More Than A "Freak Like Me": Adina Howard on Womanhood & Wholeness

In this powerful episode, Dr. J Barnett sits down with R&B icon Adina Howard for an intimate and reflective conversation about healing, identity, and womanhood. Adina revisits her groundbreaking hit “Freak Like Me” and its lasting impact on sexual liberation, self-expression, and female autonomy, while unpacking the realities of navigating fame at a young age in the music industry.

The conversation dives deeper into healing childhood wounds, the importance of sisterhood and self-awareness, and Adina’s intentional decision to prioritize her career and personal fulfillment over traditional expectations of motherhood. She also speaks candidly about the role of faith, evolving relationships, and learning to stay present through life’s transitions. 

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Episode Transcript

Speaker 1 (00:00):
Welcome to jess Hell with Doctor J, a production of
the Black Effect Podcast Network and iHeartRadio or some good people.
This is Doctor J and we are back for another
episode with Just Heal with Doctor J. Some of you
have been eavesdropping on the episodes, and I want to
challenge you to click that subscribe button. Listen. We are

(00:20):
available on Spotify, the Black Effect Podcast Network, iHeart Podcast Network,
or wherever you listen to podcasts. All right, welcome back
to another episode of Just Here with Doctor J. And
I am your host, Doctor J. Barnett. Listen. I am
a eighties baby, and I know some of you were
probably in ninety five ninety six years. I think I

(00:44):
was in seven or eighth grade, but I wasn't old
enough to listen to rap and hip hop because my
dad was a pastor, and so we had to sneak
and watch BT because BT could not be played at
our house. I remember an encounter where my dad caught
me watching BT after dark, and let me tell you,
it wasn't a good sight because he said, what are

(01:07):
you doing watching? Boy? Not what you doing watching this?
What are you doing watching? So it was like, why
are you watching this? And so I can vividly remember
this song called Freak Like Me Again. I was in
school and I was doing what every other seven and
eighth grader was doing. I was watching miss Adena Howard

(01:32):
as all of you were wherever you were. Anyway, I
am honored and I am humble to have none other
than herself, miss Adena Howard, and this recording artist who
has been a pillar in women liberation in the nineties.
Because what she did in the nineties, I don't think

(01:54):
we ever seen done until some years later with some
other artists. I won't name them at this time, but
miss Da how welcome to the healing community.

Speaker 2 (02:02):
Thank you for inviting me.

Speaker 1 (02:04):
Now i'd have had this big loud voice she come
here with this.

Speaker 2 (02:06):
Thank you for listen. This is what happens. So when
I'm on camera, I'm not comfortable in front of the camera.
So there's something that comes over me where I just
I start touched. I start to just kind of my
voice comes down, but like coming through that, I'm like, hey,
how you doing. Yeah, I project, But when this stuff

(02:27):
is around, I'm just a little listen.

Speaker 1 (02:29):
I won't say thank you because you guys, this is
the first time she's done this, and for her to
be open to come to the healing space. I don't
take it for granted. Thank you to Kasha, thank you
to London for aligning all of this, because what I
wanted my platform to be is a space for people

(02:50):
from all walks of life to come right. Because we
know you as the artist, but today I think we
get in. We will have the opportunity to get to
know the Laman behind the music, not just behind the song,
because you've done other things and so I just want
to say thank you for lending me your time. I
know you're touring right now, and so thank you for

(03:11):
stopping buying Dallas to sit down with the Good Doctor.
As my mother say, Mama, I love it, I got it.
I got always shot her out because she will say,
you know, I gave you that name boy. So thank you, mama.
So how you feeling today, baby?

Speaker 2 (03:25):
I feel better than good. I'm blessed to marinated in
divine favor, blessed and man and marinated. Yes, Mama, I'm
about to get my mama there. Because my mom I
can call her right now. She's gonna be like, I'll
be like, Mama, what you doing? Blessing Holly's favor I'm
gonna tell her. I have to tell her.

Speaker 1 (03:42):
She got to add that marinated in.

Speaker 2 (03:43):
Yes, marinated in divine favor. Absolutely.

Speaker 1 (03:46):
Man, you look good, look amazing. I was telling you earlier,
like whatever you're doing, you need to put in a
ball and to sell it.

Speaker 2 (03:53):
You know what. It started early when I, you know,
when I had access to you know, the finding chancewers
to be able to really do skincare. I just really
started a really good skincare routine for me and it
just carries over. You know, this right here is what
people see the most of and so I just want
to make sure it stays on point.

Speaker 1 (04:15):
Wow.

Speaker 2 (04:15):
Yeah, And I don't wear a lot of makeup, So
this is just for the you know, for this particular situation. Wow,
have you always not worn a lot of makeup or honey?
I was born in seventy three. My mother did not
play that. My mother raised four girls, and one of
the things that we could not do because like you
raised in you know, a Christian household, no secular music,

(04:36):
There was no makeup, that type of thing. So just
it just you know, the seeds that have been sewn
into me have grew into just not really caring to
wear makeup because I like what I see in the
mirror when I look at me with no makeup. So
I'm fine with that.

Speaker 1 (04:52):
I'm just gonna let that shit because somebody need to
hear that, because we live in a society where I
think it's not just women, it's men that feel unless
we are able to assessorize ourselves, we don't feel comfortable
in our skin.

Speaker 2 (05:10):
Let me tell you the only reason why I have
earrings right now is because my sister said that I
needed earrings. I don't do jewelry. I'm not really a
fan of like the embellishments. I like to just I'm very,
very simple when it comes to dress and things of
that nature. I become the peacock when I have to
be a Diana Howard.

Speaker 1 (05:30):
M M. I love that you become the peacock when
you become a Deeda Howard. Now you've been able to
sort of kind of I don't want to say, live
in both spaces, but you had to sort of employ
both spaces where there is a Deeda Howard the act

(05:51):
and then there's a Dena Howard the woman. What was
that like to manage bold?

Speaker 2 (05:59):
It's not something that I even think about. Honestly, it's
when it's time to turn it on and turn it on,
and when I turn it off, I turn it off.
I think a lot of time because I, for me,
I don't believe the hype. I didn't drink the kool aid.
So I just go to work. That's all it is
for me. I go to work, And what I know

(06:19):
is when it's time to clock in, put the face on,
put the costume, and put everything on that they want
to see. Clock in, go to work, do what I
have to do, and as soon as I'm done and
I'm able to clock out, I'll clock out. It's not
something that I have to think about. I just do it.

Speaker 1 (06:35):
So because you were what twenty two when you made.

Speaker 2 (06:37):
This, all I was let's see, it came out in
ninety five, so I was twenty one. I was probably
twenty So.

Speaker 1 (06:46):
You were twenty one when Freak like Me came out. Now,
did you have that same mentality that you were clocking
in and clocking out like that? You have that same
mentality that you have today or had you not really
sort of evolved in a way where you could separate
the act from the person.

Speaker 2 (07:08):
My mother always told me it's a job, show up
and do what you're supposed to do. Show up one time,
get the job done. And so that's it's all I know.

