May 18, 2023 • 42 mins
Rafa and Joe G take the show on the road, broadcasting from the Legion Lair and joined by Jonathan Sumers, VP of ESports Legion Gaming Club, to talk about the sport's growing global popularity, the in's and out's of life in the league and the squad's upcoming season.
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Speaker 1 (00:00):
First we take a good record.
Speaker 2 (00:03):
Then we have a super sound.
Speaker 3 (00:04):
DJ makes it with enthusiasm, and that's the supersund to day.
Speaker 2 (00:27):
Recount of my Steven sixty seconds ago, out comes Garland.
Speaker 1 (00:30):
Garland looking for an opening.
Speaker 4 (00:32):
Gama Lane clotes it score. It's a wonderful tess a game.
Speaker 1 (00:37):
Whoa wow. Well that's what we have here.
Speaker 3 (00:40):
Broadcasting live is from Rocket Mortgage field House on the
sunny shores of beautiful Lake Erie.
Speaker 1 (00:49):
I look up with your quarter the ride about a
part crown. My honor knows you don't leave it better
than me that.
Speaker 3 (01:01):
In downtown Cleanland. You tuned in to Wine and Gold Radio.
Now you're your host Rafa and Joji no.
Speaker 4 (01:17):
Ya Hey, yeahybody, and welcome to the first off season
episode of Wine and Gold Radio. I like it that
we're keeping up a caden. We are keeping the cane
season caten. I know, I know, it's it's kind of good.
I mean, and I have to say, I was thinking
about this on the way down here. I miss you.
I do because like I'm so used to seeing you. Mean,
(01:39):
we sit on the plane together, we eat dinner together,
we do everything together. And then all of a sudden,
when the season ends, It's just over and I'm lonely.
Speaker 1 (01:46):
It takes me a while to what just my life
from going from sixty to zero. Right, It takes me
like a two to three games to watch where actually
not studying or recording anything. I'm just enjoying basketball and
sports by itself, like just without having to worry about anything.
But the hardest part for me is the morning. Well,
I don't have to start, I don't have to read,
(02:07):
I don't have to take notes, I don't have to
make sure I have everything ready for my broadcast. So
it takes me a little while. I enjoy it, but
it takes me a little while to get used to
that sixty two zeros.
Speaker 4 (02:17):
I know, I know, I wake up and do three
keys for the for the other player, the other player.
So you're not one of those guys who because the
calves are out the playoffs, that you stop watching playoffs
and just turn off the NBA told it.
Speaker 1 (02:31):
I wish I could, but I just automatically drove by.
The TV just drags me into watching. I know I
have I have to tell you that I do enjoy
the eight thirty starts for me just coach team that
the nine thirty ten o'clock. I was watching halftime. I
was watching up till halftime, going to bed.
Speaker 4 (02:46):
Yeah, eight thirty.
Speaker 1 (02:47):
That's how little I care when it comes to like
midnight and watching a basketball game.
Speaker 4 (02:51):
No, it's perfect right now, eight thirty is the perfect time.
Speaker 1 (02:54):
It's it's and they moved the finals up too, by
the way, it's going to be yet they moved them
back a half hour to the eight thirty.
Speaker 4 (03:01):
That's good. That's good because kids too. Man, you want
kids to be able to watch, and you want to
be able to stay up and watch the whole thing.
Let's before instead of jerking around talking because I do
want to talk to some NBA hoops, Let's welcome in
our guest Power guests. Our power guest are very be spent.
Speaker 1 (03:17):
Only one.
Speaker 4 (03:18):
You know, Jonathan as If you've ever listened to the show,
you know that I don't know anybody's title in the
whole company. I know that I am the b writer
and he is the Spanish radio Okay, promoted to Senior
Spanish play. Jonathan Summers, you're head of the Legion, the
(03:39):
Digion Gaming, Legion Gaming. But you explain your title and
what you do because I'll screw it up.
Speaker 2 (03:46):
Yeah, no, absolutely, so thank you guys for having me.
Speaker 5 (03:48):
I'm our vice president of esports Operations in Caves Legion GC,
and in short, Calves Legion GC. Calves Legion Gaming Club
is our fourth professional sports franchise under our umbrella here
in Cleveland. And most of your listners obviously know about
the Calves, and I'm sure they know about the Monsters
and the Cleveland Charge. But in addition, we own and
operate Calves Legion Gaming Club, which is a professional esports
organization that participates in the NBA two K leave.
Speaker 1 (04:11):
I have to tell you I've been here. I just
finished my ninth season, which is unbelievable. That is when
you are with the Legions.
Speaker 5 (04:17):
Usits well the Legion. We're in the middle of season six.
I've been at the Calves. That was my seventh.
Speaker 1 (04:22):
We just so But to me when this started, it
was just so intriguing because I'm still from the generation
that put a quarter in the machine and got three
lives put Donkey Kong Junior or whatever it was. I
never saw anything beyond that, so I really wasn't triggued
and got interested in the whole operation that we have
going on. As usual at a top notch operation. But
(04:44):
how did this start and how how has the game
or the league changed in the six years.
Speaker 5 (04:50):
Yeah, well it started six years ago when the NBA
was really the first North American sports professional organization league
to recognize this growth of gaming in esports that is
so prevalent, which we could talk about for hours, and
in turn created the NBA two K League. So the
NBA two K League, as I reference, you know, the
Kavslegian GC being our fourth franchise, the NBA two K
League is the fourth league of the NBA. Because most
(05:11):
listeners know obviously of the NBA and the WNBA and
the g League. Well there's the NBA two K League
as well, And this is this is the real deal.
And Adam Silver's out greeting the number one pick at
the draft at MSG Barclays. Games are competed live on stage.
You know, we're competing against other NBA franchises, which we'll
get into, but in short, really it was the foresight
(05:32):
of the NBA to see, you know, the expression is
always you know, skates where the puck is going? Now
where the puck is And I think the NBA got
ahead of it by creating the NBA two K League,
and we were proud to be one of the first
founding teams to within the NBA to join.
Speaker 4 (05:44):
Are other sports league is going to eventually? Yes and no.
Speaker 5 (05:47):
You know, sports is so different from non sports e
sports titles. You know, when you think about the most
popular football game is Madden, which is one player controlling
eleven players on a football field, or MLB is most
popular baseball game, which is one player controlling all nine
baseball players.
Speaker 2 (06:03):
With us, it's different.
Speaker 5 (06:03):
It's five on five, So every player on our team
is controlling an arch type you know, player within the game.
And so because of that, the strategies involved, there's such
a different beast being five on five. And also NBA
two K is the number one sports game in North America,
right above FIFA Sports Actually, so I think that the
popularity of basketball, especially amongst the youth, the popularity of
two K I think sets it apart from other sports
(06:26):
leagues replicating.
Speaker 1 (06:27):
And I would say when you say popularity is like
the global popularity right, because I mean when you talk
about mann and is a very popular video game, but
I would imagine most of the popularity comes from the United.
Speaker 5 (06:37):
States, yeah, there's about ten million people playing in the
United States of NBA two K. Ten million copies are sold.
Excuse me, but when then when you look at Asia,
I mean the amount of people. You have tens of
millions of people playing, you know, every single month, So
you know, esports as a whole is a larger conversation
obviously than two K. NBA two K is one game
within the grand universe, and that actually parlays into what
we're trying to do at our organization, which is really
(06:59):
touch and be able to work within the larger esports landscape,
not just two K, even though that's our focus.
Speaker 4 (07:05):
When we got here, you were talking about dealing with
trade requests and things like that. Real man, right, So
I guess that's good kind of my next thing. And
you talked about the number one pick, Adam Silver, greeting him.
So as far as player levels go, you have to
deal with your kind of the front office guy. You
have to deal with the players.
Speaker 5 (07:26):
Well, you know, I tell people all the time who
are as unfamiliar with the two K league. Imagine if
after the game, you know, Darius and Evan walked back
to their apartment and shared it to bedroom apartment.
Speaker 1 (07:36):
With one another.
Speaker 2 (07:36):
Right, that's just like you laugh, right, because that's like
crazy to think about.
Speaker 5 (07:39):
But that's our world. You know, our guys there here
in Cleveland six months a year. You basically try out
to be in the league online, there's the draft and
then we get our guys from all over the US
and Canada. We have three of our five guys are
currently from Toronto as we speak, and so we bring
them to Cleveland. We put them in apartments together, and
they actually live in the same complex, the main building as.
Speaker 2 (07:58):
Our g league plays the charge players do.
Speaker 5 (08:01):
And you know, it's the real world meets the NBA.
And so yeah to what you were saying, you know,
over the six years, there's trade requests and suspensions or fines.
I mean, whatever you can think of has happened because
you know, that's that's the way of professional sports nowadays.
Speaker 2 (08:15):
So sports is no different.
Speaker 4 (08:16):
I gotta know, what does a guy have to do
to get to earn a suspension or fine?
Speaker 5 (08:20):
Well, you know, just I'd say step outside the lines
of what Rock Entertainment Group would or the NBA two
K League would would authorize. You know, I'm not going
to get in any specifics. I think we all know
the dudes and does.
Speaker 1 (08:30):
But I would imagine since you're dealing with much younger,
younger than the three of us, Younger than the three
of us, of course, and in average, I guess you
know the game, but I would imagine because I get
in trouble at fifty six. You know, social media and
all that. These guys live in the.
Speaker 2 (08:46):
World, they live it.
Speaker 5 (08:47):
Yeah, you have to be eighteen to be in the league,
and the average ages between about eighteen to twenty four.
I'd say, while they're having players older than that, and
we currently have players older than that. Yeah, it's a
young man's game. As we say, I mean, you kind
of age out and retire by your mid twenties. So
we are dealing with the younger side of the young
professionals and a lot of individ You know, Look, this
is not the NBA or the NHL, where you practice
and train for years and years and you go up
(09:09):
through the ranks and through the ranks. These are kids
who were playing at home six months ago. They try out,
that made the league, and next thing you know, they're
on a plane to Cleveland. So there's no ramping up
period for them, and it's beholden on us to really
get them.
Speaker 2 (09:19):
Equipped to be a PF. Was the average age between
eighteen to twenty three?
Speaker 1 (09:23):
What were you making at twenty at twenty at twenty
years old?
Speaker 4 (09:27):
Oh, I got I don't know.
Speaker 1 (09:30):
Nothing, and what.
Speaker 4 (09:34):
The player?
Speaker 5 (09:34):
Yeah, So the players in the NBA two K League
signed six month contracts and they become actual employees of
the NBA, so they get health coverage and benefits as
if they were an NBA League employee in New York.
Speaker 2 (09:44):
They then get housing.
Speaker 5 (09:45):
We're responsible for their housing, as I mentioned, we put
them up here in Cleveland, and then they earn a
salary for those six months, which is a conservative salary.
And then there's prize money, which is really the big
carrot at the end of the day. So this season,
there's two and a half million dollars available spread route
six tournaments, and so there was six hundred thousand available
for the last tournament of the three on three playoffs.
