Episode Transcript
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Speaker 1 (00:00):
When you need wisdom and advice.
Speaker 2 (00:03):
Seek out a guru.
Speaker 1 (00:04):
When you need wisdom and advice about remodeling and design.
Lock on and listen right now to Nick the construction Guru.
Here is award winning remodeling expert Nick Kerzner.
Speaker 3 (00:22):
You was talk eleven thirty DIBs and good morning Wisconsin,
Nick the construction grew Here. I have a good friend
returning guest. We've been how long have we known each other, Scott?
Longer than I know. But it's been good. Yeah, it's
been fun. I have Scott Klein from J and B
Construction with me today. We were on a couple of
weeks ago and we were talking about, you know, a
(00:44):
roof is a roof?
Speaker 2 (00:45):
Is a roof?
Speaker 3 (00:45):
Not really, because there's a lot of underlying things other
than the physical physical roof that you have to think about.
And you know, on the way here today we were
talking on the phone, and you know, Scott, you were
bringing up some pretty good points about warranties and stuff
like that. We're going to get into that in just
a couple of minutes. But for the few people that
don't know who you are, tell us a little bit
about your company, and you know, what you guys all
(01:07):
do You've been around three generations, man, three generations.
Speaker 4 (01:11):
Sixty eight years.
Speaker 2 (01:13):
Yep.
Speaker 4 (01:13):
We have our third generation in place, Ali and Austin
our kids, and they are the third generation of J
and B. They're about twenty seven. They're both very vested
in being involved with the company and taking it to
the next level. My dad started a business in nineteen
fifty eight. I was raised and born in the family business,
(01:35):
got out of high school in seventy eight, and I've
been here my whole life. And Wendy joined me in
the nineties and a very integral part of J ANDB.
Wendy's your wife, yes, and so we have, you know,
have a situation where we're truly family owned and operated
and three generations and you know, people brag about being
around for twenty years and stuff like that. And as
(01:59):
you're in a same situation, Nick your second generation into
your family business. So you understand, you know a lot
of things that you know why that's important and you
know you.
Speaker 3 (02:09):
Probably have This happened too. I walked into our showroom
because we just we've just finished off the heels of
the the realtor show. You and I were both down there,
and you know, we bring our awards down, as do you.
And it's funny because we literally there's some we have
to blow the dust off of. They're so old, you know.
And you think about that, and you think about how
(02:31):
long you've been around. And I don't know about you,
but I remember when I was in high school. My
dad used to take me on the weekends. It was
like slave labor, and throw me in the truck and
we would go work. And that's how I paid for school,
and paid for motorcycles and paid for that stuff he created.
And at the time I kind of hated it because
you were supposed to get a break in the summer, right,
But thinking back at those times, it really afforded me
(02:51):
an opportunity to be able to be a little bit
ahead of my peers when it came to the cool
cars and stuff like that, because and.
Speaker 5 (02:58):
I was learning a trade. And you don't even think
about that right when you're when you're that age, No,
you don't. You just you're you're around it. You hear
the conversations just like our kids did, you know, and
so forth, and but you know, they get to you know,
I got to see and my kids got to see,
you know, Grandpa's thoughts and processes in very old school.
(03:21):
And you know I'm I'm old school.
Speaker 3 (03:23):
Too, you know, I'm laughing, Scott Is. There comes a
time in your life when you become worldly, right, and
you start to think about those things that you just
kind of took for granted, like your dad's sitting in
the truck every day and pulling into uh, you know,
when McDonald's was good, he would it would be an
exciting time when we would just go to lunch and
me and my dad would sit in the truck and
look out the windshield and talk about the next job
(03:45):
eating McDonald's.
Speaker 2 (03:46):
And you think about that.
Speaker 3 (03:47):
Back then, and you thought, man, I'd really rather be
doing this thinking back in that, I wouldn't rather have
been anywhere else.
Speaker 2 (03:52):
You know, that was that was really cool.
Speaker 4 (03:54):
Yeah. No, I was going to college and my dad
took me to my first near meeting in nineteen seventy eight,
and yeah, nineteen seventy eight, and you know, I had
a lot of better things to do. You know, there
was things going on out there that you don't think about.
Speaker 2 (04:13):
But I agree with you.
Speaker 4 (04:14):
You know, we did a lot of things together, got
a lot of input from him, just in doing those things.
We were in the very first Milwaukee Nary Show, which
was nineteen six, in nineteen sixty two at the arena.
Speaker 2 (04:28):
Oh, it was at the arena. You've been there longer
than I have.
Speaker 4 (04:32):
Yeah, at the arena and yeah, and he said there
was two aisles and no carpeting and you could just
see a few people come in here and there. And
he said, boy, I hope they need a roof, you know.
So but no, it's been a good it's been a
good journey. It's been fun. It's been fun investing the
(04:53):
time with my kids and teaching them. And they grew
up with their grandpa, so they understand his ethics and everything,
and you know, they want to make them proud. And
three generations, and when your family owned and operated, I
think it takes it to another level. I'm just not
an employee somewhere else. It's our name on it. I
hear that from my kids. It's our name on it.
Speaker 2 (05:13):
Dad.
Speaker 4 (05:14):
We got to make sure this is good, you know,
and so forth. And you know, having a boy and
a girl, you know, a girl in this industry isn't
an oddity, but it's it's slightly rare.
Speaker 2 (05:25):
Becoming more normal every day it is.
Speaker 4 (05:28):
And but you know she is, you know, really taking
charge and you know, you get that female touch. It
makes a difference, you know, with it. So it's it's
it's all good. But she is the one that controls
all our appointments. So if you want to get a
hold of us, you can call her office at two
six two four three seven zero five three seven, or
(05:49):
you can go to Jnbconstruction dot com and you can
schedule an appointment there. Our estimates are free. We're very
low pressure company. We're very old school with how we
inspect the existing situation of what you have and where
we're starting with your project, and then we can talk
about what needs to happen to move forward and to
get you to the next level of improvements and technologies
(06:13):
and you know, everything else that comes into play as well.
Speaker 3 (06:16):
You know your business and you do more than just roofing.
You guys do windows, You do all the exterior stuff,
a lot of siding, siding. But when you think about roofing,
I always kind of equate it to painting because there's
always been this belief that anybody can do it. Anybody
can do roofing and anybody can do painting. And I
have to tell you my years in the business, two
(06:38):
of the most difficult processes I think in the remodeling
business is painting number one. Now, a crappy paint job
is really easy, but a good paint job is really difficult.
