April 27, 2023 • 26 mins
With 11 locations around Central Ohio, the Premier Allergy & Asthma team is committed to offering life-changing solutions for anyone suffering from allergies and asthma. Born and raised in Central Ohio, Dr. Shah decided he wanted to bring new, innovative treatments back to his hometown of Columbus Ohio. Dr. Shah opened the doors of Premier Allergy & Asthma in Dublin and Westerville and has always been humbled by how Central Ohio has embraced Premier Allergy & Asthma. Here's his story...
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(00:00):
Columbus and Central Ohio have a richhistory of companies being headquartered here, everything
from technology, manufacturing, retail,insurance, and more. But what about
the leaders behind these companies? Whatmakes him tick? How did they get
their start? This is where youget to meet the captain of the ship.
Welcome does CEOs You Should Know andiHeartMedia Columbus Podcast. Welcome back to
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another episode of CEOs You Should Know. I'm your host Boxer and this week,
boy is this ironic that this weekmy guest happens to be someone where
I happen to be struggling with somethingthat he specializes in, and that's allergies
Sinus and we want to welcome someonewho you may have seen on TV.
Of course I've had him on theradio before too. He is the founder
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of Premiere Allergy and Asthma, DoctorSummit Shaw is what this is? By
the way, good to see youin person, as Yeah, right now,
you're right. The timing couldn't bemore appropriate. Wait, let's just
dive right into it, doctor Shaw. What is it about spring and allergies
that just knotch people like me onthe floor? Well, I'd one more
thing to it. It's spring allergiesthan also Central Ohio. I mean,
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we unfortunately live in this area that'sjust blossoming with such a variety of trees.
We're in a valley. They calledthis like the Ohio Valley because the
pollen kind of settles in right here, and spring and fall are just you
know, just miserable. I grewup here in Columbus, Ohio. It's
just a really tough season for peoplewith seasonal allergies and asthma. Unfortunately.
Is would you say, doctor showthat this is your is there a peak
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season for what you do? Iwould say, I mean year round,
we have patients that come in,but definitely in the spring and the fall.
You know, in the summer weget a little bit of a lull
because it's very warm, there's nota lot of stuff growing. But right
now in the spring, when thetemperatures are rising, you see the buds
on the trees. Same thing inthe fall, the ragweed, the mold,
all that stuff is growing. SoI would see that those seasons are
probably like our peak seasons. Comparedto our winter and our summer, it's
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a little bit more static. Let'stalk about your journey, because, like
you said, you're from sa EntralOhio, graduated Valdatorian from Bishop Waterson Go
Eagles. Yeah you you would.Uh. Well, first of all,
I always like to ask people whatwas life like growing up? So,
um, you know, my parentswere first generation moved from India. We
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grew up on the west side ofColumbus, actually close to Cooper Stadium.
Uh. They owned a motel.We lived on site at the motel.
I went to Saint Mary macdalan onthe west side of Columbus. Then when
we moved to like the Dublin area, I transitioned over to Bishop Waterson.
Uh. You know, my parentswere big on education, working hard,
um, and you know, alwayswanted you know, kept pushing us,
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pushing me and my sister m Andthen when it came time to go to
college, you know, I wasalready a Buckeye kind of growing up in
Columbus. So stayed on at OhioState UM. And then after finishing Ohio
State, I only applied to onemedical school because I didn't want to go
anywhere else, So I only appliedto the Ohio State you know, University
of Medical School UM, and uh, you know, continued on for my
(02:57):
medical school education there as well.Yeah, you're back. Ron. Is
interesting. Your your parents owned amotel, That's right. I would have
to imagine that you learned about hardwork and the work ethic factor very early.
Absolutely. Yeah, we come homefrom school and we started helping out
at the Hope Motel and you know, like, uh, I remember my
parents, you know, cleaning roomsand stocking coke machines and I mean it
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was just, you know, itwas just part of what you did when
you came home from school and thenyou got to go do your homework and
sports and so yeah, it wasa it was a busy day, but
you know, they kept they Ithink they intentionally kept us busy like that.
Did you went in a different route, doctor Shaw than that? Obviously
what your parents did. So whenwas it? I guess when did the
light bulb go off that you wantedto do what you're doing now? Was
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Yeah, that's a great question.Um. You know, I think I
was always drawn to the sciences earlyon. It kind of intrigued me,
and those are classes that I alwayswas drawn to. Um, when I
was in college, I was debatingbetween becoming a math teacher and then going
on out the school just because youknow, I liked those subjects so much,
but really opportunity to help people thatare struggling and you know, in
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a tough time a lot of peoplewhen they're going through you know, a
medical illness, it's it's very frustrating. They're looking for answers. They want
somebody that can explain things to them, you know, very simply and where
they can understand. So I waskind of always drawn to that, and
then specifically, you know, thepath towards allergy and immunology. Allergy I
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enjoy because you have an opportunity tomake an impact in someone's quality of right
life rather than their quantity of lifenecessarily, So a lot of our resources,
especially in the United States healthcare system, are spent in the last six
months of someone's life, right likewhen they're in the hospital or in the
ICU and stage cancer. With allergy, we have an opportunity to see a
much wider breadth of patients. Wesee kids as young as one too,
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you know, adults as old asyou know, over ninety, and we're
really I think, making an impacton people's quality of life with their asthma
allergy. So uh, you know, so they can go out and they
can play sports more effectively. Theycan go over to their in laws who
have a Catarat dog and not bebothered by their allergies. They can go
out in the spring and the falland be able to breathe and run and
play in parks and so, youknow, I think that that's really for
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me, was really refreshing, andthat's what kind of drew me towards the
field. Doctor Sabbage Shaw is whethershe's the founder of Premiere Allergy and Asthma
now eleven locations, which I can'twait to get into that. But as
we go along, doctor Shaw,in your in your journey. But by
the way, do you get allergies? Do you have any issues like that?
I do a little bit, butyou know, we'll get into that.
(05:30):
But I'm on something called allergy shotsor allergy imminotherapy. Yeah, so
that's something that's been around for along time where we can and again another
draw that kind of drew me toallergy and a lot of other disease states.
