NFL Network Insiders Tom Pelissero and Ian Rapoport are joined by Sara Walsh to recap the Vikings beating the Browns in London and look ahead to the Broncos and Jets playing in London in Week 6. Steve Wyche joins the show to try and understand how the Cardinals lost to the Titans, what is wrong with the Raiders, and give you an answer to the Bengals QB problem.
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Episode Transcript
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Speaker 1 (00:01):
Welcome back to the Insiders, Tom Pillicero, Ian Rappaport, joined
right now by our friend Sarah Waltz in London, one
game into her three game personal International series. Sarah, Yeah,
this is pretty late your time, so we appreciate you
taking a time and portion of your evening to its.
Speaker 2 (00:24):
Prime, prime dinner time.
Speaker 1 (00:25):
Ian would be about four beers deep at a pub somewhere,
so we appreciate you having What do you mean she.
Speaker 2 (00:30):
Could hold on us?
Speaker 3 (00:32):
Said anything else? She could be drunk right now.
Speaker 2 (00:35):
No, she sounds She said, sure, this would.
Speaker 4 (00:37):
Be a lot better if I was Ian. I'll tell
you that.
Speaker 2 (00:39):
That's a good That is also a valid point.
Speaker 1 (00:41):
If you're picking up right here and you didn't hear
part one of the podcasts, you can go there or
stick it out with this one. We talk about separate
topics in each one every single Monday.
Speaker 2 (00:49):
We appreciate you finding us.
Speaker 1 (00:51):
However you did, Sarah. Let's get right into that game yesterday.
It was obviously a big moment for the Browns, starting
a new quarterback and Dylan Gabriel, who we saw some
things from. It also felt like a really critical game
for the Vikings, a zero to two stretch internationally would
have hurt. They had so many different injuries. They got
a backup quarterback, they got all these backup offensive linemen.
(01:12):
Even though it wasn't really pretty yesterday, walking off that field,
it seemed like, Okay, maybe this is kind of a
galvanized force as Minnesota moves forward. Yeah.
Speaker 5 (01:20):
I was thinking about it today too, when these guys
always talk about it's a game of inches, and I
think mentally, it's a game of inches, and where this
team would have been to your point flying back yesterday,
and Kevin O'Connell, even before that game kicked and we
talked to him, was talking about, look, our goal was
to come out here to Dublin, to London and to
(01:41):
go home with two more wins. And he's like, and
one is that's not possible, So we have to at
least get one.
Speaker 4 (01:46):
And that game's tiken down.
Speaker 5 (01:47):
And it really felt like Dylan Gabriel and the Browns
were in control of most of that one until the
very end. I mean, the Vikings were in it the
entire time, but the Browns were controlling the clock. There
were just it seemed like they were struggling more on
the Viking side, and so the fact that that slipped
away for Dylan Gabriel and the Browns justin Jefferson. They
(02:08):
needed the big play, they got it from him. Jordan
Addison stepped up. But it really could have been very
different for Minnesota if Addison doesn't come up with those
really three crucial catches at the end in the game
winning touchdown, and then I think it's a much different
scenario in Minnesota today. I think there would have been
a little bit of panic. I think there would have
been frustration. Tom, you know more than anybody living there.
(02:30):
It felt like it could have been heading that direction.
The O line situation is really difficult for them. And
I say this to people all the time because you guys,
I know you guys were talking about the Bucks today
and they have had a tremendous amount a turnover on
that offensive line, signing practice squad players, signing practice squad
guys from other teams, practice squads, and they have managed
(02:52):
to somehow piece this thing together well Over in Minnesota,
it was back up to the backup to the backup.
O'Connell said, it's like twelve thirteen combinations in now and
it showed.
Speaker 4 (03:02):
I mean, Carson Wentz was under pressure at all times.
Speaker 6 (03:04):
No.
Speaker 5 (03:05):
Granted he was going against the number one defense in
the league in Cleveland, but I mean there was just
such little time for him to do anything, and I
think it could be real tenuous if they don't, if
they're not able to figure that out. I do think
obviously they're going to go to a bye week now
and hopefully get some of those guys back.
Speaker 4 (03:21):
Ryan Kelly is out now.
Speaker 5 (03:23):
O'Neil, like the buy could certainly help that situation, but
that O line, I mean, the inexperience. There were penalties,
and it was by guys you would expect maybe would
have those penalties. So I think they did the best
they could do, but I think that's really hurting them
right now.
Speaker 6 (03:40):
Sarah, So, I have some thoughts on the Vikings and Browns,
but what I kind of want to do instead?
Speaker 3 (03:45):
Can you tell us like what's going on over there?
Speaker 6 (03:47):
Because like Tom and I have obviously never been and
it seems really fun. You got three weeks there, you're
going to be give us like the breakdown, like like
what do you doing in your time?
Speaker 3 (04:01):
Are you seeing anything fun?
Speaker 6 (04:03):
What have the teams been, Like what's the atmosphere for
like practice and whatever else been like give us a
little flavor of what's going on over there and what's
your schedule is like for the next three weeks.
Speaker 4 (04:13):
It's really different. So it's been sort of NonStop.
Speaker 5 (04:16):
Honestly, people think you're over here on vacation, like partying
it up, and there are some people in different roles
maybe that are. I have not been able to do that,
and part of that is because the way that they
practice here in London. For example, the vikings are really
far outside of London, so it was different definitely. I've
(04:38):
done the Munich Games, I've done Frankfort games. They're so
far outside. So if for the experience for the teams
as well, I mean it's a hall for them to
get into London where there's that sort of atmosphere. They
were practicing in the like the most picturesque if envision
like the holiday with Cameron Diaz back in the day
and it's this like picturesque countryside and the cottages like
(04:58):
they are staying in this or they were staying in
this picturesque area. They literally carved a football field into
the side of these like rolling hills in between a
golf course. So if you're looking for if you're looking
to like sip some tea and be in this like bucolic,
like that's that's their scene. Like they're not necessarily they're
not on double decker buses running around town. I think
they try to give them some free time for those guys.
(05:21):
Those guys were in a different situation because they were
coming from Dublin, so they were already tired and I
think they were definitely ready to get home after that.
