Episode Transcript
Available transcripts are automatically generated. Complete accuracy is not guaranteed.
Speaker 1 (00:00):
Nuggets take game one in a stunner to a lot
of people. That's me, but stunner to a lot of people.
Speaker 2 (00:06):
Not your stuff on the bag.
Speaker 1 (00:07):
Listen, credit, football is not gonna spike yourself, somebody.
Speaker 3 (00:11):
Ben's gonna always right. You're not gonna run victory laps
for me, are you?
Speaker 2 (00:18):
No, I'm not. I'm not the football spike itself. I'm
picking this thing up, but I'm stuffing it. You didn't
put any money on this game? Did you get it?
Come on, man, you can't be doing that. I won
humanity for winning.
Speaker 1 (00:29):
Talking if he didn't, nobody called a gamble.
Speaker 2 (00:37):
Of hotline when they're a wing bro. Okay, sorry, I
would it too much. I need to got a problem.
Nobody call him. I'll tell you this.
Speaker 3 (00:45):
If Ben did not make a wager on the game,
and he was a major benefactor, it had been like
a mouse pisson on cotton in here.
Speaker 4 (00:57):
But like a monastery. So you know, when he on
the game, he's super exciting.
Speaker 2 (01:02):
I'm winning.
Speaker 3 (01:03):
Okay, wins though only when he wins. He reminds me
of someone I know really well. He's kind of like
I've already called him the John Morant of radio broadcasting.
He is, but there's another comp for for Ben. And
now that he was talking, it just hit me.
Speaker 2 (01:24):
He's like my former teammate Jay Cutler because because Jake
Tuler would only talk to the media we had a game.
When he had a good game, would come on an
NFL you gotta talk to me. Hey, listen, I'm telling
you man NBA two. Yes. But that's that's that's that's been.
Speaker 1 (01:42):
All right, fine Broncos country tonight, Nick first in the
Hall of Famer, Steve al or grest Smith back there
apparently smoking Jay Cutler over here on the microphone.
Speaker 2 (01:50):
That's you.
Speaker 1 (01:52):
I will absolutely take it when I lose, but I'm
spiking that thing. I'm taking credit when I win, like
when I lose, I got problem accounability. But I have
absolutely taken my victory.
Speaker 2 (02:02):
Lafts. Nobody's running victory lap for you. Apparently you weren't
surprised about the victory either. I wasn't. I was not.
I had faith all you doubters, you hated you.
Speaker 3 (02:13):
Listen camera and Ben's home when he was watching the game.
He wasn't as confident then as he is. Rails to
see if they all chewed off. I'm mad take care
of myself. Then the game was spectacular. I I it
(02:34):
was kind of a toss up when you really think
about it, because there's two things working now. You will say, well,
if okay s were to win, you would say, well,
the Nuggets going to game seven games, they.
Speaker 2 (02:45):
Were a little tired. They were a little exhausted.
Speaker 3 (02:46):
One day off, right, and then you say, okay, well
if the Nuggets won, well, okay, see had a long layoff,
they were.
Speaker 2 (02:54):
A little rusty.
Speaker 3 (02:54):
Talked about that yesterday. I'm not going to say that
at all. To me, it was one hell of a game.
Definitely a game and all you need was and it
was kind it kind of got.
Speaker 1 (03:04):
Front because in the fourth quarter when Nicole picked up
that fifth foul, and like, bro, can't play defense and
they're leaving it in and I'm sitting there, like, Bro,
you got sub DeAndre Jordan in for a couple of minutes,
so you could have Nicole's officer.
Speaker 2 (03:14):
They didn't. They just rolled the dice and rolled.
Speaker 3 (03:16):
And the fact that and this is why I figured
that maybe Ben was biting his nails when ched Holmer
was at the stripe, Oh my god, he.
Speaker 2 (03:23):
Missed the first one. We miss the first one was
like my eyes lit up.
Speaker 4 (03:28):
I was like, oh, I got this, and he missed
the second one.
Speaker 3 (03:33):
And in this series there are there are a lot
of characters, but for me, this one guy who's always
taking it on the chin, and it's Russ Westbrook. We
talked about it and how fitting was it. Christian Brown
got the rebound, kicked it out to Russ. Russ like
like a kid on you know, just candy. He just
(03:53):
pushed it up the court. Somehow I don't understand. Okay,
see was so slowly getting back and leave Aaron Gordon
on the right the left wing to knock down the
three point shot. And to me, Aaron going and saved
the bacon for the Nuggets, not once, but twice.
Speaker 2 (04:09):
He did it the last night, and he did it
with the dunk. Held it, dude, I'll tell you what.
Speaker 1 (04:13):
I went through the entire range of emotions, like the
entire spectrum in that span of like eight seconds.
Speaker 2 (04:21):
When Christian Brown pulls the board down, I'm like, yet,
my eyes light up. I'm yes.
Speaker 1 (04:24):
Then I see Jamal Murray over there in the corner
like not really doing anything, just sitting over at the
corner like no, and he has seen Christian Brown.
Speaker 4 (04:31):
With you to pass up to Russ and I'm like,
oh no, I see Russ like drive it to the
center and I'm like and then he like kicks it
over to Gordon to take the thread like you only
need two, like the whole thing and it snaps the
net and I'm like, no on my hands.
Speaker 2 (04:46):
I'm like, I no doubt, I do it the whole time.
Speaker 3 (04:48):
What you know, it was in insane game and it
was reminiscent for me. Where you look at what today's
NBA is, it's that up and down pays like you
know what my miked and Tony pace up and down.
No one plays, no one plays. And I mean they
both teams shot a lot of threes, a lot of threes.
Speaker 2 (05:10):
I think people think they plan on that or do
you think it's just the game? Fold is absolutely that's
who they are.
Speaker 1 (05:18):
The mathematicians have gotten into basketball, and they will tell
you it is absolutely in your best interest to just
continue jacking up threes, even if you miss them.
Speaker 2 (05:25):
You will come out ahead. Okay, see shot forty three threes?
Forty three? You know you know they made fifteen of
them and you were off. He's got listen.
Speaker 3 (05:35):
I love the level of intensity, level excitement that we
see on these NBA games. But man, I can't help,
but the child and me want old school basketball.
Speaker 1 (05:44):
Yeah, you know what, when the Pacers used to play,
Revy would make two or three three pointers in a game,
and it was like a big thing.
Speaker 2 (05:51):
But you had that, you had a down low you had.
Speaker 1 (05:52):
The Rick Smith's and the yeah Charles Oakley, you know
down low, those kind of battle.
Speaker 2 (05:58):
You don't see that anymore.
Speaker 3 (05:59):
No, it was kind of like a basic Nicola Yolk game, right,
that's old school basketball.
Speaker 1 (06:05):
And somehow he had forty two points. By the way,
it was like the quietest points.
Speaker 5 (06:09):
I've ever seen. That guy is incredible and he can
do it anyway. He can beat you on inside. He
can go and just shoot a three point for a
three pointer from almost half court, like.
Speaker 2 (06:21):
It doesn't even look like he's aiming.
Speaker 1 (06:23):
No he doesn't, but it's just it's like he had
forty two points in twenty two boards, which is an
astronomical stat line.
Speaker 2 (06:29):
And it felt like a bad game.
Speaker 3 (06:31):
Yes, Like hars Stein was in his face and he
pulls the ball bag and looks like he's reaching back
like he's about to pull a lot of shotguns or something,
and he just just shoot the ball.
Speaker 1 (06:41):
There's no way that's going like a rainbow. It's like
a Russell Wilson.
Speaker 2 (06:48):
That didn't even Yes, it's phenomenal.
Speaker 3 (06:51):
What that says to me is that the international players
athletically are far superior, not fundamentally sound than American basketball.
Speaker 2 (07:06):
Not of them. We got better general generalization.
Speaker 4 (07:09):
I mean, wait, wait, we make better athletes.
Speaker 2 (07:13):
They got more fundamental players.
Speaker 3 (07:14):
Yes, they're they're players are fundamentally sound. It's it's out there.
All you have to do is look at the last
couple of m v P s in the league. They're
all European players. All of the European paid players, all
of them them, the last the last I think ndred
percent of them or fundamentally sound, yes, fundamentally sound. See,
(07:38):
we want to play our guys basketball. I got our guys.
Speaker 2 (07:42):
Want to play ISO basketball.
Speaker 1 (07:43):
Russ was James hard and Russ were the last two
to win be an American And we know.
Speaker 2 (07:49):
What but James Harden is he going to drible out
the clock? The clock?
Speaker 1 (07:53):
James like somebody put up a graphic the other day
about players who had below twenty point performances in Game
seven's all time and it was something like it was
something like two from Jordans and three from Kobe or
something like that.
Speaker 2 (08:05):
It's like James Harden.
Speaker 1 (08:06):
Forty two or something some third number that he had
just horrible Game seven.
Speaker 2 (08:11):
Think about the.
Speaker 3 (08:12):
Level of international influence on today's NBA is so big
that we got the euro step.
Speaker 2 (08:20):
We got the euro step. That's been it for a minute.
Then well it's more prevalent now you can just know
what it is, traveling exactly traveling.
Speaker 4 (08:33):
There was like Lebron like rand half court. He ran
half the court with the ball. Rand he took like
nine steps.
Speaker 2 (08:40):
And because it's so common, it's a common.
Speaker 5 (08:45):
Thing in the NBA, like the rest must have got
together and said, look, man, we waste time calling these calls.
Speaker 2 (08:51):
The fans they don't mind it. So I'm like, I'm like,
you could have called two travels and that one one move.
But everyone the euro step.
Speaker 3 (09:00):
I remember watching uh the throwback San Antonio Spurs and
this is obviously in their heyday, and Genobili is there.
Janobile was infamous from doing it. I mean the euro
step something.
Speaker 2 (09:13):
So you got kids now just practicing that in the school.
The euro step.
Speaker 4 (09:22):
I'm sitting here like euro stepping right now, Broet.
Speaker 2 (09:26):
But but but yeah, that's that's trapping. Nicol is phenomenal.
Speaker 3 (09:31):
I mean, what more can we say about him that
we have not said or heard thus far? Just an
extraordinary guy. And here's the here's the biggest thing for me, Steve,
because most of the time, when we see a guy
this talented, sometimes that the idea is that maybe he
may be arrogant, he may be selfish. And Nikola doesn't
(09:52):
seem like that type of player. And even in games
where he doesn't score, he's getting everyone else involved.
Speaker 2 (09:57):
If anything, the knock on him is he's not selfish enough. Yeah,
good thing.
Speaker 5 (10:01):
I mean, you got You've had quite a few guys
who were like, Shaq wasn't selfish?
Speaker 2 (10:05):
One what Shaq wasn't selfish? Me? I'm outstanding me. Jaq
wasn't zelfish? I mean, you don't know the album does
if he's Kobe. You didn't hear what he said about
Kobe call come on man, Jaquish.
Speaker 4 (10:21):
Stay Shaqui game winners and yelled out Derek.
Speaker 2 (10:23):
Fisher instead of coming yes, yeah Kobe, Yeah Kobe.
Speaker 4 (10:26):
Kobe was the most selfish player of all Kobe, Kobe
or Jordan something something to that level of greatness like
that Kobe was that level of greatness that he could
demand to be that selfish.
Speaker 3 (10:38):
But I mean, come on, Kobe, but you have to
wear that hat and be that guy.
Speaker 2 (10:42):
And he was. I mean, he was absolutely that dude.
He was not given for being selfishly.
Speaker 1 (10:47):
But at all time, like honestly, it used to be
Russ Westbrook, like ten years ago.
Speaker 2 (10:51):
Yeah, I probably the most selfish. Let's think about it.
Speaker 3 (10:53):
If you were on a team with a bunch of players,
the game is on the line and it was trying
to figure out who's going to take the list shot.
Speaker 4 (10:59):
We know you selfish though, is that Hey, that's the leader,
that's the that's what, that's what.
