April 20, 2024 • 43 mins
Marc Stein is here with a monster preview of the Dallas Mavericks' third playoff showdown with the LA Clippers in a space of five years ... with special guests to provide further insight into both teams: Mavericks TV play-by-play voice Mark Followill and former Maverick turned Clippers TV analyst Jim Jackson.
Mark as Played
Transcript
Episode Transcript
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Welcome to the Saturday Steinline with MarkStein, presented by Panini Trading Cards and
Collectibles. On ninety seven to oneThe Freak, the official homes all Dallas
Nevericks games, hosted by legendary NBAreporter and publisher of his substack, the
Steinline. Here's Mark Stein. Welcomein everyone to the April twentieth edition,
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a fully fledged playoff edition of theSaturday Steinline presented by Panini Trading Cards and
Collectibles. The NBA Playoffs will indeedbe underway in mere moments as this show
unfolds. Orlando, coached by longtimeand very popular former Mavericks assistant coach Jamal
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Moseley, It's magic at Cavaliers toget things started tip off literally in moments.
There's also a huge FA Cup semifinalat Wembley right now that is distracting
me. I'm going to do mybest to stay focused here because we know
the priority for local purposes is fastapproaching. Tomorrow Sunday afternoon, two thirty
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Local time, Mavericks at Clippers,game one of Act three, the third
time that these teams will be meetingin the playoffs in a span of five
years, and as such, Wehave a Monster Monsters show in store for
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you today to get you ready forthis MAVs Clippers series. Mavericks TV Play,
Mavericks Even TV TV, even MavericksTV play by play voice Mark Followell
scheduled to join us in segment two. Former Maverick Jim Jackson, former number
four overall pick by Your Mavericks,now the lead analyst on Clippers broadcasts for
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Bally Sports in Southern California. JimJackson will join us in segment three to
talk about the Clippers and I actuallyhave an important announcement to make about Games
one and two of this series.Of course, those games will be heard
all Mavericks games heard right here onninety seven to won the Freak, I
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am expanding my role at the station. It's just for the first two games
of the series, but a significantexpansion for yours truly. For these two
games, I will be joining theone and only Chuck Cooperstein as Chuck's side
by side analyst for the Freaks broadcastsof the first two games of this series
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in LA in the building which stubbornscribes like me still refer to as Staples
Center. Cannot wait. I haveonly done radio color once before in my
life at the NBA level. Afew years back, Sean Grandy, the
radio play by play voice of theBoston Celtics. He was in town here
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in Dallas his longtime partner Cedric Maxwell, of course Cornbread Maxwell NBA Finals MVP
in nineteen eighty one. Mister Maxwellwas not on that trip, so Sean
Grandy asked me to join him.Sat in with Sean for that Celtics Mavericks
regular season game. But this isthe playoffs, and I hope, Chuck
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hope, mister Cooperstein understands that hewill have to carry me just like Sean
Grandy did years ago. But seriously, a new, new and fun experience
for me, and in the processthat means I get to connect with you
again here on ninety seven to wonthe freak both Tomorrow afternoon Game one Tuesday
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night Game two, nine pm localstart time for that one. So,
and let's be honest, we mightbe looking at the tastiest first round series
of them all, this third installmentof Mavericks Clippers. We had the series
in the bubble in twenty nineteen twenty, that was just Lucas's second season in
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the league. I was fortunate enoughto be among the small handful of reporters
who lived in the NBA bubble atWalt Disney World in Orlando, so I
had the privilege of being there inperson when Luca hit that fame buzzer beater
from the left wing to seal oneof the Mavericks wins in that series.
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And then, of course, theteam's met again the following season, crazy
series seven games. The road teamwon the first six games before the more
experienced Clippers finally closed it out witha home win in Game seven. And
now here we are again. Itis a series that has the whole league's
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attention. I think that's fair tosay, although I do feel it's a
must to add here. Throw inBucks Pacers in the East, Nick seventy
six ers in the East, andI would say especially Timberwolf's sons in the
West. All three of those matchupshave the potential to be quite tasty as
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well great potential to be great.And now I've mentioned four of the first
eight for a V eight first roundmatchup, and that's without even bringing up
the Nuggets meeting the Lakers again,the defending champions from Denver playing host to
Lebron James, Anthony Davis and co. Although this time it's Round one as
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opposed to the Western Conference Finals aswe saw last season, So this first
round lots to laser in on.Besides Mavericks Clippers, and I know everybody
wants to know the status of KawhiLeonard. We still don't have an official
ruling on his availability for tomorrow's Gameone. It's a huge variable and at
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this hour still remains an unknown.My gut instinct, if you want to
trust that, that's your call.Again, this is purely a gut instinct.
Reading the tea leaves my gut sayswe won't see Kawhi Leonard before Game
two. But even if he isable to play Game one, even if
it has to wait until Game two. To me, the much larger question
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is how close to full speed Kawhican he possibly be. Kawhi Leonard has
not played in a game since lateMarch. He basically has had no contact,
no on court basketball contact for threeweeks. And we all say it,
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Kawhi is a robot. Kawhi isa cyborg. He'll come back and
be his usual havoc wreaking self.I'm not sure that he can step into
that speed and roll now that he'sthirty two. Maybe I will come to
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regret saying that out loud, ButI think the Clippers, I think they
know that they need something resembling Kauhi'sbest at this stage of his career to
deal with one of the league's hottestteams. The Mavericks had the fourth best
record in the league after the AllStar Break eighteen and nine. And remember
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they basically surrendered the last two gamesafter getting to fifty wins and after it
became apparent that they were pretty muchlocked into the number five seed. Only
Boston, Denver, and Oklahoma Citywere better than this Mavericks team since the
All Star Break. So is KawhiLeonard going to be healthy enough to lead
a Clippers team? And yes,there are obviously three other future Hall of
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famers on this roster, Paul George, who needs no introduction to MAVs fans
after his role in the first twoplayoff matchups between these teams. They added
James Harden this season. Russell Westbrookis there. Now we'll get into this
with Jim Jackson in the third segment. How the Clippers actually have two Elite
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six men in both Russell Westbrook andNorman pal But you can say all those
names. This is a team thatstill needs to be led to match what
Luka Doncic and Kyrie Irving are goingto throw at them. As a duo,
Luca and Kyrie have won raves forthe duo that they have become after
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last season, after it started sobadly only five and eleven in uniform together
after last season's trade deadline, andof course the Mavericks didn't even make the
playoffs. They sank all the wayto eleventh in the West. But right
now you've got Luca and Kyrie functioningat peak capacity as a duo, and
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on the Mavericks side, apart fromTim Hardaway Junior, who is not yet
with the team in La due towhat the team is listing is an illness,
Dallas is pretty much at full strength. All signs point to Derek Lively,
the second being able to make hisreturn to the court in Sunday's Game
one. Lively, of course,he missed the final eight games of the
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regular season with a spraying knee,much like Kawhi Leonard. We last saw
Derek Lively play in late March,and it must be said, I don't
even know how he is doing it, because Derek Lively is also dealing with
great personal tragedy. His mother,Kathy Drysdale, recently passed away after a
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very painful and difficult battle with cancer, and I just I continue to be
amazed by what we see from DerekLively the second, how this young man,
at a mere twenty years old,how he is coping with all these
things on and off the court,because this is not the first injury he
has had to face as a rookie. He addressed the team at a morning
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practice late in the regular season,which ended up being just mere hours before
he lost his mother. Earlier thisweek, there was a service for Kathy
Drysdale. The Mavericks did not practiceWednesday, so everyone who wanted to could
attend the service. I'm told thatmany of Lively's teammates were there with him
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to support him in these unspeakably difficultcircumstances. I just, I'm absolutely in
awe of Derek Lively and how he'shandled everything that gets thrown at him.
Everyone knows the story of how closehe was with his mother. They lost
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Derek's father, He passed away ata very young age, and I can
tell you I was there in Indianapolisin February at All Star Weekend. Derek
Lively there for the Panini sponsored gamepitting first and second year players against each
other, which has now done ina tournament format, but Lively is in
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the Young Stars Challenge representing the Mavericks. You saw him at All Star Weekend.
