(2025) 7-6 David Carrier Show Hour 2 Podcast

Episode Transcript

Speaker 1 (00:00):
He served at the Pentagon as an army jag. He
graduated from Notre Dame and has two law degrees from
Boston University and Georgetown University. He's been practicing law for
over thirty years. He's your family's personal attorney. It's time
for the David Carrier Show.

Speaker 2 (00:19):
Hello, welcome to the David Carrier Show. I'm David Carrier,
your family's personal attorney. And as we enter the era
of the Big Beautiful, what have you? Yeah, exciting things
coming up. We spent the first hour talking about that,
so you know you have to go back and listen
to the podcast or what have you? Highlights number one?

(00:41):
I mean it's highlights. It's like you remember Star Wars,
you know the Death Star. Oh, what are the highlights
in the dust Star? Well, the cafeteria on level four. Anyway,
a lot of highlights of the big beautiful. What have you?
The Sasquatch, the big Foot, of a federal legislation. Yeah, yeah,

(01:02):
and it's not all table. Manners aren't as good as
you might wish, but anyway, it is what it is.
And when Sasquatch is coming to dinner, YETI h YETI
has good manners? Get it? Yet he has yet he
has anyway, Yeah, it's a sasquatch of a bill and
it's here, and it's uh, you know, and it's we

(01:25):
got to deal with it now. But if you'd like
to have a question you'd like me to deal with
that's easy to do. Six one six seven seven four
twenty four twenty four. That's six one six seven seven
four twenty four twenty four. We'll get your question on
the air immediately. You can also dial me, dial me.

(01:46):
You can also email me. That's that electronic mail, you know,
that newfangle stuff. David at Davidcarrier Law dot com, David
at David Carrier Law all one word, squish it all
together dot come and uh. You know, when you visit
the website davidcarry Law dot com, you can see when
all the workshops are. These are the workshops we give

(02:08):
every week, the Good Lord brings and multiple locations, whether
it's in our offices in Norton Shores, or in Holland
or Grand Rapids or or uh all the way down
there in Portage. Well, if you're listening on kz oh,
it's not done. W kz oh, it's not that far. Obviously,

(02:31):
it's around the corner. So but I'm sitting at Grand Rapids.
So they go, oh, and we're trying something new, uh
for the workshops. We're actually I know, I know that
Russ's is like the favorite place, right, but we're actually
we're actually doing sort of a luncheon learned kind of thing.
You may already click on the on the thingy on

(02:53):
the if you go to Facebook or whatever you met up,
whatever you call it. Uh, if you uh get served
one of our ads, click on it, because we're doing
we're doing a lunch and learned sort of thing at Russ's.
And you know we were I've gotten those invitations, you know, oh,
come to the fancy, fancy, fancy steakhouse. I'm like, well,

(03:17):
chicken salad at Russa's. Yeah, I can do that. I
don't know about the steakhouse, but anyway, if you you know,
because people need to keep their energy up. Also, also
on the sixteenth, if you if your life if you've
done your life plan with us, or if you remember
a Red Wagon club, you should have already gotten your
invite to the to the zoo. Now, for some reason

(03:39):
which has yet to be explained to me, there's no
return address. Our return address is not on there, but
there's a picture of me supposed to be me. I
guess cartoon in a with a red wagon with monkeys
or something, and I don't know. Anyway, the point is
on the sixteenth, we're having our the Tuesday the sixteenth,

(03:59):
we're having our summary quarterly meeting. We're not doing a
concert this this year. We're doing it at the at
the zoo. And if you would like to go to
the zoo afterwards, this is a whole separate ticketing process.
But if you would like to go to the zoo,
that's a okay, just let us know when you're rs VP. Yeah,
I want to go and walk around in one hundred
and three degree heat looking at monkeys or elephants or

(04:21):
where they get over there. If you'd like to, that's
super duper. That's fine, right. But the but the meeting
is is at eleven you know, box lunch, et cetera,
et cetera. Get to you know, Stump the Chump in person.
Won't that be fun? What else is going on? I
don't know. Oh oh. At the end of the month,
of course, we have our trip to the Kalamazoo Growlers

