Dalton Scale 2022: Finding a New Prime Meridian

A room filled with some heroes - Dan Hanzus, Marc Sessler, Gregg Rosenthal and Patrick Claybon bring you the definitive quarterback power rankings for 2022 and break down this year's Dalton Scale. The heroes talk through their consensus list while searching for a new Prime Meridian to replace Andy Dalton, who was left off the list this year as he settles into his backup role.

See omnystudio.com/listener for privacy information.

Episode Transcript

Speaker 1 (00:00):
Be Around with the NFL podcast has not considered trading
for Baker Org from the Chris Westling podcast studio. It's
around the NFL. I'm Dan Hansis. I'm in a studio
filled with some heroes, Greg Rows, withal Mark Sessler sitting

(00:21):
to my right. Don't you dare call him Pat, Patrick Claybon.
What's up? Everybody? You can call me whatever you want.
All right, I'm glad to be here. I'll take it.
I got paper in my hand. This is crazy. Dan
likes using unpopular ways to say people's names. He likes
calling him Pat Claybon. He likes called me Greggy, which

(00:43):
only called west unpopular. It's almost like a there's like
a negative connotation to that. It's more just like more
off the grid, like a lesser alias. Even lesser is
kind of negative way look at it. It's just more
like off the beaten path of how the person is addressed.
It was at the point though, because again these text

(01:03):
conversations that bubble up during the weekend, Uh, you were
so apologized for. No, no, no no, they're perfectly pleasant. It's
just that I don't always track them as carefully as
I would if you know, right before a burning work
meeting or something, and it's like, oh, let's have Pad
on the show. And I spent a big chunk of
yesterday thinking that we were having Rhodo Pat, who's been
on our show before, to join us for the QB debate,

(01:24):
so which he would have been great on them. He
would have done a fantastic But I think we've got
our guy right here. Shout out to Pat Darty. Yeah,
shout out to Pet who goes bo Pet which is
but it's not a called San Patrick. Yeah, it's a
it's a not lesser. But Dan would never talk about
Revenge of the Fifth. He would say episode three, I
have no idea. Yeah, I mean he wouldn't do either,
but yes, um, all right, save it for the spot podcast. Alright,

(01:50):
that'll just a needle right anyway. He he knows so
much more than he lets stuff like Dan definitely has
a Bill Bell check. Talking about my face vibe whenever
start as my face Honestly, Um, I've said it to you, Mark,

(02:11):
I have not seen the films. I maybe saw them
when I was four or five, the initial ones, and
then I saw Fantom Medicine. That's you. It's like the
saying I don't eat French food because the one time
I went and had food at a French restaurant, I
was poisoned. Because fantom menace is the equivalent of that. Like,
but also we don't even I haven't seen any of

(02:32):
them other than as a kid. I I and I
don't defend more than about eight hours of the entire product.
That's the thing that I get annoyed by. It's um,
I have a I have institutional knowledge just because you
guys won't shut up about it for thirty five straight years.
And by you guys, I mean well you guys, yes,
but the rest of America in the world as well.

(02:54):
You're are pop cultural liaison with a massive blind spot
to one of the biggest events an American cinema history.
It's why Mark always wants Pat on the show to
even out number I'll take it anytime I can shoehorn
five minutes. I should say I don't. That's not a
self I've never said that. I am the pop culture

(03:15):
savant of this show. I have a very I'm passionate,
you said of the entire NFL media group at one
point that was sort of where you were going with
your injectory. All end around and scores being that was
that was a an interest of you. You like to
blend the pop culture with football and sport. I never
said I am the voice of the show for pop

(03:36):
culture that not of this show. Poisting that upon. I
meant more of NFL media, larger king this little thing. No,
so you bring up Star Wars. Yeah, this is my
fault because we talked um I will and I have
said one of those dope movies. I said to you
and Zumwald, I'll watch it with you, right, which me,
you're overrating my interest in in in the whole thing too.

(03:59):
So no, I'm being foisted into a position of like
I've already told you what I feel about this. Greg
is falling asleep right now. He doesn't wants to move
on anyway. I'm just saying, like someone that can compare
and contrast different Carrie Fisher biographies are probably in it
at the high level that Dan is insane, which is

(04:19):
that's your opinion, which is fine. I don't want you
ever to feel uncomfortable about it, because I am Actually
there is more nuance to it. That's all tell me
about it. I'm telling you that I just think about
always been attractive to me. I think they've largely failed
in massive ways. All right, let's get into today's show

(04:43):
because we've got a very important program. I'm leaving. I
cannot believe we would be caught up with that madness
when we have come together for the return. Hit it great.

(05:09):
Now you chopped off my hand. I'll get revenge. Nailed it.
You are my father? Now that backwards again? All right?
Here we are, here, we are I'm making enemies in

(05:31):
the room. Here. This is a golden Boy again by
Sam Spence, the legend NFL films. The quarterback is the
golden boy of this sport. And if we have carved
out any if we've carved out any niches within the

(05:51):
NFL landscape, the NFL media landscape through the years, it's great.
That's awesome. And if you had to pin something that
we've done on the show that has gotten the most traction,
it's the Dalton scale. And the Dalton Scale is a
creation of the great late Chris Westling, And um, you

(06:13):
know what. I was going to describe what that is,
but as I always did whenever we did this exercise,
and we didn't do it last year because last year
was a pretty heavy year. Um, but we've done it
every other year on this show. I would always open
this exercise by throwing it to Chris and saying, Chris,
what is the Dalton Scale? I also always needed a reminder.

(06:35):
You always struggled with that. I'm still not totally sure
you've got it, but let's I think I have it now.
This is what Chris said the last time we did
this exercise with him in two thousand nineteen. Andy Dalton
is the primary Indian of NFL quarterbacks. He represents quarterback purgatory.

(06:55):
If you are ranked below Andy Dalton, your franchise needs
a quarterback. If you're ranked above Andy Dalton, you're in
ship shape. Everything's figured out. You're good to go. And
uh later in that same episode, and it was so
nice to go back and listen and hear Chris's voice.
He was in good form. He was healthy at this
time in his life, days before his wedding, days before

(07:16):
his wedding, he had beaten cancer the first time and
was on top of the world. So it was really
as a nice listen if you ever want to go
back and listen, UH and here the essence of of
wes Uh. He also went on and explained why the
scale works and always will work whether or not Andy
Dalton's involved. There. The beauty of this scale is that

(07:37):
it's truly reflective of quarterback play in the NFL. He
could be ranked fourteen one year and still be the
prime Ridian, and the next year be ranked and still
be the prime Ridian. So here we are, so here
we are. And that's true. And this is tell me
if I'm understanding correctly, Greg Rosenthal, Greggy Andy Dalton is

(07:58):
the prime Ridian. So there and B twenty three quarterbacks
that are true franchise guys, and that just means that
there are more upper level quarterbacks than other years in
this and using this as an example, but Dalton will
always remain that cutting point, the break point between the
guys you can trust and believe in and the riff raff.

