2021 Week 12 Recap & BTS of BTS

Episode Transcript
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Speaker 1 (00:00):
Me Around the NFL podcast It's French fries in milkshakes
from the Chris Westling podcast studio. It's around the NFL.
Dan hands this hero with some heroes, Greg Rosenthal, Mark Sessler,
Week twelve, Sunday Night Flagship Show. Listen. Everybody knows you

(00:28):
don't even have to count the games until you get
past Thanksgiving. And that's when it starts to matta in
professional football. And now here we are back after this.
I mean, there's a lot of teams that would be
excited if that was true. The Bears are undefeated by
that method, so are my Jets. So I like to

(00:49):
think that anything that I did did annoyed anyone on
the home front or beyond before Thanksgiving. This doesn't count
for the whole year, just in the season. My entire
lifetime up and he build this and I've been I
saw them for five minutes this morning and it was
pristine behavior. Um. And of course that sentiment doesn't really

(01:10):
hold a ton of water, but it also comes from
like the Belichicks and the Parcels of the world who've
been around and did it makes some sense, right, Yeah,
Well that's what I was gonna get to, Like, I
like there is something to it, because this is when
you separate the pretenders fall away now when you get
into December. Um. But then again, every season is a

(01:31):
beautiful flower, and this is a strange little sucker, this flower.
So I feel like we don't have any real answers
at all entering December. So you know, it's all coming
together in real time. Like remember that Gregor Mendel would
like a toy around with like plant and flower dna
to create mad things. That that's what this is, you know,
essentially a Gregor Mendel season. I'm gonna pretend I get

(01:53):
the ref and be like I totally agree. Are you
aware of that, Gregor, Gregor Mental? Yes, yeah, all right,
we'll look it up. Good take, good takes, really good one.
Let's talk about a good take. Greg is ready to
shoot me with an arrow. And there's also another little

(02:14):
element going on here. The Brownies, Mark's favorite team, uh
and Mark's passion for his favorite sports team really is
unlike anything any of us have ever seen before. And
they're playing as we tape right now, so we you know,
there's a lot of cooking emotionally. I know you you
like to keep it like the surf on the surface.

(02:34):
It's not something that's churning within you, but we know
it is. And if you want to kind of get
anything out there before we get going on the games,
maybe some uh some what do they call the third rail?
What to avoid anything to make this more pleasant for
you and us. I like our efficient approach. We started
on time, which is um, highly unusual for for us.

(02:54):
But on top of it, there is a high octane
BTS concert, a boy in from South Korea operating. It's
so far right now, so we're gonna have to get
out of here and the minute this ends. Um, we've
annoyed Chris Rose highly once again. He wanted to watch
The Browns with us. You explain all that, um, but
it's just like a pull me back into the Browns scene.

(03:15):
This is like the third act of Paul Thomas Anderson
movie where there's all these different things happening at the
same time and they're all connected, and it's there's just
a lot of energy in the air and a lot
of it is chaotic. Alright, Emmica and and my daughter
Alis are at the show too. That that that's like
a little story that might be tracking. We might be
tracking and then you know when um, I don't even

(03:36):
know a single member of BTS, I can't even name
drop here when he like shoots up through the riser
and the smoke machine comes out, and then your daughter
looks to her right and it's just the empty seat
where you should have been. And then she turns back
and she's like, well, then all of his listeners would
have missed that on that trenchant Falcons Jags analysis. What

(03:57):
a day for Patterson? Where is my dad? Is Daddy
Ever coming home? Let's get into the games. No, that's good,
that's good parent work by you and Ever getting the
BTS tickets in a big spot at the height of
their popularity, getting inside that building. We don't know they're
they're tremendously popular pop group. Let's get going. Let's start

(04:20):
at lambeau Field where BTS is not performing. And here's
the snapper Stafford tight pocket hit as he throws left
to the house, high stepping touchdown, green Back had a
third quarter tigger. It's thirty six to seventeen. In all

(04:42):
our years doing this, and since we introduced the local
radio call calls, still my favorite trope is the second
banana just screaming out an exultation. Yeah, like straight up
a fan. I have no idea that I'm getting paid
to be in the booth right now. I'm just excited

(05:03):
that my favorite team did something good. Individual Usually there
is some alcohol involved, they believe, or something well in
the seventies made or that one booth uh where the
the service woman climbed in and there was a full bar.
Apparently that was a weird story. Still weird. That was
in Baltimore. They got in Sandusky's booth in a big spot.

(05:27):
Larry mccaren, that was I believe, yelling yeat with Wayne
Larvy w TMJ Razul Douglas picked off Matthew Stafford took
it all the way. His pick six was the key
play in the second half of the Packers, who beat
the Rams thirty in a battle between two Super Bowl
or Bust squads. Interesting game here. Matthew Stafford through three
touchdown passes, including long strikes to Van Jefferson and Odell Beckham,

(05:51):
which kind of got him back in the game a
little bit in the fourth quarter. But it was an
imperfect game for the veteran quarterback, whose health issues were
a big storyline entering the game. As for the Packers gentlemen,
their own veteran quarterback Aaron Rodgers looked far less than
healthy by the end of this game. He's limping around
on that COVID toe. But all the Packers do with

(06:12):
Matt Lafleur in the regular season is win their nine
and three and they stay a step behind the idle
cards in the NFC. This Packers team is impressive. Just
we don't need to go through the laundry list of
injuries that they've had, that they've overcome. The guys who
are coming back like that's just part of their story
and they don't let it sidetrack them at all. And
they they've got something you you can't totally quantify it.

(06:36):
And I think that's something that the Rams having put
this team together, and it's not like this is a
brand new team. They have a lot of pieces that
have been there and won a lot of games. But
Stafford and that now you had olb J to the mix.
You lose a team captain and Robert Wood specifically Stafford
missing a lot of throws looking in a little bang.
But like you can't just create that instant familiarity and

(06:57):
chemistry on offense, it's an offensive league, and the fact
that their offense was inferior to the Packers offense in
this spot, like in this week, is not a good
sign for them, you know. Down the line. Yeah, I
thought they were one of the more desperate teams coming
out of their bye week, just the way that they
spoke about their own you know what had happened before
the break, and this uh I left with more concerns.

(07:18):
It starts with Matthew Stafford looking just simply not healthy
on any level. The defense allowed green Bay to pile
up forty yards of possession time and the better team
one There's just no question. If they played ten times,
I'd say green Bay takes eight of them. Who I thought, Yeah,
I thought that green Bay for a game that it
was a little jagged and there wasn't like a ton

(07:38):
of flow to it, but it still felt like the
Packers really in control the entire way, and that Douglas
interception and the runback pretty much cinched it. And you know,
Stafford could have thrown more than the I N team
by the way, that's pick sixes and three straight games
for Stafford. Now also lost the fumble so another turn
and lost the fumble. Um. They were unable to get
their running game going. Uh. Um. You know they had

(08:01):
the splash place to Jefferson and Beckham, but other than that,
it was, you know, not just not a lot cooking.
It just feels like Los Angeles is out of swords.
And you know, how desperate can a team be when
you're going into a game seven and three. But at
the same time, now you when you put these back
to back to back games together where you just don't
look good and you don't look cohesive, and yes, now

(08:22):
we're turning the calendar over to December, I think there
is legitimate cause for concern that you're trying to operate
like some type of chemistry experiment on the fly here,
and it's there's no promise that's gonna work out Green
Bay at the same time, as a team that knows
who they are, they know their personnel, their coaching staff
is an intact, They know their personnel and how to
run the best version of what the team does best.

(08:45):
That's just two different teams right now, and they're heading
into their bye week, to which they have to be
thrilled to get in there. At nine and three through
these two games and the chemistry. It's not just Stafford,
it's their defense too. You know, their defense has been
mediocre this year, and when they've been in big spots,
I don't think they've particularly impressed. They're not terrible, They're

(09:05):
just not like a difference making group. And everyone wants
to say how it Stafford's hurt and that that's a
big fact, and maybe it is. But I just feel
like the Stafford we've seen this year is the Stafford
we've seen in Detroit, to which is there's ups, there's downs. Like,
he's not Aaron Rodgers. He he will never be Aaron Rodgers.
Being on shaunwick Bay's team doesn't make him Aaron rod

(09:25):
you know what I mean, like our peak Brady or whatever.
To me, he's a little bit of an erratic quarterback.
And I think you've seen that the last I think
that our first couple of months of Stafford, or let's
say first, you know, five six weeks, suggested that maybe
we were getting a different version inside an offense that
was pretty go. I see one weakness on green Bay.
Um it is Mason Crosby. I understand that he's you know,

(09:46):
he died in the wool fan favorite to some degree.
I'm Matority's a fan favorite right now. I mean at
one point they basically said from we have got to
punk the ball because because Crosby, we don't trust the guy.
I mean, he's leads the league in kicks that if
they get into a tight one, I don't they don't
trust him. I think he's an example Crosby of why
relationships matter, because I think we know it's on record

(10:09):
that he's very close with Aaron Rodgers. Uh, that he's
been there forever. He's built up a lot of good will.
But you wonder at what point is he used up
that good will? Can you trust him when it really counts?
And I'm looking at it, like on the ramp side
of the ball, you know, the von Miller trade. It's
still too early to put any great on that. But
he had one quarterback hit in this game, and the
other hit he had in the quarterback resulted in a

(10:29):
fifteen yard penalty. Uh. Aaron Donald was quiet in this game.
He had one quarterback hit. Uh. We didn't see a
game changing play from Jalen Ramsey, but that doesn't always
obviously tell the story with a cornerback. But at the
same time, it's like when they needed someone to step
up and make a play and turn the tide of
a season, that's all of a sudden getting a little
bit away from him. Nobody was there to do it.
So I think there's a lot of reasons. There's reason

(10:50):
to be frustrated and concerned with the Rams and in
fear of the Packers or a Packers fan, you love it,
and it's like keep winning because they're five and oh
at home and they just look so tough a beat
in that building. Uh, this year, it really feels like
the one seats kind of come down to Arizona in
green Bay. In green Bay, as we know, has the
tiebreaker over the Cardinals. This game specifically is gonna make

(11:11):
it a lot tougher for the Rams to win that division,
much less get the one seat. Green Bay does have
the Ravens, Browns, and Vikings down the stretch after their
buying final five games. It's not a cinch, but you
just trust them, all right. We were starting to trust
the Indianapolis Colts after a killer run but beaten Tom
Brady in the Bucks. Oh that's a whole different machine.

