July 24, 2023 • 19 mins
Caitlin Ruiz is a talent acquisition, recruiting, and human capital expert within the Government Contracting (GovCon) industry. She began her career on the corporate side as a Recruiting Assistant, working her way up to the Director of Talent Acquisition for a large GovCon in the DMV area before striking out on her own. Ultimately building out her own specialty recruiting firm, she brings a great sense of humor and level of authentic truth-telling to the table that can’t be found anywhere else. Having obtained her Master of Science in Conflict Analysis and Resolution, she frequently leans on her academic background to ensure creative solutions are leveraged to address some of our nation’s toughest to fill positions (think intel roles!). As the Founder of Human Design Consulting you can find her and her team providing recruiting strategy consulting services and fractional recruiting solutions to growing businesses nationwide.
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(00:00):
M and T Bank Prison CEOs youshould know powered by I Heartadia. Let's
meet Caitlin Ruiz. She is thefounder and chief consultant for a human design
consulting based out of the DMB,but also working domestically with recruitment, mainly
for gov KAN. Before we talkmore about Caitlin's company, I first asked
her to talk a little bit aboutherself, where she's from, and her
(00:21):
origin story. I am a DCDMV specific native. I grew up around
here. I actually did undergrad inNorthern Virginia at Fairfax at George Mason,
but then I ended up going downto South Florida, Miami specifically for grad
school, and somewhere along the wayended up finding my way into temp recruiting
(00:42):
work and it put me back uphere in the Northern Virginia area and I
kind of set off on my owndown a path that would ultimately become his
company. I love to talk tohomegrown talents because we don't it's weird,
we don't, you know. There'sso many people that are transplanted in the
DMV, of course because of thegovernment. So it was always that's to
talk to somebody that's from the area. I've lived here four years, so
(01:03):
I don't necessarily think that I'm homegrown, but I feel like I am since
I've lived here four years, fourdifferent times now in the DMV. Well,
Kaitlin, there's a lot to talkabout when it comes to your company
human design consulting as the founder andthe chief consultant. But I always like
to talk to our leaders and ourfounders about that epiphany, that idea about
(01:25):
you know what, I'm starting thiscompany. This is the reason why.
Let's go tell us why you startedthis company five years ago? Great question.
So it actually was a slightly tragicbeginning to an ultimately amazing ending.
But it was the government shutdown thathappened in twenty eighteen, and I was
actually laid off myself and most ofmy team that I had built and spent
years with at that point. Soit just I had come to a level.
(01:49):
I was a director at the time, and I had seen enough consultants
go, so I understood the businessfrom an external observatory perspective, but I
had never really really thought, hey, I'd probably do that myself. I
could take all these years of internalcorporate experience and take them outside and really
help some growing businesses. But thatgovernment shutdown that lovingly kind of pushed me
out of the nest into this worldof consulting. That was really the moment
(02:14):
for me where I decided that's it. No one else ever gets to decide
when my last day is. Specifically, in recruiting, we work with people.
Our reputation is everything, so justghosting candidates is not okay. The
highly cleared work and projects that wedo, it's hard one progress when we
do make it, So just leaving, for example, during a government shutdown
or a layoff, is really notan option. There's a level of dedication
(02:36):
that it takes to do this workpersonally and professionally, so allowing someone else
again to kind of call my lastday wasn't interested in that anymore. So
I decided that I would figure itout from the ground up. I didn't
necessarily have family in this area thatcould help in terms of connections, which
is often true, especially in governmentand in Northern Virginia and in growing up
(02:58):
here. Most people do have familyand friends that can help open some doors.
But even without that, I thoughtthat this mission was worthwhile, that
I had something of value to offer, and that something about me personally,
which is that I have a lovefor candor and speaking truth to power,
that that would serve me well ina consultancy position. That that's something that
is sought after by sea levels.That again, that truth to power,
(03:22):
that candor, that authentic conversation wheresomebody will tell them that they're wrong or
that it's a horrible idea and maybehere are some alternatives because their internal employees
are not in a great position tobe able to do that sometimes. So
really it was that again a tragicbeginning to something that ended up quite positive,
but it was a loving push outof that nest and deciding no more
(03:44):
is it someone else's story to tell, but mine, no matter how hard
Well there's also a common thread inall our leaders that we talked to,
and it's that leap of faith whenyou start your own business and it's going
to be a little rocky peaks andvalleys, but after five years it sounds
like there's a lot to be proudof that we're going to talk about.
