Episode Transcript
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Speaker 1 (00:02):
iHeartMedia Presents CEOs you should know.
Speaker 2 (00:06):
I have John Dinkele, founder and CEO of Dentkele Business
Development and former president publisher of the Baltimore Business Journal.
This is Iheartradios CEOs you should know, and I'm here
today with Rob Skinner, CEO of Offit Kerman. Welcome Robin,
Thanks for being here.
Speaker 1 (00:20):
Thanks John, really really excited to be here.
Speaker 2 (00:22):
Yeah, I really appreciate you taking the time and looking
forward to learning a little bit more about OFFA Kerman
And maybe we'd start there. Actually, for those who may
not be familiar, could you tell us about Offit Kerman.
Speaker 1 (00:33):
So AfOR Kerman is a full service law firm. We're
focused on serving the privately held businesses and families of
wealth that typically own those businesses, and we act as
specialty counsel to select large businesses and some institutional clients
as well. So we were founded here in Baltimore in
nineteen eighty seven by two brothers, Ted and Maurice Offitt,
(00:55):
and they were joined shortly thereafter by a colleague, Howard Kerman,
and from there we've grown to the firm we are
today with two hundred and seventy five attorneys and about
five hundred and fifty total staff helping to support the
legal and business needs of our clients.
Speaker 2 (01:11):
Fantastic, congratulations. What could you tell us your mission?
Speaker 1 (01:15):
Yeah, our mission has really always been to serve the
legal needs of those private businesses, their owners and our
private wealth clients. And that really started with the founders
Ted Off. It was a business transaction and planning attorney,
his brother Maurice was a estates and planning attorney, and
(01:35):
Howard added employment practice expertise, and so the goal was
always to be that one stop law firm for the
entrepreneurial private business owners and help them grow their business,
hopefully get to a sale event and then generate some
wealth and have some personal state needs as well. And
(01:56):
from there we've added another multitude of actice areas that
really help us to continue to fill that need and
complete that mission. And over the years it's evolved a
little bit from being less of a client focus on
the business side and more of an attorney focus. So
now a lot of our time and attention is spent
on finding those attorneys who want to serve those target
(02:19):
clients and helping to support them grow their practices so
they can deliver those quality services to the clients that
we still focus on in that privately home market space.
Speaker 2 (02:29):
That's great. That's great. Yeah, And having known your firm
for for quite a while, going back to oh gosh,
all the way back to my bonder of business journal days.
You know, alf of Uraman is kind of very entrepreneurial
in nature, and it seems to always have had that
kind of perception. And you know, something about what you
do know is that would you would you say that's
(02:51):
one of your core values and so like, did you
talk about that a little bit?
Speaker 1 (02:55):
Absolutely, our entrepreneurial spirit. It's a foundation of who we
are and the vision that was set out from the
very beginning. So it's been a big part that's guided
the firm and helped us, i think, really to connect
with those entrepreneurial clients that we're looking to serve. And
(03:16):
it's really been refreshing as a professional manager who doesn't
have a background in legal coming in and finding a
law firm that's willing to act on opportunities to create value,
to innovate, take risks, and operate as a business. It's
been fantastic and I think it is one of the
(03:36):
things that continues to set off a Kerman apart from
a lot of other firms, having that core value of
the organization and our management team.
Speaker 2 (03:45):
Yeah, that's great. I appreciate sharing that. Could you give
us a quick rundown of the practice areas you have.
I know you serve a lot of different clients on
the commercial side of thing and in different ways, so
you know, give us just maybe a quick rundown of
some of those practice areas and maybe you know what
practicers you see the most growth in these days.
Speaker 1 (04:04):
Yeah. Absolutely, So we have a full service litigation team
for commercial and general litigation needs, a robust business law
both planning and transaction side. We have creditors' rights and
bankruptcy as well as banking expertise, real estate and land use,
(04:25):
and on the private side everything from family law and
matrimonial to estates and trusts and a number of other areas.
So again the idea is really that full service commercial
law firm. So we'll stay away from personal injury, we'll
stay away from criminal, but everything else we tend to
(04:47):
have expertise in the areas that we can help whatever
may come our clients' ways in their legal needs and
from a growth point of view. We see a ton
of growth in our litigation areas as well as the
estates and trust and real estate. So that's been been
organically an area where we've seen a lot of growth
(05:09):
in the past year. And then you know, on the
inquisitive side, we tend to see growth more by region
than practice area, and so we're seeing a lot of
opportunity in New York, Los Angeles, the DC area. There's
been markets that have really been been huge for us
in growth, both in attracting new legal talent as well
(05:33):
as growing our client base.