(11:40):
Two touchdown Letard four that touchdown tapas whoa is that
the dagger, I hope. So with twenty seconds left, I mean,
how dare I ramble over Jean Decker half w f
U s Lenny Fournette broke the tie with a twenty
eight yard of scoring run with seconds to play. It

(12:02):
lifted the Bucks to a thirty thirty one come from
behind win over the Colts at Lucas Oil Stadium. It
was the fourth touchdown of the game for four Nett,
who by the way, if you watched the Bucks week
after week since Brady got there, let Lenny's a big
part of what they do on offense, and he was
He's always at the center of things, it seems, even
though he's not necessarily the most you know what was

(12:23):
the old West saying that he was like a ship
that had to change direction. You know, it's it was
like a battleship. I think even though four Nette has
now forged a successful NFL career, I still kind of
agree with West's take back in the day. He doesn't
move like as nimbly as a but everything is set

(12:45):
up well for him now and he is succeeding. So
the difference in this game, though, was turnovers. Uh India
had five of them. Four and then a desperation heave
for an I N T in the last play of
the game, and then Brady doing what Brady does, made
indeed pay for those first turnovers, turned them into points
each time. And uh, this was a game that turned

(13:05):
on one play. The Colts played excellent football in the
first half. I mean, I'm watching the Colts in the
first half and I'm watching Carson Wentz and I'm thinking
to myself, like, is this twenty seven Carson Carson Wentz
on Colts? And if it is paired with Jonathan Taylor
and these defensive players and the coaching, like, what is
the ceiling of this team? They're up ten points at

(13:27):
the half, they get the ball to start the third quarter.
They had first and ten at the Tampa Bay twenty.
They have a chance to go up seventeen in the
third quarter, and then Mark's boy Shaquille Barrett surges around Sacks,
Went strips some of the ball, recovers the ball at
the thirty five. Six plays later, four Net scored on
a four yard run and that started the comeback. And

(13:49):
I thought it was really impressive what the Bucks were
able to do on the road to get the game
changing play and then just turning into a snowball situation.
Now they go ahead, and then they finally the Colts
give the ball to Jonathan Taylor. They went a large
swath of this game not giving it to Taylor if
you believe that he ties the game up with a

(14:10):
touchdown of the fourth quarter, but they couldn't stop Brady
on the final drive ending with that four net touchdown.
So nice fun back and forth game. But the Cults
are gonna kill themselves when they watch this tape because
they if they don't turn the ball over like that,
there's no way they lose. Well and Antoine Winfield Jr.
Said that that was their focus in their mindset all week.

(14:31):
What they had to take the ball away from from
the Colts to reverse what Indie did to Buffalo, And
I takeaway I have is that the Colts watched everything
the Bills have done on defense and said we are fearless.
We're gonna run the ball NonStop against that defense. But
they they saw something different with the Bucks and Arians
after the game basically said anyone that tries to run
on us is gonna hit a wall at some point

(14:51):
real quick and have to shift what they do a
couple other notes, like I thought Gronkowski has he is
looking as good as he has in years. He's a
huge part of this offense. And Leonard Fournette next gen
status points out seventeen rushes faces zero stack boxes. I
understand you don't stack the box against Leonard Fournette, but
he burned him for that. He burned him for that.
They didn't adjust on how well he was playing down

(15:13):
the stretch. I when I when I look at Gronk
I used the Frankenstein Frankenstein scale to kind of gauge
like how he's moving, where he's at in his career
physically injury wise. One is, you know, peak Gronk like
Patriots Eric Ron for all surgeries. Ten is like the
guy at the end of last year, or I mean,

(15:34):
I should sayeen Gronk where he's basically full on Frankenstein
like rumbling through Godzilla's rumbling through Draculus Clinton the Super
Bowl looking like Frankenstein his last play as a Patriot.
So where he is right now is four and that's great.
You want to be low as you can get on
the Frankenstein scale. Uh, he's so key to what they

(15:57):
do as well. They just have another team that has
a very defined offense greg and they know what they're
doing every week, and that they're so different with Gronk,
like the last two weeks, he's been the key to it.
I hate those like on off splits when it comes
to the NFL, like Baker when O'Dell is not there,
Baker when he is there, it's like, but look at
this Bucks offense this year when Gronk is there and
when it's not, the great games are all with Gronk.

(16:20):
I think this was kind of an important win for
the Bucks to come back from ten down on the
road against the quality team because I've been so brainwashed
by Brady and Belichick over the year that like every
team is different, every team has its own personality, its
own uh story, and you have to sort of build
from scratch. And if you look at this Buck season,

(16:40):
they haven't had games like this in the in they
haven't had comeback wins. They they in tough spots. They
kind of crumbled more than not, Like the Patriots had
a chance to win that game late. The Saints certainly
did it, they couldn't pull it off against Washington. They
haven't had a game like this where it was back
and forth, and they showed some toughness and they wanted
a different kind of ways. I think that's big. Had

(17:00):
they lost to think we're talking about the Brady and receptions.
He has nine on the year, he has six over
his last four games. There's been mistakes, you know, without Antonio,
talk about splits. Without Antonio Brown, he's not the same player, right,
And but Gronk has helped out a lot um interesting
uh and Frank Reig was getting some guff on social
media for this, like they did ask him about it

(17:23):
the day. Well, Jonathan Taylor, who's been the best running
back on the planet for two months now, went from
I believe it was six minute mark of the second
quarter to the ten minute mark of the fourth quarter
without getting a touch twenty two or twenty three straight
plays something like that. And it's not it's no coincidence
that that's right. That windows right when the Bucks got

(17:44):
back into the game and took over, and it was
almost like somebody tap Raik on the shoulder. He's like, hey, Bud,
give it to Jonathan Taylor. Touchdown and what does he
do on that? And the driver where they tied it
at thirty one, all on the fourth quarter, they gave
it to him eight times for fifty eight yards on
one and culminating in the touchdown. I think there's something
that Reich learned from that. After the game, Rich is

(18:05):
so stubborn, and he said, based on like the looks
they were giving, we should have thrown it. Even more
like that, he had no regrets about it, and that
like that was what it called for. A lot of
it was r pos where you know, Wentz looks at
how many guys are in the box and chooses to pass.
But I don't know, I'm with you. You can't. You
can't go away from him that long. Doesn't matter what Wentz.

(18:26):
And then you look at the box score finished with
two interceptions. Once was one was a desperation he at
the end. Uh. The other was a great play by
Antoine Winfield on a jump all to Michael Pittman, you'll
do one on one your best wide receiver against the
safety all day, every day. UH. And Winfield just made
a great place. So I think Wentz is playing really well.
But even with Went's playing well, Jonathan Taylor's got to

(18:47):
be the man. So that Wentz touchdown shot to Ashton
Duelan like his arm is fine. He that was one
of the better throws of the day. Um all right,
So the Bucks moved to eight and three. The fall
to six and six. The Titans have a chance to
put the division to bed. Speaking of the Titans, hit it,

(19:08):
Ricky Jones is back in the pocket or is down
about the cop five barn wedding room to be outside
as he carries to the third sideline away from a defender.
Jone to run after the catch touchdown. Patriots a cool
book born back. Oh no, I thought we were set

(19:32):
on the Zooac book like five years. Nothing on the
Patriots front. Are you set on or we set on?
It's all coming back. Control your excitement. I'm not. I'm
just telling you reality. Bob Sochy and Scott Zolac with
the call for w BZ mac. Jones through two touchdown
passes both to Kendrick Bourne, and the New England defense

(19:52):
forced four turnovers and the Patriots six sixth straight wind
rolling past the injury plague. Titans very six third got
to be dying, Greggy. I thought, you know, New England
caught another opponent at the right time. Obviously, the Titans
are a mess, but you get the feeling that they
can give any team hell right now, they can because

(20:14):
in the second half of these games, it's like they
get this downhill momentum where it just feels it does
feel very old school Patriots like, where they are going
to figure things out in the first half of the
game and in the second half they are going to roll.
And part of that is the physical nature of both
of their lines, which offensively started to control it in