Speaker 1 (07:17):
And how did that song come about? Because you know,
I was a teenager when that song came out. But
you had did something that Salt and Pepper hadn't done.
You had did something that Alatifa hasn't done. You had
done did something that MC like you had. You had
did something that no female artist has done. You had
created this song that created sexual liberation for many women

(07:41):
at that time, right and being comfortable in your sexuality
and then also verbalizing what it was that you wanted.
How did that come about?

Speaker 2 (07:51):
My personality who I was at the time. It's interesting
because my sisters and I, you know, my mother is
for girls by ourself, So we lived in the father
was household and being in a fatherless household, and finally,
like my mother, like I said, raising us in a
very something I'm gonna say, a strict upbringing. When it
came to Christianity or whatever the case may be, I

(08:13):
think once I got a taste of sex, it was
just like, oh okay, I like this. And so just
me being that person out there bless you me becoming that,
you know, enjoying sex, promiscuous and just doing what I
wanted to do and how I wanted to do it.

(08:33):
It just came about that way. My manager, you know,
my former manager. He and I had conversations and he
was like, okay, all right, I see what it is.
And then R Kelly was out at the time, and
of course Madonna was out at the time, and what
they wanted was to take my personality and create a
female R Kelly slash black Madonna. Wow, and you get

(08:57):
a Diana Howard.

Speaker 1 (08:59):
Wow.

Speaker 2 (09:00):
Now, now when did you start doing music like professionally?

Speaker 1 (09:05):
Yeah, because you know, you know, you're twenty one years
old when this song will released, like you have your
sexual experience that opens your you know mind, and so
Pandora box has been opened. So it's like, man, I
really like this, and how do you go from really
liking this to now this is like, yo, I'm pinning
this down to be a song.

Speaker 2 (09:26):
Well, I didn't write the song. There were some guys
out of Baltimore, Maryland and management that wrote the song
based off of my personality because managers was like, look,
this is who she is and this is how she is,
and this is what we're wanting to put out there
in the public. It's it's honestly, it's one of those
things that it was just meant to be. And I
tell people all the time, I didn't choose music. Music

(09:47):
chose me. And my mother used to like force me
to sing as a kid, and I'm trying to find
a better word than force, but that's pretty much what
she made me do. She she made me sing for company,
she made me sing inquir at church. And so it's
something that I've always been doing music. I've always been singing,
and somehow as I got older, people would find out

(10:10):
that I was a singer. They're like, oh, she sings,
and then people would just gravitate to me and want
to put me in the studio and record. And it
was just like okay, and I'll just record. I'll just
go work.

Speaker 1 (10:21):
So how many takes did it take for that song?

Speaker 2 (10:24):
You know? But that's a good question. I don't know.
Interesting story though, So when we first did the demo,
it was like, Okay, this is you know, I can
do it. It's cool. And I remember being in New
York to officially record the song and I got to
a space where I didn't want to do it and
I was just and I don't know what came over me,

(10:44):
but it was a space where I was just like,
I don't think I want to do this, and management
was like, okay, you know we're here now, you know
we have to get this done. And it's just you know,
we did it again, show up having to go to work.

Speaker 1 (10:55):
Yeah, were you shocked by the success of it?

Speaker 2 (10:59):
You know what? Honestly, I'm still in the same spaces.
I'm not shocked, but I don't even know really how
to grasp the concept because my mother still asked me
to this day, has it hit you? And I'm like, now,
are you serious? He hasn't hit me thirty years later,
don't it's a job, a Dina. Come on, and I'm

(11:20):
gonna say this with all due respect, I bullshit you
not like it's a job. I don't know what. I
don't know how I'm supposed to feel about that. I mean,
it's my mother told me as a kid, you show up,
do what you're supposed to do, and it's I don't so.
I mean, I'm grateful for the success, but it's not like,

(11:40):
oh my god, I'm adena Howard it hasn't because at
the end of the day, what I know and the
experiences that I've had, people don't care that I'm Adena Howard.
I ain't paying their bills, i ain't writing them a check,
I'm not employing them. So a lot of times they're
be like okay, And I've had that experience multiple times before,
so it's kind of like, oh, okay, let me just.

Speaker 1 (12:02):
Well what what what I what I what I what
I talk about? You know, has it hit you? It's
just what you've been able to accomplish through it and
through the song, you know, because the Adena Howard or
doctor j these are just titles, right, So it's you know,
what I do as a therapist and a clinician and

(12:22):
speaker at all these different things. It's not who I am.
It's part of me, but it's not who I am.

Speaker 2 (12:27):
And I think that's probably the reason why is because
it's not who I am. It's just a part of
what I do. It's like, okay, it's adopt it's a
job title. It's just it's just what it is for me.

Speaker 1 (12:37):
Yes, So in some way do you feel that that
has kind of kept you saying throughout this process?

Speaker 2 (12:44):
Yeah? Yeah, not not drinking the kool aid. Yeah, not,
you know, believe in the hype that surrounds me or
surrounded me.

Speaker 1 (12:52):
Absolutely, and particularly for people in that industry who who
did not have the stability of thought right, and they
did not have the groundness, and they did not have
the foundation around what they were doing during that time.
When you look back at it, are you are you

(13:13):
glad from the should? I say? Are you proud of
the decision that you made to be as you are
today in your fifties? Because there's some artists right that
started out with you, right, I mean, life has changed
for them, who they are has changed, and they weren't
able to sort of transition after the song was over

(13:38):
or the run was over. Are you proud of what
you've been able to do after the success of that song?

Speaker 2 (13:45):
Absolutely? Absolutely. Longevity is the key, because every entertainer has
a shelf life, and so to be able to still
be here doing what I do thirty years later and
enjoying it more than I did when I first started,
really absolutely?

Speaker 1 (14:01):
Why now what do you enjoy about it? Now?

Speaker 2 (14:04):
This is more freedom, a lot more freedom. When I
first started in the industry, it was very structured, which
the industry is structured anyway, but it was a structure
that did not really allow me to enjoy it.

Speaker 1 (14:18):
It was.

Speaker 2 (14:20):
Get on the transportation, be it busts or plane, you know,
the car, get in, get in or on the transportation,
get to the hotel, get yourself together, you know, back
to the transportation, get on stage. Didn't get to hang around,
get back into the transportation either, get back to the
hotel to clean up, get back on the bus to

(14:41):
head to the next destination. So it was just a
boom boom boom, boom boom. I didn't get to see
the places that I that I traveled to. I didn't
get to meet the people who enjoyed my music. I
just got to see them from you know, stage level.
And it was just the in and out, a constant
in and out, so there was there was really no connection.

(15:04):
And I think that's one of the reasons too why
it really hasn't hit me, because it's just like in
and out, in and out, and it's like, oh, okay,
you know, go to work, show up, dude, you're supposed
to do, be on time, get paid off to the.

Speaker 1 (15:16):
Next That's why it's a blue work.

Speaker 2 (15:18):
Yeah, very much black yeah, you were.

Speaker 1 (15:20):
You weren't really present.

Speaker 2 (15:21):
No, not at all. And now I'm more present because
I get to see y'all, pay attention to the faces.
I get to, you know, just really be in the
moment and communicate and connect, which is it's nice to
be able to connect.

