Bill Chaves Pod_EP 182

This week, Bill and Alex welcome back Josh Fenton of The Summit League to chat about staging conference championships, the new Summit-MVFC partnership, the current NCAA landscape, and much more (3:14). Then, the conversation shifts to UND Athletics, as football remains unbeaten in Valley play, hockey prepares for this weekend’s NCHC opener, and both cross country teams set their sights on the league championships (32:21). On the B-side (49:37), Tottenham Hotspur become masters of the set piece, while Liverpool’s poor run continues.

Episode Transcript

Speaker 1 (00:00):
You're listening to the Bill Shaves Podcast, presented by Mid
Coast Sports. Crossover season is in full swing on Mid
Coast Sports with wall to wall live coverage of college football,
college hockey, volleyball, postseason, soccer, and in a matter of
days basketball as well. Watch on Mid Coast Sports and
stream on the Summit League Network powered by Mid Coast
Sports Plus. This is how we do sports, and this

(00:22):
is the Bill Shaves Podcast. Yes, welcome to another edition
of the Bill Shaves Podcast. We're taping this on a
Tuesday morning, the twenty eighth of October. Alex Heiner, Bill
Shaves a special guest that will introduce in a moment
Bill Howard things in your world as we get set
to flip the calendar to November in just a couple
of days.

Speaker 2 (00:42):
Yeah, alex So, yeah, good morning, good afternoon. We're potting
on a Tuesday morning, So this is an odd time
for us, but this is this worked for us, So
here we go. You know what, Alex So, in higher
ed if you're an administrator, there's couple things over the
course of the year that you get let's just say

(01:05):
eyes on to some degree. When does Halloween fall and
it falls on a Friday, okay, a Friday Halloween. Oh
and we have a hockey game, so there's a lot
of pieces of the puzzle going on this week. So
we're just making sure that everybody, let's just say dots,
eyes and cross as t's this week.

Speaker 1 (01:26):
I love that I have young children still, so this
is still a big, a big moment in on our calendar.
When is Halloween? What are we going to dress up as?

Speaker 3 (01:34):
Et cetera.

Speaker 1 (01:35):
I have noticed in recent years, I'm hesitant to even
go down this road. It feels like we dressed up
a lot more. It feels like there are a lot
more like trick or treat events in the build up
to Halloween. I think my kids are dressed up in
their costumes like three times already, and we're still several
days away from the actual Halloween night.

Speaker 2 (01:50):
You know what, Elex. So last night actually we hosted,
probably it's been at least six seven years now, our
Student Athlete Advisory Committee host to Halloween Bash at the
Pollard Center and it really is awesome. And you know,
I think a couple things. I think maybe even parents
or whomever you know, said hey, we're going to spend

(02:13):
X amount on a costume. At least you get a
little bit more time with it to some degree. And
as we all know, if you're let's just say, in
the in the North, sometimes it can be a little
dicey on the actual night itself. So having some other
events may may not be the worst. But we had
a tremendous attendance last night. I mean in our our

(02:34):
student athletes love it too because they get to dress up.
So it's great.

Speaker 1 (02:38):
Yeah, No, it's such a cool thing for the kids
to do it. Like you said, inside in the Pollard Center,
you have student athletes that are handing out candy and
celebrating and having a good time like that's that's every
kid's dream to go hang out with their heroes in
costume and get candy come on a lot of boxes.

Speaker 2 (02:53):
I mean, it's just that's it. I think we're done
this week. I think we're you know, we've we've done
everything we can do.

Speaker 1 (03:01):
We could talk about trigger treating for a long time.
We're not going to. We're not going to. We're going
to transition to the reason why we have this podcast
and talk about things that are going on around the
University of North Kota Athletics, around the conferences we're in
around the NCAA. Who better to talk about that than
a man that has been at the helm of a
variety of conferences that North Dakota cares about. First the NCCHC,

(03:21):
the Semi League. Now an executive advisor to the Missouri
Valley Football Conference, he is no stranger to this podcast.
He is Someeon League Commissioner Josh Fenton. He joins us. Now, Josh,
how are you.

Speaker 3 (03:31):
I'm great, Thanks for having me. Appreciate you guys recognize
me as a longtime guest of this podcast. It's a
true honor.

Speaker 2 (03:39):
Yeah, well, thanks Josh for being here. Yes, we were
talking off air with you that I think at some
point Alex and I are going to have to count
up all the guests at some stage of the game.
But you're right there. I think you're right there. There's
a few, there's a few, that's for sure, right off
the top of our head. But you're always a wealth
of knowledge, and not only for what we're doing in
the league itself, are multi sport league, but then also

(04:03):
on some national landscape items as well. So we'll get
right up, we'll get right to it. So, Alex, I
think you're gonna you're gonna lead off today?

Speaker 1 (04:11):
I can Bill, Yeah, I'll bet first. So this we
mentioned again late October, Josh. This is a great kind
of time period, I'm sure for the league where you've
got league championships obviously women's soccer, cross country, volleyball starting
to come to the end of their seasons, basketball is beginning.
What is this time of year like for you and
for your staff when everything feels like it's happening.

Speaker 3 (04:33):
Well, as Bill knows very well on a campus, I mean,
these are the times of year that you work for.
You know, we all got into this industry to help
student athletes or young people become better humans kind of
through this athletic curriculum. And so when you get to
these times of years when you know you're crowning champions
and you're seeing, you know, the exhilaration upon people's faces,

(04:56):
and then you welcome in a new sports season like
the basketball season which will begin next week. You know,
this is just really again what we work for, and
it's exciting time a year and I'm glad it's here.

Speaker 2 (05:09):
Well, I'll tell you what You're right, you're in crossover.
I know it gets really busy for your staff at
this point in time. But as we kick off basketballs
and I you know, it's interesting as your offices are
located in Sioux Falls, it's been interesting what the Sue
Falls community has done with bringing in certain college basketball
games as well.

Speaker 3 (05:29):
Yeah, so for those that are not familiar, our office
is located on the northwest side of Sue Falls. And
what's on the northwest side of Sue Falls is a
building called the Pentagon. And the Pentagon has been around
for you know, decade plus at this point, and it's
and it's run by Sanford Sports, a division of Sanford Health.

