Its The Growth For Me ( Angie Martinez interview with Charlamagne)

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Episode Transcript

Speaker 1 (00:02):
I'm a homegrown that knows a little bit about everything
and everybody. You don't know if you don't lie about that. Right, Hey, y'all,
what's up. It's Lauren l Rosa and this is the
Latest with Laura L Rosa. This is your daily dig
on all things pop culture, entertainment, news, and all of
the conversations that shake the room. So checking in behind

(00:25):
the scenes to the grind. We are a few days
out from Christmas, and uh, I mean, I feel great.
I haven't had to wake up at four o'clock in
the morning because the Breakfast Club is supposed to be
on a vacation, but we've been working a little bit.
We got some special things coming that we will talk
about soon here on the podcast and reaction, So make

(00:45):
sure you guys are following, you know, the Breakfast Club
over on Socials because some things will be releasing. But
I'm excited to get home to my family after we
record this episode. I'll actually be driving to wear me.
My family will be celebrating Christmas and you know, just
be home, Just be home, be chilling. I'm gonna start cooking.

(01:06):
I might start cooking tonight actually, and then you know,
and tomorrow morning. We'll be cooking as well too, But
I'm excited to be with the family. Christmas is the
holiday where like all of my family gets together. So
for Thanksgiving it's more of like immediate family, and my
immediate family is kind of small. It's really just me,
my brother, my grandma, and my niece. But my larger

(01:29):
family is pretty large. My grandmom's mom had fifteen children,
not all alive anymore, but you can imagine how many
kids they have, so I have a lot of cousins
and uncles and all of that. So on Christmas Day
we'll all get together, and I'm just excited to be
around family and to not be in nobody business but
my own in the mac and cheese's business. That's it.
I'm really excited for that. So that is where we're headed.

(01:53):
But in the meantime and between time, let's get on
into the latest. So one of the releases. I've been,
you know, watching a lot of interviews and just television
in general these last couple days because I've had the
time Charlemagne sat down with Angie Martinez and when he

(02:15):
had mentioned to me that he was doing Angie Martinez
Is in Real Life podcast, I was really excited just
because Angie Martinez on her show on the radio's Fire.
Y'all know, Angie Martinez, icon legend, gets to the things
that a lot of people can't get to, and she
does it in such a caring and like wholesome way.

(02:36):
I feel like talking to her feels like a hug,
and that is one of my biggest goals to be
able to make people feel that way. But I do
feel like watching her on her podcast is I mean,
it's like Angie Martinez two point oh, honestly four point zero.
I think Angie Martinez two point oh is like it
doesn't even do justice for the conversation she's able to

(03:00):
have with her in real life podcast. So her in
real life podcast was birth after she got into a
very serious car accident, you know, one where you know,
it was really bad for her. She was going through
her own things with you know, life and death and
you know, just recovering from how serious the accident was
at the time, and it made her start having really

(03:22):
serious conversations just about you know, like life and what
life has been and where it's going and you know,
where it could have stopped and things like that. And
she's taken that into her conversations with her talent on
the podcast. So I mean and I mean it's Injibytenes,
so she's had everybody but her and Charlamage sat down
for an interview and they talked about a lot of things.

(03:44):
They talked about, you know, just career, where he's gone,
and the podcast conversation itself is centered around, not center around,
but you know, this all comes in time and around
the time of you know, the two hundred million dollar
I Heart Media deal announcement that he did, and just
you know some pres that he's doing. Just talking about

(04:05):
where he's been, where he's going, and where he is
right now. So this was a great conversation. Wanted to
dive into it. So one of the things that Charlemagne
and Angie Martinez talked about that I was like, man,
this is such a good conversation to hear both of
them discussed because both of them come from such a

(04:27):
different time in media, such a different time in radio,
a different time in interview, a different time in celebrity.
And it's like, it's crazy because everyone that they talked
about during this interview, both of them have experienced these
people personally, but in very different ways. So they start