Speaker 2 (05:35):
So that's great. Yeah, we're going to ask you what
what where are your offices located in any other plans
for expansion. You guys have done a lot of growth
in recent years and I kind of curious, off here's
any other any other states in your forecast?
Speaker 1 (05:50):
Yeah, well, well always and at the Kerban, growth is
always on the horizon. So that's what keeps it interesting here.
So we currently have nineteen offices in ten states and
d c H So being Baltimore born as a firm,
we have a number of offices in the Maryland area,
so Baltimore, BEESDA, Columbia, and Frederick, and then we go
(06:14):
as far north as New York, all the way down
to South Carolina on the East coast, with a number
of locations throughout, and then we have a Southern California
office in downtown Los Angeles that we opened up a
few years ago, So that's the current footprint. Most recently,
we opened an office in Atlanta, Georgia through an affiliation
(06:35):
with a prominent attorney down there. That's been fantastic. We're
seeing a lot of growth opportunities, and yeah, we continue
to see and target growth on the West coast, the southeast,
particularly in Florida, and throughout the rest of the footprints.
There's just a lot of opportunity in both lateral growth,
(06:55):
bringing additional attorneys on and we see firms that are
interested in joining Offit Kerrman for the benefit of the
platform for succession planning and that exists nationwide. So we're
always entertaining new growth opportunities in new markets, which keeps
the job very exciting and engaging.
Speaker 2 (07:14):
Yeah, sounds like it sounds very exciting. I appreciate you
sharing all that. I know we talked about this a
little bit, but who do you consider a good client
for off At Kerman. Yeah, so I.
Speaker 1 (07:25):
Think as we've grown over the years, one of the
things that we've done really well is holding on to
that original vision and mission of serving the privately held marketplace.
And so I think the best clients for Offit Kirman
remain those who look at us as a trusted advisor.
So somebody who may be a business owner, entrepreneur who
(07:48):
can look to us to help them both in their
business needs as well as their private planning. These are
the type of clients that we have multiple practice areas
that can help service them. We develop deep and long
relation ships and again we really become more than just
legal counsel. We become an advisor in their personal and
professional goals and help them achieve them. So I think
(08:10):
that's where we provide the greatest value. Those are some
of the longest client relationships we develop, but we really
we see clients from many different areas that we're able
to help service and develop good relationships with as well.
Speaker 2 (08:26):
That's great, that's great, and you know, you all have
a reputation and kind of perception I guess out there
about your all of the philanthropic efforts that you do
in the communities you serve. Can you talk about that
and talk about the importance of that for offit government.
Speaker 1 (08:45):
Yeah, yeah, that'd be great. So we have primarily two
ways that we try to help support the communities that
we serve, and one is through the individual efforts of
our attorneys and staff. We really we try to help
support them through whether it's contribution of funds or just
(09:06):
general support in their efforts for whatever activities may be
beneficial to their local, regional communities or even more broad communities.
So we have a number of attorneys who have international practices,
who have international backgrounds, and so keeping them connected to
those international routes has been a part of our philanthropic
(09:30):
activities as well. And then several years back we actually
found it the offic Kerman Foundation, and that is a
charitable giving arm of the firm that we leverage to
go ahead and make monetary contributions again local, international. Some
of it is pure aid when natural disasters come through
(09:52):
and some of the areas that are affected in the
communities we serve all the way to supporting some of
the activities again that are attorneys or even our client
its are engaged in that just help benefit whether it's
medical research or aid for communities or access to legal services,
So we try to be broad in our outreach there,
(10:13):
maximize the impact that we can have and again really
connect locally with the communities that mean the most to
our clients and our attorneys.
Speaker 2 (10:22):
That's great, that's great. And yeah, and appreciate the you know,
your commitment to your film topic efforts. That's really important
and as you know, so thank you banks. Switching up
a little bit, I like talking about leadership on the
show and one to ask you, how would you describe
your leadership style.
Speaker 1 (10:42):
I approach leadership in a very collaborative way, so I
try to be somebody who is there to support, make
the most and empower the most out of our people
so that they can sell in their roles. I really
believe in the Steve Jobs approach right hire smart people
that will tell us what to do and enable the
smart people to do good work. So I think that
(11:05):
that's served us well. I try to add value to
the interactions that I have, whether it's with attorneys and
staff or management here and then I think the value
that I bring given my background coming up through technology
initially before getting into business operations, that there's also a
(11:27):
push that I can help help bring in my leadership
style for performance and improvement efforts through innovation, through leveraging
technology in ways that can be transformative to the organization.
