The Season with Peter Schrager: Steve Spagnuolo, Kansas City Chiefs Defensive Coordinator

Episode Transcript
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Speaker 1 (00:07):
The Season with Peter Schrager is a production of the
NFL in partnership with iHeartRadio.

Speaker 2 (00:23):
What's Up, everybody, Welcome to another episode of the Season
with Peter Schrager. I'm Peter Scheger. I'm joined by Aaron
wang Kaufman, my wonderful producer. We are now a week
and change removed from the Super Bowl and I'm just
flipping the I'm flipping the page. Our guest is gonna
be Steve Spagnolo, who has won his fourth Super Bowl

(00:44):
as a coordinator, which is an NFL record in the
history of the sport. No coordinator has won four different
Super Bowl titles. We're gonna get spags on in a bit,
but before we do that, I wanted to look ahead
to the Combine because if you're clicking on play on
this podcast, it's late in the week during this President's
Day week, which is kind of a dark period for

(01:05):
the NFL, and then you might listen to on the
weekend and then guys, before you know it, Monday, everyone
descends upon Indianapolis and we already are on the draft season.
And to me, the Combine is such a I think
the viewers at home and the fans at home see
it one way, but those of us in the NFL

(01:26):
see it a different way. There is an art and
a science to it. The science part is the actual
player workouts, which will rule the headlines, and we'll rule
the weekend coming up, spanning from Thursday to Sunday, and
that's where you're gonna get all your quarterbacks. You're gonna
get all your tight ends, all your defensivens, you're gonna
get your freak show athletes, and you're gonna have them

(01:47):
doing the forty and doing the past catching trills, and
you're gonna have your amazing moments where someone's gonna break
a record doing a high jump or a long jump.
And that is the science to it. And if you
talk to NFL teams, the drills really do matter. They're
very significant, but so are the interviews which is earlier
in the week which is unfilmed. Again, the science of it,

(02:10):
this is stuff that you bring a player in. You
get a feel for their intelligence, to feel for their vibe.
You get a feel for what they can do on
a board if you had to have them draw up
a blitz, or if you had to have them draw
up what they would do if they're being blitz and
they're the quarterback or the running back. How they would
block it. They call it the train station, and that's
the beginning part where teams can just meet with players

(02:32):
one by one, just kind of boom boom boom bom boom.
Then you have your private interviews where players will walk
in and you've probably seen the footage of it before,
where the most famous one is either the DK Metcalf
one where he walks in a room and it's all
the Seahawks guys and Pete Carroll eventually removes his shirt

(02:54):
to show DK Metcalf his physique. But that is very important.
That is where a fifteen minute interview and the teams
request certain players to come in and they have an
opportunity to get in front of the coaches, in front
of the GMS, and there could be a wide array
of ways those interviews go. Sometimes the head coach won't
say a word and it'll just be a position coach

(03:14):
running point. Sometimes it's the GM running point. Sometimes they'll
go around in a circle and it'll be rapid fire
the questions. I also remember, I want to say, I
specifically remember an Eagles interview with I want to say
it was Jalen Hurts and it was with Doug Peterson,
and that one was leaked to the media, and that

(03:35):
one after the fact came out and was super informative
on how on how Jalen Hurts handled his interview with them,
Like it's it's so rare. We actually see the footage
of these. Usually they come out after the draft when
a player selected and that team will say, Okay, well
this happened during that interview. That's all the science of it,
all right, So I said art and science. The art

(03:56):
of it is Monday, Tuesday, Wednesday, and it's in the hallways,
and it's in these giant corridors, and it's these these
wonderful restaurants in Indianapolis, in a back room or at
the bar, and it's basically a free for all where
you're throwing NFL coaches and not just the head coaches,

(04:19):
NFL position coaches, NFL coordinators, NFL support staff, putting the
entire front office, and you've got a lot of downtime,
and you're putting them all together in Indianapolis, which is
a city that has about forty different restaurants and bars
in a one mile radius. And you also throw in

(04:40):
NFL media, and you throw in NFL agents, and you
throw in NFL league executives, and suddenly it becomes the
biggest convention in NFL yearly calendar you're going to have.
And me personally, as a longtime NFL reporter and someone
who really values boots on the ground, I found a

(05:01):
way to get there for Monday and Tuesday. And it's
important to be there Monday and Tuesday because a lot
of conversations happen and it's not gossip, it's not This
is where I filled my notebook. This is where I
will tell you straight up who I'll meet with, Like
we're gonna have spags on. I'm gonna have dinner with
Reid and Veach on Monday Night. We're gonna go to

(05:23):
a steakhouse that's the chiefs coach and GM. We're gonna
do that Monday night. Monday Night. There's a gentleman named
Bob Lamont who is an agent to all the top
head coaches. He represents everybody from Doug Peterson to Andy
Reid to Sean mcvayh you can go down the list.
There are so many Lamont clients. He is a legend

(05:45):
in his own right. He was Mike Holmgren's agent way
back when. Bab Lamont and his wife they have their
own agency, they both and he does a little private
dinner Monday night, late night, and I usually am one
of maybe two media people ever at the table. It's
it's a cool invite to get I like to always

(06:05):
hit that up. I'll make sure I get there. So
what's the value of being at a dinner with ten
NFL head coach? As well? There's drinks going, there's stakes
being in, there's jokes being had, and just reading between
the lines, I could pill up a notebook on Okay, well,
here's how this coach feels about this player, or here's
what this coach feels about this league issue, or here's

(06:27):
what this NFL GM here's who he was talking to.
And I wonder why he was talking to that coach. Well,
maybe because that coach is a player that might be
a free agent. All right, Tuesday morning, I'll do Good
Morning Football, and then afterwards, I've got a day that
I've already booked, hour after hour after hours, so I'll
talk to Joe Shane, the general manager of the Giants.

(06:48):
We've got that in the books I've got Brendan Bean,
general manager of the Bills. We've got that in the books.
I'm sure I'll link up with somebody from the new
Chargers brass I've been texting with them, whether it be
Joe Hortiz, their GM, or whether it be Jim Harbaugh
or one of his many assistants that he's bringing with them,
Guys that honestly I don't no. I don't know Jesse Minter,
I don't know Marcus Brady. So if I get an

(07:10):
opportunity at the combine to introduce myself in a casual setting,
I can add their phone number. We could continue a dialogue,
whether it be for information, whether it be any way
that I can help, or whether it be them clarifying
something I say on air. That's very helpful. So that's
a goal of mine. I got to get in front
of some of those Chargers guys Tuesday night. I last
year started this tradition. It's a dinner with Sean Payton.

(07:33):
He came back to Denver last year. Mickey Loomis was
at our table, who I'd never really gotten to know.
We really hit it off. I'm hoping to do that
again this year and will solidify relationships and will solidify thoughts.
And in this case, if I get Mickey Loomis, well,
what are they doing at quarterback for the future. We
know Derek Carr's there, but what are they doing with

(07:53):
that offense? What are they doing with all those frenzies?
The Saints are into this weird crossshroads. I'd love to
fill my notebook a little bit. And this is where
you do it. Furthermore, beyond the science of the workouts
and the interview, we go back to the art of this.
There are twenty NFL coaches who are going to speak
on the podium during those first few days. There are

(08:15):
twenty six general managers who are going to speak at
the podium. There's a lot to be taken from those moments.
And it's local be reporters. There's also national folks asking
him questions. And if you're talking about we have a
free agency period in three weeks that's coming up, and
you also have the draft, you better believe there's stuff
to be taken from there. I really do value the
combine for that. I think the art of it is

(08:37):
what happens in the Wollway. Like I'll do Good Morning
Football and I think Tom Pellisaro's going to join me
on Monday, on Tuesday and Wednesday, and we're going to
do it from the conference center. And there's a walk
from the conference center to the hotel. You can't walk
two steps without bumping into a quarterback, coach, an agent,
an NFL PR person, and those conversations are all used

(09:01):
to help inform the next several months of what's going
to be smoke screen season, but also information season. You
the listener, you're gonna want to know what these teams
are leaning towards it. Like I'm looking at the coaches,
twenty er are going to speak. That means twelve aren't here.
Here are the twelve that are not on the schedule,
and you can shame them. You can tweet at them,

(09:22):
you can find their PR team and try to commit
some otherwise. I don't like it. I don't like it,
and I've said it before. Come to the combine. Don't
be too cool for the combine. Come to the combine,
and then speak at the combine. Mike McCarthy's not speaking,
Brian Dabele's not speaking, Matt Lafleur is not speaking, Kyle
Shanahan's not speaking. Sean McVay is not speaking, Mike McDonald's

(09:45):
not speaking, Dennis Allen's not speaking, Robert Sala's not speaking,
Gerrodmeo is not speaking, like Tomlin is not speaking, Jim
Harbaugh is not speaking, Antonio Pierce is not speaking. So
I'm just looking at the schedule of who's going to
be on those risers, and those are the twelve coaches
who will not be speaking at the combine. That's their choice.

