March 3, 2024 • 42 mins
The stretch run has begun and Marc Stein assesses the Mavericks' chances of escaping the Play-In round of the playoffs along with a pulse check on the rest of the West. Special guest: Longtime ESPN analyst and former Mavericks guard Tim Legler.
Mark as Played
Transcript
Episode Transcript
Available transcripts are automatically generated. Complete accuracy is not guaranteed.
(00:00):
Kgl FM, Dallas Fort Worth,the official home of the Dallas Mavericks.
This is dark Nowitzky and you're listeningto ninety seven to one The Freak.
Welcome to the Saturday Steinline with MarkStein, presented by Panini Trading Cards and
Collectibles. On ninety seven to oneThe Freak, the official homes while Dallas
(00:25):
Mavericks Games hosted by legendary NBA reporterand publisher of his subsdact, The Steinline.
Here's Mark Stein. Everybody, Welcomein to the Saturday Steinline presented by
Panini Trading Cards and Collectibles. Yes, we have moved into March Month of
(00:50):
madness, as they say in thecollege game, not exactly the same in
the NBA, but we are insidethe fire third of the regular season.
The stretch run has begun to reallylaser in and determine the top six in
(01:10):
both conferences. It's the race tosee which teams, like your Mavericks,
can they escape the playing round,to see which teams get stuck between seven
and ten in the standings and haveto play an extra game or two just
to seize a playoff spot. We'renot going to review the precise standings as
(01:32):
of this Saturday lunchtime, because wemust confess this week's show is a bit
untraditional, still a good one,still going to be a fun one,
built around a voluminous interview with ESPN'sTim Legler and Legs don't forget a former
Maverick that's going to be in thesecond segment. But leading off today,
(01:56):
it's a little tricky, and I'vegot to do this with a confession,
a disclaimer, some funky travel toa top secret location that soon will be
revealed. My travel itinerary mandated thatthis show had to be pre recorded,
(02:16):
since I was required to board myplane while the Mavericks were still finishing up
Friday night's game in Boston. Iam not in the studio as we speak.
Maddy g behind the glass. She'salways in charge anyway, but she
is solo on the bridge right now, steering us to safety. It's just
(02:38):
that's the way this one had togo. Had to finish recording it not
only before I got on the plane, but also I had to give the
Great Grooves the glue guy here atninety seven to one. The freak had
to give Groobs enough time to stitchall this together. So this is my
long winded way of saying, allthree segments of this show had to be
(03:00):
put to bed before the game inBoston, And that means, if you're
hearing this now, whatever happened inBoston last night was mundane enough and normal
enough that we could proceed with therecordings as planned, whether that was a
win for the team in Green withthe best home record in the NBA,
(03:23):
or if that was an upset fromthe Mavericks to salvage a two and two
road trip. If you're hearing menow, that means nothing sufficiently crazy,
scary, dangerous. Nothing happened inBoston that necessitated an emergency audible and a
(03:43):
first segment hastily redone from a farawaylocation. Boston was, of course,
the last stop on a pretty challengingfour game road trip for the MAVs.
The MAVs had won seven in arow going into the trip. Started off
with a rough loss Sunday in Indianapolis. Dallas could not keep pace with the
(04:08):
running Gun Pacers in an up anddown game. Then the Mavericks go to
Cleveland and absorb an absolute heartbreaker,l seriously to lose on a sixty footer
by Max Struce after Struce had alreadyrained in four threes in the space of
(04:30):
about seventy seconds to haul Cleveland backin the game. There were some questionable
calls late Donovan Mitchell banked a threein in the midst of all that just
a dagger defeat of the most insidiousproportions. So I think, all things
considered, the Mavericks could live witha one and two start entering the finale
(04:51):
thanks to the when they got inToronto on Wednesday night. Look, there
are essentially two immediate goals for thisteam from here, getting up to six
in the West, avoiding the playin scenario if they can. Now the
Mavericks are good enough to come outof the play in round seven, eight,
(05:14):
nine, ten, wherever they wouldland. They can certainly do it,
but you don't want to mess withit if you don't have to.
So the preference obviously get up tonumber six, and if possible, that
helps them with target number two forthe remainder of the season, which is
how close can they get to fiftywins to boost Luka Doncic and his MVP
(05:36):
campaign. Entering the Boston game,the Mavericks would have needed a sixteen and
seven finish to get to fifty winsfor the second time in Jason Kidds three
seasons as coach. I firmly seeLuca now as part of the top three
(05:56):
in the MVP race, But he'sprobably gonna need the Mavericks to get fifty
wins to really have a shot,because he's got to beat out both Nikola
Jokic and Denver and Shay Gilgess Alexanderin Oklahoma City, and those teams are
(06:18):
gonna win more than fifty games andare in contention for the top seed in
the West. I don't think there'sany question that Luca has moved past Milwaukee's
Giannis Antetokumpo to put himself in thetop three. Here. We know that
the reigning MVP, Joel Embiid fromPhiladelphia, He's not gonna be able to
(06:39):
play in the needed sixty five gamesto be eligible to repeat his MVP.
Even if Embiid does make it backfrom his recent knee procedure to play again
in the regular season, not gonnacome anywhere close to sixty five games.
But I don't want to diminish thereality here Andga both absolutely formidable obstacles for
(07:03):
Luca to displace in this race,and having a fifty win season on the
resume just would help his cause immensely. Okay, As I've said, this
is an untraditional show this week,this first segment, which normally goes fifteen
sixteen seventeen minutes of monologuing, I'mkeeping it shorter by design because I want
(07:30):
to leave extra time for our visitwith ESPN's Tim Legler that's coming up.
We're also going to have a replayin segment three of the recent lunchtime that
I shared with the Ben and SkinShow. It was Wednesday, that was,
of course, Luka Doncic's twenty fifthbirthday. The idea we had was,
(07:53):
let's celebrate this together the three ofus on the air. So I
came in studio and spent a halfhour with those guys. We're not gonna
be able to run the whole halfhour, but we've got a pretty good
slice of that segment to give yousome flavor of what we got into.
Pretty lively and fun conversation with theworld famous Ben and Skin Show. And
(08:16):
like I said, the Tim Leglerdiscussion, it goes long, but Tim
Legler was fantastic. I think youguys are going to enjoy that. A
reminder before I take you to break, I've been writing about this in my
sub stack every Tuesday for weeks now. I've made please on Twitter for participation
(08:37):
in the last couple of weeks aswell underlining this. Everyone make your voice
heard on this show. It isso easy. If you go to the
ninety seven to one page via theiHeartRadio app, you will see very clearly
towards the bottom a red microphone icon. On click the mic, record a
(09:03):
message, record a question, andall I ask beyond you doing that,
just leave me a name as well, or at the very least a first
name, last initial, the cityyou're calling in from. We want to
know a little bit about you.I would love if you'd leave your whole
name in city. But if youfeel like that's too much information to share,
just click the microphone icon and say, hey, this is Marcus from
(09:26):
Dallas, or hey this is Lucafrom Lubliana. Two of the last three
submissions that we got in the hopperwanted to put on the show. There
was no name, no city,no nothing, and so I'm not even
sure who we're hearing from. Ifwe can get some good ones, if
we can get three or five ofthese, I'm gonna do a whole segment
(09:48):
in the next show just answering listenerquestions. I'd love to do that.
I'd love to have one good submissionevery week, but I would really love
to have four or five in thehopper, so I can just do a
whole segment answering questions. I thinkthat would be great to make this more
interactive. All right, I've madethat pitch as loud and as often as
(10:11):
I can lately. I told youwe are still going to have a stacked
show here, with lots of discussionabout the MAVs, about the state of
the NBA, and lots of laughstoo. ESPN's Tim Legler, who among
national NBA pundits, has been ashigh on the Mavericks since the trade deadline
(10:33):
as anyone you'll find out there.And Tim Legler himself, he's going to
join me to talk about his growingfondness for the MAVs, how he sees
the rest of the West shaking out. That's next here on ninety seven,
Won the Freak. This is theSaturday Steinline Quiz Mark Stein presented by Benini
(10:54):
Trading Cards and Collectibles on your officialHomes, All Dallas Mavericks Games nine,
The Freak, The Saturday Steinline dribblesOn, presented as always by Panini Trading
Cards and Collectibles. I cannot believeit's basically been twenty years since the inception
(11:16):
of a show, an NBA showon ESPN which no longer exists, But
when it debuted during the two thousandand three two thousand and four season,
I was on it almost every Tuesdaynight with our special guest this week,
a former Maverick special guest. Theshow was called NBA Coast to Coast,
(11:39):
starring Stephen A. Smith, GregAnthony, Rick Buker, and I used
to sneak on there to provide areporter presence, and the other pillar of
that show joins us, now apopular man in these parts for his frequent
recent praise of the Mavericks and howthey've looked since the trade deadline. ESPN's
(12:01):
Tim Legler joining us now here onthe Saturday Stein Line legs it is great
to catch up with you, MarkStein, my man, one of my
favorites, and it's fun going downmemory lane a little bit with you there,
taking me back to Coast to Coast. But I will contend to this
day, was one of the beststudio shows ESPN really ever had. It
was so unique because we would sitthere for two hours and we would just
(12:24):
pop in and go to live gameaction on that given night, come back
to the studio, discuss what washappening, go to a different game.
