Joan Baez - Iconic Folk Singer, Songwriter, and Activist

Joan Baez, iconic folk singer, songwriter, and activist discusses her early musical influences and career, social and cultural activism, and her recent induction into the Folk Americana Roots Hall of Fame.

Episode Transcript

(00:02):
This is What's at Risk with MikeChristian on WBZ, Boston's news radio.
Hi, Mike Christian. Here ofWhat's at Risk. First up on tonight's
show, we are most honored tospeak with Joan Biaz, iconic folk singer,
songwriter and activists. Joan discusses herearly musical influences and career social and

(00:27):
cultural activism, and her recent inductioninto the Folk Americana Roots Hall of Fame
in Boston. Our second segment featuresNew York Times best selling author Mark Sullivan.
Mark talks about his new book Allthe Glimmering Stars, a fascinating and
inspiring story about two child soldiers inthe Joseph Coney era of terror in Uganda

(00:51):
and their journey from tragedy to triumph. As we continue to showcase Boston's Folk
American Roots Hall of Fame BARHAF forshort, and its inaugural class of inductees,
our guest tonight is Joan Bias.The following is from the Kennedy Center
website, honoring Joan's storied career.Joan Bias has long been a musical force

(01:17):
of nature of incalculable influence, startingin the turbulent nineteen sixties, she marched
on the front line of the civilrights movement with doctor Martin Luther King Junior
China spotlight on the free speech movement, took to the fields with Caesar Chavez,
and organized resistance to the Vietnam War. Over the decades, she inspired

(01:40):
the Fight for a Czech Republic,saluted the Dixie Chicks for their courage to
protest the Iraq War, and stoodwith old friend Nelson Mandela in London's Hyde
Park as the world celebrated his ninetiethbirthday. Joan's earliest albums fed a host
of traditional ballads into the rock forNow before she unself consciously introduced Bob Dylan

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to the world in nineteen sixty three. Thus began a tradition of mutual mentoring
of songwriters that continued throughout the careerof Joan Bias, whose lifetime of recordings
and memorable concert performances will reverberate longinto the future. Hello everyone, it's
nice to have you with us,and tonight, our very very special guest

(02:29):
is Joan Bias. John, thankyou so much for spending some time with
us. It's absolutely my pleasure.Thank you and Joan, We're talking a
little bit about the Folk Americana RootsHall of Fame here tonight, of which
you were just named as one ofthe inaugural inductees into the Hall of Fame.
So just wondering what your thoughts wereabout that, And first off,

(02:52):
congratulations for that, by the way, thank you very much. Oh.
I want to say folk music rootsfor me. The roots are for me.
The roots aside from the official rootsare My roots were in Cambridge,
you know, with the people,some of them listed here who played in
the little club I played in justpassing through is where I learned a lot

(03:15):
of the names of the ones whohad already passed on and heard the ones
who were living and learned from them. Yeah. And when you you you
played a club forty seven, Iknow a lot. And you knew Betsy
Segonds, who's also an inductee inthe on musical category. But what was
what was that like? When whenI knew Betsy she sang as well.

(03:38):
No, I didn't realize that,utu. It was what we did sing
together. Yeah, that's great allI told you. Well, she'll be
at the induction ceremony, so maybemaybe I will. But how was how
was it working with Betsy, becauseI've met her. She's just the sweetest
person. And you know it's butI didn't know her back in those days,

(03:59):
in the early sixties and Cambridge.I wouldn't say sweet. She cursed
constantly. That's one of the reasonswe got along so well. And she
was tough. But as you seenow and her later life has done such
wonderful things. I mean, whensomething like Club forty seven is going to

(04:19):
close or change and I think it'sgoing to turn into a you know,
a laundromat, and so somebody hasto rejuvenate it. And that's what she
did. Moved it, changed thename, but kept what it does,
which is really show every level offolk music. Yeah, And was that

(04:41):
when you when you would play therein those days, was that a special
place, a high energy place,or was it just a folk club getting
going? Well? You know whatit was that the two women whose names
I can't remember at the moment hadrun it as a jazz club for many
years and when they were smart enoughthat when they saw the folk music beginning
to rise at a rapid rate,they would take one night a week and