Let's say you have high blood pressureor cholesterol. You get a medicine,
and that medicine helps you, butyou're kind of taking that medicine forever
and ever in allergies, if someoneyactually goes under allergy imminotherapy or allergy shots,
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you can actually reverse the allergic process. So you can make somebody who's
allergic on allergic to those pollens intothose cat and dog danders and actually reverse
the process so they don't have totake medications anymore. So that was,
you know, another kind of drawto me as well. But it is
it just me. I don't knowthe vast knowledge that you know, but
it appears to me, doctor Shaw, that there's still a lot of mystery
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when it comes to allergies. Isam I right or wrong? I mean,
you know, it comes down toa couple of simple things. So
allergies basically, it's your body's immunesystem and it's recognizing something that's foreign as
something that it wants to fight off. So, for example, when it
comes to food allergies, uh,you know, kids who have food allergies,
they ingest a food and that childor that adult's body recognizes that is
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something foreign that they want to getrid of that. So that's why you
can have really really serious reactions withlike food allergies for example, YEA,
with seasonal allergies and asthma, it'svery similar. Your body's immune system is
recognizing something as foreign and it's causinga reaction, whether it's itchy, watery
eye, sneezing, coughing, troublebreathing. So the easiest way is avoidance,
right, So if you avoid someonehas a peanut allergy, you avoid
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the peanut protein, you're not goingto have the allergic reaction. Same thing
with seasonal allergies. If you simplyavoid the pollen, then you're not going
to have those symptoms. Unfortunately,living here in Ohio where you know,
I'm able to avoid those pollens.So then you move on to other options
like medications or immunotherapy. So Iunderstand because it's so prevalent, and there's
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so many different pieces of advice outthere, and you know, over the
water cooler people are saying, oh, try this, and try that,
and try some local honey or whateverit might be. But to us,
obviously, we've you know, ourdoctors have studied this for years and years
and years, so we know exactlywhat it is for each patient that's going
to work for them. Do youever ask a patient where they're from,
like if they and it probably sayson their chart where they live now obviously,
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For example, I was born andraised and grew up in Minnesota right
through through college. Then I movedto New York, doctor Shaw, I
never had issues with sinuses with allergiesuntil I moved. Dear, Yeah,
no, you're absolutely right. Whenyou you know, it takes some time
to develop allergies. So when you, for example, move from New York
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or California or Florida and you haven'tseen the local pollens and the stuff that's
in our air here, then thefirst year or two you might be perfectly
fine because your body hasn't seen thoseproteins and hasn't identified those proteins as something
that's foreign that they want to havea reaction to. But after a season
or two, we see patients thatcome in and say, oh kay,
I've been here a couple of years, and now all of a sudden,
I'm starting developed spring and fall allergies. So you're absolutely right. Yeah,
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it doesn't matter a doctor show.A doctor told me once, this is
years ago, by the way,this is before I knew you that if
I want to completely get rid ofsinuses and allergies, I need to move
to Arizona. Is that true?It used to be true boxer until all
the people like you moved out toArizona. But then they also brought their
plants and their trees and all thatstuff from Ohio with them and started planning
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them in Arizona. And so nowyou know, when we have a more
verse diversification of our our flora acrossthe United States, it's not that easy
just to move to another place,because you're gonna find some of those same
allergies out there too, now,So now you could get them out there
too, I could move there,And yeah, why did I move here?
Why? Why did I move here? All right? So you you
graduate from med school at the OhioState University, we know about you being
(09:22):
a Buckeye. What next after that? What happened? So after medical school
you do residency. So I wentout to the East Coast to Boston to
do my residency in internal medicine.And then after internal medicine you can decide
what special do you want to door you can stop and you know,
be an internist. So I decidedI want to apply for an allergy immunology
fellowship, so that I matched outin San Diego at UCSDU. That must
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have been rough, yeah, exactlyand lived out there and in my allergy
fellowship out there in San Diego fortwo years. So I really wanted to
kind of go and to places faraway from Ohio to learn some of the
new techno, some of the newprocedures, the new ways of thinking approaching
allergy care. Uh that was differentfrom what you know, I'd grown up
in Ohio for twenty five years.Yeah, on a light hearted note,
(10:09):
and I'm sorry, I'm a kidderdoctor shot, but uh, did you
learn how to drive in Boston?Better? No, I didn't have a
car out there, so well goodgood. Yeah, I know all public
transportation out there, but yeah,I swear they're the worst. But anyway,
so from San Diego there must havebeen a point where you you're a
black guy, So did you feellike I want to come home? Absolutely?
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Absolutely? So. Um I gotmarried my second year of fellowship,
my wife Lake, she's from Dublinas well, and so, you know,
I had had gained all this amazingknowledge from you know, my professors
and the doctors that had trained inBoston and then the same thing in San
Diego, and so we looked ateach other and we said, hey,
you know, what's the next stephere, and it was it was kind
(10:52):
of easy. I mean we decidedwe want to go back home, go
back to Columbus and kind of takeall these things that we've learned. You
know, we've learned about oral immunotherapy, we learn about accelerated allergy shots,
um, and you know, takeit back home and give it to our
community and be able to share someof those things that we've learned, and
you know, open up shop inColumbus, Ohio. So you and your
wife you move back here. Diddid you immediately start Premiere allergy and asthma
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right away? Did you work undersomeone else? How'd that happened? Yeah?
So we basically, um, youknow, just opened up just first
on one office. UM. Shewas a secretary. She was seven months
pregnant with our firstborn. It wasme and there was you know, one
nurse, just the three of us, one office probably about as big as
this room, uh in Dublin,Ohio. And uh we opened uh about
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twelve years ago today, April,um, you know, twelve years ago,
Happy anniversary, Thank you so much. And we I remember just you
know, staring at the phone andjust waiting for the phone to ring,
for the h you know, hoveringover and they say, oh, when's
your next you know, available appointment. We look at our watch and say,
well, when when can you gethere? You know? So it's
just that, you know what thatreminds me that doctor show. That reminds
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me of reading the story of Bezosand Amazon when him and his wife moved
to Seattle. They they started itin a garage and they had a bell
when when there was finally a saleof a book, right, and they
were waiting and waiting for that firstsale. And of course e commerce was
much different back in the nineties versusversus now. Right, So when you
do you still remember the first call, the first patient to this day,
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I remember my wife teasing me becauseyou know, I was a little bit
of a perfectionist. I mean Istill am, so I would, you
know, kind of critique every singleword that she would say when she would
be answering the telephone call. Oh, I'm sure she liked that man pregnant.
So I do remember that. Iremember making house calls because before we
even opened the office, I hadbusiness cards without an address on them that
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I would start giving out to pediatriciansand primary care doctors and so we didn't
have a physical office, but youknow, I would go patient was really
bad and say hey, I cancome and see you. And so yeah,
I remember those days vividly. Actually, doctor Summit Shaw is with us.