Speaker 3 (11:04):
It all depends on how you choose to look at
the situation. Some may view it as being selfish. Others
may view it as here's a guy who's hyper competitive
and he's going to take.
Speaker 5 (11:15):
Over and their clutch they make you have the ability
the ability back because there's a.
Speaker 4 (11:21):
Little bit difference if you're like, I'm the guy, I'm
gonna take the shot and you're not making it.
Speaker 2 (11:24):
Oh yeah, you know.
Speaker 1 (11:25):
I mean there are also guys that had that clutch ability,
that weren't selfish, that weren't big tight like Robert Orriy
big shot Bob. I just mentioned Derk Fisher or you know,
and neither one of those guys was selfish. I mean
their fish Wood selfish, Robert orri would selfish.
Speaker 2 (11:39):
You know. They came in and executed.
Speaker 3 (11:41):
No even Michael and his that hey day, he had
to learn to distribute the ball to someone else because.
Speaker 1 (11:50):
Because by the time Tony Kuk coach had got there
with Pip and co coach and those guys like he'd
learned by that point shoot like John Paxson.
Speaker 2 (11:58):
Okay, so in the clutch, yes, he let them get
not giving because bj Armstrong and packs then won games
for them. Because Michael. Everyone knew Michael's gonna take the
last shot, so they're gonna.
Speaker 4 (12:13):
Trap him triple cover and you kick it off the
triple cover, so he draws.
Speaker 2 (12:20):
The defense and he kicks He got one on one,
of course. I mean he's taking a shot. Yeah, I mean,
think about what he did to Utah.
Speaker 4 (12:27):
I'm just saying I thought you was talking about like,
all right, he's running on the court, he's uncovered or
you know he's got one guy covering and he gets
off to the other.
Speaker 2 (12:38):
He's not gonna no, no, And that's where Kobe got
it from.
Speaker 6 (12:43):
Kobe learns from money like show, I'm taking a shot,
but you can only do that if you are the
guy and you have to make that shot.
Speaker 1 (12:54):
But there is a winner's mentality to that too, as
there's the great fictional coach Jimmy McGinty says, and the replacements.
When games on the line, winners want the ball, Yeah,
you do.
Speaker 3 (13:03):
You want them, You want the ball, You want that
moment in your hands. You don't want to defer to
someone else, and you can you can look at it.
Speaker 2 (13:11):
Steven say, well, is it a little.
Speaker 3 (13:14):
Insecurity because you don't trust anyone else but yourself. You've
made that shot time and time again. Are you willing
to defer to someone else and watch them.
Speaker 2 (13:25):
Not knock down the shot?
Speaker 5 (13:27):
Not knocked down the show? Not not exactly and you
know that, Hey, you've done this a thousand times, thousands
of times. You could close your eyes and I would
wager that, Well, I'm not gonna wager.
Speaker 4 (13:38):
But however, most of his teammates, expecting them to say.
Speaker 1 (13:48):
They know what kind of player is, but you're talking
about Kobe specifically. There were also times Kobe when he
knew that he couldn't get there, that you gave it
to Derek Fisher because Derek Fisher was killer in the
clutch too.
Speaker 3 (13:59):
Yes, and that's what Big Shot Bob knocked down a
lot of shots because he went right to the wing
because he's my spot.
Speaker 2 (14:07):
I'm going to drive down and it's it's a driving kick.
Speaker 3 (14:10):
We've seen it happen so many times in basketball, the
drive and kick.
Speaker 2 (14:15):
And this is why when you look at you.
Speaker 3 (14:17):
Know, Aaron Gordon, Aaron Gordon is now becoming that clutch
player for the Denver Nuggets where you may think that
it might be or should be Nicola Jokic or Jamal Murray.
The way that games are kind of working themselves out.
Speaker 2 (14:31):
He's now this year become that guy.
Speaker 3 (14:34):
And that's why it's going to be all important that
this Nuggets team definitely stay stay healthy. This series is
not over. I'm thinking this this this is gonna be
another seven game series.
Speaker 2 (14:45):
But with Oka.
Speaker 5 (14:46):
See yeah, and they're going this is a big dude. Man,
that's a big.
Speaker 1 (14:50):
Boy, just like with six six Yeah, and he can
he can guard.
Speaker 2 (14:57):
I'm not sure.
Speaker 1 (14:59):
He he's thick for an NBA player, and then that
lean bill he's but he can guard four out of
five positions on the court. I mean you could put
him on most centers, power forwards, you know, in the
three and the two. There's not many points that I would,
you know, because I'll take him off the dribble. But
he can guard four out of five positions on And
there were times when they had him and the Tea
Wolves games on it on edwards at the you.
Speaker 2 (15:16):
Know, the off guard.
Speaker 3 (15:17):
You know, that's that's that's a hard matchup for anybody.
Speaker 1 (15:23):
You kind of wrong for two, Like, it's kind of
makes sense to you know, to do that. It reminds
you of and he's better than him, but it kind
of reminds you of you remember Boris dil Yes, you
know Boris d I used to play.
Speaker 2 (15:33):
He can play all five positions. You know.
Speaker 1 (15:34):
It gives you that versatility on defense to be able
to defend all five positions like that. I always wonder
one thing. I wondered who had the most game winning assists?
Who was the most unselfish player?
Speaker 2 (15:44):
And no one really talks about well, they do talk
because I looked it up. So you know the guy
given an assist?
Speaker 1 (15:50):
Yeah, the game winning assists all time in the modern era,
in the last twenty years, it's NICOLEA.
Speaker 2 (15:55):
Jokic. But in the NBA history, who has the most
game winning assist? And you'll as soon as I say it,
you'll say, but game winning assists? That's yes, okay, because.
Speaker 1 (16:07):
Malone was the dude stocked them alone, I mean, and
then of course they had the corner second, Barron Randall
and all those guys too.
Speaker 2 (16:13):
But yeah, Joss stocked the most game winning.
Speaker 3 (16:16):
John Starnton no short shorts.
Speaker 1 (16:24):
Shorts, way after everybody had.
Speaker 3 (16:26):
They said, like, no, no, no, you need to bring it
up just a little bringing him up, just a little boy.
Speaker 2 (16:31):
Like you can see what color Stockson's brief for. They
don't even have pressing shorts at that points.
Speaker 4 (16:35):
You can tell he had up for a layoff, like
you see the tidy wa on the bottom of the shorts.
Speaker 2 (16:42):
Come on and post me up.
Speaker 4 (16:43):
Back in the day, endorsement deal was spole.
Speaker 2 (16:49):
Oh man, I had to.
Speaker 3 (16:50):
Work maybe two thousand no no, no, no, windows just last year.
Speaker 1 (16:58):
Hang, I'm looking at up right now because can't remember
what I us was still two o three.
Speaker 5 (17:01):
Okay, yeah, come on, man, that's twenty some years ago.
Speaker 2 (17:04):
Doesn't make a difference.
Speaker 1 (17:05):
But my favorite series of all time was when the
Jazz with the Old Heads took on at the time
the Sacramento Kings, which was Chris Weber Jason Williams. It
was like the New Versas and they played old man
dirty basketball the whole series and were frustrating the hell
out of it. Like they were getting so mad because
they'd be pitching their elbows and stock to be like
grinding up all.
Speaker 2 (17:23):
It with their shorts and stuff.
Speaker 1 (17:26):
So like Weber and Waisbrey, they were expected to blow
out the Old Heads and they didn't, and they were
getting so.
Speaker 2 (17:30):
Mad, so mad, man, what are you doing? Yeah?
Speaker 3 (17:35):
And that speaks a lot to the evolution of the
game and how the game has changed so much from
what it used to be. And when I think about
today's game, that's why we see so many of the scores,
the combined scores like two thirty almost too forties, like
in the old.
Speaker 2 (17:54):
NBA that would have never happened.
Speaker 3 (17:56):
And because I'm a defensive person through in I mean,
I love to see great defensive performances. Blocks in the
paint blocks out there on wing defenders. To me, I
want to see a little more of that in today's
game and last night's game between the Thunder and the Nuggets.
To me, it took me back because we got a
little we got a little more of that blocks at
(18:18):
the rim. By the way, you know, how many what's
the most assists John Stock that ever had a game?
Speaker 2 (18:22):
Just before game? In one game, what do you think?
Maybe twenty we'll say eighteen. Okay, First of all, he
had twenty games with more than twenty twenty eight. He
had twenty eight assists in a game he scored twenty points.
Speaker 1 (18:39):
That's crazy, that's ball bestion insane. Yeah, rockus Country and
I gotta hit a break. We'll be back after this.
Several people did text in with some suggestions here pistol
peak most selfish all time.
Speaker 2 (18:51):
There's probably true things and truth to that.
Speaker 1 (18:54):
Although he you know Ai, somebody suggested that Ai was
the most selfish.
Speaker 3 (18:58):
Alan iverson selfish Okay, I don't know. I don't know
about that, but very very interesting. I mean, hey, I
used to jack up some shots, but didn't lead the
league in.
Speaker 2 (19:09):
Assists one year? Or am I wrong on that? I
don't know. Yeah, maybe not, but he did have I
mean he.
Speaker 1 (19:14):
The dude has like several seasons where he averaged like
seven eight assist a game, so it wasn't like he
was doing at all well.
Speaker 3 (19:20):
Once again, AI was a score by nature, right, So
I think when individual thing selfish, they think about the
persona of AI in his clash, like a John Morant
with the association right, because.
Speaker 2 (19:35):
AI classed a lot.
Speaker 3 (19:37):
I mean they change the I guess wardrobe on the
on the bitch, because yeah, to be.
Speaker 2 (19:46):
Fair, to to be fair to the text.
Speaker 1 (19:47):
I mean a I led the league and field goal
attempts like six years six like four out of and
and six out of seven.
Speaker 5 (19:53):
But I got this from a I Oh you got
a no. No, Alan Iverson not lead the band, says
during his career, there's a good passer. His career average
of six point two assists or game wasn't enough to
rank him among them.
Speaker 2 (20:12):
So only six point two. So let's put this in context.
Speaker 3 (20:18):
If we're gonna talk about a player being selfish and
you're gonna throw a name into that equation, what does
that really mean selfish? Are we talking selfish on the
court or the public assumption that the guy is selfish
based on what he does off the court.
Speaker 1 (20:34):
Well, I'm gonna say on the court, although I think
what you're probably right is most people do make an
assumption based on what they see, you know what.
Speaker 2 (20:39):
That kind of stuff.
Speaker 1 (20:40):
I would say, like, if you're a guy who's only
hitting thirty eight percent of your shots, but you're jacking
up a league leading field goal attempts, you're selfish?
Speaker 2 (20:47):
Okay, okay, are.
Speaker 3 (20:52):
But if you but if you that dude, and you've
known for being that dude, obviously you're gonna take.
Speaker 2 (20:57):
A lot of shots.
Speaker 5 (20:58):
Well, sometimes you offen, I bro, don't don't shoot anymore,
got it off.
Speaker 2 (21:06):
But if you're shooting like Nai did this.
Speaker 1 (21:08):
If you're shooting thirty eight point seven percent for the
season and you're leading the NBA in field goal attempts,
you ate off one night, you got a problem.
Speaker 2 (21:16):
At what point? Uh?
Speaker 3 (21:17):
Statistically was that in his career in the in the
good part he was still in Philly.
Speaker 2 (21:21):
Okay, Well, he was the type of guy he talk
about six seven years in. He's gonna fill up the bucket.
Speaker 3 (21:27):
I mean, he's gonna take those shots because Philly at
that time they needed him to take those shots, like
when he came in to join the Nuggets. I mean,
it was great when he took some shots, but he
didn't really need to take all the shots because there
was other talented players who were on the rocks he could.
Speaker 1 (21:41):
I mean, he didn't lead a league in field goal
attempts when he came to Denver, and that's probably why
the other guys to take. He did lead the league
in minutes played, yes, but he didn't. You know, he
led the league in field goal attempts like six out
of seven straight years back in from ninety eight to
like four, and he had two seasons there where he
shot below forty percent. I mean he shot thirty nine
point eight percent one oh two and he shot thirty
eight point seven percent three four. Now, he was an
All Star that year because he put up raw numbers.
