26):
I went into that, not one piece of paper with
me into that interview. And when when I sat out
with John Harball and Ozzy Newsome, who I have the
ultimate respect for is I went and they said be yourself.
And then I said, look, I'm not paper and pencil,
you know, I'm not that. That's not who I am,
you know. So again I go back to Jim to
(19:46):
get your point. I can't answer what you're saying about
why it hasn't happened. But I just knew though in
the example that I had to me was an example
of again you're looking for leaders of men, and Tony
is so right. And again that's what I feel like
I've always been now, prior to getting this opportunity, all
(20:07):
the other opportunity and listen, I've been around guys probably
during the last probably ten fifteen years that I feel
like I helped get jobs, you know, I mean, and
and all of a sudden I'm sitting there saying, wait
a minute, uh, you know, I see this happen, and
see that happen, and then you start to think about it.
But let me go back to why I feel like
(20:29):
I'm here now. Is this is that I've always been
taught and told coming through this business, is that the
best thing you can do forgetting your next job is
to be the best that you can be at the
job that you're at, in whatever position that is. And
I've taken that, and I've used that. Now have there
been times when I've sat here and said, I can't
(20:49):
use the words right here, but could I say go
for it? I'm not going to you, but but why
why not me? Why can't I it an opportunity to
do this? But again, I always went back to that,
that thing of being the best that you can be
at what you're doing. And again I got to the
point where it wasn't like I was looking for one,
(21:12):
and it wasn't like if it never happened that I
would be disappointed. During my career. I wasn't. I was
completely happy that with where I was at, with what
I was doing, and still believe at some point, especially
when I came to Baltimore with John Harbaugh, he reassured me.
And going back to Jim to what you said earlier
(21:33):
about qualifications, Andy Reid would didn't call plays when he
became a head coach. Prior to Andy Reid becoming a
head coach, we were told you needed to be a coordinator. Well,
he wasn't a coordinator. He got hired, So then that
one got throughout the window because he got coase. There
are so many of those have been thrown out the
window and exit made for those and and and that's
(21:55):
part of the frustration here. Have always been told you
have to all of this path, and they follow that path,
and then they're not afforded the opportunity well to have
a shot at being a head coach. I was one
of those have been told that and then find and
then again I'm gonna go back and use John Hardball.
John Harball wasn't a coordinator when he got the job.
(22:15):
When Ozzi Knewsome hired John Harball. John Harball was a
defensive back coach, and the reason he went to be
a defensive back coach, and I'm just gonna get tell
you this here too is because he said, you know
they're not hiring special teams coaches. Well, here's here's the
guy that's not African American and saying, look, I'm a
special team's coach. They're not gonna hire me. So he
goes and he says, look, I want to be a
head coach someday. They're not hiring special teams coaches. Well,
(22:37):
he's he goes to John and says, look, I want
to coach secondary because I want to have a chance
some day have not I'm gonna go to Stanford and
be a defense coordinator from my brother and have a
chance to get a job someday. Well, point being is
those two examples right there which changed changed. Jim and
Stephen y'are saying about how this process is going. I
(22:57):
feel good about it simply because here is someone that
and and I and I go back to Steve that
I can remember you doing in the interview talking about
all the potential head coaches that were African Americans that
we're been looking And I don't feel bad about this,
but I wasn't one of those guys you had on.
I know that's right. And my point being is go ahead, no, no,
(23:20):
And I'll say this, Jim and I don't say these
things off the top of our head. We talked to
the lines, we talked to all these other people, and
they helped us. Right, So right, it's not it's not
just us. I mean so in terms of the whole process,
your your name, I mean, I'm being honest, wasn't one
that popped up right and and and I understand that,
I understand that completely. But what I'm saying is this
(23:42):
is that I was fully confident and when I got
this interview that if what they're looking for, if the
things they're looking for is what they're told me they're
looking for, I felt like I fit that bill, and
I had to come in and convince them that I
fit that bill. And I'll say this, during the interview process,
(24:04):
my first process was was a zoom. Then after the zoom,
after the zoom, now I didn't hear anything for about
six days. So I'm sitting there saying, I'm waiting on
that call back to say, hey, look I'm moving forward,
and I'm getting ready. At that time, we were getting
ready to going on vacation in Baltimore a little earlier,
and we expected and and so I got my dog,
my cat, and my wife and we're getting ready to
drive to Tennessee to go see my family. And then
(24:26):
next thing, you know, I get a phone call and
I tell John, I said, John, listen as that call
come in. And he said he had a call just
came in, he said, but it ain't the call we expected.