(10:06):
So these guys can be walking home, you know, if
they perform well and play well for six months of service,
you know, potentially with six figures if they play well
on the court, which is not a bad living, you know.
Speaker 4 (10:15):
And I want to go back to the draft pick.
You said, the kids got drafted, how do they get
where do they get drafted from? And you talk to
We're going to bounce around a little bit, but we
talked about Cleveland State, your partnership with cleven State. And
again I learned just today that colleges are now having
varsity programs and there's the possibility of earning a scholarship
for gaming. This is crazy to me because I'm like
(10:37):
Rafa man, my last video experience was tech Mobile.
Speaker 5 (10:39):
Yeah, you know, right, yeah, you know, you guys are
ahead of your time. I guess to your point on
the league, everything as you would imagine, it's a digital league.
Everything is digital, right, So you try out from home
and you go into basically a virtual combine. So the
best players all go into a virtual court together, they
play each other and I we are team.
Speaker 2 (10:58):
We watch, we scout at the stats, We.
Speaker 5 (11:00):
Get these guys phone numbers, we call, we interview them.
We have a director of you know, BASTA Operations, guy
Leading who's our GM and coach, former player in the league,
Joela Zu. So I'm not going to take you know,
the credit for that, but you know it's this community
is a very tight, close knit community. Everybody knows who
the next players are and who the sixteen year old
from Toronto is, and there's a seventeen year old in
LA who's gonna be eligible for the league next year.
Speaker 2 (11:21):
It's that kind of tight knit community. So it really
is wild.
Speaker 5 (11:24):
But yeah, I mean to and to your latter point
on the larger esports landscape. You know, as I reference
NBA two K is one game, but I'm sure listeners
know of or have heard of a lot of other
titles out there, Rocket League, over Watch, League of Legends
for Atnite, and so on and so forth. So you know,
we organizationally, you know, have a relationship or connected to
one hundred Thieves, which is one of the largest esports
organizations the United States. They're based out of Los Angeles
(11:46):
and they compete at that Tier one level. But to
your point, it goes all the way from that in
LA at a huge compound in Los Angeles, down to
you know, high schools and college relationships. Here in Cleveland,
we are partnered with Cleveland State who recently elevated their
program from an esports club to an esports varsity program,
so you can now be a student athlete at Cleveland
(12:07):
State and our facility which we're currently sitting in. By
the way, I don't think we've even mentioned the Calves
Legion Layer lit by TCP where in our home esports
facility is their home esports facility as well, So you
could come here on most days, well, don't come here,
but if you were to come here, you would see,
you know, our Calves Legion guys, you know, scrimmaging and
watching film. And then right next to them is you know,
the Rocket League team from Cleveland State doing the same thing.
(12:29):
So the growth of esports and gaming locally continues to grow.
Speaker 1 (12:33):
So to that point, like you know the draft is coming, now,
do you have guys in the league that you are
known for shooting and another one that are known for
the good defenders? I see the boards here at the
layer sometimes before when he started how it's.
Speaker 2 (12:47):
Like, don't tweet those don't tweet those images? Yes, right,
Look it's five on five.
Speaker 5 (12:53):
And just to provide more clarity that it is point
guard through center, so you have to have a point guard,
shooting guard, et cetera, and their standard arch types. So
if your say Joe's the point guard, all right, Joe,
you are fifty different type of point guards you can
choose from. It could be a Darius out a Garland
type of point guard. It can be Jalen Brunson type
of point guard. There's fifty arc types save with the
shooting guard and so on and so forth. So because
(13:13):
of that, there's it's like a chess match. There's a
lot of strategy. Oh well, maybe we're playing Toronto Raptors uprising.
You know their team and they're known because their center
is a Porzingis type, so we want a stretch five
to match it. So there's a lot of mixing and
matching of the arc types. But also, as I mentioned,
because you move your individual player, you have to run plays.
Speaker 2 (13:32):
I mean, think about it.
Speaker 5 (13:33):
So you know, a former coach of ours, Austin Peterson,
who's currently been a charge coach, is now at cassistant coach.
Speaker 2 (13:39):
He was a coach of Ours for Cavs.
Speaker 5 (13:40):
Lenior for a while to the point where we were
running the same sets and x's and o's as the
guys were at the fieldhouse on the floor. Because it's
the same strategy at the end of the day. So
it really differentiates itself from other sports titles in.
Speaker 4 (13:52):
That way, is there a dominant team and what makes
them dominant? Or and or is there a domin player?
Is there a joke kitch? Is there a top player
in the league?
Speaker 2 (14:05):
Yeah, I get that question a lot.
Speaker 5 (14:07):
I would say, you know, obviously we have to give
credits to the teams that have done well and the
past champions of the league. You know, the two time
champion Washington Wizards, District Gaming obviously deserves a lot of credit.
And what makes them a lot of things? I think
you know their organizational commitment. You know, from from ownership
all the way down, you know who they are, all
well invested, well interested. It's a big commitment of ours
to the point where they have a facility called District E.
(14:29):
We're currently sitting in our Cavs Lesion Layer LIPATISP which
is our esports facility. They recently unveiled THEIRS, which is
attached to Capital One Arena where the Wizards play. Of course,
so I would say that just organizational commitment, staffing knowledge,
know how you know, it helps to get some great players.
They had the number one pick a few years back
and drafted a great, great kid.
Speaker 2 (14:48):
Who led them to a couple of titles as well.
Speaker 5 (14:51):
So you know you can just as we saw what
last night with the NBA lottery, sometimes you strike gold
on a number one pick and that can carry you.
So we've seen that happen in the two K league.
And I think just you know, the well run organizations,
I think we all kind of know who's who's doing
it really well, and we think we're one of those,
but there are others as well.
Speaker 4 (15:07):
I want to know who the number one kid is.
Speaker 5 (15:09):
Man who in the next NBA two K lee season.
It's too hard to say. I mean as far as
who the current number one player is. You know, an
analogy I gave someone is UFC. Like in UFC, it's
a short shelf life, right, other than our guys THEIPE
who's managed to stick around for a long time, usually
it's it's quick like it's a violent support. And these guys,
these kids, they come in the league at eighteen or
(15:30):
nineteen and by twenty one, twenty two, you know.
Speaker 2 (15:33):
They could be out of the league. They could be
not at the top of their game. So look, we've had.
Speaker 5 (15:37):
Players win awards and other players who have won awards
for you know, MVPs Defensive Player of the Years, All
Stars and then a year or two later they're out
of the league. Yeah, so it takes a year round
grinding and commitment to the game because the last, you know,
piece I'll note on this front is the game changes.
So that's an important piece to note as well, which
is like, look, if you go out onto a basketball
court that hoops always ten foot, the free throw is
(15:58):
always fifteen feet, right, two K changes every year. The
game that these guys changes every year. So if you're
a point guard you're really good at shooting, the next
version two K, you know, twenty three, twenty four to
twenty five, could you know, decrease the importance of shooting
from the point guard position. It's more about can you drive?
So these guys, every year the game comes out, usually
in the fall. It's like almost the league has reinvented
(16:18):
itself every year, hence a lot of the turnover on
rosters and players coming.
Speaker 1 (16:22):
In and out.
Speaker 4 (16:23):
Does one guy play the same position all year? Your
center's your center?
Speaker 2 (16:26):
Fully? Yeah hopefully.
Speaker 5 (16:27):
Okay, We've had years where you know, a guy's got
to move from centering point guard from Wednesday to Thursday
because we got beat pretty bad, so we got to
But you know, Okay, that's happening. It's probably not the
best sign. Okay, So this year we've been fortunate. We're
having a good year thus far. We're halfway through the season.
We're currently in ninth out of the twenty five teams.
So we're going to just try to improve on what
we have.
Speaker 4 (16:46):
How much does chemistry matter?
Speaker 2 (16:48):
Everything?
Speaker 4 (16:49):
Yeah?
Speaker 2 (16:49):
Everything, I got it. Everything.
Speaker 1 (16:51):
Yeah.
Speaker 5 (16:51):
I can't even begin to describe the importance of chemistry.
For the reasons that we laid out, these guys live together,
they're away from their family and friends for six months.
I mean, that's another factors, you know, Like at the
end of the day, Darius goes home and to whomever
his family friends are that he lives with, that he
knows he will see. Whereas our players, none of them
are from Cleveland. They have no family here, they have
no friends here. So they're they're alone in a way,
(17:13):
and we have to form that bond. And if that
bond is informed, it poses a great challenge.
Speaker 4 (17:18):
It sounds like a kind of a good reality show. Actually,
at first I was thinking of Darius and like Evan
living together and how hilarious that would be. That would
be something, and then like imagine these kids. I mean
like again, because they know each other through this, then
they practice and they play together. Then they got to
go home, and I mean it's got to be Uh.
Speaker 2 (17:39):
Have you and never consider getting a two bedroom?
Speaker 4 (17:42):
No?
Speaker 1 (17:42):
Well, we actively think know each other when we're in
New York.
Speaker 4 (17:48):
You know, what I was thinking about was how great
it would have been if this would have been around
when I was a concrete state. I could have been
like a Viur city. I could have been like a
stud Well.
Speaker 1 (17:56):
My question to you regarding that is, are you surprised?
Which is the league looking expecting, like for the NC
DOUBLEA to get into this business of creating a league
of the run. But I guess the same type of players, right, So.
Speaker 5 (18:09):
I would say at both the collegiate and high school level,
it's not one governing body overseeing everything. It's kind of
the wild West, right, So you to your point of
NC Double A kind of runs college, but that's not
the way it is easy. It's more of just kind
of leagues and conferences have been formed. So for example,
we're in MAC territory here in Cleveland, so the MAC
has the e sc Esports Collegiate. It's a conference just
(18:30):
for the MAX schools plus some non Max schools esports
programs to compete. So it's separate from the MAC, it's
separate from NCAA. It's not governed the same way yet
the organization and structure is there. So will everything eventually
fall under nc double A. I'm not sure. We're definitely
not that point anytime soon. And then just locally for
folks in Ohio, you know it's OHSAA runs high school
(18:51):
sports in the state, not the case you know, necessarily
the esports more like EESO Esports Ohio and other organizations
which bring high school under their umbrella.
Speaker 1 (19:00):
And the originally asked you that is because I know
you guys are televised as well the NBA.
Speaker 5 (19:05):
Yeah, so some matches are predominantly it's digital though predominantly
you'll catch our matches on Twitch and YouTube, the two
main channels.
Speaker 1 (19:12):
But play but play guy, because I remember doing in Spanish.
Speaker 2 (19:16):
Don't know anybody, Yes, well.
Speaker 4 (19:17):
I did it.
Speaker 3 (19:18):
I did.
Speaker 1 (19:18):
I did a highlight in Spanish when you guys, when
you guys won, they had like you had like a
four point play or something to the winner was one.
Speaker 5 (19:25):
Of our most engaged social yet.