He was just giddy to be there, and his mom was there and
they had You could just see herpride in seeing her son reach this stage
in his rookie season. And KathyDrysdale, of course we should mention great
player in her own right at PennState. She later worked for the seventy
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six ers, and again I justcannot imagine what her son is going through
right now. So I want todedicate this show to the memory of Kathy
Drysdale, and I want to wishwith as much gusto as possible, I
hope that Derek Lively playing in thisseries, which now appears apparent, that
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coming back joining this team, tryingto carry on with his day job,
hopefully somehow that brings some small measureof peace to Derek Lively the second as
he negotiates this absolute the incredibly complicatedperiod in his life, and man,
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it's a lot. There is nothere is no easy way to shift back
to basketball or focus on basketball afterthat. We will try, because Derek
Lively is trying right now. Andthe Mavericks, of course, they flew
to Los Angeles last night. Theyare scheduled to practice this afternoon at USC.
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That session is due to start atroughly two pm Our time noon local
time, twenty six ish hours beforethe game takes place against the LA Clippers.
A crucial game one of course,whether we see Kawhi Leonard or not
will be a huge, huge swingfactor in that game. And I think
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another major factor something that we haveto keep our eye on PJ Washington.
It will be the first playoff gameof his career, and I want to
play a short little clip from PJWashington. He was speaking to MAVs reporters
earlier this week, and it's notlost on PJ Washington the questions being thrown
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at him. He knows this isgoing to be a massive step up onto
the largest stage he's ever played on. PJ Washington was asked how much playoff
basketball he's watched in his past.I'm gonna be honest with you, I
didn't really watch a lot of playoffbasketball because I wasn't participating, so kind
of pissed off about that. ButI'm here now, so good. A
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lot of questions that he's going tohave to answer, and they can only
be answered on the floor, becauseyou know that the Clippers are going to
try everything they can. I don'tknow how you do it. It's not
easy to take away both Luca andKyrie, but you know that the Clippers
are going to try to force theMavericks shooters who surround this star duo.
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Will PJ. Washington be able tomake shots? Will Dante Exum be able
to find his same level of effectivenessthat we've seen at various points in the
season. Well, Derek Jones Junior, who is such a crucial element of
the Mavericks defense, will he makeenough shots to stay effective and stay off
the floor, because you know theClippers are going to try to put the
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ball, force the ball into thehands of these players and make them make
shots. And it's a critical elementof the Mavericks' success in their series.
They've had the number one defense inthe league during this amazing run. When
they went sixteen to two to getto fifty wins. But okay, well
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a is how close to that levelof defense can they play in this first
round series against the Clippers, andthen the role players have to make shots.
One of the Clippers advantages and isTac Franco spelled this out beautifully in
his piece for D magazine this week. One advantage that the Clippers certainly do
have is more accomplished shooting on theperimeter, more reliable shooting on the perimeter
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if you look into the statistics.So how the Mavericks role players shoot the
ball gonna be a crucial element thatdetermines what happens in this series. All
right, we are gonna grab abreak. Very soon. We will be
joined by Mavericks TV play by playvoice, Mark Followel, Jim Jackson coming
up in the third segment. Tonslots more MAVs Clippers playoff preview that's next
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here on ninety seven. Won thefreak the hook shots shot. Look at
at your little spie. That isa beauty looking It's a great class the
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man who came Puss tell you gif. It's the purty great to sec you
shoes? Why don't turn I seeyou you're I made a toy, he
says. Let the girl you makecount the pain. It's turning into way
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shop. Sai, you'll make thisfor Jesse. I think anyone who listens
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to this show recognizes that voice.But just to make it official, let
us formally welcome in. My goodfriend Mark Followell, TV play by play
voice for the Dallas Mavericks are BallySports Southwest colleagues. They had like a
three minute follow Well highlight reel thatthey played plays the year pregame show and
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postgame show on the last day ofthe regular season, so we wanted to
We wanted to start this off witha little bit of that flavor. Mister
follow Well, I am guessing youare playoff focus, playoff ready, and
eagerly awaiting this series. Playoff focused, eagerly awaiting. My notes aren't all
ready for the series yet, sincemy first broadcast is not until Tuesday night,
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will the giving way to national networkexclusivity as you probably know tomorrow,
But we'll be up and running onValley on Tuesday night for Game two and
doing games two, three, five, and six. And it's a pleasure
to talk to you today. Bythe way, it's great to be on
the show. So look, Idon't need to tell you the history between
these teams. This is Act threein the trilogy. For you, what
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jumps off the page most? Whatare you most carey about as these teams
get ready to hook up yet again, Well, the fact that they haven't
played each other since December, andso the relevance of that, of course,
is that the Mavericks have gone apretty significant change and personality and what
makes the team tick since then,and that of course is the acquisitions of
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Gafford and PJ. Washington Junior havechanged the dynamic of the Mavericks. They're
a bigger, better rebounding team,a bigger, better defensive team now,
and a more successful team when itcomes to not only defending the paint,
but scoring in the paint. Sothe fact that the team has changed so
much, the Clippers haven't seen thisiteration of the Mavericks, and for that
matter, you know, Kyrie Irvingwasn't healthy the last time that these two
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teams played as well, back inDecember. So just the fact that the
Mavericks looked like so much of adifferent team compared to the last representation that
the Clippers saw of the MAVs,and so that's that's probably the thing I'm
most curious about. And then justto see, you know, how all
of this plays out, and aseries against a team that in the past
certainly bedeviled the MAVs with their physicalplay and toughness and grit and playoff experience.
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You're with this team everywhere it goes. And actually when the one in
five skid in early March, Iwas actually out of the country. I
was on England. I was inEngland on a little soccer getaway, so
I missed a lot of that.Just if you could paint a picture for
us, what how worrisome was themood then, because I don't think after
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five losses in six games that anybodywas projected a sixteen and two surge to
fifty wins from that point. Well, I felt like, as I look
back on it, that the moodgot worrisome after the second loss to Indiana,
which was the fifth loss in sixgames. That night, the mass
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played at home, as you know, Mark, and that was their second
game of a three game homestand andif you kind of if you look back
at the losses that they had,well, the first loss to Indiana on
the road trip was the end ofa seven game winning streak, so I
don't think anybody panicked there. TheCleveland game was a game that they were
poised to win and then Max Threwssaid a fifty nine foot shot, and
you know, what are you goingto do about that? I don't think
there was any panic. And losingto Boston, Boston's the best team in
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the league. Then they came home, first game after a long road trip,
Well you can kind of rationalize thatthey didn't play well against Philadelphia,
but you could also say it's thefirst game, you know, the draded,
first game after a long trip.I think playing the way that they
did against Indiana on Tuesday night,March fifth, having a team meeting after
the game, which included players andcoaches and the mood going from before the
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game, Jason was asked some questionsabout the rotation and the lineups, and
the starting lineup in particular, becausethey were on a stretch of not having
lead at halftime for several games ina row at that point, and Jason
didn't really seem to want to entertainthe idea. You know, why would
I change the lineup? It's justa few games, and we're trying to
look at different things, and sothere doesn't seem to be any need to
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me to change the lineup. Andthen after the game, after they lost
that game to Indiana and frankly didn'tplay very well, the mood of the
press conference was everything is on thetable. Lineups are on the table,
rotation changes are on the table.We'll look at everything over the course for
the next few days before our nextgame against Miami. And obviously they made
a significant change with two fits ofthe starting lineup being replaced, with Derk
Jones Junior and Daniel Gaffer going intothe starting lineup, and they made a
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rotation change at that point to thedegree that whenever both were healthy and this
hasn't been the case the whole way, but Gafford and Lively were playing consistently
forty plus minutes from that point forward, So obviously, to me, that's
what the mood was like. Everything was, well, we can explain
all this, and we're trying tofigure it out. And then that second
Indiana game there seemed to be adramatic change and moved from how things were
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talked about in position before the gameto the urgency of we're looking at everything
after the game, and obviously thethings that they looked at paid dividends.
Mavericks TV play by play voice MarkFollowell joining us here on the Saturday Steinline
on ninety seven to one The Freak. You know, that's a great point
that you just made, Like theway that thing started. We look at
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it as this massive crisis, butreally it was the Philadelphia and Indiana games
that turned it into a crisis.I mean, you talk about Max Struce,
I've got Cleveland Orlando on the TVhere in the studio as the Calves
in Orlando get the playoffs underweight.The buzzer beaters we've seen this season Strews
and then Kyrie hitting the lefty,even the lefty runner from twenty to beat
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Denver, I mean just that,I mean, we've both been doing this
a long time. I've never seenI mean, those might be the two
craziest buzzer beaters that I can remember. I mean, I don't know that
I can top those, and theyboth happened within a few weeks span.