(05:51):
And what they've done over you know that decade plus
time frame is bringing in some high level high major
and mid major basketball to play in the Pentagon during
the kind of the non conference season. So next Monday,
which is the official start of the men's and women's season,
they've got a significant event. A media company called the

(06:13):
Field of sixty eight, which participated in our media day
a couple of weeks ago, is hosting an event where
they have three men's games starting at about Newnish and
going all the way through the end. And you know,
we're actually fortunate we've got two of our conference members
participating in that Omaha is going to play Murray State

(06:34):
and the opener, and then the Jackson South Dakota State
will take on Merrimac in the one that will close
the evening. And so, but to your point, Boil, like
the community has really embraced the sport of basketball. I
think it's I think it's certainly in the DNA and
the blood of the people that live in and around
in the state of South Dakota, especially the community of

(06:54):
Souit Falls. And then that extends into that early March
time period when we have a chance to welcome our
teams to see Falls for the sum League Basketball Championships,
and the community has really really embraced and supported that
event as well.

Speaker 2 (07:08):
And Josh, you know, having had our Fall Summate League
meetings just about maybe close to a month ago, somewhere
in that range. That's something that your staff works on
three hundred and sixty five days a year.

Speaker 3 (07:21):
Yeah, I mean, as you know, we work on behalf
of the membership. You know, we are here to support
the athletic interests and follow the direction that our membery
institutions currently nine at this point, would like to go
with a conference. You know, that's led through our President's Council,
which is our highest ranking and governing body representative of

(07:42):
the presidents or chancellors of each institution, but then down
through a body that you're a part of, Bill, which
is the Joint Council, and sometimes separately just the athletic
directors alone, who have governance authority over certain things. And
so our staff is constantly working on how do we
find ways to advance the league forward, but obviously following

(08:04):
the direction of our member institutions. And so you know,
it's exciting when we get to this point of the
year because it is championship season in the fall side,
and so our staff is hard at work preparing for
hopefully what will be great experiences for our student athletes
as they kind of culminate their seasons. You know, if
there's one thing that we talk about, probably most within

(08:26):
the League office is how do we enhance experience and
opportunity for student athletes through the things that we can
control in the Conference office, and our conference championships have
to play a significant.

Speaker 2 (08:39):
Role in that.

Speaker 3 (08:40):
You know, for our for our team sports, you'll have one,
maybe more than one if we're fortunate that we'll move
on and participate in the national postseason through the NCAA Tournament.
But for most of our institutions, it's kind of the
end of the line, the end of the season, maybe
in some cases, the end of athletic careers for some
of our student athletes. So it's really important that we

(09:03):
pride ourselves on what type of experience is that during
those championships for the student athletes that are able to
participate in them. So we're excited and our staff works
really hard on them.

Speaker 1 (09:13):
I think it shows. I think that care really shows.
And if you've been to a championship event, whether it
is basketball, whether it is cross country, or it's softball
or whatever it is, it does feel like that the
league has done a great job of elevating that experience.
If you could for people too, maybe you haven't been,
Could you give some examples of things that just even
in the last three years since you came to Power

(09:35):
that was then came to my head, since you became
the commissioner of this league. What are some of the
things that you've seen the league do to help elevate
that experience when it comes to championship season.

Speaker 3 (09:45):
Yeah, well, I think it first starts with the facilities
and where are we hosting our championship tournaments. Most take
place on a campus, and we've got great facilities on
our campuses, and so being able to host in a
in a premier facility is certainly number one. You know.
For instance, this this upcoming weekend, we're going to host

(10:07):
across Country Championship in Omaha's the host and they're going
to host it at what I've heard. I haven't been
there yet. I will be there on Saturday, but an
incredible cross country course just southwest of Omaha, Nebraska. And so,
you know, our student athletes have really talked to us
through feedback about our championships regarding the facilities, and so

(10:27):
you know, we've had a lot of discussion about, you know,
how can we ensure that our facilities are in you know,
highest form as we host those championships. Obviously, our basketball
Championship is hosted in a neutral site. We think the
Danny Stanford Premier Centers is a great facility there. But
you know that then it comes down to just kind

(10:48):
of some of the little things that you'll see at championships.
You know, what are we doing to create content and
promote what's going on? During the championships, whether it be
through our social media websites, collaborating obviously with our schools.
You know, we we see ourselves as a bit of
a storyteller in the conference office, and so I know

(11:09):
our student athletes appreciate our ability to to tell their
stories during the championship and showcase them them them proudly.
But then, you know, Alex, it really comes down to
kind of each individual championship and what are the unique
aspects that that we can do around those championships, whether
it's student athlete hospitality, hospitality, we've elevated our participant gifts

(11:33):
that our student athletes are are receiving each year. You know,
there's there's things around kind of the in game experience,
if you will, especially with basketball, that we've brought in
that that have elevated the championship, the signage, the branding,
things of that nature, trying to make it feel and

(11:53):
look like a big time conference tournament experience. Obviously, we're
a mid major conference and money doesn't grow on the
trees outside of my office the last time I checked,
and I keep checking every day, and so we have
to work within the resource constraints that we have. But
we try to make the dollar go as far as
we can to elevate those experiences.

Speaker 1 (12:13):
Yeah. I always think if you make it a big deal,
it is a big deal and you've done a great job.
I think of doing that for these kids.

Speaker 2 (12:19):
Well, it's it's our annual plea that if you've never
been to that particular tournament, I think you'd be incredibly
You could be surprised, you may not be. It's it's
certainly one of the best tournaments in the country, period,
end of story, at any level. Let me switch gears
on you, Josh, real quick. A couple different directions here.

(12:40):
One is there was a press release, Oh maybe around
August time frame, could have been July. Who knows that
the Summit League is now kind of connected with the
Missouri Valley in running kind of the football league at
this point in time, And I think it'll be just good.
From your perspective, how's it gone so far? Are in

(13:00):
sort of the thought process even behind that? And uh,
and then where do you see this going? Maybe moving forward?