Speaker 2 (06:48):
Roofing is another one.
Speaker 3 (06:48):
There's so many guys out there just slamming one roof
over another. When you see these what I call storm
chasers coming in after a storm and all these unfamiliar names.
You know what, you and I have both been in
an area. We know the names in the business now.
And so when you see these companies coming in, these
storm chasers, and you know, there's just a five thousand
guys on a roof slamming another roof over the top
(07:09):
of what's there. I'm gonna let you talk about it.
But what's wrong with that scenario?
Speaker 4 (07:15):
Well, there's you know, a lot of what we see
with failures out there, whether it's siding, whether it's windows,
whether it's roofing, has to do with installation, and so
it's just them understanding proper installation practices, tying into things.
You know, I mean, a roof isn't just a roof,
you have your flashing detail, you have wall flashings, you
(07:38):
have systems of roof south valleys, valleys, valleys, you know,
pitch changes, all different kinds of things, transitions, you know,
flat roofs that tie in. You know, there's just a
lot of things that happen. But you know, being the
owner and having other salespeople in the company, I chase
more of the problematic things, and so I probably see
(08:01):
more of it than any of our other guys. But
a lot of what you see out there is this
improper installation, and the people don't know it until it's
too late.
Speaker 3 (08:09):
Yeah, because even improperly installed roof looks good.
Speaker 4 (08:12):
It's new, it's clean, it's fresh, looks like a fresh
paint job. Yeah, you know, well that's brand new, you know,
and so it does look, you know, good, but they
can't tell staggers. I've been a big problem, you know,
with how roofs are installed.
Speaker 3 (08:26):
And there's actually there's actually a specification for that that
will avoid a warranty if it's wrong.
Speaker 4 (08:32):
Oh yeah, everything will avoid warranties if installation is wrong.
And that's one of the things that manufacturers look at,
and so it's important to have to warranties. You get
to warranty on materials, and then you get to warranty
from the installer. And I see more problems with installation
practices in avoiding warranties than I do with product problems
(08:54):
out there.
Speaker 3 (08:55):
And a lot of these, a lot of these companies,
and roofing is just one part of it. I mean
so many in our industry, different different companies, Windows Sighting,
all that stuff. They tout a ten year installation warranty,
but they've only been in business for three or four years.
And I don't know what the turnover is now. I
(09:15):
used to pay attention to that, but I know that
eighty percent of the home improvement companies you know last
time I checked, will be in business three to five
years and then they're either under another name or out
of business.
Speaker 4 (09:25):
Yeah, and a lot of companies are getting bought up,
you know too, bigger companies. We've been approached multiple times
to be bought. But you know, I'm looking into our
third generation and want to provide a future for our kids,
and so I have no interest in that. But you know,
it's you know, people talk about different things. Everybody certified,
(09:48):
everybody has lifetime warranties, you know. And I also say
there's two trumped upwards in my industry certified in lifetime warranty.
They can either mean something significant or they can mean
absolutely nothing.
Speaker 3 (10:00):
And you know, so, so how does a you know, Scott,
I think the listeners are probably listening to this thing.
Speaker 2 (10:06):
Okay, how do I know? How do I pick? What
do I do?
Speaker 3 (10:09):
Who should I look at? What certifications are important? What
certifications are are bs?
Speaker 2 (10:15):
You know?
Speaker 4 (10:16):
Well, you know you can go online with the manufacturers,
and that's what I encourage people to do.
Speaker 2 (10:21):
With us.
Speaker 4 (10:22):
We're Master Elite with GAF. Less than two percent of
all the roofing companies in the United States.
Speaker 2 (10:26):
Are Master Elite. Why don't they do it?
Speaker 4 (10:28):
Well, it isn't something that you pay for. You have
to be asked. So when manufacturers want to give extended
warranties on our workmanship on their products, they want to
make sure they're installed properly. So it isn't something I
pay a fee for. But they come to us and
they ask us to be in their program, and we're
proud of that.
Speaker 2 (10:48):
And you know that's additional training, right.
Speaker 4 (10:50):
Oh, it's it's additional training yearly. It isn't just you
did it once you paid your fee. Yeah, but there
are a lot of certifications out there. You just pay
your fee, you know, you train one time, you do this,
you do that, so you know, there's there's different things
that happen.
Speaker 2 (11:05):
Smoking mirrors.
Speaker 4 (11:06):
Yeah, So it's it's it's difficult for consumers to understand.
But if if a contractor really is doing things properly
and they can offer you things, they should be talking
to you about it, you know, and they should be
telling you what you need and we can get into
systems and stuff like that and start talking about that stuff,
and then the contract should be extremely detailed, you know,
(11:27):
with what's going on. And the first step for us
is a meet and greet and we want to do
some evaluation of the attic space. We want to look
at your existing venting, we want to look at your
existing insulation, we want to look at what's there for
your roof decking. All these things that come into play
when you're you know, talking about your next step. You know,
(11:48):
you got to know where you're starting if you're going
to move forward, and most companies don't do that.
Speaker 2 (11:52):
Let's do this, Scott. We're going to take a short break.
Speaker 3 (11:54):
When we come back, I want to talk to you
a little bit more about warranties and and you know,
you and I were talking about some things this morning,
where what how guys that aren't master elite, How guys
that don't have those certifications combat that in the field
with maybe some truth and maybe some untruth to clients.
But let's educate the clients on what to look for
(12:14):
with with some of this stuff and how to figure
out who's telling them the truth. Because you had some
good points on that this morning. Sure, all right, News
talk eleven thirty wis N. We will return after these
messages here you just talk eleven thirty w I s N.
Returning from break. Nick the construction grew.
Speaker 4 (12:34):
Listen.
Speaker 3 (12:34):
If you're thinking about a project, I always say, get
a few opinions.
Speaker 2 (12:37):
Make one of those ours.
Speaker 3 (12:38):
We'd love to come out and talk to you about
an addition, interior remodel, kitchen, bathroom, anything you can think
of on the house.
Speaker 2 (12:44):
We do it. You can check us out on the
web at Kursonerinc.
