July 14, 2025 • 38 mins
Dan Milleson sits down with Mike Howard to discuss the development of Waterfront Hall, some of his other ventures, and more.
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Speaker 1 (00:19):
Welcome to CEOs.
Speaker 2 (00:21):
You should know. I'm your host, Mike Howard, Chief Operating
Officer of the Wheeling Area Chamber of Commerce. We've been
a sponsor of this show for quite a while, been hosting.
Speaker 1 (00:30):
Now off and on.
Speaker 2 (00:31):
I don't get in as often as I would like,
but we're going to try to recommit to that again
starting here now in the middle of twenty twenty five.
We are sponsored by our good friends at the Banks
of West Banco, right down the line from Jeff Jackson
to David Klick, Amanda Brown and Sonny West and many others.
We really appreciate our partnership with our good friends at
(00:53):
West Banco. Today our guest is from Waterfront Hall at
All and I'm going to let him tell a little
more about that in studio with me as Dan Millison.
Speaker 1 (01:03):
Dan, welcome to CEOs. You should know.
Speaker 3 (01:04):
Thanks for having me, Mike.
Speaker 2 (01:06):
Okay, give us what is your official title there? I
mean a owner, I guess, but what else?
Speaker 3 (01:12):
A founder and owner?
Speaker 1 (01:13):
Founder and owner? Okay? And you opened? What was the
opening date?
Speaker 3 (01:18):
August third, twenty twenty.
Speaker 2 (01:20):
Three, All right, August third, twenty twenty through Sui World.
Come we haven't it hadn't been two years. You feel
like a community institution already.
Speaker 3 (01:28):
Man, that's the best compliment you can pay me right there.
Speaker 1 (01:31):
Well, I'm telling you it really does.
Speaker 2 (01:32):
I mean, and I've been the chamber now right about
three years, but it seems like, you know, you've been
here forever, and all the comments we get all that,
it's so much fun to go down there, like even
at four forty five and see the place bustling. Now, yeah,
maybe there's a nailor's game, who knows what's going on,
but it's just great to see.
Speaker 1 (01:49):
When did the idea materialize over covid Okay.
Speaker 3 (01:55):
I had bought the building in partnership with my mother
and father just as a speculative thing because we loved
and I mean we had seen just such great momentum
and wheeling and so in twenty eighteen, with the help
of Jay Goodman from Harvey Goodman, right, I walked through
the We walked through the building, my mother and I
(02:18):
and we ultimately just were blown away by the structural
integrity of the building and the location and the possibilities.
It's always for me been about the possibilities, you know,
And ultimately I had no idea what I was going
to do there. I mean, I knew there had to
be some entertainment component. I knew that I one day
(02:39):
wanted to own some type of.
Speaker 1 (02:40):
And this was during COVID Music Venue.
Speaker 3 (02:42):
This was actually pre covidre but like in twenty eighteen
twenty nineteen, this was very much just a like just
mulling it over, speculative like, let's just make sure the
building is in good shape. And then the big loan,
you know, the big effort occurred over the course of COVID.
(03:04):
Main Street Bank Is actually was a lender on this,
and they ultimately rich Lucas, Brian Ramsey.
Speaker 1 (03:11):
Awesome guys.
Speaker 3 (03:11):
They made this project happen. Yeah, they gave me not
even a competitive rate, but just set me up for success.
And then I pursued historic tax credits and the whole
story rolls right through COVID.
Speaker 2 (03:26):
Basically back in the day in the nineties, when I
was working at WTRFTV in my early part of my
media career, I was always calling I think her name
was Janet at Berry Supply and I went in there
every month for our little ad buy that we'd talk
about and see that building and now to see what's done.
Speaker 1 (03:43):
How long did it sit empty?
Speaker 3 (03:45):
Oh, August of twenty eighteen through?
Speaker 2 (03:49):
Okay, so not that long. Maybe as long as some
of the buildings around you.
Speaker 3 (03:53):
Yeah, about five years. But it was never really empty.
I mean we were always making some progress, whether it
was pulling things out of the building from the kitchen
and bath supply store and auctioning them off, or whether
it was us repointing the outside of the building. There
was almost always there was like a continuous work in
progress taking place for those five years that it was closed.
Speaker 2 (04:14):
Great, all right, I'm going to hit a waterfront hall
pause because I did what I don't normally do, and
that was launch right into it.
Speaker 1 (04:20):
I'd like to go back a little bit.
Speaker 2 (04:22):
Where are you originally from? Where'd you go to school?
Where'd you grow up?
Speaker 3 (04:25):
I grew up around Pimont Lake. Oh yeah, okay, so
I went to Harrison Central Schools, gotcha, And I later
after I graduated, went down to High University and got
a business degree from there. It's kind of a scattered
journey between, yes, but ultimately I got my business degree
(04:49):
and I came back and I did what my father
and my grandfather and my great grandfather all did. I
went into the insurance business, okay, and that ultimately was
I still do it to this day. So from the
age of nineteen, I got my insurance license, and in
the summers I was working at the office through college
(05:10):
and then when I graduated on a Saturday and the
following Monday, I was in a training for insurance. And
that's basically how I started my professional career. That business
allowed me to do things that I was really really
passionate about, which you know, weren't insurance coaching, Being involved
in the community. I was once a chamber board chairman
(05:32):
in Oha County, Yice, and so yeah, I was involved
in the very involved in the community in various ways.
But insurance allowed me to do that. I hired my
best friend at the insurance agency. His name's Adam Personowski.
He really runs the thing today, and he and I
(05:54):
took the agency in twenty thirteen. I bought it at
that time was extraordinarily young principal agent and an insurance agency,
and took my lumps, you know, and and learned a lot.
But Adam and I over the course of from twenty
thirteen to twenty twenty three, we grew the agency one
thousand percent nice. We went from for Staff to one
(06:20):
Time seventeen and ultimately took it from Freeport and SiO
to small towns in Harrison County to Catis, Steubenville, New Philadelphia,
all in those counties county seats and yeah, and went independent.
And now don't just sell nationwide insurance products, which is
(06:42):
how I started, but we sell the whole gamut and
represent a lot of different companies.
Speaker 2 (06:47):
But my favorite Harrison County story. When I was in
high school, I lived in Point Pleasant. We were always
watching the wrestling teams up here, you know, with the
big High Valley Athletic Conference. But we were always like, man,
that teamate could it is? Looks really good? And then
I get up here, it's like silly, it's cats. Yeah,
that's what we called you back the great area over there,
all right, So lots of things happen at Waterfront Hall.
(07:13):
And you know how I like to tease you that
you look like Dan Fogelberg. I know, music's a huge
part of what you're doing there, right, How did that
come about? And then we'll talk about your tenants that
are in there now.
Speaker 3 (07:23):
I wrote down in a secret notebook somewhere in twenty
fifteen that I wanted to own a music venue someday, okay,
and I find that, you know, if there's anything that's
worked for me, it's you know, getting really quiet writing
down the things I wanted to accomplish, and then my
subconscious usually takes me there. Yeah, and this is just that.
(07:45):
This was one of those things, as outlandish as it
seemed to me when the stroke of the pen happened,
you know, and as I laughed at myself, ultimately, as
soon as I wrote it down, I was on a
journey headed that direction there. Yeah, And I love music
I don't play, but but ultimately wanted around me at
all times, try to live my life like my favorite
(08:05):
songs in my head at all times, you know. And
and ultimately what we've done at Waterfront all so far
is one hundred and forty concerts. We've we've had every
genre of music there. We've tried to make everyone happy.
You know.
Speaker 2 (08:21):
My favorite is Office and his little jazz trios that
he brings in there.
Speaker 1 (08:26):
Man, that's just all that.
Speaker 3 (08:29):
And yeah, I think Tinos awesome. But I gravitate towards
the jam band world a little bit. I like, uh,
obviously the Grateful Dead's music and all the derivatives of this.
Speaker 1 (08:42):
And.
Speaker 3 (08:44):
Ultimately try to try to schedule a good bit of that.
And we've we've created a nice scene at Waterfront Hall.
But the thing that I think may matter more than
anything else musically that we do in the long term
is we do a jam night and open jam.
Speaker 1 (08:58):
Yeah, I've seen that.
Speaker 3 (08:59):
Yeah, it's going to be. It's every other Thursday up
until now, it's run for about a year and a half,
but now to be every Thursday.
Speaker 1 (09:06):
Thursday, every Thursday.
