After Biden: Here's What's Next with Jeff Angelo

Episode Transcript

(00:00):
To give us those answers. Ihave called on quite literally the best political
analysts that I know that I havein my rolodex. And he also hosts
the WHO Morning show on our sisterstation ten forty WHO and des moin.
His name is Jeff Angelo, andhe is joining us on the phone line
right now. Jeff, thanks somuch for the time today. Spoiler,
it's going to be Kamala Harris.Come on, you couldn't have just given

(00:23):
me a heads up you were goingto do that to me? Gosh,
darn it, I didn't even watchthe first three episodes. Oh wait,
no, different things. Sorry,Okay, well, surely Kamala Harris is
going to be the nominee. Allthis money came pouring in. Was that
the biggest factor in him jumping outof this thing? Yeah? What happened,
Emery. When you're a candidate isthe donors are always asking for updates

(00:48):
as to what's your path to victory. They want to know what your path
to victory is. And even ifyou're a candidate that's behind as Biden is,
if you can show your donors applausiblepath to victory, they'll give money
to that. So the problem wasthat the state polling had gotten so bad

(01:10):
for Joe Biden. He was notonly losing states he needed to win,
like Michigan and Wisconsin, but hewas also the states that the Democrats generally
count on winning. They were inplay. And what happens when that happens
is not only are you going tolose badly, but everybody down the ticket

(01:34):
is going to lose badly. Sothe problem was that people went to Joe
Biden over the weekend and they said, you have no path to victory,
and the donors are going to stopgiving you money. You will have no
more money coming in, and thatultimately is what led to him having to
say and I think in a verybitter way, I tried to put myself

(01:56):
in his shoes them bringing over theweekend. You know a guy that with
a lifelong political service, you know, he's alone in his house, He's
got COVID, he's achieved his lifelongdream to be president of the United States,
and his donors and his supporters justabandoned him. And I feel like
he just, in a very bitterway, put out this statement on Sunday

(02:20):
because the reality, as a lifelongpolitician, Joe Biden no when your donors
give up on you, you're done. You're absolutely gone. So the donors
gave up on him, they willswitch all of their money to Kamala Harris,
and that's why she's going to beyour nominee. Speaking with Jeff Angelo,
he's a former politician himself, neverlost an election. If my memory

(02:40):
serves me correctly, that is correct. Thank you for reminding everybody. Yeah,
yeah, you're welcome. I supposethe thing about winning in this scenario
that makes it a little challenging isnow you're doing the old switcheroo right before
the ballots need to be finalized,before you have the Democratic national Convention.

(03:04):
Did they screw over the Democratic votersin the primary and caucus season this time
around, or did they truly thinkuntil the last few weeks post debate that
Joe Biden could be their guy andwin in November. Well, I think
it's both. I think they didscrew over their voters because, as you
know, I host the morning showin Iowa, and the first in the

(03:27):
nation status got taken away from IowaDemocrats. The entire caucus primary process was
set up for Joe Biden to win. So your big wigs set up a
process by which Joe Biden was goingto win, and so you know,
no, no, there was noserious competitor. So he wins. The
delegates go along with it, theydo what they're told, and they nominate

(03:51):
Joe Biden. And then those samebig wigs say, no, it's not
going to be Biden. We're takingthem away. We're gonna, we're gonna,
we're gonna put Kamala Harris up.So, yeah, this is screwing
over your voters. He absolutely is. But yeah, I believe, pardon
it, I believe that up untilthe debate, they thought they could win
with Biden, because this isn't aboutsupporting a candidate, this is about being

(04:14):
anti Trump. And so the wholecampaign was going to be anti Trump.
Anyway. We got to vote againstTrump. Don't worry about whether you're voting
for Biden, just vote against Trump. That's the whole campaign. And they
really did believe that they were goingto win with that strategy. And then
they realized things had gotten so badwith Biden, i e. His cognitive

(04:36):
abilities, that he couldn't win.You could not actually nominate anybody to run
against Trump. You nominated a guywho would not win against Trump, So
really they can because they're going todo an anti Trump strategy. They just
swap out for a candidate that hasa plausible chance of beating Joe Biden.