(08:19):
And as a team builder, anyone below Andy Dalton you
probably have to have a serious conversation about whether he
should be the leader of your team. Well, I think
we need to find who's the new Andy Dalton on
some level, because Andy Dalton's now now a backup, and
I think we'll get into who we are considering who
are not some of the youngest quarterbacks. They don't really

(08:41):
fit the Dalton scale as much. It's more for someone
that you've seen for a few years, maybe not just
one year. Not rookies certainly. Uh So it's also the
memory of Dalton, of who Dalton was for the majority
of that run, uh with the Bengals. Now of course,
uh he's a backup with the Saints, and um, I
have a feeling and dal is going to be part
of this two season more than we expect in some

(09:03):
way or another. It's just gonna happen that Andy Dalton's
making a big time spot start, but he's no longer.
Really this is the Dalton scale. And yet when I
look at the list that we all put together, and
then we had a consensus list that Grave Digger helped
put together, Andy Dalton doesn't appear anywhere because the passages
of time. And uh, I would say, before we get

(09:24):
into our list, before we get into the consensus list,
I think it is um important that we pay respect
to the man for which the exercise was named by
Chris Westling. Have success r Tyler Boyd out of the sun.
He's got single coverage right out. For sure, we'll be

(09:46):
double at the honor will be screening Ravens trying to
end it here, so down got your step. So the

(10:08):
have stunned this crowd. Unbelievable, unbelievable. Week seventeen, two thousand seventeen,
Dalton knocks the Ravens out of the playoffs, gets the
Bills off the Schneiden back into the postseason. West is
pretty annoyed about that. If you recall he was he

(10:28):
was not like I think he was annoyed that the
Bills were not good and he was kind of on that, like, guys,
don't respect them that they made the playoffs because they're
not a good team. That wasn't there a heat there?
I kind of recall that, Yeah, there's a Tyrod Taylor
led Bills team that very different than the Bills team.
That's this is they are no relation to the team,
really know. And they fizzled out to the Jaguars and

(10:49):
one of the weirder, like low octane wild card games
we've ever witnessed. And I now know Dan, why you
came into the news from our newsroom is like very
hushed and um, it's fout. It's really strange. But Dan
came in belting that song out. Uh, turnheads. It is
that the last great Dalton moment. I mean he's had

(11:13):
he's had a couple since. Uh. Is that some decent
start since? But I don't know if there's been anything
like I think that's the Dalton moment, which is funny
because they were playing out the string as I recall Cincinnati,
and that was just stunning knife through the heart of
the Ravens in their building. Uh, just a kind of
a great certainly the last great Cincinnati Dalton moment. All right,

(11:34):
so let's get into it. Great to hear from Wes.
Great to pay respect Andy Dalton. Hey, the last time
we did it in I asked Graver to go check
it out. We did this with Chris also, um to
see the previous year. What kind of takes what takes
stood out from the Dalton scale the last time we

(11:56):
did it. Uh, And now if you could share some
and Atrick, I know you also checked out the app,
so if you had any share, But what do you
got there? Grade there? Good? Yeah? So, like Greg just said,
even back in you guys were discussing should Andy Dalton
still be the scale or do we need to find
a new player to be that that Primeridian quarterback, and

(12:19):
there was some thoughts that Dave damit Check was actually
on that episode. I thought maybe Cam Newton could be
that guy. Maybe Ryan Tannehill. A couple of people said
Ryan Tannehill, Jared Goff. But then Derek Carr came up,
and there was a big sticking point around Derek Carr
because you guys all had him rank slightly different. You
all kind of agreed that Car might be the new Primardian,

(12:41):
except for Mark, who was very low on Derek Carr
and actually said he would take Gardner Minshew over Derek Carr.
Back on, UM, that was the hottest bad take. But really,
all of you guys are on Car. I feel like
you have the job right now, by the way, or
is he still in the street. Come on, he's a
backup quarter He's one of the best backups in the league. Yeah,

(13:05):
oh yeah. Can I mention one while from the year
before one that when West was was was on fire, Um,
multiple people wanted to have Sam Donald over Derek Carr,
and Greg just said he wanted Andy Dalton over Derek Carr.

(13:26):
So we have been all over the So we've been
all over them because he had outside that sixteen season
been a largely hot and cold passer. Yeah, well that's
it's interesting because that would have meant I'm sure I
was gassed up because Donald finished what you said. It
was just like you were positive about I. When I
made my list for this year, I took out anyone
that's just one year deep into their career, just because

(13:48):
I think you need to see more. And Matt mac
Jones was the only guy. And we'll get into mac
Jones because I think he's an interesting case here. Um,
but I removed anybody that's a rookie, anyone that's played
only one year, and just John Watson. Those are the
guys I pulled from the list. Um, is there any
other touch takes? Though? That stood out? Where is that?
That was pretty much? I thought it was because Check

(14:11):
had brought up cam and the idea that there's guys
out of the league that can make their way into
the Dalton Scale. But like year over year, that the
discussion about the scale itself. It has to be the
Dalton scale. It has to remain the Dalton scale. But
as a concept. Because you go through lists, there's list online,
they have you guys right list, everybody does list. It's
hard to get the full context of a list. But

(14:33):
what this vehicle provides an opportunity for is to discuss
the way that the particular list is made, how important
is for certain things. And so if people look at
the list or are the consistent listen, they're like, oh,
you got this guy there, it's impossible. We don't know
how they're gonna play. We don't know if Herrett Carr
is gonna become the greatest player in the NFL history.
We don't know if somebody's gonna have a revolution. He's

(14:53):
not becoming the greatest player in history. His his maturity
and his improvement and where he is now, ow which
looking at our rankings, he's at twelve, and we all
had him almost identical between twelve and fourteen, so we
all saw him in a very similar way. I think
is instructive because he's probably been the same guy for
the most part throughout and we were on the fence

(15:15):
whether he's really the guy, much like a lot of
Raiders fans out there, and I think now we've come
to the conclusion that he is. But part of the
reason is is that he's improved, like you are allowed
to improve, and we're baking that into the rankings, who
we think can improve, who we don't think will improve.
And car is undoubtedly a different quarterback than he was

