Hops & Hogs BBQ 04/30 - Welcome to Turtle's!

Nordo and Ken from Heavy Rotation hang out with Bryan, the owner/founder Turtle's Bar & Grill, a longtime staple in downtown Shakopee!

Episode Transcript

(00:05):
What Up. It's Nordo from Kfan. Welcome to Hopson Hawks, Local Beer,
Local Barbecue one podcast, and Ilove this most recent episode because while
we usually focus on the stories ofthose who make the beer, Ken from
Heavy Rotation and I got to sitdown with a guy who sells the beer
and has been doing so for threeand a half decades. So what does
it take to grow and survive inthe bar business that long? Well?

(00:27):
Meet Brian Turtle, owner of TurtlesBar and Grill in Shockapede. We spent
all this time Ken visiting breweries,understanding how the beer is made, but
at some point the beer has tobe sold, and that's not only at
a liquor store, that's not onlyon site at a brewery. And I'm
so glad that you have this relationshipbecause this is a place that I've known

(00:49):
for nearly twenty years now. I'vebeen here so many times, and I'm
so happy to have Brian the owner, the founder of Turtles Bar and Grill
here in Shokapy. Thank you somuch for giving us time and hanging out
with us. Brian absolutely happy tobe here. We love selling good beer
and we're happy you're talking about it. No it's so cool, and I
do want to get into that becausein some ways you have kind of three

(01:15):
or four different personalities to Turtles insome ways where in the end, if
I want to play poll tabs andpost up and have beers, I got
that. If I want to bringfamily in and eat dinner, I got
that. If I have a specialevent, there's room for us too.
Ed Turtles so so much to getinto, but I do want to maybe
start at the genesis of why yougot into the business and maybe kind of

(01:38):
the just the origin story of Turtlesas it is now in the heart of
Shockapy. Yeah. Well, westarted in nineteen ninety and my dad was
kind of looking for a new career. He used to be a salesman of
businesses, so he's kind of lookingfor something to do. We also I
grew up in the business when Iwas six seven eight years old up North

(02:00):
supper club, and so he thoughtI was time to get back in and
I was just kind of getting outof college. So we made it a
thing. So at first I ranthe bar and he ran the kitchen,
and my mom ran the restaurant,and he used to be a VFW club.
So we had some employees that wecan kind of draw on and thirty
five years later, here we are. You still love it? I do.

(02:23):
I'm kind of looking forward to retirement. My daughter is thirty four and
she'd been here since she's fourteen,so we're sort of starting to throw her
some stuff and maybe looking at ourexit plan eventually a couple of years.
So kind of, but it's kindof become a family affair, right,
Like is it all hands on deck, like just supporting the business, keeping
turtles the way it is and continuingto grow over time. Totally. Yeah.

(02:46):
So I run the wedding hall andI'm the general manager. My daughter
runs the bar and she's starting tobecome COGM. My wife runs the restaurant.
Okay, sister in law's the bookkeeper. My niece is the chef back
in the banquet hall. So atotal family thing for real. Wow.
Yeah, who makes the pizza?Who do I have to tip my cap

(03:07):
to and say thank you for makingelite pizza? Well, my dad designed
the menu initially, and really wegot to do a little hats off to
Red from Red Savoy remember back inthe day. Hell yeah, he would
take us there in the seventies asa family and we lived in Eaton Prarie,
so it was a long drive andhe got to become friends with Red
and then when we were going todo this, he kind of taught us.

(03:29):
So our pizza is very similar toRed Savoy, especially the stuff that
he serves. I mean, there'sa bunch of chains that are pretty similar.
They got the recipe down pretty goodtoo. Yeah, and Red Savoy
is so good. I ken kindof chuckled when and I have to admit
it's it's funny thinking about it.I'm a bit younger than you, Brian.
You said we grew up in EdenPrairie, so it was a long

(03:50):
drive the Red Savoy and anybody listeningto this that commutes for work for a
living, it is like, Yeah, I mean I'm stuck on sixty two
or I'm stuck on one hundred.That's kind of become the routine. You
know how big this metro area hasgrown. And actually, I would say,
even going back to nineteen ninety,I bet Shokape looks a heck of
a lot different than it did whenyou first opened Turtles. It does.

(04:12):
Yeah, we were fortunate to kindof get here at the right time.
There was about twelve thousand people inthis sound at that time, and now
there's I think close to fifty.Yeah, Shocopy is pretty pretty large geographically.
You know, new developments just poppingup all over the place too.
Yeah, yeah, it's still growinglike crazy. And the downtown. The
city's put a lot of money intothe downtown infrastructure, so it's busier than

(04:35):
it's ever been down here. Andit's a couple of breweries in town also,
So how is how do you viewthat? You? Again, ultimately,
you sell a ton of local beerhere and even when I just first
met you, you immediately showed animmense love for local beer, which is
super cool. So I want todig into that. But what has it

(04:58):
been like? Because it it's twouniverses that actually kind of offer a lot
of the same thing. People thatwant to drink beer, they want to
hang out with their friends. Youwould have a more advanced and extensive menu
than the average brewery by ten miles. There are health department and you know,
code related bits associated with that.But what have you felt as a

(05:20):
business owner a long time? Andyou've seen a ton of different things over
thirty five years, but what haveyou thought about the expansion and the boom
of breweries locally here in Minnesota.Well, it's been great for us.
I mean at first, we alwayswanted to sell good beer, and at
first it was kind of limited to, you know, stuff not from here,
so we sold well, Summit washere, I think they start kind

(05:45):
of the og, right, wasthat kind of really the first big pale
ale? Absolutely, and they alsokind of gave people from around here taste
for hops, you know, Ithink that's really been pervasive in our I
mean that's the stuff we sell themost. Now. Of course we're selling
more Northeast style i pas, youknow, hazy IPAs, but as well,

(06:06):
you know, the surly law reallychanged everything, and that's when you
know, now there's a couple hundredbreweries making and most of them making pretty
good beer, and some of themmaking really really good beer. But we
it's also it's you know, nowthat we have such a good inventory of
good product to bring in that's nearby, it just makes sense. It's the

(06:28):
green thing to do instead of haulingyou know, nothing against stone, but
you know, instead of putting beeron trucks in San Diego and driving them
here on diesel, you know,I can sell beer, you know,
like Ken's beer, and we've gotyou know, I try to have an
insight out purchasing policy now because it'sjust it makes more sense. You know.
That's a really good point. Andhow has it been creating relationships with

