It's My Way Or The Highway

It's My Way Or The Highway

Episode Transcript

Speaker 1 (00:00):
This show is produced and hosted by Mark Webber.

Speaker 2 (00:03):
The show is sponsored by G three Aparo.

Speaker 1 (00:05):
The views expressed in the following program are those of
the sponsor and not necessarily the opinion of seven ten
wr or iHeartMedia. Who is Mark Webber. He's a self
made business executive here to help you find your success
from the New York City projects to the Avenue Montaigne
in Paris. His global success story in the luxury world

(00:27):
of fashion is inspirational. He's gone from clerk to CEO twice.
Mark his classic proof that the American dream is alive.
And well, here's your host of always in Fashion, Mark Weber.

Speaker 2 (00:41):
Mark Webber. I remember when I was six years old,
Kinto owned the basketball set the rules of the time
for playing my mom. That's my house, Mark, my rules.
I learned the negotiating you can walk away wins. Then
a business, I learned an antidote for leverage. It's my
way or the highway. With that in mind, I've been

(01:05):
thinking about the concept of exclusivity late. I've lost all
patience and respect with the luxury. It led me to
have exclusivity on my radar. But before I get there,
I've always loved Smoking Robinson, perhaps no more than and
I heard him singing. The love I saw in you

(01:26):
was just a mirage, a great voice, a great song.
But it appeared to me in Richard Gear's American Jigelow
Georgia o'mani's clothes, the star of that movie. But before
I get there, Georgia o'mani has passed away. I'm so

(01:47):
sorry to hear it. I never knew him, although shopping
his flag show with my son Gerard one day he
was visity, came over to say helloe. We talked with him.
A massive highlight and a footload on my care in retail,
luxury and fashion or many made an impact and an
impact on me. I take a moment on reflection. I

(02:10):
never knew about Georgia o'moni in my twenties, never could
forget him after that scene in that movie, Smoky singing,
Richard curating, dancing by his bed, laying out his wardrobe
silk neutral relaxed sport coat, slightly different colored neutral silk pant, cotton,
silk double pocket sports shirt, knit striped tie, swede loafer,

(02:34):
oh double breasted blaze, a soft blue tu pocket dress shirt.
Lower than you expect. These pockets to be. It was
new loafers as he filled the bed with choices, amazing,
amazing statement on how men could and should dress. Here
it was Richard Gere, beautiful, tall, fit and smoking, pulling

(02:54):
it all together. We used to live in hm. Never ever,
as I'm more affected by fashion in that moment in
that movie. There are moments in time where fashion has
done something to me. I spent a career in the industry,
but as Michael Corleone said, it's strictly business. I looked

(03:16):
at fashion, luxury, retail as a business. It never was
part of my psyche. Yes I wanted to look good.
Yes I wanted to look my best. But to this
day I can't explain fashion as I should. I can't
talk about the details and what is happening, nor do
I care. But there are times when mostly movies made
an impression on me. Sean Connery and Goldfinger, the way

(03:39):
he walked, the way he wore his clothes, and Out
of Africa, Robert Redford wearing Safari clothes, and then of
course Giorgio Omani and American Jacob. To be honest, fashion
for me was more of a uniform. I could care less.
I dressed simply for success. I want the same thing
every day for twenty years. Actually, if you had met

(04:01):
me in my early days of my career, you would
see me wearing a navy single breasted suit, white dress shirt,
navy tie, black tesseled loafers, sterling silvil cofflings, and a
Rolex stainless steel watch. What happened to me is I
tried fashion. I chased it down everywhere I could go,

(04:21):
tried different things. And one day I was out and
about took a picture so what I looked like? I
was in embarrassed. It wasn't the first time. This time
it was an orange Kiana shirt. Don't ask what it
is in the past that did no collar shirts looking
like narrow collar shirts. And it was ridiculous. Everyone else
was dressed in Romez and Brooks brothers, and I was
looking like a fool until I saw this picture of

(04:43):
myself and I went home and I said, what am
I doing? I can't do this anymore. And then the
next week I was trying to be conservative and one
of the first days I was getting dressed, I put
on a navy blue suit, a white shirt, navy tie.
I looked in the mirror and said, oh my gosh,
I can't look better than I do right now. I
remember calling my wife and saying to come after she

(05:05):
came over and said what, I said, what do you see?
She looks at me so sad, I see you. I said, no,
look closely, what do you see? She said, help me
and Mark, I don't know what you're talking about. I said,
I'll tell you what you see. You're seeing your husband
look the best that he could look. I can't look
any better than I look right now, and from here
on in, I'm wearing this every day For twenty years.

(05:28):
I wore the same thing every day now. Don't get
me wrong. I had all my suits made to order
because of going back and forth on Hong Kong. I
had single breasts that I had double breasts out of
different weights, but they were all navy blue. All the
loafers were black tile for the loafers. All my shooters
were numbered because I had many pair made in the
same exact style. My suits were numbered every single one.