(05:05):
devote it to folk music. Andthat's how those are my first jobs.
I got paid ten bucks a night, and I felt absolutely the wealthy woman,
and so I think it was Tuesdaysand then that was going so well
that we added Fridays and went upto fifteen bucks. So I was really
I was high on the hog.But they, you know, they had

(05:30):
the smarts to run the place,and eventually it was just all folk music
because that's what happened, you know, right what. I'm sure you've been
asked this question a million times,but what did you listen to when you
were young, when you were gettinginto music. What inspired you to move
toward folk music. Well, it'ssort of an interesting story because I was
steeped in rhythm and blues and that'sall I listened to was at fourteen fifteen,

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and my parents were sort of atwits end because they wanted me to
not just be listening to rhythm andblues on my little in my little plastic
radio at one o'clock in the morning. So my aunt had the smart to
take me to Peach Seer show.And I don't remember that show, but
I've heard the story many times thatwhen I saw him, it was like

(06:23):
a vaccine, a good vaccine.That took because that swerved me over into
folk music, and I listened tothe first to Bellefonte and then to Odetta
and peat Seger, and that wasthen I was off and running in that
direction of folk music and politics.You know. I ran across a quote

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as I was getting ready for allthese interviews I've been doing for Farhof,
and it's actually by Nietzsche. Folkmusic is the original melody of man.
It's the musical mirror of the world. And I never saw Nietzsche talking about
folk music before. I'm not sureif you've ever heard that quote, But
what do you think? What alovely quote. Yeah, I couldn't have

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thought of it myself back then whenI was sixteen or so and people said
asked me if I wanted to gointo opera, but I wasn't comfortable in
that genre because it was something tooelite about it. And I think that
was another feeling about folk music thatI just had my feet on the ground

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bare feet as well. Yeah,when you recorded your first album, was
there was it really sort of thatroots music that in folk music that maybe
was sung by a lot of thefirst the inductees that are going in with
you in the Hall of Fame.No. The very first album I made
with these rascals when I was sixteenyears old. Who said, you know,

(07:48):
come on, little girl, let'smake an album. And I went
at the studio and I sang everythingI knew. Fifty percent of it was
Harry Bellefonte. As far as realroots, I had no clue at that
moment, you know, And Ijust moved and I would say, the
first thing comes to my mind isthe tents at Newport, where you could

(08:09):
find anything, find the blues,find the blue grass. And that'd be
the first place that I started hearingsreal roots music. A house in heid
about it inside that isn't mean ohmany poor girls? Oh god? Oh?

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And when you first played there,didn't you play with Bob GIBSONW I
did? I did? Yeah,he was a folk musician and I met
him at the Gate of Horn whenhe was I was an opener there.
Yeah, it was. He wasan interesting combination because he was a real
entertainer, but he was also rootedin folk music. Yeah. So you've

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lived an amazing life, not onlyan amazing musical life, but an amazing
life of activity and working through socialand cultural issues and disparities and lack of
diversity and all the things, allthe passion, the things you've had passion
about. What where did that comefrom? Joe? And the music,
I can I can see that,but that seems like almost as important as

(09:41):
the music for my perception of you. Yeah, I guess my I would
start with my family. They werepacifists, and I learned early. I
heard discussions about nonviolence in the houseviolence, nonviolence, the analyst discussions.
They were the first people i'd seendue action. You know. My father

(10:03):
took us to a march. Ican't remember exactly which one it was.
Is all anti nuclear back then,and so that was my background. And
then I met a couple of peoplewho really helped me understand and sort of
steered me in the direction of politicalaction. And I was really very comfortable

(10:26):
there. And I know, andI was. I was fifteen. We
had an air raid drill. We'reall supposed to run home and hid from
the nuclear weapon, which was atomicquestion be on its way from Russia,
and I knew it was a force. So I just stayed in school.
That began my politically active life.Yeah, well, that certainly served as

(10:50):
a springboard for all the activities inthe action that you've taken since then.
You know, I read something aboutthe fact that you had met with Thomas
Martin and maybe talked about some ofthis action. He was more on the
contemplative side. I think he wrotesomething called Contemplative Citizenship. How was that

(11:11):
experience meeting Thomas Martin? It wasreally long for a long time. Yeah,
he was a wonderful man. Hereally wanted to get out in the
world. You know, he wasvery an outspoken pacifist and really sort of
steeped in the issues of the world, but was not allowed to leave the