(06:50):
breweries? And I'm glad you mentionedsummit and Ken and I have talked about
this many times, like when Iwas in college. Some it was a
revelation with the EPA and now weare. I mean, that's ancient,
that's like stone tablet history. Itfeels like with the way with the way
beer's evolved over the last now twentyfive years. But what has it been

(07:13):
like creating relationships with the breweries,Because in the end, everybody wants to
be on that menu you have overthere, and so that that's tough in
itself as you meet out various expectationsand there's only so many tap lines.
But what's that, I mean,there's got to be you're you're kind of
part of the community. You're notin you're not brewing the beer, but

(07:34):
certainly you have an immense impact ontheir growth and evolution as businesses too.
Yeah, well, at first itwas the other way around. I was
having to drive to pick up kegsof surly and stuff. And I was
begging for beer, you know,And now I got guys driving down from
Brooklyn Park to give you their beer. Well, that was funny. We

(07:55):
had a mutual friend that kind ofconnected us there. You meet halfway,
like do you meet a new man. It's been around here. We're both
pretty busy trying to run these things, you know. We're also fortunate here
that we have the world's largest maltplant on the planet in the h I
think it's number one in the world, and that's where our malt thing and
that's a staple of Shokapy. Andthey have a subsidiary. Why am I

(08:18):
so dumb? I didn't know that. That's awesome. It's a huge company,
but the biggest single malt producing plantin one spot is literally three blocks
from here. And but most sothey're servicing people like, you know,
the macro beers. But they alsohave a subsidiary called BSG Brewers Supply Group,
which almost every you know, smallto medium sized brewery in the country

(08:39):
is getting product from you guys,probably you guys. Yeah, And so
it first started, and so wegot to be friends with all the people
that work there, they started drinkingbeer here. They started asking for certain
beers to have on tap that theyhad worked with, you know, breweries
directly with. And then we startedmeeting a bunch of brewery owners and brewers

(09:01):
because they're down here picking stuff upat the beginning, and a lot of
them were driving vans down here,and then they'd bring them in here for
lunch and they get to chatting.And then of course we're always trying to
find the best beer we can.So I had a little connection. And
then the other half of that is, you know, you got to get
fat a little bit and go drinksome beer with people, and so I

(09:22):
don't mind doing that at all.Yeah, the toughest, you know,
twist your arm. I'm sure it'sbeen twisted a couple of times, Brian.
You've been forced to sit down andtaste tests some of this over the
course of time. Do you remember, and I don't mean to put you
on the spot, any chance youremember nineteen ninety or even early nineties,
what the taps looked like. Ido. Yeah, well, it wasn't

(09:45):
so much little guys making beer,but all the big breweries were trying to
come up with these crazy ideas.One I remember specifically, Miller came out
with a beer. It was calledMiller Clear, and it looked like seven
up coming out of the tap andyeah for real, and it tasted like
a just like a logger, Ithink if I remember right. But you
know, they spent millions of dollarsdeveloping and promoting and then three months later

(10:09):
it was gone. You know.So they were all trying these things,
and now I'm kind of going,you know, the other direction. You
know, I really non clear beers. Well for instance, you know,
I mean I know a lot ofpeople like the big Macro make golden lights,
cord lights, and and you know, I kind of saw some of
the fridge beers of the world certainly, and we still sell a bunch.

(10:30):
But then Shells developed a product calledgrain Belt Elite, and it's similar in
numbers to like a mic Ultra,but it has more beer flavor. It
tastes like beer, you know.So we started working with Shells and we
became I think we're the number onesellar of that beer. I'd love to
just transfer some of those sales toMinnesota Brewery. Those guys are great down

(10:52):
there, and we do a lotof yeah, they're just they're kind of
the other og, you know,and they're just wonderful people. So we
love having that relationship. And andthis is kind of their home base when
they're because they're a new alm andthey got salespeople up here, but when
they got to meet for drinks,they come here a lot, you know.
Fortunate for us. We're actually justtalking to one of the all our

(11:13):
mutual buddy Nordo andized buddy Frank.He does all the he's in the productionary
for shells Now, so we're justactually having a beer with him at the
bar. Perfect see. So Kenon your end, it's sir, how
important are bars like turtles in termsof continuing to grow? Because you know,
we've we've been to brewers, hadthis conversation. You own a freaking

(11:35):
brewery, and I just think aboutall the different it's it's not even necessarily
revenue streams as much as it canbe in some ways a marketing proposition where
it is so much get your nameout there. So it's real estate space
in the liquor store, it's gettingkegs inside of bars, if anything,
just to have that name on themenu. How how vital are places like
Turtles to you guys. Yeah,especially this place, right, because it's

(11:58):
as Brian mentioned, it's very it'svery known in the community, especially in
the beer community, for a placeto go and get good craft beer,
right, So to have like theprivilege of having our beer on here.
We we started, we talked aboutBSG and one of our rep for BSGC
is who contact who got us incontact with each other, Shannon. We

(12:20):
did a tap take over here withfour different beers, okay, which was
the first, I think the firstaccount that we were ever on tap at.
And we were kind of just ecstaticabout that, right, We're like,
holy crap, Like sweet, wehave to have our beer on at
Turtles. That's really awesome. Andas you mentioned, it's not super close
for us, which is even kindof better because no one here probably knows
who the hell we are, right, So when they when they did the

(12:43):
tap takeover, like that's awesome.And then Brian and I just kind of
became buddies through that and this text. We text and talked more than people
know, as they say in theradio, right, And I just shot
them a text one day and Iwas like, hey, man, has
anybody ever made you a beer?Like not really, I'm like, we
should do something kind of right,and then we just kind of went through
that. And then, like Isaid, it's it's an absolute honor to

(13:05):
be on these tap lines because ofwhat the place is and who he is.
I mean, it's huge for us, so vice versus's an honor to
have this beer. I mean,no one really we had done a one
off with some a couple of differentplaces, but not a dedicated beer that's
only going to be sold here.And I'll never forget that communication. I
was walking hiking with my dog somewhereand I barely had service and we got

(13:31):
through to each other, he startedtalking. I think we lost each other.
I waited until I got back tothe camp or whatever, and then
it started there and then we startedtalking about what we wanted to do.
I already knew they made just greatHayes and the beer went over fantastic the
night that they did that that taptakeover. And then I had a couple
ideas. I wanted it to bepretty crushable. You know, yep,

