Will Houston make a splash in the NBA’s 2025-26 trade season?

In this roundtable episode, Ben DuBose, Paulo Alves, and Dave Hardisty (Editor of ClutchFans) preview the NBA’s upcoming transaction window and its potential implications for the 16-6 Rockets.

December 15 is when players who signed contracts in the preceding offseason become trade eligible, so the period from Monday until the February 5 in-season deadline is among the most active on the 2025-26 calendar. 

Discussion topics include roster needs and potential trade targets across the board, including the likelihood of bigger-name deals (such as Giannis Antetokounmpo, Jrue Holiday, and James Harden) and smaller acquisitions along the lines of Keon Ellis, Chris Paul, and Ayo Dosunmu.

The show also explores Houston’s potential desirability on the buyout market and the team’s long-term timeline for title contention, and specifically why those factors might make this a relatively quiet trade window for the Rockets.

Episode Transcript

Speaker 1 (00:03):
Rockets fans, Welcome to the Rockets Launch Pod, an exclusive
podcast from the home of the Rockets, Sports Talk seven
ninety Red Nation. Get Ready, Ready, Get Ready. The Rockets
Launch Pod starts now.

Speaker 2 (00:24):
Welcome aboard, Welcome to the podcast. Consider this your Rockets

(00:52):
Trade season special because Monday is December fifteenth, so that's
the date in which players who signed off season contra
tracks can be moved, well most of them, there are
a few exceptions, but it really opens up trade possibilities
around the NBA because until now about thirty five to
forty percent of the league has been untradeable. Well, now

(01:13):
every team can make close to their best offer, and
so it's not just deals involving the players that are
trade eligible, but it's the fact that now teams potentially
trading a big name can compare the offers because everybody
is now able to move close to all of their players.
So Monday's a big day around the NBA, and really
for two months leading up to the trade deadline in

(01:33):
early February. So to talk about what the Rockets will
do or won't do, I'm joined by two of my
really good friends. Dave Hardesty, editor of Clutch Fans, Palo Alves,
who you know from the Rockets Launch Pod is basically
a co branded podcast Clutch Fans youtubes that many of
you are accustomed to and also the Rockets Launch pods
that I host with Polo. We're sort of joining forces
today and we'll simulcast this on both the Clutch Fans

(01:56):
YouTube and the Rockets Launch Pod RSS fees. So let's
talk about what the Rockets are going to do or
not do in the two months leading up to the
trade deadline. I don't have the date, that's usually around
the sixth or seventh of February, that first week. Dave,
what are you thinking? Because we've heard big rumors connected
to the Rockets in the off season. There were reports

(02:18):
they could go after Giannis, and there's been some whispers
in recent weeks, louder whispers if you listen to Shaan's
that he might get moved. John Morant out of Memphis
is another big name that could get moved, but that
seems unlikely for the Rockets. According to reports, there's some
more moderate veterans that could go after Drew Holliday, James Harden.
Those have been floated in recent months, ever since the

(02:40):
Rockets lost Fred Finfleet. There's obviously some smaller guys, and
so we'll sort of weep through the various tiers on
today's show, But just generally speaking, Dave, Rockets, they're in
a good spot a quarter of the way into the season,
but they're certainly not the twenty four to one juggernaut
Oklahoma City Thunder. What are you thinking as far as
what they should do and what Retell sto Owen's mindset

(03:00):
should be heading into this trade season.

Speaker 3 (03:03):
You know, this is it's a good problem to have,
but it's to me it's also kind of tough. This
is the first trade deadline in a while where I
just don't feel like the Rockets need to do anything
or you know, it's tough to find something that necessarily
improves them. They have a lot of what they need now.
I know to the national audience they need a point guard.
I feel like the Rockets are content watching the men

(03:25):
and redeveloped there. But guess why I say itself this overall?
You know, I fall back on Daryl Morty's comment about
opportunity not being a lengthy visitor. They have a really
good team now. Kevin Durrant is thirty seven years old.
You have this young core, five really good players, and
so you've got a future. But at the same time,

(03:47):
do you have an opportunity here as you mentioned Ben
Okay season Juggernaut, do you similar to the Daryl Morey
era that we want to beat Okay see and we
want to do it now. That's the big question for me.
So it's big game hunting, is anything at all or
just sampat And I think just let the rotation and

(04:07):
the depths play out.

Speaker 2 (04:10):
And I should have introduced myself off the top. Of course.
I'm Ben to Vos. I write for Clutch Fans and
Rockets Fire and one of the stories that I've covered
in recent weeks is that the Rockets, according to multiple reports,
are unlikely to go after John Morant, and I think
that's just a classic case of the juice not being
worth the squeeze. They have a very good situation as is,
and so to dip into their war chest for someone

(04:32):
that would be an incremental upgrade, but not necessarily a
big jump relative to the eight confirmed names that are
going to be in this playoff rotation. Assuming health, You've
got eight guys that they really like right now that
are going to absorb the majority of the minutes. You've
got the four confirmed starters kd Alprinch and gou A
Men Thompson, Jabari Smith Junior. And then you've got Tarry Eastan,
Dorian Finney Smith even though he hasn't played yet, Steven

(04:55):
Adams and Reed Shepherd. And then that ninth spot, which
in the playoffs typically is only about twelve minutes or so.
I think Joshua Kogie and Aaron Hall they are very
good candidates. So in order for a move to be worthwhile,
it needs to clearly, clearly upgrade one of those players
to where you feel significantly materially better about your playoff odds.
And so I don't think John Moran, at least not

(05:18):
the version we've seen to this point. Maybe that changes
if he's in a better situation. I don't know if
the Rocket necessarily want to bet on that, especially because
they feel a lot better about their point guards to
Men and Reed than I think, at least nationally the
perception would be. So I tend to think it's it's
go big or go home, at least in terms of
major moves. Maybe there's something small around the edges you

(05:39):
can do, you know, swapping out a minimum contract. They
are hard capped at the first aprin, but you can
move out at a minimum deal or two. You can
move out Clint Cappella, who's at like seven million. But
in terms of larger deals, I don't think Job would
do it. I think Jonnis would move the needle, but
he's thirty one years old. He'll be thirty two next year,
and so that's why I have a tough time seeing it.

(06:01):
And Pawlo we've discussed this a little bit on the
Rockets launch spot, and so I'll bring you in on this.
Dave's point on opportunity not being a lengthy visitor is valid.
At the same time, you have to give to get,
and if Milwaukee's trading Giannis when he's still a top
three player in the world, I think a deal would
have to start with all for in Chan, Gooon or
a Men Thompson. If it's going to happen this year,
I think it would have to be all for Inch

(06:23):
and Goon because of the salaries, and Men's not on
his next contract yet, and I don't see any way
you could play all three of Yannis, Shangoon and a
Men with you know, the spots on the floor they
need the ball, there would be a point of diminishing returns.
So I think for a deal to make sense this year,
it would have to involve Shangoon for financial reasons, for
asset reasons. And I think, you know, we talked about

(06:44):
this the other night. It's riskier than people would think,
right because even if j' honest is a better player now,
Shoooon gives you a long runway of ten to twelve
years potentially being a really good team, whereas with Giannis,
I mean, he's thirty two next year, he's he's an
upgrade now. But but it's riskier than people might think,
or at least what the perception would be. I think
that's the conclusion that we came to. Hower. Do you
want to elaborate a little bit more about why that.

