ENCORE PRESENTATION: A search for Meaning & Purpose with Myran Denham Porter

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Episode Transcript

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The following is a paid podcast.iHeartRadio's hosting of this podcast constitutes neither an
endorsement of the products offered or theideas expressed. Welcome to Becoming the Journey.
This show will be a series ofconversations that will inspire listeners along their
life's journey. This show's mission isto cultivate a community of mentorship by sharing

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our experiences in our life's journey.Nobody's journey is a straight line, so
no matter where you are in yours, this show is for you. Meet
Grace Loverrae. Welcome listeners. Thisis Becoming the Journey, becoming as you
well know as a shelf conversations aboutexperiences and knowledge that can inform you or

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be that Aha moment while you arestruggling. You can message us on Instagram
at Becoming the Journey and share withus how many guests resonated with you.
My guest today is Myrna Denham Porter. Rna is the author of The Blue
House. She is number six ofa family of sixteen lived on a farm

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at the edge of the Canadian Prairie, which is an isolated area of Saskatchewan.
Her family barely scraped by at theage of fourteen, Myrna left Saskatchewan
to begin a journey of purpose.After working several years as a flight attendant

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until she married and after her boysbegan to attend school, she obtained a
nursing degree and later a master's inclinical social work. After about with cancer,
she co founded Wellness Place. Sheis a mentor and supporter of the
care k a r E Program atPalm Desert Charter Middle School and an advocate

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for Errupe College. Welcome, mRNA, Well, thank you, God be
with you. I have to tellyou I'm so impressed with I don't know
if this book is impressed me morethat you came from poverty and a dysfunctional

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situation from home as much as itdid that created this hope and this purpose
and wisdom that you would get throughoutthe whole book. So the first question
I'm going to ask you is forour listeners, why the blue House?

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Why did you call it the blueHouse? Well, that's a very good
question. I more most important readthe doys that I've found outdoors in the
next of the Canadian prairie. Theskies were extremely blue in Canada, extremely
blue, and I always I'm enjoyingthat the foremost blue and the mood within

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the house was blue. So wethought that that would be a great title,
and that's fantastic. But don't letanybody think that the Blue House was
this wonderful. Inside that blue house, it was two bedrooms. Am I
correct? Pretty much? Pretty much? Jeder very cold area tal Chelan,

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which catche And by the way,I pardon me, I'm out in California,
where I have a little bit ofbalacy, so my voice is not
totally perfect. But I left homewhen I was fourteen because there was no
high school to go to in thosedays. So I went to town one

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hundred miles away, one hundred milesaway and worked with a nanny for three
years. And then my aunt camefrom the United States, and in my
last year of high school, well, I was going into my last year
house and said, I think youbetter come to the United States than I'm
with me. So I came tothe United States when I was seventeen.

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But I left my home where Igrew up at fourteen. So when you
left it fourteen until you moved tothe US at the age of seventeen,
where did you live at a youngage? Well, it was very interesting
process. And I always always feel, regardless how what you spirital orientation is,

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and that there was a higher poweror a god an icon itic on
looking out for me, because there'swere so many situations where I think and
I just I wouldn say my motherput me at risk of a little daughter.
I basically I can get to atown of one hundred one hundred miles

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away with fourteen hundred people there thathad a good high school. Now I
intended to live with my grandmother,which I wasn't looking forward to. But
I got a call from a registerhearst in the town and in saidn't,
I'm a registered nurse. I willwork full time. I have four children

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under four, and I been usedsome helps. Would you consider talking to
me about living with us while yougo to high school? And so I
lived and I was their nanny andwith them and their nanny, and I
was through nanny for three years,and to me that step up, I

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enjoyed it. I knew how tocook, I knew how to clean,
I knew how to take care ofchildren because I was the sixth of sixteen
children and I was the mother basicallyin my family of origin when I was
six, So but you were stillin Canada. Yes, I was the
first three years of high school Iwas in Canada then. To be honest

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with you and frank with you,and to be honest with myself, the
high schools are very difficult in Canada, and I did not have the background,
and I knew that if I stayedto finish my high school, I
might thought make it also, Andall I could think of was living in
a dusty little town and working inthe dying store for the rest of my

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life. So I was fortunate.I came to the US. I stayed
with my aunt. I finished mylast year of high school and it was
very simple, and got my diplomaand integrated into the school at school of
two thousand, where I never livedin a town larger than fourteen hundred,