He is the founder of Premiere Allergyand Asthma. Doctor Shaw, I
always like to ask entrepreneurs like yourselfthis, you know, you describe so
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well. You know that that firstday, that first office that you opened.
Now you have eleven. But whenyou look back that, I mean,
how scary was it to dive inknowing, well, it's all me,
it's all us, and my wifeis pregnant and I gotta make this
work. I mean it was veryscary, you know, having her support
met the world. So I thinkthat was a big part of the you
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know, courage that I had totake that first leap. But yeah,
it was scary. We were sevenmonths pregnant with our firstborn. We had
no source of income, we hadno health insurance, and no way to
deliver the baby. I mean itwas definitely scary. Yeah. Yeah,
so yeah, but we you know, we again, like I said,
when we decided to come back toColumbus. One of the things that surprises,
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I mean, we knew Columbus wasa great place to live and we
a great place to raise a family. But the welcome and the reception that
we've received and continue to receive fromthe patients and from the doctors and from
the pediatricians, that's I think justbeen overwhelming. And I never thought that
we would get so much support,you know, for our company here well
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well and doctor's Summit shows with itsa founder of Premiere Allergy and Asthma.
I hope you don't mind me sayingthis, but I've always felt about you,
even though this first time I'm meetingyou, but I've interviewed you before.
You've always been you. You giveoff this energy of your approachable I
know you already know way more thanI do, but but you don't.
(14:39):
You don't make me feel stupid,right you know, on top of you
and I like that, And youcome across very friendly. Whether it's you
or someone from your staff that's onmedia being interviewed you, you're all very
approachable and likable. Thank you,and that I think that I want to
say that makes someone like me orany other patient feel very comfortable about making
that call. Yeah. No,I think that that patient experience is so
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important because in medicine and many otherfields too. I mean, you can
have all the knowledge you can have, you know the science, and you
can have all the knowledge, butif the patient doesn't feel comfortable, and
that patient experience isn't there, andyou can't educate and you can't be partners
in someone's health care. And Ithink a lot of that comes from what
you're saying, the approachability and theease of you know, being able to
talk to somebody and those kind ofthings. From day one, when you
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open that first office. How longafter that did did could you whether it
was in the car, look inthe miry or doctor Sean go okay,
I think I think it's gonna beokay. I think we're gonna make it.
How long after I mean I wouldsay I probably don't. Still don't
think that, you know, Istill think that there's more bad thing to
feel, there's more to do,there's more patience to serve. I mean,
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you know, we just opened upour eleventh office less than six months
ago because we had patients and doctorsand Mary and saying, hey, we
need patients, you know, weneed an allergist up here. So I
still always think that there's more todo and ways to serve patients better and
improve the patient experience and make theemployee experience better. So I'm we're always
still striving to just you know,be better and better, Doctor Shaw.
(16:07):
How because you're you're also a businessman, so how hard is it to go
from one? And like you justsaid, now you have eleven locations,
and what are the projections for thefuture. What are your goals for the
future. So, I mean,I think that probably within the next two
years will probably there's four more locationsthat we're looking at in central Ohio that
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we're going to need to serve UM, so we'll probably be close to fifteen
offices and then you know, whoknows, the sky's the limit after that.
Um. So that's the kind ofthe projections. But I think,
really, Boxer, just to kindof get back to what you were saying
as far as being a business owner, I shure that one thing that I
can't discount is the team that wehave, the people that we have working
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at Premier Allergy and ASTHMA. UM. You know, one of the questions
that I always guess, Hey,what's your secret sauce? Like, how
did you how did you guys getto where you are today? And my
answer is always, always, alwaysthe same, it's the people. And
I think a lot of other entrepreneursprobably you know, have that same answer.
The people meaning the patients who youknow come in and support us,
and the family members that support us, but also our employees. I mean,
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they are our secret sauce. Theywork so hard, they embody the
mission, the values, and it'sjust really been it's just been amazing to
see their growth, their professional growth, and how much they give back to
the company into the community as well. But can I call you summit,
excuse me, but summit. Youknow, some of the gifts that you
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have I don't think you can reallyteach, and one of those is having
a good read on someone, havinga good read if someone is a good
candidate, if they'll be a goodemployee. So clearly you've done a pretty
amazing job with that. What yeah, I mean, Boxer, I would
say, well, you know we'vewe've made a lot of mistakes too,
I can't you know. I thinkthat's part of any entrepreneur's journey is you
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know, making mistakes and learning fromthem. So you know, we always
say, like there's no mistakes ashis lessons, right, So just trying
to constantly improve and learn from themistakes that you've made. I can't say
that every hire has been amazing,and I can't say that you know,
every fire that or every person that'sleft is you know, left in the
right way, and but I alwaystry to learn from that, and yeah,
you figure out how to be betterabout it. Would you like to
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call them out right now? I'mjust totally joking. I like to see
your right hand man and his eyes. I'm only gid No, I'm only
kidding. Um, So what iswhat when patients are coming in? Sure
what happens to be one of thebiggest issues you're seeing right now? Well
(18:38):
or a common one? Would Yeah? I mean again, like you said,
we're seeing patients coming in right nowwith miserable you know, seasonal allergies
asthma, and like you said,there's a lot of myths out there about
allergies, right like taking over thecounter medications. We see patients that every
spring or every spring or every fallare just taking anahistamines or nasal sprays or
they're getting they're going there and gettingquote an allergy shot, which is actually
(19:03):
we found out later it's a steraredinjection, and hey, we don't want
to be giving stared injections every seasonto somebody because staries have a lot of
negative side effects and you want tolimit the use. So I think the
biggest challenge is those myths that peoplehave and sure coming in because most people
that come in to see us,they don't have just mild allergies or moderate
allergies because those you know there cantake over the counter medications or their primary
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care doctors can do an amazing jobtake care of those. But people that
come to us with severe asthma,with severe seasonal allergies, recurrent sinus disease,
food allergies, So those are thepatients where I think our responsibility is
really educating those patients and you know, making ermaking them understand what are the
options that I have. Wow,Doctor Summit Shaws with us, who's the
founder of Premiere Allergy and Asthma.By the way, who came up with
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the jingle, Oh man, that'sone of our one of our employees actually,
because that's really good. My sonsings it every time it comes on.