Sometimes we'd go to the game andjust listen to the play by play of
that game by the local announcers,come back more studio discussions. So I
just thought the content was great,it was great working with you, and
it is my pleasure to be onwith you today. Plus, didn't we
(12:46):
kind of make stephen A's career?Like I think we should get some sort
of agent fee. That was thefirst ESPN show he was really on.
Absolutely, he was just Steve Smithat that point, Mark, let's be
honest. He was just Steve Smith, and then he became stephen A because
of what we did for him onthat show, even obviously a friend of
both of ours. And uh,yeah, man, this guys, you
said twenty years going back. It'syeah, it's been twenty since my twenty
(13:09):
third season at ESPN covering the NBA. It's really the only two jobs I've
really known in my life were beinga player and being and working at ESPN
or Serious XM or the podcast I'mdoing now. Basically in media, that's
all I've really know. The ESPNhas been a second home to me for
twenty three years. You are doingwell. You are doing very well.
(13:30):
And look the reason I needed tohave you on here, it's because kind
words about the Mavericks from national punditshave been very rare this season. But
I have to say you already werea Maverick as a player, but you
have a growing fan base here becauseyou've been so openly impressed by what we've
seen from Dallas during this eight andtwo stretch. What is it about the
(13:52):
MAVs that has won you over?I think there's two components to it,
Mark, and I think I'm gonnastart with the most important one, which
is Luca. So let's start withLuca. And and Luca statistically, he's
been doing a lot of this reallyhis entire career, certainly the last few
years, last couple of years,and it's not about the numbers anymore for
(14:15):
me. It's about the seriousness forhim. And look, he's still gonna
play with that little cocky smirk onhis face, and that's okay, and
that's part of who he is andthe joy that he comes out with.
But I'm talking about the seriousness withwhich I think he's taken the physical conditioning
necessary to be a guy on thatlevel, I think he looks he just
(14:35):
looks leaner, he looks like he'sin better shape. He's always been strong
as an ox and like, Ithink even his body type didn't really I
think, indicate how strong the guyreally was. You could tell that when
you watch him and the way guyswould just you ride his hip to the
rim, and he was unfazed bythe contact, and I knew pretty early
on, like, man, thisguy must be unbelievably strong. Well,
he actually looks stronger now, likehe's just got more definition. He looks
(15:00):
like he's lost a little bit ofthe softness that he had in his body.
So that's the first thing I thinkhe is the conditioning. And then
I think just his approach to leadershiphas been better this year than it's been
in the past. I don't spendas much time watching Luca play and get
kind of getting irritated with him becauseI think he gets distracted easily by the
officials, or he gets caught upin things that aren't hurting it to winning.
(15:22):
I think there's fewer of those momentsnow, and I think it's all
coming together for him now, Likewhat ultimately this guy's ceiling could be.
I said halfway through his rookie year, Luka Doncics was going to be a
multiple time MVP and a multiple timechampion. I said that halfway through his
rookie season because guys like him winrings because of their effects on everybody else
on the roster with their passing ability. But then you'd watch him play those
(15:45):
for a couple of years, He'ssay, you know, he has to
grow up a lot, and Ithink that's all coming together. So that
would be the first thing. Luca'sapproach physically and mentally to being a leader
in what it takes every night,playing a little harder defensively, all those
things happening for him, and thenthe other thing, And you know a
big reason why I'm kind of hoton him right now. I just love
what they did at the deadline.I love those two editions. I love
(16:07):
Gafford was the one guy that stoodout to me when I watched Washington play
all year and in a bad situation, this guy competes every night. I'd
say to myself, like, ina bad situation, it's easy to come
out and think about numbers or getcaught up in whatever and pout or not
show up with effort every night.He never did it. He just consistently
played hard and it stood out tome. So when they get out and
(16:29):
they get him, now you havetwo lively set the legs, not no
pun intended with Derek and and Gafford. You have two bouncy legs, two
different guys that can go catch lives, that can protect the rim, that
can cover pick and roll adequately,and track guys if they turn the corner.
They have two of those down,not just one. So that just
gave them a different look. Andthen I think PJ. Washington is just
(16:51):
a pro and I think he's thebetter fit for than Grant Williams was in
that same spot. And so theygot deeper, and they needed to get
deeper, And they're making me alittle bit of a believer now that this
is a team that can can reallydo some damage that you've got to keep
them in the conversation. When youtalk about contenders in the Western conference.
I asked Charles Barkley this question atAll Star weekend, and now's my chance
(17:12):
to ask you. When Kyrie Irvingwas first acquired by the Mavericks, basically
thirteen months ago, what did youthink a Kyrie and Luca duo was capable
of. You know, ironically,I didn't have as much of a problem
wrapping my head around the two ofthem playing together like that. That's just
(17:33):
to me, was like, no, they're gonna figure that out. They're
two super talented guys that have alot of versatility in their game. Kyrie
has thrived being in that like thatsecond seat right, the striding shotgun,
if you will, because that's wherehe thrived the most in Cleveland with Lebron
James, and he went to Boston. The leadership thing that you know,
with the younger players that he hadto uplift. I don't think that's his
(17:56):
in his wheelhouse. I don't thinkhe really wanted to do that, and
obviously he forced his way out.Goes to Brooklyn. We know what happened
there. That just never came togetherfrom the beginning. My concern wasn't about
to fit stylistically. My concern wasjust Kyrie Irving. Is he someone that
is going to be committed to thisto the extent that he has to be
to get this thing where you wantedto go and get it across the finish
(18:19):
line ultimately, Because Kyrie, aswe know, has had moments where he
hasn't been available, either by hisown doing or circumstantial or whatever the reasons
may be. Injuries, he wasnot available all the time and there were
times when you wondered, like,how much does this mean to Kyrie Irving?
So that had to be answered.And look, I think there's still
(18:40):
questions about that. They've had anice run right now, but he just
missed another large chunk of time.Since he's come back, they've played really
well. I will say this,this stretch they've had here lately, that's
the best I've seen Kyrie and Lucalook together. They look like they're figuring
each other out. They're having morefun the ebb and flow that two guys
like that that dominate the ball haveto have to make that seamless. They're
(19:03):
starting to figure that out. Andwhen that happens, watch out, because
I just don't know how you weresupposed to defend both of those guys.
Trip after trip after trip, andso that's what my hesitation was about.
Kyrie Irving really just between his ears, where was he more so than what
they were going to look like whenthey actually put their games together. ESPN's
Tim Legler joining us here on theSaturday Steinline presented by Panini. Tim,
(19:29):
of course, played two seasons inDallas. Then he went on to win
the NBA's Three Point Contest while amember of the Washington Wizards, and as
you heard him off the top yeartwenty three with ESPN, Crazy run Man's
that is impressive. Look, theWest is absolutely stapped. I'm still a
Denver guy. I still trust theNuggets more than I trust anybody else.
(19:53):
I just can't pick against a Jokicled team if I'm forced to register my
pick right now. But when youlook at the West, I mean,
what can the Mass realistically do?And who do you see as the biggest
threat to Denver? Well, Iwould say, look, I think I
(20:14):
could go down the Western Conference andall the top probably the top eight teams
and give you compelling reasons why maybethat's just the team that ultimately rises to
that level and challenges Denver. First, I agree with you about Denver.
I trust them more than any otherteam, probably even in the league.
I think Boston's got the best startingfive. Boston certainly has had the best
year. You could say that.I think because of that, Boston is
the best team right now. Butthat's a different question then two minutes to
(20:37):
go deciding game, get through aseries, you get to around who you're
counting on them most. It Denver'sstill my answer, as is yours.
It's because of Jokic, and becausethere's no answer for joks and how well
the cool continuity of that starting five, and how well they play together on
both ends when they have to haveit in new way Murray played last night
when he's in that mindset being thataggressive. I just I agree with you.
(21:00):
It's still Denver. Go down thelist. I can make a compelling
case for all of them. Ithink right now, Mark, I'm gonna
answer it this way. I thinka lot of it is why I'd open
it to me determined his last twentygames, because I think there are still
teams figuring stuff out, and that'swhy it's hard to say definitively. I
think we know who Minnesota and OklahomaCity are. I don't know that Oklahoma
City as well as they play together. As much as I love Shay as
(21:23):
that star factor, I don't knowthat they make the run from basically being
on the outside looking into like theconference finals in one year and run all
those minefields. I just don't knowthat they can do that. Minnesota.
They're a great defensive team, andI don't say that much about anybody these
days. I do think that lategame situations is going to be interesting for
(21:45):
them. I don't know if AnthonyEdwards is like arrived to that level that
he's going to be able to beatyou with a high quality shot for himself
or a potentially make a play forsomebody, if that's what it takes in
that moment. So I think lategame situations offensively are still going to be
interesting for men. That's why I'mnot quite ready to go there with them.
I think the Clippers could be theteam, but I think they they've
(22:06):
got to figure out James Harden's balldominance I think is too much, and
I think it's gonna affect Kawhi Leonardin a negative way. I think they're
better off operating with Kawhi Leonard asthe initial primary guy and with James Harden
there. That's hard to do,so they've got some things to figure out.