(04:47):
the conversation, I start, but I mean, I guess this
is more towards the beginning of the conversation. I mean
they've talked about they talk about, you know, Charlemagne and
like his marriage and being a good husband and just
all those things. In one of the things that I
thought was interesting, Charlemagne had mentioned that he went to
Aguila for his fortieth birthday, which was crazy to me
because I remember being at TMZ and Van talking about

(05:11):
going to Anguila to celebrate Charlamagn's birthday. But I didn't
know Charlamagne at a time, but he talked about being
in a Guila for his fortieth birthday, and he talked about,
you know, at that time, he had begun to make
that like switch of like I want my life to
be this certain way, so everything I do has to
align with that. Everything I discussed the people I bring

(05:35):
it to my life, the decisions I'm making, And it's weird,
there's like this this this thing that I always have
a really hard time with putting into words to other people,
but it's like something that you feel. So he talked
about his wife had made this like college video of
all of his friends talking just about him and you know,

(05:57):
celebrating him for his birthday, and he said he bawled
crime after she played the video. And when I heard this,
I was like, Okay, talk about alignment and talk about
being because I'm always worried, Like, okay, am I as
in tune with my faith and my journey and is
my like passageway to hear God as clear as it
should be because there's a lot going on. There's a

(06:18):
lot of noise in what I do. And when I
heard this, I'm like, oh, no, girl, you were right
on track when he talked about you know, seeing it
clearly and hearing it clearly, Like Okay, if this is
the life you say you want to live, here's what
you should be doing. And there's like this refresh of
like new life and new energy and like basically you're

(06:38):
on track. I've felt that so many times in so
many different ways, but it's like such a hard thing
to describe to people. So when I heard that, and
then you know, you hear Angie Martinez as well, like
just talking about you know, some of her life experience too,
and just you know, like I think for people who
have reached a certain level of success, there's always those

(06:59):
like epiphany more moments. But I think for people who
reach a certain level of success, and it's not just
like outwards success. So it's not just about like the
money that you're making, the job that you receive, but
how successful, how successful have you been with actually changing
the person that you show up as in the midst
of it, right, And I think Angie Martinez has grown

(07:22):
in front of our eyes, Charlomagne has grown in front
of so many people from their generation and their time
have grown in front of our eyes. And you know,
as I'm doing things and figuring things out, like I
want to grow as well. So hearing just that conversation
and journal, I was like, Okay, this is the confirmation that, like, girl,
you're not crazy, Like you know, the things that you're hearing,
the things that you're feeling, are very in line and

(07:44):
intune what your purpose and what God has happening for
you and where he sees you and how he sees
you and not even sees you, but how He's designed
you to be and to walk on this earth like
your in alignment. Just stay step fast and keep listening,
like sometimes you push back, keep listen and then the
conversation came up about Wendy Williams because Angie Martinez was

(08:06):
talking to him about, you know, just things and times
in his past that he'd regretted. Right, let's take a listen.

Speaker 2 (08:15):
I used to work with Wendy. Wendy was the one.
Because I got with Wendy, I was really compromising myself
for a position, like I was really the pit bull,
like purposely that was my job. And she would be
like get get, get them. I want you to get
that person. You know, she wasn't enough, she wasn't doing
enough well. She was trying to make the transition. She
was trying to make a transition to television. Oh, she

(08:35):
was trying to do good good, absolutely, And it was
just it would be sometimes where like my conscience would
be like why, like and one I always remember is
Kelly Rowling, Like she was like get up, and I'm
like Kelly Rolling, like why, Like what did Kelly Rolling do?
What did you do? I think I came up with
this angle, like we we both know how it feels

(08:57):
to be sidekicks. So Homo Sorde kicked it, and then
she decided to kick the Beyonce. It's great, stupid disrespectful
shit for no reason. And I remember when Kelly wanted
to do breakfast club, La La hit me like, you know, yo,
Kelly wants to do breakfast club. But she was like
when she met you with Wendy, it was bullshit basically,
So immediately I apologized to her when before she even
walked to the studio and when we got on air,

(09:17):
And I wrote about that story in my book because
I always tell people, don't compromise yourself for a position,
Like what the hell was I attacking Kelly rolling for?
Like just because I was like, the.