(05:49):
I had a different number from one to active. I
guess twenty at a time, and I would reverse them
and changed in the shirts. All the same style, navy
blue ties all the same. In fact, it was embarrassed.
When I would meet new people, I'd have to take
them aside and say, look, now that you met me,
I need to tell you when you see me, I'm
gonna look like or I'm gonna look as if I'm
wearing the same thing every day. I want you to

(06:11):
know I don't. This is a uniform. I opened up
my suit jacket and when the pocket was inside the
suit there was a number illustrating one number the suit.
What might have been number ten on this particular day.
And I show them a suit and say, all my
suits are the same. They're all numbered, they're different fabrics,
different ways, but they look the same. I wanted you
to know that I'm not wearing the same thing every

(06:31):
day that I change off. But this is who I became,
and this is what I did. And then one day
I came across Georgia 'mani and it blew me away,
and it changed my stall forever. I started wearing OurMine. Now,
as time went on, I will tell you know, I
never really gave much thought to fashion. I lost interest

(06:53):
in fashion. But when I lost wait a few years ago,
and my corporate life changed, and I became a Ralph
Lauren guy. And now I'm back into fashion. And now
that I'm not a CEO, you know what I'm getting
ahead of myself. Let's go back. The first time my
fashion was captured my imagination was because of OURMANI I

(07:17):
became addicted the clothing, the lines, the silhouette, the way
they look elegant but casual, the way they fit, the
way they felt very comfortable. I could tell you could
be better dressed than anyone in the room. They could
be more formal, yet you looked relaxed or cool. I
was cooler than Paul Stewart guys, the Armas guys, as
Egna guys. He changed the world, my world. No, it's

(07:41):
hard for me to remember Barneys. It was lost in
the private equity and banking world over. Expansion increased that
poor management you can choose. I knew Barneys was dead
when I showed up in Las Vegas at the Palazzo
Hotel to see a magnificent two floor mansion, if you will,
for Barneys walked in. It was empty and devoid of inventory.

(08:02):
They were often wrong, and the choices they were making
that they never seemed to be in doubt. It was
too fruit through, too isolated, not enough appeal to the
amount of customers that would come to Las Vegas. There
weren't enough Barneys customers for a store that big. Their
choices were all and wrong, and they were always I
was always knowing that they weren't in doubt, but more importantly,

(08:25):
they were empty and devoid of customers. I knew I
was seeing the death of Barneys. It was just a
question of when. But once again, I'm getting ahead of myself.
You see, American Jiglo and the movies in general put
Georgio on Money on the map in the eighties, and
my internal GPS led me to Barney's. Donny's at the

(08:48):
time I think had ten floors. The store was on
twentieth Street and Seventh Avenue. A masterpiece of men's closing
in New York City. Seventy seventh Avenue, twentieth Street amazing.
It was a museum. It was the centerpiece, the place
to be that we were all drawn to. I'll never

(09:08):
forget a TV commercial that were a little straight to
you how clever Barneys were at the time. It's just
a bunch of kids sitting on the porch talking about
their futures, Stacy Stengel, the future of the Yankees Hall
of Fame manager, Fiorella LaGuardia, the future mayor of New
York City, and then Barnies. I was a little boy

(09:28):
at the time my aunt and uncle, my aunt Teddy,
my uncle Bill. One day with visiting them. They happened
to live on Twentieth Street. They had a condo and
there were city people and very sophisticated to my parents,
and I would drive from the projects in Brooklyn go
visit them and have a New York City experience. And
one day my uncle Bill said, Mark, I want to

(09:49):
take you to Barneys to shop. And at the time
I was a husky. That was the word for little
boys who wait too much. And I went and he
bought me few things, and I never forgot Barney's, and
I never forgot the feeling of warmth and happiness I
had when my uncle took me shopping. My first suit,

(10:10):
my mother and father took me to Barney's. As I
got older, my mother and father took me to barney
So Barney always had a certain feeling for me. And
my first Georgia Romani suit and sport code after seeing
American Jugio was at Barney's. I attempted to look like
Richard Gere. He was taller, thinner, better looking, but he

(10:34):
didn't have better hair. I was already building a career.
I couldn't afford the clothes, but I found a way.
I found the money, and for years and years i'd
wear it. Eventually I became me when I didn't buy
ARMANI everyone thought that which I wore was on money.

(10:57):
I made Brooks Brothers look better, Calvin Klein look at
in dkn why look more? Milanise Georgia o'moni passed away
last week. Rest in peace, mister Romoni. You were appreciated.
You made a difference, and for what it's worth, I'm
still buying sportswhear items, some of my favorite pieces. I

(11:17):
promise you, I promise you the audience. I still buy
in Bloomingdale's. Rest in peace, mister Omani will be back
in a minute.

Speaker 1 (11:27):
Always in fashion.

Speaker 2 (11:29):
Spent a lifetime of my career building the van Usen Brand,
and I am so pleased that they're back with us now.
Talking about suits, men were dressing up again and it's
become cool to wear a suit. Suits can be won
on multiple occasions in multiple ways. You could wear a
suit formally to go out at night or to an event,

(11:50):
to wear a suit to the office with or without
a tie. If you look closely now fashion trends, suits
are being worn with turtlenecks or mark next. The choices
are endless and every one of them looks right. You
could really really look the part. I believe that packaging
yourself this is important. Does the products you package and

(12:11):
wearing a suit is one of those things that make
men look their best. Venuesing invented a new idea. It's
called the cool Flex suit. It's been engineered with stretch technology,
giving you the most comfortable fit and mobility. Its wrinkle
resistant fabric, it's cool moisture wiki it makes it perfect
for all occasions. As we discussed just now, this new

(12:33):
style of looking sharp while feeling cool and comfortable is amazing,
and I'm so excited that the ven Using company is
involved in this new technology and is embracing the whole
idea of dressing up. Let's not forget Venues and Maine
It's name with dress shirts. It's only proper that the
suit business follows strongly in its way. You can find