(04:46):
for some of you of course it won't be a trip,
but the Kalamazoo Growlers this is our summer of baseball. See,
I gotta remember all this stuff. If I don't remember,
how you gonna know? So you see, and you thought
that big beautiful Bill was something? How about all us anyway?
That's what we're uh, that's what we're ab So there's
a lot of things going on. You go to the

(05:07):
website davidcarrierloon dot com. Ask the uh uh, the AI
intelligent assistant there to help you out with that. Okay,
if you have if you have any questions, six one
six seven seven four, twenty four, twenty four. That's six one,
six seven seven four twenty four to twenty four. That's
the number of call right now. Now, how does this

(05:28):
big beautiful bill affect you? Well, there are lots of
ways it's going to affect you. One of the things,
as you know, that we plan for is long term care. See,
if you're not doing, if you are not explicitly on
purpose focus like a laser beam on long term care,
you're gonna die broke. Now, we always die broke. No, No,

(05:51):
So when I say you're gonna die broke, scary, Well,
it is scary because it happens a lot. Talk to
some Talk to some people. Okay, you got to be
you got to be aware of the biggest risk to
your well being, to your spouse as well being, which
is long term care. It's the most expensive thing out there.
It's not going to get any better. And people say, whoh,

(06:13):
how do you know it's not going to get better. Well,
I'll tell you how I know it's not going to
get better. It's not going to get better because there's
a lot of boomers. There's a lot of us, and
we're not dying. You know. When I first started doing
this stuff thirty some odd years ago, flu influenza was
the old man's friend. It cleared out the nursing homes.

(06:34):
Okay it people died of flu like routinely, like that
kind of what happened. All right, Well, nowadays they've got
more pneumonia. What have you. I'm not a doctor. I
was pre med. I got to see in biology. I
didn't last as a pre med, So what do I

(06:54):
know about the medical stuff. But anyway, people would die,
they would get an infectious disease, they would die. Okay,
Nowadays they don't die anymore. You send them over to hospital,
they do whatever it is they do, and they shoot
them back to the nursing home. As a consequence, not
only do we have all these baby boomers who are
aging into long term care, got a lot of them

(07:15):
doing that, but we also have the folks that you
expected to die off. They ain't dying off, right, They're
hanging around, Which means that the population of people who
need care is going through the proverbial roof going up there,
and the number of people available to provide care right

(07:36):
is going down down down. Why is it going down, down, down?
Because you didn't have as many kids as your parents did,
that's why. And your parents are hanging around a lot longer.
So when supply goes down and demand goes up, guess
what happens to price See if we can figure this
one out, what happens to price correct? It goes skyri

(08:00):
And that's what we've got going on with the long
term care. This is why it's twenty thousand dollars a month,
eighteen thousand dollars a month, fifteen thirteen thousand dollars a month. Oh,
I got a real cheap deal. It's only five six
thousand dollars a month. Yeah, that's independent living. Wait till
they start delivering meals. Wait till they start doing all
the other things that they got to do as the

(08:22):
level of care goes up. And lest you think I'm
a big fan of long term care facilities, which i am,
those people do a very very difficult job, and they
primarily do it very very well, okay. And the fact
that given the current labor market and all the demands
that are put on the fact that they do it
as well as they do for the price that they've got,

(08:42):
that's sort of amazing, okay. And if you're a skilled
nursing facility, you also got to deal with the fact
that you cannot evict anybody like a hospital that way.
So how the hell are they supposed to do it?
And the answer is by squeezing you for every freaking
nickel they can possibly get until you're on the Medicaid,
all right, which lots of times your kids will screw

(09:04):
up and they'll lose a couple of months and then
you get sued. It's terrible, but there you go, or
they just won't get paid. There's a way to do
this stuff that most people aren't doing. Most people's estate
plans are not focused on this very seventy percent of