Speaker 6 (19:27):
They had they had a play that they were down
for and they stole the ball and it was one
like a real thing, like one of those one of
those Larry Johnson in My Square Garden four point play
type of thing.
Speaker 4 (19:38):
And now they just had their most recent tournament was
in DC. Correct.
Speaker 2 (19:42):
Correct.
Speaker 5 (19:43):
So the season is split into two. The first half
of the season is three on three. So it's not
what I was describing a five to five. It's more
of the what you know, a kid who plays the
retail version of the game would play with his friends
at three and three. So they did half the season
that way to really appeal more to the masses and
to the you know, retail side of who played is
the game. And now starting on the twenty third, we're
getting back to the straight five e five what we've
(20:04):
been discussing the league build, if you will, of the game.
So yeah, the second half of the season kicks off
the twenty third and concludes the beginning of August.
Speaker 2 (20:11):
Is when the finals culminated.
Speaker 1 (20:13):
Are you still hosting events here at the Layer, because
I know we used to do you know, private events
and stuff like that.
Speaker 5 (20:20):
So yeah, I mean, as we sit here in the
caves Legion Layer right by overlooking Edgewater Beach here on
the near west side of Cleveland. As mentioned, this is
a twenty six hundred square foot facility. We have twenty
six gaming stations, two soundproof streaming pods, you know, a
gig of everstream fiber, and so this place is decked out.
There really is no place like this in Northeast Ohio.
So to your point, Rafa, we realized quickly we'd be
(20:41):
remiss if we only use this for our team or state.
Hence all the other use cases. So yes, we throw
birthday parties here. We have cash tournaments, we have charity tournaments.
We've worked with Make a Wish, LGBT Center, local CMSD
school projects, field trips, and the list just goes on.
So we feel strongly and are proud of this being
really the mirror gaming and esports facility in Northeast Ohio,
(21:02):
and the use cases for it are endless. So you
can follow us on at Caves Legion GC or at
Legion Layer TCP.
Speaker 1 (21:09):
There is the Rocker Mortgage intramural like team members intramural anywhere.
Speaker 2 (21:14):
In Yeah, you know, we've had we've had some money.
Speaker 4 (21:19):
Yeah, each other man with j Mike, Yeah, we got
we got one already.
Speaker 5 (21:24):
Yeah, we've had some team member tournaments, internal team member
tournaments in might shock you to learn that a lot
of our younger entry level team members tend to do
the best.
Speaker 4 (21:32):
Yeah, you personally when you took over the legion, were
you a big gamer or did you have to kind
of learn this from.
Speaker 2 (21:41):
I learned this from scratch.
Speaker 4 (21:42):
Yeah.
Speaker 5 (21:42):
So I started with the organization October of sixteen in
a digital partnerships role from my previous life working in
digital media and partnerships for a long time. And so yeah,
the esports came six months after I started the organization,
and uh, you know, I got thrown into the mix
not knowing what the eastood for, to be honest, and
I knew nothing. And that's why I think I have
the perspective I have because I can really explain it
(22:05):
to individuals and who don't come from this world, right,
And the best way to describe it to people is
there's no barrier of entry to this And I think
that's what makes it so unique within our family of
companies as opposed to you know, say, the calves and
monsters of the charge. Because look, at the end of
the day, basketball and hockey are very appealing, but there's
always gonna be a subset of people in youth in
particular who either can't play or don't have an interest
(22:27):
in playing. But gamings for everybody, and so whether you
play Fortnite or pac Man, whether it's Rocket League or GoldenEye,
right like, we've never had anyone come in here that
did not enjoy themselves and have a good time.
Speaker 2 (22:38):
And that's gaming.
Speaker 5 (22:40):
And so a lot of what we talk about is
esports and caves leasion is esports. That's the competitive side
of gaming. That's the one percent of the pie chart.
But I think what we've recognized, you know, really quickly
here is the ninety nine percent of the pie chart
of gaming, which is what we do right that reaches everybody.
And so organizationally, it's you know, this place and what
we've done has given us that platform to reach every body.
And you know, that's half the battle is reaching folks,
(23:02):
especially kids, as we know.
Speaker 2 (23:04):
I mean I have two boys and nine and five,
and just getting their attention is half the battle. So
gaming gives us the opportunity to do that.
Speaker 4 (23:10):
Gaming is just I mean, again we talked about where
we came from, put the quarter in and tech mobile
and things like that. Gaming now is it's permeated society
and culture in that you look at the biggest show
on HBO, I think that, what is it that, oh
the Last of Us based on a video game? Super
Mario Brothers was you know, was a video game? I
(23:33):
mean like it's you know, Grand Theft Auto, Like the
music from that, I mean.
Speaker 2 (23:38):
Like permeates society and FIFA the soundtrack from that.
Speaker 4 (23:42):
It permeates society now, so everywhere.
Speaker 5 (23:44):
There's two reasons for that in my opinion. One is
because gaming is always changing, right. It's like Fortnite didn't exist,
what you know, ten fifteen years ago, right, Who knows
if it's.
Speaker 2 (23:52):
Gonna be around in ten years from now. Maybe it will,
maybe it won't.
Speaker 5 (23:55):
Basketball has always been and always will be what it is, right,
and we can tweak and make the changes to it
as we've described.
Speaker 2 (24:00):
But the sport is the sport.
Speaker 5 (24:01):
But every game is so different than the game next
to it that that's what gives it the ability to
really appeal to everyone over the masses. So yeah, I
think that, you know, it's a playground for everybody to
play and get involved.
Speaker 2 (24:13):
So we feel bullish on the growth of it moving forward.
Speaker 1 (24:16):
You mentioned the global portion of it, and correct me
if I'm wrong, But we were the first team that
had an international player.
Speaker 5 (24:23):
We were the first team that had a Spanish player. Spanish, yes, yes,
so we do participate. Yeah, Mario, ave Mario, who's our friend?
Hello Mario if you're listening over in Spain. But yeah,
it's and you know an expression I use all the
time from Daryl Morey, as we know from the seventy
six ers, the Cleveland native. He said, he said at
one point there are three global sports soccer, basketball, and esports.
(24:44):
And I always challenge people or if you can tell
me know there's like crickets not global, Baseball is not global, right,
those are three sports that are really played everywhere. So
the NB two K League is a combination of two
of those. So basketball and youth sports and gaming will
continue to grow over time. And I think as you
see more changes with the two K League in the
NBA are actually going to become closer over the next
few years and you'll see more interwoven connectivity between them.
(25:08):
And the main part of that, the reason Joe you
were touching on is look, every guy the Cavs draft
from here on out has experience in gaming and video
game Every guy either owned a PlayStation of guest By
or an Xbox ten fifteen years ago, that wasn't the case.
It was like, oh so and so on the road
as an Xbox, he's into gaming. Well, the veteran on
the team doesn't. Well, now the oldest guy in our
team is going to be a twenty seven to twenty
(25:31):
year old guy who grew up gaming. Jared Allen is
a huge gamer, Darius is a huge game and half
our team, Dylan's a huge gamer.
Speaker 2 (25:37):
So we're just gonna see more and more and more
of it. And so because of that, you're going to
see this thing grow.
Speaker 1 (25:42):
But the thing is, do you see the league expanding
a little further than what he did already with the team?
You know? I think yeah.
Speaker 2 (25:49):
So there's twenty five teams in the league.
Speaker 5 (25:51):
Twenty two of those are NBA teams, So twenty two
of the thirty NBA franchises participating in the league. There
are three non NBA teams. They all happen to be
international organization. So we have Deuce Gaming from Latin America,
who just won the three and three championship this year.
We have jen G, a very large esports organization based
out of Shanghai in Asia. And then we have OZ
Gaming from the NBL. The Australian Basketball League just entered
(26:12):
as the newest expansion team. So we have franchises in Asia,
Latin America, Australia. We've had players from Europe. I'm sure
we'll have a team from Europe. We've had tournaments that
we've held in Germany and Great Britain, in New Zealand
and Australia.
Speaker 2 (26:25):
So yeah, kids all over the world play two K.
It just makes sense.
Speaker 1 (26:28):
And I wanted to ask you this because are you
still doing the tournaments on site? Like I know everything
we used to be in New York.
Speaker 4 (26:37):
Yeah.
Speaker 5 (26:37):
Yeah, So the league this year, it's kind of central
hub is DC at the District headquarters. So the tournaments
this year are played remote. Our guys play from here
at our facility online versus Lakers Gaming, Miami, heat Check Gaming,
Pacers Gaming. If we advance out of group play in
the tournament, we then go to d C and compete
live on stage, which is an incredible, incredible atmosphere.
Speaker 1 (26:59):
I'm telling you it feels you know what it feels
like that movie Running man, Yeah.
Speaker 2 (27:08):
That's a reference.
Speaker 6 (27:08):
That's like everybody's looking at these kids are going like
looking at the screen and like I.
Speaker 4 (27:16):
Was going to ask you about the players and that
do we do anything? Is there any kind of connectivity
with the players and uh the Legiance Calves players, I should.
Speaker 2 (27:24):
Say, with Calves players and cavsations.
Speaker 1 (27:26):
Yes and no.
Speaker 5 (27:26):
I mean there you know, there are some restrictions in
place in terms of what we can and can't do,
you know, the not to get tun into the weeds
with the collective Bargaining Agreement that until as of now,
we've been operating under what's done in advance of the
two K League being introduced. So long story short is
you know I'm getting I'm speaking a lot of legalies.
But with the new CBA and with the way things
are trending, things are going to change and I think
(27:47):
you're going to see a lot of that. Whereas prior
to now we just were a little bit restricted. I
think the flood gates can open a little bit.
Speaker 4 (27:54):
And they kids, and that's what I'm saying. It might
be it's kind of cool that but your young guys
could kick their ass.
Speaker 2 (28:03):
That's the best is anytime.
Speaker 5 (28:04):
I mean you know, whether it's a collie of ours
in the office or front I know, and they're like,
oh my god, I'm so good at two K. I'm
all right, cool, and I'll set it up somewhere somehow
to play our guys. And they just leave shaking their
head because again, you know, there could even be listeners
who are listening to all this thinking this.
Speaker 2 (28:17):
Is wild, this is crazy.
Speaker 5 (28:18):
You get played to play video games. Look, whether you know,
you turn on ESPN, you see darts, you see bowling,
you see poker.
Speaker 2 (28:25):
These are the best people, of course, the best people
in the world.
Speaker 5 (28:28):
Right at the end of the day. If you're if
you do something you want to see or hear, the
best people in the world do that. And that could
be Minecraft, or it could be esports, could be botch Belt, whatever.
And these guys are the best two K players in
the entire world. And because of that, you know, this
thing continues, the game, the popularity does.
Speaker 4 (28:44):
If there's a kid out there young I shouldn't say kid,
but if there's a young person out there listening right
now and thinks, hey, I'm I'm really good and I'm
getting better, how could they? Uh, how how do try outs?
Speaker 1 (28:55):
Yeah?
