Spring Tasks - What to Do and When to Do It

Spring is here and with it, the return of garden tasks. Join us to learn what to do and when to do it. Featured shrub: Show Off Sugar Baby forsythia.

Episode Transcript

Speaker 1 (00:02):
Coming to you from Studio A here at Proven Winners
Color Choice Shrubs. It's time for the Gardening Simplified Podcast,
radio and YouTube show with Stacey Hervella, me, Rick Weist,
and our engineer and producer Adrianna Robinson. Well Stacey. Around
here in the North, it's felt like Groundhog Day every
day for the last two months. Snow, snow, snow, and

(00:25):
it makes you wonder when spring is going to arrive.
I love following the adventure in Danville, Vermont, where they
put a palette out on the ice on the lake.
It's called Joe's Pond. They have an annual ice out.
It has bricks on it. It's wired with a weather

(00:47):
proof clock. And when that palette and bricks finally break
through and sink to the bottom, you know it's spring.
And they have people who pay a dollar each for
a ticket. It's a big deal. But when that brick
goes through the ice, you know at spring.

Speaker 2 (01:02):
Oh.

Speaker 3 (01:02):
I like that, that's a real symbol. We've had a
lot of false spring here exactly in West Michigan. Not
sure about the rest of our listeners. If I know,
we have a lot of people in warm climates, so
you're probably like, yeah, it's great.

Speaker 2 (01:14):
It has been less.

Speaker 3 (01:16):
Than great here in Michigan, and really no signs of
it improving in the near forecast, at least that I've seen, And.

Speaker 1 (01:24):
So you start to question yourself when does spring start.
So they're on Joe's pond, they know definitively when spring starts.
But in the North and Midwest, we are anxious for spring,
and most people will do a few things as spring starts.
They'll fertilize their lawn and apply an annual crab grass control.

(01:45):
They'll spray weeds, and in many cases they're winter annual
weeds like hen bit or chick weed or my good
friend Harry bittercress, who are going to die anyhow, That's
always driven me crazy in the garden center industry, people
need to understand the difference between annual and perennial weeds.

(02:06):
Many people will have a massive pile of mulch dumped
on their driveway and then in May they'll head to
the garden center and try and get it all done
at once. That's what I see.

Speaker 2 (02:18):
Yeah, that's pretty accurate.

Speaker 3 (02:20):
You know, like maybe two weeks ago it was somewhat
nice on the weekend. I'm speaking relatively like it wasn't
like oh one of those days you just gotta get outside.

Speaker 4 (02:29):
You know. I saw the.

Speaker 3 (02:29):
People out there pulling up their leaves and you know,
putting around here and there because it was a bit sunny.
I don't know if most people are as organized as
you make them out to be in that and that.
I think that a lot of times what happens is
people is people think, Okay, it's nice, I'm going to
go outside do some ard work. And you know, they again,

(02:50):
they start putting around, they get a rake, they pull
some leaves out of the beds. You know, they go should.

Speaker 2 (02:54):
I cut this? Should I not?

Speaker 3 (02:56):
But then you know, maybe they listen to us, or
they read an article or you know, see something on
social media and they're like, oh, shoot, I should have
been doing X, Y and Z right, and then it's all,
you know, all hands on deck.

Speaker 1 (03:07):
Yeah that's true. And coming up in segment four it
we'll talk to Mike Connor, he's a pollination and be expert.
We'll talk about cleaning up the leaves, clean up in
spring effect on native bees. That's coming up in segment four.
But you know your garden in spring, it's an outdoor
living room. And I guess my point what I'm trying

(03:28):
to make, and I see people do this is uh,
don't try and get it all done at once. I mean,
spring is a little over ninety days long, plus garden
centers greenhouses have gotten very good at the shoulder seasons.
You know, we head well into June, July, into the fall.
You have plenty of time, so peace yourself. Spring is

(03:52):
not a weekend. This week's limb a rick. There once
was a man from ocean whose plant choices weren't well chosen.
The plants he had grown were outside of his own,
and now his camellias are frozen. He learned winter over
exposes and splits your left out new hoses. The azaleas

(04:12):
are toast his flowers compost. Yes, life ain't a bed
of roses. But let's get out there in the yard
and let's kick off spring. So stacy, A lot of
people do feeding. I want to say real shortly. I
like to feed my shrubs, perennials and plants in spring.
I like to use a slow release organic fertilizer. But

(04:36):
a lot of people feed their lawns. And if you're
going to do that, use a good quality slow release
because that grass is going to grow like nuts anyhow.
So if you just jump you dump a quick release
nitrogen fertilizer on the lawn, it's gonna cause it to
grow even faster. And I just think that feeding a

(04:57):
lawn and fall is more important than feeding it in.

Speaker 3 (04:59):
S I couldn't speak to lawn fertilization, as you know,
it is not my forte quite the opposite. But I
do agree with you on fertilizing the trees and shrubs
and perennials if you're going to do that. And you know,
people always ask us if they should fertilize their shrubs,
and you know my answer, and I'm not trying to

(05:19):
be obtuse or whatever is if you want to, it
is not necessary in most areas to fertilize landscape plants. Now,
if you started with something small, you might want to
fertilize to get because it does indeed boost growth, and
that's why people fertilize their lawn and greens everything up.

Speaker 2 (05:38):
Or if you are trying to grow for.

Speaker 3 (05:39):
Privacy, so I have a privacy hedge of junipers. I'm
trying to get established on the back line of my yard,
and you better believe I went out and fertilized those
last week when it was a somewhat nice day, because
we're gonna get some rain. So that's like the ideal
time to do this is if you have a day
where it's nice enough for you to be out there.
The ground should not be frozen. And whether you're doing

(06:01):
your lawn or you know, perennials and shrubs and the like,
try to pick a nice day ground's not frozen and
it's gonna rain really good the next day to get
that stuff, you know, working, because all of these slow
release fertilizers, and when we talk about slow release fertilizers,
we're not talking about like the little osma code or
other things like that that you put in your in

(06:21):
your annual containers that release fertilizer for them all summer.
We're talking about a fertilizer that weathers due to rain
and acidity and the soil and all of that and
releases those nutrients slowly correct to their plants, rather than
like here you go, you just got your boost.

Speaker 2 (06:37):
Now deal with it, you know.

