No Response Is A Response

No Response Is A Response

Episode Transcript

Speaker 1 (00:00):
This show is produced and hosted by Mark Webber. The
show is sponsored by G three of Parol. If he's
expressed in the following program are those of the sponsor
and not necessarily the opinion of seven tenor or iHeartMedia.
Who is Mark Weber. He's a self made business executive
here to help you find your success from the New

(00:21):
York City projects to the Avenue Montaigne in Paris. His
global success story in the luxury world of fashion is inspirational.
He's gone from clerk to CEO twice. Mark his classic
proof that the American dream is alive. And well, here's
your host of Always in Fashion, Mark Weber.

Speaker 2 (00:41):
Mark Weber.

Speaker 3 (00:42):
I often wonder whether I should just be quiet. There's
no question that in this life. If I just didn't answer,
just didn't offer, didn't suggest, refrain from options, kept my
advice to myself, kept my own counsel, I didn't get involved.
I kept my mouth shut. I just might be happier.

Speaker 2 (01:04):
Now.

Speaker 3 (01:04):
I've been working on my happiness, which is more important
to me than being heard. And you think, after all
this time, I've had learned that no response is a response.
You don't have to say anything if you don't want to.
Now I have to admit I could be my own
worst enemy forgetting humans and their nature.

Speaker 2 (01:23):
Humans. Many don't wish you well.

Speaker 3 (01:26):
Particularly if you talk about yourself. My wife always warned me.
She said, those above you in business mark will love
you until you catch up to them. And then I
learned on my own that those below you that work
for you will love you for the thousand things you
do for them until you say no once and then
all bets are off. Yet here I am. I'm happy,

(01:46):
and when I'm happy, it's makes me funny. And when
I'm funny, I talk too much and invariably get into trouble.
But I want to talk. I have a show tonight.
I have a Radis show talk. So I have things
I want to do. I have stories I want to tell.
Now part of what I'm going to do tonight is
paint the bullseye on my back. I deserve it. I
have some things I have to share. I want to

(02:07):
teach some important lessons. But I will tell you from
now on in this world, if someone asked me a
question and I don't answer, that means that's my answer.
And perhaps all of you learned that lesson you too,
will realize no response is a response. With that as
a back trip, I want to introduce my co host,
my lawyer, and my son, Jesse Webber. Jesse, you haven't

(02:30):
been on the show in a while, and now you're back.

Speaker 4 (02:32):
I know, I know, I know. It's just been incredibly
busy in the legal world. Have you seen how many
cases are happening right now, how much Trump legal stuff's
been going on. I want to be on the show,
but I'll tell you I listened to the show last week.

Speaker 2 (02:45):
It was great.

Speaker 4 (02:46):
I thought it was a great show. I did have
one question for you. I did have one question for
you about the show last week. You gave this great
story about Macy's West Macy's East, and I'm not going
to summarize the whole thing, but you basically were reassured
the guy that ran Macy's East that they were going
to continue to carry the brand. But there was this whole,
big concern about Macy's West not no longer carrying it.

(03:07):
The one thing I never understood was what happened after
Macy's West said they weren't going to carry You had
to report that back to the board, right. You tried
every which way to make sure the brand was held
by Macy's West. Did the board say, hey, Mark, did
you try every which way? I mean, were they What
did they say to you when you came back and said, listen,
I tried every which way for Macy's West Coast to

(03:28):
keep our brand and they said no. What was the
reaction from the company about that? That was the one
part I was missing.

Speaker 3 (03:34):
Yeah, Well, Macy's East decided to stay loyal to the brand.
Macy's West ran away. I told the board that this
is happening. I told the board, it's not going to work,
the trading off our great brand for some private lebel
brand and over time it'll come back and let's just
stay the course. And that, in turn, is what happened.
So it was really a non entity of the board.
But thank you for bringing that up. But what I
want to talk about a little differently tonight is the

(03:56):
idea of being quiet. You know, when you talk, when
you don't talk? What is rule number one?

Speaker 2 (04:01):
Keep the mouth closed exactly.

Speaker 3 (04:05):
Now that began with you jumping in the swimming pool
with you little boy, keep the mouth closed, and then
in life it's the same thing. Don Corleone said, never
let anyone outside the family know what you're thinking.

Speaker 2 (04:17):
Same thing.

Speaker 3 (04:17):
You gotta keep the mouth beclouse. I'm always getting in trouble.
But the other day I had a reoccurring thing. I'm
going to talk about. Somebody called me eccentric. I'm not eccentric.

Speaker 2 (04:27):
You are.

Speaker 4 (04:27):
But that's not a bad thing. It's not a bad thing.
You should wear it as a badge of honor. It's
funny I was talking about somebody.

Speaker 2 (04:34):
Wait a minute, Wait a minute, I have tape something
I want to play for you.

Speaker 5 (04:38):
What eccentric is Eccentric as an adjective definition one of
a person or their behavior unconventional and slightly strange, as
in my favorite aunt is very eccentric In a technical sense,
definition two of a thing not play centrally, or not
having its axis or other part play centrally, as in
a servo driving in eccentric cam. As a noun, definition

(05:02):
one a person of unconventional and slightly strange views or behavior,
as in he enjoys a colorful reputation as an engaging eccentric.

Speaker 2 (05:11):
I thought it was a great thing. Listen to what
it just said. I'm strange on this.

Speaker 4 (05:16):
That's bad. That's bad. All the great people in this world,
so entrepreneurs, the best in industries. They're all unique, they're
all one of a kind. They've all been called different
or weird or eccentric. That's not a bad thing. I
spoke to somebody today who I work with, and I
told him, I said to them, right through his face,
I was like, I will never meet anyone like you

(05:37):
ever again in my life. I said. There's some people
that you meet who are like at of Central Casting.
You know exactly what they're about. They're very characteristic of everybody.
It's great to be different. That's how you stand out.
That's how you stand out. I think you're the same way.

Speaker 3 (05:52):
Well, I'm going to cover thank you for that. I
figured you jump on my head for being weird.

Speaker 4 (05:58):
No, I mean you're weird. I mean you're weird and
good ways and bad ways. There are some things you're
weird about a little eccentric about that. I'm like, eh,
I don't know. But other than that, it's great.