Speaker 1 (15:34):
You know. I'm glad that you said that you get
to connect now because I think about age and often,
and I remember having this conversation with this old legitleman
that it was getting ready to transition, and one of
the things that we was talking about is I wanted
to know what mattered to him the most now that
he was getting ready to transition. And one of the

(15:56):
things he talked about he talked about the memories that
he were record and what was interesting that he can
only recall the things where he were present. And I
think that is what's really taking us out of life,
Like we are living longer, but our quality of life

(16:18):
is not there as human beings anymore, because.

Speaker 2 (16:21):
Everything is like moving so fast, moving.

Speaker 1 (16:25):
So fast, as you were saying earlier. And what I
realize is even in my own life personally, if you
don't slow life down, it won't ever slow down for you.
Like you really have to slow life.

Speaker 2 (16:41):
Now you're in control of, you know, how fast and
slow things move, in control of your narrative and what
you want to have happened. I think that's part of
why I appreciate it so much more now, is because
now I'm in more control of how I do things,
not necessarily the personas so to speak, but just being

(17:01):
able to control how I move I you know, that
is that's one of the things that I appreciate more.
And I'm again able to be present and have that
control to say, Okay, I want to slow it down, okay,
or I want to move you know, I want to
work a little bit more. I get to you know,
I get to gauge things and figure out how I
want to move forward.

Speaker 1 (17:20):
Yeah. And you and you really now you get to
decide for you rather than a decision being made for you.
In it says is that is that like another level
of freedom for you? Absolutely as a woman.

Speaker 2 (17:33):
Absolutely, I think as a human being in general, but
for sure. And I'm the firstborn, so being the firstborn
of my mother raising four girls and my dad having seven,
and always being told as a child, you're the matriarch,
which didn't know what that meant. At the time, but
I knew that there was a lot of responsibility and
I had sisters that I had to be, you know,

(17:53):
responsible for, so now to be able to have control
of my life and say yeah, to know maybe so, yeah,
a lot more freedom.

Speaker 1 (18:04):
You know. It's interesting because most of my work started
with girls in group homes and Falster care. That's how
I got started. And most of the girls were either
sex trafficking victims or victims of sexual abuse sexual assault.
And here I was, as former football player that was
working with these girls, and I created this program, Don't

(18:27):
I went to sleep one night, woke up and started
writing and created an entire program, and these group homes
bought it. So I'm in these group homes working with
these girls, and most of them have had a traumatic
experience with the man by the age of thirteen and
fourteen years old. And when you talk about freedom, I

(18:48):
am thinking about most of these young girls their experience
with men, or with their perpetrators, or with those individuals
that had taken advantage of their innocent They often spoke
about decisions being made for them, and they felt like
they did not have a choice to their freedom, which
is the choice to choose.

Speaker 2 (19:09):
Absolutely.

Speaker 1 (19:10):
So when you're talking about freedom, there's something that leaps
on the inside of me that you get to experience
that now in this season of life. Bishop Jakes is
my mentor, and he told me he recently he said,
he said, you're in your forties. He said, grind until
you get to your fifties. And I need you to
ride the wave in your fifties. And I said, bous,

(19:32):
when did you truly start living? He said, in my fifties.
You feel the same.

Speaker 2 (19:37):
It's getting there, it's getting there. I'm riding. I'm riding
the wave because that's on enough seed.

Speaker 1 (19:43):
And you know, that's exactly what he said.

Speaker 2 (19:46):
I tell people all the time, the seeds you so
well grow, you know, because they say you read with yourself.
So the seeds have been growing, and you know, I'm
in that harvest where I'm able to coast a little
bit more.

Speaker 1 (19:57):
Yeah. What does that feel like for you?

Speaker 2 (19:59):
Freedom? Yeah, it's peace. It's just really not having to
concern myself or worry and I don't worry anyway, but
not really having to concern myself with a great deal.
Just be like, okay, just it is easy, preecy. Yeah,

(20:20):
just as long as I stay up the top of
my bills and do it I'm supposed to do, you know,
like they say, you do the things that you need
to do in order to do the things that you
want to do. And so I've done a lot of
what I needed to do so that I can do
what I want.

Speaker 1 (20:33):
Nowt fifty two year old data, What does she think
about twenty one of your data?

Speaker 2 (20:40):
That's a good question. The twenty one year looking back
looking at her just you know, just trying to find
her way. Not the most secure individual. She was angry
for sure. You know, I've noticed a lot of posts
that say guys don't really like women. You know, they
use for what they want to use them for, but

(21:01):
they don't really like them. I was the same lay
with guys. I didn't really like him, didn't have much
respect for him. Just they served a purpose and that
was to pleasure me in that moment that I wanted
to use them for that and then it was like okay,
moving on to the next. So she was just out there,
you know, just living, being wild and just trying to
find her way.

Speaker 1 (21:21):
Yeah, you know, what do you think she was looking for?

Speaker 2 (21:25):
That's a good question. What was she looking for She
was probably looking for the replacement for her dad because
he wasn't there, he didn't show up, being that he
was an addict, and so probably trying to find that love,
that acceptance because one of the things that I know
is abandonment and rejection. That's what I felt, you know,

(21:48):
even though I know now his story is his story
and it wasn't intentional. It was just he made the
choices that he made that led to him not being present.
But I think that's probably you know, what it was,
was just trying to find that male figure to fill
that void.

Speaker 1 (22:09):
Yeah, you know, as you're talking the clinical side of me,
it goes back to thinking about the four types of
childhood wolves, trusts, guilt, abandonment, and the other one that
comes to me, Come on, doctor Jay, there's other one
that come come to me, guilt, trust, neglect, and abandonment

(22:31):
and guilt when when see the abandonment wold is such
a deep wold for children, and it's such a deep
wound because being abandoned in such a young age and
not having someone to fend for you and then and
not even just having someone to really guid you, it

(22:54):
creates trust issues absolutely and when you have trust issues,
it develops the guilt world, right, You feel guilty for
certain things, and you develop the guilt for someone else's guiltiness. Right,
so it's like, why am I feel guilty for what
they should have done? You know? And then you're dealing
with this neglect of not being tended, to not being

(23:18):
cared for. So when I'm asking you what was she
looking for? It's connected to the behavior in a sense.
And I'm not clinicalizing it at all. I can see it,
but you know, And this is why I love to
hear people's backstories to how they become, their stories, to

(23:40):
how they saw life, their stories, to how they even
perceive certain things, because it's usually associated with our experiences,
and particularly for daughters. What I saw in those young
girls is most of them that have been engaged with
any set actual activity or anything, it was usually connected

(24:03):
to a.

Speaker 2 (24:03):
Father of them.

Speaker 1 (24:05):
And they often would say the same thing a data
of life, why didn't dad love me? Or why didn't
Dad stay? And this is why I work with men,
and particularly for men who have daughters. And it suchs too,
because I think there's just something about a father what

(24:25):
he's able to kill to that.

Speaker 2 (24:27):
Daughter at the end of the day, it's but I
think a lot of times people fail to understand there's
a reason why man and woman create, you know, a
human being is because there's that balance there. And then
when one is absent being a mother and or a father, yes,
it creates an imbalance. Yes, And I've had to learn
that again. He made his choices, he has his story,

(24:49):
and whatever transpired in his life, you know, it happened
to carry over into ours, you know, when he decided
that he wanted to create, you know, with my mother.
So go into a space now where I'm like, well,
he has a story, and you know, if it weren't
for him being absent, I wouldn't be who I am.
I would have had the experiences, you wouldn't have a
Diena Howard here on the podcast having this conversation.