Yeah, when we participate Boxer andsome of these parades, like Fourth
of I Parade or the Dublin fireworksand when kids go by, they always,
you know, sing our jingle.It's just it's nice. That's got
to make you feel good. It'sjust nice being part of the comet that's
important to us. Being put.Yeah, you're like, wow, my
(20:08):
my brand is a living thing.Like they're singing the jingle. That's awesome.
Doctor Shaw. I'm not asking youto rip or talk badly about because
that's not you anyway. But Ido have questions about and specifically my life.
Uh flown As allegra. I've beentaking those for years and doctor Shaw,
(20:30):
I feel like none of that stuffreally helps me. Yeah. So,
I mean you might be in thatcategory where you might have more moderate
to severe disease. I think thatthose medications are out there. They're very
very safe actually to use. Soshall we recommend patients you know, flown
as for example, UM we prescribethat in kids's youngest too. It doesn't
know, it's very safe, it'suh doesn't cause any uh you know,
(20:52):
growth stunting or anything like that.Um and can be used year round.
You don't your body doesn't get tolerantto it. But there are some medications
that your body does get tolerant to, like the antihistam means that you're talking
about. Yeah, so sometimes werecommend patients rotate those. The other thing
that we always tell our patients isknowing is half the battle. So when
you come into an allergist, youget what's called allergy skin tested, and
(21:15):
it's much different than it was thirtyforty years ago. Again, it's another
kind of technique that I learned whenI was out in San Diego and my
allergy fellowship. We can do skintesting now, same day skin testing where
a patient can come in, wecan do skin testing on them, not
using any needles, not punching theskin, no blood, and we can
find out exactly what they're allergic towithin twenty minutes. Amazing. Yeah,
and then we can give people alittle bit more customized plan with medications or
(21:38):
with allergy shots to figure out,you know, how to kind of navigate
the allergy seas. So is thislike I don't want to say, one
time visit, but is it isit one visit that a person can find
find all this out? Yeah?We have our patients who come in for
consultation, you know, we takea thorough history, you know. Of
course we have to do a physicalexam exactly find out what or you know,
(22:00):
and and after we do that,we decide, okay, what are
the next steps. Do we needto do lung function testing? Do we
need to do skin testing, intradermals, a food challenge if there's a history
of food allergies and they're coming infor that UM sperometry, which there's a
breathing test to find out they haveasked. So we have a lot of
different UM kind of tools and arein you know, ye that we have
and then we kind of decide customizedto each patient. But if it's for
(22:21):
simple allergy testing, they come inone day, UM, they offer anahistamines
for a few days and we canfind out on the first day that they
come in exactly what they're allergic to. Do you still use the needle technique?
No, we actually have a techniquewhere basically we don't have to use
needles, we don't have to puncturethe skin UM, and so we can
get results that's you know, withno needles testing, that's pain free UM.
(22:42):
And especially with the pediatric population withkids, they love that because we
can have answers and we don't haveto, you know, put them through
like the torture. When I wasto allergies, well, I was gonna
say over a decade ago. Ijust remember being allergic to Jamaican grass.
Okay, rights, yeah for me, thank you, thank you. And
(23:02):
it's like and I'm like, wait, all of those needles right, and
that's what you've found out. Wow, that's funny. Thanks a lot.
How far you've talked touched on italready? Really, but technology definitely more
efficient now with the technology you useversus well, like needles for example.
Absolutely. Yeah. So um,let me give you an example, for
(23:23):
example, allergy shots. So Italked about that earlier, how we can
make somebody unallergic to something that they'reallergic to. So allergy shots have been
around for a hundreds of year,hundreds of years. They're FDA approved,
they're covered by every insurance company,and you know, the allergists that have
been practicing in Columbus for thirty fiftyyears, they all offer that it's great,
it's effective. Basically, what wedo is we give patients small amounts
(23:45):
of the very substances that they're allergicto, in sightly higher incremental doses so
their body's immune system creates tolerance tothem and immunity towards them, so they're
not allergic to it. But nowwhen you talk about technology and new procedures
and new things that we can do, we've offered and we've brought to Consentral
Ohio what's called accelerated allergy shots oryou know, you might have heard the
(24:06):
word rush immunotherapy or cluster immunotherapy,where you instead of being on allergy shots
for you know, a year ortwo, three, five years, we
can really shorten that dose. Sosome somebody who is coming in for an
allergy shot every week now can comein instead eight weeks and get accelerated treatment,
and now their symptoms are better ineight weeks instead of a year.
And now they can also get offallergy shots instead of being on them for
(24:30):
five, ten, fifteen, twentyyears. So it's you know, the
science is the same, but there'sa better way of doing it, which
is what technology well, and Imust say, if you're listening to this
podcast and you're wanting more information onyour website you've put up, it's very
informative, right, and you canlearn a lot for what's the website again,
it's Premiere Allergy Ohio dot Com.Okay, very easily, and you
(24:52):
get to meet the doctors. Everyone'sadded information questions that you might have,
which, by the way, youknow what I I just thought about,
Doctor Shaw is you're rebranding to PremiereAllergy and Asthma. I was thinking about
the jangle. You're gonna You're gonnahave to do Premiere Allergy and Asthma.
Yeah, that's right, that's right. We'll have our team get on.
That's true too. Funny. Well, look in the future. You know
(25:18):
you've got eleven locations. You talkedabout adding more down the road. That's
right. Um, could we seePremiere Allergy and Asthma. Let's just go
big here, go national, youknow, I mean I think that's you
know, I think that's the plan, Boxer, I think. I mean,
you know, we've, like Isaid, now, are we going
to have the same reception with theyou know, like that we've had in
the central Ohio community with the restof the country. I'm not sure.
(25:40):
Um, We've just been so blessedto be here and to be in this
community, and you know how warmlythe patients have received us, and how
drawn they've been to the doctors andto the nurses, and you know,
to kind of the the business andthe patient experience that we provide. But
we think that we have something specialand we have something unique that we can
you know, offer to the restof the country as well. This has
(26:02):
been a real pleasure, especially sinceI'm dealing with you know, allergies right
now, so I mean, oneof the chances. This is awesome.
Doctor Summasha, the founder CEO ofPremiere Allergy and Asthma, thanks so much
for your time and being a guestthis week on CEOs you Should Know.