Speaker 3 (06:10):
What's the most important case you're covering out? Talking weird?

Speaker 4 (06:13):
Did he I want to talk weird? Diddy? Diddy's trials
about to start, so.

Speaker 2 (06:18):
It's really I didn't realize.

Speaker 4 (06:21):
Yeah, this past week perspective, jurors were brought into the courtroom,
not for individual questioning. They filled out questionnaires, forms about
what's your age, where do you live, have you heard
anything about the case, And then they're going to be
whittled down and we're going to have real jury selection
beginning next week. I think it's gonna be very tough
to find the jury in this case. But remember, he's

(06:43):
going to trial federal court facing five sex crimes charges,
faces potentially the rest of his life in prison. All
eyes are going to be on this trial. And you
want to talk weird. He's accused of doing a lot
of weird things.

Speaker 2 (06:59):
Is he going down?

Speaker 4 (07:00):
Hard to say? I'll say this much. What he's charged
with are very specific crimes. So if we're talking sex trafficking,
there are very specific elements that the prosecution has to prove,
And I gotta say, I'll see what the evidence is,
but I think the defense can make an argument that
this is not a classic example of that. That he

(07:23):
might have had relationships with girlfriends and was flying them
out and paying them and buying gifts for them. Is
that really what sex trafficking is? Did he run a
criminal enterprise? For a racketeering charge. I know why they
charged them the way they did, but I don't know
if a jury's going to accept it. This is not
a case of did Sean Combs abuse anyone or engage

(07:47):
in sexual assault? That's not what this is. It's very,
very different. It's beyond that. And I think the prosecution,
though this is the Southern District of New York federal prosecutors,
they wouldn't move forward with the case unless they felt
they had the goods. There's talk about whether or not
they offered a plea deal and Shawn Combs rejected it.
I'm gonna be very curious to see how everything's argued
and who ends up testifying. But it's gonna be quite

(08:11):
the case. And by the way, it's by the way,
it's very rare for a federal case like this to
go to trial and very rare for it to go
to trial within a year of when someone's arrested. But
Shawn Colmbs wants to go full speed ahead. He wants
us to go to trial. It seems like he believes
he can be acquitted in this case. Very interesting.

Speaker 3 (08:31):
When you said the jury, what are the criteria for jury?
How are they going to find a jury that doesn't
know anything about this.

Speaker 4 (08:38):
They're not going to try to find a jury that
doesn't know anything about this. It's going to be, first
of all, impossible to find a jury that doesn't know
who Sean Combs is. Okay, that's going to be number one.
But to find a jury that hasn't heard something about
the charges or the criminal case, or seen that really
really bad video of him allegedly beating up an ex girlfriend. No,
The question is can the jurors who are seated, can

(09:00):
they put aside whatever they've seen about the case. Can
they put aside whatever opinions they have and say I
promise to make a decision purely based on the facts
and the evidence presented in this courtroom. Easier said than done.
You have to take their word for it. Sometimes their
backgrounds are going to be looked into. Did they post
anything on social media about it in the past year?

(09:22):
But that's what you're looking for, and you better have alternates.
You better have a lot of alternates, because during the
course of what could be an eight week trial, things happened,
jurors could say things, they might be approached. You want
to make sure you have enough because if you run
out of jurors, then you have a mistrial. So you
want to make sure you have enough jurors and jurors
who can look at this case impartially.

Speaker 3 (09:45):
Well, here's the deal. I'm glad we have a little
current events. I'm glad we're going to talk about this.
That might be very helpful for everybody to watch. But
here's the case I'm going to build right now, you're ready.
I've been accused of being eccentric, and point out and
prove that I'm not with that of mine. I hate
talking about myself. In all my formal lives. My former reiterations,

(10:10):
I talked about brands. I talked about the companies I
work for, the brands I represent. Now the brands that
I'm representing is always in fashion, and I'm a point
and I set the stage, and I have to talk
about me. It isn't easy being me, but I like it.
I have to admit, I'm always concerned that when I
talk about my own personal successes, it could be considered

(10:34):
as bravado or bragging full of myself, and therefore I
try and offset it with some humility and reality and
to yours truly, if you ask me. Hey, I think
I'm a great guy. I'm well thought out. Everything I
say is with common sense. Everything I say makes sense
and well. What I also say is I may not
always be right, but I'm never wrong, which is backed

(10:57):
up by I don't know if I'm smart. That's for
others to decide, but I know I'm well trained. But
this is where I want to go. And I have
a story I want to tell you that happened a
while ago, but reoccurred last week. I was cold eccentric.
I always wore eccentric as a badge of honor. I
thought it was cool to be eccentric. But let me

(11:19):
play it for you again. This is what eccentric is.

Speaker 5 (11:22):
Eccentric as an adjective definition one of a person or
their behavior unconventional and slightly strange, as in my favorite
aunt is very eccentric. In a technical sense, definition two
of a thing not play centrally, or not having its
axis or other part play centrally, as in a servo
driving an eccentric ham. As a noun definition, one a

(11:45):
person of unconventional and slightly strange views or behavior, as
in he enjoys a colorful reputation. As an engaging, eccentric.

Speaker 3 (11:54):
So I'll say I've always been different. Some would say
I beat to my own drum. Others I'd say I'm up.

Speaker 2 (12:01):
I don't know what do I say?

Speaker 3 (12:05):
Now?

Speaker 2 (12:05):
You know I'm not full of myself. I'm not apologizing.

Speaker 3 (12:09):
I was with a group of people the other night
and were shooting the breeze, and I decided to hold court, talking,
you know, okay about my wardrobe. And one woman said
to me, you don't mark. Every time I see you,
you're wearing a navy suit. So I decided to be playful.
How do I look? She says, you always look great
to me. Now I'm thinking, is this where I'm going

(12:31):
to get into trouble?

Speaker 2 (12:32):
Now?

Speaker 3 (12:32):
I look at her and say, well, how good is good?
And she says you look great?

Speaker 2 (12:38):
Why? Ass?

Speaker 3 (12:39):
She said? Seriously? Yeah, you said I look good. I'm curious.
Are you fishing for compliments?

Speaker 2 (12:46):
Mark?