(15:36):
three years ago when he refused to throw the ball deep,
and now he's one of the more effective deep ball
throwers in the league. He still has the things that
we got concerned about back then, and that's why he's
like in the twelve to fourteen range and he's not
in the top ten. Uh, but he got better. You
can get rewarded. It should just so everyone knows. Yes,
Andy Dalton is essentially being replaced in this conversation. But

(15:59):
like to use a baseball term, the Mendoza line, which
was a Mario Mendoz of the nineteen seventy nine Mariners.
That's when that was coined. Of a guy that struggles
to get over two batting average. He's long gone, and
yet that's always now how it's known. It's the Mendoza line.
That's what the Dalton scale is. It will always be
the Dalton scale. But who is the new Dalton? Derek

(16:21):
Carr is certainly one of those names I think, um
Mark I want to say for me, and I'm curious
anybody else that disagrees, because This isn't a straight QB
ranking exercise. We're trying to figure out that primary Indian.
But there there are ten names for me that I
feel um and I'll do him an order because they
just there's the order of the quarterbacks I had that
are out of the conversation because there's no doubt to

(16:44):
me that they belong on the right side of line Rodgers, Brady,
Josh Allen Mahomes, Herbert Burrow, Stafford, Prescott, Rust Wilson, and
Lamar Jackson. That's where my list cuts off. Of debate,
I have Kyler Murray still up for debate, Derek Carrup
for debate, and then everyone else. Do you guys disagree
with that? Minus the out of out of out of

(17:06):
conversation players you mentioned are essentially identical to mine. If
they're not in the same order, they're essentially identical. Right
the consensus list you you're pretty close to. I mean,
Stafford would be part of that for me, and Kyler
would too, and and Derek Carrwood as well. And that's
our top twelve on our consensus. I mean, are we
really discussing whether Stafford or Kyler Murray are whether you're

(17:28):
set as a franchise quarterback. Both of those two guys.
For instance, I think we're the best quarterback in the
league for about a month at a time. Matthew Stafford
was the best quarterback in the league for the playoffs,
which is you know, I think you should get a
little extra weight for that. Uh. And so he he
was eighth or ninth on my list overall, the tenth
on the consensus list. And Kyler even though um, I

(17:51):
guess you want to put him up here, to me,
there's not much question. Through seven weeks last season he
was number one on my QB Index. And like any
any quarterback that can put that kind of stretch together,
and he's had other stretches for his career, I'm not
talking about them, whether they are a franchise quarterback or not.
He he has done it, and he's been a little
more up and down than you would want, and he's

(18:11):
had his minor injuries. But to me, those twelve and
I'm I'm throwing car in there. Uh. The consensus list
was Rogers, Mahomes, Brady, Alan, Herbert Burrow, Dak Russell, Wilson, Lamar, Stafford,
and Kyler. Murray was the top. I get why Dan
has maybe some Kyler concerns though, because two years in
a row it's been injury based to some degree. But

(18:32):
they've fallen off a clip as a team. His play
fell off at the end of last year. But there's
other stuff. There's there's the idea that is like this
guy a natural leader, is like football everything that he
cares about maturity. But on top of that, if he
if he reaches those m v P levels, that that's
what you're gonna get. If he grows and he becomes
more consistent, he's still young, right. I think I feel

(18:52):
even though I have him outside my top ten, Patrick,
I I feel totally fine in terms of us reaching
a consensus here to have Kyler and car on the
right side as well. Are you on board? I mean
the way I tried to break mine down is to go,
what unique talents do you have that the rest of
the league doesn't offer? And my scale kind of favors that,

(19:13):
and Kyler definitely has that. Um, you know, there's this
asinine question from the franchise about you know, the future,
like he's there, Like he clearly has the ability and
and that's all you're looking for, right, Um, Andrew Luck
decided he didn't want to play football anymore. I would
have still had Andrew Luck on my team if I
could have convinced him to play. And so if you
can pay Kyler and he shows up, then yeah you
do that. But yeah, between him and and Derek Carr,

(19:36):
I've seen enough to say, like, why why am I
going to go into quarterback purgatory and search for another
quarterback when I have a quarterback that I can win with.
So we agreed so much it's it's almost outrageous, like
our top tens are essentially the same thing we do
show together. It didn't take long to come up with
the top ten two minutes well, and I think that's
reflective of the the whole league study. And I think

(20:00):
this exercise, the top twelve to thirteen and even the
top fifteen sixteen seemed pretty defined. Like I had Russell
Wilson the lowest at eleven, uh Mark had him at eight,
Dan at nine, Claibon at six, but like, still, what
are we talking about here? That's not that it's not
like I'm burying him. I think his average level of

(20:22):
play has been significantly below any of the rest of
the top ten over the last two years. We kind
of forget that he was to start last year even
before the injury. Uh. To me, he he hasn't played
at that like really high level and a lot longer
than any of those other names like Dac and Burrow.

(20:42):
And I'm sure he's gonna light it up. In the
same thing with Kyler, you're saying, I can look at
a stretch, what about the first six or seven weeks
of completely on fire? So he I don't think he's
really know what I mean that we're almost all agreeing.
All these names, including car for the most part, are
the same. I had Tannehill as my twelve, which was

(21:02):
the highest they see that anyway, Right, So Tannehill, let's
start here on grave Digger. I know this is a
sense of topic for you, so just try to comport
yourself with professionalism. Uh, Tannehill. You know we've even I
think in this exercise made him the tennis scale. We've
talked when he was on the Dolphins. At one point
we thought he was the Tanna Very well, here we
are years later. I have him at fourteen, Greggy at twelve,

(21:28):
Mark at fifteen, and Pat Claibon at fifteen. So um,
he is certainly in this conversation as that guy, right,
and and you try not to put too much into
one playoff game. And Greg, I know you've you've talked
about it before that maybe that game wasn't quite as
bad as some people remember in the playoffs. I did
rewatch it the coaches film that he made a couple

(21:50):
of bad throws, but he was it wasn't the worst.
The first and last throw, we're pretty ghastly, but like, yeah, um,
he's still he was another, he was steady. He's a
guy that you can rust. He's taking them on deep
playoff runs. And yet where are we now, Clay about
An Tannehill as we spin into two? It's you you
feel you felt a regression. I mean, and I haven't
gone back and recently watched those games, especially the Bengals game,

(22:13):
but it it feels like late Dolphins era Tannehill to
a certain extent. And what I'm doing the exercise right,
because what I did was I assigned thirty points for accuracy,
uniqueness and and well, it's just playmaking. And so the
guys that I feel I can't make plays like Ryan
Tannehill's ability to make plays when athleticism is such a