(04:57):
That's what they've done. Is thisgoing to we see the money coming in
from the donors, but that doesn'tnecessarily speak for those swing states of the
states that you talk about being questionablethat's going to determine who's going to win
this election. Did it just needto be a coherent person that had a
pulse or was this a person thathas enough of a name now because of

(05:18):
her status over the last few yearsthat there actually could be some additional enthusiasm
for her as a candidate now thatit's not Joe Biden. I think coherent
person with a pulse. And ifyou watch Kamala Harris campaign through the Midwest,
that's pretty much what she is.You know, when she was campaigning
in Iowa to try to win theIowa caucus and by the way, she

(05:41):
never made it. He candidacy didn'teven make it as a caucus. She
is not a good candidate in andof herself. The problem memory is that
she's not authentic and voters can seethat everything about her is very scripted.
Everything about her is sticking talking points. Everything is about her is very planned

(06:02):
and scripted and polished. You justnever know who the real, authentic Kamala
Harris is, and that's still goingto be a problem for her. I
think on the campaign trail because peopleare tired of lifelong politicians. It's why
Donald Trump gets elected is because they'rejust so upset with lifelong politicians in Washington

(06:26):
that don't listen to them. Andnow you've got Kamala Harris out there.
So I do think she still hasthe same problem as any other politician does
against Donald Trump, but she's gota more plausible shot at winning the race.
Joe Biden had no shot whatsoever.Yeah, well, there's no doubt
that she's got a more plausible shotbecause she actually can communicate with people,

(06:49):
remember what she's trying to say,So there's at least of that. Jeff,
can you stick around one more segmentfor us, Yeah, sure will,
All right, we will talk morewith Jeff Angelo warning show hosts on
who ready in Des Moines, butalso a guy who's spent a lot of
time in and around politics, andwe are going to talk about the vitality
of running mates in this race,especially now that one has to be plucked

(07:12):
out of oblivion for the Democrats.That's coming up next on news Radio eleven
to ten kfab. Em Marie Sungeron news Radio eleven ten kfab. There's
a lot going on in the newscycle, as you can imagine a day
after a presidential candidate this late inthe cycle is pulling out, not just
any presidential candidate, the incumbent who'sdropping out because of health and age related

(07:33):
concerns. Joining us on the phoneline is our friend Jeff Angelo. He
hosts the WHO Morning show in DesMoines, and on our assituation ten forty
Who and Jeff, let's talk potentialrunning mates and why it's important. How
important on a scale of like oneto ten, is the running mate for
Kamala Harris on this Democratic ticket.Oh, it'll be a ten because she

(07:56):
needs to name somebody from a keyswing state that she needs to win.
So she needs to pick somebody fromneeds to do Michigan, Governor Whitmer,
or Governor Shapiro over in Pennsylvania,or just somebody that will tip a swing

(08:20):
state in her direction. So itis it's really, really important for her
to make one of those swing statescompetitive because again, the problem for Joe
Biden, the reason he was goingto lose the election, is that he
needed to win all of the statesthat he won last time, and then

(08:43):
he needed to win Georgia, Arizona, and then either Pennsylvania, Wisconsin,
or Michigan. Well he's losing allthose states, all of them. And
so not only there was just apoint ever either CNN was saying this last
week it started to look like anelectoral landslide for Donald Trump. So not

(09:07):
that these states suddenly don't become competitive, they will, but to give herself
a fighting chance, Kamala Harris hasto pick somebody from one of those key
swing states that sheanged to win.I think I'm leaning right now towards the
Pennsylvania Governor Shapiro. I was reallyimpressed with him. After the firefighter died

(09:33):
at the Trump rally in his stateand he walked out of hospital. Governor
Shapiro did and was very, very, very statesmanlike. He eulogized the firefighter.
He acknowledged that he was a bigfan of Donald Trump, you know,
the presidential candidate of the opposite politicalparty. And he spoke eloquently of

(09:54):
his life in saving the life ofhis family's and he was a fellow Pennsylvanian.
I was it was a moment ofstatesmanship in what can be a really
crazy political world that really impressed me. And I think it got him a
lot of attention. And he doescome from a state that Vice President Harris
needs to win this election. Uhyeah, Josh Shapiro fifty one years old,

(10:18):
definitely the person I think makes themost sense from my vantage point,
I'm only really hearing governors and thenPete Budagic as like the potential ideas that
people would have, and like yousaid, I don't know how realistic it
is that you would even decide topick somebody from a state you already kind
of have in hand. So fromyou know, like an elector perspective,