Speaker 2 (09:07):
All right, you guys got that out there, You gals
that want to play open Jansa and anyone can come right.
Speaker 3 (09:12):
Yeah, there's a yellow pad sitting at the foot of
that stage, man. And if you want to get up
there and play by yourself, if you want to play
with the band, you can kind of communicate that.
Speaker 1 (09:21):
And even drummers. Drummers, all right, I'm coming down.
Speaker 3 (09:24):
We have a house drum kit. So the whole back
line was set up when you get there. We try
to make it as as streamlined as possible. My friend
Jan Dykstra, we call him Dutch Dutch. He is the
engine behind this, and he runs a Facebook page called
a High Valley gigs. Yes, come on, and that that
is the driving force behind jam night, and we we
(09:47):
host it and get to reap all the rewards of
having people just improvise with one another, which is my
that's my favorite thing we do.
Speaker 2 (09:55):
Yeah, that's great. Well that's what any of those jazz guys.
My wife was just like, wait a minute. They just
said these guys, the three of them have never played together,
and two of them have never ever played with each other,
and how do they know that's jazz? Yeah, yeah, we're
talking with Dan Willison. The Waterfront Hall project. Is there
a DBA? Is this a DBA? What is the company name?
(10:15):
Should we name that?
Speaker 3 (10:16):
Waterfront Hall?
Speaker 1 (10:17):
Is the DBA?
Speaker 3 (10:17):
Okay, the LLC name is nearly irrelevant, but no, the
Waterfront Hall is the is the name of it? I
struggled with that for a long time.
Speaker 1 (10:27):
Oh yeah, fun stuff.
Speaker 3 (10:28):
Ill, what do I call this thing? Because I just
refer I still referred to it as the building, the building,
and so I struggled with that for a long time,
but I just kept coming back to keep it simple, stupid,
say what it is. It's a It's a long rectangular
building on the water from the waterfronting.
Speaker 2 (10:46):
Yeah, well, it's interesting you had a kitchen supply place
and now you're cooking not only great music, but great
food out of there. Tell us about your food vendors
that you've had there, which I think have been the
only two. It's not like people come and go. They
seem to be doing very well.
Speaker 3 (11:00):
Avenue Eats and their owners, Laura and Phil took such
a gamble on what I.
Speaker 1 (11:06):
Was doing that.
Speaker 3 (11:09):
That they should be commended.
Speaker 1 (11:11):
Absolutely.
Speaker 3 (11:11):
They gave me credibility where I really had none and
the Wheeling community, and ultimately I owe them a huge
debt of gratitude for their guts to believe the vision
that I was trying to explain at that time. They're awesome.
They've won best burger in West Virginia. That you I mean,
their their track.
Speaker 1 (11:31):
Recteen Burger is just like nothing like it.
Speaker 3 (11:34):
Speaks for itself, and they've been I think it's find
us very successful in our location, and their business attracts
business for us, and our business attracts business for them,
and I owe them a huge debt of gratitude. I
remember the day that that the wood fired pizza became
(11:58):
like a possibility the ether, and that was when they
were at Bluesfest, Bruce Wheeler talked to tiff Nardo and
then they came over to the building. And I had
a big grin on my face when I heard that
they were going to come by, And we literally knocked
down a wall in the kitchen to get that pizza
(12:19):
oven in there and build it right back up again
and moved them in over the course.
Speaker 1 (12:23):
Do what you can do.
Speaker 3 (12:24):
Yeah, And so yeah, they've been a huge hit. When
when they opened, we were absolutely slammed for like a
month and a half after that. So we we're in
this really unique position where there's an upward kind of
cycle taking place where the better one of us does,
(12:44):
the better we all do.
Speaker 1 (12:46):
Yeah. Oh yeah.
Speaker 2 (12:47):
So you have those two folks on the first floor.
You run the beverage operation, I believe, right if I
understand it, Yes, and where the music takes place behind it?
Is there a name for that room? Does it have
its own name?
Speaker 3 (12:58):
Do you think there should be?
Speaker 1 (12:59):
I mean, I don't know.
Speaker 3 (13:00):
I think I think maybe there should be.
Speaker 1 (13:01):
But but maybe it is the Waterfront Hall.
Speaker 3 (13:05):
Maybe. But if you, if you, if you stand at
the altar of the Google search engine optimization gods, I
probably shouldn't change anything. Yeah, but but ultimately I would
like to I thought I wanted to call it something.
Speaker 2 (13:19):
Yeah, let's let it ride for a while, till till
you have another day with your notebook and some choir, right,
and maybe a Dan Foegelberg Songye, talking with Dan Millison
from Waterfront Hall. That's the first floor, So tell us
about second and third.
Speaker 3 (13:32):
We just had a new tenant move in in March.
This is b SPA from Whirton. This is their second location.
Speaker 2 (13:38):
Gorgeous location. We did a little ribbon cutting.
Speaker 1 (13:40):
Yeah, and.
Speaker 3 (13:42):
Uh, Genie and Brad burkehead or the owners and amazing people.
Brad is the co owner of Catural Companies, which is
the general contractor that did the project at Waterfront, and
so that's the connection. And they did an amazing build
out and they adhered to a lot of the design
choices that I had already made, so it feels like
a coherent part of the space and it just matches
(14:06):
up beautifully. And yeah, they're open Wednesday through Saturday, basically
same opening. Yeah, eleven ams the opening time and they
close sometime around dinner. But but no, we we love
having them there where. That works beautifully is when we
have a wedding and then all of the brides and
(14:26):
bridesmaids stay in one of our apartments and then walk
across the hall and get all their hair and make
up done without ever having to take their slippers off.
Speaker 1 (14:35):
You know.
Speaker 3 (14:36):
It's a nice it's a nice arrangement. So yeah, we
have on the second floor, on the other side, the
historic side of the building, we have one Airbnb and
I refer to it as an Airbnb, but it's on vrbo,
it's on our own website. You can book it right
through Waterfront Hall dot com. But ultimately, yeah, that is
at its best been used as a place for events
(14:59):
to use, just like a place that they stay over
as while they're either running their event or most commonly
for weddings. And then we have one other apartment on
that floor that is really a green room for bands,
a place for our staff to crash.
Speaker 1 (15:15):
Oh nice.
Speaker 3 (15:16):
We do a songwriter's room up there on Thursdays as well.
Caden Board and her husband Derek Board run usually on
jam night, a songwriter's room on the second floor. Try
to write something, come downstairs, try.
Speaker 1 (15:32):
To play well. Now that's fun, yeah, and.
Speaker 3 (15:36):
It's hard for me to keep track all the things
kind of swirling about a lot. I should have mentioned
that sooner, but so Camp Waterfront's what we call that
other apartment. And there's all kinds of action in terms
of the second floor.
Speaker 2 (15:51):
Third floor, and we've had an event there. We're going
to have another one. I think on August twenty eighth
will be our economic driver's brunch that we had to
separate from our golf outing and maybe that'll be a
good thing. But definitely being downtown and that your facility
will be fabulous. Tell us how the third floor kind
of materialized.
Speaker 3 (16:06):
The third floor was the thing that I knew was
a great business decision from the start. You know, event
spaces don't have the same kind of operating costs that
it barred us. The bar is like a passion project,
and the margins aren't so great. An event space is
smart if you can establish the right kind of atmosphere
(16:27):
and location and all of that kind of hits people
in the right way. And I think we did that
on the third floor. We've got you know, beautiful original
pine floors in that space. All of the all of
the brickwork is exposed, all of the ceiling is exposed,
it shows, you know, the way that they you know,
(16:47):
the way that carpenters operated in the late nineteenth century,
you know. And and we've done forty five weddings. I
think at this point we've done maybe sixty years any
other private events. And we have a great team that
we've established. Ashley Kirchner is really our front end like
(17:09):
booking salesperson, and she owns Plans for Perfection. So we've
set up kind of a commission arrangement with her, a
nice sales agreement and she takes everyone on all the tours,
runs all the contracts, and our staff executes on the events.
They're the day of execution people. So that's worked out great.
Speaker 2 (17:31):
And it's still at this point people can use whatever
caterer they would like, correct.
Speaker 3 (17:35):
That's right, yeah, open catering policy. We try to be as.
Speaker 2 (17:37):
Flexible as it's nice for a lot of meeting planners
because if they have relationships with different folks, are not
locked into something. We certainly appreciate that. We go to
a number of places where you don't have that, and
that's fine, but it's nice to have a couple of
options where you can do that.