Speaker 3 (12:47):
Dot com. That's k E r z N E r
I n C dot com, or you can give us
a call at two six y two five six seven,
twenty five hundred. Kurzner is the only company in Wisconsin
when the Better Business Bier Towards award for ethics and
ten three times. If you're just tuning in, I have
Scott Klein on with me from J and B Construction.
We were talking a little bit about I got to
(13:09):
say something first. I used to work at super Still
when I was in high school and they had this
coffee machine and you know, you'd have the four cards
on the side and there'd be one card on the bottom.
Speaker 2 (13:19):
So we play poker.
Speaker 3 (13:21):
I have to tell you, the coffee there was just
as bad as it is in a WISN studio here,
and you don't get the cup, so I can't even
play poker. But Scott, we were talking about and it
happens in my business too. But a lot in your
business where you know, you'll you'll explain to the customer
what your qualifications mean. You'll tell them what the ramifications
(13:45):
of those qualifications are. In other words, you have a
longer warranty. You Obviously, when the rep comes out and
he looks on the sheet if there's a service problem
and he sees J and B on there, he knows
it's been installed correctly, because I know you have relationships
with your vendors, and that's what side to and windows.
Speaker 2 (14:01):
I know you guys.
Speaker 3 (14:01):
We have talked about this dozens of times, and in
many cases, all certifications out there on different things in
any business are just smoking mirrors. As we talked about,
It's something you pay for and maybe you sign in
a test that you're going to do things a certain way.
Master Elite, and I'm sure a number of the other
certifications that you talk about do require continuing education and
(14:23):
does require that you hold yourself to a certain level
of standards. I want you to delve into that a
little bit. But more than that, when the companies come
out when they're getting another estimate, which you and I
always say, get a couple estimates.
Speaker 2 (14:35):
That's a good practice.
Speaker 3 (14:36):
But when they come out and they say, well the
other guy had this Master Elite, and they'll say, well,
that doesn't really mean anything. We give you a lifetime
warranty tour, we give you this too. I'll talk about
that a little bit because that's not the case, is it.
Speaker 4 (14:48):
No, it's it's not. You know, what every consumer wants
to do is have a registered warranty and in the
roofing industry. What happens at GMB is everything we put
together with the consumer is a system. So not only
are we using a particular shingle, but all the components
with the underlayments, the ice and water shield, the pro start,
(15:11):
the ridge cap, the ventilation is all part of the
system too. And the reason that's important is two reasons.
One that becomes part of the warranty, and if it's
part of the warranty, you know it's good quality products.
Speaker 3 (15:23):
So Scott, no, no, And I'm sorry to interrupt you,
but what a lot of companies are doing, because I
see them doing it, is they will use like GAF
shingles and then they'll get their flashings, they'll get their
ice and water shield and all of that from a
big box store. Because I know that in my time,
I remember Grace icinwater shield was like seventy five bucks
(15:46):
a roll, and you could buy the no name stuff
for maybe fifty bucks a roll.
Speaker 2 (15:51):
And now you bring up a great point.
Speaker 3 (15:52):
Because that's going to reflect they're saying, Okay, no, we're
giving you the same shingles, but all of the pieces
that you put together with that are all somewhere else,
And I'm going to assume that if Grace is seventy
five dollars a roll at the time, I know it's
more now and another one's fifty. There's a difference in product,
isn't there.
Speaker 4 (16:11):
Oh, there's definitely a difference in product. But the big
thing is is you want the warranty to come from
one place. You don't want to have to have somebody say, well,
this is a problem because of that product, and it's
because of that product. You want a system, and if
you have your system warranted by the manufacturer, same thing
with like LP smart side. You know they're warranting the finish,
(16:32):
they're warranting the product. You don't have to worry about
the differences of is it the finish or is it
the product. If they're warranting it, they're warranting everything. And
that's what you want with your roof system. So when
we're using a roof system with GAF and we're using
all the components, Wendy goes online and goes into their
portal and enters the whole system. And now it's a
(16:54):
registered warranty, so it's not some piece of paper I'm
handing somebody at the end of the job, and they say, borde.
Speaker 3 (17:01):
On your roof, not just your shingles. That's a differentiation here.
Speaker 4 (17:05):
Yes, yes, on the install and on the products and
all the components. And with shingles there are no more thirties,
there are no more forties. A lot of people don't
realize that anymore. I'm sixty five, so I understand when
I tell somebody about a fifty year roof what fifty
years is. And so I'm not trying to upsell people.
But that's what shingles are now. With three big shingle manufacturers,
(17:27):
they only make fifty year. But the key thing is
to get a registered warranty because the registered warranty is
going to include all the components. It comes directly from
you from the manufacturer. You got a registered number. I
just had a client where we did the job, like
in twenty ten. It was a condo complex, different management people.
(17:47):
They lost warranties, they lost that. I just went right
to the manufacturer, told them the address. Boom, they fired
out all their warranty information to them, you know, and
now it's you know, sixteen years later. So pretty significant
with you know, with what they do and take care
of but with a registered warranty, it's fifty years and
it's non pro rated, and that is the key, non
(18:08):
pro ration.
Speaker 2 (18:09):
A lot of people don't even know what that means.
Speaker 4 (18:10):
Yeah, well, pro rated means that you lose some value
as time goes on. So if somebody hands you a
paper warranty after ten years, it goes into prooration.
Speaker 2 (18:21):
That's depreciation.
Speaker 4 (18:22):
Yes, that's what it is. And when it's ten years,
it isn't ten years. And then one day of proation
they go back to day one, so it's ten years
in a day of proation. So by the time you
get to year eleven, you've got a small amount of
your warranty left with the registered warranty. With a systems
(18:43):
plus with JAF or Silver or Golden pledge which includes
labor warranty, they'll stand behind us on our labor, so
we're certified. So not only do you have warranty information
from us, but you have a company that's going to
stand behind our install and so it's it's a double Yeah,
it's a double plus, you know, and stuff because people say,
(19:05):
you know, webs if you go out of business or
you do this or you do that, you know, I
get that they you know, nobody ever knows for sure,
but so sometimes people will get into the labor warranty
on the install with it, but anyway, all gets registered
to you and it protects you fifty years non pro rated.
So it means replacement. So if you have a problem
(19:27):
that you're fifteen twenty five and you have your warranty,
it's going to be replaced. And it's the tear off.
It isn't just the shingles. It's going to be all
the components involved, you know. So it's it's a very
very good warranty and that's what consumers should look for.