Speaker 3 (13:07):
Yeah, I mean maybe I should ask you Bill, how's
it gone so far? But from from our perspective, you know,
we think it's it's gone well. First off appreciative of
the Missouri Valley Conference, Jeff Jackson, the commissioner there, and
everybody across his staff for the collaborative approach. You know,
don't You don't have success and be able to operate

(13:29):
effectively unless both sides are bought in. And I certainly
think that that both sides are bought in. And a
lot of groundwork went in last academic year, kind of
leading through the spring late spring before anything was generally finalized,
to kind of put the parameters in place as to
how things would be structured. So, you know, Jeff sits

(13:49):
as the commissioner, I said, as a title called executive advisor.
But really what we've done is is we've hired somebody
in a chief operating officer role, and that's Kyle Groomes
and he came over from the United Athletic Conference to
run the day to day, the week to week as
it relates to the sport of football. And so, you know,
Jeff and I will communicate a lot with the presidents,

(14:12):
we'll connect with the ads occasionally, but you know, the
person on the ground and the person that's done a
great job thus far has been Kyle. You know, our
previous commissioner Patty Vivorito, a longtime commissioner. Full credit to
her and developing what this conference has become. We joke
that we needed three people to replace what Patty did,
and so, you know, I think that's a testament to Patty.

(14:35):
But you know, Bill, we've kind of worked within the
lanes that we've established in the structure. So, for example,
the Summit League manages the content creation and generally the
distribution through social and so a lot of the imagery,
a lot of the video, a lot of the things
that you're seeing on social to help promote the brand

(14:55):
of the Missouri Valley Football Conference and at schools, which
is deservedly so given the competitive success that we've had
for a while. Now comes out of the Summer League's office.
There's things that come out of the Valley's office, like compliance,
more the traditional communications p R, A little bit of

(15:15):
financial operations operate there. But we have a weekly check
in and so we touch base across kind of all verticals,
if you will, And from my standpoint, I think it's
worked really well, and like I said, appreciative of the
Valley's cooperative, cooperative approach and collaborative approach.

Speaker 2 (15:36):
No, I appreciate it. I think you're right, Josh, And
I think it's been really really good that both leagues
are vested into what's transpiring on the football field. And
I think I think, you know, hopefully people have seen
an elevated opportunity that we're able to showcase our student
athletes and our programs.

Speaker 3 (15:56):
Yeah, I think that's right. You know, the football at
the FCS space, and there are other sports that may
be of similar you know, you don't have widespread conference,
multi sport conferences sponsoring the sport. You certainly have some
the big Sky CIA, patri League, et cetera. Others that

(16:17):
are out there, but a lot of those multi sport
conferences or even our unique configuration is that we have
schools coming from various multi sport conferences to come together.
And so, you know, I'm not suggesting that this is
a new way or a new approach to sports sponsorship
in the future, just buying large across the board for

(16:37):
all sports, but you have to think kind of collaborative,
collaboratively around a sport like football, because we have four
institutions that sponsor it, the Valley has five institutions that
sponsor it, and then Youngstown States obviously in the Horizon League,
and so it's difficult. There would be difficult for one

(16:58):
of US, as a multi sport conference to sponsor it
unless a significant amount of schools agreed to become affiliate members.
And you know, I think the best approach is the
approach that we kind of landed on.

Speaker 2 (17:11):
Well. I think it's gone well, and you know, and
Kyle's done a great job, and you know, we'll get through.
We'll call it year zero right of this and then
really hit hit into year one. Let me switch gears
one more time. And my last question for you, Josh,
is you've done and I would say, let's let's do
an elevator speech, maybe up to the third floor, because

(17:31):
you could go up to like you go really high,
you could go to the Empire State Building high. So
let's let's keep it really simple. But you've done a
lot of things in the national landscape of what's going
on with intercollegiate athletics at the Division one level, and
there's just a lot of we'll call it noise in
the system right now. And if you want to read

(17:52):
about a lot of different things, you can read every
day about certain things that are occurring. But from your chair,
where are we right now? And and Crystal Ball, where
do you think we're going?

Speaker 3 (18:04):
Yeah, I mean, I still think that we're in a
transitioning phase and we're probably going to be in a
transitioning phase for for some time here. You know, the
the NCAA has gone through some challenges. And when I
say the NCAA, I'm looking inwardly at myself and as
conferences and member institutions because we represent the NCAA. But

(18:24):
obviously our rules of old were challenged in the court,
and the court has ruled and said that no longer
can you operate the manner in which you're operating, in
particular regarding financial benefits for student athletes. And so we've
we've evolved out of that, and you know, maybe started
with Alston a few years ago, and then as transitioned

(18:45):
to House and the House settlement this past year, and
so we now have an environment where student athletes have
the ability to benefit financially benefit off of their name,
image and likeness, whether that's kind of what I call
outside the system or kind of within the system. Some
refer to it as as revenue sharing. And so I
think we've we've we've ended, or I shouldn't say ended,

(19:06):
we've gotten to a better place there because it's important
for the students athletes to be able to benefit off
of that. But we still face significant challenges now and
likely will in the future. We've got challenges around whether
student athletes should be employees. We've got challenges around eligibility

(19:32):
that that's a significant one. That's that's the latest flavor
of lawsuits that are out there, and now that the
financial benefit is being seen and taken advantage of rightfully,
So you know, people are challenging the ability to continue
to compete in college athletics because of the economic opportunity

(19:54):
that that may be there as they continue to stay
in college athletics. One of the things that I believe
to my core, and I think all the commissioners and
I think all member institutions believe to their core that
if athletics is going to exist on a campus of
higher education, we need it to be inherently educational and
we need a connection to the academic curriculum. And so

(20:19):
what I mean by that is student athletes need to
be students, and that the academic career connected to one's
athletic athletic eligibility is still vitally important, and that is
what's being challenged. And so we are in a place
where we're having a tough time being able to manage

(20:43):
and really enforce the rules. And so you're seeing things
like congressional engagement and the need for congressional support and help,
which I believe that there is some limited need for.
And people talk about anti trust exemption and whatnot, and
I think that gets used a little too broadly, you know,