(09:24):
folks wind up in kind of skill care, not most
of our folks. Most of our folks are staying at home.
Most of our folks are dying at home. How do
you do that? Well, the way you do that is
by recognizing number one, that you've got a problem here
long term care. Number two, that there are a wide
variety of government programs to help out. The umbrella is Medicaid,

(09:47):
and all this Medicaid stuff that's been going on, it's smoke.
It still works, it's still there. The programs we're relying
on haven't changed, you know. We just do the things
we do so that you, the people who worked and saved,
did all the good things, get a payback for what

(10:07):
you paid in. Okay, this is why Social Security is
not terrible. You paid for it. So why Medicare is
not terrible. You paid for it. This is why long
term care through Medicaid is not terrible. You paid for it.
Now maybe you're in favor of paying for stuff you
don't get back on. Okay, Well, and then to each

(10:28):
his own you know who am I? Who am I
to judge such insanity? But the fact of the matter
is every time you do it, it works. So that's the
big beautiful bill. There will be lots more stuff. We'll
be talking about it, but taking action is just as
important as it ever has been. I'm David Carrier, your
Family's Personal Attorney. Welcome back to the David Carrier Show.

(10:52):
I'm David Carrier, your Family's personal attorney. Things are changing,
Yes they are, and sometimes and ways that are good,
sometimes in ways that are problematic. U. The good news
is that the some of the you know, here's the
thing with the this, uh, the law that just passed.
You know, I'm gonna harp on that because it there

(11:15):
are things. It's not taking away anything that you've got. Okay,
let's put it that way. Let's start with let's start
with that one. You know, for regular folks, you know,
it's not gonna not gonna make that much of a difference,
but negatively, right, unless you're involved with stuff. But if

(11:36):
you it does put some limits on things that you
could do, should do, would do, could have, should have,
would have. Right, Well, now you don't have the excuse
of not knowing what those things are because and for me,
it's the Roth conversion, is the big thing because I've
heard so much talk about people thinking, oh I should
do a roth conversion. Yeah, you probably should, yeah, and

(11:57):
and oh but I can't because it's too small. It's this,
it's that. And there is a thing called the called
the back door conversion. You put the money in a
traditional and then you convert it to the to the
wrath that's going away about I want to say ten
or fifteen years ago. I guess there were some This

(12:17):
is one of those techniques, okay, the backdoor conversion that
became popular. And as soon as it became popular, right,
they changed it. The you know, everyone who did it
was grandfathered in. But this is also the very reminds
me very strongly of what they did with the iras

(12:39):
excuse me, with Social Security. There was a way for
married couples to really kind of supercharge what they were
getting from the from the Social Security Administration, all according
to the rules. Right, So what did they do as
soon as it had been going on. We've been doing
it for decades, all right, this kind of thing had
been but on a small basis, you know, a relatively

(13:01):
small few number of people, because the word didn't get out.
I mean, it's kind of like what I talk about
here all the time, you know about follow through, about
you know, providing for your spouse, about providing for your kids,
about treating iras like this weird thing that you know,
they could alter anytime they wanted, which they have been altering,

(13:23):
not to your benefit. Okay, you know, it's all about
how do we maximize what you can do. Well, the
fact of the matter is, right, for our tens of
thousands of families who've actually done it, that's great, that's
really good. But you know, tens of thousands is a
drop in the bucket in a nation of three hundred
and thirty million people, so three and forty million, however
many there are right, it's a drop in the bucket,

(13:44):
so it's not on the radar. But a lot of
these things once they tend to become popular even if
they're done screwy. I mean, like that was the thing
with the with the social security right, there was some
techniques that were being used and all of a sudden,
and this is maybe part of the interwebs thing, all

(14:06):
of a sudden, a lot of people started asking about it,
and there was a flood of people taking advantage of it,
and as a consequence. Very quickly, within six months, they
changed the rules. So this now everyone who had done
it before their grandfather didn't. You know, they did it
under the law that applied at the time. Are they

