Episode Transcript
Available transcripts are automatically generated. Complete accuracy is not guaranteed.
Speaker 1 (00:00):
So weird to how the Colorado State Legislature well scream
about how taber tize their hands. They can't make investments
in schools or infrastructure. But it did stop them from
giving money to NGOs or other no profits, oh which
(00:21):
they have family members in.
Speaker 2 (00:22):
Very interesting, very very true.
Speaker 3 (00:28):
Yes, cronyism is alive and well under the gold Dome.
Speaker 2 (00:32):
Hey, I'm John Caldera.
Speaker 3 (00:33):
Seven minutes after give me a call three h three
seven to one three eight two five five seven to
one three talk. I run a little organization that's been
around for forty years now.
Speaker 2 (00:44):
I can't believe it.
Speaker 3 (00:45):
Independence Institute has been leading the fight for limited government,
for the taxpayer Bill of Rights, for our flat tax,
for lowering our flat income tax, for concealed.
Speaker 2 (00:58):
Carry, for educational choice.
Speaker 3 (01:00):
Without us, we wouldn't have charter schools, concealed Carrie Tabor,
the flat tax, all sorts of great things. And as
there's a fight for a tax increase coming up next year,
we'll be leading a charge. Join us, won't you go
to thinkfreedom dot org. Thinkfreedom dot org. Next Saturday, we're
having our world famous alcohol, tobacco and firearms party where
(01:25):
we yes, we spoke drink and shoot. Why to have
some fun and to hack off the nannyists? Columnists and
reporter John Fundle join us there. It's always a great time.
If you like shotgutting in clay sports, you want to
do it again? Go to thinkfreedom dot org. We're closing
up our registration today. I think we've got a couple
(01:45):
seats left, so you want to jump in if you
want to. It's a great fundraiser for us, and my god,
we've been doing it for nearly a quarter of a century.
How to make the eight Do you have fun again?
You actually smoke, drink and shoot?
Speaker 2 (02:04):
We do it.
Speaker 3 (02:05):
Go to thinkfreedom dot org. That's thinkfreedom dot org. We
switch gears a little bit because this has something to
do with Colorado, even though it's a national issue. The
minimum wage, tipping tax, on tips and who should get paid?
What this from the Wall Street Journal. McDonald's, Yes, the
(02:28):
big corporation. McDonald's thinks that set it down. Restaurants need
to give their servers a raise. Well, that makes sense
because it would give them a competitive advantage, wouldn't it.
The Burger Giant has come out against wage rules that
allow casual dining restaurants bars and other establishments to pay
(02:52):
below the typical minimum wage to tip earning workers.
Speaker 2 (03:02):
If if you follow.
Speaker 3 (03:05):
This, you know that those waiters, waitresses, bar staff who
work for tips have a smaller minimum wage. You don't
have to pay them as much. Why because they get tips.
They get tips, so they get less than minimum wage. Now,
(03:27):
the minimum wage nationally is seven dollars in something it's
kind of irrelevant. The Colorado minimum wage is something like
fifteen dollars. The Denver minimum wage is over nineteen dollars.
Which is why businesses are going out of business. It's
why your favorite mom and pop store isn't there any longer.
(03:52):
It's there because we have cities deciding what the minimum
wage should be in their town and putting business is
out of business, which means they won't make tax revenue.
Speaker 2 (04:04):
It's all a wonderful, wonderful game.
Speaker 3 (04:08):
So it's very important that restaurants get to pay less
than minimum wage. Now, less than minimum wage doesn't mean
less than minimum wage because you get tipped. So those
people who work for tips on par make a lot
(04:29):
more than minimum wage. Now McDonald's wants wants everybody to
pay this higher wage.
Speaker 2 (04:39):
Why wouldn't you.
Speaker 3 (04:42):
McDonald's has gone so far as to withdraw from the
National Restaurant Association, sometimes known as the Other NRA, the
industry's main US trade group, as of its result on
its stance on tipped wages. Right now, there's an uneven playing.
Speaker 2 (05:01):
Field, says McDonald's.
Speaker 3 (05:06):
All classes of workers should be paid at or above
the federal minimum wage. Of course, McDonald's wants that because McDonald's.
McDonald's pays that minimum wage. You don't tip at McDonald's,
so they don't get to pay the lower than minimum wage. Chicago,
(05:27):
where McDonald's is based, is phasing out the tipped minimum wage.
Speaker 2 (05:34):
Washington, d c. Is deciding to eliminate it.
Speaker 3 (05:39):
This is going to cause all sorts of problems for restaurants.
Wouldn't it be nice if we just got rid of
tipping all together? How about we do that? Would you
like to go full Europe and simply get rid of tipping?
Speaker 2 (05:57):
I would love that.
Speaker 3 (05:59):
Ask people who for tips and they probably don't like
that idea.
Speaker 2 (06:04):
Hmm.
Speaker 3 (06:07):
Sit down, chains, so, says Chilis, have had to cut
into sales. Have cut into sales at McDonald's by advertising
burgers at prices that compete with the fast food giant
paying tipped employees a sub minimum wage is an advantage
on labor costs that fast food chains don't have. Is
(06:29):
that fair? Absolutely, it's fair. First of all, let me
go on my rant on the minimum wage. I despise it. It
is a hate law. It is a dangerous, terrible, Unamerican
concept the minimum wage. Why you know, we can do
all the usual reasons that it keeps people from getting
(06:52):
their first starter job, that it's the way that people
get into the economies, how they get work experience, how
businesses go out of business when there's a raised in
the minimum wage.
Speaker 2 (07:03):
We can do all that stuff. I really don't care
about that.
Speaker 3 (07:08):
I care about the ability for people to have a
relationship of their choosing. If we had a law that
said gay people couldn't get married, or gay people couldn't
have a relationship together, people would lose.
Speaker 2 (07:24):
Their mind, and they should.
Speaker 3 (07:27):
If we had a law that said, no, I'm sorry,
interracial couples, no, we can't have that. We find that
too perverse. We would say those are hate laws. Those
are hate laws that make it so that we discriminate
against people who choose relationships we don't like, and we
find gross or immoral or unreligious or whatever, and everyone
(07:53):
would scream a law like that is a hate law.
You're keeping gay couples from having the lifestyle they choose
and have the relationship they choose. But if someone decides
to have a relationship as a worker, as an employee
with someone, and we don't like what they've agreed on,
(08:17):
we go, oh, that's two perverse, you guys. You two
people cannot have that relationship of employer and employee.