Speaker 5 (28:55):
Tryouts, you know, follow along at NBA two K League
and at cavsg GC. We for example, put on a
tournament usually every February where you can potentially win the
tournament and then you gain entry into the draft automatically
just in winning that tournament.
Speaker 2 (29:08):
That's our battle for the land tournament.
Speaker 5 (29:10):
But aside from that, everything's online, like I said, and
just you know, click on some links, register and everyone's
open to try out. There's no restrictions as long as
you meet the minimum requirements.
Speaker 1 (29:19):
I like it, man, I wish. I wish this is
around one.
Speaker 4 (29:21):
That's what I'm saying. Like they didn't playing video games,
I could have got a scholarship.
Speaker 1 (29:26):
Save all that money.
Speaker 4 (29:31):
Jonathan uh We talked, we jumped right into the right
into two K. But are you watching? Are you sticking
with the NBA playoffs?
Speaker 5 (29:39):
Of course, but I'm like, rafa, you know those ten
o'clock games. I was falling asleep at halftime, So I'm.
Speaker 1 (29:43):
Like, hard did you learn that the year of the pandemic?
After after that season when we started on Christmas that
we weren't traveling and that West Coast trip and walking
out of the fieldhouse at two in the morning, I
was like, you appreciate the fan, yeah, the list and
or watch the game because those are hard.
Speaker 4 (30:02):
Yeah, those are not easy. And what did you think
of the lottery?
Speaker 5 (30:06):
I mean, you know, Wemby, I don't even know what
to say. In addition to what's already been said. You know,
we've been sitting here talking about video games for a while,
which is apropos because.
Speaker 2 (30:15):
He someone made a comment.
Speaker 5 (30:17):
I think Steph made a comment, So curry about how
he's like if someone made a two K player, it's
true because you know, again, my nine year old Grant
and we're watching highlights and he was like, wait, he's
seven five, never seen anything like that. So now that
we know where where he'll be going, uh, you know,
I'll be circling that date from the Spurs when they visit.
Speaker 2 (30:33):
I'll be sure in the building.
Speaker 4 (30:34):
I'm glad he went to the Spurs.
Speaker 1 (30:36):
I'm not why you could have We could have been
on the draft that year when he came out.
Speaker 4 (30:41):
Well, I mean he wasn't coming to us, So of
all the teams, of all the possibilities, he's.
Speaker 1 (30:46):
Amazing how he would have had the number one pick.
The last three times at are a top not center
right at the time. Man's Robinson what's his name?
Speaker 4 (30:59):
Tim on him, Duncan, what's his name?
Speaker 1 (31:02):
Power Center? Yeah?
Speaker 4 (31:05):
And Wemby Yeah. So I'm happy. I'm really happy, and
it's gonna be good pop having him.
Speaker 1 (31:10):
I think that he posted a picture when he was
like twelve or ten years old with a with a
with a Tony Parker Jersey.
Speaker 4 (31:16):
Oh really okay, very cool. And then have you seen
the Lakers Nuggets? I don't know if you watched Game one?
I have you made it?
Speaker 5 (31:22):
And when we talk about video games, you look like
Fox score it. You'll get your stat line and it's
just like you made up that stat line in a
two K game. I don't even know what to say
about that guy.
Speaker 4 (31:30):
Yeah. I was trying to explain to our Roady Nicole,
by the way, you have a super cool title, but
you don't have a Roady. We do we have al
ready for the show to even though we're Roady's for
feedoor and and then but last night I just thought, uh,
adjustments from one game to the next. I think putting
(31:51):
Hachamura on joke, it's really made a difference.
Speaker 1 (31:54):
I think you're going to see that they didn't. But
everybody's saying that that's the that's the solution, and that's
the thing that they're going to adjust to that. Especially
Jokis himself, he just didn't they were They had a
couple of turnovers. But I think he's on a mission.
He's on a mission to that that MVP that was
taken from him by by every single by every single
(32:15):
X player in the media that campaigned for m BIT
to get it. And and I think it's going to
be an interesting series because obviously now you get adjustment made.
But to me, people saying like Kendrick Perkins, who I love,
saying that the Lakers should be happy or should be
you know, okay with the way they were. They had
the best game from Anthony Davis, a very good game
(32:37):
from Lebrown, a really good game from Rees, and the
problem was they gave up one hundred and thirty six points,
you know, so defensively, the Nugget didn't play the good
defense either. But Jokis and Morriment, they're for real exactly.
Speaker 4 (32:50):
So Jonathan season starts made twenty third.
Speaker 5 (32:55):
Correct, Yeah, five five starts made twenty third, So yeah,
all things at Cavs Lead and GC, Twitter, Instagram and
you know, we we're doing well, but we hope to
close it out of the championship in five y five
this year.
Speaker 4 (33:05):
Who's who you're taking on the first game?
Speaker 5 (33:08):
Our first game is still to be scheduled, so they're
sorting out the schedule for the back half of the year.
Speaker 2 (33:13):
But regardless, you know, our guys are on a little
bit of a buy right now.
Speaker 5 (33:15):
They're actually getting back to Cleveland today and tomorrow, so
it'll be nice to get them back and have a
refresh for the second half of the season.
Speaker 4 (33:21):
I got to say also, I love artwork, team artwork, uniforms,
things like that. Legion has great has a great look,
but also the entire league has I'd say that the artwork,
the logos, everything, it's a cool looking you know.
Speaker 5 (33:39):
Similar you know, the G League, many listeners probably know,
has been a testing ground from many years for the NBA,
whether it's using Twitch or rules on free throws, things
at nature, and you take that a step further even
to the two K League, where it's been a testing
ground for things like that and artwork and logos and
creative and music and personalities that we've seen go from
the two K League to then participate.
Speaker 2 (33:59):
In the g leeague or the NBA side as well.
Speaker 5 (34:01):
So it's very cutting edge, and it has to be
in many ways because that's what esports and gaming is.
Speaker 4 (34:05):
So are their rivalries? Are they rival rivalries?
Speaker 2 (34:11):
There are rivalries?
Speaker 1 (34:12):
Yes, do we have one?
Speaker 5 (34:15):
Well yes, I mean I wouldn't say we have any
one in particular. What I would say is, you know,
we are one organization at the end of the day.
So what our rivals on the NBA floor would be,
we we carry those over into the two K league.
Speaker 4 (34:26):
Oh O, get good?
Speaker 1 (34:27):
What about what about players that have been traded from here?
Do they want to when they play when they play
against the legion?
Speaker 2 (34:35):
You know what that happens. But we got guys in
our team who we traded for from other teams that
want to.
Speaker 5 (34:40):
So again, this is real life, this is sports. It's
no different than anything else. You know, I would encourage
the two of you guys and others as well. You know,
come here on a game night, eight nine o'clock at night.
The guys are playing some music, they're in their element,
and they're they're playing versus the other team. That's also
another great experience to check out because it's really, really
intense and fun and these guys are the best, the best,
so we'll see what happens.
Speaker 4 (35:02):
So on a game night you can come here and
kind of watch them.
Speaker 2 (35:04):
Well not anyone listening can just know. It's not open
to the public, right, but we could. But yeah, but
you guys, you know obviously your VIPs.
Speaker 4 (35:10):
Okay, right the Spanish.
Speaker 1 (35:15):
I would love to that's my dream, like that happened.
Do it on twitch.
Speaker 4 (35:20):
Hey, Jonathan, we're going to wrap up here. We have
to say some thank yous. Can you stick around for
thank you? As you can see, this is a huge production,
so it takes a lot of people to get this done.
We have to we have to think even though we
didn't have a guest, even though we didn't have a
player guest on this week, we have to always thank
the PR department. Yes, we always have to thank bj
Evans who runs the department with the iron fist. As
(35:41):
you know. I mean, it really comes down Cherome making
the guys. I missed. I means Cherome guy. And what
is this sling in? Samy miss slinging Sammy and and
Devin Bookerk of the Year the Year Devin Booker, who
who had a late Surge and one Rookie of the year,
Boo Banks. Do you know Boo Banks?
Speaker 1 (36:00):
Of course?
Speaker 4 (36:00):
Okay Boom. Has Boom moved up to a position where
she can start yelling at you or not?
Speaker 1 (36:05):
She's always been in a partici.
Speaker 4 (36:09):
We have to thank our special guest, Jonathan Summers. Jonathan,
thank you for coming on and thank you for hosting
us at the Layer. Man, this it is really cool.
It's really a cool play. You wish you lived in
a layer.
Speaker 1 (36:20):
Yeah, although I was thinking, I don't think I don't
think the Legion GC would have won taken me on
the road at eighteen.
Speaker 4 (36:27):
Oh my god, you'd lead the league in suspensions. Could
be one of those guys. Jonathan was kindly cracking down on.
We have to thank Joe Fritchan. Do you know Joe?
Of course, Joe's the greatest man. He is the man.
I love you, Joe. Lucy veris the best female human
in Cleveland. We have to qualify that. We have to
call it Lucy is the best. A fact, Lucy right
now is.
Speaker 1 (36:47):
Out actually heading on what you see.
Speaker 4 (36:49):
Yes, she's doing tree planting trees. Lucy's doing. Everybody else
is sitting around jerking around at their desk, and Lucy's
out planting trees. So Lucy is the best and we
all only say the best female human because the best
male human in Cleveland maybe anywhere the guy that now
you can see Jonathan, the guy that does all the
hard work around.
Speaker 1 (37:08):
Jonathan knows who you're talking about.
Speaker 4 (37:10):
D Mac. Right, you're going to thank him in the
off season.
Speaker 1 (37:16):
Even in the off season.
Speaker 4 (37:18):
D mac never rests. Man, He's like the post office.
He's going all the time. And then we had the thing,
of course, the dynamic duo, yes of Dirty Kurt and
the Bedet King in the pickleball.
Speaker 1 (37:29):
King to be damn man, what is it called them?
Pillow They guy might might.
Speaker 4 (37:32):
Be like today guy. And also he's a great pickupball player.
Marty Allen. Do you know Marty Allen? You do not.
Speaker 1 (37:38):
You don't know Big Daddy.
Speaker 4 (37:39):
You need to get to know Big Daddy. That's yeah,
because we were talking earlier about that there's a pickleball
league now, right, yeah, and didn't Kevin yeah, Kevin, Yeah,
I think Marty should be a draft pick. Marty should
be like the number one pick.
Speaker 1 (37:53):
The only thing is that Marty plays with people that
are it's eighty and over. That's why he's.
Speaker 4 (37:58):
Yeah, he's he's there's no one player. He's in the
eighty five U League. Hey, we'll be back. We're on
a Cadence style raph. I don't guess we'll be back
in the layer, but we will be back soon. And
as always, good night, Freddy Mac.
Speaker 1 (38:14):
Wherever you are now else is back Jr Fires j
R Smifthony. You're listening to Wine and Gold Radio, Price
right Wing the Hot Rock Right Wright Cocko, Miles Garrett,
(38:36):
What in the woe mouse got it? Who are you you? America?