Speaker 1 (06:38):
And that's exactly my point with the lawn. So I'm
not saying don't feed your lawn, I'm saying, use a
good quality slow release. My point is not all fertilizers
are created the same well.

Speaker 3 (06:49):
That is for sure, and there's a lot of confusion.
And I'm a big fan of granular fertilizers. Anyway, as
we've talked about before, especially for this time of year.
You know you're fertilizing your annuals, your veget a little
bit later in the season by all means, mix up
that liquid stuff. But when we're talking about more of
this long term sustained growth, I really like a good stony,

(07:10):
granular slow release for life.

Speaker 1 (07:12):
You too, I agree. So here's a few things that
you can do. Of course, I love in viral weather.
I'm a meteorologist wannabe. So if you're north of let's
say a line between Kentucky and Virginia, and you're north
of that area, get to know soil temperatures because it matters.
It makes a difference on how quickly things emerge. Insects emerge.

(07:35):
Also GDD growing degree day accumulation. Don't have time to
explain it right now, but get to know that, and
there are great tools on the internet where you can
track that. I do that all the time. Then get
edging out of the way. Early springs a great time
to get edging work done. Clean out your shed. I

(07:58):
say that, but I won't do it. Sharpen your pruners
and shovels, divide and move some perennials like ornamental grass yep,
good time for that for sure, and when you plant
them in spring, they won't heave out of the ground
like they might in fall. Stacy, I like to give
my mulch beds a stir. I joke about the people
who put a big pile of mulch in their driveway

(08:19):
and pile it on too deep. By the way, don't
pile it on to old mulch and pile mulch too
deep just because you feel that's something you gotta do
at the outset of the spring. Appropriate amounts of mulch
are important for plants, and the old mulch I like
to stir it.

Speaker 3 (08:38):
Yeah, break up that surface tension. I mean the wood
as it sits does the waxes prevent water from wetting it.
So it is a good idea to kind of stir
that around and get some air under there, and you
keep it from looking too flat.

Speaker 1 (08:52):
Absolutely, you have a strategic functional advantage when you understand pruning.
And we'll talk about pruning throughout the spring, but it
makes a world of difference to know what you're doing.
It's a perfect time to set up your irrigation system
and your needs for the season. In other words, I'm

(09:12):
talking about we're in spring here. Before you can set
out annuals, we're still going to get some hard frosts.
I like the HHH approach that means inspect heads on
irrigation hoses and hardware in early spring, put soil in
your containers so they're ready to go when you do

(09:32):
buy those annuals. And maybe this is one of those
years where you upsize your hanging baskets. I often recommend
to people who buy the ten inch hanging baskets upsize
them into a twelve or fourteen inch basket. They're readily
available right now in stores. If you go looking for
them in June, you might not be able to go.

Speaker 2 (09:54):
Oh, that's for sure, the hanging baskets will sell out.

Speaker 1 (09:56):
Well, there's an idea of some things on your list
when you're just raring to go.

Speaker 3 (09:59):
In Yeah, I'd say if you're out there inspecting your
heads in hardware and organizing your shed, I would say
you indeed have a case of spring fever, and that
would probably be the way this season appears to be going,
although I did see that they're predicting a very warm April.
So we'll see what happens. Because March has been, you know,
a little little less time outside than I had been

(10:21):
hoping for.

Speaker 1 (10:22):
March hasn't been a lion or a land, it's just
been awful. Yes, we'll see what Stacy has in mind.
And plants on trial coming up next here on the
Gardening Simplified Show.

Speaker 3 (10:41):
Beautify your home and community with proven Winner's Color Choice
Shrubs with over three hundred and twenty five unique varieties
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proven Winner's Color Choice dot com. Greetings, gardening friends, and

(11:02):
welcome back to the Gardening Simplified Show, where we are
talking about springtime tasks. And you know, if you're in
one of the areas that are nice right now, your
tasks may look a little bit different than us here
in Michigan, just trying to pass the time until we
can get outside and do something meaningful. But I did,
before I launch into today's plan on trial, want to
just bring up two really important facts. And number one,

(11:25):
Ricky mentioned pruning a bit. Pruning is obviously a massive topic.
I mean, we could do multiple shows about pruning, but
as you have hopefully heard me say before, the thing
to remember about pruning in spring is when in doubt,
don't just don't. So if you're out there, you got

(11:45):
the pruners, you're getting a little you know, over excited
about everything, and you're clearing it out, and you're wondering,
should I have cut that back? Should I be cutting this?
Where should I cut this? This is the best thing
to do is to take that moment to RECOGNI that
you don't know what to do, and you should just
walk away because it's much easier to fix something that
you didn't prune than to fix something that you did.

Speaker 1 (12:07):
And stay tuned to the Gardening Simplified show as we
advance into spring, because we're going to have to continue
to address this time.

Speaker 3 (12:14):
Oh yes, for sure. But I did also want to
tell you that you know, with perennials, so a perennials
and our baceous plant that died back to the ground.
So you've got plants parts that are above ground if
unless you cut them all back and fall that are
going to be cut back. And if you don't cut
back a perennial like that, the worst thing that's going
to happen is you're just going to have all of
the old brown foliage and the green foliage mixed together

(12:37):
and it doesn't look great, but the plant will be fine.
And with shrubs, of course, if you cut them at
the wrong time, you could be removing flowers and that's,
you know, something that you can live with, but it's disappointing,
Like we don't want you to be disappointed, but you know,
we do have information on every Prooven Winner's Color Choice shrub,
how to prune it, when to prune it on our

(12:58):
website at Proven Winner's Color Choice doch, So that is
a great place to start finding out whether you can
or should prune. And then as far as cutting back
perennials go, you know, I've said it before and we're
going to get into it much more with Mike and
segment four. But I am a big believer in not
over cleaning the garden in spring, letting all of that
stuff emerge. But on the other hand, I also don't

(13:20):
like to have to pick through all that fresh new
growth while I'm trying to pull out all of the
dead stuff. So my solution, of course is just to
pile it up somewhere and let it sit. So that's
just something to keep in mind if you have the
real estate, which I don't actually have the real estate anymore,
but I'm going to figure it out somehow or another.
So anyway, plants on trial, if there is one shrub

(13:43):
that you think of when it comes to spring, what
is it, Well.

Speaker 1 (13:47):
I can tell you, but I looked at your notes here,
so that's not fair for even if I'm stealing.

Speaker 2 (13:54):
Here, even if I hadn't told you.