Speaker 1 (25:14):
Right, would you look at your other sisters, how's the
relationship with the rest of them them?

Speaker 2 (25:19):
I love my sisters, Oh, I love my sisters. They
are I mean, one of the things that my mother
made sure was that she always instilled in us that
you are each other's best friends, period. And so if
we didn't ever have friends in this life, we have
each other. But I adore my sisters.

Speaker 1 (25:36):
What were their thoughts when, like you were, you know,
Adena Howard and the.

Speaker 2 (25:40):
Music and got to ask them? I don't know. I've
never asked them. I know I've not known because for me,
it's always been a job. You know, it just so
happens to put me in the spotlight. And fame is
not something that I desire anyway. It's not something that
I am. I have to accept it, but it's not
some thing I necessarily embrace. But I think that you know,

(26:03):
they're very proud. I can definitely tell you that, very
very proud, very supportive, and it helped them in so
much shape from her fashion, for sure.

Speaker 1 (26:15):
Yo, I was asking you about what fifty two year
old a data thought about the twenty one year old.
Now let's step back into the twenty one year old. Okay,
if she's looking at the fifteen year old, what does
she saying about you.

Speaker 2 (26:29):
The fifteen or the fifty ten, I mean, the twenty
one year old, what does she said about the fifty
two year old? Damn bitch, come through, am you did that?
She would be very proud, very very proud, just to
see the success, to see the fact that she's an
overcomer that in spite of she didn't you know, she

(26:53):
didn't like buckle, she didn't fold, she didn't one of
the things that my dad says, you can you can
slow me down, but you can't hold me down, you know.
And so there were some moments where I had to
be slowed down. But it made sense, you know. And
so to just see that I'm an overcomer, to see
that in spite of I'm still here. I'm still standing,

(27:16):
you know, and the you know, the wounds or whatever,
it's part of the journey. Yeah, Well, what was the
one thing that you had to heal from on this journey?
Oh my gosh, the father wound. And I'm still in
that process. Though I have a better relationship with my
dad than I did when I was younger. I'm not

(27:37):
as angry as I used to be, because again, I
understand that we all have a story, and I think
that's one of the things that children failed to pay
attention to. Our parents have a story, you know, and
it's not always about us, even though when we're coming
this story, it's all about me. You know, you had me.
I didn't ask to be here. At the end of

(27:59):
the day. They it's like they have a story. They
have their own wounds, they have you know, they have
things that they haven't healed from. And so having a
better understanding as to you know what all of all
of it is just a piece to the puzzle to
make the whole to you know, to bring the whole
picture together. And so that's you know, that's where I

(28:20):
am right now.

Speaker 1 (28:21):
Yeah. I usually say to my mom, is that the
older I'm getting, I understand you better as a woman. Yeah,
and beyond my mother, and I think the older that
we get, we begin to see our parents as.

Speaker 2 (28:36):
People exactly, and not just parents and not just parents.
So I have a song that I just released called
I Overstand, And so I'm having an overstanding even though
I don't have children, I do I overstand. You know
that our our lives from the moment that we arrived,
it's all been shaped molded by you know, our experiences

(28:58):
and the people who have poured into listen to people
who have taken from us, and so on and so forth. So, yeah,
did you ever walk children?

Speaker 1 (29:06):
MM?

Speaker 2 (29:08):
One of the things was business over babies? Okay, business
over babies okay? Unpacked that because because because we're in
a season.

Speaker 1 (29:15):
Where you know women are doing that thing, and that
thriving study shows women are waiting later in life to
have children. Women are pursuing their careers, and I'm all
for it. And I never heard that was that's a
newer of business over babies. That's a new one. So
unpack that.

Speaker 2 (29:32):
For me ninety five, being an artist in the nineties,
you had to make a choice. It was either career
or family. And my mother raising for girls by herself,
and her sharing some of her story with me, you know,

(29:52):
when I was able to comprehend, kind of put me
in a space of like, I'm good, no, and just
kind of knowing somewhat of her struggle. You know, it
was just like, nah, I'm cool on the baby bit. Yeah,
And I'm you know, at fifty two and not having
any children. I love babies. So I love babies. I

(30:15):
think they're so adorable. And one of the things that
I've always wanted to do was volunteer as a cuddler.
I would love to cuddle babies in the hospital and
the nikkis that's something that you know, I've wanted to
do for a very long time because I love babies.
But having my own. I can barely take care of
a plant, you know. So I'm like I used to

(30:36):
growing up. My mother adopted a little one, and I
was you know, I was the one who changed her,
fed her, bathed her. And so I've gotten that, you
know that in me, But business and I have the
freedom to be able to get up and go. Like,
if I had a child right now, my mother would
probably be here because she would be the one watching

(30:58):
I would have, you know, because now you know, people
can afford to have the nannies, they can have people,
you know, and then the industry is open now for
females to be able to be mothers, you know, to
be able to have families, and they can bring them
on stage and they can do all of this stuff.
I wasn't afforded that growing up in this industry. So
and they kind of kept you in that train of thought. Absolutely, yeah, absolutely.

Speaker 1 (31:22):
What would you say to the woman that is choosing
business over babies and unconsciously right because she's locked in,
she's focused. What would you want to say to her?
Because you know, being in the space that I am,
I'm the only boy, So I grew up around women
and I have sisters, My mom has twelve sisters. Yeah, no,

(31:44):
not nice at all.

Speaker 2 (31:45):
I mean that's like that because at the end of
the day, you're you know, you're surrounded by well, I'm
surrounded by love.

Speaker 1 (31:50):
So I so I have I have a I have
an understanding about women that most guys don't have the
level of wisdom that I've obtained just sitting and listening.
But there's often a shame around women who have achieved
and have not had kids. And I remember saying to
this guy once, I was like, the woman gets his

(32:13):
deside if she wants to be a mother or not,
No different than the dad gets to decide if the
man gets to decide if he wants to be a dad.
Like me personally, I don't like, I don't define a
woman by her not having children. I define her by
the life that she chose to live. Makes sense, you

(32:34):
know what I mean? Because it's not for everybody.

Speaker 2 (32:37):
It's not not to say all the time just because
you can't don't mean that you should.

Speaker 1 (32:41):
Come on.

Speaker 2 (32:43):
You know, we can all do a lot of things,
but should we be doing them? Are we do? We
have the capacity to be that and do that. And
I know for me and plus if I choose to
have a child. I want, I want the whole package.
I want the husband, I want the father. You know,

(33:04):
because if I wanted to just have a child, I
could go adopt one. I could have been a baby
mama easily if that was the case. But it's unfair
to the child, yes, to not have both parents. Yes,
And it creates and imbalance when there's not both and

(33:24):
you're not choosing healthy either, because you can still have
a parent both parents. But then if you're not choosing wisely,
then you're still creating a conundrum for the child. And
I know for me when I was younger, the guy
served one purpose and it was not to be a father.
I was not trying to make daddies. I was just
trying to you know, practice, you know, waste the seed

(33:48):
and keep moving. That's what it was. Skating. Let's go, Brothers,
don't be offended. She's just telling the truth. So, I mean,
that's all they were good for in that moment because
I wasn't again the capacity. I didn't have the capacity
to want to be in a relationship, and I didn't
have the time to be in a relationship. I was

(34:08):
all over the place, like physically mentally, spiritually, I was
just all over the place.

