March 9, 2022 • 40 mins
In this episode, Rhett Lewis is joined by insiders Jim Trotter and James Palmer for perspective on the quarterback situations surrounding Aaron Rodgers, Russell Wilson and Carson Wentz. Jim and James share how the Russell Wilson deal got done, why Wilson could align himself with greatness if he wins in Denver, what the future looks like in Seattle after the trade, and what the Washington Commanders can expect from Carson Wentz. Jim also shares why he likes to see hall of fame caliber players like Aaron Rodgers stick with one franchise throughout their career, the reasons Aaron Rodgers might be underpaid in a few years, and what the future looks like for Davante Adams now that Rodgers is staying. James reflects on the Jordan Love selection and explains how the Green Bay Packers should handle his situation and then he gives us insights into what the future could look like for Jessie Bates III in Cincinnati
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Episode Transcript
Available transcripts are automatically generated. Complete accuracy is not guaranteed.
Speaker 1 (00:10):
I'm Red Lewis, and this is NFL Inside Report, and
if you're struggling to keep up with the news, you
are not alone. Welcome everybody. Great to be here with
you this week, which has truly been a frenzy of
breaking news stories, one after the other, and we just
had one within an hour ago of this recording. And
(00:31):
we'll get to Carson Wentz in his move now to
the Washington commanders here in just a minute. But first
let's welcome in a couple of guys who had front
row seats all this news here over the last couple
of days, our friends here at NFL Media, James Palmer
and Jim Trotter. Guys. Great to have you with us
here on NFL Inside Report. But before we get to everything,
I just want to do a little uh Seinfeld airing
(00:52):
of the grievances quickly if we could, because there seemed
to have been a bit of back and forth between
both of you guys regarding this Russell Wilson trade that
went down on Wednesday or Tuesday. Now, let's check in
with what James had to say following Jim's reaction to
(01:13):
James saying Russell Wilson might be a possibility to Denver,
and it well not to roast any of our colleagues
on national television. But Jim Trotter more or less laughed
in my face about twenty minutes ago when I said
Russell Wilson was a possibility of landing with the Denver
broncois and then Tom right there puts it out that
it's happening. Okay, Is everybody okay? Between you two? So
let me go first here on this one, because James
(01:35):
should have the last word as he had it, he
had it right. First of all, I would never laugh
in James's face. I have too much respect for my colleague.
What I was laughing about, if you will, if you
want to call it laughing, is the idea that a
franchise would give away a future Hall of Fame quarterback,
which is what Seattle essentially did. So my comment, if
(01:59):
we go back and us into the whole tape of
what I said, exactly go to the tape, is that
it would be an exorbitant price to get Russell Wilson
out of Seattle, and I just did not believe that
Denver would be able willing to pay that price. Well,
they didn't have to pay an exorbitant price. They basically
paid what the forty Niners paid, if not less, for
(02:22):
the forty Niners to go up and get an unproven
quarterback who hadn't even played in a year, and now
Seattle gives away a guy who is a potential Hall
of Famer, who had never had a losing season until
this last season, who just a few years ago when
we would ask the question of if you're down in
the final two minutes, trailing by a touchdown or less,
(02:43):
who's the quarterback you want with the ball in your hands,
and many of us at that time would have said
Russell Wilson. So for Denver to get him at the
price that it did to me, I just could never
have imagined that. So that's what that was about. I
would never laugh in any sort of way safe or
form in the face of Jim Palmer too much respect him. Yeah,
(03:05):
and it's true because I'm looking at Jim's hoodie right
now and it says Howard mine says Ohio State. So
I think we know who has a greater intelligence here.
And that's where it kind of stemmed from. Because Jim goes,
I get done talking, and he goes, are we going
to talk semantics here? Are we gonna talk semantics? You don't.
I didn't know what he meant. I was like, I'm
(03:25):
not entirely sure what Jim means here because I had
to look up the definition of semantics in a sense
we were doing. But Jim, Jim made a great point
in that sense, and he's exactly right because the way
and we're gonna break this down. Everybody I've talked to
(03:46):
in Denver over the last twenty four hours, I don't
want to say that they feel like they've flee stir
and that's the word that everybody loves to use in
these trades, right, But I feel pretty good about it.
I would feel pretty good about it because George Payton
really values picks, uh and he still has six picks
in this draft in the top one fifty after this trade.
(04:06):
You look at what he got from the Vommela, he
still has it to he still has a three, He
has two fours and to five you get one of
the fives. And so then you look at the players,
and everybody I talked to, Drew Lock was not going
to be their starter this year. Shelby Harris is a
is a solid player. They do think Noah Fan and
this is them speaking, they think he's gonna be a
thousand yard receiver in Seattle. But they also had another
(04:29):
pass catching tight end where they were lacking in a
block where they were lacking as a blocking So you
had two pass catching tight ends. What I've heard out
of Denver is we still have some picks and we
didn't give up anybody of that young Cora players we
wanted to keep, which was Courtland's Sutton, Jerry, Judy Pats
or Tang you know, Javonte Williams. Like the whole group stays,
(04:50):
the whole group stays intact, and you get Russell Wilson
at the price you get Russell Wilson at right now,
when we just looked at what Green Bay went and paid,
they're gonna be able to go out and get a
pass rusher and the next couple of days as well. Yeah,
it's certainly interesting, guys. I mean you're looking at you
mentioned the three players, lock Fan Harris, two first round picks,
two second round picks, and a fifth round pick, and
(05:12):
then the Broncos get Russell Wilson and a fourth round
pick back. So I mean, all in all, I'm still
kind of shocked that this that this all kind of happened.
It just it just felt like, you know, all the
words that were coming out of you know, Seattle's organization
and all that that sort of thing, it seemed to say,
we're moving forward with Russell. It's all gonna happen. Um, Jim,
(05:33):
I'm curious, do you do you feel like this was
a move where we're you know, Pete Carroll and John
Schneider you know, had to go up to ownership and
be like, is this cool? Can we do this? Or
is this something that they could do just kind of
on their own given the statue of the player. No,
I think anytime you're talking about a franchise quarterback, and
particularly one of Russell Wilson's statue, you always run there
by the ownership. Um, even if it's just out of courtesy.
(05:56):
But in this is Russell is so deeply ingrained in
the Seattle community. In turn so of you know, the
Tuesday visits at the hospital and whatnot. He had kind
of ingrained himself there. So obviously you would never want
to catch ownership off guard in that way. Um. I
just look, you know again, I can say go back
to the tape I think we said late in the
(06:17):
year where we were talking about Russell Wilson and the
question was being asked after he came back from the
injury and they had been on that losing streak, was
this sort of the beginning of the end of Russell
in Seattle? And I said at that time, if you
thought the previous season was a bumpy ride, you better
buckle up, because this offseason is truly gonna be m
a bumpy ride. Because if he was making the noise
(06:39):
that he was making after last season when they actually
had a winning record and went to the playoffs, imagine
what he was going to do now with his first
losing season. The people have to understand about Russell the
two most passive, aggressive players I know in the NFL,
particularly at the quarterback position, or Aaron Rodgers and Russell Wilson. Okay,
(06:59):
now that's the reality of it. And for Russell to
say I never asked for a trade, well, you're your
Your reb doesn't come out and say Russell never asked
for a trade, But here are the five teams. Yes,
if you're going to deal, I'm here are the teams
we would be interested in. Okay, Hey, Jim. Let me
let me phrase it to you this way real quick,
because as I mentioned, like going to ownership, do you
(07:19):
then go, all right, we're trading Russell Wilson. But here's
our plan for how we want to replace him. And
by the way, is it cool if we bring in
a quarterback from Houston that's tied up in some legal issues. Well, look,
ownership ownership had already signed off on them bringing in
Antonio Brown, you know, a couple of years ago. So
are we gonna say now that all of a sudden
(07:40):
they're gonna draw a line on on Deshaun Watson if
he's available. No, this is an organization. Also, back in
twenty seven, team brought in Colin Kaepernick for an interview
when no one else would touch him, and we're was
willing to sign him if the football conversation had gone
the way that the Seahawks wanted it to go, which
it did not. So to me, that was never an issue.
(08:03):
What I see here now is Pete. I will never
forget the conversation I had with Pete Carroll early on
UM when he was in Seattle, and he told me
this story where he said that when he was in
usc his first year, I believe it was, they went,
they played five hundred football and Carson Palmer won the
Heisman Trophy, right, and he said to me, I never
(08:26):
want to be dependent on a quarterback again. And so
what did that mean? He wanted to be able to
play defense, he wanted to be able to run the ball.
So he gets to Seattle and that's their formula for success.
Earlier in the year with Russell, and the minute Russell
starts opening the offense up and whatnot, what do we
hear from Pete man, I don't recognize this team. I
don't recognize this offense, and they try and scale it back.
(08:49):
So what it appears to me is that John Schnyder
and Pete Carroll, if they do not use these chips
that they got from Denver to go out and get
Deshaun Watson. And there are people in the league who
tell me that that is part of their plan what
they would like to do, even though there's going to
be competition from other clubs. But it says to me,
if that doesn't happen, what they're doing here is saying
(09:10):
we're gonna try and follow that blueprint all over again
and come up with a team that plays great defense
and is able to run the football. The problem with
that is, in my view, Russell Wilson actually played better
than what we're giving him credit for his first few
years in the league when they had that formula and
they had the legion of boom, because you got to
tell me who your quarterback is gonna be if that's
(09:31):
gonna work, and I just don't know who that is.