Speaker 3 (12:47):
No, I'm interested in what you have to say. Now
I'm being charming, or at least I think I am.
I I'm watching what's going on the table and I'm
liking this. And she says, okay, I'll answer you. First
of all, you're handsome.

Speaker 2 (13:00):
I start to walk thank you.

Speaker 3 (13:02):
You have great hair and your shirt serves you well.
Now I'm feeling like Brad Pitten. I go to the
Larry David mode with that. You like the navy, I
love it, And here we go. I have a story
to tell, and I start to tell the story, and
the story goes. I'm thinking, how I tell you. I
had been in the industry for a while, and I

(13:24):
tried very different things. I was a fashionable kind of
guy and I was following fashion, or should I say
I was chasing it, and I literally was chasing it
down the wrong street. I got myself into fashion faux pars,
and I wore banded collars with a suit, you know
those dress shirts without a collar buttons, and then I
can look out fool. I went to a charity event

(13:44):
and I wore an orange shirt. At the time, my
company was making shirts out of nylon dress shirts. They
were cold Kiana, they came in different colors. They are
very silky looking. But I bought an orange one with
an orange white and navy print tie with a navy suit.
And that night I took a picture with the then
Governor of New York and I brought it home and
I opened up. I looked at the picture, says, what

(14:05):
an idiot? I look like an idiot. I can't believe
I did this. I was so upset with myself, and
I realized right then and there, I had to change
my look. And I started struggling. And it went on
for about a week. I would never wear a colored
shirt again. One day I put on a navy suit,
white shirt, navy blue tie, black tesseled loaf for Sterling

(14:27):
silver cuff links, and a Sterling silver Rolex watch. And
I look in the mirror and I think, for me,
I look amazing. I call over my wife and I said,
look in the mirror, Sue, what do you see? She
looks at me, says you. I said, no, no, what
do you see? She says, help me here? I said,
I'll tell you what you see. You see me looking

(14:49):
the best I possibly could look. I am never going
to wear anything but a navy blue suit. And for
twenty years I had all my suits made to order.
They were all navy blue. They were different ways somewhere
to winter, they were single breasted and double breasted. Every
single day for twenty years, I wore navy blue suit,

(15:12):
white shirts, Sterling silver cofflings, navy tie, black tauseil loafers,
and stain the steel rollers watch. And I explained that
when I met people who didn't know me, or we
hired new people to work, I'd have to take them
aside and say to them, listen, you're gonna see me
what you think is the same thing every day. And
I do wear a uniform. This is it that you're

(15:34):
looking at it. But I want you to know all
the suits are numbered, all the shoes and number, the
shirts and number. They're all different. But I believe I
look best this way, and that's what you're going to
see every day. But I didn't want you to think
I'm slovenly and I you know, and I told this story,
which I think is funny. After all, we all struggle

(15:55):
to look our best. We all want to look our best.
The show package yourself as important as the products.

Speaker 2 (15:59):
Your package. I'm a product. I want to look the
best I can.

Speaker 3 (16:02):
I found out what I look best in and I
wanted to wear it every day. And the woman at
the table who before was telling me how good I look.
I'm feeling really proud, and she says to me, I
didn't know you were in eccentric, I said, thank you.
Is that good? Well, it means you're different, different in

(16:22):
a good way. And she pauses and says, you want
me to be honest? I said what I always would.
I said, no, I want you to lie to me.
She said, eccentric means you're strange. Now how did I
go from being really good looking with great hair and
interesting to strange in the next minute? How because I

(16:44):
opened my big mouth? Like I said earlier, talking gets
me in trouble. Now, I don't think I'm eccentric. In fact,
you know, I struggled with it for many years, thinking
about me in the same suit every day, until one
day I read an article about Alblet Einstein, who wore
the same suit every day. I don't know if he
had more than one, but when asked about he said, look,

(17:06):
I don't want to think about clothes. I want to
think about relativity. And kind of made me feel good.
But I'll double back down on this.

Speaker 2 (17:12):
Okay.

Speaker 3 (17:13):
I have a bunch of cars. I have two sports
cars and a bunch of SUVs, and they're all black.
And you would ask, why would you buy all the
same cars that are black? The two sports cars look
alike the two SUVs will look alike. Why all black,
I said, because it came to me one day after
I tried gray, I've tried white that I like black

(17:35):
best of all. Black is my favorite color in the car,
no matter which car I'm driving, I wanted to look
my favorite, which is black. You're eccentric again, I'm eccentric,
which got me to the other thing. I don't know
about the rest of you. Those of you married your
significant other sessue what you want for dinner that night?
My wife at six in the morning, I'm getting dressed,
What do you want for dinner?

Speaker 2 (17:55):
At night?

Speaker 3 (17:56):
I don't know what I want for dinner. I haven't
even brushed my teeth yet. She is, what I have
to prepare? What do you want? I said, I don't know.
So every night I would have something different. And one
night in particular, my wife made roasted chicken. The minute
I walked in the house. It smelled unbelievable. I ate
it the way she prepared it was so delicious. The
chicken was falling off the bones. And at dinner, I

(18:18):
said to her, Sue, no matter what happens, don't ask
me what I want for dinner anymore. This is what
I want for dinner every night. She said, what do
you mean every night? I want this for dinner every
single night. You ever see the army and they show
you how a guy could take his rifle apart and
put it back together his eyes closed. My wife got

(18:39):
to the point where she can clean the chicken without looking.
She knew how to do it because every night, and
for five years running, I had the same thing every night,
roasted chicken. Now I tell this story and people think
I'm crazy. They'll tell me I'm eccentric. I don't know
why I loved it.

Speaker 2 (18:56):
Now.

Speaker 3 (18:56):
It got to a point at one time that I
wanted to lose weight. I said, you know, I want
to try fish. My wife made salmon three years in
a row, every night salmon until one day the fish
market where she bought the salmon didn't have salmon, so
she bought halibu. Two years of halibu. That's been my thing. Now,
if that's eccentric, I could live with it. If you're
using it when you tell me that I am eccentric

(19:19):
as a weapon against me, you're putting a bull's eye
on my back and you're telling me, here's what I
want to tell you, every one of us needs to
know what we like best. Every one of us needs
to know how we look best. Every one of us
needs to know what makes us happy. So, Jesse, you
could be the judge and jury. I'm gonna end this
segment with you. Am I or Am I not eccentric?