(22:03):
But bro, you're shooting thirty eight percent from the field
and you're leading the league in attempts, somebody got I
think you could.
Speaker 3 (22:10):
Look at some of the more top players in the
NBA and you can see where they're taking a lot
of shots, and they're known for that, and they're scrowing
a lot, and I can easily see how some fans
would consider those individuals to be selfish, like Donovan Mitchell,
Donovan mischief is a walking bucket, right and I can
easily see him in the transition three just walk up
(22:30):
and take the shot because he's capable of We've seen
him do it before. So I think we have to
be really delicate when we talk about selfish players.
Speaker 2 (22:39):
Steve, if you ever played with a.
Speaker 3 (22:41):
Guy in football and any level that you felt he
was selfish and he was just kind of thought about himself.
Speaker 4 (22:47):
Oh yeah, mostly the receivers, defensive guys, both of them.
Speaker 5 (22:53):
Receivers see the question. None of their receivers. Yeah, you know,
I'm not gonna say any name, but you can tell
me the break. You know, there were several you know that, hey,
they wanted the ball. I don't care what the situation was,
they give me the ball. You know, you know they
(23:13):
got had good hands, you know, but they wanted the ball.
And I'm like, I am I right with that.
Speaker 2 (23:19):
I rather you want the ball.
Speaker 4 (23:20):
And you're like, don't get But sometimes it got.
Speaker 2 (23:26):
To be a distraction for the office when you know
they're not they.
Speaker 1 (23:29):
Give me the dag on the ball, man, you know,
I mean in Minnesota, had the Randy ratio, you know,
I mean, Randy Moss was worth it.
Speaker 2 (23:37):
But I say, throw me the damn ball. And Wayne
was cold.
Speaker 4 (23:43):
That's the thing I'm like, I see if Wayne would
have been a scrub, Wayne Gribette was cold, Yeah he was.
Speaker 3 (23:50):
But you're talking about Keyshawn Johnson at that time, coming
from California, USC, wanting to be the face, wanting to
get every single possession. Like most people say, Well, Terry
Owens were selfish, right, And I always tell people say, look,
I never had a chance to play with Tarol. If
I did, and and I had to choose, yes, yes
(24:12):
I'm choosing.
Speaker 2 (24:13):
But Shine was that way too. But it's like you
also have Wayne.
Speaker 5 (24:18):
If if if Wayne, I said, Wayne was, would have
been a bad player.
Speaker 2 (24:22):
I can see. All right, Well, I understand.
Speaker 3 (24:24):
Said Wayne is still on my shine. He's still on
my spotlight. I know you played in New York City.
Speaker 2 (24:30):
It's only spotlight for one person, one person.
Speaker 4 (24:32):
Only, like eighty k from five hot beats, they both
could have got in loved there.
Speaker 2 (24:38):
Not not from from that standpoint exact. It's my team.
I want people to talk about me, right, Yes, that's
why that's part. That's part of who he is. But
you know you you played with Rod, you played with
Ed McCaffrey to to to these guys.
Speaker 5 (24:56):
But when they get that ball, yes, they gonna catch
it and they gonna do what they can do, what
they got to do.
Speaker 2 (25:01):
That was Wayne was doing more with it when he
got it too. Yeah, Wayne was I'm telling you Wayne
was nice.
Speaker 1 (25:05):
Wayne was getting fourteen point four perception while Keyshan was
getting thirteen point six on the other side.
Speaker 2 (25:10):
Dude, I see and I heard the key shot of
the interviews.
Speaker 4 (25:12):
He's like, uh, hey, you see all these other superstars.
They got great player, Jerry Rice got John Taylor, and
I don't know, maybe after.
Speaker 2 (25:20):
That Tim Brown on the other side. Yeah, yeah, yeah, Look,
come on, man, look what I got.
Speaker 5 (25:24):
I'm like, bro, what's what do you say that? I
don't what are you saying that that? I'm that's different
from what I see Wayne.
Speaker 2 (25:30):
Keveg had more more yards per touch caught the ball.
Speaker 1 (25:32):
Morall hit a sixty five percent point reception rate, where
Keyshot at fifty five percent.
Speaker 3 (25:36):
Hey listen, key, Shawn didn't want Wayne to steal his Shawn.
Speaker 2 (25:39):
Yeah, I remember we were in practice and.
Speaker 5 (25:44):
Wayne Quebec, you know, we're running office versus defense, ones
versus one.
Speaker 2 (25:50):
He's trying to block me.
Speaker 4 (25:51):
I'm like, broop, I'm gonna give you the business.
Speaker 2 (26:00):
And so I had to have to get to give
him that elbow to the neck. Man, I'm like, bro you.
Then he's after that brother law. Yeah yeah, man, wait,
he's a breakout of the man. That was my guy?
That was that was? That was it? Because that was
whn't uh didn't Charlie weis run the offense? Then? Yeah?
I sure did.
Speaker 1 (26:15):
Yeah, Charlie got a memory. Yeah, I was like trying
to go back and remember that was Charlie. Think Testa
Verdi running the QB or was it Chad Pennington? Then no, No,
Chad came after Testa Verdi. Yeah it was he tos
Uh No, he tore his achilles that year.
Speaker 2 (26:30):
Was that the year?
Speaker 1 (26:31):
Oh yeah, that's the the Ray Lucas Lucas Tom Tuba
have to come in and play quarterback. Well he did
for he was a punk for the punter. He came in,
threw two touchdowns that year.
Speaker 2 (26:42):
What Yeah, I don't remember that. Yeah, he threw two
touchdowns and U that year. But it was Ray Ray
Ray Lucas right and Rick Meyer. Meyer played six games
that year.
Speaker 1 (26:52):
Yeah, because Meyer, uh, because Lucas came in and he
was playing pretty well and then I think he got
her or something and Meyer came in. Well, I mean,
relatively speaking, Meyer played horribly because Meyer was like five touchdowns,
nine picks or something like that. It was like awful. Yeah,
Meyer came in and played six games. It was terrible.
Speaker 3 (27:10):
But you know what you know, fellas, I think it
does come a time, depending on the team that you're on,
where it may call for you to be selfish, right,
because you can be selfless up to a certain point
in the game, and you see it as though there's
no momentum, there's no energy, there's no juice, and you
can scream and shout all you want to on the sideline,
but then it's just like, well, someone's got to make
(27:31):
a play as.
Speaker 2 (27:32):
A defensive player. Cand a defensive player be somelfish. I mean,
if you try to chase stats.
Speaker 1 (27:36):
I think so if you guys, if you give it up,
run contained to go chase the sack or someone you
get them contained to go go go. Well, what you're.
Speaker 2 (27:44):
Talking about right now, that's a that's Troy Pola.
Speaker 1 (27:46):
Mabel well, if.
Speaker 2 (27:51):
Defensive in mind, but I'm missing with that. I'm just saying,
if you're giving.
Speaker 1 (27:55):
Up contained to chase the sacks or something like that,
or if you're Yeah, the Chiefs used to have a corner.
Speaker 2 (27:59):
He's prett Sean Smith or he was a gambler.
Speaker 1 (28:01):
Though he wanted the interception, he'd give up his man
to try the interception.
Speaker 2 (28:04):
Sometimes it works the pay.
Speaker 3 (28:06):
I played with some some guys who were really selfish.
This is why I've always hated Cover two because corners
they're not going to get the jam because they're looking
for the quick outlet. I want to tie the running
back and they sell you out on the deep rock
because you got a vertical coming up inside the hashes
and one outside. So no matter where it's caught, if
(28:28):
you're in the frame, it's your fault. So I had
some corners. I will not say this particular corner the name,
but I knew that he was constantly thinking about ways
that he can get paid, and the only way he
can get paid was getting interceptions right, And I used
to get so mad. We were in cover too. He
doesn't get the jam, and he's trying to take the
guy in the flat and when I say, you know what,
(28:49):
if a guy catched the ball on me, I found
a way to pay him back on run plays.
Speaker 2 (29:02):
How we played today, I'm gonna take you to the run.
There's no bounce text line. Man, Uh yeah, you're right.
The seven to two O talk about Iverson calling him
he was a point shooter. That was the reason.
Speaker 1 (29:13):
That was the reason that he you know herying to
get right, trying to get his points. So, yeah, I agree.
I had a couple of others come in. Uh is
Anthony Miller selfish?
Speaker 2 (29:23):
Yes? And the selfish Uh yeah.
Speaker 3 (29:28):
I mean from the i'dn't played with Anthony Miller, but
from the players I know who played with him when
I arrived, there were just certain guys that they talked about,
and he was one of those guys.
Speaker 2 (29:40):
He wont that ball now, yes, and Anthony was. He
was a great player too.
Speaker 5 (29:45):
I mean I remember when he was with the Chargers
before he came over with the Broncos and man hesed
because the spits boy.
Speaker 1 (29:52):
Yeah, uh see he is Shiloh selfish talking about I guess,
I don't know.
Speaker 2 (30:00):
I just don't understand how. I don't know how he'd
answer that. As safety can be selfish? Can safety be selfish?
Speaker 1 (30:05):
I mean, I guess if you're gambling on your assignment
to you want to gamble on something.
Speaker 2 (30:11):
Eddie Kennison is a selfish guy.
Speaker 1 (30:13):
And any Stonehands I called him just gill Hands was
trying to catch a ball between two frying pans.
Speaker 2 (30:18):
I had all the speed in the world, all the
speed in the world, but.
Speaker 4 (30:21):
Man, he looked like he was trying to catch the
ball between two frying pants.
Speaker 3 (30:24):
Trying to I can tell you this, depending on what
group of Broncos players that you're around, you throw that
name out there, man, you.
Speaker 2 (30:35):
Will get Yeah, absolutely, you will. Absolutely.
Speaker 1 (30:39):
Everybody does not have an opinion of Eddiekennison, one opinion
of the other.
Speaker 2 (30:43):
Nobody's middle round on Eddie Kennison.
Speaker 3 (30:46):
But I do believe that it is like moments of
the game that you may have to be selfish, You
may have to go out and take a game over
because you realize whatever's being called, whatever's supposed to be done,
is it being done in those moments.
Speaker 2 (31:01):
I wouldn't view that as being selfish.
Speaker 3 (31:05):
Is like, I mean, your your drive to win is
bigger than the idea of like being comfortable with losing
because there's some people okay with losing as leasy as that.
Speaker 1 (31:15):
Sound, as long as they got theirs, and that would
be the definite selfish to me.
Speaker 2 (31:19):
Right, he was like that.
Speaker 1 (31:23):
I think the first person in the NFL to run
like for to eight on their for like officially fortunately eight,
not like you know, some guy rand he.
Speaker 2 (31:30):
Ran the fourth weight out of Denver right to Kansas City.
Well yeah, but he also scored twelve on the Wonder Lake.
Stop stop, come on, man, stop that Hall of Fame
quarterbacks who scored? Man? You know, like you get what
is like the best scorer? You just it's like fifty
(31:51):
damn twelve? Yeah. I think then rise Is Patrick scored
like a forty four, forty nine, Ryan Fitzpatrick, Yeah, Ryan Fitzpatrick,
Alex Smith, they scored like perfect scores on it. I
think I took one and I got a forty nine.
Speaker 3 (32:04):
I never liked that test, you know why. It's just
that that's all it is. And I don't even remember
it well to see.
Speaker 2 (32:14):
If you look at it. Yeah, I mean I took it.
Speaker 3 (32:16):
But the thing about is that not everyone is great
at tests taking, and when you're under the gun like that,
it makes it difficult because you're trying to answer every
single question, but they tell you don't try to answer
every single question, and they use it as a barometer
determine whether players or how can players operate under stressful tradition?
(32:39):
And I'm like, well, no, when you're on the field,
I don't remember anyone throwing a piece of paper at me.
Speaker 2 (32:45):
Right, I've but to score here, a score here.