Speaker 2 (08:28):
And think about it.
Speaker 3 (08:32):
Two women can live together, they can start a business together,
they can get married together, they can buy a home together.
Speaker 2 (08:39):
They can do all.
Speaker 3 (08:40):
These things together. But if their relationship is employer and
employee under the minimum wage.
Speaker 2 (08:49):
They can't have that.
Speaker 3 (08:51):
One woman wants to work for another woman for less
than the minimum wage, that's perverse. Basically, progress only believe
in consensual relationships when people are naked. Otherwise a financial
relationship is too perverse. I find this im moral. I'll
(09:13):
give you my case in point. My son, as you
might know, has Down syndrome. He's now twenty one. He
loves to work, he loves to be part of a team.
He would love to work at a restaurant where he
could sit people at the table or clean up the
table and interact with typical folks.
Speaker 2 (09:34):
He excels at that, but he's not worth twenty dollars
an hour.
Speaker 3 (09:41):
No one will pay him to do that because it
takes it's well, he's just not like his old man.
He's not what you call a productive guy. He takes
a lot of he takes a lot of.
Speaker 2 (09:55):
Oversight. You have to have someone with him basically all
the time. But he would love to work. Now.
Speaker 3 (10:02):
Instead of working, he goes to a day program basically
it's daycare for adults, and he hangs out with a
lot of people who's in similar situations. Now, these are
all great people, but they want jobs. They can't get jobs.
(10:23):
I don't care if my son makes a penny an hour.
He would be better off working. He would be better
off if he could spend a few hours a day
doing something, interacting and being part of a team. He's
had some of that training when he was in school,
(10:44):
and you could see the pride in his eyes when
he talked about it. He worked at mcguck and Hardware
as part of the hardware store up and Boulder, and
he loved working there. Now all he did was wipe
down the counter or shopping carts. It was kind of
made up work, but it was to train him how
(11:04):
to do something at work. And he would come home
from work being full of pride because he was part
of a team. He loved wearing the green vest that
the employees would wear. But he doesn't have that pride
because he cannot work at full wage. It would be ridiculous,
(11:28):
absolutely insane.
Speaker 2 (11:30):
You know, he's basically a six.
Speaker 3 (11:32):
Year old, but if he got paid a penny, he
doesn't know the difference.
Speaker 2 (11:41):
He doesn't care.
Speaker 3 (11:43):
He's not allowed to have this relationship because other people
think it's perverse. Thus it's a hate law. It is
a hate crime. That's why the minimum wage sucks and
it's wrong. And here in Colorado where we've unleashed it
(12:04):
to a real extent, a nineteen dollars an hour minimum wage.
Anybody who's been in the restaurant industry or service industries
knows that doesn't work. That's why mom and pops are
going out of business at a record level in Denver.
It cannot continue and it hurts people. That's why it's wrong.
(12:30):
So one of the ways around it is if you
get a tipped wage, you get to make a little
less on the minimum wage, you're still your take home
is far above minimum wage. And that's the law. By
the way, that's the law. When you hear that people
get paid less than the minimum wage when they're on
(12:52):
a tipped scale, you need to know this.
Speaker 2 (12:55):
It's not that they take home less than minimum wage.
Speaker 3 (12:59):
In fact, by law, they have to take home more
than minimum wage when you add in the tips. Colorado
deals with this, and there's a group of people who
want to get rid of it. Let's let's grab a
couple of phone calls here, three or three seven, one, three, eight,
(13:21):
two five five.
Speaker 2 (13:22):
Brian, Welcome. You're with John Caldera. So glad to have you.
Speaker 4 (13:26):
Good morning, John. Hey, question about minimum wages. And I
used to be in the printing industry a long time ago,
twenty years back. Used to employ a company called day
Odd Industries I believe it was.
Speaker 3 (13:37):
Yeah, I know theyd great organizations, Yeah, and they were
That's exactly what they did.
Speaker 4 (13:43):
They employed people that were challenged and they did a
wonderful job for like collating and sorting and things of
this nature. Would that minimum wage come into play for that?
Speaker 2 (13:57):
For those I believe. So yeah, and Colorado.
Speaker 3 (14:00):
So if it is a for profit company, you have
to pay minimum wage.
Speaker 4 (14:06):
Interesting, that's it.
Speaker 3 (14:08):
And so think about this. The national minimum wage is
what's seven bucks an hour?
Speaker 2 (14:13):
In Denver? It's nineteen. It is hot.
Speaker 3 (14:17):
The minimum wage in Denver is higher than the minimum wage.
Speaker 2 (14:22):
In New York City.
Speaker 3 (14:24):
So you're trying to make minimum wage in New York
City where the cost of living is so so much
more than Denver and the minimum wage is lower.
Speaker 2 (14:32):
That's how out of whack Colorado is. And it's one
of the reasons why.
Speaker 3 (14:37):
I mean, when was the last time you went to
a restaurant and you get a super in a salad
and fifty bucks?
Speaker 2 (14:43):
It's like, what is this?
Speaker 3 (14:47):
You've seen it, and you've also noticed that the service
industries are suffering. Service at restaurants is not as good
as it used to be before COVID. Have you gone
to a hotel recently, just got back from a trip,
and daily room service of cleaning your room, you have
to ask for it. They don't come into your room
(15:08):
and make the bed and vacuum up and give you
fresh towels. No, no, no, there for three days and
nobody showed up. That's because they can't afford the labor.
You've noticed this, haven't you, Yes, that's why. And the
(15:30):
people it hurts are the people who are not employed.
Colorado has a ridiculous minimum wage law even before we
let the cities go loose. It ties it to inflation,
and it's in the constitution, so anytime inflation goes up,
the minimum wage goes up. There's obviously written by people
who don't remember stagflation of the seventies where you can
(15:53):
have unemployment and inflation. So imagine the inflation rate drives
our minimum wage up to fifty.
Speaker 2 (16:02):
Dollars an hour.
Speaker 3 (16:03):
No one can pay it, but no one can take
a wage lower than that, So unemployment keeps skyrocketing as
the minimum wage keeps skyrocketing. It's insanean yep, hey, Brian,
thank you so much. Have a great one three oh
three seven one three eight.
Speaker 2 (16:24):
Two five five. So this this.