(20:37):
the second half. Defensively, they did not trust Ryan Tannehill.
The Titans didn't drop back and pass, and for good reason.
He had ninety three yards on one attempts. Uh. The
Titans ran for two hundred and seventy yards in this game.
Their offense moved the ball great. It was a lot
about turnovers. Did not feel like the Patriots were that
much of a better team until the fourth quarter, but

(20:59):
they managed to force all the turnovers like they have
in recent weeks, and they just feel like they they're
the old school Patriots idea that they have so many
different ways that they can win that like, which is
the way that they need to in this game. And
in this game, it was like getting big time production
from Myers and Kendrick Born Kendrick Borne is their number
one receiver this year in terms of production, and it

(21:22):
just reminds me how last year they just had had
no one that would make plays for them, Like the
coaches got a lot of credit for the Patriots, but
it's like remind J. Stevenson made plays. Today, Born made plays.
John H. Smith made a couple of plays like where
it had nothing to do with the play call. Its
just like they were better than the guys across from them,
and they have way more of those guys this year,

(21:43):
so they have answers. I mean, no Derrick Henry, no
Julio Jones, no A. J. Brown. Five fumbles, three turnovers.
That's eight turnovers in two weeks. Like the Titans team
on the field over the last you know, Fortnite needed
to essentially coach perfectly, play perfectly, execute perfectly, and the
opposites happened right And and yet you I watched this

(22:03):
and it was sixteen thirteen at half time, and you
felt like, I don't know, like they were they were
doing about perfect in the first half, but they had
to play this game in such a way that it
was like, we know, we're not as good as the Patriots.
We're gonna try to just ground up rushing yards. The
Patriots were kind of allowing them, almost daring them too,
which was interesting. Uh, they played like light boxes the

(22:25):
whole game, and the Titans pulled it off for a half,
but they couldn't fit. And I know it's it's on
the Titan side of things. There is a temptation to
just go with a narrative. Well, this is exposing Ryan Tannehill.
He is a good quarterback, but he's not great and
when you put him in a situation like this, he's
gonna fail you. But I'm looking at their wide receivers.

(22:45):
This is what he's passing to today, Nick Westbrook, what
is that again? A Keena, Cody Hollister, Dez Fitzpatrick, Michael
pruittt Jeff Swain, Anthony Firkser. I mean, this is gonna
be if you're going against the Patriots defense, which is
playing as well as any defense in the league. The
almost had no chance. I mean that's why I locked
up the Pats here, because even though the Titans came

(23:07):
in eight and three, it just felt like they were
there was no way they were going to move them. No,
that's who gets the sad. I think maybe Ricky, did
you lock the opposite? I did? Yeah, that was so
why you you only think about you at all times? Probably? Yeah,
I locked up the Patriots and you locked up the Titans.

(23:27):
So the Patriots had wins, so you don't really get
the sad hord, Right, I get the winning. But I'm
a professional, you know, so the locks I did lose
my lock again. All right, I'm glad we worked that
all out. But you're happy with the outcome of our lockoff?
Yeah it was. It was. It was a fantastic showing
by the Patriots. But if Derrick Henry was there this
they wouldn't have stand a chance too a chance? Well yeah, right,

(23:51):
the defense was great, but not with the run. Against
the run, I mean, you had like Hillard. Like my
point is, if I know if don Trell Hilliard has
on thirty one yards in a sixty eight yard touchdown,
well that's what Derrick Henry maybe would have done in
this game. But there's still foreman goes for one on nine.
They had two over a hundred. It was a strategy
and I don't think it worked the way exactly that
they wanted, but the outcome kind of ended that way,

(24:13):
which was like you can run and spend all day
like going on these long drives. We kind of don't
trust Tannahill to finish it off. I think Dan your
point though they don't have they don't have a target
with more than twenty five yards. I mean, he's playing
with a week three preseason roster. They've set that, they've
set the NFL record for the most players used in
a season. It is week twelve, That isn't and I
know that because of the I R rules that sort

(24:35):
of bends it to the last couple of years that
you're gonna use more players with the practice. That doesn't matter.
They've set the NFL record for the most players use,
which is essentially the most injuries in the history of
the NFL. And it's week twelve. They they they have
done an incredible job getting to this point, and all
those wins they stacked up before are gonna come in
handy because a lot of these players are coming back

(24:56):
for Tennessee. And yes, that's the that's the way to
look at this, Graver, But I mean, how fortunate are
you and how relieved are you that the Colts found
a way to lose that game today? Because if the
Colts beat the Bucks paired with this, it would be
panic on the streets in Nashville. Yeah, it would be bad.
I think that was a much needed loss for the Colts.

(25:16):
From a Titans perspective, it still seems like the South
an f C South, is the Titans division to take.
They just have to come back, get healthy over the
BYLEP three with five to go. If you count the
tiebreaker as a game to completely like collapse full against
the Jaguars and the Texans again and the Steelers and
the Niners and the Dolphins. I feel like the Titans,

(25:38):
depending on how healthy they are after the bye, should
be able to win three of those five games. All right,
it sounds like you're in a good place, Justin, and
I'm happy for you. But I you know, from a
podcast perspective, you know, a crestfall and grave Degger would
have been fun too, all right. And on the Patriots side,
before we move on and gets shook in here out listen,

(26:00):
I'm all for the reality that the Patriots, uh could
be a team that makes a deep run in the playoffs,
but I just need to see it. I just need
to see these next three games. What happens at Bills
at Colts Home. Bills, give me two wins there, or
don't give them to me. I don't want them, but
win two of those games, and I'm on board the

(26:21):
rest of the world that this is the dynasty reborn.
The rest of the world is saying. I think the
rest of the world is recognizing they lead the NFL
and point differential right now, and but I think it's
absolutely fair to point out still that their best win. Like,
you know, they haven't beaten a team that's like above
average in dv o A this year other than the Browns.

(26:41):
That's about it. Well, I would just you don't, let's
just disconnect from the previous dynasty and just saying we
don't have an achilles heel. At the moment, they seem
very balanced, they're getting better by the week. They're getting
great play from a rookie quarterback in their defense is nasty.
I agree with all that, and now I just want
to see it happen against premium opponents. You let's talk
in two weeks exactly, all right, Let's take a break

(27:04):
and then talk to Nick Shook. You get this stop
on four down, the forty Niners win the game. Cousins
back on Fort Town has time throws. Jefferson Dicut played
the forty Niners take over on Towns. They stopped the
Vikings twice in a row on fourt Town. The Fortyers
will win their third in a row. Bongo time Greg

(27:29):
Papa with the call ken k n b R San
Francisco got the big stop in the fourth quarter. Deebo
Samuel ran for two touchdowns before leaving with an injury,
and Elijah Mitchell ran for a hundred thirty three yards
in a score, leading the Niners to a thirty four
win over the Vikings at the Big Bell Bottom. This

(27:52):
is uh Nick Shook now joining us shook you. This
was a game to five hundred teams that are very intrigued,
five teams in a wide open conference, and it was
the Niners who looked like the team that will continue
with surge. While you come out of this game wondering
about the Vikings, especially after Dalvin Cook has carded off
with a shoulder. This game very much played like a

(28:14):
game you would expect between two teams with identical records
and kind of on similar trajectories as of late. It
was a close one. It was a hard fought, chippy game.
There were a lot of scuffles breaking out after you know,
the whistle, and it came down to the end and
the Vikings, who have become this aggressive new age fourth
go for it on fourth down team for the first time,
couldn't convert in those key situations, and that ultimately proved

(28:37):
to be the difference. That and Mike Zimmer's stingy defense
that we've come to know is one that you know
can stand up against the test and get stops when
it needs to to get them. Could not do that,
especially late. They allowed the forty Niners to grind away
seven minutes of game clock in the fourth quarter while
trailing by one possession, and then when they did get
the ball back, they ultimately could not convert. They blew

(28:58):
two opportunities in forty ninners territory to try to score
the potential game tying touchdown with the two point conversion
added in and came up short by eight points. And
and the Vikings now have to kind of figure out
what went wrong. While the forty Niners continue, you know,
this positive momentum going forward. The only question now with
the status of Deebo Samuel, who suffered an injury and
did not return to that game. Was seen on the

(29:20):
sidelines with his helmet nowhere in sight, indicating that he
was not going to come back. He is obviously crucial
to their fortunes, has been for the last month, was
again today with two rushing touchdowns. Can he return in
time to help them keep going forward? Because what they
proved today is that they can run the ball well.
They're really tough out much like they were a few
years ago. All Right. What I like about the Niners
today is they didn't totally crumble when Deebo went out.

(29:44):
I mean he was he crossed the thousand yards receiving
for the year. He had sixty six yards on the ground.
You mentioned the two touchdow. He's legitimately a running back.
He had no receiving yards like and before minutes before
his injury. Today there was a swing here. This game
was fourteen to seven where the Niners came to life
with a pair of drives that when eighties seven yards

(30:04):
over eight minutes eighty five. And then they got a
Kirk Cousins who had through his third interception of the year.
He's been great on that front through a terrible one
into the third quarter, they gave the Niners the ball
at the two, and so you had a twenty one
point swing for the Niners over four minutes from before
halftime into the third quarter. And this game did not
start the way that previous Niners games have during their

(30:25):
hot streak where they start with these long drives. They
morphed into that down the stretch they let they had
their biggest output on the ground with like two eight
yards rushing, and so it gives you faith and the
fact that the Niners can continue to be what they are.
The Deepo Samuel thing is huge. The Vikings, I think
Vikings fans have to be annoyed by two things. There's
this was a Minnesota game, so there's two plot points.