Speaker 3 (09:29):
Nicest, She's just like the purest little soul.

Speaker 2 (09:35):
And I still don't even know what the issue was
was she was she gracious to your apology? Oh yeah, absolutely,
That's what I love Kelly. Me and Kelly like he's
super locked it.

Speaker 4 (09:44):
So.

Speaker 1 (09:44):
Charlottage worked with Wendy Williams on her radio show The
Wendy Williams Experience from about two thousand and six two
thousand and eight with BLS WBLS NOW very different times
and you know his life, and he talked a bit
about to you know, just understanding people differently in different

(10:10):
eras of that life, in different eras of their life.
So in that era he was working with Windy Williams,
He's living with her and Kevin Hunter Senior, who was
Wendy Williams husband at the time, who she you know,
went on to divorce. That's also who Wendy Williams had
her son with Kevin Hunter Junior. But you know, I
think at that point he you know, he had been fired.
He was, you know, doing what he could do to

(10:32):
figure things out, and no excuse at all, because I
think the whole like compromising yourself for a position thing
that's always like, that's always something that when you are
a person really trying to grow and figure things out,
you think about. I know, I think about that all
the time, like, you know, when I'm saying yes to

(10:53):
things or saying no to things, or you know, when
I'm choosing not to be involved with certain people or whatever.
Like a lot of times, I always and I consider
it a different way because I feel like I've always
been a person that like I'm not really like there's
not much I'm gonna compromise at all, Like I really
don't know how to be that way. I can be

(11:15):
very cordial, I can be silent, but I can't like it.
I can only live in like this like created environment
or space or whatever, so that things just flow the
way that they're supposed to. But so long, eventually the
nurturing I care about you, I'm want everybody to win.

(11:37):
Whatever in me is like, Okay, I can't do this anymore,
And I think for me, I've always thought about it
like that, Like sometimes I feel like that comes back
to bite me in the butt, like caring about people
in a way that sometimes they don't care about me,
or just being very considerate of people in a way
that they're not considered of me. I feel like it's

(11:59):
the opposite of me, Like I've never been a person
who's just like nasty and like could like like I'm
not coming for you unless you send for me. And
every now and then I could be a little shady,
like I got my moments, but if I say something
and I feel a way, I stand on at least
in that moment. But even in those times, I've always
thought about like, Okay, your thought process and your opinion

(12:19):
of people change, Like me as a person, I've changed
today so much as I was last week, so much
as I was last month. So when I'm publicly given
opinions about people or reporting on people, Like I never
wanted to come off as if I'm trying to just
be nasty to a person or like anything like that,
because it's like I may feel a way in a

(12:41):
moment or feel a way based on certain things that's
in a you know, the media or the cycle, but
like you get to really know these people, or even
if not, even if you never really get to know
these people, you just move on with life. You experience things,
you may get put in the same positions, and literally
your thought process changes. So even if before that it
wasn't true, it's very true, and it's very different now,

(13:05):
where like I'm definitely one of them people where I'm like,
I tried my hardest to be fair. I try my
hardest to be fair. The people don't be thinking it's
a thing. There's so many people who think I'm just
like messy, and I'm like, that's not I tried so
hard to be fair because I think about how much

(13:26):
things I've messed up, how many crazy things I've done,
said or whatever, And I'm like, if someone was reporting
on me, the minimum I will want is for them
to be fair and for them to hear me out,
so heard them right, But I think it was in
hearing that and looking back on because you guys know
Whndy Williams came on to the Breakfast Club and like,

(13:48):
you know the first interview that Wendy Williams did where
she was breaking down crying just about her situation and
her guardianship. When we could take a listen to a
little bit of that, that interview, Sky pocketed everything for
Wendy in her fight against her conservatorship. You know, I
think I remember after we recorded the interview and he

(14:09):
asked me, like you think this is gonna be everywhere?
I was like, are you crazy? Like this is literally
going to stop the world tomorrow, because we taped it
one day, it was going to air the next morning,
and it did just that. But I also remember having
a conversation with Charlemagne when he had first said to me,