Speaker 3 (32:53):
But that idea is that that test does not predict
the way that it doesn't be because you're, in my mind,
you're measuring two different things.
Speaker 1 (33:03):
It's supposed to measure how quick you process things, but
nowadays like they didn't use it anymore, but it's supposed
to measure how quick you process things, right, and so
like on the field, how quickly you processed it.
Speaker 2 (33:11):
But it's really not And there was no correlation.
Speaker 1 (33:13):
The only position group that had any correlation between wonderlick
scorre and success was corner and it was an inverse correlation,
meaning the lower you scored on it, the better you
probably did in the NFL.
Speaker 2 (33:23):
And that what Yeah, that was crazy about the test
that I found out, like no correlation for any other position.
Speaker 3 (33:29):
Yeah, it was really biased because for certain teams if
you tested too high. Some teams liked it. Other teams
use it against you because they say, well, you made
too much.
Speaker 2 (33:38):
You have ability to overthink things and make question authority. Yep,
they use it against crazy.
Speaker 5 (33:44):
It's crazy. That's crazy. I bet he's going high. Man
and Crack was probably one of the one of the
smartest cornerbacks I've played with.
Speaker 2 (33:53):
Was Ray Crockett. Yeah, yeah, you had problems with him
and Cover two never never.
Speaker 5 (33:59):
But when Wade Phillips got there, this is well when
Wave Films was there my rookie year.
Speaker 2 (34:05):
Uh, he was the defense coordinator in.
Speaker 5 (34:07):
That The rule that he had was in Cover two,
the corner has to get a jam if the receiver
is trying to release outside.
Speaker 2 (34:16):
If he doesn't guess.
Speaker 5 (34:17):
What the cornerback has him, that's your man.
Speaker 1 (34:21):
Than you, and that's that's you're responsible for him. And
so that put wait hold on, let me back up,
because I don' want to make sure clear you're saying wads.
Wade's rule was if the receiver comes off the line
of the outside, it's a it's a jam and release
to the safety. He comes inside the corners riding up
the scene right to the linebacker. Yeah, yeah, okay, right,
all right, make sure I was confused there.
Speaker 5 (34:41):
But the thing is, you know how some guys, if
the receiver tries to really released outside, they let him
go because they're looking for number two in the flat.
Speaker 4 (34:48):
Yes, well he wasn't. He didn't allow that. You got
to jam that guy and run with them and then look.
Speaker 2 (34:55):
Back and then right versus you know versus. Yeah, I mean,
then they got go the way it was that. Yeah,
not that I played but one snap of defense.
Speaker 1 (35:04):
But like you know, the rule for three steps on
the cover, it's you gotta ride that jam, and you
gotta ride it three steps before you're fighting back.
Speaker 2 (35:11):
Tell you my rule was, if.
Speaker 3 (35:13):
You let him go looking for the back in the flat,
I'm hitting you and your gay.
Speaker 2 (35:17):
Go through you. I mean I love yeah, yeah, yes,
because we're a team. You can't hang me out.
Speaker 3 (35:27):
The drive because you're looking at your personal status. No,
So since you do that, and then when when when?
Because at the end of the game, I got to
get the phone calls from from from dudes I grew
up with, like, hey man, they got you.
Speaker 2 (35:39):
On that one. No, nope, if I'm gonna get it,
you're gonna get it too. It's just a little reminder,
that's all. If a guy got past.
Speaker 5 (35:48):
You somehow, whether it's through a pass or run, you
couldn't catch up.
Speaker 2 (35:52):
Would you sprint all the.
Speaker 5 (35:53):
Way to the end zone? And they say you're getting
the picture? You in the picture?
Speaker 3 (35:59):
Yeah, I'm gonnae of everything unless I got now one
thing I wasn't doing. I'm I wasn't gonna run and
then at the two yard line to try to dive
and swipe out and by that time it's it's too late.
Speaker 5 (36:09):
Yeah, yeah, yeah, I'm not good too.
Speaker 2 (36:13):
I was like that too. I've seen some guys, you know,
just give up.
Speaker 4 (36:17):
Even if even there on the other side of the field,
the guys take off.
Speaker 5 (36:20):
Running, they just walking like bro, you gotta, you gotta
you just never know going to happen.
Speaker 4 (36:25):
Right, they cut back and that ten ten yard burst
at the start and finish it.
Speaker 2 (36:30):
You could have saved the touchdown, could have saved the touchdown.
Speaker 1 (36:33):
Was there ever any extra incentive to go after the
selfish guys on offense on opposing team, like you knew
they were selfish? So it kind of wounds you up
to be like, all right, I know where the ball's
going I wouldn't.
Speaker 5 (36:45):
Say selfish players. I would say guys who just were
great players. You just you know, you got up.
Speaker 1 (36:51):
I mean, obviously you get up for good players, but
like anybody who had the attitude though that me first attitude.
Is there any extra like, Oh, I'm gonna take this
guy out to you quat you wants the ball, all right,
I'm gonna.
Speaker 3 (36:58):
Make it so he doesn't want the fun The funniest
thing ever, like like Randy Moss could have dominated receiving
an NFL if he played every single play, but but
we knew if he wasn't running really fast, the ball
was not coming to him at all.
Speaker 2 (37:15):
That's how a majority of the receivers were. That's how
that's that's what I ran for my run pass key back.
Speaker 5 (37:28):
I know you're not getting the ball because that's a
part of being selfish.
Speaker 4 (37:32):
Exactly when you want the ball, you're gonna haul, but
offlag you're going.
Speaker 5 (37:35):
To run, and when you don't, then you're gonna you're
gonna loaf, you know what.
Speaker 3 (37:38):
That's that was amazing thing about playing for the Denver
Broncos because Mike Shanahan was infamous, like if you don't
block and you don't.
Speaker 2 (37:46):
You know every plays to any other guy. Alex Gibbs,
Oh my god, if if you if you loaf and
a running back gets caught, you're gonna get an ear
full of gis Well. That's why it was cool to
hear when Pat Bryant got drafted.
Speaker 1 (37:58):
We did the interview with him or whatever one of
the first thing and Nick was asking him to the
first thing he let a.
Speaker 2 (38:01):
No block, no rock, Like this guy sounds like he's cold.
Speaker 5 (38:07):
Man.
Speaker 1 (38:08):
Yeah, he's got the block, he's got the edge she got,
he's ready.
Speaker 2 (38:11):
To I watched some of his highlights. Man. Man, he's
a big boy, got great hands, he's open. Quarterback is
a bomb, dude.
Speaker 4 (38:18):
Like I'm not trying to be that dude, but that
quarterback is a bomb.
Speaker 2 (38:22):
Yeah.
Speaker 1 (38:23):
That I'm like, I'm looking because I finally after they
drafted him, like I've seen, like, you know, some broadcast stuff,
I started watching the tape on the studio.
Speaker 2 (38:28):
And I'm like, bro, this, how is this guy the
FBS quarterback? And see I like that Brian for the
room because if he.
Speaker 3 (38:36):
Plays and comes here, plays the same way he played
in college, and he brings that same attitude that he
had when we interviewed him. It's going to force other
guys in that receiver room who might have just just
going about their business. It's going to force them to
kind of elevate their play because I.
Speaker 2 (38:54):
Mean, he's coming in terms of block and overrun.
Speaker 3 (38:58):
Because that's the way that should be when they bring
those guys in. There shouldn't be any guys who are
comfortable in the room. You should make every single guy
think about what they're doing. That's why it's going to
be important to see a lot of these rookies and
Pat Bryan being one of those guys perform this week
in the Broncos Rickie Minicamp.
Speaker 1 (39:15):
Does everybody look you like out of this draft classic
you really really want to see?
Speaker 2 (39:19):
Sha obviously, you know, I think everybody wants to see.
Is there anybody you like just dying to see? Yeah?
I want to see the running back.
Speaker 4 (39:26):
Yeah.
Speaker 1 (39:27):
Bothers me when people call him small. He's short. He
is not SMARTA That dude is spelt thick.
Speaker 2 (39:31):
He's like m J D.
Speaker 3 (39:32):
He's below to the ground, but he built thick. Look
man for me, uh and I put this out uh
last week. He reminds me of Ray Rice.
Speaker 2 (39:40):
Yeah.
Speaker 3 (39:41):
For the Baltimore Ravens. He he was short and hype,
but he was thick and he had the ability to
run through guys.
Speaker 5 (39:49):
So yeah, that'd that'd been a great running back room too.
Come on, man, Jalil McLoughlin. Estimate, Come on, man, we
just need to estimated.
Speaker 1 (39:56):
Pick it up a little bit, not you know, get
hang on the rock and pick it up a little
bit on the on them early downs, because that's what
that's what you're going to see in the you know,
once your season starts. You see he asked me on
first down, and then you start working Harvey En whether
or not he takes over, you know, however many downs
he takes over, depending on the success of those guys.
Speaker 5 (40:10):
But you always got to have two or three really
good backs anyway.
Speaker 1 (40:14):
Well yeah, I agree, but I mean, Sean Payton really
loves having you know, two or three guys.
Speaker 3 (40:18):
I would love to see the Broncos at JK. Dobbins
or Chubbs.
Speaker 2 (40:24):
Voice in that room, voice in that room.
Speaker 5 (40:26):
Yes, yeah, I just want to Nick Chubb his second
knee surgery.
Speaker 1 (40:33):
It's just third actually, I mean to go back and
look Tip dating back to college.
Speaker 2 (40:37):
He's but he's if you've seen he's been posted workout videos.
You can seeing his workout videos.
Speaker 1 (40:41):
Say the thing about it look like he's back.
Speaker 2 (40:44):
We'll see you got put the pads on.
Speaker 1 (40:46):
But I mean this dude's leaping over stuff and and
all this kind of stuff.
Speaker 2 (40:48):
And I like that because now he has something to prove.
Speaker 3 (40:52):
That is the part that drives the player, that makes
him dangerous when he feels as though everyone is throwing
him to the curve and he has something to prove.
Speaker 2 (40:59):
Yeah, Nick.
Speaker 5 (41:01):
At full speed when he's healthy, he's like, yeah, similar to.
Speaker 2 (41:08):
But you know he's a he's a game changer. Think
about what that would do for both.
Speaker 3 (41:16):
He's not, but just hypothetically thinking once again, because it's
all about improving the production of bo Nick's right, imagine
having a running back room similar to what it was
when when you play, When I play, there's a stable
of guys you can go to at any time.
Speaker 2 (41:33):
Right, And I hate.
Speaker 3 (41:35):
To say this, but I'm going to do it just
for this this this case. But everyone's talking about Joker
after Sean Payton mission. It ideas you just need dynamic playmakers,
That's that's all it is. And have a running back
room where you have about four guys that are interchangeable.
Speaker 2 (41:50):
Man, that's like Mike Tyson just pushing you in the
face over there. Be activated though active on game day,
but you got the options are arrest the guy.
Speaker 1 (42:01):
Will we get caught up getting them injuries here, We're
gonna keep rotating him through. I think that'd be the
ideal type situation. But yob, he's only played one hundred
and thirty snaps over the last two seasons. Yeah, you
know that's that you got to give.
Speaker 5 (42:13):
The heads off that training squad boy, the right boy.
Speaker 1 (42:17):
I'm all for add Nick Chubb in the room. I
think they need that kind of bruiser. A guy could
pick you up short yards at a veteran mentor to
that room because I think that's what's Look if we
can if you can have.
Speaker 3 (42:25):
On defense, a third guy is a third down specialist.
Why can't you have a guy like that first? Specially Yes,
with the Giants they had when I was growing up,
they had Dave Maggott.
Speaker 2 (42:33):
Yeah, and he was just third down.
Speaker 3 (42:35):
Yeah, and he's excelled at third down. So you can
do the same thing with the with the Larry Centers
used to be that dude fall back to yeah, you know,
he used to be that.
Speaker 2 (42:43):
Kind of guy. Stevens.
Speaker 4 (42:45):
It's great to have you and his always man looking forward.