It's not Drew Lock, right. And then you know, looking
at this, uh, you know now coming off the combine
makes you wonder how teams are feeling about the you know,
the quarterback draft class that we've talked about, you know,
at length here over the last few days, and how
it's just not quite as strong as it's been in
recent years. And then there's this this next huge piece
(09:54):
of the puzzle which we learned today, which is Carson
Wentz now one and done, which I think we all
have expected after the way that Chris Ballard and Frank
Bright talked about it during the week in Indianapolis. On
his way to the Washington Commanders, he and his twenty
eight million dollars in salary essentially for the third round
pick and a conditional third round pick, and the two
(10:14):
teams will swap second round picks. Um James, I'm just curious,
like as you're as you're assessing all of this quarterback
news and seeing the puzzles you know, fit into place here. Uh,
you know, it's a bit more wild than we kind
of thought it was gonna be. It is. I remember
Bruce arians standing up on the podium just last week
at the Combine going like, these these veterans are not
(10:35):
to be trade. Come on, who's training these guys? You know?
And and so it was funny to hear him him
talk about that. And first I want to tackle kind
of this quarterback class because the more you know, questions
I asked around, and and Ba's team is kind of
one of them. The way they feel about Kyle Trask
that they drafted in the second round last year out
of Florida to finished fourth in the Heisman voting, Like
(10:57):
they like him better than anybody else in this class
that's coming out now. So like that's the way they feel.
You go down to Houston and they're probably gonna have
Davis Mills start this entire season from what I'm hearing,
and to me actually makes sense. You you start him,
you get a look at him for a year, and
the picks that are you hoping you're getting from Deshaun
Watson you can use for your quarterback next season in
(11:18):
draft better last season than most people. Really good understand.
And that's my other point, Like I was asking people
like what if Davis Mills would have stayed at Stanford
for another year and come out in this class, Like
where would he have ranked in this quarterbacks if he
would have came out, Because yeah, when he became the starter,
he Houston thinks he played as well as any rookie
(11:38):
that was out there. Now, these rookies had some some
struggles this year, and that happens with rookies. But yeah,
the way these things have fallen, and we'll now go
to Indie. What I had heard was obviously the way
the season ended. We saw Jim r says tarmac press conference,
and uh, the way he felt about what went down.
What Chris Balad was trying to do was let's make
(12:00):
sure and I think this is a smart move in football,
in business, in any aspect, is let's remove emotion from
the decision. And he was trying to drag this thing
on as far from the end of the regular season
as possible so him, Frank Riich and Jim rcay could
look at this thing and take emotion out of the
equation about the way the season ended. And what the
(12:21):
move we just saw now is it looks like with
that even being done, that they didn't think it was coredual.
I'm curious, Jim, is what we saw from Carson Wentz,
who Frank Reich, as we all say, gets more out
of him than anybody, and he goes to twenty seven
touchdowns and seven picks. Is Jimmy Garoppolo that much of
a step above Carson Wentz to make this move because
(12:42):
you would think that would be where they are somewhat heading.
Because if that's not, I'm not sure what their other
options are at the spot. I'll say this to you, um,
I always laugh when people tell me that certain draft
class this week at the quarterback position. It does not
(13:04):
matter how strong or how weak a classes. We know
that teams always go and so when we came in,
when we're coming into this draft and everyone's saying there's
not a top ten guy there, I am almost willing
to bet James Palmer's paycheck that a quarterback will be
drafted and this year, okay, I'm pulling the way. Let
(13:28):
me heck, I might even throw myne in, Jim. Seahawks
could do it now at nine if they wanted to know.
And that's what I'm saying to you. And all it
takes is one and then other teams are like, oh
my god, we gotta get one. And now these quarterbacks
get pushed up the board. And so that's what I'm saying.
What people say to me, it's like a weak draft
in terms of the quarterbacks. It does not matter they
(13:50):
are going to be taken high anyway, because that's just
the nature of the league where everyone is searching for
that quarterback. And that's why I'm going back to the
Seattle situation and makes those system me because even if
allow this works out at Seattle wants, they still don't
have a quarterback. And what every team in this league
is chasing is that franchise guy. And Jim, to my point,
it wasn't that these guys are it's that teams that
(14:13):
we think need quarterbacks value who's already on the roster
pretty highly. In terms of those are two teams where
we're all wondering, like, who are they gonna have his
quarterback like. That's the interesting way it measures up in
the landscape of who's gonna be picking this because somebody
is Jim's right, somebody's gonna pick, and then somebody's gonna
go oh, and then then it's gonna you know, it's
gonna snowball in that sense, and that's why the teams
(14:33):
that have the quarterbacks talent at the top of their
board gets pushed down towards them and then they go, okay, well,
we'll just we'll just snag this guy who we're picking.
You know, we're picking at twenty eight and we had
him at fifteen on our board. But he slides down
to me because people go on a cute quarterback run.
But Herman Wers always said this to me. I'll never
forget it, and I always steal it from him, and
(14:54):
he always says, the best predictor of future behavior is
past behaviors, and when it comes to the NFL Draft,
that is all true. The best predictor of future behavior
is past behavior. So let's watch and see what happens
with these quarterbacks. So everyone is saying it's not a
good class. Let's see how many go in the first
round and how high? Sure? Sure? And now you know
you've got the Washington Commanders who have been looking for
(15:17):
a quarterback seems like the last couple of years since
the Dwayne Haskins experiment did not work after taking him
in the first round, and they seem desperate, right, made
a big move, made a big play reportedly for Russell Wilson,
and I Russell didn't want to go there. Uh, you know,
they've been searching around other places. And then today, you
know this, this Wednesday of this week, they execute a
(15:39):
trade to bring in Carson Wentz and it's got people
all over Twitter wondering is he really that much better
than Taylor Heineke? And you're gonna pay him twenty eight
million this year? And so does that effectively take the
Washington Commanders out of the draft market for a quarterback
at number eleven? I don't know, um, but that's a
lot of money you're paying to the quarterback spot there
(16:00):
for somebody, um who maybe you know, isn't that much
better than somebody already on your roster. But clearly Washington
guys would have to see him as a as a
clear upgrade, right, otherwise you don't you don't make a
move like this. Yeah, completely, And I think I think
Baldi said it on our air. I don't know if
Jim was in that. No, I don't think he was
in that segment, and Bucky was in a different segment.
(16:20):
Everybody was. We had a million people in the show today.
And he said, like when you he's kind of that
guy to where and Jim can say this does have
been around the league forever and not to date you Jim,
just you've covered the league for a while. Every every
coach thinks that they can change a player, every coach
thinks that they can, well it once he gets with me,
I can. And Baldi said it best you look at
(16:43):
the measurables of Carson Wentz and the size and the
arm strength and the athletic ability like that is not
a common group of traits that a lot of people
on this planet have. But then it's the decision making
and all the other things that go with playing the
quarterback spot. When you see those traits as a coach,
you go, well, I can fix the other parts. And
that's why I'm assuming this isn't gonna be the last
(17:04):
we see. If Carson Wentz going to another location and
another team taking a chance because the traits are there,
and everybody's gonna see if they can be the one
to change him. Look at look at what's going on
with Mitchell Drabinsky. It's like all of a sudden, he's
a he's a hot guy. Yeah, I mean how they
couldn't run him out of Chicago fast enough? And now
(17:24):
it's Matt Neege's fault and this and the other. And
I'm not saying that that that Matt Nege isn't isn't
complicit in in the struggles that Tbisky had, But I'm
just saying everybody thinks that they're the ones that can
correct the guy. And I know Dave All had them
up in Buffalo, and now you can. You can bring
him to New York if that's what indeed happens, and
he competes with Daniel Jones. But if Daniel Jones were
to lose that that job to Mitchell, watch the next
(17:47):
thing is there's gonna be a team. Man. We gotta
get Daniel Jones. We think we can fix him. Yeah,
and we go you know my my look, and I'm
not a personnel guy, would never claim to be in
this and the other, but I do believe that that
after three years of seeing a guy for three years
or whatever, he is who he is for the most part.
And Jim, how much does where these players are selected
(18:09):
make that possible to keep coming back? If Mitchell Trobinski
was a fourth round pick, this wouldn't be happening over
and over again. Like you said in the same thing
with with Wentz and the same thing with Daniel Jones.
You look at the talent that you see just an
athletic ability, you look at where they're picked, and then
they keache and coming back exactly over and over and
over again. I was gonna make how much time do
(18:31):
we have? I I didn't want to Oh, okay, I
want to drop a couple. I didn't know if we
left the whole Russell will still please give me more?
And I had a couple of nunets that I thought
were pretty interesting. Um one, this is something that George Payton,
I found this out today, has been working on for
maybe months. And that doesn't mean he was talking to
(18:54):
Seattle for months, But that was him putting things together
and on his side of things four months and then
the last several weeks going back to the Senior Bowl,
he started having conversations with John Schneider, and that's when
they started to start having these deeper conversations with one another.
And then the combine those really kind of heated up.