And then there's and I know you guys talked about
this too, there's the different takes of do you come
in early, do you come in late? When these teams
come in late, when they come in closer to game time,
and especially depending on where they're staying and they stay
outside of London.
Speaker 4 (05:39):
There's not a lot of time.
Speaker 5 (05:40):
So so basically most of my time has been like
shuttling in and out of cars and getting out because
it's just and the traffic here isn't isn't the best,
so they are not in like the hub of activity.
I am staying in the hub of activity, So I mean,
I get some of that feel, but it's a lot
of like car riding out to the stadium and h
and at least I can speak for the Vikings facility.
(06:01):
It was this beautiful, beautiful countryside, a state type of
fear and I know, like a lot of guys golf
because there was a gulf like right there at the facility,
and I just unbelievably beautiful. It looks like something out
of like I said, a movie. I think Camerondy is holiday.
That's where they're at.
Speaker 1 (06:19):
That's where I saw Sean Payton say something along the
lines as he was asked about like plans and London's like,
have you've seen where we're staying?
Speaker 2 (06:25):
The middle of nowhere?
Speaker 1 (06:26):
And that is part of it, you know, that's the
reality of it is you kind of can isolate yourself away,
you know. But it's also interesting you talk about the
teams arriving at different times, the fact that the Broncos
essentially flew overnight after their game against the Eagles just
like we're on to the next thing and went the
Jets fly later tonight. They're going to be there the
(06:46):
entire week as well. We heard Aaron Rodgers a couple
weeks ago say, well, I wish we came in a
little early. It didn't end up hurting the Steelers. They
got to win over the Vikings. But clearly both these teams,
the Broncos and the Jets, in a game they'll face
off on and I found that nine am Eastern time,
you can get up really early and watch me Ian
Sarah Walsh cast one thousands on the pregame show as well.
(07:08):
But it does say something about, you know, just kind
of the the the way the teams are perhaps implementing
sports science and other things like, hey, we need to
give guys a little different clock as they as they
go overseas here and this will just give me as
we take a quick peek ahead at this game. Sarah,
and I know you're coming right off of the Vikings
Browns game, but you got Broncos and Jets, two teams.
(07:31):
I mean, the Jets played a game last year in
London and fired everybody essentially as soon as they got home.
I don't anticipate it's going to be the same thing.
But finally to owen six with a team with expectations
there certainly would seem to be a lot on the
line for them, as well as a Broncos team right now.
There's no reason to sit there and think, hey, they
can't make a run at winning the AFC West.
Speaker 5 (07:51):
You know what's so funny is I'm over here and
it's like one game at a time and I just
got to get through the week. But you better believe
that when I'm looking at the next two teams coming
over here, I want them to come over here in
a good mood.
Speaker 4 (08:01):
Right, So I was hoping for I needed both of.
Speaker 5 (08:03):
Them to win, just for my own selfish purposes because
we've got to talk to these guys this week. Yeah,
so I would have liked to have seen the Jets
get their first win, just because selfishly, I want it
to be easier. I will say this though, I have
seen teams in the International Games, and Germany is one
of them come over that, you know, because these are
set so long ago that are not having good seasons.
(08:25):
And if you are mired in that situation and you
need a spark and you need something to just look different,
this will give you that. And I talked about this
before I got over here. It doesn't matter the record.
These stadiums and these International Games are completely filled. So
the Jets can come over here winless. They can be
zero to five. They are going to step into a
(08:47):
stadium on Sunday, that is going to feel super Bowl
like it has that big of a feeling. Every seat
is filled, and I have seen it. I'm not saying
that they are going to turn around and run to
the super Bowl, but I have seen it provide a
day distraction in a way of like new environment. We're
not going into the same facility coming off of this loss,
(09:07):
you know what I mean. Like sometimes I do think
like eventually I think there's a breakup. And I will
give you another example, like we had the Panthers last
year wasn't going well. It ended with me interviewing Bryce
on the field and again the joy they feel. It
doesn't change. I know it doesn't count as extra wins
in the win column, but there is something about a
(09:27):
reset coming over here and leaving the country and sort
of you're not picking up maybe the New York papers
that you would be seeing getting hammered every day.
Speaker 4 (09:35):
I'm not saying that that gets.
Speaker 5 (09:37):
Them a win on Sunday, but I'm saying that I
do think if you are a team that comes over
in that position, I have never seen a team that's
come over in a position where things aren't going well,
sort of like mope and drag and be like, I
can't believe. It's like you're just in such a vastly
different place and environment. It's almost like wipes the slate clean.
At least it sort of suspends reality, I think, at
(09:59):
least for little bit, being over here, and it will
not feel it will not feel that way on Sunday
for them, And maybe maybe that does something for this team, right,
maybe that provides something, even if it's like a mental
edge of a help, and maybe it doesn't change anything
at all. But I've seen it happen, and I've seen
at least teams feel differently when they're over here.
Speaker 3 (10:20):
Yeah, that's so interesting.
Speaker 6 (10:21):
You can sort of like talk yourself into I think
it'll be a good game anyway, but you can sort
of talk yourself into it where it's like the Jets,
I can tend are way better.
Speaker 3 (10:29):
Than the record.
Speaker 6 (10:29):
I'm sure everyone disagrees, but watch them play in and
play out.
Speaker 3 (10:32):
They don't look to me like a bad team. They
look to me like a team that's pretty close.
Speaker 6 (10:36):
They kind of feel like those like that Dan Campbell
one in seventeen from like when was that time three
years ago?
Speaker 3 (10:42):
Or four years ago?
Speaker 2 (10:43):
Four years ago? Four years ago?
Speaker 3 (10:45):
But who maybe I'm who knows, Maybe I'm crazy.
Speaker 6 (10:49):
One thing I would say is this game is going
to be so meaningful to Woody Johnson, who obviously spent
a lot of time there a lot obviously was the
ambassador and last year, you know, you do wonder some
of the reaction about Sola was because they lost and
played horrible in London.
Speaker 2 (11:07):
I don't think it's going to with his buddies and
all that stuff.
Speaker 6 (11:09):
I mean a lot of the whole thing, the whole thing,
but like, this is a very meaningful game to him,
and so if the Jets were away, it would probably
be very good for a lot of people there, sir.