Speaker 2 (42:47):
To chatting it up with you here again, so I
absolutely appreciate you guys. All right, Broncleus Cutcher night back
after this
Nuggets take game one in a stunner to a lot
of people. That's me, but stunner to a lot of people.
Speaker 2 (00:06):
Not your stuff on the bag.
Speaker 1 (00:07):
Listen, credit, football is not gonna spike yourself, somebody.
Speaker 3 (00:11):
Ben's gonna always right. You're not gonna run victory laps
for me, are you?
Speaker 2 (00:18):
No, I'm not. I'm not the football spike itself. I'm
picking this thing up, but I'm stuffing it. You didn't
put any money on this game? Did you get it?
Come on, man, you can't be doing that. I won
humanity for winning.
Speaker 1 (00:29):
Talking if he didn't, nobody called a gamble.
Speaker 2 (00:37):
Of hotline when they're a wing bro. Okay, sorry, I
would it too much. I need to got a problem.
Nobody call him. I'll tell you this.
Speaker 3 (00:45):
If Ben did not make a wager on the game,
and he was a major benefactor, it had been like
a mouse pisson on cotton in here.
Speaker 4 (00:57):
But like a monastery. So you know, when he on
the game, he's super exciting.
Speaker 2 (01:02):
I'm winning.
Speaker 3 (01:03):
Okay, wins though only when he wins. He reminds me
of someone I know really well. He's kind of like
I've already called him the John Morant of radio broadcasting.
He is, but there's another comp for for Ben. And
now that he was talking, it just hit me.
Speaker 2 (01:24):
He's like my former teammate Jay Cutler because because Jake
Tuler would only talk to the media we had a game.
When he had a good game, would come on an
NFL you gotta talk to me. Hey, listen, I'm telling
you man NBA two. Yes. But that's that's that's that's been.
Speaker 1 (01:42):
All right, fine Broncos country tonight, Nick first in the
Hall of Famer, Steve al or grest Smith back there
apparently smoking Jay Cutler over here on the microphone.
Speaker 2 (01:50):
That's you.
Speaker 1 (01:52):
I will absolutely take it when I lose, but I'm
spiking that thing. I'm taking credit when I win, like
when I lose, I got problem accounability. But I have
absolutely taken my victory.
Speaker 2 (02:02):
Lafts. Nobody's running victory lap for you. Apparently you weren't
surprised about the victory either. I wasn't. I was not.
I had faith all you doubters, you hated you.
Speaker 3 (02:13):
Listen camera and Ben's home when he was watching the game.
He wasn't as confident then as he is. Rails to
see if they all chewed off. I'm mad take care
of myself. Then the game was spectacular. I I it
(02:34):
was kind of a toss up when you really think
about it, because there's two things working now. You will say, well,
if okay s were to win, you would say, well,
the Nuggets going to game seven games, they.
Speaker 2 (02:45):
Were a little tired. They were a little exhausted.
Speaker 3 (02:46):
One day off, right, and then you say, okay, well
if the Nuggets won, well, okay, see had a long layoff,
they were.
Speaker 2 (02:54):
A little rusty.
Speaker 3 (02:54):
Talked about that yesterday. I'm not going to say that
at all. To me, it was one hell of a game.
Definitely a game and all you need was and it
was kind it kind of got.
Speaker 1 (03:04):
Front because in the fourth quarter when Nicole picked up
that fifth foul, and like, bro, can't play defense and
they're leaving it in and I'm sitting there, like, Bro,
you got sub DeAndre Jordan in for a couple of minutes,
so you could have Nicole's officer.
Speaker 2 (03:14):
They didn't. They just rolled the dice and rolled.
Speaker 3 (03:16):
And the fact that and this is why I figured
that maybe Ben was biting his nails when ched Holmer
was at the stripe, Oh my god, he.
Speaker 2 (03:23):
Missed the first one. We miss the first one was
like my eyes lit up.
Speaker 4 (03:28):
I was like, oh, I got this, and he missed
the second one.
Speaker 3 (03:33):
And in this series there are there are a lot
of characters, but for me, this one guy who's always
taking it on the chin, and it's Russ Westbrook. We
talked about it and how fitting was it. Christian Brown
got the rebound, kicked it out to Russ. Russ like
like a kid on you know, just candy. He just
(03:53):
pushed it up the court. Somehow I don't understand. Okay,
see was so slowly getting back and leave Aaron Gordon
on the right the left wing to knock down the
three point shot. And to me, Aaron going and saved
the bacon for the Nuggets, not once, but twice.
Speaker 2 (04:09):
He did it the last night, and he did it
with the dunk. Held it, dude, I'll tell you what.
Speaker 1 (04:13):
I went through the entire range of emotions, like the
entire spectrum in that span of like eight seconds.
Speaker 2 (04:21):
When Christian Brown pulls the board down, I'm like, yet,
my eyes light up. I'm yes.
Speaker 1 (04:24):
Then I see Jamal Murray over there in the corner
like not really doing anything, just sitting over at the
corner like no, and he has seen Christian Brown.
Speaker 4 (04:31):
With you to pass up to Russ and I'm like,
oh no, I see Russ like drive it to the
center and I'm like and then he like kicks it
over to Gordon to take the thread like you only
need two, like the whole thing and it snaps the
net and I'm like, no on my hands.
Speaker 2 (04:46):
I'm like, I no doubt, I do it the whole time.
Speaker 3 (04:48):
What you know, it was in insane game and it
was reminiscent for me. Where you look at what today's
NBA is, it's that up and down pays like you
know what my miked and Tony pace up and down.
No one plays, no one plays. And I mean they
both teams shot a lot of threes, a lot of threes.
Speaker 2 (05:10):
I think people think they plan on that or do
you think it's just the game? Fold is absolutely that's
who they are.
Speaker 1 (05:18):
The mathematicians have gotten into basketball, and they will tell
you it is absolutely in your best interest to just
continue jacking up threes, even if you miss them.
Speaker 2 (05:25):
You will come out ahead. Okay, see shot forty three threes?
Forty three? You know you know they made fifteen of
them and you were off. He's got listen.
Speaker 3 (05:35):
I love the level of intensity, level excitement that we
see on these NBA games. But man, I can't help,
but the child and me want old school basketball.
Speaker 1 (05:44):
Yeah, you know what, when the Pacers used to play,
Revy would make two or three three pointers in a game,
and it was like a big thing.
Speaker 2 (05:51):
But you had that, you had a down low you had.
Speaker 1 (05:52):
The Rick Smith's and the yeah Charles Oakley, you know
down low, those kind of battle.
Speaker 2 (05:58):
You don't see that anymore.
Speaker 3 (05:59):
No, it was kind of like a basic Nicola Yolk game, right,
that's old school basketball.
Speaker 1 (06:05):
And somehow he had forty two points. By the way,
it was like the quietest points.
Speaker 5 (06:09):
I've ever seen. That guy is incredible and he can
do it anyway. He can beat you on inside. He
can go and just shoot a three point for a
three pointer from almost half court, like.
Speaker 2 (06:21):
It doesn't even look like he's aiming.
Speaker 1 (06:23):
No he doesn't, but it's just it's like he had
forty two points in twenty two boards, which is an
astronomical stat line.
Speaker 2 (06:29):
And it felt like a bad game.
Speaker 3 (06:31):
Yes, Like hars Stein was in his face and he
pulls the ball bag and looks like he's reaching back
like he's about to pull a lot of shotguns or something,
and he just just shoot the ball.
Speaker 1 (06:41):
There's no way that's going like a rainbow. It's like
a Russell Wilson.
Speaker 2 (06:48):
That didn't even Yes, it's phenomenal.
Speaker 3 (06:51):
What that says to me is that the international players
athletically are far superior, not fundamentally sound than American basketball.
Speaker 2 (07:06):
Not of them. We got better general generalization.
Speaker 4 (07:09):
I mean, wait, wait, we make better athletes.
Speaker 2 (07:13):
They got more fundamental players.
Speaker 3 (07:14):
Yes, they're they're players are fundamentally sound. It's it's out there.
All you have to do is look at the last
couple of m v P s in the league. They're
all European players. All of the European paid players, all
of them them, the last the last I think ndred
percent of them or fundamentally sound, yes, fundamentally sound. See,
(07:38):
we want to play our guys basketball. I got our guys.
Speaker 2 (07:42):
Want to play ISO basketball.
Speaker 1 (07:43):
Russ was James hard and Russ were the last two
to win be an American And we know.
Speaker 2 (07:49):
What but James Harden is he going to drible out
the clock? The clock?
Speaker 1 (07:53):
James like somebody put up a graphic the other day
about players who had below twenty point performances in Game
seven's all time and it was something like it was
something like two from Jordans and three from Kobe or
something like that.
Speaker 2 (08:05):
It's like James Harden.
Speaker 1 (08:06):
Forty two or something some third number that he had
just horrible Game seven.
Speaker 2 (08:11):
Think about the.
Speaker 3 (08:12):
Level of international influence on today's NBA is so big
that we got the euro step.
Speaker 2 (08:20):
We got the euro step. That's been it for a minute.
Then well it's more prevalent now you can just know
what it is, traveling exactly traveling.
Speaker 4 (08:33):
There was like Lebron like rand half court. He ran
half the court with the ball. Rand he took like
nine steps.
Speaker 2 (08:40):
And because it's so common, it's a common.
Speaker 5 (08:45):
Thing in the NBA, like the rest must have got
together and said, look, man, we waste time calling these calls.
Speaker 2 (08:51):
The fans they don't mind it. So I'm like, I'm like,
you could have called two travels and that one one move.
But everyone the euro step.
Speaker 3 (09:00):
I remember watching uh the throwback San Antonio Spurs and
this is obviously in their heyday, and Genobili is there.
Janobile was infamous from doing it. I mean the euro
step something.
Speaker 2 (09:13):
So you got kids now just practicing that in the school.
The euro step.
Speaker 4 (09:22):
I'm sitting here like euro stepping right now, Broet.
Speaker 2 (09:26):
But but but yeah, that's that's trapping. Nicol is phenomenal.
Speaker 3 (09:31):
I mean, what more can we say about him that
we have not said or heard thus far? Just an
extraordinary guy. And here's the here's the biggest thing for me, Steve,
because most of the time, when we see a guy
this talented, sometimes that the idea is that maybe he
may be arrogant, he may be selfish. And Nikola doesn't
(09:52):
seem like that type of player. And even in games
where he doesn't score, he's getting everyone else involved.
Speaker 2 (09:57):
If anything, the knock on him is he's not selfish enough. Yeah,
good thing.
Speaker 5 (10:01):
I mean, you got You've had quite a few guys
who were like, Shaq wasn't selfish?
Speaker 2 (10:05):
One what Shaq wasn't selfish? Me? I'm outstanding me. Jaq
wasn't zelfish? I mean, you don't know the album does
if he's Kobe. You didn't hear what he said about
Kobe call come on man, Jaquish.
Speaker 4 (10:21):
Stay Shaqui game winners and yelled out Derek.
Speaker 2 (10:23):
Fisher instead of coming yes, yeah Kobe, Yeah Kobe.
Speaker 4 (10:26):
Kobe was the most selfish player of all Kobe, Kobe
or Jordan something something to that level of greatness like
that Kobe was that level of greatness that he could
demand to be that selfish.
Speaker 3 (10:38):
But I mean, come on, Kobe, but you have to
wear that hat and be that guy.
Speaker 2 (10:42):
And he was. I mean, he was absolutely that dude.
He was not given for being selfishly.
Speaker 1 (10:47):
But at all time, like honestly, it used to be
Russ Westbrook, like ten years ago.
Speaker 2 (10:51):
Yeah, I probably the most selfish. Let's think about it.
Speaker 3 (10:53):
If you were on a team with a bunch of players,
the game is on the line and it was trying
to figure out who's going to take the list shot.
Speaker 4 (10:59):
We know you selfish though, is that Hey, that's the leader,
that's the that's what, that's what.
Speaker 3 (11:04):
It all depends on how you choose to look at
the situation. Some may view it as being selfish. Others
may view it as here's a guy who's hyper competitive
and he's going to take.