Speaker 4 (19:40):
I think you are. I think you're an interesting guy.
I think I've never I will never meet anybody in
my life quite like you. You are a little weird. Yeah,
you are a little weird. Good ways, bad ways. I
would love for somebody to call in or somebody write
in and say, Jesse, you're totally off. Your dad's just
like everybody else. Really, I don't think, but I think

(20:01):
it's a great thing, and I think you should wear
it as a badge of honor. And I'm proud that
you're eccentric.

Speaker 3 (20:07):
Well, thank you for that. All right, that's where we are, guys.
Remember silence is golden, and maybe no response is a
response Back in a minute.

Speaker 5 (20:19):
Always in Fashion.

Speaker 3 (20:21):
Spent a lifetime of my career building the Van usen Brand,
and I am so pleased that they're back with us
now talking about suits. Men were dressing up again, and
it's become cool to wear a suit. Suits can be
worn on multiple occasions in multiple ways. You could wear
a suit formally to go out at night or to

(20:41):
an event, wear a suit to the office with or
without a tie. If you look closely, now fashion trends,
suits are being worn with turtlenecks or mark next. The
choices are endless and every one of them looks right.

Speaker 2 (20:56):
You could really really look the part.

Speaker 3 (20:58):
I believe thatckaging yourself this is important, does the products
you package and wearing a suit is one of those
things that make men look their best. Venuesing invented a
new idea. It's called the cool flex suit. It's been
engineered with stretch technology, giving you the most comfortable fit
and mobility. It's wrinkle resistant fabric, it's cool moisture wiki.

(21:21):
It makes it perfect for all occasions. As we discussed
just now, this new style of looking sharp while feeling
cool and comfortable is amazing and I'm so excited that
the ven Using company is involved in this new technology
and is embracing the whole idea of dressing up. Let's
not forget Venues and Maine, it's the name with dress shirts.

(21:42):
It's only proper that the suit business follows strongly in
its way. You can find vanues in cool Flex men's
stretch suits at jcpenny are online at jcpenny dot com.

Speaker 2 (21:54):
Guys, they're great. You should go look at them.

Speaker 3 (21:57):
Done A Karen began a career is one of the funest,
most successful, powerful women in the fashion industry. She developed
a collection aimed at the luxury market for women on
the go, women who were powerful in their workplace, women
who had lives that extended beyond the workplace, and her
clothes went from day and tonight. An extraordinary collection. But

(22:20):
the interesting thing Donna Karen had a young daughter, and
she had friends and they couldn't afford to buy the
Donna Karon collection, and Donna invented dk NY Donna Aaron,
New York. It's an offshoot of the Donna Karen collection.
The same concept a lifestyle brand. Now we talk about
lifestyle brands, what does that really mean? Simply what they say,
there are brands that follow you throughout your lifestyle. You

(22:43):
get up in the morning, you start to get dressed.
Donna Karen decan why as intimate apparel, as hosiery, as
all those products you're getting dressed for work? You get
accessorized shoes, handbags, and it takes you through the day.
The remarkable thing about DK and Y clothes for work,
they work.

Speaker 2 (22:58):
Into the evening.

Speaker 3 (23:00):
The dresses, the suits, the pants, the sweaters, the blouses,
extraordinary clothes at affordable prices that go from day in tonight.
Part of your lifestyle is active. You have weekends, you
have events, you participate in sports. Donna Karen's casual clothes
did that under the DK and Y label. A vast

(23:20):
array of casual sportswear that make women look great as
they navigate their busy lives. Whether you're going to soccer
games for your children, or whether you're going out to
the movies, whatever you want to do, DK and Y jeans,
DK and Y sportswear is there for you. That's what
a lifestyle brand is. And I need to mention DKY

(23:43):
active Wear, which is extraordinary, the leggings, the sports bras,
the sweats. You can wear DKY active Wear, certainly in
the gym, certainly when you're working out at home, and
certainly if you want on the street, because it's that
well done. The quality DK why is nothing short of exceptional,
And why shouldn't it be Because it was born from

(24:05):
the idea of luxury made affordable for women of America.
DK and Why a true lifestyle brand that takes you
from day and tonight, from the week into the weekend.
DCN why you can find DCNY and Macy's DKY dot com.

Speaker 1 (24:24):
Welcome back to it Always in fashion. Here's your host,
Mark Webber.

Speaker 3 (24:29):
We had a beautiful day this week. I said it
that way, a beautiful day. We've been struggling with the
weather for a long time now. We had a relatively
easy winter, but man, oh man, spring has been so disappointment.
And the other day it was beautiful and I ended
up sitting at a restaurant for breakfast outdoors, holding court,

(24:50):
looking around and being happy about the weather changing. Maybe
started thinking about summer things, certain things that try me crazy.
I've often said to you that I don't mind spending money,
but I hate wasting it. I had a period where
McDonald's diet cokes or a dollar nine, no matter what

(25:13):
size you brought, and I'd give the person at the
window the drive and a dollar ten and she wouldn't
give me my penny back. I'd look on her, say
you owe me a penny, and she'd say, do you
want it? I said, why wouldn't I want it? Why
would I give it to you? She has to call
over a manager for approval to open the register, and
she's pissed at me. But what do I care. It's
my dollar, my penny. The same woman I come the

(25:35):
next day. He goes, oh, it's you again. I said, oh, yeah,
it is. I have a question for you. If I
would give you a dollar eight, would you take it?
She said maybe, I said, because it's me, She said maybe.
I'm laughing at my said no, really, would you take
a dollar eight? She says, I might, but it's a
dollar nine, so why should I give you my penny?
What got me thinking about this? I'm sitting out at

(25:57):
an outdoor cafe having breakfast. I ordered a bagel, dry bagel,
and I ordered a diet coke. I'm trying them every
once in a while again, and I said a lot
of ice and what have you? And she served me
die coke the ice litle bottle and poured it in
went away, and I was scooping out my bagel and