Speaker 1 (34:13):
Listen. I respect that so much because adena I have
to sit and listen to people because I'm not practicing
full time, but I still see people virtually. I have
to sit and help people process their inability to deserve
or to desire or in some way come to this

(34:34):
awakening that they don't have the capacity. There's a lot
of will, but you simply don't have the capacity. So
I can honor somebody saying listen, I would love to,
but I just don't have the capacity. And I think
we need more people to have that ability, to have
that level of thinking that says, hey, listen, I don't

(34:55):
have the capacity. Even though it's been deemed as this
societal sort of achievement. You gotta get married, you gotta
have the family, you got to have the house, you
gotta have the car, you got to have the six
figure career. And I'm watching people who are literally dying.

Speaker 2 (35:13):
They're failing at it because at the end of the day,
they're trying to keep up with, you know, a society
that says this is what it's supposed to be, and
it's like, oh, well, who said Zoe? And then and
for who. You know, if it's if it works for you, great,
And I'm the type of person. I'm not an or person.
I'm an a person, So I want this and that.
But going back to the question when it comes to

(35:34):
the women, you know, deciding business over babies, again, you
have to do what you need to do in order
to do what you want to do later. So if
it is something that you would like to do eventually,
then sow the seed, you know, get the foundation for
you know, the business, the success that you desire, and
then you know, as you go along in your journey,

(35:54):
if that's one of the destinations, you'll get there. It's
just do what you have to do first. But just
know that at some point in time, if you're so
focused on business, you your wound may become geriatric. And
that's a whole nother to do because you know, they
tell us our wounds are geriatric, but what by the

(36:16):
time of the art.

Speaker 1 (36:17):
Yeah, thirty five, thirty five is a geriatric pregnancy.

Speaker 2 (36:21):
So you know, and I know, I'm I'm I'm at
this point, I'm senior, like I'm so this my I'm
damn near past being able to So at fifty two,
it's like start considering adoption if you if that's what
you want. But like I said, it's right now you
have to be an or person if you're building. But

(36:41):
then once you achieve that goal, you can then be
an and person. I want this and that, but right
now you have to be the or.

Speaker 1 (36:49):
Listen. I want to pause right there because that that
that that is a what we do over here. That
that is a car's terri moment where I have to
tear the cars like and it's a season. You have
to be a or person. Once you get to where
you want to go, you can become the ad person.
That is so profound because most people have it backwards.

(37:12):
It can't be aired in a season where it has
to be or absolutely you either got to choose this
or that. Oh my god, that's so profound. I'm sitting here.
My brain is like, man, I can teach that thing
because I've watched so many people they're backwards and it's like, no,

(37:34):
it can't be or right now, I mean it can't be.
It has to be or you have to make a choice.
And I think, you know, I have this conversation all
the time with guys and it's like, man, you know
ain't nobody chose her because she had no kid? And
I'm like, brother, every woman is not on that plane.
There are some women that are on a different trajectory

(37:56):
where they their career does take precedents. And there are
some women where it says like I never wanted that,
and that's okay. Exactly if you could speak to the
women this is your camera right here. But if you
could speak to that woman who's at that place where
it's like, no kids, they're successful, what would you say

(38:17):
to her?

Speaker 2 (38:17):
Girl, You better live your life living like as ULI
go then, because it's you know what, I am at
peace with not having children. I'm at peace coming home
to just no one being there. I'm at peace with
not having to clean up after kids, you know, after

(38:38):
a whole grown ass adult, I can just come home
and I'm at peace. And if that's where you are,
it is okay to just be with you and yourself
and feel no guilt, feel no shame, because if you're
at peace with it, then that's where you're supposed to be.
That's exactly where you're supposed to be.

Speaker 1 (38:58):
And I love that you share that. It's okay because
Maya just recently came out said she never desired to
be married.

Speaker 2 (39:06):
Maya really, well, let me say this, no, no, no, no,
let me don't don't reach track, no, no, only track.
I want to go.

Speaker 1 (39:12):
I want to go deeper. I want to unpack that.

Speaker 2 (39:14):
It's I think it's overrated because it's expected. And I
know when I got married it wasn't for the right reasons.
I was in survival mode. I wasn't in a space
where I truly wanted to be with that person because
it was like, yeah, oh now, don't get me wrong.

(39:38):
It was a perfect fit for that moment because it
was survival mode, so it was perfect for that. But
outside of that, to me, it was overrated because I
don't really know what it's supposed to do for a person,
what is supposed to bring. I'm at peace where I
am right now. If I do have someone come into
my life and we you know, we're in alignment environment

(40:01):
where you know it's a partnership. You know, I'm I'm game,
but I don't. I don't. For me, I don't feel
like it has to be paper. And I know people say,
you know, the Covenant and this and that, and you know,
they start to get biblical, but at the end of
the day, I'm like, you know what, it's overrated because
I know that there are a lot of married I

(40:23):
should say a lot of single married people, you know,
And there are a lot of people who are in
relationships that are married and they're they're you know, it's like, okay,
so you know, there are couples who aren't married, but
they're they're functioning at a capacity where it's working. But

(40:45):
the minute that they sign some paper and they do it,
then it's all of a sudden it falls apart, and
it's it's something falls apart. I think there's a mindset
that comes with it. There's a mindset that comes with it.
There's an expectation, unrealistic expectation or unvoiced expectations. And I think,
and I tell people all the time, expectations were in relationships,

(41:06):
especially those who have those that have not been vocalized,
you know. And so but I just think for me,
it's unless it's a line, it's a line that's what
God says, this is the person for you, and I
want you to be married, then okay. But other than that, I'm.

Speaker 1 (41:23):
Just like you, as you was talking off thinking about
the meme where the lady says for me to get married,
God like to come in my room and say, hey,
my home boy, try to my son trying to get
at you. Say, God is going to have to come
out of the sky he himself and said, hey, this
is him, this is her, this is yeah.

Speaker 2 (41:43):
Like, because I have to respect that, because I you know,
when it comes to comes to that at this point
in time in my life, I'm just like, well, let
me just say this. My choices haven't been the greatest,
you know, based on just maybe not being in the
right space again capacity, you know, just you know, still

(42:06):
dealing with trust issues. Sometimes I trust too much when
I shouldn't trust, you know, and then ego may get
in the way I can do this, you know, and
it's really noticing, you know. And then mankeeping. I'm just
really tired of man keeping, you know, having to you know,
keep him in the space of being okay, you know,
keep him fed and keep it. I'm tired of the

(42:29):
man keeping, the housekeeping. Like I got enough to do
with me, and you know, I need to focus on
me and make sure that at the end of the day,
I'm kept spiritually, mentally, physically, emotionally, you know, financially and
you know, and the sexual part comes into it as well,
but I know that that has to be set to
the side because everything else is a lot more important

(42:52):
than that. And I've grown to that space to say,
you know what, as much as I love me, so, man, meat,
I'm going to have to just pause for a cause
on let's not well, if not working right now, just
pause on the man meat, Okay, just let's be still
even had enough for or for you know, to hold
you over. Yeah, you know, so I'm just in that

(43:12):
space now.