But I do like their overall depth. I like the fact they could
turn up the heat defensively but theyneed to and they got a lot of
(22:26):
firepower offensively. Phoenix barely play togetherthose three guys. I need to see
that. I like the Roycenill pickup a lot. Let me see those
three guys operate together. And thenyou've got Dallas Mavericks and you've already said
how high that I am on them. I'm not going to be shocked whatsoever
if they can avoid Denver's bracket untilthey need to play them in the conference
(22:48):
finals. I'm not gonna be surprisedby Dallas making a run to the conference
finals. I'm trying to think ifI left anybody out the Pelicans, I
just I don't know, Like,you know this point Zion stuff that everybody's
so enamored with, I'm like,is that really what we want Zion Williamson
to be? Ultimately, he wasa dominant force that was unstoppable offensively when
he first came into the league,and you know, a unique one off
(23:10):
type player. Yes, fewer ofthose moments where he plays that way and
the assists are great, But isbo Aley a pass He's improved to the
point you can do that, butI think he's a unique force that is
not necessarily imposing his will on thegame in the same way that he used
to, and therefore I'm not sureabout them. Look, they're dangerous because
they got a lot of talent atthe top, they got good role players.
They could be a scary team.So I think I've covered everybody.
(23:33):
I don't know if I missed anyone, But well, that's the thing.
This conference is so deep that wereally haven't even touched on the Lakers and
the Warriors, who were down therein the playing zone right now. But
of course, if we were doingthis on the ESPN, we would have
to talk about those teams, butwe are we don't have to on this
show. But look, the problemwith radio is, man, the clock
moves so damn fast. And Icould do this with you for another hour,
(23:56):
but the last thing I want tothrow at you just before you go
and listen if you guys want moreof Tim Legler. Besides ESPN, he
does a podcast multiple times a weekwith Adamarrez, The All City Podcast,
which is fantastic. So Tim Legler'scommentary not hard to find. But I
just want you to rewind to yourplaying days. You were on those Mavericks
(24:17):
teams that were eleven and thirteen winseasons, a really tough time in the
history of this franchise. What comesto mind when I ask you about your
life with the Dallas Mavericks as aplayer, That's a very easy one for
me. You got to remember Mark, at that time I graduated in nineteen
eighty eight, I was undrafted,and I took a different route, right,
So I was playing in the CBA, which you know, for the
(24:37):
younger listeners, that's the G leaguethat we have today, was the seat
called the Continental Basketball Association sheet that'sat the time. I played in Rochester,
Minnesota. I played in Omaha,Nebraska. I went to Europe.
I had some ten days, youknow, go up to the league,
get back, go back when guysgot healthy. So I struggled to battle
all that. So then my firstreal legitimate opportunity to sink or swim team
(25:02):
on that first Dallas Mavericks team Ritchieout of Botto hundred fire. Earlier in
the year, Gar Hurt took overas the interim coach. Brad Davis was
his assistant. I will never forgetI was leading the CBA and scoring.
I was putting up like almost thirtyat night in the CBA, doing everything
I could, and at this pointout of school four to five years,
thinking is this gonna happen for me? I was definitely reaching that point if
(25:22):
a fork in the road was comingmy way and deciding what I wanted to
do with my life. And Igot this call from the Dallas Mavericks and
I met them on the road.I remember I went into the hotel room,
I met Gar, I met Brad, and I would never forget what
they said to me, like,look, we think you could play in
this league, but you've never reallyhad an opportunity to play three year mistakes
(25:44):
and just go play. Well,obviously, you know we're not a very
good team. We're losing a lotof games. We need shooting. You're
gonna play. We're gonna throw youout there and let you play, and
you can determine for yourself if youbelong in this league. And it was
a weight lifted off me. Ican't even tell you so even though you're
losing a frustrating, and I'm competitiveand I want to win every night.
I looked at that every single dayof practice, every shoot around, every
(26:07):
minute I got on the court asGame seven of my NBA Finals, trying
to cement myself and prove that Ibelonged in this league. And that was
really what that enabled me to do. And I played really well for them
that the end of that year,and and they pick picked up and assigned
me to a one year contract thenext year, and I played really well
as like the sixth man on thatthat second Dallas team, and that's when
(26:30):
I kind of proved everybody I thinkaround the league that I belonged. And
it was Golden State in Washington forfour years after that and Golden State one
more at the end. But itall really started for me in Dallas that
first year, getting an opportunity tojust playing and as a result, I'm
incredibly grateful, and the fans reallyreacted to me and and I just will
always appreciate the support. It's probablyto this day, I consider that one
(26:52):
of my favorite cities I've ever livedin, and I'm just grateful that it
that it worked out for me togo to that team in that situation because
I had an opportunity for the firsttime to miss shots and stay in the
game, and it was at theNBA level, and it was a tremendous
weight because I knew I had thetalent and the muscle memory. It was
getting the confidence at that level thatyou could play through mistakes and stay on
(27:15):
the court and they would value youfor more than just your shooting. That's
what happened for me in Dallas.That's why it's always gonna have a special
place in my heart. And bythe way, there's two jerseys hanging up
in my house. One is Washingtonand one is Dallas. For my days
playing there. There only two jerseysI have hanging up. Nice That tells
you how much that time in Dallaswent to me. And you saw I
already sent you the tweet from earlierthis week. My buddies at MAVs Film
(27:37):
Room they've started the campaign to retireyour number twenty three because of all the
nice things you've been saying about Lukeand the MAVs. So I'm glad we
I'm glad we could hook up anddo this. Uh No, definitely,
man, But I appreciate you reachingout anything for you love coming on,
good talk, and you're good catchingup and hopefully we'll do it again down
the road. Everybody there, hegoes Tim Legler from ESPN, and believe
(28:00):
me, everyone at ESBN knows thisguy has always been one of the foremost
basketball brains in Bristol, and everybody'sgetting to enjoy that now on his new
podcast with Adamar As an addition toESPN coverage, lots more of the Saturday
Steinline is coming up next here onninety seven, won the Freak. This
is durt Nowitzki and you're listening tothe Saturday Steinline with my guys Steiny on
(28:25):
ninety seven, won the Freak.Thank you Dirk Nooviski, and thank you
audience for sticking with us here onthe Saturday Steinline, presented as always by
my pals at Panini Trading Cards andCollectibles. Wednesday, you guys already know.
Wednesday was the twenty fifth birthday fora certain Gospodoncic Luka Doncic, and
(28:51):
that led to yours truly. Imade an in studio appearance with the world
famous Ben and Skin Show. Spenta half hour with the guys at lunch
talking all things Luca All things MAVs. Obviously we do not quite have the
real estate to replay the whole thing, but can we give you some flavor
(29:17):
of the spicy convo that we gotinto. Yes we can, so let's
get right to it. Wednesday lunchtimewith Ben and Skin. Oh man,
it is time to do something specialbecause joining us live in studio in honor
of Luka Doncic's twenty fifth birthday,give it up for our favorite old time
(29:38):
NBA reporter and host of the SaturdaySteinline, brought to you by Paniti Trading
Cards. It's Mark Stein. Thankyou, guys, thanks for the warm
welcome. Look at that dope ninetyseven to one the freak haddies right over
there visus you. I know youguys follow none of my works, so
(29:59):
you haven't said I wore this thingevery day to All Star Weekend. I
wore it on a night on thetown with the Chuckster. Are you serious?
Well, I was wearing the hat. The slight exaggeration is I accidentally
ended up spending my Saturday and night. I ended up in the same place
with a chuckster. But I hadmy free cat on hosted two pods at
the NBA Crossover FanFest, wearing myfree cat picture with Grant Hill and Chelsea
(30:25):
Gray. Wearing my free cat picturewith Chris Finch, the Wolves coach,
wearing my free I love this hatand I told you it is. It
is an amazing conversation starter. It'sa dope. It's a dope. What
I'm waiting for is I want tosee Yannis when I'm wearing this hat,
because I guarantee he's going to seethis hat and the Greek freak will say,
I want to talk to you,and I will get to interview him.
(30:48):
I will get to interview the Greekfreak on the freak. That is.
Oh, that's a goal. That'sfantastic. That's fantastic. I didn't
want to start with this, butnow I'm completely sidetracked by it. It
sounds like your All Star weekend wasjust incredible. You were everywhere and doing
everything. Honestly that no, Iwouldn't say that, but I had a
great time. I love Indianapolis.I'm sure you've been there with the MAVs
(31:10):
at something. I've actually never beento Indianapolis. It is a old school,
traditional NBA city, former ABA city. I love going there. You've
probably heard me witter on about SaneElmos Steakhouse and their famed shrimp cocktail.
Follow Well, you know the MAVswent right to Indianapolis right out of the
break or you know, right afterthey played Phoenix at home then went to
Indianapolis. Followell and Coop couldn't waitto tweet their shrimp cocktails because when you
(31:34):
go to Sane Elmo and Indy,this this shrimp cocktail. It comes with
this spicy horse radish sauce. OhI'm in, that clears your sinuses.
Oh I'm in, And like itis, it's just like it's an end.