(12:55):
vanues in cool flex men's stretch suits at JC Penny
are Onlinepenny dot Com. Guys, they're great, you should go
look at them. Donna Karen began her career as one
of the finest, most successful, powerful women in the fashion industry.
She developed a collection aimed at the luxury market for

(13:17):
women on the go, women who were powerful in their workplace,
women who had lives that extended beyond the workplace. And
her clothes went from day and tonight. An extraordinary collection.
But the interesting thing Donna Karen had a young daughter,
and she had friends and they couldn't afford to buy
the Donna Aaron collection, and Donna invented DKNY Donna Aaron,

(13:37):
New York. It's an offshoot of the Donna Karen collection.
The same concept a lifestyle brand. Now we talk about
lifestyle brands, what does that really mean? Simply what they say,
there are brands that follow you throughout your lifestyle. You
get up in the morning, you start to get dressed.
Donna Karen decan why as intimate apparel, as hosiery, as
all those products you're getting dressed for work. You get

(13:59):
accessor shoes, handbags, and it takes you through the day.
The remarkable thing about dk Y clothes for work they
work into the evening. The dresses, the suits, the pants,
the sweaters, the blouses, extraordinary clothes at affordable prices that
go from day in tonight. Part of your lifestyle is active.

(14:19):
You have weekends, you have events, you participate in sports.
Donna Karen's casual clothes did that under the DK and
Y label. A vast array of casual sportswear that make
women look great as they navigate their busy lives. Whether
you going to soccer games for your children, or whether
you're going out to the movies, whatever you want to do,

(14:41):
dkn Y jeans, dc HY sportswear is there for you.
That's what a lifestyle brand is. And I need to
mention DKY Active Wear, which is extraordinary, the leggings, the
sports bras, the sweats. You can wear DKY Active wears,
certainly in the gym, certainly when you're working out at home,

(15:03):
and certainly if you want on the street, because it's
that well done. The quality of DK why is nothing
short of exceptional, and why shouldn't it be because it
was born from the idea of luxury made affordable for women.
Of America, DK and Why, a true lifestyle brand that
takes you from day and tonight, from the week into

(15:24):
the weekend. DCN Why. You can find DCN Why and
Macy's DKY dot com.

Speaker 1 (15:32):
Welcome back to it Always in Fashion. Here's your host,
Mark Webber.

Speaker 2 (15:37):
You know you can tell me what to do, you
can offer suggestions for me as to what to do,
but the reality is I'm gonna do what I want
to do. I'll listen, I'll pay attention, I'll respect what
anyone has to say by In life, you're responsible for yourself.

(15:59):
If you're not feeling well, you have to take care
of yourself. If you don't think you're doing well at work,
you have to fix what you're doing. When you're interrelating
with people, you are in charge. When you're in business,
you're responsible and frankly, that's my way of the highway.
I get paid to make decisions and I'm going to
make decisions, which brings me to the question of exclusivity.

(16:24):
If you follow the show and listen to what I
have to talk about, I'm fed up with luxury. I'm
fed up right now of kissing salesmans and store managers.
Both cheeks to get a Rolex watch because they're just
not available. I'm tired of waiting online for cars that
I like when I'm paying good money for those cars.
I'm tired of listening to women grown about waiting five

(16:48):
years to get a broken bag. I'm just not enjoying
this whole experience. They come me to thinking about exclusivity.
How important is exclusivity in the main I could care
less if anything's exclusive. What do I care? Why do
I care if this navy blue suit is exclusive to
a given store I buy it. I only care about

(17:11):
what it looks like. I mean, if everyone in my
company buys the same suit and we all show up
in a maybe blue suit, I'm gonna accessorize it differently.
It's gonna fit me differently. I carry myself differently. I'm
gonna look my best. I don't care. But people care
about those things. You ever see those tags as signs

(17:31):
and stores like Bloomingdale's that say this product is made
exclusively for Bloomingdales or at Sacks, found only at Sacks.
I could care less. It means nothing, But I can
tell you the department stores in particularly in most retails,
it means something, if not everything, for business for those

(17:54):
of them a know, for those who have to manage it.
It's called channel conflict. The idea that you need products,
you need, things are different in your store that are
different from everybody else's store. Now, there is something to
be said for if I'm picking on Macy's and Bloomingdale's tonight.
They don't mean to do it, but frankly they can't

(18:16):
pick on them. They're own to both find the same company.
But I'll come to that. You share them all with Nordstrom, Bloomingdale,
JC Penny and Macy's. And if all stores had the
same things, the same brands, the same item, it probably
would be a problem. But that's impossible to happen. Each
store curates these brands, these ideas, the styles to fit

(18:40):
what they believe is right for their custom Which is
the key right here, what is right for the customer.
Not let me give what is right for the customer
that I didn't buy because it's in another store. It's
called channel conflict. Think about batteries, GRSOL batteries, the black
and gold batteries. To many, they're the best there is.