Speaker 2 (38:43):
Surprise, Surprise, Surprise, sod.
Speaker 1 (38:46):
Hala down Rhining Go Radio
First we take a good record.
Speaker 2 (00:03):
Then we have a super sound.
Speaker 3 (00:04):
DJ makes it with enthusiasm, and that's the supersund to day.
Speaker 2 (00:27):
Recount of my Steven sixty seconds ago, out comes Garland.
Speaker 1 (00:30):
Garland looking for an opening.
Speaker 4 (00:32):
Gama Lane clotes it score. It's a wonderful tess a game.
Speaker 1 (00:37):
Whoa wow. Well that's what we have here.
Speaker 3 (00:40):
Broadcasting live is from Rocket Mortgage field House on the
sunny shores of beautiful Lake Erie.
Speaker 1 (00:49):
I look up with your quarter the ride about a
part crown. My honor knows you don't leave it better
than me that.
Speaker 3 (01:01):
In downtown Cleanland. You tuned in to Wine and Gold Radio.
Now you're your host Rafa and Joji no.
Speaker 4 (01:17):
Ya Hey, yeahybody, and welcome to the first off season
episode of Wine and Gold Radio. I like it that
we're keeping up a caden. We are keeping the cane
season caten. I know, I know, it's it's kind of good.
I mean, and I have to say, I was thinking
about this on the way down here. I miss you.
I do because like I'm so used to seeing you. Mean,
(01:39):
we sit on the plane together, we eat dinner together,
we do everything together. And then all of a sudden,
when the season ends, It's just over and I'm lonely.
Speaker 1 (01:46):
It takes me a while to what just my life
from going from sixty to zero. Right, It takes me
like a two to three games to watch where actually
not studying or recording anything. I'm just enjoying basketball and
sports by itself, like just without having to worry about anything.
But the hardest part for me is the morning. Well,
I don't have to start, I don't have to read,
(02:07):
I don't have to take notes, I don't have to
make sure I have everything ready for my broadcast. So
it takes me a little while. I enjoy it, but
it takes me a little while to get used to
that sixty two zeros.
Speaker 4 (02:17):
I know, I know, I wake up and do three
keys for the for the other player, the other player.
So you're not one of those guys who because the
calves are out the playoffs, that you stop watching playoffs
and just turn off the NBA told it.
Speaker 1 (02:31):
I wish I could, but I just automatically drove by.
The TV just drags me into watching. I know I
have I have to tell you that I do enjoy
the eight thirty starts for me just coach team that
the nine thirty ten o'clock. I was watching halftime. I
was watching up till halftime, going to bed.
Speaker 4 (02:46):
Yeah, eight thirty.
Speaker 1 (02:47):
That's how little I care when it comes to like
midnight and watching a basketball game.
Speaker 4 (02:51):
No, it's perfect right now, eight thirty is the perfect time.
Speaker 1 (02:54):
It's it's and they moved the finals up too, by
the way, it's going to be yet they moved them
back a half hour to the eight thirty.
Speaker 4 (03:01):
That's good. That's good because kids too. Man, you want
kids to be able to watch, and you want to
be able to stay up and watch the whole thing.
Let's before instead of jerking around talking because I do
want to talk to some NBA hoops, Let's welcome in
our guest Power guests. Our power guest are very be spent.
Speaker 1 (03:17):
Only one.
Speaker 4 (03:18):
You know, Jonathan as If you've ever listened to the show,
you know that I don't know anybody's title in the
whole company. I know that I am the b writer
and he is the Spanish radio Okay, promoted to Senior
Spanish play. Jonathan Summers, you're head of the Legion, the
(03:39):
Digion Gaming, Legion Gaming. But you explain your title and
what you do because I'll screw it up.
Speaker 2 (03:46):
Yeah, no, absolutely, so thank you guys for having me.
Speaker 5 (03:48):
I'm our vice president of esports Operations in Caves Legion GC,
and in short, Calves Legion GC. Calves Legion Gaming Club
is our fourth professional sports franchise under our umbrella here
in Cleveland. And most of your listners obviously know about
the Calves, and I'm sure they know about the Monsters
and the Cleveland Charge. But in addition, we own and
operate Calves Legion Gaming Club, which is a professional esports
organization that participates in the NBA two K leave.
Speaker 1 (04:11):
I have to tell you I've been here. I just
finished my ninth season, which is unbelievable. That is when
you are with the Legions.
Speaker 5 (04:17):
Usits well the Legion. We're in the middle of season six.
I've been at the Calves. That was my seventh.
Speaker 1 (04:22):
We just so But to me when this started, it
was just so intriguing because I'm still from the generation
that put a quarter in the machine and got three
lives put Donkey Kong Junior or whatever it was. I
never saw anything beyond that, so I really wasn't triggued
and got interested in the whole operation that we have
going on. As usual at a top notch operation. But
(04:44):
how did this start and how how has the game
or the league changed in the six years.
Speaker 5 (04:50):
Yeah, well it started six years ago when the NBA
was really the first North American sports professional organization league
to recognize this growth of gaming in esports that is
so prevalent, which we could talk about for hours, and
in turn created the NBA two K League. So the
NBA two K League, as I reference, you know, the
Kavslegian GC being our fourth franchise, the NBA two K
League is the fourth league of the NBA. Because most
(05:11):
listeners know obviously of the NBA and the WNBA and
the g League. Well there's the NBA two K League
as well, And this is this is the real deal.
And Adam Silver's out greeting the number one pick at
the draft at MSG Barclays. Games are competed live on stage.
You know, we're competing against other NBA franchises, which we'll
get into, but in short, really it was the foresight
(05:32):
of the NBA to see, you know, the expression is
always you know, skates where the puck is going? Now
where the puck is And I think the NBA got
ahead of it by creating the NBA two K League,
and we were proud to be one of the first
founding teams to within the NBA to join.
Speaker 4 (05:44):
Are other sports league is going to eventually? Yes and no.
Speaker 5 (05:47):
You know, sports is so different from non sports e
sports titles. You know, when you think about the most
popular football game is Madden, which is one player controlling
eleven players on a football field, or MLB is most
popular baseball game, which is one player controlling all nine
baseball players.
Speaker 2 (06:03):
With us, it's different.
Speaker 5 (06:03):
It's five on five, So every player on our team
is controlling an arch type you know, player within the game.
And so because of that, the strategies involved, there's such
a different beast being five on five. And also NBA
two K is the number one sports game in North America,
right above FIFA Sports Actually, so I think that the
popularity of basketball, especially amongst the youth, the popularity of
two K I think sets it apart from other sports
(06:26):
leagues replicating.
Speaker 1 (06:27):
And I would say when you say popularity is like
the global popularity right, because I mean when you talk
about mann and is a very popular video game, but
I would imagine most of the popularity comes from the United.
Speaker 5 (06:37):
States, yeah, there's about ten million people playing in the
United States of NBA two K. Ten million copies are sold.
Excuse me, but when then when you look at Asia,
I mean the amount of people. You have tens of
millions of people playing, you know, every single month, So
you know, esports as a whole is a larger conversation
obviously than two K. NBA two K is one game
within the grand universe, and that actually parlays into what
we're trying to do at our organization, which is really
(06:59):
touch and be able to work within the larger esports landscape,
not just two K, even though that's our focus.
Speaker 4 (07:05):
When we got here, you were talking about dealing with
trade requests and things like that. Real man, right, So
I guess that's good kind of my next thing. And
you talked about the number one pick, Adam Silver, greeting him.
So as far as player levels go, you have to
deal with your kind of the front office guy. You
have to deal with the players.
Speaker 5 (07:26):
Well, you know, I tell people all the time who
are as unfamiliar with the two K league. Imagine if
after the game, you know, Darius and Evan walked back
to their apartment and shared it to bedroom apartment.
Speaker 1 (07:36):
With one another.
Speaker 2 (07:36):
Right, that's just like you laugh, right, because that's like
crazy to think about.
Speaker 5 (07:39):
But that's our world. You know, our guys there here
in Cleveland six months a year. You basically try out
to be in the league online, there's the draft and
then we get our guys from all over the US
and Canada. We have three of our five guys are
currently from Toronto as we speak, and so we bring
them to Cleveland. We put them in apartments together, and
they actually live in the same complex, the main building as.
Speaker 2 (07:58):
Our g league plays the charge players do.
Speaker 5 (08:01):
And you know, it's the real world meets the NBA.
And so yeah to what you were saying, you know,
over the six years, there's trade requests and suspensions or fines.
I mean, whatever you can think of has happened because
you know, that's that's the way of professional sports nowadays.
Speaker 2 (08:15):
So sports is no different.
Speaker 4 (08:16):
I gotta know, what does a guy have to do
to get to earn a suspension or fine?
Speaker 5 (08:20):
Well, you know, just I'd say step outside the lines
of what Rock Entertainment Group would or the NBA two
K League would would authorize. You know, I'm not going
to get in any specifics. I think we all know
the dudes and does.
Speaker 1 (08:30):
But I would imagine since you're dealing with much younger,
younger than the three of us, Younger than the three
of us, of course, and in average, I guess you
know the game, but I would imagine because I get
in trouble at fifty six. You know, social media and
all that. These guys live in the.
Speaker 2 (08:46):
World, they live it.
Speaker 5 (08:47):
Yeah, you have to be eighteen to be in the league,
and the average ages between about eighteen to twenty four.
I'd say, while they're having players older than that, and
we currently have players older than that. Yeah, it's a
young man's game. As we say, I mean, you kind
of age out and retire by your mid twenties. So
we are dealing with the younger side of the young
professionals and a lot of individ You know, Look, this
is not the NBA or the NHL, where you practice
and train for years and years and you go up
(09:09):
through the ranks and through the ranks. These are kids
who were playing at home six months ago. They try out,
that made the league, and next thing you know, they're
on a plane to Cleveland. So there's no ramping up
period for them, and it's beholden on us to really
get them.
Speaker 2 (09:19):
Equipped to be a PF. Was the average age between
eighteen to twenty three?
Speaker 1 (09:23):
What were you making at twenty at twenty at twenty
years old?
Speaker 4 (09:27):
Oh, I got I don't know.
Speaker 1 (09:30):
Nothing, and what.
Speaker 4 (09:34):
The player?
Speaker 5 (09:34):
Yeah, So the players in the NBA two K League
signed six month contracts and they become actual employees of
the NBA, so they get health coverage and benefits as
if they were an NBA League employee in New York.
Speaker 2 (09:44):
They then get housing.
Speaker 5 (09:45):
We're responsible for their housing, as I mentioned, we put
them up here in Cleveland, and then they earn a
salary for those six months, which is a conservative salary.
And then there's prize money, which is really the big
carrot at the end of the day. So this season,
there's two and a half million dollars available spread route
six tournaments, and so there was six hundred thousand available
for the last tournament of the three on three playoffs.
(10:06):
So these guys can be walking home, you know, if
they perform well and play well for six months of service,
you know, potentially with six figures if they play well
on the court, which is not a bad living, you know.