(30:47):
But Adam Thealen I thought absolutely made a critical catch
that they that the Vikings essentially challenged did not. It
was called incomplete on the challenge. They lost that time out,
then they lost another time out when Kirk Cousins, you know, uh,
this is gonna go crazy on on social media, but
lined up under guard and you know they had like
the running back comes up to try to move them over,

(31:08):
and so they suddenly had no ability to control the
clock and the Niners took that away from them as well.
There was also a Kawan Williams defense on third down,
a huge third down that was not called p I
that I thought was p I just think if you're
a Vikings fan, it's another one of those down moments
where you're looking at a couple of plays and going
insane in your mind. I think this is a game.
I think this is a game that um outcome. Aside

(31:31):
one team six and five. The other one is now
five and six. I feel like a lot is going
to go back to the m r I exams tomorrow.
I've developing news on this front. Uh. This just came over,
uh from on top rap sheet. Dalvid Cook suffered a

(31:51):
shoulder dislocation. See that's why he was writhing on the ground.
They're probably popping that sucker back into place. Suffered a
shoulder dislocation. Will have an m r I Monday to
determine the damage caused. So Cook is as valuable to
his team in my opinion as Deebo is to the Niners,
and Debo will have his own m r I on Monday.
Because I don't know, you know, you can make a

(32:13):
case for either of these teams Greg making a big run.
Uh if they got hot at the right time. But
if you take either of those guys out of it,
you get very You kind of have to pull it
back a little bit. Agree or disagree. I agree, especially
with Diebo Samuel. I think they could survive without Cook
for a few weeks. Alexander Madison, like they're running games,
survived that you need him back at some point. You

(32:35):
just need both these teams to make it. I think
if you want maximum playoff enjoyment, I have to say
if I had to pick a six and a seven
seed in the NFL, of like, what's gonna be the
craziest NFC? I want Vikings Niners, Like, well, the Niners
are the team of cest L. I've waited until now today,

(32:56):
Dan was there, you know, the team of Zeus teetle late.
It's a little late, but you want it's on my clock. Well,
it's interesting, you actually picked to win the Super Bowl
before the season, and you you pump your fist correct
literally four weeks ago you took them off and you
said they were no longer even a playoff team on
your season, and he locked against them in a two

(33:18):
weeks ago. But now I'm back. The problem is when
you make so many different predictions, Mark that we have
to hold you to them all. So it does. It
does water down your problem, any problem with anything. I
feel fine. It also felt like it was like a
regressive game for Kirk Cousins. ESPN remembers ESPN stats in info,
Had says the Browns game look seven off target passes,

(33:38):
the highest that he's had all season, including two on
fourth down. So it's like Cousins have been playing great
and Shook up maybe just struggle. I was gonna ask you, Shook,
do you pause the Browns game for this or do
you know? You keep it roll? It's all real time,
like they just got a first down. This is all
real time. You know, we take we're breaking the fourth
wall here by admitting this, but yeah, I'm totally looking
at my left while you guys are arguing obviously here,

(33:59):
but I'm also paying attention. What's happening? Well in an
honor of Shook. If anybody else has another comment in
this game, why don't we move along now to what
went what went down? I should say in Cincinnati bloodbath slaughter,
short drop throws starting back Mike Hilton against his former

(34:25):
team m Burger's pass and runs it into the end zone.
Cincinnati is embarrassing Pittsburgh so far today? Oh, how long
have the people of West Ohio waited to hear a
comment like that? Cincinnati is embarrassing Pittsburgh. Dan Hord, Dave
Lapham what they called w c k y Mike Hilton

(34:49):
intercepted former teammate Ben Roethlisberger took out to the house
to pick six, but Cincinnati up by four touchdowns in
the second quarter in route to a forty one to
ten win. That blowout followed a double digit Bengals win
over Pittsburgh in September, making it since the night's first
season sweep of the Steelers since two thousand. This is
the type of game that makes you think you're watching

(35:09):
the end of one era and the beginning of another.
In the division. Ben Roethlisberger really, I mean, he he
he he. He looked like he's looked he looked against
the Bengals when they played earlier this year. That was
the game in which he threw a four yard interception
to Logan Wilson. He had two picks today. Um, their
offense regressed back to this group that we saw earlier

(35:32):
in the season, which was dump it off for three
or four yards because we can't trust anything else at
the middle or deep part of the field. I mean,
that is who the Steelers are when when things aren't
really going well, they can't run the ball effectively, they
can't stop the run, and credit goes to Sincinnati. They
made an emphatic statement with this wind. I mean, they
didn't need Joe Burrow to be great, but he was

(35:53):
still solid. They wrote Joe mix into another big game.
Carries for a hundred and sixty five yards, two touchdowns.
I mean, this was a big win for the Bengals
and the fact that they proved that they can do
it on both sides of the ball, and like you said,
the change of one, you know, maybe the passing of
a torture one team going down the hill and the
other one coming up the hill. Right now, I mean,
they're three and one in the division. I never would

(36:14):
have expected this out of these Bengals, especially after they
got blown out by the Browns a few weeks ago.
They've really used that by week and replicated last week's
performance of this one to prove that, hey, look we
we figured out some of our problems, and we know
what our strengths are. When we ride them, we can
beat most anybody. Their last two games against Baltimore and Pittsburgh,
they've outscored them eighty two to twenty seven. Thirty one
points in the first half was most ever by a

(36:35):
Bengals team against the Steelers, and they played a billion games.
I think this version of Cincinnati that we saw today
could beat anyone in the conference. I'm not saying you're
gonna get that every week, but the questions about them
being a Jackal and High team are quieted at the moment.
This version of the Steelers is a floating corpse because
they're about six weeks away from having a massive, burning
question at quarterback. They were totally demoralized today. This game

(36:59):
was over twenty minutes in thanks to Joe Mixon totally
running through it all week long. It's they didn't have
t J. Watt last time. It's gonna be a totally
different result. It didn't matter at all. I mean, they
thumped them as hard as I've seen the Bengals thump
a Steelers team in my entire life. I've such excited
in the news room watching this game. He was loving

(37:20):
Big Ben taking a dirt nap. It's almost like the
Bengals are I don't know, they're like the surrogates for
the Browns right now. If the Browns can't do it,
they should have feelings against the Bengals. And I think
shook them. And would you agree that of the three
teams in the division outside of Cleveland, like they've been
kind of like your dance our dance partners as Browns
fans and you know, and horrid play. But today was

(37:41):
quite a revelation the Steelers. Tomlin, you know, he said,
we're not gonna concoct any excuses. This was a butt kicking.
He also said that some changes are coming. I don't
think it's going to be a quarterback, but they are
well see that. This is part of the problem is
that they never actually built themselves a legitimate safety net
a quarterback. So I think they are, as Mark put it,

(38:01):
the equivalent of a floating corpse in the a f C.
Because you know, right down the three they've been, they've
they've dissected them into three parts. They're each and one
of the rivers are they weighed down in a bag
with some chains and rocks at the bottom. Of the
three next Um shook. Uh, is there anything that could

(38:22):
save the Steeler season in your mind? Or is this
are we playing out the string for the Steelers this
season and ahead of those big changes in your opinion?
I mean, their defense always gives them a chance. Their
defense not the same defense down the street. It gives
them a chance, but they have to figure out how
to stop the run, and they haven't been able to
do that. They weren't able to do that today. I mean,

(38:43):
I think personnel wise, for the most part, I would
still trust it will be competitive. But if they can't
do much offensively, which they haven't done in recent weeks,
I mean except for that explosion and Sunday night, you
know last week for you know, they came back from
behind and nearly won the game. Um, if they can't
get consistent play out of that group and the defenses,
and as good as we expect it to be, this
is they are. What their record is their five five

(39:04):
and one, They could easily be four six and one
or or four and seven. It really, I mean, that's
who they are. They're an average team, and they're a
team that has to start figuring out what they're gonna do.
Under center beyond this year, and and I know there's
still some games to play, and and knowing the franchise
and history and and you know the reputation, I wouldn't
be surprised for to see them pull a out a
few more wins, But I don't have high expectations for

(39:24):
them because they basically are who they are in terms
of record. A few more wins is maybe the high
point that they on paper are best chance for a
team to go eight eight and one, but they have
the Ravens, the Vikings, the Titans, the Chiefs, the Browns,
and the Ravens eight and one would save that. Tomlin
has never had a losing streak record. And I just

(39:45):
want to say congrats to all the people holding those
Bengals over six and a half wins tickets you got,
I've got paid in November. That's big. All right, Let's
close out our time with Shook with a trip to
the Meadowlands, hurt sticks, shotgun snow. Who's gonna hand it off?
Right for Scott's goot Bubble the football and it's recovered
by joyant Love of the Giants. They got popped up

(40:06):
from behind and Love recovered it. Worth one thirty four
to go by Papa with the call w f A
N Yes. Giants defense was on point on Sunday. They
intercepted Jalen Hurts three times, forced four turnovers total excluding
that when you heard there, and they held the Philly
offense to a season low and points, beating the error