(10:07):
I'm not trying to make news here. I doubt Sean
mcvay's at the combine at all. He and I used
to have some ripper nights in Indianapolis at High Voltage,
which was a bar that was in the JW. Marriott,
which was a fun spot. But the last couple of
years he has not attended, and that has not hurt
their draft process at all. Robert Salah, I know Joe

(10:29):
Douglas will be there. Salad didn't go last year. I
don't know if once you say no and you skip Indy,
it's usually where you come back, And in a lot
of cases it's because the coaches rather have all their
guys in the building back in their facility just grinding
on tape and working that way and then all the

(10:51):
workouts you get and all the interviews you can have taped.
I don't know if there's been a big study done
on team success or draft success of teams that have
sent their head coaches and sent their coaching staff to
the Combine. In those two have not, but in recent
years it's been a trend that teams have not been
sending as many people. I see Kyle Shanahan's not speaking.

(11:12):
I don't know if Kyle Shanahan's going to the Combine.
Their season ended late, and yet Andy Reid, we have
a dinner date for Monday, so he will be there,
and their season and ended late as well. Art and
a science. I think it's interesting and hopefully we'll get
upot I think in Aaron, I'm thinking we'll do next
Thursday when I'm back from the Combine and I can

(11:35):
empty the notebook here on this on this yere podcast
viewer note if you're a Good Morning Football viewer, we're
on all Monday through Friday. Kyle's on vacation, Jamie Erdall's
on vacation, but it will be myself, it'll be Jason mccordy,
and it'll be Colleen Wolf in studio in New York
on Monday. I'm gonna be in Indy for Tuesday Wednesday.

(11:58):
Like I said, just NonStop, forty eight hours. Will not sleep.
We'll do as much, you know, hanging but also filling
the notebook up as I can. And I'm coming back
to New York for Thursday Friday shows in studio, and
I'm flying back to Indianapolis to be there for the drills.
We're all be on the broadcast with Chris Rose up

(12:18):
on the second concourse, which means you've got Eisen and
Charles Davis, and you've got Daniel Jeremiah on the call
and then hey in pockets here shreger, what do you got?
And I'll just give you all the good juice. And
this is sentimental for me. Last year, I'll never forget.
It was the Friday night of the combine. I had

(12:39):
been there for five days, we were grinding, and it's
when my wife gave me a text Friday night, and
I'll never forget it was Will Levis Hawk. It wasn't
even Will Levis working out, but it was Will Levis
talk about of all time. And I've gone back and
watching a clip of all topics it was Will Levis,
how will he perform in the NFL, because when he

(13:03):
lost Liam Cohen, who was offensive coordinator at Kentucky, his
numbers went down. When Liam went to the Rams, Will
Levis's numbers plummeted, did not have as good a season
as he did the year before where he lit up
the SEC. And then it was me talking about, Okay, well,
what kind of offense will he fit in. He's obviously
gonna be our first round pick. And my wife texts

(13:24):
me and says, you've got to get out of here.
You got to fly back home asap because we're about
to have our second child. So I had to bail
on the combine early. That was Friday, and then I
immediately got out of there and took care of some
family business. And we've got our baby, Betty. But I
missed last year Saturday and Sunday because of things happening

(13:46):
a little earlier than we anticipated. But Will Levis, I
Aaron I lobbied to name our child Betty Levis Schrager.
And it did not. It didn't, it didn't win. I
thought that was a connection to football into Indianapolis and
to Will Levis, not Betty High voltage. Oh, not Betty
high voltage, Not Betty sat l Low's Betty Betty Levis Schregger.

(14:10):
But Will went in the second round, you know that.
And here he is starting quarterback. And basically Brian Callahan
gets the head coaching job on the premise that he's
gonna get the most out of Will Levis. Stag's gonna
join us quickly. I'd just real small quick note. Adam
Schefter had a tweet that was similar to a tweet

(14:30):
that I had about two weeks ago, and it comes
off of a really you know, it's not one that's
going to move the needle at all. But interestingly enough,
USC running backs coach Keil McDonald, who I don't know
at all. I texted Cliff Cliff's like, he's the man,
He's great. So he was a USC running backs coach
under Cliff who was under Lincoln Riley at the USC Okay,

(14:54):
he had a chance to be a college offensive coordinator
and opted to not do that, not be a college OC,
but instead to jump to the NFL and be the
Chargers running backs coach. And shef there's tweet, and I
think Adam's really good at hearing think from people but
this this has spotted on. He says, a trend that
has emerged this winter. Many college coaches are tired of

(15:14):
the transfer portal, the nil money in the new NA world.
Don't just prefer to work in the NFL. Many college
coaches have already left, many more want to. I guys,
I can't stress this enough. There's a mass exodus from
the college game as far as coaches go. They don't
want to deal with this anymore. And two good examples.
Jeff Hafley was the head coach at Boston College, making

(15:35):
millions and millions of dollars, and BC is a is
an ACC school, and they've got all this you know, history,
and Tom O'Brien and Tom Coughlin and all this history
and Doug Flutie and Glenn Foley and all that, say Flowers.
In recent years, Aflee left being a head coach to
be a defensive coordinator of the Packers. That sounds like

(15:56):
a down move, going from head coach and a major
college program to a DC in the NFL. He did that, Kingsbury.
So many faulty reports out there, and I was biting
my tongue, but he's gonna get the Houston job. He's
gonna get to Texas a and m job. Cliff to
anyone who knew him, saying, I will never be a
head coaching college again. Never will do that. That's hell
to go, do you know, to recruit a high school

(16:19):
kid non stop with money, the nil money, and then
for the kid to commit, and then for him to
decommit or then to stay for a year, then have
to beg him to stay like that's not no one wants.
That's that's not coaching football. That's that's a whole other business.
Cliff says no to all that and decides to instead
of being a college head coach, which he could have
had several jobs, he says, I'll just be an NFL

(16:40):
offensive coordinator. I'm good with that, and we'll see what
happens from there. And in this case, you're getting Kill McDonald,
who could have been a college offensive coordinator. He coached
at Utah and USC and worked for Zach Moss and
and other guys. You know. Before that he was with
Marshawn Lloyd, who's a top prospect in this year's draft.
He says, Nah, I'm good, I'll be a I don't

(17:01):
need to be a college offensive coordinator and work up
those ranks. I'll instead go there. And the last one
was Chip Kelly, who I think made it very clear
he was a head coach at that You can see
LA he's still a head coach at UCLA and he's like,
all right, does anyone want me as an OC in
the NFL. Made it very clear that he was interested,
having had his name tied to many teams throughout this process.
So just an interesting thing to watch one of the fallouts. Yes,

(17:24):
we all want the players to be taken care of,
and we all want nil and we all want all
these guys to get as much as they can. But
from the coaching side, yeah, for years, for twenty years,
we've said these college coaches have had a great sweet
gig in that they can leave whenever and no one
bats in an eye and everyone just gets paid and
it's money, money, money, money, money.

Speaker 3 (17:44):
Yeah.