And you know, I have people tell me, well, this
contractor says he's given you the same shingles that you're
(19:49):
giving me, But it's a totally different warranty. It's not
the components, it's not the tear offf it's not the
dumpsters and all part of it. And the good thing
about the warranty is it transfers one time, and you know,
we never know how long we're going to be there.
We've been in our house thirty one years and Wendy
said they're going to carry us out of this house
when we walked in for the first time, and we're
(20:10):
still in the same plan god willing. So you don't
know and but you know you have it, and then
you can transfer the warranty, so's it's a win win.
Speaker 3 (20:18):
It's a great point because you know a lot of
people probably I'm sure you hear it because I'm thinking
it right now. We're only going to be here for
seven years, so it really doesn't matter to us. We
just need to put a roof on and then we're
going to be moving in five to seven years. We've
already got our plans to do that. So we're going
to go with the guy who's a little cheaper, but
with your warranty, but that it's transferable. If now, if
(20:40):
you don't tell your real estate broker, obviously it's not
going to make a difference. But if I put on
a really good roof and I have a transferable warranty,
that's something I'm going to want to make sure it
gets communicated to a potential buyer because it's not there's
no more five thousand dollars roofs.
Speaker 4 (20:54):
It's a selling point, absolutely, and.
Speaker 2 (20:56):
Ye are extremely expensive now.
Speaker 4 (20:58):
And a lot of homes we work on it or
not starter homes, So you know, they're not looking to
sell to somebody that's going to come and fix this
place up. You know, the people that are moving in
are professional. Nobody wants to do maintenance anymore, you know,
So anything that's a plus with a little less maintenance
or a little more maintenance free and having warranties that transfer,
you know, it's a big plus.
Speaker 3 (21:19):
So obviously there's been a time when the warranty came
into play and you had to get the manufacturer out there.
Can you quickly go through that scenario because I'm thinking,
you know, it's like with insurance, you get into a collision.
I remember, I hit a deer and a guy's trying
to talk me into aftermarket parts and basically looking out
for the insurance company rather than taking care of the client.
And I'm not saying all insurance companies are like that.
Speaker 2 (21:40):
Please please don't. I'm not trying to make a blanket statement.
Speaker 3 (21:44):
But when you're talking about warranty work, when you've gone
through that process, how does how is that handled? I mean,
do the customers feel.
Speaker 4 (21:52):
Like, well, they have their registered warranty and so they
got documentation right from the manufacturer and every company out there,
whether it's siding or roofing or windows. They have the
process you need to go through, but you already have
your registered warranty. You know what it entails, and you
just have to go through their steps now. I will
(22:14):
also tell you that, you know, working with a contractor
that has some relationships with manufacturers definitely helps, you know.
And I go up the chain with GAF and so
forth and have developed relationships to higher up parties and
stuff like that. But we've had next to nothing with problems.
(22:37):
And the two problems we had, they replaced them. And
one was a colorization issue, not even anything to do
with the performance of leakage, you know, and the other
one was a product that's no longer made. So you know,
so you want to put yourself in a good position.
Nobody buys anything to say, boy, I can't wait to
use this warranty, you know. But you know, most warranties
out there are not what they appear.
Speaker 2 (22:58):
And that's what I was just going to say.
Speaker 3 (22:59):
Most people, well, when I hear the word warranty, it
automatically triggers. Okay, I don't have to pay attention now
because it doesn't matter. But it does matter. It does matter,
and I think you guys take the time. Well, it
matters enough to me that And I'm just going to
tell you, Scott, I know you pretty well, and I
don't mind saying you're not the cheapest guy out there.
Speaker 4 (23:16):
Okay, we never will be. We're going to be in
the middle. We should be in the middle.
Speaker 3 (23:20):
But you know, I have a ton of friends in
this industry that do different things. And you guys are
going to put my roof on this spring. We plan
that out a year ago, so I mean, it's it
does make a difference. And I'm going to be selling
my house, so you know, I want to be able
to transfer that warranty and I want to be able
to tell the next home wonder that hey there's a
value here that that comes your way. And you can
(23:43):
open up that warranty. You can show them it's registered,
they can go online and.
Speaker 2 (23:46):
Check it right.
Speaker 4 (23:47):
Well, they get it sent to them directly, you know,
to them, and they understand everything that's going on. So
it's a win win, And you know, there's no substitute
for experience out there, you know. And like I said,
we've been around sixty eight years, three generations. We got
a guy, we got a girl, we got a family,
you know, and stuff, and you know, one of our
(24:08):
taglines is our family has your family covered.
Speaker 2 (24:11):
That's cool.
Speaker 4 (24:11):
Yeah, so yeah, the kids are very proudly.
Speaker 3 (24:14):
I've known you guys. I know Austin, I know Allie,
I know Wendy, I know most of your staff, and
I got to see most of them down at the show.
I don't think I saw Allie down there first weekend.
Yeah I missed, Yeah, I was. I was working nights
with We kind of work it out so that I
can come in later. But anyway, you know, it's a
(24:35):
well run organization. It's a neat, clean organization. You can
tell by looking at the people that are there that
they know what they're doing. It's it's clearly a tight
running organization. And that's why I have the confidence to
have you guys do my roof give out your information.
We're going to have another show in the near future
here because we kind of always talk about roofing, because
there's a lot of roofing going on right now. I
(24:57):
want to talk about your windows and siding and one
of the next shows because you.
Speaker 4 (25:00):
Yah, absolutely more. Yeah, We're going to bring the kids
into give them a shot, you know, they're the next generation.
Oh yeah, yeah, they've both been here before and you know,
so it's good for them. But you can reach us
at two six two four three seven zero five three seven,
or go on our website Jnbconstruction dot com and you
(25:20):
can find out more information about us. Uh, call the office,
talk with Ali. But certainly not a problem to get
a bid.
Speaker 3 (25:28):
Awesome and windows and door side and you do the
whole package on the outside. Just keep that in mind
when you're looking at this and lots of good before
and afters on the website. Thanks for coming in today.
You appreciate it. It's always good to see us Scott.
We can sneak out maybe get breakfast now like we
do on Sunday mornings. Yeah, you went to church this
morning before you came, I know, so we're all good again.
(25:48):
Thanks for coming in. Scott News Talk eleven thirty WISN.