(40:29):
prone Eagles thirteen to seven. Chook Eagles Twitter was particularly
emotional during and immediately following this game. What did Big
Blue do to lead to this result? In this outpouring
of grief amongst Eagles Nation? They played stifling defense so

(40:49):
much that it left Eagles fans questioning the abilities of
Nick Sirianni to to actually uh scheme up an offense
that can get the ball to its playmakers because they
didn't do that very often. Jalen Hurts it three inner
aptions thrown and and his greatest strength became running and
and even in a close game, you know, they needed
to throw the ball late on two separate possessions, and
it didn't. It didn't look very good. It didn't pan

(41:10):
out in their favor because of the Giant. You know,
it's weird because the Giants got blown out by the
Buccaneers last week in Prime time and and led is
Jason Garrett's firing and everything else. But if you've watched
them for the last few weeks, you've noticed that their
defense is starting to come into shape, kind of like
it did last year before they fell apart down the stretch.
Um And and this was like the peak production of

(41:33):
that group. You know, get forcing four takeaways, a key
fumble that we heard on that clip there, Uh, Darnay
Holmes intercepting, Jalen Hurds, Xavier McKinney take Crowder. They're all
getting interceptions. Um And, and that was enough to really
keep them in the game and hang on to this lead, because,
let's face it, the offense still has a long way
to go. Freddy Kitchens in his first game as a
play caller, you know, it didn't ask too much of
Daniel Jones, and I think it worked out in their favor.

(41:55):
But I mean, you didn't get a ton of production
out of guys. You know, thirteen carries for forty yards
and se kuon Barkley. That's not gonna of the doors
off of anybody. But it was enough to win, and
it was enough to avoid the errors that the Eagles
couldn't avoid, and that's the Giants defense was able to
capitalize on end up with this close. What about this
Jalen Reagor. I saw his name pop up over and
over and over again. It sounds like he had a

(42:15):
tough one, seven targets, two catches that we had two
chances to win the game. That you know as as
bad of a game that Jalen Hurts had. Yeah, you
get he puts two balls in the spot where Rayor
can make a play to win the ball game at
the end. One would have been a tough catch, but
the second one he should have caught it. And that's
that's like that changes your season. That's a that's Nelson

(42:36):
aghil are dropping the ball type of stuff right there.
That has been a disastrous pick by and by the way,
taking one pick before justin Jefferson. Imagine Jefferson on that
Eagles team with Jalen Hurts. Uh So you have the
Giants offense still sub three hundred yards, but like we
saw last year, their defense has a chance to rise

(42:57):
up every once in a while and beat the team.
Does this what do we where does this leave us
with the Eagles? Now? I mean, are they just like
any of these other teams just up and down because
they felt like they were building momentum, Shookie, and it
just floated away in the New Jersey air. It's funny
I saw in the Fox pregame today, um that they
did a little uh it was kind of like a

(43:17):
uh parody of of like an alert and it was
like warning NFC East fans, the Philadelphia Eagles are back.
If you're a fan of the Giants, Cowboys are Washington
football team, you might be in danger. Well, you know what,
I think you can put those concerns to bed because
for as much excitement as we've gotten out of the
Eagles and some of the games they played this year,
we're also reminded that there are still a team that

(43:38):
has a ways to go, both in terms of roster
construction and figuring out what their identity is, because as
they proved today, they're not a consistently reliable team when
it comes into situations like this and against better opponents.
I don't know if theil fair much better. I mean
if if if they're not playing the Giants, they might
lose by two three possessions. But because they're playing the Giants,
who was still a close game that they had a

(43:59):
chance to win all simbly couldn't come through. This backs
my theory that whenever UM a player or a player
slash team are celebrated, slash over celebrated all week long. Later,
we woke up with Jalen Hurts has answered questions at
quarterback you buying, and Rapp report they're ready to roll
with their three first round picks and build around. I'm
not saying that's not true. He's been great, but like

(44:19):
Jonathan Taylor two, when it's just like endless hype parades,
like invariably Sunday will underwhelm. I called the Jamis Winston
corollary because I'll never forget the week sixteen, a Saturday
game where Ian reported that the Bucks are rolling forward
with Jamis he's shown enough. And then he threw like
nine interceptions in the last two games, including a walk

(44:39):
off pick six, and they went and signed Tom Brady
and the rest was history and shook ee Um, listen,
you're the pipe you delivered with a hard blow to
the uh listeners. Now it okay, thank you for joining
us and and and like Jamis Tampa, I am also history.

(45:01):
There he goes, get back to your game, buddy, Thank
you for joining us. Let's take a break and then
hit the rest of the Sunday games. Quick throw the
echuer deflected and intersecton Patcherton down the west seven nine.
This may be a house call. Five touchdown Denver, seventy

(45:23):
yards for Patch or ten. I like that, Dave Logan
ko a house call. Rookie Patrick certain the second picked
off Justin Herbert twice, returning the second one seventy yards
for a touchdown that's sparked the Broncos win over the charge,
I mean charges, What are we doing here? You go

(45:44):
up there after an emotional Sunday Night win and you
lay this type of egg. Anyway, This wind sets up
a showdown for the a f C West lead next
weekend in Kansas City, where the game has already been
flexed to Sunday night. That's fun, Greg vic fas you
was working his Warlock magic again. I can't get a

(46:05):
feel of this Broncos team. It is crazy. For as
many times as we've tried to bury them on this
show that they're playing for the division league, like you
mentioned Demember Football in December, and yet I'm still not
convinced they're like a great team. But they today showed
what Fangio wanted when he took certain Curtin has been
a good pick. He'll always be compared to then passing

(46:26):
on Justin Fields. It'll always be a bad process to
me that they took him for Fangio's defense when Fangio
is probably on the way out. But he's a really
good starting cornerback. And their secondary was great today, but
it was great in part because the Broncos got after
Justin Herbert and this Chargers front offensive line with just
four just four rushers. And this is like Jonathan Cooper

(46:50):
who stepped up and be good, and Stephen Weatherly who
they just signed off the scrap heap, and other guys
like you know, Kenny Young who they traded for from
l A. Like they're getting the eyes up the street
and playing them on their defense, and the Chargers still
can't protect in that situation and they were flumex. It's
been a trend here, I think when the Charges have
played some strong defensive play callers that can scheme up

(47:14):
some tricky looks in terms of coverage and and pass rush.
What they did against Baltimore and New England and now
Minnesota and now Fangio with a depleted Broncos team, the
Chargers offense has been pretty d o A in all
of those games, which is disappointing. They have it, they
and they opened the second half with an eleven play

(47:34):
drive that ends in a misfield goal. The Chargers. Their
next drive is third team plays ends in an interception.
Their next drive is a five play drive that ends
an interception. Then they have a garbage time touchdown. I
I have to look at the Joe Lombardi experience on
offense and feel like, as as as much as I
love Brandon Staling, how much he gets involved in all
sides of the of the football, like, it's just kind

(47:55):
of not working. And I love what you said on
Sky gregularly, we're kind of con to never blame um, Well,
you're not gonna blame Herbert for any of that. That's
my rule. You know, that's the number one rule of Herbert.
But blame everyone else. He he and he and Stafford
through pick six is almost the exact same time, which
was not a great moment for l A M fights

(48:16):
in general. But you don't do is there anything happening
with Herbert that is culpable here? That was a tip
pass although it was a little behind. Um, I mean,
it was it that the pick six was a drop pass.
The first interception, UM was on I gotta have it
play and it was. It was a bad play by
Herbert I mean, but even earlier in that drive, thinking

(48:36):
about like the fourth down crazy scramble. I really think
when you watched the tape on him, it always ends
up better than you think because he ends up making
so many plays that were just all him. Uh. And
like I said, the offensive line has been a mess,
but you got you gotta give Denver credit. They they
they did the game plan against the charges that everyone's
been doing against the Chiefs. It's like back up, make
them drive these long drives and they'll make a mistake

(48:58):
by the end of it. Meanwhy all the Chargers run
defense gave up a lot of yards. Again, Teddy had
one of his more UM I would say, memorable wins.
Even though he finishes with a d nine yards. He's
limping around out there. He missed three or four drives
and his shin was hurt. Drew Lock came in and
was a disaster, turned the ball over and at a fumble,
and then Teddy comes back after halftime and at least

(49:19):
calm things down and steered them till the wren a
quarterback and the Chargers. You know, they start the season
with four winds and and five tries, but since then
that they've lost four of six to the Ravens, to
the Patriots, to the Vikings, to the Broncos. And they're
kind of telling you who they are, which is they
have a lot of big name talent, but they're kind
of the middle of the pack team and I don't

(49:42):
know if we're gonna see them really ever rise up.
I feel like this is kind of who they are now.
Can't run, can't stop the run. Offensive line I think
has problems that that's like only a lot of things
going against you where you need something great to overcome it,
and I'm not sure what they have that's great other
than Herbert, you know, making some crazy place this broadcast team.