(26:18):
drinking my diet coke. I hadn't had one in a
real long time, ever since I found out they can
kill you. So anyway, while I'm eating and looking around,
the waiter comes by and tops off my glass. Now,
let me tell you something. If there's one thing in
this life I hate more than anything as a waiter
or waitress topping off my glass. You see, there is

(26:41):
a sacred relationship between ice and liquid. Now you think
about it. When you get ice in a drink, is
it to make it lukewarm or is it to make
it cold? And in my view, the more ice or
the ice must be always above the liquid. To have

(27:01):
something that's really cold, you never order I'd like a
lukewarm diet coke, or lukewarm iced tea, or lukewarm soda
club soda. No, she topped it off, and it started
me thinking about summer thing. I will tell you the
best diet cokes in the world are at McDonald's, only

(27:22):
followed closely by the cheesecake factory. So those of you,
when you listen to me and think I'm a snob,
i am not. I'm a man of the people. But
here I am having breakfast, sitting out at the cafe
looking at people going by. Now you might wonder where
am I going with this? Well, you'll see in a minute,
because I've always said packaging yourself is important as the

(27:43):
products you package. And I'm watching now before I go there,
before I'm at this breakfast. The other night, I'm in
my favorite restaurant having dinner. The weather was beautiful that day.
I noticed in a booth next to where I'm sitting,
there's a young guy, good look guy and his parents
and they're talking and I'm just looking and I look

(28:04):
down and I see he's wearing shorts. I'll come back
to that. And he's wearing flip flops. And I said
to myself, I want to throw up. If there's one
thing in this world I don't want to see. I
told you what I don't want waiters to what I
don't want to see in the summer. I don't want
to see your feet. I'm not interested in you in
flip flops. I'm looking at this guy and say, what
a schmuck. Why do you think you're saying? What's this

(28:26):
statement you're making now? All of you who wear shorts
and all of you wear flip flops, all of you
who are saying I don't know what I'm talking about.
All you're saying I'm an idiot.

Speaker 2 (28:35):
I'm not.

Speaker 3 (28:36):
It is not your best look. Your feet aren't nice.
I don't want to see your legs. Nobody cares about it.
Half of you aren't tan. Even if you are, you
have ankle spots. I don't want to see it. It
drives me crazy. So here I am now sitting at
this cafe and the guy walks by, and he's wearing
shorts and flip flops. In the back of his feet

(28:57):
are cut like women who wear these tight shoes. I
have to have bandages. And again I want to throw up.
And I'm watching, and I'm watching all these people walk by. Guys,
unless you're Brad Pitt, don't wear shorts. You don't look
good in them. It ain't your best look. But they
don't keep you cool. Shorts do not keep you cool.

(29:18):
You want to go and understand where we are. Let's
look at our friends in the Arabia. They wear those gowns,
they wear those things. They cover their head, they cover
the whole body because it keeps them cool. They're in
the middle of the desert. They must know something we don't.
I go out on the golf course, I see these guys.
They're wearing the shorts with the lotion on their legs.
The hottest can be. I'm wearing long pants and I'm

(29:40):
not hot, so it doesn't make you cool, and it
certainly doesn't make you look good. So I don't know
what you're thinking about. In fact, when I watch these
people walking pie, I'm sitting there and saying, you know what,
I should have made up T shirts for all these
people walking by and selling them, and on the T
shirts print I own this T shirt. I'm a schmuck.

(30:04):
I'm wearing shorts of flip flops. I can make a
fortune because you all look like schmucks. My favorite story
of all, favorite story of all is I'm in Spain.
Not only am in Spain, It's Sunday. I have the
day off. I'm gonna be by myself and I'm going
to see chiz sechs is in like the riviera of Spain,

(30:26):
and I figure I'm gonna go to sea chairs and
hang out on the beach, spend the day looking at
everybody going by, hang out, get a tan, go in
the water.

Speaker 2 (30:35):
Whatever.

Speaker 3 (30:36):
I get a call the night before Saturday night. Hey
market's John. Who's John, my big boss?

Speaker 2 (30:43):
Hey John? What's up? He says?

Speaker 3 (30:44):
I got a surprise for you, said, Okay, what's up?
He says, I'm going to meet you tomorrow on Sea Chaz.
So my heart drops out here. I am he's meeting me?
I was, yeah, and I have three other people with me.
So great, Hey, John, Gret, what are we doing. Well,
I'll take the train with you and we'll go to
Sea Chairs. We'll have some lunch. We'll go to the beach. Now,

(31:06):
I am not a breakfast to lunch guy. When a
beach is staring in front of me, I want to
get out there. If anything, I'll have a drink. I'll
bring it to the beach on life. So you get
to Sea Chairs, me and four other people and John
the boss, and John says to me, all right, let's
all have lunch.

Speaker 2 (31:20):
Now.

Speaker 3 (31:21):
Why does he want to have lunch? Because he's an
experienced guy. He wants the experience of sitting on the
Spanish Riviera, eating outdoors, looking out at the sand, looking
out at the ocean, drinking abouttle wine, getting s faced
a little drunk. He's always drinking. He had a bad
drinking problem. He wants to be drunk looking out at
the beach. And I say, we get there, right, We

(31:43):
all go towards the rest and I say, listen, guys,
I'm going to go to the beach. I'll see you
when you're done. And he looks at me. He says,
you're not going to the beach. I said, I beg
your pardon. He said, we're all having lunch. I said,
but I don't want to have a lunch. He said, Mark,
you're having lunch. I said, I'm not having lunch. And
he looks at me and he says, if you don't
have lunch with us, you don't work for the company anymore.

(32:05):
You believe this. And I'm saying to myself, f me, Now,
why am I telling you the story in the middle
of all this. Why because John is wearing shorts and
a Hawaiian shirt and sandals with black socks. You want
to talk about a schmuck or a nerd, that's what
he looks like. And he forced me and everybody else
to sit there and have lunch for two hours while

(32:26):
he got drunk on wine. I sipped a little. I
must admit it was good Spanish wine, very good. But
here's the way the story gets interesting, and it's about
human nature. After two hours of this, we watched him
stumble across the beach. He puts two towels down on
the floor, lies down face first, passes out in the sun.

Speaker 2 (32:45):
I let him bake. I let him bake.