Speaker 5 (11:20):
And you guys, I know, you guys were talking about
how good the Bucks are, and they are really good,
and they are. They're sort of the epitome, I think
right now of a team that has had sort of
every injury thrown at them and not flinched at all.
Speaker 4 (11:31):
But this is a Jets.
Speaker 5 (11:32):
Team that had him, like, had him on the ropes,
had him was going to beat him in Tampa.
Speaker 4 (11:37):
And that's not a fluke like Tampa's not a fluke team.
Speaker 5 (11:40):
They're really good and so and the Jets were right
there you know, a couple of weeks ago like that
looked at one point that that was going to be
number one and it didn't work out for them.
Speaker 4 (11:50):
And the Bucks are on the.
Speaker 5 (11:51):
Opposite end of that where they had a lot of
close games and it didn't work out for them last
year and they flipped the script on that. So you
never know, man, Maybe maybe it's some London magic for
the Jets.
Speaker 1 (12:00):
Sarah, tremendous stuff. Enjoy the remaining couple of weeks. Hopefully
you can come back and do this again. This has
been a ton of fun.
Speaker 4 (12:08):
Thank you guys.
Speaker 5 (12:09):
Look, no pub time, but Ian, I'm sure we could
carve some out if you want to get over here.
We got plenty. The teams are just getting here. There's
plenty of time. Hop on the plane, get.
Speaker 4 (12:18):
On over here.
Speaker 6 (12:19):
I will talk to the bosses and they will decline
as per usual.
Speaker 3 (12:23):
Thank you, Sarah, or from the insiders.
Speaker 1 (12:25):
After this, we had a ton of big comebacks around
the NFL on Sunday as welcome Steve Weitz back to
(12:47):
the conversation as well.
Speaker 2 (12:49):
I don't know that there was a nut of your game.
Speaker 1 (12:50):
I don't know that I've seen many nute of your
games than the one in Arizona, Omah. You have a
touchdown for a minute till they reviewed it Murray Demarcado.
That would make it twenty eight to six. The Cardinals
not only win this game, they are blowing out a
winless Titans team. They're right back in the thick of
(13:11):
it in the NFC West after two last second losses
on field goals, and.
Speaker 3 (13:17):
Instead you have it. They keep watching that.
Speaker 1 (13:19):
It's because it is baffling ian, because it is just
I understand. There are physics to this, the way that
the brain feels it's in a different place than the
body based upon velocity. You can read all sorts of papers,
I'm sure by people smarter than me about why someone
would think they're in the end zone when they're not.
There's two ways to look at this. Because you also
(13:40):
had the interception fumble play, which still watching it five times,
it's hard. It's hard to see how that's an interception,
but it was called that on the field. That's how
they stood with it, and back come the Titans. They
take advantage of it.
Speaker 7 (13:55):
Here.
Speaker 2 (13:56):
There's two different ways to look at this.
Speaker 1 (13:58):
You have a Cardinals team that this is I mean,
this is brutal This is as bad of.
Speaker 2 (14:01):
A gut punch as you're ever going to have.
Speaker 1 (14:04):
I'm going to choose to look at this as the
upside for the Titans, Steve, because what we got to
see and again, in a game where in a season
where the Titans have not gotten any bounces, okay, in
a season where nothing's gone their way, sometimes you need
a little bit of luck. And there's a couple of
things you see from the Titans down the stretch in
that game. One on the fumble play that we saw
(14:26):
over and over, it's the fact of the Jerius Sneaed,
one of your highest paid players is hustling seventy yards
down the field to stay with that play, trying to
make a play. If you want to sit there and go, oh,
they've quit on Brian Callahan, they don't care a play
like that with a guy who doesn't need this, that
shows you that's not true. And two cam Warden, the
(14:47):
second half of that game was balie. He played bad
the week before and the shutout lost to Houston. The
numbers weren't great in the first half, but when they
needed plays, Steve, this dude stepped up. None bigger than
the throw of cut Lvin Ridley that sets up the
winning field goal. I've been impressed just with the overall
aura of cam War beyond how he has played. They
(15:08):
needed this, cam Ward needed this, and it was as
much as again I feel for everybody in Arizona. It
was cool to see the Titans like, hey, we got
a couple of bounces go away and we're not gonna
waste it this time.
Speaker 8 (15:19):
And I like that approach Tom because they didn't need it,
right they.
Speaker 7 (15:23):
We've seen flashes of positive things from that.
Speaker 8 (15:25):
The team's not the roster's not very good, right, They're
just not a really well put together team yet. They
they're a year away from being a year away in
terms of talent. But you can see they're trying to
establish some things and so the ball did bounce their way.
You need those from.
Speaker 7 (15:39):
Time to time.
Speaker 8 (15:41):
I'm putting all this on Arizona because if my guy
doesn't fumble that ball in the end zone, they're up what.
Speaker 7 (15:48):
Three scores, that's including a two point conversions.
Speaker 2 (15:51):
It's a twenty eight six game. I mean it is over.
Speaker 7 (15:54):
Okay.
Speaker 8 (15:54):
So when you're at the combine, when your coach to
do the forty, what do you do?
Speaker 7 (15:58):
You run? Through the four.
Speaker 8 (16:01):
Right when you're doing everything at every level, you run
through the finish line. This is the second week in
a row we've seen this foolishness. I mean, call me
old school whatever. I've got no time for this. I
have no time that you just cost. See people feel
bad for him. There are fifty two other dudes on
that team who put food on their table by guys
(16:22):
individual performances. And you drop a pass, that's one thing.
You throw an interception that's another thing. That stuff is inexcusable.
And again you have to answer to those coaches and
everybody else whose seat might be getting a little warm,
or whose positions might be getting a little warm because
you made a mistake like that. And that is just
something that he'll learn from mitlet's hope. But in a
(16:42):
game like that, when you should win over a team
that's got nothing to play for right now, that just
can't happen.
Speaker 3 (16:49):
Yeah, and just real quick, because I know we got
to get some other stuff.
Speaker 6 (16:51):
But I think you are right, Steve, to draw a
distinction between dropping a pass, tripping and falling to like
something you can control, which is running through the rep,
which is essentially what that is. Now, I do feel
horrible for him, And you know, I saw the satellite
interaction between him and Jonathan Gannett, and I just hate
(17:11):
to see someone yell at someone who just made a
horrible mistake. I don't I'm sure he feels horrible enough,
but you're right. I mean, that is something that is
avoidable by just completing the rep, which is something over
and over they all go through.