And I thought it was interesting. They're having all these
(19:15):
closed door meetings and nobody in the building knows, Like
coaches on the staff I'm talking to don't know, And
so few people in the building knew what George Peyton
was up to. And he did it that way on purpose,
and it was a very tight circle because a he
didn't want the trade to be squandered in any sort
of capacity to where something gets out and somebody gets
out early, and both sides, both teams did a pretty
(19:36):
good job in this social media world of keeping this
thing pretty tight lipped for as long as they did.
And then the other part that I found really interesting
is they weren't the only ones doing a ton of work.
Russell Wilson did a boatload of work on the Denver
broncos I'm told on his own and and I think,
isn't it Russell loves Seattle. He's all He's gonna stay
(20:01):
in Seattle. Go Hawks, Come on? Does he say? Does
he say? Go? I can go let's go Donkeys go.
I think it's gonna because I would assume it would be,
but yeah, go Orange. I'm not sure. But it was
funny because when he I was told when he and
Sierra and they came into the building yesterday and they
(20:22):
he took his physical and went around the building, talked
to people, met with people. There were people in the
building going like, wow, he knows a lot about us,
Like he knows so like even like like you know
guys that are not even at the top of the
front office, like middle tier guys, like he knew who
they were, and like so like they're okay. Russ did
do a lot of work and I know he talked
to a lot of people about this process because I
(20:44):
do think and this is a discussion I think, Jim
and I'd like your take, Like everybody is wondering, like
why would you go to this division? Why would you
head to this division? But he put a lot of
work in. He likes the roster um. He's not going
into it blindly, I guess, is my point. No, the
Broncos have a lot of talent. And here's the thing
about Russell and and Denver fans that they don't know
(21:06):
what they'll learn it. Russell is one of the more
fascinating personalities to me in the NFL, and there is
a very distinct line between many who believe he's genuine
and those who believe he is in authentic. Okay, but
I do know this about Russell. He wants to be
viewed as one of the all time grades. I mean,
(21:28):
and he believes already that he is. Whether you believe
it or not, or I believe it or not, he
believes he is. And so when that conversation comes up
about who's the all time grades, he knows that he
needs Pelts on the wall. And therefore he can look
at Seattle and say, We're not gonna win Pelts here,
And if I'm going to be in that conversation, I
(21:49):
gotta go someplace where I feel I can win him.
Denver has got a lot of talent, you know, and
he wants to throw the ball down the field. Nathaniel
Hacketts already said that's one of the priorities for this offense,
is that they're going to push the ball down the field.
So let rust Cook. Now, whatever happens, we'll see. I
don't know, but I do know he has driven and
(22:13):
motivated to have people speak about him in the way
they speak about Tom Brady and Peyton Manning and these others,
that he is one of the all time grades and
we've been saying it for years. And the Denver Broncos
have one of the best young offensive skill sets out there,
just not the guy that leads them. Oh and by
the way, only two teams in the NFL gave up
(22:34):
fewer points per game than this. James. Is Vaughan really
lobbying to come back, By the way, from what I've
heard over the last you know, day and a half,
Vaughan had a pretty good idea this was going down
clearly there. Clearly. I think we all know that players
talk and things get around players circles pretty pretty easily.
(22:55):
I do know they're gonna go hard at the pass
rushing spot. And I will say this, Um, I know
they traded him. It probably went as amicable as trading
face of your franchise could have gone. Through the conversations
that that George Payton and Joe Ellis and John Elway
all had with von Miller heading out the door, Um
were could not have gone better. And they wouldn't have
(23:16):
traded him if it wasn't too a situation like he
landed in in l A. So I wouldn't rule it out.
I don't think it's likely, but I wouldn't. I wouldn't
rule it out. And and the other point to Jim's
point is if you want those pelts on the wall,
I just thought of it now, And that makes such
a great point, Like if you go and dominate this division,
like that's what salts on the wall, like, you come
out of that division repeatedly and you make things happen.
(23:38):
That's that that that actually even proves a point even
further open by the way you just put one on
the wall with the L. A. Rams and you know
going back there might give you another shot to do
the same. So I did find it interesting that a
guy who was just on the Super Bowl champion L A.
Rams um, you know, kind of advocating to come back
to a place uma. He knew what was gonna there.
You go, Okay, So I'm gonna steal your Herm Edwards
(24:01):
quote again, Jim, because if you say past behavior is
the best predictor of future behavior, then the packers should
be feeling good about what's coming with Aaron Rodgers, get
into that when we come back. All right, back here
(24:30):
with the NFL Inside Report, We've got Jim Trotter and
James Palmer with us on a wild week of NFL news.
We've discussed a couple of the quarterback trades. Carson Wentz
to the Commanders, Russell Wilson now to the Broncos, and
that Russell Wilson news kind of stealing the shine of
Aaron Rodgers essentially announcing that he is coming back to
the Green Bay Packers, announcing because he told Pat McAfee. Um,
(24:52):
and so we we then knew that that was that
was going to happen. There's some ambiguity. It sounds like
guys on the exact contract numbers, but the ones that
Ian Rappaport has put out there would make Aaron Rodgers
the highest paid player in NFL history based on average
salary per year, which has been reported at fifty mill
(25:12):
gym um. It seemed like the writing was on the wall,
like for the last couple of months and weeks especially
that Aaron was going to make his way back to
Green Bay. Uh? Is this how it all should have
worked out? Yeah? I mean, look, I'm a traditionalist. I
like to see players stay or I like to see
Hall of Fame caliber players stay with one franchise if possible.
(25:33):
I understand that that's polly Anish and that's not the
NFL today, but for me personally, I love to see that.
I love to see guys like you know, Larry Fitzgerald
stay with one team or to see even read you'll
you'll appreciate this that I'm including Eli Manning and you
know that's sort of thing. So um, but yeah, you know,
(25:54):
but one thing I want to say about these salaries, like,
it's funny if the Aaron Rodger numbers are accurate and
they have no reason to believe that they're not. Um
and everyone's like fifty million a year. Wow, Well, if
what I heard on the weekend is true, we're all
gonna be laughing about that deal and how Aaron Rodgers
is underpaid in a couple of years because they have
One agent tell me that a private call with the
(26:15):
union recently that the union expressed that the expectation is
the salary capital increase by next year and then by
another twenty percent the year after that. So we're talking
about a potentially increase two years down the road. When
we talk about Aaron's fifty million a year, We're gonna
think that that's a great deal when we start thinking
(26:35):
about the Justin Herbert's and and the Joey Burrows and
these guys who are gonna be coming down the pike. So,
I don't know, it's always it's fascinating people when people
want to make a big deal out of these salaries.
Look the many you sign one, you know that somebody's
coming down the pike to replace you as the highest paid.
It's the way the NFL operates. So good for Aaron
(26:58):
Rodgers and good for them R. Jackson when he gets
his for waiting and holding out to this point, because
now his his value went up even more with this deal.
A Jim, is it a fail if the Packers don't
get another Lombardi in this contract extension window of Aaron Rodgers?
I think it's a fail right now period. I mean,
when you have a quarterback of that caliber and you
have only one championship, you know during his time there, um,
(27:23):
I think that a lot of good years were wasted
when the when the Packers would not go into free
agency and supplement that roster. Um. So yeah, I do
believe that Aaron Rodgers should have more championships, and I
found the whole discussion. I know I'm dominating here, but
I found the whole discussion about he was overrated because
he only had one championship and he didn't come up
(27:43):
big in that playoff loss to San Francisco. I think
back to some of those playoff games where they lost,
where they put up over forty points and they lose.
How is that on Aaron Rodgers? The best playoff games
I've ever seen against the Cardinals twice and they end
up lose in those games. So I don't put all
that necessarily on Aaron, but organizationally, I do believe it's
(28:06):
to fail if they don't get another championship while he's there. James,
let me let me put it to you this way.
How do we view the Jordan Love trade and selection
do we view it as well? It helped Aaron Rodgers
get two straight MVPs, you know, inspired him enough to
do that, or it wasted another opportunity to try and
help support it. That's the first part that I always
(28:26):
go to, that it was an opportunity to help find
someone to aid and what Jim saying, you know, the
lack of action and free agency in any chance to
build a roster around a player that doesn't come around
very often is somewhat of a waste. But at the
same time, I don't hate the pick when I still
look back at it, because you didn't know Aaron was
(28:47):
going to do this. We didn't know that these last
two years he would play the best football of his career. Like,
It's not like he's falling off in any capacity. He's
getting better, which is wild to say. So I go
back and look at how many picks in the back
end of the first round do not pan out, uh
and and you couldn't. I wouldn't say that's a waste
(29:07):
of a pick. You gave it a shot. But at
the same time, not every first round pick becomes, uh,
you know, even a starter exactly. And so to me,
the plan would be what we whipped on it and
just openly admit it and say we're gonna extend Aaron
and we're gonna keep him as our quarterback. We miscalculated this,
(29:27):
you know. That was the issue that I always had
from the jump of just tell Jordan's love and tell
everybody we whipped on it. Instead of dangling this with
Aaron Rodgers and saying like we when you we may
move on at some point, we just say we we
blew the pick, and Aaron, you're playing great. Yeah, But
you know, personal people don't like to do that because
the answer and this is why, this is why I
(29:50):
love um Less Sneed When I said to him about
the fact when you look at how heat team builds
in terms of going out and making trades to bring
improving players and then admitting their mistake with guys, whether
it's Jared Goff or Brandon Cook or whoever, you go
down the line, and I'll never forget less, Sneet said
to me. He goes, ego is the enemy, which I
know is the title of a book that he has read.