(21:03):
I think we're talking about things that we need protection
around to be able to enforce our rules, and one
of the first ones is eligibility and eligibility tied to academics.
But there are other things, transfer rules, competitions, playing seasons,
et cetera. You know, we need some help on codifying

(21:25):
the point I made earlier about employment and that we
don't believe student athletes should be employees on our campuses.
That we feel as though that we found a bit
of a sweet spot and kind of where they are
with the ability to benefit financially benefit off of their
ni L, but to take it to the extent that

(21:46):
they should be employees in the campuses, you know, we
obviously we don't believe that, but that's being challenged, and
so you know, there's there's a lot that that's kind
of come for good Bill in terms of how we've
evolved as a system, but there's still a lot of
challenge that is there, and you know, we're going to
have to continue to work our way through it. And

(22:07):
I do believe, like others believe that we're going to
need some outside help to get to where we need
to be. But but ultimately, as you think about the
role of college sports, the role of college sports goes
way beyond what you see on a Saturday afternoon on
the major networks. And I'm obviously talking about high level

(22:30):
college football because it provides so many opportunities and so
many experiences for student athletes at our level, but also
at other levels Division two and Division three, and if
we're not careful, you know, those experiences and opportunities could
be impacted to the point where we're we're not providing

(22:51):
them like we have in years past. And so I'm
optimistic that we can get to a better place, but
certainly a lot of work still.

Speaker 1 (22:59):
Had we talked about the Missouri Valley in the some
League partnership, I know with your background within the NCC,
I think people have asked, would that make sense for
the some of league to also have a connection with
that hockey conference as well? Could you talk to us
about the possibility of that being something in the future
that we might see.

Speaker 3 (23:15):
Yeah, I don't know, Alex. I mean our industry, you
never say never. But you know, hockey conferences other than
the Big Ten have been historically set up based on
single sports structures where they're independent from the multi sport world.
And the aspect of Division two and Division three institutions
playing at the Division one level I think is a

(23:38):
key difference from you know what you just brought up
in terms of an analogy regarding the Missouri Valley Football Conference.
You know, the Missouri Valley Football Conference has ten institutions.
All ten of those institutions are Division one institutions. They
just happen to be from different multi sport conferences. Whereas
if you look at the NCCHC or other single sport
hockey conferences, you know you have a mix of Vision

(24:00):
one and then incorporated within our Division twos and Division threes,
and so the structure is different in that regard, And
so I don't know that it necessarily makes complete sense
in the manner in which we're trying to do it
or are doing it related to football. But you know,

(24:21):
I know those are will always be conversations that people
will have, and if there's a better way to approach
things and we can provide more benefit to our schools
and our student athletes, you know, we're all for the conversation.
But at this point, you know, I don't necessarily see
anything on the horizon.

Speaker 1 (24:38):
Thanks for laying that out. And then one other thing,
just because the Women's Soccer Championships are coming up this weekend,
you know, men's soccer also is getting set to play
their tournament. That's been a big talking point in that
space recently about perhaps changing what soccer looks like at
the collegiate level. I know there was a big study
from former athletes and coaches and different people that really
support the game within the US soccer structure about transitioning

(25:01):
from a fall sports season into making it more of
a little bit more like a hockey where you play
a September, October November schedule, kind of take a Christmas
break and then resume in the spring, sort of to
mirror what it might look like professionally. What have you
made of some of those conversations, Josh, I know the
league is one of the best. It's one of the
best conferences in the country, certainly on the men's side.
The women are always in the tournament. What are your thoughts?

Speaker 3 (25:23):
Yeah, well, well, first of all, I should have known
better that a soccer question was coming from the two
of you. I know, Bell, it wasn't you, So I
maybe should have read up more on my US Soccer proposal. Actually,
I've I've participated in multiple zoom conversations with the people
at US Soccer that are looking at kind of this

(25:45):
different approach. So a couple of things, alex One. This
is kind of being spurred a little bit more from
the men's side than it is from the women's side.
There was actually legislation in the NCAA system to change
it to kind of the full season Struck sure, and
that that legislation never made it to the point of
actually coming to be. And so what US Soccer is

(26:07):
now proposing as a very similar type of structure, and
they're looking at it from the standpoint of health, safety,
well being for student athletes. How many days in between
games kind of elongating the season if you will, also
looking at it from kind of an elite player development standpoint,
what's what's a better training gown from an elite player

(26:29):
development standpoint, and then also believing that there's just you know,
better chance of exposure just given this overall structure. And
so this is very much in its in its infancy stages.
US Soccer has put out a white paper talking about
how how this could be structured. They're regionalizing things and

(26:49):
so really it would it would really remove the roles
of multi sport conferences or conferences in general, because it
would be managed kind of through the national structure being
put out by US Soccer, and it intended to be
a bit more regional, which is which is understandable to
to try to help manage transportation, travel things, things of

(27:13):
that nature. But you know, there's still a lot of
unknowns around it. One, the Men's Soccer Championship and the
Women's Soccer Championship. Of the Men's Soccer Championship is an
NCAA sponsor sport and right now we've got bylaws within
the NCAA that indicate if the NCAA sponsoring is sport
and if you're selected to participate in that championship. You know,

(27:38):
you you're obligated, unless you have some exception, which is
limited on some sports like football at the FCS level,
Celebration Bowl, things of that nature. But you're you're obligated
to participate, and if you don't, then you know, you're
you're giving up on some of the other things that
that come as a benefit to to being a member

(27:59):
of the NCAA, including clear revenue distribution. The NCAA obviously
as a media partner in ESPN that controls the rights
to the championship. You know, I know that's an important
championship for ESPN, But we I and others are very
open to the discussion and I and I give you
A Soccer a ton of credit for expanding this discussion,

(28:22):
but we're open to the to the discussion about how
do we find ways to improve the overall structure for
for sports. There's just a lot of layers to think through,
and you know, time will tell on ultimately where this
goes and whether we get it to the point of,
you know, partnering with US Soccer within the NCAA structure

(28:44):
or you know, I think the extreme would be in
some manner the sport is removed from the NCAA structures
and has positioned with US Soccer. But you know, there's
unintended implications or consequences there that that could as it
relates to other sports. Who's to say that sport XYZ
doesn't think that they could do something different or better

(29:06):
through a national governing body. And so we need to
be really thoughtful about the approach here and I know
we will be here in the future.