So try to bring that approach to conversations with others
here in the organization. But at the end of the day,
(11:48):
I think being a good leader is about supporting the
people who you have surrounded yourself with, trusting that you
surround yourself with the right team, and getting everybody engaged
and pulling in the same direction so that you can
achieve goals of the organization.
Speaker 2 (12:01):
Yeah, that's that's great. I appreciate sharing that. Yeah, And
speaking of technology, how are how are law firms using
artificial intelligence? And you know, these days you hear about
it a lot. A lot of eeos and business owners
are talking about AI and the impact on their businesses.
And my understanding on the law side, obviously, uh, research
(12:23):
and using AI for research is probably not the best thing,
just because the inconsistency. But are there are there ways
that you all are looking at using artificial intelligence to
either help you know the internal operations or even even
client work.
Speaker 1 (12:38):
Yeah, yeah, you know, law firms are somewhat notorious for
being late adopters of many technologies. So you know, there
there's two sides to that. One we lag a little bit,
but two some of the bumps get worked out before
it comes our way for actual implementation. But I think
(12:59):
we all all some of the headlines around hallucinated case
law being cited in CHAT, GPT and others. So it
really made us sit up and pay attention to what's
going on with an AI and what we're seeing and
what we're exploring is both of what you outline, which
(13:19):
is both application on the business side as well as
application in legal service delivery. And so we're on the
early side of piloting and exploring how some of that
can be used. And I think that's where many law
firms seem to be. There are some legal specific tools
out there that are gaining some traction. They're doing some
(13:40):
really amazing and innovative things with what these solutions can
do for whether it's research or helping to idate in
preparation for depositions and trial prep all the way down
to e discovery and some of the more routine things
that attorneys probably dread getting into on a discovery.
Speaker 2 (14:01):
But yeah, it's.
Speaker 1 (14:02):
Been really really interesting to see how it's developing.
Speaker 2 (14:05):
Yeah, it is. Yeah, I think I think any business owner,
CEO or anybody even in the leadership suite is hard
pressed not to be thinking about this and how it's
going to impact their business and not to be left behind,
because you know, it certainly can be and is a
competitive advantage for many companies already. So that's that's that's great.
(14:26):
I appreciate you talking about that. Resilience kind of seems
to be a buzzword these days. I hear it a lot.
You know, what does resilience mean to you and how
do you demonstrate that and leaving your team?
Speaker 1 (14:38):
Yeah, Resilience, to me, I think is really about perseverance.
It's kind of that great intenacity that comes with with
pushing through and adapting and really coming out of any
sort of challenges not just as you were before you
entered them, but even better. And so to me, I
(15:01):
think resilience is really about demonstrating that through through our
ability to adapt as business leaders and show our teams
that we're dependable and we've got an even keel and
going through those and that we're going to come out
on the other side not just surviving, but but thriving
where we can. So I think it's something that that
(15:22):
business leaders have to demonstrate, and you know, to our
conversational AI, it's not even these negative events that may
come up that require some of that resilience. It's the
resilience to weather a changing landscape and technology and and
figure out how we're going to to leverage that and
how we're going to navigate it. Give them some leadership
(15:43):
through that, so that that grit is important. As a leader,
we always have to be able to uh, to push
through and to demonstrate how to operate in those challenging times.
Speaker 2 (15:56):
Agreed, Agreed, Thank you appreciate that. What excited about the
future of off it Kerman, Well.
Speaker 1 (16:02):
Hands down, it's growth, right, Alphit Krman is known as
a growth organization. So I don't think you survive here
with with much tenure if you're not a little bit
of a growth junkie. An addictation of those deals. So
I think that's been been one of the most rewarding
parts and one of the parts I'm looking forward to
(16:23):
the most as we go forward. They're they're always unique.
Every growth opportunity brings with it new challenges as well
as new learnings. Right. I think we believe that we
have a pretty robust and effective platform that we're operating
here at alfhit Krman. But whenever we bring on a firm,
there's new opportunities to learn about how others are operating,
(16:45):
other innovations that they've leveraged, and so you know, it's
not just growth at the firm through headcount and revenue,
it's growth of the management team as well. We all
learn and we grow through those transactions. And I think
the technology side, like we're talking about, was it's AI
or how law firms are leveraging business intelligence, process automation
(17:05):
and even just kind of practice management techniques. There's some
changes in how we're going to deliver legal services that
are on the horizon and those are really exciting as well.