Speaker 1 (17:26):
The thing I keep thinking is what what does the
upside to dropping the ball at all?
Speaker 2 (17:30):
Why?
Speaker 1 (17:31):
Like if if you know, again, I'm not an NFL coach,
but my coaching point would be, hey, guys, I'm not
going to tell you how to celebrate. I'm not going
to say you have to do X, Y and Z
don't get penalties. But also your celebration needs to involve
the ball, whatever it is. Somehow the ball needs to
be involved. That's a good celebration. You must be still
holding it when you begin the celebration in the end zone.
Speaker 2 (17:53):
I just don't know what else, what else you do
about it.
Speaker 1 (17:55):
The week before, it was the Colts who had ad
Mitchell commit the same sin for no pair reasons. In
that case, he's not even trying to drop the ball.
He's trying to reach it out and fumbles the thing away.
But it's cold Stein now that should be five to
zero after Steve. They absolutely dismantled a Raiders team yesterday
that is going completely the wrong direction. And I don't
(18:16):
know you're talking about teams there a year away from
being a year away. I don't even know what buttons
Pete Carroll and company have to push at this point
because the roster is not all that great. You paid
Gino Smith. What do you do at this point? I
don't know how you look at the way things are
going from Las Vegas's standpoint and think anything other than
this is gonna be.
Speaker 7 (18:36):
A long year. Yeah it is.
Speaker 8 (18:38):
I mean it's just there. We've seen this before, like change,
the coaches changed, whatever. We're back to where we were
and look here, here's all I needed to know was
last week after they won, when Ashton Genty went off
and they said, yeah, will you finally let him go
back to his stance he used from college? Why were
you messing with something that minimal in the first place
(19:00):
when it worked? Like that's where you guys are, that's
what you're worried about when you don't have a great roster.
Speaker 7 (19:07):
When you strategically build a patchwork defense with mainly guys
on one year salaries other than Max Crosby. But you
have a very good defensive coordinator who now can't get
the talent to play up to the scheme that Patrick
Graham was running. And then Gino's out here playing like
crap like it this is you know, I thought Pete Carroll,
(19:29):
and I'm a huge Pete Carroll guy, and I thought,
culture wise, he's going to be able to get his
arms around some things. Maybe he still can't to some point.
This is systemic.
Speaker 8 (19:38):
Fifteen layers deep in that building, and Tom Brady whatever
can sit in the coaches but that's not helping a thing.
Speaker 1 (19:45):
So I think the whole competitive disadvantage thing has gone
out the window. Whatever they were getting from Tom, I
don't think that it's making to me.
Speaker 7 (19:53):
Ian.
Speaker 1 (19:53):
We know Chip Kelly's making a ton of money. Yeah,
at some point here you're looking. I mean, Chips are
very you know, intelligent guy. He just want a national
title at Ohio State. But it was not good at
the end in Philly, it was not good. As you're
in San Francisco, at what point does some of the
heat begin getting redirected there again within the broader context
that they don't have a true number one wide receiver.
Jacobe Myers is a really good player, but probably not
(20:15):
a true number one Brock Bauers is out. You have
a running back, but you're just you're struggling to get
the consistent production. Did you want to hear At what point
does do people in the buildings start to look at Chip?
Speaker 7 (20:26):
Yeah?
Speaker 6 (20:26):
I mean, I think that's a good question. There's a
lot of places to look. I mean, the the you know,
look the I would say, taking a running back in
the top ten when he's the best player on your board.
I didn't argue with that at the time. Kevin Banks
is a very good tackle. That probably would have been
their pick. He shut down Abdulla Carter when the Saints
(20:48):
played the Giants yesterday. That would have been the guy
like that would have helped to add a stud tackle
on that offensive. Like, there's a lot of decisions that
sort of go into it, but Gino playing some of
the worst football he's ever played in his career does
bring you back to like, why are we paying so
much money for this guy?
Speaker 3 (21:05):
The other thing I would say is.
Speaker 6 (21:06):
Like I remember I thought personally that Chip Kelly was
going to go to the Texans, and I remember when
he went to the Raiders being surprised. They hired a
young guy named Nick Keyley who've never been in oc before.
And now the Texans the last two weeks have kind
of started looking pretty good and the Raiders haven't. And
she was always very interesting to see what might have
(21:27):
been in the different ways.
Speaker 3 (21:29):
Anyway, it's a lot of problems there in Vegas.
Speaker 1 (21:32):
Yeah, last thing, real quick, speaking of bad offenses, Steve
the Bengals at least found something in the fourth order
yesterday and put the ball in the end zone a
few times. If you're sitting there and you're Mike Brown,
you're Duke Tovin or Zach Taylor, what are you doing
a quarterback?
Speaker 7 (21:46):
I'm making trade and I was saying it for weeks.
Go ahead and trade for Jamis.
Speaker 8 (21:49):
At least show the guy you think I would think
Jamis because I don't know what Russ does for you.
Saw Russ last year. He killed you in that game.
I think we threw five interceptions. One thing about James,
he's not playing it safe. He's letting it rip a
lot like Jake Browning. But he's letting it rip deep, right,
and you got two of the best deep threats in
the NFL. He's all charisma. I'm a Jake Brownie guy,
(22:11):
but he just and it's not all on him. I mean,
they're a mess.
Speaker 1 (22:15):
J Jake Brownie was three interceptions three touchdowns yesterday. That
sounds like a Jameis Winston's that line. It would it
would definitely lend a different personality to it. Ian But
real quick, what do you think is the most likely
scenario of how this plays out this week?
Speaker 6 (22:28):
This is going to air eight o'clock, So for sure
this could be old takes exposed, I think, but don't
really know that they saw enough of Browning in the
fourth quarter to say one more week. But we will
see which way it ends up going.
Speaker 1 (22:44):
Steve, Thank you very much, great stuff from you. You
can check out the Insiders all over the place NFL
Networks seven pm Eastern Time every Tuesday, Wednesday, Friday, all
five days, weekdays per week on YouTube, as well as
the podcast.