(22:35):
big part of the game. It has diminished recently over
the years. To me, you do you agree with that?
For the most part. I think one one area Tannehill
doesn't add a lot of value is the ability when
things break down to just make something happen off script,
like roll out of the pocket and buy time. Like
he has good athleticism and he can like pick up

(22:56):
yards with his legs, but he doesn't like buy time.
One of the better, one of the better, but in
a in a like it has to be called for
him type And the only way I pushed back there
is few guys make more plays when just holding onto
the ball. Generally holding onto the ball and standing there
not a great idea. Ryan Tannehill continues to make more

(23:17):
plays in those situations, which is a hard way to
live waiting for the last second. To me, that's playmaking,
like holding it for two point eight, staying in there
and making tough those I don't think any quarterback in
the NFL played better compared to his ross stats uh
than Ryan Tannehill last year when PFF had him in
their top five all year long, Like it made sense

(23:38):
to me watching each one of his snaps, I would
rank them in the bottom three or four in terms
of how they protected him that the running game was
obviously up and down. Maybe he doesn't like elevate you
as much uh as you would like, But to me,
he is like absolutely a solution. He's a starting quarterback
and and I think he's closer to the Russell Wilson

(24:00):
sort of car area. Like those three guys, for instance,
to me are all in the same area. Tannehill carn
I have him two spots below Matt Ryan, but I'd
be willing to flip that if I were trying to
build a team at this point. And I think he
has blazing toughness. But the Titans have told us what
they think. They went out and drafted Malik Willis, but
they drafted four guys before that, and if anyone had drafted,

(24:21):
you know, like they expected, they would not end it up.
It's it's just it's it's no, it's a notable draft pick,
all right. How about Matt Ryan mark because he's a
guy that for years and years and years on this
podcast comfortably in that top ten, ten to twelve spot,
but as he's gotten older and um, his arm strength
is diminished and maybe doesn't move as well, not that

(24:41):
he ever moved really well. Um, he's become more of
a target for the defense. Where do you think about
age thirty seven, Matt Ryan in a new setting with
a better offensive line. I think the setting is good
the same way the setting was good for Carson Wentz
a year ago. And I have more much more faith
that Matt Ryan can go in there and succe right away.
And everything they've said about him in O T S.

(25:04):
I realized that TS have been like, he's fitting in
really well. Everything looks good. He doesn't look thirty eight necessarily,
but at thirteen, I think he's a candidate too to
completely drop down this list if things don't go well,
I don't see him sticking at thirteen, higher than the consensus.
Dan has fifteen, Greg has sixteen, Mark has thirteen, and

(25:28):
Claibon has Like in a mind military I want to say,
right now, I feel like this is the guy. I
feel like Ryan is the dude. But I'm still open
to the conversation and hearing different opinions. But when I
think about what this is, and I think, Greg, I

(25:48):
know what it is. UM. I also think a factor
in you know, down for two minutes to play. You
need it. You need your quarterback to be able to
make that drive. If the guy if in your mind
like Kirk Cousins, I think that's why he's on the
wrong side, because I don't count on him. Matt Ryan,
I think more times than not he could get it done,

(26:10):
especially with the better supporting cast. So I think he's
right there, maybe a touch above, but he could be
to me the prim rate where you have him on
your list at fifteen below Ryan Tannehill, above Jalen Hurts,
Jimmy G. Carson, Wentzon down and on. That makes sense
what you're saying right here. I think he's snuggly, you know,
just above it. But he does hit some of the

(26:32):
the bells here that West would talk about. With the
down scale. He rises and follows a little bit with
his surroundings, but in in that way that he's going
to a place where which I think will have good
surroundings for him, especially the coach, and getting rid of
the ball quickly. I like him in that two minute situation.
I like how accurate is I really think he could
be like a poor man's Peyton Manning later in his career,

(26:53):
not not the last year of Peyton Manning. But the
years before that in Denver, he obviously doesn't have that
kind of talent around him. And I think you saw
it last year, and it's actually last year that convinced
me he's definitely on the right side, because because I
think he did about there were some games where he
just you knew that because they were playing a team
with a good pass rush, it just wasn't gonna happen.

(27:14):
He wasn't gonna happen. But if he had any help whatsoever,
he would be above that line. And to me that
that means you're you're just above the Dowtons. If it
was purely a quarterback rankings list, I would have probably
had Matt Ryan higher. But because it's the Doton Deale, right,
it's the state of the quarterback position on your team,
and I'm not gonna have Matt Ryan ahead of Derek Carr, right,

(27:35):
or Matthew Stafford or bumping him up the Cousins thing.
I just had to go into the minutia and like
go tip for tat on our three categories to try
to find out those two verses each other. Yeah, they
were right next to each other, and I just gave
Matt Ryan the edge. Uh. I think it wound up
being playmaking because it's just so hard to see Kirk
Cousins make I'll play when the play is not going right.

(27:57):
And I've seen Matt Ryan do it more that that
was really what it came down to. And you haven't
both over Tanna House just and people just don't. I mean,
he went, he went and did the work you use
and it could be dumb. It would be dumb. I'm
just saying for what it's worth. Like in terms of
numbers the previous two years, and there was no bigger
fan in this room during that stretch of him than West.

(28:18):
It was the top five is quarterback. Now, I think
you can use your logic and know he wasn't really
a top five quarterback, but just pure numbers, that's what
he was. Cousins did it. Cousins is this past year
because the same last summer and last spring, we were
having these same conversations and then you'd be like, well,
look what he just did, and then you look at
the numbers. And again with Kirk Cousins, year after year,

(28:39):
the production is there. He completed two thirds of his
passes over yards, three thirty three touchdown seven picks passer
rating north of a hundred and three UM and yet
we know the story by now about him that he's
not as good as those numbers look. But at the
same time, like if numbers were that easy to attain,
and especially he was in a kind the stale offense.

(29:00):
He has some big playmakers, but like everyone would do it.
So to me, it's hard to get an accurate way
to read Cousins because he does produce. He might be
the guy, then he's I think he fit down four
two minutes to play need the drive. I don't know though,
I don't know if he's that guy. He did it,

(29:22):
and he was he was great. He was the first
half of the season through ten weeks were like, wow,
this is a bad season for quarterbacks. Cousins is kind
of having his best season. Is there an argument that
Kirk Cousins this year is one of the top five
or six quarterbacks. But I think it's so telling that
about five or six weeks left in the season, they
kind of did a Kirk let Kirk Cook type of

(29:44):
plan of like we just gotta let him throw deeper,
be more aggressive Zimmer was doing and it all kind
of fell apart Davin Cook injured as well, which speaks
to the Kirk the West is there again, He'll rise
and fall And when the cast went down, so too
did their production. West. Did you know ding Dalton for
going into the postseason over and over and completely flopping.