It's NBA legend. So when yougo to Indy, you gotta get
that whoa, whoa, whoa.Don't even move on. Okay, okay,
a shrimp cocktail that is so famous, Like it's not even the restaurant
(31:56):
as much as it's that item,the shrimp cocktail. Give me some description
here is it are a giant orgiant shrimp in what has been described as
a hubcap, and it is justbathed in this super spicy horse radish cocktail
sauce. Amen, and it isan It's just like in the NBA when
(32:20):
you like, look, the bestpart of our job when you do what
I get to do. I alwayssay to sports writers, we root for
restaurants and hotels, we don't rootfor teams. So I mean to me
in Indianapolis. Indianapolis is synonymous withthe Pacers, the Indy five hundred,
(32:40):
and the Saint Almost Shrimp Cocktail.What's important is that you are here on
Luka Doncic's birthday, and two weeksago Luka Doncic's birthday felt like it was
going to be way different than whatit feels like right now. Yes,
they have lost two games in arow, but everything lead up to that.
(33:00):
The wind streak started, the trade, the wind streak continued. I
would imagine the vibes are way differentin Lukadancic world than we anticipated them being
a couple weeks ago. Well,I thought this was going to be a
big celebration. That's why my ideawas coming here and sit with you guys.
But I after last night, Imean, I was really worried about
Ben. I figured this thing,this thing turns into a therapy session now
(33:22):
because that look, it was gutwrenching when Cleveland came here and beat the
MAVs. I think it was afifteen oher run to close the game.
No Donovan Mitchell, no Darius Garland, and give that was a really bad
home loss. What happened last nightwas I mean, that had to be.
That had to be a top fiveworst MAVs loss. Ever, it's
(33:45):
it's just so improbable to lose ona fifty nine foot Yeah, I mean,
it just the hell. But I'mnot emotional about it. It's really
not Surprisingly he didn't watch it.No, I watched every second of it.
And the reason I'm not emotional aboutit is because it was such an
entertaining game and the end of it, and if it was a playoff game
or something like that, I wouldbe devastated. But so many weird things
(34:09):
happen at the end. And Idon't know if you know this, but
yesterday on the show, I predictedLuca would have a fifty point triple double.
He did, and he flirted withit, he got really really close.
And so I'm watching that game saying, we're watching one of the all
time great Luca games. And thenthere were some weird calls, there were
some weird turnovers. It was justso bizarre. Max Strus just gets red
(34:30):
hot, can't miss, and DonovanMitchell banked in a three. When guys
are banking in threes, all betsare off. It's just a weird night.
And then for somebody to hit afifty nine foot shot, you can't
even be mad. That is justa freak. That's harder to do than
complete a Hail Mary. It hasto be galling for Luca on his birthday
(34:51):
Eve. He is the you know, the half court shot maestro. The
reason you show up early to MAVsgames is to watch him go through his
crazy shooting routine. There's no databaseto check this, but has it ever
happened that a team got a bankthree and a sixty footer in the last
ninety seconds of an NBA game?There is no way that had to be
(35:13):
a first, right? Are youlike me now? Since we're all old
like obviously you love your job,Yeah, you love being there in person,
But isn't it great to just behome and watch it too. I've
been to a zillion NBA games.I'm so privileged, I'm so lucky.
I don't know what it is.I'm so much more relaxed at home at
a game. My head's on aswivel, and I'm always, oh my
(35:37):
god, there's you know, there'san agent I didn't expect to see.
I gotta go corner him. Ohthey're at home. I'm just like,
I'm watching it with my kid.I just I really really like watching basketball
at home. You're enjoying hoops athome and you're working at the arena.
I will say that the experience Ihad last week where it was a T
and T game, and so abuddy that sits on the front road gave
(35:59):
me and myself on seats to siton the baseline, that was about as
much fun as I've had it aMaverick game in my entire life, at
any age in the AAC Or Reunionarena, I had more fun sitting on
the front row with my son asa fan. I wasn't even drinking.
I'm drinking water, and we hadso much fun. When you can go
(36:21):
be a fan at an NBA game, and I think that's why you enjoy
watching it at home because you're notworking. Speaking of vibes, you know
that every time you come on ourshow, I got to tell you how
concerned I am about Luca right righthere It's why I made the arduous five
minute drive in all right. So, and I don't know if you're familiar
with the movie War Games, Iam not. You know, I am
(36:42):
not. I'm not familiar with it. Well, deaf Con five is the
lowest perceived threat. Deaf Con oneis the highest threat level and readiness for
a state of war. And soif you get to deaf Con one,
that means Luca for sure is requestinga trade. My read on it from
a million miles away is that afterthe MAVs made the trades that they made,
(37:07):
and watching the chemistry out there betweenKai and Luca, that you can
take it on back to deaf Conefive. My read is there is no
current threat that this offseason Luca willrequest a trade. Now I have I
swung too far the other direction.I would never put it at deaf Con
one or deaf Con five. Iwould keep I would just keep it at
(37:29):
deaf Con three. Oh that's aggressive. You just ruined that. No,
March Sean, what are you doing? Lie to the man, what are
you doing? Well? I wasactually thinking, if you ask me this
every time I see you, whichis once a month, maybe once every
two months, do you ask Skinevery day, I mean every five minutes
text him in the middle of askinghim mate, when you finished answering this
(37:50):
week, answered again. Look,there is zero indication that he's requesting anything
like you're suggesting. But I'm justsaying it's just wise. It just I'm
a star trek. Gu I justkeep the shields up. How much better
are the Mavericks with the trades inyour estimation? The best thing about MAVs
(38:12):
Land right now is no question theway that Luca and Kyrie are functioning as
a duo. I mean again,last night they were ridiculously good, Yes,
and the fantastic And you know,Jalen Brunson was famous for saying,
the vibes are immaculate. The vibesare never immaculate in the NBA. No
one, not even the Boston Celticshave immaculate vibes. Nobody does. But
(38:36):
the MAVs star duo. They're playingwell together. They look like they're getting
along fantastically well. The duo isfunctioning as well as the MAVs could have
hoped, except for that one caveatthat Kyrie has missed twenty two games.
I want to say, off thetop of my head and in the year
span for the season and so looka lot. But when they are out
(39:00):
there together, they are crushing theissue. There's no question that the MAVs
have upgraded the roster. PJ.Washington and Daniel Gafford addressed multiple needs.
But the problem still is they theystill live in the Western Conference. That's
the problem. The West is backto what it was and what it usually
(39:20):
is. Last year was a crazyaberration. There were only two fifty win
teams in the West. Sacramento wasthe third seed with forty eight wins.
Forty eight wins, you might endup in the play in this year,
right look at the play in rightnow. MAVs are there. You gotta
deal with Stephen Curry and the Warriors. As much as we say nobody wants
to see Luca and Kyrie in theplayoffs, you do not want to see
(39:44):
the Warriors in a playing game oreven a series. They're they're you know,
they're dangerous. Lebron James and AnthonyDavis. It's like the playing zone
is daunting. Even if they getto six, it's not going to be
a fun first round. Do youplay the Clippers again? Does Denver stay
(40:04):
number three, and you do youwant to see Denver in the first round.
Hell no, I would not.I mean, I'd rather play Minnesota
or Oklahoma City because they're unproven.I want to ask you about this with
regard to the All Star Break.Luca plays the game, yep, and
then he goes on a vacation toMexico. It's then reported, oh,
Jason kids at the same resort.Oh my goodness, look at this,
Devin Bookers at this same resort,and people were getting on social media going,
(40:29):
oh, no, it's a fakebeef. They love each other.
They're vacationing together. And I'm thinking, I don't know if that's the case.
It may just be the hot spotwhere all the big NBA players go.
So can you tell me if thoseguys went on a vacation together,
they one bazillion percent did not goon a vacation. Did they end up
(40:50):
in the same vacation destination? Yes, do they beef? No, they
they're fine. They're fine. Thereisn't a beef. They respect each other.
I would even dare say they likeeach other. So I hope I'm
not ruining your your Luca birthday partyeven further. But they are fine,
(41:10):
there's no issue there, So thisscenario'm gonna paint. If they run into
each other at the vacation destination,there is tapping up in mutual aspect.
Luca in the middle of the night, I think I need some ice.
He grabs the ice bucket. He'swalking down the hall Bookers leaving the ice
bucket. They're in. They're in. They're in fancy villas with like they
(41:36):
hit a little button if they needa somebody comes running and brings it to
them. There there's no ice buckets, no disheveled hair and flip flops walking
to the ice. I don't knowwhere you go on spring break, but
they are not in the same place. They are not at the Garland Motel.
Sits okay, everyone that is goingto do it for this edition of
(41:58):
the Saturday Steinline. Thanks to Paninitrading cards and collectibles, without whom this
show does not happen. This showis not possible. Thanks to glue Guy
Grooves. He put the show andit's many disparate pieces together. Yet again,
Thank you Maddy G for scaring theship while I'm considerably out of range,
(42:22):
and remember everyone tomorrow Sunday noon,a very early tip off. The
Mavericks are back from the road.The Philadelphia seventy six ers without joe El
Embiid are in town. Kevin Graywill have MAVs pregame at eleven thirty.
Chuck Cooperstein on the call with BradDavis at noon
Kgl FM, Dallas Fort Worth,the official home of the Dallas Mavericks.
This is dark Nowitzky and you're listeningto ninety seven to one The Freak.
Welcome to the Saturday Steinline with MarkStein, presented by Panini Trading Cards and
Collectibles. On ninety seven to oneThe Freak, the official homes while Dallas
(00:25):
Mavericks Games hosted by legendary NBA reporterand publisher of his subsdact, The Steinline.