Speaker 1 (17:51):
I was at it.
Speaker 2 (17:51):
I have a number of events there, but two of
my favorites have been the High Valley Energy Association with
Toby Rice came in from EQT, and then the Project
Best Christmas. Nathan did a great job those both of
those were I think they were both around Christmas time,
so they were a lot of fun.
Speaker 3 (18:07):
Yeah, that space, we're still finding new ways to use it.
You know. One of the things we want to maybe
try to accomplish up there is a big comedy show.
Sell two hundred and fifty tickets instead of the ninety
that we can sell seeded downstairs, and maybe do like
a comedy thing or like a speaker series. You just
had Brad Smith at Wheeling Park.
Speaker 2 (18:30):
We have to look at doing some of our one
of our leadership events with you at some point because
we plan to just keep rolling with that. Our Leadership
Wheeling Alumni Association is looking at some type of leadership
speaking series. So we want to get behind any and
all of that sure and continue to help that. Which
is a great segue to my next question. I love
to talk to the people that come on this show
(18:51):
about leadership style. Now you're in a juggling act. I mean,
you've got employees you've got tenants. I mean you you're
you're playing in all forms of leadership that there are.
How have you seen that and your leadership style develop
over these last couple of years. What's your thoughts on that.
Speaker 3 (19:10):
I have been forced into a position where I am
able to now control my emotions better than I ever
could as a twenty something or even five years ago. Yeah,
it's just, uh, you know, when you when you try
to pull something like this off, ultimately things aren't going
(19:34):
to go your way even even sixty percent of the time.
And when you have when you have this level of
cooperation to do something like what we do at Waterfront Hall,
I what I try to do is I try to
sit in the observer chair of my mind, which ultimately
is hey, uh, something something was just said or something
(19:57):
just happened that made me feel some kind of of
reaction physically, emotionally, mentally. And what I try to do
is just be aware of that, notice that, point it out,
and then try to let that pass and then make
decisions from a place of being observant rather than emotional.
(20:20):
And that has helped me. That has helped me dramatically,
I think in terms of leadership style, stoicism is really
what I'm talking about, you know, in that Ryan Holliday's
books have helped me a lot. Yeah, Ryan Holliday is
modern kind of He's read everything from Seneca to Aristotle
(20:45):
to all that good stuff and then letters letters to
a Stoic or letters from a Stoic, excuse me by Seneca.
This kind of stuff, you know, helps greatly because it's
two thousand and three thousand years old, and socially, not.
Speaker 1 (21:03):
Much has changed when you think about it.
Speaker 3 (21:05):
No, and and and so for us, I mean what's
changed is the demands on our attention by technological.
Speaker 2 (21:13):
Uh that's a that's a that's a bumper there, man.
Speaker 3 (21:17):
Yeah. So but the tried and true things that were
written by these people they still hold hold true, and
they still have hold water. And and so I try
to pay attention to that that kind of thing a lot.
And I try to remain as empathetic as possible with
our in terms of our staff. You know, like everybody's
(21:41):
in a different situation in terms of where their life's
at now. So I try to listen first. I just
try to I just try to hear the context of
somebody's Like often the reason someone makes a decision, has
a lot to do with their circumstances, and then the
situation overlays on top of those circumstances. So I try
(22:01):
to listen deeper and try to get a feel for
what's going on in that person's life, and it helps
me react in the way that I need to react
to pool the best results in the in the most
harmony out of the situation. In terms of strategy, organizational strategy,
(22:22):
we don't miss a meeting. We have a Tuesday meeting
every week for all the live music that we bang
through an agenda on that I got from a consultant
nine years ago from my insurance business. We use that
same organizer for a separate meeting that's the operations meeting
every Wednesday at nine o'clock. There's a there's there's a
lot of consistency in in the meetings and as a result,
(22:47):
you know, and there's accountability delivered through that organizer that
I use. It's simply a Google sheet that's got a
specific agenda, an assignment list from last week and what
did you put on the issues list? Well, that's what
we're going to talk about this week, you know, And
that just never missing a weak kind of attitude, and
(23:09):
my approach to it I think has bred everyone's approach
to it, and they know if they want to get
something done, it's got to go on the issues list.
Speaker 1 (23:16):
It's got to go on. Yeah.
Speaker 2 (23:17):
Well, it's like my teaching sales and sales training three
word phrase, plan, schedule, execute. You got to start with
the plan that you got to have all of it
down like that, and then all right, when is.
Speaker 1 (23:29):
It going to get done? Schedule it, and then next
locute it.
Speaker 2 (23:31):
And of course the gravy that flows all around that
is the accountability side of it. Yeah, everybody holding each
other accountable.
Speaker 3 (23:37):
It's I carry the rigidity of the financial service business
into Waterfront Hall and some professionalism that I gathered up there,
and then I.
Speaker 2 (23:47):
Let without compliance, I'm sorry, I had to say.
Speaker 3 (23:53):
And then I kind of let whatever happens at Waterfront
Hall just kind of like hang on loosely right from
thirty eight special song. Yep, not as good as Dan
fout Well broke, of course, but but yeah, I mean
I try to I try to stay loose but have
that rigid kind of meeting structure that keeps everything on
(24:13):
track at all times.
Speaker 2 (24:13):
Absolutely so when we talk about leadership. Obviously, no one
learns all this by themselves. I'm sure there's been influences
in your life, from family, to teachers, to business folks.
Who are one or two of those that you might
share with us. My dad, we get that one a lot, yeah,
in that amazing or mom, we get mom or dad
quite a bit.
Speaker 1 (24:32):
But it's good.
Speaker 3 (24:33):
My dad's an amazing guy, an incredibly hard worker, taught
me work ethic. Uh, just you know, just a just
a terrific guy. And I would not you know, I
wouldn't have half the chances I've had without him.
Speaker 2 (24:52):
Uh.
Speaker 3 (24:52):
From my grandpa has another you know, I was very
lucky I had. The story of my grandpa's is kind
of interesting. There's I've got my Grandpa Kinsey on my
paternal side. My dad's dad, who was an insurance guy. Yes,
but he was a state senator in Ohio and rose
up the ranks of vice chairman of the Senate Finance Committee.
(25:14):
Had a great political career and kind of had the
urban knowledge and like it was kind of a city mentality,
right and fell on the d side of the house.
And then I had my mom's dad. His name is
Frank Puscarage, and he and his seven brothers in nineteen
fifty one mortgaged their house to start a coal company.
(25:38):
They called it Cravat Coal. And he is a his
dad was a Croatian immigrant, and he's a first generation American, right,
so he all of his seven brothers and him, they
start this cool company and then by the time it's
at its peak, they're mining coal in the Philippines. And
so I say that only to say that these are
(25:59):
two star arkly different individuals. Grandpa's on the r side.
And so I had these and I knew them both
well and had them both until I was twenty four
and twenty nine. So their influence on me was enormous.
You know, I had Rush Limbaugh in the truck and
then I had mpr in the truck, and it's so funny,
(26:21):
and it really kind of gave me the whole picture.
Speaker 2 (26:24):
Was maybe a balance, right, Yeah, And that.
Speaker 3 (26:30):
Was great for my ability to relate to everyone, yeah,
and see and see things maybe more clearly. I mean,
my views obfuscated as much as anybody else's probably, But
but these guys, you know, they were enormous in my development.
Speaker 2 (26:46):
Well, gave you some entrepreneurial desires, and I think, you know,
for honest, it probably played a lot into your development
of empathy. And to me, empathy and listening are the
two best skills that a leader can have, and then
obviously resilience and tenacity to be able to put up
with all the crap every day. But then it's a circle.
They've got to come back to the empathy and the
(27:07):
listening and then yeah, and maybe there's a book there
somehow on the circle of leadership through those four things.
So I love to ask this question, but I should
probably let everybody know beforehand before I ask it, because
some people have kind of scratched their heads. And then
it's usually a compilation. But I always like to mention it,
is there a tough lesson that kind of shaped you
(27:28):
or a you know, we say a failure, but failures
are success in disguise in my mind, Is there anything
in that nature that's kind of taught you through you
a curveball but you answered, the answered the call on it,
or anything that's a tough time that's come through.
Speaker 3 (27:44):
Yeah, uh, the water for haul actually getting it one
of these experiences. I was delusional when I started that project.
You know, no real development experience, No, no real you know.