Speaker 3 (32:50):
So he had that tan on his legs from the
top of his black socks to the shorts and he
was in pain. The point is, you want to be
a schmuck, do it by yourself. Don't make me part
into it. And John, if you would have made no
response rather than a response, this would have been fine.
Sometimes you have to let people do what they want
to do. Have another story to tell you. It has

(33:10):
to do with business and shoes. Actually, back in the day,
I was senior vice president of sportswear for van Usen
and I had a great life at that time because
the corporate vision was still in the twelve ninety sixth Avenue,
the corporate headquarters, and we had just bought the Izard Company,
and my job was to run Izard and the rest
of the sports were companies and were a separate off

(33:31):
site building. It was the coolest place in the world.
It was like animal house. I was the senior most executive.
We all pumped, We're all excited. We loved the brand.
We loved the turnaround that needed to take place. We
loved the responsibility, and nobody was there to tell us
what to do. We had a great time. It was nuts.
I was more like one of those crazy guys in

(33:51):
Animal House than a corporate executive.

Speaker 2 (33:53):
At the time.

Speaker 3 (33:53):
This was our building. We were winning, we were rocking,
we were making money. We're doing everything corporation, having a
great time. I get a call one day by my
boss at the time. He says, Mark, his assistant. Her
name was Lucien Watt. Why do I remember everyone's name?

Speaker 2 (34:08):
I don't know.

Speaker 3 (34:08):
Lucien gets on the phone, Mark, you have to come
up to the building at ten o'clock. We're having a meeting.
I said, but I'm down here. Says we need you
up here.

Speaker 2 (34:16):
So I go there.

Speaker 3 (34:17):
I get there at ten o'clock that day and I
walk into the boardroom and everybody in the boardroom is depressed.
And I walk and I look at them all and said,
you know, i'd tell you you'll look depressed, but I'll
tell you what, every time I'm here, you.

Speaker 2 (34:30):
All look like this. Get a life.

Speaker 3 (34:32):
And my boss says to me, he says, Mark, shut
the f up and sit down. I look at him
and said, why, what's going on?

Speaker 2 (34:38):
He said, sit down?

Speaker 3 (34:40):
So I sit down and he looks around the room
and he says, look, Mark, we have a problem with
our shoe company. At the time, we own Ghpas shoes.
Great Shoes are still a great company. My title sponsored
G three owned Spare shoes. They're doing great. But at
this point in time, he starts to say, we had
a plan to make fifteen million dollars this year in

(35:02):
gh Bath and it looks like we may lose ten.
So what says there's a lot of problems and messed up.
We're in trouble. So I'm looking around the groom. I said, okay,
now I'm glad I'm here. You want my opinion, He said,
that's why we brought you here. This is here's what
we should do. We should all be on a plane
Monday morning, go to Portland, Maine, check into the Marriotta

(35:26):
Hotel next to the Bass office in Portland, Maine, and
not leave until we fix what's wrong. He said, that's
exactly what you're gonna do.

Speaker 2 (35:34):
Mark.

Speaker 3 (35:35):
He starts to look at me and laugh. I said,
what he says, that's what you're gonna do. I'm gonna
go to Maine by myself. No, You're going to go
to Maine to help Michael. Michael is another guy in
the company that we're gonna name him temporary CEO of
the company, and I was going to go to help him.
I said, what does he need be for? We need
your mark. We want you to look at the product.
We want you to look at them the marketing. We

(35:56):
want you to help Michael get this place on track
again to building. Michael's a great financial eye, a good
operations guy. We know what you could do. We need
you to help him. So I'm going to report to him.
So I everybody, I'll be back in a minute. Takes
me into his office. He points his figure into his
face and he said, I told you you're going to
be the president of this corporation in a couple of months,

(36:17):
and I told you to behave, So just behave. Do
what I need the board needs us do it. I said, okay,
So I end up going to Maine. Get on the
plane Monday morning, I meet Michael and Maine he's in
the office.

Speaker 2 (36:28):
I have a cubby hole. Anyway, I'm there to help him, and.

Speaker 3 (36:31):
We start out and he said, look, why don't you
take a look at what they're doing. If you ask
me what's selling, I can tell you pretty much. Nothing selling.
We have a problem. We need to go in and
look at it. So I go in and I meet
with the management team and shoes first, that's where the
big opportunity always has, best shoes, best footwear. I meet
with the women's group and I look at all the

(36:53):
shoes there, and nothing's exciting me. You know, women's shoes.
I've never worn them, of course, but I could appreciate them.

Speaker 2 (37:00):
You know. I found out when I.

Speaker 3 (37:01):
Was in the Goodman's business at decan Y that you're
allowed to use the word sexy, you're allowed to use
the word hot. They all do it. That's what they're
trying to create. So I didn't know that. Then in
Bass I was Camfitable and I said, and I looked
at them, and I said, these are not what's really
happening in women's shoes. How do you know, Mark, I said,
I look at women, don't you Everybody looks at everybody.

(37:23):
I look at the man, I look at women. This
is not happening these shoes. There's too many penny loaf
as women are wearing Penny Loaves. They're wearing those pumps
that make clock every time you wear They were cold Well,
I don't want to say what they were called, but
they were all wearing these pumps and I said, you
have none of them. They say to me, that's not Bath.
I said to them, how could this possibly be? Every

(37:44):
woman in the world is wearing this trend and you're
telling me not Bath. Can't there be a version of
it that's not Bath? So I left the women's team
to themselves and I said, woodheads. And but before I left,
and I said, you know, if I put a slogan
on the Bath, this women's footwear line, you know what
I give it bass shoes for women who don't shave

(38:05):
their legs.

Speaker 2 (38:06):
I walked out.

Speaker 3 (38:07):
I don't know how many people were pissed at Babe.
I walked out. I walked into the men's group. Same thing.
All Penny Loaf was all tired, and at the time,
Kenneth Coal was hot as a pistol. I don't know
where Kenneth Cole is right now, but when Kenneth Cold
was Kenneth Coal, his shoes were on fire. What they
did is they took modern black shoes and made them

(38:30):
wearable for at night with your sports. You go on
a night black pants, black shoes. They were great shoes.
They were dress shoes, but they had more style than
anyone else's. And if you wore them in the day
with a black out for the jeans, they looked great.
Kenneth Cole owned the look. The only other person of
any consequence was I forgot. They were called don't hold
me to it. But there was no industrial looking boots,
and everyone was wearing them, and I looked, wear are

(38:52):
your boots that's not for us? Wear your black shoes
not for us? Were bess And I looked at them
and I said, listen, I'm watching it listening. Do you
do you want to be the last company making buggy
whips for horse and chariots.

