August 21, 2025 • 5 mins
In this riveting episode of The Ben and Skin Show, Ben Rogers, Jeff “Skin” Wade, Kevin “KT” Turner, and Krystina Ray dive headfirst into one of the most legendary—and misunderstood—moments in NFL history: the Herschel Walker trade. Sparked by a moment in Episode 3 of Netflix’s America’s Team: The Gambler and His Cowboys, the crew unpacks the real story behind the trade that built a dynasty and left the Vikings holding the bag.Skin goes full football detective, questioning the narrative presented in the docuseries and digging into the actual mechanics of the trade. Did Jimmy Johnson really bait the Vikings into giving up a treasure trove of picks? Was Isaac Holt just a throw-in, or a key contributor? And how did the Cowboys end up with all those first- and second-round picks?
Mark as Played
Transcript
Episode Transcript
Available transcripts are automatically generated. Complete accuracy is not guaranteed.
Speaker 1 (00:00):
All right, So Iheartradios thank a teacher powered by donors
(00:03):
chooses going on all August. You can go nominate your
favorite teacher now at iHeartRadio dot com Forward slash Teachers,
and the winner is gonna win five thousand dollars to
deck out their classroom. Today we are honoring Marie Ward
of Alvis c Story Elementary School and Alan how about
that my oldhood there. Uh yeah, so Marie, this this
(00:25):
person says she was kind to me and all my classmates.
She got nominated. You can nominate your favorite teacher right
now at iHeartRadio dot com Forward slash Teachers.
Speaker 2 (00:35):
All right.
Speaker 1 (00:36):
Coming up at the bottom of the hour, we have
the July news bloopers. I'm excited about that. But right
now it's time for this O track, another edition of
things Skin is Tracking. Okay, yesterday we were talking about
the episode two of The Gambler and his Cowboys, the
(00:58):
docuseriies on Netflix and the five o'clock Hour. We're gonna
get into episode three, but I want to talk about
something that happened in episode three that led me back
to earlier in the day. We were talking about the
herschel Walker trade and how we remembered the Herschel Walker trade,
and in episode two, they were saying, here's what the
Cowboys did. They tricked the Minnesota Vikings, and there is
(01:22):
a clause in there that if they cut all the players,
they were gonna get picks for all the players. And
so I'm sitting there thinking about that, trying to remember
it because in my mind they traded and got players
and picks. But that was thirty something years ago, right,
So we're watching this and I'm sitting there going, man,
but I remember Isaac Holt because he blocked punts. I
(01:44):
remember he was the guy that stood out. I remember
him blocking two punts for the Cowboys.
Speaker 2 (01:49):
I thought he stayed two more than a year. I okay,
I'm having an impact.
Speaker 1 (01:52):
So you're right, Ben. In in episode three, the first
the first drive for the forty nine ers, Jerry Rice
catches a touchdown down the middle of the field and
he's being chased by I Colt and I'm watching that
going so I Colt was still on the team, So
my brain starts going crazy. I'm like, all right, and
I get it. They got to cut some corners to
(02:13):
present stories the way they want to present it. But
I actually spent the time today and looked up what
actually happened on the herschel Walker trade, because now I'm confused.
We're thinking they traded for these players, they cut them
all and got all these picks. So if you go
to Wikipedia, here is what the Cowboys got in the
herschel Walker trade. By the way, they also pulled into
(02:35):
San Diego Chargers, and that's where the Minnesota Viking running
back Darren Nelson went, because he was a good NFL
running back, but he didn't play for the Cowboys. He
went to the Chargers. Listen to who the Cowboys got.
Linebacker Jesse Solomon, he got time. I remember him playing
linebacker David Howard. I don't remember cornerback Isaac Colt, who
(02:56):
started probably ended up starting like thirty games games for
the Cowboys. When I went and looked defensive end Alex Stewart,
Minnesota's first round pick in nineteen ninety, Minnesota's second round
pick in nineteen ninety, Minnesota's sixth round pick in nineteen ninety,
Minnesota's first round pick in nineteen ninety one, Minnesota's second
round pick in ninety one, Minnesota's first round pick in
(03:19):
ninety two, conditional on cutting Ike Holt, Minnesota's second round
pick in ninety two Minnesota's third round pick in ninety two.