(13:52):
a lot of people are making theseten percent triple IPAs, which you know,
they're fun to drink, they're good, but as a bar owner.
I'd rather sell a couple couple threepints instead of one ten ounce glass of
a of a triple, you know. Oh yeah, And as a I
am not a proprietor. I'm purelya customer. I don't want to go
to a bar and drink a tenpercent beer. I instead of one of

(14:16):
those, I want to have threeof these, enjoy myself and get out
alive, if that makes sense,might me too? And yeah, you
got to get home from here,you know, correct, you know.
And it's funny. He says hewas on a hike. This picture that
he sends me, it was likea painting. He's got this dog there,

(14:37):
beautiful background. Maybe I'll tweet itout later Instagram or whatever, but
absolutely, And he's like, yeah, he's like, let's do something like
I'm like this, this is whereyou're at right now, like this beautiful
scenery. I'm like, what thehell, Like, I can't even believe
you respond to my text like thisis crazy, Hey it's the Southwest metro
man. Well no, no,he was like, you were out of
town. Yeah, I can't remember. We were on a camping trip.
Even us bar guys get to goout of town once it's. Oh good,

(15:00):
keep you saying it, but no, it's it's. It's it's awesome
to be on here. I amthe guy who just throws it in the
back of my car right like andjust deliver them. And it's it's.
It's it's definitely it's. It's acool thing. It's a very cool thing.
Well, it's cool on the brewingend to understand what it takes to
run and grow a brewery, right, because it isn't build you know,

(15:22):
this, this ain't field of dreamsin some respects build it and they will
come. Now if it includes beer, people actually will naturally probably at least
come in and they'll they'll find itonce, but how do they find it
twice? The third, the fourthand beyond and and from your standpoint,
Brian, you know customers drive thisultimately, right, you know, great
people coming in here and then thatsecond and third and fourth and four hundredth

(15:46):
trip. Uh when it at whatpoint you know, and you understanding local
beer, wanting to support it,wanting to put it on a platform here
at Turtles was there in maybe inyour memory or it just kind of started
to get that way slowly but surelythe point where people started asking you,

(16:06):
or more specifically maybe asking your employeeswhere do you have this beer from XYZ
Brewery? Do you have this?Well you don't, and they're disappointed.
So and then you start getting enoughof those people that come in and you
ultimately would have to make the decisionto yeah, we really do have to
offer more local. Our customers arebegging for it, our customers are loving

(16:27):
it. Was there any point intime where you saw that transition among your
customer base. Yeah, And thecustomer base kind of dictates what we should
be doing. I mean ultimately,they vote with their dollars. So I
wouldn't have known about Kensbury. Ithink it was already a year old.
But it's like said the other sideof the city. Sure, if it
wasn't for our mutual friends Shanner andyou say, hey, you got to

(16:47):
try this beer. And I knowwe have a little beer group where we
do beer shares and there's you know, eight, ten to twelve of us
to get together, so I knowpeople's tastes, that I know someone that
knows good beer, and that's howthe whole thing got set up. And
then when he brought the beer here, I'm like, Okay, we're onto
something here, and then it's gettingback to that beer that we made just
real quickly. Yeah. Yeah,I had an idea what I wanted.

(17:11):
You know, I didn't want atriple. I wanted something pretty crushable.
I think I said, you know, six six and a half percent,
kind of a home run hop competentcombinations. Always if you put mosaic and
citron there, you know it's goingto work and some to some degree.
And then but that's a that's aboutit. And then they decided that they
added a third hop would would youput a cascade in there? I think

(17:33):
it was, yeah, And becauseI sent it over to Josh, because
Josh obviously the guy who makes thebeer, right I I do, I'm
the face he's you just tweet aboutit. I tweet about it. Yeah.
Yeah, we've established that, butwe have like so I uh,
I asked Josh. I'm like,hey, Brian wants to do it.
This is what he's looking for.I think I can do something like that.
And then it's kind of like,you know, it's a little bit
risky, right, because you doit and then you bring it and then

(17:56):
you got to hope that he likesit, right, because if you make
it and he's like, ah,the idea was cool, it didn't it
didn't turn out the way I wantedit to write. And Brian such a
nice dude. He still wouldn't Hestill wouldn't put it on his tab if
he didn't like it. Yeah,I would, hope, right, So
sure, so there's a there's athere was pressure there, but also like,
all right, we're gonna we're gonnaknock this one out of the park

(18:17):
for this dude. And we thinkwe did. We've been doing it some
one now since December, I believeso, And what are we on the
third dedicated, third dedicated batch ofit? And you can literally only get
it here, So that's that's acool thing. So well, it's cool.
And then Josh, you know,Josh doesn't need to be told this.
Josh does a great job and heavyRotation does great work. And so

(18:37):
I I personally would have been confidentyou were going to send him an awful
beer. But I can understand asan outside of the trepidation, it's kind
of like the first date, yeahright, yeah, kind of yeah,
Well the first date was a beertab. Take the beer tap, takeover
it, and we did have oneHazy and it went well, Yeah,
we had our we talked about allthe time on the podcast, so lean
into it our kind of flagship Hazyip A. But yeah, and Josh

(19:00):
on to what he's doing. Butthere's still kind of that. Yeah,
there's those those first date jitters rightwhere you're like, we have these beers
that are we just brought one kegof each. Yeah, if they're they're
most likely going to sell because it'sa tap takeover and if however long they
take, they take whatever. Butthen when you have something made specifically for
a place and he agreed to acertain amount, you're like, I don't
fuck this up, right, youcan't do it because you and then if

(19:21):
you do. He has such highstandards and good I mean, if you
look at a tap list, it'sunbelievable. Everything on there I would absolutely
approve of. So when you seesomething like that, you're like, all
right, we're gonna we gotta geton there and we gotta make it.
Gotta make it what he wants becauseit's kind of a it's a cool thing.
Yeah, I wouldn't have said yesto you know, every brewery that
asked me. I would not nameany names or you know, kind of
stay out. But once I knewhow good the beer was and how well

(19:45):
it went over with our customers,it was a no brainer. Oh that's
great, and I'm glad it workedout. And let me ask you this.
Everybody, and I'm sure you knowthis after thirty five years, everybody
wants to start a beer Bran orstart a bar Brian. Everyone wants to
open a bar. Everyone wants todo what you're doing. They come,

(20:06):
they drink at the bar, Theylove the bar, they enjoy it,
they have a blast. There's anambiance. I would actually say there's a
culture to the social atmosphere that existsin a bar. What do you think
is one thing if somebody came toyou and they said, I'm here with
you right now, I'm trying toopen a bar, Brian. Is there

(20:27):
one particular thing that while sitting onthis side the outside of the bar,
good customer loves it, absolutely smartenough to understand the inner workings, knows
everybody by name. But if Iwas to step inside of that bar,
that I would be blown away orat least super surprised and caught off guard.