Speaker 2 (17:44):
I think a lot of these coaches are like, at
the end of the day, I'd like to cut coach football,
and I don't want to deal with the money, money, money, money, money.
And it's amazing that the NCCA and amateur sports is
becoming that while in the NFL it's just all right,
coach ball, do x's and o's do it while you
got into this thing. Speaking of coaching ball and axes
and o's, I could not be more excited for our
next guest. He is a four time Super Bowl champion

(18:05):
as a quarter and he is a gem of a
human being. And Steve Spagnolo joins his next It's my
great honor and a pleasure for a guy I've gotten
to know really well over the last few years. He's
one of the most successful coaches in NFL history, and

(18:26):
he is a super Bowl champion yet again. Uh, what
a thrill for us here about ten days removed from
his fourth super Bowl title, Steve Spagnola, Welcome to the
season with Peter Shaker.

Speaker 4 (18:39):
Love it. P doesn't honor to be on this show?
Are you kidding me?

Speaker 2 (18:42):
Yeah?

Speaker 4 (18:42):
Who the thug it?

Speaker 2 (18:44):
Look I'm looking at I googled. I googled something because
I'm so tech savvy. Which coordinators have won the most
Super Bowl titles? And what comes up is this The
defensive coordinator who is one of the most Super Bowl
titles is Steve Spagnolo, who now holds the record for
any DC and NFL history with four. Washington's Richie Pettibaum
Pettybone nineteen eighty two eighty seven one and Romeo Crnell

(19:08):
won three to four each have three, but Spagnolo has four.
When you hear that, what is your reaction?

Speaker 4 (19:15):
Well, first of all, I know those two coaches. I
got a lot of respect for it.

Speaker 5 (19:19):
So I did an internship Pete way back, and I
want to say it was the fall of eighty two
or eighty three years after the Redskins when they were
the Washington Redskins. Yeah, when their first well, and Richie
Pettibone was the decoordinate.

Speaker 4 (19:30):
I got to know, I love coach. How about that?
How about that?

Speaker 5 (19:34):
And then fast forward whatever that is thirty something years
and uh, it's quite a not very humbling Listen. I
think every coach will tell you, Pete that when a
coach gets an award, it's not a it's not an
individual award. I mean, you can't get coaching awards for
winning or being successful on one unit without a bunch
of players and a bunch of assistant coaches. So to me,

(19:54):
it's just a it's a reflection of all the good
people I've worked with.

Speaker 2 (19:57):
Yeah, and Deyonder to be lone guy in his story.
It's for any coordinator too, because no offensive coordinator is
one four. You're the loan, four time seer a champion
as a coordinator, each different season tells the story, right,
So you had the seven Giants, which you've been the Patriots,
and then you've had these three with the Chiefs. What's

(20:18):
ten days removed? What's the what's the story of this group,
and what's the feeling you have removed? The takeaway of
like what you look back on or what you do
in the in the near history or the recent history
of of what really stands out from this unit.

Speaker 5 (20:32):
Yeah, I'll tell you what. What stands out I've said
this a lot, Pete is the the tremendous culmination of
a high IQ players. I mean I've worked with some
real high i Q football players. I mean, you guys
know Antonio Pierce is the head coach in the league. Now,
you guy, I don't know if you were to be.

(20:52):
I mean you remember the Jeremiah Trot James Lawernitis that
I had. I'm thinking about all these linebackers that we
worked with that we're really really smart. But the Sam
Madison's you know, the the Kavika Mitchell's the.

Speaker 4 (21:03):
Guys that we had in New York.

Speaker 5 (21:04):
But as a as a group, as a unit, as
a number, this was the highest total of high IQ players.
Combine that with high character guys, really good assistant coaches.
That's what sticks out like we were able peak quite honestly,
to be multiple because we had guys like Nick Bolton
and you know, guys like l J. Sneed and you

(21:24):
know guys up front like Mike Dana, you know Turk.
I mean, guys that they just get football, they love
embracing football. Drew Trank, will you know all these guys
that we had in line back in Leo Chanel.

Speaker 4 (21:36):
They just eat, drink and sleep at Pete.

Speaker 5 (21:39):
And when you have that and then you're throw in
a bunch of good assistant coaches, I mean, it made
it for a really good recipe.

Speaker 2 (21:45):
This is the craziest stat that didn't get enough love.
The Chiefs were the youngest defense in the league this year.
And you're talking about your naming guys like like l J.
Snead and of course you know Danas, I think in
his fifth year in the league. But Trenton McDuffie stepped up.
Willie Gay was awesome when you guys needed them. There's
so much youth on this roster, and yet all those guys,

(22:07):
the mental errors were not there. They were Johnny on
the spot every time they had to be.

Speaker 4 (22:11):
Yeah, you know, Pete, it's funny.

Speaker 5 (22:12):
I think this time last year when you and I
talked a little bit after the game. I mean, we
were pretty young last year with I mean that secondary
was specifically young with three true rookies and Trent, Josh
and Jalen. But you're right, the the other guys that
feel like they're veterans now have only been two or
three years in the league. And so but I tell

(22:32):
you what, Peter, I've said this before. When so when
you make that statement or or we talk about that,
you can't help but credit the assistant coaches for that
because one person can't do it or coordinator can't do it.
And players need to be fed all of this information.
They need to embrace it, but it needs to be
fed in a way that they understand it, they get

(22:53):
it and they can play fast. And I got a
great staff. I don't know how if you get a
chance to get to know those guys, Pete, but shut out. Yeah,
Dave Merrit Brendan Daily, Joe Cullen, Terry Braid, Rod Wilson,
Alex witting Him, Donald Delacio. I don't think I've missed anybody,
but it's a great group. I'll tell you to think

(23:13):
so when you are blessed to go is fir in
the playoffs as we have for these past five years.
The downside is all of these guys who should be
coordinated or should be moving up in the league. It's
hard to do, Pete right, because the jobs are all
washed up by the time you get done in February eleventh.
And now, listen, it's a blessing to win Super Bowls

(23:33):
and all that. I don't think any of these guys
are going to give their rings back for a job,
but I mean it's truly so. I just don't think
they get enough credit, Pete, and I just want to
make sure that we always recognize what they mean in
the middle of this whole thing.

Speaker 2 (23:46):
I don't know if you get enough credit. I thought,
I don't know if he saw and I know you're
not living on Twitter one of the fortunate ones. I
made a big case how absurd it was that you
weren't being mentioned for head coaching jobs. And you're probably blushing, like,
don't even go there. Kevin Demoff comes out of the cobwebs.
I don't even know where he and he goes on
a ten.

Speaker 5 (24:04):
Tweet any of this, Well, somebody sent it to me
and I'll tell you what I and I did text Kevin.

Speaker 2 (24:12):
Let me give the context first, but the listeners them
Off was in Saint Louis, where you were the head
coach for three years, and Kevin listened about fifteen reasons
why you had no chance to actually have great success
because of the ownership change, because of things that were
done before you got there, because of just the climate
of what was going on in Saint Louis and the

(24:33):
money and all this stuff. And Kevin wore it and
was like, let maybe the first to tell you Spags
would be an incredible head coach and should have been.
He didn't have the resources or the opportunity that others
had to really have success. And I thought that was
pretty cool to get that from a guy who, for
being honest, they fired you. And yet he's coming back
ten years later and he's like, no, no, no, no, no, no,

(24:54):
that was not on. That was not on. Steve.

Speaker 5 (24:56):
Yeah, well it was Listen, it was really nice of
Kevin to say. I've always had a lot of respect
for him. I think he's a real intelligent guy in
this business. And listen, it was a challenge. I'd do
it again because the lessons you learn, you and I
both know this, right, The lessons you learned from failure
usually or more valuable than the ones that you learned
from success, and so I think there was some valuable lessons.

(25:18):
There were some tremendous relationships pulled from there, and there's
some things that we're really proud of. I mean, the
overall record wasn't great, but I really enjoyed our twenty
ten season. We went from the twenty two thousand and
nine where we were one and fifteen, and we drafted
Sam Bradford, who I thought was really really good. He
was exceptional, and that he was the offensive rookie of

(25:39):
the year. In twenty ten, you know, we were one game,
last game of the season. If we win, we're in
the playoffs, so that we're proud of. And then it
kind of fell apart in twenty eleven. And listen, we
all get this business and it's about winning, and we
didn't win enough game, so it happens. But nice Kevin
to say that's all in the past. Now, listen, I'm
blessed to have the things happen after that. And you know,
God puts us on these these trails and these journeys

(26:01):
for a reason, Pete, and all of it's been very
valuable for me.