Speaker 2 (22:58):
We're on the fast streaming platforms on Mondays and Thursdays.
Just just find us wherever you are we are. We'll
see you there soon.
Speaker 8 (23:08):
H
Welcome back to the Insiders, Tom Pillicero, Ian Rappaport, joined
right now by our friend Sarah Waltz in London, one
game into her three game personal International series. Sarah, Yeah,
this is pretty late your time, so we appreciate you
taking a time and portion of your evening to its.
Speaker 2 (00:24):
Prime, prime dinner time.
Speaker 1 (00:25):
Ian would be about four beers deep at a pub somewhere,
so we appreciate you having What do you mean she.
Speaker 2 (00:30):
Could hold on us?
Speaker 3 (00:32):
Said anything else? She could be drunk right now.
Speaker 2 (00:35):
No, she sounds She said, sure, this would.
Speaker 4 (00:37):
Be a lot better if I was Ian. I'll tell
you that.
Speaker 2 (00:39):
That's a good That is also a valid point.
Speaker 1 (00:41):
If you're picking up right here and you didn't hear
part one of the podcasts, you can go there or
stick it out with this one. We talk about separate
topics in each one every single Monday.
Speaker 2 (00:49):
We appreciate you finding us.
Speaker 1 (00:51):
However you did, Sarah. Let's get right into that game yesterday.
It was obviously a big moment for the Browns, starting
a new quarterback and Dylan Gabriel, who we saw some
things from. It also felt like a really critical game
for the Vikings, a zero to two stretch internationally would
have hurt. They had so many different injuries. They got
a backup quarterback, they got all these backup offensive linemen.
(01:12):
Even though it wasn't really pretty yesterday, walking off that field,
it seemed like, Okay, maybe this is kind of a
galvanized force as Minnesota moves forward. Yeah.
Speaker 5 (01:20):
I was thinking about it today too, when these guys
always talk about it's a game of inches, and I
think mentally, it's a game of inches, and where this
team would have been to your point flying back yesterday,
and Kevin O'Connell, even before that game kicked and we
talked to him, was talking about, look, our goal was
to come out here to Dublin, to London and to
(01:41):
go home with two more wins. And he's like, and
one is that's not possible, So we have to at
least get one.
Speaker 4 (01:46):
And that game's tiken down.
Speaker 5 (01:47):
And it really felt like Dylan Gabriel and the Browns
were in control of most of that one until the
very end. I mean, the Vikings were in it the
entire time, but the Browns were controlling the clock. There
were just it seemed like they were struggling more on
the Viking side, and so the fact that that slipped
away for Dylan Gabriel and the Browns justin Jefferson. They
(02:08):
needed the big play, they got it from him. Jordan
Addison stepped up. But it really could have been very
different for Minnesota if Addison doesn't come up with those
really three crucial catches at the end in the game
winning touchdown, and then I think it's a much different
scenario in Minnesota today. I think there would have been
a little bit of panic. I think there would have
been frustration. Tom, you know more than anybody living there.
(02:30):
It felt like it could have been heading that direction.
The O line situation is really difficult for them. And
I say this to people all the time because you guys,
I know you guys were talking about the Bucks today
and they have had a tremendous amount a turnover on
that offensive line, signing practice squad players, signing practice squad
guys from other teams, practice squads, and they have managed
(02:52):
to somehow piece this thing together well Over in Minnesota,
it was back up to the backup to the backup.
O'Connell said, it's like twelve thirteen combinations in now and
it showed.
Speaker 4 (03:02):
I mean, Carson Wentz was under pressure at all times.
Speaker 6 (03:04):
No.
Speaker 5 (03:05):
Granted he was going against the number one defense in
the league in Cleveland, but I mean there was just
such little time for him to do anything, and I
think it could be real tenuous if they don't, if
they're not able to figure that out. I do think
obviously they're going to go to a bye week now
and hopefully get some of those guys back.
Speaker 4 (03:21):
Ryan Kelly is out now.
Speaker 5 (03:23):
O'Neil, like the buy could certainly help that situation, but
that O line, I mean, the inexperience. There were penalties,
and it was by guys you would expect maybe would
have those penalties. So I think they did the best
they could do, but I think that's really hurting them
right now.
Speaker 6 (03:40):
Sarah, So, I have some thoughts on the Vikings and Browns,
but what I kind of want to do instead?
Speaker 3 (03:45):
Can you tell us like what's going on over there?
Speaker 6 (03:47):
Because like Tom and I have obviously never been and
it seems really fun. You got three weeks there, you're
going to be give us like the breakdown, like like
what do you doing in your time?
Speaker 3 (04:01):
Are you seeing anything fun?
Speaker 6 (04:03):
What have the teams been, Like what's the atmosphere for
like practice and whatever else been like give us a
little flavor of what's going on over there and what's
your schedule is like for the next three weeks.
Speaker 4 (04:13):
It's really different. So it's been sort of NonStop.
Speaker 5 (04:16):
Honestly, people think you're over here on vacation, like partying
it up, and there are some people in different roles
maybe that are. I have not been able to do that,
and part of that is because the way that they
practice here in London. For example, the vikings are really
far outside of London, so it was different definitely. I've
(04:38):
done the Munich Games, I've done Frankfort games. They're so
far outside. So if for the experience for the teams
as well, I mean it's a hall for them to
get into London where there's that sort of atmosphere. They
were practicing in the like the most picturesque if envision
like the holiday with Cameron Diaz back in the day
and it's this like picturesque countryside and the cottages like
(04:58):
they are staying in this or they were staying in
this picturesque area. They literally carved a football field into
the side of these like rolling hills in between a
golf course. So if you're looking for if you're looking
to like sip some tea and be in this like bucolic,
like that's that's their scene. Like they're not necessarily they're
not on double decker buses running around town. I think
they try to give them some free time for those guys.
(05:21):
Those guys were in a different situation because they were
coming from Dublin, so they were already tired and I
think they were definitely ready to get home after that.
And then there's and I know you guys talked about
this too, there's the different takes of do you come
in early, do you come in late? When these teams
come in late, when they come in closer to game time,
and especially depending on where they're staying and they stay
outside of London.
Speaker 4 (05:39):
There's not a lot of time.