Speaker 2 (29:16):
My follow up to that, I would say from an
AD's chair is in a vacuum, I think we can
talk about any sport and trying to elevate any sport.
I think that's very fair. But what's happened is very
quickly you have multiple sports that you're trying to balance
in the chair certainly that I sit, and you're trying

(29:37):
to figure out how can that work. From a staffing standpoint,
from a facility standpoint, There's just a lot of pieces
and layers to it. As Josh was saying, So I
just wanted to kind of get into the ground level
of saying, you know, they're just those are the things
that you really really have to think through. And I'm
not suggesting their ideas, not great. I mean, really, if

(29:58):
you took every sport in ice and said how can
you blow it up to the nth degree, you might
be doing something different than what you're doing right now.
You could maybe or may or maybe you're good with it.
I don't know.

Speaker 3 (30:10):
I mean, I think Bill's hitting on exactly kind of
the things that we have to think through the unintended consequences.
You know, are are we entering into a world where
each sport has almost become completely separated out and federated.
I don't think that's the case. I think there's still
advantages and synergies to kind of being ruled up within
multi sport conferences and obviously working through the national structure.

(30:34):
But again, I think that the conversation is a very
healthy one and we should have a conversation about, especially
if it comes around to things like health and well
being of players and student athletes. But you know, Bill
going into the ground level, he's absolutely right. Like, for instance,
the proposal I believe calls for the second portion of

(30:54):
the season to start in February, and I know it
could be very challenging to play men's soccer games in
East Lansing, Michigan because Michigan State has a men's program
towards the middle to the end of February, just based
upon what the weather looks like at that point in time,
and so not that the weather can't be bad as
we go through the later latter portion of the fall,

(31:15):
but you know, things like that, plus other sports that
are going in the spring when you typically haven't had
to manage a sport that's existed in the fall summer,
using lcross facilities for soccer facilities and vice versa, and
so there's a lot of that that has to be
thought about. But again open to very much have the conversation.

(31:37):
And we've told you as soccer use us as a
as a as a think tank if you will. Is
this kind of continues to move forward.

Speaker 1 (31:45):
Well, we could talk for a long time, but you're
a busy man and we appreciate you taking so much
of your morning with this, Josh, So best of luck. Again,
is the some of the transitions to fall championship season
coming up? Enjoy it. Like you said, this is the
best time of year. Thanks again for joining us.

Speaker 3 (31:58):
Yeah, I always appreciate you guys having me. Thanks Thanks
Josh big.

Speaker 1 (32:02):
Thanks again to Josh Benton for taking some time today
in the midst of a busy week for the summon league.
He's juggling a lot right now. He and his staff
have a lot going on with all these different sports underway,
not too dissimilar from yourself and your staff with football
and hockey and hoops starting on Monday and everything else
that's going on. I know his role is a little
different than yours, but how do you and your staff

(32:24):
handle all the stresses that the end of October early November.

Speaker 3 (32:28):
Bring, well?

Speaker 2 (32:28):
I you know, I would say this start with this, Alex.
We get to we get to do all this. We
it's a it's awesome, it's you know, it's a chosen field,
and you know, it really is a way of life.
It's a lifestyle. And so if you choose to be
an intercollegiate athletic, certainly at any any portion, whether it

(32:49):
be a coach, administrator, whatever, whatever it is, you have
to be all in because it's it. You work when
people work, and you work when people play, and so
that's but when you get to crossover time like this,
you do have to juggle and balance, you really do. Hey,
I've got a juggle and balance on literally where I'm

(33:11):
going to be. I mean, that is an accurate statement.
I keep looking through, like, how can I balance something
when there's a potential, say hockey doubleheader at home. Can
I somehow make it to Friday night, but then maybe
get get to where football is on Saturday. I mean,
those are the things we have to figure out. But

(33:32):
then we have other staff members that are just with
those teams too, so we just have to balance everything out.

Speaker 1 (33:38):
What do you always say, You've got seventeen only children,
You've got to make sure feels the love.

Speaker 2 (33:43):
My particular sports if you look at our or chart
is football, hockey, and the two basketballs. You know, again,
as the athletic director, you have all the sports and
no question about it. But we have you know, incredible
professionals that oversee those particular sports for our department. And so,
for instance, Liz Jarnigan oversees women's soccer, and she was

(34:06):
down at Saint Thomas at our final game of the year.
And so we make a really intentional thought of how
to manage all these schedules, and and you know, you
do the best you can. I mean literally, at times
you can't be two places at once, but sometimes you
can make an effort to try and do something so

(34:28):
that you are at least somewhere one day and maybe
another place another day.

Speaker 1 (34:34):
You might have that opportunity this weekend, as hockey is
home taking on Minnesota Loop on a Friday Saturday, football
is on the road in Vermillion on Saturday Afternoon's.

Speaker 2 (34:42):
Exactly what I'm doing. I'll be home. I'll be here
in the Ralph on Friday night, and then I will
get in the car first thing in the morning on
Saturday and probably get right around kickoff at one o'clock,
and then we will drive back and I'll be listening
you know, on the radio at that point. So but
it's just, you know, that's what you do, Alex. I mean,

(35:04):
you just have to balance it out and uh you know,
I mean it's just an awesome opportunity, you know, to
to kind of figure it out. But you have to
be ahead of it and make sure that you know
you're you're always a couple of weeks ahead during this
time of year.

Speaker 1 (35:19):
If you leave at seven am, you should be just fine. Yeah, yeah,
no worries. One o'clock kick at the Dakota Dome. You'll
be give me great quick trip down. I twenty nine
bill straight, No worries straight five hours and forty five
minutes or so from Grand for from million you've done
not that I've never done that before.

Speaker 2 (35:35):
I was just gonna say you've never done discussing, you've
never done it, Not that you know every piece of
the mile markers.

