An intimate conversation with cultural icon Bahamadia

I had an amazing coversation with culutral icon with Hip-hop artist and singer Bahamadia about her classisc debut album "Kollage" reased in 1996, female rap camaraderie, she appeared as a guest client on Project Runway where her son, Mah-Jing Wong, was a contestant, upcoming projects,and shared her thoughts on women in hip hop .

Episode Transcript

(00:00):
Welcome to the Mother Nos Show.I am Mother No's I'm Back, Episode
number four of my podcast. Today, I am super excited. I simply
adore this woman. Philly legend Okayhip hop artists and singer Bahama DIA's nineteen

(00:22):
ninety six debut album, Collage isrightly regarded as one of the greatest albums
in hip hop in the nineties.Today, we will catch up with her
and see how she feels about today'sfemale rappers and hear what she got going
on. Welcome to the Mother NoseShow. The legendary Bahama Ya, Good

(00:44):
morning, mother. What's up?Oh Bahama Dan? Can I just tell
you I am super estatic, sohyped that you are on my show.
Thank you so much for having me. You never know who radar are you
on? You know what I mean? I listen to you and I just
I was so a stated when MsBrown here me up and was like,
mother, want an interview, I'mlike, I'm sure. Sure. First
and foremost, let me just tellyou, thank you, thank you for

(01:07):
your contributions to hip hop music.My friend, thank you, and you
know I appreciate it. It's moreof a world music thing though in electronic
and music, progressive music, youknow what I mean. In terms of
my album though, it's a definitive, definitive work, you know what I
mean. And I feel like justbeing an organic hip hop artist, you

(01:34):
know, with a progressive and visionaryoutlook on things creatively, sometimes you ahead
of yourself. You're ahead of thecurb, you know. So just being
in a game like thirty years plus, I just appreciate still getting an acknowledgement
and the support, you know whatI mean. It's just like I said,
it happens at sporadic times. Youdon't know who radio are you on?
Well, you have always been onmy radar. For those that are

(01:57):
watching that are unfamiliar with Bahamadia,who is Bahamadia? Bahamadia is so many
different things. But in terms ofartistry, a prolific, visionary artist,
oh creative, you know what Imean. I'm gonna say, I don't
know. I guess Maverick and that'sa better term for me because I don't

(02:17):
care. I think that what mytalent encompasses is more than just hip hop,
you know what I mean, Itjust is It's just you know,
whatever I do, it's gonna beforward thinking and progressive so a progressive creative.
When did you first fall in lovewith music, Mohamadia? Since my

(02:39):
childhood. I understand it to bemy life's work because I was exposed to
different, diverse styles of music comingup in my household. My mother sang,
my grandparents sang, and it wasjust always artists always been around me,
you know, my formative years,So it's just innate for me to
do what I do. How didyou get the name Bahamadia? I love

(03:00):
it well. It means body,it means original creation and am dela means
thankful in Arabic. I don't rememberthe dialect, so I just can combine
the two words together because I feellike, spiritually, whenever you say someone's
name, you evoke a spirit attachedto it, and so I'm thankful to
be and grateful to be an originalcreation, you know what I mean.

(03:23):
So I feel like that those twowords encompassed who I embody as a person,
as an artist. Could you tellme a little bit about what it
was like being a female MC inthe nineties. I just feel like,
you know, like, again,I'm a prolific artist, so I just
feel like in terms of the nineties, that marked for me in terms of

(03:44):
experience in hip hop, that wasthe last that was like the archaeo type
of like what hip hop is andeverything else after the nineties wave of hip
hop is just a resurgence of whatwas initiated because that was the last era
that where individuality, an authentic andcreative expression was celebrated on a mainstream level,
you know what I mean. Andnow it's more underground. But I

(04:08):
think the cultures in the era's nowall fused together because of the way we
communicate with the Internet and stuff likethat. You know, it's like a
plethoro artist out now internationally that arereally you know, moving the needle forward
in terms of sonically, in termsof just you know, just the overall
approach of hip hop and getting backto the court aesthetics of hip hop,

(04:30):
which was community, you know,self respect, you know more the more
positive aspects, you know, varyingaway from the what do you call it,
like the capitalists standpoint and the musicof business and music. Twenty eight
years ago, you dropped your debutalbum, Got Large, Happy anniversary,

(04:54):
Bahamada, Thank you. What doyou remember about recording this legendary album?
You know, one fun fact aboutit. It was so innate that I
didn't have and you know how likepeople artists go into the studio and they
record like a valume of songs,maybe like fifty to one hundred songs,

(05:14):
and then they picked it, theynarrowed down. Every song that I did
on Collis was like mainly one takesand it was all just what I did.
I didn't have any surplus material.And then after that, I just
went back to my life. Iwas a single mom of two, you
know what I mean, in thesystem, you know, and just just
finding a way out and finding myvoice through hip hop the platform because I

(05:36):
was always into music. I studypercussions and studying my house of music in
my youth, and my parents gotdivorced in and that that led to me,
you know, just being rebellious inthe streets and this and that.
And then from near I started DJing. And I always wrote poetry and journaled
as a child for it helped mewith it was therapeutic for me. And

(05:57):
then when hip hop came along,I was like, Yo, this is
what I want to do. ButI focused more on DJing at the time
because I was into percussions. LikeI said, I went to music school
for extint in my youth, andthen from there I just started rhyming,
you know what I mean. Wehad a batter on my community. The
MC's didn't show up, and Iknew the routines because I used to write

(06:19):
them. So I said to Rohmsand I got the response that I got.
I was like, this is whatI'm supposed to be doing, you
know. And I was fortunate enoughto have a support system at home with
even being a single mother or toowas I was afforded the liberty and honor
of still pursuing my dream in themidst of that, you know. Unfortunately,

(06:39):
my offspring got a chance to seeme. They grew up seeing me
pursue my dreams and they become realitiesand now they doing it. You know,
they're entrepreneurs absolutely, and we're definitelygoing to talk about meeling and my
genre Wong later on. The albumhas so many gems on Abahama. Was

(07:00):
there any songs on the album youwished were released? And what were your
favorite tracks from college? I wasfor again, like I came in the
industry green, you know, justjust being street smart, like even negotiating
my own deal, like I didn'tknow. I'm like, you know,
this is the opportunity of a lifetime. That's how I saw it. So

(07:21):
I was like, how can Idon't know the industry, so let me
learn it. So I got DonaldPassman's book called All You Need to Know
About the Music Business, probably waslike one of the earlier editions. I
was so greened. I took thebook. I read the parts that I
was supposed to read, the protectme from publishing and the budget part.
I took that up to the labeland negotiated even more advancement for my budget.