We will return again next week
When you need wisdom and advice.
Speaker 2 (00:03):
Seek out a guru.
Speaker 1 (00:04):
When you need wisdom and advice about remodeling and design.
Lock on and listen right now to Nick the construction Guru.
Here is award winning remodeling expert Nick Kerzner.
Speaker 3 (00:22):
You was talk eleven thirty DIBs and good morning Wisconsin,
Nick the construction grew Here. I have a good friend
returning guest. We've been how long have we known each other, Scott?
Longer than I know. But it's been good. Yeah, it's
been fun. I have Scott Klein from J and B
Construction with me today. We were on a couple of
weeks ago and we were talking about, you know, a
(00:44):
roof is a roof?
Speaker 2 (00:45):
Is a roof?
Speaker 3 (00:45):
Not really, because there's a lot of underlying things other
than the physical physical roof that you have to think about.
And you know, on the way here today we were
talking on the phone, and you know, Scott, you were
bringing up some pretty good points about warranties and stuff
like that. We're going to get into that in just
a couple of minutes. But for the few people that
don't know who you are, tell us a little bit
about your company, and you know, what you guys all
(01:07):
do You've been around three generations, man, three generations.
Speaker 4 (01:11):
Sixty eight years.
Speaker 2 (01:13):
Yep.
Speaker 4 (01:13):
We have our third generation in place, Ali and Austin
our kids, and they are the third generation of J
and B. They're about twenty seven. They're both very vested
in being involved with the company and taking it to
the next level. My dad started a business in nineteen
fifty eight. I was raised and born in the family business,
(01:35):
got out of high school in seventy eight, and I've
been here my whole life. And Wendy joined me in
the nineties and a very integral part of J ANDB.
Wendy's your wife, yes, and so we have, you know,
have a situation where we're truly family owned and operated
and three generations and you know, people brag about being
around for twenty years and stuff like that. And as
(01:59):
you're in a same situation, Nick your second generation into
your family business. So you understand, you know a lot
of things that you know why that's important and you
know you.
Speaker 3 (02:09):
Probably have This happened too. I walked into our showroom
because we just we've just finished off the heels of
the the realtor show. You and I were both down there,
and you know, we bring our awards down, as do you.
And it's funny because we literally there's some we have
to blow the dust off of. They're so old, you know.
And you think about that, and you think about how
(02:31):
long you've been around. And I don't know about you,
but I remember when I was in high school. My
dad used to take me on the weekends. It was
like slave labor, and throw me in the truck and
we would go work. And that's how I paid for school,
and paid for motorcycles and paid for that stuff he created.
And at the time I kind of hated it because
you were supposed to get a break in the summer, right,
But thinking back at those times, it really afforded me
(02:51):
an opportunity to be able to be a little bit
ahead of my peers when it came to the cool
cars and stuff like that, because and.
Speaker 5 (02:58):
I was learning a trade. And you don't even think
about that right when you're when you're that age, No,
you don't. You just you're you're around it. You hear
the conversations just like our kids did, you know, and
so forth, and but you know, they get to you know,
I got to see and my kids got to see,
you know, Grandpa's thoughts and processes in very old school.
(03:21):
And you know I'm I'm old school.
Speaker 3 (03:23):
Too, you know, I'm laughing, Scott Is. There comes a
time in your life when you become worldly, right, and
you start to think about those things that you just
kind of took for granted, like your dad's sitting in
the truck every day and pulling into uh, you know,
when McDonald's was good, he would it would be an
exciting time when we would just go to lunch and
me and my dad would sit in the truck and
look out the windshield and talk about the next job
(03:45):
eating McDonald's.
Speaker 2 (03:46):
And you think about that.
Speaker 3 (03:47):
Back then, and you thought, man, I'd really rather be
doing this thinking back in that, I wouldn't rather have
been anywhere else.
Speaker 2 (03:52):
You know, that was that was really cool.
Speaker 4 (03:54):
Yeah. No, I was going to college and my dad
took me to my first near meeting in nineteen seventy eight,
and yeah, nineteen seventy eight, and you know, I had
a lot of better things to do. You know, there
was things going on out there that you don't think about.
Speaker 2 (04:13):
But I agree with you.
Speaker 4 (04:14):
You know, we did a lot of things together, got
a lot of input from him, just in doing those things.
We were in the very first Milwaukee Nary Show, which
was nineteen six, in nineteen sixty two at the arena.
Speaker 2 (04:28):
Oh, it was at the arena. You've been there longer
than I have.
Speaker 4 (04:32):
Yeah, at the arena and yeah, and he said there
was two aisles and no carpeting and you could just
see a few people come in here and there. And
he said, boy, I hope they need a roof, you know.
So but no, it's been a good it's been a
good journey. It's been fun. It's been fun investing the
(04:53):
time with my kids and teaching them. And they grew
up with their grandpa, so they understand his ethics and everything,
and you know, they want to make them proud. And
three generations, and when your family owned and operated, I
think it takes it to another level. I'm just not
an employee somewhere else. It's our name on it. I
hear that from my kids. It's our name on it.
Speaker 2 (05:13):
Dad.
Speaker 4 (05:14):
We got to make sure this is good, you know,
and so forth. And you know, having a boy and
a girl, you know, a girl in this industry isn't
an oddity, but it's it's slightly rare.
Speaker 2 (05:25):
Becoming more normal every day it is.
Speaker 4 (05:28):
And but you know she is, you know, really taking
charge and you know, you get that female touch. It
makes a difference, you know, with it. So it's it's
it's all good. But she is the one that controls
all our appointments. So if you want to get a
hold of us, you can call her office at two
six two four three seven zero five three seven, or
(05:49):
you can go to Jnbconstruction dot com and you can
schedule an appointment there. Our estimates are free. We're very
low pressure company. We're very old school with how we
inspect the existing situation of what you have and where
we're starting with your project, and then we can talk
about what needs to happen to move forward and to
get you to the next level of improvements and technologies
(06:13):
and you know, everything else that comes into play as well.
Speaker 3 (06:16):
You know your business and you do more than just roofing.
You guys do windows, You do all the exterior stuff,
a lot of siding, siding. But when you think about roofing,
I always kind of equate it to painting because there's
always been this belief that anybody can do it. Anybody
can do roofing and anybody can do painting. And I
have to tell you my years in the business, two
(06:38):
of the most difficult processes I think in the remodeling
business is painting number one. Now, a crappy paint job
is really easy, but a good paint job is really difficult.