Speaker 1 (43:13):
I'm like, this's just so she said, man, meet Pauls, Pauls,
because I already know CJ's looking over here, like Paul's dude,
Pauls A pause a year just in case. So what

(43:34):
you say in this season of your life, as you
are enjoying you, as you are enjoying this level of
freedom that you never had in your career, but also
there's a part of you that's still growing and learning,
which you say you're in a healing phase right now.

Speaker 2 (43:51):
I am. Yeah, I am, and I'm I'm healing and discovering. Yeah,
because I don't think you ever you'll ever know yourself
in totality, because it's not until you experience certain things
in life that you recognize who you are and what
you will do. You know, something has to happen to

(44:12):
trigger a certain aspect of you to be able to
respond to that. And so I'm you know, healing and discovery.

Speaker 1 (44:20):
Yeah, what has a healing been like for you? What
does it journey been like?

Speaker 2 (44:23):
Has it It's been chill. It's been like, you know,
I'm one, Like I have conversation with God all the time,
and so it's like, Okay, what is it that you
need me to do? What is it that you want
me to do? Where am I supposed to go? How
am I supposed to get there? And you know, what's
going on with me? Like why am I feeling this way?

(44:44):
And to just be able to be in a space
where it's not pushed, it's not you know, I'm not
being egged to just like get it done, get it done.
I'm moving at my own pace, accepting the things that
need to be accepted, disregarding the things that make no

(45:05):
sense that don't work for me. So it's been it's
been chill.

Speaker 1 (45:09):
I've have you know, like any moments, any moments that
make you cringe when you discovered or why you discover something.

Speaker 2 (45:21):
I wouldn't necessarily say it makes me cringe, but I'm like,
damn for real, like is this what you know? You
did that? Why did you do that? I question? You know,
I have conversation with myself a lot, and I answer.
I'm one to answer because one of the things that
I know when I ask myself a question, if I'm
asking me a question, then I know I have the answer.

(45:44):
And so just you know, having those moments where there's
that enlightenment, I'm like, oh, that's interesting, Well why did
you do that, you know, and how did it make
you feel? And so, you know, I get answers and
then i'm you know, kind of guiding myself alone. But
I don't think I've had any cringe woments because at

(46:05):
the end of the day, I'm like, well, the what's
supposed to be, you know, it's it's life. It's gonna
happen how it happens. You make your choices based off
of you know, so you make decisions based off of choices,
and it's like, okay, well you made that decision based
off of that choice wasn't the best one, yeah, but
it is what it is.

Speaker 1 (46:26):
And also you make choices based off the information that
you had at that time. Absolutely, and the only way
the choice change information has changed. Y'all cares that your
choices don't change until the information changes, because you cannot
make better decisions until you have better information. And I

(46:47):
think for us within the black community, a lot of
choices are made off of information that's not good for us. Absolutely,
and that's that's both men and women.

Speaker 2 (46:58):
Absolutely.

Speaker 1 (46:59):
You know, I want to transition because recently you you
were spotted singing a gospel saw.

Speaker 2 (47:07):
As my stomachers growling, Can y'all hear that?

Speaker 1 (47:10):
So you're spotted singing a gospel saw? And to some
it's a shock because it's like this is Dale Howard singing.
I think, was it amazing grace? Yes, singing amazing grace,
but not realizing that your background is church. Now in
this season of your life, is Christian or gospel or

(47:34):
faith based? I don't know the genre that they have
in the music industry, like it is that pulling you
more right now in this season your life?

Speaker 2 (47:43):
No, No, not at all. When I see when I
sing love songs to God, I just it's just for us.
I don't care to do it for the world to hear,
because it's not for the world to hear, It's for
my God to hear me sing and then keep it moving.
But if it's something that that is presented to me, maybe,

(48:08):
but I'm just really I could see you doing I
could see you cutting a single, so I'll overstand is
more of an inspirational song. So I like inspirational music.
One of my inspirations. One of my my what's the

(48:28):
word she? Because she's Why wouldn't I say say idle?
But someone that I looked up to influences CC Winings.
I love beating in CC Winings growing up. So listening
to them growing up was because it was it was
love songs to God, but it wasn't so gospel in
you you know what I mean, And a lot of
people got upset about that when they first started saying

(48:50):
people were hottest fish glass right, But it was something
that opened the world up to be able to like
gravitate to that without it being you know, so gospel
and so you know what I mean.

Speaker 1 (49:06):
Yeah, Tambourines c b CC had folks confused, man, because
I remember hearing this song when I was a kid.
I was like, is this gospel sound more like R
and B. But they but they added a different sound
that made gospel music not only catchy, but made gospel
music you know. And SRI's a way exactly more palatable

(49:27):
to where you was like, you know what, I can
rock with that, you know, and I can remember what
was this song? All I wanted.

Speaker 2 (49:35):
To do just explain why do I feel the way
you do? What they listen?

Speaker 1 (49:42):
I thought that was a love song.

Speaker 2 (49:46):
It is see.

Speaker 1 (49:48):
Love song of Jesus. Absolutely, and I'm like, because you know,
when you first hear it, I was like, dang, somebody
getting at work. They singing to somebody. Man, you know
what I mean.

Speaker 2 (49:58):
I was getting that work, That's what was absolutely, But.

Speaker 1 (50:02):
It was such a beautiful, like display of love toward
God in such a different way. That wasn't the old
hymns exactly because I grew up in the South, so
most of the songs that I learned in church were
struggle songs.

Speaker 2 (50:18):
Yeah, how I made it?

Speaker 1 (50:21):
You know. It's like, man, so I can really appreciate
you know, what you're doing. What I overstand because I
think there is something to be said about music and
the inspiration of faith based or whatever you want to general.
You want to place it in for music to be
palable to where people can digest it. Because I think

(50:46):
that there's nothing worse than an antiquated sort of framework
on how we do things. And that's where we have
been for many years in the black churches.

Speaker 2 (50:58):
I think, and I think religion in general. See, I'm
not a religious person. I'm a relationship person.

Speaker 1 (51:04):
It's funny you say that, because that is Buller was
just here, former WWE wrestler. He said the same thing.
He said, I'm not a religious person. I'm a relationship person.
How have how has your faith played a role in
your journey?

Speaker 2 (51:22):
My goodness, it helps me stay sane. My faith has
helped me make better decisions. It's really just help me
stay you know, centered and grounded. Not really again, drinking

(51:42):
the kool aid and getting caught up in the hype
and recognizing that, okay, you have a responsibility, it's helped.
It's definitely helped me sure me as well. Yeah, recognizing
that I have a responsibility not just to myself, but
to those who have a tendency to want to gravitate

(52:04):
to me and help me recognize the influence that I
have because when I was younger, I was like, I
don't give a damn. I'm not raising anybody's kids. To
say my responsibility I am. I'm doing me. I'm living
my life. I have a career and I'm not going
to tailor it to help you raise your kids. That's
not my job.

Speaker 1 (52:23):
So what you're saying is that if some pairent walked
in and they son or daughter was listening to your music,
that wasn't your problem.