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and later, at twenty one,became the United Flight attendant. So let's
go back a little bit. Whenyou just said that your mom encouraged you
to leave because of the schooling.But but weren't there other reasons? You
did not come from a family whereyour dad was a role not you know

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what great? No one is allgood nor all that. I don't believe
he had some good qualities, hehad some good values, but he would
not he was not. But let'sjust say bear the wrong and spoil a
child in that era with something thatPeithable complied with, I believe, And

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we had some difficulties and my personality, quite frankly with more independent, and
they used to call me Summer asa child, and I basically would not
put myself in that position. You'llbe physically harmed. Now some of my
other sisters did. Is that ananswer the catecuts for you, Ray,

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Yes, absolutely, because later onwe're going to talk a little bit about
when you get further into the book, your marriage to stew And and then
you know and how perhaps having adad good or bad. I'm sure he
had amazing qualities, and you mentionedthat in the book that he taught you

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values and responsibility, but how sometimesit's a pattern that you kind of follow
because you don't know anything else.So now you have to move to the
United States, you go to collegethe first in your family, I think,

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well, first, yeah, forsure, you know I did not
go to college. I didn't.I was fortunate the requirement benight didn't sixty
one. When I was hired butunited with two years into college and they
hired me anyway because I think theyunderstood good that the education my system was.

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The lip was quite different. Hedied. I did not go to
college until my youngest son. Well, I took a course or two,
but until my youngest son went tonursery school. And then I started curiously
going to the local college and Igot my r ND and then went to

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work great once a year. Itdidn't work within my family because I had
two little children and had to workshift. And then I went back to
my bachelor's to bring it and continuedwith my master's and went into private practice
schools train where I could call myown hours. But I didn't do that,
and my whole family was extremely supportiveof me. I have to say

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that my husband was more than support. He picked up the pieces for me.
In other words, on Saturday sometimesSundays, where I had to eat
papers, et cetera, and tookcare of the children. And what he
said to me and again, noone is perfect. And if you read
the book, he had his ownflock. And if you read the book,

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I mean here he told me methat I don't care if you both
call it in those days, mostwomen didn't you will call it uh during
my era when I go ahead towait a Hunt high school but huh,
he said, I don't care,but do you you need to do that?

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And it was the best thing thatever happened to me because it really
increased my self esteem. And hehad been a When I'm met at it
was a PhD's University of struggle,and so of course I was running into
not only and but women livena PhDsare getting their PhDs. Though I felt

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very badly about the fact that Ihad not even gone to college. Don't
they watched me and they became goodtoo in high school and in college.
I think, well, yes,sure, you said an example without a
doubt. But when you were whenyou were fourteen and you left, okay,
did you have this in mind?Is this something that you always wanted

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to achieve? Is someday go tocollege? Did you know you wanted to
be a nurse? Did you knowyou wanted to get into social work?
When when did you reach that?Well that moment, no, in no
grace. In that era, womenwere either registered nursists or they were teachers.

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In fact, I went to mymy husband grew up in Growth Pointiscant
and I went to a fiftyth reunion. Every woman in his class except one
was either a nurse I believe,I believe I'm correct here, or you
know, a teacher. So that'sthat's where we were. In that era.

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You could really didn't go into bedand I thought, I'm did.
Some became doctors, exceetter but verycute. Right. Well, just so
you know, it wasn't just thatera. I mean, I was the
first in my family and my extendedfamily, my cousins to to go to
college. And I didn't get intonursing and I didn't get into uh teaching.

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I am in the financial arena,although my my, uh, what
I really wanted to be was achild psychologist, but we won't get into
my issues. So so it wasn'tthat you always had this that, you
know, I want to be anurse, or when it was just a
path you chose because it won it. Well, my my thinking how the

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end was of course, of courselibert I were the woman that I was
a nanny for was the registered nurseand she worked full time. My sister,
my oldest sister, was the nurse. So those are the model,
I suppose that I followed and itwas a you know that that was the

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most difficult patient for me. Iwas found on a book club zoom and
they asked me members of the bookclub, what was the most difficult thing
on your journey towards socioeconomic a highersocioeconomic status or a medal? When the