Speaker 5 (05:40):
So so basically most of my time has been like
shuttling in and out of cars and getting out because
it's just and the traffic here isn't isn't the best,
so they are not in like the hub of activity.
I am staying in the hub of activity, So I mean,
I get some of that feel, but it's a lot
of like car riding out to the stadium and h
and at least I can speak for the Vikings facility.
(06:01):
It was this beautiful, beautiful countryside, a state type of
fear and I know, like a lot of guys golf
because there was a gulf like right there at the facility,
and I just unbelievably beautiful. It looks like something out
of like I said, a movie. I think Camerondy is holiday.
That's where they're at.
Speaker 1 (06:19):
That's where I saw Sean Payton say something along the
lines as he was asked about like plans and London's like,
have you've seen where we're staying?
Speaker 2 (06:25):
The middle of nowhere?
Speaker 1 (06:26):
And that is part of it, you know, that's the
reality of it is you kind of can isolate yourself away,
you know. But it's also interesting you talk about the
teams arriving at different times, the fact that the Broncos
essentially flew overnight after their game against the Eagles just
like we're on to the next thing and went the
Jets fly later tonight. They're going to be there the
(06:46):
entire week as well. We heard Aaron Rodgers a couple
weeks ago say, well, I wish we came in a
little early. It didn't end up hurting the Steelers. They
got to win over the Vikings. But clearly both these teams,
the Broncos and the Jets, in a game they'll face
off on and I found that nine am Eastern time,
you can get up really early and watch me Ian
Sarah Walsh cast one thousands on the pregame show as well.
(07:08):
But it does say something about, you know, just kind
of the the the way the teams are perhaps implementing
sports science and other things like, hey, we need to
give guys a little different clock as they as they
go overseas here and this will just give me as
we take a quick peek ahead at this game. Sarah,
and I know you're coming right off of the Vikings
Browns game, but you got Broncos and Jets, two teams.
(07:31):
I mean, the Jets played a game last year in
London and fired everybody essentially as soon as they got home.
I don't anticipate it's going to be the same thing.
But finally to owen six with a team with expectations
there certainly would seem to be a lot on the
line for them, as well as a Broncos team right now.
There's no reason to sit there and think, hey, they
can't make a run at winning the AFC West.
Speaker 5 (07:51):
You know what's so funny is I'm over here and
it's like one game at a time and I just
got to get through the week. But you better believe
that when I'm looking at the next two teams coming
over here, I want them to come over here in
a good mood.
Speaker 4 (08:01):
Right, So I was hoping for I needed both of.
Speaker 5 (08:03):
Them to win, just for my own selfish purposes because
we've got to talk to these guys this week. Yeah,
so I would have liked to have seen the Jets
get their first win, just because selfishly, I want it
to be easier. I will say this though, I have
seen teams in the International Games, and Germany is one
of them come over that, you know, because these are
set so long ago that are not having good seasons.
(08:25):
And if you are mired in that situation and you
need a spark and you need something to just look different,
this will give you that. And I talked about this
before I got over here. It doesn't matter the record.
These stadiums and these International Games are completely filled. So
the Jets can come over here winless. They can be
zero to five. They are going to step into a
(08:47):
stadium on Sunday, that is going to feel super Bowl
like it has that big of a feeling. Every seat
is filled, and I have seen it. I'm not saying
that they are going to turn around and run to
the super Bowl, but I have seen it provide a
day distraction in a way of like new environment. We're
not going into the same facility coming off of this loss,
(09:07):
you know what I mean. Like sometimes I do think
like eventually I think there's a breakup. And I will
give you another example, like we had the Panthers last
year wasn't going well. It ended with me interviewing Bryce
on the field and again the joy they feel. It
doesn't change. I know it doesn't count as extra wins
in the win column, but there is something about a
(09:27):
reset coming over here and leaving the country and sort
of you're not picking up maybe the New York papers
that you would be seeing getting hammered every day.
Speaker 4 (09:35):
I'm not saying that that gets.
Speaker 5 (09:37):
Them a win on Sunday, but I'm saying that I
do think if you are a team that comes over
in that position, I have never seen a team that's
come over in a position where things aren't going well,
sort of like mope and drag and be like, I
can't believe. It's like you're just in such a vastly
different place and environment. It's almost like wipes the slate clean.
At least it sort of suspends reality, I think, at
(09:59):
least for little bit, being over here, and it will
not feel it will not feel that way on Sunday
for them, And maybe maybe that does something for this team, right,
maybe that provides something, even if it's like a mental
edge of a help, and maybe it doesn't change anything
at all. But I've seen it happen, and I've seen
at least teams feel differently when they're over here.
Speaker 3 (10:20):
Yeah, that's so interesting.
Speaker 6 (10:21):
You can sort of like talk yourself into I think
it'll be a good game anyway, but you can sort
of talk yourself into it where it's like the Jets,
I can tend are way better.
Speaker 3 (10:29):
Than the record.
Speaker 6 (10:29):
I'm sure everyone disagrees, but watch them play in and
play out.
Speaker 3 (10:32):
They don't look to me like a bad team. They
look to me like a team that's pretty close.
Speaker 6 (10:36):
They kind of feel like those like that Dan Campbell
one in seventeen from like when was that time three
years ago?
Speaker 3 (10:42):
Or four years ago?
Speaker 2 (10:43):
Four years ago? Four years ago?
Speaker 3 (10:45):
But who maybe I'm who knows, Maybe I'm crazy.
Speaker 6 (10:49):
One thing I would say is this game is going
to be so meaningful to Woody Johnson, who obviously spent
a lot of time there a lot obviously was the
ambassador and last year, you know, you do wonder some
of the reaction about Sola was because they lost and
played horrible in London.
Speaker 2 (11:07):
I don't think it's going to with his buddies and
all that stuff.
Speaker 6 (11:09):
I mean a lot of the whole thing, the whole thing,
but like, this is a very meaningful game to him,
and so if the Jets were away, it would probably
be very good for a lot of people there, sir.
Speaker 5 (11:20):
And you guys, I know, you guys were talking about
how good the Bucks are, and they are really good,
and they are. They're sort of the epitome, I think
right now of a team that has had sort of
every injury thrown at them and not flinched at all.