Speaker 4 (07:06):
Is, Yes, definitely. I think it's because of all the
things that you said, but also because, even from me a
win now perspective, I think most people would agree that
Yani is the better player right now. But I think
it's close enough that at a certain point is making
super max money and open Shinghun's making, you know, the
bargain of a contract that I think we already he
is on at thirty three thirty five million dollars versus

(07:27):
fifty three fifty five million dollars a year, and at
that point you're not really trading just shan Gun free. Honess.
You also got to take into consideration that you're giving
up the availability to have a piece worth a round
twenty million dollars a year. By then you're going to
have that, which with the honest however longes is, you
want to extend them out. This human was at in collapses,
but with Shangun you're guaranteed to have that discounted deal

(07:50):
for for five more years, like we're in year one
of that. I think that considering Shanghun has broken out
to be you know we why run out star, probably
makes him one of the best assets. So I don't
think the asset discrepancy is that big, and then that
we'd mean to what my second point is is all
it's also about understanding what is the price that's actually

(08:12):
going to take to get yachts. Because what we've heard
around the league, and he wants to go to the
Knicks or he wants whatever different teams he wants to
go to, there's not necessarily a lot of teams that
are in a position to want to trade for him,
that have the assets equivalent towards Schengo would be as
an access. So how much more do you really need
to act on top of Shingun to make your trade

(08:35):
package competitive. I know in these things a lot of
the time, it's not really about your trade package, is
about whether the star wants to go. And I know
we're assuming that Janis would be okay coming to Houston,
but I don't think it's a foregone conclusion that it
costs shng Gun's Phoenix Shengun and Phoenix picks and whatever
else some people may be throwing out there. And I
know you made the argument that from all of the

(08:58):
four fit perspective, it might not fit the best to
have a man Sing and Katie and Yannis, but it's
worth throwing out there at the very least as a
possibility considering the trade packages that we've been seeing, Like
the Knicks have a bunch of pick swaps, they don't
have any for drunk Picks to give up. I guess
you could give up Jen Andobi, although I'll give an
arity if that's a positive compact, rightner or not? With

(09:20):
its current massive extension, and how much the Bugs would
want the guy that's already you know, into his prime
when they're clearly going into a rebuild. There is mathematically
a possibility of trading for Yannis using a combination of
an out a lot Fred van Vliet, Steven Adams starring
Phinney Smith and Tarret. Soioredically that could be one of

(09:42):
This is obviously with that decat you have to add
the Phoenix.

Speaker 2 (09:45):
Picks on top.

Speaker 4 (09:47):
But this to say that if we're giving a thing
on my current stance and you've seen it, is that
Shingham's contract is just too much of an asset when
building a team that has to have depth in today's NABA,
when trading for a guy like Kenna, as good as
he may be, also a guy that is you know,
not quite like Lebron.

Speaker 2 (10:05):
Right.

Speaker 4 (10:05):
Lebron relied on his physicality, but he also had touch
in this game, you know, he developed into a guy
that he was able to shoot six threees a game
and making him an early percentage someone who could create
out of the midwage, some one who had great footwork.
Jannis has great footwork, but still he had he is
someone who relies on his athleticism a bunch and how

(10:25):
you know, we've seen guys like Katie who isn't really
reliant on enough criticism, guys like Lebron, like guys like
Steph played, you know, be superstars well into their late thirties.
I'm not sure that's the case with vian Is, considering
the knee injuries that he's had and what is play
stylets So, you know, and I know I kind of
made arguments for both sides here, but at the at
the end, what I'm sitting at is I think there

(10:47):
while being there being arguments for both sides, I think
it's not worth the risk to give up on this
film go right now, which I do think it still
has a bunch of upside.

Speaker 2 (10:56):
And Dave, we've talked about this, you and I offline,
and you know, one of the things we've tried to
suss out is what's changed between now and early May
when if you recall, and we've talked about this coming
off of the Game seven loss to the Warriors, it
was actually reported that of the potentially available stars in
the off season, that Yannis was the one that intrigued

(11:16):
the Rockets the most, even more than Kevin durant in
sort of the post mortem article that came out from
Kelly Eco and Sam Amy of The Athletic, and then
six weeks later then Depth trading for KD, and we've
heard the rationale since the window opens sooner to legitimate
contention with KD, but it doesn't shut any faster, which
I think that would be the fear of a Shingooon

(11:38):
Yanis deal, is that it actually could potentially shut your
window sooner based on the asset cost and Yannis's advanced
age relative to Shingoon. Nonetheless, I think it's clear that
the Rockets at least were considering it a few months ago,
and now reading the Tea leaves it seems less of
an option now, and I think there's a couple of

(11:58):
things that have changed. I just want to get your
thoughts on, Dave, because I know you're at least open
minded to having the conversations and Throfelstone's credit like they'll
at least they'll at least explore it, Like they've been
insistent that no one is completely off limits. They don't
really believe in the concept of someone being untradeable because
you're not doing your due diligence if you don't at
least listen to what's out there. It's their job to

(12:19):
build the best team possible. But as far as what's
changed since the end of Game seven and the acquisition
of Kevin Durant and all of that, I think there's
a couple of things. I think, first off, Alprah and
Shooon start to this season, he looks a lot closer
to All NBA than All Star. I don't know if
he's all the way there, but he's definitely a better
player than last year. The true shooting is back above

(12:41):
fifty eight now, the assist have gone up, and so
if he's an All NBA player and not just an
All Star, like if he's legitimately top fifteen ish in
the league and there's no injury history, and that's a
guy who does every year give you a pretty high
floor assuming he's on the roster, and at twenty three
he may not be done improving. I think he's got
a little bit better between year four and year five.

(13:02):
So I think the Rockets might feel a little bit
better about Shoinggoon the way he started this season and
what that means for essentially the next decade or so.
In a way that coming off of last year when
he put like what fifty four and a half percent
true shooting I think was the figure he put up,
I think they might feel a little bit better about
Shagoon after the start to the year. The other thing
is the timing the mega trays that have happened at

(13:25):
the deadline in this generation of the NBA. So Luca
to the Lakers last year, Katie to the Suns in
twenty three, and Hardened to the Sixers in twenty two.
You know what all three of those teams have in common.
None of them advanced beyond the second round. I think
it's really hard when you bring in a player of
that caliber, like you reshape your team on the fly

(13:48):
to where you bring in a new alpha, a new
best player on your team. Well, I guess with the
Sixers it's sort of like co because Embiid was still
in close to MVP form at the time. But certainly
Katie with the Suns and Luca with the Lakers, you're
bringing in a new best player. It's tough to make
that work on the fly, to make the chemistry right
to optimize your roster around him, and so typically it
takes until the off seasons, you can get the right