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most difficult was to getting my educationalability up to up to the levels of
six feets And it was because gifts. You've read my book. We basically
in the community, five miles inschool in the winter, the weather would

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be sixty bo. My father wasnot educationally oriented, my mother was,
and we we at school so manydays. And this see that the teachers
were probably no more than correspondence teachers, if you know what I mean.
Look, even as psclade, Istopped and my little desk right up front,

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and I'm looky at this teacher,and I'm thinking, what if she
difficult? It's interesting. I thinksome of our you know, how we
respond to life, and I thinkthere's more and more letters you're coming out
on this. Our disposition, personalityare focus, it's inherited. If he

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seems to be more and more comingout on it, and some of it,
of course is environmental, and noone can never start that all fools.
I thought I hadn't think. Don'tyou think getting into that field and
then going for social work kind ofyou were prepared to be that someone that

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cared because in a family of sixteenchildren and then caring for three three villains,
didn't that kind of prepare you.I mean, maybe that was maybe
it's not inherited, maybe just itwas your path. Well, I think

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that a factor. I think I'mnot sure none about you, but I
will tell you that I offered aboutthis at this fate and for the south
twenty person years. In a way, I'm my sister if I think with

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him, I'm very caring, I'mvery supportive because I do kind of big
things for them, I doubt,but I'm not a person that is there
like many of the women I knowwho is constantly carrying, caring, caring
for others. And I believe inmy case, because I was a mother,

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is sick, I left home,I take care of you know,
three four chosen one to four andI really adore them, by the way,
but it maybe I've been a littlebeen a little bit of burn out
my ky Does that make sense?Yes, no, it absolutely does.

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But I still want to give youcredit for the calling that you had.
You know, being a nurse isnot an easy task, and and and
even social work. So well,it's interesting that my master's I sort of
breeze through without too much work.Well, I have a son that's an
m D. And he called meonce and probably if I would have been

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younger, I would have done that. I had to get through the anatomy,
did they all? Indeed, inall those courses, it's stuff working
in the hospital to become an ma m D. And the hard most
gift about parts immediately anatomy. That'sall of people, I think, all
individual students in the nursing from thoseof the hard course. Then once I

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got through those and ended up putstrade a's in them, it was a
real booster for me for myself wasseeing And then you know, from there
I managed to graduate with the fourpoint zero and by master high level,
and I doubled them. I thinkI got with cree or something. It

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wasn't it difficult Once I got myyouth up to speed a fifth that's just
say right, so you have let'sI'm going to say this delicately. You
are in the fourth quarter of yourlife, as soon as I have one
hundred years to live. Why atthis I don't feel it? No,

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and I didn't say it, did. I'm just saying that you know and
and which amazes me because you satdown and you wrote this book, your
Journey. I'm just going to askone simple question, and that is why.
Well, I think your audience mightbe interested in another thing also,

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which I find kind of fascinating.The book was public after I turned eighty.
I had the and my co writer, who pushed me to write this
doctor shut up and transcribed for me. He's what had been on a respirator

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one of the first cases of cold, the fifty four dates and recovered.
And it's one of my best friends. Out here here a man and he
is at the Care program, hasthe Care program, which I the port
And as he said, I've inone of his mentors, which I find
interesting because I'm so imprescious the man'sdid I get too off tracker? No,

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I I think what I'm getting outof that is you spoke with this
gentleman about your your journey, whichand let me remind my listeners you come
from poverty. You came from povertyin an extremely rural area of Canada.
You had just about the bare necessities. There's a part in your book where

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it says you slept in no sheetswith big bugs. For it could not
have been an easy journey for youto the age of thirteen. So and
again I will go back to foras good as a relationship you might have
had with your mom and dad,there were difficulties, and you know,

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those things probably have stayed with you. And we'll talk a little bit about
that going on. So and yeah, pardon me for a graphiking, but
I want you to aunt here thatquite Why did you like a little more?
Go ahead propriately. I tell youI have a five rankids. I'm

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proud of them. I'm hoping they'llbe great contributors to society, and I
think they will. I they're allcollege graduates, and I am a wonderful
relationship with them, and I amstill they have bought up with quite a
bit of wealth, and I wantedthem to understand that not all of us

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started that way, and that theythis is all they know them is quite
frankly, by allowed the tide ofplaints that their father have done so well,
you know, and I wanted themto know that not fits is not
that way for all people. Andthat was really my motivation for writing his