Speaker 2 (26:05):
Yeah. Obviously your career, it is so decorated with different players.
You were mentioning the Jeremiah Trotters and the Kavika Mitchells,
but also legendary coaches. You and I texted when you
guys had headed over to Germany. You're like, you know,
I used to coach in the world link and here
we are and I'm going back and I'm coaching in

(26:25):
Germany and this is thirty years ago. Take us through
some of your mentors coaching wise, who really get a
few opportunities to elevate your career and move in this
amazing path and have this journey to win four titles.
The defensive coordinator.

Speaker 5 (26:38):
No, a great question, Pete. I'm glad you asked it.
I love talking about it. If I go, if I've
moved backwards, I mean, how blessed am I to worked
with what I considered two Hall of Fame NFL coaches
and Andy Reid and Tom Coughlin, and then you know,
in a close friend of mine, John Harbor, I spent
two years in Baltimore with which was there was some growth.
You know, listen, you know when your peers, when you

(26:59):
get to watch your peers do of it, and you
know exactly what he's thinking and doing, and you're able
to pick.

Speaker 4 (27:04):
Apart his brain. That was too valuable years.

Speaker 5 (27:07):
But you know, and then they go all the way
back to college where I don't know if you remember
this thing, Pete, but Jack mcnell was the head coach
of the Boston College Eagles when Doug Flutie was the
quarterback there and had that miracle down there in Miami.
But I worked for Jack in one of those years
in NFL Europe. And you know, Dick Curle was the

(27:27):
head coach of the Franklin Galaxy to what you were
talking about, And Dick was nice enough to hire me
his defensive coordinator. But you know, as much as the
head coach Bill Russo, I worked for Tom Jackson in Connecticut.
I mean, the list goes on and on. Tim Murphy
who just retired at Harvard. He's the Harvard head coach.
He was head coach at Maine at one time and

(27:47):
I worked for him for a brief period. But you know,
as much as the head coaches, Pete, you know, we
learn and grow from the guys we work with as
assistant coaches across the board.

Speaker 4 (27:58):
And I love that part of it.

Speaker 5 (27:59):
I mean, one of the things John Harburn I used
to do when we were back in Philadelphia were together
for eight years, both assistants. He was a special teams
coordinator and I either have the secondary linebackers, whatever year
it was, but we would evaluate each other, Pete, so
he would spend a day, you know, as a special
teams coach, he could watch all the other coaches. I'd say, John,

(28:20):
just watch me for a day and then just give
me feedback at things that I need to work on.

Speaker 4 (28:24):
And then I would do the same for him.

Speaker 5 (28:26):
I'd go out watch a special teams practice and then
we used to bounce those things off of each other
all the time. And so I think when you do that,
the growth is just greater than just what you might
get from a clinic or from working from the head coach,
but just the relationships to me or with what Terrrish and.

Speaker 2 (28:43):
Of course the late great Jim Johnson had such an impact.
Talk about who he was and what he.

Speaker 1 (28:48):
Did to the game.

Speaker 5 (28:50):
Listen, I don't think any of us and you know
the list Pete of the guys that worked for the gym, myself,
Ron Vera, Leslie Fraser, Sean McDermott, John Harbor. I think
the list goes on and on, right, and the influence
he had on all of us from a defensive perspective,
he was. We were at the Combine one time and
I remember, so, I'm I don't know, I'm early forties,

(29:13):
and you know, Jim's into his mid sixties and he's
kind of at the end of his career, but he's
doing great. You know, We're kicking butt in Philadelphia defensively,
and one of his buddies, who's probably the same age,
comes up to him and says, hey, Jim, I see
you finally got your retirement defense in and so we
didn't really know what he was talking about, so we
asked him. He goes, well, Jim's wanted to do all

(29:33):
of these exotic, crazy defenses, and now he doesn't because
he figures if they didn't work, he's retiring anyway, right,
I thought that was the greatest line in the world. Yeah,
because one of the things Jim did do, and you
know from watching it, was he would take he would
take some real chances at what we did and overloaded. Yeah,

(29:54):
it's not as much of a chance when you got
Brian Doctors doing it. But I'll tell you what, there
were the things we did that were a little unconventional.

Speaker 4 (30:02):
And we still do him today. I mean we don't.

Speaker 5 (30:04):
Yeah, we offensive offensive is pretty smart now, so they'll
hurt you if you get too crazy. But because of
his influences where I'm going, I think a lot of
us have things that we wouldn't have had had we
not worked.

Speaker 2 (30:15):
With Jim Giants era. You go there two thousand and seven.
Obviously you guys have all this incredible playoff front. Talk
about that defensive front and working with talking o C
and straighthand and of course Jay Alford and Dave Tollison
and I love I love that O seven Giants defense,
And if you can give us a little color on
preparing for that offense, which at the time was the

(30:36):
greatest offense the NFL had ever seen, and having those
teen days to build some sort of defensive game plan.

Speaker 4 (30:42):
I remember Pete.

Speaker 5 (30:45):
In the lead up to the game, you know, looking
at them as you watch the tape, and Tom Brady
and the weapons they had, Randy Moss, all of them.
I'm just saying, oh my god, if we could just
hold them under thirty five, you know, maybe we gotta
Maybe we got a chance to be If we don't,
we got no chance. But I mean, that's how dynamic
they were. But you led this thing with those naids

(31:05):
up front, and any defense has to start up front.
So but I will say this, I'm going to go
back to Antonio piss. He was the glue in the
middle that.

Speaker 4 (31:15):
Really kept it all agether like he could. He could.

Speaker 5 (31:17):
That's why he said, a good head coach now he
could connect all the rooms because he can speak the
language of the dbs and the linebackers and the d line.
He can go over to the offensive guys and he can.
I mean, he can rile things up and he knows
how to get people.

Speaker 4 (31:30):
And that's why he's so good at what he's doing.

Speaker 5 (31:32):
Now.

Speaker 4 (31:32):
I knew.

Speaker 5 (31:32):
I told his dad five years ago when he got
in the league's assistant I said, heyp the head coach
in five years.

Speaker 4 (31:38):
Yeah, he beat it by two years because that that's Antonio.

Speaker 2 (31:40):
But do you remember he was an NFC Championship game.
He has a hit on either Ryan Grant or Brandon
Jackson and it's up in green Bay and Antonio Pierce
saves a touchdown on a third and long and a
little screen path. It's one of the greatest defensive plays
the Giants ever had.

Speaker 4 (31:55):
Pete great memory. He would it off too.

Speaker 5 (31:58):
There was nobody there if he gets blocked by green
Bay's offensive lineman. I mean, he would have been in
the in the end z on his huge play. I
mean it was that might have been Pete. It might
have been one of those risky calls that you say,
shot here and Antonio saved us. But then you go
back on the back end there you know Sam Madison,
who's coaching now that with the Miami Dolphins, he was

(32:20):
a corner, Corey Webs That, James Butler, Jabelle Wilson. I mean,
we had a bunch of guys that just, you know,
not household names, not superstars, you know, but they it
was just another group that played like that high IQ.
It was a little rough early in the year, but
because they all stuck with it, and they believed in it,
and they believed in each other.

Speaker 4 (32:40):
They got better and better and better.

Speaker 5 (32:42):
And then in that game, I mean, the biggest thing
in that game for us Pete was we didn't allow
I don't think we allowed to pass completion over twenty yards.
In other words, we didn't allow the explosive pass play,
which is the same thing that happened in this past one.
And I think when you do that, you know, and
you can make a play here or there, you can
keep the point total down.

Speaker 4 (33:02):
And you know, we certainly did it in that game
and obviously in this past one too.

Speaker 2 (33:05):
You've coached all these two was just you've won four,
but there's other games that you coached in there. The
super Bowl week, I thought Mahomes had such a subtle
little comment that didn't get enough pickup, and I went
big on it. Good Lord football. He said, yeah, and
I'm doing my pat voice. Yeah, you know, it's we're
just gonna I'm just gonna do what I always do
this week. I'm gonna stick to my routine. And I said,
what a subtle flex that he has a super Bowl

(33:26):
week routine, like so many players just just desire to
get to one and he's got a superw week routine
that he does. You must have it too. When do
you start cracking open the books on a Niners offense?
Does that start the second you get home? After you guys,
you know, beat the Ravens on Sunday or you take
a couple of days and then you know you're a
mastermind and you're gonna be humble about it. But when

(33:48):
do you start employing like, here's how we stop this team?