Here's Mark Stein. Everybody, Welcomein to the Saturday Steinline presented by
Panini Trading Cards and Collectibles. Yes, we have moved into March Month of
(00:50):
madness, as they say in thecollege game, not exactly the same in
the NBA, but we are insidethe fire third of the regular season.
The stretch run has begun to reallylaser in and determine the top six in
(01:10):
both conferences. It's the race tosee which teams, like your Mavericks,
can they escape the playing round,to see which teams get stuck between seven
and ten in the standings and haveto play an extra game or two just
to seize a playoff spot. We'renot going to review the precise standings as
(01:32):
of this Saturday lunchtime, because wemust confess this week's show is a bit
untraditional, still a good one,still going to be a fun one,
built around a voluminous interview with ESPN'sTim Legler and Legs don't forget a former
Maverick that's going to be in thesecond segment. But leading off today,
(01:56):
it's a little tricky, and I'vegot to do this with a confession,
a disclaimer, some funky travel toa top secret location that soon will be
revealed. My travel itinerary mandated thatthis show had to be pre recorded,
(02:16):
since I was required to board myplane while the Mavericks were still finishing up
Friday night's game in Boston. Iam not in the studio as we speak.
Maddy g behind the glass. She'salways in charge anyway, but she
is solo on the bridge right now, steering us to safety. It's just
(02:38):
that's the way this one had togo. Had to finish recording it not
only before I got on the plane, but also I had to give the
Great Grooves the glue guy here atninety seven to one. The freak had
to give Groobs enough time to stitchall this together. So this is my
long winded way of saying, allthree segments of this show had to be
(03:00):
put to bed before the game inBoston, And that means, if you're
hearing this now, whatever happened inBoston last night was mundane enough and normal
enough that we could proceed with therecordings as planned, whether that was a
win for the team in Green withthe best home record in the NBA,
(03:23):
or if that was an upset fromthe Mavericks to salvage a two and two
road trip. If you're hearing menow, that means nothing sufficiently crazy,
scary, dangerous. Nothing happened inBoston that necessitated an emergency audible and a
(03:43):
first segment hastily redone from a farawaylocation. Boston was, of course,
the last stop on a pretty challengingfour game road trip for the MAVs.
The MAVs had won seven in arow going into the trip. Started off
with a rough loss Sunday in Indianapolis. Dallas could not keep pace with the
(04:08):
running Gun Pacers in an up anddown game. Then the Mavericks go to
Cleveland and absorb an absolute heartbreaker,l seriously to lose on a sixty footer
by Max Struce after Struce had alreadyrained in four threes in the space of
(04:30):
about seventy seconds to haul Cleveland backin the game. There were some questionable
calls late Donovan Mitchell banked a threein in the midst of all that just
a dagger defeat of the most insidiousproportions. So I think, all things
considered, the Mavericks could live witha one and two start entering the finale
(04:51):
thanks to the when they got inToronto on Wednesday night. Look, there
are essentially two immediate goals for thisteam from here, getting up to six
in the West, avoiding the playin scenario if they can. Now the
Mavericks are good enough to come outof the play in round seven, eight,
(05:14):
nine, ten, wherever they wouldland. They can certainly do it,
but you don't want to mess withit if you don't have to.
So the preference obviously get up tonumber six, and if possible, that
helps them with target number two forthe remainder of the season, which is
how close can they get to fiftywins to boost Luka Doncic and his MVP
(05:36):
campaign. Entering the Boston game,the Mavericks would have needed a sixteen and
seven finish to get to fifty winsfor the second time in Jason Kidds three
seasons as coach. I firmly seeLuca now as part of the top three
(05:56):
in the MVP race, But he'sprobably gonna need the Mavericks to get fifty
wins to really have a shot,because he's got to beat out both Nikola
Jokic and Denver and Shay Gilgess Alexanderin Oklahoma City, and those teams are
(06:18):
gonna win more than fifty games andare in contention for the top seed in
the West. I don't think there'sany question that Luca has moved past Milwaukee's
Giannis Antetokumpo to put himself in thetop three. Here. We know that
the reigning MVP, Joel Embiid fromPhiladelphia, He's not gonna be able to
(06:39):
play in the needed sixty five gamesto be eligible to repeat his MVP.
Even if Embiid does make it backfrom his recent knee procedure to play again
in the regular season, not gonnacome anywhere close to sixty five games.
But I don't want to diminish thereality here Andga both absolutely formidable obstacles for
(07:03):
Luca to displace in this race,and having a fifty win season on the
resume just would help his cause immensely. Okay, As I've said, this
is an untraditional show this week,this first segment, which normally goes fifteen
sixteen seventeen minutes of monologuing, I'mkeeping it shorter by design because I want
(07:30):
to leave extra time for our visitwith ESPN's Tim Legler that's coming up.
We're also going to have a replayin segment three of the recent lunchtime that
I shared with the Ben and SkinShow. It was Wednesday, that was,
of course, Luka Doncic's twenty fifthbirthday. The idea we had was,
(07:53):
let's celebrate this together the three ofus on the air. So I
came in studio and spent a halfhour with those guys. We're not gonna
be able to run the whole halfhour, but we've got a pretty good
slice of that segment to give yousome flavor of what we got into.
Pretty lively and fun conversation with theworld famous Ben and Skin Show. And
(08:16):
like I said, the Tim Leglerdiscussion, it goes long, but Tim
Legler was fantastic. I think youguys are going to enjoy that. A
reminder before I take you to break, I've been writing about this in my
sub stack every Tuesday for weeks now. I've made please on Twitter for participation
(08:37):
in the last couple of weeks aswell underlining this. Everyone make your voice
heard on this show. It isso easy. If you go to the
ninety seven to one page via theiHeartRadio app, you will see very clearly
towards the bottom a red microphone icon. On click the mic, record a
(09:03):
message, record a question, andall I ask beyond you doing that,
just leave me a name as well, or at the very least a first
name, last initial, the cityyou're calling in from. We want to
know a little bit about you.I would love if you'd leave your whole
name in city. But if youfeel like that's too much information to share,
just click the microphone icon and say, hey, this is Marcus from
(09:26):
Dallas, or hey this is Lucafrom Lubliana. Two of the last three
submissions that we got in the hopperwanted to put on the show. There
was no name, no city,no nothing, and so I'm not even
sure who we're hearing from. Ifwe can get some good ones, if
we can get three or five ofthese, I'm gonna do a whole segment
(09:48):
in the next show just answering listenerquestions. I'd love to do that.
I'd love to have one good submissionevery week, but I would really love
to have four or five in thehopper, so I can just do a
whole segment answering questions. I thinkthat would be great to make this more
interactive. All right, I've madethat pitch as loud and as often as
(10:11):
I can lately. I told youwe are still going to have a stacked
show here, with lots of discussionabout the MAVs, about the state of
the NBA, and lots of laughstoo. ESPN's Tim Legler, who among
national NBA pundits, has been ashigh on the Mavericks since the trade deadline
(10:33):
as anyone you'll find out there.And Tim Legler himself, he's going to
join me to talk about his growingfondness for the MAVs, how he sees
the rest of the West shaking out. That's next here on ninety seven,
Won the Freak. This is theSaturday Steinline Quiz Mark Stein presented by Benini
(10:54):
Trading Cards and Collectibles on your officialHomes, All Dallas Mavericks Games nine,
The Freak, The Saturday Steinline dribblesOn, presented as always by Panini Trading
Cards and Collectibles. I cannot believeit's basically been twenty years since the inception
(11:16):
of a show, an NBA showon ESPN which no longer exists, But
when it debuted during the two thousandand three two thousand and four season,
I was on it almost every Tuesdaynight with our special guest this week,
a former Maverick special guest. Theshow was called NBA Coast to Coast,
(11:39):
starring Stephen A. Smith, GregAnthony, Rick Buker, and I used
to sneak on there to provide areporter presence, and the other pillar of
that show joins us, now apopular man in these parts for his frequent
recent praise of the Mavericks and howthey've looked since the trade deadline. ESPN's
(12:01):
Tim Legler joining us now here onthe Saturday Stein Line legs it is great
to catch up with you, MarkStein, my man, one of my
favorites, and it's fun going downmemory lane a little bit with you there,
taking me back to Coast to Coast. But I will contend to this
day, was one of the beststudio shows ESPN really ever had. It
was so unique because we would sitthere for two hours and we would just
(12:24):
pop in and go to live gameaction on that given night, come back
to the studio, discuss what washappening, go to a different game.
Sometimes we'd go to the game andjust listen to the play by play of
that game by the local announcers,come back more studio discussions. So I
just thought the content was great,it was great working with you, and
it is my pleasure to be onwith you today. Plus, didn't we
(12:46):
kind of make stephen A's career?Like I think we should get some sort
of agent fee. That was thefirst ESPN show he was really on.
Absolutely, he was just Steve Smithat that point, Mark, let's be
honest. He was just Steve Smith, and then he became stephen A because
of what we did for him onthat show, even obviously a friend of
both of ours. And uh,yeah, man, this guys, you
said twenty years going back. It'syeah, it's been twenty since my twenty
(13:09):
third season at ESPN covering the NBA. It's really the only two jobs I've
really known in my life were beinga player and being and working at ESPN
or Serious XM or the podcast I'mdoing now. Basically in media, that's
all I've really know. The ESPNhas been a second home to me for
twenty three years. You are doingwell. You are doing very well.