(19:02):
I don't know if they are or not. I can't
tell you whether ever ready in the Bunny or Durasla
is better. But you can buy batteries pretty much anywhere.
You could buy them in convenience stores, you can buy
them in toy stores, electronics stores, somehow or another. When
you need a battery, you know where to buy them.
They're everywhere. And does it change your feeling about the
battery if you're bought it in JC Penny or you

(19:23):
bought it in CDs. No, it's a battery. You know
what it's s priced that, you know what it's supposed
to do. Do it. iPhones. I went into Best Buy
not too long ago, and I realized they have iPhones.
I've walked into Macy's and New York had iPhones. Or
you can buy iPhones that I don't know any of
the service providers and phones at and T or whoever

(19:47):
they are. Does it make the iPhone any different? No?
You buy clinics, you need a tissue, you care where
it's You buy a tissue, you're walking by somewhere, you
see tissues on, you're looking the mark of the All
you care about is blowing your nose. And yet all
these retailer are worried about being exclusive. This probably made

(20:10):
for my store. You can't find it anywhere. Who gives
a hoot Coca Cola? You buy Coca cola anywhere. I
buy it a gas station, a movie theater, the Fourth
Seasons in Milan, the Polar Bar in New York. Expect
to find it there, and it's at any price. I
had a coke the other day at a bar in

(20:31):
a hotel waiting for someone. It's twelve dollars for coke.
I don't care what it is. You pay what you
think you pay for the environment that you're in. I
think it's crazy when I'm in a hotel in New
York and I have to pay that amount. I'm only hoping
that we're robbing foreigners, not just me. Anyway, The idea is,

(20:52):
you buy coke, we expect to find it and at
any price. But in some reason in retail luxury fashion
that doesn't exist. If you put your brand in store
a and store breathing hears about it, they're angry. I've
talked about Jeff Bezos and Amazon Apparel. I met him.
My CEO believed he was a book reader. That if

(21:14):
they could sell Amazon, if they could sell books sold
in plastic packages, why not dress shirts by size in
the pastic packages. We know what our size is. We
don't have to touch them, we don't even have to
open it. We buy a white shirt from Venues and
you're fifteen and a half thirty four, sleep, It's easy,
and I got news for you. It worked and no one

(21:36):
stopped buying Venues and dress shirts because we sold them
at Amazon. But retailers believe in exclusivity, separating themselves from
their competitors. They are allowed to think that way. They
may be right. I don't get it. I don't agree
with it. I don't get it. For me. I lived

(21:57):
a life calling channel conflict. No question I would ask,
shouldn't the customer buy what they want to buy where
they expect or want to buy it? You know, if
you're gonna go as far as call your customer guests,
shouldn't you make it as easy as possible to give
your guests what they want or they provide them what

(22:18):
they expect to find in your store. The problem is
retailers truly believe distinctive assortments and an important key to
differentiation and success. Okay, Ralph Lauren must have a million styles,
you need a hundred. I assure you Macy's. The hundred
styles you pick are going to be different from the

(22:41):
hundred styles to Bluemendell's picks. Now, I know you both
will buy the basic Polo shirt and the basic Chino,
but everything else will be disserent. You're entitled to your opinion.
I don't agree. I used to love my eyes at
outlet stores. I love them. Went into an Isaac outlets store,

(23:01):
who have found the most remarkableble assortment of the brand.
It was a showcase for isaon hats, matching socks, pants,
polo sweater, jackets. Everything was curated to be sold as
collection outfits. Put together, they were beautiful. I promised you
that when the heyday of Isza, when I was there,

(23:23):
you would find a sortment in our autless stores better
than the best apartment store who edited and carried it
only a sample of That's what they thought they needed
amongst their many other brands. Here's one think about this.
You have us see these zip next sweaters that are
an item. Some people wear them as turtlenecks. Some people

(23:45):
wear t shirts underneath them. Some people wear button down
collar shirts underneath them. Some people wear buttoned down collars
and ties, and they need them. Go into any store
you favor now you'll find a zip polo, but you
won't find one. You'll find it from every men's brand.
I'll have ten of them there. Does that make any sense?

(24:05):
Is that good edity? Is that curating or creating a distinction?
I could go on and on and on in each
individual sentence I've given you so far. Is the story
unto itself? How to edit? What is this? Think that?
Do you need exclusivity? Why are you doing it? The
reality is specialty stores, specialty retailers, change stores, clubs, off

(24:31):
price stores, you name whatever you want, they'll talk about
exclusivity accounts, and if you ask me, it doesn't. And
if you ask me, what we're really hearing is a
lack of confidence period period. Why wouldn't an item in
my store be more attractive to the custom a same

(24:52):
item in another store because I don't have confidence in
what I'm doing. I could drink a coke anywhere from
a street vendor in New York on the side of
the street. I'm fifty fiop or whatever, selling sulvak whatever
it is, to the King Cobar at the Saint Regis Hotel.
I feel different at the Saint regis when I'm drinking

(25:13):
my coke than standing in the street smelling the Slvwaki.
The venue is the distinction. The venue offsets the channel
conflict fall on Bloomails. Why should I care if Macy's
have the same Ralph Lauren Oxen shirt. I shouldn't. I
should be thinking my store is more special, it has

(25:34):
better displays. My assortments are more impactful. They drive the consumer. Aby.
I have better salespeople. They're more experienced. I'm more of
them on the floor. My music is elevated. I have
a cleaner environment. My eyes are wider for people's comfort.
And if you come into Bloomvale, I have a better

(25:57):
fragrance department. My cosmetics are as good or better than
anyone's in the world. I have more expensive brands. I'm
blooming there. I'm not afraid of Macy's or Nordstrom or J. C.
Penney or anyone for that matter. And as I said before,
Macy's incorporated. Oh it's Macy's and blooming Dell's. And yet

(26:19):
they care they separate the assortments from one another. They
would be easy for them to differentiate. I don't get it.
Nordstrue considered one of the finest department stores in the world.
Would you believe up until recently they didn't carry Ralph Lauren.
I could tell your Men's they still only have one
small wreck. It's ridiculous. There's no choice, nothing to choose from.