Speaker 3 (16:29):
Move to push restaurants to get rid of the sub
minimum wage. So the wage minimum wage is two dollars
and thirteen cents federally and allows patrons to round up
the rest of the service pay, but it has to
(16:50):
reach at least the minimum wage, which is seven dollars
and twenty five cents an hour. And this is where
Republicans failed again. Back when George was president, there was
a big push to raise the minimum wage on a
federal level. Being whimphs about it, the Republicans decided not
(17:13):
to have a debate. They just said, no, let's leave
it the way it is, and over time, inflation will
make the federal minimum wage irrelevant. And at seven dollars
twenty five cents it is rather irrelevant. But imagine, if
you will, if Republicans, when they had the presidency, in
the House and the Senate, said the minimum wage is immoral.
(17:36):
This is not a federal issue, it's a state issue,
and we shouldn't be dictating private relationships.
Speaker 2 (17:43):
We're going to get rid of the minimum wage. They
could have made the case that they could.
Speaker 3 (17:49):
Have educated the public on this hate law, but no,
they just took the easy way out, as Republicans often did.
Speaker 2 (17:58):
Now, Colorado's going to nineteen dollar and the power minimum
wage in Denver.
Speaker 1 (18:03):
Two items to check when tipping. First of all, check
the receipt to make sure tipping somehow hasn't been already
included on your charges, maybe because of a large party
or something else. But second, use your basic maths fills
and calculate the tip yourself, or use your calculator. I
will say, in many instances, on the printed out receipts
(18:24):
or the device they give you, those calculations aren't always accurate.
Speaker 3 (18:31):
Hmm, all right, how how much have you seen about
this little fee that is now part of many restaurants.
It's called the BOH fee. You don't actually have to
pay it, but it's there on your bill. You'd have
to ask for to be gone. What is BOH back
(18:56):
of house? So here's the deal. Your restaurant waiters, waitresses, servers, bartenders,
you can tip them. They make money on tips, and
they can do pretty well. The guys who are the
line order cooks in the back they don't get tipped wages.
They get a regular wage, whatever that wage might be.
(19:19):
And restaurants can't afford them any longer, so they add.
Some restaurants added BOH fee at back of house fee
like three percent, So you buy something and there's an
extra three percent charge so that they can give that
(19:40):
money as a tip sort of to the to the
line cooks. And they're doing this because the front of
house people are making so much more money on tips,
and then your bill goes up and you tip on
the bill which includes the boas fee, and the waiters
get even more in tips. It's all pretty crazy. Three
(20:02):
h three seven one three eight two five five. I'm
John Caldera in for the big man. Not to worry,
he'll be back next week. And then I love this
game when they they hand you now the little iPad,
or they flip the iPad over and it has the
(20:23):
tips already built in, and the lowest tip is always
twenty percent, twenty five percent, thirty percent, and and they're
holding it while you tip them. It would be kind
(20:44):
of like having the politician standing there in the voting
booth watching you choose which lever to pull. No no
pressure there, and what is this tip inflation? Now, I'll
(21:04):
remember when I had a kid that that it was
a fifteen percent tip was a good tip. Fifteen percent
that's a big tip. Ten percent was normal, fifteen was
if they're doing well. And then it switched that fifteen
percent was the normal tip and twenty percent and now
(21:27):
they're trying to push it that no, no, no, no, no,
twenty percent is the normal tip and twenty five percent
is even better. Ugh. I'm not saying you don't deserve this,
and I'm not saying you don't deserve a good tip.
(21:48):
I'm just saying it's getting crazy. And that wonderful way
of having the suggested tip already on the on the
iPad when they.
Speaker 2 (21:59):
Give it to you.
Speaker 3 (22:01):
There was a study done, I think it was like
a Starbucks or some chain, and some of their stores
had the suggested tip amounts on the screen and some
did not. And they found that the workers wanted to
work at the places that had the suggested tips on
the screen. Why because the amount of tips was sizeably higher,
(22:25):
sizeably higher. Let's grab a couple of phone calls. Sore
youre three seven one three eight two five five? Hey
don you're with John KELDERA good morning.
Speaker 5 (22:36):
Yeah, A quick question on this sum. Can businesses negotiate
wages and work around the minimum wages?
Speaker 2 (22:48):
Yes and no.
Speaker 3 (22:50):
You cannot negotiate something that is lower than minimum wage.
But if you have a salaried employer employee.
Speaker 2 (23:01):
They can.
Speaker 3 (23:03):
You're a lot more free to have them work longer,
work after hours.
Speaker 2 (23:09):
You don't have to worry about overtime.
Speaker 3 (23:13):
And so a negotiated wage a salary is different than
a negotiated wage.
Speaker 2 (23:18):
You cannot.
Speaker 3 (23:20):
If you cannot negotiate a lower wage than the minimum wage.
So in Deaver, somebody says, hey, dude, I'm happy to
work for ten dollars an hour, and the guys I
could actually afford that. So you have two people who
say I want to work for ten dollars an hour,
and the employer going, I can actually afford that, so
(23:41):
I can say yes, and the government steps in and
says no, that that's just perverse. You're exploiting that person.
So neither one of you get the advantage of your relationship.
You cannot have the relationship of your choice.
Speaker 2 (24:00):
Are good?
Speaker 5 (24:00):
Thank you?
Speaker 2 (24:01):
Yeah? Pretty awful. I think I think it's downright hateful.
Speaker 3 (24:04):
I think any law that prevents people from having a
relationship of their choosing is hateful. And I think we've
done a terrible job of making the moral case against.
Speaker 2 (24:20):
The minimum wage.
Speaker 3 (24:21):
Instead we keep doing these economic cases. It's bad for kids,
it's bad for businesses, it's bad for the economy. All true,
all true, But that's not what makes it ugly.
Speaker 2 (24:32):
What makes it ugly is that you're keeping people apart.
Speaker 3 (24:37):
If you like the minimum wage, then if people want
to say, you know, gay people shouldn't have relationships, you
should be okay with that too.
Speaker 2 (24:49):
All right, Hey, thanks for the phone call. Have yourself
a great morning.
Speaker 3 (24:51):
Three h three seven one three eight two five five
seven one three talk.
Speaker 2 (24:56):
So what do you tip? What? What is your average tip?
And have you noticed that it's harder to.
Speaker 3 (25:06):
Give the tip you want because the waiter, waitresses is
it is staring at you as you're filling out the
little pad that she's holding. That used to be you
sign a receipt and you put down a tip, or
you put down some cash, but now they're holding a
(25:27):
thing and the minimum amount suggested is twenty percent and
they're looking at you like what you're gonna just choose
the minimum? Is my service really worth the minimum? After
I brought you that glass of water?