Speaker 2 (39:07):
You can't just stick.

Speaker 3 (39:08):
You gotta find a way to do this on your own.
But I failed miserably. But before I left, I said,
we're gonna have another meeting later. I went back to
them later and said, here's what we're gonna do. You're
gonna do what you wanna do, and I'm gonna do
what I want to do, and we're gonna put it together.
There's a scene In the movie Days of Thunder, Robert
Duval is the engineer. He builds the race cars. Tom

(39:30):
Cruise drives him. He just becomes a race car driver
and they can't win. And every time they race, they
can't or practice, they can't get to finish the race
because they wear out the tires. Robert Duval says to
him at one point, he's advised, you gotta talk to
him like an equal, don't talk down to him. He says,
I'll tell you what I'd like to do. Why don't
we do this first, We'll run the race. You race

(39:52):
any way you want. We're gonna have the same tires
you race. Tom Cruise comes back to tires oral run,
he can't race his speed. Robert Davals says, now, now
I'm going to work with you while you're racing. Tell
you when to make the turns, how to do there.
It comes back Robert de Vell's tires are perfect condition,
and he pats the tires and he goes your way,
my way. I did that with the best people. Listen,

(40:12):
you have your idea, I have mine. We're going to
work together. Here's what we're going to do. I want you
to create five rows of shoes for men. The first
row is going to be the most avant garde black
shoes you're gonna I'll do Kenneth Cole in modernization of
men's shoes. Well, the second row is going to be
moderated to look like Kenneth Cole, but with your style,

(40:33):
but they're also black. The third row is going to
be bass. Let me see what you think if Bess
was in the dress shoe business, what it would look like.
And of course the next few rows will be your
traditional bass shoes, but you'll do them in black Norwegians
the Penny loves whatever. I left them and went out,
and I said, I'll be back in a week. I

(40:55):
want to see this, even if you have to go
out and buy storebus shoes, go buy shoes from Italy. Go.
I want to see what those rows will look like,
and I want the line to be crafted that way.
So I go back to the head of design in
womenswear and I said, where are you next week?

Speaker 2 (41:10):
I said Monday. I'm in New York.

Speaker 3 (41:11):
I said, I'm going to be in our offices two
hundred Madison Avenue on Monday. I need you to come
see me. This is why I said, I want to
talk to you about fashion. He says, okay, I'll see
you Monday morning. What time you want me? I want
you eleven o'clock. Comes by eleven o'clock. I said, hey, Soal,
I'm glad you're here. We're going on a road trip.
Where are we going? I said, First, I want to
tell you what.

Speaker 2 (41:31):
We're going to do.

Speaker 3 (41:32):
I need you to get a pen and paper. I said, okay,
what I need for? I said, we're going to make
some notes. You know how you count one to five
and then you put a slash through it. You know,
you know stick lines, You do one, two, three, four
and put a slash through five. We're going to keep count.
We're going on a road trip. Crick, where are we going?
Come with me. I get in the elevator with him again.

(41:52):
He says, where were going on a road trip? He
said to the corner, He liokten, what do you mean?
I said, here's what we're going to do. Get out
of the building on the corner. I said, you and
I got to stand there. You have your pen and paper.
I'm going to ask you to be the scribed. I said,
we're gonna watch the women walk by now and here's
what we're gonna do. Every woman who comes by with

(42:13):
those sexy shoes that are opening the back and are
flopping every time she walks, we're gonna put a stick mark,
and we're gonna count how many of them there are.
And I'm gonna keep count of all the women wearing
penny loafers and the shoes that you don't need to
shave your legs for. He says, you're kidding me. You
called me here for that. I said, yeah, I'm gonna
make a point to you. So we're standing on the
corner and all the women are clacking, clacking, clacking, clacking.

(42:37):
Everyone's wearing stylish shoes. Everyone's wearing these sexy shoes, every
one of the women are wearing, and there's nobody wearing
penny loavers. The end of I don't know a half hour,
there's fifty of those checkmoks on his page and two
on mine. I said, I want to make a point
to you. It's too easy to say no, the world
is changing. You've got one of the world's great brands.

(42:58):
Bess put the shoes on. Admiral Birdwin navigated the North Pole.
Charles Lindbergh wore best boots when he flew the planes.
We have his history, and you're telling me you can't
be bess. We have to take on women's shoes, modernized
and make them current, make them exciting, but do it
in the best way. You have a special label, you
have a special stitching, you have a special technique, you

(43:20):
have a certain kind of leather. I'm not a post
any of that, but I want to make shoes for
women that are current and trendy. Fast forward a week later,
I came back and saw the men's I was out
I was outraged. How great it was when you gave
people directions and told them this is what you do,
and I had the authority to make them do it.
There was no question that they were there and I

(43:41):
was the boss. There's no question. The CEO, Michael gave
me his authority to do what needed to be done
to get this and they had him and they over
delivered on what we saw. A week later, the women's
team came back with flip flop shoes. Women wear shoes, clocking.
The women are wearing nich shoes, were shaving their legs.
These were looking great. This was a great thing, and

(44:03):
everybody got energized everyone got excited. Everyone got on board
to revitalize the besque company that wasn't making money into
a winning company again. And it wasn't all that hard.
It was the wisdom to do what's right, be current
for the one thing we know about this industry detail
luxury fashion. It changes, you have to change. Six months later,

(44:29):
we call a meeting Saturday night for all the executives
in BASS and the senior most executives in the company,
including the board of directors, if they can come with
their spouses. We had six hundred people in a ballroom
in Portland, Maine, come to see the presentation of a
new basque company and it was extraordinary. We had photography

(44:49):
the show with the advertising we look, We had the shoes,
We had them on tables, we had pictures of them
that would blow them up on the screen. Everything was
laid out. Men at work with the fashion shoes, men
women at work with the fashion shoes for women. Each
one the industrial have boots and everyone had a bass flare.
And it was one of the most exciting nights for

(45:11):
me in my career. Not because we were successful in
creating energy, not because I was the host of the
evening and I did a lot of the talking, but
during the presentation, the CEO of the company, my friend
handed me a piece of paper. He always wrote in
reading and honored written in reading. He wrote, while I'm

(45:34):
on the stage, this is your finest hour. I've never
been more proud of you. You gave credit to everyone else,
and the only person you didn't mention was yourself, and
because of that the credit goes to you. Thank you, BJK,

(45:55):
great night, great story. I didn't have anything to say.
I was speechless, and probably that was best, because sometimes
no response is the best response. Take a break back
in a minute.

