Episode Transcript
Available transcripts are automatically generated. Complete accuracy is not guaranteed.
Speaker 1 (00:00):
Colorado's special session in the books, with about a dozen
bills now off to the governor for his signature. It's
an effort to address the nearly eight hundred million dollar
budget deficit.
Speaker 2 (00:08):
However, Republicans disappointed, saying that this special session was tailored
to what the governor and the Democratic majority wanted. Joining
us now on the KWA Common Spirit Health Hotline as
Cleeve Simpson, Senate Minority Leader and Republican state Senator for
District six. Senator Simpson, thank you so much for your
time this morning.
Speaker 3 (00:25):
Oh my pleasure, good morning. Happy to join you.
Speaker 2 (00:28):
So you said earlier that this special session was never
really about collaboration. The script was written before the gabble
even dropped.
Speaker 1 (00:35):
What do you mean by that, well, that.
Speaker 3 (00:38):
There was no engagement. So you would think, you know,
particularly on leadership role, there would have been an opportunity
to have some thoughtful conversation and some ideas about you know,
how do you how do you work in this space?
You know where the cards were dealt, you know, how
do you work work collaboratively? And they're disposed. Absolutely none
of that. Again, that's script was written minus the AI
(01:02):
bill and maybe one of the income tax credit bills.
Outside of that, the other ones were they were put
together and Republican bills and ideas were sent to State
Affairs Committee and diet In Committee right away. We were
done on the first day.
Speaker 1 (01:19):
So in your assessment, the session was at least he
seemed nonplussed about it. And when it comes to addressing
the big deficit, it looks like will you you say
the Democrats created it and now they're putting on the
back of taxpayers. Is that how this is going to
be paid? Do I see? As it taxes on businesses,
that's how they're going to try to fill.
Speaker 3 (01:36):
The hole, at least part of it. And I think again,
I spoke routinely at the well over the last five
days about missing an opportunity. You know, we could have
come together, sat down, rolled up our sleeves and got
to work about thinking about You know, there are over
seventy income tax credit programs that I support, many of those.
(01:57):
But why didn't we sit down and prioritize as those
and go, look, these are important and maybe some of
these we can put on a pause for a year.
And some of them have are fully refundable, which is
a whole nother calculation where you know, if you do
your taxes and you owe a you a thousand dollars
to the state for income tax, and you have a
(02:17):
fifteen hundred dollars credit, the state will actually send you
a five hundred dollars check back in the mail and
wipe out your tax obligation. Like why can't we review
those and go there should be something that says, hey,
in some circumstances, we probably can't afford to make this
a fully refundable tax credit. I just between that and
(02:38):
you know, the state has grown. We're pushing like two
hundred new programs and offices since twenty ten, and we
don't seem to be willing to sit down and prioritize.
Do we really want to fund the Office of Saving
People Money on Healthcare? Do there are Office of New Americans,
the Office of Sustainability. I could go on and on
(02:58):
and then last like, why don't we sit down and
engage instead of taxing businesses, let's think about how do
we incentivize some growth in business. How do we make
color out of more business friendly again and generate more
revenue that way and broaden the tax space out But
none of that happened, and no conversation in that space whatsoever,
(03:19):
which was again just frustrating that there are other avenues
here besides you know, taxing businesses and raising revenue that way.
There just should have been a lot more collaboration and
thoughtful approach.
Speaker 2 (03:34):
Senator Simpson, I know there's been a lot of accusations
when it comes to some of these bills that are
now before the governor, saying that they violate tabor they
should actually be voted on by the voters. Do you
feel the same way, and if so, which ones do
you think are direct violations that the voters should be
deciding on.
Speaker 3 (03:51):
Certainly, the qualified business income deduction just rises to the
top for me. I've tried to work with the sponsors
and the body to go, look this really it matches
really closely to a ballot initiative coming forward this this
November that we referred ballot measure MM. I just think
(04:11):
it it was about the same scale and magnitude and circumstances.
I go, why would we not send this one? You're
talking about fifty million dollars this year and one hundred
million dollars next year. Why the reluctance and hesitancy to
move forward with a ballot in issue, and this was
all a debate about what Colorado practices in the in
(04:32):
the tax world of rolling conformity, where currently, right now
Colorado does not allow that qualified business income deduction. But
because of House Resolution one, we immediately do July the fourth,
we said we will honor that because Colorado has chosen
to follow rolling conformity. They're pros and cons to that,
(04:53):
and we could have decided years ago to change that
if we want, where we just follow what the Fed's
tax paulic and it makes life simpler for Colorado's and
truly probably in the long run, less expensive and simplifying
Colorado tacks policy. So if you're going to change that,
you know, my Democratic colleagues were going, no, we're not
changing anything. We're just keeping it the same. But if
(05:14):
we if we're following rolling conformity July the fourth, that change.
So you're going back and changing tax policy. And I
firmly believe that should have been a referred measure to
the voters to decide whether they wanted to accept that
tax increase.