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book, simply for my grand Sheldonto know what life is. I think
value is getting Leanne and our familydidn't have money. We were extremely core.
No, we didn't have a lotof things. It's cathartic, honey,
right, it's cathartic. Mm hmm. Well, yet the book what

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bet so catholic as you might think, because I have I had seven sisters.
I have five sisters that I'm extremelyclose to. In fact, they
were just at my house for areunion and some of them were in Canada.
Only one lives in the US.And we have had our own therapy
group for the last thirty or fortyyears where we talked, talk, talk

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and acknowledged what went on within ourfamily. And let me tell you something,
I get to a therapist and asa person that is benefit from it.
It really is kind of important tonot keep everything inside but could connect
with the group that had fallen throughthe same experiences you have in life,

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whether the cancer. And that's whyI had started Cauncer Sports Center was with
my Hope co founder Annie Murphy,because we had no place to go when
we were fit fifty eight years oldand diagnosed with cancer and being told I
didn't I had a fifty to fiftychance to live, yet my husband once

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again was reported. I had supportivefriends. I lived in my community for
fifty forties fifty years. But theexperience being diagnosed with cancer, it's more
with the experience than being diagnosed withcancer. It was more helpful to be
with others that had experienced staff samesituation. I agree with you, it

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is It is definitely support mentorship andany anyone who has already experienced that.
I I too, am a survivor. By the way, boy, oh,
I kind of yes. I Andand when I was diagnosed, I
internalized a lot. Uh, Iguess I should not have. But then

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while I was going through radiation therapy, I met a girl who just struck
up a conversation and it was thefirst time talking to her about it because
she was going through the same thingthat I actually felt relief. So I
get that, I understand. Andthen there are times and you can correct

(24:38):
me if I'm wrong, because yoursupport group, your your close support group
or your sisters, and I don'tknow if they went through it, but
there are times where you you youhave a support group that are going through
it that maybe sometimes you get negativefib is that you just don't want to

(25:02):
hear at that time. I don'tknow if that makes sense. But again
again I apologize that I'm interrupting yourlife. I don't know you, you're
not at your show. Well,I didn't gain my support from my sister
or my count experience, my supportand talking through what we all, we

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all all the girls in our familywent through with our father was what where
I gained a lot of support andyou might even't say resolution to that difficult
part of my childhood, our childhood. None of my sisters there. I'm

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the oldest. My youngest sister's fifteenyears younger than I am. And then
and no, I struggled because thewhat not there were ten perversions, not
on top of the center, butstill an hour, hour and a half
away. And so that's why weraised the money and built a count the

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sports tender cloture, which is alsoa sense of purpose and an impact.
Yes, without a doubt and Rodento believe me, you know what it
would really, I can't coun't stressenough. It doesn't matter how old we
are, find a sense of purpose. I found so much purpose. I

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was digosed. I remember imf amessage by my mother in every cloud's still
for money, it's used to say, and yeammy. My co wounder came
to me and said she was consideringthis, and we went after it.

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And I would going through chemotherapies andradiation, and I was out there speaking
to raising money out with union aswe recovered. As I recovered with a
year or two ahead of me,But that was my purpose and with a
beautiful purpose. Ah. Then Ifounded my diagnosis. And to me,

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other people would feel different to me. Ah, that was thought and asked
me. I needed to be thereto help other and and I felt the
same way. I think it humbledme. Nobody wants to hear that six

(27:48):
lettered word. It did humble mea lot. And and that's how I
lived my life today, believing thatI should always be humbled and constantly doing
things that humble me even more becausethere are people that are worse oft than

(28:08):
me. But I find I don'tknow if I find that in a lot
of people. I mean, certainlypeople I am close to have the same
values as me. But do youfind being as having as much wisdom as

(28:30):
you have right now? I meanat your age and you did say your
age. Do you do you findthe younger generation has those same values?
Has that are humble? Are asgiving as or do you have to discover

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it? You find it? Discoverit? Do we all know that we
can do it? Or do wehave to experience before we can get that?
Why that? That's a tricky question. I think the loaded question.
It's a loaded question, and Ithink we do have to experience to appreciate

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where others are coming from so thatwe can be empowered to help them.
I do believe that, and doesn'tmatter what it is. It's very difficult
to understand another personal situation unless you'vebeen through it and experience the pains I'm
going through it. So have Iagain? Have I answered your question?