Speaker 3 (13:57):
Of course, it's for city, of course, you know and
every and I'm sure I've said this on the show before,
but it amazes me that Forsythia is one of these
plants that nobody thinks even for a moment about outside
of its bloom.

Speaker 2 (14:12):
Time, paying no attention, and then when it's in bloom,
it is just so unignorable.

Speaker 1 (14:17):
And everybody comes to the garden center wanting to buy.

Speaker 3 (14:20):
It exactly, and it's just it's a It's a wild
thing to go from not thinking about forcythia at all
to seeing Forsythia literally everywhere. It seems like everyone has
a forcythia, and I think that's a great testament to
how tough and durable and easy to grow this plant is.

Speaker 1 (14:41):
But isn't it something when it's in bloom with daffodils
at the ceme?

Speaker 2 (14:45):
Oh, it's perfection. I love it.

Speaker 3 (14:46):
Yeah, you know, I mean, I'm you know, I do
have a Forsythia in my yard. It was there when
we moved in. I'm actually going to cut it back
to kill it this year. I'm going to kill it. Yeah.
But we didn't want to pull it out entirely because
we don't want to disturb all the soil. But I
am after I'm gonna give it one last balloon. But
you know, it's just for me. It's too big. This

(15:08):
is this is one of the old fashioned varieties. So
our plant and a trial today show off sugar baby
Forcythia is going to change all of that. But let
me just finish my point here about the massive forcythia
that I have in my yard that is every bit
of six feet tall and wide. And you know, for me,
it's just not my yard, and my garden is too
small for something that doesn't do a little bit more,

(15:29):
you know.

Speaker 1 (15:29):
What I mean, I understand.

Speaker 3 (15:30):
Yeah, so it's coming out. I don't know exactly what
I'm gonna plant in its place, probably give some room
to some other things that are already kind of muscling
it out. But I do love the golden color of Forsythia,
and for me, it's kind of like I can I
get my fill from everybody else who's got the forcythia.
I don't necessarily need it in.

Speaker 2 (15:51):
My own yard.

Speaker 3 (15:52):
Okay, I borrowed, borrowed sceener. The borrowed scenery is sufficient.
But if I did want to continue to grow for
Scythia in my yard, I would indeed pick today's plan
on trial show off sugar Baby forcythia. Why it is
hands down the smallest forcythia on the market. It reaches
just one and a half to two and a half

(16:14):
feet tall and wide.

Speaker 1 (16:15):
That's amazing.

Speaker 2 (16:16):
That is very tiny.

Speaker 1 (16:17):
That's small.

Speaker 3 (16:17):
I mean for most forsythias are gigantic, right, and you know,
people make room for them. They still make a great
privacy heads. There's still a place for those larger ones.
But I think as a lot of us find ourselves
either as gardeners with more and more plants that we
want to accommodate and plants that give us maybe longer

(16:38):
seasons of interest compared to Forsythia, or we move to
smaller areas and we just love forsythia with like a
condo or apartment or something like that. This is a
great choice for you. And because it is so small,
it is a plant that can grow in places where
other forcythia can't.

Speaker 1 (16:57):
Yeah, instead of using it as a fountain dation plant
against your house, how about putting it in a perennial guard.

Speaker 3 (17:04):
It's great in a perennial gardener. It can be grown
in containers. And I would also encourage you, if you're
the kind of gardener who just likes to create really
pretty containers. Check out show off sugar Baby at your
garden center. Go ahead and plant it temporarily in a
container with pansies and bulbs and all of that fun stuff,
and then just plant it in your garden when you're
ready to change that container over for summer.

Speaker 1 (17:26):
I saw Forcythia's in containers at corkin Hoff in the
Netherlands with bulb plants. Wow.

Speaker 3 (17:33):
Yeah, it's such a great combination. And then you know, yes,
you're investing a bit into the forcythia, but you're going
to plant it out in your yard, so it's a
really great choice. You can also plant it. This is
an interesting choice for planting, say on either side of
your steps, because also, unlike those larger forcythia's, a show
of sugar Baby has a very tidy habit, so regular

(17:54):
forcythia's kind of can be a little bit messy, no rangey.
I like that about them because I like things to
look a little bit while and sometimes when I see
a forcythia that's really been you know, super meatebald, I'm
a little like ouch that looks like it hurts.

Speaker 2 (18:07):
Or it hurts. In the right setting, it can work
really really well.

Speaker 3 (18:12):
But the nice thing about show off sugar Baby is
you don't have to worry about that because it does
just naturally grow as this very dense, little kind of
column of golden flowers. So it has the structure that
you need for these more formal applications, like I said,
going up to your front door on either side of
your garage. Of course, in perennial gardens, You can also

(18:34):
even plant this as kind of a low hedge around
the front of landscape.

Speaker 2 (18:40):
Yeah.

Speaker 3 (18:40):
So the size is a great way to get everything
you love about Forcythia two areas that you normally wouldn't
have grown it. Now, there's another big advantage of a
small Forcythia like show off sugar Baby, that I wanted
to share with our listeners, and that is it is
hardy to USDA Zone five, but we have heard reports

(19:02):
of people in colder climates being successful with it because
it is so small that it's usually covered by snow
in those colder you know, zone four areas. If you
live in a zone four that usually has reliable snow cover,
it is a Forcythia that you can actually potentially grow
because the snow provides all that insulation during the coldest

(19:22):
part of the winter when those buds would potentially be
susceptible to cold damage. It's got that nice fluffy white
coat on and it's able to bloom and survive. And
I have heard this even in places as cold and
exposed as Edmonton.

Speaker 2 (19:35):
Alberta is. Yeah, so love it another word.

Speaker 3 (19:39):
Way to kind of use plant sizes and these unique
features of plants in your favor and to experiment with
that a little bit. These heat tolerant through usda is
own eight. I think it's funny that people tend to
think of Forsythia as more of a hardy plant, but
it's actually more heat tolerant than it is hardy. It's
I don't think a lot of people realize. Did you

(20:00):
know that, botanically speaking, for Scythia is related to olives.

Speaker 1 (20:06):
I did know that, and I find that interest.