Speaker 5 (11:15):
Over and their clutch they make you have the ability
the ability back because there's a.
Speaker 4 (11:21):
Little bit difference if you're like, I'm the guy, I'm
gonna take the shot and you're not making it.
Speaker 2 (11:24):
Oh yeah, you know.
Speaker 1 (11:25):
I mean there are also guys that had that clutch ability,
that weren't selfish, that weren't big tight like Robert Orriy
big shot Bob. I just mentioned Derk Fisher or you know,
and neither one of those guys was selfish. I mean
their fish Wood selfish, Robert orri would selfish.
Speaker 2 (11:39):
You know. They came in and executed.
Speaker 3 (11:41):
No even Michael and his that hey day, he had
to learn to distribute the ball to someone else because.
Speaker 1 (11:50):
Because by the time Tony Kuk coach had got there
with Pip and co coach and those guys like he'd
learned by that point shoot like John Paxson.
Speaker 2 (11:58):
Okay, so in the clutch, yes, he let them get
not giving because bj Armstrong and packs then won games
for them. Because Michael. Everyone knew Michael's gonna take the
last shot, so they're gonna.
Speaker 4 (12:13):
Trap him triple cover and you kick it off the
triple cover, so he draws.
Speaker 2 (12:20):
The defense and he kicks He got one on one,
of course. I mean he's taking a shot. Yeah, I mean,
think about what he did to Utah.
Speaker 4 (12:27):
I'm just saying I thought you was talking about like,
all right, he's running on the court, he's uncovered or
you know he's got one guy covering and he gets
off to the other.
Speaker 2 (12:38):
He's not gonna no, no, And that's where Kobe got
it from.
Speaker 6 (12:43):
Kobe learns from money like show, I'm taking a shot,
but you can only do that if you are the
guy and you have to make that shot.
Speaker 1 (12:54):
But there is a winner's mentality to that too, as
there's the great fictional coach Jimmy McGinty says, and the replacements.
When games on the line, winners want the ball, Yeah,
you do.
Speaker 3 (13:03):
You want them, You want the ball, You want that
moment in your hands. You don't want to defer to
someone else, and you can you can look at it.
Speaker 2 (13:11):
Steven say, well, is it a little.
Speaker 3 (13:14):
Insecurity because you don't trust anyone else but yourself. You've
made that shot time and time again. Are you willing
to defer to someone else and watch them.
Speaker 2 (13:25):
Not knock down the shot?
Speaker 5 (13:27):
Not knocked down the show? Not not exactly and you
know that, Hey, you've done this a thousand times, thousands
of times. You could close your eyes and I would
wager that, Well, I'm not gonna wager.
Speaker 4 (13:38):
But however, most of his teammates, expecting them to say.
Speaker 1 (13:48):
They know what kind of player is, but you're talking
about Kobe specifically. There were also times Kobe when he
knew that he couldn't get there, that you gave it
to Derek Fisher because Derek Fisher was killer in the
clutch too.
Speaker 3 (13:59):
Yes, and that's what Big Shot Bob knocked down a
lot of shots because he went right to the wing
because he's my spot.
Speaker 2 (14:07):
I'm going to drive down and it's it's a driving kick.
Speaker 3 (14:10):
We've seen it happen so many times in basketball, the
drive and kick.
Speaker 2 (14:15):
And this is why when you look at you.
Speaker 3 (14:17):
Know, Aaron Gordon, Aaron Gordon is now becoming that clutch
player for the Denver Nuggets where you may think that
it might be or should be Nicola Jokic or Jamal Murray.
The way that games are kind of working themselves out.
Speaker 2 (14:31):
He's now this year become that guy.
Speaker 3 (14:34):
And that's why it's going to be all important that
this Nuggets team definitely stay stay healthy. This series is
not over. I'm thinking this this this is gonna be
another seven game series.
Speaker 2 (14:45):
But with Oka.
Speaker 5 (14:46):
See yeah, and they're going this is a big dude. Man,
that's a big.
Speaker 1 (14:50):
Boy, just like with six six Yeah, and he can
he can guard.
Speaker 2 (14:57):
I'm not sure.
Speaker 1 (14:59):
He he's thick for an NBA player, and then that
lean bill he's but he can guard four out of
five positions on the court. I mean you could put
him on most centers, power forwards, you know, in the
three and the two. There's not many points that I would,
you know, because I'll take him off the dribble. But
he can guard four out of five positions on And
there were times when they had him and the Tea
Wolves games on it on edwards at the you.
Speaker 2 (15:16):
Know, the off guard.
Speaker 3 (15:17):
You know, that's that's that's a hard matchup for anybody.
Speaker 1 (15:23):
You kind of wrong for two, Like, it's kind of
makes sense to you know, to do that. It reminds
you of and he's better than him, but it kind
of reminds you of you remember Boris dil Yes, you
know Boris d I used to play.
Speaker 2 (15:33):
He can play all five positions. You know.
Speaker 1 (15:34):
It gives you that versatility on defense to be able
to defend all five positions like that. I always wonder
one thing. I wondered who had the most game winning assists?
Who was the most unselfish player?
Speaker 2 (15:44):
And no one really talks about well, they do talk
because I looked it up. So you know the guy
given an assist?
Speaker 1 (15:50):
Yeah, the game winning assists all time in the modern era,
in the last twenty years, it's NICOLEA.
Speaker 2 (15:55):
Jokic. But in the NBA history, who has the most
game winning assist? And you'll as soon as I say it,
you'll say, but game winning assists? That's yes, okay, because.
Speaker 1 (16:07):
Malone was the dude stocked them alone, I mean, and
then of course they had the corner second, Barron Randall
and all those guys too.
Speaker 2 (16:13):
But yeah, Joss stocked the most game winning.
Speaker 3 (16:16):
John Starnton no short shorts.
Speaker 1 (16:24):
Shorts, way after everybody had.
Speaker 3 (16:26):
They said, like, no, no, no, you need to bring it
up just a little bringing him up, just a little boy.
Speaker 2 (16:31):
Like you can see what color Stockson's brief for. They
don't even have pressing shorts at that points.
Speaker 4 (16:35):
You can tell he had up for a layoff, like
you see the tidy wa on the bottom of the shorts.
Speaker 2 (16:42):
Come on and post me up.
Speaker 4 (16:43):
Back in the day, endorsement deal was spole.
Speaker 2 (16:49):
Oh man, I had to.
Speaker 3 (16:50):
Work maybe two thousand no no, no, no, windows just last year.
Speaker 1 (16:58):
Hang, I'm looking at up right now because can't remember
what I us was still two o three.
Speaker 5 (17:01):
Okay, yeah, come on, man, that's twenty some years ago.
Speaker 2 (17:04):
Doesn't make a difference.
Speaker 1 (17:05):
But my favorite series of all time was when the
Jazz with the Old Heads took on at the time
the Sacramento Kings, which was Chris Weber Jason Williams. It
was like the New Versas and they played old man
dirty basketball the whole series and were frustrating the hell
out of it. Like they were getting so mad because
they'd be pitching their elbows and stock to be like
grinding up all.
Speaker 2 (17:23):
It with their shorts and stuff.
Speaker 1 (17:26):
So like Weber and Waisbrey, they were expected to blow
out the Old Heads and they didn't, and they were
getting so.
Speaker 2 (17:30):
Mad, so mad, man, what are you doing? Yeah?
Speaker 3 (17:35):
And that speaks a lot to the evolution of the
game and how the game has changed so much from
what it used to be. And when I think about
today's game, that's why we see so many of the scores,
the combined scores like two thirty almost too forties, like
in the old.
Speaker 2 (17:54):
NBA that would have never happened.
Speaker 3 (17:56):
And because I'm a defensive person through in I mean,
I love to see great defensive performances. Blocks in the
paint blocks out there on wing defenders. To me, I
want to see a little more of that in today's
game and last night's game between the Thunder and the Nuggets.
To me, it took me back because we got a
little we got a little more of that blocks at
(18:18):
the rim. By the way, you know, how many what's
the most assists John Stock that ever had a game?
Speaker 2 (18:22):
Just before game? In one game, what do you think?
Maybe twenty we'll say eighteen. Okay, First of all, he
had twenty games with more than twenty twenty eight. He
had twenty eight assists in a game he scored twenty points.
Speaker 1 (18:39):
That's crazy, that's ball bestion insane. Yeah, rockus Country and
I gotta hit a break. We'll be back after this.
Several people did text in with some suggestions here pistol
peak most selfish all time.
Speaker 2 (18:51):
There's probably true things and truth to that.
Speaker 1 (18:54):
Although he you know Ai, somebody suggested that Ai was
the most selfish.
Speaker 3 (18:58):
Alan iverson selfish Okay, I don't know. I don't know
about that, but very very interesting. I mean, hey, I
used to jack up some shots, but didn't lead the
league in.
Speaker 2 (19:09):
Assists one year? Or am I wrong on that? I
don't know. Yeah, maybe not, but he did have I
mean he.
Speaker 1 (19:14):
The dude has like several seasons where he averaged like
seven eight assist a game, so it wasn't like he
was doing at all well.
Speaker 3 (19:20):
Once again, AI was a score by nature, right, So
I think when individual thing selfish, they think about the
persona of AI in his clash, like a John Morant
with the association right, because.
Speaker 2 (19:35):
AI classed a lot.
Speaker 3 (19:37):
I mean they change the I guess wardrobe on the
on the bitch, because yeah, to be.
Speaker 2 (19:46):
Fair, to to be fair to the text.
Speaker 1 (19:47):
I mean a I led the league and field goal
attempts like six years six like four out of and
and six out of seven.
Speaker 5 (19:53):
But I got this from a I Oh you got
a no. No, Alan Iverson not lead the band, says
during his career, there's a good passer. His career average
of six point two assists or game wasn't enough to
rank him among them.
Speaker 2 (20:12):
So only six point two. So let's put this in context.
Speaker 3 (20:18):
If we're gonna talk about a player being selfish and
you're gonna throw a name into that equation, what does
that really mean selfish? Are we talking selfish on the
court or the public assumption that the guy is selfish
based on what he does off the court.
Speaker 1 (20:34):
Well, I'm gonna say on the court, although I think
what you're probably right is most people do make an
assumption based on what they see, you know what.
Speaker 2 (20:39):
That kind of stuff.
Speaker 1 (20:40):
I would say, like, if you're a guy who's only
hitting thirty eight percent of your shots, but you're jacking
up a league leading field goal attempts, you're selfish?
Speaker 2 (20:47):
Okay, okay, are.
Speaker 3 (20:52):
But if you but if you that dude, and you've
known for being that dude, obviously you're gonna take.
Speaker 2 (20:57):
A lot of shots.
Speaker 5 (20:58):
Well, sometimes you offen, I bro, don't don't shoot anymore,
got it off.
Speaker 2 (21:06):
But if you're shooting like Nai did this.
Speaker 1 (21:08):
If you're shooting thirty eight point seven percent for the
season and you're leading the NBA in field goal attempts,
you ate off one night, you got a problem.
Speaker 2 (21:16):
At what point? Uh?
Speaker 3 (21:17):
Statistically was that in his career in the in the
good part he was still in Philly.
Speaker 2 (21:21):
Okay, Well, he was the type of guy he talk
about six seven years in. He's gonna fill up the bucket.
Speaker 3 (21:27):
I mean, he's gonna take those shots because Philly at
that time they needed him to take those shots, like
when he came in to join the Nuggets. I mean,
it was great when he took some shots, but he
didn't really need to take all the shots because there
was other talented players who were on the rocks he could.
Speaker 1 (21:41):
I mean, he didn't lead a league in field goal
attempts when he came to Denver, and that's probably why
the other guys to take. He did lead the league
in minutes played, yes, but he didn't. You know, he
led the league in field goal attempts like six out
of seven straight years back in from ninety eight to
like four, and he had two seasons there where he
shot below forty percent. I mean he shot thirty nine
point eight percent one oh two and he shot thirty
eight point seven percent three four. Now, he was an
All Star that year because he put up raw numbers.