I had done a couple of small projects on little
brick office buildings with one with one or two uses habitational,
(28:07):
just an office occupancy. But this this was, you know,
way out over my skis. And I got the whole
thing moving, and you know, got the GC in place,
and got the architect in place, and got the historic
tax credits rolling, and one thing led to another, and
(28:31):
the project itself as it was laid out. The renovations
that had already been completed, were deemed by the State
of West Virginia's Liquor Control Department to be illegal.
Speaker 1 (28:45):
O nice.
Speaker 3 (28:47):
So I was trying to make a food hall and
food halls. No law explicitly said this, but the way
that the liquor laws were written, the food food halls
were illegal in West Virginia, legal in Pennsylvania, legal and Maryland,
legal in Ohio, but illegal in West Virginia because the
law stated that you could not serve alcohol as one
(29:08):
entity into a common space where other entities were present.
Speaker 2 (29:13):
A lah to restaurants.
Speaker 3 (29:15):
Yeah. So I had a breakdown, and because I went
back to the Liquor Control Department, back again, back again,
and They were like, you're you're gonna have to pull
you know, this plumbing out, You're gonna have to So
I just took I just kind of like and I'd
already took taken draws on the loan from Main Street Bank,
(29:35):
and I was in a state of state of crisis.
Speaker 1 (29:37):
Yeah. Yeah.
Speaker 3 (29:39):
So I drove home bug eyed that night and just
for two weeks just kind of walked away from the project,
just went back to the insurance office and just was like,
how am I gonna unwind this? And then you take
you know, you go on a walk or something, and
then things start to you know, you get out of
the cortisol shot that got inject it into your body,
(30:01):
good illustration, and then you start to get some clarity
over time. So walking away was probably the best thing
I could have done. I started to work with Dennis Madonna,
the architect up here on fourteenth Street, to develop basically, Okay,
I'm gonna separate the two sides on the first four
(30:22):
from one another. Now started working on that Plan B.
At the same time that I was working on Plan B,
I contacted Ryan Weld State Center Ryan Weld, and I
contacted Sean flu Hardy again. R and D both sides
of the ticket besides the House right Senate and my delegate,
and those guys heard my plea. I think flu even
(30:44):
came down. And I talked to Ryan on the on
the phone, various emails, and as I was working Plan B,
the project was grinding to a halt. I got a
call from Ryan Weld one day and I was in
Columbus with at a friend's place, and he said, hey, man,
(31:06):
the language that you need to open your concept as
you wanted is in Senate Bill five point thirty four
and it's going to go to a vote next week.
Speaker 1 (31:15):
Wow.
Speaker 3 (31:16):
And I and he said, you can watch the vote
online or you can like follow this thing, which a
watch part. At the time, I wanted to lay as
low as pib. Yeah. I was scared. But anyway, so
it passed, and it jumped back over to the House
and passed. And Yeah, I realized through that experience that
(31:41):
very you know, the panic inducing, horrific kind of like
how am I going to tell the bank that I
you know? And and turned it around and government responded
the way that we all wish it would.
Speaker 1 (31:54):
Yeah, that that is such an awesome story. I'm so
glad you shared that with us, and what.
Speaker 2 (31:58):
A great and to that question that I love to
ask people.
Speaker 1 (32:03):
Yeah, and that's it's very real. It's very recent.
Speaker 2 (32:06):
Uh maybe even a tad rows still I don't know, it.
Speaker 3 (32:08):
Is it is. I'm still I'm sweating right now talking
about it. We were the first, we were the first
food hall to submit for a permit in the state
of West Virginia when we were trying to open.
Speaker 2 (32:18):
It should be a big historical sign up there first
food hall.
Speaker 3 (32:22):
There was a second applicant about a month later too,
so somebody else wanted to do the same thing. I
think in Clarksburg maybe you're down in the.
Speaker 2 (32:29):
I think there's a reasonable uh setup like that in
Martinsburg too, which is really cool.
Speaker 3 (32:33):
I think that's it.
Speaker 2 (32:34):
We were there for a Bridging Innovations conference and they
have this little barbeer and you got all these kitchens
going down the line. It's such a cool place. It's
it's like waterfront hole in that regard. But they have
like five or six food vendors in there in a
dessert place and oh my gosh, I need to not
go back.
Speaker 1 (32:51):
Yeah.
Speaker 2 (32:52):
So last question is for an aspiring young leader that
wants to be a CEO or a entrepreneur. What's maybe
a parting thought you might have for the minute. I
am going to have an epilogue question too, Okay.
Speaker 3 (33:10):
I would say that this is the most for me,
at least, has been the most rewarding way to live
my life. To come up with things, to lean on
other people, to build something with other people. Absolutely collaboration,
(33:32):
and and to pool ideas from inside your mind out
into physical reality is the most rewarding experience, one of
the most rewarding experiences that a human can have. I
got married last weekend.
Speaker 1 (33:45):
Actually I heard about that, and that was.
Speaker 3 (33:48):
An amazing experience. I hope to be a father someday,
and I'm sure that will be it is. But up
until now, the favorite thing, my favorite thing in my
life life has been, you know, pulling ideas into reality,
and that that's really what. You know, All these old
buildings downtown are all antiques of people's minds. You know,
(34:13):
the thing that's succurred down there at Waterfront Hall, you
know that that was just me down there, once upon
a time, sitting in a big pile of gravel on
the music venue side. And like all I can say,
I guess I guess to anybody that wants to try
to pull something off.
Speaker 1 (34:29):
Is that.
Speaker 3 (34:31):
There are resources.
Speaker 1 (34:33):
Call me.
Speaker 3 (34:35):
Get involved in the chamber because it's so much fun,
it's so terrifying. You worry that the perception of what
you're trying to do is not going to match the
thing that you wanted to do. But my advice is
to get your hands dirty and try it.
Speaker 2 (34:53):
Yeah, I'm gonna have to get you involved in some
of my entrepreneurial contacts around the state. They need to
have you out there talking to some of the these
entrepreneurs so they can hear reality, they can hear the
dreams all that. So the epilogue questions. I made a
couple of notes when you were way back, almost near
the beginning, you talked about taking that quiet time thinking
and jotting things down. What how did people do that?
(35:16):
Do you block that out or do you just make
it happen when you're like, okay, it's just that time.
Speaker 3 (35:20):
I moved into a new house in October with my
now wife Page, and I haven't done this for myself
there yet, but what I had at my old office
in Catus and at other places where I'd spent a
lot of time was kind of a sacred domain. Yeah,
and really like if you set up a environment or
(35:43):
a kind of you know, your favorite chair, nice table,
a pen that you like, if you set up the
conditions where in a place where you want to spend
a lot of time, things flow better. Yeah. And you
know whether for you if it's burning incense or if
(36:04):
it's dead silence.
Speaker 2 (36:06):
Or it's solo piano music. Okay, that gets my brain going.
Speaker 3 (36:11):
Yeah, So just listen to yourself and and ultimately invite
in all of the things that inspire you and and
these these things will will come flowing back out of you.
You know. I think that you know, it's a little
metaphysical and a little heady sometimes to talk about the
muse and all that, but I think, uh, you know,
(36:34):
when you're talking about creation pulling things out of nowhere,
like you, you set up the conditions for it to happen,
and you'll be rewarded for it.
Speaker 1 (36:44):
That's awesome.
Speaker 2 (36:45):
Our guest has been Dan Millison, co found founder and
owner of Waterfront Haul. How can they find you against
give us the website. We didn't even talk about all
that stuff. I didn't give you a chance to kind
of give you a little commercial.
Speaker 3 (36:56):
That's all right. Waterfront haul dot Com. I write a
news letter. It's out every Tuesday. It's called The Waterfront Times.
Speaker 1 (37:04):
I see it on the shirt reading the Waterfront Times all.
Speaker 3 (37:06):
That, and so that that comes out and everybody's in
boxes who are subscribed on Tuesdays at eight am. And
we're at twelve thirty Water Street and Wheeling. And if
you haven't been there yet.
Speaker 2 (37:20):
And Ashley is the lady to call if you've got
an event to talk about.
Speaker 3 (37:23):
Right, you can drop every every inquiry you want into
our website and it will make its way to the
proper person.
Speaker 2 (37:29):
Purpose you got the system set up all right. You've
been listening to CEOs, you should know. I'm your host,
Mike Howard, chief operating Officer of the Wheeling Area Chamber
of Commerce, sponsored buyer good Friends at West Banco. Our
guest has been Dan Millissen from the Waterfront Hall. Dan,
thanks for joining us. Thank you, we'll see you again soon.