Well, you know, I guessif I were going to throw anything out
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there in recent memory, Lucas doubleclutch one handed shot that was a three.
He took off from outside a threepoint line, landed inside the line.
That's where you take off, asyou know. And that was in
the season where you didn't have fansin the stands completely yet, So that
was against Memphis. If you rememberApril of twenty twenty one, and maybe
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look on this show, I knowthat there will never be a time when
it's past eight that throws some loveto number forty one. We'll always want
to do that. And if yourecall his buzzer beater at Madison Square Garden
that remmed out, hit way off, high off the board and then came
back down that he refused to celebrateeven after all of his teammates ran out
of the floor back in twenty fourteenat Madison Square Garden. Maybe that's maybe
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that one of the wilder buzzer beatersin recent memory. But those two shots
Struce and Kyrie Irving were amazing.And the crazy thing about that Cleveland game
is, you know, the Matshad a ten point lead and they took
the lead Cleveland did. Cleveland tooktheir initial lead. They went up by
three when Donovan Mitchell with about thirtythirty five seconds to go somewhere in that
ballpark, hit a three that bankedin, hitting the backboard above the square.
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It didn't even land in the square. It was it was a it
was a it wasn't like a realit wasn't a wing bank shot. It
was something from a lot closer toout front, and it just hitted a
strange angle above the square and fellin, and that put Cleveland in front.
The Mavericks then scored, forced aturnover, got the PJ. Washington
basket to put them in front withtwo seconds to go, and the rest,
as they say, is history.But yeah, that was certainly that
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was a wild time in Madge Land. No doubt. You've had a front
row seat for the Luka Doncic,Kyrie Irving partnership blossoming into what it is
now, which is a duo thathas the attack of the whole league.
Maybe just share with us some ofyour reflections of the way, you know,
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what these guys have been able toachieve, because you know, you
remember in the preseason the maps goall the way abroad, two games in
n Abu Dhabi, one game inSpain. It was supposed to be,
Hey, they're going to have awhole training camp together, they owned up.
They didn't even end up playing sevenminutes together in the preseason, so
they really didn't have the preseason,and of course Kyrie had the two long
(26:27):
term injuries. But just to seewhere they are now, you've had probably
the best advantage point of anybody.Well, I think there's just a real
love and respect for each other's games. I think that there's a recognition on
the part of both players that theysee in the other individual the fact that
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you know, collectively they can accomplishsome special things. So I've seen that.
I've seen two players last year,Mark who through no fault of their
own, they were trying, butthey were playing to me like two talented
individuals who were doing the best thatthey could to throw things together on the
fly. And as you know,that's very difficult. And I've just seen
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a very cohesive duo this year whohas very good chemistry and and intangible ways
that are a little bit harder todefine, but they have a chemistry of
respect for each other's games. Andthen they're playing off each other too,
And by that I mean there it'snot one guy has the ball and the
other guy stands in the corner.Or your turn in my turn, it's
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you know, there's offensive actions thatinvolve both individuals where it's one player screens
for the other or something along thoselines, where they're getting the defense and
conflict and forcing the defense to makechoices and playing off each other rather than
just one guy has the ball andthe other stands in the corner. So
I think there's there's tangible things thatyou can see from an XT and O
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strategy standpoint that have developed, andthere's just intangible things of you know,
two guys who have own closest teammatesand closest brothers and closest players, and
it's been really a lot of funto see. All right, last thing,
and then I'm going to let yougo. And I hope this isn't
too painful a question, but I'mnot sure that you are. Many many
many fans here realize how hard itis on you when you don't get to
(28:15):
do a game. And as yousaid, I think you get two,
three, five, and six,But these other games will all be national
exclusives. So how are you goingto cope Game one as just a mere
spectators. It's not it's going tobe tough, you know, My feeling
on that is when the schedule comesout in August and you know way ahead
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of time that, hey, you'renot going to do the opener when Dallas
plays San Antonio, the Wimby debut, or this game or that game or
Christmas ight in Phoenix. I mean, you know this way ahead of time.
There's no surprises, there's nothing that'sout of the ordinary. I went
through and I will leave open thepossibility that my memory isn't completely correct on
this, But in nineteen years,my nineteenth year doing the TV broadcast after
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radio for six years before that,so nineteen years of TV. This is
the fourteenth time the Maps that madethe playoffs. So in the previous thirteen
first rounds, I only recall losinggames to an ABC national exclusive when the
Mas and Spurs played a Game sevenin twenty fourteen, When the Maps and
Clippers played a Game seven in twentytwenty one and the famous bubble double overtime
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Lucas stepped back to win it atthe at the end the bang bang called
by Mike Breen. So we've onlylost three games to ABC National exclusives in
my time that I recall the firstround playoff series. So to lose two,
that's you know, and to findout four days before the series starts.
That's a big bummer. So howwill I cope? Maybe I'll listen
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to some Coop on the radio hereon ninety seven to one of the Freak.
Always good to listen to Coop,and here is outstanding broadcasting work.
And you know, I'll be takingnotes and looking for things that I think
will be relevant to bring to thetable on the broadcast on Tuesday. And
I don't know, maybe I'll doplay by play for the Dogs and the
Wife at my house so we'll see. Yeah, well, you probably didn't
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hear this bad news in the firstsegment. I'm gonna beat you. I'm
gonna be Coop's color man for thefirst two games, so you know,
that's that's great news. A matterof fact, I'm careful that if that's
your if that's your choice tomorrow,be careful. Well, that's well,
that has elevated the possibility of itbeing my choice. And I guess I
was aware earlier in the week thatthis was possible, but I was not
aware that this is over the finishline that you're doing that. So uh,
(30:30):
you know, love your work onBally that you do on pre and
post games for us, and welcomefurther to the world of Dallas Maverick's game
broadcasting. It's a pleasure to haveyou with us. Well, the pleasure
was ours to have you on thisshow. Everybody, Mark Mark Followell,
who of course needs no introduction.You guys heard the voice, you knew
instantly who it is. And ashe said back in his normal press row
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perch for game two when Bally's hasthe game too broadcast Tuesday night, I
will see you in La my friend. Yo. Delight to talk to you
and have a great weekend, andwe'll see you very soon. All right,
there, he goes MAVs TV playby play voice Mark Followell. Next
up, we've got former Maverick JimJackson to give us the clipp review.
(31:14):
How things look on the other sideof this series. That's next here on
ninety seven, Won the Freak?Why has that been dealing with inflammation for
almost three weeks and his right knee. He's doing everything, Our medical staff
is doing everything to get the inflammationdown so he can play. Progress has
been made, but more progress needs. The inflammation needs to continue to do
(31:38):
so he can do functional basketball movements. We're hopeful it's going to get there
in terms of practice participation under you, guys, vast ty. He's able
to do all the mental preparation partof it, the film study, the
personnel review, hasn't done any contact, and we'll just take it day by
(31:59):
day. And I know from yourguys standpoint, you know, you guys
have to ask the questions. Theone thing you know share with you is
that inflammation's unpredictable. So it's we'dlove to have a crystal ball, and
Kahi would love to have a crystalball and know exactly on this day.
But just you just control in control, and hopefully hopefully the inflammation reduces in
(32:20):
a short amount of time and he'sback on the court. Let's you go.
That was Clippers President of basketball OperationsLawrence Frank speaking to the LA media
on Thursday. It's the closest thingwe have to an official update on Kawhi
Leonard. We'll no more closer togame time Sunday. That's my best forecast.
(32:42):
Now let's go right to our interviewwith former Maverick Jim Jackson. Let's
get Jim Jackson's preview of the Clippersside of this series. Guys, I
gotta tell you, I am sohappy about this closing segment this afternoon to
at this up with our next guest. He is not only perfectly positioned to
(33:05):
help us preview the Clipper side ofthe equation in this series, but he
is also a former Maverick, thefourth overall pick in the nineteen ninety two
NBA draft out of Ohio State.He went on to play for eleven more
teams after that, which was anNBA record until Ish Smith got to thirteen
(33:27):
and broke it. But you seehim now, you see him a ton.
He's one of the top broadcasters inthe sport NBA the college game,
and he's the lead analyst for theClippers on their Ballet Sports West coverage.
A hearty welcome in to the oneand only Jim Jackson. How are you,
sir? Beautiful day is out oneof the better times of the year.