(22:03):
But bro, you're shooting thirty eight percent from the field
and you're leading the league in attempts, somebody got I
think you could.
Speaker 3 (22:10):
Look at some of the more top players in the
NBA and you can see where they're taking a lot
of shots, and they're known for that, and they're scrowing
a lot, and I can easily see how some fans
would consider those individuals to be selfish, like Donovan Mitchell,
Donovan mischief is a walking bucket, right and I can
easily see him in the transition three just walk up
(22:30):
and take the shot because he's capable of We've seen
him do it before. So I think we have to
be really delicate when we talk about selfish players.
Speaker 2 (22:39):
Steve, if you ever played with a.
Speaker 3 (22:41):
Guy in football and any level that you felt he
was selfish and he was just kind of thought about himself.
Speaker 4 (22:47):
Oh yeah, mostly the receivers, defensive guys, both of them.
Speaker 5 (22:53):
Receivers see the question. None of their receivers. Yeah, you know,
I'm not gonna say any name, but you can tell
me the break. You know, there were several you know that, hey,
they wanted the ball. I don't care what the situation was,
they give me the ball. You know, you know they
(23:13):
got had good hands, you know, but they wanted the ball.
And I'm like, I am I right with that.
Speaker 2 (23:19):
I rather you want the ball.
Speaker 4 (23:20):
And you're like, don't get But sometimes it got.
Speaker 2 (23:26):
To be a distraction for the office when you know
they're not they.
Speaker 1 (23:29):
Give me the dag on the ball, man, you know,
I mean in Minnesota, had the Randy ratio, you know,
I mean, Randy Moss was worth it.
Speaker 2 (23:37):
But I say, throw me the damn ball. And Wayne
was cold.
Speaker 4 (23:43):
That's the thing I'm like, I see if Wayne would
have been a scrub, Wayne Gribette was cold, Yeah he was.
Speaker 3 (23:50):
But you're talking about Keyshawn Johnson at that time, coming
from California, USC, wanting to be the face, wanting to
get every single possession. Like most people say, Well, Terry
Owens were selfish, right, And I always tell people say, look,
I never had a chance to play with Tarol. If
I did, and and I had to choose, yes, yes
(24:12):
I'm choosing.
Speaker 2 (24:13):
But Shine was that way too. But it's like you
also have Wayne.
Speaker 5 (24:18):
If if if Wayne, I said, Wayne was, would have
been a bad player.
Speaker 2 (24:22):
I can see. All right, Well, I understand.
Speaker 3 (24:24):
Said Wayne is still on my shine. He's still on
my spotlight. I know you played in New York City.
Speaker 2 (24:30):
It's only spotlight for one person, one person.
Speaker 4 (24:32):
Only, like eighty k from five hot beats, they both
could have got in loved there.
Speaker 2 (24:38):
Not not from from that standpoint exact. It's my team.
I want people to talk about me, right, Yes, that's
why that's part. That's part of who he is. But
you know you you played with Rod, you played with
Ed McCaffrey to to to these guys.
Speaker 5 (24:56):
But when they get that ball, yes, they gonna catch
it and they gonna do what they can do, what
they got to do.
Speaker 2 (25:01):
That was Wayne was doing more with it when he
got it too. Yeah, Wayne was I'm telling you Wayne
was nice.
Speaker 1 (25:05):
Wayne was getting fourteen point four perception while Keyshan was
getting thirteen point six on the other side.
Speaker 2 (25:10):
Dude, I see and I heard the key shot of
the interviews.
Speaker 4 (25:12):
He's like, uh, hey, you see all these other superstars.
They got great player, Jerry Rice got John Taylor, and
I don't know, maybe after.
Speaker 2 (25:20):
That Tim Brown on the other side. Yeah, yeah, yeah, Look,
come on, man, look what I got.
Speaker 5 (25:24):
I'm like, bro, what's what do you say that? I
don't what are you saying that that? I'm that's different
from what I see Wayne.
Speaker 2 (25:30):
Keveg had more more yards per touch caught the ball.
Speaker 1 (25:32):
Morall hit a sixty five percent point reception rate, where
Keyshot at fifty five percent.
Speaker 3 (25:36):
Hey listen, key, Shawn didn't want Wayne to steal his Shawn.
Speaker 2 (25:39):
Yeah, I remember we were in practice and.
Speaker 5 (25:44):
Wayne Quebec, you know, we're running office versus defense, ones
versus one.
Speaker 2 (25:50):
He's trying to block me.
Speaker 4 (25:51):
I'm like, broop, I'm gonna give you the business.
Speaker 2 (26:00):
And so I had to have to get to give
him that elbow to the neck. Man, I'm like, bro you.
Then he's after that brother law. Yeah yeah, man, wait,
he's a breakout of the man. That was my guy?
That was that was? That was it? Because that was
whn't uh didn't Charlie weis run the offense? Then? Yeah?
I sure did.
Speaker 1 (26:15):
Yeah, Charlie got a memory. Yeah, I was like trying
to go back and remember that was Charlie. Think Testa
Verdi running the QB or was it Chad Pennington? Then no, No,
Chad came after Testa Verdi. Yeah it was he tos
Uh No, he tore his achilles that year.
Speaker 2 (26:30):
Was that the year?
Speaker 1 (26:31):
Oh yeah, that's the the Ray Lucas Lucas Tom Tuba
have to come in and play quarterback. Well he did
for he was a punk for the punter. He came in,
threw two touchdowns that year.
Speaker 2 (26:42):
What Yeah, I don't remember that. Yeah, he threw two
touchdowns and U that year. But it was Ray Ray
Ray Lucas right and Rick Meyer. Meyer played six games
that year.
Speaker 1 (26:52):
Yeah, because Meyer, uh, because Lucas came in and he
was playing pretty well and then I think he got
her or something and Meyer came in. Well, I mean,
relatively speaking, Meyer played horribly because Meyer was like five touchdowns,
nine picks or something like that. It was like awful. Yeah,
Meyer came in and played six games. It was terrible.
Speaker 3 (27:10):
But you know what you know, fellas, I think it
does come a time, depending on the team that you're on,
where it may call for you to be selfish, right,
because you can be selfless up to a certain point
in the game, and you see it as though there's
no momentum, there's no energy, there's no juice, and you
can scream and shout all you want to on the sideline,
but then it's just like, well, someone's got to make
(27:31):
a play as.
Speaker 2 (27:32):
A defensive player. Cand a defensive player be somelfish. I mean,
if you try to chase stats.
Speaker 1 (27:36):
I think so if you guys, if you give it up,
run contained to go chase the sack or someone you
get them contained to go go go. Well, what you're.
Speaker 2 (27:44):
Talking about right now, that's a that's Troy Pola.
Speaker 1 (27:46):
Mabel well, if.
Speaker 2 (27:51):
Defensive in mind, but I'm missing with that. I'm just saying,
if you're giving.
Speaker 1 (27:55):
Up contained to chase the sacks or something like that,
or if you're Yeah, the Chiefs used to have a corner.
Speaker 2 (27:59):
He's prett Sean Smith or he was a gambler.
Speaker 1 (28:01):
Though he wanted the interception, he'd give up his man
to try the interception.
Speaker 2 (28:04):
Sometimes it works the pay.
Speaker 3 (28:06):
I played with some some guys who were really selfish.
This is why I've always hated Cover two because corners
they're not going to get the jam because they're looking
for the quick outlet. I want to tie the running
back and they sell you out on the deep rock
because you got a vertical coming up inside the hashes
and one outside. So no matter where it's caught, if
(28:28):
you're in the frame, it's your fault. So I had
some corners. I will not say this particular corner the name,
but I knew that he was constantly thinking about ways
that he can get paid, and the only way he
can get paid was getting interceptions right, And I used
to get so mad. We were in cover too. He
doesn't get the jam, and he's trying to take the
guy in the flat and when I say, you know what,
(28:49):
if a guy catched the ball on me, I found
a way to pay him back on run plays.
Speaker 2 (29:02):
How we played today, I'm gonna take you to the run.
There's no bounce text line. Man, Uh yeah, you're right.
The seven to two O talk about Iverson calling him
he was a point shooter. That was the reason.
Speaker 1 (29:13):
That was the reason that he you know herying to
get right, trying to get his points. So, yeah, I agree.
I had a couple of others come in. Uh is
Anthony Miller selfish?
Speaker 2 (29:23):
Yes? And the selfish Uh yeah.
Speaker 3 (29:28):
I mean from the i'dn't played with Anthony Miller, but
from the players I know who played with him when
I arrived, there were just certain guys that they talked about,
and he was one of those guys.
Speaker 2 (29:40):
He wont that ball now, yes, and Anthony was. He
was a great player too.
Speaker 5 (29:45):
I mean I remember when he was with the Chargers
before he came over with the Broncos and man hesed
because the spits boy.
Speaker 1 (29:52):
Yeah, uh see he is Shiloh selfish talking about I guess,
I don't know.
Speaker 2 (30:00):
I just don't understand how. I don't know how he'd
answer that. As safety can be selfish? Can safety be selfish?
Speaker 1 (30:05):
I mean, I guess if you're gambling on your assignment
to you want to gamble on something.
Speaker 2 (30:11):
Eddie Kennison is a selfish guy.
Speaker 1 (30:13):
And any Stonehands I called him just gill Hands was
trying to catch a ball between two frying pans.
Speaker 2 (30:18):
I had all the speed in the world, all the
speed in the world, but.
Speaker 4 (30:21):
Man, he looked like he was trying to catch the
ball between two frying pants.
Speaker 3 (30:24):
Trying to I can tell you this, depending on what
group of Broncos players that you're around, you throw that
name out there, man, you.
Speaker 2 (30:35):
Will get Yeah, absolutely, you will. Absolutely.
Speaker 1 (30:39):
Everybody does not have an opinion of Eddiekennison, one opinion
of the other.
Speaker 2 (30:43):
Nobody's middle round on Eddie Kennison.
Speaker 3 (30:46):
But I do believe that it is like moments of
the game that you may have to be selfish, You
may have to go out and take a game over
because you realize whatever's being called, whatever's supposed to be done,
is it being done in those moments.
Speaker 2 (31:01):
I wouldn't view that as being selfish.
Speaker 3 (31:05):
Is like, I mean, your your drive to win is
bigger than the idea of like being comfortable with losing
because there's some people okay with losing as leasy as that.
Speaker 1 (31:15):
Sound, as long as they got theirs, and that would
be the definite selfish to me.
Speaker 2 (31:19):
Right, he was like that.
Speaker 1 (31:23):
I think the first person in the NFL to run
like for to eight on their for like officially fortunately eight,
not like you know, some guy rand he.
Speaker 2 (31:30):
Ran the fourth weight out of Denver right to Kansas City.
Well yeah, but he also scored twelve on the Wonder Lake.
Stop stop, come on, man, stop that Hall of Fame
quarterbacks who scored? Man? You know, like you get what
is like the best scorer? You just it's like fifty
(31:51):
damn twelve? Yeah. I think then rise Is Patrick scored
like a forty four, forty nine, Ryan Fitzpatrick, Yeah, Ryan Fitzpatrick,
Alex Smith, they scored like perfect scores on it. I
think I took one and I got a forty nine.
Speaker 3 (32:04):
I never liked that test, you know why. It's just
that that's all it is. And I don't even remember
it well to see.
Speaker 2 (32:14):
If you look at it. Yeah, I mean I took it.
Speaker 3 (32:16):
But the thing about is that not everyone is great
at tests taking, and when you're under the gun like that,
it makes it difficult because you're trying to answer every
single question, but they tell you don't try to answer
every single question, and they use it as a barometer
determine whether players or how can players operate under stressful tradition?
(32:39):
And I'm like, well, no, when you're on the field,
I don't remember anyone throwing a piece of paper at me.
Speaker 2 (32:45):
Right, I've but to score here, a score here.
Speaker 3 (32:53):
But that idea is that that test does not predict
the way that it doesn't be because you're, in my mind,
you're measuring two different things.