Speaker 2 (52:30):
No, Because what I know is when I grew up,
if my mother didn't want us listening to certain music,
it wasn't played in the household. Don't make me, don't
don't hold me accountable for you raising your child. That's
not my responsibility.

Speaker 1 (52:43):
Yeah.

Speaker 2 (52:44):
Period. Now if they come and if I see them
in person, they happen to run up on me say
oh my gosh, you know I love the music. Da
da da da da, then I may have some words like,
first of all, what are you going to listen to
my music? And why?

Speaker 1 (52:57):
Yeah?

Speaker 2 (52:58):
You know, and you know, and have that kind of
conversation where it's like, okay, so where are you, you know,
in your journey? What are you doing over to your
grades and things of that nature. I may, you know,
sow some seed, but for the most part, that's not
my responsibility to raise your child. Not I don't have
any she says, not her responsibility.

Speaker 1 (53:19):
Listen. I love it because I think sometimes we can
try to delegate that to, you know, other people when
it comes to our parent and not realizing that, yeah,
children will be children, because you would hear that right often, well,
children won't be children, but there's a responsibility there on
the parent that, while they may be children, what is

(53:41):
the structure or what is the order that you have
in your home and the standard in your place? Because
like I said, when we're mopping up the show, when
I heard the song, I was sneaking and listening to it,
right because my dad was like, no, y'all ain't listening
to that music, you know what I mean. So and
then by the time I heard T Shirt and panted,
I was in college. You know this is like, I mean,

(54:06):
how old were you made T shirty pennies?

Speaker 2 (54:08):
T shirt and paints at that point I think I
was probably like twenty three, twenty four.

Speaker 1 (54:14):
So that came after freak, Like yes, wow, now was
that written by somebody else.

Speaker 2 (54:20):
Or was that Jamie Fox? Wrote that song.

Speaker 1 (54:22):
Jamie Fox wrote that song.

Speaker 2 (54:23):
Jamie Fox, He sure did.

Speaker 1 (54:26):
Man, I remember, yeah, because isn't he on the intro?

Speaker 2 (54:31):
He's that's his voice and the intro.

Speaker 1 (54:33):
Man, Listen, I got a good memory, CJ. I got
a good memory. I remember being at Taunton State University,
and this is when DJ Shrew used to sell CDs
and most of my homeboys coming from Houston, and they
used to chopping Shrew music and they chopped and screwed
T shirt and panti to all of my college teammates.

(54:57):
Y'all know we were jamming at T shirt and panties
chopped and shrew. Man, Yes, oh remember that? Oh you
remember that.

Speaker 2 (55:03):
I remember that because that was the first time I
ever heard of chopping screw and I was like, what
the hell did they do to my soul?

Speaker 1 (55:08):
Man?

Speaker 2 (55:09):
That was but especially here in Texas, in Texas, what
y'all do in Texas? That T shirt and panties chopped
and shrew?

Speaker 1 (55:17):
Oh my gosh with that baseline hidden, Oh my gosh.

Speaker 2 (55:22):
Man, But yeah, he having flashbacks now. Listen. I slanger
man me like it wasn't nothing. It was my last
my playlist.

Speaker 1 (55:33):
Listen, man, I had so DJ DJ Screw used to
do what they call f actions. That's what that was
the name of the CD. F Action and T shirty
party has to be on. Was it like f Action
twenty This is I remember it had to be build
f Action twenty. Let me see. I'm telling you, man,

(56:00):
I'm telling you, I'm gonna put this up.

Speaker 2 (56:03):
Wow. I just remember, like I said, T shirt and
pants chopped because I never heard of choppin screw before
until you know T shirt and painties in Texas. Like yeah,
oh yeah, you say chopped the screw, you automatically think Texas.

Speaker 1 (56:20):
Oh that had us in a chokehold do you hear me?
Everybody was trying to get the CD on college cap Man,
Oh my god. I could call some of my teammates
right now, be like T shirt and pants chopped, screw
that bigga like go crazy. They would go crazy. I
cannot tell you how many times, my oh boy, this

(56:42):
dude would have a girl over, this food would go by.
This was like they had the cheap candles.

Speaker 2 (56:47):
Man, that waxes.

Speaker 1 (56:49):
This wax. This wax was so toxic you could smell
it when it was burning. Well, have candles all over.
I walked to and all I heard T shirt and
pass throwing it it. Man, I got a little something
I'm coming through. Man, Man, give us you gonna get
because he had all the food. Man gets what you
gonna get. Man, it's just all my guys to break
so back, bring back so many memories.

Speaker 2 (57:09):
Man.

Speaker 1 (57:10):
So, I didn't know you wrote that right after Free
I mean that that song was produced right after that.

Speaker 2 (57:16):
Absolutely. It was on the second album, and the second
album was called Welcome to Fantasy, Allen. It wasn't ever
released at the time. They just released it a couple
few years ago. Yeah, they had shelved it for a while.

Speaker 1 (57:29):
Wow.

Speaker 2 (57:30):
Yeah.

Speaker 1 (57:30):
So Adeita Howard, you're fifty two years old. You look amazing.
You started this skincare of routine that has benefited you
in such a great way to where you're gonna look
a day over thirty. You look amazing.

Speaker 2 (57:45):
Now receive it. Yes, I do.

Speaker 1 (57:47):
So. So you you have something that you created called
she EO, right, talk about that.

Speaker 2 (57:52):
So. She EO is an agency that is specifically dedicated
to established female talent in the entertainment industry because we
have a tendency, especially those of us that are seasoned
in the industry we've been in it for a while,
we have a tendency to be overlooked, and a lot
of us have difficulty pivoting and we may not necessarily

(58:14):
have the tools as well to be able to pivot
or to be able to manage our careers, et cetera
effectively and efficiently. So that's where she EO comes in.
We provide the tools to be successful in the entertainment industry.

Speaker 1 (58:28):
Wow, I love that that that that is critical for
those who are navigating not just life after the life during.
So no that that that is awesome. And also you're
celebrating thirty.

Speaker 2 (58:42):
Years thirty some changes in counting.

Speaker 1 (58:45):
Thirty years ago you made that song, man, and I
ain't gonna ask you how you feel, because you could
keep telling me it's a bloy.

Speaker 2 (58:52):
You know what. I'm grateful. I'm truly grateful that I've
had the longevity and to look at clothes. Bailey and
Tianna Taylor and Meghan the Stallion actually take that song
and utilize it in their music. But whether they know
me or not, they were they've you know, put a
piece of history in their music and they're keeping you know,

(59:13):
the song alive and reintroducing me to the world. Yes,
so I'm not going anywhere.

Speaker 1 (59:18):
Yeah, y'all, y'all need to get to know this amazing system. Adita,
how you've got to pay homage to history. Now. So
when you think about your journey as it's sum up
like and just one word, what comes.

Speaker 2 (59:33):
In your mind overcomer, overcomer, overcomer.

Speaker 1 (59:37):
Yeah. Yeah, as an overcomer, how do you.

Speaker 2 (59:42):
Feel blessed and marinated in divine favor?

Speaker 1 (59:46):
Still blessing?

Speaker 2 (59:47):
Yes, absolutely, because at the end of the day, if
I had not overcome, I don't know where I would be. Yeah,
it's being an overcomer shows me I'm stronger than I
ever thought I possibly could or would be. That I
have drive, dedication and determination to continue to move forward.