(11:31):
order and go and talk about it. But the day I saw him,
I was with my mentor, IrisSandpill, and I have to tell you
it was a fun day. Youknow. Martin got out to go have
lunch and I thought, oh,we're going to have something like dark bread
and old cheese or something. Hewanted a hamber and a milkshake. We

(11:54):
sat out in a field somewhere andhe just had the most delightful time burgers
and milkshakes and sort of unabashedly andno, he was just a sweet,
regular guy. Yeah, he hada great sense of humor. I can
tell from the books on tape thatI listened to with him. He was

(12:15):
a funny guy. He was funny. Yeah. Yeah. So when you
when you think about this class ofinductees into the Folk Americana Roots Hall of
Fame far off Hall of Fame,a lot of them were involved in action,
and not just from the lyrics oftheir songs, but actually getting involved.

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And I don't think it was actuallyit was a criteria for induction,
but I do think it was adiscussion around induction. What are your thoughts
about your contemporaries back in the sixtiesand the work that you all did,
maybe either together separately. I thinkit's something that people quote nowadays wish they
had their version of it. Itwas it was really you felt you had

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neighbors, You felt you had acommunity that was just with the singing and
playing, and then when it movedinto politics, then you really depended on
each other for the next move thatyou were going to make. And it
was really a sense of community that'sreally hard to find now we're up such
such an avalanche of horrors that wheredo you really really begin? And what

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I think is missing is that senseof a sixteen year old once said,
you know, you guys had everything, and you had the glue, and
what's missing now seems to be theglue where you really are in touch with
your fellow singers and fellow activists andfeel you have a community. Yeah.
I think having grown up also inthe sixties, I think back about there

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were heady days, you know,and a lot of and days of hope
on a lot of levels. Whydo you think we lost that over time?
And there's a million reasons, butyou know, look at what you
just described as the days that areso difficult and challenging. Now what happened
to that optimism and hope from thesixties. First thought that comes to mind

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is that it really does swing backand forth. So that was a huge
moment, and the long moment ofthe things that we were facing were clear.
There was civil rights, and therewas basically the anti war movement.
And then when it got the warwas over, civil rights had had the

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March on Washington, and it reallyhad its moment, and I think people
were kind of lost. I knowI was, you know, I fortunately
had a basis in non violence,nonviolent actions, so I held on to
that and moved on to whatever wasgoing to be next. You didn't have

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that foundation. It was very hardto figure out what to do at the
you know, and all that.Really the big activities died down, and
I think that people sort of wentoff into their own thing, which is
understandable. The following is a shortaudio clip from The Boys Who Said No

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film where Joan Bias talks about theinfluence of doctor Martin Luther King Junior and
the civil rights movement on her nonviolentactivism. Well, the first I would
talk about King's influence on me,which started when I was sixteen. That
was the beginning of that era inmy life. And I was at a
Celamark conference, which was a bigconference of kids from all over the country,

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and we've talked about political issues,social issues, and that year doctor
King was the guest speaker, andI was dissolved in tears for the speech
because I'd read about nonviolence. Iknew about nonviolence, and they were doing
it, you know, they werewalking in the streets and they were walking
to their freedom basically, and Iwas just I was a mess. And

(16:14):
before I'll be a slave, I'llbe buried in my grave and go home
to my Lord and be free.Now back to our interview with Joan Bias.

(16:36):
I don't know that regaining it wouldbe the right word. Do you
think we can evolve back into anera that's more similar to that? And
maybe the community aspects the most importantpart. We have to evolve into the
future. We can't evolve back tothat because it's never going to happen again,
you know, especially the music.It was such a bombshell of ten

(16:57):
years of talent, you know,from Dylan, Joni Mitchell, the Beatles,
Rolling Stones, et cetera. Itwas an enormous amount of talent that
that came out of that, andand you know, you can't repeat that.
And I think about among the thingsthat we're trying to have now but

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don't have yet is some kind ofanthem, And an anthem we shall overcome
is impossible to sit out. AndI'm gonna write an anthem probably the hardest
thing to do. So maybe itmeans that when there's enough cohesive political action
that an anthem will come out ofthat. I really don't know. You're