(14:29):
bad people, No, they're smart People's what they are. Okay,
they understand how the system works. They understood how the
system works, how they changed the system. And now we're
under new rules. So okay, it's new rules. You deal
with the rules that they give you. That's what it is.
In the democracy. Democracy means what representative democracy. You vote
for those people. They do what they're supposed to do, supposedly,

(14:52):
we hope, right, but we have to trust that they're
doing what they do, so that majority rules subject to limit,
subject to all kinds of limitations. You've been watching it.
If you've been watching that, you know the sasquatch of
law go through the you know, you got the nails
trimmed and the you know what did they end it was, uh,

(15:13):
you know, a trim trim here and a trim trim there,
and a couple of trial laws. Right, that's how we
keep you in repair. And the muryal Land of Washington,
d C. That's the that's the Sasquatch Bill that I'm
going to call it that from now on, right, the
Sasquatch Bill that came out, the Sasquatch Law actually because
it's it's law now right. It's closing down some things,

(15:37):
that's opening other things. The traditional sort of long term
care planning that we've been doing for a very long
time now, that was codifyed back in the back in
the six was was when we got that rule, and
those rules are still fundamentally the same everything we've been doing.

(15:58):
It hasn't hasn't changed what we were doing. It is
shutting down. It is shutting down some It is shutting
down some opportunities that there were simple as that, which
is too bad, like the Social Security thing that went away,
and now the roth conversions that's going to go away.
But you've got to the end of the year, so

(16:20):
there is enough time to take advantage of it. But
you don't want to wake up, you know, in the
twenty twenty six, you know, two hundred and fiftieth anniversary
of the founding of the country, you don't want to well,
SISC bi centennial year, I don't know anyway, the two
undred and fiftieth anniversary and celebrate by Oh I could
have done that. Okay. It's the same way with a

(16:42):
lot of this stuff. We do what the rules say.
When the rules stop saying it, when the rules change,
we read the rules and we deliver the greatest benefit.
That's what this is. That's what all this planning is
all about. Whether it's Social Security, Medicaid, Medicare, tax law,
whatever it is, the goal is to maximize. If you

(17:05):
don't think rich people, and I don't mean you, I
mean rich people. If you don't think that, they've got
platoons of lawyers, probably brigades by now right scouring through
sasquatch looking for advantage and all. That's what they're doing,
all right. You don't stay rich without doing the taxes.

(17:26):
You don't stay middle class anymore without the same thing.
They are not going to let you alone. Okay, it
doesn't work like that anymore. You used to be you
didn't have to worry about it, right, Well, well, there's
ways to get advantage that you have earned by working, saving,

(17:48):
you know, doing all the doing all the good things.
And that's really what this is, what this is all about.
That's why we do the Three Secrets workshop. You know,
you think it's bad. It's worse than you can imagine.
And we go into that in the in the Three Secrets.
That's why we do it. Okay, you can't buy anything
at the Three Secrets. All you can do is learn.
That's it. That's the whole, that's the whole intention. It's

(18:10):
a very measured, step by step process to get you
to where well, most people seem to want to go.
That's the that's the deal. So come to with a
Three Secrets workshop. They're listed on the website Davidcarrier law
dot com. We do them, of course in Norton Shores,
Holland Grand Rapids and down in down in good old Portage.

(18:34):
And you're don't say Kalamazoo.

Speaker 1 (18:36):
Uh.

Speaker 2 (18:36):
I was warned about that. I actually said Kalamazoo a
couple of times, and people in Portage. You're like, no,
we're from Portage and your office is in Portage, so
you need to say. People from Kalamazoo will understand that
you're in Portage. You know they're close enough. Okay, sorry,
but anyway, that's where we're that's where we're doing them.
The next baseball game is with the Kalamazoo Growlers. But

(18:57):
before that, at Jumbo Park Zoo. We're having our qorterly meeting,
our July quarterly meeting, that'll be a week from Tuesday.
Oh that's coming up, and and the baseball games at
the courses at the end of the month. So come
on in, have a box lunch, take a load off.
We're doing it at the air conditioned Treehouse. You get
to take the cog Railway, the funicular up to the