(50:02):
Though now I'm like, okay, they're coming out of it
by maybe they're but you know how you're you want
like the Niners, and you want various other teams to
get that. I can't. That's I don't need to see that.
Oh yeah, they're they are. I feel like they are
maxing out considering their injuries. I mean they lost their
left tackle today, who was already their backup there down

(50:23):
to their fourth and fifth string UH tackles. They lost
the starting guard today. They have been crushed by injuries.
I think they are maxing out what they can do.
But that might be eight and seven in the end,
right or nine and eighty. They're gonna be the first
ever nine and eight team and the most nine and
eight team ever assembled in professional football. But that might
get them into the playoffs. They're interesting team to keep

(50:45):
an eye on, and they are set up with a
big spotlight game next week. Let's move on from Denver
to Miami where the Dolphins are back. Miami miamis Toutstown
waddles tuck into the end zone of Miami Miami. The

(51:06):
Panthers paid for the interception. Oh Alabama connection right there, Diami.
The perkup, guys, Jimmy is SEVENO follow hit me up
with the uh in the copy here with the what
do they call the phonetic pronunciation? Help me out that

(51:29):
because I've been stumbling on that one for about seven
years now. W q A M with the call. Jalen
Quaddle at nine catches for a season, hid thirty seven
yards in a touchdown. The Dolphins feast five sacks, three interceptions,
beat the Panthers thirty three to ten. Mark at the
beginning of the month, the Dolphins were dead and buried

(51:50):
at one and seven. Four wins later, it's the zombie
Dolphins lurking on the periphery of the a f C
playoff picture. They are lurking. I would I would say
team they played looked more, UM had more zombie characteristics
throughout today. I mean, this was a game that if
you're one of the Dolphins fans that are saying, I
don't want them to go get another quarterback. I want

(52:10):
to see to be given the full entree into you know,
four years of experience in Miami, I'm not sure that
will happen. But he was twenty seven for thirty one today.
Weren't all splash plays because that's too uh. But the
connection with Waddle uh was you know, bordered on electric.
I mean, Waddle showed you what he was today at a
a hundred thirty seven yards and a touchdown off nine grabs.

(52:32):
That was their offense. They're they're not a big run team. Um,
their defense got the job done against Cam I'll get
that to that in a second day. A blocked punt
that went for a touchdown. That's like when the Brian
Flores Dolphins are doing it. You're getting a little thing
from all sides of the ball, and that that what happened.
That's what happened today. They encountered, um a Cam Newton
meltdown scenario. This is a pretty amazing little nugget. Cam

(52:54):
Newton went five for one UM and it looked like
it well it is her. This it is horrendous and
it is the lowest um completion percentage by a quarterback
with twenty plus attempts since Joey Harrington did it went
five for twenty two Lions in two thousand and four.
With Joe Harrington would have had a better career. You

(53:15):
might be right, Cam Newton. I'll give him this um.
It was. It was an ugly, ugly day. He did
not mince words or make an excuses about the you know,
the parade of social media hype in the I'm back business, Ricky.
Let's hear what he said. This is the NFL. Nothing's promised.
Just because Cam Newton's on your roster doesn't mean you're
just gonna win. Just because it's a feel good story

(53:36):
doesn't mean you're gonna win, right, I'm well aware of
that one little thing. Like even early in the game,
the Fox broadcast was asking like, should p J. Williams
come in here? It looked that bad. I thought that
would have been way premature. Matt Rule did bring him
in down the stretch. I think they just wanted to
pull Cam out of the fire to some degree um
and then said after the game there's not going to

(53:56):
be any change at court properly took like three sacks
in a round. Well, yeah, I think the thing is
the p J Williams. P J Walker. Sorry, p J
Walker is an athletic and he's sort of fun to watch,
but he cannot escape killer mistakes. So you're gonna go
back to Kim Hey why? I mean Cam, it sounds like,
and I'll watch us tomorrow, but it sounds like he
was as miserable as can be. But you're in it

(54:18):
with Cam now for the rest of the season. I
don't think there's any way unless he like doubles up
on this type of performance, which feels like unlikely. You're
gonna roll with Cam, who's still going to give you
the best chance to win. But I if you're the Panthers,
and we'll give Dolphins, you know, a little bit more
love in a second, But if you're the Panthers to
kind of have all this buzz around you after Cam's
first game and now to lose back to back games

(54:40):
and this game, especially as ugly as it looked, I
just don't like. What direction is this organization heading right now.
Is we're getting into the back end of the second
year of the Matt Rule era. It's fair to ask
because I'm not seeing a ton of progress here. They're floating,
but I think losing Christian McCaffrey to a rolled up ankle,
I mean again with this guy offense, I know he
is injury prone, but they're floating in Their defense was

(55:01):
a no show today. That's the thing that you think
that's gonna be their strength, and the two times in
the last couple of weeks the defense has been you know, neutralized.
I think Flores bring something to the table, you know,
I have that there where it's like five coaches matter
because they're bad. Five doesn't because they think. But what
you want is a coach that brings something to the table.
And what I think Flores does some sometimes in certain matchups.

(55:25):
He really gives you an advantage in this Panthers offensive line,
which has been quietly miserable all season, especially like picking
up stunts, splits and stuff like that. It was this
was a terrible matchup for them today to have to
play this Dolphins defense with a quarterback that's not totally prepared. Uh,
doesn't know the whole offense and your offensive line and

(55:47):
nothing to do. And like that's twice in the last
three weeks where I think Flores has come to the
table because I know to have played well, but ultimately
they had three fifteen yards on offense, where Flores kind
of one you a couple of games here with your
defensive gameplay took He's taking his butt out of the
fryar Flora's with this run. I mean you know that
he's not gonna tell you that because he's the coach,

(56:08):
And well, no, that's fair to say. But if they
have a non competitive season where they go three and fourteen,
you could be in trouble. And at one and seven
they're ahead of that way. But now there's some juice
and now you get bolt New York teams coming up.
We'll we'll spend forward on later in the week. But
they really do have a chance to make a run
at the playoffs now they needed this was the big one.

(56:30):
If you could beat the Panthers, a team that profiled
a frisky and dangerous in that spot, you really do
open things up. Giants Jets at Saints uh the next
three weeks. So they are still thirty shot here, so
they gotta keep winning. Their thirteenth in the a f C.
So there are a couple of losses behind still despite
this winning. But but they're in the middle. I wanted
to just quickly before we go, give you a couple

(56:51):
of stats. Number one, Jalen Wattle over the last month
second in the NFL and receiving yards in receptions. And
two US played sixteen starts now, so that's a nice
little number that we understand. Passing yards six point eight
yards per tempt, twenty seven touchdowns, twelve turnovers. Solid. It's
good considering again ignoring the seventeen game schedule that is

(57:13):
now part of our I hate that because I have
always thought that that's how you have that's how you
evaluate Hall of famers, that's how you valuate you a player.
Sixteen game. Chunks messed that. I think he even went
down to fifteen in the prior game he said that
it was gonna be eight and seven finish to the season.
Was that that and the math got messed up because
I was like trying to do out numbers. All right,

(57:33):
let's get through this next game as quickly as possible.
Atlanta at Jacksonville. Oh boy, here's Rynald the near hash
mark Gavis Patterson straight ahead touchdown Cardarol Patterson. I kid
jack Wars fans. That's what we do here. We give
everybody some shine Western with the called w z g

(57:56):
C g C good call. Quadurell Patterson ran for a
career high eight yards and two touchdowns in his return
from an ankle injury. The Falcons win for the first
time in three weeks over the moribund Jacksonville. Atlanta has
now five and six. They finished with a season high

(58:16):
hundred and forty nine yards on the ground. That's not
that much. Uh, They're most since October twenty. That's weird, Greg,
What did you learn here that Cordurel Patterson matters? I
guess I knew that already, but I don't know. Let's
come up with an award to give this guy sixteen runs,
hundred and eight yards, two touchdowns, you know, like Deebo Samuel,
like he's really gone full transition to a running back.

(58:39):
He had a couple of touchdowns. And I feel like
I know the next gen stats, you know, could could
check this, but I believe that eight percent of the
Falcons yardage this year are Cordurell Patterson off off miss tackles,
like not even just normal plays just after he breaks
the tackle. That was pretty much the offense. This will
annoy Dan because Dan I think he's waiting for the

(59:00):
Falcons to you know, vaporize itself. They are, they are,
I'm going to I'm not matter. They are right now
tied with the precious Minnesota Vikings at five and final spot.
But what stands out to me is they have the
second worst point differential at a negative a hundred and
three points in the NFC. I know they stink, but

(59:22):
like I'm trying to help you have, but stinky teams
get into the playoffs and to we're just saying, from
where we stand today, I'm not predicting that. And this
game didn't make me feel better about them. This game,
what it did make me feel as an appreciation for
the love I have for the around the NFL listening
because I missed the first half of this game. I
was I was on a I was on a flight
back from a friend's wedding in Miami. The Jet Blue

(59:45):
had only the New York teams on the you know,
on the flight, so so late into the AFTERDAMI, late
in the afternoon, as the afternoon games are on, I'm
trucking through twenty one to three. Let's see this Trevor
Lawrence come back. I want to see every play of this.