Speaker 4 (11:31):
But this is a Jets.
Speaker 5 (11:32):
Team that had him, like, had him on the ropes,
had him was going to beat him in Tampa.
Speaker 4 (11:37):
And that's not a fluke like Tampa's not a fluke team.
Speaker 5 (11:40):
They're really good and so and the Jets were right
there you know, a couple of weeks ago like that
looked at one point that that was going to be
number one and it didn't work out for them.
Speaker 4 (11:50):
And the Bucks are on the.
Speaker 5 (11:51):
Opposite end of that where they had a lot of
close games and it didn't work out for them last
year and they flipped the script on that. So you
never know, man, Maybe maybe it's some London magic for
the Jets.
Speaker 1 (12:00):
Sarah, tremendous stuff. Enjoy the remaining couple of weeks. Hopefully
you can come back and do this again. This has
been a ton of fun.
Speaker 4 (12:08):
Thank you guys.
Speaker 5 (12:09):
Look, no pub time, but Ian, I'm sure we could
carve some out if you want to get over here.
We got plenty. The teams are just getting here. There's
plenty of time. Hop on the plane, get.
Speaker 4 (12:18):
On over here.
Speaker 6 (12:19):
I will talk to the bosses and they will decline
as per usual.
Speaker 3 (12:23):
Thank you, Sarah, or from the insiders.
Speaker 1 (12:25):
After this, we had a ton of big comebacks around
the NFL on Sunday as welcome Steve Weitz back to
(12:47):
the conversation as well.
Speaker 2 (12:49):
I don't know that there was a nut of your game.
Speaker 1 (12:50):
I don't know that I've seen many nute of your
games than the one in Arizona, Omah. You have a
touchdown for a minute till they reviewed it Murray Demarcado.
That would make it twenty eight to six. The Cardinals
not only win this game, they are blowing out a
winless Titans team. They're right back in the thick of
(13:11):
it in the NFC West after two last second losses
on field goals, and.
Speaker 3 (13:17):
Instead you have it. They keep watching that.
Speaker 1 (13:19):
It's because it is baffling ian, because it is just
I understand. There are physics to this, the way that
the brain feels it's in a different place than the
body based upon velocity. You can read all sorts of papers,
I'm sure by people smarter than me about why someone
would think they're in the end zone when they're not.
There's two ways to look at this. Because you also
(13:40):
had the interception fumble play, which still watching it five times,
it's hard. It's hard to see how that's an interception,
but it was called that on the field. That's how
they stood with it, and back come the Titans. They
take advantage of it.
Speaker 7 (13:55):
Here.
Speaker 2 (13:56):
There's two different ways to look at this.
Speaker 1 (13:58):
You have a Cardinals team that this is I mean,
this is brutal This is as bad of.
Speaker 2 (14:01):
A gut punch as you're ever going to have.
Speaker 1 (14:04):
I'm going to choose to look at this as the
upside for the Titans, Steve, because what we got to
see and again, in a game where in a season
where the Titans have not gotten any bounces, okay, in
a season where nothing's gone their way, sometimes you need
a little bit of luck. And there's a couple of
things you see from the Titans down the stretch in
that game. One on the fumble play that we saw
(14:26):
over and over, it's the fact of the Jerius Sneaed,
one of your highest paid players is hustling seventy yards
down the field to stay with that play, trying to
make a play. If you want to sit there and go, oh,
they've quit on Brian Callahan, they don't care a play
like that with a guy who doesn't need this, that
shows you that's not true. And two cam Warden, the
(14:47):
second half of that game was balie. He played bad
the week before and the shutout lost to Houston. The
numbers weren't great in the first half, but when they
needed plays, Steve, this dude stepped up. None bigger than
the throw of cut Lvin Ridley that sets up the
winning field goal. I've been impressed just with the overall
aura of cam War beyond how he has played. They
(15:08):
needed this, cam Ward needed this, and it was as
much as again I feel for everybody in Arizona. It
was cool to see the Titans like, hey, we got
a couple of bounces go away and we're not gonna
waste it this time.
Speaker 8 (15:19):
And I like that approach Tom because they didn't need it,
right they.
Speaker 7 (15:23):
We've seen flashes of positive things from that.
Speaker 8 (15:25):
The team's not the roster's not very good, right, They're
just not a really well put together team yet. They
they're a year away from being a year away in
terms of talent. But you can see they're trying to
establish some things and so the ball did bounce their way.
You need those from.
Speaker 7 (15:39):
Time to time.
Speaker 8 (15:41):
I'm putting all this on Arizona because if my guy
doesn't fumble that ball in the end zone, they're up what.
Speaker 7 (15:48):
Three scores, that's including a two point conversions.
Speaker 2 (15:51):
It's a twenty eight six game. I mean it is over.
Speaker 7 (15:54):
Okay.
Speaker 8 (15:54):
So when you're at the combine, when your coach to
do the forty, what do you do?
Speaker 7 (15:58):
You run? Through the four.
Speaker 8 (16:01):
Right when you're doing everything at every level, you run
through the finish line. This is the second week in
a row we've seen this foolishness. I mean, call me
old school whatever. I've got no time for this. I
have no time that you just cost. See people feel
bad for him. There are fifty two other dudes on
that team who put food on their table by guys
(16:22):
individual performances. And you drop a pass, that's one thing.
You throw an interception that's another thing. That stuff is inexcusable.
And again you have to answer to those coaches and
everybody else whose seat might be getting a little warm,
or whose positions might be getting a little warm because
you made a mistake like that. And that is just
something that he'll learn from mitlet's hope. But in a
(16:42):
game like that, when you should win over a team
that's got nothing to play for right now, that just
can't happen.
Speaker 3 (16:49):
Yeah, and just real quick, because I know we got
to get some other stuff.
Speaker 6 (16:51):
But I think you are right, Steve, to draw a
distinction between dropping a pass, tripping and falling to like
something you can control, which is running through the rep,
which is essentially what that is. Now, I do feel
horrible for him, And you know, I saw the satellite
interaction between him and Jonathan Gannett, and I just hate
(17:11):
to see someone yell at someone who just made a
horrible mistake. I don't I'm sure he feels horrible enough,
but you're right. I mean, that is something that is
avoidable by just completing the rep, which is something over
and over they all go through.