Speaker 1 (35:43):
I could give you a pretty good breakdown where you are,
how much further you have to go. Well, let's let's
get into just a quick run around. Obviously a lot
going on. As you mentioned, you just listened off a
couple of the sports that are happening. We should probably
start with football because they're again having this phenomenal run.
Five wins in a row sill un vetenn in Valley
play back to back, really actually three dominant first halt

(36:04):
performances in a row to really put games away in
the last three weeks. It just feels like everything's clicking
right now. Again, maybe not complete sixty minute type performances,
but they've just won these games in the first two
quarters and then certainly this last weekend, then kept it
going in the third and the fourth. Pretty impressive stuff
from this group.

Speaker 2 (36:23):
Yeah, I think that's right, and I think the preparation
has been outstanding. Obviously, our trigger guy has been you know,
is having a phenomenal season. Jerry's been really really good
distributing the ball and executing whatever the game plan is
that week. And you know, we've seen we've seen a
couple think about the last two weekends.

Speaker 3 (36:43):
Alex.

Speaker 2 (36:45):
I think he had less than one hundred yards passing
the week before because that's what the game called for,
and then he was up over what three hundred yards
this week because in some ways, that's what the game
called for. So that's that to me is the most
exciting part of you know, I think that that particular
team has you know, thought through like, Okay, what gives

(37:05):
us the best chance this week? And you may you
may or may not be as highlighted as you were
in other weeks or future weeks, but that's what the
game calls. So that's exciting. But I will say this,
going into this one had to look back and it's
not really fair because we didn't play every year, but

(37:26):
the last time we won in the Dakota Dome, George W.
Bush was the president. So that's a that's a long time,
feels like a long time.

Speaker 1 (37:36):
It feels like a long time. Feels like a long
time and that that has been a sough place to
win has been. He came close, came close a couple
of years ago. We will see Usd's a good team obviously,
like they are coming off a disappointing close loss to
a ranked team this past week, so they were a
semi final team a season ago. Another really good challenge
for this North Dakota side. One of the great things
that Eric Smith said this week at the press conference

(37:58):
was this, this group has gotten so tight, like the
culture has really grown because we've been getting through hard
things together. We've been doing hard things and accomplishing things together,
and that belief that's just grown through that is one
of the big reasons why we're playing with such confidence.
And they'll have another chance to test that against the
good South Dakota team that just fell out of the
top twenty five and then home against number one North

(38:18):
Dakota State that just looked fantastic against STSU this past weekend.
Just four games left in the regular season, four more
big tests. If you Andy keeps this up, you would
think for more big tests before the postseason comes. It's
exciting to think that's going to be If they keep
doing this certainly in their future, yeah, you.

Speaker 2 (38:34):
Would hope so. But you know, I think there was
a good conversation at the presser, or maybe it was
even after the game, where someone may have asked Coach Schmidt,
you know, regarding you know, you kind of flush October.
Now you really go into November, you know, and I
think this is the month where you really do make
memories and so and you know it can get challenging.

(38:57):
You just look at our schedule here coming up, and
it's it's going to be a real real challenge for us.
But I think our guys are up for it. I mean,
I think they're excited about what they seem to have
been pretty locked in every week as far as what
the task is at hand. So, you know, knock on wood.
Hopefully we can go down play a good South Dakota
team in their place and have a you know, a

(39:20):
good game. I mean, and let's obviously you always want
the result, but we'll see, just just play well, play well,
and then we'll see what transpires.

Speaker 1 (39:29):
The games you remember take place in November, I believe
was basically the quote. And there are four pretty big
ones coming up for North Dakota. So good luck to
coach Smidt and the Fighting Hawks coming up this weekend
again one o'clock kick in Vermilion. You can watch that
live on Mid Coast Sports and streaming on Mid Coast
Sports Plus Hockey. Meanwhile, coming back home after a road
trip to the North Country this past week to take

(39:49):
on Clarkson. Back to back splits against good teams for
Dane Jackson's crew as they improved the four two and
zero this year. Jan spunir with the shutout in his
first collegiate action on Saturday to earn the split against
the Golden Knights. It's just fun to see this team
just continue to take steps against good teams early on
in this campaign.

Speaker 2 (40:08):
Yeah, I think, you know, first time I've ever been
in that particular part of the North Country. So just
I know, I'm originally from the East Coast. Some folks
thought you just kind of go there. Not really if
you're from the Hartford Springfield area, it's not really on
your BINGO card to go up there. So it was
kind of interesting, a long trip. Guys did great. Yeah,

(40:31):
college hockey. Let me start on a really broad level.
It is hard to sweep, right, I mean, at the
end of the day. I thought Clarkson came out and
they played to the identity we talked about playing the
game that you wanted to play. I thought they played
the game they needed to play. I'm not so sure
we did as much on Friday. And then I thought
the team kind of, you know, dialed it back as

(40:51):
far as playing really really I'll call it simple, but
simple but effective. It was a good college hockey game,
and I don't think we gave them any greade a
chances that day. You know, he had to make a
couple saves. Jan had to make a few saves, but
I think, you know, we closed down, We closed down
the fortress a little bit in front of him a

(41:12):
little bit more than we did the day before. And
that's going to have to be the recipe at some
point moving forward, because obviously we've got a really good
to lose team coming in, or at least a team
that's gotten off to a really good start.

Speaker 1 (41:23):
All those things you just said I think are very true. Again,
this was a team on Friday that gave up five goals.
A lot of those were on the power play. The
penalty kills stepped up a lot on Saturday, and they
just played tighter, just it was a much tighter checking game.
North to Go to had opportunities to extend their advantage
a couple of times, but yes, one nothing on Saturday
after the five to defeat on Friday, and now you
host number ten umd it team that is seven and one,

(41:45):
and you had said, by the way to college hockey,
it's tough to win. Same thing with college football. All
these teams are good, and we have seen that if
you look at the top five, everybody split last weekend,
like all of these teams, whether it was Michigan and
Western Michigan splitting, Boston University splitting, nobody's unbeaten. We're only
a couple of weeks since in the season. Everybody's got

(42:06):
at least one defeat so far. That is just going
to be the nature of the game this year. These
these wins are tough to come by it and two
wins will be tough to come by this weekend with
the Bulldogs opening against You know, I see.