(33:52):
You are fully an LA guy,now, aren't you. Yeah?
Yeah? But I've been coming out, you know, Mark, since I
was a rookie. This is whereI would train in the summer. Good
friend of mine, Tracy Murray,had a place here, so I would
come and stay with Tracy. Wewould go train play UCLA the end of
my career with the Lakers, SoI've been kind of part of the LA
(34:13):
community off and on, you know, since I got into the league.
So it just made sense that Iended up back here a few years back.
So let's just dive into it.Mavericks Clippers Act three. To you,
besides the obvious, which is KawhiLeonard's health, what is the most
important swing factor in this series?Well, you just said it, it's
(34:36):
Kawhi's health. At the end ofthe day, Mark, you know,
you need your best players to play, in particular lead against this Dallas Maverick
team that's kind of retooled, youknow, the Clippers, who I worked
for. We were able to wintwo out of the three games, but
those games were played before you know, the year turned of twenty twenty four.
Last game was twelve twenty and twentythree in which the Clippers, but
(35:00):
the roster construction for the Mavericks istotally different than at that point. So
yes, you can take some dollarsif you're the Clippers in that you were
able to win the three game seriestwo to one, but you're not playing
and going against the same Maverick teamalternatively in defense what they had to offer.
(35:21):
So it's a little different strategy goinginto the playoffs this year versus this
team. Then it wasn't a regularseason. And look, the reality is
none of us know about Kawhi.We're not going to know probably until closer
to the game time, if he'sable to go in Game one, and
then there's the whole question of howclose to full speed Kawhi is he even
(35:43):
going to be if he's able toplay in Game one or Game two or
whatever it is, because we haven'tseen him since the end of March.
But I want to put that aside. There was the stretch where the Clippers
looked unbeatable. This team was twentysix and five, and then since the
All Star break only fifteen and fourteen. Dallas was actually the fourth best team
in the league after the All Starbreak at eighteen and nine. Clippers more
(36:06):
middle of the pack. From yourseat, what changed with this Clipper team,
It's really hard to pinpoint because wewere in a lot of games that
I thought we should have won,especially down the stretch. The energy level
I thought tailed off a little bitafter All Star break because this team kind
of you know, veteran laden teamkind of found their stride, proved what
(36:30):
they could be. Not to saythat they just laid things and said,
Okay, we're waiting for the playoffsor All Star break to be over into
the season. But I just thinkthe energy level wasn't as quite as high
as it was when James came inat the beginning of the season. Kind
Of during that time period of therecord that you talked about, it was
(36:51):
a different feeling in the locker room, on the court, and some of
the execution side of the things weren'thappening. With the Clippers turning the ball
a little bit over more teams werescoring at a higher rate. So all
these teams go back to energy andeffort, not extras and oh not execution.
It's not it's a lack of executionmaybe on a defensive end and doing
(37:14):
a little things offensively that got themto that point where they were one of
the better teams in the league.Jim Jackson, the former Maverick and now
Clippers TV analyst for Bally's Sports West, joining us here on the Saturday Steinline
on ninety seven to one. TheFreak, presented of course by Panini trading
cards and collectibles. So there's somuch talk here in Dallas about the Mavericks
(37:37):
playing the Clippers for the third timein five years and what this means for
this franchise. From the Clippers perspective, how do you think they feel about
having to see Luka Doncic again again, only, you know, only five
years they got to deal with himfor the third time and now he's got
Kyrie or side. Yeah, yeah, yeah, you know it's different because
(38:01):
it's free. The defensive players,as Kawhi and Paul George have been in
the past, they couldn't do anythingwith Luca. Nobody could. I mean
last year Luca averaged maybe close toforty points a game. Okay, because
what you try to do is makeLuke in any player in this situation.
Mark, you've been around this along enough to understand this. A player
(38:22):
like Luca down to skyrieor you can'tstop. They're gonna have the ball in
their hands too much. It's justlike trying to stop Paul George or Kawhi
Leonard or James Harden. From thatperspective for making play James, what you
try to do is make him lessefficient and not give up plays because when
you play against Luca like Yoki,where he really beats you is when you
(38:45):
overhelp, over commit, and andhe beats you with the past. And
I really also wanted to ask youabout Russell Westbrook. I don't think he
gets you know, it's weird withthe Clippers because they have two great six
men with Norman Powell and right RussellWestbrook. But I don't know. I
mean warm Powell has the more impressivestats, but to me, Westbrook has
(39:06):
become the heartbeat of that team andthe Clippers I think they're forty five and
twenty when Russ has been in uniformthis season. So what kind of role
do you foresee for Russell Westbrook inthis series? Mark, I think that's
a great point. We talked aboutthe two six men with Norm pot and
Norman Powell and Russ because they bothfeed off each other. They both bring
(39:29):
a different energy when they come inthe game. The pace kind of picks
up a little bit more offensively forboth Norman when he's actually involved in plays,
whether that's coming off the weak sideDownstreet on the left side to get
to his right head, or Russgetting a defensive rebound and pushing it in
transition. That's what Russ Brook.He brings a different energy in the game.
(39:52):
When we were at Phoenix not toolong ago, we jumped out to
that big League the Clippers did whenit was thirty five or whatever it was
first quarter, A lot of thatwas due to Rucks and his energy.
Now, listen, it's not easyeither. It hasn't been an easy transition
for Russell Westbrook. This is apotential future first ballot Hall of Fame,
(40:14):
a young man that's averaged a tripledouble, he's been MVP, he's been
all of these different things, allthese accolades, and now you're coming off
the bench in a situation mark whereyou're still a viable acid and can still
play. But in this situation withthe Clippers, the four stars on the
court didn't work, so somebody hadto take a back seat, and at
(40:37):
that period of time it was Russell. So that transition period was a lot
different our last few moments here withClippers TV analyst Jim Jackson. Yes,
the same Jim Jackson drafted number fouroverall by your Dallas Mavericks in nineteen ninety
two. Last thing I'm going tohit you with, obviously you came into
(40:59):
the league before for Jason Kidd.So you were with Jason Kidd, the
rookie, a very young Jason Kidd. To see him as a coach,
now, can you rewind all thatway back? Did you imagine that he
would end up coaching, and justwhat's it like for you now to watch
him as a coach. I've neverimagined Jason being a coach, and probably
(41:22):
not for the reasons that a lotof people think. The intelligence, the
understanding of the game, No doubtJason had that downpack the knowledge base of
how to involve teammates and to win. I didn't know Jason from a communication
perspective would want to be in thatposition because because Jason wasn't a very outspoken,
(41:47):
communicative leader. I was more ofthe vocal on the team. So
you watched Jason's career, Yes hewould lead, but he led by example
because he played so hard, andhe would coach individually on the sideline a
little bit. But he wasn't thatoutspoken leader. Go back to his interviews
(42:07):
back in the day, go backto his leadership style, which was a
lot different. You have to beable to communicate, you have to be
able to confront the uncomfortable. Thoseare the things I think Jay Kid learned
later in his career and was ableto adapt to it. And he's adapted
to it more and more as hehas he's become a better coach. So
(42:31):
that's a surprising part to me.I'm not surprised that the intellectual part put
the game plan together, you know, helping Luca. No, that doesn't.
It's the overall communication on how farhas come since I was there when
he was a rookie. That's thetransformation hopefully you make as a true leader
that he's made now to his coachingranks. Well, look, I could
(42:54):
do this for another ten twenty minutes, but unfortunately we've run out of time.
But like I said, I amso glad we caught up. I
look forward to seeing you during thisseries, and I look forward to seeing
if you and just to see youand Jason Kidd together again, because for
Mavericks fans from the nineties, youwill always be part of the Three J's.
(43:14):
Jim Jackson, thanks to Milk forjoining us. Hey Mark, thanks
for having me enjoy the playoffs too. All Right, everyone that is going
to do it for this edition ofthe Saturday Steinline. Be sure to tune
in tomorrow two thirty tip off fromla I will be joining Chuck Cooperstein on
the broadcast. Game one MAVs Clippersright here on ninety seven won the freak
Welcome to the Saturday Steinline with MarkStein, presented by Panini Trading Cards and
Collectibles. On ninety seven to oneThe Freak, the official homes all Dallas
Nevericks games, hosted by legendary NBAreporter and publisher of his substack, the
Steinline. Here's Mark Stein. Welcomein everyone to the April twentieth edition,
(00:33):
a fully fledged playoff edition of theSaturday Steinline presented by Panini Trading Cards and
Collectibles. The NBA Playoffs will indeedbe underway in mere moments as this show
unfolds. Orlando, coached by longtimeand very popular former Mavericks assistant coach Jamal
(01:02):
Moseley, It's magic at Cavaliers toget things started tip off literally in moments.