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the chairperson of far HAFF also thehonorary chairperson. What what was appealing to
you about that You're in the rockand roll Hall of Fame. There's a
lot of Hall of fames obviously,but what was appealing to you to get
involved with Farhof in the organization.Oh, the people who are in it
as a star studded group of solidpeople. You know, there's nothing fo

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foo about it. It's you know, it's been my lifetime with all the
people I see written on the pagethere, so it's kind of a natural.
And then Woody Guthrie, you can'tget any you can't get any deeper
in soul wise and his brand ofmusic. It's very appealing to a barefoot

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girl like me, no question.So in terms of the far Half mission,
part of it is education. Abig part of it is education for
the next generation, for the youngpeople to look at how music has been
so reflective of our culture, soreflective of what our history has been.
How can we learn through music tosee maybe that brighter future that we all

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aspire to. What are your thoughtsthere? You know, I'm just thinking
of my granddaughter who's twenty, who'sa songwriter, singer, songwriter, and
I kind of try to figure outwhere her head is and you know,
who she listens to. I don'tspend lot of time researching early kids music
right now. I don't know howI know. There are a lot of

(20:08):
kids who are politically aware, andthen there are a lot of kids like
Jasmine knows things, but she doesn'tspeak out. It's not where her head
is. And that's a part ofall of this that we when somebody says,
what can you do to educate theyoung people? You know, I
would say to Greta read her book. You know, that's a young person

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who took life and death and especiallyof other people very seriously, and she's
still doing it. And there's somethingreally rewarding to find that out. And
also some you know, encouragement toyoung people who feel like speaking out.
Yeah, no question, and Ido. I'm encouraged by some of the

(20:55):
younger musicians that I see today.They're not maybe the iconic ones that you
reference are the ones that are goinginto Farhoff now is the first class.
But there is a feeling in thisnew generation of using music, maybe much
in the way you and your contemporariesused it to be a point of change.
Also, well, they're no dummies, you know, for sure,

(21:22):
Yes, for sure. I haveto thank you so much for participating in
this. I really appreciate it,and thank you so much. Okay.
And here are a few things youprobably didn't know about Joan Baez. She
was a teen star in the folkmusic world. Joan was only eighteen when
she first performed at the Newport FolkFestival. A year later, she recorded

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her first solo LP for Vanguard Records, the beginning of a prolific fourteen album
twelve year association with the label.Her earliest records, with their mix of
traditional ballads, blues lullabies, Carterfamily weavers, and Woody Guthrie songs,
among others, won strong followings inthe US and abroad. She was only

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twenty two when she led the crowdat the March on Washington with We Shall
Overcome. Joan Biaz sang about freedomand civil rights everywhere from the backs of
flatbed trucks in Mississippi to the stepsof the Lincoln Memorial at the Doctor Martin
Luther King's March on Washington in nineteensixty three. In fact, doctor King

(22:29):
visited her in prison once. Atwo thousand and two interview with Joan Biez
revealed that Doctor King visited Biez,who was imprisoned for blocking the entrance to
the Armed Forces Induction Center in Oaklandat Santa Rita Prison. He spent about
an hour with the singer and gavean impromptu speech later to a group of
demonstrators outside the prison. On topof being the queen of folk music,

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she was and remains a very seriousactivist. In nineteen sixty four, held
sixty percent of her income tax fromthe RS to protest military spending and participated
in the birth of the free speechmovement at the University of California in Berkeley.
A year later, she co foundedthe Institute for the Study of Nonviolence

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near her home in Carmel Valley.In nineteen sixty six, Joan stood in
the fields alongside Caesar Chavez and migrantfarm workers striking for fair wages and opposed
capital punishment at San Quentin during aChristmas vigil. She is perfectly bilingual and
even produced an album in Spanish.Joan dedicated her first album, sung entirely

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in Spanish, to those suffering inChile under the rule of Augusto Pinochet,
a record that inspired Linda Ronstaid laterin the eighties to begin recording the Spanish
songs of her heritage. She wasalso prominent in the struggle for LGBTQ rights.
In nineteen seventy eight, she appearedat rallies on behalf of the nuclear

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Freeze movement and performed at benefit concertsto defeat California's Proposition six legislation that would
have banned openly gay teachers from thepublic schools. She also participated in the
memorial march for assassinated San Francisco CitySupervisor Harvey Milk, who was openly gay.

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We'll be right back after the newsat the bottom of the hour.