(14:09):
role players, then the coach can implement his new scheme
in training camp. And so in many cases, when you
make a trade of that significance, it takes until the
following year to really reap the reward. And so I
think that could especially be the case this year with
the thunder twenty four to one and looking incredible. So
if you change your team like that leading up to
the trade deadline and the thunder are historically good, Dave,

(14:32):
I don't want to be a pessimist, but I don't
see how this year is not realistic given those headwinds.
And so if you do that, if you look at
it that way, then all of a sudden, you know,
Giannis is thirty two next year, and how much longer
is his prime realistically going to be? And so that's
that's why I sort of keep coming back to. It
just feels different now than it did in May. I

(14:53):
think maybe with KD there's a little bit less of
the senseub urgency because the floor has been raised now.
To your point, you can make the other argument as well.
Because you have KD, maybe you know you're a little
more laboration and you should wait the short term more heavily.
There's two ways to look at that, but I don't know.
I just keep coming back to the difficulty in winning
this season, even if you get Yannis, if you make

(15:14):
a trade of that significance and the leap we've seen
from Shangoon. I'm not saying there's no argument Giannis is
a top three player, but it's harder to convince me
relative to a few months ago. Where are you at
when you sort of balance tech as how you felt
in May versus how you feel now in December.

Speaker 3 (15:31):
There's lots of digest there. I think the Rockets from
there got Russell Westbrook, who another player who relied heavily
on athleticism. I think was around the same time. I
believe he was thirty. I can't remember. I'm going off
the memory close to that. So yeah, there's definitely some
risks there with Yannis, and you know, I think you
guys made some valid points that definitely. You know, one
of the big questions for me is what else would

(15:53):
be there on top of Shnggoon. It's not just that
you would just easily off of that. And I think
this really will come down to Yannis. First of all,
you know, sort of making his decision. The Rockets can
say with with bravado, you know that they're not interested
in their young cores, attackt and all that stuff. But
if Jannis comes knocking and says, hey, I want to
play here, I just don't know if they're gonna say

(16:14):
outright no. That's the only thing I really question, because
right now we can say all that we want the
Spurs as well. I mean, you're seeing all kinds of
eleaked reports. We're not going to trade any of these
young players. Castles untouchable, Harper's untouchable, and maybe they really are.
But if Janna says I want the Spurs, I think
you might see something structurally change there. And I just

(16:36):
think that, you know, giving to the Rockets history, you know, Ben,
and I mean you probably know this is well, Paolo,
that how disappointed they were that Luca was traded and
they had no crack at it. They had no chance
to even discuss that trade. And of course everybody in
the league felt the same way Jannis, even though he
did he just turned thirty one this month. I mean,
he is a top three to four player in the league.

(16:59):
I just have a hard time thinking they're going to
just outright say no, we're moving forward. It's a really
tough you know, needle to thread here is basically as
trying to thread this needle. Excuse me, like in figuring
out how, you know, are the Rockets win now there
clearly are. They have a bunch of young players. But
then if you just size up their young players and
look at it compared to San Antonio and OKAC, are

(17:20):
they you know, leaps and bounds ahead of those teams?
You know, certainly as far as best player where you
got Wemby out there in San Antonio and the Courchet
and okay, see and all that. It's tough, right, We're
hoping for Shang Gun. We're hoping on a mend that
they can continue to grow. But Ben, I think you
made really strong points because they were very aged and
Giannis at the end of the year, and that they
probably would have done some moves there if that had

(17:43):
been a possibility. And Shangun had a great offseason, got
in great condition, worked on his three point shot that
showed in the first game, certainly, and it's been better
this year. It's just a really tough thing for me
because Giannis is a former defensive player, of the year
legit too way Force plays with an amazing amount of thrust.
There is some overlap between him and the men that

(18:04):
I don't love, but you know, for me, I would
be very interested if he becomes available. I think the
ideal situation for the Rockets is that he holds on
and he's available in the summer, and that they can
at least look at it, because let's see what this
team does together in a playoff series where you've got Shangun,
You've got excuse me, Katie, and you got you know,
a man Jabbari, all these guys working together. You know,

(18:26):
that last playoff series might have been the catalyst for
you know, trading Jalen and possibly having traded Shangun if
it was a Yanis deal. In the summer, we might
see something like that if the Rockets were to disappoint
or something. But right now, it definitely throws a curveball
that this yannest thing's happening mid season.

Speaker 4 (18:48):
Yeah, and just to play a little bit of Devil's appocate,
I think that there's other arguments as well, At least
me personally. I think when Manyama is a league, knt
rip right, and we will never be sure how available
he's going to be his career. There's people who say
she'll be available for full seasons, but perhaps when it
comes to how long his career will be, maybe that
will be a little bit shorter. Who knows. But if

(19:10):
he is that level of a lad change and I
think he will eventually be in go to the Bates
as long as he stays healthy. There's a there's an
argument to be made that you might want to strike
before that concord, before the sports are fully built around
the around the top one Pikewine Mayama, for example. Now,
I guess that gets a little bit counter when it
seems like you have an all time great team in
the West at the same time. But I think that's

(19:32):
the factor that you that you have to take into
account as well. And I think Dave mentioned something that
I hadn't thought about that that I really agree with.
One thing is you having to reach out and go
and see, hey, do you want to You know, it
seems not really interested that you want to. You go
out and you try to get Yannis right. The other
thing is, okay, Yannis says he wants to compare, and
at that point you're not really seeking out Janischell, you're

(19:54):
telling you're saying no to the acts, and that's a
little bit of a different to me, that's a little
bit of a different fight. That's a little bit of
a different level of responsibility. Oh, you're one of the
guys that refused to trade free Anas and the cons
And let's say he goes to the Spurts, for example,
they have the Aspets and now you have what four
years maybe of Wemby and Yannis and they'll likely still

(20:15):
have one of their young guards. But I don't think
they have to give both of those up. It's tough
if he's in. That's another thing that plays into into
the equation. Is he being traded to the west or
is he staying east? If he stays east week the
Knicks and probably it's probably a lot easier of a no.
And it is if he's going to Okay see or
two or to the Spurts who both have the ascids.