(01:00:13):
You know, in order to overcome, you have to just
you know, put certain doubts out of your head. And
even if you do have them, you just have to say,
you know what I can do it to have faith
in myself, to know that I'm able and capable of
making it, to have the capacity that word again, that
the capacity to keep moving forward in spite of.

Speaker 1 (01:00:33):
Listen, I love it.

Speaker 2 (01:00:34):
I think what I loved about this interview is the
grace that you.

Speaker 1 (01:00:37):
Have on your life. And because you're an overcomer and
you start off saying earlier that you didn't drink the
kool aid, you were able to maintain your certainty, dignity, foundation,
mental health and just like you the stableness of your mind.

Speaker 2 (01:00:56):
There are moments where I was not stable. There were
moments where there was you know, if I had moments
where if you ever heard overstaying, there's there moments was
like I had, you know, suicidal thoughts came to my
brain for just a brief moment. But then I was like,
you know, I'm not I'm not that brave. I don't
have that kind of courage to take my life. And

(01:01:18):
I have to grow through what I'm going through. You
know this it serves a purpose. Like you know, they
say your tests are your testimonies, and I know that
at the end of the day, I have, you know,
a testimony. I'm here for a reason, and I'm going
through what I'm going through for a reason. It's just like,
grow through it, get past. They don't call it growing
pains for nothing.

Speaker 1 (01:01:39):
You know, the can't grow without the brain of it.

Speaker 2 (01:01:42):
Unfortunately, Fortunately you know you have to and what I
recognize also is that it's a lot of what I
went through, a lot of what I'm going to go through,
because as long as I'm living, I'm going to be
going through something and I have to grow through it.
It's not just about me. It's about making sure that

(01:02:02):
I'm relatable, because someone is going to approach me at
some point in time in life and say X, Y
and Z, you know whatever it is that they may
be going through with the time, and they're going to
be led to me for a reason, and I'm going
to be able to comfort them because I'll be able
to relate against I overstand and I think you know,
every time we go through something in life, it's not

(01:02:25):
just for you. It's for those who's you know, who's passed.
You'll cross eventually and you'll have some effect on them
in some way shape from a fashion.

Speaker 1 (01:02:34):
Yeah, this has been beautiful. I again want to say
thank you to your team and to yourself for sitting down.
And what I loved about this is that we got
to hear from all different parts of you, childhood music,
who you are today, who you want to become, and
even when you are today. I think so many times

(01:02:56):
when we are sitting down with people I know. For me,
my goal and my objective is always to extract moments
where people can share part of the story that encourages
someone else. And what I love about your journey is
that you may have known me because of this, but
today you're reintroducing yourself as this woman who has overcome,

(01:03:19):
a woman who now says, I get it, I overstand
a woman who is now saying that my father's story
was his story, but I'm now rewriting my own story.
I think that's powerful because so many times people are
navigating through mental health challenges just through the challenges of life.

(01:03:41):
As I say, mental health is just life and motion. Absolutely,
that's what it is. It's life in motion because if
you alive mental health.

Speaker 2 (01:03:50):
Is you're going to be affected in somewhere shaping from
a fashions this life is happening in real.

Speaker 1 (01:03:54):
Time, and it's happening for you. Just say, life is
life and for everybody in some way, shape, fashion or full.

Speaker 2 (01:04:03):
Absolutely it's happening.

Speaker 1 (01:04:05):
But how you respond to it is always going to
be contingent upon the tools that you have. If you
don't have any tools, you will be reactionary. But if
you have tools you'll know how to respond. The last
question I always asks each es what is healing for you?
When you think about that word healing, what does that

(01:04:26):
mean to you?

Speaker 2 (01:04:29):
Peace? It means peace because I feel like when you're
not healed, when you're going through it, there's a disturbance.
You know, there's some upheaval, there's some chaos. And for me,
healing means peace, overcoming the drama, the trauma, you know,

(01:04:50):
and being able to sit in that space and of
gratitude and just saying, Okay, I'm good, I've survived this,
I've overcome this. I'm now not trying to I'm not
questioning a lot. I'm not disturbed. You know, my groove
isn't being disturbed by the shenanigans. I'm not putting extras

(01:05:13):
on it. I'm just I'm easy. I'm at peace.

Speaker 1 (01:05:18):
Listen, you heard it from Adda Howard. Healing is peace.
What does healing mean for you? And we all have
different meanings for healing based off where you are in
your life. I often say healing for me is touching
the things that you would rather put gloves on to
pick up or the touch, because sometimes healing means going

(01:05:40):
into the trevices and into the dark spaces and into
the corners, into the areas that we really don't want
to go into. But you can't get to peace until
you go through the chaos of healing. Because if I'm honest,
healing is an ugly business. It's not cute, it's not pretty.

(01:06:03):
It's not running through a bed of flowers. As we
see you on Instagram where people are reading the journals
and I'm healing and I'm drinking tea. That's not healing.
Healing is disrupted, and sometimes it can be destructive because
you've got to address the ugliness that you have covered
up and make up that you covered up in jewelry,

(01:06:25):
that you covered up in all of the other accessories
that aa Adida talked about in the beginning, how she
doesn't like accessory, but healing is saying, I'm not going
to put a band aid on it. What are you
going to do? Listen, This healing community is a community

(01:06:46):
of people. Even myself. Every conversation that I have with
the guests, it heals a part of me. And I
think what I've just experienced here is the freedom to be.
I think it's so difficult, difficult for us as we
are aging to find freedom to be because sometimes our
freedom is stuck in our childhood. The freedom is stuck

(01:07:10):
in the little boy, stuck in the little girl, and
the adult is fighting. But until you go back and
visit that little boy, little girl where those childhood wounds begin,
you're always wish for freedom rather than actually living in it. So,
Mster Dina Howard, I want to say thank you for
the opportunity to sit down with a legend, to sit

(01:07:32):
down with someone who changed our childhood because when her
song hit the air, everybody was grabbing their.

Speaker 2 (01:07:39):
Pearls like ooh, what is this?

Speaker 1 (01:07:44):
But also in that moment, I think the world was
shifting to allow women to express how they felt about
their sexuality and also given it a voice that they
too could talk about what they desire. So again, thank
you for joining the healing community. I just want to
say thank you for speaking to the women in the

(01:08:04):
part where you shared about business over babies. I really
know because I know so many women that are in
that space where they feel like, what do I choose
in this moment?

Speaker 2 (01:08:16):
Do you do first?

Speaker 1 (01:08:18):
I want you looking at the camera, tell it's important,
choose you first? Listen. I want to say, take care
of yourself, continue your healing journey whatever you may be,
because healing is not linear. It's not linear, but what

(01:08:38):
it can be. It can be liberated when you begin
to set free your mind from the traumas and the
restraints that has been attached to your negative experiences. And
as I say in closing each episode, healing is a
journey and wholeness is the destination. And until next time,

(01:09:00):
here well just here with Doctor J, a production of
the Black Effect Podcast Network. For more podcasts from iHeartRadio,
visit the iHeartRadio app, Apple Podcasts, or wherever you listen
to your favorite shows, and you can follow me at
King J. Barnett on Instagram and x and follow us
on YouTube. Just here, Doctor J.