On CEOs, you should know
Welcome to CEOs.
Speaker 2 (00:21):
You should know. I'm your host, Mike Howard, Chief Operating
Officer of the Wheeling Area Chamber of Commerce. We've been
a sponsor of this show for quite a while, been hosting.
Speaker 1 (00:30):
Now off and on.
Speaker 2 (00:31):
I don't get in as often as I would like,
but we're going to try to recommit to that again
starting here now in the middle of twenty twenty five.
We are sponsored by our good friends at the Banks
of West Banco, right down the line from Jeff Jackson
to David Klick, Amanda Brown and Sonny West and many others.
We really appreciate our partnership with our good friends at
(00:53):
West Banco. Today our guest is from Waterfront Hall at
All and I'm going to let him tell a little
more about that in studio with me as Dan Millison.
Speaker 1 (01:03):
Dan, welcome to CEOs. You should know.
Speaker 3 (01:04):
Thanks for having me, Mike.
Speaker 2 (01:06):
Okay, give us what is your official title there? I
mean a owner, I guess, but what else?
Speaker 3 (01:12):
A founder and owner?
Speaker 1 (01:13):
Founder and owner? Okay? And you opened? What was the
opening date?
Speaker 3 (01:18):
August third, twenty twenty.
Speaker 2 (01:20):
Three, All right, August third, twenty twenty through Sui World.
Come we haven't it hadn't been two years. You feel
like a community institution already.
Speaker 3 (01:28):
Man, that's the best compliment you can pay me right there.
Speaker 1 (01:31):
Well, I'm telling you it really does.
Speaker 2 (01:32):
I mean, and I've been the chamber now right about
three years, but it seems like, you know, you've been
here forever, and all the comments we get all that,
it's so much fun to go down there, like even
at four forty five and see the place bustling. Now, yeah,
maybe there's a nailor's game, who knows what's going on,
but it's just great to see.
Speaker 1 (01:49):
When did the idea materialize over covid Okay.
Speaker 3 (01:55):
I had bought the building in partnership with my mother
and father just as a speculative thing because we loved
and I mean we had seen just such great momentum
and wheeling and so in twenty eighteen, with the help
of Jay Goodman from Harvey Goodman, right, I walked through
the We walked through the building, my mother and I
(02:18):
and we ultimately just were blown away by the structural
integrity of the building and the location and the possibilities.
It's always for me been about the possibilities, you know,
And ultimately I had no idea what I was going
to do there. I mean, I knew there had to
be some entertainment component. I knew that I one day
(02:39):
wanted to own some type of.
Speaker 1 (02:40):
And this was during COVID Music Venue.
Speaker 3 (02:42):
This was actually pre covidre but like in twenty eighteen
twenty nineteen, this was very much just a like just
mulling it over, speculative like, let's just make sure the
building is in good shape. And then the big loan,
you know, the big effort occurred over the course of COVID.
(03:04):
Main Street Bank Is actually was a lender on this,
and they ultimately rich Lucas, Brian Ramsey.
Speaker 1 (03:11):
Awesome guys.
Speaker 3 (03:11):
They made this project happen. Yeah, they gave me not
even a competitive rate, but just set me up for success.
And then I pursued historic tax credits and the whole
story rolls right through COVID.
Speaker 2 (03:26):
Basically back in the day in the nineties, when I
was working at WTRFTV in my early part of my
media career, I was always calling I think her name
was Janet at Berry Supply and I went in there
every month for our little ad buy that we'd talk
about and see that building and now to see what's done.
Speaker 1 (03:43):
How long did it sit empty?
Speaker 3 (03:45):
Oh, August of twenty eighteen through?
Speaker 2 (03:49):
Okay, so not that long. Maybe as long as some
of the buildings around you.
Speaker 3 (03:53):
Yeah, about five years. But it was never really empty.
I mean we were always making some progress, whether it
was pulling things out of the building from the kitchen
and bath supply store and auctioning them off, or whether
it was us repointing the outside of the building. There
was almost always there was like a continuous work in
progress taking place for those five years that it was closed.
Speaker 2 (04:14):
Great, all right, I'm going to hit a waterfront hall
pause because I did what I don't normally do, and
that was launch right into it.
Speaker 1 (04:20):
I'd like to go back a little bit.
Speaker 2 (04:22):
Where are you originally from? Where'd you go to school?
Where'd you grow up?
Speaker 3 (04:25):
I grew up around Pimont Lake. Oh yeah, okay, so
I went to Harrison Central Schools, gotcha, And I later
after I graduated, went down to High University and got
a business degree from there. It's kind of a scattered
journey between, yes, but ultimately I got my business degree
(04:49):
and I came back and I did what my father
and my grandfather and my great grandfather all did. I
went into the insurance business, okay, and that ultimately was
I still do it to this day. So from the
age of nineteen, I got my insurance license, and in
the summers I was working at the office through college
(05:10):
and then when I graduated on a Saturday and the
following Monday, I was in a training for insurance. And
that's basically how I started my professional career. That business
allowed me to do things that I was really really
passionate about, which you know, weren't insurance coaching, Being involved
in the community. I was once a chamber board chairman
(05:32):
in Oha County, Yice, and so yeah, I was involved
in the very involved in the community in various ways.
But insurance allowed me to do that. I hired my
best friend at the insurance agency. His name's Adam Personowski.
He really runs the thing today, and he and I
(05:54):
took the agency in twenty thirteen. I bought it at
that time was extraordinarily young principal agent and an insurance agency,
and took my lumps, you know, and and learned a lot.
But Adam and I over the course of from twenty
thirteen to twenty twenty three, we grew the agency one
thousand percent nice. We went from for Staff to one
(06:20):
Time seventeen and ultimately took it from Freeport and SiO
to small towns in Harrison County to Catis, Steubenville, New Philadelphia,
all in those counties county seats and yeah, and went independent.
And now don't just sell nationwide insurance products, which is
(06:42):
how I started, but we sell the whole gamut and
represent a lot of different companies.
Speaker 2 (06:47):
But my favorite Harrison County story. When I was in
high school, I lived in Point Pleasant. We were always
watching the wrestling teams up here, you know, with the
big High Valley Athletic Conference. But we were always like, man,
that teamate could it is? Looks really good? And then
I get up here, it's like silly, it's cats. Yeah,
that's what we called you back the great area over there,
all right, So lots of things happen at Waterfront Hall.
(07:13):
And you know how I like to tease you that
you look like Dan Fogelberg. I know, music's a huge
part of what you're doing there, right, How did that
come about? And then we'll talk about your tenants that
are in there now.
Speaker 3 (07:23):
I wrote down in a secret notebook somewhere in twenty
fifteen that I wanted to own a music venue someday, okay,
and I find that, you know, if there's anything that's
worked for me, it's you know, getting really quiet writing
down the things I wanted to accomplish, and then my
subconscious usually takes me there. Yeah, and this is just that.
(07:45):
This was one of those things, as outlandish as it
seemed to me when the stroke of the pen happened,
you know, and as I laughed at myself, ultimately, as
soon as I wrote it down, I was on a
journey headed that direction there. Yeah, And I love music
I don't play, but but ultimately wanted around me at
all times, try to live my life like my favorite
(08:05):
songs in my head at all times, you know. And
and ultimately what we've done at Waterfront all so far
is one hundred and forty concerts. We've we've had every
genre of music there. We've tried to make everyone happy.
You know.
Speaker 2 (08:21):
My favorite is Office and his little jazz trios that
he brings in there.
Speaker 1 (08:26):
Man, that's just all that.
Speaker 3 (08:29):
And yeah, I think Tinos awesome. But I gravitate towards
the jam band world a little bit. I like, uh,
obviously the Grateful Dead's music and all the derivatives of this.
Speaker 1 (08:42):
And.
Speaker 3 (08:44):
Ultimately try to try to schedule a good bit of that.
And we've we've created a nice scene at Waterfront Hall.
But the thing that I think may matter more than
anything else musically that we do in the long term
is we do a jam night and open jam.
Speaker 1 (08:58):
Yeah, I've seen that.
Speaker 3 (08:59):
Yeah, it's going to be. It's every other Thursday up
until now, it's run for about a year and a half,
but now to be every Thursday.
Speaker 1 (09:06):
Thursday, every Thursday.
Speaker 2 (09:07):
All right, you guys got that out there, You gals
that want to play open Jansa and anyone can come right.