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Yes? And I think I amhoping that after experiencing COVID young people.
I mean, I don't know,the statistics does don't show it by young
people, you know, realize thatthey have experienced something devastating and that they
can get definitely do something better.Better about that? You're listening to Becoming

(30:04):
the Journey on WOR seven ten iHeartRadio. Let's continue my conversation with my
guest, Myrna Porter. These arefor you talked about your dad, Okay,
and I want to go back tothat because sure, but I'm conversation

(30:27):
we're having about the younger generation.Yes you can, I which can only
do what we can do, andwe can only be the role model.
And I belong to a bottle steadygroup and I always hey, the the
role model, the role model,and for my grandschold and I think for

(30:52):
other people, and that's the situation. I'm not so sure that this group
I'm here, I have grandchildren betweentwenties three or four to thirty, and
I'm hearing miither are different about adifferent direction they're taking. And I have

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hope, great hope with the traumathat Derek Barian, you know, being
alone during COVID et cetera, etcetera, will bring them to a different
level. And so I got tothem with mar marbles respond than my one

(31:37):
grand son who is twenty sixth aboutthe book, and I don't have that
and Sunday right now. But oneof his comments or about forgiven that's was
in the book. I spoke aboutit's better for you to forgive your your
soul is at peace if you're ableto forgive. And of course that's taking

(32:02):
me a life time to learn.With my father and he read the book
so honest he wrote about it,and he spoke about his need to forgive,
and he understood what it was saying, and he wrote about every aspect
of my book and with the touchingAnd really that's one of the reasons that

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I pointed out for the public thatI bought a influence the other a young
people his age. But also Igot some feedback from people my age who
felt dead learning things from the book. So I put it off guy never

(32:45):
too old to learn writing, Yeah, I'm actually gonna I'm actually going to
read a passage in your book whichreally touched me. And it goes to
what you're saying, what right now? And it says countless years ago,
I separated myself from the poverty,the torn floroplastic curtains, and the degradation

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and violence of the blue house.When I left my home for good,
I did not know that the scarsfrom a traumatized childhood would be with me
for many years, and that mysoul would only be healed after I learned
to forgive. I did not understandthat my choice to hold on to the
hurt, anger and blame I feltfor my father would affect my intimate relationships.

(33:35):
I did not know that my internalanger would be more damaging to me
than to him. It was transformative. When did that happen? I'm so
glad you brought that up. Andyou know, uh, some people may
not that, and I guess that'stheir choice. That on. Yeah,

(33:57):
uh yes, I did not becomea therapist. Of course two years after
that, and you know I wasprobably forty best time I got my graduate
degree, and that EVE an olderanyway, So I didn't know the truth
is but I went home actually whenI was thirty Hugh and by the way,

(34:22):
my HUD's bunny. I didn't wantto go home ever. And we
had two little children. I hadbeen married for seven years. My husband
had me not not my mothern father, and I that we're going we need
you it. We bought a neotletsand waggon no seat belts. It's played

(34:45):
in the back of the station wagon. We drove fifteen hundred miles and I
was. I know, I wasthirty two and it was out me.
It was a wedding or my parentsfiftieth anniversary Mandy, and my father asked
me to dance, and I dancedwith him, and I was gracious,

(35:09):
and he said, I'm so proudof you, and I said, I
said thank you. And in myhand I said, I could care a
lot. But you know at theend, at the end of the book,
no, no, no, theone the book gets told here by

(35:30):
me. At the end of thebook there said passage that my two grod
sons and my nephew from California forme good at the grave and beautiful to
catch one prairie with the blue skiesaboves. And my mother and father were

(35:52):
there. They were looking at theirgrave. And that's when I really thought
and then had a difficulty situation.He was smart, he was illiterate,
he was poor, that he wasattemptigably in our entrepreneurial and and so I

(36:13):
got that here I came to therealization that again and many times, that
people are not perfect, and hemade some mistake. I'm going to read
another passage to that. It says, in some strange ways, I I

(36:37):
did It's an amazing book and anda lot of it is impressed impressed me
because I am a firm believer thatwe awfuly are either the way we're raised
in spite of how we're raised,and it depends on how you look back.
And this one passage really got tome, and it says, in