They want you for a second interview. Once I got
that call, I didn't and listen to this fellas. I
didn't change my plans now because I'm sitting here saying, look,
I'm going down here for an interview. I'm gonna be
on here for today, I'm gonna come back and then
(24:47):
when it's over it, I'm I'm gonna probably be in
Tennessee somewhere, driving down to forty eight to Tennessee from Baltimore,
and you know they're gonna tell me that you know
it's it's over. Well, it didn't happen that way. I
didn't make that trip to Sparta, Tennessee. I did. I
got a dad, it's ninety four years old, that's still
hanging in there, and I got to make that trip
(25:08):
a week later after they named me the head coach
of the Houston Texans. Let me tell you something. So
I'm sitting here saying, Jim and and and Steve, is
that that process it's not It hasn't been right, has
not been right. But I do know this from my experience.
And I told Leslie and Eric and some of those
guys we've been on conversations before that. Listen, Hey, I
(25:30):
don't know. I don't know why it was me. You know.
All I know is I knew what they were looking for.
And obviously I had enough in me to convince him
that that I was the right guy to do that.
And I felt one confident to do that, and when
I did it, and they gave me the job. And
listen to men, of all those things, y'all just asked me.
Whether it's about Deshaun, Steve or or a Jim, or
(25:51):
whether it's about the personnel or no kind of thing. Man,
that stuff doesn't doesn't scare me at all. Listen to me.
I've been doing this for forty three years. There's nothing
happening in this league right now that I haven't seen,
and that I'm also not surprised that nothing surprises me
in this league. It's not like I hear something and
they say, man, can you believe they did that? Yeah,
(26:12):
I can believe they did that, because it's happened before
you know, I got hold of I got two questions
for I want to follow up on that. But first
I want to ask you this. When you go back
to Sparta and you meet with your nine year old
father and you tell him you are the head coach
of the Houston Texans, what is that moment like and
what is that conversation like. Listen to this. It meant
more to me to me for him to be able
(26:35):
to say, David, I'm so proud of you. You know,
he says, I'm telling you, and it's almost like right
now he is saying like he's ninety four. He's sitting
there saying that now I believe I can make it
to a hundred because of the way I feel right now,
because of what's just happened to you. And I'll say
this here too, to both of you. I was not
(26:55):
going back to Baltimore before after I got this job.
I was not gonna go back to Baltimore before I
went there first, simply because you never know it ninety four.
What's gonna happen. So this franchise right here, they're making
their families said, listen, you take the next you you
take the plane. They sent me and my wife to
Tennessee right then. As soon as I got off of
(27:18):
that private plane it wasn't commercial, it was private. As
soon as I got off of that plane, I went
directly to my dad's house. He was sleep. I woke
him up and we stayed up from twelve o'clock to
two o'clock talking about what just happened. And to me,
it was I felt so now. I felt validated. I
(27:38):
felt validated that my dad, my dad had seen that.
So again, I couldn't be I couldn't be more elated
to be in this position. And I'll tell you this,
I don't know if I win one football game here,
but i'll tell you what, I'm gonna do everything in
my power to be able to do that. They've they've
given me what I need to be able to do,
what I need to do for this, for this franchise
(28:00):
to do. They trust in what I'm doing, they trust
in the direction I'm going, and I'm gonna take it
and go that direction, you know. And and I believe
in what we're doing. I believe in it, you know,
and they're gonna have they're gonna have to throw me
out of here. Look, we could sit here and talk
to Sean, we could sit here and talk personal everything else.