Speaker 2 (42:16):
A lot of you know, digital you know, I'll call
it words of encouragement or thoughts from football here because
you know we're right here now housed with them. But
it's kind of us versus us. That's what you know,
it says, and and I think that's you can say
that about a lot of teams in college hockey right now.

(42:36):
I think everybody's trying to figure out what their best
lineup is, how they want to play, and I think
each each weekend becomes its own in some way. So
I know our guys will be excited about, you know,
getting back to the ralph and opening NCAC play and
it will be a challenge for sure.

Speaker 1 (42:54):
The way to loth is playing hockey very much. In
the infancy of their long six months season women's soccer, volleyball,
cross country all winding down with theirs you mentioned. Liz
was with the soccer team in the Twin Cities as
they defeated Saint Thomas five to two in the final
day of the regular season. That result meant they had
a chance they had moved beyond Omaha into the top

(43:15):
six to make the postseason, and then Omaha finished off
their victory just later that afternoon to move right back
in front of North Dakota to take six spots. So
North Dcota finishes two points back in seventh place. It
was still a good year. I guess when you look
back on this season eight wins over the course of
the campaign, two four and two in conference. All of
their conference losses were by one goal, just some tough

(43:38):
luck late losses. What did you make of soccer this
season with the first year for Henry.

Speaker 2 (43:42):
Yeah, you know, I thought, you know, overall, certainly getting
to eight seven and three, so above five hundred, I
thought was a really good marker for this team. You know, yeah,
that's kind of a bitter pill the way it ended.
But to some level, and we've said that on this
pod before, even when we flip sometimes b side, we
talk about, you know, winning matches, you know, getting three

(44:03):
points is really critical, and unfortunately, you're right, we had
a couple that we actually had the lead and unfortunately
let it slip through our hands. So it felt a
little maybe a little a little too late that we
kind of made the push that we needed to. It
would have been great if it was maybe more in
the middle of the season. But I do think there's
a lot to build on as we move forward.

Speaker 1 (44:25):
You mentioned some of those close losses that game against
all Roberts that want to share the regular season title.
You know, you with these up one mill in the
second half at home, and then a Lake goal means
it's three points dropped, and same thing against Kansas City.
That's right, just a couple of those. It's just fine
margins again, but I think that the numbers were good.
North Dakota had the third most goals in the league,
even goal difference over the course of conference play as well.

(44:47):
Just got to find that find that cutting edge sometimes
it gets you over the top in those tight games.
But yeah, congrats to the ladies on a really good season.
A lot of good players coming back certainly next year.
Volleyball three and seven now in conference play. Got a
nice one against Kansas City on Thursday in the midst
of this busy three match week. They'll go on the
road now for a couple of games this weekend to
Tulsa at Denver before finishing up with three in a

(45:08):
row at home Northakota State, Omaha, Saint Thomas again. Their
conference tournaments just right before Thanksgiving, so that's not far
away either. What have you seen from volleyball lately as
they try and push on.

Speaker 2 (45:18):
Yeah, you know, they have a three match week, one
one of them. You know, I still think we're still
trying to, you know, play our best volleyball at this
point in time, and I think that's our that's our key.
We're gonna have to get to a point where we
win a couple in a row or do something to
kind of break out of maybe kind of where the

(45:39):
logjam is.

Speaker 3 (45:40):
To some to some level.

Speaker 2 (45:41):
So so more to come.

Speaker 3 (45:43):
You know.

Speaker 2 (45:44):
They they've still got it in front of them, Alex
and so that's that's the encouraging party.

Speaker 1 (45:50):
It's just six matches to go. It's it's crazy in
their regular season. Some more opportunity here for that group
to keep building towards some league championships in Brookings beginning.
The twenty third of Nova cross Country is already there,
like we're we're here, We're at it. This Saturday, on
the first of November, the men and women will take
part in the Semi Leage Cross Country champion Championships down
at Mahoney State Park in Nebraska, Omaha hosting. The men

(46:12):
were fourth last year. They were one point off a third.
The women were fourth as well a year ago. I
think expectations are they can move up the podium a
little bit based on what we've seen from both of
those teams this fall.

Speaker 2 (46:22):
Yeah, I think high expectations, but you know, we've said
it over and over again, it's that day that's it.
I mean that that gun goes off and you've got
to perform in that moment. So we've seen some really
good performances on both sides leading up to this, so
we're excited about it. I know coach Scott is as well.

Speaker 1 (46:42):
Jaden Keeler one of the favorites. I would probably say
the favorite on the women's side. That race will be
second eleven AM. The men will run at ten. Conditions
look to be pretty favorable, high forties, little fifties at
the time of running down in Omaha, and if you're interested,
you can stream that on the se of League network
on Mid Coast Sports Plus, So get signed up if
you want to watch. Should be a great competition to
get a great opportunity to see some of the best

(47:03):
cross country runners in North Kota program history. Ye for
a championship this Saturday in Omaha. Cross countries wrapping up
men's women's hoops are just getting started, like it's just
this the unique balance between closing the door on one
sport opening on the other. The men kick things off
in Tuscaloosa, as we have discussed on the third. The
women play at Minnesota on the fourth. The men have

(47:24):
had a couple of exhibitions both it's unique when you're
you're playing Jamestown and you're the team that is up here, yes,
and then you kind of flip it and you play Minnesota,
the team that's kind of supposed to win and is
trying to tune up using you, and the scores were
almost identical.

Speaker 2 (47:38):
Just on the other side. Were good.

Speaker 1 (47:39):
Those were good, Those were good things, Those were good experience.

Speaker 2 (47:42):
That's what Paul said is correct. This particular team, Wow,
it may look a lot different in January when finally
they figure out rotations and in some of the other things.
And we've had a few guys that we haven't had
the full complement of our roster at the stage of
the game. So you know, but you're right. I think
they were too two ends of the spectrum, if you will,

(48:03):
in a sense, and we kind of were in the middle.
And so so it was good and I thought that
game was really good for us as we head to Tuscaloosa.