(36:58):
some strange ways, you begin tofeel a deepening empathy towards your parents as
you wonder what their inner lives werelike in their final years. Were they
content with the course their lives hadtaken and with the outcome. Had bitterness
overtaken them as it does so manynear the end, or did they find
a sweetness of soul that can notonly make life bearable but bring a rich,

(37:22):
precious sense of life's fleeting quality.Isn't that that's sort of like a
self or But it's not your parentsdoing that. You're questioning it for yourself.
Correct, Okay, I'm not quitesure I understand. I'll take it

(37:43):
out again. You don't know theanswers to those questions as far as your
parents are concerned, but thinking ofthose questions and developing a sort of empathy
towards your parents knowing like you justsaid before where your dad came from,

(38:04):
you know, his struggles and whatnot. But thinking about how they might have
felt in the end, doesn't thatmake you start to question or shouldn't we
question what our role is right now? From now until the end? Oh?
Absolutely, I think we almost intoquestion what our role is. And

(38:29):
and really I've got and I'm notthe perfect child. I always say to
my children, I'm not not forpost child. I'm sort of like Meryl
straight after all, our children,he said, had one fight. After
all, I know they are not. He was announced that upon I'm dead,

(38:49):
there's a yeall at the world's greatestactresses. And after all, I'm
not so great. I have fourchildren to tell me I'm not great.
M hm exactly. But yeah,look, the last journey we're going to
take, okay, is the journeyto the grave side. And and I

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always, I always like to saythat it's it's that moment between that birth
and that death, which is thedash. You know when you when you
look at a gravestone, it saysthe date you were born, the date
you died with a dash. Itis that dash that is our lives and

(39:38):
is what we do with that dash? So so yes, we should constantly
question ourselves how important it was?Go ahead. I think at least a
couple of my friend uh addressed inthat the books for them made me a

(40:06):
question, just that, just thatthat they're thinking about what are they doing
with their lives? They're younger thanI am, but tangent in your but
what are they doing with their lives? What's the purpose? And how do
you the old look love? Howdo you forgiveness? And so in reality,

(40:27):
that's another reason I'm gone. Ihope I've influenced some people. Not
everyone's going to appreciate what I'm saying. I understand. Uh, but two,
let's do that look at your lifeare you? Are you living life
as as a good role model?And for me, that role model is

(40:51):
based on based on Christian values Ilearned in my childtold and we never went
to church because there weren't no churches. But mind have read of the bi
on it, but a very basicyou know, take care of riters.
Not that how do you can youhave values without having Christian values? Boy,

(41:17):
that's a good question, eh Ifrom me? No, I don't
know, I'd be interested in honit you. Well, certainly there's a
lot of people out there that ifthey've never read the value it but I
mean, bybone, but know whatthe value is. Or they're atheists or

(41:43):
they're agnostic, whatever it is,they don't believe in a god, they
don't believe in a higher power.But can they still be kind and have
values and be humbled? And andyou know, I just fact it's just
like, Okay, I don't thinkeveryone's it considers themselves and I always an

(42:07):
agnostics acknowledged it. I think they'revery different people. Uh h So yes,
yes, I would have to say, yeah, what not judge people
because they believe that they are notsisten? Uh? Yeah, know that
that is truly my hope. Iwill accept anyone's belief or non belief.

(42:32):
But just being a good kind personis probably what I believe is is what
it's all about. You talk alittle bit about letting go you you had
somewhat of a tumultuous or maybe Imaybe that's the wrong word. You can

(42:58):
you can change it for me withyour with your husband of many many years?
Was that a pattern fus the well? I'd love to addressive questions because
it may be of you strated people. Uh And I not as I said

(43:22):
earlier, no one and the recruitingyou and I ris no one is all
look and no one is all bad, and yes to coming throughout the here.
I didn't have a demostious relationship withKnight husband, but I was one

(43:45):
that I realized that need is setlimits because at my youngest son, and
am not proud. I'm proud ofthat. Yeah. He addressed me the
day after my husband died and said, why didn't Julie treated you poorly?
And he loved you? Now Inever forgot kat. I'm was the one

(44:07):
that had to set limits on thekind of actions that took place here and
there in my relationship and you,and where does that come from? I'm
certain that how you are with yourfather and your relationship with your father,