But that conversation, just just thinking about it between you
(28:23):
and your father, to me, it gives me goose bumps. Man,
that was everything, Coach. I mean, I'm telling you, Coach,
We've had a lot of great conversations on this podcast.
Right what you just took us through is so human
and so loving and so special. I'm sitting here like
(28:44):
I mean that that's just awesome. I mean, for any
of us to be able to experience something like that,
it's just awesome. That's real. That's real. And let me
do that's bigger than football, you know. And I'll tell
you what what when I go back there now I've
only been back, uh one time since then. I mean
(29:04):
the feeling that that that that they get from me
being in the position that I am, being African American,
also being listen, I bring this up again being sixty
five years old with that card that I use, and
I use it, Man, when I go to Burger King
and McDonald and I use it. I still use it.
I'm not stayed to use it now. So my point
(29:26):
is it, it just makes me feel so good to
know that. And I think about through the history of
when I first came into this league too. I've gotten
calls from from James Harris, from Doug Williams. I've gotten
calls from coaches that have been in this business for
a long time that have mentored me. Jim Skipper, guys
that have been here before I ever got when there
was only one of us on the staff, you see,
(29:49):
that have mentioned to me about being proud of where
I'm at at this point and because of my journey
and where I come from. But listen, man, I never
felt like it was a big journey because you know
what during that whole time, Jim and Steve, I love
what I do. I love what I do. My wife
kiss asking all time when you're gonna retire as a
retire why you want to retire doing something that you
(30:09):
love doing, And not only that you love doing that,
you're pretty good at doing that. You've been pretty good
at it, and if you weren't pretty good at it,
they would have retired you. So that's my plan right now, Coach,
how does this moment compare two even when you went
to Vanderbilt and you became the first black quarterback at
Vanderbilt University. The significance of that, the significance of this moment,
(30:32):
are they comparable. Uh, it's it's comparable. But here here's
the difference. At that time. At that time, I was
eighteen years old. All right, when I went in there,
I was eighteen years old. I went there Jim and
Steve because and the reason I didn't go to Tennessee
or someplace else was simply because they weren't gonna play
me as a black quarterback. There was a recruited crue
(30:54):
to me as a quarterback. But when I came there,
Steve Sloan, who was a head coach at that time,
and Bill Parts said, was who was recruiting me at
that time? And speaking of this, Romeo Cornell was recruiting
me also, but from another team at that time. So
my point being is is that all those those three
people said you're gonna be a quarterback. You're gonna play
(31:14):
quarterback for us, And that's why I went there to
be able to do that. Now, I didn't play quarterback
as much as I liked to have played quarterback, but
they kept me at quarterback because that's what I was
when I came out. That's what I was gonna be.
And because listen to this, I said. One time at
Vanderbilt University or actually Tennessee Staateon Gramlin used to play
(31:35):
football games at our stadium because they would have so
many people come to the game that their stadium would
hold them, so they would come to They would come
to Vanderbilt to play. Listen, I saw I saw Joe
Gilliam and James Harris through a driving range rain throw
for like five hundred yards apiece on a night when
nobody could throw. And I said, here, and you're saying,
(31:57):
this is why I want to be a quarterback. And
then I go back later and see those guys in
the NFL and listening, and I'm going back to the
history that motivated me right there to see those guys
doing what they did and said here and saying, is man,
that could be me someday. That wasn't me throwing because
I wasn't known where near near as good as as Joe,
(32:17):
Joe and and and James were at that time. But
I'm gonna tell you something right now, to to be
in this position watching those kind of guys. And and
again I'm going back to watching those hbc U schools
played during that time, not just for the halftime show,
all right, but do those things I'm telling you motivated me.
(32:39):
Motivated me throughout my whole career. So so that's awesome.
So now that you're sitting in this chair, do you
talk about just those two schools, Eddie Robinson and John
Merritt like two of the greatest coaches ever. I mean,
since we're talking about history here at hbc USED and
those two schools you saw, those are two of the
greatest coaches ever. And listen to this, John Merritt recruited
me also at that time. John was there at that time.