Speaker 3 (09:12):
Yeah, there's a yellow pad sitting at the foot of
that stage, man. And if you want to get up
there and play by yourself, if you want to play
with the band, you can kind of communicate that.
Speaker 1 (09:21):
And even drummers. Drummers, all right, I'm coming down.
Speaker 3 (09:24):
We have a house drum kit. So the whole back
line was set up when you get there. We try
to make it as as streamlined as possible. My friend
Jan Dykstra, we call him Dutch Dutch. He is the
engine behind this, and he runs a Facebook page called
a High Valley gigs. Yes, come on, and that that
is the driving force behind jam night, and we we
(09:47):
host it and get to reap all the rewards of
having people just improvise with one another, which is my
that's my favorite thing we do.
Speaker 2 (09:55):
Yeah, that's great. Well that's what any of those jazz guys.
My wife was just like, wait a minute. They just
said these guys, the three of them have never played together,
and two of them have never ever played with each other,
and how do they know that's jazz? Yeah, yeah, we're
talking with Dan Willison. The Waterfront Hall project. Is there
a DBA? Is this a DBA? What is the company name?
(10:15):
Should we name that?
Speaker 3 (10:16):
Waterfront Hall?
Speaker 1 (10:17):
Is the DBA?
Speaker 3 (10:17):
Okay, the LLC name is nearly irrelevant, but no, the
Waterfront Hall is the is the name of it? I
struggled with that for a long time.
Speaker 1 (10:27):
Oh yeah, fun stuff.
Speaker 3 (10:28):
Ill, what do I call this thing? Because I just
refer I still referred to it as the building, the building,
and so I struggled with that for a long time,
but I just kept coming back to keep it simple, stupid,
say what it is. It's a It's a long rectangular
building on the water from the waterfronting.
Speaker 2 (10:46):
Yeah, well, it's interesting you had a kitchen supply place
and now you're cooking not only great music, but great
food out of there. Tell us about your food vendors
that you've had there, which I think have been the
only two. It's not like people come and go. They
seem to be doing very well.
Speaker 3 (11:00):
Avenue Eats and their owners, Laura and Phil took such
a gamble on what I.
Speaker 1 (11:06):
Was doing that.
Speaker 3 (11:09):
That they should be commended.
Speaker 1 (11:11):
Absolutely.
Speaker 3 (11:11):
They gave me credibility where I really had none and
the Wheeling community, and ultimately I owe them a huge
debt of gratitude for their guts to believe the vision
that I was trying to explain at that time. They're awesome.
They've won best burger in West Virginia. That you I mean,
their their track.
Speaker 1 (11:31):
Recteen Burger is just like nothing like it.
Speaker 3 (11:34):
Speaks for itself, and they've been I think it's find
us very successful in our location, and their business attracts
business for us, and our business attracts business for them,
and I owe them a huge debt of gratitude. I
remember the day that that the wood fired pizza became
(11:58):
like a possibility the ether, and that was when they
were at Bluesfest, Bruce Wheeler talked to tiff Nardo and
then they came over to the building. And I had
a big grin on my face when I heard that
they were going to come by, And we literally knocked
down a wall in the kitchen to get that pizza
(12:19):
oven in there and build it right back up again
and moved them in over the course.
Speaker 1 (12:23):
Do what you can do.
Speaker 3 (12:24):
Yeah, And so yeah, they've been a huge hit. When
when they opened, we were absolutely slammed for like a
month and a half after that. So we we're in
this really unique position where there's an upward kind of
cycle taking place where the better one of us does,
(12:44):
the better we all do.
Speaker 1 (12:46):
Yeah. Oh yeah.
Speaker 2 (12:47):
So you have those two folks on the first floor.
You run the beverage operation, I believe, right if I
understand it, Yes, and where the music takes place behind it?
Is there a name for that room? Does it have
its own name?
Speaker 3 (12:58):
Do you think there should be?
Speaker 1 (12:59):
I mean, I don't know.
Speaker 3 (13:00):
I think I think maybe there should be.
Speaker 1 (13:01):
But but maybe it is the Waterfront Hall.
Speaker 3 (13:05):
Maybe. But if you, if you, if you stand at
the altar of the Google search engine optimization gods, I
probably shouldn't change anything. Yeah, but but ultimately I would
like to I thought I wanted to call it something.
Speaker 2 (13:19):
Yeah, let's let it ride for a while, till till
you have another day with your notebook and some choir, right,
and maybe a Dan Foegelberg Songye, talking with Dan Millison
from Waterfront Hall. That's the first floor, So tell us
about second and third.
Speaker 3 (13:32):
We just had a new tenant move in in March.
This is b SPA from Whirton. This is their second location.
Speaker 2 (13:38):
Gorgeous location. We did a little ribbon cutting.
Speaker 1 (13:40):
Yeah, and.
Speaker 3 (13:42):
Uh, Genie and Brad burkehead or the owners and amazing people.
Brad is the co owner of Catural Companies, which is
the general contractor that did the project at Waterfront, and
so that's the connection. And they did an amazing build
out and they adhered to a lot of the design
choices that I had already made, so it feels like
a coherent part of the space and it just matches
(14:06):
up beautifully. And yeah, they're open Wednesday through Saturday, basically
same opening. Yeah, eleven ams the opening time and they
close sometime around dinner. But but no, we we love
having them there where. That works beautifully is when we
have a wedding and then all of the brides and
(14:26):
bridesmaids stay in one of our apartments and then walk
across the hall and get all their hair and make
up done without ever having to take their slippers off.
Speaker 1 (14:35):
You know.
Speaker 3 (14:36):
It's a nice it's a nice arrangement. So yeah, we
have on the second floor, on the other side, the
historic side of the building, we have one Airbnb and
I refer to it as an Airbnb, but it's on vrbo,
it's on our own website. You can book it right
through Waterfront Hall dot com. But ultimately, yeah, that is
at its best been used as a place for events
(14:59):
to use, just like a place that they stay over
as while they're either running their event or most commonly
for weddings. And then we have one other apartment on
that floor that is really a green room for bands,
a place for our staff to crash.
Speaker 1 (15:15):
Oh nice.
Speaker 3 (15:16):
We do a songwriter's room up there on Thursdays as well.
Caden Board and her husband Derek Board run usually on
jam night, a songwriter's room on the second floor. Try
to write something, come downstairs, try.
Speaker 1 (15:32):
To play well. Now that's fun, yeah, and.
Speaker 3 (15:36):
It's hard for me to keep track all the things
kind of swirling about a lot. I should have mentioned
that sooner, but so Camp Waterfront's what we call that
other apartment. And there's all kinds of action in terms
of the second floor.
Speaker 2 (15:51):
Third floor, and we've had an event there. We're going
to have another one. I think on August twenty eighth
will be our economic driver's brunch that we had to
separate from our golf outing and maybe that'll be a
good thing. But definitely being downtown and that your facility
will be fabulous. Tell us how the third floor kind
of materialized.
Speaker 3 (16:06):
The third floor was the thing that I knew was
a great business decision from the start. You know, event
spaces don't have the same kind of operating costs that
it barred us. The bar is like a passion project,
and the margins aren't so great. An event space is
smart if you can establish the right kind of atmosphere
(16:27):
and location and all of that kind of hits people
in the right way. And I think we did that
on the third floor. We've got you know, beautiful original
pine floors in that space. All of the all of
the brickwork is exposed, all of the ceiling is exposed,
it shows, you know, the way that they you know,
(16:47):
the way that carpenters operated in the late nineteenth century,
you know. And and we've done forty five weddings. I
think at this point we've done maybe sixty years any
other private events. And we have a great team that
we've established. Ashley Kirchner is really our front end like
(17:09):
booking salesperson, and she owns Plans for Perfection. So we've
set up kind of a commission arrangement with her, a
nice sales agreement and she takes everyone on all the tours,
runs all the contracts, and our staff executes on the events.
They're the day of execution people. So that's worked out great.
Speaker 2 (17:31):
And it's still at this point people can use whatever
caterer they would like, correct.
Speaker 3 (17:35):
That's right, yeah, open catering policy. We try to be as.
Speaker 2 (17:37):
Flexible as it's nice for a lot of meeting planners
because if they have relationships with different folks, are not
locked into something. We certainly appreciate that. We go to
a number of places where you don't have that, and
that's fine, but it's nice to have a couple of
options where you can do that.
Speaker 1 (17:51):
I was at it.