Thank you, Boxer, appreciate it. CEOs You Should Know is hosted and
produced by Brandy Boxer, a productionof Ihartmedia Columbus
Columbus and Central Ohio have a richhistory of companies being headquartered here, everything
from technology, manufacturing, retail,insurance, and more. But what about
the leaders behind these companies? Whatmakes him tick? How did they get
their start? This is where youget to meet the captain of the ship.
Welcome does CEOs You Should Know andiHeartMedia Columbus Podcast. Welcome back to
(00:20):
another episode of CEOs You Should Know. I'm your host Boxer and this week,
boy is this ironic that this weekmy guest happens to be someone where
I happen to be struggling with somethingthat he specializes in, and that's allergies
Sinus and we want to welcome someonewho you may have seen on TV.
Of course I've had him on theradio before too. He is the founder
(00:44):
of Premiere Allergy and Asthma, DoctorSummit Shaw is what this is? By
the way, good to see youin person, as Yeah, right now,
you're right. The timing couldn't bemore appropriate. Wait, let's just
dive right into it, doctor Shaw. What is it about spring and allergies
that just knotch people like me onthe floor? Well, I'd one more
thing to it. It's spring allergiesthan also Central Ohio. I mean,
(01:07):
we unfortunately live in this area that'sjust blossoming with such a variety of trees.
We're in a valley. They calledthis like the Ohio Valley because the
pollen kind of settles in right here, and spring and fall are just you
know, just miserable. I grewup here in Columbus, Ohio. It's
just a really tough season for peoplewith seasonal allergies and asthma. Unfortunately.
Is would you say, doctor showthat this is your is there a peak
(01:32):
season for what you do? Iwould say, I mean year round,
we have patients that come in,but definitely in the spring and the fall.
You know, in the summer weget a little bit of a lull
because it's very warm, there's nota lot of stuff growing. But right
now in the spring, when thetemperatures are rising, you see the buds
on the trees. Same thing inthe fall, the ragweed, the mold,
all that stuff is growing. SoI would see that those seasons are
probably like our peak seasons. Comparedto our winter and our summer, it's
(01:53):
a little bit more static. Let'stalk about your journey, because, like
you said, you're from sa EntralOhio, graduated Valdatorian from Bishop Waterson Go
Eagles. Yeah you you would.Uh. Well, first of all,
I always like to ask people whatwas life like growing up? So,
um, you know, my parentswere first generation moved from India. We
(02:14):
grew up on the west side ofColumbus, actually close to Cooper Stadium.
Uh. They owned a motel.We lived on site at the motel.
I went to Saint Mary macdalan onthe west side of Columbus. Then when
we moved to like the Dublin area, I transitioned over to Bishop Waterson.
Uh. You know, my parentswere big on education, working hard,
um, and you know, alwayswanted you know, kept pushing us,
(02:37):
pushing me and my sister m Andthen when it came time to go to
college, you know, I wasalready a Buckeye kind of growing up in
Columbus. So stayed on at OhioState UM. And then after finishing Ohio
State, I only applied to onemedical school because I didn't want to go
anywhere else, So I only appliedto the Ohio State you know, University
of Medical School UM, and uh, you know, continued on for my
(02:57):
medical school education there as well.Yeah, you're back. Ron. Is
interesting. Your your parents owned amotel, That's right. I would have
to imagine that you learned about hardwork and the work ethic factor very early.
Absolutely. Yeah, we come homefrom school and we started helping out
at the Hope Motel and you know, like, uh, I remember my
parents, you know, cleaning roomsand stocking coke machines and I mean it
(03:19):
was just, you know, itwas just part of what you did when
you came home from school and thenyou got to go do your homework and
sports and so yeah, it wasa it was a busy day, but
you know, they kept they Ithink they intentionally kept us busy like that.
Did you went in a different route, doctor Shaw than that? Obviously
what your parents did. So whenwas it? I guess when did the
light bulb go off that you wantedto do what you're doing now? Was
(03:40):
Yeah, that's a great question.Um. You know, I think I
was always drawn to the sciences earlyon. It kind of intrigued me,
and those are classes that I alwayswas drawn to. Um, when I
was in college, I was debatingbetween becoming a math teacher and then going
on out the school just because youknow, I liked those subjects so much,
but really opportunity to help people thatare struggling and you know, in
(04:00):
a tough time a lot of peoplewhen they're going through you know, a
medical illness, it's it's very frustrating. They're looking for answers. They want
somebody that can explain things to them, you know, very simply and where
they can understand. So I waskind of always drawn to that, and
then specifically, you know, thepath towards allergy and immunology. Allergy I
(04:23):
enjoy because you have an opportunity tomake an impact in someone's quality of right
life rather than their quantity of lifenecessarily, So a lot of our resources,
especially in the United States healthcare system, are spent in the last six
months of someone's life, right likewhen they're in the hospital or in the
ICU and stage cancer. With allergy, we have an opportunity to see a
much wider breadth of patients. Wesee kids as young as one too,
(04:46):
you know, adults as old asyou know, over ninety, and we're
really I think, making an impacton people's quality of life with their asthma
allergy. So uh, you know, so they can go out and they
can play sports more effectively. Theycan go over to their in laws who
have a Catarat dog and not bebothered by their allergies. They can go
out in the spring and the falland be able to breathe and run and
play in parks and so, youknow, I think that that's really for
(05:09):
me, was really refreshing, andthat's what kind of drew me towards the
field. Doctor Sabbage Shaw is whethershe's the founder of Premiere Allergy and Asthma
now eleven locations, which I can'twait to get into that. But as
we go along, doctor Shaw,in your in your journey. But by
the way, do you get allergies? Do you have any issues like that?
I do a little bit, butyou know, we'll get into that.
(05:30):
But I'm on something called allergy shotsor allergy imminotherapy. Yeah, so
that's something that's been around for along time where we can and again another
draw that kind of drew me toallergy and a lot of other disease states.