Speaker 2 (25:46):
Oh?
Speaker 3 (25:47):
I hate those things? I hate those things? So what
is your what is your average tip? And if you
make your living on tips? Why should you? Why should
you not have to pay taxes on your tips? That
makes no sense to me, That makes no sense to me.
(26:11):
You should you should pay taxes on what you earn.
All of us should. Now that taxes on tips are
going to be tax free once they figure out how
to do it. I'm going to pay everybody in tips.
(26:33):
I'm sorry, you're you're a tipped employee. Now you're you're
you're a tipped employee. Will just tip you for the
work you do. I'm a computer programmer, and you're doing
a wonderful job, by the way, So here's here's an
extra twenty percent as a tip. Now you don't have
to pay taxes. I love that thought. Three or three
(26:56):
seven one, three eight two five five. I think Europe does.
Speaker 2 (27:04):
Does it right.
Speaker 3 (27:05):
I love that you don't pay taxes in most or tips.
You don't pay tips in most of most of Europe.
How about this one. When I was a waiter, I
would tip my bus boys out of my tips. The
cooks also, if they would work with me, if they
I got better service and made more on tips than
(27:26):
the waitresses.
Speaker 2 (27:27):
Who would not share their tips. Oh that makes sense.
Midium wage is nothing more than.
Speaker 3 (27:36):
Tax increase, one tex says, because workers more than pay
workers more than they pay more taxes federal and state,
and then prices have to go up to those to
pay those workers as they get more taxes.
Speaker 2 (27:54):
All right, got it?
Speaker 3 (27:59):
There's also a ripple effect. Whenever the minimum wage is
put up. A guy I know who has a small
shop does oil changes. He says, Yeah, the minimum wage
when it goes up, costs me a lot more than
just the minimum wage. Because the minimum wage goes from
eighteen dollars to nineteen dollars. That means the new guys
(28:21):
who are hired are at nineteen dollars and the old
guys who are who moved up because of seniority or
good service or after a year, who are getting nineteen
or like, wait a second, you're paying this new guy
the same amount as me who's been here for two years. No,
(28:43):
I deserve to make more than him. And so you've
got to pay the minimum wage for the new guy.
But you also have to pump up all the old guys,
even if they are at the new minimum wage. And
that's why businesses are going out of business. That's why
Denver restaurants aren't going out of business, particularly the mom
(29:05):
and pop places. Add to that, Colorado's inflation on food
is among the country's highest because of all the regulatory burdens.
And then you've got property taxes, and then you've got
(29:26):
the family leave at tax, which is a one percent
tax on a payroll tax, and then you've got problems
with homeless and crime, and people go, you know what,
I'm not paying for all this. It's not worth it
to me to spend so much money, so much money
(29:51):
on on a sandwich. I'll just bring a sandwich to work.
I's thinking one more call here, that's grab Richard, Richard,
welcome who with John KELDERA.
Speaker 5 (30:04):
Yeah, thank you. A lot of people forget that.
Speaker 2 (30:07):
Tips.
Speaker 5 (30:08):
There's a difference between tips and a gratuity. Tips actually
stands for to insure prompt service, and that's something that
you give something like a bell boy or concierge of
a hotel. A gratuity is for service above and beyond.
And I don't give a tip or a gratuity if
you will, to McDonald's or the doughnut shop or a
(30:30):
sandwich shop, because they're already getting a salary of minimum wage.
If there's a difference in salary between a salaried person
at a restaurant, a sit down restaurant as compared to
like a McDonald's. So I don't give gratuity at all
(30:52):
unless I'm at a sit down restaurant.
Speaker 2 (30:55):
Yeah, And it's tough.
Speaker 3 (30:57):
You go to a coffee shop and there's a tip job,
are there, It's like, well, you give me a tip.
Speaker 2 (31:01):
It's like you just handed me a cup of coffee.
Speaker 3 (31:04):
It's it's not like you brought it over to me
and stirred it in the sugar for me.
Speaker 2 (31:08):
You just handed me a sandwich. That's that's not it.
That's not something.
Speaker 5 (31:15):
Turn around and handed me. That's what you get paid
to do.
Speaker 2 (31:18):
Yes, that's your job.
Speaker 3 (31:22):
By the way, talk show hosts can accept tips, too,
so feel free to you know, if if so inclined,
if you.
Speaker 5 (31:29):
Like the service, I'll tell you what. I'll double what
time I'm paying you.
Speaker 2 (31:34):
That is generous, I'll triple.
Speaker 5 (31:36):
I'll triple what I'm saying.
Speaker 2 (31:37):
Oh no, now you're just being silly. All right, I
got a run. Thanks for the call. I'm John Caldera
and for the big man.
Speaker 3 (31:44):
Keep it right here six thirty k. How was this
Dire Straits that did that song with and with sting? Yeah,
now I remember, all right, we got about seven minutes
to the top. I'm John Caldera talking about minimum wage
and tips. So I love the politics of Trump saying
(32:06):
we're going to end the tax on tips. Now, mind
you really is an a tax on tips. There's a
tax on making money. It's called your income tax. Now,
how you make your money that should be up to you.
(32:29):
How you make your money is you.
Speaker 2 (32:33):
Whatever you make should be taxed. Everyone should pay tax.
Speaker 3 (32:40):
Everyone should pay tax, whether you make a lot or
a little. I believe everyone should make and pay the
same rate of tax. Whatever you earn, you pay that rate.
Colorado has a flat rate income tax. Colorado's Independence Institute
was crucial in doing that. In the mid seventies, we
(33:03):
used to have a progressive income tax. That progressive income
tax scared away a lot of productive people. Next year
you could well be voting on another progressive income tax
to bring it back, which basically says richer people.
Speaker 2 (33:22):
Please move to Texas.
Speaker 3 (33:26):
That's all that does, and it thrives on class warfare.
It makes sense it could well pass because if you're
not rich, what do you care if the rich pay more,
and especially if they lower the income tax for you.
(33:47):
People who make more can just pay more. But they
don't pay more.
Speaker 2 (33:54):
They leave. That's exactly what's happening in California and New York.
Speaker 3 (33:59):
They leave and they go someplace that instead lets them
keep their money.
Speaker 2 (34:09):
Let's not do that to Colorado. Let's keep Colorado fair.