Speaker 5 (33:52):
Well, it does happen that Monday, Like we did not
do very much with the previous games, so we we
win the we went in Baltimore, right, we have the
tell you what was different, Pete, was we had a
plane flight after an AFC Chanir.

Speaker 4 (34:08):
We had been home, so that was a.

Speaker 5 (34:09):
Little bit different. That was enjoyable and normal, No flex
It just kind of popped in my head. But you know,
normally on the plane after a game, I would watch
the game that we just played on the iPad.

Speaker 4 (34:23):
I didn't do that. I just I just forgured that
was time. Let's just enjoy this.

Speaker 5 (34:26):
But the minute we got out on Monday morning, it
was right into San Francisco. And the way Andy does
things is we we kind of keep a normal week
for that first sweek Peete. The only thing that's different
is getting ready with tickets and all that. But but
he pushed it back one day. So when we finally
got to Wednesday during that week, it was an NFL Tuesday,

(34:47):
and then Thursday was an NFL Wednesday, and we got
on a normal flow, so that by the time we
got on the plane on Sunday, really eighty eighty eighty
five percent of the work is done. Now there's some tweaking,
and that's where coaches can get themselves in trouble.

Speaker 4 (35:02):
Other week. Yeah, and that goes on too.

Speaker 5 (35:05):
And I always tell I told the defensive staff, make
sure you put a put some rains in on me,
because if I walk in here and say, hey, we
need to put this in, you know, give me the whoa,
whoa whoa, we might not need to do that. And
so that's a challenge that that second week is a
challenge for a lot of reasons. You know, keeping the
guys focus, which I guys do a great job of
making sure you're not putting too much in because you

(35:26):
have the extra week looking at too much film.

Speaker 4 (35:28):
I have to stop myself from watching film.

Speaker 2 (35:30):
One are you one of those film junkies, and I
don't know that about he's what like, I know, I
talked to McVeigh a lot, and he'll be up at
four in the morning looking at like nineteen ninety eight film.
I'm like, what are you doing?

Speaker 5 (35:38):
Yeah, yeah, well I listen, I don't. Every once in
a while you go back and have it. Oh I
got to go back and look at such and such.
That's where you drive the video people crazy. Right, he
can get me the get me the fellow out feed
Eagles two thousand and one whatever, and then they got
to go digging for it. Uh. But yeah, I think
we're all built like that, Pete, because that's where it begins, right,

(35:58):
That's where your ideas and formulated. That's where you can
and this is listen, this is a big barrow and
still defense. I mean off borrowing field love that no
beg bar.

Speaker 4 (36:07):
And steel profession. We all do that.

Speaker 5 (36:09):
Like you'll see a You'll see and I don't what
did they do? And you might tweak it a little bit,
but you're stealing it from something, right, because nobody's got
an original idea anymore. But that's what the beauty of
this game is. It ghosts in cycles, right, I mean,
we're seeing some running football coming back now after years
and years of all the spread and throwing it all
over the place and uh, and you just try to

(36:30):
stay ahead of the cycle.

Speaker 4 (36:31):
But I think we all enjoy.

Speaker 5 (36:32):
If you don't enjoy grind and tape, then you're probably
not in the right business.

Speaker 2 (36:36):
I said, the biggest X factor is going to be
Spags versus Kyle Shanahan. And they had their big plays
like McCaffrey got his you know at points, but you
got it was Ben but don't break. For the most
part for you guys, Yeah, the challenge of preparing for
that offense. What was that like going into this thing?

Speaker 5 (36:53):
Well, not only do they have all those weapons like
you and I know, but I mean Kyle, Kyle is
really good. He made everything look the same. You know,
that kind of goes all the way back to his dad.
I've always thought that that was a hard offense to defend,
and with all those weapons, it was just one of
those games where you couldn't say, okay, okay, we just
need to take that away because the minute you did that,

(37:15):
he had so many other places to go. And then
Kyle figures that out but it did begin with the
running back. I mean, we couldn't let Christian McCaffey and
he got you know, he he poked away at a
couple of runs and you know, and had a pass
completion that we just couldn't get there in time. Like
Edward was almost made the tackle, but then they sped
out because he that high step that un do he

(37:36):
just right, Yeah, I think I've seen you do that before.

Speaker 2 (37:40):
Yeah, that's in the streets of New York. That's me
running from the top.

Speaker 5 (37:45):
But I mean with that offense, I mean, that's why
they were so good all year long. There just but
I will say this Ore what really helped us was
l J. Trent, whether Josh and Jalen was in there,
because we did have to switch in the middle of
that game to play a little bit more.

Speaker 4 (38:00):
Man.

Speaker 5 (38:00):
I just didn't think that his own coverage was was
tight enough, and they had a couple of completions that
those in breaking that they always get. I thought our
linebackers could get deep enough and our quarter safeties would
be there.

Speaker 4 (38:12):
But they're just so good they and I think rocked
pretty Uh. I think he's terrific.

Speaker 2 (38:18):
Watched you watched all the games and you know there's
guys on TV me included who poke holes and pies.

Speaker 4 (38:24):
No, you got to watch the whole Yeah, I didn't
find many. I did tell you.

Speaker 5 (38:28):
The other thing that that stuck out was and those
you know, so we played tour, we play, uh, Josh
Allen play with Jackson, and you've got to worry about
those guys always running football. So we get now it's
going to be San Francisco. We haven't watched a lot
of film with them, so I don't really know him. Okay,
it's a backup quarterback. Okay, maybe he's not a runner.
Maybe we maybe we can get a little break here.

(38:51):
I turned the film Lin and then he's ripping Green
Bay and Detroit with a couple of you know, the
run plays that were against the Troit And I said, okay,
here we go. We got another one. I will I'll
tell I'll be honest with you. I just texted Brock
the other day. I tried to track down and sell number.
I just wanted to tell him how much respect I
have for him. Well, dude, I love a terrific game

(39:12):
he played. I mean, and he's he's such a quality guy,
strong Christian man, and I respect all of that, and
I'm happy for all his success.

Speaker 4 (39:21):
I'm glad he didn't have quite.

Speaker 2 (39:25):
But let's get Let's get to the big spot because
it's third and four, and if Perdy converts a first down,
the game is essentially over because Patt doesn't get the
ball back and you send McDuffie on a blitz. Now,
I've watched this play and I haven't spoken about it
on television or I haven't spoken to Kyle about it.
I thought it was interesting they had Kittle in the
backfield as the blocker and not McCaffrey, who's traditionally back there.

(39:47):
Did that Did that raise a red flag to you
and say, okay, we've got something that What was your
thought on third and four coming out of a huge
stop to play beforehand, because if they get the first down,
they belave the clock kick a field goal, game is over.

Speaker 4 (39:59):
I think that was Did Trent make that play on
the kid on that it was a great tackle. Well,
here's what happened, Pete.

Speaker 5 (40:06):
So if you remember on that play, there was about
two twenty or something or two fifteen when they broke
the huddle. So we made a call because I didn't
know if he was going to let it come down
to the two minute or not, and they decided to
let it come down. We made a particular call. And
then when I went to the two minute warning, of course,
with the with the Super Bowl.

Speaker 2 (40:26):
With these times, big break to discuss.

Speaker 4 (40:28):
Big break, huge break. So that's when the wheels go
like this.

Speaker 5 (40:31):
And so it was at that moment, you look, okay,
this is really In my mind, I said to my
this is really this is a fourth down play.

Speaker 4 (40:38):
This is not a third and four or five what
it was. This is critical. I had a thought.