(07:46):
After they had David Sigerson, hewas the CEO of EMI at the
time they folded, and he wantedto take me with them. But they
wind up letting me go. Theywind up not shoving me or keeping me.
No, you know what I mean. No, that was a blessing
for me because sometimes when they investa lot of money, like they invested
a lot of money into my promo. I had like five different videos for

(08:07):
the album, think of four orfive at the time internacal. The first
tour that I did was the Fuuji'stour when they sold the ten million so
imagine coming from single mind bedroom recording, basement studio recording, and you thrust
it on the world stage, youperforming in front of sixty seventy thousand,
eighty thousand people a night. SoI still in these latter years, I'm

(08:30):
still just coming up off of adream state of that even becoming in reality.
Like I never got the gist ofme being who I was supposed to
be in their context, so tospeak. And I still tore at my
leisure, you know, so thirtyyears plus in the industry, Like I
can't complain coming from nothing and something. I know. That's fright. You
know, out of all your albumsyou recorded, which one was your favorite

(08:52):
all of them because they all werea different interpretation of where I was at
the time. Like, I don'twrite about any thing that I haven't lived,
that I don't know about firsthand,because I feel like it's a spiritual
thing to be a creative. Wehave a huge responsibility that some of the
people that may not know who theyare spiritually, or they're not centered spiritually,

(09:13):
they looking towards celebrity culture or artiststhey have a platform or people that
have a platform to be some sourceof I'm just gonna say inspiration humbly because
some people, as you can seeyou see what's happening with the Diddy situation,
yes, and the kind to celebrityculture, you know, but there

(09:33):
are a lot of people out therethat just looking for a way and they
gravitate towards the arts because it's sopowerful vibrationally, it's real powerful, particularly
music, absolutely, you know.So you know, with all that being
said, like every album that I'veever done, I'm honored to be able
to articulate it on their level,So all of them for different reasons,

(09:56):
and they mean different things to me. Now if I ever go back and
listen, cause once I record mystuff, I don't listen to it unless
I'm performing it like it's out andit's done. You know, I'm I'm
on something else, you know.I absolutely love you on Erca by Dudes,
Love of my Life with Angie Stoneand Queen come on, Behama,

(10:16):
dr girlfriends. But let me telllet me tell you something about that though.
And this is a real, areal awkward dynamic that I have too,
like being like to some people,I'm considered a grassroots, underground artist
right Dawa artists, even though Icame out on a major label, but
I still have a footing in mainstreamtoo, like relationships with people that platinum

(10:39):
artists, you know, people thatI know that I inspired, you know
what I mean, that inspired meas well in the community of the art
ston I don't want to just limitit to hip hop, because I do
like electronica music and stuff like that. It's well, Ronnie size all those
different things, a lot of firsts, and I think just being stolid with
who I I am and contempt andcomfortable with who I am to just be

(11:03):
expressive the way I needed to beat that time. And now I lost
my training thought because I can gettingour real bible. What was your question?
Yes? And how was it workingwith such phenomenal women? It was
dope. I worked with Latifa beforelight all of all the greats with Erica.
She invited me to come down andwe did that. We did it

(11:26):
that Electric Lady, which I thinkis Jimmy Hendrix's studio, So that was
awesome. Common was at the session. It was real dope. That's when
they were dating at that time,okay, and she asked me to do
it and I just went in anddid it and it was just was that
we all wrote our stuff. Idon't know if they wrote this stuff on
the spot, but I wrote minon the spot, and it was supposed

(11:50):
to be Conceptually, it was supposedto be us just freestyling. That's why
all the different verses are different inminds. It's talking about like shelters and
stuff because she wanted to be moreof a hip hop song. And then
everybody just did their take on it. But it was awesome. The camaraderie
was genuine because a lot of timesit's not the case. It's just all
about a check and the marketing aspectof it. But I can honestly say

(12:11):
a lot of the people that I'vehad the liberty of collaborating with, it's
been organic. You know, howdo you remain authentic just being solid within
yourself? You know what I mean? Like, you got to know who
you are. You have to havea relationship with the Most High. For
me, I'm a believer in theways and teachings of Jesus Christ. I

(12:33):
don't call myself a Christian because Ihaven't seen in the Bible where Christ called
themselves a Christian, so I don'tdo that. But having a relationship with
the Most High guy, that's theonly thing I can attribute it to because
it's bigger than me. Like it'sjust I don't even have a word to
describe being considered one of the luminaryartist in world music with the core you

(13:05):
know, discipline and hip hop andthen a woman of color on top of
like an indigenous woman on top ofthat. It's not too many people that
garner that kind of respect and thatkind of alcoleague, you know what I
mean. So I can't even justsay I can't. I think I would
be arrogant to just say that it'sall about me and my talent. It
was just a spiritual assignment that Iwas, you know, was given and

(13:28):
accepted. Do you feel like youget decorated? I've talked about you in
the past on a Rising Grand Morningshow and for me, I remember as
a kid watching video music Box andseeing your video. You had me hooked.
There is something special about you,Bahamadia, from the fashion to the

(13:52):
lyrics. You are the truth.Thank you. I think it's more and
then it wasn't nothing again, beingthe first to day like like the people
that inspired me, the Shy Rocks, Queen Latifa, and not even can
say MC light in terms of thebe girllism, you know what I mean,