(13:30):
And look the reason I needed tohave you on here, it's because kind
words about the Mavericks from national punditshave been very rare this season. But
I have to say you already werea Maverick as a player, but you
have a growing fan base here becauseyou've been so openly impressed by what we've
seen from Dallas during this eight andtwo stretch. What is it about the
(13:52):
MAVs that has won you over?I think there's two components to it,
Mark, and I think I'm gonnastart with the most important one, which
is Luca. So let's start withLuca. And and Luca statistically, he's
been doing a lot of this reallyhis entire career, certainly the last few
years, last couple of years,and it's not about the numbers anymore for
(14:15):
me. It's about the seriousness forhim. And look, he's still gonna
play with that little cocky smirk onhis face, and that's okay, and
that's part of who he is andthe joy that he comes out with.
But I'm talking about the seriousness withwhich I think he's taken the physical conditioning
necessary to be a guy on thatlevel, I think he looks he just
(14:35):
looks leaner, he looks like he'sin better shape. He's always been strong
as an ox and like, Ithink even his body type didn't really I
think, indicate how strong the guyreally was. You could tell that when
you watch him and the way guyswould just you ride his hip to the
rim, and he was unfazed bythe contact, and I knew pretty early
on, like, man, thisguy must be unbelievably strong. Well,
he actually looks stronger now, likehe's just got more definition. He looks
(15:00):
like he's lost a little bit ofthe softness that he had in his body.
So that's the first thing I thinkhe is the conditioning. And then
I think just his approach to leadershiphas been better this year than it's been
in the past. I don't spendas much time watching Luca play and get
kind of getting irritated with him becauseI think he gets distracted easily by the
officials, or he gets caught upin things that aren't hurting it to winning.
(15:22):
I think there's fewer of those momentsnow, and I think it's all
coming together for him now, Likewhat ultimately this guy's ceiling could be.
I said halfway through his rookie year, Luka Doncics was going to be a
multiple time MVP and a multiple timechampion. I said that halfway through his
rookie season because guys like him winrings because of their effects on everybody else
on the roster with their passing ability. But then you'd watch him play those
(15:45):
for a couple of years, He'ssay, you know, he has to
grow up a lot, and Ithink that's all coming together. So that
would be the first thing. Luca'sapproach physically and mentally to being a leader
in what it takes every night,playing a little harder defensively, all those
things happening for him, and thenthe other thing, And you know a
big reason why I'm kind of hoton him right now. I just love
what they did at the deadline.I love those two editions. I love
(16:07):
Gafford was the one guy that stoodout to me when I watched Washington play
all year and in a bad situation, this guy competes every night. I'd
say to myself, like, ina bad situation, it's easy to come
out and think about numbers or getcaught up in whatever and pout or not
show up with effort every night.He never did it. He just consistently
played hard and it stood out tome. So when they get out and
(16:29):
they get him, now you havetwo lively set the legs, not no
pun intended with Derek and and Gafford. You have two bouncy legs, two
different guys that can go catch lives, that can protect the rim, that
can cover pick and roll adequately,and track guys if they turn the corner.
They have two of those down,not just one. So that just
gave them a different look. Andthen I think PJ. Washington is just
(16:51):
a pro and I think he's thebetter fit for than Grant Williams was in
that same spot. And so theygot deeper, and they needed to get
deeper, And they're making me alittle bit of a believer now that this
is a team that can can reallydo some damage that you've got to keep
them in the conversation. When youtalk about contenders in the Western conference.
I asked Charles Barkley this question atAll Star weekend, and now's my chance
(17:12):
to ask you. When Kyrie Irvingwas first acquired by the Mavericks, basically
thirteen months ago, what did youthink a Kyrie and Luca duo was capable
of. You know, ironically,I didn't have as much of a problem
wrapping my head around the two ofthem playing together like that. That's just
(17:33):
to me, was like, no, they're gonna figure that out. They're
two super talented guys that have alot of versatility in their game. Kyrie
has thrived being in that like thatsecond seat right, the striding shotgun,
if you will, because that's wherehe thrived the most in Cleveland with Lebron
James, and he went to Boston. The leadership thing that you know,
with the younger players that he hadto uplift. I don't think that's his
(17:56):
in his wheelhouse. I don't thinkhe really wanted to do that, and
obviously he forced his way out.Goes to Brooklyn. We know what happened
there. That just never came togetherfrom the beginning. My concern wasn't about
to fit stylistically. My concern wasjust Kyrie Irving. Is he someone that
is going to be committed to thisto the extent that he has to be
to get this thing where you wantedto go and get it across the finish
(18:19):
line ultimately, Because Kyrie, aswe know, has had moments where he
hasn't been available, either by hisown doing or circumstantial or whatever the reasons
may be. Injuries, he wasnot available all the time and there were
times when you wondered, like,how much does this mean to Kyrie Irving?
So that had to be answered.And look, I think there's still
(18:40):
questions about that. They've had anice run right now, but he just
missed another large chunk of time.Since he's come back, they've played really
well. I will say this,this stretch they've had here lately, that's
the best I've seen Kyrie and Lucalook together. They look like they're figuring
each other out. They're having morefun the ebb and flow that two guys
like that that dominate the ball haveto have to make that seamless. They're
(19:03):
starting to figure that out. Andwhen that happens, watch out, because
I just don't know how you weresupposed to defend both of those guys.
Trip after trip after trip, andso that's what my hesitation was about.
Kyrie Irving really just between his ears, where was he more so than what
they were going to look like whenthey actually put their games together. ESPN's
Tim Legler joining us here on theSaturday Steinline presented by Panini. Tim,
(19:29):
of course, played two seasons inDallas. Then he went on to win
the NBA's Three Point Contest while amember of the Washington Wizards, and as
you heard him off the top yeartwenty three with ESPN, Crazy run Man's
that is impressive. Look, theWest is absolutely stapped. I'm still a
Denver guy. I still trust theNuggets more than I trust anybody else.
(19:53):
I just can't pick against a Jokicled team if I'm forced to register my
pick right now. But when youlook at the West, I mean,
what can the Mass realistically do?And who do you see as the biggest
threat to Denver? Well, Iwould say, look, I think I
(20:14):
could go down the Western Conference andall the top probably the top eight teams
and give you compelling reasons why maybethat's just the team that ultimately rises to
that level and challenges Denver. First, I agree with you about Denver.
I trust them more than any otherteam, probably even in the league.
I think Boston's got the best startingfive. Boston certainly has had the best
year. You could say that.I think because of that, Boston is
the best team right now. Butthat's a different question then two minutes to
(20:37):
go deciding game, get through aseries, you get to around who you're
counting on them most. It Denver'sstill my answer, as is yours.
It's because of Jokic, and becausethere's no answer for joks and how well
the cool continuity of that starting five, and how well they play together on
both ends when they have to haveit in new way Murray played last night
when he's in that mindset being thataggressive. I just I agree with you.
(21:00):
It's still Denver. Go down thelist. I can make a compelling
case for all of them. Ithink right now, Mark, I'm gonna
answer it this way. I thinka lot of it is why I'd open
it to me determined his last twentygames, because I think there are still
teams figuring stuff out, and that'swhy it's hard to say definitively. I
think we know who Minnesota and OklahomaCity are. I don't know that Oklahoma
City as well as they play together. As much as I love Shay as
(21:23):
that star factor, I don't knowthat they make the run from basically being
on the outside looking into like theconference finals in one year and run all
those minefields. I just don't knowthat they can do that. Minnesota.
They're a great defensive team, andI don't say that much about anybody these
days. I do think that lategame situations is going to be interesting for
(21:45):
them. I don't know if AnthonyEdwards is like arrived to that level that
he's going to be able to beatyou with a high quality shot for himself
or a potentially make a play forsomebody, if that's what it takes in
that moment. So I think lategame situations offensively are still going to be
interesting for men. That's why I'mnot quite ready to go there with them.
I think the Clippers could be theteam, but I think they they've
(22:06):
got to figure out James Harden's balldominance I think is too much, and
I think it's gonna affect Kawhi Leonardin a negative way. I think they're
better off operating with Kawhi Leonard asthe initial primary guy and with James Harden
there. That's hard to do,so they've got some things to figure out.
But I do like their overall depth. I like the fact they could
turn up the heat defensively but theyneed to and they got a lot of
(22:26):
firepower offensively. Phoenix barely play togetherthose three guys. I need to see
that. I like the Roycenill pickup a lot. Let me see those
three guys operate together. And thenyou've got Dallas Mavericks and you've already said
how high that I am on them. I'm not going to be shocked whatsoever
if they can avoid Denver's bracket untilthey need to play them in the conference
(22:48):
finals. I'm not gonna be surprisedby Dallas making a run to the conference
finals. I'm trying to think ifI left anybody out the Pelicans, I
just I don't know, Like,you know this point Zion stuff that everybody's
so enamored with, I'm like,is that really what we want Zion Williamson
to be? Ultimately, he wasa dominant force that was unstoppable offensively when
he first came into the league,and you know, a unique one off
(23:10):
type player. Yes, fewer ofthose moments where he plays that way and
the assists are great, But isbo Aley a pass He's improved to the
point you can do that, butI think he's a unique force that is
not necessarily imposing his will on thegame in the same way that he used
to, and therefore I'm not sureabout them. Look, they're dangerous because
they got a lot of talent atthe top, they got good role players.