So what happened was here's and I'm reading this right
out of Wikipedia, so it says despite the criticism, Johnson
openly bragged about the trade, describing it as the great
train robbery. He waved Stewart in November of nineteen eighty nine,
(03:44):
then told his coaches not to start Solomon, Howard or Holt,
signaling to the rest of the league his intention to
claim the draft picks. Vikings general manager Mike Lynn eventually
made another deal, letting the Cowboys keep the three play
and all the conditional picks in exchange for two draft
picks from the Cowboys. So they ended up getting back
(04:08):
from the Cowboys the Cowboys' third round pick in nineteen
ninety and their tenth round pick in nineteen ninety and
their third round pick in ninety one.
Speaker 2 (04:19):
Wow.
Speaker 1 (04:19):
So that's actually obviously you can see why they don't
have time in a TV special to explain all that.
But I was so confused because, like Ben, I was
sitting there going, dude, I Colt was good for us,
Like he started a lot and made big plays but
that's how it all went down. They made this monster
trade and then Jimmy started baiting the Vikings by going, yeah,
(04:43):
we're not even gonna play these guys, We're gonna cut them.
Speaker 2 (04:45):
What do you want to do?
Speaker 1 (04:46):
Circled back, gave them some third round picks and ended
up getting all those first and second round picks.
Speaker 2 (04:52):
God, just hearing that, all the riches involved in that,
all the picks, it's nuts, right, Like first second, first second,
all those high picks.
Speaker 1 (05:01):
And you know what else. So remember just watching episode
two as they start jumping around a couple of years
later herschel Walker's the Philadelphia Eagles.
Speaker 2 (05:11):
Yeah, I was wondering that too. They give up everything
for him and then he was on the Eagles.
Speaker 1 (05:14):
King Vikings went six and ten. Yeah, so those ended
up being really good picks for the Cowboys, and that
is how they built their team.
Speaker 2 (05:25):
Well, we'll do a deep dive in episode three coming
up today at five o'clock America's team, the Gambler and
his Cowboys. This has been so much fun. We'll get
back into it at five. We might even talk a
little bit about it in Around the Sports at four
point fifteen. But coming up next the audio bubble bath,
the July TV news bloopers are here, and we've got him.
That's coming up next
All right, So Iheartradios thank a teacher powered by donors
(00:03):
chooses going on all August. You can go nominate your
favorite teacher now at iHeartRadio dot com Forward slash Teachers,
and the winner is gonna win five thousand dollars to
deck out their classroom. Today we are honoring Marie Ward
of Alvis c Story Elementary School and Alan how about
that my oldhood there. Uh yeah, so Marie, this this
(00:25):
person says she was kind to me and all my classmates.
She got nominated. You can nominate your favorite teacher right
now at iHeartRadio dot com Forward slash Teachers.
Speaker 2 (00:35):
All right.
Speaker 1 (00:36):
Coming up at the bottom of the hour, we have
the July news bloopers. I'm excited about that. But right
now it's time for this O track, another edition of
things Skin is Tracking. Okay, yesterday we were talking about
the episode two of The Gambler and his Cowboys, the
(00:58):
docuseriies on Netflix and the five o'clock Hour. We're gonna
get into episode three, but I want to talk about
something that happened in episode three that led me back
to earlier in the day. We were talking about the
herschel Walker trade and how we remembered the Herschel Walker trade,
and in episode two, they were saying, here's what the
Cowboys did. They tricked the Minnesota Vikings, and there is
(01:22):
a clause in there that if they cut all the players,
they were gonna get picks for all the players. And
so I'm sitting there thinking about that, trying to remember
it because in my mind they traded and got players
and picks. But that was thirty something years ago, right,
So we're watching this and I'm sitting there going, man,
but I remember Isaac Holt because he blocked punts. I
(01:44):
remember he was the guy that stood out. I remember
him blocking two punts for the Cowboys.