(01:00:05):
Try this Trevor Lawrence come back, just so I can
give the listeners a little something. And I don't really
have much other than Ti law You know, he had
another chance to do something where you're like, oh, that's
a moment, because he did get the ball back. He
had a nice touchdown drive before that. But then they
go like four and out with two pretty bad throws
and he's just not super accurate. That's the thing that

(01:00:26):
worries me a little bit. I think it's safe to
say and listen this is it's way too early to
cast any final opinions on Trevor Lawrence. But given the
hype and everything else. It's been a disappointing first year
for him. And that's not just on him, but if
you thought he was going to come into the league,
even you know, he's been compared to Andrew Luck, Peyton Manning.
Those guys came into the league and even if they

(01:00:47):
had growing pains in that first year, they flashed. And
we just haven't seen a ton of it from Trevor
this year. Little spurts though, but he isn't a chaotic
the worst landing, absolutely absolutely, but that the problem is
that's not changing at least in terms of the coaching
staff and that and that's yeah, that's part of the part.
I just thought this was gonna be a spot when
I picked this game too. It's like, Okay, maybe we

(01:01:08):
have a nice Trevor Lawrence glow up game against this
lousy Falcons and he had like a d ten yards
going into the fourth quarter. I'm a loser. That's absolutely right. Last, last,
but not least Miami. We had to not Miami Houston
for the game of the day. Zo Wilson's staff and

(01:01:28):
it's a quarterback people that sits back to the left,
dives for the goal he's in. That's a Jet touchdown.
All right, Bob was Shusan on our show for the
third time this year. Is Zack Wilson had more downs
than ups in his return from a four week injury layoff,
but his four yard touchdown scramble was pivotal win for

(01:01:50):
the Jets over the Texans, the favorite Texas in Houston.
By the way, the home I was a little annoying. Um.
The home teams went seven three this Sunday entering SNF
F Y I. The Texans, Uh, you know, they're hoping
to build on their upset of the Titans last week,
and they're up fourteen three in this game. But then

(01:02:11):
their offense just went to bed Tyrod Taylor through two
touchdown passes in the second quarter and that was it
for the game. Uh. They had a chance to tie
it late, but Bryce Hall, who's done pretty good work
for the Jets in their secondary and secondary knockdown a
pass intended for Nico Collins and fourth and two to
give New York the ball back. And then they did
what they need to do to wind down the clock

(01:02:33):
get the win. I thought. Michael Floor, who's really had
a nice month after a rocky started as o C
did something that is not easy to do. He had
to coach around a rookie quarterback who was struggling and
dig out of a double digit deficit. I mean you,
that's not usually a needle. You can't thread that needle typically,
but he did. And I guess when you're playing the

(01:02:54):
Texans it helps as well. Because Wilson was not good
in this game and he appeared to aggravate that knee
injury on a scramble in the second half, so he's
not healthy still. Um, but he missed too many and
too many throws. And you know I don't have I
don't host a quarterback camp. I'm not a give me
a QB guru, Greg Um, you don't write QB index.

(01:03:17):
I'm not a Greg Rosie. I'm not uh jt Sell.
I'm not a Jordan Palmer. Tom House. I'm not a
Tom House. But I can tell you this that the
game is moving super fast for Zach Wilson, and you
could see it. He had a really bad interception where
he scrambled and threw a shovel pass into the back

(01:03:39):
of his running back that, of course, then ricochets off
the back of the jersey and into the hands of
the defender. It's just a classic moment of everything is
moving too fast for him. If if Tom Brady has
mastered the sport by everything slowing down, Zach Wilson is
still on the other side of that spectrum where everything
is moving at light speed and you could just see
it the way he moved. Um. So that's frustrating because

(01:04:01):
you were hoping for progress. But again, uh, they did
get a win, and I guess it is on in
New York City. This is this is the fun fact.
This is the first time the Jets and Giants won
on the same day since nineteen And also, by the way,

(01:04:24):
Justin Reid was deactivated for disciplinary reasons from this team
that is all about like our culture or culture. Maven's like,
that's the third first thing I read this morning that
read essentially in a fight with um team brass over
something and becomes a free agent after this season. Did
not play today, Give me a break. Also, one of
their better players. These two teams combined for four hundred

(01:04:46):
and sixty years, so they combined for you know, a
lot less than the Raiders had the other day. I
don't think it's going to be number one in the game.
Pass Um this one. If you're lucky, it will be
in that like thirty one to thirty three minute range. Uh,
the the quick game pass version one though, because I
just feel like they've been better than the Texans this

(01:05:07):
year and and you're right that Texas laying wood in
that spot. Yeah, there's just something like I just feel
like that. It's right, It's just right. I'll take the devil.
I don't care about draft standings. I don't give it.
I don't give a hoot. I just I'll take the
w But I need the boy to play better. It's
still not happening all right now. That takes us to

(01:05:29):
Mark Sessler and highly emotionally charged Sunday night football affair
against the team that was ripped from the belly of
the Browns. As the man they call the Quiet Storms said,
after this Sunday Night, Jackson takes the snap, pressures coming

(01:05:49):
cloudy almost got it. He's rolling back to the thirty
five yard like throws as he's hit. He throws to
the episode touchdown Ravens been a little field of Mark
Andrews who came back to make the touchdown reception. It's
a thirteen yard touched out officially, but It was about
a thirty seven yard pass from Lamar Jackson. Yes that

(01:06:11):
hey in the barn for the Baltimore Ravens and one
of those classic rugged a f C North affairs. The
Ravens hold off to Cleveland Brown sixteen to ten at
M and T Bank Stadium, and they win a game

(01:06:31):
in which Lamar Jackson threw four interceptions, including three in
a single quarter of play. Usually that's doomed, but it
wasn't on this Sunday because the defense of Baltimore rose
up and shut down the Cleveland Brown's offense all night,
especially on that final drive when the Browns needed to

(01:06:52):
get down the field for seven, they could not produce
a first down or even throw to the sticks there
Um when it counted, Ark Seessler, Uh, your Brownies fallowed
six and six. The Ravens move to eight and three
and feel like they are in command of the af
C North. Yeah. I mean, I think if we had
done our preview show on Thursday, and you know, the

(01:07:16):
football gods had whispered in my year before we discussed
this game that Lamar would do what you just said,
that he would throw four interceptions, and I would tell
you I'll go to NFL research with that, and they'd
come back and say that since qbs to do that,
starters to throw four interceptions the game are oh and
thirty seven, Now they're one in thirty seven. It's because

(01:07:38):
Cleveland could do very little with those gifts. I mean,
I'm not sure what else you could ask this defense
to have done. I mean, I felt the frustration that
Jadeveon Clowney felt, um that so many defenders feel, chasing
Lamar around and unable to close the deal. But they
did in so many ways. I mean, the turnovers are
the gifts that the Brown's offense should have done something with.

(01:07:59):
Here's what they could hear what they got off of
that three points, a field goal, two punts, and the
ball flickering out of Baker Mayfield's hands um at a
key moment that set the Ravens up. So this Brown's
offense um looked broken against the Lions, Uh muddled, really
weird play selection. I thought tonight they got too cute
with that Jarvis Landry um, you know, strip sacked. It

(01:08:21):
was was a bit of a nightmare. And you know,
if the football gods had also told me, oh, by
the way, along with those gifts, you're gonna run for
forty yards at two point four yards per carry. You
aren't gonna have outside of Jarvis Landry, anyone really helping
out in the passing game. And Baker Mayfield. You know,
I'm not saying that that last drive was, um a

(01:08:41):
great situation for him, but that was another chance for
Baker Mayfield to seal a game and do something in
a big national spot, an Island game, like you say, Dan,
and they fizzled. And that's what their offense has been
for for weeks now, um a fizzle operation. Yeah. I
can't believe how bad this Brown's offenses. I don't think
Kevin an Sky can believe it either, And that's why
I think he keeps calling passing plays in situations where

(01:09:05):
Browns fans are like, why don't we just try to
run the vaults because he's he's looking at the numbers,
he's seeing the way defenses are playing them. In the
book says, you do what the defense gives you. You know,
you can take what the defense gives you. And I
think defense is, especially the Ravens tonight or in a sense,
giving the Browns a pass passing game. They're giving him
one on one matchups. They were run blitzing all night.

(01:09:28):
Now they also the Browns didn't run well when they
tried to run, and so that that was a problem.
But he's calling these class plays and they don't have
a passing game right now that can overcome it. Uh.
Even in a game like this where I still thought
they had a chance there at the end, it was
it was that like ugly old a f C North game.
I was hoping Baker could just give us a little

(01:09:48):
entertainment at the end. Come on, you kept you kept
thinking that maybe they had something special. Uh. In the
fourth quarter, they scored the touchdown on that hotly contested
David and Joku catch, which is one of the more
kind of borderline uh coin flip plays I can remember
where it doesn't matter how much you slow it down. Um,

(01:10:09):
you can't really discern whether that was a catch or not.
And because they ruled it a catch on the field,
it was the right move to keep it as a touchdown.
That ended up being the only touchdown the Browns had.
Justin Tucker and his brilliance, he takes care of all
his opportunities and that ends up being the margin for victory.
But Mark, I think I mean, you've hit on it
with the Browns, and no one's tracking this team closer

(01:10:31):
than you that We're now twelve games into the season,
and you know, they've had some nice moments this year,
a blowout of Cincinnati a couple of weeks back. There
have been other games that have been quality wins you
would define them as. But how many times now have
they had a chance, an opportunity to do something special
and really put their season on a different trajectory and

(01:10:52):
they just fall short? And I just wonder what they
can do at this point to fix it. As are
you to do deep into a season to find that
type of DNA or is there something really missing here?
They're not. They're not a team that's like well positioned
too to battle from behind to start um. But to
your question, like that is become their character trait in

(01:11:14):
their character flaw. I mean you could point to four
or five games this year where you know, had Baker
Mayfield been Joe Montana late eighties, they their record would
be vastly different. And I'm not putting it all on
Baker Mayfield. I think systemically, the loss of Odell Beckham,
like from a production numbers standpoint, doesn't look too big.
But I think the way the defenses would treat the

(01:11:36):
Browns wide receiver group and their tight end group in
general has changed a lot. Like I see a group
of white outs that that can't separate or get open.
I mean, you know, you don't have Anthony Schwartz in there.
Uh like that that's a speed guy, but he has
his production. He's a rookie. But it's like they just
don't have that guy that really scares you at this point. Um.
I think losing Harris and Bryant didn't help them tonight.