Speaker 2 (20:33):
To make that, Yeah, I think Dave hit the nail
on the head that the ideal scenario for the Rockets
is that this stalls until the summer, and perhaps with
Yannis suffering the calf strain, that makes it more likely
because I I think that's going to make teams all
across the league. There have been so many CAF to
Achilles issues in recent months that I think teams are
going to be wary to give up what Milwaukee wants

(20:55):
until they see him back on the court. And Milwaukee
is going to be reluctant to put him back court
given the injury risk, because my god, that the nightmare
scenario for Milwaukee would be if he didn't blows out
in the Achilles, and not only do their Bucks not
have honest the player, but they also don't have be
honest the trade asset, and then they're really in an
awful spot. So I think teams will want to see
Yiannis back on the court at full strength before giving

(21:17):
up what the Bucks will want, and the Bucks will
want to be cautious before letting him on the court
to avoid any disaster scenarios. So this could, you know,
stall out for a little bit for that reason. And
so because of that, we're already inside of two months
until the doubline, So it's possible that it just gets
too tight and that everyone sort of says hey, this season,

(21:37):
I mentioned the Luca harden kd parallels that everyone just
sort of comes to an agreement and says, hey, you're
probably not going to win a championship this year anyway,
with under really good, you need a sample size to
prove your healthy. Let's just table this until the offseason,
and then at that point the Rockets would get a
lot more data in terms of how the status quo
looks in the playoffs. I think they can stress test

(21:59):
the boy, because I think everybody when the Rockets were
considering this last summer, the way it was phrased to
me by people inside the building at Toota Center, you
can drop in KD to the existing formula, how well
we've talked about it, put KD in that Jalen Green role,
but largely keep the rest of the team the formula
as is, and to this point it's largely working. Now.
Can't win you a championship, we'll see, But in terms

(22:22):
of making you a better team from last year, yeah,
that's absolutely happening. Giannis, on the other hand, would be
changing the formula altogether. And so I think if you're
going to change the formula, you'd rather do it in
the off season when you can sort of remake the
roster as you need and Secondly, if changing the formula
also potentially shortens your runway, then you'd rather do that

(22:43):
after you feel like you've given the current formula at
least a chance. And if this waits until the twenty
twenty six offseason, then I could see the Rockets saying, Okay,
we at least saw how this team performed in the playoffs,
and if they underwhelm, then yeah, maybe the scenarios where
it makes sense. But right now, I just I tend
to think it's too risk. I don't think the juice
is worth the tweeze, even for Giannis. And so my

(23:04):
bet this is not source. This is just my bet,
but it sort of sounds like what Tim McMahon and
others at ESPN are saying as well, is that it
doesn't happen for the Rockets if a deal is consummated
by the trade deadline at Milwaukee Ships, Joan is somewhere.
I don't think it's Houston. So let's move on to
names that are more attainable. I mentioned off the top.
If we're going from you know, the A tier to

(23:26):
the B tier, I would put names like Drew Holliday
James Harden in the B tier. Still very good players,
but not to the tier of Yiannis and not to
the tier that I'd throw John Morant. He's not the
same as Giannis, but I would put him in that
a tier because he would cost you a lot of
assets if Memphis was going to move him. With guys

(23:46):
like Drew Holliday James Harden, there's, you know, certainly some
high upside with those players, but this very short term upside,
And because they're in their mid thirties on big contracts,
those teams probably can't command nearly as much in terms
of young players in draft equity. So I'll put them
in the the B tier, and I think whether the
Rockets go after them, a lot of it just comes
down to how do they feel about Amen Thompson and

(24:08):
Reed Shepherd at point guard? Do they think Fred ben
Fleet's going to be able to come back from his
ACL tear by the playoffs? It comes down to the
age old question of do they have a point guard
that Rockets fans have been debating for almost three months now,
really ever since Fred beIN Fleet went out with the injury.
So Dave, I'll start with you on this one. What
are your thoughts going down a tier going after a

(24:31):
veteran guard of at least a name stature, but one
that isn't of the a list here, that's going to
cost you a ton of assets. They might cost you
a lot of salaries, because obviously the Rockets above the
cap have got to send out about as much as
they take in. But what do you think about going
after someone in the true holiday James hardent Ty's here,
you know.

Speaker 3 (24:50):
I bet James is licking his chops, especially being here tonight. Yeah,
or excuse me, annoying in this game here Thursday against
the Clipper or the Clippers Rockets. It's bet he's looking
at the Rockets and thinking, man, I wish I was
here now, Kevin Durantz here, e May's got this team bawling,
you know, the young players, the defensive wings, guys who
can shoot threes. I bet he would love to be here,

(25:12):
and it wouldn't shock me if that becomes an option.
I don't know if the Rockets are necessarily looking there.
Obviously they already passed on James one time when they
met with Fred Instead. I personally think Jeru is the
problem with Drew is the contract. Hands down, it's very,
very difficult to get that, and it's not super friendly.
But I think Jeru would be ideal. I mean, he's

(25:33):
been really good for Portland, but Portland is starting to
slip a little. Let's see how they do could make
him a trade candidate. I think Jeru would be awesome here.
I think he'd be a great fit. He's already got
the experience with both Boston and Milwaukee and doing exactly
what the Rockets need him to do. I think there
would be a lot of teams interested in Drew. Minnesota
would be one, of course, like I said, the contract,

(25:55):
how do you fit that? But that, to me is
more interesting than Harden. Harden's fun. It's nostalgic. Harden changes
your team significantly. You know you're going to see less shit.
He is the system now, Yeah, he is the system exactly.
It would be fun and I would love it, and
it would be certainly a hot ticket to see James
Harden come back here. But I think Jeru is somebody

(26:16):
who would make more sense. It's just very, very tough
to see on paper. With the finances.

Speaker 2 (26:21):
I think it's a little easier than people think. I
certainly wouldn't consider it likely, but Polo, you and I
were talking about this the other night on Rockets Launch Pot.
I think the Rockets have more maneuverability with their salaries
than people around the league give them credit for. I
think the Fredman Fleet contract, the no trade clause is
not a non factor. But I also don't think it's

(26:44):
nearly as big of a deal as a lot of
people on social media make it out to be.

Speaker 3 (26:48):
I think you think you would play ball a sortain
intereugh you think he would.

Speaker 2 (26:51):
I think he'd be open to it. If he knows
by the deadline that he's not going to play this year,
then I don't know why it would matter to him
who he's getting paychecks from when he's sitting on the bench,
Like the Rockets will know by the deadline if there's
a realistic possibility of him coming back, and if there is,
I bet they just stay the course because, Dave, you

(27:11):
know it, the Rockets love Fred They love the idea
not just this season, but years into the future of
having him around this team. His mile can be scaled
up or scaled down depending on the surrounding pieces, and
so if there's a realistic case that he can come
back and play this season as unlikely as it would
seem with an ACL tear in September, then I would
bet anything they just keep him and roll the dice

(27:32):
because they love Fred in the scenario where they know
it's pretty much off the table. I mean, I don't
see why Fred would care who's paying him this year
because he's not playing anyway. He's sitting on the bench,
and then he's got a player option. If he doesn't
like it, he can become a free agent this summer
before the team acquiring him even has him for a
single game that he's able to play for. He can

(27:53):
leverage buyout the way we saw John Waldo with the
Rockets a couple of years ago.

Speaker 4 (27:56):
Hell, he might.