Speaker 2 (06:48):
Roofing is another one.
Speaker 3 (06:48):
There's so many guys out there just slamming one roof
over another. When you see these what I call storm
chasers coming in after a storm and all these unfamiliar names.
You know what, you and I have both been in
an area. We know the names in the business now.
And so when you see these companies coming in, these
storm chasers, and you know, there's just a five thousand
guys on a roof slamming another roof over the top
(07:09):
of what's there. I'm gonna let you talk about it.
But what's wrong with that scenario?
Speaker 4 (07:15):
Well, there's you know, a lot of what we see
with failures out there, whether it's siding, whether it's windows,
whether it's roofing, has to do with installation, and so
it's just them understanding proper installation practices, tying into things.
You know, I mean, a roof isn't just a roof,
you have your flashing detail, you have wall flashings, you
(07:38):
have systems of roof south valleys, valleys, valleys, you know,
pitch changes, all different kinds of things, transitions, you know,
flat roofs that tie in. You know, there's just a
lot of things that happen. But you know, being the
owner and having other salespeople in the company, I chase
more of the problematic things, and so I probably see
(08:01):
more of it than any of our other guys. But
a lot of what you see out there is this
improper installation, and the people don't know it until it's
too late.
Speaker 3 (08:09):
Yeah, because even improperly installed roof looks good.
Speaker 4 (08:12):
It's new, it's clean, it's fresh, looks like a fresh
paint job. Yeah, you know, well that's brand new, you know,
and so it does look, you know, good, but they
can't tell staggers. I've been a big problem, you know,
with how roofs are installed.
Speaker 3 (08:26):
And there's actually there's actually a specification for that that
will avoid a warranty if it's wrong.
Speaker 4 (08:32):
Oh yeah, everything will avoid warranties if installation is wrong.
And that's one of the things that manufacturers look at,
and so it's important to have to warranties. You get
to warranty on materials, and then you get to warranty
from the installer. And I see more problems with installation
practices in avoiding warranties than I do with product problems
(08:54):
out there.
Speaker 3 (08:55):
And a lot of these, a lot of these companies,
and roofing is just one part of it. I mean
so many in our industry, different different companies, Windows Sighting,
all that stuff. They tout a ten year installation warranty,
but they've only been in business for three or four years.
And I don't know what the turnover is now. I
(09:15):
used to pay attention to that, but I know that
eighty percent of the home improvement companies you know last
time I checked, will be in business three to five
years and then they're either under another name or out
of business.
Speaker 4 (09:25):
Yeah, and a lot of companies are getting bought up,
you know too, bigger companies. We've been approached multiple times
to be bought. But you know, I'm looking into our
third generation and want to provide a future for our kids,
and so I have no interest in that. But you know,
it's you know, people talk about different things. Everybody certified,
(09:48):
everybody has lifetime warranties, you know. And I also say
there's two trumped upwards in my industry certified in lifetime warranty.
They can either mean something significant or they can mean
absolutely nothing.
Speaker 3 (10:00):
And you know, so, so how does a you know, Scott,
I think the listeners are probably listening to this thing.
Speaker 2 (10:06):
Okay, how do I know? How do I pick? What
do I do?
Speaker 3 (10:09):
Who should I look at? What certifications are important? What
certifications are are bs?
Speaker 2 (10:15):
You know?
Speaker 4 (10:16):
Well, you know you can go online with the manufacturers,
and that's what I encourage people to do.
Speaker 2 (10:21):
With us.
Speaker 4 (10:22):
We're Master Elite with GAF. Less than two percent of
all the roofing companies in the United States.
Speaker 2 (10:26):
Are Master Elite. Why don't they do it?
Speaker 4 (10:28):
Well, it isn't something that you pay for. You have
to be asked. So when manufacturers want to give extended
warranties on our workmanship on their products, they want to
make sure they're installed properly. So it isn't something I
pay a fee for. But they come to us and
they ask us to be in their program, and we're
proud of that.
Speaker 2 (10:48):
And you know that's additional training, right.
Speaker 4 (10:50):
Oh, it's it's additional training yearly. It isn't just you
did it once you paid your fee. Yeah, but there
are a lot of certifications out there. You just pay
your fee, you know, you train one time, you do this,
you do that, so you know, there's there's different things
that happen.
Speaker 2 (11:05):
Smoking mirrors.
Speaker 4 (11:06):
Yeah, So it's it's it's difficult for consumers to understand.
But if if a contractor really is doing things properly
and they can offer you things, they should be talking
to you about it, you know, and they should be
telling you what you need and we can get into
systems and stuff like that and start talking about that stuff,
and then the contract should be extremely detailed, you know,
(11:27):
with what's going on. And the first step for us
is a meet and greet and we want to do
some evaluation of the attic space. We want to look
at your existing venting, we want to look at your
existing insulation, we want to look at what's there for
your roof decking. All these things that come into play
when you're you know, talking about your next step. You know,
(11:48):
you got to know where you're starting if you're going
to move forward, and most companies don't do that.
Speaker 2 (11:52):
Let's do this, Scott. We're going to take a short break.
Speaker 3 (11:54):
When we come back, I want to talk to you
a little bit more about warranties and and you know,
you and I were talking about some things this morning,
where what how guys that aren't master elite, How guys
that don't have those certifications combat that in the field
with maybe some truth and maybe some untruth to clients.
But let's educate the clients on what to look for
(12:14):
with with some of this stuff and how to figure
out who's telling them the truth. Because you had some
good points on that this morning. Sure, all right, News
talk eleven thirty wis N. We will return after these
messages here you just talk eleven thirty w I s N.
Returning from break. Nick the construction grew.
Speaker 4 (12:34):
Listen.
Speaker 3 (12:34):
If you're thinking about a project, I always say, get
a few opinions.
Speaker 2 (12:37):
Make one of those ours.
Speaker 3 (12:38):
We'd love to come out and talk to you about
an addition, interior remodel, kitchen, bathroom, anything you can think
of on the house.
Speaker 2 (12:44):
We do it. You can check us out on the
web at Kursonerinc.