(30:05):
I think that matters. I just don't trust. There's a
there was a lack of trust with Andy Dalton to
rise up in big moments if the environment wasn't right,
and I lacked that trust, and Kirk Cousins too. It's
not I don't even know if it's rising up. Like
to a certain extent, you are how that's how good
you are, right, and you need to make a play right,
you needed you need to see Joe Burrow be able
to spin away from Aaron Donald. But Aaron Donald is

(30:26):
one of the greatest players of all time, and so
he made the play. And if you like, if you can't,
if you don't have the ability to make a play
when the play is not there to be made, then
that's you're just Kirk Cousins. Although in fairness, like he
if he was listening to this, he'd probably be like, um,
like if at least in terms of last year, like
what more do I have to do had that played
at kJ Osborne to win the game, to play against

(30:48):
the Cardinals early in the season, which they came back
the final couple of drives against the Lions early in
the season. Like he did make a lot of big time.
It has highlights, but like I get it, but he's
he's sitting fifteen and he's appropriate. He's he's totally an
inappropriate That's where I have him too. And he's very
the thrower of the football, which I do think gets
a little underrated. So that's how Yeah, that's a big

(31:10):
reason why he has these numbers. He's good at at
what he does, but they're also limitations involved might be
the guy he might, I do, but my feeling is
that he is at this stage of his career still
just north in that place, which is what explained his
contracts he signed Andy Dalton. It's like we're trying to
teams have been tasked to figure out how do we

(31:31):
pay this guy because we think he's the guy, but
maybe he's not. And it's worked out for him financially. Certainly.
The Vikings with this new staff really went through this
exercise when they took over. They had to decide whether
he was north or south of the Dalton scale, because
they could either tack an extra year onto his contract
and kind of kick the can, or if they really
thought he was south of the Dalton scale, they would

(31:52):
have done They just wouldn't have done that. They would
have eaten whatever his salary was this year and made
it work, and they decided to give him the money.
I do think there's hope that Kevin o'cone I'll bring
him more rams S type offense will help him grow
versus the relationship with Mike Zimmer, which just was such
a headache and such a nightmare. He had no belief
from his coaching staff. He grows, at least like statistically speaking,
he's going to be an MVP candidate, Like he's that

(32:14):
close statistically if he makes a jump from what he's
done the last couple of years and is throwing forty
touchdowns and eight interceptions like couldn't he jumped Derek Carr,
couldn't he jumped Matt Ryan. I think he's on the
right side. He certainly has it points. But for the
purpose of the the scale right, just because guys are
lower on the scale doesn't mean the Vikings can't win

(32:36):
a Super Bowl, you can still build a team, but
ranking the players I'm I'm not I'm not taking any
of those guys that I have ahead of Kirk Cousins
except maybe Matt. Right, It's true. If I'm starting a
team and and Cousins is there, man, that's that's a
tough one. I mean you kind of I wouldn't want
to be in that spot. And I do want him

(32:57):
to eventually end up with Kyle Shanahan like everyone's been
talking about forever. But it's like after they're both passed
their primes, it'll just be like, like have totally fallen apart.
In Kirk, it would be like Carolina, Like the old
Muppet guys that are up in the booth during the show, Um,

(33:18):
what are their names? Anybody I know exactly who you're
talking about? What was that? Kirk? Alright? So Tannehill, Ryan
Cousins are all kind of names. That makes sense. Just
a round zero in this conversation. Now here's a newer
name Statler and waldor yeah, there it is. All right,

(33:40):
Let's take a break and then get to a new
name in this conversation. All right, let's talk Jalen Hurts
entering year three Eagles. We know, Greggy, you're you're pumped
up about his ability, um and what he can bring
to this team even if he doesn't take a big
leap in his third season. I have him at sixteen.

(34:04):
Greg has him at you what but you have the rookie.
You know what Graver pointed out, if you if you
remove the second year quarterback from the equation, we all
had Jalen Hurt sixteenth. Exactly What does that mean? Patrick?

(34:24):
It means we're we watched the games together. Sometimes we're
on the same page. It's hard to have him higher,
right Um, when we when we look at all of
the guys that we have, it's hard for him to
be significantly higher, and then it's very difficult for him
to be significantly worse. He's the median. And yet I
don't know if he's like the Dalton scale guy because

(34:45):
I think based on the numbers and where we all
have him and and the way I looked at it,
like he would be the median right now? Now? Is
that the prime meridian? Like he is the middle of
the NFL. The thing with Hurts is like you expect
him either to go up, maybe he takes a step back.
If if the running game, you know, isn't as dominant,
Uh my thing looking at him and just trying to

(35:07):
evaluate him, and we took the second year quarterbacks out
of the mix. Was I guess I looked at it
like if Trevor Lawrence or Zack Wilson or Justin Fields
or Trey Lance, I'm putting back to the side. But
if if any of those guys have Jalen Hurts is
season season this year, how will people view it? And now,

(35:32):
granted that the running is gonna be a little different,
but like I think most people would view that as
a big leap um and as a great sign that
these quarterbacks are improving and that they're they're may be
going to get to where you believe they would be
when they were drafted. And so I I tend to
give Jalen Hurts the benefit of doubt that if he's

(35:52):
improved this much in two years, why can't he keep improving?
I'm with you. I think he has a high floor.
He does bring to claibonn points special skill sets that
other quarterbacks do not in many cases, and yet it's
a TBD for me. I just think that the I
think the Eagles need to see it more information before
they decide what to do next offseason, and I'd like
to see more information. Sixteen feels right. He's only started

(36:14):
nineteen games. He's kind of in a typical offense too.
We you know, this is his third year, but he
you know, only started four games as a rookie, so
it's still you can almost take him out, but he
you can almost use the middle. But I think we
have a kind of right where we're all feeling pretty
good about his chances of getting on the right side
of it. But it feels premature to to give him
give him that nod right now. Like if we had

(36:35):
arrows right, we would all have an arrow for potential
at six team with Jalen hurts to to go up
the list, whereas two as arrow consensus seventeen the sideways
double arrows question. The situation is so much better that
that you think the production is going to be better,

(36:57):
And he seems to be right around that line. Like
I've I've thought like the median for his career will
be a teddy type of career and to a two
and on doesn't want to hear that, but like it
could be worse than that too. He certainly hasn't come
out of the gates as good as well as as
Teddy did. Or you know some quarterbacks like a Jamis