All right, I'm John Calderic. Keep it right here. You're
on six point thirty k
So weird to how the Colorado State Legislature well scream
about how taber tize their hands. They can't make investments
in schools or infrastructure. But it did stop them from
giving money to NGOs or other no profits, oh which
(00:21):
they have family members in.
Speaker 2 (00:22):
Very interesting, very very true.
Speaker 3 (00:28):
Yes, cronyism is alive and well under the gold Dome.
Speaker 2 (00:32):
Hey, I'm John Caldera.
Speaker 3 (00:33):
Seven minutes after give me a call three h three
seven to one three eight two five five seven to
one three talk. I run a little organization that's been
around for forty years now.
Speaker 2 (00:44):
I can't believe it.
Speaker 3 (00:45):
Independence Institute has been leading the fight for limited government,
for the taxpayer Bill of Rights, for our flat tax,
for lowering our flat income tax, for concealed.
Speaker 2 (00:58):
Carry, for educational choice.
Speaker 3 (01:00):
Without us, we wouldn't have charter schools, concealed Carrie Tabor,
the flat tax, all sorts of great things. And as
there's a fight for a tax increase coming up next year,
we'll be leading a charge. Join us, won't you go
to thinkfreedom dot org. Thinkfreedom dot org. Next Saturday, we're
having our world famous alcohol, tobacco and firearms party where
(01:25):
we yes, we spoke drink and shoot. Why to have
some fun and to hack off the nannyists? Columnists and
reporter John Fundle join us there. It's always a great time.
If you like shotgutting in clay sports, you want to
do it again? Go to thinkfreedom dot org. We're closing
up our registration today. I think we've got a couple
(01:45):
seats left, so you want to jump in if you
want to. It's a great fundraiser for us, and my god,
we've been doing it for nearly a quarter of a century.
How to make the eight Do you have fun again?
You actually smoke, drink and shoot?
Speaker 2 (02:04):
We do it.
Speaker 3 (02:05):
Go to thinkfreedom dot org. That's thinkfreedom dot org. We
switch gears a little bit because this has something to
do with Colorado, even though it's a national issue. The
minimum wage, tipping tax, on tips and who should get paid?
What this from the Wall Street Journal. McDonald's, Yes, the
(02:28):
big corporation. McDonald's thinks that set it down. Restaurants need
to give their servers a raise. Well, that makes sense
because it would give them a competitive advantage, wouldn't it.
The Burger Giant has come out against wage rules that
allow casual dining restaurants bars and other establishments to pay
(02:52):
below the typical minimum wage to tip earning workers.
Speaker 2 (03:02):
If if you follow.
Speaker 3 (03:05):
This, you know that those waiters, waitresses, bar staff who
work for tips have a smaller minimum wage. You don't
have to pay them as much. Why because they get tips.
They get tips, so they get less than minimum wage. Now,
(03:27):
the minimum wage nationally is seven dollars in something it's
kind of irrelevant. The Colorado minimum wage is something like
fifteen dollars. The Denver minimum wage is over nineteen dollars.
Which is why businesses are going out of business. It's
why your favorite mom and pop store isn't there any longer.
(03:52):
It's there because we have cities deciding what the minimum
wage should be in their town and putting business is
out of business, which means they won't make tax revenue.
Speaker 2 (04:04):
It's all a wonderful, wonderful game.
Speaker 3 (04:08):
So it's very important that restaurants get to pay less
than minimum wage. Now, less than minimum wage doesn't mean
less than minimum wage because you get tipped. So those
people who work for tips on par make a lot
(04:29):
more than minimum wage. Now McDonald's wants wants everybody to
pay this higher wage.
Speaker 2 (04:39):
Why wouldn't you.
Speaker 3 (04:42):
McDonald's has gone so far as to withdraw from the
National Restaurant Association, sometimes known as the Other NRA, the
industry's main US trade group, as of its result on
its stance on tipped wages. Right now, there's an uneven playing.
Speaker 2 (05:01):
Field, says McDonald's.
Speaker 3 (05:06):
All classes of workers should be paid at or above
the federal minimum wage. Of course, McDonald's wants that because McDonald's.
McDonald's pays that minimum wage. You don't tip at McDonald's,
so they don't get to pay the lower than minimum wage. Chicago,
(05:27):
where McDonald's is based, is phasing out the tipped minimum wage.
Speaker 2 (05:34):
Washington, d c. Is deciding to eliminate it.
Speaker 3 (05:39):
This is going to cause all sorts of problems for restaurants.
Wouldn't it be nice if we just got rid of
tipping all together? How about we do that? Would you
like to go full Europe and simply get rid of tipping?
Speaker 2 (05:57):
I would love that.
Speaker 3 (05:59):
Ask people who for tips and they probably don't like
that idea.
Speaker 2 (06:04):
Hmm.
Speaker 3 (06:07):
Sit down, chains, so, says Chilis, have had to cut
into sales. Have cut into sales at McDonald's by advertising
burgers at prices that compete with the fast food giant
paying tipped employees a sub minimum wage is an advantage
on labor costs that fast food chains don't have. Is
(06:29):
that fair? Absolutely, it's fair. First of all, let me
go on my rant on the minimum wage. I despise it. It
is a hate law. It is a dangerous, terrible, Unamerican
concept the minimum wage. Why you know, we can do
all the usual reasons that it keeps people from getting
(06:52):
their first starter job, that it's the way that people
get into the economies, how they get work experience, how
businesses go out of business when there's a raised in
the minimum wage.
Speaker 2 (07:03):
We can do all that stuff. I really don't care
about that.
Speaker 3 (07:08):
I care about the ability for people to have a
relationship of their choosing. If we had a law that
said gay people couldn't get married, or gay people couldn't
have a relationship together, people would lose.
Speaker 2 (07:24):
Their mind, and they should.
Speaker 3 (07:27):
If we had a law that said, no, I'm sorry,
interracial couples, no, we can't have that. We find that
too perverse. We would say those are hate laws. Those
are hate laws that make it so that we discriminate
against people who choose relationships we don't like, and we
find gross or immoral or unreligious or whatever, and everyone
(07:53):
would scream a law like that is a hate law.
You're keeping gay couples from having the lifestyle they choose
and have the relationship they choose. But if someone decides
to have a relationship as a worker, as an employee
with someone, and we don't like what they've agreed on,
(08:17):
we go, oh, that's two perverse, you guys. You two
people cannot have that relationship of employer and employee.