(26:43):
They don't want it because it's in Macy. Again, they
want exclusivity. Again, you have your exclusivity, but don't have
Ralph Lauren in your store. That makes sense. And again,
I could go on and on and on. I could
do hours of programming. I have a million stories that
I can tell you about channel conflict, but I want
to tell you my favorite story. It comes with a

(27:07):
little drama. Lessons learned me becoming an officer in the
company and one of the happiest moments and status moments
in my career, not for me, but for brands that
I were involved with. Takes me back. I had music
that would take me back in time, that would take
you back in time to a time when I was

(27:29):
a fashion director in the shirt business at Venues. I
was responsible for creating the product assortments, the packaging, the
labeling of our dress shirt products. Big job. We were
in the second largest shirt company in the world. But
the world was changing. We had the venues and brand
and it was a respected, world known national brand. But

(27:52):
designer brands were starting to come in to our industry
and they were wrecking havoc with the norm. They were
Donna Karen, there was Calvin Koran, of course, Georgia Olmani,
other French brands like Daniel, heshtere Is S and Laurent.
All of these brands were eating away at the market

(28:13):
share of national brands of America, and not just in
dress shirts, in every category. You would go into a
sweater store and there used to be McGregor sweaters or
whatever brands, Brooks Brothers. You picked the national brands that
you know. All of a sudden, half the flow became
designer and we as a shirt company were only selling

(28:35):
dress shirts under the venues and name. So our company
made a decision to buy or license designer brands, and
the first brand that we were able to acquire full
license was Jeffrey Bean. Jeffrey Bean, who probably very few
of any of you knowing him, was one of the

(28:56):
world's most famous couture designers. He was in ar artist.
He won more Cody Awards than anyone. He was heralded
as one of the great design talents of our era. Well,
he wasn't really good at is building his brand like
so many others did, but he was a force to
be Reckonedly, we launched a shirt line one season, not me,
but another department. They sold none of it. We gave up,

(29:19):
and then one day Holston one of the America's most
pre eminent designers, one of America's most visible designers. Holston
of JFK wife Jackie Kennedy's hall fame when he made
her pillbox hat, expanded his design empire and Holston became

(29:40):
one of the hottest, most important followed designers in America
in women's work and Holston, over a period in time,
took an investors and they needed to grow and made
a decision to enter the men's were industry through licensee
and we licensed their name. I can't tell you how
excited we were. Excited. I was to have my chance,

(30:02):
on our company's chance at entering the designer business. While
we tried Jeffrey Bean, we didn't put our best st
effort forward. We were not successful. This one mattered. We
made big guarantees. Holston was very high profile. He was
going to oversee everything we did. We would have to
deal with him. I ended up dealing with him personally

(30:22):
on a weekly basis. We were going to involve with
one of America's most well known, most prestigious studio fifty
four leading the un Kajagga, Nick Jagger, everyone famous hung
out with Holston every day he was in the press.
This was a big, high profile decision. Now within our company,

(30:45):
it's interesting. We decided to make Halston the best of
the best at shirts could be. We hired. We had
a guy in our company. His name was Terry Conway.
I think Terry at this point would be over one
hundred years so I'm going to say to him, I
lost truck. Terry. If you're out here, I hope you're well,
but more probably rest in peace. He was a British guy,
went to Brown Houston Versity. He was educated, well spoke

(31:08):
the language, looked the part. It was very British, all classed.
They gave him the head the title of president of
a designer group, which at the time meant Holston and he,
myself and a team of people came together to talk
about what could Holston dress shirts be. First of all,
we would make them one hundred percent cot of the

(31:29):
finest genre we could find in America. Cotton shirts at
the time were a very small part of the business
because they weren't washing and wear, I believe it or not.
Back in the day, people cared about washing and wearing
this shirt. That invention wash his shirt hanging on the
line rather take it to a dry. Clan or God
for bit forced women to press them because men were
impressing their shirt. It became a big deal and we

(31:54):
decided first of all to make it one hundred percent cotton,
which is a big decision. And then from the collar
on down we made the label silk gray, satin, label beautiful,
label silver, and the exact logo that Holston was known
for Beautiful. In the collar we put removable stays, those

(32:15):
those bones that they call them. You take out when
you dry clean the shirt and you put them in
and keeps the collar in shape. And on them we
monogram the name Holston, all the buttons with special buttons
with tone on tone vision of the word Holston, and
the shirt was perfection. Back in the day, all shirts
and dress shot packages you came in plastic package with

(32:38):
the name and information, all the washing instructions, all the details.
We lobby in Washington to put the details inside the
package around rather than the outside, and whether they agreed
or not, I don't recall. We did it. Anyway, The
only thing you saw on the outside on the Holston
package is on the front in big bold Holston logo

(32:59):
Holsteon and the charcoal gray matching the charcoal gray of
the letter. And on the back we had very small
print made in America, whatever it was, and we launched Holston.
I on my team designed the most elegant line of
dress sits you can imagine. We had a beautiful array
of solids and white, light blue, pink, soft yellow, even

(33:20):
a soft purple. At the time. The stripes were beautiful.
The checks were minuscule checks in a kind of weaving
technique called pick and pick that were single ends of check.
They're the finest checks that you could buy anywhere in
the world. And we put together a line of Holston.
We had one tonal program. It was called a tone

(33:41):
on tone. It's like a if it's a white shirt.
It was a white on white stripe, very elegant, widely spaced, beautiful,
and we launched Holston Dresser for the first holiday season
or whatever year that was, call it eighty eighty one
or eighty two, id oh call, and every retail in
America was interested to see what Holston was doing. And