Speaker 5 (40:43):
I looked at my list and I said, I need
to ask Nick about this. This is the trust I
had in Nick Bolton. So Nick's on the field now
he can't he can't talk to me, but I'm staring
right at him. I clicked the button and I said, Nick,
what do you think about this? All I wanted to
do was see his reaction, and he just stided yes, yes, yes,
and he did the signal and it he was like

(41:03):
he was all in. And so I knew I know
when he was all in that we should change it
to that. So changed personnel and put a different call
in and it was a fourth down call or or
what we had on our fourth down list, and it
was for the critical situation and fortunately for us, you know,
our guys executed it really well. I mean to Mario O'Connor,

(41:24):
if you go back and watch it, Pete, he kind
of goes back.

Speaker 4 (41:27):
He at first he was a little.

Speaker 5 (41:29):
Bit confused because the to the point that you're making
about Kittle being in the backfield.

Speaker 4 (41:34):
But the guys unwounded, and uh, Jay Reid was critical
in it. Trent was critical, and you.

Speaker 2 (41:39):
Know, and Tred hits that hole and comes right in
and does he tip the pass or is he just enough?
He did?

Speaker 4 (41:46):
He's really good at that.

Speaker 5 (41:47):
I mean, we you know, we we're all about trying
to find free runners, right however we can dissect it
and can't always get them. But in that play, we did,
and I you know, I watch it and I thought
our man coverage Dean Bush was in it because we
had if you watch it, I think there's eight DB's
in there or something, only have two lines, and it
was something that we had. But you know, I think

(42:09):
Dion's gonna I think theon's going to make a break
in such a way that I maybe he knocks it down.
So I just got the guys the way they played
it was, they executed it perfect and.

Speaker 2 (42:20):
You get the ball back and on that moment you
go to there, everyone's coming to the sidelines. Are you
guys just freaking like, Yes, we did it, like we
need to make a stop work and we did it.
Like that's got to be the coolest. You change the
play call at the two minute warning, you get the
play and now you give my homes a chance, and
you have to have the utmost confidence that, oh, well,
this dude's going to get it done.

Speaker 4 (42:38):
Well, there's no question about that.

Speaker 5 (42:39):
Now, we'd rather not put him in that situation, you know,
because that's got to come down and tie it. But
all the confidence in the world and Patrick and our guys,
I think know that if we could have just I
think I think early in that particular drive we're talking about,
they hit they hit one of their longer passes early

(43:00):
in that drive. Now that you know, we're talking about
the good one, but I'm always thinking about the one
that it should change. And then there was one and
then the one that that sticks out is the third
and thirteen in overtime that we got the penalty on
tr hold little tug. Yeah, and uh, you know they
called it, so that's the way this is. But it
would have been nice if we could have sent Patrick
Heldea right, yeah, and then kick a field goal. But

(43:22):
that's okay. I mean, it was dramatic for the public.
We wanted we wanted the public to have a dramatic game.

Speaker 2 (43:27):
It was pretty I guess my next question is, you know,
with with that victory and you guys are are celebrating
and the deal liked, do the players do they you're
talking about McDuffie now has two Super Bowl rings in
two years and Sneed's got three trips to the Super Bowl? Like,
do the players recognize just how special this is? Do

(43:49):
you think they understand just how absurd it is what
you guys are doing.

Speaker 5 (43:53):
That is a great question, probably better question for them.
I mean you're trying to remind them. But in the
middle of it, you know, me all the dancing in
the locker room, and I was just enjoying the moment.
I think that we all will someday, you know, be
able to to kick back and say wow, because look
at and here's his the beauty of these elite athletes.
I'm talking about Patrick and Travis and Trent and l

(44:15):
J and all these guys and Chris Jones. The minute
you know we're in the middle of that celebration, they're
talking about trying to win the third one, and it's
just I mean, for Patrick to to think of that
on the field, I'm like, man, I need a break.
He's talking about one to the third one. But isn't
that the beauty of these elite athletes. That's how they're wired,

(44:36):
that's how they're built.

Speaker 2 (44:38):
That's a good transition. I went on Fox Sports once,
so usually I'm an NFL network, but we're off for
the week and they asked me if I wanted to
come on Fox Sports one. I went on it yesterday
with Nick Wright, who's a fellow Kansas City. Yeah, big thought.
He's a big fan. Nick's a great dude, and he
was at the parade and all this stuff. And we're
on the show and we're talking about Chris Jones and

(44:58):
I'm not going to ask you about where you think
that contract and all that is. That's not your job
and you just coach the guys and you don't have
to worry about that. But I said, if he never
takes another snap again, I think Chris Jones is a
Hall of Famer. And I'll go further. When they did
the Coach the Defensive Player of the Year voting, he
didn't get a single vote. Eleven other players did. We're
talking guys like Deron Bland and Dexter Lawrence are getting votes,

(45:19):
but Chris Jones didn't get a single vote. I think
he might be the under the most underappreciated player of
this entire Chiefs run, and maybe the most underappreciated defensive
player of his generation. You've coached him the whole way
through Chris Jones, talk about what he brings to the table,
how much he's come a long way too. In the
last he's now a leader on this defense, which I

(45:40):
love to see.

Speaker 5 (45:42):
His growth just even throughout this year was just awesome
to watch and see. And I told him that we
had our exit interview and we talked to him a
little bit. But you know, I don't know, Pete. Maybe
because he's been so good and so dominant, do people
just get used to it so when it's you know,
when it's only ten only right, when you get that
a half sacks, that's pretty good as an interior alignment.

(46:04):
And yet people I think just I don't know, maybe
maybe the same maybe that happens with these elite athletes.
But I'm with you, Pete the year he had, the
impact he has for us defensively, the things that we're
able to do because we know people are going to
double them, you know, and you're anticipating that, and so
you do other things. That opens up for some of

(46:24):
our other guys. But I mean, we love him. I
hope we don't lose him. I mean, he knows that,
and I think I know he'd like to stay. We'll
see what happens, you know.

Speaker 4 (46:31):
How this league is.

Speaker 5 (46:31):
I mean, it's it's one of the Yeah, it's one
of the reasons during the course of this run of
the playoffs that, uh, you know, and I'm a Christian
guy and I have my prayer time, but I was
always praying, just give me one more week with these guys.

Speaker 4 (46:44):
I just want to work with them one more week
because it's going to change.

Speaker 5 (46:47):
It's it's going to change, and that's the reality of it.
But the relationships remain.

Speaker 2 (46:51):
Yeah, as we turn the page, when do you kick
it back up and say, Okay, I'm looking at a
prospect from Kansas State or TCU. I mean, do you
give yourself that grace period of guys, Can we just
enjoy this for two weeks or do you get right
back into combine mode.

Speaker 5 (47:05):
Well, the I think we got right back into it
was evaluating our own guys, because we've got to, you know,
we visit with Brett vieach who's the best. And then
I'll be honest with you, I have not done these
last four or five days. I have not done much.
This was all Maria time. This was all is all
Maria time. And when we get to Monday, I think
we'll be kicking it right back into full mode and

(47:26):
we need to do that.

Speaker 4 (47:26):
We're behind a little bit. That's what happens when you
go on these long playoff runs.

Speaker 2 (47:30):
But we'll get caught up two questions and then we'll
let's just enjoy the last couple of days of freedom
before we get back into football. But yeah, you mentioned Maria,
your lovely wife, and I think Chris Jones had some
really cool stuff about her cooking and what she provides
the team. That was the first time I'd heard that.
Maybe I just not in the Kansas City day to
day Chicken parm or was it veal parm?

Speaker 5 (47:53):
What special Okay, you name it, she can cook it.
She's still she does soul food. She does everything. It's
not just the Italian. She's full italianed and she's a
great But you know what, Pete, she loves to do it.
It's her way of She'll say this all the time.
It's her way of connecting with these guys, and it's
her way of showing her love full of them. Like

(48:14):
I mean, everybody needs to and these guys are all away,
you know, for the most part, away from home, right,
they don't they don't get home cooked meals.

Speaker 4 (48:20):
So we make it fun. We have what we call
the Cram Award, you know, and the guy that.

Speaker 5 (48:23):
Has the big hit it's the Big play Deposta, and
she makes stuff on Fridays, there's always everybody always gets,
you know, either the banana pudding or some kind of
cake or something on Friday, and then Saturday wee give
out the award.

Speaker 4 (48:36):
But I think the guys enjoy it and we like,
we love doing it too.