And being a mid sized law firm that has the
opportunity not only to grow, but to leverage some of
those changes and bring them to our target practitioners and clients,
(17:27):
that is really really exciting.
Speaker 2 (17:29):
Yeah, yeah, that is exciting. And on the other side, though,
like what what keeps you up at night?
Speaker 1 (17:35):
The growth? Yea, So it's it's the same on both sides, right,
It's you know, I think the growth has has that
constant change and challenge to what we're doing, So so
that is is a little challenging at times. But we've
also seen in the past few years, and I think
(17:56):
most law firms have seen this, and I think a
lot of other businesses have seen it. Just the competition
for talent has really ed it up. And Althor Kerrman
was one of the early adopters of our growth strategy,
but others have joined in and so now there's a
tight competition for legal and professional talent for sure.
Speaker 2 (18:14):
Yeah, are you seeing this generation, whether it's the millennials
or Gen Z wanting to get into practicing law? Have
you seen that the numbers of students, you know, going
for their law degree. Has that changed over the past
five five years or so? And anyway it has.
Speaker 1 (18:34):
There was a there was a March decrease in law
school enrollment. And we also have a demographic issue on
the other side, which is there's a large group of
attorneys who are reaching the end of their careers with
a narrower pipeline on the front end. So you know,
it's one of those challenges that we're trying to think
(18:55):
through as to how we attract that talent, but also
how do we transition practices in a way that's maybe
innovative and not relying on the same amount of legal
talent that we've had in the past. So it's a
it's a real challenge. And I think what those new
(19:16):
attorneys who are coming out of law school, what they
want is different as well. And I think that's a
generational trend that we see.
Speaker 2 (19:24):
Yeah, it seems I have a niece that's going into
Georgetown Law this fall, and you know, talking with her,
it's there's a different perception of work hours, workload, you know,
where that didn't seem to happen maybe ten or fifteen
(19:44):
or twenty years ago. There was an expectation of kids
coming out of law school that, yeah, they have to learn,
they have to you know, learn the ropes and you know,
work their way up and all those things. And I think,
like a lot of industries, you know, that may be
that a lot of folks and that in this generation,
you know, have a different perception of that.
Speaker 1 (20:05):
I guess, yeah, I think you're you're exactly right, and
a different expectation for what a career and career fulfillment means. So, uh,
the legal has always been an apprenticeship model, and so
how we we adapt to that and and help to
bring up that next generation in a way that's fulfilling
(20:27):
for them but also meets the objectives of the law
firm has a business. It's a real challenge and one
that I'm happy, happy that we're not alone in facing
and legal for sure.
Speaker 2 (20:39):
Yeah, yeah, that's great. I appreciate you talking about that
well to to kind of wrap things up. Is there
anything else you'd like our listeners know about you and
off It Kerrman.
Speaker 1 (20:48):
You know, I think about off It Kerrman. It's it's
really you know, we're we're an opportunity driven organization. I
think that gets back to that entrepreneurial spirit. So, you know,
whether it's a business or individual who's looking for for
legal services, an attorney or a firm who's looking to
move their practice to a firm that can better support
their needs, or even a professional who's looking for career
(21:10):
advancement opportunities. You know, offic Kerman has been a great
opportunity for me and many others. And that's what I
hope that the marketplace hears about offic Kerman is that
there's opportunity here no matter what you're looking for. And
keep us in mind when that opportunity arises.
Speaker 2 (21:26):
Excellent, thank you. And what's the best way for us
to find more information about offic Kirman.
Speaker 1 (21:31):
So the best way is go to our website and
that's Offitkirman dot com. And we're also on many social
media platforms LinkedIn, YouTube, Facebook, and some of the legal
platforms like JD Supra. Our marketing team does a great
job of putting our attorneys out there and thought leadership
and business issues, private issues as well as issues for
(21:53):
the legal industry. So even if you're not in need
of legal services, it's a great great wealth of information
that's that's being put out there from our thought leaders
in the attorney ranks.
Speaker 2 (22:04):
Excellent, excellent, Well, thank you so much.
Speaker 1 (22:06):
Rob.
Speaker 2 (22:06):
It was great, great talking with you, great and getting
to know you a little bit more and I learned
I'd learned some more things I didn't know about off
of Kerman. So I really appreciate your time and and
thank you. Look forward to hope and to see you soon.
Speaker 1 (22:18):
Absolutely, thank you, John, I really appreciate having me. This
has been iheartmedias CEOs.