(34:05):
when I say every retail, I'm talking about Bergdolff, Gooden,
who was so big and Holston women's were at that time.
Even if they wanted to be snobby and not look
at our Holston line, Holston and team made it clear
to it you have to see my shirt line, you
have to support it. And burggolf good with their noses

(34:26):
in the air, with all the respect that I don't
remember them, but you could picture Berg of Goodin coming
to Van Uesen's office and really determining whether they would
buy Holston or not. With a lot of pressure from Wolston.
Came in were stounded at how well the package, the
product was executed. Burgoff Goodman bought Holston, Nieman Marcus nose

(34:48):
in the air, maybe not as high as Bergoff owned
by the same company. We're given the same direction, come
in and see Holston, Blooming Girls, Macy Lord and Taylor, Billard's, Robinson, May,
Marshall Fields, Burdimes. Every retail in the country came in

(35:09):
to see the collection, bought it, bought it big. Ask
when they reorder it, Ask when they can come in
by the next season. Every single retail in America bought
that collection. There was nothing offered for off price. There
was nothing discounted anywhere. This was a regular price offering

(35:31):
that if you had to buy, you had to manage carefully,
because if we didn't like the way you were selling it,
if we didn't like your presentation, if you didn't a
separate Halston from your other shirt, if it didn't sit
on its own fixture with its own sign, you wouldn't
get it again. Every retail in America had to come
back to Terry Conway and the team and show them

(35:53):
how they would present Holston. And they all did. And
they all did it because Holston at that time was
big than lib and it was not a good success,
not an amazing success. It was extraordinary. Here is one
of the oldest shirt companies in the world, if I
remember correctly, venues and began in eighteen fifty seven selling

(36:17):
shirts to coal miners as they exited the factory full
and soot, so that I have a clean shirt to
put on after they went home and took a shower
then using dress shirts now owned to Alston and Holston
Dressherts not a license, was magnificent and we sold them
all and we were so excited. The company was so excited.

(36:38):
I was called into the office of its president, mister
Chuck Smith, and he said to me, kid, he did
an amazing job. I want you to know, as of
this moment, you are being named vice president of van
Usen for the work that you did in Holston. I
got a raise, I got a new title. That night.
There was a big event honorings than in Bloomingdale's. I

(37:01):
have a picture in my house. Maybe I'll put her
on Instagram. While my wife and I showing up in
a limousine to the Holston event, knowing that here I
am thirty years old, unexpectedly made vice president of the company. Now,
if you asked me, I wanted it years before. And
those of who listened to the show know my story,
and those of you here I've read Always in Fashion,

(37:23):
the book. You'll know the story, but those of you didn't.
That was the night. That was the day actually I
became vice president and I have him to joyfully celebrate.
I met Holston that night, say hello to him. He
congratulated me on becoming vice president. You know, I'm working
with Holston, who's an extraordinary guy. Everything he did was

(37:43):
with great, great detail. His office, I forgot, was in
a one of those massive, beautiful office buildings on Madison
Avenue of fifth and you'd walk in, you'd come to
the outer office to be a beautiful appointed administrative assistant,
always wearing black black turtlenecks, talks and was known for
black turtlenecks. She was elegant, looked the part, and his

(38:06):
door in his wall before he was all mirrors and
when you would open his door, she'd get up and
open his doors to let you in. All the mirrors
surrounding him would reflect light back on him, so he
was always lit in perfect light. He looked like he
didn't look like he was from this world. Tall, handsome,
good looking, appointed, moved elegantly. He was Holston. He lived

(38:29):
it and did it, and we launched this and it
was going to be successful. We delivered the product in
August of that year, and by October of that year
we were sold out. It was the most extraordinary success
you could ever imagine. I mean, I can't put words
on it. I can't put words on it. If we

(38:49):
were to write a script for it, and it was
a movie, we couldn't do better. We opened up the
spring season in November of that year. Everyone wanted a
fly in to see it. They were ready to buy
it early. They were on consignment. We can they were
on allotment. We can only give them so much. While
we were doubling or tripling the business. There was only

(39:11):
so much we can get them. There's almost so much
risk we could take. We already selling everyone there was
to sell, and we did, and we had this extraordinary success.
I'll never forget. I get a call to come see
the president of the company. Hey, mar come down to
my office. How's it going. H It's going great. You know,
everything is so amazing. I can't believe how what we're doing.

(39:34):
He says, Yeah, that's what I want to talk to
you about. We just got known that the investment firm.
I apologize, I don't remember who it was who purchased
Holston want more growth, and they just concluded a deal
to sell a new Holston collection called Holston three. Get
ready for this? Everyone to J C. Penny, my mouth dropped.