Speaker 2 (17:51):
I have a number of events there, but two of
my favorites have been the High Valley Energy Association with
Toby Rice came in from EQT, and then the Project
Best Christmas. Nathan did a great job those both of
those were I think they were both around Christmas time,
so they were a lot of fun.
Speaker 3 (18:07):
Yeah, that space, we're still finding new ways to use it.
You know. One of the things we want to maybe
try to accomplish up there is a big comedy show.
Sell two hundred and fifty tickets instead of the ninety
that we can sell seeded downstairs, and maybe do like
a comedy thing or like a speaker series. You just
had Brad Smith at Wheeling Park.
Speaker 2 (18:30):
We have to look at doing some of our one
of our leadership events with you at some point because
we plan to just keep rolling with that. Our Leadership
Wheeling Alumni Association is looking at some type of leadership
speaking series. So we want to get behind any and
all of that sure and continue to help that. Which
is a great segue to my next question. I love
to talk to the people that come on this show
(18:51):
about leadership style. Now you're in a juggling act. I mean,
you've got employees you've got tenants. I mean you you're
you're playing in all forms of leadership that there are.
How have you seen that and your leadership style develop
over these last couple of years. What's your thoughts on that.
Speaker 3 (19:10):
I have been forced into a position where I am
able to now control my emotions better than I ever
could as a twenty something or even five years ago. Yeah,
it's just, uh, you know, when you when you try
to pull something like this off, ultimately things aren't going
(19:34):
to go your way even even sixty percent of the time.
And when you have when you have this level of
cooperation to do something like what we do at Waterfront Hall,
I what I try to do is I try to
sit in the observer chair of my mind, which ultimately
is hey, uh, something something was just said or something
(19:57):
just happened that made me feel some kind of of
reaction physically, emotionally, mentally. And what I try to do
is just be aware of that, notice that, point it out,
and then try to let that pass and then make
decisions from a place of being observant rather than emotional.
(20:20):
And that has helped me. That has helped me dramatically,
I think in terms of leadership style, stoicism is really
what I'm talking about, you know, in that Ryan Holliday's
books have helped me a lot. Yeah, Ryan Holliday is
modern kind of He's read everything from Seneca to Aristotle
(20:45):
to all that good stuff and then letters letters to
a Stoic or letters from a Stoic, excuse me by Seneca.
This kind of stuff, you know, helps greatly because it's
two thousand and three thousand years old, and socially, not.
Speaker 1 (21:03):
Much has changed when you think about it.
Speaker 3 (21:05):
No, and and and so for us, I mean what's
changed is the demands on our attention by technological.
Speaker 2 (21:13):
Uh that's a that's a that's a bumper there, man.
Speaker 3 (21:17):
Yeah. So but the tried and true things that were
written by these people they still hold hold true, and
they still have hold water. And and so I try
to pay attention to that that kind of thing a lot.
And I try to remain as empathetic as possible with
our in terms of our staff. You know, like everybody's
(21:41):
in a different situation in terms of where their life's
at now. So I try to listen first. I just
try to I just try to hear the context of
somebody's Like often the reason someone makes a decision, has
a lot to do with their circumstances, and then the
situation overlays on top of those circumstances. So I try
(22:01):
to listen deeper and try to get a feel for
what's going on in that person's life, and it helps
me react in the way that I need to react
to pool the best results in the in the most
harmony out of the situation. In terms of strategy, organizational strategy,
(22:22):
we don't miss a meeting. We have a Tuesday meeting
every week for all the live music that we bang
through an agenda on that I got from a consultant
nine years ago from my insurance business. We use that
same organizer for a separate meeting that's the operations meeting
every Wednesday at nine o'clock. There's a there's there's a
lot of consistency in in the meetings and as a result,
(22:47):
you know, and there's accountability delivered through that organizer that
I use. It's simply a Google sheet that's got a
specific agenda, an assignment list from last week and what
did you put on the issues list? Well, that's what
we're going to talk about this week, you know, And
that just never missing a weak kind of attitude, and
(23:09):
my approach to it I think has bred everyone's approach
to it, and they know if they want to get
something done, it's got to go on the issues list.
Speaker 1 (23:16):
It's got to go on. Yeah.
Speaker 2 (23:17):
Well, it's like my teaching sales and sales training three
word phrase, plan, schedule, execute. You got to start with
the plan that you got to have all of it
down like that, and then all right, when is.
Speaker 1 (23:29):
It going to get done? Schedule it, and then next
locute it.
Speaker 2 (23:31):
And of course the gravy that flows all around that
is the accountability side of it. Yeah, everybody holding each
other accountable.
Speaker 3 (23:37):
It's I carry the rigidity of the financial service business
into Waterfront Hall and some professionalism that I gathered up there,
and then I.
Speaker 2 (23:47):
Let without compliance, I'm sorry, I had to say.
Speaker 3 (23:53):
And then I kind of let whatever happens at Waterfront
Hall just kind of like hang on loosely right from
thirty eight special song. Yep, not as good as Dan
fout Well broke, of course, but but yeah, I mean
I try to I try to stay loose but have
that rigid kind of meeting structure that keeps everything on
(24:13):
track at all times.
Speaker 2 (24:13):
Absolutely so when we talk about leadership. Obviously, no one
learns all this by themselves. I'm sure there's been influences
in your life, from family, to teachers, to business folks.
Who are one or two of those that you might
share with us. My dad, we get that one a lot, yeah,
in that amazing or mom, we get mom or dad
quite a bit.
Speaker 1 (24:32):
But it's good.
Speaker 3 (24:33):
My dad's an amazing guy, an incredibly hard worker, taught
me work ethic. Uh, just you know, just a just
a terrific guy. And I would not you know, I
wouldn't have half the chances I've had without him.
Speaker 2 (24:52):
Uh.
Speaker 3 (24:52):
From my grandpa has another you know, I was very
lucky I had. The story of my grandpa's is kind
of interesting. There's I've got my Grandpa Kinsey on my
paternal side. My dad's dad, who was an insurance guy. Yes,
but he was a state senator in Ohio and rose
up the ranks of vice chairman of the Senate Finance Committee.
(25:14):
Had a great political career and kind of had the
urban knowledge and like it was kind of a city mentality,
right and fell on the d side of the house.
And then I had my mom's dad. His name is
Frank Puscarage, and he and his seven brothers in nineteen
fifty one mortgaged their house to start a coal company.
(25:38):
They called it Cravat Coal. And he is a his
dad was a Croatian immigrant, and he's a first generation American, right,
so he all of his seven brothers and him, they
start this cool company and then by the time it's
at its peak, they're mining coal in the Philippines. And
so I say that only to say that these are
(25:59):
two star arkly different individuals. Grandpa's on the r side.
And so I had these and I knew them both
well and had them both until I was twenty four
and twenty nine. So their influence on me was enormous.
You know, I had Rush Limbaugh in the truck and
then I had mpr in the truck, and it's so funny,
(26:21):
and it really kind of gave me the whole picture.
Speaker 2 (26:24):
Was maybe a balance, right, Yeah, And that.
Speaker 3 (26:30):
Was great for my ability to relate to everyone, yeah,
and see and see things maybe more clearly. I mean,
my views obfuscated as much as anybody else's probably, But
but these guys, you know, they were enormous in my development.
Speaker 2 (26:46):
Well, gave you some entrepreneurial desires, and I think, you know,
for honest, it probably played a lot into your development
of empathy. And to me, empathy and listening are the
two best skills that a leader can have, and then
obviously resilience and tenacity to be able to put up
with all the crap every day. But then it's a circle.
They've got to come back to the empathy and the
(27:07):
listening and then yeah, and maybe there's a book there
somehow on the circle of leadership through those four things.
So I love to ask this question, but I should
probably let everybody know beforehand before I ask it, because
some people have kind of scratched their heads. And then
it's usually a compilation. But I always like to mention it,
is there a tough lesson that kind of shaped you
(27:28):
or a you know, we say a failure, but failures
are success in disguise in my mind, Is there anything
in that nature that's kind of taught you through you
a curveball but you answered, the answered the call on it,
or anything that's a tough time that's come through.
Speaker 3 (27:44):
Yeah, uh, the water for haul actually getting it one
of these experiences. I was delusional when I started that project.
You know, no real development experience, No, no real you know.