Speaker 2 (22:25):
You should know
iHeartMedia Presents CEOs you should know.
Speaker 2 (00:06):
I have John Dinkele, founder and CEO of Dentkele Business
Development and former president publisher of the Baltimore Business Journal.
This is Iheartradios CEOs you should know, and I'm here
today with Rob Skinner, CEO of Offit Kerman. Welcome Robin,
Thanks for being here.
Speaker 1 (00:20):
Thanks John, really really excited to be here.
Speaker 2 (00:22):
Yeah, I really appreciate you taking the time and looking
forward to learning a little bit more about OFFA Kerman
And maybe we'd start there. Actually, for those who may
not be familiar, could you tell us about Offit Kerman.
Speaker 1 (00:33):
So AfOR Kerman is a full service law firm. We're
focused on serving the privately held businesses and families of
wealth that typically own those businesses, and we act as
specialty counsel to select large businesses and some institutional clients
as well. So we were founded here in Baltimore in
nineteen eighty seven by two brothers, Ted and Maurice Offitt,
(00:55):
and they were joined shortly thereafter by a colleague, Howard Kerman,
and from there we've grown to the firm we are
today with two hundred and seventy five attorneys and about
five hundred and fifty total staff helping to support the
legal and business needs of our clients.
Speaker 2 (01:11):
Fantastic, congratulations. What could you tell us your mission?
Speaker 1 (01:15):
Yeah, our mission has really always been to serve the
legal needs of those private businesses, their owners and our
private wealth clients. And that really started with the founders
Ted Off. It was a business transaction and planning attorney,
his brother Maurice was a estates and planning attorney, and
(01:35):
Howard added employment practice expertise, and so the goal was
always to be that one stop law firm for the
entrepreneurial private business owners and help them grow their business,
hopefully get to a sale event and then generate some
wealth and have some personal state needs as well. And
(01:56):
from there we've added another multitude of actice areas that
really help us to continue to fill that need and
complete that mission. And over the years it's evolved a
little bit from being less of a client focus on
the business side and more of an attorney focus. So
now a lot of our time and attention is spent
on finding those attorneys who want to serve those target
(02:19):
clients and helping to support them grow their practices so
they can deliver those quality services to the clients that
we still focus on in that privately home market space.
Speaker 2 (02:29):
That's great. That's great. Yeah, And having known your firm
for for quite a while, going back to oh gosh,
all the way back to my bonder of business journal days.
You know, alf of Uraman is kind of very entrepreneurial
in nature, and it seems to always have had that
kind of perception. And you know, something about what you
do know is that would you would you say that's
(02:51):
one of your core values and so like, did you
talk about that a little bit?
Speaker 1 (02:55):
Absolutely, our entrepreneurial spirit. It's a foundation of who we
are and the vision that was set out from the
very beginning. So it's been a big part that's guided
the firm and helped us, i think, really to connect
with those entrepreneurial clients that we're looking to serve. And
(03:16):
it's really been refreshing as a professional manager who doesn't
have a background in legal coming in and finding a
law firm that's willing to act on opportunities to create value,
to innovate, take risks, and operate as a business. It's
been fantastic and I think it is one of the
(03:36):
things that continues to set off a Kerman apart from
a lot of other firms, having that core value of
the organization and our management team.
Speaker 2 (03:45):
Yeah, that's great. I appreciate sharing that. Could you give
us a quick rundown of the practice areas you have.
I know you serve a lot of different clients on
the commercial side of thing and in different ways, so
you know, give us just maybe a quick rundown of
some of those practice areas and maybe you know what
practicers you see the most growth in these days.
Speaker 1 (04:04):
Yeah. Absolutely, So we have a full service litigation team
for commercial and general litigation needs, a robust business law
both planning and transaction side. We have creditors' rights and
bankruptcy as well as banking expertise, real estate and land use,
(04:25):
and on the private side everything from family law and
matrimonial to estates and trusts and a number of other areas.
So again the idea is really that full service commercial
law firm. So we'll stay away from personal injury, we'll
stay away from criminal, but everything else we tend to
(04:47):
have expertise in the areas that we can help whatever
may come our clients' ways in their legal needs and
from a growth point of view. We see a ton
of growth in our litigation areas as well as the
estates and trust and real estate. So that's been been
organically an area where we've seen a lot of growth
(05:09):
in the past year. And then you know, on the
inquisitive side, we tend to see growth more by region
than practice area, and so we're seeing a lot of
opportunity in New York, Los Angeles, the DC area. There's
been markets that have really been been huge for us
in growth, both in attracting new legal talent as well
(05:33):
as growing our client base.