Speaker 2 (46:08):
Always in fashion.

Speaker 3 (46:10):
Donna Karen began her career as one of the finest,
most successful, powerful women in the fashion industry. She developed
a collection aimed at the luxury market for women on
the go, women who were powerful in their workplace, women
who had lives that extended beyond the workplace, and her
clothes went from day and to night. An extraordinary collection.

(46:33):
But the interesting thing Donna Karen had a young daughter,
and she had friends, and they couldn't afford to buy
the Donna Karen collection, and Donna invented DKNY. Donna Aaron,
New York. It's an offshoot of the Donna Karen collection.
The same concept a lifestyle brand. Now we talk about
lifestyle brands, what does that really mean? Simply what they say,
there are brands that follow you throughout your lifestyle. You

(46:56):
get up in the morning, you start to get dressed
Donna Karen decan why as in mid apparel, as hosiery,
as all those products. You're getting dressed for work. You
get accessorized shoes, handbags, and it takes you through the day.
The remarkable thing about DK and Y clothes for work,
they work into the evening. The dresses, the suits, the pants,
the sweaters, the blouses, extraordinary clothes at affordable prices that

(47:21):
go from day in tonight. Part of your lifestyle is active.
You have weekends, you have events, you participate in sports.
Donna Karen's casual clothes did that under the DK and
Y label. A vast array of casual sportswear that make
women look great as they navigate their busy lives. Whether
you're going to soccer games for your children, or whether

(47:44):
you're going out to the movies, whatever you want to do,
dkn Y Jeans, dc Y sportswear is there for you.
That's what a lifestyle brand is. I need to mention
DKY active Wear, which is extraordinary, the leggings, the sports bras,
the sweats. You can wear DKY activewear certainly in the gym,

(48:06):
certainly when you're working out at home, and certainly if
you want on the street, because it's that well done.
The quality of DKY is nothing short of exceptional. And
why shouldn't it be because it was born from the
idea of luxury made affordable for women of America. DK
and why a true lifestyle brand that takes you from

(48:27):
day and tonight, from the week into the weekend DCN.
Why you can find DCNY and Macy's DKY dot com.
As one of the world's most celebrated fashion designers, car
Lagafeld was renowned for his aspirational and cutting edge approach
to style. His unique vision of Parisian shit comes to
America through car Lagefeld Paris. He has women's collections, men's collections,

(48:52):
ready to wear, accessory, shoes and bags. The fashion house
Carlagafeld also offers a range of watches, eyewear, and premium fragrances.
You can explore the Carlagofil collection at carlagofelpowers dot com.
But it's more than that. I for one, love to shop.
I love going around and seeing what's happening and what
catches my attention, what would make me feel good to

(49:14):
wear now. I don't wear the women's wear obviously, but
I can appreciate it, and they look amazing. If you
want to look right, you want to have clothes that
fits you well. You want to look like you're wearing
something that's very expensive, that's exclusive for you and yours.
You can find it at very affordable prices at Macy's
orcarlagofel dot com. Paris, the women's ready to wear fashion

(49:37):
is extraordinary, as well as the handbigs and the shoes.
I for one, wear men's clothes unlike my appreciation of
women's clothes. I'm a modern guy. I want to look current.
I want to look the way I want to feel.
I go out at night, I'm in black and carlagofel
is My buddy calls are great. They fit great, and
they have little tweaks and touches, whether it's a stripe

(49:59):
on the sleeve or button that the neck or on
the shoulder. There's a lot of details that go into
Carl Lagafel because he's always been He always had been
one of the world's great designers, and this legacy and
goes on and on. I can't speak enough about it
except to say to you, you want to feel good
about yourself. You want to know that you're dressing properly.
You want to clothes that fits you well. Carl Lagafeld

(50:21):
Paris at Macy's Orcarlagafel dot com.

Speaker 1 (50:25):
Welcome back to it Always in Fashion.

Speaker 2 (50:28):
Here's your host, Mark Webber.

Speaker 3 (50:30):
I've been thinking about character. I've been thinking about the
night's show. Is no response is a response. Someone comes
to me and answer your question. I don't feel like answering.
That tells a big signal. Sometimes somebody asks you to
do something, taking a moment to think about it, or
pregnant pores is a big deal. Sometimes coming to you
and saying I need an answer right now, and you

(50:53):
say to someone the answer is if you need it
right now. No, I deserve the right to think. I
deserve the right to make decisions in my own time,
my own pace. So I've been thinking a lot about
the response to questions answers, because no response is a response.
But I've been thinking about character. I was accused of
being an eccentric, for which I was always proud to

(51:15):
be different, and every one of us is different. We're
all allowed to be ourselves. We're allowed to think the
way we want to think, dressed the way we want
to think, speak the way they want to think. The
common bond is you have to know who you are
and know who you are. You have to be responsible
to yourself, because the theme of this show has always been,
and it will always be, packaging yourself is as important

(51:38):
as the products you package, and therefore, knowing who you
are and what you're doing and caring about who you are.
There's ways to say things, there's ways not to say things.
You're entitled to your own counsel. I've often thought, what
is character? People challenge the way I behave. I know
I feel good about myself. I know I do the

(51:59):
right thing. I know what honesty. It's doing the right
thing when no one's looking. I know about integrity. I've
wrote about it in my book Pearls of Wisdom. You
ever want to know about integrity, read that chapter and
always in fashion of the book. That is a backdrop
Tonight's show. No Response is a response, So, if you

(52:20):
want to ask me what I think about the show,
good night,