(10:41):
is anything comparing Now, I wantto go to the Republican side. If
they would have known this was happening, does JD. Evance still get the
nod? Is that something that theywish they could have a do over with?
Because jd. Vance only has beenserving in politics for less than two
years, has that never Trumper backgroundseemed to kind of be more of a

(11:05):
legacy pick as somebody who'd run infour years instead of somebody you could help
win the election right now? Doyou think that they got that one right
now that we know what happened forthe Democrats? Well, I think so
they knew, and the Trump campaignactually put out a news release before all
of this happened that said, wereally can't agree to a vice president's debate

(11:28):
right now because we don't know whothe vice president's going to be. That
was released before this weekend, sothey didn't know. They want someone Emory
that can articulate the Trump agenda andnever flinch from it, have no differences
with Trump. Reinforce the agenda,the America First Agenda, be in a
debate, be in speaking engagements wherethis person is completely articulate and able to

(11:54):
articulate the Trump vision. So Ithink they're okay with Jade Vans, and
I think they we're okay knowing thatit may not be Kamala Harris that he's
going to debate. Now, youknow, I think of course that Vance
versus Harris, Vance I think actuallyhad an advantage there in a debate.

(12:16):
But I think like Vance versus Shapiro, get the popcin out that's going to
be a heck of a debate.I think those are two articulate guys.
Speaking with Jeff Angelo, he's themorning show host on our sister station in
De Mooine ten forty who and alsospent a long time in and around politics.
I find the fascination with polling,and I have to ask you about

(12:37):
polling. We mentioned the polling alot. Some people get on me because
I mentioned the polling so much indifferent places, because I try to find
trends. I try to see kindof the way things are going, and
then once we vote, we cango back and see exactly what happened.
And how I hear some of thisstuff was how important really is the polling
and what's the appropriate amount of payingattention into polling? If there is such

(13:01):
a thing for a politician, Well, Emery, here's what I'll say.
I say the same thing to myown w A jo or the audience is
skeptical a pulling, I said,even if you don't believe them, politicians
do. So that's why I readyou the polling, Because politicians, how
they act and reacted, everything theysay in a campaign is driven by polling.
And I promise you that Joe Bidengot out this weekend because he was

(13:24):
shown polling that was being shown todonor, which said that he was going
to lose, and lose badly.Pulling drove Joe Biden out, and pulling
drives politicians what they do, wherethey go to campaign, what their messaging
is, what they're reacting to.So it's okay. You know, I
understand the vast majority of the listeningaudience gets sick of the hearing polls or

(13:48):
as skeptical of polls. I totallyget it. But the reason that I
use them, the reason that youuse them. Yes, you can spot
trends just like you said, andI promise you that politicians are reacting to
it. That's the bottom line.You know, there was going forward young
people were not going to show offto vote in this election because they weren't

(14:09):
going to show off for either Trump. Urbie. I promise you that everybody's
looking at Kamala Harris's numbers among youngpeople. Will those young people now show
up to vote? Where are theymore enthused by Kamala Harris. People will
pull that number and it makes adifference to how a campaign is run.
So it's okay. To be skepticalpulling, you know, don't get me

(14:31):
wrong, but understand that somebody likeme, somebody like you. We talk
about it because drives the politicians.That's what drives what they do, and
it is fascinating. I think tofollow along with kind of the scoreboard as
time goes on and see how differentthings in the news change public opinions.

(14:52):
The assassination is timpon Trump is agood example as to you know, what
the pulling was before that, andwhat the polling looked like after that.
Now, I I want to wrapup with this, Jeff. Now that
we have this happening, it seeminglyappears that Kamala Harris is going to be
the nominee. You and I seemto agree that Josh Shapiro of Pennsylvania seems
like the most logical vice presidential candidate. How quickly do they need to finalize

(15:16):
this stuff? And what can weexpect with campaign advertising? What can we
expect with the scheduled vice presidential andpresidential debates that we still had in the
next couple of months. What canwe expect now with following steps that the
Democrats have to take that really isunprecedented okay, so they need to have
a virtual role call by August seventh. They have to have a role call

(15:39):
before they are their convention because Ohioneeds the name by August seventh, So
they have to have a virtual rolecall by August seven. So you'll have
your nominee. It'll be Kamala Harris. Then what that means is that later
in the month August nineteen through twentysecond, which is a Democrat National Convention