(37:17):
who end up being kind of that middle tier quarterback
that doesn't end up sticking. Uh. Too also had about
a six or seven game stretch last season where like
his strengths really stood out. He gets rid of the
ball quickly, he makes decisions quickly, he's on point, he's accurate,
he has his limitations. But like you kind of know
who toa is, I have to at twenty and he
begins um a period of quicksand where every quarterback beyond

(37:41):
him I have almost no faith and I would never
sign up as my starter. And Too, I think someone
a candidate to be benched early on in this season.
So it's like he's in total tryout mode at this point.
I just wanted to say, three of you have Jimmy
Garoppolo ahead of ahead of two. Uh. But Claibon has

(38:01):
Garoppolo so low on his list that it's weighing him,
pulling him down down a hot guy on hot guy crime.
It's not get well soon, Jimmy. I appreciate what Jimmy
brings to the table, it's your Claibon had hurt sixteen
to a seventeen, and that's where the consensus list ended

(38:22):
up too. To it down at if it's tough, because
I need to hear more from Patrick. If the rest
of the league was busting down Shanahan's door trying to
get Jimmy Garoppolo, maybe I would feel like I washtor
that in as well. But he, I mean, he was
pretty brutal down the stretch last year well, and he

(38:42):
was hurt. He was so I mean, he wasn't great
early either. I know that numbers were pretty good, but
last year was the worst year of Jimmy Garoppolo's career,
no doubt. Even before he got hurt, I thought as
like a full time starter, which was surprising to you
could almost take these I feel like he's too young too,
and it's a bit of a cop out, but I
think it's it's just true. But to me, if you're

(39:04):
asking the question like is your quarterback situation solved with
Toua or not, he's below the Dalton scale, I don't
feel good enough. Like I think they're in a good situation,
that they have Teddy as a backup, and that you
have another year to find out, but I'm not feeling
like that's solved. And and I think, just like we
talked about with the top ten or eleven names that

(39:26):
we all felt were comfortably above, I don't think we
need to have much debate about the rest of these
names unless somebody wants to chime in. These guys are
all at this point in their career is comfortably below
the line. Um, let's see that would be in a
consensus list. Winston, Garoppolo, Baker, Teddy, Daniel Jones, Carson Wentz,
Jared Goff, Marcus Mariotto, Gino, Jake Briskett, Mitch Robiskie, Drew

(39:49):
Lock and Sam Donald. Anybody want to make a case
for one of those guys being in the conversation as
the primer Indian No a credible case, I would Jameis Wilson,
Ye want to do it? Well? I think Jamis Winston
has been incredibly productive. Uh and it's coming off the

(40:10):
season where he made the fewest amount of mistakes and
had the best numbers of his career. I don't think
he was as good as the fact that at one
point in the season he was leading the league in
e p A per play and he was already done
for the season, like he wasn't that, But man, he
shows you a lot of the things that you want
in an NFL quarterback. He plays really well from the pocket.
He just shows anticipation. Could he mature and get ahead

(40:35):
of that line a little bit like Derek carr uh
did improving in his late twenties. I believe it. I
believe it. I don't think he should be the line
right now. I have them below, I have him at twenty.
He's actually my first name under what my uh Dalton
scale would be. I I'd have Hurt says the last
one above it, and then Jamis is the first one
below it. But to meet him and Baker are very

(40:55):
close to that line and that they're gonna go up
and down with the people around them. And that wouldn't
surprise me if they put together a couple of years
straight of of good play where we think this is
way too low for the two of those guys. If
you go back to that episode again where Baker was
coming off his rookie year, this was sort of a
stunning conversation we had. I had Baker Mayfield is the
ninth best quarterback in the in the league. Greg had

(41:17):
him is the eighth, Dan thirteenth, Dan was the closest.
West had him is the fifth. That shows you how
quickly things change. And now Baker is well, I think
he is below off. The league's telling you that rookie season, right,
so that that yeah, but he's he's a quarterback like
a lot of these guys at the bottom half year aboard.
If he was on the Jets, I'd have him wherever
you had him to factor right now, you made a

(41:38):
strong case, so you had him clumped up with like
Jared Goff and others. But it's a reason not to
rank these guys for this exercise, specifically in the first
two years, because it's there's so much environment going on
with how they perform, and when the environment changes, these
this bottom third can crumble very quickly. Injuries were a
huge factor in the way that I did mine out.
That's that's probably why Jimmy g is solo, why big

(42:00):
Or gets punished, and while jamis is you know, it's
it's hard to see them anywhere other than on the
other side of the line, just because like they have to,
they have such a huge hill to climb just to
eat this year, this year. But I think and it's
it was interesting that they gave Jamis such a big
contract the Saints, like when they didn't need to, when
they obviously wanted a different quarterback. They wanted to Shaun Watson.

(42:23):
But man, I know we did this to Jamis all
the time. But the man is only twenty eight years
old the production, and I think he is a perfect
guy to have this conversation with. If you put him
on those Titans teams, you're telling me he wouldn't have
been productive. Like to me, he is gonna rise and fall,
and he's probably right around that line. I think he's close.
Something about it doesn't ring truth to me because down four,

(42:45):
with the game of the line, he's stone to pick six.
There's that also, and Matthew Stafford through a whole bunch.
But when you have the ability, eventually you're gonna put
in a position where if you make plays and you're
a guy who takes risks, you make a no look
class and you win the super Bowl. Like sometimes it's
just right. Those guys are getting punished than they should, Baker,
Jamis and Jimmy because we've seen so much of them

(43:07):
that kind of now we know that at best year
like a one a where you need to be replaced.
I think Daniel Jones is a tough one again to
put in there, just because of the situation. Yes, he's
he's below the line, um, but but I think he'll
have a chance this year. Man. He I thought he
really showed strides early last year before everything crumbled. And

(43:27):
I haven't told together for seventeen games, you know, at
this point, um, before we kind of get to our
choices for um the prime Ridian and then maybe we
could get a consensus choice, we should hit mac Jones
because he was the only guy that kind of stood
out stood apart from the rookies last year. Like I
initially when I was putting them in, I had him,

(43:48):
I think either right above or right behind Jalen Hurts,
so around sixteen or so. Um. And I think the
reason why he's so different is A he had a
much better season than the other rookies, but B he
was also in a much better, much better surrounding. So
you could definitely make the case that mac Jones is
in this conversation already. UM. So that's another name to

(44:12):
throw in there. It's just a little tough for a
guy that only has sixteen seventeen starts, I have seventeen,
and I think he's above the line from what we've seen.
But again, things can change so much in season two.
You know, he did trail off last year as well,
So I just it's not a shot against because he
was a rookie. It was a good rookie year. You
just I just need to see more. That's really when
I came down on it. You got him at fourteen, Greg.