Let's say you have high blood pressureor cholesterol. You get a medicine,
and that medicine helps you, butyou're kind of taking that medicine forever
and ever in allergies, if someoneyactually goes under allergy imminotherapy or allergy shots,
(05:54):
you can actually reverse the allergic process. So you can make somebody who's
allergic on allergic to those pollens intothose cat and dog danders and actually reverse
the process so they don't have totake medications anymore. So that was,
you know, another kind of drawto me as well. But it is
it just me. I don't knowthe vast knowledge that you know, but
it appears to me, doctor Shaw, that there's still a lot of mystery
(06:18):
when it comes to allergies. Isam I right or wrong? I mean,
you know, it comes down toa couple of simple things. So
allergies basically, it's your body's immunesystem and it's recognizing something that's foreign as
something that it wants to fight off. So, for example, when it
comes to food allergies, uh,you know, kids who have food allergies,
they ingest a food and that childor that adult's body recognizes that is
(06:42):
something foreign that they want to getrid of that. So that's why you
can have really really serious reactions withlike food allergies for example, YEA,
with seasonal allergies and asthma, it'svery similar. Your body's immune system is
recognizing something as foreign and it's causinga reaction, whether it's itchy, watery
eye, sneezing, coughing, troublebreathing. So the easiest way is avoidance,
right, So if you avoid someonehas a peanut allergy, you avoid
(07:04):
the peanut protein, you're not goingto have the allergic reaction. Same thing
with seasonal allergies. If you simplyavoid the pollen, then you're not going
to have those symptoms. Unfortunately,living here in Ohio where you know,
I'm able to avoid those pollens.So then you move on to other options
like medications or immunotherapy. So Iunderstand because it's so prevalent, and there's
(07:25):
so many different pieces of advice outthere, and you know, over the
water cooler people are saying, oh, try this, and try that,
and try some local honey or whateverit might be. But to us,
obviously, we've you know, ourdoctors have studied this for years and years
and years, so we know exactlywhat it is for each patient that's going
to work for them. Do youever ask a patient where they're from,
like if they and it probably sayson their chart where they live now obviously,
(07:49):
For example, I was born andraised and grew up in Minnesota right
through through college. Then I movedto New York, doctor Shaw, I
never had issues with sinuses with allergiesuntil I moved. Dear, Yeah,
no, you're absolutely right. Whenyou you know, it takes some time
to develop allergies. So when you, for example, move from New York
(08:11):
or California or Florida and you haven'tseen the local pollens and the stuff that's
in our air here, then thefirst year or two you might be perfectly
fine because your body hasn't seen thoseproteins and hasn't identified those proteins as something
that's foreign that they want to havea reaction to. But after a season
or two, we see patients thatcome in and say, oh kay,
I've been here a couple of years, and now all of a sudden,
I'm starting developed spring and fall allergies. So you're absolutely right. Yeah,
(08:33):
it doesn't matter a doctor show.A doctor told me once, this is
years ago, by the way,this is before I knew you that if
I want to completely get rid ofsinuses and allergies, I need to move
to Arizona. Is that true?It used to be true boxer until all
the people like you moved out toArizona. But then they also brought their
plants and their trees and all thatstuff from Ohio with them and started planning
(08:56):
them in Arizona. And so nowyou know, when we have a more
verse diversification of our our flora acrossthe United States, it's not that easy
just to move to another place,because you're gonna find some of those same
allergies out there too, now,So now you could get them out there
too, I could move there,And yeah, why did I move here?
Why? Why did I move here? All right? So you you
graduate from med school at the OhioState University, we know about you being
(09:22):
a Buckeye. What next after that? What happened? So after medical school
you do residency. So I wentout to the East Coast to Boston to
do my residency in internal medicine.And then after internal medicine you can decide
what special do you want to door you can stop and you know,
be an internist. So I decidedI want to apply for an allergy immunology
fellowship, so that I matched outin San Diego at UCSDU. That must
(09:48):
have been rough, yeah, exactlyand lived out there and in my allergy
fellowship out there in San Diego fortwo years. So I really wanted to
kind of go and to places faraway from Ohio to learn some of the
new techno, some of the newprocedures, the new ways of thinking approaching
allergy care. Uh that was differentfrom what you know, I'd grown up
in Ohio for twenty five years.Yeah, on a light hearted note,
(10:09):
and I'm sorry, I'm a kidderdoctor shot, but uh, did you
learn how to drive in Boston?Better? No, I didn't have a
car out there, so well goodgood. Yeah, I know all public
transportation out there, but yeah,I swear they're the worst. But anyway,
so from San Diego there must havebeen a point where you you're a
black guy, So did you feellike I want to come home? Absolutely?
(10:31):
Absolutely? So. Um I gotmarried my second year of fellowship,
my wife Lake, she's from Dublinas well, and so, you know,
I had had gained all this amazingknowledge from you know, my professors
and the doctors that had trained inBoston and then the same thing in San
Diego, and so we looked ateach other and we said, hey,
you know, what's the next stephere, and it was it was kind
(10:52):
of easy. I mean we decidedwe want to go back home, go
back to Columbus and kind of takeall these things that we've learned. You
know, we've learned about oral immunotherapy, we learn about accelerated allergy shots,
um, and you know, takeit back home and give it to our
community and be able to share someof those things that we've learned, and
you know, open up shop inColumbus, Ohio. So you and your
wife you move back here. Diddid you immediately start Premiere allergy and asthma
(11:16):
right away? Did you work undersomeone else? How'd that happened? Yeah?
So we basically, um, youknow, just opened up just first
on one office. UM. Shewas a secretary. She was seven months
pregnant with our firstborn. It wasme and there was you know, one
nurse, just the three of us, one office probably about as big as
this room, uh in Dublin,Ohio. And uh we opened uh about
(11:37):
twelve years ago today, April,um, you know, twelve years ago,
Happy anniversary, Thank you so much. And we I remember just you
know, staring at the phone andjust waiting for the phone to ring,
for the h you know, hoveringover and they say, oh, when's
your next you know, available appointment. We look at our watch and say,
well, when when can you gethere? You know? So it's
just that, you know what thatreminds me that doctor show. That reminds
(12:01):
me of reading the story of Bezosand Amazon when him and his wife moved
to Seattle. They they started itin a garage and they had a bell
when when there was finally a saleof a book, right, and they
were waiting and waiting for that firstsale. And of course e commerce was
much different back in the nineties versusversus now. Right, So when you
do you still remember the first call, the first patient to this day,
(12:24):
I remember my wife teasing me becauseyou know, I was a little bit
of a perfectionist. I mean Istill am, so I would, you
know, kind of critique every singleword that she would say when she would
be answering the telephone call. Oh, I'm sure she liked that man pregnant.
So I do remember that. Iremember making house calls because before we
even opened the office, I hadbusiness cards without an address on them that
(12:48):
I would start giving out to pediatriciansand primary care doctors and so we didn't
have a physical office, but youknow, I would go patient was really
bad and say hey, I cancome and see you. And so yeah,
I remember those days vividly. Actually, doctor Summit Shaw is with us.