(19:19):
top of the hill there. It'll be loads of fun
looking forward to seeing there. Just go to the website,
call the office and you know, make sure we've your
RSVP because it's seating's limited. We're only gonna be able
to take about two hundred people. And the last time
we're oversubscribed for the baseball game or over subscribe for
a bunch of this stuff. It really it really pays

(19:39):
to let us know what you're doing up from Okay,
you've been listening to the David Carrier Show. I'm David Carrier,
your family's personal attorney.

Speaker 1 (19:48):
David's got the how too you're looking for. Just call
seven four. This is the David Carrier Show.

Speaker 2 (19:57):
Well, come back to the David Carrier Show. I'm David Carrier,
your family's personal attorney six one six seven seven four
twenty four twenty four. That's sixty one six seven seven
four twenty four twenty four. I'm going to guess this
guy's a listener because this is a great question, one
of those questions we get. And no, I didn't write

(20:19):
it myself. It's almost too perfect. I were throwing I
would have changed it a little bit, but this is
like a perfect question, says Medicaid planning for my mother?
Who can assist me in planning for a state recovery?
Question mark? I need help determining strategies to reduce assets
and prove financial eligibility, protect her wealth and you know
wealth sometimes just an IRA and a home seeking personalized

(20:43):
strategies focused on asset protected and it reads like a
website or something. What did this guy do and safeguard
her financial well being? Helping her navigate the complexities of
elder law? All right, one, what strategy you recommend for
protecting my mom's home and savings from medicaid and the
state recovery? Well recovery is the fact that, unlike SOB
security and Medicare, Medicaid wants to get paid back. Did

(21:06):
you know that you know you get somebody on somebody's
on the Medicaid, it's like, oh, well they're on Medicaid.
It's terrible. You know, we're spending all this money on
the Medicaid. Well, while when it comes to long term
care Medicaid, right, the government wants your house when you die,
and it goes through probate. Some states they even put
most states forty three states they put liens on the property. Okay,

(21:27):
Michigan doesn't do that. Ohio, Indiana, and Minnesota, Illinois, Wisconsin,
they all put lians on the property. Michigan doesn't yet. Anyway,
here are the questions, what strategies you recommend for protecting
mom's home and savings from Medicaid Medicaid estate recovery. And
the answer is, I'm a big fan of the protection Trust.

(21:49):
It's a divestment trust. Is what it called, Medicaid divestment Trust,
Medicaid asset protection Trust, different names for it. But the
key here is that if you give stuff away, if
you give stuff away, they count it for five years.
All right, So if you gave one thousand bucks to
your kid, because you got to the end of this

(22:11):
radio show and you're like, ooh, I made it all
the way through. I had a bet with myself, I'd
give my kid a thousand bucks if I could listen
to the end of this annoying show. If that was
your bet while you went, You're almost You're getting close
to winning the bet. It's like eating the twelve hot
dogs at the corner bar. Anyway, the point is that
you give a thousand bucks to your kid. For the
next five years, Medicaid will count that against you. Medicaid

(22:35):
will penalize you for having given away the money. And
it's if you give away fifty cents legally, they will
penalize you. Usually fifty cents you get away with. But
the point being all right five years later, they don't
care if you gave away a million dollars. Well, why
don't you give everything away to your kids? Because you're

(22:55):
not a total dummy. That's why you're not a dummy.
You earned it right, why would you give it away?
In Massachusetts, it's very popular to give houses to kids
for some well I know why, because they're very aggressive
about the estate recovery. They put the lean on. They
come right after the house. You're really right, and giving
stuff to kids for whatever reason has become the popular

(23:18):
way of doing it. It's almost as bad as ladybird
deeds around here, you know, where people aren't really thinking
through the consequences. But it kind of works and other
people did it, so okay, I'm going to do it.
That's that's a problem. But what I would recommend is
the is the trust right we do the Asset Protection Trust,
the Medicaid Protection Trust, Medicaid devestment trust, because you don't

(23:41):
have to give your stuff away to the kids to
trigger the five year the five year look back, the
five year period there for devestment. Okay, you can put
it in a trust and retain control, practical control, legal control,
no practical control. Okay, what do you want to do.