But when a company name catches myattention, like Human Design Consulting, I
always have to ask out of curiositybecause it's a great name, how did
(04:08):
you come up with the name ofthe company. Sure, So it's recruiting
as a whole. There's a lotof organizations out there to do it.
But frankly, when you really thinkabout what it is that we're trying to
teach, even as an organization,it really is people, people, processes,
people, strategy and intentionality, beingthoughtful about it, doing it by
(04:29):
design. So I decided I wantedsomething that maybe the word wasn't people in
terms of marketing and SEO and allthe other good stuff, maybe it wasn't
the best one. But humans,we're all human and doing things again with
intentionality, with purpose, so bydesign, So human design consulting, and
it's it's everything from actual just therecruiting the transactional piece of things, to
teaching organizations how to interview. Soit kind of runs the gamut everything that
(04:54):
touches people and humans and processes withcorporations, we're here to help with.
Well, I'm sure you've heard this. I love it. It's a great
name. So it's wonderful one.You can always put your personal touch on
the name of a company, Sothat's wonderful. You did touch in this
a little bit. But let's circleback, just to be very clearing.
Give context to our listener about themission statement of Human Design Consulting. What
(05:15):
is it? So we are missionat Human Design Consulting is to provide recruiting,
expertise, candor and authenticity to everyclient that we work with. We
provide recruiting and talent acquisition solutions togrowing businesses who value their people, cost
savings, employer brand and culture.Okay, so we know that you work
out of the DMV when it comesto that, but you also work domestically.
(05:39):
So we've heard the thirty thousand footview. Let's get into the capabilities
and the specifics about what you actuallyoffer all of your clients and what you
do. Yes, so we actuallyoffer again it runs the gamut as do
our clients in terms of size,scope and need. But we do absolutely
everything from the transactional recruiting, sohelping them to fill a role, everything
(05:59):
from their internal administrative assistance and againinto corporate corporate capacity to their CFO C
suite executive search. And then alsofor all of our government contracting clients,
we do help them in terms oftheir recruiting for all of the different contracts
that their people are on and thoseagain also run the gamut everything from uncleared
to cleared program managers up through cybersecurityengineers, cloud solutions architects, and then
(06:25):
for nonprofit clients, we do allsorts of sourcing and seeking of very specific
niche type of development directors for example, and we also will help organizations we
come in a partner and teach themhow to build a recruiting function in house,
which again runs a gam at everythingfrom the systems of it to the
(06:48):
when, how and why, theinterviewing, interviewing questions, creating guides,
creating all sorts of evaluations. Sowe really are looking to partner with organizations
to address holistically and at an enterpriselevel their recruiting functions. So for again
for different clients, that means reallydifferent things. But we have consultants that
(07:11):
run again the gamut. It's abreadth of expertise that these people bring to
the table. So we absolutely havea person with that level of experience and
expertise to partner with our clients tohelp them grow hopefully as painfully as possible.
Kalen, I imagine that gov conis the majority of it, but
I know it's not all of it, And you can also touch a little
bit more on that and maybe expound, but I did want to ask you
(07:32):
also about COVID because you created yourcompany before it, and you know,
the government had its own issues withthe rest of the world when it came
to pivoting and changing everything. SoI'm curious what that was like for you
of where you started the company towhere you took it today with all the
gov Con work. Yes, sothat was a huge pivot, i'd say
for recruiting as a function as anindustry and then gov Con even more specifically
(07:56):
as a market. The COVID changedeverything. This work recruiting specifically, could
have always been done for the mostpart virtually prior to the pandemic. Obviously
everything turned virtual during the pandemic.And what that meant for the FEDS and
for the government and for gov Conswas place of performance changed, So where
the work was being done they wereall in depending on the level of clearance,
(08:16):
skifts secured buildings, and there wereabsolutely some organizations that went on rotating
schedules and people never stayed home completelyand went remotely. It was not an
option for them. But in termsof recruiting, it changed the entire landscape.
It took away the in person function, so everything from job fairs to
(08:37):
just being able to physically go toan organization and meet people. So you
had to get really good and smartabout where these candidates are and where the
clients are. Even from a clientbusiness development perspective, Now where to my
clients. But then when you doget the work and we're filling these roles,
where if the candidates gone, andagain during the pandemic, it was
(08:58):
absolute could make more money on unemploymentor in other ways. So it was
never a run of applicants. Itwas always a poaching game and a searching
game and us going and finding thesepeople and trying to convince them to make
a jump elsewhere. So it's itbecame a big sales component kind of got
(09:18):
thrown into the mix in terms ofhow we typically speak with and search for
candidates. So it changed everything andsome honestly for the better. A lot
of organizations had to start looking attheir culture, had to look at themselves
internally. I had to figure outwhen they became dispersed over geography, how
to function better as teams, howto hire, how to interview that way,
(09:39):
Now that it's all virtual and notin person, we're not having in
person interviews anymore, you know,all the systems that can support that.