They could be a scary team.So I think I've covered everybody.
(23:33):
I don't know if I missed anyone, But well, that's the thing.
This conference is so deep that wereally haven't even touched on the Lakers and
the Warriors, who were down therein the playing zone right now. But
of course, if we were doingthis on the ESPN, we would have
to talk about those teams, butwe are we don't have to on this
show. But look, the problemwith radio is, man, the clock
moves so damn fast. And Icould do this with you for another hour,
(23:56):
but the last thing I want tothrow at you just before you go
and listen if you guys want moreof Tim Legler. Besides ESPN, he
does a podcast multiple times a weekwith Adamarrez, The All City Podcast,
which is fantastic. So Tim Legler'scommentary not hard to find. But I
just want you to rewind to yourplaying days. You were on those Mavericks
(24:17):
teams that were eleven and thirteen winseasons, a really tough time in the
history of this franchise. What comesto mind when I ask you about your
life with the Dallas Mavericks as aplayer, That's a very easy one for
me. You got to remember Mark, at that time I graduated in nineteen
eighty eight, I was undrafted,and I took a different route, right,
So I was playing in the CBA, which you know, for the
(24:37):
younger listeners, that's the G leaguethat we have today, was the seat
called the Continental Basketball Association sheet that'sat the time. I played in Rochester,
Minnesota. I played in Omaha,Nebraska. I went to Europe.
I had some ten days, youknow, go up to the league,
get back, go back when guysgot healthy. So I struggled to battle
all that. So then my firstreal legitimate opportunity to sink or swim team
(25:02):
on that first Dallas Mavericks team Ritchieout of Botto hundred fire. Earlier in
the year, Gar Hurt took overas the interim coach. Brad Davis was
his assistant. I will never forgetI was leading the CBA and scoring.
I was putting up like almost thirtyat night in the CBA, doing everything
I could, and at this pointout of school four to five years,
thinking is this gonna happen for me? I was definitely reaching that point if
(25:22):
a fork in the road was comingmy way and deciding what I wanted to
do with my life. And Igot this call from the Dallas Mavericks and
I met them on the road.I remember I went into the hotel room,
I met Gar, I met Brad, and I would never forget what
they said to me, like,look, we think you could play in
this league, but you've never reallyhad an opportunity to play three year mistakes
(25:44):
and just go play. Well,obviously, you know we're not a very
good team. We're losing a lotof games. We need shooting. You're
gonna play. We're gonna throw youout there and let you play, and
you can determine for yourself if youbelong in this league. And it was
a weight lifted off me. Ican't even tell you so even though you're
losing a frustrating, and I'm competitiveand I want to win every night.
I looked at that every single dayof practice, every shoot around, every
(26:07):
minute I got on the court asGame seven of my NBA Finals, trying
to cement myself and prove that Ibelonged in this league. And that was
really what that enabled me to do. And I played really well for them
that the end of that year,and and they pick picked up and assigned
me to a one year contract thenext year, and I played really well
as like the sixth man on thatthat second Dallas team, and that's when
(26:30):
I kind of proved everybody I thinkaround the league that I belonged. And
it was Golden State in Washington forfour years after that and Golden State one
more at the end. But itall really started for me in Dallas that
first year, getting an opportunity tojust playing and as a result, I'm
incredibly grateful, and the fans reallyreacted to me and and I just will
always appreciate the support. It's probablyto this day, I consider that one
(26:52):
of my favorite cities I've ever livedin, and I'm just grateful that it
that it worked out for me togo to that team in that situation because
I had an opportunity for the firsttime to miss shots and stay in the
game, and it was at theNBA level, and it was a tremendous
weight because I knew I had thetalent and the muscle memory. It was
getting the confidence at that level thatyou could play through mistakes and stay on
(27:15):
the court and they would value youfor more than just your shooting. That's
what happened for me in Dallas.That's why it's always gonna have a special
place in my heart. And bythe way, there's two jerseys hanging up
in my house. One is Washingtonand one is Dallas. For my days
playing there. There only two jerseysI have hanging up. Nice That tells
you how much that time in Dallaswent to me. And you saw I
already sent you the tweet from earlierthis week. My buddies at MAVs Film
(27:37):
Room they've started the campaign to retireyour number twenty three because of all the
nice things you've been saying about Lukeand the MAVs. So I'm glad we
I'm glad we could hook up anddo this. Uh No, definitely,
man, But I appreciate you reachingout anything for you love coming on,
good talk, and you're good catchingup and hopefully we'll do it again down
the road. Everybody there, hegoes Tim Legler from ESPN, and believe
(28:00):
me, everyone at ESBN knows thisguy has always been one of the foremost
basketball brains in Bristol, and everybody'sgetting to enjoy that now on his new
podcast with Adamar As an addition toESPN coverage, lots more of the Saturday
Steinline is coming up next here onninety seven, won the Freak. This
is durt Nowitzki and you're listening tothe Saturday Steinline with my guys Steiny on
(28:25):
ninety seven, won the Freak.Thank you Dirk Nooviski, and thank you
audience for sticking with us here onthe Saturday Steinline, presented as always by
my pals at Panini Trading Cards andCollectibles. Wednesday, you guys already know.
Wednesday was the twenty fifth birthday fora certain Gospodoncic Luka Doncic, and
(28:51):
that led to yours truly. Imade an in studio appearance with the world
famous Ben and Skin Show. Spenta half hour with the guys at lunch
talking all things Luca All things MAVs. Obviously we do not quite have the
real estate to replay the whole thing, but can we give you some flavor
(29:17):
of the spicy convo that we gotinto. Yes we can, so let's
get right to it. Wednesday lunchtimewith Ben and Skin. Oh man,
it is time to do something specialbecause joining us live in studio in honor
of Luka Doncic's twenty fifth birthday,give it up for our favorite old time
(29:38):
NBA reporter and host of the SaturdaySteinline, brought to you by Paniti Trading
Cards. It's Mark Stein. Thankyou, guys, thanks for the warm
welcome. Look at that dope ninetyseven to one the freak haddies right over
there visus you. I know youguys follow none of my works, so
(29:59):
you haven't said I wore this thingevery day to All Star Weekend. I
wore it on a night on thetown with the Chuckster. Are you serious?
Well, I was wearing the hat. The slight exaggeration is I accidentally
ended up spending my Saturday and night. I ended up in the same place
with a chuckster. But I hadmy free cat on hosted two pods at
the NBA Crossover FanFest, wearing myfree cat picture with Grant Hill and Chelsea
(30:25):
Gray. Wearing my free cat picturewith Chris Finch, the Wolves coach,
wearing my free I love this hatand I told you it is. It
is an amazing conversation starter. It'sa dope. It's a dope. What
I'm waiting for is I want tosee Yannis when I'm wearing this hat,
because I guarantee he's going to seethis hat and the Greek freak will say,
I want to talk to you,and I will get to interview him.
(30:48):
I will get to interview the Greekfreak on the freak. That is.
Oh, that's a goal. That'sfantastic. That's fantastic. I didn't
want to start with this, butnow I'm completely sidetracked by it. It
sounds like your All Star weekend wasjust incredible. You were everywhere and doing
everything. Honestly that no, Iwouldn't say that, but I had a
great time. I love Indianapolis.I'm sure you've been there with the MAVs
(31:10):
at something. I've actually never beento Indianapolis. It is a old school,
traditional NBA city, former ABA city. I love going there. You've
probably heard me witter on about SaneElmos Steakhouse and their famed shrimp cocktail.
Follow Well, you know the MAVswent right to Indianapolis right out of the
break or you know, right afterthey played Phoenix at home then went to
Indianapolis. Followell and Coop couldn't waitto tweet their shrimp cocktails because when you
(31:34):
go to Sane Elmo and Indy,this this shrimp cocktail. It comes with
this spicy horse radish sauce. OhI'm in, that clears your sinuses.
Oh I'm in, And like itis, it's just like it's an end.
It's NBA legend. So when yougo to Indy, you gotta get
that whoa, whoa, whoa.Don't even move on. Okay, okay,
a shrimp cocktail that is so famous, Like it's not even the restaurant
(31:56):
as much as it's that item,the shrimp cocktail. Give me some description
here is it are a giant orgiant shrimp in what has been described as
a hubcap, and it is justbathed in this super spicy horse radish cocktail
sauce. Amen, and it isan It's just like in the NBA when
(32:20):
you like, look, the bestpart of our job when you do what
I get to do. I alwayssay to sports writers, we root for
restaurants and hotels, we don't rootfor teams. So I mean to me
in Indianapolis. Indianapolis is synonymous withthe Pacers, the Indy five hundred,
(32:40):
and the Saint Almost Shrimp Cocktail.What's important is that you are here on
Luka Doncic's birthday, and two weeksago Luka Doncic's birthday felt like it was
going to be way different than whatit feels like right now. Yes,
they have lost two games in arow, but everything lead up to that.
(33:00):
The wind streak started, the trade, the wind streak continued. I
would imagine the vibes are way differentin Lukadancic world than we anticipated them being
a couple weeks ago. Well,I thought this was going to be a
big celebration. That's why my ideawas coming here and sit with you guys.