Speaker 3 (20:08):
It is interesting because you know, again we're talking about
heartiness and heat tolerance, and of course olives are not
the least bit heat tolerant, and for Cynthia looks nothing
really like an olive, but it is in the oly
ace the or the olive family, and so it's not
only unlike olives, but it's also unlike other plants that

(20:29):
are in the oly ace that we grow in our
gardens that are grown for fragrance. So Lilac is in
the oly ac jasmine privet fringe tree, Osmanthus ke and
othis or yeah, ke and othis the fringe tree. Adriana
sorry was looking at me like trying to trying to
place the plant, and so I wanted to get that
in their beautiful plant. It's such an amazing fragrance on

(20:51):
that I love it.

Speaker 1 (20:52):
Stacy. I mentioned in the first segment pruning, and you
have a strategic advantage when you know when to prune.
You see the old and Forcythia's out there, this is
one that where people will take a little off the
top and then you have the naked branches below and
the tuft on the top. Yeah, so pruning's key. Also,
pruning is.

Speaker 3 (21:11):
Key especially with those older varieties that do tend to
be a little rangy. Now because for Cynthia blooms so
early in spring, you have to think about this logically
and know that means it blooms on old wood.

Speaker 2 (21:22):
It's set.

Speaker 3 (21:22):
It's flower buds that you're about to see last summer,
because otherwise when would I have a chance to create
flower buds when it's still kind of cold and crummy. Right,
So if you want to prune Forcythia, you're going to
do that immediately after it flowers in spring, when the
last bloom falls there. You can do it a little
earlier if you don't mind missing out on a couple
and that will give it the whole summer to recover.
And if you have one of those older ones, those

(21:44):
big rangy ones that is kind of bare at the
bottom with just the flowers on the top. Consider giving
it a rejuvenation pruning cutting it back to just stumps hard.

Speaker 2 (21:54):
Yeah, it'll be fine.

Speaker 3 (21:55):
Pune it back to just stumps and get a freshly
sun life and start to appreciate your Scythia again like
it deserves.

Speaker 4 (22:02):
So.

Speaker 3 (22:02):
We're gonna have all of this in the YouTube version,
or of course in the show notes at Gardening Simplified
on air dot com. So check it out there if
you want more information about show off sugar Baby for Cythia.
We're gonna take a little break.

Speaker 2 (22:12):
When we come back.

Speaker 3 (22:12):
We've got the mail bags of stay tuned. At Proven
Winner's Color Choice Shrubs, we know that a better landscape
starts with a better shrub. Our team of experts tests
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eight to ten years to ensure they outperform what's already

(22:34):
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your home and express your personal style, look for Proven
Winner's Shrubs in the distinctive white container at your local
garden center or learn more at proven Winner's Color Choice
dot Com. Greetings gardening friends, and welcome back to the
Gardening Simplified Show, where it is our pleasure to help

(22:55):
you solve your garden questions, quandaries and conundrums, which I'm
sure sure you have.

Speaker 2 (23:00):
But let me just go.

Speaker 3 (23:01):
Back to how I started the previous segment, which is
the thing I want you to keep in mind as
you're doing your spring chores and clean up. When in doubt,
don't you can ask us a question. No, but I
feel like I kind of should need a T shirt. Yes,
I mean it's it's kind of It's somewhat good life

(23:22):
advice anyway, so even if it's not in the context
of gardening. You know, there's certain cases where when in doubt,
you should, but there's a lot of cases where when
in doubt don't.

Speaker 1 (23:32):
It's a good point because my nature has been to
jump in with both feet and then figure it out
as I go.

Speaker 2 (23:38):
Oh, me too.

Speaker 3 (23:39):
This is why I'm giving this advice well ground well
and also like it's fine. Here's the other corollary I
think to that, which is like, it's fine to ignore
that advice if you're willing to live with a consequence
but I've definitely dealt with so many gardeners over the
years who have prune something wrong and they just cannot

(23:59):
stop beating themselves up over it. And you know that's
hard because it's like, Okay, well, you've learned a great lesson.
You're obviously not gonna let this happen again. But if
you're like, hey, I don't know what's gonna happen, but
I'm willing to accept the consequences of this not blooming
or you know, having its growth scented or whatever, then
by all.

Speaker 1 (24:17):
Means, do Isn't it fair to say you want to
use as a general rule of green thumb if you're
going to prune it, prune it right after it's done.

Speaker 3 (24:28):
Blooming as a general guideline, especially for spring, especially for
stuff that blooms in spring.

Speaker 2 (24:35):
For sure.

Speaker 3 (24:37):
Okay, but speaking of pruning, uh, you know, we talk
a lot. I think when most people talk about pruning
the immediately like hyde rangees, you know, like, do I
prune my headrange? Don't I prune my hydrange it didn't bloom.
I prove my hydrange it did bloom. What's going on?

Speaker 2 (24:52):
People get real confused.

Speaker 3 (24:53):
That's why we have so very many resources on pruning
hydrangees and when to prune them and how to know
if and when you should prune them. And one of
the hydrangs that we generally recommend having regular pruning on
is panicle hydrangers. Right, beautiful, easy to grow a plant,
not imperative to prune them, but you will find generally
that you kind of improve the overall habit of the

(25:16):
plant and the blooming if they are prune regularly. And
we just put a video on on this so I
can link that in YouTube and the show notes. But
I had a listener writ in a listener named Margaret,
I believe she is in Pennsylvania, and she says, I'm
watching your Limelight hydrange' show again, and I felt the
need to show mine. It is planted at the top

(25:38):
of a huge raised bed and has two offsprings that
I made to make a cave like structure in a
secret garden. This was purchased as a quart size plant,
so a four and a half inch container four and
a half inches twenty four years ago. Now, if you
are listening to us on podcasts or on radio, you
need to get over to YouTube or the show notes

(26:00):
and see a picture of Margaret and her Winmelight Hydrangea
it is.

Speaker 2 (26:06):
I mean, I'll paint a.

Speaker 3 (26:07):
Quick picture for you here. It's probably what you say,
twenty five feet tall. I'm going to say that about
twenty five feet tall and about is wide.

Speaker 1 (26:14):
Twenty five feet tall, twenty five feet why, twenty five
years old, twenty five years old, quarter of a century.

Speaker 3 (26:20):
And I mean it must have thousands and thousands of
blooms on it. I've seen a lot of limelights that
haven't regularly been pruned. Not everyone has a space that
Margaret does, but wow, what an absolutely stunning specimen.

Speaker 1 (26:37):
Man, it's a kick in the plants. Yes, so Margaret's
a baby bloomer just like me.