(24:02):
There's a way to do it. Okay, we've been at
this now for twenty years, longer than that. But the
point is, all right, there's things to do. So that's
what we would do, especially if there's no medical issue
now there's medical issues, or if we're already in long
term care. There's other stuff we would do. And I
have to say, full disclosure, there are people who I

(24:24):
am now convinced I've had the conversation. I'm now convinced
they understand and have made a decision right, and I
think it's the wrong decision, but they have made I
mean I'm talking attorneys. They have made their decision not
to do this now. Usually usually I have no respect
for people who do that because they say thinking, oh,

(24:46):
I'm not comfortable, Well why don't you learn about it
and get comfortable right? Or oh people don't really need that, Yeah,
well I give you chapter verse. People do, okay, But
there is there is and I only really know one
guy who's actually I did it by a thought process
as opposed to fear. There is an idea out there

(25:10):
which I think is wrong. But I can respect the
way the guy got to the conclusion that no, I'm
going to wait till the last minute because I can
always because there are various tools that we can use
right now to do this. And he's not wrong. There
are tools that we can use. They're more expensive, they're
not as effective, but there are things that you can

(25:30):
do right at the very last minute to protect substantial
amounts of assets in Michigan. Now it's not portable. It
doesn't whereas the trust is portable, goes anywhere you want,
but I mean other states. If you move or what
have you. Okay, and it's backed By next year, it
will be twenty years of a federal law that allows

(25:54):
us to do it. Okay, and all kinds of decisions
saying that we can, So why wouldn't we Why would
we use the other one? Well, big world. People have
different opinions, and it's possible to have a legitimate opinion
that doesn't do it our way, But most of the
time it's just excuses. It's just people no interest in

(26:14):
actually figuring the stuff out. But you know, full disclosure
and all the rest of it. There's there's one guy
in Lansing who actually him. The two of them in
their partners, they've actually thought it through. How does the
five year look back period apply to her situation? Well,
the five year look back is when you make a divestment,

(26:35):
whether it's to a trust or to a kid, and
we prefer the trust rather than the kid because you
control the trust and the kid is out on their
own right. That's how it applies. Five years, after sixty months,
six zero months after you put assets in the trust,
those assets do not count against you for medicaid anymore.
Now when you apply for medicaid, we've done thousands of

(26:58):
times when you apply for medicaid, you give them a
copy of the trust. You're not hiding anything. This is
not about hiding assets. Okay, because you don't hide anything.
You just put all your cards on the table. You
got a royal flush, right, You've got exactly what you
need to get what you want, et cetera, et cetera.
There's no playing games. There's no oh, I'm going to

(27:18):
tell you. We tell them. We lay it out for
them right in the application process. Now not everybody does
that again it, but that's how we do it, and
explain how exactly the five year period ran, you know,
ten years ago or five years ago or whenever, because
we planned ahead, and when you plan ahead, guess what

(27:40):
good things happen? Is anyone mystified by that is that
like too hard? I don't think So. What are the
risks and benefits of transferring assets to family members. What's
the risk that they'll go bankrupt, that they'll get divorce,
that they'll forget who you are, that they got a
book about how to win at Vegas? They're going to

(28:01):
test out those theories, you know, with your money. That's
the risk. What's the benefit, The benefit is you don't
have to pay a tenth of one percent of what
you got to get it set up correctly. Seriously, I
mean the fee to get it all done. It's almost
always I'm trying to think of the situation was more

(28:22):
than one percent, but you were protecting ninety nine percent
of what you got. You know. That's that's how it works.
You know you do this? Yeah, do you have to
pay the fee to get it done? That's the that's
the risk, I guess of. I mean, it's the benefits
of transfer. I can't think of a single benefit. Or
maybe the benefit is you don't have to pay the lawyer.