(14:13):
the tomboy angle and everything. Yes, because you had the kind of
stuff. But then I would comeout and I embraced myself in totality them
is an androgeness person, you knowwhat I mean? And that was I
think that was forward thinking as well. But I was afforded the liberty in
my household. You know, I'mgonna tell you a fun fact. When
I first decided that I was goingto professionally do music, I told my

(14:35):
family. From the day that Itold them, they accepted me for who
I was. I told them whatmy name was. They accepted. They
was even calling me there. That'srare, and they supported me from day
one when I had to go upto the studios. I remember I used
to be taking my kids all tothe because I did radio at one time.
I used to take the kids tothe radio station. My nephew too

(14:56):
because he liked my son though theyall around the same age, and I
used to te them and let themsee my son Majine. One time he
said I don't like rep and Iwas like why, and he see it
because it's stealing you from us.From when he was real little from their
day forward. I was like,they got to be more involved when I
showed them it would what I did, they caught the bug. The next

(15:20):
thing you know, may write andrhymes in freestyle and next thing you know,
man gene sketching and wanting to do. Now look what that evolved into
with me being myself. That's whyit's important to embrace your individuality because it's
not just about you. It's youdon't know who watching you or what you
being yourself can unlocking somebody else thatyou crossing paths with facts you never know.

(15:41):
You like this, like I ain'tknow I was on your radar and
I listened to you too all thetime. I love you and I've always
felt like you don't get the recognitionyou deserve. So this is my way
of giving you your flowers. Becausereal recognized real and then we family.
I had no eyes idea my unofficialniece Meelane, it's your daughter. When

(16:07):
I found out out, I calledher, I said, whoa niece?
You're my fust mahadmadya get the fuckout of here. You know what?
You know why because I always keepa low profile. Number one, number
two in terms of me not beingcelebrated. I'm solid within myself, so
I was always me, like Inever needed the false you know. And
I don't want to say self sabotaging, because a lot of it. I

(16:30):
always would go and do what Ineed to do, and then I'm off
there. That's not my life.That's something that I do, that's my
life's work. But I'm a mom. I got other dynamics of my life
that need to be nurtured and cultivatedas well. And I don't have low
self esteem, like I never needednobody to validate me because I already had.
There was factory equipment for me,fortunately, you know. And then

(16:51):
I was twenty seven when I camein a game. I was a whole
grown woman with two kids. SoI wasn't young and impressionable. I wasn't
gonna smut myself out. And onceI saw the politics in the dirty side
of the industry, oh I wasn't. I knew I wasn't gonna be involved.
And they're on their level now.And I realized once I realized that

(17:11):
it was relationship driven, I knewthe politics was gonna be involved. I
was like, all, I'm notgonna be getting down with this, I'm
too strong will I'm gonna do whatI can do, and I'm gonna find
a lane that works for me,and I'm gonna milk that. That's when,
and that's when I started touring overseasand always had a palette for when
I used to hang out in theclubs and stuff and for diverse music,

(17:33):
you know what I mean. SoI always was ahead of the curbing.
Now going forward, you got theyears a Zella Banks and all the different
people what's her name, breathe Runway. I think her name is Breede Wing
well okay, and all those girlsthat's doing the more progressive styles of hip
hop. I love to see thedisco and electronic and house music now fusing
together. Though I feel like Latifawas a pioneer in the hip house for

(17:56):
women, but she she doesn't gether credit for that. Why is that?
I said the same thing I said, more people focused on her being
an actress than they do as ahip hop historian. She a hip hopper
first, and I feel and she'lllet you know that too. In no
uncertain way. I think she gettingback to that now. Though we love

(18:18):
the queen stuff like that. Sheanother one. She was one of the
first women. Actually, Mega fromDiggable Planners was the first established female rapper
and you know hip hopper that embracedme. Me and Google on us peoples
at the Supper Club in New Yorkand she approached me and introduced herself and
we and you know, she kindof like showed me the ropes and everything.

(18:41):
She was the one that told me, empowered me to know that the
team of people at the label,I'm signed to the label, but they
work for me. She was theone that told me that I can exercise
my creative voice for my album cover, that I can be more involved in
in picking my producers, all ofthat. She did that just because just
because the Latifa. I remember onetime I performed somewhere Wetlands or somewhere in

(19:04):
New York and she was real hugethen in the music mute on the movies
and all that, and she camedown to my show, stayed for my
whole event, came up. Wewas talking because I was like startled a
she I was like, She's like, girl, give me a hug,
and gave me and it was realever since that they liked the same thing

(19:26):
even to this day. Shante thesame thing. You know these people because
they recognized that and they understand theplight of what women in particular have to
deal with in the industry. Whenyou don't compromise your body and your spirit
and soul like that. It's ascenic route. But I'm built for it.

(19:48):
So you know, I'm mature andgracefully. I ain't mad. I'm
working when I want to blah blahblah, and you look fabulous while doing
it. Thank you. Let's talkabout today the themcies because it is a
mess, and I am probably thebiggest fan of female rappers, from Salt
and Pepper to EMC Light to QueenLatifah, Bahamada, Sweet Tea, the

(20:12):
list goes on mony. Love Ican continue isis oh man yo yo.
I love the ladies because I feltlike the ladies always spoke to me.
So to see all of this madnesstoday it behooves me. It was not
like this in the nineties. Therewas commoderie, there was sisterhood, and

(20:36):
now you cut on the goddamn Twitter. This one is fighting with each other,
this one is arguing, this oneis calling each other names. What
is it gonna take for women tothrive in peace? Successfully in hip hop.
You know, what I feel likeyou're talking about is this is a
difference, distinct difference between rappers andemces and hip hop culture and rep culture

(21:02):
mainstream the commercialization and hip hop areentertainers, so they put the culture last,
even if some of them were influencedby that's it to me. It
boils down to what your goals are. If you're an entrepreneur, business person
and you sign a deal, thenyou definitely signing your soul away. Definitely

(21:23):
doing it me too, cause ifyou signing the deal, your soul,
your thoughts and stuff. You signinga deal to express yourself. So it's
not about selling out, per se. That's the goal is to sell out,
It's just not at the expense ofyour soul and your integrity. For
me, that's for me. AndI feel like the origins of hip hop

(21:44):
when it first started, it startedout as a tool. You know,
it was rooted in youth culture.But a lot of the first wave of
hip hop is was adult stuff.And I think that's why you more substance
was presented too. Angibing on wasgrown women. When you remember before back
then, it wasn't no videos onit not even they wasn't even an album
cover, so you had to actuallygo to the show to see them.