(16:00):
in Chicago. They want that conventionto be just like the Republican Convention was.
They want it to be a coronation. Kamala Harris is your nominee,
she names the vice presidential candidate.But just before that, it's a multi
night celebration of the United Democrats,all united behind Tamala Harris. So that'll

(16:21):
be the next step. They wantthat convention to be look just as joyous
and united and effective as the RepublicanNational Convention was. And then you could
expect to hear two things this fallfrom Kamala Harris, Donald Trump's the threat
to democracy and Republicans won a banabortion nationwide. And those will be the
two issues that will be pounded intothe minds of voters as we head toward

(16:45):
November appendage question. Sorry, thisProject twenty twenty five the Democrats can't stop
talking about now because they know thatthey're using the verbiage in that you know,
manifesto or whatever you want to talkabout of conservative ideas, and they're
using that to try to generate fearabout what Republicans will do if they win

(17:07):
control. Donald Trump has already saidI have no connection to this thing whatsoever.
What say you about how important thisthing is? Is this really just
a tool for the Democrats or isthis something that there's some substance here that
Donald Trump and the Republicans are goingto have to do some true like distancing
if they're going to be effective inwinning this election. No, I feel

(17:29):
like stuff like dad Emory is justsocial media fodder. I think like your
political junkies get caught up in theProject twenty twenty five discussion. But you
know, if your mom and dadand you're worried about your daycare bill and
your grocery bill and your utility bill, or you're worried about gramp and crime,
I mean, it just needs nothingto you. And that really I

(17:52):
do blame on the presence of socialmedia sometimes, Emory, I just think
feel like you got a bunch ofwonky political operatives who do a lot of
talking on social media, and theythink that social media is real life,
and they think that the average voter, the average KFAB voter is thinking about
Project twenty twenty five. Nobody's thinkingabout Project twenty twenty five. Well,

(18:15):
I guess time is going to tellon how much of a steak is in
the ground from the Democrats to tryto scare people, even if it is
something that a whole lot of peopleare thinking about. Jeff Angelo thinking about
everything. You can hear him inthe mornings on our association ten forty who
if you're over there, and JeffAngelo, I really appreciate the time,
the expertise. Thanks so much forbeing a part of our show today Star.

(18:37):
He's a pleasure to talk to yousoon, Emory. Absolutely, it
is the bottom of the hour,two thirty more on the way. We'll
get your thoughts as well on thehistoric news about though twenty six hours ago
or so that Joe Biden was nolonger going to be running for president,
and we'll discuss it even more nexton news Radio eleven ten KFAB. Emory
sun on news radio eleven ten KFABI learned about what happened with Joe Biden.

(19:03):
I went out with my neighbors toa rum bar, like a tiki
bar, and just went and gotabsolutely smashed on Saturday night. Okay,
I made a critical error. We'resitting there, You're drinking these rum tiki
style mixed drinks, and they havesomething on the menu called a rumham.
Rumham is a shot of bottomshelf rumand a pint of hams. Oh,

(19:29):
I'm like four cocktails deep and Iordered the rumham like an idiot, mixing
my beer that deep into a nightof rum and other mixed liquors. Okay,
so I go home after we getdone. I'm messed up, man,
Like, I'm definitely messed up.But you know what happens when you
get messed up, you don't sleepsuper well. So I woke up at
like eight in the morning, whichdoesn't sound that crazy, but for me

(19:51):
on a week and in the morning'spretty early. But I was like,
you know what, it's fine,I'll just go crawl out onto the couch
and watch the Open Championship which wasgoing on, you know, the British
Open golf tournament. It's fun towatch, you know, golf early in
the morning. So I was watchinggolf and I was going in and out
of sleep, and then the golftournament ended. I was like half asleep
in my ears were listening and theysaid, this is a special report from

(20:12):
NBC News and I was like justkind of listening and they're like, the
anchor said, this is a trulyhistoric moment, and my ear was like,
what's about to happen? We finallymade it to Jupiter. Oh yeah,
yeah, was that what you werehoping for? Yeah, I feel
like we would have known we weretrying to do that right anyway, No,

(20:33):
she said, Joe Biden has officiallydropped his candidacy, and I was
thinking to myself, man, meand Matt case Yeah, Like I eventually
like opened my eyes and started watchingtheir coverage. Me and Matt case Man,
we were on it. We wereon it a year ago. I
was talking about this happening a yearago. Now, I didn't get the
candidate right. We waited too longto get Gavin Newsome in the mix.