Speaker 3 (26:42):
So you definitely want to take a look at that.
And that's just something too, you know, kind of bear
in mind as you think about if you're planting, you know, pruning,
what's it going to look like in the long term?
Do you have the space to let this thing go unpruned?
And wow, a limelight can be just spectacular unpruned. So
it's kind of one of those things where is that
strictly necessary maybe nice to have in most situations, but

(27:04):
you make your own decisions based on what you need.

Speaker 1 (27:07):
Great job, Margaret. Linda writes to us, have just come
across your on air show today and I'm hooked. Thank
you very much, Linda. I do have a question. Two
years ago I had four crape myrtles removed stumps, grounded,
way too close to my house and hard to maintain.
The following spring, they began creeping back up. Strangely, the

(27:29):
new shoots grow in a circle and very thick at
each remaining soil mound. I have sprinkled, sprayed two four
D charcoal starter fluid burning them, salt vinegar roundup. Wow,
they keep coming back.

Speaker 2 (27:44):
He's trying it all, i'd think. Yeah.

Speaker 1 (27:47):
My question is if I plant something in that spot,
do you think all of the chemicals I've sprayed has
damaged the soil so that it will kill anything I
plant there? And do you have suggestions as to what
might finally do a way with these shoots? Thanks?

Speaker 3 (28:02):
Love your show, Right, okay, so you know take it away, right,
So crape myrtles and I feel like we've been talking
about crape myrtle quite a bit lately for a variety
of reasons, and crape myrtles are definitely a Southern plant,
but they are hardy and then people expected. And one
of the reasons that we are able to grow them
successfully up here in USDA Zone six, especially shrubby varieties

(28:26):
like our center Stage series, is because they can grow
from their roots. They can grow from the ground. So
if we have a very harsh winter here, they grow
up from the roots. Now, what that means for you
as a Southern gardener is that they can grow up
from the roots.

Speaker 2 (28:39):
And I'm not.

Speaker 3 (28:40):
Sure if your tree service there didn't do a great
job grinding the stumps, because normally, when a stump is
properly ground, everything should be gone to the point where
this would not happen.

Speaker 1 (28:53):
I'm just still sitting here shell shocked. I wanted to
make sure I read this right. Using charcoal starter.

Speaker 3 (29:00):
Yeah, she was burning it, trying to burn them barbecued
close to the house too. So so okay, a couple
of things there. So the the shoes that you're seeing
are coming from roots that are still in the ground.
And when I say roots, I don't mean like little
tiny hair roots like a running perennial. I mean there
is a portion of the woody plant, like the trunk

(29:23):
or something still in the ground. Yeah, yeah, and so
you need to dig back to that and you can
take a little hatchet and try to ax that out.
You could also, you know, trying to use an herbicide
on this, I think is going to be really difficult
because the shoots that are coming out are not big
enough to absorb enough chemical to translocate into the remaining

(29:46):
part of the plant and actually, you know, kill the plant.
So I'm not sure that's going to help. I will
say I have heard that if you cut backsuckers like
these in late summer that will stop them because the
hormone levels in the plant are such that it won't
keep trying to grow back. If you can try waiting

(30:06):
until summer. Otherwise, I think you're gonna have to, like
I said, get a little hatchet and start trying to
hatch it out whatever part they're coming from. So don't
just cut them back when you see them, trace it back,
you know, dig away the soil, trace it back to
whatever part of the plant is in there. I wouldn't
be surprised if it's the whole stump, especially since these
are coming up in a circle. It sounds like the
tree was cut off and the stuff that's left is

(30:28):
all is where it's coming up.

Speaker 1 (30:30):
And if you were to apply some sort of herbicide,
remember it's taken in systemically by the plants, so you're
not let's call it poisoning the soil. What you're doing
is the plants taking it in systemically, meaning if you
do try this again in the future, falls the best
time to do it.

Speaker 3 (30:48):
Yes, fall is a good time to do it, so
you don't have to worry about the herbicides that you
applied making the soil unhospitable for something else, the salt potentially,
because of course salt is not a friend to the soil.
But the good thing about salt and soil is that
it leaches out very, very easily and quickly. So if
you live in a rainy climate and or you have irrigation,

(31:10):
unless you went absolutely bonkers crazy with the salt, it
will already be leached out. So I don't think you
need to worry about that vinegar. I don't know same
kind of thing. I would think that any moisture, you know,
regular irrigation or rainfall is going to take care of that.

Speaker 1 (31:23):
Yeah, I think so. I just have never heard charcoal starter,
lighter fluid.

Speaker 3 (31:28):
Well, I wouldn't recommend that, especially being so close to
your house. But you know, eventually you can exhaust the plant,
but it is going to take some work. But like
I said, I think if it were me, I would
sharpen up that hatchet, try to trace it down, and
just get all your aggressions out trying to chop up
whatever's left in the soil there.

Speaker 1 (31:46):
I could go for a good burger right now. I
guess I'm hungry. I didn't need lunch.

Speaker 4 (31:51):
Okay.

Speaker 1 (31:51):
David asks, I want to plant Miscanthus gigantis grass as
screening the spring. What should I do to my unworked
soil for the rhizomes very aggressive plant? I grow them
in beach sand I would say, you know, David doesn't
tell us what kind of soil he has. If it's
a heavy clay soil, that can be a little bit

(32:12):
of a problem because the roots are too wet and
it can kind of keep the plant from not growing
as aggressively as you want it to. So just work
in organic matter into the soil and you're going to
be fine.

Speaker 3 (32:24):
Well, you know what I wanted to say about David's question,
and to a lot of people in Michigan, who have
clay soil, which is just wild that you know, grow
gardening out here on the lake shore sand all day
long and you just go a little bit inland and
it's clay city. But I have a tip for people
who have clay soil that is difficult to dig in,
and then is start with a smaller plant. You know,

(32:46):
if you can get smaller plants like mail order or
perhaps your garden center sells them. If you have clay soil,
and especially if you're trying to plant something big with
a dense root system like an ornamental grass and especially Misscanthus,
there is no forgiveness. You're going to need to make
that hole every bit as deep as it needs to be,
which can make because you can't squish it down like

(33:06):
some things you can kind of collapse the route and
you know, get it in there. Not so with them
as canthus. So start with a smaller plant so you
don't have to dig as big of a hole. But overall,
I don't think you need to really do too much
at all. They'll be fine.