So it changed everything, but itwas I think a lot has stayed and
for the better. Frankly, I'mglad you shared all of that and you
got very specific because a lot ofour leaders that we've talked to that have
created a business before the pandemic andeven just like families, how you had
(10:01):
to change and adapt, so didbusinesses. And also the other common theme
that I got from our leaders isthe businesses that did survive, they actually
got better. And it sounds likeyou did too. Yes, absolutely,
Frankly, it created better efficiencies.If we have a virtual process that you
know, I don't have to waitfor everyone to be in one location or
fly a candidate in anymore. Andnow we have better tech and tools and
(10:22):
AI that can help facilitate these virtualmeetings or how we're interviewing and evaluating candidates.
So again you have to lean in, I think in business in general,
to evolution and reiterating your own processesand looking at yourself and how you're
doing things to not just keep up, but to be more effective and to
be more successful. Caitlin, Ialways like to ask our leaders about success
(10:45):
stories and challenges. So let's puta pin in a success story just for
a second, and let's talk aboutchallenges. I know it's windious at the
top, especially when you have yourown building. There's not a lot of
people that you can cry in yourshoulder and you just got to get it
done sometimes. But what kind ofchallenges does the industry polls right now that
you're working on oh Man challenges forrecruiting. Frankly, it really depends on
(11:07):
the end. So gov con hasa very different experience and history than does
private or commercial or nonprofit industry.So for gov CON specifically, I would
say that our current challenges really arearound that it's a candidate market versus an
employer market, so who has anupper hand the power dynamics around it,
which change frequently and can be affectedby economy. Right So right now,
(11:33):
specifically, there's a huge move forsome organizations to kind of go back to
that more in person a less remotekind of workforce or culture, and there's
a lot of resistant on a candidatemarket level to do that. Why we
don't need to. I can also, as a candidate, regardless of geography,
set my own market, right Now, in terms of salary, it
doesn't matter where I am. I'mvirtual, so has everyone else, So
(11:54):
it kind of leveled out a lotof that salary, information, intelligence,
and competition. But overall it's reallytrying to bridge that gap between what an
employer may think that they want orneed and what is actuality. So is
there a reason that this person hasto be in Washington, DC versus virtual?
I mean, what are you what'sthe real kind of angle there?
(12:16):
Right? What are they actually tryingto do with this or accomplish and trying
to back them into creative alternatives othersolutions. Can we accomplish that through quarterly
meetings in person? Can we write? Are there other ways? So it's
just a constant dance and education,both in bending and working with and being
flexible with the market and candidates andpeople and the human aspect of things,
(12:37):
and also being creative enough to sayit's not no, it's just not like
this. Perhaps we can do itthis way, maybe, you know,
and just opening up your mind.I know, you get a chance to
work with ex military and veterans.Is there enough of them to supply what
you need when it comes to govcon and some of the other top level
clearances that they need to get intothat job and their next part of their
(12:58):
life. O great questions. Solove vets constantly working with veterans both from
an organizational business client relationship and alsofrom a candidate perspective. They are some
of the most valuable candidates in themarket. That clearance that they often come
with from their military background into acivilian private workforce is super valuable. There's
(13:20):
absolutely not enough clear talent in themarket today, so they have an untapped
kind of value that sometimes they themselvesare unaware of. So absolutely vets are
an amazing set of candidates. Wework with vets in all different levels and
they should continue to come to goovcons and droves. Bring all your clearances.
We're here for it. Nice.Well, that's good sales pitch right
(13:41):
in the middle of everything. Ilove it. That's why Kilo is very
good at what she does when itcomes to human design consulting. All right,
let's talk about a success story becausethere's a lot of super secret stuff
that you don't have to get specific. But over the five years, I'm
sure you've had some wonderful stories whereyou said, you know what, today
we knocked that one out of thepark for our client and also the person
that was applying for the job.Was there something that sets aside all the
other stories that said, you knowthat, that is just something that we're
(14:05):
really proud of. Yes, they'reActually it was a story with one of
our largest clients. They're a massiveTop four organization, and they brought us
in for really cool strategy work.So not kind of your typical transactional recruiting
fill this role, but hey,we're designing a new role completely for this
firm, and it's it's government contractbased even though they're a large commercial firm.