Speaker 1 (33:03):
It's supposed to measure how quick you process things, but
nowadays like they didn't use it anymore, but it's supposed
to measure how quick you process things, right, and so
like on the field, how quickly you processed it.
Speaker 2 (33:11):
But it's really not And there was no correlation.
Speaker 1 (33:13):
The only position group that had any correlation between wonderlick
scorre and success was corner and it was an inverse correlation,
meaning the lower you scored on it, the better you
probably did in the NFL.
Speaker 2 (33:23):
And that what Yeah, that was crazy about the test
that I found out, like no correlation for any other position.
Speaker 3 (33:29):
Yeah, it was really biased because for certain teams if
you tested too high. Some teams liked it. Other teams
use it against you because they say, well, you made
too much.
Speaker 2 (33:38):
You have ability to overthink things and make question authority. Yep,
they use it against crazy.
Speaker 5 (33:44):
It's crazy. That's crazy. I bet he's going high. Man
and Crack was probably one of the one of the
smartest cornerbacks I've played with.
Speaker 2 (33:53):
Was Ray Crockett. Yeah, yeah, you had problems with him
and Cover two never never.
Speaker 5 (33:59):
But when Wade Phillips got there, this is well when
Wave Films was there my rookie year.
Speaker 2 (34:05):
Uh, he was the defense coordinator in.
Speaker 5 (34:07):
That The rule that he had was in Cover two,
the corner has to get a jam if the receiver
is trying to release outside.
Speaker 2 (34:16):
If he doesn't guess.
Speaker 5 (34:17):
What the cornerback has him, that's your man.
Speaker 1 (34:21):
Than you, and that's that's you're responsible for him. And
so that put wait hold on, let me back up,
because I don' want to make sure clear you're saying wads.
Wade's rule was if the receiver comes off the line
of the outside, it's a it's a jam and release
to the safety. He comes inside the corners riding up
the scene right to the linebacker. Yeah, yeah, okay, right,
all right, make sure I was confused there.
Speaker 5 (34:41):
But the thing is, you know how some guys, if
the receiver tries to really released outside, they let him
go because they're looking for number two in the flat.
Speaker 4 (34:48):
Yes, well he wasn't. He didn't allow that. You got
to jam that guy and run with them and then look.
Speaker 2 (34:55):
Back and then right versus you know versus. Yeah, I mean,
then they got go the way it was that. Yeah,
not that I played but one snap of defense.
Speaker 1 (35:04):
But like you know, the rule for three steps on
the cover, it's you gotta ride that jam, and you
gotta ride it three steps before you're fighting back.
Speaker 2 (35:11):
Tell you my rule was, if.
Speaker 3 (35:13):
You let him go looking for the back in the flat,
I'm hitting you and your gay.
Speaker 2 (35:17):
Go through you. I mean I love yeah, yeah, yes,
because we're a team. You can't hang me out.
Speaker 3 (35:27):
The drive because you're looking at your personal status. No,
So since you do that, and then when when when?
Because at the end of the game, I got to
get the phone calls from from from dudes I grew
up with, like, hey man, they got you.
Speaker 2 (35:39):
On that one. No, nope, if I'm gonna get it,
you're gonna get it too. It's just a little reminder,
that's all. If a guy got past.
Speaker 5 (35:48):
You somehow, whether it's through a pass or run, you
couldn't catch up.
Speaker 2 (35:52):
Would you sprint all the.
Speaker 5 (35:53):
Way to the end zone? And they say you're getting
the picture? You in the picture?
Speaker 3 (35:59):
Yeah, I'm gonnae of everything unless I got now one
thing I wasn't doing. I'm I wasn't gonna run and
then at the two yard line to try to dive
and swipe out and by that time it's it's too late.
Speaker 5 (36:09):
Yeah, yeah, yeah, I'm not good too.
Speaker 2 (36:13):
I was like that too. I've seen some guys, you know,
just give up.
Speaker 4 (36:17):
Even if even there on the other side of the field,
the guys take off.
Speaker 5 (36:20):
Running, they just walking like bro, you gotta, you gotta
you just never know going to happen.
Speaker 4 (36:25):
Right, they cut back and that ten ten yard burst
at the start and finish it.
Speaker 2 (36:30):
You could have saved the touchdown, could have saved the touchdown.
Speaker 1 (36:33):
Was there ever any extra incentive to go after the
selfish guys on offense on opposing team, like you knew
they were selfish? So it kind of wounds you up
to be like, all right, I know where the ball's
going I wouldn't.
Speaker 5 (36:45):
Say selfish players. I would say guys who just were
great players. You just you know, you got up.
Speaker 1 (36:51):
I mean, obviously you get up for good players, but
like anybody who had the attitude though that me first attitude.
Is there any extra like, Oh, I'm gonna take this
guy out to you quat you wants the ball, all right,
I'm gonna.
Speaker 3 (36:58):
Make it so he doesn't want the fun The funniest
thing ever, like like Randy Moss could have dominated receiving
an NFL if he played every single play, but but
we knew if he wasn't running really fast, the ball
was not coming to him at all.
Speaker 2 (37:15):
That's how a majority of the receivers were. That's how
that's that's what I ran for my run pass key back.
Speaker 5 (37:28):
I know you're not getting the ball because that's a
part of being selfish.
Speaker 4 (37:32):
Exactly when you want the ball, you're gonna haul, but
offlag you're going.
Speaker 5 (37:35):
To run, and when you don't, then you're gonna you're
gonna loaf, you know what.
Speaker 3 (37:38):
That's that was amazing thing about playing for the Denver
Broncos because Mike Shanahan was infamous, like if you don't
block and you don't.
Speaker 2 (37:46):
You know every plays to any other guy. Alex Gibbs,
Oh my god, if if you if you loaf and
a running back gets caught, you're gonna get an ear
full of gis Well. That's why it was cool to
hear when Pat Bryant got drafted.
Speaker 1 (37:58):
We did the interview with him or whatever one of
the first thing and Nick was asking him to the
first thing he let a.
Speaker 2 (38:01):
No block, no rock, Like this guy sounds like he's cold.
Speaker 5 (38:07):
Man.
Speaker 1 (38:08):
Yeah, he's got the block, he's got the edge she got,
he's ready.
Speaker 2 (38:11):
To I watched some of his highlights. Man. Man, he's
a big boy, got great hands, he's open. Quarterback is
a bomb, dude.
Speaker 4 (38:18):
Like I'm not trying to be that dude, but that
quarterback is a bomb.
Speaker 2 (38:22):
Yeah.
Speaker 1 (38:23):
That I'm like, I'm looking because I finally after they
drafted him, like I've seen, like, you know, some broadcast stuff,
I started watching the tape on the studio.
Speaker 2 (38:28):
And I'm like, bro, this, how is this guy the
FBS quarterback? And see I like that Brian for the
room because if he.
Speaker 3 (38:36):
Plays and comes here, plays the same way he played
in college, and he brings that same attitude that he
had when we interviewed him. It's going to force other
guys in that receiver room who might have just just
going about their business. It's going to force them to
kind of elevate their play because I.
Speaker 2 (38:54):
Mean, he's coming in terms of block and overrun.
Speaker 3 (38:58):
Because that's the way that should be when they bring
those guys in. There shouldn't be any guys who are
comfortable in the room. You should make every single guy
think about what they're doing. That's why it's going to
be important to see a lot of these rookies and
Pat Bryan being one of those guys perform this week
in the Broncos Rickie Minicamp.
Speaker 1 (39:15):
Does everybody look you like out of this draft classic
you really really want to see?
Speaker 2 (39:19):
Sha obviously, you know, I think everybody wants to see.
Is there anybody you like just dying to see? Yeah?
I want to see the running back.
Speaker 4 (39:26):
Yeah.
Speaker 1 (39:27):
Bothers me when people call him small. He's short. He
is not SMARTA That dude is spelt thick.
Speaker 2 (39:31):
He's like m J D.
Speaker 3 (39:32):
He's below to the ground, but he built thick. Look
man for me, uh and I put this out uh
last week. He reminds me of Ray Rice.
Speaker 2 (39:40):
Yeah.
Speaker 3 (39:41):
For the Baltimore Ravens. He he was short and hype,
but he was thick and he had the ability to
run through guys.
Speaker 5 (39:49):
So yeah, that'd that'd been a great running back room too.
Come on, man, Jalil McLoughlin. Estimate, Come on, man, we
just need to estimated.
Speaker 1 (39:56):
Pick it up a little bit, not you know, get
hang on the rock and pick it up a little
bit on the on them early downs, because that's what
that's what you're going to see in the you know,
once your season starts. You see he asked me on
first down, and then you start working Harvey En whether
or not he takes over, you know, however many downs
he takes over, depending on the success of those guys.
Speaker 5 (40:10):
But you always got to have two or three really
good backs anyway.
Speaker 1 (40:14):
Well yeah, I agree, but I mean, Sean Payton really
loves having you know, two or three guys.
Speaker 3 (40:18):
I would love to see the Broncos at JK. Dobbins
or Chubbs.
Speaker 2 (40:24):
Voice in that room, voice in that room.
Speaker 5 (40:26):
Yes, yeah, I just want to Nick Chubb his second
knee surgery.
Speaker 1 (40:33):
It's just third actually, I mean to go back and
look Tip dating back to college.
Speaker 2 (40:37):
He's but he's if you've seen he's been posted workout videos.
You can seeing his workout videos.
Speaker 1 (40:41):
Say the thing about it look like he's back.
Speaker 2 (40:44):
We'll see you got put the pads on.
Speaker 1 (40:46):
But I mean this dude's leaping over stuff and and
all this kind of stuff.
Speaker 2 (40:48):
And I like that because now he has something to prove.
Speaker 3 (40:52):
That is the part that drives the player, that makes
him dangerous when he feels as though everyone is throwing
him to the curve and he has something to prove.
Speaker 2 (40:59):
Yeah, Nick.
Speaker 5 (41:01):
At full speed when he's healthy, he's like, yeah, similar to.
Speaker 2 (41:08):
But you know he's a he's a game changer. Think
about what that would do for both.
Speaker 3 (41:16):
He's not, but just hypothetically thinking once again, because it's
all about improving the production of bo Nick's right, imagine
having a running back room similar to what it was
when when you play, When I play, there's a stable
of guys you can go to at any time.
Speaker 2 (41:33):
Right, And I hate.
Speaker 3 (41:35):
To say this, but I'm going to do it just
for this this this case. But everyone's talking about Joker
after Sean Payton mission. It ideas you just need dynamic playmakers,
That's that's all it is. And have a running back
room where you have about four guys that are interchangeable.
Speaker 2 (41:50):
Man, that's like Mike Tyson just pushing you in the
face over there. Be activated though active on game day,
but you got the options are arrest the guy.
Speaker 1 (42:01):
Will we get caught up getting them injuries here, We're
gonna keep rotating him through. I think that'd be the
ideal type situation. But yob, he's only played one hundred
and thirty snaps over the last two seasons. Yeah, you
know that's that you got to give.
Speaker 5 (42:13):
The heads off that training squad boy, the right boy.
Speaker 1 (42:17):
I'm all for add Nick Chubb in the room. I
think they need that kind of bruiser. A guy could
pick you up short yards at a veteran mentor to
that room because I think that's what's Look if we
can if you can have.
Speaker 3 (42:25):
On defense, a third guy is a third down specialist.
Why can't you have a guy like that first? Specially Yes,
with the Giants they had when I was growing up,
they had Dave Maggott.
Speaker 2 (42:33):
Yeah, and he was just third down.
Speaker 3 (42:35):
Yeah, and he's excelled at third down. So you can
do the same thing with the with the Larry Centers
used to be that dude fall back to yeah, you know,
he used to be that.
Speaker 2 (42:43):
Kind of guy. Stevens.
Speaker 4 (42:45):
It's great to have you and his always man looking forward.
Speaker 2 (42:47):
To chatting it up with you here again, so I
absolutely appreciate you guys. All right, Broncleus Cutcher night back
after this
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