Speaker 1 (17:26):
The thing I keep thinking is what what does the
upside to dropping the ball at all?
Speaker 2 (17:30):
Why?
Speaker 1 (17:31):
Like if if you know, again, I'm not an NFL coach,
but my coaching point would be, hey, guys, I'm not
going to tell you how to celebrate. I'm not going
to say you have to do X, Y and Z
don't get penalties. But also your celebration needs to involve
the ball, whatever it is. Somehow the ball needs to
be involved. That's a good celebration. You must be still
holding it when you begin the celebration in the end zone.
Speaker 2 (17:53):
I just don't know what else, what else you do
about it.
Speaker 1 (17:55):
The week before, it was the Colts who had ad
Mitchell commit the same sin for no pair reasons. In
that case, he's not even trying to drop the ball.
He's trying to reach it out and fumbles the thing away.
But it's cold Stein now that should be five to
zero after Steve. They absolutely dismantled a Raiders team yesterday
that is going completely the wrong direction. And I don't
(18:16):
know you're talking about teams there a year away from
being a year away. I don't even know what buttons
Pete Carroll and company have to push at this point
because the roster is not all that great. You paid
Gino Smith. What do you do at this point? I
don't know how you look at the way things are
going from Las Vegas's standpoint and think anything other than
this is gonna be.
Speaker 7 (18:36):
A long year. Yeah it is.
Speaker 8 (18:38):
I mean it's just there. We've seen this before, like change,
the coaches changed, whatever. We're back to where we were
and look here, here's all I needed to know was
last week after they won, when Ashton Genty went off
and they said, yeah, will you finally let him go
back to his stance he used from college? Why were
you messing with something that minimal in the first place
(19:00):
when it worked? Like that's where you guys are, that's
what you're worried about when you don't have a great roster.
Speaker 7 (19:07):
When you strategically build a patchwork defense with mainly guys
on one year salaries other than Max Crosby. But you
have a very good defensive coordinator who now can't get
the talent to play up to the scheme that Patrick
Graham was running. And then Gino's out here playing like
crap like it this is you know, I thought Pete Carroll,
(19:29):
and I'm a huge Pete Carroll guy, and I thought,
culture wise, he's going to be able to get his
arms around some things. Maybe he still can't to some point.
This is systemic.
Speaker 8 (19:38):
Fifteen layers deep in that building, and Tom Brady whatever
can sit in the coaches but that's not helping a thing.
Speaker 1 (19:45):
So I think the whole competitive disadvantage thing has gone
out the window. Whatever they were getting from Tom, I
don't think that it's making to me.
Speaker 7 (19:53):
Ian.
Speaker 1 (19:53):
We know Chip Kelly's making a ton of money. Yeah,
at some point here you're looking. I mean, Chips are
very you know, intelligent guy. He just want a national
title at Ohio State. But it was not good at
the end in Philly, it was not good. As you're
in San Francisco, at what point does some of the
heat begin getting redirected there again within the broader context
that they don't have a true number one wide receiver.
Jacobe Myers is a really good player, but probably not
(20:15):
a true number one Brock Bauers is out. You have
a running back, but you're just you're struggling to get
the consistent production. Did you want to hear At what point
does do people in the buildings start to look at Chip?
Speaker 7 (20:26):
Yeah?
Speaker 6 (20:26):
I mean, I think that's a good question. There's a
lot of places to look. I mean, the the you know,
look the I would say, taking a running back in
the top ten when he's the best player on your board.
I didn't argue with that at the time. Kevin Banks
is a very good tackle. That probably would have been
their pick. He shut down Abdulla Carter when the Saints
(20:48):
played the Giants yesterday. That would have been the guy
like that would have helped to add a stud tackle
on that offensive. Like, there's a lot of decisions that
sort of go into it, but Gino playing some of
the worst football he's ever played in his career does
bring you back to like, why are we paying so
much money for this guy?
Speaker 3 (21:05):
The other thing I would say is.
Speaker 6 (21:06):
Like I remember I thought personally that Chip Kelly was
going to go to the Texans, and I remember when
he went to the Raiders being surprised. They hired a
young guy named Nick Keyley who've never been in oc before.
And now the Texans the last two weeks have kind
of started looking pretty good and the Raiders haven't. And
she was always very interesting to see what might have
(21:27):
been in the different ways.
Speaker 3 (21:29):
Anyway, it's a lot of problems there in Vegas.
Speaker 1 (21:32):
Yeah, last thing, real quick, speaking of bad offenses, Steve
the Bengals at least found something in the fourth order
yesterday and put the ball in the end zone a
few times. If you're sitting there and you're Mike Brown,
you're Duke Tovin or Zach Taylor, what are you doing
a quarterback?
Speaker 7 (21:46):
I'm making trade and I was saying it for weeks.
Go ahead and trade for Jamis.
Speaker 8 (21:49):
At least show the guy you think I would think
Jamis because I don't know what Russ does for you.
Saw Russ last year. He killed you in that game.
I think we threw five interceptions. One thing about James,
he's not playing it safe. He's letting it rip a
lot like Jake Browning. But he's letting it rip deep, right,
and you got two of the best deep threats in
the NFL. He's all charisma. I'm a Jake Brownie guy,
(22:11):
but he just and it's not all on him. I mean,
they're a mess.
Speaker 1 (22:15):
J Jake Brownie was three interceptions three touchdowns yesterday. That
sounds like a Jameis Winston's that line. It would it
would definitely lend a different personality to it. Ian But
real quick, what do you think is the most likely
scenario of how this plays out this week?
Speaker 6 (22:28):
This is going to air eight o'clock, So for sure
this could be old takes exposed, I think, but don't
really know that they saw enough of Browning in the
fourth quarter to say one more week. But we will
see which way it ends up going.
Speaker 1 (22:44):
Steve, Thank you very much, great stuff from you. You
can check out the Insiders all over the place NFL
Networks seven pm Eastern Time every Tuesday, Wednesday, Friday, all
five days, weekdays per week on YouTube, as well as
the podcast.
Speaker 2 (22:58):
We're on the fast streaming platforms on Mondays and Thursdays.
Just just find us wherever you are we are. We'll
see you there soon.
Speaker 8 (23:08):
H
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