Speaker 2 (48:39):
I love it. And my last one is you mentioned
the head coaching stuff, and I think everyone takes it
for Greade, like, oh well, he wouldn't want it. I
thought it was interesting you said that you'd be interested
in again and then to maybe become my head coach again,
And I don't think it's out of the out of
the picture. Is that something you still aspire for and
something is a goal or is it just if that
happened to happen, you'd be happy. You're blessed either way.

Speaker 5 (49:02):
Yeah, I do feel that way. I know the avalianswer
it the same way I always do. We're prideful men
in this business. I mean, we want to win and
we want to show that we're capable of doing things right.
So I'm no different than the player. Would I love
to do it?

Speaker 2 (49:13):
Yes?

Speaker 5 (49:14):
If however, I always fall back on this and this
is always to follow up. If that never happens, I'm
okay with it. I put these things in God's hands.
It's if his, If it's his will to lead another
team and young men and mentor and teach, which is
what coaching is all about, then that I'll walk right
in it and full bore. If not, I'm so I'm

(49:34):
so blessed pede to have the job I have to
work with the guys that work.

Speaker 4 (49:38):
With Andy Reid.

Speaker 5 (49:39):
I mean, come on, you've got to be kidding me,
so I don't lose sleep over it. But the answer
to the question would be yes, I would, but if
it never happens, I'm okay too.

Speaker 2 (49:48):
It's a great answer, and you're at piece with it
either way. And guess what they can ever take away
four different Super Bowl titles from from you? One more
do you get in the full five finger tree? And
it got a wall you can you can do it that,
I quickly will say. You and I we've gotten to
each other in last couple of years pretty well. Well,
I'll never forget. You were the interim coach with the Giants.

(50:10):
I guess after Macadoo got let go? Was that what
it was? And it was Giants Eagles and everyone was
and it was it was after the Wents injury, so
Eagles were coming into town and everyone's like, all right,
we're not sure what the Eagles, but the Giants they're done.
And the way you got those Giants fight after the
coach being really and that was a good game. And
I remember the production meeting. You were so conscientious of

(50:32):
finishing the season strong and you were so hell bent
on getting the most out of these guys. And Eli
what was his future? We don't know he couldn't sing
higher praises of you. I think that's as commendable as
winning these these titles as a coordinator with this loaded
Chiefs team. But like, hey, that Giants team was going
nowhere and we're playing the Eagles in week sixteen and
we're going to give them hell.

Speaker 5 (50:51):
And I love that, you know, Pete, that's a I'm
glad you. But that's a great memory. It was a
hard time. It's not easy to do the interim head
coast thing in the middle of the seat, and it's
not easy on different guys. You haven't really had time
to put your spin on it. But that particular game,
I thought I guys fought harder. I think we we
might have went for a fourth thout something at the end.

Speaker 4 (51:10):
It was really close.

Speaker 5 (51:11):
We could have scored and won the game. But you don't, Pete,
when you were taught. When you were saying that, but
jumped into my mind. I've been blessed with these Super Bowls,
playoff runs, the whole thing. We won that that year.
We beat the Washington Redskins on the last game of
the season and the game meant nothing.

Speaker 4 (51:29):
It meant nothing to them. And then but I will
tell you this, I love winning that game.

Speaker 5 (51:34):
I walked into that locker room, I was excited about
winning that game as any I'd been a part of,
just because of what we had been through and just
the locker rooms celebrasion on any win especial. I mean
when you it's hard to explain what it's all about.
But guys that are in the business, players of coaches
or personnel know how hard it is just to win

(51:55):
one game in this league. And I just I cherished
that moment ended up with a you know the guys,
the equipment guy's got me a game ball and that
goo ball that meant nothing right is as valuable to
me as is any that. So thanks for bringing that up,
because that was that was a special time.

Speaker 2 (52:11):
That's so awesome. And my last story is probably five
years ago. You had just joined the Chiefs. You hadn't
even coached a game with the Chiefs yet it was combined.
It was late. I went to dinner with I'll name you.
The name was Joe Thomas, the offensive tackle who is
now getting into TV. It was his first foray into TV. So,
like I was at dinner, this gentleman named Mike Mariano,
who is now running Amazon's football stuff. Gentleman named Mike

(52:34):
Connor who's still with the NFL network, and a gentleman
named Charlie Yuk who's with the NFL Network. And we
go to dinner at one of the states, probably Shoola's
in the Weston. And afterwards, because we're fat pigs, we're like,
let's go get a milkshake from Steak and Shake. And
we walk in and it's empty. Steak and Shake is empty.
I get a banana milkshake. I'm so excited. It's literally
one am. This is terrible for my body and soul.

(52:56):
And then walked two bodies, Steve Spagnolo and Andy Reid,
walking in at one am, and I'm so excited. I'm
so excited to see what happens. I spilled my entire
milkshake all over myself and you and Andy Reader just
looking at me like you freaking kluts.

Speaker 4 (53:10):
I remember that, Hey, that's to be expected, that late
at night in the place like that, right.

Speaker 2 (53:15):
Come on, that's what it is. But you're grateful to
me then, and you've been great to me, said, I
appreciate these forty minutes. I can't wait to see you.
We'll hang at the combine for sure, but congratulations another
super Bowl ring. But as we've learned in this interview,
it's not just the Super Bowls, it's the entire journey,
and I think you appreciate that more than anybody.

Speaker 5 (53:36):
Yeah, very much so, Pete, appreciate to having me on.
This is great man, a lot of fun.

Speaker 2 (53:40):
The best. All right, guys, thank you, SPACs, appreciate it.

Speaker 4 (53:43):
Coming back to guys, thank you.

Speaker 2 (53:52):
The youngest defense in the league, they win a super Bowl,
his fourth as a coordinator. It's the only four time
Super Bowl champion as a coordinator. And he's a hell
of a guy. What'd you think of s bag there?

Speaker 3 (54:05):
You know, I wanted to dislike him, you know, the
best bill as a Bills fan, keep running into him.
As soon as he jumped on the call, I was like,
this guy's he's he's great. Yeah, I'm really unhappy with
how much I enjoyed him.

Speaker 2 (54:20):
Awesome and like the love he has. And what I
like is that he mentioned names like Kavika Mitchell and
James Butler and even on this defense Mike Dana, Like
these these are not household names, but you could tell
the love he has for all of the players. And
then when we talk about Chris Jones, of course he
goes big on you know, like I love Chris, but
it was no different than he has for Leo'shane. I

(54:42):
love that it's almost like a galitarian like that they're
all his guys.

Speaker 3 (54:45):
And no no hesitation to call out his entire staff
like this is nice. The first thing out of his
mouth or whatever was like, anytime you have this kind
of success, it's not a one person thing. There are
so many members of the staff that help. And then
his entire interview was him giving real examples of that,
like where his the p he's working with are helping

(55:07):
making Hanim communicate.

Speaker 2 (55:08):
Yeah totally.

Speaker 3 (55:09):
So yeah, he was great.

Speaker 2 (55:11):
I thought the last part of it when he says
he's a competitive guy in a competitive industry and he
would love to be a head coach. Again, it's interesting
zero head coaching interviews, not only this year but last
year as well. I think the time for a guy
in his sixties who is the defensive coordinator has passed
in this league. And if Belichick can't get a job

(55:32):
at seventy two, why would Spags get one? And then
I say screw that. Look how the young guys play
for him. Look how the young guys respond to him,
and maybe maybe this is a great oversight that Spags
didn't get head coaching interviews, and maybe his head coaching
career is not is not done. I'm very feel, very

(55:54):
passionate about the fact that he deserves another shot. Yeah.

Speaker 3 (55:59):
I mean again, as a Bills fan, I'd love for
him to go somewhere.

Speaker 2 (56:03):
Out of the division. Yeah, go out of the conference,
go coach someone else. Real quick housekeeping stuff. Like I said,
Good Morning Football, We'll be on all the next week
this podcast. I think we're gonna do it Thursday morning,
when I'm fresh off a Combine trip about to get
to the Combine. Maybe we'll do a little bit more
of a Combine preview. I'll have more stuff on these players. Obviously.

(56:26):
My weekend, I am Saturday afternoon taking my son to
the Harlem Globetrotters at the Madison Square Garden. Have you
ever seen the Globetrotters lives.