(14:28):
They wanted to kind of get intothis space, so we need a
business development executive specific to this exactyou know, niche industry and these types
of customers. And we came inthere and said, okay, we did
awesome interviews and kind of did discoveryand figured out what it was that they
wanted to build in terms of adepartment, and then we figured out backed
our way into a role description,interview questions, what the answers should kind
(14:52):
of feel like and look like,case studies, We created some of those,
and then we helped guide them intheir of all the potential candidates for
the role, which again was veryspecific and a pilot program. Right,
it's a new thing that they're tryingout, and it was absolutely successful.
It took quite a while, afew months, as some of your C.
Suite and director level roles may they'reon a different kind of timeline,
(15:16):
but it was again successful. Itwas a pilot program, and now they're
opening up that exact type of rolein multiple other divisions in their organization.
So it was a great, greatpartnership between the two of us. Great
story. If we could just takea pause on human design consulting just for
a second, because there's a coupleof personal things I want to ask you,
and one of them is about philanthropicand charity. I know that you
(15:37):
have a family, but if thereanything that you really like to be a
part of when you do have timeand imagine running your own business twenty four
seven, three sixty five seven daysa week, it is intense. But
when you have to do anything incharitable what do you like to be a
part of? Yes, also wonderfulquestion. There's so many amazing organizations here
in the DMB. Again, Ipersonally grew up in foster care, so
I was the benefactor of many ofthem a lot of services. And there's
(16:00):
one specific organization that I just love. I volunteer any chance I get,
donate and try to support all oftheir causes. And it's called Second Story
based out of Vienna, Virginia.It used to be called the Alternative House
when I was young, and wasagain a benefactor of some of the amazing
work that they do. But they'rea great organization. I love supporting them.
(16:21):
And then second to that is anythingto do with animals. Absolutely love
animal advocacy and training and rehabs andso anything with dogs, I'm all in.
I love that. It's wonderful.The other personal thing I want to
ask you is about advice. Iam running into so many more women that
are running their own companies and extraordinary. I have a wife and the daughter,
and I love role models like youthat are showing women out there that
(16:42):
you can start your own business andyou can be successful. So we have
a lot of leaders that listen tothis program, but we also have some
budding leaders out there who want tobe a leader someday. What advice would
you impart on them? Oh Man, Frankly, especially for women, You're
absolutely right and I hope that ourgrasp gets heavier and bigger and we keep
taking over and keep showing up becausethere's absolutely room at the table. But
(17:04):
I think as women, we tendto approach business dynamics in a way that
might be limiting. We want tostay in femininity. And I realized in
a black and white way, longlong long time ago that men in a
recruiting in an interview process, we'regetting a lot more money simply just by
stating that that was their number andnever justifying it, going back against nothing,
(17:29):
just saying this is what I wantand that's it. And because it
wasn't an open door for conversation,that level of confidence it changed everything for
them. So once I realized that, I was a huge advocate for women
in compensation transparency and trying to getthem to understand, no, you just
say what your number is, andthat's that. I think women in business
have to kind of approach the dynamicthe same way, show up in a
(17:51):
similar way. Don't show up likethe men because we're not men, but
show up with that same level ofconfidence, gravitas and understanding that you have
just as much value at the tableas anybody else. So take up some
space outstanding advice. Thank you forthat, all right, as we put
a bow in our conversation, Kaitlin, when it comes to human design consulting
in your baby over the last fiveyears, what one takeaway do you want
(18:12):
our listen to go away with whenit comes to your company. I hope
that if you hear of an organizationthat has recruiting needs or questions, I
love candid conversations, ask all thequestions. We hope that you reach out,
that you think of us, thatyou again look us up, contact
us to have a candid, openconversation about not just recruiting as a function,
(18:36):
but people processes as a whole.We love to be that authentic partner
for conversation and hopefully evolution and successfor both parties. Let's give the website
for all those people that want toreach out to you. Absolutely it's www
dot go human design dot com.Kaitlin, I can't tell you how much
(18:56):
I appreciate your time. You've donewonderful before COVID, during COVID, and
after COVID. Sounds like you gotsomething very special. We appreciate you joining
us on CEOs. You should knowand continue success Thank you, Dennis,
it was a pleasure. Thanks forhaving me. Our community partner, M
ANDT Bank supports CEOs, you shouldknow, as part of their ongoing commitment
to building strong communities, and thatstarts by backing the businesses within them.