Speaker 2 (27:57):
Prefer to play for a bad team for a little
bit before leveraging the buyout because he could then get
more minutes and more shot attempts to sort of re
establish its value. We've seen that template with guards in
their thirties entering their second decade in the league, and
so there's a lot of different ways this could go.
But because Fred is on a very short term contract
and it's one that has considerable optionality, I don't know

(28:18):
that it's a given that he will be Houston or boss,
especially if the Rockets are going to Fred and saying
we want to trade you for all to talk about, Oh,
the vibes are great for Felstone and Fred Benfleet are
in lockstep Emi Udoka as well well. In this hypothetical,
the Rockets are going to Fred and saying we want
to trade you. So if they want to trade him,
they clearly don't see a long term role. So combine

(28:38):
that with the contract being so short term, the ability
to hit free agency leverage a buyout, I don't think
it is implausible that Fred been Fleet would approve a trade. Now.
I don't know that the trade is likely. However, the
reason I don't think Fred Benfleet gets moved is that
it would require the other team to value Fred. Like
when I keep coming back to Dave, the Rockets could

(28:59):
have traded for Kevin Duran at last year's deadline, and
if they did, they almost certainly would have gotten past
the Warriors in Round one. They didn't because the Rockets
they are a very value based for an office and
they weren't going to do the kd trade on the
terms that Phoenix wanted at last year's deadline. It took
until the off season for it for the price to
come down to a more manageable amount, and even if

(29:20):
it cost them around in the playoffs, the Rockets were
okay waiting. And the reason I bring that up in
the context of Fred is that the Rockets believe that
Fred next year and beyond is going to be a
big part of this team's formula. They are not going
to use Fred as neutral to negative salary filler just
for this season. Even with Kevin Durant, I don't think

(29:42):
they viewed this season that heavily. So it would require
the other team valuing Fred to some extent. And the
good news if they do value Fred, then the situation
maber's all of itself, because that'd probably be a situation
that Fred feels pretty comfortable going to. They'd probably engage
in dialogue with Fred to make sure they're on the
same page. So bottom line for if a Fred deal
actually gets close to materializing, my bet is that it's

(30:04):
a team that behind the scenes, Fred and his people
already feel pretty comfortable with that see a long term
fit with and then in that situation, it's really on
a big ask at all, particularly with the contract that
Fred is on. So I think a Fred deal as possible,
but very unlikely because I don't think the Rockets are
going to use him as just salary filler, and how
many teams are really willing to value him at a

(30:27):
positive level coming off the ACL I think, you know,
it's a fun theoretical exercise. I don't know how realistic
it is. So Fred potentially could be moved, but then
beyond that, look, you've got other salaries. Tarry Easten until
he signs his next contract, I don't think he's unmovable.
Dorian Anthony Swift has not played and he only has
two years guaranteed. That's a very short term deal. Clint Capella,

(30:47):
He's been okay, but certainly not someone I think they
anticipate playing a lot in the playoffs. His primary value
is a third string center, is sopping up minutes during
the regular season. Well by the trade deadline, two thirds
of the season's already gone, so a lot of that
value will already been realized. So you know, Tari, Dfs, Papella,
Fred in the right situation, certainly the minimum guys I

(31:07):
don't think they're that you know, sold on Tate, Jeff Green,
even Aaron Holliday. Guys that are not locks to play
in the playoffs, So those don't move the needle a
lot in terms of salaries, but it's not nothing either.
The point is that the Rockets have a lot of
salaries that they could theoretically move to make a deal work.
Not saying they will. I don't personally expect them to,

(31:27):
but it's also not nothing. So POWLO, how do you
sort of, I guess, balance all of those competing interests
the fact that you know, yeah, the Rockets have some
pieces they could move, but how many of them should
they move if we're talking about someone in the true
holiday James Harden type tire. Yeah.

Speaker 4 (31:49):
Regarding the Fresendleek being traded or not, I think there's
arguments for both sides. Again, I think one of the
arguments that you kind of glossed over is well, this
team is probably second best team in the league. There's
a chance at a free ring, which I don't think
that whoever the Rockets are trading him too would give
him a chance at the playoffs or at anything one time.

(32:10):
I don't know how much that would be valuable since
he's already a champion and he has one as you know,
real real he was a big part of it. Although
on the other end, right, there could be a situation
where friend's between twenty five million next year in twenty
five this year, where they are traded and there's a
winkling two with rockets where they say, hey, we'll give
you the MLI next year, and you come back and
we and we we run at it, we make a

(32:32):
run at it again. Obviously that will take a further
bake it. You know, it's unlikely, but something that could happen.
We never know how the market will value Fred coming
of an ecl at his age, as another size guard,
as a guy who was already not that athletic and
that already struggled at the room. How he will you know,
come back at what it will come back as. But

(32:52):
then regarding moves in general, I think I think the
most likely try candidate Degnis as much as I will
as i'm as I love him. He's probably been quint
for what you said, most of its value for this
season is distinguished when once you're going to the playoffs,
there's barely ever play a third screen center in the playoffs,
even if you play the bole big a lot. But
what I what I keep coming back to and we

(33:13):
can go into some of their names. But what I
keep coming back to is this team's already really good.
They are already second in night trading. They already have
an historically good night rating, I think fifth best all time.
There's not really much you can change to make this
team better without making substantial changes, and which is why
we talk about the anasty Right then that's you know,

(33:34):
both of the blasings and occurs but Sims, that's the case.
The only moves that to me could make some sense
are moves that are not really going to shake up
the rotation too much right now, because the team's already
really good and the team's already happy. Giving the minutes
that you blackly target at point are two guys that
have upsided that will be better with those minutes as
the season goes along and in the future. The only
types of moves that I could see them making are

(33:56):
more insurance type moves in the sense that, hey, we
can move Capella because he's insurance for Adams and fortune Gun,
but maybe we'ld rather have insurance elsewhere. If read or
a men God forbid get hurt, well, then it's really
really gets really really rough, right And you're not going
to get us the whole replacement in the buyot market,
so and moves more than that to me doesn't really

(34:17):
make sense. As well as even if you were going
to go for insurance, right, how much how much is
insurance really going to do for you when you're facing
what's looking to be an all time and great team. Right,
If you're not your best your best rotation already you
were already you know, at not very good odds fully
on full strength. If you're not at full strength, how
much better do those odds really get? And then just

(34:39):
to close out. I think Withdrew it's tough because you're
gonna have to I think you're gonna have to give
up real assets, even though the contract is what it is,
just because I don't think Porton's going to give up.
At least try and make the play they have, you know,
a breakthrough. Then you have the hab season. You know,
they would likely want to give those guys some some
play eff experience. They are in the same position we
were our first season.

Speaker 2 (34:59):
One.

Speaker 4 (35:00):
All he wanted was to get into the player. I
think Portland might be at that stage as well. Regarding
James right, it is a very romantic possibility, right, But
it would change the way you play a lot. It
would take away those reps from a man and read
how much better does it really make you on defense?
And how much better can you really be on offense?
Is you're already second in the league, So I don't

(35:22):
think no longer or second league can offense at this moment.
But we're still very very good to me. The only way,
and this is a far fetch way that James Harburn
union may happen, is if the Clippers keep being the
second worst team in the West, which they currently are,
and he asks out or he doesn't ask out, and
he wants a buy he has one year left on

(35:42):
his contract, and he has a team option, he has
a clear option for next season. Can you leverage that
into a buyout, get back some salary to the Clippers,
you know, make they queer their books for next season
as well. And if a buyout thus happened, then in
that circumstance, I could see him signing for Houston. And
you know, that way, Houston's actually giving up much other
than the playing time to come on the department. And

(36:04):
then at that point I think it might be worth
We're risking whatever chemist and whatever plays out the team
already at that point, maybe is it likely? No, But
as far as trading for him, you know, literally you
have to give up Dorian Phinis Smith, Fred van Vliet
and Twin Cappella, or if you don't want to give
those up, you would have to give up Steven Adams.
But he's way to be a part of this team

(36:25):
for even to consider that. So yeah, regarding all those possibilities,
that's basically what I said. I don't I don't think
that's much out there that could really changed the outlook
of his team and what could We talked about it
righter at the beginning of the show.