Speaker 2 (08:28):
And think about it.
Speaker 3 (08:32):
Two women can live together, they can start a business together,
they can get married together, they can buy a home together.
Speaker 2 (08:39):
They can do all.
Speaker 3 (08:40):
These things together. But if their relationship is employer and
employee under the minimum wage.
Speaker 2 (08:49):
They can't have that.
Speaker 3 (08:51):
One woman wants to work for another woman for less
than the minimum wage, that's perverse. Basically, progress only believe
in consensual relationships when people are naked. Otherwise a financial
relationship is too perverse. I find this im moral. I'll
(09:13):
give you my case in point. My son, as you
might know, has Down syndrome. He's now twenty one. He
loves to work, he loves to be part of a team.
He would love to work at a restaurant where he
could sit people at the table or clean up the
table and interact with typical folks.
Speaker 2 (09:34):
He excels at that, but he's not worth twenty dollars
an hour.
Speaker 3 (09:41):
No one will pay him to do that because it
takes it's well, he's just not like his old man.
He's not what you call a productive guy. He takes
a lot of he takes a lot of.
Speaker 2 (09:55):
Oversight. You have to have someone with him basically all
the time. But he would love to work. Now.
Speaker 3 (10:02):
Instead of working, he goes to a day program basically
it's daycare for adults, and he hangs out with a
lot of people who's in similar situations. Now, these are
all great people, but they want jobs. They can't get jobs.
(10:23):
I don't care if my son makes a penny an hour.
He would be better off working. He would be better
off if he could spend a few hours a day
doing something, interacting and being part of a team. He's
had some of that training when he was in school,
(10:44):
and you could see the pride in his eyes when
he talked about it. He worked at mcguck and Hardware
as part of the hardware store up and Boulder, and
he loved working there. Now all he did was wipe
down the counter or shopping carts. It was kind of
made up work, but it was to train him how
(11:04):
to do something at work. And he would come home
from work being full of pride because he was part
of a team. He loved wearing the green vest that
the employees would wear. But he doesn't have that pride
because he cannot work at full wage. It would be ridiculous,
(11:28):
absolutely insane.
Speaker 2 (11:30):
You know, he's basically a six.
Speaker 3 (11:32):
Year old, but if he got paid a penny, he
doesn't know the difference.
Speaker 2 (11:41):
He doesn't care.
Speaker 3 (11:43):
He's not allowed to have this relationship because other people
think it's perverse. Thus it's a hate law. It is
a hate crime. That's why the minimum wage sucks and
it's wrong. And here in Colorado where we've unleashed it
(12:04):
to a real extent, a nineteen dollars an hour minimum wage.
Anybody who's been in the restaurant industry or service industries
knows that doesn't work. That's why mom and pops are
going out of business at a record level in Denver.
It cannot continue and it hurts people. That's why it's wrong.
(12:30):
So one of the ways around it is if you
get a tipped wage, you get to make a little
less on the minimum wage, you're still your take home
is far above minimum wage. And that's the law. By
the way, that's the law. When you hear that people
get paid less than the minimum wage when they're on
(12:52):
a tipped scale, you need to know this.
Speaker 2 (12:55):
It's not that they take home less than minimum wage.
Speaker 3 (12:59):
In fact, by law, they have to take home more
than minimum wage when you add in the tips. Colorado
deals with this, and there's a group of people who
want to get rid of it. Let's let's grab a
couple of phone calls here, three or three seven, one, three, eight,
(13:21):
two five five.
Speaker 2 (13:22):
Brian, Welcome. You're with John Caldera. So glad to have you.
Speaker 4 (13:26):
Good morning, John. Hey, question about minimum wages. And I
used to be in the printing industry a long time ago,
twenty years back. Used to employ a company called day
Odd Industries I believe it was.
Speaker 3 (13:37):
Yeah, I know theyd great organizations, Yeah, and they were
That's exactly what they did.
Speaker 4 (13:43):
They employed people that were challenged and they did a
wonderful job for like collating and sorting and things of
this nature. Would that minimum wage come into play for that?
Speaker 2 (13:57):
For those I believe. So yeah, and Colorado.
Speaker 3 (14:00):
So if it is a for profit company, you have
to pay minimum wage.
Speaker 4 (14:06):
Interesting, that's it.
Speaker 3 (14:08):
And so think about this. The national minimum wage is
what's seven bucks an hour?
Speaker 2 (14:13):
In Denver? It's nineteen. It is hot.
Speaker 3 (14:17):
The minimum wage in Denver is higher than the minimum wage.
Speaker 2 (14:22):
In New York City.
Speaker 3 (14:24):
So you're trying to make minimum wage in New York
City where the cost of living is so so much
more than Denver and the minimum wage is lower.
Speaker 2 (14:32):
That's how out of whack Colorado is. And it's one
of the reasons why.
Speaker 3 (14:37):
I mean, when was the last time you went to
a restaurant and you get a super in a salad
and fifty bucks?
Speaker 2 (14:43):
It's like, what is this?
Speaker 3 (14:47):
You've seen it, and you've also noticed that the service
industries are suffering. Service at restaurants is not as good
as it used to be before COVID. Have you gone
to a hotel recently, just got back from a trip,
and daily room service of cleaning your room, you have
to ask for it. They don't come into your room
(15:08):
and make the bed and vacuum up and give you
fresh towels. No, no, no, there for three days and
nobody showed up. That's because they can't afford the labor.
You've noticed this, haven't you, Yes, that's why. And the
(15:30):
people it hurts are the people who are not employed.
Colorado has a ridiculous minimum wage law even before we
let the cities go loose. It ties it to inflation,
and it's in the constitution, so anytime inflation goes up,
the minimum wage goes up. There's obviously written by people
who don't remember stagflation of the seventies where you can
(15:53):
have unemployment and inflation. So imagine the inflation rate drives
our minimum wage up to fifty.
Speaker 2 (16:02):
Dollars an hour.
Speaker 3 (16:03):
No one can pay it, but no one can take
a wage lower than that, So unemployment keeps skyrocketing as
the minimum wage keeps skyrocketing. It's insanean yep, hey, Brian,
thank you so much. Have a great one three oh
three seven one three eight.
Speaker 2 (16:24):
Two five five. So this this.