(19:18):
As a Bank for communities, Mand T believes in dedicating time, talent
and resources to help local businesses thrivebecause when businesses succeed, our communities succeed.
M and T Bank Prison CEOs youshould know powered by I Heartadia. Let's
meet Caitlin Ruiz. She is thefounder and chief consultant for a human design
consulting based out of the DMB,but also working domestically with recruitment, mainly
for gov KAN. Before we talkmore about Caitlin's company, I first asked
her to talk a little bit aboutherself, where she's from, and her
(00:21):
origin story. I am a DCDMV specific native. I grew up around
here. I actually did undergrad inNorthern Virginia at Fairfax at George Mason,
but then I ended up going downto South Florida, Miami specifically for grad
school, and somewhere along the wayended up finding my way into temp recruiting
(00:42):
work and it put me back uphere in the Northern Virginia area and I
kind of set off on my owndown a path that would ultimately become his
company. I love to talk tohomegrown talents because we don't it's weird,
we don't, you know. There'sso many people that are transplanted in the
DMV, of course because of thegovernment. So it was always that's to
talk to somebody that's from the area. I've lived here four years, so
(01:03):
I don't necessarily think that I'm homegrown, but I feel like I am since
I've lived here four years, fourdifferent times now in the DMV. Well,
Kaitlin, there's a lot to talkabout when it comes to your company
human design consulting as the founder andthe chief consultant. But I always like
to talk to our leaders and ourfounders about that epiphany, that idea about
(01:25):
you know what, I'm starting thiscompany. This is the reason why.
Let's go tell us why you startedthis company five years ago? Great question.
So it actually was a slightly tragicbeginning to an ultimately amazing ending.
But it was the government shutdown thathappened in twenty eighteen, and I was
actually laid off myself and most ofmy team that I had built and spent
years with at that point. Soit just I had come to a level.
(01:49):
I was a director at the time, and I had seen enough consultants
go, so I understood the businessfrom an external observatory perspective, but I
had never really really thought, hey, I'd probably do that myself. I
could take all these years of internalcorporate experience and take them outside and really
help some growing businesses. But thatgovernment shutdown that lovingly kind of pushed me
out of the nest into this worldof consulting. That was really the moment
(02:14):
for me where I decided that's it. No one else ever gets to decide
when my last day is. Specifically, in recruiting, we work with people.
Our reputation is everything, so justghosting candidates is not okay. The
highly cleared work and projects that wedo, it's hard one progress when we
do make it, So just leaving, for example, during a government shutdown
or a layoff, is really notan option. There's a level of dedication
(02:36):
that it takes to do this workpersonally and professionally, so allowing someone else
again to kind of call my lastday wasn't interested in that anymore. So
I decided that I would figure itout from the ground up. I didn't
necessarily have family in this area thatcould help in terms of connections, which
is often true, especially in governmentand in Northern Virginia and in growing up
(02:58):
here. Most people do have familyand friends that can help open some doors.
But even without that, I thoughtthat this mission was worthwhile, that
I had something of value to offer, and that something about me personally,
which is that I have a lovefor candor and speaking truth to power,
that that would serve me well ina consultancy position. That that's something that
is sought after by sea levels.That again, that truth to power,
(03:22):
that candor, that authentic conversation wheresomebody will tell them that they're wrong or
that it's a horrible idea and maybehere are some alternatives because their internal employees
are not in a great position tobe able to do that sometimes. So
really it was that again a tragicbeginning to something that ended up quite positive,
but it was a loving push outof that nest and deciding no more
(03:44):
is it someone else's story to tell, but mine, no matter how hard
Well there's also a common thread inall our leaders that we talked to,
and it's that leap of faith whenyou start your own business and it's going
to be a little rocky peaks andvalleys, but after five years it sounds
like there's a lot to be proudof that we're going to talk about.
But when a company name catches myattention, like Human Design Consulting, I
always have to ask out of curiositybecause it's a great name, how did
(04:08):
you come up with the name ofthe company. Sure, So it's recruiting
as a whole. There's a lotof organizations out there to do it.