(20:48):
Before I opened a bar, thatI might need to know before doing
so. Well, you know,it is pretty sexy from the outside,
but it's not as sexy from thebackground, you know. And it only
gets sexier is I keep drinking thesecrushing ezy IPAs well. There's a lot
of people that had money and theythought, oh, that'd be fun to
open a bar, you know,and now they have less money. But

(21:11):
you know, I say, locationis important, and you've got to be
ready to work hard. You've gotto have people you can really trust.
You'd have to be very cautious aboutpartnerships. Sure, you know where that's
kind of a we're family thing.We know what to expect from our family.
But I've seen a couple fail whereyou know, a couple buddies got
together and it wasn't what they thoughtand uh. And then the other challenge

(21:33):
is, you know, we've gotwe've got a wedding hall, we've got
a couple of bars on a restaurantin the middle. So we've got about
seventy employees, mostly part time,and that's probably the main challenge is keeping
them happy, you know, andkeeping them working hard. Yeah, but
it's also you know, one ofthe most beautiful things because it becomes your
extended family. You know, youget your your your customers are obviously number

(21:56):
one and certainly but your your employee, and also your relationships with vendors,
not just your guys, but foodguys are that's kind of like tied for
number two, and they're all prettymuch tied. You know. Well in
small business, right, I mean, just at a fundamental level is and
it feels like sometimes we make itin this country very difficult to be a

(22:18):
successful small business owner. But inthe same sense, the rewarding nature of
it. But you're not just punchingthe clock nine to five. This is
a in all the time, everytime type of venture. Correct. Yeah,
well, not just physically but alwaysmentally. You know, even if
my daughter is kind of picking upsome slack and we're able to get out

(22:38):
of town for a month or twoin the winter, it's you're never not
thinking about it, you know.And then we've been here long enough to
see that it's more successful and lesssuccessful. Over cyclical you know happenings in
you know, in our country,and you know, they kind of ride
those waves. I mean, twothousand and eight was a really tough time.

(23:00):
You know, it was tough foreveryone, but in this business,
you know, nobody had any expendableincome and uh, it was tight,
so you got to do more stuffyourself. Yeah, it's kind of like
you talk about the relationship with customersand everything like that. It's we have
a guy that comes in all thetime. Dave. Shout out to Dave.
He said it perfectly. He's investedin a lot of different places,
and he said, you know,you don't own the business. The business

(23:22):
owns you, right, So true, like you, like you said,
you're always you might be off,you might be on a beautiful hike,
but you're still thinking about work,right. It's it's always call answered my
call. Yeah, you only hadone bars to like work. He's not
quite sure what he agreed to initially, but eventually he got there. Hey
and it worked, It worked outfor the better. Yeah, it's it's

(23:44):
it's yeah, it owns you.I mean that's one hundred percent. Like
and we're only two years in.I can't imagine thirty plus years in,
like knock on wood that we're there. So I mean, congratulations, that's
they still have a smile and alaugh. Yeah, right, Like,
well that's what beer is for.I know, if you both know that
true. I mean, the otherthing we were talking about a second ago

(24:07):
was it's kind of a symbiotic relationshipbetween us on sailors, the producers of
good beer and liquor stores the offsailors. You know. So he does
a type event here, people comein that have never had it, they
like it, and all of asudden they see it on a liquor store
shelf, or they'd make the driveup to the brewery, you know it.
Really the other thing that happens whenwe do events is we cross pollinate

(24:30):
our social media contexts, you know. So I'll do a big deal and
I'll tag him and and I'll spenda little money on some social media ads.
He'll do the same, and thenwe're kind of getting you know,
a cross pollination of our of ourcontacts. Is there? And I had
asked you about this earlier, youknow, breweries coming in. What did
you think about it, What itwas like being a different entity but ultimately

(24:52):
offering many of the of the sametypes of things. Did you feel it
like is there a competitive element?Because is what you're talking about is really
a collaboration much more than it iscompetition. For sure, Even other places
down the street. It's kind ofone of those things. It's like and
it sounds weird. And you know, in the radio business, we're judged
by ratings, kfa N, we'rejudged by ratings. I've always looked at

(25:17):
it competition is a good thing.If we have a competitor that forces us
to be better, we force themto be better, and in the end,
actually we can coexist. Is thathow you look at it in that
element? Because I think about it, it's like business down the street.
If they're doing well, ultimately they'regoing to be in here and vice versa.
Right, So how do you viewthose things? There's that, but

(25:38):
I think the craft beer community ittakes out a step further. It's almost
kind of a love fest, youknow. I mean everybody gets along.
I mean, sure, if you'vegot two breweries on the same street,
you want to sell more than yourother, you know, neighbor or whatever.
But having two breweries close together worksbecause people go to both of them.
Let's say, but you're seeing alot of these breweries do collaboration beers.

(26:00):
I mean, already you know,two good breweries working together and learning
from each other. And yeah,it's it's a real community, not just
the people that drink it or thepeople that produce it or the people that
sell it. All of us areone cohesive. Like, well, beer's
fun, yeah, and it's goodright, here's a fun business and business

(26:21):
like yeah, third batch, thirdbatch? You say, of I think
we brought the last time as Kenever slipped down the stairs of the That
is a good question because it andto preface that, you'd have to see
the stairs because they are so thiswas built, this place is built,

(26:42):
and probably it was a VFW club, And like, could I even fit
down the stairs? Well, someof the you gotta suck it in a
little bit. I've seen, likeI'm heavy two kegs on one dollary,
two half barrels, so we're talkingtwo hundred and eighty pounds. Some of
those guys do to make it easier. We've kind of started using six barrels,

(27:03):
you know, just to for youknow, he's got to I've struck
them down here. But yeah,they're pretty rickety stairs, let me put
it that way. So the factthat he hasn't or I haven't heard about
it is pretty remarkable. I reallyI will laugh. The first the first
time I came here again because itwas one of our first accounts. And
I've heard, like I was atDoode Pills for a long time, and
I've heard from the salespeople like,oh, there's certain accounts that you go
to and it's like you're going intoa dungeon. You're going this. I'm
like, yeah, how bad couldit be? Not not about necessarily about