(14:29):
way before we did any interview. Charlamagne had said, you know,
Wendy Williams and I have been talking. She'd been reaching
out whatever, Like he said it so casually, and I
was like, wait, you and Wendy have been having conversation
and he was like, yeah, you know, she been calling me,
this is what's going on, blah blah blah blah, And

(14:49):
I'm like, why do you say anything, like do you
know that the world would literally like be on pins
and needles to know what you guys relationship was like today,
because even when Windy Williams did her documentary or when
whoever did it, because I know she's fighting that documentary
in court right with A and E in lifetime. Even

(15:10):
when that documentary happened, there was a lot of people
who were like trying to figure out if there was
any involvement from Charlemagne and why that part of her
life wasn't depicted more with him more active, and because
he's such a big name down and people wanted to
hear from him and just see his like take on
the story, which didn't happen. So I remember saying to him, like, yo,

(15:33):
people would love to hear that, but he was very
set on like, nah, that's not for the people like
she checking in. You know, I'm in a good place mentally.
I'm just making sure she's straight. And at that point
he wasn't even doing much for her. It was just
like literally answering the phone. And then there was one
day he mentioned something about having a conversation with her.

(15:55):
So this was I wasn't on air at this point.
I was just producing the show, so I was behind
the scenes and Jess was on air. And in casual
conversation that day while we were from in the show,
Charlemagne had mentioned to me that it had spoken to
Wendy Williams, and I was asking him because there were
reports about, you know, just her health and all these things,

(16:15):
and I'm like, you know, do you think she is
well enough to be able to get on radio or
do anything in that space, podcast, whatever the case may be.
He was like, yeah, I think she's you know, ready,
And I said, can we talk about that on air? Well,
if I produce this segment and throw the oop, you
know where Jess is giving you a platform to be

(16:37):
able to say that, not a platform, but like a
segue to be able to say that, will you mention
that on air? Like are you comfortable with that? And
I was always very sensitive to it because, you know,
I understand the dynamic, especially coming from like a TMZ,
where there's a trauma in in this, like there's a there.
People don't understand that there can be a trauma in

(16:59):
working in the industry because this industry is so glamorized.
But I got it. I understood it. So when he
would have certain hesitations, I would get it. But I
remember asking him, like, you know, you're okay we're talking
about that, and he was like, yeah, I mean I
guess like people don't care about that. I'm like, yeah,
let's list.

Speaker 2 (17:15):
I spoke to Windy over the holidays. He did, Yeah,
what happened? She was seemed perfectly fine to me, Like
he's like, she could do radio tomorrow. She wanted to
hein Nothing In facitated about Wendy Williams.

Speaker 3 (17:27):
How was her energy?

Speaker 2 (17:28):
How was she sounded like Wendy Williams trying to tell
you like there was there was? She didn't miss skip
a beat. She actually said to me when she called me,
she was like, why are you answering the phone? Like
we just we just spoke yesterday, We just talked last week.

Speaker 1 (17:41):
She wanted me to be more excited.

Speaker 2 (17:43):
Nothing inpacitated about windows.

Speaker 1 (17:45):
So that clip picked up everywhere. I mean, People Magazine,
page six, Shade Room, Hollywood, un Lock, like black white, indifferent,
whatever media out you could think about naturally picked up
that clip, right, And it's because of the dynamic in
how I of a voice Charlemagne has become, but how
iconic of a voice Wendy Williams has been for so

(18:06):
many years. So to hear him talk about this, I'm like, Okay,
here's where a lot of the trauma is coming from.
And you know, people ask me all the time. We
haven't really leaned into the Wendy Williams stuff a lot
at all. I know, I talk about it here on
the podcast sometimes and I bring you guys updates, and

(18:26):
I'm very honest when I bring you guys updates and
letting you know, like, Okay, I'll reach out to the
attorneys that I could reach out to. Haven't heard anything
back my correspondence with Wendy Williams team and even her.
I haven't talked to Wendy Williams in months, like a
long time, but just her attorneys in general. What has
been you know, scarce to none because things are just

(18:49):
different behind the scenes now. And he got into that
a bit. Let's take a listen.