(22:06):
Ile in the youth, I waslike, damn they grown. You know,
no wonder substance or whatever in themusic. And I think at a
certain time, I think in thenineties when Liut Kim went because my album
Kim and Foxy Brown album Albums wasaround the same time, they ain't know
what to do with me because theyhad never seen anything like me. They

(22:26):
never seen that. Even though Medusawas on the West Coast at the time,
she had her row on everything.But I'm talking about on the mainstream
platform. You know, they hadto deal and all of that. I
think she had a deal too,but she didn't get the support that she
needed. And I didn't know herat the time. So but when when
our albums came out, they werehighly anticipated the first thing. But secondly,

(22:48):
I feel like Kim's representation in themusic, in the industry of music,
right that was the most pivotal momentfor women because they had mastered the
formula for how to market and packagesex. So that's why she's been like
like her, there's never been anythingnew added to what Kim contributed to hip

(23:12):
hop again, even in that aspectof it. That was the last in
the nineties, was the last waveof individuality, whatever it happened to be,
whatever your former self expression was greedand I always embrace. They used
to remember in interviews, they usedto always try to get me to say
derogatory things about Kim. You know. I was like, no, that's
not my thing. I but Iknew a Kim. I grew up with

(23:33):
a Kim. I used to hustlewith a Kim. I know these people.
So and then the success of heras a solo artist is indicative of
the artists, indicative of the times. Obviously, it's a whole wave of
people that lived their life because shewouldn't have been successful, and she never
came in like she was this lyricalperson. To me, I felt like

(23:56):
her thing was her bottom line wasmonetary game at anyway, That's how she
came in the game. So thatwas for her. But this was my
route. My route was more creativeexpression, more you know, holistic,
you know, approach, you know, more therapeutic rhymes, more inspirational.
That was me, you know,and you know everybody here, I mean

(24:18):
so many different diverse voices, butI think there needs to be a balance,
you know, in the mainstream particularly, but you know that's rearing his
head in the organic scene now too. It's like everybody sound and saying,
everybody want to be super lyrical,and it's like, but a lot of
them are just like, what doyou call it? I don't want to
say a parody. It's almost likea cosplay. And I mean that in

(24:45):
any way that it's taken, youknow, because there had to be people
that had to bring a word ofcorrection to certain things that we to move
forward absolutely, you know. SoI just feel like, even if you're
a mainstream artist, at least puta spin on, you know, assess,
assess the markets and the demographics thatyou target, targeting and attempt to
supply something that's foreign, something thathasn't been exploited. It's a lot of

(25:11):
new territory to chort, you know, it's a lot of voices that still
need to be heard, and evenyour own, you know what I mean,
some people hiding behind all of thattell your story because there's a lot
of people that could be set freefrom there. So that's what I like
to see more of, and amore genuine camaraderie amongst women because people will
see you toiling. That's artists overall, though, because I know there are

(25:33):
a lot of men that have takenfrom my esthetic as well, I can
I can even say, like theKendricks, I could say the J Coles,
and they're beefing. It's crazy foolishness. I never thought that a million
years I would see J Cole andKendrick Lamar exchanging jab But do you think
that's more marketing though? Because you'relooking at somebody like this, This is

(25:56):
if this is organic hip hop culture, then it would extend to battle.
They got bad old leagues and stufflike that. Now they have a lot
of and they got huge platforms andperfect promotion drop the album, which which
could do a lot for the cultureand that aspect. But it depends on
who you your what your goal is, who your strategies are, and what

(26:18):
your bottom line is. But wenot goant. You know, we gotta
stop exploiting hip hop on that level, even as hip hoppers won't have the
right to do that even if weare hip hoppers. That's the issue,
and there's so many different ones.Hip Hop journalism is another one. This
is the only We're the only culturethat people can literally appoint themselves a position

(26:41):
and if they got contacts in thecomputer, they become that thing. It's
kind of like that's kind of likeawesome to be able to bring something out
of nothing because that's like one ofthe spiritual foundational pieces to hip hop culture
overall and the movement of it.But at the end of the day,
still study to show yourself for proovebecause every other genre does that. Absolutely
every other genre does that. See, they don't want me talking to a

(27:03):
lot. Oh they don't want theydon't want a Bahama da. We do
need that, we need we needmore more mentorship, Yes we do.
And but you know what, Igotta be honest, like some some of
the seasoned states men and women andpractitioners and hip hop had to humble themselves
too because we in a different time. I work with you, so I

(27:25):
gotta I gotta you know, aliberal open mind, but you gotta respect
where they all we insight and soundnow and ain't going back to where it
was back then. But I thinkthe competitive edge or the edge that we
have overall is our insight and ourwisdom, because that's what's lacking. They
got everything else down. They knowhow to get to a dollar, they

(27:45):
know how to maneuver network, theygot the cooperative economics down to a pet.
I gotta commend this generation in theone previous that they know how to
collaborate, they know how to getto a bag, but they don't have
the wisdom applied to make it whereif one of us eat, then all
of us eat generationally. That's what'smissing, and that's our generation is.