(27:26):
you, but just in counts ingeneral. I get here, I'm back
down the alley and I'm like,all right, go get the key,
open up the door. I'm like, you gotta be kidd to go there's
a freezer or I'm like, I'mlike, I'm like, i gotta go
down here. I'm like and andshout out to the guys gals that are
doing the half barrels bringing those downthe stairs. Hey, I I don't
know if I could do it,you know, I think I think I

(27:48):
you know, I can move somekegs around, but six barrels are definitely
even that. It's like, allright, because we're usually bringing over eight
or nine at a time up anddown the stairs. You're like, that's
that's kind of a free work.I mean, you were going to go
to the gym, I was goingto you were gonna run a five k
yeah, yeah, yeah, butbut this actually may suffice. Well,
then I get done with the stairs, and then I come up, and

(28:11):
then I go and I got toget somebod You know, you guys are
talking about the pizza. I hitup the fried chicken. I get some
fried chicken, a couple of beers. There's our, there's our. You
can't see it in this podcast,so who cares if that's our guy Frank
from Shells. He was the onegoogly eyeing us in the window. But
we may have even asked him aboutShells, but it wasn't the right time.

(28:32):
It wasn't the right time. Yeah, the fried chicken here is,
so you know, I'm the onewho I was like, I'll bring the
kegs. I'll bring the kegs.Get the fried chicken. Dri First,
you walked outside for a bit totake some deep breaths of air. Oh,
take the hat off, like,well, there's a there's a spot
and it's uh, it's well.I wanted to say exactly where it is

(28:53):
because it may give it away.But to change a keg, you have
to pull like twelve sixteen, Yeah, double up. You have to pull
them out of the cooler, andI'm just this and I'm just thinking.
I mean, picture in your spotwhere it is, and now once you're
down there. I've never been downthere, but the idea where and it's

(29:14):
happening. I mean, this isa Friday afternoon and it's what do we
It's quarter to four pm, soit's about to heat up around the bar.
Picture one of your bartenders having topull out fourteen kegs. Now they're
on carts, but she has toroll out fourteen kegs of beer to change
one keg of Coors Light and thenreload fourteen kegs of beer into a cooler

(29:38):
and shut it. Like we were, it is a freaking nightmare. I
would not have happy people. Oh, they would make me do it.
I think they're cooler is like thesize of one of your booths. Really,
and we were like, he hadordered a beer, won't say a
beer was and sure as hell,the guy goes to pour it, shoots
on. He's like, he's like, well now I gotta it's like now
I gotta only drink beer because hesaw the guy pulling all the kegs out

(30:02):
and we're like we were just astonishedby it. But this can't be a
real thing that they're doing this.You gotta do what you gotta do.
I guess, you gotta do whatyou gotta do. And like our stairway.
This we're a conglomeration of four buildingskind of hooked together in an old
downtown area. Most of these werebuilt in the late eighteen you know,
like eighteen eighty eighteen ninety, andso we just like that stairwell, there's

(30:23):
a huge three foot thick, youknow, wall that we can't move,
you know, So you kind ofgotta do what you gotta do. I
guess I will say I'd rather godown these stairs any day of the week
than what that guy had to doat that spot. We were at no
every every single time. That's whyI brought it up. It is the
most nightmarish game of tetris I've everseen in my life. Brian, I
kind of prolonged it. I wantto apologize to you here. Okay,

(30:48):
So now it's been I'm thirty nineyears old and it's been seventeen years,
so I just want to let youknow I was twenty two at the time.
I was younger. I was dumb. The whole thing. I've been
kicked out of here before. Idid not hear that story. So in
two thousand and seven I did livein Shakapie right off of well it was

(31:11):
Hickory Lane and right off of Vierlingthere, and I forget is it at
Vierling in Spencer is at the middleschool the high school here in Shakaya.
Yeah, Spencer's like kind of themain up to town. So I lived
there with with some roommates. Myroommate and I were here one night.
Now I must I was not thein the end, it was not the

(31:32):
perpetrator. But I do believe inguilt by association, so I feel terrible
about it. My roommate and Iwere celebrating his birthday and he found a
couple of delightful young ladies who weresitting the I'm struggling with with with east

(31:52):
west, north south straight, okay, perfect, So north side of the
bar, you got that one table, you got some pull tab machines,
et cetera, next to that entrance. This is why he didn't want to
sit there, I think. Andthere were there were there were two ladies
there, a couple of guys,and my roommate decided after you know,
I mean just a couple of ofbeverages, way too many that that we

(32:16):
had enjoyed throughout the day at thehouse. We did grill out, we
did the whole thing, and we'relike, you know what, We're gonna
go to downtown. We're gonna hangout at Turtles. We're gonna have a
good time. My roommate, wehad just walked in the door. We
had not even purchased a beer fromyou yet. My roommate sees these two

(32:37):
ladies and he wants to introduce himselfto them. Well, those two gentlemen
happened to be their boyfriends, andthey're just a couple of couples trying to
have a good night. And theyclearly knew they were regulars here. That's
one of the best parts about Turtles, by the way, is every time
I come in, I get hereprobably i'd say once every couple of months,

(32:58):
and I'm always seeing similar people.There's good relationships here. It's such
a good vibe. And he wantedto introduce this is like three PM,
by the way, Oh ridiculous,It's ridiculous. And he decided to introduce
himself to those two ladies, andright in front of their boyfriends, and
then he had a couple of thingsto say to them. They knew the

(33:22):
bartenders, and we were asked notto come back, and as we were
leaving, my roommate yelled like JackBuck style Game six ninety one World Series
and we'll see it tomorrow. Heactually said, well, we'll see you
tomorrow night. I hope he cameback. And we did come back,

(33:44):
and he was in a better spot. Okay again, twenty two years old,
made some mistakes, came back,apologized, and they were good to
us from there on out. ButI needed to get that out. It's
been seventeen years, Brian. Thisis like I'm in the fashion room right
now, but but I needed to. I needed to let you know that

(34:05):
your people were good to us then, and I apologize for causing a scene.
Apology seventeen years ago. Apology accepted. You know, I mean,
things happen at a bar, youknow, especially when you're young and you're
starting to kind of learn how tohow to drink and what to say to
people at bars. But no,that's a good story. I want to

(34:27):
have to try to figure that out. Who might have been if anybody remembers
that I it was to bad hewould I would have been on the thirty
day wall. You have a thirtyday yeah. Yeah. If if there's
like if you're you know, iflike appendages start flying towards people, we
uh, you get it. Youget a thirty day little vacation. And
well we we had to leave,let's you say quickly because the two boyfriends,