Speaker 2 (36:39):
So yeah, and I think go ahead, David.

Speaker 3 (36:42):
Yeah, No, I was just gonna say to that. Obviously
you bring it hard and if in that scenario, which
is an interesting when Apollo outlined, is you know, Ree's
not gonna play and we're not gonna play much certainly
in that scenario, and maybe that's something you just live with,
but it's hard to see it for me to see
them doing that. That's one thing. The other thing I
I'm just throwing this out there. You brought up Tari

(37:02):
and I hadn't really. I mean, I've been thinking in
the past and didn't think to mention it. Here is
you know, we don't know the variable that they do
of how what was the gap between what he wants
and what they offered, And here we have this injury
situation again. I know they love Tari. I don't see
them trading Tari, but you do have to wonder. You know,
Eli in the basement of the Tota Center on his

(37:24):
hocket calculator coming up with this stuff about you know,
do we have to trade him now for a fifteen
to twenty million dollars player, which is where we think
we can get great value for somebody who's you know,
who's trying to get twenty five or something like that
in Tari. Again I'm speculating here, but that's something that
you know, maybe they look at too, especially because he's

(37:44):
now dealing with another injury and that's been part of
a knock on his value.

Speaker 2 (37:48):
The bottom line here when you look at next season,
and you should know that Rafelstone and Eli white as
they are very focused on not just this year but
the years ahead. We talked about that as a factor
in the KD talks and why they wanted the window
to open sooner, but not close any faster. And so
when they make a trade of any significance, they're going
to be looking at not just this season, but next

(38:09):
season as well, and years beyond that. And so you
have eight rotation players for the playoffs this year that
I mentioned, but next year you basically have nine. You
add thread to that. You're already pretty deep as is.
So it's got to be quality over quantity, Like it's
got to be clearly better than one of those nine,

(38:33):
And ideally, if you're doing it this season, one of
the eight or otherwise, the juice isn't going to be
worth the squeeze. I know I keep saying that analogy,
but I do because I think that's the way the
Rockets have to look at this. And so I agree
with the framing that if somehow there's a buyout possibility
and it's an add on, then great, and you can
sort it out through merit and who's hot in a

(38:53):
given game in terms of how the minutes go. But
if you're having to give up real assets but you
would go up to the trade deadline, I just don't
know if it's going to make sense because I think
some of the more doomsday scenarios in terms of, oh,
the Rockets just need a point guard because they can't
bring the ball up to court and they're turning over
like crazy. That's not happening. We have twenty games, twenty
plus games of data in which, like I'm in and

(39:14):
Reid at least look competent. We can disagree over exactly
how well they've played and exactly what the fit is
long term. I would actually argue that going forward, if anything,
they should improve because they're both very young, and as
you get closer to the playoffs, you're going to run
more through Kevin Durant and all Prints Shooing because they're
your best players anyway. So if anything, I think the
point guard needs so to speak, goes down a little bit,

(39:36):
not up as they progress their way through the season.
So what it all comes down to is the eight players,
maybe nine when you consider future years in Fred van
Fleet is the player you are bringing in clearly better
than one of those eight or nine to the point
where it's worth it, especially if the other team, like
Kywoll said, the Blazers would probably want assets for holiday

(39:56):
given what they gave up to bring him in. And
I just do know that it's all going to line up,
like you can't rule it out, But I just think
barring a major injury on the Rocket side, or maybe
God forbid DFS or Tari doesn't make it back to
the extent Rocket spans hope, then maybe something changes on
Houston's end. But right now, assuming the players stay healthy

(40:19):
and return the way everyone expects them to, that will
be another point, you know, I think the Rockets are
trying to buy time, Like right now, it's entirely possible
that a lot of their so called problems resolve through
a men and Reeds still getting better and then Tari
Easton and jury and Finny Smith coming back in the
next few weeks. If we get to the end of
January the beginning of February and that hasn't happened, then

(40:39):
maybe there's a different conversation to be at at that point.
But knowing what we know now, yeah, it's fun to
talk about and financially I think it's doable, but in
terms of whether it works out, I'm skeptical. And then
if we go to sort of the bottom tier, and

(41:02):
I guess you could throw buyouts into the mix as well,
because Whenever you look at names, you know lower in
the chain, you can say, well, are they that much
better than a guy you could just get after the
trade deadline that gets fought out? And that's a fair consideration.
I know a lot of people look at you know,
in recent weeks, it's been Chris Paul ever since it
was announced that he and the Clippers are parting ways.
The sense I get is the Rockets won't be interested

(41:23):
in Chris Paul for reasons you can probably suss out yourself.
The Rockets already have two backup point guards that they
like in Reed Shepherd and Aaron Holliday. I don't think
a forty year old Chris Paul is better than either
of those two players overall. In some very specific areas,
he might be, But if he's not going to play
every game, is it going to be worth the potential
locker room issues, the things we've heard about in LA

(41:45):
Is it worth it for a guy who's not playing?
In many ways, it's like an exaggerated version of what
we had in the late twenty tens. When you know,
why did James and Chris get along so well the
first year they were together? Because Chris was playing at
a really high level and all the baggage was worth it.
Second year was when Chris wasn't the same player, and
I think, you know, his style became a lot more
grading when it's the same as the year before. But

(42:08):
he's nowhere near as good as a player. Well now,
he's forty years old and hasn't been good at all
this year. Even if there's a few very specific niche
situations he might can help. I don't think that for
a guy who would be your fourth string point guard
that it would be worth trading. I know, as of Monday,
you could theoretically trade like Jay Shaun Tate or Jeff Green,

(42:29):
someone like that for Chris Paul. I don't think that's
going to make sense for the Rockets. And I actually
think if we're looking at smaller moves, let's say ten
or lower in the depth chart for the playoffs, because
I mentioned, you know, they have a clear top eight
or nine, hopefully nine. Maybe Fred's able to make it
back my hot take. I know people are going to
speculate about them in point guards. I could see them

(42:49):
going for another shooter or a three and D type
guy like I've looked. He's a little on the fall side.
I've looked at Kean Ellis and Sacramento. A guy who's
about forty percent of his career from three and is
a pretty good defender isn't playing there much for whatever reason.
Someone like that, I think this season what it seems
like to me, whenever injuries pile up, regardless of position,
it feels like the next guys in ema Udoka's circle

(43:11):
of trust are already point guards, Like ema Udoka is
going to play the best player, and to this point
that's been Aaron Holliday is the first, and then JD.
Davison is the second in terms of guys outside of
the inaugural rotation that he may trust when these injuries
pole up. And so I don't know if it makes
sense to bring in another guy that's a point guard