There's also a huge FA Cup semifinalat Wembley right now that is distracting
me. I'm going to do mybest to stay focused here because we know
the priority for local purposes is fastapproaching. Tomorrow Sunday afternoon, two thirty
(01:26):
Local time, Mavericks at Clippers,game one of Act three, the third
time that these teams will be meetingin the playoffs in a span of five
years, and as such, Wehave a Monster Monsters show in store for
(01:48):
you today to get you ready forthis MAVs Clippers series. Mavericks TV Play,
Mavericks Even TV TV, even MavericksTV play by play voice Mark Followell
scheduled to join us in segment two. Former Maverick Jim Jackson, former number
four overall pick by Your Mavericks,now the lead analyst on Clippers broadcasts for
(02:15):
Bally Sports in Southern California. JimJackson will join us in segment three to
talk about the Clippers and I actuallyhave an important announcement to make about Games
one and two of this series.Of course, those games will be heard
all Mavericks games heard right here onninety seven to won the Freak, I
(02:38):
am expanding my role at the station. It's just for the first two games
of the series, but a significantexpansion for yours truly. For these two
games, I will be joining theone and only Chuck Cooperstein as Chuck's side
by side analyst for the Freaks broadcastsof the first two games of this series
(03:02):
in LA in the building which stubbornscribes like me still refer to as Staples
Center. Cannot wait. I haveonly done radio color once before in my
life at the NBA level. Afew years back, Sean Grandy, the
radio play by play voice of theBoston Celtics. He was in town here
(03:23):
in Dallas his longtime partner Cedric Maxwell, of course Cornbread Maxwell NBA Finals MVP
in nineteen eighty one. Mister Maxwellwas not on that trip, so Sean
Grandy asked me to join him.Sat in with Sean for that Celtics Mavericks
regular season game. But this isthe playoffs, and I hope, Chuck
(03:51):
hope, mister Cooperstein understands that hewill have to carry me just like Sean
Grandy did years ago. But seriously, a new, new and fun experience
for me, and in the processthat means I get to connect with you
again here on ninety seven to wonthe freak both Tomorrow afternoon Game one Tuesday
(04:14):
night Game two, nine pm localstart time for that one. So,
and let's be honest, we mightbe looking at the tastiest first round series
of them all, this third installmentof Mavericks Clippers. We had the series
in the bubble in twenty nineteen twenty, that was just Lucas's second season in
(04:38):
the league. I was fortunate enoughto be among the small handful of reporters
who lived in the NBA bubble atWalt Disney World in Orlando, so I
had the privilege of being there inperson when Luca hit that fame buzzer beater
from the left wing to seal oneof the Mavericks wins in that series.
(05:00):
And then, of course, theteam's met again the following season, crazy
series seven games. The road teamwon the first six games before the more
experienced Clippers finally closed it out witha home win in Game seven. And
now here we are again. Itis a series that has the whole league's
(05:23):
attention. I think that's fair tosay, although I do feel it's a
must to add here. Throw inBucks Pacers in the East, Nick seventy
six ers in the East, andI would say especially Timberwolf's sons in the
West. All three of those matchupshave the potential to be quite tasty as
(05:49):
well great potential to be great.And now I've mentioned four of the first
eight for a V eight first roundmatchup, and that's without even bringing up
the Nuggets meeting the Lakers again,the defending champions from Denver playing host to
Lebron James, Anthony Davis and co. Although this time it's Round one as
(06:15):
opposed to the Western Conference Finals aswe saw last season, So this first
round lots to laser in on.Besides Mavericks Clippers, and I know everybody
wants to know the status of KawhiLeonard. We still don't have an official
ruling on his availability for tomorrow's Gameone. It's a huge variable and at
(06:43):
this hour still remains an unknown.My gut instinct, if you want to
trust that, that's your call.Again, this is purely a gut instinct.
Reading the tea leaves my gut sayswe won't see Kawhi Leonard before Game
two. But even if he isable to play Game one, even if
it has to wait until Game two. To me, the much larger question
(07:03):
is how close to full speed Kawhican he possibly be. Kawhi Leonard has
not played in a game since lateMarch. He basically has had no contact,
no on court basketball contact for threeweeks. And we all say it,
(07:26):
Kawhi is a robot. Kawhi isa cyborg. He'll come back and
be his usual havoc wreaking self.I'm not sure that he can step into
that speed and roll now that he'sthirty two. Maybe I will come to
(07:46):
regret saying that out loud, ButI think the Clippers, I think they
know that they need something resembling Kauhi'sbest at this stage of his career to
deal with one of the league's hottestteams. The Mavericks had the fourth best
record in the league after the AllStar Break eighteen and nine. And remember
(08:11):
they basically surrendered the last two gamesafter getting to fifty wins and after it
became apparent that they were pretty muchlocked into the number five seed. Only
Boston, Denver, and Oklahoma Citywere better than this Mavericks team since the
All Star Break. So is KawhiLeonard going to be healthy enough to lead
a Clippers team? And yes,there are obviously three other future Hall of
(08:35):
famers on this roster, Paul George, who needs no introduction to MAVs fans
after his role in the first twoplayoff matchups between these teams. They added
James Harden this season. Russell Westbrookis there. Now we'll get into this
with Jim Jackson in the third segment. How the Clippers actually have two Elite
(08:56):
six men in both Russell Westbrook andNorman pal But you can say all those
names. This is a team thatstill needs to be led to match what
Luka Doncic and Kyrie Irving are goingto throw at them. As a duo,
Luca and Kyrie have won raves forthe duo that they have become after
(09:18):
last season, after it started sobadly only five and eleven in uniform together
after last season's trade deadline, andof course the Mavericks didn't even make the
playoffs. They sank all the wayto eleventh in the West. But right
now you've got Luca and Kyrie functioningat peak capacity as a duo, and
(09:39):
on the Mavericks side, apart fromTim Hardaway Junior, who is not yet
with the team in La due towhat the team is listing is an illness,
Dallas is pretty much at full strength. All signs point to Derek Lively,
the second being able to make hisreturn to the court in Sunday's Game
one. Lively, of course,he missed the final eight games of the
(10:01):
regular season with a spraying knee,much like Kawhi Leonard. We last saw
Derek Lively play in late March,and it must be said, I don't
even know how he is doing it, because Derek Lively is also dealing with
great personal tragedy. His mother,Kathy Drysdale, recently passed away after a
(10:28):
very painful and difficult battle with cancer, and I just I continue to be
amazed by what we see from DerekLively the second, how this young man,
at a mere twenty years old,how he is coping with all these
things on and off the court,because this is not the first injury he
has had to face as a rookie. He addressed the team at a morning
(10:52):
practice late in the regular season,which ended up being just mere hours before
he lost his mother. Earlier thisweek, there was a service for Kathy
Drysdale. The Mavericks did not practiceWednesday, so everyone who wanted to could
attend the service. I'm told thatmany of Lively's teammates were there with him
(11:16):
to support him in these unspeakably difficultcircumstances. I just, I'm absolutely in
awe of Derek Lively and how he'shandled everything that gets thrown at him.
Everyone knows the story of how closehe was with his mother. They lost
(11:37):
Derek's father, He passed away ata very young age, and I can
tell you I was there in Indianapolisin February at All Star Weekend. Derek
Lively there for the Panini sponsored gamepitting first and second year players against each
other, which has now done ina tournament format, but Lively is in
(12:00):
the Young Stars Challenge representing the Mavericks. You saw him at All Star Weekend.
He was just giddy to be there, and his mom was there and
they had You could just see herpride in seeing her son reach this stage
in his rookie season. And KathyDrysdale, of course we should mention great
player in her own right at PennState. She later worked for the seventy
(12:22):
six ers, and again I justcannot imagine what her son is going through
right now. So I want todedicate this show to the memory of Kathy
Drysdale, and I want to wishwith as much gusto as possible, I
hope that Derek Lively playing in thisseries, which now appears apparent, that
(12:45):
coming back joining this team, tryingto carry on with his day job,
hopefully somehow that brings some small measureof peace to Derek Lively the second as
he negotiates this absolute the incredibly complicatedperiod in his life, and man,
(13:05):
it's a lot. There is nothere is no easy way to shift back
to basketball or focus on basketball afterthat. We will try, because Derek
Lively is trying right now. Andthe Mavericks, of course, they flew
to Los Angeles last night. Theyare scheduled to practice this afternoon at USC.