(01:11:57):
But but I'm pointing to like they're they're most not
even like three tight end sets. And I think that
this offense um has been slightly figured out, and uh,
you know, teams are attacking it differently than last year
when there was you know, they were able to kind
of do what they wanted to do and mystify defensive coordinators.
That's not the case. The Ravens, I thought, diagnosed them

(01:12:17):
really well tonight and did what the Ravens do. And
yet there were more open Browns receivers tonight than Ravens receivers.
Like well, the uple plays had about three or four
great throws in this game, which is why I struggled
with the whole injury thing of like we put it
all on the on the injuries. But he had some
gems and his biggest problems came on plays where he

(01:12:40):
held the ball where he did the pump fake thing.
On one of them he just fumbled and dropped it,
but on another one he just seemed like he had
an open receiver, does the pump, holds it and then
bad things happen. And then on the flip side, it's
like Lamar Jackson has a disastrous night, four interceptions, a
couple other miss throws that he had, and yet he
reminds me a little bit of Brady in that. Like

(01:13:02):
you know, like if you're an opponent of Lamar, all
you're thinking is like he still made that Lamar play
where he back pedals back to the thirty five and
hits a freaking touchdown. He still had that play where
he evades like four different tacklers to get out of
a sack and make a completion. Like in the end,
like he ends up winning these games with a couple
of winning plays and you're just like, oh, that that's Lamar.

(01:13:24):
But he's getting wins. It seems fair that like Lamar
wouldn't be critiqued the same way that another baker or
another quarterback would for throwing for receptions because you still
know he's going to be a game changer down the stretch.
And like the Ravens didn't change what they were doing
because of any of that, and they and the defense
ultimately bailed him out. I know he made a couple
of big throws and showed that great escapability all night long,

(01:13:45):
but he averaged four yards per carry on I believe
twelve attempts. He threw the ball up for grabs all game,
and the d just balled out in a huge spot.
Even right down to that final series, the Browns go
four and out and they get a fourth down stop
where you know it's short of the sticks, they get
the tackle, and they walk off with a win. Where
you throw four interceptions in prime time, that's a that's

(01:14:06):
a big win for the Ravens and the Browns. They
got there looking for answers right now and it's getting
late early. We might have to talk like m v
P or something on Tuesday. I don't know. It's like
Lamar in his last five games that just scribbled this
down forgive me if I'm wrong, has seven touchdowns, nine
interceptions and taking seventeen sacks. It has not gone well
over the last five Well that's why everyone's, you know,

(01:14:28):
trying to figure that out. And that's why when Jonathan
Taylor blew up last week and as he had over
two months that, it was like, Okay, maybe we'll give
it to a running back, because the quarterback position this
year doesn't have a guy that's really running away with
this thing. Stafford, you thought might do it, It's not happening.
Kyler Murray got hurt, Lamar Jackson now has gone sideways.

(01:14:49):
Brady still makes sense as an option obviously, But yeah,
that's a conversation perhaps for another show. Mark, How you doing, buddy?
You seem like you're in I feel like you're in
a in a some healthy place with this Brown's team
where a loss like this isn't crushing you. In fact,
you locked up the Ravens, so congratulations. Yes, um, you know,
a minor solace, But I mean I think that we

(01:15:10):
You asked me a couple of weeks ago in our
network show Lock it Up Right with a joyous occasion,
like who are who is this team, and I kind
of just felt back then like they are what they are,
Like they're just there's a lot of there's more questions
than answers. Um, they're frustrating to watch. I think they
must be. They must be feeling extremely frustrated. And they
aren't built right now to win games like this um

(01:15:33):
in their own division where Baltimore is and that's who
the Ravens have been against Cleveland forever. And like I said,
I think that they the Ravens always reveal Cleveland's um
character and I guess status maybe more than characters sometimes too.
And they revealed Cleveland status tonight and guess what the
Browns hit thereby and then come back and play the

(01:15:54):
Ravens again. Uh in week fourteen. That will have huge consequences.
Let's get it together, NFL. The Browns are doing this,
and so are the Patriots. Wait, what's wrong? I think
it's kind of a neat little wrinkle. It doesn't happen
all at all. I think that's so bro I don't
love it, but I put them out like it's all
about adjustments. SINCEAI playing the same team twice in a row,

(01:16:16):
it's it's a different type of challenge for the coaching staff.
You know, it's just different. Hey, you know what else
is different? Like, uh, this BTS group biggest pop in
on the world, Ricky jump on a second. So you
were in between our early taping and now you walk past, uh,
you know, our commissary, and you heard the squealing of

(01:16:37):
seventy thousand girls, including I would think Greg's own daughter.
I thought I heard Ellis. Actually I heard Ellis and
and it was right at the beginning, you know where
they like play music and the lights come down and
you're like waiting for a group to come up, and
then I think there's seven of them. You could hear
them come up, and I thought there was like an earthquake,

(01:16:58):
like our office building was shaking. It is out of
control over there. I went for a second just to
get a feel of it too. It's definitely louder for
BTS than any rams or charge ever. Greg. You you uh,
you coughed up half your paycheck for those tickets, and
I think it's worth it, uh to give your daughter

(01:17:18):
that experience. Before we sign off and mark you, you
feel free to log off. You know you don't have
to deal with this after a Brown's loss but again,
like you're in a healthy I'm just curious because I
don't have a real working knowledge of BTS. I asked
Ricky just to pull up the three biggest BTS songs
on Spotify, and I want to know if if anyone's

(01:17:39):
recognizing any of them or what we think of them.
Just check in real quick. Okay, I know all three,
but that could just be I know out three. There's
only three in the English language, so I could even
name them for you before you put it wrong. There's
more than that. Here's the first one, just because from difference.

(01:18:09):
Wait a minute, I think I believe I saw Chris
Martin there. That's a collab Chris. Okay, that one. What
else I know that you were, but it's it's skyrocket disappointing.
But Dan, I think you will know whoa Okay, not totally.

(01:18:34):
I think you know that. I mean I know the
source material. I don't. I didn't know. I wasn't aware
of their like tenanch remix version or whatever it is.
All right, let me hear one more. Are these are
over like a billion? Yeah, they're like they're too big
numbers for me to pronounce. All right, one more? Anybody
else curious. No, no, like it's good to be tapped

(01:18:56):
into songs, although the first one not so much, but yeah,
the other ones, this one Greg plays all the time.
But for dream meal Bed I've heard that before. So
they are they? So? Is that the is that guy?

(01:19:17):
The styles, the Harry styles, the Justin timber Lake of
the group you seem to be they're all. There's a lot,
but there is one I think that is like the one.
I think his name is John. I don't know. I
don't even want to see Greg, but yeah, what's his name?
We're just sounding so so old like MM play some

(01:19:40):
more of these, Greg, don't be self conscious, just embrace
that you like Yes, you like rap. There's a thirst
for knowledge here, Greg. You know it's okay. I've gotten
all the knowledge I need of BTS over the list.
I just think it's funny that you're like playing it
cool because when we were coming back from doing the

(01:20:00):
UM Sunday Night Show in London, we're walking back to
the hotel, it's two am, we're getting ready to start
the show and Greg, you literally pumped her fist and
you go, yes, Emmaica got the tickets for beating It
was because I like love my family. Yeah, it was,
it was. It was an uphill battle. We didn't think
she was going to be able to get it, and
uh it happened. Initially, the tickets Greg, they were for

(01:20:21):
him and Jessel Nick and some other guy, and then
Emmaica decided otherwise. No, I was supposed to get the tickets,
but then we were on the stage when they when
they went on sale, and I was like, I can't
possibly pull this off. Well, it all worked out, and
I feel enlightened now. I feel like I'm under I'm
surfing the zeitgeist right now with all that melody pumped

(01:20:41):
into my I feel like you the way home, you know,
and see what you think. I think you should work
in smooth like butter into your like daily binocular. All right,
I'll work on that. All right, good stuff, good show.
That's the flagship program. And remember this, These games occurred
after Thanksgiving, so they count. Okay, keep that in mind.

(01:21:05):
When you put your head to pillow, you're there in
a really good place. Emotional links. Your team one like me,
jets one to oh. In games that count, we're flying.
Everybody else not so hot. Well, half the leak. That's
the breakdown. Good night. All right, they're ready to go.

(01:21:28):
This stand has a signing off for Quiet Storm. The
old boss Ricky Hollywood until Tuesday, he'd the call m

(01:22:00):
spe

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Host

Gregg Rosenthal

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