(43:31):
only of the same you know, body type player archetype.
I've actually at times this year missed Cam Whitmore. Not
saying that they should have kept Cam because I don't
think Cam would have been happy in a very uh,
part time role, but I do think there's been games
this year where it's like, hey, it'd be really great
to have, you know, an explosive six foot six six
foot seven, six foot eight athlete that can that can

(43:53):
fill it up when you need and the Rockets just
don't have one of those guys. They have a lot
of point guards. You go down the depth chart, they
like your on holiday like Jady Davison. They have Quinn
Capella as the third string center. I think you could
do better than Jay Shon Ted or at least a
different type of player at the wing spots. I think
that's I think that deficiency has been even more exaggerated
without Tory Eason, without Doriy and Benny Smith. But for me,

(44:14):
if they're doing something smaller, I think a more three
and D type that provides a little more positional versatility
can fill it up. To me, that makes a little
bit more sense than a point guard when you already
have Aaron Holliday and j D Davison, who Ema Udoka
likes behind your top two of the men Thompson and
Ree Shepherd. So that's sort of how I'm looking at
they do smaller deals. Dave, I'll start with you. Does

(44:36):
that logic make sense to you?

Speaker 3 (44:38):
Oh, it totally does. It's a valuable archetype. I mean,
just even looking at the Clippers here Thursday night, you know,
missing Norm Powell and how much that has you know,
been a problem for them. It makes total sense. I
just it's such a hard thing to figure out this
Rocket team. I think you know, you guys have touched
on all the reasons. Is they already have a hard
enough time if everybody's healthy. I feel like as far

(44:59):
as small moves, you're probably looking at insurance. Otherwise you're
looking at upgrades. So you've got to be moving out
somebody and upgrading them in some way. Because you do
have Tari, you have DFS coming back, a Kogi, somebody
that he may trust significantly to defend, and it's going
to be hard to see him if DFS is playing
like we expect him to play when he comes back
and Tari is healthy, it's hard to see Okogie playing.

(45:22):
So very simply, there's not much room at the end
for just adding players other than guys who could come
in like an Aaron Holliday and you know, be in
the stay ready group and play in a pinch if
you do have some injuries, which every team does eventually have.
So it makes total sense what you're saying. I think
it's the need technically of the team to add a
player like that, But it's just hard to imagine the time,

(45:44):
the rotation time for anybody at this point. Really.

Speaker 2 (45:48):
Yeah, and Paolo, you're better than I am at throwing
out specific possibilities. And we were talking about this offline
before we started. Who are you thinking of, if anybody
in terms of lower tier acquisition that might make sense,
someone that you could acquire using let's save limited funds.
Someone in the tate Jeff Green tier or I guess
Clin Kapala who's at seven million, but let's say someone

(46:09):
ten million dollars or less that could potentially be useful
to this team. Do you have any names that you've
thought of.

Speaker 4 (46:15):
Yeah, it's harder and harder every year to get guys
in that minimum sour Like back when James Harder must see,
for example, a lot of teams signed, you know, veterans
at that minimum contracts, it doesn't really happen anymore. It's
really hard to find quality minimum guys now. They're like,
guys don't really line up to sign minimum contracts for
the contenders right now, especially because the contenders right now

(46:38):
are also either the same contenders as they were aware
of the season. Nobody has really fallen off and at
the same time, well, there's really no no use of
signing a minimum contract for the okay see Thunder for example,
who are really younger, or the Spurts who are the
were the top four seat right now, you don't really
gain any anything signing for those guys. There's no you know,

(46:58):
first year lebron ad like type five where they have
a bunch of like Markis Morris and Dwight Howard and
I think he at that moment, who are making me
a little bit more than that? But a lot of
those guys I think Caruso at at times roup making
basically no money. That doesn't really you don't have these
veteran heavy teams that you know entice those veteran players

(47:19):
to sign, and so you're almost always looking at guys
there are at that five million type seven million type tiers,
which means moving gin Cappella. If you want some names,
I think I think Kean Ellis is a good one.
I think I doesn't move from the Bulls is a
good one. He's an inexpiring deal. Do the Bulls want

(47:39):
to pay him and Derek White at the same time,
Do they want to commit to being mediocre forever. I
guess if you're looking for a I guess a non
ball guard defender, we totally have, although Aaron Holliday does
do a job in that regard. I if you could
try to call the Pelicans about Alpha, though, for example,

(48:01):
you know someone who's making four point five million a year.
At this point, everything seems like a stretch for all
the reasons that you guys already laid out. Right, you're
not gonna get a guy. You're not gonna get a
guy good enough to surpass any of the already got.
And if you're going for insurance, well, if it's a
good enough they're not really going to kind of want
to come into a team and be, you know, the

(48:22):
food stringer and not play, versus being on their current
team where they do play and wait for someone to
get hurt. Right, you don't really have that luxury unless
it's a really vitrum guy who's willing.

Speaker 2 (48:31):
To do it for a championship.

Speaker 4 (48:33):
So there's really not much to be done in that
range that those couple of themes that I mentioned. But
then as we talked about, it's just really hard to
make work guys on that rains a lot of the
times are on rookie deals and guys that you typically
cost more as to obtain, and you're not going to
give up a first shoun pick for any guy that's
not a bona fide probession player for now and for

(48:54):
the future. So yeah, there's not really much. I think
I truly boom or bus like if something happens, I
think it's a really high profile move because that's what
would be worth changing for. But considering what's available right now,
I wouldn't let for pay for it.

Speaker 3 (49:09):
I agree it fully with that because I feel like
it's either really high profile move or significant upgrade in
type of trade or stand pat like the Rockets really have.
I mean, kudos to rafel Stone. He's built a really
really good team, good young team, deep, very deep per
in fact we've talked about before. I think it pretty
much can you know, survive any one single injury to

(49:30):
any one player, like they just they have a lot
of ways to fill gaps, not for very long, but
I'm just saying, you know that they could do that,
and you know, I think it's got to be a
significant upgrade to either compete with an Okay, see, I'm
not saying they have to do that right now. But
otherwise I think it's kind of wait for scraps in
a buyout type situation. I really that's kind of how

(49:50):
I view.

Speaker 4 (49:51):
It, as boring as it might sound, Their deadline up
grades might be call tar eas and in our infinish math,
just what it is.

Speaker 3 (49:59):
I'p actually speak right there for sure.