(28:42):
But then again you're going to be broke, So I
guess who cares? Number four? Should I consider a life
estate deed or an irrevocable trust? Well, the trust, Yeah,
we do the trust. Irrevocable does not mean irrechangeable. Irrevocable
does not mean you give up control. Irrevocable means all
kinds of things, depending on the context. Could be a

(29:04):
tax irrevocable trust, could be an asset protection irrevocable trust.
It could be a medicaid devestment irrevocable trust. And people
screw this up all unbelievable. They'll just talking to a guy,
you know, he's been a lawyer for a long time, right,
completely misunderstands what's going on, right things. Thinks it's a

(29:25):
you know, like a statutory asset protection trust. And you know,
I get this long letter point now, well let's not.
And it's like, yeah, I know it isn't It wasn't
meant to be. Uh, but sometimes you know that people
get an idea in the head. Hard to hard to
communicate at that point. So no, you don't want to
give assets. Uh, well, we'll talk about it more when

(29:48):
we get back. You've been listening to the David Carrier Show.
I'm David Carrier, your family's personal attorney. There we go, Okay,
welcome back to the David Carriers Show. I'm David Carrier,
You're families personal attorney. Changing changes, that's the that's the
subject today. If you want to change, easy to do.
Go to Davidcarrier Law dot com and on Davidcarrier lawd

(30:11):
dot com. Uh, there's all kinds of the Three Secrets Workshop,
the others. If you're already a member, if you're a
Red Wagon Club member, or if you're a life Plan
member either one. Just go to the website see the
upcoming exciting events. And if you're not yet, If you're
not yet, you see how I use that anyway, if
you're not a Life Plan member or a Red Wagon

(30:34):
Club member yet, just go to the website see where
the uh you know the workshops that we're doing. Uh
we are. We are doing a lunch and learnt at Russ's.
That's a couple of them. I think we got on
the calendar. That's very exciting. Uh, that's that's sort of
a new new things for us. We're not to We're
not to the fancy schmancy steakhouse yet, but there you go.

(30:54):
I did get an email, and frankly, that's why I
was a little bit later here. I did get an
email suggesting that the that the phase out of the
Roth conversion was was pulled from the final version of
the bill. But I subscribe to a number of tax
services and they're not saying that. You know, it's all about,

(31:15):
oh my god, you know the commentary that I was
reading from the services who actually read this stuff, because no,
I haven't read the whole thing. It's a sasquatch. What
do you want anyway, I'll be I'll be checking that out.
But if if it isn't phasing out, good news, you
get to put it off some more. But but here's

(31:38):
what I would suggest. Here's what I suggest if you've
been considering the wroth, understand that there's a lot of
support for phasing it out. And if it hasn't been
phased out, like I said, glory, hell lea. But if
you've been on the fence about it, get or done,
because you already know they've telegraphed to you it's important.

(32:01):
Somebody thinks it's important to get rid of it, and
you don't want to be You don't want to be
you know what do they say a daylight and a
dollar short when it comes to that. Okay, so, but
I will get back to you. Think thanks to Steve
for the hat tip. I do appreciate it. That's how
we stay stay straight. Okay, benefits, Let's get back to

(32:25):
our email question. This is sort of a laundry list
of things that you could do to qualify for the medicaid.
He's concerned about his mom. The h we already handled
the first for should I consider life estate deed? No,
you see the life of state deed or the Enhanced
Life of State deed or the Lady Bird deed and

(32:46):
stuff like that that people talk about. It has its place.
We've done hundreds, if not thousands of them, okay, but
we don't do them generally speaking. Exception to every rule,
but generally speaking, we don't do them. As part of
a pre plan. When we're looking ahead, we tend not
to use the Ladybird deed because the trust works so