Speaker 3 (12:47):
Dot com. That's k E r z N E r
I n C dot com, or you can give us
a call at two six y two five six seven,
twenty five hundred. Kurzner is the only company in Wisconsin
when the Better Business Bier Towards award for ethics and
ten three times. If you're just tuning in, I have
Scott Klein on with me from J and B Construction.
We were talking a little bit about I got to
(13:09):
say something first. I used to work at super Still
when I was in high school and they had this
coffee machine and you know, you'd have the four cards
on the side and there'd be one card on the bottom.
Speaker 2 (13:19):
So we play poker.
Speaker 3 (13:21):
I have to tell you, the coffee there was just
as bad as it is in a WISN studio here,
and you don't get the cup, so I can't even
play poker. But Scott, we were talking about and it
happens in my business too. But a lot in your
business where you know, you'll you'll explain to the customer
what your qualifications mean. You'll tell them what the ramifications
(13:45):
of those qualifications are. In other words, you have a
longer warranty. You Obviously, when the rep comes out and
he looks on the sheet if there's a service problem
and he sees J and B on there, he knows
it's been installed correctly, because I know you have relationships
with your vendors, and that's what side to and windows.
Speaker 2 (14:01):
I know you guys.
Speaker 3 (14:01):
We have talked about this dozens of times, and in
many cases, all certifications out there on different things in
any business are just smoking mirrors. As we talked about,
It's something you pay for and maybe you sign in
a test that you're going to do things a certain way.
Master Elite, and I'm sure a number of the other
certifications that you talk about do require continuing education and
(14:23):
does require that you hold yourself to a certain level
of standards. I want you to delve into that a
little bit. But more than that, when the companies come
out when they're getting another estimate, which you and I
always say, get a couple estimates.
Speaker 2 (14:35):
That's a good practice.
Speaker 3 (14:36):
But when they come out and they say, well the
other guy had this Master Elite, and they'll say, well,
that doesn't really mean anything. We give you a lifetime
warranty tour, we give you this too. I'll talk about
that a little bit because that's not the case, is it.
Speaker 4 (14:48):
No, it's it's not. You know, what every consumer wants
to do is have a registered warranty and in the
roofing industry. What happens at GMB is everything we put
together with the consumer is a system. So not only
are we using a particular shingle, but all the components
with the underlayments, the ice and water shield, the pro start,
(15:11):
the ridge cap, the ventilation is all part of the
system too. And the reason that's important is two reasons.
One that becomes part of the warranty, and if it's
part of the warranty, you know it's good quality products.
Speaker 3 (15:23):
So Scott, no, no, And I'm sorry to interrupt you,
but what a lot of companies are doing, because I
see them doing it, is they will use like GAF
shingles and then they'll get their flashings, they'll get their
ice and water shield and all of that from a
big box store. Because I know that in my time,
I remember Grace icinwater shield was like seventy five bucks
(15:46):
a roll, and you could buy the no name stuff
for maybe fifty bucks a roll.
Speaker 2 (15:51):
And now you bring up a great point.
Speaker 3 (15:52):
Because that's going to reflect they're saying, Okay, no, we're
giving you the same shingles, but all of the pieces
that you put together with that are all somewhere else,
And I'm going to assume that if Grace is seventy
five dollars a roll at the time, I know it's
more now and another one's fifty. There's a difference in product,
isn't there.
Speaker 4 (16:11):
Oh, there's definitely a difference in product. But the big
thing is is you want the warranty to come from
one place. You don't want to have to have somebody say, well,
this is a problem because of that product, and it's
because of that product. You want a system, and if
you have your system warranted by the manufacturer, same thing
with like LP smart side. You know they're warranting the finish,
(16:32):
they're warranting the product. You don't have to worry about
the differences of is it the finish or is it
the product. If they're warranting it, they're warranting everything. And
that's what you want with your roof system. So when
we're using a roof system with GAF and we're using
all the components, Wendy goes online and goes into their
portal and enters the whole system. And now it's a
(16:54):
registered warranty, so it's not some piece of paper I'm
handing somebody at the end of the job, and they say, borde.
Speaker 3 (17:01):
On your roof, not just your shingles. That's a differentiation here.
Speaker 4 (17:05):
Yes, yes, on the install and on the products and
all the components. And with shingles there are no more thirties,
there are no more forties. A lot of people don't
realize that anymore. I'm sixty five, so I understand when
I tell somebody about a fifty year roof what fifty
years is. And so I'm not trying to upsell people.
But that's what shingles are now. With three big shingle manufacturers,
(17:27):
they only make fifty year. But the key thing is
to get a registered warranty because the registered warranty is
going to include all the components. It comes directly from
you from the manufacturer. You got a registered number. I
just had a client where we did the job, like
in twenty ten. It was a condo complex, different management people.
(17:47):
They lost warranties, they lost that. I just went right
to the manufacturer, told them the address. Boom, they fired
out all their warranty information to them, you know, and
now it's you know, sixteen years later. So pretty significant
with you know, with what they do and take care
of but with a registered warranty, it's fifty years and
it's non pro rated, and that is the key, non
(18:08):
pro ration.
Speaker 2 (18:09):
A lot of people don't even know what that means.
Speaker 4 (18:10):
Yeah, well, pro rated means that you lose some value
as time goes on. So if somebody hands you a
paper warranty after ten years, it goes into prooration.
Speaker 2 (18:21):
That's depreciation.
Speaker 4 (18:22):
Yes, that's what it is. And when it's ten years,
it isn't ten years. And then one day of proation
they go back to day one, so it's ten years
in a day of proation. So by the time you
get to year eleven, you've got a small amount of
your warranty left with the registered warranty. With a systems
(18:43):
plus with JAF or Silver or Golden pledge which includes
labor warranty, they'll stand behind us on our labor, so
we're certified. So not only do you have warranty information
from us, but you have a company that's going to
stand behind our install and so it's it's a double Yeah,
it's a double plus, you know, and stuff because people say,
(19:05):
you know, webs if you go out of business or
you do this or you do that, you know, I
get that they you know, nobody ever knows for sure,
but so sometimes people will get into the labor warranty
on the install with it, but anyway, all gets registered
to you and it protects you fifty years non pro rated.
So it means replacement. So if you have a problem
(19:27):
that you're fifteen twenty five and you have your warranty,
it's going to be replaced. And it's the tear off.
It isn't just the shingles. It's going to be all
the components involved, you know. So it's it's a very
very good warranty and that's what consumers should look for.