(30:11):
And and it's true. Too many of these personnel people
allow their ego to get in the way of saying,
you know what, we tried, it didn't work, you know exactly,
and there's nothing wrong with saying we were wrong. Right
And by the way, like the next six picks in
(30:33):
the first round after they took Jordan's love that, I mean,
like there's some decent players in there, but they're not
exactly light in the world on fire However, T Higgins
Michael Pittman Jr. Taking at the top of the second
round Have been pretty darn good, so that that's certainly interesting.
Now here's the other piece of this, Jim that I
find really interesting is that Davante Adams has now been
officially franchise tagged. I know they want to get a
long term deal done there. I don't know how close
(30:55):
they are, but like, what part of the Aaron Rodgers
discussion was like he's either playing or I'm not, and
so like they've had to have come to some understanding there, right. Well,
I think all along we knew the Packers were going
to franchise him. So whether Aaron was there or not,
Davante Adams was going to be franchise tagged. So I
(31:15):
don't think that was part of the equation at all.
What's gonna be fascinating for me now is now that
Aaron is there, now that you have restructured his contract,
will you take care of Davante now and get that
multi year deal done, because that sends a message to
the locker room as well as what are you all about?
You know, Aaron made this this big deal about you know,
(31:37):
loyalty is too strong a word, but sort of the
culture you want to create. Um, in terms of how
you treat your franchise players. Well, Davante Adams has done
everything right and he's one of the best in the league,
and so he deserves to get paid. Are the Packers
going to pay him on a multi year deal? That's
the key question for me, And I think if I
don't want to say if they're smart, because they're obviously
(31:58):
not dumb people, but but in terms of culture building,
I think it would be wise for them to get
a multi year done with him. Yep, agreed. That's some
great insight there, Jim on with the Packers are dealing
with here so now like they but they James, like,
they've got other pieces to deal with. I mean, they
got JR. Alexander, who I know Ian Rapport has been
(32:20):
talking about as you know, they've kind of restarted some
some contract talks there. Uh, Deveandre Campbell was a really
good player for them last year. You gotta figure out
what's going on with to Darius Smith, um, you know,
who's making a pretty decent number now and and you
know hasn't played very much in the last two years.
I mean, was huge for them last exactly, and he
I think tweeted out recently just want to get what
(32:42):
I'm worth something like that, right. No, I think he
also tweeted out like there's no more money in Green Bay.
Did he say like I think he means not in
the organization. I think he means in the time, right,
and that and that does lead you to I mean,
I was trying to before we went on the area yesterday.
I was trying to watch Pat McAfee for long as
I possibly could. It's an hour before our show starts
(33:02):
that he's on, and it was hilarious that he kept saying,
my source, my sore thing. Aaron told me. Okay, Aaron.
Aaron told me he couldn't keep it going. But it
was interesting to hear him repeatedly say, and I'm with Jim,
I have no reason not to believe Ian's numbers that
he repeatedly kept saying that Aaron is telling me that
these are not the numbers. I haven't agreed to anything,
(33:23):
and this is solely my opinion. That is, I believe
the concern with with Aaron Rodgers part of the perception
of I only came back because of this massive amount
of dollars that have been put there. But if you
look at what Jim is talking about with the percentage
increases that could be going on within the salary cap,
and this is structured properly, you can pay him this
(33:46):
and you can still sign and make these other moves
and make these other plays with and within the roster.
And I think the way we're trying to describe this
and all of us having an understanding of how it
works is a little bit greater than Joe Fan not
to speak above them, to understand Aaronadger is gonna get
this money and how are we gonna get all these
guys back? And I don't think he wants that perception
(34:07):
out there that I came back for the money. If
if those numbers are right what Jim saying, and I
agree that, like, you can slide this money however you'd like,
and there's much more room as as we go and
they can make these other plays. I just think no Brady,
no Drew Brees, like, no Russell Wilson, like. I think
he has more pressure on him than any other quarterback
(34:28):
in football in two season. All right, So Davante Adams
got the tag. Mike Williams gets the big contract extension
from the Chargers three for sixty million, forty million guaranteed,
keeping a big piece of their core in place there
in that wild wild a f C West. Now, some
other players who were tagged at the deadline, Chris Godwin
with the Bucks, Cam Robinson an interesting one with the
(34:50):
Jacksonville Jaguars could change what they do at number one overall,
Dalton Schultz tagged as a tight end for the Dallas Cowboys,
Orlando Brown after his first year as a left tackle,
and Casey also tagged David Njoku with the Cleveland Browns.
Another tight end getting tagged as was Mike Kisiki down
in Miami. But a really interesting one. Here's Jesse Bates
coming off the a f C champion Cincinnati Bengal squad.
(35:12):
Here the safety for since he who has been such
a huge piece of their turnaround, especially on the defensive
side of the ball with Joe Burrow kind of leading
the way offensively, James, what do you kind of make
of of Jesse's where he's at right now considering what
this franchise has done in its history. Yeah, you can
look at this red from two sides, and the first
one I'll say, is there's the argument to be made
(35:33):
Jesse Bates is the best safety in football. I mean,
if you if you go out and try to make
that argument, and David Moving at his his representation, is
going to go out and do that. He's represented a
lot of safeties, and with those safeties he's represented, he's
reset the market multiple times, and he is going to
try to do that again with Jesse Bates's contract, And
that would not be out of the question that if
there's the argument he's the best safety and football, Like
(35:55):
we got done talking with Jim Trotter, the contracts always
go up. If he's the next up, he should probably
reset the market. Remember they tried to get a deal
done for about the last year really and he made
it known that he was upset he didn't get a
contract extension. He showed up for everything. He showed up
for voluntary workouts last offseason, he was there for every
day of training camp. I don't want to speak for Jesse.
(36:16):
I talked to him a lot, and I think he's
a wonderful person. I don't know if he'll be that
kind this time around. If an extension doesn't come around
the point I'm making is he might be the most
valuable person to this team outside of Joe Burrow, from
a leadership standpoint, from a player standpoint, from a performance standpoint. Exactly,
look at everything I'm gonna add of everything about him,
(36:38):
and then tell me how this could impact the culture
of the locker room. When he was brought in and
drafted in the second round, I believe i'd a wake
for us and he comes in before the turnaround happens
that they are now a legit Super Bowl contender for
the next several years with Joe Burrow as their quarterback.
He was part of the rebuild on the defensive side
of the ball. He is the guy who is the
captain of their entire defense. There are three players since
(36:59):
two thousand night I believe nineteen with four hundred tackles
and thirty passes defense. It's Darius Leonard, uh Jesse Bates,
and I'm trying to think who the throw is. Another linebacker.
One of the best linebacker pool might be Fred warner Man.
I don't can't remember, but the point is he's doing
things that very few safeties can do. No if you
if you don't give him a contract extension and he
(37:21):
plays in this franchise tag, and you look at the
previous seven franchise tags they have dished out since two thousand,
none of those players have received contract extensions. What does
that tell Joe Burrow specifically and the other players how
business is going to be done moving forward? Because I
think we do know how Cincinnati has financially done business
(37:41):
over the course of the last many years, right, whether
it's from the coaching standpoint, whether it's from the player's standpoint.
Oh yeah, and from the coaching standpoint, Rehett, we gave
the head coach a contract extension mere days after the
loss of the Super Bowl. So when are one of
our best players is looking for a new contract and
that doesn't potentially happen. I'm curious. There are people in
(38:01):
the league that think is we don't know this yet
and we'll see what it is. There are people in
the league that think Joe Burrow will not finish his
career in Cincinnati, and this is one of the main reasons.
Mike Droump, I mean, look, history, We've been talking about it, right,
the best predictor of future behaviors, past behavior, Yeah, I mean,
look until until it's not right, until the history changes
(38:24):
and their trends changed. Then it's something we have to
continue to look at. And it might be slightly telling
about how they go to fix this offensive line. If
they go and get some maybe older veterans. I mean,
they weren't interested in Joe Tuney last year because it
was too expensive, and they don't look at guys in
their late twenties early thirties. They look for specific things.
If they go and say, listen, we can win right now.
I don't care how old this guy is. He'll help
(38:45):
us on the offensive line. Maybe that's an indication that, Okay,
we're thinking a little bit differently than we have in
years past because of Joe Burrow, because of where we are.
But we're not there yet. So this is a wonderful
question to have. And I think Jesse Bates is going
to be the big part of it, and and it's
gonna be really interesting to watch throughout the off season
because you know who else is watching the rest of
the locker room, and that's gonna be the interesting part
(39:06):
about it. James Palmer, Jim Trotter, fantastic insight all episode
long here for us on NFL and Side Report. JP
always appreciate your time, but no problem o H And
that's gonna do it for this episode of NFL Inside Report.
(39:29):
Always love having Chip Trotter James Palmer aboard here for
us previewing this and really recapping this wild week of
news in the NFL. What will come next week when
we kick off NFL Free Agency Frenzy over on NFL Network.