(28:06):
We're supposed to be delayed longs inbetween traditional sensibilities and what the youth culture
is. But we're not young.You're young in spirit, but you need
to understand and draw a boundary,a healthy boundary with the culture, with
the youth culture. And we're notdoing that. We're trying to catch up.
Like you had your time. Youhad your time. This is your
position, now collaborate. Who doI know? Who can you think of

(28:30):
any artists that's out currently that gotthat they collaborate and with I can almost
say Drake, yeah, he's sure, go to yeah, because Drake he
embraced the the up and coming artists. But I don't know if it's more
business than it is actually culturally though, for him. It's still a smart

(28:52):
move though, because at least hein the position to show you, give
you an example or how that canbe successful. Uh. I think Kanye
West doing it too somewhat, youknow, mm hmm. I like what
MC light is doing. I loveher. That's my girl. Yeah.
I love what she's doing. Andit's just too far in between of us

(29:17):
that I can't die. I see. I should be able to ride off
more names like Staples. It keepbeing in Staples. Yeah, we talked
about conforming earlier. Did record labelsever ask you to change your image?

(29:40):
Sexit op? I want to know, Mohamada, That's what I'm saying.
Look, my situation was so unique. First of all, I was signed
to you know, rest in PowerGuru from Gang Stars, and we got
to talk about that too. Howdid you meet DJ Premier and Guru?
Okay? So when I met thisis how I met Okay, I had
funk five had come out. Itwas all through relationships. This guy named

(30:06):
Chris down the where he was inthe fashion. He wasn't the most traditionally
handsome guy, but he used tothrow that shit on he was. He
just was always fast from forward.He could dance real good. He was
well connected me and home was cool. He found out through it. I
think somebody was having a ski party. DJ Ran was DJing it and he
found He said you still DJ Isaid, no, I'm rapping it.

(30:27):
You rapping? I said yeah.He said they looking for a female artist.
He gave me the number head Ryanand dj rans contact when it I
called him. He asked me tocome up there. I guess he probably
want to see what I look likeor whatever I freestyle for. When we
started working together. When we startedworking together, an opportunity came up for

(30:47):
him to produce Executive producer EP.We did funk Vibe over the phone.
He contacted me and it was alive past. You know how they do
like betsa whatever. Yeah, hedid that on the turntables. So this
this is how crazy this song.Okay, so we did we did phone
vibe. We did over phone.He said, I'm ripping the verses or
whatever. He passed it out.Okay, we're gonna go in the studio.

(31:10):
We going to the studio. Latersong the song start hitting start charting
and Gavin that's when they had allthe publications for that, Gavin Magazine and
all that hits magazine, all thatcharts and stuff like that. That led
to Google hearing the special Ed heard. At first special Ed heard about me
from special Ed, and then Googlehad heard about me through this girl from

(31:36):
South Philly that my sister went tojunior college with her. Cousin was dating
Google or something, and I foundout and I was like, Trey,
my sister named Tracy. I wasat Trey, get this tape. The
girl name was to Cecily. Isaid, get this take to Cecily to
get to her. Cousin did messwith Google. She gets the tape.

(31:56):
He liked the tape. Him andand Premiere. They had a show at
was not Number J. It wasone of them clubs it used to be
on. It was on Penn's campus. It's an Indian restaurant and something.
Now it's been like many different things. Anyway, in University City. He
was he they had a gang starhad a show and I went down to
me and Ursula Rucker, you know, we went down there and and watched

(32:22):
him perform and everything like that.I think Dayla Sola was performing too,
went down there. We exchanged numbersand stuff like that. Next thing,
you know, it just turned intoa thing. He submitted paper and a
lot of people wanted to sign me. I signed to his production company,
ill Care Records. He was justshot me a deal. But we recorded
Total Wreck, and I thought thatwas gonna be the first of many songs

(32:43):
that we recorded. He put that, he was like, we're doing a
video. I thought he was talkingabout the Gang Star video that he was
doing. I'll go on New York. We shoot the video for Total Wreck
and it started blowing up. Sothen it became a bit and war.
That's when it was a lot ofpeople involved, and bad Boy was one
of the people that was biting.It was a lot of different people.

(33:05):
But I wound up deciding to gowith Google because I was already a supporter
of Gang Stars and I felt likesonically, the jazz influence and the you
know, the traditional boombab that justsounded like it would compliment me more.
I felt like that was the bestfit. So and that and from there
it just was. It just itwas a thing. It's been my life
ever since then, and that's howthat happened. It was crazy. Everything

(33:30):
it was that was crazy for again, hustling and turning it relationship oriented.
The six degrees. You never knowwho you connected to all of that,
and then he just supported me.So when I went to when I went
to record the album, they gaveme part a bloc there, meaning they
did not bother me at all.I came in even my air fro because

(33:52):
my hair used to be real long, and I love let me tell you
how to add, but I wasgonna lock my hair up and I was
like, I need to get Igotta cut. My hair's too long.
This guy named Jamal he was cutting. He cut my hair. I was
at the club and it was somebodywas in there and they had they had

(34:12):
an afro. It was a girland that was a guy too, and
I was like, that will becute. Paid it on mine and I'm
like, who cut your hair?And they was like Jamal, I got
the number they got. Jamal cutmy hair. When he cut my hair,
they had a poetry slam at thelast drop. I looked in that
mirror. I was like, thisis cute. And I had a photo

(34:35):
shoot the next day. They hadto go up New York. The next
day. He was like, letme shape it a little bit. He
shaped that jawn. I was like, I'm leaving, I said, I
was nervous. I said, I'mgonna test it at the thing. So
we went to the Last Drop poetryreading and abody was like this, you're
here. They just kept complimenting.The next day I went to go do
a photo shoot with the coat andeverything that wound up being a collage cover

(34:59):
that wasn't even at the it wassupposed to be a photo shoot. Get
out of here. The photos wereso sick, and I was like,
that's right there to say, that'sme right there, even aside, I
look, I picked my own pictures. They ain't bother me at all.
They ain't bother me at all.In fact, the layout, everything I
ever did, the studios, Iwent to everything. They just let me.