Speaker 2 (05:35):
So that's great. Yeah, we're going to ask you what
what where are your offices located in any other plans
for expansion. You guys have done a lot of growth
in recent years and I kind of curious, off here's
any other any other states in your forecast?
Speaker 1 (05:50):
Yeah, well, well always and at the Kerban, growth is
always on the horizon. So that's what keeps it interesting here.
So we currently have nineteen offices in ten states and
d c H So being Baltimore born as a firm,
we have a number of offices in the Maryland area,
so Baltimore, BEESDA, Columbia, and Frederick, and then we go
(06:14):
as far north as New York, all the way down
to South Carolina on the East coast, with a number
of locations throughout, and then we have a Southern California
office in downtown Los Angeles that we opened up a
few years ago, So that's the current footprint. Most recently,
we opened an office in Atlanta, Georgia through an affiliation
(06:35):
with a prominent attorney down there. That's been fantastic. We're
seeing a lot of growth opportunities, and yeah, we continue
to see and target growth on the West coast, the southeast,
particularly in Florida, and throughout the rest of the footprints.
There's just a lot of opportunity in both lateral growth,
(06:55):
bringing additional attorneys on and we see firms that are
interested in joining Offit Kerrman for the benefit of the
platform for succession planning and that exists nationwide. So we're
always entertaining new growth opportunities in new markets, which keeps
the job very exciting and engaging.
Speaker 2 (07:14):
Yeah, sounds like it sounds very exciting. I appreciate you
sharing all that. I know we talked about this a
little bit, but who do you consider a good client
for off At Kerman. Yeah, so I.
Speaker 1 (07:25):
Think as we've grown over the years, one of the
things that we've done really well is holding on to
that original vision and mission of serving the privately held marketplace.
And so I think the best clients for Offit Kirman
remain those who look at us as a trusted advisor.
So somebody who may be a business owner, entrepreneur who
(07:48):
can look to us to help them both in their
business needs as well as their private planning. These are
the type of clients that we have multiple practice areas
that can help service them. We develop deep and long
relation ships and again we really become more than just
legal counsel. We become an advisor in their personal and
professional goals and help them achieve them. So I think
(08:10):
that's where we provide the greatest value. Those are some
of the longest client relationships we develop, but we really
we see clients from many different areas that we're able
to help service and develop good relationships with as well.
Speaker 2 (08:26):
That's great, that's great, and you know, you all have
a reputation and kind of perception I guess out there
about your all of the philanthropic efforts that you do
in the communities you serve. Can you talk about that
and talk about the importance of that for offit government.
Speaker 1 (08:45):
Yeah, yeah, that'd be great. So we have primarily two
ways that we try to help support the communities that
we serve, and one is through the individual efforts of
our attorneys and staff. We really we try to help
support them through whether it's contribution of funds or just
(09:06):
general support in their efforts for whatever activities may be
beneficial to their local, regional communities or even more broad communities.
So we have a number of attorneys who have international practices,
who have international backgrounds, and so keeping them connected to
those international routes has been a part of our philanthropic
(09:30):
activities as well. And then several years back we actually
found it the offic Kerman Foundation, and that is a
charitable giving arm of the firm that we leverage to
go ahead and make monetary contributions again local, international. Some
of it is pure aid when natural disasters come through
(09:52):
and some of the areas that are affected in the
communities we serve all the way to supporting some of
the activities again that are attorneys or even our client
its are engaged in that just help benefit whether it's
medical research or aid for communities or access to legal services,
So we try to be broad in our outreach there,
(10:13):
maximize the impact that we can have and again really
connect locally with the communities that mean the most to
our clients and our attorneys.
Speaker 2 (10:22):
That's great, that's great. And yeah, and appreciate the you know,
your commitment to your film topic efforts. That's really important
and as you know, so thank you banks. Switching up
a little bit, I like talking about leadership on the
show and one to ask you, how would you describe
your leadership style.
Speaker 1 (10:42):
I approach leadership in a very collaborative way, so I
try to be somebody who is there to support, make
the most and empower the most out of our people
so that they can sell in their roles. I really
believe in the Steve Jobs approach right hire smart people
that will tell us what to do and enable the
smart people to do good work. So I think that
(11:05):
that's served us well. I try to add value to
the interactions that I have, whether it's with attorneys and
staff or management here and then I think the value
that I bring given my background coming up through technology
initially before getting into business operations, that there's also a
(11:27):
push that I can help help bring in my leadership
style for performance and improvement efforts through innovation, through leveraging
technology in ways that can be transformative to the organization.