But frankly, when you really thinkabout what it is that we're trying to
teach, even as an organization,it really is people, people, processes,
people, strategy and intentionality, beingthoughtful about it, doing it by
(04:29):
design. So I decided I wantedsomething that maybe the word wasn't people in
terms of marketing and SEO and allthe other good stuff, maybe it wasn't
the best one. But humans,we're all human and doing things again with
intentionality, with purpose, so bydesign, So human design consulting, and
it's it's everything from actual just therecruiting the transactional piece of things, to
teaching organizations how to interview. Soit kind of runs the gamut everything that
(04:54):
touches people and humans and processes withcorporations, we're here to help with.
Well, I'm sure you've heard this. I love it. It's a great
name. So it's wonderful one.You can always put your personal touch on
the name of a company, Sothat's wonderful. You did touch in this
a little bit. But let's circleback, just to be very clearing.
Give context to our listener about themission statement of Human Design Consulting. What
(05:15):
is it? So we are missionat Human Design Consulting is to provide recruiting,
expertise, candor and authenticity to everyclient that we work with. We
provide recruiting and talent acquisition solutions togrowing businesses who value their people, cost
savings, employer brand and culture.Okay, so we know that you work
out of the DMV when it comesto that, but you also work domestically.
(05:39):
So we've heard the thirty thousand footview. Let's get into the capabilities
and the specifics about what you actuallyoffer all of your clients and what you
do. Yes, so we actuallyoffer again it runs the gamut as do
our clients in terms of size,scope and need. But we do absolutely
everything from the transactional recruiting, sohelping them to fill a role, everything
(05:59):
from their internal administrative assistance and againinto corporate corporate capacity to their CFO C
suite executive search. And then alsofor all of our government contracting clients,
we do help them in terms oftheir recruiting for all of the different contracts
that their people are on and thoseagain also run the gamut everything from uncleared
to cleared program managers up through cybersecurityengineers, cloud solutions architects, and then
(06:25):
for nonprofit clients, we do allsorts of sourcing and seeking of very specific
niche type of development directors for example, and we also will help organizations we
come in a partner and teach themhow to build a recruiting function in house,
which again runs a gam at everythingfrom the systems of it to the
(06:48):
when, how and why, theinterviewing, interviewing questions, creating guides,
creating all sorts of evaluations. Sowe really are looking to partner with organizations
to address holistically and at an enterpriselevel their recruiting functions. So for again
for different clients, that means reallydifferent things. But we have consultants that
(07:11):
run again the gamut. It's abreadth of expertise that these people bring to
the table. So we absolutely havea person with that level of experience and
expertise to partner with our clients tohelp them grow hopefully as painfully as possible.
Kalen, I imagine that gov conis the majority of it, but
I know it's not all of it, And you can also touch a little
bit more on that and maybe expound, but I did want to ask you
(07:32):
also about COVID because you created yourcompany before it, and you know,
the government had its own issues withthe rest of the world when it came
to pivoting and changing everything. SoI'm curious what that was like for you
of where you started the company towhere you took it today with all the
gov Con work. Yes, sothat was a huge pivot, i'd say
for recruiting as a function as anindustry and then gov Con even more specifically
(07:56):
as a market. The COVID changedeverything. This work recruiting specifically, could
have always been done for the mostpart virtually prior to the pandemic. Obviously
everything turned virtual during the pandemic.And what that meant for the FEDS and
for the government and for gov Conswas place of performance changed, So where
the work was being done they wereall in depending on the level of clearance,
(08:16):
skifts secured buildings, and there wereabsolutely some organizations that went on rotating
schedules and people never stayed home completelyand went remotely. It was not an
option for them. But in termsof recruiting, it changed the entire landscape.
It took away the in person function, so everything from job fairs to
(08:37):
just being able to physically go toan organization and meet people. So you
had to get really good and smartabout where these candidates are and where the
clients are. Even from a clientbusiness development perspective, Now where to my
clients. But then when you doget the work and we're filling these roles,
where if the candidates gone, andagain during the pandemic, it was
(08:58):
absolute could make more money on unemploymentor in other ways. So it was
never a run of applicants. Itwas always a poaching game and a searching
game and us going and finding thesepeople and trying to convince them to make
a jump elsewhere. So it's itbecame a big sales component kind of got
(09:18):
thrown into the mix in terms ofhow we typically speak with and search for
candidates. So it changed everything andsome honestly for the better. A lot
of organizations had to start looking attheir culture, had to look at themselves
internally. I had to figure outwhen they became dispersed over geography, how
to function better as teams, howto hire, how to interview that way,
(09:39):
Now that it's all virtual and notin person, we're not having in
person interviews anymore, you know,all the systems that can support that.