(33:01):
And let me tell you something talking about living legend.
And again, obviously when you talk about Adian Robinson, you
go to a whole different level right now with that.
But the point is you're exactly right. And and and Jim,
going back to to what you said about what did
it mean back then? It meant more to me back
then to be playing that position, having looking at at
those guys playing at those schools and me being at
(33:23):
Vanderbilt being able to do the same thing. That's what
it meant to me. But this here, being the head
coach of the Houston Texas at this point in my career,
to me, you know, validates all of those things that
I went through back in nineteen seventy three when I
first went to school. It validates everything that I went
through as a coach, going through their college ranks, uh,
(33:45):
going through the NFL ranks. I mean it validates because
basically what I did was I believed in myself. I
happened to get around some people that trusted me and
believed that someday this could happen. And then it happened,
you know, and then here I am. I'm curious if
you ever had conversations with Lamar, who in many ways
faced some of what you faced in terms of others
(34:06):
not believing that he could play the position I did have,
you know, I did, Steve. I had conversations with him,
and we sat down and we talked about that and listen.
And the one thing I mentioned to him was this listen.
And he was so motivated because people kept saying to him,
was this is that, Oh, here's a running back playing quarterback.
Here's uh, you know, here's an athlete right here that
(34:28):
that basically all he could do is run and and
the one thing I said to him was this, I said, listen,
you're obviously the franchise quarterback at this place. When John
Harriba made the decision to go with you, he saw
a quarterback that could take this franchise to the next
level to win a Super Bowl. And basically, with that
being said, just remember, you're not gonna be judged on
(34:49):
what you do with your legs. You're not gonna be
judged on what you do with your arms. You're gonna
be judged on a quarterback is how many games you win.
And that's the bottom line. And obviously you're off to
a great are to doing that. And eventually at this
point in your career, if you go back and look
at him at his at this point in his career
and you look at, uh, some of these other quarterbacks
that have gone on to become a Hall of Fame
(35:11):
type quarterbacks where they were at that point in their career,
he is at least there or maybe ahead of some
of those guys. So the point being is that he
understands that, and then no, at no point that was
it ever a thought on him to be any other
other thing other than the quarterback and being not only that,
just a quarterback. And then' that's how he's perceived there,
(35:31):
that's how he's looked at there. And again, uh, I
felt good. That was one of the reasons why I
went to Baltimore with John Harbor was because two reasons,
actually three reasons. Ozzy Newsome, who if you don't remember this,
I hosted Ozik Newsome on the recruiting visit when he
was a senior in high school at Vanderbilt University. Listen
(35:53):
and about this sometimes and then I'll tell you this.
I told him this. I said, I was a heck
of recruiter back then for the university. But I think
you did the right thing in going where you did.
He made a good but and then the other one
was was John Harball. John Harball, and then because I
(36:14):
worked with John Harball for eight years in Philadelphia, and
John Harball had always talked about working together and I
had the utmost respect for him, and he had dealt
nost respects for me, and he saw me in the
same light that he saw himself as a head coach
and when he brought me there with him and we
finally got it worked out. Then I could you know
it's happened. And then Lamar Thomas I told him, I said,
(36:34):
Lamar time, I said, we have a chance every time
we go on the football field to win a football
game because of this young man at your quarterback right here?
You mean Lamar Jackson? Right? Yes, who'd I say, Thomas?
You know why I say Lamar Thomas. Lamar Thomas I
coached him at Tampa Bay Buccaneers. He recruited Lamar Jackson
to Louisville. Okay, for you one wide receiver apgociate those
(37:02):
two because he recruited Lamar Jackson to Louisville. Wow, okay, great.
So so the question you talk about Lamar Jackson, you
were the passing game coordinator. We've heard so much about
Lamar's inability to do certain things in the past game,
but you design things around his strength, right, Yes, we
did talk about what what about his ability? Because so
(37:22):
many people want to put limitations on what he can't do.