So try to bring that approach to conversations with others
here in the organization. But at the end of the day,
(11:48):
I think being a good leader is about supporting the
people who you have surrounded yourself with, trusting that you
surround yourself with the right team, and getting everybody engaged
and pulling in the same direction so that you can
achieve goals of the organization.
Speaker 2 (12:01):
Yeah, that's that's great. I appreciate sharing that. Yeah, And
speaking of technology, how are how are law firms using
artificial intelligence? And you know, these days you hear about
it a lot. A lot of eeos and business owners
are talking about AI and the impact on their businesses.
And my understanding on the law side, obviously, uh, research
(12:23):
and using AI for research is probably not the best thing,
just because the inconsistency. But are there are there ways
that you all are looking at using artificial intelligence to
either help you know the internal operations or even even
client work.
Speaker 1 (12:38):
Yeah, yeah, you know, law firms are somewhat notorious for
being late adopters of many technologies. So you know, there
there's two sides to that. One we lag a little bit,
but two some of the bumps get worked out before
it comes our way for actual implementation. But I think
(12:59):
we all all some of the headlines around hallucinated case
law being cited in CHAT, GPT and others. So it
really made us sit up and pay attention to what's
going on with an AI and what we're seeing and
what we're exploring is both of what you outline, which
(13:19):
is both application on the business side as well as
application in legal service delivery. And so we're on the
early side of piloting and exploring how some of that
can be used. And I think that's where many law
firms seem to be. There are some legal specific tools
out there that are gaining some traction. They're doing some
(13:40):
really amazing and innovative things with what these solutions can
do for whether it's research or helping to idate in
preparation for depositions and trial prep all the way down
to e discovery and some of the more routine things
that attorneys probably dread getting into on a discovery.
Speaker 2 (14:01):
But yeah, it's.
Speaker 1 (14:02):
Been really really interesting to see how it's developing.
Speaker 2 (14:05):
Yeah, it is. Yeah, I think I think any business owner,
CEO or anybody even in the leadership suite is hard
pressed not to be thinking about this and how it's
going to impact their business and not to be left behind,
because you know, it certainly can be and is a
competitive advantage for many companies already. So that's that's that's great.
(14:26):
I appreciate you talking about that. Resilience kind of seems
to be a buzzword these days. I hear it a lot.
You know, what does resilience mean to you and how
do you demonstrate that and leaving your team?
Speaker 1 (14:38):
Yeah, Resilience, to me, I think is really about perseverance.
It's kind of that great intenacity that comes with with
pushing through and adapting and really coming out of any
sort of challenges not just as you were before you
entered them, but even better. And so to me, I
(15:01):
think resilience is really about demonstrating that through through our
ability to adapt as business leaders and show our teams
that we're dependable and we've got an even keel and
going through those and that we're going to come out
on the other side not just surviving, but but thriving
where we can. So I think it's something that that
(15:22):
business leaders have to demonstrate, and you know, to our
conversational AI, it's not even these negative events that may
come up that require some of that resilience. It's the
resilience to weather a changing landscape and technology and and
figure out how we're going to to leverage that and
how we're going to navigate it. Give them some leadership
(15:43):
through that, so that that grit is important. As a leader,
we always have to be able to uh, to push
through and to demonstrate how to operate in those challenging times.
Speaker 2 (15:56):
Agreed, Agreed, Thank you appreciate that. What excited about the
future of off it Kerman, Well.
Speaker 1 (16:02):
Hands down, it's growth, right, Alphit Krman is known as
a growth organization. So I don't think you survive here
with with much tenure if you're not a little bit
of a growth junkie. An addictation of those deals. So
I think that's been been one of the most rewarding
parts and one of the parts I'm looking forward to
(16:23):
the most as we go forward. They're they're always unique.
Every growth opportunity brings with it new challenges as well
as new learnings. Right. I think we believe that we
have a pretty robust and effective platform that we're operating
here at alfhit Krman. But whenever we bring on a firm,
there's new opportunities to learn about how others are operating,
(16:45):
other innovations that they've leveraged, and so you know, it's
not just growth at the firm through headcount and revenue,
it's growth of the management team as well. We all
learn and we grow through those transactions. And I think
the technology side, like we're talking about, was it's AI
or how law firms are leveraging business intelligence, process automation
(17:05):
and even just kind of practice management techniques. There's some
changes in how we're going to deliver legal services that
are on the horizon and those are really exciting as well.