He is the founder of Premiere Allergyand Asthma. Doctor Shaw, I
always like to ask entrepreneurs like yourselfthis, you know, you describe so
(13:11):
well. You know that that firstday, that first office that you opened.
Now you have eleven. But whenyou look back that, I mean,
how scary was it to dive inknowing, well, it's all me,
it's all us, and my wifeis pregnant and I gotta make this
work. I mean it was veryscary, you know, having her support
met the world. So I thinkthat was a big part of the you
(13:35):
know, courage that I had totake that first leap. But yeah,
it was scary. We were sevenmonths pregnant with our firstborn. We had
no source of income, we hadno health insurance, and no way to
deliver the baby. I mean itwas definitely scary. Yeah. Yeah,
so yeah, but we you know, we again, like I said,
when we decided to come back toColumbus. One of the things that surprises,
(13:56):
I mean, we knew Columbus wasa great place to live and we
a great place to raise a family. But the welcome and the reception that
we've received and continue to receive fromthe patients and from the doctors and from
the pediatricians, that's I think justbeen overwhelming. And I never thought that
we would get so much support,you know, for our company here well
(14:16):
well and doctor's Summit shows with itsa founder of Premiere Allergy and Asthma.
I hope you don't mind me sayingthis, but I've always felt about you,
even though this first time I'm meetingyou, but I've interviewed you before.
You've always been you. You giveoff this energy of your approachable I
know you already know way more thanI do, but but you don't.
(14:39):
You don't make me feel stupid,right you know, on top of you
and I like that, And youcome across very friendly. Whether it's you
or someone from your staff that's onmedia being interviewed you, you're all very
approachable and likable. Thank you,and that I think that I want to
say that makes someone like me orany other patient feel very comfortable about making
that call. Yeah. No,I think that that patient experience is so
(15:03):
important because in medicine and many otherfields too. I mean, you can
have all the knowledge you can have, you know the science, and you
can have all the knowledge, butif the patient doesn't feel comfortable, and
that patient experience isn't there, andyou can't educate and you can't be partners
in someone's health care. And Ithink a lot of that comes from what
you're saying, the approachability and theease of you know, being able to
talk to somebody and those kind ofthings. From day one, when you
(15:24):
open that first office. How longafter that did did could you whether it
was in the car, look inthe miry or doctor Sean go okay,
I think I think it's gonna beokay. I think we're gonna make it.
How long after I mean I wouldsay I probably don't. Still don't
think that, you know, Istill think that there's more bad thing to
feel, there's more to do,there's more patience to serve. I mean,
(15:46):
you know, we just opened upour eleventh office less than six months
ago because we had patients and doctorsand Mary and saying, hey, we
need patients, you know, weneed an allergist up here. So I
still always think that there's more todo and ways to serve patients better and
improve the patient experience and make theemployee experience better. So I'm we're always
still striving to just you know,be better and better, Doctor Shaw.
(16:07):
How because you're you're also a businessman, so how hard is it to go
from one? And like you justsaid, now you have eleven locations,
and what are the projections for thefuture. What are your goals for the
future. So, I mean,I think that probably within the next two
years will probably there's four more locationsthat we're looking at in central Ohio that
(16:27):
we're going to need to serve UM, so we'll probably be close to fifteen
offices and then you know, whoknows, the sky's the limit after that.
Um. So that's the kind ofthe projections. But I think,
really, Boxer, just to kindof get back to what you were saying
as far as being a business owner, I shure that one thing that I
can't discount is the team that wehave, the people that we have working
(16:48):
at Premier Allergy and ASTHMA. UM. You know, one of the questions
that I always guess, Hey,what's your secret sauce? Like, how
did you how did you guys getto where you are today? And my
answer is always, always, alwaysthe same, it's the people. And
I think a lot of other entrepreneursprobably you know, have that same answer.
The people meaning the patients who youknow come in and support us,
and the family members that support us, but also our employees. I mean,
(17:11):
they are our secret sauce. Theywork so hard, they embody the
mission, the values, and it'sjust really been it's just been amazing to
see their growth, their professional growth, and how much they give back to
the company into the community as well. But can I call you summit,
excuse me, but summit. Youknow, some of the gifts that you
(17:33):
have I don't think you can reallyteach, and one of those is having
a good read on someone, havinga good read if someone is a good
candidate, if they'll be a goodemployee. So clearly you've done a pretty
amazing job with that. What yeah, I mean, Boxer, I would
say, well, you know we'vewe've made a lot of mistakes too,
I can't you know. I thinkthat's part of any entrepreneur's journey is you
(17:56):
know, making mistakes and learning fromthem. So you know, we always
say, like there's no mistakes ashis lessons, right, So just trying
to constantly improve and learn from themistakes that you've made. I can't say
that every hire has been amazing,and I can't say that you know,
every fire that or every person that'sleft is you know, left in the
right way, and but I alwaystry to learn from that, and yeah,
you figure out how to be betterabout it. Would you like to
(18:17):
call them out right now? I'mjust totally joking. I like to see
your right hand man and his eyes. I'm only gid No, I'm only
kidding. Um, So what iswhat when patients are coming in? Sure
what happens to be one of thebiggest issues you're seeing right now? Well
(18:38):
or a common one? Would Yeah? I mean again, like you said,
we're seeing patients coming in right nowwith miserable you know, seasonal allergies
asthma, and like you said,there's a lot of myths out there about
allergies, right like taking over thecounter medications. We see patients that every
spring or every spring or every fallare just taking anahistamines or nasal sprays or
they're getting they're going there and gettingquote an allergy shot, which is actually
(19:03):
we found out later it's a steraredinjection, and hey, we don't want
to be giving stared injections every seasonto somebody because staries have a lot of
negative side effects and you want tolimit the use. So I think the
biggest challenge is those myths that peoplehave and sure coming in because most people
that come in to see us,they don't have just mild allergies or moderate
allergies because those you know there cantake over the counter medications or their primary
(19:26):
care doctors can do an amazing jobtake care of those. But people that
come to us with severe asthma,with severe seasonal allergies, recurrent sinus disease,
food allergies, So those are thepatients where I think our responsibility is
really educating those patients and you know, making ermaking them understand what are the
options that I have. Wow,Doctor Summit Shaws with us, who's the
founder of Premiere Allergy and Asthma.By the way, who came up with
(19:47):
the jingle, Oh man, that'sone of our one of our employees actually,
because that's really good. My sonsings it every time it comes on.