Speaker 1 (33:19):
Yeah, I say, just prepare the area, the general area
work in organic matter. We've always said, Stacey, don't dig
a hole and put some soil in it, plant in it.
You're creating a bathtub. Yes, spare the general.

Speaker 3 (33:33):
Area and starting small is just I think a great
way to deal with gray soil so you don't have
to dig quite so much, or you know, move out
to the lake shore. That's a great solution as well.
All Right, we're going to take a little break. When
we come back, we've got Mike Connor talking about pollinators
and sprinkling up, so please stay tuned. Thanks for listening

(33:59):
to the Gardens Amplified podcasts brought to you by Proven
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evergreens are trialed and tested by experts with your success
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Speaker 1 (34:13):
Welcome back to the Gardening Simplified Show today for segment four,
branching news and interview with Mike Connor, honey Tree Arborus Services,
former grower of pollinator friendly trees. But Mike is an arborist,
a certified arborist, a beekeeper. I know he's a speaker,

(34:34):
much sought after and soon to be an author. Mike
is well, I'm gonna say Honey Tree Nursery has this
goal of basically getting people to plant pollinator trees and
care for trees. I think, Mike, your motto always was

(34:55):
plant a tree, save a bee, or something like that, Right, Mike, that's.

Speaker 4 (34:59):
My t shirt. That's right there, you go, and a tree,
save a bee.

Speaker 1 (35:03):
You know, it's a good reminder for all of us, Mike,
as we enter spring and trees start to bloom, just
how important trees are. Many people think clover and other plants,
but boy, a tree is a pretty effective way of
providing pollen. Correct.

Speaker 4 (35:19):
I was just reading to report put out at Kentucky
State University several years ago where they said that the
most important spring plant for pollinators is red maple. Oh
by far, it produces more flowers per cubic meter than
almost any other plant in the springtime, and it's actively

(35:40):
visited by honey bees, by native bees. I recently saw
them being visited by what are called cellophane bees from
one of our native bees. They're already out, they're already
building up beehives, and they're so important for our early
spring build up.

Speaker 1 (35:56):
You know, Mike. That makes sense to me because in
the morning when I get up, I just kind of
I'm groggy and I kind of just wander off to
the the coffee pot. I have one thing in mind,
a cup of coffee. And I would think that bees
as they wake up in spring, they're they're looking for
some flowers. And if red maple is gone to work
early in spring, wow, it's a great resource.

Speaker 4 (36:19):
It really is. Rick and red maples are of a
range that consists from Maine to Florida and all the
way over to the Mississippi River, and then the cultivarts
go beyond that, so it's ubiquitous. It's a really important tree.

Speaker 3 (36:33):
And you know, it's a shame because red maple is
so beautiful. It's native and has much better fall color
than any of the maples that are more widely planted.
Silver maple and norm maple. I'm looking at you, but
how do those compare? I mean, do they still have
some value? Like you know, I have a massive silver
maple in the eastman Or Parkway in front of my house.

(36:54):
I didn't plant it, of course, it was there for
some reason. All of the trees, every single tree that
was ever planted in my yard was the worst possible choice.
I don't know what the previous owners were thinking, but
there is a massive silver maple, and of course it's
covered in flowers. So does that still have some benefit,
just not as beneficial as a native species.

Speaker 4 (37:15):
Well, actually, silver maple is very beneficial to the early
pollinators because it's the very first tree to bloom in
the spring. It comes out before the red maple. You know,
the red maple depends on the gree days. It has
to have a few degree days under its felt before
it opens up, but the silver maple does not. It
just has to have a chilling period. Once that chilling
period has been accomplished, then the very first or second

(37:38):
warm day above fifty five, those flowers open, and the
flowers at the top of the tree open first, and
then the side of the tree, and then the bottom
of the tree. And the pollinators are out there as
early as late February gathering nectar and pollen from those
silver maples. And little note, the silver maples don't really
care about the bees. They're not insect pollinated, pollinated by

(38:00):
the wind. But the silver maples and the red maples
produce nectar because it's are you ready for this, it's
an ana freeze and it keeps that ana freeze around
the ovaries, so they don't freeze, and they're able to
be fertilized, they're able to develop, and the honeybees are
taking advantage of that pollen and nectar as their own resource.
It's a great relationship.

Speaker 2 (38:21):
That's amazing. I had no idea. I never heard that before.

Speaker 1 (38:24):
That is interesting, very interesting. So, Mike, in our first
segment I mentioned GDD growing degree day accumulation a good
thing for people to understand, and it's interesting you talk
about the silver maples and the red maples along that line.
As far as emergence of these native insects is concerned,

(38:47):
there's a lot of confusion on how we should clean
up our yards. Should we rank up to leave, should
we prune everything back? How much disturbance should there be?
As a pollinator and be expert, what's your advice on that?

Speaker 4 (39:03):
My absolute advice is be lazy, hold off. Don't get
excited about cleaning up your perennial gardens early in the spring.
It's very important that we leave those perennial gardens intact
because those stems that are two years old are serving
as a nursery and they're holding area for our overwintering
native bees. Sixty percent of all the native bees that

(39:25):
we have in the United States are ground dwelling, and
when you rake that up and you kill that up
before those bees get a chance to emerge, you can
kill those pollinators in your perennial garden, and during really
cold weather, those bees will return to some of those
locations and escape the wind and escape the rain and

(39:47):
the freezing temperatures. So my advice to people, and I
know a lot of people will appreciate this, is don't
clean up your perennial garden. Don't be anxious to do that.
The later you can wait, the better. The very first
ones to come out of our native bees are what
we call the cellophane bees, and they're out gathering pollen

(40:10):
and nectar right now and they are taking that back
to the holes in the ground and they are feeding
their larvae, and they'll be gone in two weeks. So
I would recommend that we wait at least until the
vinka the vinca in our area are in bloom before
we start to rake and destroy those natural nesting areas

(40:32):
for the bees.

Speaker 1 (40:35):
So I was right in the first segment, Stacy Mike.
I told people to clean out their shed and work
on their or hoses, and irrigation equipment.

Speaker 4 (40:42):
First, sit out, drink another cup of coffee. Yeah, don't
be so anxious. And it's not just the bees, but
it's the chrystmases. I'm sorry, Yeah, the chrystmases and the
cocoons that are out there for our other pollinators. When
they take those up too early, then we're destroying those
native natural pollinators that we have in the garden.