Speaker 3 (56:38):
As a young kid, Yeah, because you know, growing up
in Connecticut, we would our basketball team, like our rec league.
Every once in a while we would get to go
into was it the Trotters or was.

Speaker 2 (56:49):
It the Wizards? I got the I'm not trying to
knock the Harlem Wizards, but there was like a you know,
like Oreo and Highdrocks. There was a Yeah, there was
there was a there was a Harlem Wizards said. I
used to always see in our town and the Harlem
Wizards would come and I'd be like, oh, but they
weren't the Globe Trotter.

Speaker 3 (57:05):
I'm pretty sure it was the Globetrotters, Okay, especially if
I was if we were coming into the city to
see it wasn't that. Probably wasn't the Wizards. Like the
farm team that's the travel Maybe they.

Speaker 2 (57:17):
Would come to Freehold, New Jersey. The Globetrotters weren't coming
to Freehold, New Jersey.

Speaker 3 (57:20):
I think we saw the Globetrotters.

Speaker 2 (57:22):
I have a vague memory, and I got to ask
my friend Ryan if this is true. When we were
in elementary's school, this is not a fit. They had
Freal Township, which was the town I grew up. Then
there was Real Borough and at the Freehold Borough High School.
This must have been nineteen eighty nine, nineteen ninety the
New York Giants with oj Anderson and Stephen Baker, like

(57:46):
the Super Bowl champion Giants in nineteen ninety came and
played either the high school like faculty, or they played
the Wizards, or they played the Jets. Like I have
this vague memory of like a football team coming to
our hometown that would never happen today.

Speaker 3 (58:05):
A football team playing against your school faculty. That thinks,
that sounds like a mess.

Speaker 2 (58:11):
I have to look back on this, like that stuff
kind of happened back then, Like could you imagine like
the Chiefs going to play against the Kansas City High
School science teacher's that's a memory. I have to go
check it out. But like the Harlem Wizards were who
we got. I've never seen the Globetrotters live. My son
is into it. Go on to the garden, and then

(58:32):
I have one of the coolest deals. Because I've been
on this Chiefs bandwagon and because i have done the
big Slick charity function, I've become kind of embedded in
this Kansas City celebrity world. We've had Paul Rudd on
the podcast, We've had Eric stone Street. Well, I have
never asked anything of any of these people. I finally

(58:55):
asked for a favor, and it was to Heidi Gardner
Saturday Night Live cast member. She's fantastic in that movie
Hustle with Adam Sandlers. She's got commercials now. I think
Heidi's one of the funniest what. She lives in Brooklyn
and I have her number because we did the Big
Slick Tournament, Big Slick charity function and she and I

(59:16):
were at Children's Mercy Hospital visiting kids and we hit
it off. Friend, you know, through the chief stuff, but
also just love that she's in Brooklyn and I finally
sent the text, Is there any way I can get
a ticket for Saturday Night Live this week. I'm a
huge Shane Gillis fan. He's hosting SNL and I get

(59:39):
the email yesterday on Wednesday afternoon, here's your ticket Saturday
Night Live. Arrive at ten pm Eastern. Come to SNL.
I will be there for twenty one Savage and Shane
Gillis at thirty Rock on Saturday Night. Do I go
to the after party?

Speaker 4 (59:58):
I'd like to.

Speaker 2 (59:59):
I think if I could stay awake, I will have
a big day of Harlem Globetrotters earlier in the afternoon.

Speaker 3 (01:00:03):
Ere I'd like to imagine you like, for some reason,
you know, you get pulled onto the court with the
Globe Rudders and you're playing with them, and then that
night you're like you're regaling people at the SNL after
party with like, well, you know, actually, earlier today I
was playing against the Globetrotters, and I.

Speaker 2 (01:00:22):
Was thinking, more more likely I won't get on the
court with the Globetrotters. But I always love it at
the end of SNL where like they'll have like other
people show up on stage. I'd be like, here's Billie Eilish,
but also Alec Baldwin showed up and oh my Rudolph
stop by. Yeah, that I could just I'm not going
to be invited to come on. I'm just going to
walk on stage and I want to be on that finally,
and I'll be I'll be hugging twenty one Savage.

Speaker 3 (01:00:45):
I'm trying to think of who do you think like
they'll like because Tony one Savage could have guest artists
on suree the Weekend could have could have some you know,
comedian friends that are just jumping in, Like is there
anyone in either of their New York circles that you
think will be a surprise guest who will be there.
That's always a cool thing too, like, I.

Speaker 2 (01:01:06):
Don't know the Gillis like, all right, So if you're
not familiar, Shane Gillis is the stand up comedian who's
been crushing it. He was hired by SNL in twenty eighteen.
He was fired by SNL when some old stuff came
up from his old podcasts that they fired him. Now
he has since come around and he's been from what
they say, he and Warren Michaels have hit up a friendship.
He has been to various tapings, he has spoken to

(01:01:28):
all the cast members and he's doing it all now.
And it's like, you know, you could cancel people and
then at the end of the day, like people could
be redeemed, and in this case Shane is this is
like the full circle moment. He's coming back as the
host after being fired as a cast member. And I
don't know if he's like like to me, Shane Gillis's

(01:01:49):
buddies and we talked about it with Dan Sodar, like
Christian McCaffrey and Gave Davis and Burt Kreischer. I don't
think it's like Daniel day Lewis is coming out. So
I'm not sure what kind of, you know, level of
celebrity you're expecting. I'm going some with Shane Gillis fan
and I've always obviously been a historian of SNL and
love it and I can't wait to be there. But
I don't I don't think Shang Gillis is, you know.

(01:02:11):
I don't think Ethan Hawke or you know your name,
Julian Louis Dreyfus is coming out to see Shane Gillis.

Speaker 3 (01:02:18):
I do really hope though, that CMC or gave Davis
show up and you're at the after party with them,
and like, no one knows who gave Davis is and
you're like, wait a minute, we got to talk about
you know, the fourth and long and yeah, that would
be very funny.

Speaker 2 (01:02:32):
Yeah.

Speaker 3 (01:02:33):
I do one question for you, Peter. There was one
problem I had with the guest interview. You've got a
banana milkshake.

Speaker 2 (01:02:40):
Yeah, what a weird order, right. Yeah, I've never been
to Steak and Shake, and that's not some great crime.
I grew up in New Jersey, New York. They don't
have it, and it's like they have like a thousand flavors,
and for whatever reason, banana and Creams sung to me.

Speaker 3 (01:02:54):
Hey, I had a banana this morning. I love banana.
I just I'm thinking, like, if it's a milkshake late
at night, I'm probably just chocolate.

Speaker 2 (01:03:01):
Chocolate, vanilla or straw. Yeah yeah, yeah, banana and it's
spilled all over me.

Speaker 3 (01:03:06):
Still even know how it was.

Speaker 2 (01:03:07):
How about that Andy read at one in the morning,
comes walking in and you know as a cheeseburger at
one in the morning from Steak and Shake. I love it. Aaron,
great papod, good one. This one's gonna break all the records.
I'll see you next week. I hopefully will have a
full notebook. I keep on saying that Term'm going to
fill the notebook. I'll have lots of stories and hopefully

(01:03:28):
I can share them here on the podcast. Thanks to
everyone who listens on behalf of Aaron Jason English, my
man John Syke's over at die Heart. That's my dog
now he runs iHeart. We met at the super Bowl.
That's my dog, John Sykes. If you're listening, love you
burrow to everybody else back listening, enjoy the combine. We'll

(01:03:48):
have plenty of stories, and remember it is an art
and a science. Till next time.

Speaker 1 (01:04:03):
The season with Peter Schrager is a production of the
NFL and partnership with iHeartRadio. For more podcasts from iHeartRadio,
visit the iHeartRadio app, Apple Podcasts, wherever you get your podcasts.

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.css-14f5ked{margin:0;word-break:break-word;display:-webkit-box;-webkit-box-orient:vertical;box-orient:vertical;-webkit-line-clamp:2;overflow:hidden;}The Season with Peter Schrager: Steve Spagnuolo, Kansas City Chiefs Defensive Coordinator