(34:51):
in total fairness, by the way, didn't appear too pleased that my
roommate was was trying to take hisgirlfriend out for for something. How funny
would that have been? If Itext your Brian, I'm like, hey,
nor don't I do in this podcast? We love we love your spot.
We'd love to do it here.And we walk in and you look
at him and you go, you'vegotta be kidding me. This dude,

(35:15):
correct this dude. November thousand andseven. You're rut of here. We
still got his photo on the wall. There's no way this guy's coming in
here. Well, I've always likedthe thirty day rule. Well, I
think it's smart that you do thethirty day wall because I've thought about it.
You watch sporting events, of course, Uh, someone jumps on the
field during during a Viking stand fora while or the Super Bowl your banned

(35:38):
for life? How are they gonnauphold that? They never will? There's
there's no chance, never will untilwe get to total total weird facial recognition
technology you get at some point,he's going to get back into it.
Now, the thirty day wall atolty day memory. I trust that.
I told you he was a niceguy. Yeah, thirty days. That's
pretty, that's pretty. I mean, has anybody ever set it the thirty

(36:00):
days? Well, if it happensagain, there's the there's the eighty six
list, but you know the eightysixty six like for good. But that
doesn't happen much. We don't havemany issues like that here. We're primarily
a family restaurant. We do havewe're a multifaceted thing where we got the
banquet hall and we got the bar, and we got the restaurant and then

(36:21):
then we've created this other kind ofcraft beer community. But we don't have
many problems like that anymore. Imean, you know, every time I've
been here, it's always like it'sone of the it has it kind of
has like a like a small townbar feel. It's a homey feel.
Yeahah, but like it's not likeone of those where you walk in,
the door opens and they don't knowwho you are and everybody's looking at you

(36:43):
like who's this guy? Like it'svery bartender's kick ass. The patrons are
awesome, Like there is no likeyou don't feel out of place, which
is awesome when it was twelve thousandpeople and this is we're in like the
old part of town. Yeah,and it really is kind of a blue
collar, you know, mom andpop sort of everybody knows everybody sort of
seeing. You know. It's evolveda little bit as all these houses are

(37:07):
getting built around us, but Ithink they all end up coming downtown.
And like I said, the cityspend a bunch of money making this downtown
beautiful now. And uh, it'sit's crazy Wednesday nights throughout the summer,
seven weeks in a row. Wehave this thing called Rhythm on the Rails.
Yeah, and they put the stageout here and there's four or five
thousand people out on the street ona Wednesday night. Do you guys benefit

(37:28):
at all from like live racing seasonduring Canterbury Do you see a change in
business as they get really rolling onweekends? Yeah, we've had a great
relationship with them, always been anniversand they're just great people to begin with.
People. Yeah, and we startseeing losing tickets on our booths.
You know, they're pulling out theirwallet and they're like, oh, yeah,
that's garbage or maybe they want andthey're coming to celebrate. I don't

(37:53):
know, but no, Yeah,we get a lot of traffic from that.
Then now they're they're also building thathuge empathy out there, so we're
really thinking that it's you know,supposed of the fifty sixty events a year,
and that's really amazing. So whatis it so thirty so nineteen ninety
for you? At one point itwas Canterbury Downs correct, yep, yeah,

(38:15):
then do you how how many yearswere they closed? So I'm from
Mankato, so really my my Ionly know Canterbury Park, not necessarily in
its current state, but I knewit as Canterbury and Randy Sampson and just
like I know those guys now justthrough working at the radio station, PA
who I work with, certainly obviouslyvery connected and at home there. But

(38:39):
what was that like when they weregetting kind of Canterbury was kind of getting
back into the motion of things againbecause that's grown. I mean, that's
an entirely different look than what Iremember twenty years ago. For sure.
Yeah, I don't think they hadthe attendance to begin with, well,
which is probably why they closed initiallyto really affect us or anything. But

(38:59):
I mean they've done such a greatjob. And not only you know,
off the racetrack and all, youknow that the gambling parts that they've added,
but now that the development, youknow, i mean, Badger Hill
Brewing moved and they've got the beautifulspottle. Yeah, and there's so are
they physically they're not physically in theAmphitheater. It's just near, just near.
Yeah, they got a few nearby, you know, adjacent developments and

(39:21):
they're building restaurants and trying to makeit like an entertainment complex. But but
yeah, it's uh, it's definitely. I see the traffic and and really
it's it's really reasonable to advertise withthem. Well maybe because we've been doing
it for so long, but it'sa no brainer for us. You know,
we don't do a ton of advertising. They're not newspapers because they don't

(39:42):
really you know, exists much.You know it so quickly, you know,
social media marketing. But that's oneof the few places that we continue
to do that and we love it. Oh that's good. Yeah, after
you hit the pick three, justhead on over to Turtles and shokopy it's
actual. Yeah, and celebrate anddon't leave the ticket on the table.
Yeah, you're talking about the cityand the city doing a lot of good
stuff for you guys, which isawesome to see. I noticed when I

(40:04):
pulled in today that a lot ofpeople might know you guys have a patio
in the summertime. Is that withthe city or who does that for you
guys? Because it looks very uniformto everything around here? Is that a
city thing? The city there waslike some I don't really know the exact
specifics, some government money floating aroundkind of right after COVID, and it's
to get people. It was ithink initially to get people outside. Yeah,

(40:28):
and I'm not sure where these fundscame from, but the city got
some funds federally or I believe,and they built about six of them.
So we have one. There's oneacross the street from us, and this
is about three or in our thirdyear of having that. And what I've
really noticed, you know, itgets used and it's good for us,
but it makes it more walkable.I mean there's way more people out and

(40:52):
about walking around. And who reallybenefits. I mean people come to Turtles
and they're on their way here specifically, but then they're looking at Bill's tagra
over here, the clothes and theshops and it all kind of works together.
You know, you need a fewinchor tenants to bring people to a
location, but everybody benefits well.And the best advertising, right is people
sitting outside outside of your place.Oh for sure, people drive by and

(41:15):
like oh, because sometimes people justsay, have a mindset, they're going
to one place, right. Turtleshas been here forever, but they might
not even realize that it's on thiscorner. All a sudden, you've got
people sitting out on the patio outthere, like what is that? Oh
that's where Turtles is. I've heardabout Turtles on the Hops and Hawks podcast,
I've seen them on social media whatever. So no, that's that's cool
that the city does that for you. Yeah, And it said the other