(20:53):
But I don't think that he's notgoing to be actively campaigning for Kamala and
setting himself up to to potentially havea free primary election in twenty twenty eight.
What you have to remember is ifKamala wins. If she does,
she has two terms she can serve. She doesn't just serve out one more
term. She's a brand new president, so that she could serve and then

(21:15):
run again in twenty eight. Oohinteresting. It changes the vibe a bit
right now. Again, the pollingfrom what we know is that they're working
with a bit of a deficit.But I think things can absolutely change with
her leading the way because again,coherent person with a functioning brand that can
actually speak to people, you don'thave to worry about. I mean,

(21:40):
she's probably gonna look stupid from timeto time, but who doesn't. There
were moments that even Barack Obama,who I thought was almost flawless in the
way that he presented himself, whichis why he won the presidency, had
nothing to do with potential policies orpolitics. It had everything to do with
the way he communicate to people.But there are moments where he would flub

(22:02):
up or anything, but he wascharming in the way that he handled it.
When Kamala flubbed up, Tulsi Gabbertbasically put a proverbial knife in her
political career, only for Joe to, you know, use identity politics to
resurrect her from the ashes. EhDonald Trump, certainly if your opponent of
Donald Trump, there are moments wherehe looks kind of dumb when he's talking.

(22:22):
But when you're look I think PatrickMahomes walks and runs like a loser
guy, looks like he's completely outof shape. If you're a Patrick Mahomes
fan, you're probably not going toagree with me on that. And the
proof is actually in the pudding,because who cares he wins? You know
what I'm saying. People who don'tlike somebody else are always going to have
like that thing of like irrationally dislikinganother person. Sure, same thing with

(22:45):
Kamala, and I know that we'regoing to probably have plenty of Kamala conversations
about that over the next three months. However, I think it is important
for us, as the people whoare going to be voting in this country,
to at least be paying attention towhat's going on. Nikki Haley did
say this, for whatever it's worth, when she was running that a vote
for Joe Biden is a vote forKamala Harris, and she was right on

(23:08):
with that. Now I have towonder, since you and me have been
this far out on this and talkingabout they're going to pull an old switcheroo
at some point, and how theyare a lot of people are saying twenty
fifth Amendment needs to be in votebecause if he's not good enough to run
a campaign, can we trust thathe is going to be able to serve
this country for the next six monthsuntil the next inauguration of whomever. It's

(23:30):
a fair question to ask. Sawmultiple headlines from different news sources that Taiwan
is doing some military exercises potentially preparingfor Chinese invasion. That's what a lot
of people are saying. I know, the American public, in the American
name in the USA carries a lotof weight internationally. I'm not sure how

(23:52):
much it carries in terms of thedecision making that other countries make. But
I do find it to be prettyfascinating that while we're dealing with all this
stuff and oh yeah, they're asecret Service director was being questioned on Capitol
Hill today. We'll get to someof that, if not today tomorrow,
you have all this you know,we're still reeling from the assassination attempt.

(24:12):
We're still talking about who even isgoing to be the presidential candidates for an
election just a few months away.This would be a pretty good time for
a villainous country around the world todecide they wanted to take something. Wouldn't
surprise me at all. Can wetrust that Biden's going to be able to
make those calls quickly because he's stilltechnically the president? You know, yeah,

(24:34):
right, when your house is amess, how do you help out
in the neighborhood? You know,I mean, and you wonder about the
twenty fifth Amendment? Yeah, Like, what are you saying here? So
he's not going to read What didhe say specifically why he's not running.
He said, it's best for meto step aside, which again is the
exact opposite of what he's been sayingfor the last six months. It's the

(24:59):
opposite what the White House was sayingbefore the debate when we all saw it
with our own eyes, remember usgetting gaslighted about his behaviors ahead of that
being called it was deep faked.It was you know, they were being
crop, they were edited, theywere not being shared with good faith.
Yet everybody was like, Okay,so you're telling me what I'm seeing isn't
actually what I'm seeing kind of thing, and that that to me, that