(13:30):
That session is due to start atroughly two pm Our time noon local
time, twenty six ish hours beforethe game takes place against the LA Clippers.
A crucial game one of course,whether we see Kawhi Leonard or not
will be a huge, huge swingfactor in that game. And I think
(13:56):
another major factor something that we haveto keep our eye on PJ Washington.
It will be the first playoff gameof his career, and I want to
play a short little clip from PJWashington. He was speaking to MAVs reporters
earlier this week, and it's notlost on PJ Washington the questions being thrown
(14:18):
at him. He knows this isgoing to be a massive step up onto
the largest stage he's ever played on. PJ Washington was asked how much playoff
basketball he's watched in his past.I'm gonna be honest with you, I
didn't really watch a lot of playoffbasketball because I wasn't participating, so kind
of pissed off about that. ButI'm here now, so good. A
(14:45):
lot of questions that he's going tohave to answer, and they can only
be answered on the floor, becauseyou know that the Clippers are going to
try everything they can. I don'tknow how you do it. It's not
easy to take away both Luca andKyrie, but you know that the Clippers
are going to try to force theMavericks shooters who surround this star duo.
(15:09):
Will PJ. Washington be able tomake shots? Will Dante Exum be able
to find his same level of effectivenessthat we've seen at various points in the
season. Well, Derek Jones Junior, who is such a crucial element of
the Mavericks defense, will he makeenough shots to stay effective and stay off
the floor, because you know theClippers are going to try to put the
(15:31):
ball, force the ball into thehands of these players and make them make
shots. And it's a critical elementof the Mavericks' success in their series.
They've had the number one defense inthe league during this amazing run. When
they went sixteen to two to getto fifty wins. But okay, well
(15:52):
a is how close to that levelof defense can they play in this first
round series against the Clippers, andthen the role players have to make shots.
One of the Clippers advantages and isTac Franco spelled this out beautifully in
his piece for D magazine this week. One advantage that the Clippers certainly do
have is more accomplished shooting on theperimeter, more reliable shooting on the perimeter
(16:17):
if you look into the statistics.So how the Mavericks role players shoot the
ball gonna be a crucial element thatdetermines what happens in this series. All
right, we are gonna grab abreak. Very soon. We will be
joined by Mavericks TV play by playvoice, Mark Followel, Jim Jackson coming
up in the third segment. Tonslots more MAVs Clippers playoff preview that's next
(16:41):
here on ninety seven. Won thefreak the hook shots shot. Look at
at your little spie. That isa beauty looking It's a great class the
(17:07):
man who came Puss tell you gif. It's the purty great to sec you
shoes? Why don't turn I seeyou you're I made a toy, he
says. Let the girl you makecount the pain. It's turning into way
(17:45):
shop. Sai, you'll make thisfor Jesse. I think anyone who listens
(18:11):
to this show recognizes that voice.But just to make it official, let
us formally welcome in. My goodfriend Mark Followell, TV play by play
voice for the Dallas Mavericks are BallySports Southwest colleagues. They had like a
three minute follow Well highlight reel thatthey played plays the year pregame show and
(18:36):
postgame show on the last day ofthe regular season, so we wanted to
We wanted to start this off witha little bit of that flavor. Mister
follow Well, I am guessing youare playoff focus, playoff ready, and
eagerly awaiting this series. Playoff focused, eagerly awaiting. My notes aren't all
ready for the series yet, sincemy first broadcast is not until Tuesday night,
(18:59):
will the giving way to national networkexclusivity as you probably know tomorrow,
But we'll be up and running onValley on Tuesday night for Game two and
doing games two, three, five, and six. And it's a pleasure
to talk to you today. Bythe way, it's great to be on
the show. So look, Idon't need to tell you the history between
these teams. This is Act threein the trilogy. For you, what
(19:22):
jumps off the page most? Whatare you most carey about as these teams
get ready to hook up yet again, Well, the fact that they haven't
played each other since December, andso the relevance of that, of course,
is that the Mavericks have gone apretty significant change and personality and what
makes the team tick since then,and that of course is the acquisitions of
(19:44):
Gafford and PJ. Washington Junior havechanged the dynamic of the Mavericks. They're
a bigger, better rebounding team,a bigger, better defensive team now,
and a more successful team when itcomes to not only defending the paint,
but scoring in the paint. Sothe fact that the team has changed so
much, the Clippers haven't seen thisiteration of the Mavericks, and for that
matter, you know, Kyrie Irvingwasn't healthy the last time that these two
(20:08):
teams played as well, back inDecember. So just the fact that the
Mavericks looked like so much of adifferent team compared to the last representation that
the Clippers saw of the MAVs,and so that's that's probably the thing I'm
most curious about. And then justto see, you know, how all
of this plays out, and aseries against a team that in the past
certainly bedeviled the MAVs with their physicalplay and toughness and grit and playoff experience.
(20:33):
You're with this team everywhere it goes. And actually when the one in
five skid in early March, Iwas actually out of the country. I
was on England. I was inEngland on a little soccer getaway, so
I missed a lot of that.Just if you could paint a picture for
us, what how worrisome was themood then, because I don't think after
(20:56):
five losses in six games that anybodywas projected a sixteen and two surge to
fifty wins from that point. Well, I felt like, as I look
back on it, that the moodgot worrisome after the second loss to Indiana,
which was the fifth loss in sixgames. That night, the mass
(21:17):
played at home, as you know, Mark, and that was their second
game of a three game homestand andif you kind of if you look back
at the losses that they had,well, the first loss to Indiana on
the road trip was the end ofa seven game winning streak, so I
don't think anybody panicked there. TheCleveland game was a game that they were
poised to win and then Max Threwssaid a fifty nine foot shot, and
you know, what are you goingto do about that? I don't think
there was any panic. And losingto Boston, Boston's the best team in
(21:40):
the league. Then they came home, first game after a long road trip,
Well you can kind of rationalize thatthey didn't play well against Philadelphia,
but you could also say it's thefirst game, you know, the draded,
first game after a long trip.I think playing the way that they
did against Indiana on Tuesday night,March fifth, having a team meeting after
the game, which included players andcoaches and the mood going from before the
(22:00):
game, Jason was asked some questionsabout the rotation and the lineups, and
the starting lineup in particular, becausethey were on a stretch of not having
lead at halftime for several games ina row at that point, and Jason
didn't really seem to want to entertainthe idea. You know, why would
I change the lineup? It's justa few games, and we're trying to
look at different things, and sothere doesn't seem to be any need to
(22:22):
me to change the lineup. Andthen after the game, after they lost
that game to Indiana and frankly didn'tplay very well, the mood of the
press conference was everything is on thetable. Lineups are on the table,
rotation changes are on the table.We'll look at everything over the course for
the next few days before our nextgame against Miami. And obviously they made
a significant change with two fits ofthe starting lineup being replaced, with Derk
Jones Junior and Daniel Gaffer going intothe starting lineup, and they made a
(22:47):
rotation change at that point to thedegree that whenever both were healthy and this
hasn't been the case the whole way, but Gafford and Lively were playing consistently
forty plus minutes from that point forward, So obviously, to me, that's
what the mood was like. Everything was, well, we can explain
all this, and we're trying tofigure it out. And then that second
Indiana game there seemed to be adramatic change and moved from how things were
(23:08):
talked about in position before the gameto the urgency of we're looking at everything
after the game, and obviously thethings that they looked at paid dividends.
Mavericks TV play by play voice MarkFollowell joining us here on the Saturday Steinline
on ninety seven to one The Freak. You know, that's a great point
that you just made, Like theway that thing started. We look at
(23:30):
it as this massive crisis, butreally it was the Philadelphia and Indiana games
that turned it into a crisis.I mean, you talk about Max Struce,
I've got Cleveland Orlando on the TVhere in the studio as the Calves
in Orlando get the playoffs underweight.The buzzer beaters we've seen this season Strews
and then Kyrie hitting the lefty,even the lefty runner from twenty to beat
(23:53):
Denver, I mean just that,I mean, we've both been doing this
a long time. I've never seenI mean, those might be the two
craziest buzzer beaters that I can remember. I mean, I don't know that
I can top those, and theyboth happened within a few weeks span.