Then then there is no limitations on him. And you're
gonna see that as time goes along. You're gonna see
the listen, it's the it's the scheme that they're doing
right there, right now. The scheme fits what they're all
about in Baltimore. The scheme fits what they want to
do in the running game. And again as as as
the passing game starts to progress, you gotta remember now
(37:43):
you know he's going into his third year, getting ready
going to the fourth, third or fourth year now is
again now things are going you're gonna see him progress
to the point not only him, it's not just him now,
it's the it's is everybody else around him, you know,
has to get to that level the where you understand
and get to that point understand this. When they get
(38:03):
to that point to where he's gonna do that. Other
than playing in the Houston Texas, I think they could,
they could beat anybody that they could beat because of
that young man at quarterback. And he's and he's he's
he's the total quarterback. You can see he's doing what
they've asked him to do. And then and what and then,
I'm gonna say this, as a defensive coordinator, if you
ever asked him not to do the things that he's
doing as a quarterback right now, as a defensive coordinator
(38:26):
who you're gonna say, please, don't run, please, don't you
know you know, I'm just saying, now, I thank you
so much. And then what ends up happening is now
they're sitting there saying, let's make him throw. I've been
in ball games there where they made him throw and
he won football games. So again, the all of that
stuff they said about those kind of guys at that
(38:47):
position in quarterback, haven't been one myself, and in the
situation that he's in now, I couldn't run like him,
couldn't throw like him. But I know this that a
quarterback is a quarterback and that guy is a quarterback. Well, coach,
if I could bring it back full circle to to
the Texans, you made a comment where you said you've
been a coach in this league nearly three decades, you've
(39:08):
seen everything. Compare a situation that you've seen in the
past of what you are currently facing with the Houston Texans.
I haven't seen this exact thing happened, but I've seen
guys that have been unhappy where they've been. I've seen
guys that that at some point, uh and and I've
seen things get worked out, especially in situations. The one
(39:31):
situation I haven't been in. Is a situation where you
go in, I haven't been a head coach, come in
and you come in a situation and you know, you
hear all these stories about the franchise quarterback, don't want
to be here, don't want to be there. I haven't
seen that situation. But I've been around situations in this
league where guys have been unhappy in their particular situation
for a variety of reasons, and and sometimes those reasons
(39:54):
been legit, sometimes not being legit. From the standpoint of
I go back to this is that when you get
in those situations like that, the one thing that you
want to make sure as a football team that you
have is you want your football team to be about
the team, not about you, not about me. And then
what ends up happening is this, when it gets to
(40:16):
the point what I've seen, Jim, and going to answer
you a question about seeing everything, what I have seen
is this is that I have not seen a football
team in this league be successful year in a year
out when it is about one guy, or it's about
this guy, or it's about this guy. It is always
and always has been and always will be about the team.
(40:38):
And then as a team. Your teammates look at it
the same way. Now, obviously at the quarterback position, that
being deposition on offense and on your team, the most
visible position, then obviously that's where it starts. But the
point there is this is that at some point, when
it gets to that point where decisions have to be
made and listen, he's our quarterback and I feel right
(41:00):
about him being our quarterback. And if he is he
as I said before, he is our quarterback, and and
when it gets to that point where we're there with that,
then I'm ready to go with that. I'm ready to
go with that. If if it gets to the point
where that's not the case, then we're still going to
be ready to go, and we're gonna make adjustments and
we're gonna move on, just like coaches do in this business.
(41:22):
But right now, we're not in that situation where we
have to worry about that. We're in a coach go ahead,
go ahead. No. The way I was gonna ask you
is frame it this way. How confident are you that
this situation with Deshaan can be worked out to where
he will be your starting quarterback Week one of the
NFL season. I'm very confident. I'm very confident. I'm very confident.
(41:46):
So because here here's here's to follow that up. You're confident,
But he doesn't seem to have an issue with you.
You're new you guys. You guys are just potentially starting
a relationships. Issue seem to be above you or somewhere
else besides you. So Howard confident are you that those
relationships or whatever is going on can be reconciled. I'm
(42:08):
remember this now. We're moving forward. You know, we're moving forward.