(35:22):
I thought that was how it went. And then that ain't getting to
talk with with Mecca when I toldyou she was showing me the ropes.
I just had the fuel to dowhatever. In terms of that, Yeah,
and that's how it went. Andthen and then when they found out
that I was writing my own material, because a lot of time they hit
like the ghostwriters and stuff for thefemales and stuff like that. In terms

(35:44):
of authentic expression for the female voice, and hip hop. Collaza's the first
one is a definitive work, handsdown. And I've traveled the world for
almost thirty years. I still haveyet to receive my platinum plaque, but
I was ship platinum with no returnsthough, and I've been traveling when I

(36:07):
tell you, traveling to remote Sophia, Bulgaria, like these eye places like
where how did my music get allthe way around the world? Like that?
And I not be a household name. That's when I knew it was
different. But I still to thisday, I'm I'm wavering and compromising my

(36:28):
integrity and my soul, and I'mnot just I'm just not gonna do anything
financially. I'm just not gonna dothat. I also own all my publishing
as well. Good for you,Yeah, all them own the masses to
my second my third, Good RedMusic, That was the first finance project.
I was in financial ruin, andI was a God blessed me with

(36:49):
like about fifteen thousand and fifteen thousandout the blue cause somebody that went to
college was the fan in my BretBret somebody I forgot his last but he
is a huge Hollywood producer now fromfilms don't tell me. Brett Rattner,
Brett Ratner, bres his name BrettRatner. Look. He contacted my lawyer
and was like, these is thepeople that's Bahama di Look, I'm like

(37:12):
for real. He was like,yeah, I'm a fan. He licensed
one of my songs, what's itthree the Hard Way for his I think
the movie was called Dynamite or somethinglike that, something like that, and
he licensed the song and I tookthat money and financed good rap music with
it. Yep. Him. Ihad a lot of stories like that,

(37:35):
people that I ain't know I wason their radar and they called me talking
about that. I'm like, youyou know who I am. I don't
say nothing like that, but Ijust be like, for real, like
thank you God, I ain't knowBrett. Yeah, that's how my things
be happening. And people probably lookingat my social media and wondering she's still
doing it? She is she doingthis? I'm transparent though, because if

(37:58):
you ask me, I'm gonna haveto tribute that to the most high guy.
That can't be just me. I'min position to receive those blessings.
But I gotta I gotta say that, and I gotta and I hope I'm
inspiring people that's been watching me thisfar, even the people that that convince
themselves that they hate me, becauseyou know, no, you know you're
gonna have opposition. You can't progresswithout opposition. I'm saying they had convinced

(38:22):
themselves because really, all that isis contaminated love. That's all it is.
It's the level of disunderstanding and frustration, you know, That's what I'm
saying, Like, how way Iget that kind of insight and wisdom from
you? Humans don't have that,But I share that because somebody paid it
forward in my life. I was, you know, afforded those kind of

(38:43):
talks and seeing people like that andjust I don't know. I'm just happy
to be here and to see thefruits of my labor. So if I
ever, if I never physically receivethose flowers, I am receiving them because
I see the harvest that me beingbeing courageous enough to be myself here afforded
generations like I've influenced generations to hiphoppers. I'm very aware of who I

(39:06):
am in my contribution to the music. You know, that's the way I
was wired, Like nobody can't convinceme that I'm not, and I show
up as who I am, andthat's why I'm respected. You can't invite
me somewhere and think that I ain'tgonna come any like unroyalty, because I
know that I am. I wouldn'thave got the invited if I wasn't drec
that's the business part. That's thebusiness part, and I share that so

(39:29):
people will know because this game isreal. It's a lot of trickery,
you know, communications overall, butour voices, our voices, even just
the vibration of our voices and whatwe represent. That's a spiritual thing that
we're gonna be held accountable for whenwe leave here, because we're the ones
that's been entrusted by the most highguy to be gatekeepers to lead these people
where they need to be at,which is in that direction to him and

(39:52):
a relationship with them. And that'sthe bottom line. I don't play with
that, you know, honestly,Like some of the stuff was a bit
of self sabotaging because like I said, I'm a private person and all the
stuff that come with the fan fearand the public Papa Rossi and all that.
Like I can do what I wantto do. I can do what

(40:14):
I want to do. You mightsee me in the Netflix documentary and then,
which was good too. By theway, that's another one of my
girlfriend See people don't know who theydon't know. You don't know that.
And just because you don't see me, and and I'm not perceivingly perceivingly active,
that don't mean that I still ain'tin a loop and connected though,

(40:36):
you know. But whatever you know, I appreciate you sharing your platform with
me. I really do. Anytime. I wouldn't have it any other way.
I think this is what we're supposedto do. This is my job.
So if I got this seat andthis microphone, I'm gonna do it.
God has blessed me to give back. And Patti LaBelle says it best,

(40:57):
when you've been blessed, you passit on one ya that's recognized,
recognized. Why can't there be twofemale rappers in the game, Bahamadia,
please explain this to me. Whatwhy can't there be two females? It's
always one at a time because youwas just the key word is rapper.

(41:17):
We talking about industry, were talkingabout the business of music and the corporate
cod that has like decimated with hiphop culture, the fun aspects of it,
the hobbyist approach to it, thelifestyle of it wasn't as marketable on
that level. That's why we ain'ttalking about hip hop when we talking about

(41:38):
rappers, were talking about a marketingtool. And then let's talk about terrestrial
radio too, because that's a hugepart of it. The demographic of people
that support the music that's programmed tobe on from the player lists and the

(42:00):
streams and all that stuff. Whoare those people, Who are those people
targeted towards and what products are beingadvertised and promoted to those same demographics of
people. That's what it boils downto. A boils down to marketing and

(42:21):
advertising dollars. You know that you'rein radio, that's the bottom line today,
So what's your goal specifically? That'swhy when I hear when I hear
artists get frustrated, they're not playingit, they're not gonna You don't fit
the format, and you haven't educatedyourself enough to know what the protocol is.
It's not business. It's business andyou and you nothing that you do