(33:09):
much better. But if we're in a crisis situation, yeah,
we do a lot of Ladybird deeds. Sure, you know,
because it's the only thing, it's the only thing left.
But it's not. It's not the oh boy, this is
the holy grail. And unfortunately, there's a lot of people
out there, including attorneys and financial advisors and everybody else. Right,
not all of them, thank god, but there's an awful

(33:30):
lot of people who think that the Ladybird deed or
the transfer on death deed or the Enhanced Life estate deed,
which are all the same thing, really just different works
for the same thing. Is really the bee's knees, the
cats meow right, the grasshoppers, suspenders. It's the best thing
ever slice spread you know, whatever fish on Friday. It's

(33:51):
the mood, super wonderful and it's a useful tool, but
it's not a solution. Okay, how can I structure a
state to avoid probate? Well, you avoid probate by holding
assets in trust. Unfortunately, there are points of contact between
trusts and medicaid. Okay, you have to negotiate those, you

(34:11):
have to steer you, you have to navigate through. But
when you do it correctly, you don't need to rely
on lady bird deeds which leave all the assets in
the person's name subject to their deaths. Blah blah blah blah.
You don't need to do that. Are there exemptions she
qualifies for that would prevent a state recovery? Well, there's
hardship exceptions and whatnot. So that's a very you know,

(34:37):
without regurgitating every possible example, I can't do that. But
that's why you pick up the phone and you come
on in. You know when we talk about that during
your one on one or a peace of mind meeting
something like that. What happens if I have a disabled
child or a surviving spouse, Well, the good news is
that transfers to disabled kids or two surviving spouses are

(34:59):
not in and of themselves devestment. The tricky thing is
though that if you transfer to your spouse, it's not
a divestment, but the asset still counts. So you didn't
get any you know, you didn't get anywhere. Really it
kind of did, but you know, it only is part
of an overall plan. However, when you give assets to
a disabled child, and by disabled we mean on social

(35:22):
security disability, okay, and it we have got a couple
of Catch twenty two situations where somebody you know, with
Huntington's or what have you, they're an automatic qualification for
Social Security. They're obviously disabled, but because they didn't have
enough quarters, they don't qualify for Social Security. So now

(35:43):
we can't we can't get Medicaid for them because they're
not We can't treat them as disabled because we can't
get medicaid for him. It's it's very frustrating. There are
some so there's some screwy things like that you offer
ongoing support or annual reviews for medicaid. Absolutely we do
when we met it when we in there. Any Way,
there are different ways to engage. Okay, we can do

(36:06):
a fixed fee. We like fixed fees. Why because now
we don't have to keep track of our hours. Everybody
knows what it's gonna cost. No hassle, no fuss, no
must We like that. The problem is sticker shop people,
Oh my god, we're gonna cost that much. Yeah, it's
really going to cost that much. And actually it's probably
going to cost more if we build you by the hour.
But you know, if you build by the hour, then

(36:26):
you get to see that we really did have to
do all the stuff. We really did have to do
a five year audit. We really did have to look
at all the bank records and check everything out. Okay,
and just pay your nickel only to take your choice.
Some people like the fixed fees, some people like the other.
And I will say that with the with the bill bolt,
sometimes it's less. It is occasionally, you know, the we're

(36:49):
not just sticking a finger in the air to figure
out what the what the fixed fee aret to be.
It's based on you know, twenty years of experience now
and how long these things take, you know, using our
paralegals and all the rent and then the annual reviews.
Those can be built in or a separate charge. It's
up to you or we can just guide you through it.
You've been listening to the David carry See I got

(37:11):
the whole question though, good for me. You've been listening
to the David Carrier Show. I'm David Carrier, your family's
personal attorney.

Speaker 1 (37:33):
You've been listening to the David Carrier Show a lively
discussion addressing your questions and concerns, but not legal advice.
There is a big difference, so when making decisions that
affect your family, your property, or yourself, the best advice
is to seek good advice specific to your unique needs.
If you missed any of today's show, or would like
additional information about the law offices of David Carrier, please

(37:55):
visit Davidcarrier Law dot com.