(25:22):
is that's that's upsetting to me,don't I don't like being told that I'm
lying to myself when my eyes areseeing this. We know why he's getting
out of the race, though,and it has everything to do with the
fact that he's never gonna admit thatit's age related. He's not gonna admit
that it's cognitively related. What hebasically is saying is that it's best for

(25:47):
the party for me to step aside. And again that is now, why
would it be best for the partyif you're also promoting yourself as basically like,
what the greatest president of all time? Well again, I'm just all
right, I'm I'm just trying touse the narrative sure against them. Here's
the passage in his letter. It'sbeen the greatest honor of my life to

(26:07):
serve as your president. And whileit has been my intention to seek re
election, I believe it is inthe best interests of my party and the
country for me to stand down andto focus solely on fulfilling my duties as
president for the remainder of my term. Very convenient for this to be released
via letter again in the middle ofhim needing to be isolated for like a

(26:29):
week because he's got COVID nineteen andno cameras can find him and talk to
him about stuff. So what arethe odds that he never goes in front
of a camera again? And beforebefore the November election he'll be or at
least be questioned. He's well,why would he need to ask answer questions
now? Because we want to knowwhy did you do this? What made
you come to this decision? Well, and that's the argument that many people

(26:52):
are going to have is if youcome to this decision for the reason that
we all think you probably did,then how are you fit to serve in
the last six months your term here? Because I mean, we can put
two and two together. Oh yeah, we can use common sense all day
long, but we're not. Butif they're not telling us this, because
this is what this White House hasbeen doing to us for the last three
and a half years, is tellingus stuff that isn't actually happening, and

(27:12):
what's happening? Rug and say okay, yeah, we're supposed to do that.
Yeah, yeah, you're right,it's it's it's a mess. I
don't think I'll be honest, Iwouldn't expect him to answer a lot of
questions from here to the end.I do think he will have remarks in
front of the camera, in frontof the crowd to get to send off
that I'm sure he and his familywant to have for all of the service

(27:34):
that he has done. So Idon't know. Two forty nine, we'll
wrap up this hour. More onthe way on this of course. On
news Radio eleven ten kfab em Ry'ssonger on news Radio eleven ten kfab Mark
says, Joe, I think he'sgot Joe and Kamala. I think he
meant Kamala. Anyways, he saidhe's doing a great job running the country.

(27:56):
Stop the fear mongering, and thenand immediately replied to himself and said,
if Republicans want to invoke the twentyfifth Amendment, go for it.
Better for Kamala to take over.Now, those are two completely different things.
And this is what we're talking aboutwith the left in kind of the
gas lighting effect. Right, thereare going to be people in this country

(28:18):
that are in specific geographical locations theyhave specific lifestyle needs or wants, and
they are going to say that theJoe Biden presidency was one of the best
that they can remember. And Ibelieve them, because America is eclectic enough
politically that there are people that I'msure are benefiting or are enjoying the policies

(28:41):
that Joe Biden and his administration andthis Democratic Congress when they've had control the
agenda that they have pushed through.I don't disagree with that, and I
think that we are a little bitmore naive if we decide that we're just
not going to acknowledge that, andthat to me, is a mistake.

(29:03):
We need to make sure that weunderstand that there's at least a third to
forty percent of America that is juststaunchly going to agree with democratic politics,
no matter how much they may notmake sense to us, even if we
have a whole of Like, Okay, so you're not answering at all what
is happening at the southern border.You're not answering at all about industry and

(29:23):
economics in America, especially with theway that you keep throttling our energy.
I have a really hard time understandingor even having the ability to have a
conversation with somebody who is so specificallyanti Republican that they won't even admit that

(29:44):
the Republicans offer good solutions to bothof those problems because they don't think those
are problems. And that's just Americaright now. With that being said,
however, you can't tell me thatit'd be better for Kamala to takeover and
for Joe Biden to step aside,not just as the candidate, but also
potentially as a president for the nextsix months when we know that there are

(30:10):
plenty of things that could happen inthe world that America could be directly related
in, and it's not necessarily limitedto what's happening in our borders. It
could be something that's happening in theMiddle East. It could be something happening
in Ukraine. It could be somethinghappening in Taiwan. God forbid. That's
something I'm sure if he's not fitto run for reelection, we need a
good answer for why the twenty fifthAmendment isn't being invoked here. We're gonna

(30:33):
talk more about this on news radioeleven ten kfab