Speaker 3 (41:03):
Yeah, and you know they're so well camouflaged. I know,
a couple of years ago we found a cocoon here
on the grounds at the nursery, and you know, it
looked it would be easy for someone who wasn't looking
for it to have just you know, tossed it out.
But instead we got to watch this amazing moth emerge.

Speaker 4 (41:20):
You know, when I was a kid, we were big
into bugs, and when we found those cocoons, we would
put those behind the screen in the house, and so
when those hatched out, the females would attract males by
the dozen, and at kids, we could see those those
male bees all fluttering around to come to visit the female,

(41:41):
and then of course we let the female go. But
what a great science experiment, what a great introduction to
nature for kids. You find those cocoons, put them in
a screen cage, and when they hatch, that protect them
from birds. And when they hatch them the males and
hopefully you've got a female, we'll come around to visit
and say hi and let them all go and we

(42:02):
can perpetuate that generation for another year.

Speaker 3 (42:04):
Well, you know, I think everything that you're saying is,
you know, people here all the time now with social
media and everything, you know, leave the leaves and blah
blah blah, and and the bees, and they think that
they're helping honey bees because of course most people when
they think bees, they're thinking of honey bees. And you know,
you're talking about all of these you know, vital and

(42:25):
really interesting you know ecologies that exists, you know, right
in our own backyards, and so many of us just
kind of plow them over without thinking. And you know,
for all of these catchy phrases like leave the leaves,
there's not a whole lot of information there as to
why and what's the you know, what's the joy and
what's in it for us as homeowners and gardeners. And

(42:47):
so I think it's so good to hear about all
of these interesting things that you enable when you just
give everything a little bit more time and space before
you you know, humanize it.

Speaker 4 (42:56):
That's right, that's right. I'm a firm believer of that.
Hold off a little while on cleaning up your spring debris,
because that's what's best for the native pollinators. Now for
our honey bees, now that's another topic, because honey bees,
of course, they're the ones that are out there doing
the bulk of the pollination. They're the ones that are
coming through the winter as a colony of five thousand

(43:18):
or more bees ready to get out there and pollinate,
as opposed to our native bees which are emerging as
a colony of one, and our queen bees and our
honey bee hives will be producing right now maybe a
thousand new babies a day, and they're all going to
mature and then get out there to pollinate our gardens
and our crops. But they are the major force for pollination.

(43:42):
But we need to preserve all of our pollinators, not
just the honey bees, but also our native bees, butterflies
and of course hummingbirds and things like that. I find
promoting the planting of trees for bees because most of
our trees that we promote our good for our native
beast and our honey bees. Some of our native trees

(44:04):
are not good for honey bees, they're good for our
native bees. So I like to promote trees that are
beneficial to both natives and honey bees. That would be
things like our lindens and our pulip trees and cornisimonum,
and those types of things are so productive for both species.
So we don't have to be exclusive and say I

(44:26):
like one more than the other. Let's provide enough forage
for both of those.

Speaker 1 (44:30):
That's fantastic. We're talking to Mike Connor Honey Tree Arborist Services,
and Mike is a beekeeper, a certified arborist, a speaker,
soon to be author. And I'd love to talk to
you about that book at some point, Mike, because I
think a lot of people are going to be very
interested in this book. You write with your experience. I mean,

(44:50):
you've been doing this be thing for I'm going to
call you out here because I'm in the same group
with you. How long have you been doing this, Mike.

Speaker 4 (44:58):
Well, I'll let you do the math. I've got my
first hive of bees in nineteen sixty six. Wow, I
was twelve years old and I ordered it through Sears catalog.

Speaker 2 (45:08):
Oh my gosh, I've got.

Speaker 4 (45:09):
Bees ever since. And at my peak I had about
two hundred hives of bees. And now it's more back
to a hobbyist observational status. And two of my daughters
are interested in carrying on bees now, and I'm really
excited about that.

Speaker 2 (45:25):
Love that is great.

Speaker 3 (45:25):
Now, so I have heard, and you know, maybe you
can reassure our listeners because you know, even as much
as people hear about bees being beneficial, most people think
bees stinging. Don't want to encourage them.

Speaker 2 (45:39):
Now, is it.

Speaker 3 (45:39):
True that most of our native bees, like the celphane
bees that you mentioned, et cetera, are not singing.

Speaker 4 (45:46):
They rarely, rarely sting, and if they do sting, it's
almost negligible, it's a small pinch. I think that the
many times I run into cellophane bees, you can take
them with your hands. I'm not recommending you do this.
You can get them in your hands, you can them
out of the air, you can look at them, examine them.
And I've never been stung. I even think if you
stood on one barefoot, that it would be rare to

(46:07):
be stung by a sellof ae B or one of
these early native bees. It just is not a major factor.
Most of these large bumble bees that we have flying around,
they don't want to sting you. If you grab one
in your hand, well then that could be the exception.
But rarely will you be stung by a native bee. Rarely.

Speaker 2 (46:27):
So that's you know, it's win win.

Speaker 3 (46:29):
So you're helping these creatures that need our help, that
are really being you know, their populations are being damaged
by our own practices, and you don't even like they're
all benefit, no harm, They're all beneficial.

Speaker 4 (46:42):
I don't see any harmful sides to these native bees
at all. Mike.

Speaker 1 (46:47):
I wanted to quickly ask you something that I'm passionate about,
and that is diversity in the landscape. We're talking about
early spring things like red maple, but it's important to
have diversity in the landscape because this bee thing, so
to speak, is a season long thing. It's not just
early spring.

Speaker 4 (47:07):
Oh, Rick, I'm so glad you asked that. There's a
springboard for me to jump onto a new topic. Springboard
that is that, Oh boy, our native bees rarely fly
more than a thousand feet in their entire life.

Speaker 2 (47:19):
Think about that.

Speaker 4 (47:20):
They have got to have the diversity within a thousand feet.
There are exceptions to that. Some of our bumblebees, for instance,
a native bee will fly further than that, but most
of our native beasts will fly less than a thousand
feet in their entire life. That means you need a
diversity of flowers from spring until fall to hit most
of those major groups of native bees. Our native bees

(47:45):
usually only live about two weeks, that you know, and
then they're replaced by another native fee and then another
native different species, a different genus. But if we don't
provide a continuous supply of food for these bees, then
we're going to miss out on some of the genuses
and species that are available in our area. So I
recommend the diversity always continuous bloom if we can do that.