Yeah, when we participate Boxer andsome of these parades, like Fourth
of I Parade or the Dublin fireworksand when kids go by, they always,
you know, sing our jingle.It's just it's nice. That's got
to make you feel good. It'sjust nice being part of the comet that's
important to us. Being put.Yeah, you're like, wow, my
(20:08):
my brand is a living thing.Like they're singing the jingle. That's awesome.
Doctor Shaw. I'm not asking youto rip or talk badly about because
that's not you anyway. But Ido have questions about and specifically my life.
Uh flown As allegra. I've beentaking those for years and doctor Shaw,
(20:30):
I feel like none of that stuffreally helps me. Yeah. So,
I mean you might be in thatcategory where you might have more moderate
to severe disease. I think thatthose medications are out there. They're very
very safe actually to use. Soshall we recommend patients you know, flown
as for example, UM we prescribethat in kids's youngest too. It doesn't
know, it's very safe, it'suh doesn't cause any uh you know,
(20:52):
growth stunting or anything like that.Um and can be used year round.
You don't your body doesn't get tolerantto it. But there are some medications
that your body does get tolerant to, like the antihistam means that you're talking
about. Yeah, so sometimes werecommend patients rotate those. The other thing
that we always tell our patients isknowing is half the battle. So when
you come into an allergist, youget what's called allergy skin tested, and
(21:15):
it's much different than it was thirtyforty years ago. Again, it's another
kind of technique that I learned whenI was out in San Diego and my
allergy fellowship. We can do skintesting now, same day skin testing where
a patient can come in, wecan do skin testing on them, not
using any needles, not punching theskin, no blood, and we can
find out exactly what they're allergic towithin twenty minutes. Amazing. Yeah,
and then we can give people alittle bit more customized plan with medications or
(21:38):
with allergy shots to figure out,you know, how to kind of navigate
the allergy seas. So is thislike I don't want to say, one
time visit, but is it isit one visit that a person can find
find all this out? Yeah?We have our patients who come in for
consultation, you know, we takea thorough history, you know. Of
course we have to do a physicalexam exactly find out what or you know,
(22:00):
and and after we do that,we decide, okay, what are
the next steps. Do we needto do lung function testing? Do we
need to do skin testing, intradermals, a food challenge if there's a history
of food allergies and they're coming infor that UM sperometry, which there's a
breathing test to find out they haveasked. So we have a lot of
different UM kind of tools and arein you know, ye that we have
and then we kind of decide customizedto each patient. But if it's for
(22:21):
simple allergy testing, they come inone day, UM, they offer anahistamines
for a few days and we canfind out on the first day that they
come in exactly what they're allergic to. Do you still use the needle technique?
No, we actually have a techniquewhere basically we don't have to use
needles, we don't have to puncturethe skin UM, and so we can
get results that's you know, withno needles testing, that's pain free UM.
(22:42):
And especially with the pediatric population withkids, they love that because we
can have answers and we don't haveto, you know, put them through
like the torture. When I wasto allergies, well, I was gonna
say over a decade ago. Ijust remember being allergic to Jamaican grass.
Okay, rights, yeah for me, thank you, thank you. And
(23:02):
it's like and I'm like, wait, all of those needles right, and
that's what you've found out. Wow, that's funny. Thanks a lot.
How far you've talked touched on italready? Really, but technology definitely more
efficient now with the technology you useversus well, like needles for example.
Absolutely. Yeah. So um,let me give you an example, for
(23:23):
example, allergy shots. So Italked about that earlier, how we can
make somebody unallergic to something that they'reallergic to. So allergy shots have been
around for a hundreds of year,hundreds of years. They're FDA approved,
they're covered by every insurance company,and you know, the allergists that have
been practicing in Columbus for thirty fiftyyears, they all offer that it's great,
it's effective. Basically, what wedo is we give patients small amounts
(23:45):
of the very substances that they're allergicto, in sightly higher incremental doses so
their body's immune system creates tolerance tothem and immunity towards them, so they're
not allergic to it. But nowwhen you talk about technology and new procedures
and new things that we can do, we've offered and we've brought to Consentral
Ohio what's called accelerated allergy shots oryou know, you might have heard the
(24:06):
word rush immunotherapy or cluster immunotherapy,where you instead of being on allergy shots
for you know, a year ortwo, three, five years, we
can really shorten that dose. Sosome somebody who is coming in for an
allergy shot every week now can comein instead eight weeks and get accelerated treatment,
and now their symptoms are better ineight weeks instead of a year.
And now they can also get offallergy shots instead of being on them for
(24:30):
five, ten, fifteen, twentyyears. So it's you know, the
science is the same, but there'sa better way of doing it, which
is what technology well, and Imust say, if you're listening to this
podcast and you're wanting more information onyour website you've put up, it's very
informative, right, and you canlearn a lot for what's the website again,
it's Premiere Allergy Ohio dot Com.Okay, very easily, and you
(24:52):
get to meet the doctors. Everyone'sadded information questions that you might have,
which, by the way, youknow what I I just thought about,
Doctor Shaw is you're rebranding to PremiereAllergy and Asthma. I was thinking about
the jangle. You're gonna You're gonnahave to do Premiere Allergy and Asthma.
Yeah, that's right, that's right. We'll have our team get on.
That's true too. Funny. Well, look in the future. You know
(25:18):
you've got eleven locations. You talkedabout adding more down the road. That's
right. Um, could we seePremiere Allergy and Asthma. Let's just go
big here, go national, youknow, I mean I think that's you
know, I think that's the plan, Boxer, I think. I mean,
you know, we've, like Isaid, now, are we going
to have the same reception with theyou know, like that we've had in
the central Ohio community with the restof the country. I'm not sure.
(25:40):
Um, We've just been so blessedto be here and to be in this
community, and you know how warmlythe patients have received us, and how
drawn they've been to the doctors andto the nurses, and you know,
to kind of the the business andthe patient experience that we provide. But
we think that we have something specialand we have something unique that we can
you know, offer to the restof the country as well. This has
(26:02):
been a real pleasure, especially sinceI'm dealing with you know, allergies right
now, so I mean, oneof the chances. This is awesome.
Doctor Summasha, the founder CEO ofPremiere Allergy and Asthma, thanks so much
for your time and being a guestthis week on CEOs you Should Know.
Thank you, Boxer, appreciate it. CEOs You Should Know is hosted and
produced by Brandy Boxer, a productionof Ihartmedia Columbus
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