We'll have a brand new episode lined up for you
next week. Can't wait to share all that happens on
the free agency world with you guys. Reminder to download,
(39:49):
rate review our show on the I Heart Radio app,
on Apple podcast wherever you get your pods. We certainly
appreciate it, and for our producers Thomas Warren and Tim Prodca,
I'm your host, Rrett Lewis. We'll ket you next time.
NFL Inside Report is the production of the NFL and
partnership with I Heart Radio. For more official podcasts from
the NFL, visit the I Heart Radio app, Apple Podcasts,
(40:11):
or wherever you get your podcasts.
I'm Red Lewis, and this is NFL Inside Report, and
if you're struggling to keep up with the news, you
are not alone. Welcome everybody. Great to be here with
you this week, which has truly been a frenzy of
breaking news stories, one after the other, and we just
had one within an hour ago of this recording. And
(00:31):
we'll get to Carson Wentz in his move now to
the Washington commanders here in just a minute. But first
let's welcome in a couple of guys who had front
row seats all this news here over the last couple
of days, our friends here at NFL Media, James Palmer
and Jim Trotter. Guys. Great to have you with us
here on NFL Inside Report. But before we get to everything,
I just want to do a little uh Seinfeld airing
(00:52):
of the grievances quickly if we could, because there seemed
to have been a bit of back and forth between
both of you guys regarding this Russell Wilson trade that
went down on Wednesday or Tuesday. Now, let's check in
with what James had to say following Jim's reaction to
(01:13):
James saying Russell Wilson might be a possibility to Denver,
and it well not to roast any of our colleagues
on national television. But Jim Trotter more or less laughed
in my face about twenty minutes ago when I said
Russell Wilson was a possibility of landing with the Denver
broncois and then Tom right there puts it out that
it's happening. Okay, Is everybody okay? Between you two? So
let me go first here on this one, because James
(01:35):
should have the last word as he had it, he
had it right. First of all, I would never laugh
in James's face. I have too much respect for my colleague.
What I was laughing about, if you will, if you
want to call it laughing, is the idea that a
franchise would give away a future Hall of Fame quarterback,
which is what Seattle essentially did. So my comment, if
(01:59):
we go back and us into the whole tape of
what I said, exactly go to the tape, is that
it would be an exorbitant price to get Russell Wilson
out of Seattle, and I just did not believe that
Denver would be able willing to pay that price. Well,
they didn't have to pay an exorbitant price. They basically
paid what the forty Niners paid, if not less, for
(02:22):
the forty Niners to go up and get an unproven
quarterback who hadn't even played in a year, and now
Seattle gives away a guy who is a potential Hall
of Famer, who had never had a losing season until
this last season, who just a few years ago when
we would ask the question of if you're down in
the final two minutes, trailing by a touchdown or less,
(02:43):
who's the quarterback you want with the ball in your hands,
and many of us at that time would have said
Russell Wilson. So for Denver to get him at the
price that it did to me, I just could never
have imagined that. So that's what that was about. I
would never laugh in any sort of way safe or
form in the face of Jim Palmer too much respect him. Yeah,
(03:05):
and it's true because I'm looking at Jim's hoodie right
now and it says Howard mine says Ohio State. So
I think we know who has a greater intelligence here.
And that's where it kind of stemmed from. Because Jim goes,
I get done talking, and he goes, are we going
to talk semantics here? Are we gonna talk semantics? You don't.
I didn't know what he meant. I was like, I'm
(03:25):
not entirely sure what Jim means here because I had
to look up the definition of semantics in a sense
we were doing. But Jim, Jim made a great point
in that sense, and he's exactly right because the way
and we're gonna break this down. Everybody I've talked to
(03:46):
in Denver over the last twenty four hours, I don't
want to say that they feel like they've flee stir
and that's the word that everybody loves to use in
these trades, right, But I feel pretty good about it.
I would feel pretty good about it because George Payton
really values picks, uh and he still has six picks
in this draft in the top one fifty after this trade.
(04:06):
You look at what he got from the Vommela, he
still has it to he still has a three, He
has two fours and to five you get one of
the fives. And so then you look at the players,
and everybody I talked to, Drew Lock was not going
to be their starter this year. Shelby Harris is a
is a solid player. They do think Noah Fan and
this is them speaking, they think he's gonna be a
thousand yard receiver in Seattle. But they also had another
(04:29):
pass catching tight end where they were lacking in a
block where they were lacking as a blocking So you
had two pass catching tight ends. What I've heard out
of Denver is we still have some picks and we
didn't give up anybody of that young Cora players we
wanted to keep, which was Courtland's Sutton, Jerry, Judy Pats
or Tang you know, Javonte Williams. Like the whole group stays,
(04:50):
the whole group stays intact, and you get Russell Wilson
at the price you get Russell Wilson at right now,
when we just looked at what Green Bay went and paid,
they're gonna be able to go out and get a
pass rusher and the next couple of days as well. Yeah,
it's certainly interesting, guys. I mean you're looking at you
mentioned the three players, lock Fan Harris, two first round picks,
two second round picks, and a fifth round pick, and
(05:12):
then the Broncos get Russell Wilson and a fourth round
pick back. So I mean, all in all, I'm still
kind of shocked that this that this all kind of happened.
It just it just felt like, you know, all the
words that were coming out of you know, Seattle's organization
and all that that sort of thing, it seemed to say,
we're moving forward with Russell. It's all gonna happen. Um, Jim,
(05:33):
I'm curious, do you do you feel like this was
a move where we're you know, Pete Carroll and John
Schneider you know, had to go up to ownership and
be like, is this cool? Can we do this? Or
is this something that they could do just kind of
on their own given the statue of the player. No,
I think anytime you're talking about a franchise quarterback, and
particularly one of Russell Wilson's statue, you always run there
by the ownership. Um, even if it's just out of courtesy.
(05:56):
But in this is Russell is so deeply ingrained in
the Seattle community. In turn so of you know, the
Tuesday visits at the hospital and whatnot. He had kind
of ingrained himself there. So obviously you would never want
to catch ownership off guard in that way. Um. I
just look, you know again, I can say go back
to the tape I think we said late in the
(06:17):
year where we were talking about Russell Wilson and the
question was being asked after he came back from the
injury and they had been on that losing streak, was
this sort of the beginning of the end of Russell
in Seattle? And I said at that time, if you
thought the previous season was a bumpy ride, you better
buckle up, because this offseason is truly gonna be m
a bumpy ride. Because if he was making the noise
(06:39):
that he was making after last season when they actually
had a winning record and went to the playoffs, imagine
what he was going to do now with his first
losing season. The people have to understand about Russell the
two most passive, aggressive players I know in the NFL,
particularly at the quarterback position, or Aaron Rodgers and Russell Wilson. Okay,
(06:59):
now that's the reality of it. And for Russell to
say I never asked for a trade, well, you're your
Your reb doesn't come out and say Russell never asked
for a trade, But here are the five teams. Yes,
if you're going to deal, I'm here are the teams
we would be interested in. Okay, Hey, Jim. Let me
let me phrase it to you this way real quick,
because as I mentioned, like going to ownership, do you
(07:19):
then go, all right, we're trading Russell Wilson. But here's
our plan for how we want to replace him. And
by the way, is it cool if we bring in
a quarterback from Houston that's tied up in some legal issues. Well, look,
ownership ownership had already signed off on them bringing in
Antonio Brown, you know, a couple of years ago. So
are we gonna say now that all of a sudden
(07:40):
they're gonna draw a line on on Deshaun Watson if
he's available. No, this is an organization. Also, back in
twenty seven, team brought in Colin Kaepernick for an interview
when no one else would touch him, and we're was
willing to sign him if the football conversation had gone
the way that the Seahawks wanted it to go, which
it did not. So to me, that was never an issue.
(08:03):
What I see here now is Pete. I will never
forget the conversation I had with Pete Carroll early on
UM when he was in Seattle, and he told me
this story where he said that when he was in
usc his first year, I believe it was, they went,
they played five hundred football and Carson Palmer won the
Heisman Trophy, right, and he said to me, I never
(08:26):
want to be dependent on a quarterback again. And so
what did that mean? He wanted to be able to
play defense, he wanted to be able to run the ball.
So he gets to Seattle and that's their formula for success.
Earlier in the year with Russell, and the minute Russell
starts opening the offense up and whatnot, what do we
hear from Pete man, I don't recognize this team. I
don't recognize this offense, and they try and scale it back.
(08:49):
So what it appears to me is that John Schnyder
and Pete Carroll, if they do not use these chips
that they got from Denver to go out and get
Deshaun Watson. And there are people in the league who
tell me that that is part of their plan what
they would like to do, even though there's going to
be competition from other clubs. But it says to me,
if that doesn't happen, what they're doing here is saying
(09:10):
we're gonna try and follow that blueprint all over again
and come up with a team that plays great defense
and is able to run the football. The problem with
that is, in my view, Russell Wilson actually played better
than what we're giving him credit for his first few
years in the league when they had that formula and
they had the legion of boom, because you got to
tell me who your quarterback is gonna be if that's
(09:31):
gonna work, and I just don't know who that is.