Well, you know, I guessif I were going to throw anything out
(24:15):
there in recent memory, Lucas doubleclutch one handed shot that was a three.
He took off from outside a threepoint line, landed inside the line.
That's where you take off, asyou know. And that was in
the season where you didn't have fansin the stands completely yet, So that
was against Memphis. If you rememberApril of twenty twenty one, and maybe
(24:36):
look on this show, I knowthat there will never be a time when
it's past eight that throws some loveto number forty one. We'll always want
to do that. And if yourecall his buzzer beater at Madison Square Garden
that remmed out, hit way off, high off the board and then came
back down that he refused to celebrateeven after all of his teammates ran out
of the floor back in twenty fourteenat Madison Square Garden. Maybe that's maybe
(24:59):
that one of the wilder buzzer beatersin recent memory. But those two shots
Struce and Kyrie Irving were amazing.And the crazy thing about that Cleveland game
is, you know, the Matshad a ten point lead and they took
the lead Cleveland did. Cleveland tooktheir initial lead. They went up by
three when Donovan Mitchell with about thirtythirty five seconds to go somewhere in that
ballpark, hit a three that bankedin, hitting the backboard above the square.
(25:25):
It didn't even land in the square. It was it was a it
was a it wasn't like a realit wasn't a wing bank shot. It
was something from a lot closer toout front, and it just hitted a
strange angle above the square and fellin, and that put Cleveland in front.
The Mavericks then scored, forced aturnover, got the PJ. Washington
basket to put them in front withtwo seconds to go, and the rest,
as they say, is history.But yeah, that was certainly that
(25:45):
was a wild time in Madge Land. No doubt. You've had a front
row seat for the Luka Doncic,Kyrie Irving partnership blossoming into what it is
now, which is a duo thathas the attack of the whole league.
Maybe just share with us some ofyour reflections of the way, you know,
(26:07):
what these guys have been able toachieve, because you know, you
remember in the preseason the maps goall the way abroad, two games in
n Abu Dhabi, one game inSpain. It was supposed to be,
Hey, they're going to have awhole training camp together, they owned up.
They didn't even end up playing sevenminutes together in the preseason, so
they really didn't have the preseason,and of course Kyrie had the two long
(26:27):
term injuries. But just to seewhere they are now, you've had probably
the best advantage point of anybody.Well, I think there's just a real
love and respect for each other's games. I think that there's a recognition on
the part of both players that theysee in the other individual the fact that
(26:47):
you know, collectively they can accomplishsome special things. So I've seen that.
I've seen two players last year,Mark who through no fault of their
own, they were trying, butthey were playing to me like two talented
individuals who were doing the best thatthey could to throw things together on the
fly. And as you know,that's very difficult. And I've just seen
(27:08):
a very cohesive duo this year whohas very good chemistry and and intangible ways
that are a little bit harder todefine, but they have a chemistry of
respect for each other's games. Andthen they're playing off each other too,
And by that I mean there it'snot one guy has the ball and the
other guy stands in the corner.Or your turn in my turn, it's
(27:32):
you know, there's offensive actions thatinvolve both individuals where it's one player screens
for the other or something along thoselines, where they're getting the defense and
conflict and forcing the defense to makechoices and playing off each other rather than
just one guy has the ball andthe other stands in the corner. So
I think there's there's tangible things thatyou can see from an XT and O
(27:53):
strategy standpoint that have developed, andthere's just intangible things of you know,
two guys who have own closest teammatesand closest brothers and closest players, and
it's been really a lot of funto see. All right, last thing,
and then I'm going to let yougo. And I hope this isn't
too painful a question, but I'mnot sure that you are. Many many
many fans here realize how hard itis on you when you don't get to
(28:15):
do a game. And as yousaid, I think you get two,
three, five, and six,But these other games will all be national
exclusives. So how are you goingto cope Game one as just a mere
spectators. It's not it's going tobe tough, you know, My feeling
on that is when the schedule comesout in August and you know way ahead
(28:37):
of time that, hey, you'renot going to do the opener when Dallas
plays San Antonio, the Wimby debut, or this game or that game or
Christmas ight in Phoenix. I mean, you know this way ahead of time.
There's no surprises, there's nothing that'sout of the ordinary. I went
through and I will leave open thepossibility that my memory isn't completely correct on
this, But in nineteen years,my nineteenth year doing the TV broadcast after
(29:02):
radio for six years before that,so nineteen years of TV. This is
the fourteenth time the Maps that madethe playoffs. So in the previous thirteen
first rounds, I only recall losinggames to an ABC national exclusive when the
Mas and Spurs played a Game sevenin twenty fourteen, When the Maps and
Clippers played a Game seven in twentytwenty one and the famous bubble double overtime
(29:23):
Lucas stepped back to win it atthe at the end the bang bang called
by Mike Breen. So we've onlylost three games to ABC National exclusives in
my time that I recall the firstround playoff series. So to lose two,
that's you know, and to findout four days before the series starts.
That's a big bummer. So howwill I cope? Maybe I'll listen
(29:45):
to some Coop on the radio hereon ninety seven to one of the Freak.
Always good to listen to Coop,and here is outstanding broadcasting work.
And you know, I'll be takingnotes and looking for things that I think
will be relevant to bring to thetable on the broadcast on Tuesday. And
I don't know, maybe I'll doplay by play for the Dogs and the
Wife at my house so we'll see. Yeah, well, you probably didn't
(30:07):
hear this bad news in the firstsegment. I'm gonna beat you. I'm
gonna be Coop's color man for thefirst two games, so you know,
that's that's great news. A matterof fact, I'm careful that if that's
your if that's your choice tomorrow,be careful. Well, that's well,
that has elevated the possibility of itbeing my choice. And I guess I
was aware earlier in the week thatthis was possible, but I was not
aware that this is over the finishline that you're doing that. So uh,
(30:30):
you know, love your work onBally that you do on pre and
post games for us, and welcomefurther to the world of Dallas Maverick's game
broadcasting. It's a pleasure to haveyou with us. Well, the pleasure
was ours to have you on thisshow. Everybody, Mark Mark Followell,
who of course needs no introduction.You guys heard the voice, you knew
instantly who it is. And ashe said back in his normal press row
(30:52):
perch for game two when Bally's hasthe game too broadcast Tuesday night, I
will see you in La my friend. Yo. Delight to talk to you
and have a great weekend, andwe'll see you very soon. All right,
there, he goes MAVs TV playby play voice Mark Followell. Next
up, we've got former Maverick JimJackson to give us the clipp review.
(31:14):
How things look on the other sideof this series. That's next here on
ninety seven, Won the Freak?Why has that been dealing with inflammation for
almost three weeks and his right knee. He's doing everything, Our medical staff
is doing everything to get the inflammationdown so he can play. Progress has
been made, but more progress needs. The inflammation needs to continue to do
(31:38):
so he can do functional basketball movements. We're hopeful it's going to get there
in terms of practice participation under you, guys, vast ty. He's able
to do all the mental preparation partof it, the film study, the
personnel review, hasn't done any contact, and we'll just take it day by
(31:59):
day. And I know from yourguys standpoint, you know, you guys
have to ask the questions. Theone thing you know share with you is
that inflammation's unpredictable. So it's we'dlove to have a crystal ball, and
Kahi would love to have a crystalball and know exactly on this day.
But just you just control in control, and hopefully hopefully the inflammation reduces in
(32:20):
a short amount of time and he'sback on the court. Let's you go.
That was Clippers President of basketball OperationsLawrence Frank speaking to the LA media
on Thursday. It's the closest thingwe have to an official update on Kawhi
Leonard. We'll no more closer togame time Sunday. That's my best forecast.
(32:42):
Now let's go right to our interviewwith former Maverick Jim Jackson. Let's
get Jim Jackson's preview of the Clippersside of this series. Guys, I
gotta tell you, I am sohappy about this closing segment this afternoon to
at this up with our next guest. He is not only perfectly positioned to
(33:05):
help us preview the Clipper side ofthe equation in this series, but he
is also a former Maverick, thefourth overall pick in the nineteen ninety two
NBA draft out of Ohio State.He went on to play for eleven more
teams after that, which was anNBA record until Ish Smith got to thirteen
(33:27):
and broke it. But you seehim now, you see him a ton.