(39:56):
Now let me tell youson I'm a fan of JAC Penny.
I am involved with selling hundreds of millions, if not
billions of dollars worth of products to Penny over my career.
I'm a huge admirer. They always had been, and back
in the day they had one of the best quality
control arms anywhere in the world. They had a buying
staff or there was second to none. They were thorough,
they were smart, they were data before anyone. They had

(40:19):
a billion dollar catalog business before we even knew it,
the word catalog met They were the precursors catalogs of
the Internet as we know it. On ELI Commerce, people
would come in, pick from the catalog, call a number,
and they out have shipped to their home. JAC Penny
was a force to be reckoned, with a force to
be admired, super profitable and super respected by all. But

(40:40):
they were low priced. They were national chain. What are
you doing selling Holston to J C. Penny. It'll be
a disaster, Mark, the President's says to me. Between you
and I, I agree with you. I don't understand why
they're doing this. Oh, I mean, Mark, they want more volume,

(41:01):
but we're only at it one season. Shock. His name
is truck Smith. He says, I know, we haven't even
got our first year and then now they're doing this.
But here's the good news. Because of our contract, we
have the rights to do this. So what we're going
to do. We're gonna sell Holston to j C. Penny.
Is it not Holston Holston three, same logo, same logo,
different color. We'll say Holston three and navy blue, and

(41:24):
they will not do the beautiful satins. We're going to
do a less expensive version that J C. Penny can sell.
You could tell by the way he was looking at
me in the conversation we're having. We all knew it
was a mistake, talk about oaking the bear in the eye.
I said, when are we announcing this? He says, I'm
afraid we're not announcing. The investment bankers, the people involved

(41:46):
in Halston in the press at the end of the
day are dropping a story that they're doing this that,
and they the story was dropped the following morning. All
the stalls dot coming. Now I was in sales. I've
never been a seller. I've always been on the merchandising
marketing side. And yes, when you're a senior executive like

(42:07):
I was, I can sell the concept on the company.
When I was in the showroom, I was selling the
concept of Holston, the finest shirt in America by one
of the most exciting designers in America. This is your
chance for America to put that hand on an opening product.
If you can't afford a three thousand dollars dress or
a pillbox hat, you can now afford a Holston shirt.

(42:30):
It was Entrey into the brand. By the way, every
luxury brand has Entrede and the Vetona might be a
five hundred dollar wallet. Well that's what they were when
I was there. I don't know what they are now. Well, Jacobs,
it could be a key chain. And every brand worries
that they have too much Entrede price items in their assortment,
but it doesn't mean they don't have it. Here was Holston,
and they started calling burgdof Goodwin called Terry Conway, the

(42:54):
president of Designer, and asked him is it true? He said, yes,
are you going to do it? We have no choice.
But it'll be a different product. Burned off ours is elegant.
It's gonna be cotton. The penny shut will be polycotton,
will be less expensive, it won't have any of the
special treatments that we gave. It's designed for the mass market.

(43:15):
Thank you for telling us. I want you to consider
all my orders canceled going forward. I'm no longer carrying
the brand. One by one, every store in America called
Terry or Chuck Smith, our president or me because I
work with them, and canceled every single future order of
Holston right then and there that first day, that first week,

(43:39):
the most extraordinary business that we ever had disappeared. So
if you want to talk channel conflict, that's a great
example of channel conflict. Just the fact that the name
Holston would be a J. C. Penny, I'll be it
in a different product. There was nothing even close to
the Holston product that we developed. One hundred percent beautiful

(44:00):
oligan shirt versus a polyesterin conton sixty five percent poll
thirty five percent Washington Wear product didn't matter. Every store
in America canceled us that day and that week. What
to do? What to do? Well? My job now was
to make Holston three successful, and we did. We made

(44:20):
an amazing design addresser that would sell for twenty five
dollars rounder that would sell in JC Penny in huge
quantities for the next twenty years in it for an item?
What else did we do? We were devastating the most
successful launch in our history. The Designer was now gone.
Residents of the company set. I have an idea. We

(44:42):
have all these companies who love us. We've proven to
them that we could do Designer. We know how to
make special shirts. Mark, if I asked you, can you
find me a cotton shirt that we could retail for
twenty dollars? I understand we might not be able to
make the same kind of margin on a fifty to
one hundred dollars shirt that we did with Holst, but

(45:03):
could we make a decent profit on a twenty dollars shirt.
Let's say, add all the accouterments of bones and a removal,
steakhou logo, buttons, nice beautiful colors, a wider assortment of colors.
I want a solid colored shirt that will sell the
twenty dollars in a range of twenty colors. I want
to sell tons of them. Can you get that done?
I'll come back to ensure enough. I went to the

(45:25):
sources in Asia, came up with a fabric, came up
with a model, and determined that we could do a
twenty dollars shirt. And what do we do. We called
it Jeffrey Bean. Within two weeks, we're in front of
every store in America once again, from Birdgoff Goodman to
Nord Streams, Janeman Marcus, to Macy's to Robinson's, May Carson,

(45:48):
Perry Scott, from Marshall Field to Birdinees to Mason. Every
one of them, with the exception of no One bought
Jeffrey Bean. And Jeffrey Bean the course of the next
twenty years became the largest selling dresshirt in the history
of design. Now, since I left, I don't know what happened.

(46:10):
I can tell you that Jeffrey Bean no longer exists
for all intensive purpose. It's very mildly distributed. It's a
great name. Jeffrey Bean was still one of the world's
famous designers. It had an amazing run. But if you
want to talk about channel conflict and exclusivity, all those
people that walked away from Holston did it without a

(46:31):
moment's notice. Did they make the right decision? I can't answer.
I can only tell you that Holston didn't last the
test of the time. Putting in jac Penny, they had
a run. I could be perfectly honest. I don't remember
why it didn't work, to the degree, why it's not there,
what happened. I know Holston is still out there in
some kind of configuration, owned by someone who is an

(46:54):
entrepreneur and trying to sell it and make money. And
I'm sure he is. I wished him the best, but
exclusivity man a long way from what I've learned. I'll
take a break back in a moment. Always in fashions.
As one of the world's most celebrated fashion designers, Carl
Lagafeld was renowned for his aspirational and cutting edge approach