(41:35):
patio that's right next to us isShockab brew Hall, and they kind of
share one with Arnies, which isanother bar, and we have a very
similar relationship with them. You knowthat we do with you and we sell
their beer and we well, weactually saw a lot of food over there,
so people q R quotas and wedid. It was actually on our
online ordering service. You can justsay delivered to brew hall or oh that's

(41:58):
over to Arnis. That's brilliant.So it's like an out of another dining
room for us. Matter of fact, tonight in the back room, there's
a fundraiser for SVA, which isa used to be called Scott County Battered
Women thing, you a shelter orwhatever, but it's just a domestic violence
organization and they're having a fundraiser andit's called Hops and Hot Dish. Okay,

(42:19):
somewhere to your show. And sothey wanted us to cook a bunch
of minute's why I have this flanneland everbody's gonna be wearing flannel shirts.
We have beer, all the beersfrom the brew hall next door. Is
there any tatertot hot dishes? Iwas gonna just tell you tater to hot
dish. We're doing some fish.We're doing some chicken wild Ride soup,
all Minnesota stuff. Okay, prettycool deal. We've been doing it for
several years. I mean I wasgoing to go home after this, but

(42:42):
now that started. It sold outlike three months ago. I could probably
get you in. We know aguy. I think we know a guy.
How do you guys? How doyou guys do with sporting events?
Here is it? You know,people gravitate to turtles like the NFL draft.
This is actually this is going tobe posted on Monday, so the
NFL Draft will be complete, buton a Friday afternoon following the first round?

(43:02):
Is this a place people gravitate toto watch the TVs? They're glued
to it? Whoa JJ McCarthy,whoa Dallas Turner? How does it do
for sporting events and such? Youknow, we got all TVs all over
the place, but so does everyoneelse. Now, when we first get
our kind of remodel of this place, we were like straight out of the
art there were you know, we'reway beyond most places and we get it.

(43:25):
Kind of depends on how the team'sdoing. You know, twins are
hot at the wild you know,way off o twins aren't helping anybody.
Yeah, yeah, people are comingfor the road game three Wolves tonight though
on a Friday night, Hopefully peopleare in ready to close the place down
right. Yeah, it's cool.It's a late game because we're usually pretty
busy already. So you know,the family restaurant portion pretty much packs this

(43:47):
place. So there's not a lotof room for people sitting around at a
table in the dining room for fivehours. Yeah sure, as we're kind
of turning and burning tables. Butwe're lucky to have the two bars.
So there's there's that. But butyeah, we got our fair amount.
But like I said, it dependson how you know, the teams are
doing a little bit well. Ilove the Minnesota Twins. Grew up a
Twins fan. They they aren't helping. Four game yeah against against the White

(44:09):
Chicago is three and twenty two rightnow, listen the beauty of it is.
I know we're not a sports podcast, but I was at the game
yesterday. Four game win streak,you need it. Then we play the
Angels. Angels are awful. Thenwe go to the Red Size or the
White Sox. Also, all ofour guys are healthy. Here we can
go Menham. Now we're going back. We're going back to back Ale Central
Champ. Is it still this AleCentral? I don't even know. Well,

(44:30):
First of all, congratulations on thebrag that you were at the noon
game in the middle of a workday, so I was still working.
I was still working. Secondly,Champions Club tickets were going for about twenty
five dolars, so there's that.I'll even brag it even more. These
tickets were free from some really goodcustomers that we have at Heavy So and

(44:50):
I was drinking five dollars Miller lights. I don't care. I was drinking
them five bucks. You can't beatit, so absolutely mean no, that's
I was wondering how you guys dofor sports because breweries never really crush it
with the sports stuff. I feelscounterculture with the TVs. It's just it's.
Yeah. We talked about a littlebit last week with elm Creek,
right, like TVs at breweries werea weird thing, and all of a

(45:10):
sudden, now everybody has them,and you everyone's trying to push like coming.
We had a pretty good turnout forthe Wolves game last or Tuesday,
it must have been Tuesday. Buttonight or late these nine thirty games we
close at ten. Oh, Ican't. I can't ask people that,
hey, stay up until one o'clock, yeah, or Sunday Sunday. Yeah,
yeah, Well I remember going toa brewery and they didn't have any
TVs, and I thought, well, I'm gonna it was a new brewery,

(45:32):
hadn't been there, and anytime anew place opens I try to go
check it out and see for bothboth personal and professional reasons. But it
was a playoff game I think itwas, could have been the trans few
years back, and they didn't haveany TVs. So we left. No.
I mean, I would bet ifyou've gone back to the same place
since they probably have TVs. Theydo, matter of fact, glued to

(45:57):
entertainment as we are. I mean, you have to write. I mean
it's people like beer, people likesports, people like food. You know,
you got to have all three rightnow to kind of come well.
And live music and lives the otherthing with I don't know what you know,
if they crush a live music here, don't Yeah a little bit.
I got a really got a reallythat's so busy with weddings, which is
where we're very fortunate. But weworked hard. We've been here thirty five

(46:21):
years. That's about twenty five yearsold, okay, so it took a
while to get you know, getit cranking like it is. We do
seventy eighty weddings a year in there, so so now, holy cats,
that's sweet. Yeah, it is, it is. But tonight, as
a matter of fact, so wedo some live music. You know that
table we were thinking about setting upat yeah, where your buddy got kicked
out of. Yeah, right rightnext to where your buddy got kicked out

(46:42):
of. We have an acoustic showtonight with three just fantastic Minnesota musician guys.
That's super cool. And they're kindof friends of mine in the band
called frog Leg, which isn't kindof an up and coming Minneapolis jam band
kind of yeah, and and soyeah, so we got that tonight.
But you know, and every Wednesdaywe have the they've played every Wednesday for
about fifteen and a half years.It's called the Sobs Singer on Barstools and

(47:07):
they got to follow in. They'refine. It was you know, requesting
songs, clapping hands and all that. So you guys are definitely a one
stop shop here in Shockapy, right, Like there's I know, you got
you got some great breweries around here, and but if this is the spot
to go if you're coming downtown Shockapy, food, beer, cocktails, sports
music, pull tabs. You canget married here, like, like,

(47:30):
what else? What else do youreally need? Could you do all that
in the day? I think.I mean, if you talk depression,
he might, he might let you. Are you know, are you an
ordained minister? I am not,But I know some people somebody else speed
dial? Yeah, I know somepeople. So if I hit a couple
of nice tab wins, yeah,the bar side to ask you to speed