Speaker 2 (01:49):
I thought he stayed two more than a year. I okay,
I'm having an impact.
Speaker 1 (01:52):
So you're right, Ben. In in episode three, the first
the first drive for the forty nine ers, Jerry Rice
catches a touchdown down the middle of the field and
he's being chased by I Colt and I'm watching that
going so I Colt was still on the team, So
my brain starts going crazy. I'm like, all right, and
I get it. They got to cut some corners to
(02:13):
present stories the way they want to present it. But
I actually spent the time today and looked up what
actually happened on the herschel Walker trade, because now I'm confused.
We're thinking they traded for these players, they cut them
all and got all these picks. So if you go
to Wikipedia, here is what the Cowboys got in the
herschel Walker trade. By the way, they also pulled into
(02:35):
San Diego Chargers, and that's where the Minnesota Viking running
back Darren Nelson went, because he was a good NFL
running back, but he didn't play for the Cowboys. He
went to the Chargers. Listen to who the Cowboys got.
Linebacker Jesse Solomon, he got time. I remember him playing
linebacker David Howard. I don't remember cornerback Isaac Colt, who
(02:56):
started probably ended up starting like thirty games games for
the Cowboys. When I went and looked defensive end Alex Stewart,
Minnesota's first round pick in nineteen ninety, Minnesota's second round
pick in nineteen ninety, Minnesota's sixth round pick in nineteen ninety,
Minnesota's first round pick in nineteen ninety one, Minnesota's second
round pick in ninety one, Minnesota's first round pick in
(03:19):
ninety two, conditional on cutting Ike Holt, Minnesota's second round
pick in ninety two Minnesota's third round pick in ninety two.
So what happened was here's and I'm reading this right
out of Wikipedia, so it says despite the criticism, Johnson
openly bragged about the trade, describing it as the great
train robbery. He waved Stewart in November of nineteen eighty nine,
(03:44):
then told his coaches not to start Solomon, Howard or Holt,
signaling to the rest of the league his intention to
claim the draft picks. Vikings general manager Mike Lynn eventually
made another deal, letting the Cowboys keep the three play
and all the conditional picks in exchange for two draft
picks from the Cowboys. So they ended up getting back
(04:08):
from the Cowboys the Cowboys' third round pick in nineteen
ninety and their tenth round pick in nineteen ninety and
their third round pick in ninety one.
Speaker 2 (04:19):
Wow.
Speaker 1 (04:19):
So that's actually obviously you can see why they don't
have time in a TV special to explain all that.
But I was so confused because, like Ben, I was
sitting there going, dude, I Colt was good for us,
Like he started a lot and made big plays but
that's how it all went down. They made this monster
trade and then Jimmy started baiting the Vikings by going, yeah,
(04:43):
we're not even gonna play these guys, We're gonna cut them.
Speaker 2 (04:45):
What do you want to do?
Speaker 1 (04:46):
Circled back, gave them some third round picks and ended
up getting all those first and second round picks.
Speaker 2 (04:52):
God, just hearing that, all the riches involved in that,
all the picks, it's nuts, right, Like first second, first second,
all those high picks.
Speaker 1 (05:01):
And you know what else. So remember just watching episode
two as they start jumping around a couple of years
later herschel Walker's the Philadelphia Eagles.
Speaker 2 (05:11):
Yeah, I was wondering that too. They give up everything
for him and then he was on the Eagles.
Speaker 1 (05:14):
King Vikings went six and ten. Yeah, so those ended
up being really good picks for the Cowboys, and that
is how they built their team.
Speaker 2 (05:25):
Well, we'll do a deep dive in episode three coming
up today at five o'clock America's team, the Gambler and
his Cowboys. This has been so much fun. We'll get
back into it at five. We might even talk a
little bit about it in Around the Sports at four
point fifteen. But coming up next the audio bubble bath,
the July TV news bloopers are here, and we've got him.
That's coming up next
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