But I after last night, Imean, I was really worried about
Ben. I figured this thing,this thing turns into a therapy session now
(33:22):
because that look, it was gutwrenching when Cleveland came here and beat the
MAVs. I think it was afifteen oher run to close the game.
No Donovan Mitchell, no Darius Garland, and give that was a really bad
home loss. What happened last nightwas I mean, that had to be.
That had to be a top fiveworst MAVs loss. Ever, it's
(33:45):
it's just so improbable to lose ona fifty nine foot Yeah, I mean,
it just the hell. But I'mnot emotional about it. It's really
not Surprisingly he didn't watch it.No, I watched every second of it.
And the reason I'm not emotional aboutit is because it was such an
entertaining game and the end of it, and if it was a playoff game
or something like that, I wouldbe devastated. But so many weird things
(34:09):
happen at the end. And Idon't know if you know this, but
yesterday on the show, I predictedLuca would have a fifty point triple double.
He did, and he flirted withit, he got really really close.
And so I'm watching that game saying, we're watching one of the all
time great Luca games. And thenthere were some weird calls, there were
some weird turnovers. It was justso bizarre. Max Strus just gets red
(34:30):
hot, can't miss, and DonovanMitchell banked in a three. When guys
are banking in threes, all betsare off. It's just a weird night.
And then for somebody to hit afifty nine foot shot, you can't
even be mad. That is justa freak. That's harder to do than
complete a Hail Mary. It hasto be galling for Luca on his birthday
(34:51):
Eve. He is the you know, the half court shot maestro. The
reason you show up early to MAVsgames is to watch him go through his
crazy shooting routine. There's no databaseto check this, but has it ever
happened that a team got a bankthree and a sixty footer in the last
ninety seconds of an NBA game?There is no way that had to be
(35:13):
a first, right? Are youlike me now? Since we're all old
like obviously you love your job,Yeah, you love being there in person,
But isn't it great to just behome and watch it too. I've
been to a zillion NBA games.I'm so privileged, I'm so lucky.
I don't know what it is.I'm so much more relaxed at home at
a game. My head's on aswivel, and I'm always, oh my
(35:37):
god, there's you know, there'san agent I didn't expect to see.
I gotta go corner him. Ohthey're at home. I'm just like,
I'm watching it with my kid.I just I really really like watching basketball
at home. You're enjoying hoops athome and you're working at the arena.
I will say that the experience Ihad last week where it was a T
and T game, and so abuddy that sits on the front road gave
(35:59):
me and myself on seats to siton the baseline, that was about as
much fun as I've had it aMaverick game in my entire life, at
any age in the AAC Or Reunionarena, I had more fun sitting on
the front row with my son asa fan. I wasn't even drinking.
I'm drinking water, and we hadso much fun. When you can go
(36:21):
be a fan at an NBA game, and I think that's why you enjoy
watching it at home because you're notworking. Speaking of vibes, you know
that every time you come on ourshow, I got to tell you how
concerned I am about Luca right righthere It's why I made the arduous five
minute drive in all right. So, and I don't know if you're familiar
with the movie War Games, Iam not. You know, I am
(36:42):
not. I'm not familiar with it. Well, deaf Con five is the
lowest perceived threat. Deaf Con oneis the highest threat level and readiness for
a state of war. And soif you get to deaf Con one,
that means Luca for sure is requestinga trade. My read on it from
a million miles away is that afterthe MAVs made the trades that they made,
(37:07):
and watching the chemistry out there betweenKai and Luca, that you can
take it on back to deaf Conefive. My read is there is no
current threat that this offseason Luca willrequest a trade. Now I have I
swung too far the other direction.I would never put it at deaf Con
one or deaf Con five. Iwould keep I would just keep it at
(37:29):
deaf Con three. Oh that's aggressive. You just ruined that. No,
March Sean, what are you doing? Lie to the man, what are
you doing? Well? I wasactually thinking, if you ask me this
every time I see you, whichis once a month, maybe once every
two months, do you ask Skinevery day, I mean every five minutes
text him in the middle of askinghim mate, when you finished answering this
(37:50):
week, answered again. Look,there is zero indication that he's requesting anything
like you're suggesting. But I'm justsaying it's just wise. It just I'm
a star trek. Gu I justkeep the shields up. How much better
are the Mavericks with the trades inyour estimation? The best thing about MAVs
(38:12):
Land right now is no question theway that Luca and Kyrie are functioning as
a duo. I mean again,last night they were ridiculously good, Yes,
and the fantastic And you know,Jalen Brunson was famous for saying,
the vibes are immaculate. The vibesare never immaculate in the NBA. No
one, not even the Boston Celticshave immaculate vibes. Nobody does. But
(38:36):
the MAVs star duo. They're playingwell together. They look like they're getting
along fantastically well. The duo isfunctioning as well as the MAVs could have
hoped, except for that one caveatthat Kyrie has missed twenty two games.
I want to say, off thetop of my head and in the year
span for the season and so looka lot. But when they are out
(39:00):
there together, they are crushing theissue. There's no question that the MAVs
have upgraded the roster. PJ.Washington and Daniel Gafford addressed multiple needs.
But the problem still is they theystill live in the Western Conference. That's
the problem. The West is backto what it was and what it usually
(39:20):
is. Last year was a crazyaberration. There were only two fifty win
teams in the West. Sacramento wasthe third seed with forty eight wins.
Forty eight wins, you might endup in the play in this year,
right look at the play in rightnow. MAVs are there. You gotta
deal with Stephen Curry and the Warriors. As much as we say nobody wants
to see Luca and Kyrie in theplayoffs, you do not want to see
(39:44):
the Warriors in a playing game oreven a series. They're they're you know,
they're dangerous. Lebron James and AnthonyDavis. It's like the playing zone
is daunting. Even if they getto six, it's not going to be
a fun first round. Do youplay the Clippers again? Does Denver stay
(40:04):
number three, and you do youwant to see Denver in the first round.
Hell no, I would not.I mean, I'd rather play Minnesota
or Oklahoma City because they're unproven.I want to ask you about this with
regard to the All Star Break.Luca plays the game, yep, and
then he goes on a vacation toMexico. It's then reported, oh,
Jason kids at the same resort.Oh my goodness, look at this,
Devin Bookers at this same resort,and people were getting on social media going,
(40:29):
oh, no, it's a fakebeef. They love each other.
They're vacationing together. And I'm thinking, I don't know if that's the case.
It may just be the hot spotwhere all the big NBA players go.
So can you tell me if thoseguys went on a vacation together,
they one bazillion percent did not goon a vacation. Did they end up
(40:50):
in the same vacation destination? Yes, do they beef? No, they
they're fine. They're fine. Thereisn't a beef. They respect each other.
I would even dare say they likeeach other. So I hope I'm
not ruining your your Luca birthday partyeven further. But they are fine,
(41:10):
there's no issue there, So thisscenario'm gonna paint. If they run into
each other at the vacation destination,there is tapping up in mutual aspect.
Luca in the middle of the night, I think I need some ice.
He grabs the ice bucket. He'swalking down the hall Bookers leaving the ice
bucket. They're in. They're in. They're in fancy villas with like they
(41:36):
hit a little button if they needa somebody comes running and brings it to
them. There there's no ice buckets, no disheveled hair and flip flops walking
to the ice. I don't knowwhere you go on spring break, but
they are not in the same place. They are not at the Garland Motel.
Sits okay, everyone that is goingto do it for this edition of
(41:58):
the Saturday Steinline. Thanks to Paninitrading cards and collectibles, without whom this
show does not happen. This showis not possible. Thanks to glue Guy
Grooves. He put the show andit's many disparate pieces together. Yet again,
Thank you Maddy G for scaring theship while I'm considerably out of range,
(42:22):
and remember everyone tomorrow Sunday noon,a very early tip off. The
Mavericks are back from the road.The Philadelphia seventy six ers without joe El
Embiid are in town. Kevin Graywill have MAVs pregame at eleven thirty.
Chuck Cooperstein on the call with BradDavis at noon
Popular Podcasts
On Purpose with Jay Shetty
I’m Jay Shetty host of On Purpose the worlds #1 Mental Health podcast and I’m so grateful you found us. I started this podcast 5 years ago to invite you into conversations and workshops that are designed to help make you happier, healthier and more healed. I believe that when you (yes you) feel seen, heard and understood you’re able to deal with relationship struggles, work challenges and life’s ups and downs with more ease and grace. I interview experts, celebrities, thought leaders and athletes so that we can grow our mindset, build better habits and uncover a side of them we’ve never seen before. New episodes every Monday and Friday. Your support means the world to me and I don’t take it for granted — click the follow button and leave a review to help us spread the love with On Purpose. I can’t wait for you to listen to your first or 500th episode!
Stuff You Should Know
If you've ever wanted to know about champagne, satanism, the Stonewall Uprising, chaos theory, LSD, El Nino, true crime and Rosa Parks, then look no further. Josh and Chuck have you covered.
Dateline NBC
Current and classic episodes, featuring compelling true-crime mysteries, powerful documentaries and in-depth investigations. Follow now to get the latest episodes of Dateline NBC completely free, or subscribe to Dateline Premium for ad-free listening and exclusive bonus content: DatelinePremium.com