It's not Drew Lock, right. And then you know, looking
at this, uh, you know now coming off the combine
makes you wonder how teams are feeling about the you know,
the quarterback draft class that we've talked about, you know,
at length here over the last few days, and how
it's just not quite as strong as it's been in
recent years. And then there's this this next huge piece
(09:54):
of the puzzle which we learned today, which is Carson
Wentz now one and done, which I think we all
have expected after the way that Chris Ballard and Frank
Bright talked about it during the week in Indianapolis. On
his way to the Washington Commanders, he and his twenty
eight million dollars in salary essentially for the third round
pick and a conditional third round pick, and the two
(10:14):
teams will swap second round picks. Um James, I'm just curious,
like as you're as you're assessing all of this quarterback
news and seeing the puzzles you know, fit into place here. Uh,
you know, it's a bit more wild than we kind
of thought it was gonna be. It is. I remember
Bruce arians standing up on the podium just last week
at the Combine going like, these these veterans are not
(10:35):
to be trade. Come on, who's training these guys? You know?
And and so it was funny to hear him him
talk about that. And first I want to tackle kind
of this quarterback class because the more you know, questions
I asked around, and and Ba's team is kind of
one of them. The way they feel about Kyle Trask
that they drafted in the second round last year out
of Florida to finished fourth in the Heisman voting, Like
(10:57):
they like him better than anybody else in this class
that's coming out now. So like that's the way they feel.
You go down to Houston and they're probably gonna have
Davis Mills start this entire season from what I'm hearing,
and to me actually makes sense. You you start him,
you get a look at him for a year, and
the picks that are you hoping you're getting from Deshaun
Watson you can use for your quarterback next season in
(11:18):
draft better last season than most people. Really good understand.
And that's my other point, Like I was asking people
like what if Davis Mills would have stayed at Stanford
for another year and come out in this class, Like
where would he have ranked in this quarterbacks if he
would have came out, Because yeah, when he became the starter,
he Houston thinks he played as well as any rookie
(11:38):
that was out there. Now, these rookies had some some
struggles this year, and that happens with rookies. But yeah,
the way these things have fallen, and we'll now go
to Indie. What I had heard was obviously the way
the season ended. We saw Jim r says tarmac press conference,
and uh, the way he felt about what went down.
What Chris Balad was trying to do was let's make
(12:00):
sure and I think this is a smart move in football,
in business, in any aspect, is let's remove emotion from
the decision. And he was trying to drag this thing
on as far from the end of the regular season
as possible so him, Frank Riich and Jim rcay could
look at this thing and take emotion out of the
equation about the way the season ended. And what the
(12:21):
move we just saw now is it looks like with
that even being done, that they didn't think it was coredual.
I'm curious, Jim, is what we saw from Carson Wentz,
who Frank Reich, as we all say, gets more out
of him than anybody, and he goes to twenty seven
touchdowns and seven picks. Is Jimmy Garoppolo that much of
a step above Carson Wentz to make this move because
(12:42):
you would think that would be where they are somewhat heading.
Because if that's not, I'm not sure what their other
options are at the spot. I'll say this to you, um,
I always laugh when people tell me that certain draft
class this week at the quarterback position. It does not
(13:04):
matter how strong or how weak a classes. We know
that teams always go and so when we came in,
when we're coming into this draft and everyone's saying there's
not a top ten guy there, I am almost willing
to bet James Palmer's paycheck that a quarterback will be
drafted and this year, okay, I'm pulling the way. Let
(13:28):
me heck, I might even throw myne in, Jim. Seahawks
could do it now at nine if they wanted to know.
And that's what I'm saying to you. And all it
takes is one and then other teams are like, oh
my god, we gotta get one. And now these quarterbacks
get pushed up the board. And so that's what I'm saying.
What people say to me, it's like a weak draft
in terms of the quarterbacks. It does not matter they
(13:50):
are going to be taken high anyway, because that's just
the nature of the league where everyone is searching for
that quarterback. And that's why I'm going back to the
Seattle situation and makes those system me because even if
allow this works out at Seattle wants, they still don't
have a quarterback. And what every team in this league
is chasing is that franchise guy. And Jim, to my point,
it wasn't that these guys are it's that teams that
(14:13):
we think need quarterbacks value who's already on the roster
pretty highly. In terms of those are two teams where
we're all wondering, like, who are they gonna have his
quarterback like. That's the interesting way it measures up in
the landscape of who's gonna be picking this because somebody
is Jim's right, somebody's gonna pick, and then somebody's gonna
go oh, and then then it's gonna you know, it's
gonna snowball in that sense, and that's why the teams
(14:33):
that have the quarterbacks talent at the top of their
board gets pushed down towards them and then they go, okay, well,
we'll just we'll just snag this guy who we're picking.
You know, we're picking at twenty eight and we had
him at fifteen on our board. But he slides down
to me because people go on a cute quarterback run.
But Herman Wers always said this to me. I'll never
forget it, and I always steal it from him, and
(14:54):
he always says, the best predictor of future behavior is
past behaviors, and when it comes to the NFL Draft,
that is all true. The best predictor of future behavior
is past behavior. So let's watch and see what happens
with these quarterbacks. So everyone is saying it's not a
good class. Let's see how many go in the first
round and how high? Sure? Sure? And now you know
you've got the Washington Commanders who have been looking for
(15:17):
a quarterback seems like the last couple of years since
the Dwayne Haskins experiment did not work after taking him
in the first round, and they seem desperate, right, made
a big move, made a big play reportedly for Russell Wilson,
and I Russell didn't want to go there. Uh, you know,
they've been searching around other places. And then today, you
know this, this Wednesday of this week, they execute a
(15:39):
trade to bring in Carson Wentz and it's got people
all over Twitter wondering is he really that much better
than Taylor Heineke? And you're gonna pay him twenty eight
million this year? And so does that effectively take the
Washington Commanders out of the draft market for a quarterback
at number eleven? I don't know, um, but that's a
lot of money you're paying to the quarterback spot there
(16:00):
for somebody, um who maybe you know, isn't that much
better than somebody already on your roster. But clearly Washington
guys would have to see him as a as a
clear upgrade, right, otherwise you don't you don't make a
move like this. Yeah, completely, And I think I think
Baldi said it on our air. I don't know if
Jim was in that. No, I don't think he was
in that segment, and Bucky was in a different segment.
(16:20):
Everybody was. We had a million people in the show today.
And he said, like when you he's kind of that
guy to where and Jim can say this does have
been around the league forever and not to date you Jim,
just you've covered the league for a while. Every every
coach thinks that they can change a player, every coach
thinks that they can, well it once he gets with me,
I can. And Baldi said it best you look at
(16:43):
the measurables of Carson Wentz and the size and the
arm strength and the athletic ability like that is not
a common group of traits that a lot of people
on this planet have. But then it's the decision making
and all the other things that go with playing the
quarterback spot. When you see those traits as a coach,
you go, well, I can fix the other parts. And
that's why I'm assuming this isn't gonna be the last
(17:04):
we see. If Carson Wentz going to another location and
another team taking a chance because the traits are there,
and everybody's gonna see if they can be the one
to change him. Look at look at what's going on
with Mitchell Drabinsky. It's like all of a sudden, he's
a he's a hot guy. Yeah, I mean how they
couldn't run him out of Chicago fast enough? And now
(17:24):
it's Matt Neege's fault and this and the other. And
I'm not saying that that that Matt Nege isn't isn't
complicit in in the struggles that Tbisky had, But I'm
just saying everybody thinks that they're the ones that can
correct the guy. And I know Dave All had them
up in Buffalo, and now you can. You can bring
him to New York if that's what indeed happens, and
he competes with Daniel Jones. But if Daniel Jones were
to lose that that job to Mitchell, watch the next
(17:47):
thing is there's gonna be a team. Man. We gotta
get Daniel Jones. We think we can fix him. Yeah,
and we go you know my my look, and I'm
not a personnel guy, would never claim to be in
this and the other, but I do believe that that
after three years of seeing a guy for three years
or whatever, he is who he is for the most part.
And Jim, how much does where these players are selected
(18:09):
make that possible to keep coming back? If Mitchell Trobinski
was a fourth round pick, this wouldn't be happening over
and over again. Like you said in the same thing
with with Wentz and the same thing with Daniel Jones.
You look at the talent that you see just an
athletic ability, you look at where they're picked, and then
they keache and coming back exactly over and over and
over again. I was gonna make how much time do
(18:31):
we have? I I didn't want to Oh, okay, I
want to drop a couple. I didn't know if we
left the whole Russell will still please give me more?
And I had a couple of nunets that I thought
were pretty interesting. Um one, this is something that George Payton,
I found this out today, has been working on for
maybe months. And that doesn't mean he was talking to
(18:54):
Seattle for months, But that was him putting things together
and on his side of things four months and then
the last several weeks going back to the Senior Bowl,
he started having conversations with John Schneider, and that's when
they started to start having these deeper conversations with one another.
And then the combine those really kind of heated up.
And I thought it was interesting. They're having all these
(19:15):
closed door meetings and nobody in the building knows, Like
coaches on the staff I'm talking to don't know, And
so few people in the building knew what George Peyton
was up to. And he did it that way on purpose,
and it was a very tight circle because a he
didn't want the trade to be squandered in any sort
of capacity to where something gets out and somebody gets
out early, and both sides, both teams did a pretty
(19:36):
good job in this social media world of keeping this
thing pretty tight lipped for as long as they did.
And then the other part that I found really interesting
is they weren't the only ones doing a ton of work.