Speaker 3 (18:55):
How do you feel about forgiveness for that type of stuff?
Like you said, you cut people are fast, right, but
like even in that moment, even in the moment with
Wendy and her saying get and you haven't apologized to
Kelly and just learning from that, and she forgived you
right clearly. I don't know, do you forgive yourself or
do you forgive other people or do you just kind

(19:17):
of cut people out like I would even imagine with
Wendy there had to be some type of I don't
know it is.

Speaker 2 (19:23):
But you know, the thing with is like like earlier
this year, you know, we were helping her right because
she was in a bad situation. But then you know,
you see some things that remind you of that old
energy and you're like, I don't really want that in
my life. No, lover, wish you the best, you know,

(19:44):
glad we was able to connect her with certain people.
Then when you see even how she might have treated
to certain people you connected it with, you know, so
it's just like let me you know, I wish you
the best. No want the best for her, But that
was a season in my life. And I aways say,
people come into your life for you know, reasons, seasons,
and you know sometimes lifetimes those lifetime was are very rare,

(20:06):
but you know you appreciate the seasons and you know,
move on to the next.

Speaker 3 (20:09):
One, and it was influential to you like it helped you.

Speaker 2 (20:13):
Oh, man, I wouldn't be I probably wouldn't be in
the position I'm in now if it wasn't for that.
And I don't even like to have those type of
hypothetical conversations because the reality is I'm in the position
I am because that was part of my journey coming
from South Carolina. I was in Columbia at the time.
I think Columbia's market number ninety three to go from
market number ninety three the market number one being Wendy

(20:35):
Williams co host Like you who gets that kind of
look like that's some stuff you see in a movie,
you know, you watch on a TV show and be like, Yo,
that's damn near impossible.

Speaker 3 (20:45):
You would have probably done anything she told you to do, right.

Speaker 2 (20:52):
I was like, Yo, I did do damn anything you
told me to do. Yes, yeah, I was. I was
her a tag dog like not only that, I was
living with her, like living with them, like they were
giving me a place to stay. I wasn't getting paid.
I didn't get paid for like a year and a half.
But I do that though, And that's why I always
tell you the next generation recognize the opportunity when it's

(21:14):
not a pay check attached to it.

Speaker 1 (21:16):
And when I heard this, mind you, this is the
first time I've ever heard him publicly speak about, you know,
where he is with forgiveness when it comes to Wendy
and just kind of right now where their relationship lies.
I was like, Okay, he's getting to a point where

(21:37):
this is like Charlomagne, like it's weird. It's like when
people experience like trauma and deal with traumatic people in
their life. I think sometimes dealing with those people can
take you back to the place that you were at
when you were being traumatized. Right. So, like Charlemagne the
God is a two hundred million dollar deal man in
a partnership with iHeartMedia in the Breakfast in the Breakfast

(21:58):
Club and you know Black Effect Podcast Network, But in
dealing with Wendy Williams, I think there are and I
don't know if he would say this, this is just
me from the outside looking in, and things that I
was always very careful about in pushing him of, Like
you know, sometimes I would have to call him and say, hey,
can you call such and such or has she called you?
When she calls you can you a like ask this

(22:20):
asks that, but in being very careful about like you
know how I know personally he has to deal with
this situation. What I took from it was I think
dealing with her takes him back to a lot of
the times in his life that he's moved on from
and has had to move on from because he's not
that attack dog anymore. And even though he can get there,

(22:41):
don't get me wrong, it's still so different. It's like
very like healed, it is very evolved or even on
the journey. I don't know if I don't know if
I would say like fully healed because he's still I mean,
little man. Anger is a thing. His legs still swinging
his seat, so he's always going to be angry. But
I think that, you know, it's just a he's in
a different place now, But hearing him talk about this,

(23:04):
I'm like, Okay, there's a part of him that always
wanted to make sure that he never returned to being
the person that like was in that position that needed her,
needed Wendy Williams so bad that he was willing to
do and say whatever, because you know, his career mattered,
Like you know, his family is depending on him. He's