So it changed everything, but itwas I think a lot has stayed and
for the better. Frankly, I'mglad you shared all of that and you
got very specific because a lot ofour leaders that we've talked to that have
created a business before the pandemic andeven just like families, how you had
(10:01):
to change and adapt, so didbusinesses. And also the other common theme
that I got from our leaders isthe businesses that did survive, they actually
got better. And it sounds likeyou did too. Yes, absolutely,
Frankly, it created better efficiencies.If we have a virtual process that you
know, I don't have to waitfor everyone to be in one location or
fly a candidate in anymore. Andnow we have better tech and tools and
(10:22):
AI that can help facilitate these virtualmeetings or how we're interviewing and evaluating candidates.
So again you have to lean in, I think in business in general,
to evolution and reiterating your own processesand looking at yourself and how you're
doing things to not just keep up, but to be more effective and to
be more successful. Caitlin, Ialways like to ask our leaders about success
(10:45):
stories and challenges. So let's puta pin in a success story just for
a second, and let's talk aboutchallenges. I know it's windious at the
top, especially when you have yourown building. There's not a lot of
people that you can cry in yourshoulder and you just got to get it
done sometimes. But what kind ofchallenges does the industry polls right now that
you're working on oh Man challenges forrecruiting. Frankly, it really depends on
(11:07):
the end. So gov con hasa very different experience and history than does
private or commercial or nonprofit industry.So for gov CON specifically, I would
say that our current challenges really arearound that it's a candidate market versus an
employer market, so who has anupper hand the power dynamics around it,
which change frequently and can be affectedby economy. Right So right now,
(11:33):
specifically, there's a huge move forsome organizations to kind of go back to
that more in person a less remotekind of workforce or culture, and there's
a lot of resistant on a candidatemarket level to do that. Why we
don't need to. I can also, as a candidate, regardless of geography,
set my own market, right Now, in terms of salary, it
doesn't matter where I am. I'mvirtual, so has everyone else, So
(11:54):
it kind of leveled out a lotof that salary, information, intelligence,
and competition. But overall it's reallytrying to bridge that gap between what an
employer may think that they want orneed and what is actuality. So is
there a reason that this person hasto be in Washington, DC versus virtual?
I mean, what are you what'sthe real kind of angle there?
(12:16):
Right? What are they actually tryingto do with this or accomplish and trying
to back them into creative alternatives othersolutions. Can we accomplish that through quarterly
meetings in person? Can we write? Are there other ways? So it's
just a constant dance and education,both in bending and working with and being
flexible with the market and candidates andpeople and the human aspect of things,
(12:37):
and also being creative enough to sayit's not no, it's just not like
this. Perhaps we can do itthis way, maybe, you know,
and just opening up your mind.I know, you get a chance to
work with ex military and veterans.Is there enough of them to supply what
you need when it comes to govcon and some of the other top level
clearances that they need to get intothat job and their next part of their
(12:58):
life. O great questions. Solove vets constantly working with veterans both from
an organizational business client relationship and alsofrom a candidate perspective. They are some
of the most valuable candidates in themarket. That clearance that they often come
with from their military background into acivilian private workforce is super valuable. There's
(13:20):
absolutely not enough clear talent in themarket today, so they have an untapped
kind of value that sometimes they themselvesare unaware of. So absolutely vets are
an amazing set of candidates. Wework with vets in all different levels and
they should continue to come to goovcons and droves. Bring all your clearances.
We're here for it. Nice.Well, that's good sales pitch right
(13:41):
in the middle of everything. Ilove it. That's why Kilo is very
good at what she does when itcomes to human design consulting. All right,
let's talk about a success story becausethere's a lot of super secret stuff
that you don't have to get specific. But over the five years, I'm
sure you've had some wonderful stories whereyou said, you know what, today
we knocked that one out of thepark for our client and also the person
that was applying for the job.Was there something that sets aside all the
other stories that said, you knowthat, that is just something that we're
(14:05):
really proud of. Yes, they'reActually it was a story with one of
our largest clients. They're a massiveTop four organization, and they brought us
in for really cool strategy work.So not kind of your typical transactional recruiting
fill this role, but hey,we're designing a new role completely for this
firm, and it's it's government contractbased even though they're a large commercial firm.