(42:44):
even even also up this this brokemy heart. Though a lot of the
people can be exceptionally talent. Wecan see that on TikTok. We say
that on the social media, there'sso many phenomenal people that it's a really
amount of talent that we have justat our fingertips these day. But a
lot of those people going leave hereand they dream not gonna be realized on

(43:05):
the main platform because they don't understandthe business. They don't have nothing to
do with your talents. AND's primeexample. I love Sweetie, and I
feel like Sweetie is evaulting. She'sa marketing drink in terms of pretty.
You know, she's marketable, buther music is not connecting. But she
on the loop. She in theloop. She in the loop. Whoever

(43:30):
her management and matter of fact,shout out to the Sweetie's management team,
because that girl is in position allthe time. And that's a prime example
of having the right team, theright strategists, who have the right connections,
who understand the vision and positioning ofan artist. That's or of I
don't want. I don't know ifI can call her artists though, because

(43:55):
art from a traditional stand point iswhat it's the expression of life. I
guess I can call her that becausethe way she expresses herself is relative to
a certain demographic of people and womenin particularly as well. And I think
she she owed something with that prettygirl. Oh yes she is. She
found her lane now that nine toninety ninety jaw see. People don't because

(44:21):
because I'm a hip hopper, becauseI love the culture of hip hop,
and because I love rap music aswell when it's done tastefully, I shouldn't
she that should be on my radar. I'm me, That's who I am.
But yeah, I think she wantto she finally found her. It's
about finding your voice too. Sheanother one. She but she started out

(44:42):
like that. You knew when shestepped on the scene. Again, like
Kim, you knew when they steppedon the scene. They was about a
bag. They ain't try to actlike they was the lyrical miracle nuhing.
They owe that to themselves, tobe honest to themselves about what their goals
are and if the trajectory have thenbe more financial than creative organically create of
them? Who to say that theywrong? I just feel like it needs

(45:02):
to be a balance. If anything, that's all that's missing. More,
that's all that's missing. A lotof people can can can exist, We
can coexist, you know what Imean. I think it's a lot to
be learned from from those different businessmodels as well. I'm rapping too much
right now, though I need myown podcast, huh. I've been approached

(45:25):
a few times. But do Iwant to make the kind of time for
it's a lot of work? Thenyes it is. And that's what people
don't understand. There is a lotof work. You have to be consistent.
People expect results overnight. It takestime. I'm rebuilding here and it's
me and against machine. Like yougotta understand too, Like a lot of

(45:45):
the stuff, you gotta have atleast one of two people to support you.
You cannot do this by yourself.You can have the tools and stuff
to get up and running. ButI'm talking about the editing, the strategizing
that you got it. It's somuch. I know because I the radio
for a while and then I justsee that as this in the same schematic.
It's just that it's some more virtual. And I say the same thing

(46:07):
every day. This is my fourthepisode. I just started because people keep
asking me when are you coming back, When are you gonna do a podcast?
I'm like, listen, I don'thave time for this. It's a
lot, but I'm making time.I'm editing my videos, I'm uploading stuff.
I'm in charge. This is myshow, this is my brand.
So if I'm not fully in tuneto it, who will be. I

(46:28):
can't expect Joe Schmoe to come inhere and do something for me. What
happens when he don't show up?I gotta get information and make this work.
And speaking of work, you workthe runway on project. It's so
fun. Let me tell you totell me how that happened. I was
shocked to see you. I wasshocked to learn that mind once again.

(46:52):
Look so the raps you know whattouched me though? Did what's his name
him Gunn? He knew who Iwas, but didn't know that that was
me, this man when they foundout who I was, because the makeup
artists knew and the camera people knew. They was in New York, so

(47:14):
they knew. But we had tosign the NBA, so you couldn't you
couldn't disclose what it was, Okay. I kept calling on Gene. I
was like, I thought he wasin La somewhere. I was like,
he must be working his behind offnew collection or something. His wife called
me and was like, they theywant you to come. They gonna call
you because she know in particular aboutgiving all my numbers and stuff. They
called. They was like, Isaid, sure, So they got their

(47:34):
arranged for us to come and theytreated us well. Went up there.
They didn't know my genie of themdidn't know the mothers was coming up there.
We rolled up in there and everybodyknew. They knew, but I
didn't know. They didn't know thatthey knew about my artistry. And like
a day or two later, misterGun came to me and start calling addressing

(47:55):
me by my stage name and apologizedfor not knowing. When I tell you,
that was the most humbling. Likethese people, these is icons And
again it was so real because youdon't see yourself like that. I don't
know, I don't see. I'msure like it's you. You had people
that thinking out when they see youor whatever. You don't see yours.

(48:17):
I can tell you grounded. Youdon't see at all, and they think
you're being shad. First of all, you be taking a back because this
is that's what you do. Youknow, you ain't looking at it,
you ain't in it for that andso yeah, they treated me nice.
But we had a ball We hada boy that was that was a real
That was another healing experience. Youlooked beautiful, You are bold, you

(48:40):
were strong, you are courageous,you are a warrior and all black.
That level number that designed for one. And now that's another thing too.
Now you see he another one thedifferent like I think, but I like
to see him. I feel likehe experienced in summer with the experience in

(49:00):
the music. In terms of Idon't know how to put it in promotion.
I'm attribute it to time and thoughbecause you know, you gotta be
spiritually ready to be dealing with allthat fan fear too, you do,
yeah, you gotta be sound.But a lot of like the style lines
and all that anime and stuff hewas doing at first that he didn't invent

(49:22):
the color block, No he didn't, but incorporating the style lines and the
superhero my son and you know,he revolutionized that. And you see ball
Man goal to all all these names. They bit that from my son,
so shout out. I never trailblade, Trailblazer, but that's that's the
that's the the lineage that they comefrom. Sometimes you your life because I

(49:45):
feel like you were first fruit too, like a sense that you are some
some of the things you may haveexperienced in your past and your trailblazing years,
they was just see, they wereseeds for somebody else to come along
and pick up. When when youhad that much influence and impact, you
can't think that it's all about youand just you prospering. At some point,