And my all our conversations have been with all of
our players here is that we are moving forward and
that we're gonna go forward, and we're gonna go forward
with everybody that is all in with us that wants
to go and I I like to think and I
(42:28):
feel like that as we move forward, as we're going,
we're gonna move forward all in with everybody that's all
in with us and I and I feel like that
everybody's gonna be all in, including him, including everybody else
that's been here, that we're moving forward and we're going
with it, and we're gonna go with that way. I
just want to say I'm not a member of the
(42:50):
Houston Texans, but I'm ready to suit up and play
for coach college. I'm telling you, don't you guys go
too far. Now. I know how old you are, listen.
I don't know. And I know I know, Steve, you
was a former quarterback. You know. Yeah, I don't know
if y'all can do the things that you used to
do to be able to help us get where we
(43:10):
need to get. But I will say this though, I
would like to have your experience, I like to have
your knowledge right here. But as far as putting you
on the football field, man, I can't do that. Okay,
you can, Jim, Jim, why is it our last two
guests they say something where it's like, Okay, time to
go listen to you. Guys are very good at doing
(43:34):
what you do, very good at doing what you do. David, David,
this we've had again, we've had some incredible conversations on
this podcast. But from where you took us through this
last thirty forty minutes has been an amazing, an amazing
journey from you from taking this job to everything you
(43:55):
had to go through to seeing James Harris and and
and Joe Gillen play at Vanderbilt University hearing that story
about your father. Man, I mean, Jim, this is like,
this is great, this is fantastic. I said, I had
never met Coach, but based on this conversation, he is
someone I would have loved to have played for. Well, listen,
(44:18):
back back then when you guys were where y'all should
be playing, I would have loved to have you playing
for me too. I appreciate that. Coach. There you go, well, Coach,
we we can't thank you enough. This, this has been
absolutely fantastic. We appreciate you. We wish you the best
of luck, We wish your father the best of luck.
And you listen. I'm gonna go when I'm gonna call
(44:39):
him a little bit later on and tell him I've
been on with you two guys. He'll be excited. Well,
held him up. You know what he's gonna say to me.
He says, you finally made it now, you made it
long before, friend before. Thank you very much. Well, thanks
so much, coach. Appreciate you, Thank you both appreciate it.
(45:08):
Like I said, Steve, how can you listen to that
and not want to suit up for this man? So
I know de Shaan has some some some issues with
some folks at the top of the organization. But man,
David Culley, to me, based on what I heard, this
man understands how to lead men and just just a
(45:32):
fantastic guy. Fantastic interview, and I can only wish him success. Yeah,
and Jim, look, look, you know one thing we didn't
really get to in here, because to me would have
taken away from just a de fascinating interview was the
fact that David Culley, who everyone was going into a
hopeless situation, still might be. But he's put together a
fantastic staff. I mean, he's got Lovey Smith at Pep
(45:54):
Hamilton's and on a lot of really good people on
the staff. They don't know who are what they're going
to be working with when he comes to molding the
plato that's being assembled down there in Houston. But David
Culley has, you know, his relationships that he talked about
some you know in that interview have really come well
into play. But I think some of the fascinating things
that that he really showed us his one he I
(46:18):
don't think he's really sure he may he's optimistic or
positive about DeShawn Watson being back. I didn't necessarily take
that um from his comments. I mean, this is gonna
be intriguing, but I think we're gonna have an answer
to this very quickly. I think sooner rather than later.