(23:26):
depending on him, His career is depending on him. So
I got it at that point. But the first time
I ever heard him say that, and even like and
I mean even to me, like in general, like I
knew that there were things going on like behind the scenes,
but like publicly, like when we're talking about it on
the show, he'd be quiet. He don't indulge at all.
And I think it's like, you know, if you ain't

(23:46):
got nothing necess to say, you don't say nothing at all,
no beef, but just being honest. But they also got
into something that was like very very interesting. So Angie
Martinez back in ninety six did an interview with Tupac.
This was one of Tupac's final interviews. It happened months
before his passing. The interview was reportedly like an hour

(24:11):
forty five two hours long. I believe Angie Martinez says
it was an hour and forty minutes long in this
interview with Charlemagne. But history has it and as she's
ever told the story and what we've ever gotten to here,
she's only ever released a little bit under fifteen minutes
of the interview. Let's take listen to what she actually
released from back in that time and what's going down

(24:32):
with that?

Speaker 3 (24:32):
So I wanted to get his view, and he goes
a little something.

Speaker 4 (24:35):
The East coast West coast thing is a musical thing
that's separate. That's a whole thing separate to itself. That's
a musical thing where we have been beefing about whose
music is better or which is this? It has Because
I'm like a lightning rod, because I'm attacking New York's finus.
They're self proclaimed king of New York.

Speaker 2 (24:55):
You know what I mean.

Speaker 4 (24:56):
I'm attacking them so because nobody's separating themselves from the
talking about how yes, they were talking about raw he is.
He's a represented He represents New York. Yeah, every time,
every time it benefits New York, he represents New York
when it don't benefit New York. Now, he's just another rapper.
What y'all let him wear y'all colors? You let him shout,
y'all stout. When Biggie came out here, he screamed out,

(25:16):
Brooklyn's in the house. We don't beat to say, why
are you starting a war? Why is everybody when I
say West Side it hurt people feeling.

Speaker 5 (25:22):
I don't think it's because you're saying west Side.

Speaker 1 (25:24):
I think because you know O me. No, not at all.

Speaker 5 (25:27):
I think it's because you know Dog Pound video came
out in New York, New York.

Speaker 3 (25:30):
And I'm not saying you was in the video.

Speaker 1 (25:31):
I know you wasn't in the videos.

Speaker 4 (25:33):
I didn't write it, I didn't produce to be so
let's say it in jail. The album was done while
I was in jail. That's separate it just you know
what it is.

Speaker 5 (25:40):
It's it's it's New York's visualizing your camp, which to
them is death Row, which is dog Pound, which is Snoop?
And which is you know, which is that whole thing?
It was all one time the New York, New York
video came out. You know, Brothers was stepping on cars
in New York, stepping on you know, on New York
like they owned their boom.

Speaker 3 (25:57):
You come out next video?

Speaker 2 (25:58):
What about?

Speaker 1 (25:58):
What about the video?

Speaker 2 (25:59):
Yeah?

Speaker 4 (26:00):
Call to me it is the best coach and everybody
in New York feel like that too. That's why they
come out here in party.

Speaker 2 (26:05):
Man, Why did everybody act.

Speaker 4 (26:06):
Like I didn't say me to say to say, Cally
is the West Coast? I never said New York And
I never said New York is the worst coast. I
just said where I'm at, where I'm from, is the
best coast.

Speaker 2 (26:16):
Why is that offending people?

Speaker 1 (26:17):
Now? She says, the reason that she's only released that,
and she's always said this from the beginning to now,
is that during that time, she felt like, you know,
if she had released the full interview, it could have
made things way worse when it came to like the
East Coast West Coast beef and all the drama that
was happening because reportedly Tupac was naming names, he was

(26:42):
you know, talking about like political concerns and like just
a lot of the different things that he was discussing
and full and in depth she didn't think would be helpful. Now,
this conversation when she had it with Charlemagne about the
the you know, Tupac tapes and all of that, it
came up, and to me, it sounds like she's willing
to do it, maybe like like a maybe, but like

(27:05):
kind of on like the warmer side of maybe leaning
into Okay, I'll do it, But I think she just
wants it to be very responsible if she does it,
because now nowadays in her career Angie Martinez the Voice
of New York in twenty twenty five, It's not Angie
Martinez the Voice of New York. She was in the nineties.
Who you know, she was grinding, she was trying to

(27:27):
get on. She needed the moments, not even need it,
but that was her job.