Speaker 4 (10:15):
And I want to go back to the draft pick.
You said, the kids got drafted, how do they get
where do they get drafted from? And you talk to
We're going to bounce around a little bit, but we
talked about Cleveland State, your partnership with cleven State. And
again I learned just today that colleges are now having
varsity programs and there's the possibility of earning a scholarship
for gaming. This is crazy to me because I'm like
(10:37):
Rafa man, my last video experience was tech Mobile.
Speaker 5 (10:39):
Yeah, you know, right, yeah, you know, you guys are
ahead of your time. I guess to your point on
the league, everything as you would imagine, it's a digital league.
Everything is digital, right, So you try out from home
and you go into basically a virtual combine. So the
best players all go into a virtual court together, they
play each other and I we are team.
Speaker 2 (10:58):
We watch, we scout at the stats, We.
Speaker 5 (11:00):
Get these guys phone numbers, we call, we interview them.
We have a director of you know, BASTA Operations, guy
Leading who's our GM and coach, former player in the league,
Joela Zu. So I'm not going to take you know,
the credit for that, but you know it's this community
is a very tight, close knit community. Everybody knows who
the next players are and who the sixteen year old
from Toronto is, and there's a seventeen year old in
LA who's gonna be eligible for the league next year.
Speaker 2 (11:21):
It's that kind of tight knit community. So it really
is wild.
Speaker 5 (11:24):
But yeah, I mean to and to your latter point
on the larger esports landscape. You know, as I reference
NBA two K is one game, but I'm sure listeners
know of or have heard of a lot of other
titles out there, Rocket League, over Watch, League of Legends
for Atnite, and so on and so forth. So you know,
we organizationally, you know, have a relationship or connected to
one hundred Thieves, which is one of the largest esports
organizations the United States. They're based out of Los Angeles
(11:46):
and they compete at that Tier one level. But to
your point, it goes all the way from that in
LA at a huge compound in Los Angeles, down to
you know, high schools and college relationships. Here in Cleveland,
we are partnered with Cleveland State who recently elevated their
program from an esports club to an esports varsity program,
so you can now be a student athlete at Cleveland
(12:07):
State and our facility which we're currently sitting in. By
the way, I don't think we've even mentioned the Calves
Legion Layer lit by TCP where in our home esports
facility is their home esports facility as well, So you
could come here on most days, well, don't come here,
but if you were to come here, you would see,
you know, our Calves Legion guys, you know, scrimmaging and
watching film. And then right next to them is you know,
the Rocket League team from Cleveland State doing the same thing.
(12:29):
So the growth of esports and gaming locally continues to grow.
Speaker 1 (12:33):
So to that point, like you know the draft is coming, now,
do you have guys in the league that you are
known for shooting and another one that are known for
the good defenders? I see the boards here at the
layer sometimes before when he started how it's.
Speaker 2 (12:47):
Like, don't tweet those don't tweet those images? Yes, right,
Look it's five on five.
Speaker 5 (12:53):
And just to provide more clarity that it is point
guard through center, so you have to have a point guard,
shooting guard, et cetera, and their standard arch types. So
if your say Joe's the point guard, all right, Joe,
you are fifty different type of point guards you can
choose from. It could be a Darius out a Garland
type of point guard. It can be Jalen Brunson type
of point guard. There's fifty arc types save with the
shooting guard and so on and so forth. So because
(13:13):
of that, there's it's like a chess match. There's a
lot of strategy. Oh well, maybe we're playing Toronto Raptors uprising.
You know their team and they're known because their center
is a Porzingis type, so we want a stretch five
to match it. So there's a lot of mixing and
matching of the arc types. But also, as I mentioned,
because you move your individual player, you have to run plays.
Speaker 2 (13:32):
I mean, think about it.
Speaker 5 (13:33):
So you know, a former coach of ours, Austin Peterson,
who's currently been a charge coach, is now at cassistant coach.
Speaker 2 (13:39):
He was a coach of Ours for Cavs.
Speaker 5 (13:40):
Lenior for a while to the point where we were
running the same sets and x's and o's as the
guys were at the fieldhouse on the floor. Because it's
the same strategy at the end of the day. So
it really differentiates itself from other sports titles in.
Speaker 4 (13:52):
That way, is there a dominant team and what makes
them dominant? Or and or is there a domin player?
Is there a joke kitch? Is there a top player
in the league?
Speaker 2 (14:05):
Yeah, I get that question a lot.
Speaker 5 (14:07):
I would say, you know, obviously we have to give
credits to the teams that have done well and the
past champions of the league. You know, the two time
champion Washington Wizards, District Gaming obviously deserves a lot of credit.
And what makes them a lot of things? I think
you know their organizational commitment. You know, from from ownership
all the way down, you know who they are, all
well invested, well interested. It's a big commitment of ours
to the point where they have a facility called District E.
(14:29):
We're currently sitting in our Cavs Lesion Layer LIPATISP which
is our esports facility. They recently unveiled THEIRS, which is
attached to Capital One Arena where the Wizards play. Of course,
so I would say that just organizational commitment, staffing knowledge,
know how you know, it helps to get some great players.
They had the number one pick a few years back
and drafted a great, great kid.
Speaker 2 (14:48):
Who led them to a couple of titles as well.
Speaker 5 (14:51):
So you know you can just as we saw what
last night with the NBA lottery, sometimes you strike gold
on a number one pick and that can carry you.
So we've seen that happen in the two K league.
And I think just you know, the well run organizations,
I think we all kind of know who's who's doing
it really well, and we think we're one of those,
but there are others as well.
Speaker 4 (15:07):
I want to know who the number one kid is.
Speaker 5 (15:09):
Man who in the next NBA two K lee season.
It's too hard to say. I mean as far as
who the current number one player is. You know, an
analogy I gave someone is UFC. Like in UFC, it's
a short shelf life, right, other than our guys THEIPE
who's managed to stick around for a long time, usually
it's it's quick like it's a violent support. And these guys,
these kids, they come in the league at eighteen or
(15:30):
nineteen and by twenty one, twenty two, you know.
Speaker 2 (15:33):
They could be out of the league. They could be
not at the top of their game. So look, we've had.
Speaker 5 (15:37):
Players win awards and other players who have won awards
for you know, MVPs Defensive Player of the Years, All
Stars and then a year or two later they're out
of the league. Yeah, so it takes a year round
grinding and commitment to the game because the last, you know,
piece I'll note on this front is the game changes.
So that's an important piece to note as well, which
is like, look, if you go out onto a basketball
court that hoops always ten foot, the free throw is
(15:58):
always fifteen feet, right, two K changes every year. The
game that these guys changes every year. So if you're
a point guard you're really good at shooting, the next
version two K, you know, twenty three, twenty four to
twenty five, could you know, decrease the importance of shooting
from the point guard position. It's more about can you drive?
So these guys, every year the game comes out, usually
in the fall. It's like almost the league has reinvented
(16:18):
itself every year, hence a lot of the turnover on
rosters and players coming.
Speaker 1 (16:22):
In and out.
Speaker 4 (16:23):
Does one guy play the same position all year? Your
center's your center?
Speaker 2 (16:26):
Fully? Yeah hopefully.
Speaker 5 (16:27):
Okay, We've had years where you know, a guy's got
to move from centering point guard from Wednesday to Thursday
because we got beat pretty bad, so we got to
But you know, Okay, that's happening. It's probably not the
best sign. Okay, So this year we've been fortunate. We're
having a good year thus far. We're halfway through the season.
We're currently in ninth out of the twenty five teams.
So we're going to just try to improve on what
we have.
Speaker 4 (16:46):
How much does chemistry matter?
Speaker 2 (16:48):
Everything?
Speaker 4 (16:49):
Yeah?
Speaker 2 (16:49):
Everything, I got it. Everything.
Speaker 1 (16:51):
Yeah.
Speaker 5 (16:51):
I can't even begin to describe the importance of chemistry.
For the reasons that we laid out, these guys live together,
they're away from their family and friends for six months.
I mean, that's another factors, you know, Like at the
end of the day, Darius goes home and to whomever
his family friends are that he lives with, that he
knows he will see. Whereas our players, none of them
are from Cleveland. They have no family here, they have
no friends here. So they're they're alone in a way,
(17:13):
and we have to form that bond. And if that
bond is informed, it poses a great challenge.
Speaker 4 (17:18):
It sounds like a kind of a good reality show. Actually,
at first I was thinking of Darius and like Evan
living together and how hilarious that would be. That would
be something, and then like imagine these kids. I mean
like again, because they know each other through this, then
they practice and they play together. Then they got to
go home, and I mean it's got to be Uh.
Speaker 2 (17:39):
Have you and never consider getting a two bedroom?
Speaker 4 (17:42):
No?
Speaker 1 (17:42):
Well, we actively think know each other when we're in
New York.
Speaker 4 (17:48):
You know, what I was thinking about was how great
it would have been if this would have been around
when I was a concrete state. I could have been
like a Viur city. I could have been like a
stud Well.
Speaker 1 (17:56):
My question to you regarding that is, are you surprised?
Which is the league looking expecting, like for the NC
DOUBLEA to get into this business of creating a league
of the run. But I guess the same type of players, right, So.
Speaker 5 (18:09):
I would say at both the collegiate and high school level,
it's not one governing body overseeing everything. It's kind of
the wild West, right, So you to your point of
NC Double A kind of runs college, but that's not
the way it is easy. It's more of just kind
of leagues and conferences have been formed. So for example,
we're in MAC territory here in Cleveland, so the MAC
has the e sc Esports Collegiate. It's a conference just
(18:30):
for the MAX schools plus some non Max schools esports
programs to compete. So it's separate from the MAC, it's
separate from NCAA. It's not governed the same way yet
the organization and structure is there. So will everything eventually
fall under nc double A. I'm not sure. We're definitely
not that point anytime soon. And then just locally for
folks in Ohio, you know it's OHSAA runs high school
(18:51):
sports in the state, not the case you know, necessarily
the esports more like EESO Esports Ohio and other organizations
which bring high school under their umbrella.
Speaker 1 (19:00):
And the originally asked you that is because I know
you guys are televised as well the NBA.
Speaker 5 (19:05):
Yeah, so some matches are predominantly it's digital though predominantly
you'll catch our matches on Twitch and YouTube, the two
main channels.
Speaker 1 (19:12):
But play but play guy, because I remember doing in Spanish.
Speaker 2 (19:16):
Don't know anybody, Yes, well.
Speaker 4 (19:17):
I did it.
Speaker 3 (19:18):
I did.
Speaker 1 (19:18):
I did a highlight in Spanish when you guys, when
you guys won, they had like you had like a
four point play or something to the winner was one.
Speaker 5 (19:25):
Of our most engaged social yet.
Speaker 6 (19:27):
They had they had a play that they were down
for and they stole the ball and it was one
like a real thing, like one of those one of
those Larry Johnson in My Square Garden four point play
type of thing.