(44:34):
I mean I and if if the exercise were just
who do I want for the next five years, I'd
haven't even higher than that. Now. I could be wrong,
like I was wrong about Baker after one year, but
I think his skill set will travel. And there's this
idea that like he was in a better situation than
all the other rookies, and I think that's true, But
I also don't think it was an exceptional situation. It

(44:55):
was not their best year for their offensive line. It
is not an amazing group of talented players around him.
And I think he's got skill sets that tend to
be pretty consistent and that he should be a top
ten type of quarterback. From coaching, the the organization, UH
he had his health. I'm just saying number one wide

(45:16):
receiver was Kendrick Bourne. So but in the offensive line
was just not as good as it was the previous
couple of years. It wasn't bad either, but a ton
of They spent a ton of money to improve the offense. Absolutely,
very similar to the Jaguars, where I think they spent
a lot and they went from like the thirty second
uh group around cam Newton to like the eighteenth or nineteen.
But it wasn't like that. It wasn't like an amazing

(45:37):
group of players. That's more about but he there's a
group of these players that are mysterious to us still
that simply do not fit for the Dalton right. He
doesn't really fit. And this doesn't because I would much
rather have him than Kirk Cousins or Tannehill or Derek
Carr for that matter. So that's why I did to
see more before I say that. But that's I mean,

(46:01):
if if you like more in general, if someone was
making you choose right now, though you would you would
still you would go with those guys for the next
three or four years. Let's say Danny, Yeah, I would
name him again, Kirk, you know Ryan, Ryan Tannehill. Yeah,
Derek Carr, Ryan Tannehill, Kirk Cars if only because they

(46:22):
have a more established resume um And I don't know,
I would just I just want to see more from
Mac Jones, That's all. But it was. It was a
very prompting rookie year. I could look like a moron
this time next year when we have this. The O
t a conversation that he's hitting a lot of deep throws.
He's worked on those deaths, he's more muscle bound. Now,

(46:42):
I buy into it on Mac alright, so not a
Pats fan that, but I'm all in on Mac did
say said, I'm not as much of a pat It's
it's a weird feeling because I feel like I'm so
much higher than consensus on their quarterback. And I really
don't think it, you know, but that's not subconscious. You
still are a Patriots fan. It's I like a little

(47:04):
bit more. I like different types. But he really reminds
me of Philip Rivers, and I just think that I
think that skill sets gonna travel, all right, but let's
not let's not pretending on a Patriots fan. No I am.
I am a Patriots. I thought that's what you just said,
though not as much as as a team. But that's
a tough look to that you It started to diminish

(47:26):
as soon as Tom Brady left. I told you guys
that it's not a goodlore that I remember. West got furious.
I was like, absolutely, I'm going to be a less
of a fan when he leaves. It's like you already
experienced the highest of highs. What's the point? Why why
do we look? Why do we dictate to other people
how they like things? Things come and go, and well,
you think it's a good Do you think it's a
good look? Though? I think the whole concept of a

(47:49):
bad look is dumb. Well, alright, drops a nuclear bomb
on the whole conversafe passions, you know, they come and
go over time. But I'm sort of like, it's like,
after I had already gotten drunk as much as I could,
staying out ntil four or five in the morning, like
three to five times a week in New Orleans, I
truly had a thought that like, it's never gonna top that.

(48:11):
I know, I'm I'm gonna say it's never gonna top that.
So I'm kind of done, just like being the going
out drinking. We have to deal with the post party. Boy, Greg,
I mean I was still annoying back then. It was
like the personality was within me. I just was at
So you're you're hanging out with this post podcast if
you hadn't had your part. It was my kids last

(48:31):
day of school. They were at the beach. They needed
to be picked up. What about us? Yeah? Mark, the
kids matter more? Did you did you find it slightly
off putting that Greg finished the pot and took off
slightly off putting? First of all, I stayed for an
hour making other parents watch my kids at the beach

(48:51):
while the entire school. I mean, what gets more so
called than that they're celebrating the last day of school
than they all go to the beach and I'm not
even there. Greg, we get it, you're plug in with
your children. But it was such a great bonding experience.
The rest of us who stayed, I don't know. And
you were already getting ready to go and I left.
So we had a marvelous time. Don't hit out. We

(49:13):
went to a second location. Nice time. Were they all there? Yeah?
I think the whole crew was one group supporting And
what did? I pulled you aside and I said, don't
stress at all about getting the show up. We're here
to have a good time and celebrate everything. Erica made
us all stay until Jet showed up, so we did.
That's true. Then we left. I was trying to get

(49:35):
out of there before then. Eric was like, I'll kill
you if you leave before Jet gets That's when it
was got a little tricky at that. Yeah, a little
tricky because it was getting later. You guys should try
parenting if you ever want to leave a situation. That's true.
All right, here we go one more break and then
we're gonna figure this out. Probably not all right, so

(49:56):
I'll stick with where I came down earlier on the show.
I think Matt Ryan's the pick for me. I like
my Matt Ryan a lot. I like his chances in Indie.
But I also think he's right there now where he
and I think that's a there's a reason why. That's
where the Colts ended up digging out of their issue
here um with Carson Wentz and they remember we we

(50:16):
talked about it um earlier in the off season about
now what are the Colts do? And they had to
figure out something. And I think this is like the
best case scenario that they get Matt Ryan. But still
it's this version of Matt Ryan's very different than the
guy that went to the Super Bowl, UM five years ago.
So I think he's the guy, Greg, who is your nomination? Well,
I'm so confused now after doing this exercise, because Hurts

(50:39):
felt like the guy. But maybe he just doesn't make
sense because he's too young, like he's an evolving player.
If we all had him sixteen, he felt like the guy. Um.
But I actually, I truly believe that Jamis makes more
sense as the median that if you're Jamis or below,
you need enfranchise quarterback. Uh. And if you have someone

(51:01):
better than Jamis in my mind, that would include Hurts,
that would include Ryan Cousins, Mac Derek Carr like then
you're then you're good. So I actually think Jamis the median.
Is is the middle player himself. Yes, is not the
guy that should be replaced. He's the guy that is
in purgatory? Is he in the I think you you

(51:23):
ranked Matt Ryan, Okay, so that's pretty similar to me.
But to me, he you don't need another starter if
you have Matt Ryan in my mind, so so it
has to be someone below it. I don't know it
hurts Jimmy G. I'm gonna go Jamis Hurts is kind
of a weird one of those ext It doesn't work
so for me because I have to go off my list.