(48:09):
And then we get into things like the honeybee, which
is you know, they just have to have a lot
of resources because they're raising a lot of babies, and
so no one plant provides all of the essential amino
acids they need for the protein to raise those babies,
but combinations do, such as red maple and pussy wallow.
Those two provide a balanced diet. A lot of our

(48:31):
fruit trees will provide a balanced diet, but not one individually.
So we need to have that diversity not only in
the trees, but in our forbes and then are smaller.
What are ornamentals that we plant in our landscape because
we need that we need that diversity of pollen for
the essential amino acids.

Speaker 1 (48:50):
What a great sales pitch for plants on trials?

Speaker 3 (48:53):
Yes, indeed, yeah, And I'm absolutely I'm wondering, you know
how So I think you know, what you're saying can
resonate with a lot of people, but they kind of
don't know where to start. And you know, Rick and
I have talked about many times how certain plants in
the garden center industry end up getting prioritized simply because
they look great when people are in the garden center.
So you know, a lot of landscapes kind of end

(49:14):
up really just centering these plants that look great in
that spring moment when they're in the garden center. So
what are you know, some of the things that people
can look for. Is is it a matter of bloom time,
is it bloom shape, is it shrubs, perennials, Is it
just kind of trying to combine all of these. Is
there some sort of you know, secret recipe so to speak,

(49:34):
that we can be working towards.

Speaker 4 (49:36):
You know, you can buy list You can get lists online. Unfortunately,
and I mean this with all of sincerity, most of
those lists are not accurate. And I'm not trying to
be a know it all here, but most of those
lists are based on somebody else's list or on somebody
else's personal opinion on what's valuable for pollinators. I think
that if you plant plants with a diversity of color, shape,

(50:00):
and blooming time, that you generally match what those bees need. Now,
that doesn't mean you only have to plant natives. And
I know I'm going to get in trouble here. I'm
sorry for that. But there are a lot of good
native oars and cultivars and even non invasive plants that
we can put into our gardens that help fill those
gaps here here.

Speaker 1 (50:21):
I appreciate that, Mike, you're preaching to the choir there.

Speaker 4 (50:24):
Buddy, all right, we need to fill those gaps. So
there's nothing else that's native filling those gaps such as
early spring and late fall and early spring in late fall,
you know, I promote the trees. There aren't a lot
of plants out there that are providing large quantities of
nectar or pollen in the spring, but we can plant

(50:46):
things trees shrubs that do that. We can plant trees
and shrubs in the fall that help fill that gap.
Of course, one of my favorites is seven Sons, but
I think that's my personal preference there. I love those
trees we can do. In terms of cultivars. When we
look at butterfly bush, I think that proven winners not
giving you a plug here, But you guys have some

(51:09):
varieties of butterfly plants that are even more productive than
the native plants, and I think we should embrace that.
We should plant those, We should acknowledge that that there
are some things that are better than just the native plants,
and they're better for our pollinators, and they're better for
our environment and for our gardens, and they're pretty as

(51:30):
long as they don't become invasive, and they're not invasive.
That's what I tell people. I'm not necessarily a native person,
gets me in trouble, but our honeybees are not native.
Our honey bees aren't native, and they need to have
some of the resources from our non native plants as
long as they're not invasive.

Speaker 1 (51:50):
I agree. I mean, what is it people? Do you
know in meetings they pound on the table or whatever.
I mean, Mike thumbs up to you, buddy, I agree, well.

Speaker 2 (51:59):
Thank you. I agree to you.

Speaker 3 (52:01):
And what's interesting is that it sounds you know, you
can frame this in a way that insects like their
gardens very much like we do. Colorful and with lots
of flowers. And so if a garden is looking good
to you as a gardener, you know, for a long
period during the season from spring until fall, with a
good diversity of flowers and different things coming and going,

(52:23):
than chances are that's also going to look pretty good
to our native insects as well.

Speaker 4 (52:28):
Yes, yes, you've got it, you understand it. That's correct,
and that's for our native bees. And then again, put
on my other hand as a beekeeper, in that is
that our honey bees need large resources of flowers that
are all blooming at once, such as a flowering tree
or a large metal, not a small metal. Honey Bees
don't profit from a small pot of flowers. Their needs

(52:51):
are too large. They need to gather a large quantity
of nectar over the season and a lot of pollen.
We need to have plants they're out there, or meadows
they're outer there that are providing large quantities of nectro
and pollen at one time. And that's what I push.
And that's what a tree is. A tree is a
meadow in the sky. And if we have a tree

(53:12):
that's in bloom, a flowering crab apple, or a flowering
maple that's in bloom, or Sepphora japonica or seven sons.
Now we have a medal that's sitting in your yard
that has a very small footprint, maybe only a couple
square feet, but it's a metal going up and that
metal going up can be planted next to a metal
on the ground and we get double the flowers available

(53:34):
for our pollinators.

Speaker 1 (53:36):
His name is Mike Connor. He's a certified arborist and beekeeper,
a speaker, and Mike, I'm always inspired after talking to you,
I sincerely mean that I can see why you're all
the buzz. Can you share with people your website?

Speaker 4 (53:53):
Well, my website is Honeytree Nursery dot com and I
don't even mind if you a personal question contact me
via email, which is Honeytree nursery at Yahoo dot com.
I'm happy to answer questions, love to do it, and
I'll even take some flack from people. That's fine. I
have broad but if you give me flack, give me

(54:16):
facts like it.

Speaker 2 (54:18):
I like it.

Speaker 1 (54:18):
I like that a lot. Mike, you are a joy,
I tell you what. Thanks so much for joining us
on the Gardening Simplified Show today.

Speaker 4 (54:26):
Thank you for the invitation. I do appreciate it.

Speaker 2 (54:29):
It was a pleasure, Mike.

Speaker 4 (54:29):
Thanks, thank you.

Speaker 3 (54:31):
Wow, I am so inspired to get out there. If
only it were warm enough to see an insect.

Speaker 1 (54:37):
He does that to me every time I'm fired up.

Speaker 3 (54:41):
I am too, so thank you so much to Mike
from Honeytree Nursery. Thank you, Rick, thank you, thank you Adriana,
and thanks so much to all of you for listening.

Speaker 2 (54:48):
We hope you have a wonderful week ahead.