Speaker 4 (19:38):
And now they just had their most recent tournament was
in DC. Correct.
Speaker 2 (19:42):
Correct.
Speaker 5 (19:43):
So the season is split into two. The first half
of the season is three on three. So it's not
what I was describing a five to five. It's more
of the what you know, a kid who plays the
retail version of the game would play with his friends
at three and three. So they did half the season
that way to really appeal more to the masses and
to the you know, retail side of who played is
the game. And now starting on the twenty third, we're
getting back to the straight five e five what we've
(20:04):
been discussing the league build, if you will, of the game.
So yeah, the second half of the season kicks off
the twenty third and concludes the beginning of August.
Speaker 2 (20:11):
Is when the finals culminated.
Speaker 1 (20:13):
Are you still hosting events here at the Layer, because
I know we used to do you know, private events
and stuff like that.
Speaker 5 (20:20):
So yeah, I mean, as we sit here in the
caves Legion Layer right by overlooking Edgewater Beach here on
the near west side of Cleveland. As mentioned, this is
a twenty six hundred square foot facility. We have twenty
six gaming stations, two soundproof streaming pods, you know, a
gig of everstream fiber, and so this place is decked out.
There really is no place like this in Northeast Ohio.
So to your point, Rafa, we realized quickly we'd be
(20:41):
remiss if we only use this for our team or state.
Hence all the other use cases. So yes, we throw
birthday parties here. We have cash tournaments, we have charity tournaments.
We've worked with Make a Wish, LGBT Center, local CMSD
school projects, field trips, and the list just goes on.
So we feel strongly and are proud of this being
really the mirror gaming and esports facility in Northeast Ohio,
(21:02):
and the use cases for it are endless. So you
can follow us on at Caves Legion GC or at
Legion Layer TCP.
Speaker 1 (21:09):
There is the Rocker Mortgage intramural like team members intramural anywhere.
Speaker 2 (21:14):
In Yeah, you know, we've had we've had some money.
Speaker 4 (21:19):
Yeah, each other man with j Mike, Yeah, we got
we got one already.
Speaker 5 (21:24):
Yeah, we've had some team member tournaments, internal team member
tournaments in might shock you to learn that a lot
of our younger entry level team members tend to do
the best.
Speaker 4 (21:32):
Yeah, you personally when you took over the legion, were
you a big gamer or did you have to kind
of learn this from.
Speaker 2 (21:41):
I learned this from scratch.
Speaker 4 (21:42):
Yeah.
Speaker 5 (21:42):
So I started with the organization October of sixteen in
a digital partnerships role from my previous life working in
digital media and partnerships for a long time. And so yeah,
the esports came six months after I started the organization,
and uh, you know, I got thrown into the mix
not knowing what the eastood for, to be honest, and
I knew nothing. And that's why I think I have
the perspective I have because I can really explain it
(22:05):
to individuals and who don't come from this world, right,
And the best way to describe it to people is
there's no barrier of entry to this And I think
that's what makes it so unique within our family of
companies as opposed to you know, say, the calves and
monsters of the charge. Because look, at the end of
the day, basketball and hockey are very appealing, but there's
always gonna be a subset of people in youth in
particular who either can't play or don't have an interest
(22:27):
in playing. But gamings for everybody, and so whether you
play Fortnite or pac Man, whether it's Rocket League or GoldenEye,
right like, we've never had anyone come in here that
did not enjoy themselves and have a good time.
Speaker 2 (22:38):
And that's gaming.
Speaker 5 (22:40):
And so a lot of what we talk about is
esports and caves leasion is esports. That's the competitive side
of gaming. That's the one percent of the pie chart.
But I think what we've recognized, you know, really quickly
here is the ninety nine percent of the pie chart
of gaming, which is what we do right that reaches everybody.
And so organizationally, it's you know, this place and what
we've done has given us that platform to reach every body.
And you know, that's half the battle is reaching folks,
(23:02):
especially kids, as we know.
Speaker 2 (23:04):
I mean I have two boys and nine and five,
and just getting their attention is half the battle. So
gaming gives us the opportunity to do that.
Speaker 4 (23:10):
Gaming is just I mean, again we talked about where
we came from, put the quarter in and tech mobile
and things like that. Gaming now is it's permeated society
and culture in that you look at the biggest show
on HBO, I think that, what is it that, oh
the Last of Us based on a video game? Super
Mario Brothers was you know, was a video game? I
(23:33):
mean like it's you know, Grand Theft Auto, Like the
music from that, I mean.
Speaker 2 (23:38):
Like permeates society and FIFA the soundtrack from that.
Speaker 4 (23:42):
It permeates society now, so everywhere.
Speaker 5 (23:44):
There's two reasons for that in my opinion. One is
because gaming is always changing, right. It's like Fortnite didn't exist,
what you know, ten fifteen years ago, right, Who knows
if it's.
Speaker 2 (23:52):
Gonna be around in ten years from now. Maybe it will,
maybe it won't.
Speaker 5 (23:55):
Basketball has always been and always will be what it is, right,
and we can tweak and make the changes to it
as we've described.
Speaker 2 (24:00):
But the sport is the sport.
Speaker 5 (24:01):
But every game is so different than the game next
to it that that's what gives it the ability to
really appeal to everyone over the masses. So yeah, I
think that, you know, it's a playground for everybody to
play and get involved.
Speaker 2 (24:13):
So we feel bullish on the growth of it moving forward.
Speaker 1 (24:16):
You mentioned the global portion of it, and correct me
if I'm wrong, But we were the first team that
had an international player.
Speaker 5 (24:23):
We were the first team that had a Spanish player. Spanish, yes, yes,
so we do participate. Yeah, Mario, ave Mario, who's our friend?
Hello Mario if you're listening over in Spain. But yeah,
it's and you know an expression I use all the
time from Daryl Morey, as we know from the seventy
six ers, the Cleveland native. He said, he said at
one point there are three global sports soccer, basketball, and esports.
(24:44):
And I always challenge people or if you can tell
me know there's like crickets not global, Baseball is not global, right,
those are three sports that are really played everywhere. So
the NB two K League is a combination of two
of those. So basketball and youth sports and gaming will
continue to grow over time. And I think as you
see more changes with the two K League in the
NBA are actually going to become closer over the next
few years and you'll see more interwoven connectivity between them.
(25:08):
And the main part of that, the reason Joe you
were touching on is look, every guy the Cavs draft
from here on out has experience in gaming and video
game Every guy either owned a PlayStation of guest By
or an Xbox ten fifteen years ago, that wasn't the case.
It was like, oh so and so on the road
as an Xbox, he's into gaming. Well, the veteran on
the team doesn't. Well, now the oldest guy in our
team is going to be a twenty seven to twenty
(25:31):
year old guy who grew up gaming. Jared Allen is
a huge gamer, Darius is a huge game and half
our team, Dylan's a huge gamer.
Speaker 2 (25:37):
So we're just gonna see more and more and more
of it. And so because of that, you're going to
see this thing grow.
Speaker 1 (25:42):
But the thing is, do you see the league expanding
a little further than what he did already with the team?
You know? I think yeah.
Speaker 2 (25:49):
So there's twenty five teams in the league.
Speaker 5 (25:51):
Twenty two of those are NBA teams, So twenty two
of the thirty NBA franchises participating in the league. There
are three non NBA teams. They all happen to be
international organization. So we have Deuce Gaming from Latin America,
who just won the three and three championship this year.
We have jen G, a very large esports organization based
out of Shanghai in Asia. And then we have OZ
Gaming from the NBL. The Australian Basketball League just entered
(26:12):
as the newest expansion team. So we have franchises in Asia,
Latin America, Australia. We've had players from Europe. I'm sure
we'll have a team from Europe. We've had tournaments that
we've held in Germany and Great Britain, in New Zealand
and Australia.
Speaker 2 (26:25):
So yeah, kids all over the world play two K.
It just makes sense.
Speaker 1 (26:28):
And I wanted to ask you this because are you
still doing the tournaments on site? Like I know everything
we used to be in New York.
Speaker 4 (26:37):
Yeah.
Speaker 5 (26:37):
Yeah, So the league this year, it's kind of central
hub is DC at the District headquarters. So the tournaments
this year are played remote. Our guys play from here
at our facility online versus Lakers Gaming, Miami, heat Check Gaming,
Pacers Gaming. If we advance out of group play in
the tournament, we then go to d C and compete
live on stage, which is an incredible, incredible atmosphere.
Speaker 1 (26:59):
I'm telling you it feels you know what it feels
like that movie Running man, Yeah.
Speaker 2 (27:08):
That's a reference.
Speaker 6 (27:08):
That's like everybody's looking at these kids are going like
looking at the screen and like I.
Speaker 4 (27:16):
Was going to ask you about the players and that
do we do anything? Is there any kind of connectivity
with the players and uh the Legiance Calves players, I should.
Speaker 2 (27:24):
Say, with Calves players and cavsations.
Speaker 1 (27:26):
Yes and no.
Speaker 5 (27:26):
I mean there you know, there are some restrictions in
place in terms of what we can and can't do,
you know, the not to get tun into the weeds
with the collective Bargaining Agreement that until as of now,
we've been operating under what's done in advance of the
two K League being introduced. So long story short is
you know I'm getting I'm speaking a lot of legalies.
But with the new CBA and with the way things
are trending, things are going to change and I think
(27:47):
you're going to see a lot of that. Whereas prior
to now we just were a little bit restricted. I
think the flood gates can open a little bit.
Speaker 4 (27:54):
And they kids, and that's what I'm saying. It might
be it's kind of cool that but your young guys
could kick their ass.
Speaker 2 (28:03):
That's the best is anytime.
Speaker 5 (28:04):
I mean you know, whether it's a collie of ours
in the office or front I know, and they're like,
oh my god, I'm so good at two K. I'm
all right, cool, and I'll set it up somewhere somehow
to play our guys. And they just leave shaking their
head because again, you know, there could even be listeners
who are listening to all this thinking this.
Speaker 2 (28:17):
Is wild, this is crazy.
Speaker 5 (28:18):
You get played to play video games. Look, whether you know,
you turn on ESPN, you see darts, you see bowling,
you see poker.
Speaker 2 (28:25):
These are the best people, of course, the best people
in the world.
Speaker 5 (28:28):
Right at the end of the day. If you're if
you do something you want to see or hear, the
best people in the world do that. And that could
be Minecraft, or it could be esports, could be botch Belt, whatever.
And these guys are the best two K players in
the entire world. And because of that, you know, this
thing continues, the game, the popularity does.
Speaker 4 (28:44):
If there's a kid out there young I shouldn't say kid,
but if there's a young person out there listening right
now and thinks, hey, I'm I'm really good and I'm
getting better, how could they? Uh, how how do try outs?
Speaker 1 (28:55):
Yeah?
Speaker 5 (28:55):
Tryouts, you know, follow along at NBA two K League
and at cavsg GC. We for example, put on a
tournament usually every February where you can potentially win the
tournament and then you gain entry into the draft automatically
just in winning that tournament.