(51:44):
Matt Ryan is a little too high for hint for
me to agree there I have I'm going Kirk Cousins
at fifteen. I think he's in that middle spot where
he is a starter. Uh, he has issues. We feel
frustrated by him, which were the feelings that I had
about Andy Dalton. But then from there it goes to
the nether world of Mac Jones and Jalen Hurts. We
need to see more. And from there it drops off
to Jimmy G and the Niners have essentially made massive

(52:06):
efforts to replace him. And then after that it's backups
and and and fill in the blank, nondescript. Doesn't it
feel like it's Kirk cousins destiny to become the Daltons
also fits as a sort of just the person who
would hate this because he always was like as we
bagged on Kirk Cousins, especially in the early window before

(52:28):
he got regrudgingly got everyone's respect. I felt like West
was mostly on an island, being like this guy is
a good quarter. That's why we were kissing Cousins. Greg
on that side of the table. He and I both
had our Kirk Cousins moment. There was a little bit
of a Shanahan fascination there. But you're not. You can't
stay as good forever. I think he's declining into this doltins.
It will happen eventually. Yes, yeah, you say he's there.
I think he's a year away, alight. And that's why

(52:52):
I really had to go into it to try to
figure out to slice this bread between Ryan Tannehill and
Kirk Cousins, and just the recent statistical success of kirk
Cousins and like the plays that he has made, like
you mentioned, Greg, I had to put kirk Cousins on
the other side. I think Ryan Tannehill is the four

(53:15):
different options. So and maybe just for fun, maybe we'll
have a vote. Put it on the on the subreddit
or on Instagram or both um, because I'm nominating Matt Ryan, Greg,
jameis Winston, Mark kirk Cousins, and Claibon Ryan Tannehill. So
we don't have any way to break the tie within
this room, which is great. When we did this, I

(53:38):
really looked at it and thought like, I don't know.
This year, I don't know if there is perfect I
will say that. I'll say this like Winston to me,
I'm I'm just not on board with him being that
high in this conversation, Uh cousins to me, I think
what we just said maybe a year or two away
from dipping down and being that guy Claiban with Tannehill,

(54:00):
that would be the one other than Matt Ryan that
I would feel good about and be like, okay if that,
if we're going for a consensus, Tannehill makes sense, even
though on my list he's just above the line. But
I understand both sides of how annoyed would you be
a grave digger if that's how like the voting came
down with a listenership, not that annoyed. I don't think
it makes sense. He's flirted with it before too. He

(54:22):
came very close to me with Miami, right yeah, I
mean he's been a much better player, and yet like that,
it doesn't make sense this year. But I really think
of the of the guys on our consensus list around
the middle, we had Jalen Hurt sixteen and to A
seventeen to a feels like a future Dalton scale type

(54:43):
of guy that, like, you can never quite decide, And
I think it's too early in his career to totally
put that on him. But when you think of players
that he's like, I think of Alex Smith, who was
very much a Tanna Dalton scale guy. I think of Teddy,
who's a little below. But I appreciate it that you
guys actually had Teddy a little higher on your list

(55:03):
than me. And isn't that I did that just for you? Yeah?
Thank you? Um and and so it's like, I think
that could be to his future. But I think we're
all uncomfortable. We're all uncomfortable about second year players on
this list. It just doesn't quite fit. Yeah, I think
all right. I would say Tannehill makes sense because the
Titans are like trying to figure out if they need
to replace him, right exactly exactly. I mean that's a

(55:25):
huge indicator with some of these some of these guys,
Jimmy g the same boat. If I'm going down my
list right and I'm looking at the scenario, I would
rather figure it out with two. Uh, I'd rather figure
it out with Jalen Hurts because you can you can
get a big win there, right in terms of the
guys having the potential, I don't see anybody underneath that

(55:47):
that it's that fits better than Ryan Tannehill to me
like that, it just keeps being the line no matter
how many times. I don't know how we got back
into two thousand twelve, two thirty and I'm somehow like
Ryan Tannehill is big fan here, but I am just saying,
like no one else in this range. And I guess
Kirk maybe would be uh would have been top five

(56:07):
PFF you know grades two straight years and then last year,
I know he was in the top ten e p
A per place, like among the best quarterbacks in the
league over the last three years. It's the last three
years in aggregate his numbers and his grades, and he's
only thirty three years old. He deserves a little more respect.
But I do understand it. The eye test is all right, well,
does this because it will be fun to see what

(56:27):
the listeners think. But does this episode fail in its
conceit if we don't have a consensus at the end
of the show, or is it okay for it to
be open ended? Mark? I think it's okay for it
to be open ended because we each came up with
the answer. I'm not shifting off of my answer at
this point. It's like the Sopranos, Uh, you know, finale.

(56:48):
I always like to. I like to be an open
liked to in the moment. It's fifteen years ago, uh
this day or two days ago. I believe it was
the anniversary, and I liked it in the moment. Alright,
Clay Boon, I, I just want to make it known
that I would be okay to move to your vote.
But at the same time, now everyone's dug in, so

(57:08):
it's not so because we did definitively say what our
picks are. It's also like a sign that like the
Dalton scale is perfect in its concept and in its creation,
and that Andy Dalton was the perfect person for it,
and we've never come up with another person. Alex Smith
felt good for like a year or two, but then
he like started throwing deep like Andy Dalton was the

(57:31):
perfect answer. It's kind of like, uh, I don't know,
it's like the perfect uh law for its time, but
time's change. You know where I'm with Dan. If if
I were forced, uh, you know, under duress to go
in another direction, Tannehill much more for me than Jameis Winston. Apologies, Greg,
I just I would go Ryan. Of all the other choices,
I would go Ryan. Also, this is like, are we

(57:53):
Ryan's career could be over in five days? Like are
we looking for someone that's going to be out of
the league in a year to years? Alright, well, we've
certainly given you, the listener a lot to think about.
Thank you to Patrick Claiban for joining us. We'll be
back on Thursday. We'll be back on Thursday with another
remote show. We're gonna be in Santa Monica for the

(58:14):
Talent Summit, NFL Media Talent Summit. We're gonna be pool
side and we're gonna try to wrangle up some guests
from the NFL media um personality and analyst world, so
that will be fun. And um, oh my goodness, a
guy and a members only jacket just walked in. And
we do have a consensus the Andy Dalton scale. The

(58:37):
winner this year is the man that is the prime
Ridian is