He's one of the top broadcasters inthe sport NBA the college game,
and he's the lead analyst for theClippers on their Ballet Sports West coverage.
A hearty welcome in to the oneand only Jim Jackson. How are you,
sir? Beautiful day is out oneof the better times of the year.
(33:52):
You are fully an LA guy,now, aren't you. Yeah?
Yeah? But I've been coming out, you know, Mark, since I
was a rookie. This is whereI would train in the summer. Good
friend of mine, Tracy Murray,had a place here, so I would
come and stay with Tracy. Wewould go train play UCLA the end of
my career with the Lakers, SoI've been kind of part of the LA
(34:13):
community off and on, you know, since I got into the league.
So it just made sense that Iended up back here a few years back.
So let's just dive into it.Mavericks Clippers Act three. To you,
besides the obvious, which is KawhiLeonard's health, what is the most
important swing factor in this series?Well, you just said it, it's
(34:36):
Kawhi's health. At the end ofthe day, Mark, you know,
you need your best players to play, in particular lead against this Dallas Maverick
team that's kind of retooled, youknow, the Clippers, who I worked
for. We were able to wintwo out of the three games, but
those games were played before you know, the year turned of twenty twenty four.
Last game was twelve twenty and twentythree in which the Clippers, but
(35:00):
the roster construction for the Mavericks istotally different than at that point. So
yes, you can take some dollarsif you're the Clippers in that you were
able to win the three game seriestwo to one, but you're not playing
and going against the same Maverick teamalternatively in defense what they had to offer.
(35:21):
So it's a little different strategy goinginto the playoffs this year versus this
team. Then it wasn't a regularseason. And look, the reality is
none of us know about Kawhi.We're not going to know probably until closer
to the game time, if he'sable to go in Game one, and
then there's the whole question of howclose to full speed Kawhi is he even
(35:43):
going to be if he's able toplay in Game one or Game two or
whatever it is, because we haven'tseen him since the end of March.
But I want to put that aside. There was the stretch where the Clippers
looked unbeatable. This team was twentysix and five, and then since the
All Star break only fifteen and fourteen. Dallas was actually the fourth best team
in the league after the All Starbreak at eighteen and nine. Clippers more
(36:06):
middle of the pack. From yourseat, what changed with this Clipper team,
It's really hard to pinpoint because wewere in a lot of games that
I thought we should have won,especially down the stretch. The energy level
I thought tailed off a little bitafter All Star break because this team kind
of you know, veteran laden teamkind of found their stride, proved what
(36:30):
they could be. Not to saythat they just laid things and said,
Okay, we're waiting for the playoffsor All Star break to be over into
the season. But I just thinkthe energy level wasn't as quite as high
as it was when James came inat the beginning of the season. Kind
Of during that time period of therecord that you talked about, it was
(36:51):
a different feeling in the locker room, on the court, and some of
the execution side of the things weren'thappening. With the Clippers turning the ball
a little bit over more teams werescoring at a higher rate. So all
these teams go back to energy andeffort, not extras and oh not execution.
It's not it's a lack of executionmaybe on a defensive end and doing
(37:14):
a little things offensively that got themto that point where they were one of
the better teams in the league.Jim Jackson, the former Maverick and now
Clippers TV analyst for Bally's Sports West, joining us here on the Saturday Steinline
on ninety seven to one. TheFreak, presented of course by Panini trading
cards and collectibles. So there's somuch talk here in Dallas about the Mavericks
(37:37):
playing the Clippers for the third timein five years and what this means for
this franchise. From the Clippers perspective, how do you think they feel about
having to see Luka Doncic again again, only, you know, only five
years they got to deal with himfor the third time and now he's got
Kyrie or side. Yeah, yeah, yeah, you know it's different because
(38:01):
it's free. The defensive players,as Kawhi and Paul George have been in
the past, they couldn't do anythingwith Luca. Nobody could. I mean
last year Luca averaged maybe close toforty points a game. Okay, because
what you try to do is makeLuke in any player in this situation.
Mark, you've been around this along enough to understand this. A player
(38:22):
like Luca down to skyrieor you can'tstop. They're gonna have the ball in
their hands too much. It's justlike trying to stop Paul George or Kawhi
Leonard or James Harden. From thatperspective for making play James, what you
try to do is make him lessefficient and not give up plays because when
you play against Luca like Yoki,where he really beats you is when you
(38:45):
overhelp, over commit, and andhe beats you with the past. And
I really also wanted to ask youabout Russell Westbrook. I don't think he
gets you know, it's weird withthe Clippers because they have two great six
men with Norman Powell and right RussellWestbrook. But I don't know. I
mean warm Powell has the more impressivestats, but to me, Westbrook has
(39:06):
become the heartbeat of that team andthe Clippers I think they're forty five and
twenty when Russ has been in uniformthis season. So what kind of role
do you foresee for Russell Westbrook inthis series? Mark, I think that's
a great point. We talked aboutthe two six men with Norm pot and
Norman Powell and Russ because they bothfeed off each other. They both bring
(39:29):
a different energy when they come inthe game. The pace kind of picks
up a little bit more offensively forboth Norman when he's actually involved in plays,
whether that's coming off the weak sideDownstreet on the left side to get
to his right head, or Russgetting a defensive rebound and pushing it in
transition. That's what Russ Brook.He brings a different energy in the game.
(39:52):
When we were at Phoenix not toolong ago, we jumped out to
that big League the Clippers did whenit was thirty five or whatever it was
first quarter, A lot of thatwas due to Rucks and his energy.
Now, listen, it's not easyeither. It hasn't been an easy transition
for Russell Westbrook. This is apotential future first ballot Hall of Fame,
(40:14):
a young man that's averaged a tripledouble, he's been MVP, he's been
all of these different things, allthese accolades, and now you're coming off
the bench in a situation mark whereyou're still a viable acid and can still
play. But in this situation withthe Clippers, the four stars on the
court didn't work, so somebody hadto take a back seat, and at
(40:37):
that period of time it was Russell. So that transition period was a lot
different our last few moments here withClippers TV analyst Jim Jackson. Yes,
the same Jim Jackson drafted number fouroverall by your Dallas Mavericks in nineteen ninety
two. Last thing I'm going tohit you with, obviously you came into
(40:59):
the league before for Jason Kidd.So you were with Jason Kidd, the
rookie, a very young Jason Kidd. To see him as a coach,
now, can you rewind all thatway back? Did you imagine that he
would end up coaching, and justwhat's it like for you now to watch
him as a coach. I've neverimagined Jason being a coach, and probably
(41:22):
not for the reasons that a lotof people think. The intelligence, the
understanding of the game, No doubtJason had that downpack the knowledge base of
how to involve teammates and to win. I didn't know Jason from a communication
perspective would want to be in thatposition because because Jason wasn't a very outspoken,
(41:47):
communicative leader. I was more ofthe vocal on the team. So
you watched Jason's career, Yes hewould lead, but he led by example
because he played so hard, andhe would coach individually on the sideline a
little bit. But he wasn't thatoutspoken leader. Go back to his interviews
(42:07):
back in the day, go backto his leadership style, which was a
lot different. You have to beable to communicate, you have to be
able to confront the uncomfortable. Thoseare the things I think Jay Kid learned
later in his career and was ableto adapt to it. And he's adapted
to it more and more as hehas he's become a better coach. So
(42:31):
that's a surprising part to me.I'm not surprised that the intellectual part put
the game plan together, you know, helping Luca. No, that doesn't.
It's the overall communication on how farhas come since I was there when
he was a rookie. That's thetransformation hopefully you make as a true leader
that he's made now to his coachingranks. Well, look, I could
(42:54):
do this for another ten twenty minutes, but unfortunately we've run out of time.
But like I said, I amso glad we caught up. I
look forward to seeing you during thisseries, and I look forward to seeing
if you and just to see youand Jason Kidd together again, because for
Mavericks fans from the nineties, youwill always be part of the Three J's.
(43:14):
Jim Jackson, thanks to Milk forjoining us. Hey Mark, thanks
for having me enjoy the playoffs too. All Right, everyone that is going
to do it for this edition ofthe Saturday Steinline. Be sure to tune
in tomorrow two thirty tip off fromla I will be joining Chuck Cooperstein on
the broadcast. Game one MAVs Clippersright here on ninety seven won the freak
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