I had done a couple of small projects on little
brick office buildings with one with one or two uses habitational,
(28:07):
just an office occupancy. But this this was, you know,
way out over my skis. And I got the whole
thing moving, and you know, got the GC in place,
and got the architect in place, and got the historic
tax credits rolling, and one thing led to another, and
(28:31):
the project itself as it was laid out. The renovations
that had already been completed, were deemed by the State
of West Virginia's Liquor Control Department to be illegal.
Speaker 1 (28:45):
O nice.
Speaker 3 (28:47):
So I was trying to make a food hall and
food halls. No law explicitly said this, but the way
that the liquor laws were written, the food food halls
were illegal in West Virginia, legal in Pennsylvania, legal and Maryland,
legal in Ohio, but illegal in West Virginia because the
law stated that you could not serve alcohol as one
(29:08):
entity into a common space where other entities were present.
Speaker 2 (29:13):
A lah to restaurants.
Speaker 3 (29:15):
Yeah. So I had a breakdown, and because I went
back to the Liquor Control Department, back again, back again,
and They were like, you're you're gonna have to pull
you know, this plumbing out, You're gonna have to So
I just took I just kind of like and I'd
already took taken draws on the loan from Main Street Bank,
(29:35):
and I was in a state of state of crisis.
Speaker 1 (29:37):
Yeah. Yeah.
Speaker 3 (29:39):
So I drove home bug eyed that night and just
for two weeks just kind of walked away from the project,
just went back to the insurance office and just was like,
how am I gonna unwind this? And then you take
you know, you go on a walk or something, and
then things start to you know, you get out of
the cortisol shot that got inject it into your body,
(30:01):
good illustration, and then you start to get some clarity
over time. So walking away was probably the best thing
I could have done. I started to work with Dennis Madonna,
the architect up here on fourteenth Street, to develop basically, Okay,
I'm gonna separate the two sides on the first four
(30:22):
from one another. Now started working on that Plan B.
At the same time that I was working on Plan B,
I contacted Ryan Weld State Center Ryan Weld, and I
contacted Sean flu Hardy again. R and D both sides
of the ticket besides the House right Senate and my delegate,
and those guys heard my plea. I think flu even
(30:44):
came down. And I talked to Ryan on the on
the phone, various emails, and as I was working Plan B,
the project was grinding to a halt. I got a
call from Ryan Weld one day and I was in
Columbus with at a friend's place, and he said, hey, man,
(31:06):
the language that you need to open your concept as
you wanted is in Senate Bill five point thirty four
and it's going to go to a vote next week.
Speaker 1 (31:15):
Wow.
Speaker 3 (31:16):
And I and he said, you can watch the vote
online or you can like follow this thing, which a
watch part. At the time, I wanted to lay as
low as pib. Yeah. I was scared. But anyway, so
it passed, and it jumped back over to the House
and passed. And Yeah, I realized through that experience that
(31:41):
very you know, the panic inducing, horrific kind of like
how am I going to tell the bank that I
you know? And and turned it around and government responded
the way that we all wish it would.
Speaker 1 (31:54):
Yeah, that that is such an awesome story. I'm so
glad you shared that with us, and what.
Speaker 2 (31:58):
A great and to that question that I love to
ask people.
Speaker 1 (32:03):
Yeah, and that's it's very real. It's very recent.
Speaker 2 (32:06):
Uh maybe even a tad rows still I don't know, it.
Speaker 3 (32:08):
Is it is. I'm still I'm sweating right now talking
about it. We were the first, we were the first
food hall to submit for a permit in the state
of West Virginia when we were trying to open.
Speaker 2 (32:18):
It should be a big historical sign up there first
food hall.
Speaker 3 (32:22):
There was a second applicant about a month later too,
so somebody else wanted to do the same thing. I
think in Clarksburg maybe you're down in the.
Speaker 2 (32:29):
I think there's a reasonable uh setup like that in
Martinsburg too, which is really cool.
Speaker 3 (32:33):
I think that's it.
Speaker 2 (32:34):
We were there for a Bridging Innovations conference and they
have this little barbeer and you got all these kitchens
going down the line. It's such a cool place. It's
it's like waterfront hole in that regard. But they have
like five or six food vendors in there in a
dessert place and oh my gosh, I need to not
go back.
Speaker 1 (32:51):
Yeah.
Speaker 2 (32:52):
So last question is for an aspiring young leader that
wants to be a CEO or a entrepreneur. What's maybe
a parting thought you might have for the minute. I
am going to have an epilogue question too, Okay.
Speaker 3 (33:10):
I would say that this is the most for me,
at least, has been the most rewarding way to live
my life. To come up with things, to lean on
other people, to build something with other people. Absolutely collaboration,
(33:32):
and and to pool ideas from inside your mind out
into physical reality is the most rewarding experience, one of
the most rewarding experiences that a human can have. I
got married last weekend.
Speaker 1 (33:45):
Actually I heard about that, and that was.
Speaker 3 (33:48):
An amazing experience. I hope to be a father someday,
and I'm sure that will be it is. But up
until now, the favorite thing, my favorite thing in my
life life has been, you know, pulling ideas into reality,
and that that's really what. You know, All these old
buildings downtown are all antiques of people's minds. You know,
(34:13):
the thing that's succurred down there at Waterfront Hall, you
know that that was just me down there, once upon
a time, sitting in a big pile of gravel on
the music venue side. And like all I can say,
I guess I guess to anybody that wants to try
to pull something off.
Speaker 1 (34:29):
Is that.
Speaker 3 (34:31):
There are resources.
Speaker 1 (34:33):
Call me.
Speaker 3 (34:35):
Get involved in the chamber because it's so much fun,
it's so terrifying. You worry that the perception of what
you're trying to do is not going to match the
thing that you wanted to do. But my advice is
to get your hands dirty and try it.
Speaker 2 (34:53):
Yeah, I'm gonna have to get you involved in some
of my entrepreneurial contacts around the state. They need to
have you out there talking to some of the these
entrepreneurs so they can hear reality, they can hear the
dreams all that. So the epilogue questions. I made a
couple of notes when you were way back, almost near
the beginning, you talked about taking that quiet time thinking
and jotting things down. What how did people do that?
(35:16):
Do you block that out or do you just make
it happen when you're like, okay, it's just that time.
Speaker 3 (35:20):
I moved into a new house in October with my
now wife Page, and I haven't done this for myself
there yet, but what I had at my old office
in Catus and at other places where I'd spent a
lot of time was kind of a sacred domain. Yeah,
and really like if you set up a environment or
(35:43):
a kind of you know, your favorite chair, nice table,
a pen that you like, if you set up the
conditions where in a place where you want to spend
a lot of time, things flow better. Yeah. And you
know whether for you if it's burning incense or if
(36:04):
it's dead silence.
Speaker 2 (36:06):
Or it's solo piano music. Okay, that gets my brain going.
Speaker 3 (36:11):
Yeah, So just listen to yourself and and ultimately invite
in all of the things that inspire you and and
these these things will will come flowing back out of you.
You know. I think that you know, it's a little
metaphysical and a little heady sometimes to talk about the
muse and all that, but I think, uh, you know,
(36:34):
when you're talking about creation pulling things out of nowhere,
like you, you set up the conditions for it to happen,
and you'll be rewarded for it.
Speaker 1 (36:44):
That's awesome.
Speaker 2 (36:45):
Our guest has been Dan Millison, co found founder and
owner of Waterfront Haul. How can they find you against
give us the website. We didn't even talk about all
that stuff. I didn't give you a chance to kind
of give you a little commercial.
Speaker 3 (36:56):
That's all right. Waterfront haul dot Com. I write a
news letter. It's out every Tuesday. It's called The Waterfront Times.
Speaker 1 (37:04):
I see it on the shirt reading the Waterfront Times all.
Speaker 3 (37:06):
That, and so that that comes out and everybody's in
boxes who are subscribed on Tuesdays at eight am. And
we're at twelve thirty Water Street and Wheeling. And if
you haven't been there yet.
Speaker 2 (37:20):
And Ashley is the lady to call if you've got
an event to talk about.
Speaker 3 (37:23):
Right, you can drop every every inquiry you want into
our website and it will make its way to the
proper person.
Speaker 2 (37:29):
Purpose you got the system set up all right. You've
been listening to CEOs, you should know. I'm your host,
Mike Howard, chief operating Officer of the Wheeling Area Chamber
of Commerce, sponsored buyer good Friends at West Banco. Our
guest has been Dan Millissen from the Waterfront Hall. Dan,
thanks for joining us. Thank you, we'll see you again soon.
On CEOs, you should know
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