Russell Wilson did a boatload of work on the Denver
broncos I'm told on his own and and I think,
isn't it Russell loves Seattle. He's all He's gonna stay
(20:01):
in Seattle. Go Hawks, Come on? Does he say? Does
he say? Go? I can go let's go Donkeys go.
I think it's gonna because I would assume it would be,
but yeah, go Orange. I'm not sure. But it was
funny because when he I was told when he and
Sierra and they came into the building yesterday and they
(20:22):
he took his physical and went around the building, talked
to people, met with people. There were people in the
building going like, wow, he knows a lot about us,
Like he knows so like even like like you know
guys that are not even at the top of the
front office, like middle tier guys, like he knew who
they were, and like so like they're okay. Russ did
do a lot of work and I know he talked
to a lot of people about this process because I
(20:44):
do think and this is a discussion I think, Jim
and I'd like your take, Like everybody is wondering, like
why would you go to this division? Why would you
head to this division? But he put a lot of
work in. He likes the roster um. He's not going
into it blindly, I guess, is my point. No, the
Broncos have a lot of talent. And here's the thing
about Russell and and Denver fans that they don't know
(21:06):
what they'll learn it. Russell is one of the more
fascinating personalities to me in the NFL, and there is
a very distinct line between many who believe he's genuine
and those who believe he is in authentic. Okay, but
I do know this about Russell. He wants to be
viewed as one of the all time grades. I mean,
(21:28):
and he believes already that he is. Whether you believe
it or not, or I believe it or not, he
believes he is. And so when that conversation comes up
about who's the all time grades, he knows that he
needs Pelts on the wall. And therefore he can look
at Seattle and say, We're not gonna win Pelts here,
And if I'm going to be in that conversation, I
(21:49):
gotta go someplace where I feel I can win him.
Denver has got a lot of talent, you know, and
he wants to throw the ball down the field. Nathaniel
Hacketts already said that's one of the priorities for this offense,
is that they're going to push the ball down the field.
So let rust Cook. Now, whatever happens, we'll see. I
don't know, but I do know he has driven and
(22:13):
motivated to have people speak about him in the way
they speak about Tom Brady and Peyton Manning and these others,
that he is one of the all time grades and
we've been saying it for years. And the Denver Broncos
have one of the best young offensive skill sets out there,
just not the guy that leads them. Oh and by
the way, only two teams in the NFL gave up
(22:34):
fewer points per game than this. James. Is Vaughan really
lobbying to come back, By the way, from what I've
heard over the last you know, day and a half,
Vaughan had a pretty good idea this was going down
clearly there. Clearly. I think we all know that players
talk and things get around players circles pretty pretty easily.
(22:55):
I do know they're gonna go hard at the pass
rushing spot. And I will say this, Um, I know
they traded him. It probably went as amicable as trading
face of your franchise could have gone. Through the conversations
that that George Payton and Joe Ellis and John Elway
all had with von Miller heading out the door, Um
were could not have gone better. And they wouldn't have
(23:16):
traded him if it wasn't too a situation like he
landed in in l A. So I wouldn't rule it out.
I don't think it's likely, but I wouldn't. I wouldn't
rule it out. And and the other point to Jim's
point is if you want those pelts on the wall,
I just thought of it now, And that makes such
a great point, Like if you go and dominate this division,
like that's what salts on the wall, like, you come
out of that division repeatedly and you make things happen.
(23:38):
That's that that that actually even proves a point even
further open by the way you just put one on
the wall with the L. A. Rams and you know
going back there might give you another shot to do
the same. So I did find it interesting that a
guy who was just on the Super Bowl champion L A.
Rams um, you know, kind of advocating to come back
to a place uma. He knew what was gonna there.
You go, Okay, So I'm gonna steal your Herm Edwards
(24:01):
quote again, Jim, because if you say past behavior is
the best predictor of future behavior, then the packers should
be feeling good about what's coming with Aaron Rodgers, get
into that when we come back. All right, back here
(24:30):
with the NFL Inside Report, We've got Jim Trotter and
James Palmer with us on a wild week of NFL news.
We've discussed a couple of the quarterback trades. Carson Wentz
to the Commanders, Russell Wilson now to the Broncos, and
that Russell Wilson news kind of stealing the shine of
Aaron Rodgers essentially announcing that he is coming back to
the Green Bay Packers, announcing because he told Pat McAfee. Um,
(24:52):
and so we we then knew that that was that
was going to happen. There's some ambiguity. It sounds like
guys on the exact contract numbers, but the ones that
Ian Rappaport has put out there would make Aaron Rodgers
the highest paid player in NFL history based on average
salary per year, which has been reported at fifty mill
(25:12):
gym um. It seemed like the writing was on the wall,
like for the last couple of months and weeks especially
that Aaron was going to make his way back to
Green Bay. Uh? Is this how it all should have
worked out? Yeah? I mean, look, I'm a traditionalist. I
like to see players stay or I like to see
Hall of Fame caliber players stay with one franchise if possible.
(25:33):
I understand that that's polly Anish and that's not the
NFL today, but for me personally, I love to see that.
I love to see guys like you know, Larry Fitzgerald
stay with one team or to see even read you'll
you'll appreciate this that I'm including Eli Manning and you
know that's sort of thing. So um, but yeah, you know,
(25:54):
but one thing I want to say about these salaries, like,
it's funny if the Aaron Rodger numbers are accurate and
they have no reason to believe that they're not. Um
and everyone's like fifty million a year. Wow, Well, if
what I heard on the weekend is true, we're all
gonna be laughing about that deal and how Aaron Rodgers
is underpaid in a couple of years because they have
One agent tell me that a private call with the
(26:15):
union recently that the union expressed that the expectation is
the salary capital increase by next year and then by
another twenty percent the year after that. So we're talking
about a potentially increase two years down the road. When
we talk about Aaron's fifty million a year, We're gonna
think that that's a great deal when we start thinking
(26:35):
about the Justin Herbert's and and the Joey Burrows and
these guys who are gonna be coming down the pike. So,
I don't know, it's always it's fascinating people when people
want to make a big deal out of these salaries.
Look the many you sign one, you know that somebody's
coming down the pike to replace you as the highest paid.
It's the way the NFL operates. So good for Aaron
(26:58):
Rodgers and good for them R. Jackson when he gets
his for waiting and holding out to this point, because
now his his value went up even more with this deal.
A Jim, is it a fail if the Packers don't
get another Lombardi in this contract extension window of Aaron Rodgers?
I think it's a fail right now period. I mean,
when you have a quarterback of that caliber and you
have only one championship, you know during his time there, um,
(27:23):
I think that a lot of good years were wasted
when the when the Packers would not go into free
agency and supplement that roster. Um. So yeah, I do
believe that Aaron Rodgers should have more championships, and I
found the whole discussion. I know I'm dominating here, but
I found the whole discussion about he was overrated because
he only had one championship and he didn't come up
(27:43):
big in that playoff loss to San Francisco. I think
back to some of those playoff games where they lost,
where they put up over forty points and they lose.
How is that on Aaron Rodgers? The best playoff games
I've ever seen against the Cardinals twice and they end
up lose in those games. So I don't put all
that necessarily on Aaron, but organizationally, I do believe it's
(28:06):
to fail if they don't get another championship while he's there. James,
let me let me put it to you this way.
How do we view the Jordan Love trade and selection
do we view it as well? It helped Aaron Rodgers
get two straight MVPs, you know, inspired him enough to
do that, or it wasted another opportunity to try and
help support it. That's the first part that I always
(28:26):
go to, that it was an opportunity to help find
someone to aid and what Jim saying, you know, the
lack of action and free agency in any chance to
build a roster around a player that doesn't come around
very often is somewhat of a waste. But at the
same time, I don't hate the pick when I still
look back at it, because you didn't know Aaron was
(28:47):
going to do this. We didn't know that these last
two years he would play the best football of his career. Like,
It's not like he's falling off in any capacity. He's
getting better, which is wild to say. So I go
back and look at how many picks in the back
end of the first round do not pan out, uh
and and you couldn't. I wouldn't say that's a waste
(29:07):
of a pick. You gave it a shot. But at
the same time, not every first round pick becomes, uh,
you know, even a starter exactly. And so to me,
the plan would be what we whipped on it and
just openly admit it and say we're gonna extend Aaron
and we're gonna keep him as our quarterback. We miscalculated this,
(29:27):
you know. That was the issue that I always had
from the jump of just tell Jordan's love and tell
everybody we whipped on it. Instead of dangling this with
Aaron Rodgers and saying like we when you we may
move on at some point, we just say we we
blew the pick, and Aaron, you're playing great. Yeah, But
you know, personal people don't like to do that because
the answer and this is why, this is why I
(29:50):
love um Less Sneed When I said to him about
the fact when you look at how heat team builds
in terms of going out and making trades to bring
improving players and then admitting their mistake with guys, whether
it's Jared Goff or Brandon Cook or whoever, you go
down the line, and I'll never forget less, Sneet said
to me. He goes, ego is the enemy, which I
know is the title of a book that he has read.