I definitely think before the draft. And and this is
the first time, more than at any point, that I
truly believe Deshaun Watson will be traded. From this standpoint,
(46:41):
when you use terms like right now he's on the
roster or we want guys who are all in and
knowing how de Shan feels about the organization, I can't
see how that works. So from my standpoint, my vantage point,
whether it was intended or not, in this interview, I
walked away thinking Deshaun Watson will not be a Houston
(47:03):
Texans next season. Yeah, And I'm glad both of us
were able to bring the clarity of like, hey, you
you don't have any issues with him, He doesn't have
any issues with you. It's other people, sure, right, and
and and and that's and that's the issue. But Jim,
just what a fascinating interview to hear him talk about
Joe Gilliam. For all you guys don't know, he's one
of the greatest quarterbacks you ever played. Black quarterback for
(47:23):
the Pittsburgh Steelers took Terry Bradshaw's spot for a while, okay,
to talk about Shack Harris in a driving rain and
seeing them throw bullets through a driving rain. You know,
it's in Vanderbilt Stadium. It's just phenomenal, phenomenal. So I
could have listened to those type stories all day, just
(47:45):
just you know, you're trying not to set expectations on
interviews when you have your guests and whatnot, and I
didn't in this case, but man, he blew me away.
I just got me on. He blew me away, and
Jim and you know, and look, and you really drove,
just to me, just a fascinating line of information to
when you were asking about the process of the head
(48:05):
coaching hiring. And I just thought it was fascinating where
he's just saying I didn't have the qualifications. I've been
here all this time, no one's brought my name up before,
yet here I am. And I thought just that whole
line of whoa hey, I didn't I didn't bring a
binder into the interview. You know, I didn't have all
of this working for me, and so it was almost
(48:28):
like listening and I'm sorry folks, if you get offended
listening to a white coach talk about all of the
things that worked for him, his relationship with nikiss Ario,
the fact that that's really what drove it. This is
what we want. You don't have to be a play caller.
You're gonna get an opportunity because we've seen so many
white coaches kind of go through that type of They
(48:48):
weren't sixty five when that happened. They were probably thirty five.
But I just thought that was just captivating stuff. And
I really hope you the listeners, uh took a lot
out of that. I'm right there with you, Steve. I
couldn't have said it any better. Just, um, there was
so much meat on the bone. There about so many
things that you could chew on all day. So you know,
(49:14):
it's not like a broken record here, but just it
was fascinating, man, it was. He just impressed me to
no end, um no end. So but I'm never going
to forget out of everything we talked about there. I'm
never gonna forget the visual image I have of just
him going back and spending two hours with his father
(49:36):
after being named the head coach, and just what that
conversation meant and to have a son talk about feeling
validated in that moment. You know, um damn it just
it it does. It gives me goose bumps. So yeah,
I am. I am really hoping. I don't care who's
listened to this story. We can we can claim exclusivity
(49:59):
on this when it had things that once everyone gets vaccinated,
everyone feels comfortable. That Jim Trotter is sitting in the
living room in Sparta, Tennessee. Count on it first game
with him. That to me, the way you can storytell
and and just observe. Oh my god, Jim, I am
(50:20):
that better happen. Count on it. Count on it. So
if I get the vaccination, count on it. Well, you
know we we but we both have our a r
PEA cars to gym, but we're not quite old enough
to get the vaccination yet in California. I gotta start
using it at Burger King and McDonald's. You know, I
don't need that though, I don't need that. I gotta
find someplace else. I don't need that stuff. I feel.
(50:45):
I feel so good, But glad you go ahead and
bring us home. That was a spectacular man. Yeah, we
we thank you all for listening. We thank you for
subscribing UM and we asked that you continue to leave
us messages about who you want to hear from, what
picks you want to hear touched on. That way, we
can continue to give you more of what you're funking for.
(51:08):
That's right to give you more. Next week, we're going
to have our first repeat guest on the Huddling Flow
podcast as producer, storyteller, reporter, and Twitter beast. Soul of
Dad O'Brien makes a return Jim. That's gonna be fantastic
to get her back on, But until then, please stay safe.
(51:31):
Please remember to support our sponsor Into It, who is
the proud makers of Turbo Tax, QuickBooks and Mint and
the proud sponsor of the Huddle Flow podcast that keeps
us rocking and rolling right here for Jim Trotter our
producer Thomas Warn On the Ones and twos, I am
Steve White. We are the Howards Mob, and we are
(51:52):
out
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