Speaker 1 (05:30):
Well, I also learned this week too that the Colorado
is only one of four states and I'm out of
my depth with this, So I'm probably oversimplifying, but our
tax rules kind of are at the behest to some
degree of what the Fed does. So when you pass
a big bill like HR won, the big beautiful bill
has those implications, it hurts us if we're only if
we're an outlier of only four states that do this.
(05:51):
Is that something we need to consider in saying we
shouldn't have some of our budget tied to what they
do at the FED level if they do an onerus
or big bill like this. And I also asked this too,
aren't we going to find out here in real time
if tax cuts really pay for themselves?
Speaker 3 (06:07):
Yes, to both of them. That's worthy of the conversation
and the debate. I think Colorado, I think the last
time I checked, we're the only state that's in a
special session trying to address the change in tax policy
and its implications. Here we use a federal taxable income
to base our taxes on. Other states use adjust to
(06:30):
gross income. Let's let's have that conversation and debate and
figure out the pros and cons Like this is, in
some instances you probably win and some iNTS you probably lose.
The last biggest federal piece of legislation, the Tax Cuts
and Jobs Act TCGA, when it went into effect, it
(06:51):
actually created three hundred and fifty million dollars more. I
can't say that that's the only thing that did that,
But the next year following that big tax policy Colorado,
Colorado's revenue from taxes went up three hundred and fifty
million dollars. And I don't know, like you, Marty, I'm
not well versed and deep into this conversation, but many
(07:11):
of the taxes, tax implications and how resolution one we're
an extension of that uh TCJA Act from twenty seventeen,
So like this is all trying to predict the future
a little bit too. And each of the economic forecast said, look,
this is where, this is where we think this is
gonna this is how this is going to unfold, But
we don't know how taxpayers are going to respond or
(07:34):
what their habits are going to be, or what they're
going to do. So lots of well, again, lots of
room for conversation if we're willing to have that. But
I'm finding more and more in my tenure. This was
my fifth session, my third in a row special session.
It seems like we're becoming you know, more and more
(07:56):
disconnected from each other in the conversation, and that's that's frustrating.
Speaker 2 (08:00):
Senate Minority Leader, it's Cleeve Simpson. Thank you so much
for your time this morning.
Speaker 3 (08:05):
Oh it was a pleasure. I wanted to say I've
listened to KOA for decades. I wanted to say as
a first time caller, but a long time you all
called me.
Speaker 1 (08:16):
So appreciate you.
Speaker 2 (08:19):
Thank you so much for to get you back on
in the future. And we've also reached out to Senate
Majority Leader Robert Rodriguez. We're waiting to hear back
Colorado's special session in the books, with about a dozen
bills now off to the governor for his signature. It's
an effort to address the nearly eight hundred million dollar
budget deficit.
Speaker 2 (00:08):
However, Republicans disappointed, saying that this special session was tailored
to what the governor and the Democratic majority wanted. Joining
us now on the KWA Common Spirit Health Hotline as
Cleeve Simpson, Senate Minority Leader and Republican state Senator for
District six. Senator Simpson, thank you so much for your
time this morning.
Speaker 3 (00:25):
Oh my pleasure, good morning. Happy to join you.
Speaker 2 (00:28):
So you said earlier that this special session was never
really about collaboration. The script was written before the gabble
even dropped.
Speaker 1 (00:35):
What do you mean by that, well, that.
Speaker 3 (00:38):
There was no engagement. So you would think, you know,
particularly on leadership role, there would have been an opportunity
to have some thoughtful conversation and some ideas about you know,
how do you how do you work in this space?
You know where the cards were dealt, you know, how
do you work work collaboratively? And they're disposed. Absolutely none
of that. Again, that's script was written minus the AI
(01:02):
bill and maybe one of the income tax credit bills.
Outside of that, the other ones were they were put
together and Republican bills and ideas were sent to State
Affairs Committee and diet In Committee right away. We were
done on the first day.
Speaker 1 (01:19):
So in your assessment, the session was at least he
seemed nonplussed about it. And when it comes to addressing
the big deficit, it looks like will you you say
the Democrats created it and now they're putting on the
back of taxpayers. Is that how this is going to
be paid? Do I see? As it taxes on businesses,
that's how they're going to try to fill.
Speaker 3 (01:36):
The hole, at least part of it. And I think again,
I spoke routinely at the well over the last five
days about missing an opportunity. You know, we could have
come together, sat down, rolled up our sleeves and got
to work about thinking about You know, there are over
seventy income tax credit programs that I support, many of those.
(01:57):
But why didn't we sit down and prioritize as those
and go, look, these are important and maybe some of
these we can put on a pause for a year.
And some of them have are fully refundable, which is
a whole nother calculation where you know, if you do
your taxes and you owe a you a thousand dollars
to the state for income tax, and you have a
(02:17):
fifteen hundred dollars credit, the state will actually send you
a five hundred dollars check back in the mail and
wipe out your tax obligation. Like why can't we review
those and go there should be something that says, hey,
in some circumstances, we probably can't afford to make this
a fully refundable tax credit. I just between that and
(02:38):
you know, the state has grown. We're pushing like two
hundred new programs and offices since twenty ten, and we
don't seem to be willing to sit down and prioritize.