(47:52):
dial somebody and do a little shotgunwedding in the back. My buddy John
could do it. Yeah, hellyeah, legit, like it's sweet,
you get it. You just getthe people around the bar. You like
for dinner, we're gonna have pizzafried chicken. Nordo was gonna marry this
gal he just met. Yep,correct, because he hit the tabs.
They're having a good time. He'sa couple of turtally hazes in. Brian

(48:15):
calls his buddy up. If it'sopen, you're getting married. But he's
doing seventy weddings a year, soyou might want to plan a little bit
more ahead. Well, it's gonnabe quick, it's gonna be I think
we would have to get him atriple, I p a from our menu
before them into something. If theyif they do, if they do want
to get married here, walk overto the dining side to find a couple
of witnesses. And yeah, obviouslyI'm happy to spread around my winnings a

(48:37):
bit if that's what's required. Butif someone does want to get married here
last minute or obviously planned out,how do they How do they do it?
They just call our general number andthen there's like a little little menu
and you just pick me Brian,and then well it says for events or
banquets and and to tuck Brian andthen uh, and I handle all that

(48:57):
myself. Now I don't do alot out here anymore, but I love
it. It's you know, Planetweddings. You know, you'd think it
would be difficult, but I've runabout nine hundred over the years, so
it's pretty easy. And it's uh, well, it's lucrative because the sales
are you know, you know certainlyyou know how many people are coming,
what they're eating when they're eating,so no wasted food, no wasted labor.
So we love it. But youget to be part of like one

(49:17):
of the most important moments in someone'slife. So we take pretty serious.
Or my name's on the front door, so you know, we try pretty
hard. So the beautiful thing,Yeah, it's it's fun. You know,
it's very rewarding and uh, youknow fairly, Luke looks if you
want to talk to Brian, youwant to get to meet him, find
a gall or a guy that youwant to marry, right, and then
you can hang out with them,maybe have a beer with them. Let's

(49:38):
just have let's concentrate on the beerpart, you know what I mean,
the wedding part. That's that's abig deal. I don't want to be
responsible for causing any more weddings thanI already do, kidding, but I
would love to have you know,if you're ever in here, ask for
me, because I'd love to sitdown and drink beer with you, that's
for sure. Oh it's fantastic,isn't it kind of amazing? You know,

(50:00):
even as we sit here and thinkingabout it, you mentioned multiple bars
and just kind of the growth ofthings, just where you were in nineteen
ninety and where you are today.I just that's that's part of what even
as we started the podcast, likeknowing Ken being buddies with ken understanding the
difficulties and the trials and tribulations isstarting a business. And he said it
early on, just like, ah, we've been doing it two years,

(50:22):
you've been doing it three and ahalf decades, Like that's insane and and
it truly is. But you know, do you do you ever afford yourself
the ability to kind of go It'spretty damn cool after thirty five years,
Like this is still pretty cool.I still get to sit down, I
get to try awesome beer, getto create relationships with good people who ultimately
both benefit from each other succeeding.Like you found the right path and you

(50:46):
made the most of it, andthings have really come together in a cool
way. And now you're you're hostingme getting married in the in the in
the event hall with sorry just hadtwenty minutes ago. No, but but
all jokes aside, just how coolthat process has been from then to now.
Yeah, there's definitely a sense ofpride, you know. And you

(51:07):
know my names are our last nameson the door. Yeah that turtles my
last name. But the people thatwork here and make this place what it
is is it's a bigger deal thanthat, you know, And they really
are the backbone of what this placehas become. Well, a lot of
people that I've seen working, they'vebeen working here for a long time.
Yeah, and it's not I got, you know, six months, I
got. I got to find thenew person. You know. Tell that

(51:30):
speaks a bit to how well you'vedone as well, from the standpoint of
creating an environment where people have trulymade careers and they they they in some
ways take some ownership of what's happeninghere. To the point where when I
was getting kicked out of here withmy roommates seventeen years ago, I bet
there's at least a handful of peoplethat were working here, But it could

(51:50):
have been Linda. She's working rightnow. I'll ask her after she's been
here for twenty eight years. Irecognized Linda. I wonder if she was
here that not the one there shegrabbed a scuff the scruff of my roommate's
neck like a cat and tossed him. Yeah, she's about ninety five pounds
up here, dynamite. I wouldn'twant to piss her off. No,
I am not no, No,I contact Linda, but I appreciate what

(52:14):
you do. So yeah, Imean it is, you know, a
cool thing to think back and thememories. And it started it with my
parents. I think we bought themabout eighteen years ago. Yeah, but
now to kind of try to teachmy daughter the ropes. I tried talking
her out of it, but shesaid, for the same reason as you
just mentioned, you know, it'sour family heritage's I needed to do this,

(52:35):
you know, And so a beautifulthing. We began the process about
a year ago and probably taking anothera couple of years and then and then
hopefully I can move south and changemy number or something. I don't know.
I will say, shout out togo on hikes. Well while you
were, while you were gone fora little while, hanging out doing what
you deserve to do. She wasgreat, Like she was the one that
I was contacting about, Hey,what are we looking at for kegs?

(52:57):
How Ever things going? She kickedass, Oh that's here. Yeah,
she's great. She's very sometimes overthinksthings, you know, because she wants
to impress me. And she's veryyou know, kind of analytical thinking person.
But as I said, watch hergrow and get more and more confidence.
And she's young woman, you know. As the comfort level improves,
exactly. Yeah, So we startthrowing her more and more stuff on her

(53:19):
plate, and pretty soon maybe ourplate will be empty. Big shoes to
fill though, right, I mean, because eventually you're gonna want her to
probably be the person that steps inand she's having beer with people, right
right, She's the one going,hey, what's going on? These tap
lines? Like beer? She does, and I've been hauling her around,
you know, was meeting Scott atBlackstack one time for a project we did
with them, and thank god,rest the soul just one of the greatest

(53:40):
people in this this industry's ever known. But she came with for that reason.
I want her to kind of getused to that kind of stuff.
And I mean, that's that's work. When you get to go to a
brewery and drink beer for work.I mean, can you complain about that?
No, it's not bad kind onlyrarely complaints, very rarely, and
it's when he has to carry thekegs. Thanks so much to Brian and

(54:04):
Turtles Bar and Grill for letting ushang out and ask stupid questions for an
hour. That's the Hops and Hogspodcast. You can follow us via x
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