Speaker 2 (29:08):
That's our battle for the land tournament.
Speaker 5 (29:10):
But aside from that, everything's online, like I said, and
just you know, click on some links, register and everyone's
open to try out. There's no restrictions as long as
you meet the minimum requirements.
Speaker 1 (29:19):
I like it, man, I wish. I wish this is
around one.
Speaker 4 (29:21):
That's what I'm saying. Like they didn't playing video games,
I could have got a scholarship.
Speaker 1 (29:26):
Save all that money.
Speaker 4 (29:31):
Jonathan uh We talked, we jumped right into the right
into two K. But are you watching? Are you sticking
with the NBA playoffs?
Speaker 5 (29:39):
Of course, but I'm like, rafa, you know those ten
o'clock games. I was falling asleep at halftime, So I'm.
Speaker 1 (29:43):
Like, hard did you learn that the year of the pandemic?
After after that season when we started on Christmas that
we weren't traveling and that West Coast trip and walking
out of the fieldhouse at two in the morning, I
was like, you appreciate the fan, yeah, the list and
or watch the game because those are hard.
Speaker 4 (30:02):
Yeah, those are not easy. And what did you think
of the lottery?
Speaker 5 (30:06):
I mean, you know, Wemby, I don't even know what
to say. In addition to what's already been said. You know,
we've been sitting here talking about video games for a while,
which is apropos because.
Speaker 2 (30:15):
He someone made a comment.
Speaker 5 (30:17):
I think Steph made a comment, So curry about how
he's like if someone made a two K player, it's
true because you know, again, my nine year old Grant
and we're watching highlights and he was like, wait, he's
seven five, never seen anything like that. So now that
we know where where he'll be going, uh, you know,
I'll be circling that date from the Spurs when they visit.
Speaker 2 (30:33):
I'll be sure in the building.
Speaker 4 (30:34):
I'm glad he went to the Spurs.
Speaker 1 (30:36):
I'm not why you could have We could have been
on the draft that year when he came out.
Speaker 4 (30:41):
Well, I mean he wasn't coming to us, So of
all the teams, of all the possibilities, he's.
Speaker 1 (30:46):
Amazing how he would have had the number one pick.
The last three times at are a top not center
right at the time. Man's Robinson what's his name?
Speaker 4 (30:59):
Tim on him, Duncan, what's his name?
Speaker 1 (31:02):
Power Center? Yeah?
Speaker 4 (31:05):
And Wemby Yeah. So I'm happy. I'm really happy, and
it's gonna be good pop having him.
Speaker 1 (31:10):
I think that he posted a picture when he was
like twelve or ten years old with a with a
with a Tony Parker Jersey.
Speaker 4 (31:16):
Oh really okay, very cool. And then have you seen
the Lakers Nuggets? I don't know if you watched Game one?
I have you made it?
Speaker 5 (31:22):
And when we talk about video games, you look like
Fox score it. You'll get your stat line and it's
just like you made up that stat line in a
two K game. I don't even know what to say
about that guy.
Speaker 4 (31:30):
Yeah. I was trying to explain to our Roady Nicole,
by the way, you have a super cool title, but
you don't have a Roady. We do we have al
ready for the show to even though we're Roady's for
feedoor and and then but last night I just thought, uh,
adjustments from one game to the next. I think putting
(31:51):
Hachamura on joke, it's really made a difference.
Speaker 1 (31:54):
I think you're going to see that they didn't. But
everybody's saying that that's the that's the solution, and that's
the thing that they're going to adjust to that. Especially
Jokis himself, he just didn't they were They had a
couple of turnovers. But I think he's on a mission.
He's on a mission to that that MVP that was
taken from him by by every single by every single
(32:15):
X player in the media that campaigned for m BIT
to get it. And and I think it's going to
be an interesting series because obviously now you get adjustment made.
But to me, people saying like Kendrick Perkins, who I love,
saying that the Lakers should be happy or should be
you know, okay with the way they were. They had
the best game from Anthony Davis, a very good game
(32:37):
from Lebrown, a really good game from Rees, and the
problem was they gave up one hundred and thirty six points,
you know, so defensively, the Nugget didn't play the good
defense either. But Jokis and Morriment, they're for real exactly.
Speaker 4 (32:50):
So Jonathan season starts made twenty third.
Speaker 5 (32:55):
Correct, Yeah, five five starts made twenty third, So yeah,
all things at Cavs Lead and GC, Twitter, Instagram and
you know, we we're doing well, but we hope to
close it out of the championship in five y five
this year.
Speaker 4 (33:05):
Who's who you're taking on the first game?
Speaker 5 (33:08):
Our first game is still to be scheduled, so they're
sorting out the schedule for the back half of the year.
Speaker 2 (33:13):
But regardless, you know, our guys are on a little
bit of a buy right now.
Speaker 5 (33:15):
They're actually getting back to Cleveland today and tomorrow, so
it'll be nice to get them back and have a
refresh for the second half of the season.
Speaker 4 (33:21):
I got to say also, I love artwork, team artwork, uniforms,
things like that. Legion has great has a great look,
but also the entire league has I'd say that the artwork,
the logos, everything, it's a cool looking you know.
Speaker 5 (33:39):
Similar you know, the G League, many listeners probably know,
has been a testing ground from many years for the NBA,
whether it's using Twitch or rules on free throws, things
at nature, and you take that a step further even
to the two K League, where it's been a testing
ground for things like that and artwork and logos and
creative and music and personalities that we've seen go from
the two K League to then participate.
Speaker 2 (33:59):
In the g leeague or the NBA side as well.
Speaker 5 (34:01):
So it's very cutting edge, and it has to be
in many ways because that's what esports and gaming is.
Speaker 4 (34:05):
So are their rivalries? Are they rival rivalries?
Speaker 2 (34:11):
There are rivalries?
Speaker 1 (34:12):
Yes, do we have one?
Speaker 5 (34:15):
Well yes, I mean I wouldn't say we have any
one in particular. What I would say is, you know,
we are one organization at the end of the day.
So what our rivals on the NBA floor would be,
we we carry those over into the two K league.
Speaker 4 (34:26):
Oh O, get good?
Speaker 1 (34:27):
What about what about players that have been traded from here?
Do they want to when they play when they play
against the legion?
Speaker 2 (34:35):
You know what that happens. But we got guys in
our team who we traded for from other teams that
want to.
Speaker 5 (34:40):
So again, this is real life, this is sports. It's
no different than anything else. You know, I would encourage
the two of you guys and others as well. You know,
come here on a game night, eight nine o'clock at night.
The guys are playing some music, they're in their element,
and they're they're playing versus the other team. That's also
another great experience to check out because it's really, really
intense and fun and these guys are the best, the best,
so we'll see what happens.
Speaker 4 (35:02):
So on a game night you can come here and
kind of watch them.
Speaker 2 (35:04):
Well not anyone listening can just know. It's not open
to the public, right, but we could. But yeah, but
you guys, you know obviously your VIPs.
Speaker 4 (35:10):
Okay, right the Spanish.
Speaker 1 (35:15):
I would love to that's my dream, like that happened.
Do it on twitch.
Speaker 4 (35:20):
Hey, Jonathan, we're going to wrap up here. We have
to say some thank yous. Can you stick around for
thank you? As you can see, this is a huge production,
so it takes a lot of people to get this done.
We have to we have to think even though we
didn't have a guest, even though we didn't have a
player guest on this week, we have to always thank
the PR department. Yes, we always have to thank bj
Evans who runs the department with the iron fist. As
(35:41):
you know. I mean, it really comes down Cherome making
the guys. I missed. I means Cherome guy. And what
is this sling in? Samy miss slinging Sammy and and
Devin Bookerk of the Year the Year Devin Booker, who
who had a late Surge and one Rookie of the year,
Boo Banks. Do you know Boo Banks?
Speaker 1 (36:00):
Of course?
Speaker 4 (36:00):
Okay Boom. Has Boom moved up to a position where
she can start yelling at you or not?
Speaker 1 (36:05):
She's always been in a partici.
Speaker 4 (36:09):
We have to thank our special guest, Jonathan Summers. Jonathan,
thank you for coming on and thank you for hosting
us at the Layer. Man, this it is really cool.
It's really a cool play. You wish you lived in
a layer.
Speaker 1 (36:20):
Yeah, although I was thinking, I don't think I don't
think the Legion GC would have won taken me on
the road at eighteen.
Speaker 4 (36:27):
Oh my god, you'd lead the league in suspensions. Could
be one of those guys. Jonathan was kindly cracking down on.
We have to thank Joe Fritchan. Do you know Joe?
Of course, Joe's the greatest man. He is the man.
I love you, Joe. Lucy veris the best female human
in Cleveland. We have to qualify that. We have to
call it Lucy is the best. A fact, Lucy right
now is.
Speaker 1 (36:47):
Out actually heading on what you see.
Speaker 4 (36:49):
Yes, she's doing tree planting trees. Lucy's doing. Everybody else
is sitting around jerking around at their desk, and Lucy's
out planting trees. So Lucy is the best and we
all only say the best female human because the best
male human in Cleveland maybe anywhere the guy that now
you can see Jonathan, the guy that does all the
hard work around.
Speaker 1 (37:08):
Jonathan knows who you're talking about.
Speaker 4 (37:10):
D Mac. Right, you're going to thank him in the
off season.
Speaker 1 (37:16):
Even in the off season.
Speaker 4 (37:18):
D mac never rests. Man, He's like the post office.
He's going all the time. And then we had the thing,
of course, the dynamic duo, yes of Dirty Kurt and
the Bedet King in the pickleball.
Speaker 1 (37:29):
King to be damn man, what is it called them?
Pillow They guy might might.
Speaker 4 (37:32):
Be like today guy. And also he's a great pickupball player.
Marty Allen. Do you know Marty Allen? You do not.
Speaker 1 (37:38):
You don't know Big Daddy.
Speaker 4 (37:39):
You need to get to know Big Daddy. That's yeah,
because we were talking earlier about that there's a pickleball
league now, right, yeah, and didn't Kevin yeah, Kevin, Yeah,
I think Marty should be a draft pick. Marty should
be like the number one pick.
Speaker 1 (37:53):
The only thing is that Marty plays with people that
are it's eighty and over. That's why he's.
Speaker 4 (37:58):
Yeah, he's he's there's no one player. He's in the
eighty five U League. Hey, we'll be back. We're on
a Cadence style raph. I don't guess we'll be back
in the layer, but we will be back soon. And
as always, good night, Freddy Mac.
Speaker 1 (38:14):
Wherever you are now else is back Jr Fires j
R Smifthony. You're listening to Wine and Gold Radio, Price
right Wing the Hot Rock Right Wright Cocko, Miles Garrett,
(38:36):
What in the woe mouse got it? Who are you you? America?
Speaker 2 (38:43):
Surprise, Surprise, Surprise, sod.
Speaker 1 (38:46):
Hala down Rhining Go Radio
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