(14:28):
They wanted to kind of get intothis space, so we need a
business development executive specific to this exactyou know, niche industry and these types
of customers. And we came inthere and said, okay, we did
awesome interviews and kind of did discoveryand figured out what it was that they
wanted to build in terms of adepartment, and then we figured out backed
our way into a role description,interview questions, what the answers should kind
(14:52):
of feel like and look like,case studies, We created some of those,
and then we helped guide them intheir of all the potential candidates for
the role, which again was veryspecific and a pilot program. Right,
it's a new thing that they're tryingout, and it was absolutely successful.
It took quite a while, afew months, as some of your C.
Suite and director level roles may they'reon a different kind of timeline,
(15:16):
but it was again successful. Itwas a pilot program, and now they're
opening up that exact type of rolein multiple other divisions in their organization.
So it was a great, greatpartnership between the two of us. Great
story. If we could just takea pause on human design consulting just for
a second, because there's a coupleof personal things I want to ask you,
and one of them is about philanthropicand charity. I know that you
(15:37):
have a family, but if thereanything that you really like to be a
part of when you do have timeand imagine running your own business twenty four
seven, three sixty five seven daysa week, it is intense. But
when you have to do anything incharitable what do you like to be a
part of? Yes, also wonderfulquestion. There's so many amazing organizations here
in the DMB. Again, Ipersonally grew up in foster care, so
I was the benefactor of many ofthem a lot of services. And there's
(16:00):
one specific organization that I just love. I volunteer any chance I get,
donate and try to support all oftheir causes. And it's called Second Story
based out of Vienna, Virginia.It used to be called the Alternative House
when I was young, and wasagain a benefactor of some of the amazing
work that they do. But they'rea great organization. I love supporting them.
(16:21):
And then second to that is anythingto do with animals. Absolutely love
animal advocacy and training and rehabs andso anything with dogs, I'm all in.
I love that. It's wonderful.The other personal thing I want to
ask you is about advice. Iam running into so many more women that
are running their own companies and extraordinary. I have a wife and the daughter,
and I love role models like youthat are showing women out there that
(16:42):
you can start your own business andyou can be successful. So we have
a lot of leaders that listen tothis program, but we also have some
budding leaders out there who want tobe a leader someday. What advice would
you impart on them? Oh Man, Frankly, especially for women, You're
absolutely right and I hope that ourgrasp gets heavier and bigger and we keep
taking over and keep showing up becausethere's absolutely room at the table. But
(17:04):
I think as women, we tendto approach business dynamics in a way that
might be limiting. We want tostay in femininity. And I realized in
a black and white way, longlong long time ago that men in a
recruiting in an interview process, we'regetting a lot more money simply just by
stating that that was their number andnever justifying it, going back against nothing,
(17:29):
just saying this is what I wantand that's it. And because it
wasn't an open door for conversation,that level of confidence it changed everything for
them. So once I realized that, I was a huge advocate for women
in compensation transparency and trying to getthem to understand, no, you just
say what your number is, andthat's that. I think women in business
have to kind of approach the dynamicthe same way, show up in a
(17:51):
similar way. Don't show up likethe men because we're not men, but
show up with that same level ofconfidence, gravitas and understanding that you have
just as much value at the tableas anybody else. So take up some
space outstanding advice. Thank you forthat, all right, as we put
a bow in our conversation, Kaitlin, when it comes to human design consulting
in your baby over the last fiveyears, what one takeaway do you want
(18:12):
our listen to go away with whenit comes to your company. I hope
that if you hear of an organizationthat has recruiting needs or questions, I
love candid conversations, ask all thequestions. We hope that you reach out,
that you think of us, thatyou again look us up, contact
us to have a candid, openconversation about not just recruiting as a function,
(18:36):
but people processes as a whole.We love to be that authentic partner
for conversation and hopefully evolution and successfor both parties. Let's give the website
for all those people that want toreach out to you. Absolutely it's www
dot go human design dot com.Kaitlin, I can't tell you how much
(18:56):
I appreciate your time. You've donewonderful before COVID, during COVID, and
after COVID. Sounds like you gotsomething very special. We appreciate you joining
us on CEOs. You should knowand continue success Thank you, Dennis,
it was a pleasure. Thanks forhaving me. Our community partner, M
ANDT Bank supports CEOs, you shouldknow, as part of their ongoing commitment
to building strong communities, and thatstarts by backing the businesses within them.
(19:18):
As a Bank for communities, Mand T believes in dedicating time, talent
and resources to help local businesses thrivebecause when businesses succeed, our communities succeed.
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