(30:11):
And and it's true. Too many of these personnel people
allow their ego to get in the way of saying,
you know what, we tried, it didn't work, you know exactly,
and there's nothing wrong with saying we were wrong. Right
And by the way, like the next six picks in
(30:33):
the first round after they took Jordan's love that, I mean,
like there's some decent players in there, but they're not
exactly light in the world on fire However, T Higgins
Michael Pittman Jr. Taking at the top of the second
round Have been pretty darn good, so that that's certainly interesting.
Now here's the other piece of this, Jim that I
find really interesting is that Davante Adams has now been
officially franchise tagged. I know they want to get a
long term deal done there. I don't know how close
(30:55):
they are, but like, what part of the Aaron Rodgers
discussion was like he's either playing or I'm not, and
so like they've had to have come to some understanding there, right. Well,
I think all along we knew the Packers were going
to franchise him. So whether Aaron was there or not,
Davante Adams was going to be franchise tagged. So I
(31:15):
don't think that was part of the equation at all.
What's gonna be fascinating for me now is now that
Aaron is there, now that you have restructured his contract,
will you take care of Davante now and get that
multi year deal done, because that sends a message to
the locker room as well as what are you all about?
You know, Aaron made this this big deal about you know,
(31:37):
loyalty is too strong a word, but sort of the
culture you want to create. Um, in terms of how
you treat your franchise players. Well, Davante Adams has done
everything right and he's one of the best in the league,
and so he deserves to get paid. Are the Packers
going to pay him on a multi year deal? That's
the key question for me, And I think if I
don't want to say if they're smart, because they're obviously
(31:58):
not dumb people, but but in terms of culture building,
I think it would be wise for them to get
a multi year done with him. Yep, agreed. That's some
great insight there, Jim on with the Packers are dealing
with here so now like they but they James, like,
they've got other pieces to deal with. I mean, they
got JR. Alexander, who I know Ian Rapport has been
(32:20):
talking about as you know, they've kind of restarted some
some contract talks there. Uh, Deveandre Campbell was a really
good player for them last year. You gotta figure out
what's going on with to Darius Smith, um, you know,
who's making a pretty decent number now and and you
know hasn't played very much in the last two years.
I mean, was huge for them last exactly, and he
I think tweeted out recently just want to get what
(32:42):
I'm worth something like that, right. No, I think he
also tweeted out like there's no more money in Green Bay.
Did he say like I think he means not in
the organization. I think he means in the time, right,
and that and that does lead you to I mean,
I was trying to before we went on the area yesterday.
I was trying to watch Pat McAfee for long as
I possibly could. It's an hour before our show starts
(33:02):
that he's on, and it was hilarious that he kept saying,
my source, my sore thing. Aaron told me. Okay, Aaron.
Aaron told me he couldn't keep it going. But it
was interesting to hear him repeatedly say, and I'm with Jim,
I have no reason not to believe Ian's numbers that
he repeatedly kept saying that Aaron is telling me that
these are not the numbers. I haven't agreed to anything,
(33:23):
and this is solely my opinion. That is, I believe
the concern with with Aaron Rodgers part of the perception
of I only came back because of this massive amount
of dollars that have been put there. But if you
look at what Jim is talking about with the percentage
increases that could be going on within the salary cap,
and this is structured properly, you can pay him this
(33:46):
and you can still sign and make these other moves
and make these other plays with and within the roster.
And I think the way we're trying to describe this
and all of us having an understanding of how it
works is a little bit greater than Joe Fan not
to speak above them, to understand Aaronadger is gonna get
this money and how are we gonna get all these
guys back? And I don't think he wants that perception
(34:07):
out there that I came back for the money. If
if those numbers are right what Jim saying, and I
agree that, like, you can slide this money however you'd like,
and there's much more room as as we go and
they can make these other plays. I just think no Brady,
no Drew Brees, like, no Russell Wilson, like. I think
he has more pressure on him than any other quarterback
(34:28):
in football in two season. All right, So Davante Adams
got the tag. Mike Williams gets the big contract extension
from the Chargers three for sixty million, forty million guaranteed,
keeping a big piece of their core in place there
in that wild wild a f C West. Now, some
other players who were tagged at the deadline, Chris Godwin
with the Bucks, Cam Robinson an interesting one with the
(34:50):
Jacksonville Jaguars could change what they do at number one overall,
Dalton Schultz tagged as a tight end for the Dallas Cowboys,
Orlando Brown after his first year as a left tackle,
and Casey also tagged David Njoku with the Cleveland Browns.
Another tight end getting tagged as was Mike Kisiki down
in Miami. But a really interesting one. Here's Jesse Bates
coming off the a f C champion Cincinnati Bengal squad.
(35:12):
Here the safety for since he who has been such
a huge piece of their turnaround, especially on the defensive
side of the ball with Joe Burrow kind of leading
the way offensively, James, what do you kind of make
of of Jesse's where he's at right now considering what
this franchise has done in its history. Yeah, you can
look at this red from two sides, and the first
one I'll say, is there's the argument to be made
(35:33):
Jesse Bates is the best safety in football. I mean,
if you if you go out and try to make
that argument, and David Moving at his his representation, is
going to go out and do that. He's represented a
lot of safeties, and with those safeties he's represented, he's
reset the market multiple times, and he is going to
try to do that again with Jesse Bates's contract, And
that would not be out of the question that if
there's the argument he's the best safety and football, Like
(35:55):
we got done talking with Jim Trotter, the contracts always
go up. If he's the next up, he should probably
reset the market. Remember they tried to get a deal
done for about the last year really and he made
it known that he was upset he didn't get a
contract extension. He showed up for everything. He showed up
for voluntary workouts last offseason, he was there for every
day of training camp. I don't want to speak for Jesse.
(36:16):
I talked to him a lot, and I think he's
a wonderful person. I don't know if he'll be that
kind this time around. If an extension doesn't come around
the point I'm making is he might be the most
valuable person to this team outside of Joe Burrow, from
a leadership standpoint, from a player standpoint, from a performance standpoint. Exactly,
look at everything I'm gonna add of everything about him,
(36:38):
and then tell me how this could impact the culture
of the locker room. When he was brought in and
drafted in the second round, I believe i'd a wake
for us and he comes in before the turnaround happens
that they are now a legit Super Bowl contender for
the next several years with Joe Burrow as their quarterback.
He was part of the rebuild on the defensive side
of the ball. He is the guy who is the
captain of their entire defense. There are three players since
(36:59):
two thousand night I believe nineteen with four hundred tackles
and thirty passes defense. It's Darius Leonard, uh Jesse Bates,
and I'm trying to think who the throw is. Another linebacker.
One of the best linebacker pool might be Fred warner Man.
I don't can't remember, but the point is he's doing
things that very few safeties can do. No if you
if you don't give him a contract extension and he
(37:21):
plays in this franchise tag, and you look at the
previous seven franchise tags they have dished out since two thousand,
none of those players have received contract extensions. What does
that tell Joe Burrow specifically and the other players how
business is going to be done moving forward? Because I
think we do know how Cincinnati has financially done business
(37:41):
over the course of the last many years, right, whether
it's from the coaching standpoint, whether it's from the player's standpoint.
Oh yeah, and from the coaching standpoint, Rehett, we gave
the head coach a contract extension mere days after the
loss of the Super Bowl. So when are one of
our best players is looking for a new contract and
that doesn't potentially happen. I'm curious. There are people in
(38:01):
the league that think is we don't know this yet
and we'll see what it is. There are people in
the league that think Joe Burrow will not finish his
career in Cincinnati, and this is one of the main reasons.
Mike Droump, I mean, look, history, We've been talking about it, right,
the best predictor of future behaviors, past behavior, Yeah, I mean,
look until until it's not right, until the history changes
(38:24):
and their trends changed. Then it's something we have to
continue to look at. And it might be slightly telling
about how they go to fix this offensive line. If
they go and get some maybe older veterans. I mean,
they weren't interested in Joe Tuney last year because it
was too expensive, and they don't look at guys in
their late twenties early thirties. They look for specific things.
If they go and say, listen, we can win right now.
I don't care how old this guy is. He'll help
(38:45):
us on the offensive line. Maybe that's an indication that, Okay,
we're thinking a little bit differently than we have in
years past because of Joe Burrow, because of where we are.
But we're not there yet. So this is a wonderful
question to have. And I think Jesse Bates is going
to be the big part of it, and and it's
gonna be really interesting to watch throughout the off season
because you know who else is watching the rest of
the locker room, and that's gonna be the interesting part
(39:06):
about it. James Palmer, Jim Trotter, fantastic insight all episode
long here for us on NFL and Side Report. JP
always appreciate your time, but no problem o H And
that's gonna do it for this episode of NFL Inside Report.
(39:29):
Always love having Chip Trotter James Palmer aboard here for
us previewing this and really recapping this wild week of
news in the NFL. What will come next week when
we kick off NFL Free Agency Frenzy over on NFL Network.
We'll have a brand new episode lined up for you
next week. Can't wait to share all that happens on
the free agency world with you guys. Reminder to download,
(39:49):
rate review our show on the I Heart Radio app,
on Apple podcast wherever you get your pods. We certainly
appreciate it, and for our producers Thomas Warren and Tim Prodca,
I'm your host, Rrett Lewis. We'll ket you next time.
NFL Inside Report is the production of the NFL and
partnership with I Heart Radio. For more official podcasts from
the NFL, visit the I Heart Radio app, Apple Podcasts,
(40:11):
or wherever you get your podcasts.
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