(50:08):
you're gonna grow to there. Ihave. I had phases though.
It took me years to grow tothis level of spiritual maturity because it's disheartening,
especially when you pay for it,like I've actually paid for it into
some careers like DJ Drama. Alot of people don't know he was the
DJ for me. Wow, Iwant to take him to you. He
hasn't forgotten, he hasn't forgotten.But this is ty lib Quality is another

(50:30):
one. We went to school together. Yo is a good dude. He
cracks me up a lot of differentpeople. So it's like paying afford to
these people. But these people arehousehold names that had worn on to win
Grammys and stuff, and you stilltoiling, not finding your voice, but
you still doing the work. Butit's perceivingly not as celebrated as some of

(50:52):
your counterparts or people that can bevery frustrating and disheartening, you know,
but allowing myself to feel that atone point in my life like disappointed,
like even with God, like whatis you doing? Like you see this
going on? Like I'm real,I'm real with myself and real, what
are we doing like this don't looklike you know, why are you letting
me? Why are you allowing thesepeople to do X, Y and z?

(51:15):
And then he one time God waslike in my prayer life, he
was like, is it about youor is it about me? I was
floored, and I realized a lotof that was ego driven what I had
been prepared for that, No,I might have been a mess. I
was a totally different person than Iam today, but being able to be

(51:39):
triumphant over all those different hardships andstill be staying in here solid like this,
you know, and look what's comingout now, Look at all the
stuff that I would have been affiliatedwith. Sometimes the rejection is protection.
Mmm, that's my message. Evenpeople that I used to party with,
a lot of them not even hereno more, you know, But I'm

(52:01):
still standing. Yes you are whatyou got planned? Next? Well,
I have. You know, Inever stopped creating. I know, I
do production and stuff like that.I do, I do, I begive
ived, but also work in themental health field as well. Children on

(52:24):
the spectrum. And I'm into technologysomewhat, but I like, I love
apps and stuff. My thing issmarter, not harder. So I had
pioneered a production approach called mobile production, where you take the phones and everybody
doing it. No, but itwas wasn't really a thing back then,

(52:45):
like doing albums on my phones andstuff like that. I had a product
endorsement deal from Native Instruments. Theygave me like equipment and stuff like that,
so I was using one of theirtools at the time, which I
wanted to parlay into what leverage andto my own signature app. But I
just gotta connect with some developers that'snot willing to try to take my idea

(53:07):
because you know certain things I knowand so you know, So mainly that
and then and then producing and stufflike that. Still writing, yeah,
recording. I got several albums inthe tuck, but I've been reluctant to
to release any of the music.Why just because I need to unders because

(53:29):
I put so much into my art, and I don't want it to go
on death ears like that's disheartened itfor you to and it's it's a different
dynamic now, like you gotta bedoing a whole lot of multitasking and internet
social media. Now they even changethe algorithm for TikTok, so now you
gotta have like the poor you knowhow outdated that now? You know,

(53:50):
all the day, I'm like,every time I get it a kind of
like a grasp on something. Igotta do this. So that's what it
is. And me being selfish too, you know. But I'm eventually gonna
have to let it go. Ijust don't know when. But the way
this world going, I don't knowit needed to be soon. I did.
The last one I did was weHear. That's when I was gonna

(54:13):
do that project. That's done too, okay, but I wound up dropping
the the video premature. I ain'tgonna say premature that I dropped it cause
I wanted to, cause I gotmy own label and stuff now too.
I've been here there for it,salude congratulations saying it's nothing like having your
own Okay, it's really not.In one time, Jermaine Dupree a few
years ago, he had said somethingabout female rappers strip hop. Remember he

(54:36):
said that, and I was like, no, i'm'a i'm'a do this empowerment
on. So I dropped a songcalled we Hear with the visual to that.
That was the last physical thing Idid and in my dialed up series.
But Bahamad Yah, let's be honest. I know when he said that,
he got a lot of backlash,but look at where we are today.
No disrespect to none of the women, but it's not but he hypocritical

(55:05):
in their stance because you while,while even though the Brat was just female
artists, he had at the timeright first platinum female or to shout out
to the Brat and she write up. She's written a lot of hits as
well, so you get enough accoladesfor that. But at the end of
the day, the content that hepromoted his music was still associate affiliated with

(55:27):
their lifestyle. So that's like somebodydoing a rally with the mirror about put
the guns down. But but allyou're talking about is trap and this and
that. You can't you can't bein both of them dynamics, even you're
gonna be on this side of younot. Yeah, I think that's what
critical. I think that's one ofthe things that meet Mill was struggling with,

(55:49):
you know what I mean, Likewhen he was doing that prison reform
and all of that and and doingand I know for a fact that he
was giving community time when he wasn'teven on community service because I used to
work at this this homeless teen shelterthat he had adopted under his wing,
and he donated a considerable amount ofmoney to them and everything, and he
would just pop up and do alot of work with no campus, none

(56:12):
of that rock by hisself. SoI know he was in the trentist like
that. I just feel like it'sunfortunate what he going through right now potentially.
And you know, I just wishI don't know if you even hearing
this, but I just wish thebest for you, no matter absolutely circumstances.
Because he's still from Philly and hecame a long way. Yes,
he asked him. I respect himtremendously. Final thoughts. My final thoughts

(56:37):
is that I hope everybody beat themselvesand they you know, find out the
truth for who they are through themost I got Jesus Christ is Lord.
I gotta say that, Ain manman. That is episode four with the
Queen, the Living Legend from Philadelphia. My girl, Bahamadia Bahamadiah, once

(56:59):
again, thank you so much.Your presence alone means everything to me.
And now that we've had an hourworth of conversation, I think I'm an
unofficial Wong nos Wong. Okay,thank you, my friend. I love
so much for having me. Ihad a wonderful time anytime. Don't be

(57:19):
a strange job. I won't sayno more. Love you, love you
too, so nice. That's whatI'm talking about.