Speaker 2 (50:01):
Yeah, especially because the buyout possibility that you just mentioned, Dave,
I would call it the buyout test. Is the player
that you're bringing in clearly better than who you would
expect to be able to get on the buyout market.
And if the answer is no, then why wouldn't you wait?
Because I think this year's Rockets team is going to

(50:21):
be near the top of the line for buyout guys,
like once you get past I think it's about the
middle of January, but they will be off able to
offer a standard minimum contract and make it fit within
the first apron. I think with Kevin Durant and a
team that should be second or third in the West,
probably second or third best record in the NBA, they'll
be desirable. KD and Shangoon sell them selves in terms

(50:44):
of star power, Like I think the Rockets will be
pretty well positioned in terms of desirability assets, they'll largely
have the same money because most of these guys get
the minimum because many of them are double dipping. You
can get a decent guy in the buyout market this
year if you're the Rockets, and so, yeah, we can
talk about, you know, smaller moves that they could make,
But then the bottom line, does it make sense to

(51:06):
give up any value when you can just add that
to the team as you have it right now? And
so I tend to think they will wait unless something
happens to change the calculus, Like if one of those
injured guys doesn't come back, if God forbid, there's another
injury that looks like it, you know, could jeopardize their
availability for the playoffs, then yeah, the formula might change.
But as I see it, if I had to bet,

(51:29):
I think staying pad is most likely because the way
I'll bring this full circle and then I'll let each
of you offer some closing thoughts as well. With the Rockets,
it's not just about this season, it's also about future seasons,
and so for them it's about it's about waiting probabilities.
And so I think a lot of people around the
league will say, well, these splashier trades if you bring

(51:50):
in well, let's say you go from Dorian Finney Smith
to True Holiday this season, like you trade DFS and
Fred as the salary and you bring in and Drew Holliday. Okay,
that might make your title odds a little bit better
this year, but next year I would say it's neutral
at best, because if you stay the course, you'll have

(52:10):
DFS and Fred coming back. And so the Rockets are
gonna wait, not just this season, but what's gonna happen
in the future. And you know, in many ways, it's
the same thing we were talking about with Giannis, Like
Giannis would give you a better championship path this season
relative to keeping Shingoon. Oh, I don't think the odds
this year would be quite as much as people think.
But then if Shingoon gives you a higher floor for

(52:32):
ten twelve years, especially once you get out, you know,
to Giannis's age thirty five and beyond, the Rockets are
going to consider that. Like they are very forward thinking,
it's not ever going to be just about one year.
And so a lot of these even smaller trays that
you think about, they sound good on paper, but is
the whatever minimal bump you would get this year from
going from say DFS and a non playing thread, whatever odds,

(52:55):
that gives you maybe what ten percent to twelve percent
something like that worth Probably I hit next year because
I think you'd rather have both of those players as
something they're fully healthy a year from now, and so
that's the kind of conversations you have to have. It's
not just this year, it's future yours as well. That
makes me skeptical, to be honest, Shangoon, at least based

(53:15):
on what we've seen. It might change if they underwhelm
in the playoffs and then any other trades and involve
Fred Denfleet's contract. It's possible, but I just don't know
if the value is going to be there to the Rockets,
because I don't know if the other team is going
to value for it. So that's why they have options.
And if guys don't come back, if guys get hurt,
if someone's play falls off a cliff like, there's definitely
things the Rockets can pivot to. But as of mid December,

(53:38):
I'm I'm pretty skeptical that anything major happens, and so
my my expectations are low and I would expect them
to be more aggressive on the buyout market. That's sort
of my closing thoughts. Polo, I'll let you wind down,
and then Dave, I'll give you the last word.

Speaker 4 (53:52):
Yeah, I think we're largely in agreement. I don't think
there's as much I can I can. That's what we've
already said. It's to sum it up. It's pretty bloom
or bus. I don't think small molds really makes them.
I think they already they already hit on the types
of ass that they would be trying to acquire. Guys
like Aaron Holiday, who's still you know, a competent defender
and a really good suitor. And Josh Okogi, who at
this point was still even though he's cooled down from Bria,

(54:14):
has still been you know, the type of guy that
we would be looking for if we didn't have So
I don't think around the Marshall touchment Speeder.

Speaker 3 (54:22):
To me, it's this is a really tough thing. It's
it's literally like a scale where you're balancing two different things.
How important is this year? How good are you this year?

Speaker 2 (54:31):
You know?

Speaker 3 (54:32):
And it's kind of like when they made the KT trade,
at least what they said when they made the KTI
trade is we don't have to do anything, But this
made sense for us. Brackets don't have to do anything.
They have a really bright future. They got Shan Gun
and a man and Bari Tari Reid when you know,
as he's starting to develop. That itself is good. But
a lot of your team also is successful because you've

(54:52):
got a Kevin Durant who's thirty seven years old. So
it's really tough to balance this. And I do look
back to a time, you know, where the Rockets had
this great team to beat Golden State, should have beat
Golden State. They're hamstring away, let's say, and then started
to decline a little bit and gave up right when
Golden State just crumbled because of all the injuries. Thenk

(55:14):
of course they bounce back, but they did have to
change their team quite a bit. Sometimes even though you're
below okay See and you can weigh Houston score versus
San Antonio's corps, you just got to keep shipping away,
hope for good health, hope for good luck, and maybe
you know, something does shift or change with okay See
or the Rockets itself just shifts and they improve. But

(55:34):
it's a tough balance and whether you think you have
enough or you can make that type of move that
really catapults you right now. With Emai Udoka, who is
a win now coach, I mean, yes, he develops these players,
but I think this guy wants to win right now.
So it's not easy. And I don't think the Rockets
have to do anything. They don't have to be aggressive,
but it it just for me comes down to if
Giannis comes to Houston and says I want to be here,

(55:57):
I think the Rockets will try to make something happen.
That's just my personal theory.

Speaker 2 (56:01):
I think they'll at least listen. They wouldn't be doing
their due diligence if they don't. I'm skeptical that he
would do that because I think it's a little bit
of a two way street in terms of, you know,
the team Giannis is likely to say he wants to
go to is probably going to be the one that's
more aggressive behind the scenes and convincing him of that.
I doubt that's going to be the Rockets. But you're
right in that hypothetical. If he makes a call to

(56:23):
KD and those two are on the same page, and
you have two of the best players in NBA history.
Let's be blunt. Who are saying they want to play together.
You can't say it's impossible, And in some ways it
might be the most likely move of all, because when
you look at some of these smaller moves, it's just
tough to see the justification assuming health when you feel
as good about their playoff rotation as they do right now,
assuming everyone's available as they expect them to be. So

(56:46):
I'll offer that caveat one more time. It's possible if
some of these guys don't make it back, or if
there's new injuries, we can revisit these takes in a
few weeks. But assuming everyone is available as the Rockets
expect by the playoffs, I think they like their current formula.
They would have to be blown away for a deal
to really make sense. I doubt it happens, but if
it does, maybe it is go big or go home.
You can't write it off with this iteration of the

(57:07):
Rockets for sure. Anyway, We'll wrap it here and if
you want more content, me and Poweller on the Rockets
launch spad. We talked trades the other night. We will
in future episodes as well. Me and Dave are doing
the Clutch Fans YouTube channel postgame shows. Roster moves come
up on that, so if you want to hear from
me and Dave, I'm sure that will come up a
little bit the next few months. We just wanted to
do this one sort of trade season preview show to

(57:29):
get some initial thoughts out there, and then we'll follow
up on the more niche scenarios as the games and
weeks progress. All right, with that, I think we're done. Guys.
Thanks for the time as always, thanks for listening, and
please come back soon for more