Speaker 3 (16:29):
Move to push restaurants to get rid of the sub
minimum wage. So the wage minimum wage is two dollars
and thirteen cents federally and allows patrons to round up
the rest of the service pay, but it has to
(16:50):
reach at least the minimum wage, which is seven dollars
and twenty five cents an hour. And this is where
Republicans failed again. Back when George was president, there was
a big push to raise the minimum wage on a
federal level. Being whimphs about it, the Republicans decided not
(17:13):
to have a debate. They just said, no, let's leave
it the way it is, and over time, inflation will
make the federal minimum wage irrelevant. And at seven dollars
twenty five cents it is rather irrelevant. But imagine, if
you will, if Republicans, when they had the presidency, in
the House and the Senate, said the minimum wage is immoral.
(17:36):
This is not a federal issue, it's a state issue,
and we shouldn't be dictating private relationships.
Speaker 2 (17:43):
We're going to get rid of the minimum wage. They
could have made the case that they could.
Speaker 3 (17:49):
Have educated the public on this hate law, but no,
they just took the easy way out, as Republicans often did.
Speaker 2 (17:58):
Now, Colorado's going to nineteen dollar and the power minimum
wage in Denver.
Speaker 1 (18:03):
Two items to check when tipping. First of all, check
the receipt to make sure tipping somehow hasn't been already
included on your charges, maybe because of a large party
or something else. But second, use your basic maths fills
and calculate the tip yourself, or use your calculator. I
will say, in many instances, on the printed out receipts
(18:24):
or the device they give you, those calculations aren't always accurate.
Speaker 3 (18:31):
Hmm, all right, how how much have you seen about
this little fee that is now part of many restaurants.
It's called the BOH fee. You don't actually have to
pay it, but it's there on your bill. You'd have
to ask for to be gone. What is BOH back
(18:56):
of house? So here's the deal. Your restaurant waiters, waitresses, servers, bartenders,
you can tip them. They make money on tips, and
they can do pretty well. The guys who are the
line order cooks in the back they don't get tipped wages.
They get a regular wage, whatever that wage might be.
(19:19):
And restaurants can't afford them any longer, so they add.
Some restaurants added BOH fee at back of house fee
like three percent, So you buy something and there's an
extra three percent charge so that they can give that
(19:40):
money as a tip sort of to the to the
line cooks. And they're doing this because the front of
house people are making so much more money on tips,
and then your bill goes up and you tip on
the bill which includes the boas fee, and the waiters
get even more in tips. It's all pretty crazy. Three
(20:02):
h three seven one three eight two five five. I'm
John Caldera in for the big man. Not to worry,
he'll be back next week. And then I love this
game when they they hand you now the little iPad,
or they flip the iPad over and it has the
(20:23):
tips already built in, and the lowest tip is always
twenty percent, twenty five percent, thirty percent, and and they're
holding it while you tip them. It would be kind
(20:44):
of like having the politician standing there in the voting
booth watching you choose which lever to pull. No no
pressure there, and what is this tip inflation? Now, I'll
(21:04):
remember when I had a kid that that it was
a fifteen percent tip was a good tip. Fifteen percent
that's a big tip. Ten percent was normal, fifteen was
if they're doing well. And then it switched that fifteen
percent was the normal tip and twenty percent and now
(21:27):
they're trying to push it that no, no, no, no, no,
twenty percent is the normal tip and twenty five percent
is even better. Ugh. I'm not saying you don't deserve this,
and I'm not saying you don't deserve a good tip.
(21:48):
I'm just saying it's getting crazy. And that wonderful way
of having the suggested tip already on the on the
iPad when they.
Speaker 2 (21:59):
Give it to you.
Speaker 3 (22:01):
There was a study done, I think it was like
a Starbucks or some chain, and some of their stores
had the suggested tip amounts on the screen and some
did not. And they found that the workers wanted to
work at the places that had the suggested tips on
the screen. Why because the amount of tips was sizeably higher,
(22:25):
sizeably higher. Let's grab a couple of phone calls. Sore
youre three seven one three eight two five five? Hey
don you're with John KELDERA good morning.
Speaker 5 (22:36):
Yeah, A quick question on this sum. Can businesses negotiate
wages and work around the minimum wages?
Speaker 2 (22:48):
Yes and no.
Speaker 3 (22:50):
You cannot negotiate something that is lower than minimum wage.
But if you have a salaried employer employee.
Speaker 2 (23:01):
They can.
Speaker 3 (23:03):
You're a lot more free to have them work longer,
work after hours.
Speaker 2 (23:09):
You don't have to worry about overtime.
Speaker 3 (23:13):
And so a negotiated wage a salary is different than
a negotiated wage.
Speaker 2 (23:18):
You cannot.
Speaker 3 (23:20):
If you cannot negotiate a lower wage than the minimum wage.
So in Deaver, somebody says, hey, dude, I'm happy to
work for ten dollars an hour, and the guys I
could actually afford that. So you have two people who
say I want to work for ten dollars an hour,
and the employer going, I can actually afford that, so
(23:41):
I can say yes, and the government steps in and
says no, that that's just perverse. You're exploiting that person.
So neither one of you get the advantage of your relationship.
You cannot have the relationship of your choice.
Speaker 2 (24:00):
Are good?
Speaker 5 (24:00):
Thank you?
Speaker 2 (24:01):
Yeah? Pretty awful. I think I think it's downright hateful.
Speaker 3 (24:04):
I think any law that prevents people from having a
relationship of their choosing is hateful. And I think we've
done a terrible job of making the moral case against.
Speaker 2 (24:20):
The minimum wage.
Speaker 3 (24:21):
Instead we keep doing these economic cases. It's bad for kids,
it's bad for businesses, it's bad for the economy. All true,
all true, But that's not what makes it ugly.
Speaker 2 (24:32):
What makes it ugly is that you're keeping people apart.
Speaker 3 (24:37):
If you like the minimum wage, then if people want
to say, you know, gay people shouldn't have relationships, you
should be okay with that too.
Speaker 2 (24:49):
All right, Hey, thanks for the phone call. Have yourself
a great morning.
Speaker 3 (24:51):
Three h three seven one three eight two five five
seven one three talk.
Speaker 2 (24:56):
So what do you tip? What? What is your average tip?
And have you noticed that it's harder to.
Speaker 3 (25:06):
Give the tip you want because the waiter, waitresses is
it is staring at you as you're filling out the
little pad that she's holding. That used to be you
sign a receipt and you put down a tip, or
you put down some cash, but now they're holding a
(25:27):
thing and the minimum amount suggested is twenty percent and
they're looking at you like what you're gonna just choose
the minimum? Is my service really worth the minimum? After
I brought you that glass of water?