(44:34):
and again people are entitled to disagree, but from my perspective, you tend
to be attracted. Now, myhusband was never physically abusive, but de
verbally allusive, and you tend tobe attracted to that kind of person.
And in my view, I neededto stud limits on that and I struggled

(44:59):
with it. But I was thenineteen to seventies. I had to two
little children and I just came tofamily first, and and and he grew
older, he mellowed, and wedidn't have my family. And I did

(45:22):
have a confrontation with him, don'tdid your did your children witness that?
Though? You know, I eventalked to about them about it in the
book, and I just said theydidn't care that it was there. My
oldest son, by the way,was the one that really pushed for the
book. Huh and us they saidthey didn't care and quit. The reason

(45:45):
they didn't care is the because itwas all embarrassingly public to me, right
and that and that's that's my question, Like they did they witness the I
don't know how abuse and abuse bythe way, it comes in many different

(46:06):
ways, verbal, emotional, whatever, but did as they were growing up?
Correct? And he outed that didthey break the cycle? Because apparently
did they break that cycle? Ithot it appears at this point they've been

(46:28):
married for both of them. Theywere married to hear apart, and they're
married to thirty more years now.But it appears to me that they've done
pretty well. But at this point, I am quite sure under my they
don't tell me these things that theyhave to They had to have that was

(46:50):
their lullam up. It has tohave some issue in their marriage. They
just didn't stop doing that. Idon't. I don't know, but that
was the role model. So Idon't know. I can't answer that,
and maybe I don't even why answered. But at this point and their marriages,

(47:10):
it appears the things they're looking prettygood, okay, because I know
for a fact in many relationships goinggenerationally, that cycle never breaks. Oh
honey, I always have a sayingI always had saying good well again,

(47:35):
by I take the responsibilities finally Ineeded for the factory. They're plainly and
simply leave. You do not putup without. And that's very hurtful,
to tell you the truth. It'snot easy. So that's a late last

(47:58):
thing I've learned did which means whenevertoo old to learn no. And I've
often said to I've often said tosome of my friends who are in certain
relationships or show certain patterns of beingin those kinds of relationships, and I've
said to them, you got toask that person, what is it in

(48:21):
me that you like so much?Because that's what you need to change in
your because that's the attraction. Soand it's not easy. It's definitely not
not easy to So you've you know, you've forgiven, You've had to reach
a point in your life where you'vehad to forgive your dad. And and

(48:43):
in a way, did you findthat after the passing of your of your
husband, that you needed to forgivehim? Oh? Absolutely, I think
I'd put that in the book,not God's Less and that and and at
that graveside, that's when I cameto forgiveness from him as well, it

(49:07):
might and you know it in strangesecrets. I know that I had I
probably not a well for sure,I had a part in it. I
accepted it, you know, right, But and and and you changed it.
I'm a pretty independent person. Icould have done better in the marriage,

(49:31):
no doubt about it. Right.So I'm not I'm not sasiting him.
I'm just saying, when in relationshipswe decied whether gonna stay in it
or not because not all black andwhite? How much value it and that
this person brings here life? Andand what are the negatives in one of

(49:55):
the positives. I think that's myview. Before I before I close,
I want to read one more passagefrom Murner's book The Blue House, and
it says, by telling the storiesengraved on my heart. I also hope
to offer a model of success forthose who were not born with a silver

(50:15):
spoon in their mouth, and perhapsto remind those who were born to affluence
that success is comprised much more thanmaterial wealth. The truly wealthy person lives
from the richness of their values.At my heart's core, I believe that
with the proper support, guidance,and mentoring, it is possible for every

(50:36):
single child living to succeed. Thankyou for listening to Becoming the Journey.
Listen on wor seven ten iHeartRadio,or wherever you listen to your podcasts.
You can subscribe for free, followus on Instagram at Becoming the Journey and
let us know how we're doing.A five star review on Apple Podcasts really

(51:00):
helps. Thank you so much,miRNA. I wish you the best.
Thank you so much for having meon and Mirna's book can be found on
Amazon. I think everyone to simpleread. It's a great read. Check
it out. Okay, thank you. You have been listening to Becoming the
Journey, hosted by Grace Lavere.Tune in weekly to hear more conversations that

(51:24):
will inspire listeners along their life's journey. The proceeding was a paid podcast.
iHeartRadio's hosting of this podcast constitutes neitheran endorsement of the products offered or the ideas expressed