Speaker 1 (48:12):
Yeah, the game against Minnesota was close in the first half,
there were some good moments, and then the Gophers just
kind of pulled away over the course of that second half.
I again, exhibition, but a good chance to get a
taste of what it's gonna look like when you're playing
the Crimson Tide. You are loaded again this year, just
outside the top ten preseason, very tough tests to begin,
I think for both men and women. And you can
speak to this. There are a couple of familiar faces,

(48:33):
like there's a couple people that fans will know, but yeah,
the most part, like it is new. There's a lot
of new for both of these teams, which makes these
early season games so much fun. You get to learn
who these who these young men and women are, Who's
going to be on the court. We're in the jersey
this year playing meaningful basketball. Get we get a taste
of that this coming week.

Speaker 2 (48:52):
Yeah, I think that's right, you know, I mean, you know,
you can certainly look at our roster, but even the one,
even our even our more familiar names might be playing
a different role this year. And so it's just it's
so I know you always say it's a new team,
it really is a new team on both sides.

Speaker 1 (49:11):
Yeah, Nature College Athletics right now, new team, that's for sure.
So enjoy that coming up this week. Anything else, Bill,
there's a lot going on. Anything No, No.

Speaker 2 (49:20):
I really appreciate having josh on. He's always a wealth
of knowledge. And you know, I think you know, you
and I have discussed, you know, certain guests. We just
keep on rolling a little bit because they bring a
lot to the table for us, and we don't have
them many many times. So while we have them, sometimes
we try to do a double segment and that was today.

Speaker 1 (49:40):
Yeah, we have a time for a very very quick
flip to the Yeah, quick flip yep. I do want
to say Spurs are in third place, Bill, third place.
All these international breaks, it almost flew under the radar
that you were in third right now after your three
nil win over Everton at the Hill Dickinson Stadium. Your
thoughts on Sattenham Hotspur.

Speaker 2 (49:57):
At the moment, getting results, getting results, That would probably
be my takeaway at this point in time. But you
know what, Alex, there seems to be a lot of
discussion surrounding open play versus set pieces. It seems like
this this is like dominated the conversation. But I do

(50:20):
think there's been some let's call it more experienced folks
that have seen it over the course of time, and
they're just reminding us. Set pieces have always been a thing.
I mean it's always been and if you're effective at
them or defending them, yeah you're going to have a
better chance. And last year, for however it went, you know,

(50:41):
we were not very good at defending them and that
really puts you in a tough spot because it's such
a premium to score goals.

Speaker 1 (50:49):
My co worker, my colleague, Alexi Lawless, would always say
set pieces, set pieces, set pieces, right, and that's you
got two of them this weekend against Everton. Arsenal have
just done this throughout there and there in front with
a healthy gap between them and the rest of the field.
Speaking of getting results, Liverpool not getting results. We've lost
five or six were to Row in the league.

Speaker 2 (51:10):
But we're talking new team and I just think that
and I will say that the saga that was Esak
probably did not help in a lot of different ways,
and I think that's part of what some of the
issues that are being because you're trying to work him
now in and it felt like when he was at

(51:33):
Newcastle there was a complete prescribed role that he had.
I think his role is going to evolve, But then
there's a lot of pressure on him to produce even
greater than he did at Newcastle. But I don't know
if the role at Liverpool will be as beneficial to
him as the one he had at Newcastle.

Speaker 1 (51:54):
It's going to be fascinating, it is. It all comes
together because you make the point he is now the
most expensive footballer in English history, and alongside and is
Florian Verts who's number two in that category most expensive
footballer in English history. And those guys for what I mean,
there are various reasons why neither have really got off
to a great start, but they've not gone off to

(52:15):
a great start, and that pressure will continue.

Speaker 2 (52:17):
It will, it'll pile up. And you know what, I
look at it when you have like a Liverpool or
a Man You, Man City, whatever it is. I don't
even really put Tottenham in that category. I feel like
they're They're just a different level of player that they
seem to get versus say that the one that that

(52:37):
a Barcelona or Reale or Bayern Munich is vying for.
Tottenham's not in that game, but Liverpool is. I would
say though, when Jack Grealish went to Man City and
I think his role got weird reduced, condensed condensed way

(52:59):
different now and now it feels like he's back to
playing freer and able to do some things that he
couldn't do out of Man City. You know, is that
a fair read?

Speaker 1 (53:12):
It's just about where you fit in with your team.
He was the main man at Villa, he was not.
He was a bench player coming in off to change
the game at City and now he's back to being
the only offensive spark on his team and everything goes
through him. It's hard as a player, I think, to
adjust to those things. Takes time, that's for sure.

Speaker 2 (53:30):
Yeah. I don't know what's going to happen with Liverpool,
but you know there's such pressure that that keeps getting
stacked and an amazing they've what they won their first
five and then have lost four in a row. And
I believe I could be wrong with this, but this
as many losses as they had all of last year, Yes,
and how many were nine matches in and there's thirty
eight in the season.

Speaker 1 (53:51):
Thirty could be a tough year on Merseyside. We will see,
we will see.

Speaker 2 (53:57):
It's part of the journey though, that's right.

Speaker 1 (53:59):
Exactly up heis and lows ups and downs.

Speaker 2 (54:01):
Yeah, so Spurs this week. It'll be very fascinating the
conversation that's happening there, and it's really kind of fascinating.
They're doing great on the road.

Speaker 3 (54:12):
They stink at home, bizarre, so.

Speaker 2 (54:14):
Play Chelsea on Saturday. At home Chelsea is not great
for Spurs. A lot of bad things happen when they
play Chelsea.

Speaker 1 (54:26):
Well, hopefully that changes this weekend for your sake. We'll see,
we will see, we will see.

Speaker 2 (54:31):
That's exactly I know.

Speaker 1 (54:31):
You got to get out of here. Always great to
chat about a variety of different things. Bill enjoyed the
crazy week ahead.

Speaker 2 (54:37):
Thanks thanks, Alex, I appreciate you.

Speaker 1 (54:39):
Safe travels Down Night twenty nine for Bill Shapes coming
up on Saturday on behalf of Bill and Josh Fenton,
of course, big thanks to him, Alex docker Johnson and
Paul Ralston on the back end. I'm Alex Hender, thank
you for listening. Enjoy Halloween. We'll talk to you soon.

Speaker 3 (55:01):
In the party Attendant Instant in the Parting PA