Speaker 2 (27:31):
Then.

Speaker 1 (27:31):
Now she's iconic, she's legendary. She can be so much
more responsible with her platform because it's her show, it's
her say, so let's take a listen.

Speaker 3 (27:40):
Yeah, it's funny to even talk about it because I
don't know. I just like somebody asked me the other day,
if I would interview Puff if he came out, would
you I'd have to think about it. It wouldn't be be
a younger me would say, of course, it's my job.
Absolutely yes. Now I'd have to say, what kind of
offering would that be to the world? Would it be

(28:02):
worth it for me? Do I want to put myself
in that noise? Can I do something really meaningful?

Speaker 2 (28:08):
You know?

Speaker 3 (28:08):
I'd have to ask myself some questions like that. It's
not just a yes, I'll do it because because it'll
be huge. I mean, I say no the huge things
all the time.

Speaker 2 (28:17):
That's what I love about you. I mean, you know,
it is so funny. Debbie Brown, who's a great friend
of mine's my good sister. She literally said she texted
me like two days ago and was like, yo, because
she loves Tupac like I'm talking about it. She's the
person that haunted me exactly. She she loves two Box.
She was like, yo, Angie really needs to put out
the TAC audio. Debbie Brown, maybe it's time then, And

(28:39):
I said to her, I said, well, you know, she
never wanted to put it out because you know, she
thought would be inflammatory. Right.

Speaker 3 (28:45):
I know there's a rumor on the internet that Puff
somehow paid me for those tapes, Like I like, I
held those tapes for all those years so that Puff
could pay me. It's absolutely there's zero truth to that
but that but you're right, that's why that's why I
never did it. And then now I think, for what
is the point Now? There's nothing there that changes history
or changes but I know people are interested.

Speaker 2 (29:05):
So I think people want to break it down psychologically
because there's this let's do it.

Speaker 3 (29:08):
You want to do it with me, you want to do.

Speaker 2 (29:10):
Like that'd be amazing, Let's do it because she you
know what it is, I think people.

Speaker 1 (29:14):
I don't know. I think, I mean, I want to hear.
If I'm being honest with you, I want to hear.
I want to especially now being so much being so
much more in the mix of like all of like
that like stuff, right, So knowing Angie Martinez personally and

(29:36):
like knowing her spirit and like we're not like besties,
you know what I mean, but like she's someone that
like looking up to and this of course, and you
just being able to have interacted with her and experience
and in real life and her spirit in real life,
and knowing everything that happened after, you know, months after
with you know, the shooting of Tupac and a Biggie

(30:00):
and like all of the conversations that happened, and there's
just been so much that has been speculated and so
much that we've had to learn and experience and hear
secondhand in the history of this conversation that I don't know,
like I would just love to be able to not
just hear about that right East Coast, West Coast, because

(30:21):
I think that they're you know, they've they had there
was community conversation in that there was let's talk about
a lack of money and amongst us as like our
community and what we could do if there was more,
and what wouldn't be happening when it comes to beef
and the back and forth and all that if there
was more. Like I feel like there's so much of
like a political stance and a community advocate in Tupac

(30:43):
that we know him to be anyway that you I mean,
you get a sense of that period right in music
and interviews and all that. But I don't know. I
just think Angie Martinez has always been able to take
people to a different place than anyone else has. And
she mentioned in this interview with Charlotmagne that her and
didn't know each other super personally. He had reached out

(31:03):
to her to interview with her when he did because
he had been he'd heard her interviews when he was
locked up, so he felt comfortable with her, right And
I mean, she's just been really good at what she
does for a very long time. So to hear him
in that space, knowing her, knowing her spirit, you know,
and just I don't know, I think that it would