Do we really want to fund the Office of Saving
People Money on Healthcare? Do there are Office of New Americans,
the Office of Sustainability. I could go on and on
(02:58):
and then last like, why don't we sit down and
engage instead of taxing businesses, let's think about how do
we incentivize some growth in business. How do we make
color out of more business friendly again and generate more
revenue that way and broaden the tax space out But
none of that happened, and no conversation in that space whatsoever,
(03:19):
which was again just frustrating that there are other avenues
here besides you know, taxing businesses and raising revenue that way.
There just should have been a lot more collaboration and
thoughtful approach.
Speaker 2 (03:34):
Senator Simpson, I know there's been a lot of accusations
when it comes to some of these bills that are
now before the governor, saying that they violate tabor they
should actually be voted on by the voters. Do you
feel the same way, and if so, which ones do
you think are direct violations that the voters should be
deciding on.
Speaker 3 (03:51):
Certainly, the qualified business income deduction just rises to the
top for me. I've tried to work with the sponsors
and the body to go, look this really it matches
really closely to a ballot initiative coming forward this this
November that we referred ballot measure MM. I just think
(04:11):
it it was about the same scale and magnitude and circumstances.
I go, why would we not send this one? You're
talking about fifty million dollars this year and one hundred
million dollars next year. Why the reluctance and hesitancy to
move forward with a ballot in issue, and this was
all a debate about what Colorado practices in the in
(04:32):
the tax world of rolling conformity, where currently, right now
Colorado does not allow that qualified business income deduction. But
because of House Resolution one, we immediately do July the fourth,
we said we will honor that because Colorado has chosen
to follow rolling conformity. They're pros and cons to that,
(04:53):
and we could have decided years ago to change that
if we want, where we just follow what the Fed's
tax paulic and it makes life simpler for Colorado's and
truly probably in the long run, less expensive and simplifying
Colorado tacks policy. So if you're going to change that,
you know, my Democratic colleagues were going, no, we're not
changing anything. We're just keeping it the same. But if
(05:14):
we if we're following rolling conformity July the fourth, that change.
So you're going back and changing tax policy. And I
firmly believe that should have been a referred measure to
the voters to decide whether they wanted to accept that
tax increase.
Speaker 1 (05:30):
Well, I also learned this week too that the Colorado
is only one of four states and I'm out of
my depth with this, So I'm probably oversimplifying, but our
tax rules kind of are at the behest to some
degree of what the Fed does. So when you pass
a big bill like HR won, the big beautiful bill
has those implications, it hurts us if we're only if
we're an outlier of only four states that do this.
(05:51):
Is that something we need to consider in saying we
shouldn't have some of our budget tied to what they
do at the FED level if they do an onerus
or big bill like this. And I also asked this too,
aren't we going to find out here in real time
if tax cuts really pay for themselves?
Speaker 3 (06:07):
Yes, to both of them. That's worthy of the conversation
and the debate. I think Colorado, I think the last
time I checked, we're the only state that's in a
special session trying to address the change in tax policy
and its implications. Here we use a federal taxable income
to base our taxes on. Other states use adjust to
(06:30):
gross income. Let's let's have that conversation and debate and
figure out the pros and cons Like this is, in
some instances you probably win and some iNTS you probably lose.
The last biggest federal piece of legislation, the Tax Cuts
and Jobs Act TCGA, when it went into effect, it
(06:51):
actually created three hundred and fifty million dollars more. I
can't say that that's the only thing that did that,
But the next year following that big tax policy Colorado,
Colorado's revenue from taxes went up three hundred and fifty
million dollars. And I don't know, like you, Marty, I'm
not well versed and deep into this conversation, but many
(07:11):
of the taxes, tax implications and how resolution one we're
an extension of that uh TCJA Act from twenty seventeen,
So like this is all trying to predict the future
a little bit too. And each of the economic forecast said, look,
this is where, this is where we think this is
gonna this is how this is going to unfold, But
we don't know how taxpayers are going to respond or
(07:34):
what their habits are going to be, or what they're
going to do. So lots of well, again, lots of
room for conversation if we're willing to have that. But
I'm finding more and more in my tenure. This was
my fifth session, my third in a row special session.
It seems like we're becoming you know, more and more
(07:56):
disconnected from each other in the conversation, and that's that's frustrating.
Speaker 2 (08:00):
Senate Minority Leader, it's Cleeve Simpson. Thank you so much
for your time this morning.
Speaker 3 (08:05):
Oh it was a pleasure. I wanted to say I've
listened to KOA for decades. I wanted to say as
a first time caller, but a long time you all
called me.
Speaker 1 (08:16):
So appreciate you.
Speaker 2 (08:19):
Thank you so much for to get you back on
in the future. And we've also reached out to Senate
Majority Leader Robert Rodriguez. We're waiting to hear back
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