And you know, I have people tell me, well, this
contractor says he's given you the same shingles that you're
(19:49):
giving me, But it's a totally different warranty. It's not
the components, it's not the tear offf it's not the
dumpsters and all part of it. And the good thing
about the warranty is it transfers one time, and you know,
we never know how long we're going to be there.
We've been in our house thirty one years and Wendy
said they're going to carry us out of this house
when we walked in for the first time, and we're
(20:10):
still in the same plan god willing. So you don't
know and but you know you have it, and then
you can transfer the warranty, so's it's a win win.
Speaker 3 (20:18):
It's a great point because you know a lot of
people probably I'm sure you hear it because I'm thinking
it right now. We're only going to be here for
seven years, so it really doesn't matter to us. We
just need to put a roof on and then we're
going to be moving in five to seven years. We've
already got our plans to do that. So we're going
to go with the guy who's a little cheaper, but
with your warranty, but that it's transferable. If now, if
(20:40):
you don't tell your real estate broker, obviously it's not
going to make a difference. But if I put on
a really good roof and I have a transferable warranty,
that's something I'm going to want to make sure it
gets communicated to a potential buyer because it's not there's
no more five thousand dollars roofs.
Speaker 4 (20:54):
It's a selling point, absolutely, and.
Speaker 2 (20:56):
Ye are extremely expensive now.
Speaker 4 (20:58):
And a lot of homes we work on it or
not starter homes, So you know, they're not looking to
sell to somebody that's going to come and fix this
place up. You know, the people that are moving in
are professional. Nobody wants to do maintenance anymore, you know,
So anything that's a plus with a little less maintenance
or a little more maintenance free and having warranties that transfer,
you know, it's a big plus.
Speaker 3 (21:19):
So obviously there's been a time when the warranty came
into play and you had to get the manufacturer out there.
Can you quickly go through that scenario because I'm thinking,
you know, it's like with insurance, you get into a collision.
I remember, I hit a deer and a guy's trying
to talk me into aftermarket parts and basically looking out
for the insurance company rather than taking care of the client.
And I'm not saying all insurance companies are like that.
Speaker 2 (21:40):
Please please don't. I'm not trying to make a blanket statement.
Speaker 3 (21:44):
But when you're talking about warranty work, when you've gone
through that process, how does how is that handled? I mean,
do the customers feel.
Speaker 4 (21:52):
Like, well, they have their registered warranty and so they
got documentation right from the manufacturer and every company out there,
whether it's siding or roofing or windows. They have the
process you need to go through, but you already have
your registered warranty. You know what it entails, and you
just have to go through their steps now. I will
(22:14):
also tell you that, you know, working with a contractor
that has some relationships with manufacturers definitely helps, you know.
And I go up the chain with GAF and so
forth and have developed relationships to higher up parties and
stuff like that. But we've had next to nothing with problems.
(22:37):
And the two problems we had, they replaced them. And
one was a colorization issue, not even anything to do
with the performance of leakage, you know, and the other
one was a product that's no longer made. So you know,
so you want to put yourself in a good position.
Nobody buys anything to say, boy, I can't wait to
use this warranty, you know. But you know, most warranties
out there are not what they appear.
Speaker 2 (22:58):
And that's what I was just going to say.
Speaker 3 (22:59):
Most people, well, when I hear the word warranty, it
automatically triggers. Okay, I don't have to pay attention now
because it doesn't matter. But it does matter. It does matter,
and I think you guys take the time. Well, it
matters enough to me that And I'm just going to
tell you, Scott, I know you pretty well, and I
don't mind saying you're not the cheapest guy out there.
Speaker 4 (23:16):
Okay, we never will be. We're going to be in
the middle. We should be in the middle.
Speaker 3 (23:20):
But you know, I have a ton of friends in
this industry that do different things. And you guys are
going to put my roof on this spring. We plan
that out a year ago, so I mean, it's it
does make a difference. And I'm going to be selling
my house, so you know, I want to be able
to transfer that warranty and I want to be able
to tell the next home wonder that hey there's a
value here that that comes your way. And you can
(23:43):
open up that warranty. You can show them it's registered,
they can go online and.
Speaker 2 (23:46):
Check it right.
Speaker 4 (23:47):
Well, they get it sent to them directly, you know,
to them, and they understand everything that's going on. So
it's a win win, And you know, there's no substitute
for experience out there, you know. And like I said,
we've been around sixty eight years, three generations. We got
a guy, we got a girl, we got a family,
you know, and stuff, and you know, one of our
(24:08):
taglines is our family has your family covered.
Speaker 2 (24:11):
That's cool.
Speaker 4 (24:11):
Yeah, so yeah, the kids are very proudly.
Speaker 3 (24:14):
I've known you guys. I know Austin, I know Allie,
I know Wendy, I know most of your staff, and
I got to see most of them down at the show.
I don't think I saw Allie down there first weekend.
Yeah I missed, Yeah, I was. I was working nights
with We kind of work it out so that I
can come in later. But anyway, you know, it's a
(24:35):
well run organization. It's a neat, clean organization. You can
tell by looking at the people that are there that
they know what they're doing. It's it's clearly a tight
running organization. And that's why I have the confidence to
have you guys do my roof give out your information.
We're going to have another show in the near future
here because we kind of always talk about roofing, because
there's a lot of roofing going on right now. I
(24:57):
want to talk about your windows and siding and one
of the next shows because you.
Speaker 4 (25:00):
Yah, absolutely more. Yeah, We're going to bring the kids
into give them a shot, you know, they're the next generation.
Oh yeah, yeah, they've both been here before and you know,
so it's good for them. But you can reach us
at two six two four three seven zero five three seven,
or go on our website Jnbconstruction dot com and you
(25:20):
can find out more information about us. Uh, call the office,
talk with Ali. But certainly not a problem to get
a bid.
Speaker 3 (25:28):
Awesome and windows and door side and you do the
whole package on the outside. Just keep that in mind
when you're looking at this and lots of good before
and afters on the website. Thanks for coming in today.
You appreciate it. It's always good to see us Scott.
We can sneak out maybe get breakfast now like we
do on Sunday mornings. Yeah, you went to church this
morning before you came, I know, so we're all good again.
(25:48):
Thanks for coming in. Scott News Talk eleven thirty WISN.
We will return again next week
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