(47:17):
to style. His unique vision of Parisian shit comes to
America through Carlagofeld Paris. He has women's collections, men's collections,
ready to wear, accessory, shoes and bags. The fashion house
Carlagafeld also offers a range of watches I wear in
premium fragrances. You could explore the car Lagovil collection to
Carl Lagofelparis dot com. But it's more than that. I

(47:39):
have for one, love to shop. I love going around
and seeing what's happening and what catches my attention, what
would make me feel good to wear Now, I don't
wear the women's wear obviously, but I can appreciate it
and they look amazing. If you want to look right,
you want to have clothes that fits you well. You
want to look like you're wearing something that's very expensive
that's exclude us for you and yours. You can find

(48:02):
it at very affordable prices at Macy's Orcarlagofel dot com Paris.
The women's ready to wear fashion is extraordinary, as well
as the handbigs and the shoes. I, for one, wear
men's clothes, unlike my appreciation of women's clothes. I'm a
modern guy. I wanna look current. I want to look
the way I want to feel. I go out at night,

(48:22):
I'm in black and carlagofeld is my buddy. Clothes are great.
They fit great, and they have little tweaks and touches,
whether it's a stripe on the sleeve or button at
the neck or on the shoulder. There's a lot of
details that go into Carlagathal because he's always been he
always had been where the world's great designers, and this
legacy and goes on and on. I can't speak enough

(48:43):
about it except to say to you, you want to
feel good about yourself. You want to know that you're
dressing properly. You want to clothes that fits you well.
Carl Lagafeld Paris, Carl lago Feldparis dot com. My favorite
brand has always been ises On. My company one time
bought that brand. The CEO of the company handed it
to me and said, you better make it work. And

(49:05):
I put everything in my career to make Eyesod work
and I fell in love with that brand, and to
this day it is one of the most exciting endeavors
I've ever got involved with. Isod is an incredibly strong
golf brand. If you play golf, if you play tennis
for that matter. They make a great polo shirts. I

(49:28):
mean great. They're fit perfect. The material is unique because
it's a PK fabric that waffle leave, you see, and
it's made of a blend of cotton and microfiber that
allows you to stretch. And very often they are treated
with solar protection as well, so they stretch, they're comfortable,

(49:50):
and they breathe well. And one thing about ISOD they
always fit. They'll never tug on you. You put it
in your waist that they'll fit you great. The colors
patterns are since now I will also tell you Isaac
makes great shorts and great golf pants. You're a golf friend.
You want to look good. You don't have to think
about how do I look. You want to think about
how you play, not how you feel. Isaad is the

(50:13):
brand for you. I know I was there when it
was created. The strategy behind that brand is brilliant. It's
one of my favorite brands. While I talk about it,
I should tell you about the man's sportswear. Isod wasn't
enough being a golf brand. It wasn't enough being just
great polo shirts with logos, without logos. Incredible brand and
story and history. Isaad makes salt weather programs. They have

(50:37):
great printed woven shirts, short sleeves. They look excellent with colors,
excellent with shorts, excellent with cotton pants, of which they
also make. This whole salt order relaxed line from Isaac,
whether it be fleece, cotton sweaters, knit polos, woven shirts

(50:58):
and pants of a range of color and fabrics that
a perfect for a guy wants to go casually in
the spring and summer of this year. And here's the
thing is is affordable. Everyone listening to me talk about
this brand can afford to buy it and know that

(51:18):
there are a lot of other brands that also have
a look like ISID, although I don't believe it's fun
as ISAAA is. The brand has a lot of energy
in it, but at the price points no one can compete.
You can find Isaac at You're leading retails and online
at ion dot com. And I help you by telling
you if you were is on, You're going to look great.

Speaker 1 (51:40):
Welcome back to it always in fashion. Here's your host,
Mark Webber.

Speaker 2 (51:46):
It's been a show about nostalgia for me talking about
two of the world's most famous designers. Jorge ARMANI saying goodbye.
He was great. I wore his clothes I still do.
The world will miss and remarkable man. And a story
about another very famous talented guy, Alston. Tonight's show, it's

(52:09):
about it's Icsion making choices. It's about confronting decisions when
they need to be made. We all are confronted with choices.
We all have to rack our minds to make the
right decision. The best way to make decisions is to
be thorough, to be diligent, to think through the issues,

(52:33):
what may be unintended consequences, you know. Sometimes you make
a decision, The decisions and the consequences last for a
long time. I often think about throwing a pebble in
the water. The pebble disappears, but the ripples go on
and on and on. You have to think through and
make decisions. And you're in business. You have to consider

(52:56):
always your customer. The only reason you're in businesses you
have customer who will buy from you. For everything you buy,
you need to make a sell. It's as simple as that.
That's commerce. I tell you that. The industry I'm in retail, luctury,
fashion complicated. Exclusivity is the concept that many people feel

(53:17):
on the key to success. Without exclusivity, there's extinction. But
on a personal note, if you're working with me, I'm
interested in your input. I will listen to your ideas.
I'll pay attention to what you have to say. But
when the decision needs to be made, the book starts

(53:38):
with me. I have to be responsible. I have to
make those decisions. I have to be in charge of
the outcome because I am responsibility. Accountability without responsibility doesn't
go in hand. Someone has to make the decision. You
always have to remember one thing about companies and e

(53:59):
commerce or business in general. This is not a democracy.
You don't get the junis. We don't vote. In the
end the night, shall it's my way of the highway.
Get on board. Good night,