Speaker 2 (25:46):
Oh?
Speaker 3 (25:47):
I hate those things? I hate those things? So what
is your what is your average tip? And if you
make your living on tips? Why should you? Why should
you not have to pay taxes on your tips? That
makes no sense to me, That makes no sense to me.
(26:11):
You should you should pay taxes on what you earn.
All of us should. Now that taxes on tips are
going to be tax free once they figure out how
to do it. I'm going to pay everybody in tips.
(26:33):
I'm sorry, you're you're a tipped employee. Now you're you're
you're a tipped employee. Will just tip you for the
work you do. I'm a computer programmer, and you're doing
a wonderful job, by the way, So here's here's an
extra twenty percent as a tip. Now you don't have
to pay taxes. I love that thought. Three or three
(26:56):
seven one, three eight two five five. I think Europe does.
Speaker 2 (27:04):
Does it right.
Speaker 3 (27:05):
I love that you don't pay taxes in most or tips.
You don't pay tips in most of most of Europe.
How about this one. When I was a waiter, I
would tip my bus boys out of my tips. The
cooks also, if they would work with me, if they
I got better service and made more on tips than
(27:26):
the waitresses.
Speaker 2 (27:27):
Who would not share their tips. Oh that makes sense.
Midium wage is nothing more than.
Speaker 3 (27:36):
Tax increase, one tex says, because workers more than pay
workers more than they pay more taxes federal and state,
and then prices have to go up to those to
pay those workers as they get more taxes.
Speaker 2 (27:54):
All right, got it?
Speaker 3 (27:59):
There's also a ripple effect. Whenever the minimum wage is
put up. A guy I know who has a small
shop does oil changes. He says, Yeah, the minimum wage
when it goes up, costs me a lot more than
just the minimum wage. Because the minimum wage goes from
eighteen dollars to nineteen dollars. That means the new guys
(28:21):
who are hired are at nineteen dollars and the old
guys who are who moved up because of seniority or
good service or after a year, who are getting nineteen
or like, wait a second, you're paying this new guy
the same amount as me who's been here for two years. No,
(28:43):
I deserve to make more than him. And so you've
got to pay the minimum wage for the new guy.
But you also have to pump up all the old guys,
even if they are at the new minimum wage. And
that's why businesses are going out of business. That's why
Denver restaurants aren't going out of business, particularly the mom
(29:05):
and pop places. Add to that, Colorado's inflation on food
is among the country's highest because of all the regulatory burdens.
And then you've got property taxes, and then you've got
(29:26):
the family leave at tax, which is a one percent
tax on a payroll tax, and then you've got problems
with homeless and crime, and people go, you know what,
I'm not paying for all this. It's not worth it
to me to spend so much money, so much money
(29:51):
on on a sandwich. I'll just bring a sandwich to work.
I's thinking one more call here, that's grab Richard, Richard,
welcome who with John KELDERA.
Speaker 5 (30:04):
Yeah, thank you. A lot of people forget that.
Speaker 2 (30:07):
Tips.
Speaker 5 (30:08):
There's a difference between tips and a gratuity. Tips actually
stands for to insure prompt service, and that's something that
you give something like a bell boy or concierge of
a hotel. A gratuity is for service above and beyond.
And I don't give a tip or a gratuity if
you will, to McDonald's or the doughnut shop or a
(30:30):
sandwich shop, because they're already getting a salary of minimum wage.
If there's a difference in salary between a salaried person
at a restaurant, a sit down restaurant as compared to
like a McDonald's. So I don't give gratuity at all
(30:52):
unless I'm at a sit down restaurant.
Speaker 2 (30:55):
Yeah, And it's tough.
Speaker 3 (30:57):
You go to a coffee shop and there's a tip job,
are there, It's like, well, you give me a tip.
Speaker 2 (31:01):
It's like you just handed me a cup of coffee.
Speaker 3 (31:04):
It's it's not like you brought it over to me
and stirred it in the sugar for me.
Speaker 2 (31:08):
You just handed me a sandwich. That's that's not it.
That's not something.
Speaker 5 (31:15):
Turn around and handed me. That's what you get paid
to do.
Speaker 2 (31:18):
Yes, that's your job.
Speaker 3 (31:22):
By the way, talk show hosts can accept tips, too,
so feel free to you know, if if so inclined,
if you.
Speaker 5 (31:29):
Like the service, I'll tell you what. I'll double what
time I'm paying you.
Speaker 2 (31:34):
That is generous, I'll triple.
Speaker 5 (31:36):
I'll triple what I'm saying.
Speaker 2 (31:37):
Oh no, now you're just being silly. All right, I
got a run. Thanks for the call. I'm John Caldera
and for the big man.
Speaker 3 (31:44):
Keep it right here six thirty k. How was this
Dire Straits that did that song with and with sting? Yeah,
now I remember, all right, we got about seven minutes
to the top. I'm John Caldera talking about minimum wage
and tips. So I love the politics of Trump saying
(32:06):
we're going to end the tax on tips. Now, mind
you really is an a tax on tips. There's a
tax on making money. It's called your income tax. Now,
how you make your money that should be up to you.
(32:29):
How you make your money is you.
Speaker 2 (32:33):
Whatever you make should be taxed. Everyone should pay tax.
Speaker 3 (32:40):
Everyone should pay tax, whether you make a lot or
a little. I believe everyone should make and pay the
same rate of tax. Whatever you earn, you pay that rate.
Colorado has a flat rate income tax. Colorado's Independence Institute
was crucial in doing that. In the mid seventies, we
(33:03):
used to have a progressive income tax. That progressive income
tax scared away a lot of productive people. Next year
you could well be voting on another progressive income tax
to bring it back, which basically says richer people.
Speaker 2 (33:22):
Please move to Texas.
Speaker 3 (33:26):
That's all that does, and it thrives on class warfare.
It makes sense it could well pass because if you're
not rich, what do you care if the rich pay more,
and especially if they lower the income tax for you.
(33:47):
People who make more can just pay more. But they
don't pay more.
Speaker 2 (33:54):
They leave. That's exactly what's happening in California and New York.
Speaker 3 (33:59):
They leave and they go someplace that instead lets them
keep their money.
Speaker 2 (34:09):
Let's not do that to Colorado. Let's keep Colorado fair.
All right, I'm John Calderic. Keep it right here. You're
on six point thirty k
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