And being a mid sized law firm that has the
opportunity not only to grow, but to leverage some of
those changes and bring them to our target practitioners and clients,
(17:27):
that is really really exciting.
Speaker 2 (17:29):
Yeah, yeah, that is exciting. And on the other side, though,
like what what keeps you up at night?
Speaker 1 (17:35):
The growth? Yea, So it's it's the same on both sides, right,
It's you know, I think the growth has has that
constant change and challenge to what we're doing, So so
that is is a little challenging at times. But we've
also seen in the past few years, and I think
(17:56):
most law firms have seen this, and I think a
lot of other businesses have seen it. Just the competition
for talent has really ed it up. And Althor Kerrman
was one of the early adopters of our growth strategy,
but others have joined in and so now there's a
tight competition for legal and professional talent for sure.
Speaker 2 (18:14):
Yeah, are you seeing this generation, whether it's the millennials
or Gen Z wanting to get into practicing law? Have
you seen that the numbers of students, you know, going
for their law degree. Has that changed over the past
five five years or so? And anyway it has.
Speaker 1 (18:34):
There was a there was a March decrease in law
school enrollment. And we also have a demographic issue on
the other side, which is there's a large group of
attorneys who are reaching the end of their careers with
a narrower pipeline on the front end. So you know,
it's one of those challenges that we're trying to think
(18:55):
through as to how we attract that talent, but also
how do we transition practices in a way that's maybe
innovative and not relying on the same amount of legal
talent that we've had in the past. So it's a
it's a real challenge. And I think what those new
(19:16):
attorneys who are coming out of law school, what they
want is different as well. And I think that's a
generational trend that we see.
Speaker 2 (19:24):
Yeah, it seems I have a niece that's going into
Georgetown Law this fall, and you know, talking with her,
it's there's a different perception of work hours, workload, you know,
where that didn't seem to happen maybe ten or fifteen
(19:44):
or twenty years ago. There was an expectation of kids
coming out of law school that, yeah, they have to learn,
they have to you know, learn the ropes and you know,
work their way up and all those things. And I think,
like a lot of industries, you know, that may be
that a lot of folks and that in this generation,
you know, have a different perception of that.
Speaker 1 (20:05):
I guess, yeah, I think you're you're exactly right, and
a different expectation for what a career and career fulfillment means. So, uh,
the legal has always been an apprenticeship model, and so
how we we adapt to that and and help to
bring up that next generation in a way that's fulfilling
(20:27):
for them but also meets the objectives of the law
firm has a business. It's a real challenge and one
that I'm happy, happy that we're not alone in facing
and legal for sure.
Speaker 2 (20:39):
Yeah, yeah, that's great. I appreciate you talking about that
well to to kind of wrap things up. Is there
anything else you'd like our listeners know about you and
off It Kerrman.
Speaker 1 (20:48):
You know, I think about off It Kerrman. It's it's
really you know, we're we're an opportunity driven organization. I
think that gets back to that entrepreneurial spirit. So, you know,
whether it's a business or individual who's looking for for
legal services, an attorney or a firm who's looking to
move their practice to a firm that can better support
their needs, or even a professional who's looking for career
(21:10):
advancement opportunities. You know, offic Kerman has been a great
opportunity for me and many others. And that's what I
hope that the marketplace hears about offic Kerman is that
there's opportunity here no matter what you're looking for. And
keep us in mind when that opportunity arises.
Speaker 2 (21:26):
Excellent, thank you. And what's the best way for us
to find more information about offic Kirman.
Speaker 1 (21:31):
So the best way is go to our website and
that's Offitkirman dot com. And we're also on many social
media platforms LinkedIn, YouTube, Facebook, and some of the legal
platforms like JD Supra. Our marketing team does a great
job of putting our attorneys out there and thought leadership
and business issues, private issues as well as issues for
(21:53):
the legal industry. So even if you're not in need
of legal services, it's a great great wealth of information
that's that's being put out there from our thought leaders
in the attorney ranks.
Speaker 2 (22:04):
Excellent, excellent, Well, thank you so much.
Speaker 1 (22:06):
Rob.
Speaker 2 (22:06):
It was great, great talking with you, great and getting
to know you a little bit more and I learned
I'd learned some more things I didn't know about off
of Kerman. So I really appreciate your time and and
thank you. Look forward to hope and to see you soon.
Speaker 1 (22:18):
Absolutely, thank you, John, I really appreciate having me. This
has been iheartmedias CEOs.
Speaker 2 (22:25):
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