(31:23):
be a history lesson that we'd be able to hear
and listen to while knowing so much other stuff that
has occurred, Like I think it might even like correct
some of the myths about the whole, like the beef,
the back and forth, and I don't know, I just

(31:47):
I just think hearing it from the person is always
different than hearing about it and hearing about the person
about the things that happen when it comes to a person.
So I'm interested in hearing that. And I just also
think too because there was an interesting put in an
interview where they were talking about whether, like how Tupac
would have evolved, and she was very honest and saying

(32:11):
that you know, from her conversations with him, she thinks
that he would have evolved like a jay Z, but
like you know, would have been really into community in
school and all that. But let's say it.

Speaker 2 (32:21):
Listen, we realized Pap wasn't as crazy as people thought.

Speaker 3 (32:24):
And also he was young.

Speaker 2 (32:25):
He was very young.

Speaker 3 (32:26):
He hadn't gone through the imagine PUC after therapy.

Speaker 2 (32:30):
Healed when you thin that was a twenty four to
twenty five, Yes, twenty four, so his full front through
cortex wasn't even full.

Speaker 3 (32:35):
This is what I'm saying. Imagine him going through how
the other side of Charlotte Mae. Imagine the other side
of Pac, what that would have been I would see.
Then then I look at the tapes and I go, well,
now that has meaning. If I release it in a
way where it actually has meaning and does something good
for the world, I want to just put it out
so people could talk about it and have it on
the internet.

Speaker 1 (32:55):
I just think it would be good to hear things
about Tupac from Tupac. I mean, there are so many,
like I've watched so many interviews online on YouTube, like
you know, like from MTV and like just you know,
different eras of like cultural history that as much as

(33:16):
I can on Tubac, just because I've always been really,
really curious just about for him to be so young, he.

Speaker 2 (33:24):
Was so.

Speaker 1 (33:26):
I don't like him when people say, like he was
so young, but he was so smart and tuned in,
because I feel like all my friends from young have
been very in tune what's going on in the world,
and you know, what's affecting us and what's not. But
one of the things I feel like as a young
person I wasn't sure about was myself and my identity

(33:48):
and where I studied all of that, and he didn't
he don't see he that wasn't him. He was very
sure about himself where he stood, what his mission was.
I don't know. I think it couldn't lighten and I
think with the right guardrails, you know. But I do
understand her hesitancy because I think people lost their not

(34:08):
I think, I know, we know people lost their lives
in that situation. People lost family members, you know, friends.
That was a very traumatic time. I saw jadakiss on
Joe and Jada, you know, talking to Tony Yayo and
Uncle Murder and Uncle Murder just about being in LA

(34:31):
with Biggie at the time that he was killed and
not connecting the two. But I mean it's the same
you know that East Coast, West coast them to dying
is like the same conversation. You have it the same way.
Every time you talk about one, you talk about the other.
But he said, he still shakes when he rides down
that street. Right. So there are a lot of people
that those tapes will bring back a lot of a

(34:54):
lot of memories, a lot of feelings for But maybe
there's some good that we can find in it that
it'll do. I think people will listen. I don't think
there's a lot of people anymore that people listen to
because everything is just so clouded and just so loud
and just so like you got to really focus in,
like dilute to really get to the cream of the

(35:19):
crop of the people you should be listening to and
all that. I think it would cut through for a
lot of people. So I think it could do some
good to Anjie Martinez's point of why she never put
it out certain parts of it anyway. I don't know
what's discussed on there, nings he's calling out and all
of that, but I do think that there are certain parts,
especially knowing how radical Tupac was against, you know, government
and the structures and the day and time we end

(35:41):
the day, you know what I'm saying, Like hear him
speak unfiltered, might just be we need at the end
of the day. There is always a lot to talk about,
and y'all join me here every single episode My Low
Riders to talk about it. It's the latest with Loura
La Roads of the podcast, my Low writers. I appreciate
you guys. I don't will see in my next episode.

Speaker 2 (36:03):
M