Flip The Tables! Oscars; Retail Blackout; A Brown Boost First

The Brown Table is BACK with all the tea! Mandi, Yanely, and Chris break down the Oscar highlights, Women's History Month, Bloody Sunday's 60th anniversary, the Retail Boycott, and a special first-time Brown Boost interview with Alencia Johnson, author of Flip The Tables: The Everyday Disruptor's Guide to Finding Courage and Making Change.

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Episode Transcript

Speaker 1 (00:00):
I'm talking right here. This is not loud.

Speaker 2 (00:02):
No, you have to really talk into it.

Speaker 1 (00:04):
All right, So what about this, I'm getting it high
right there. I heard the dial.

Speaker 2 (00:10):
You just listened. The first time you got me asked,
I think that was four times we asked.

Speaker 1 (00:16):
But then he was like, oh yeah, he sounds good.
But then like on my side, I can see that
my volume is too high.

Speaker 2 (00:21):
On Women's History month, listen to women.

Speaker 1 (00:24):
I'm telling you my volume is too high. When you
when you listen to the recording, it's gonna be bad.

Speaker 2 (00:29):
It's gonna sound you don't not listen to a woman
on March third. You know we're three days in.

Speaker 1 (00:36):
Don't start already.

Speaker 2 (00:38):
I'm starting. I'm starting.

Speaker 3 (00:46):
I won't make you all jealous.

Speaker 2 (00:47):
No, it's beautiful. She looks out and use the ocean.
You probably do too, Chris.

Speaker 1 (00:53):
Actually, yeah, she's not too far. I mean, I can't walk,
but it's out there.

Speaker 2 (00:58):
It's out there. Ella, Welcome to another episode of Brown Ambition.
Be a faan. How are y'all doing?

Speaker 4 (01:07):
Wooo?

Speaker 3 (01:07):
I'm doing all right. I feel like March just like
snuck up like it was it was just January and
then now all of a sudden. You know, February always
lies by because it's short, but then March is like
just here out of nowhere, and I'm.

Speaker 2 (01:21):
Not right, is it? Is it going to be a
stressful month for you? I love March.

Speaker 3 (01:26):
I just travel a lot in March because it's like
the last few weeks of like active legislative sessions and differ.
So when I'm doing that work, I have to like
hurry up and squeeze in a testimony at some hearings
here or this.

Speaker 2 (01:39):
Do you get nervous? I mean, testifying in front of
mini congresses is not something that people do like once
in their life, let alone as part of their job
all the time.

Speaker 3 (01:48):
No, you know, it's funny. I actually have a video
on my phone is so embarrassing of the first testimony
I ever provided. It was virtual during COVID, and I
was shaking, like you can literally see me shaking. And
then at the end when I turn off my video
to record myself, I was like trying to breathe because
I was so That's how nervous I was. It was
the first time I had ever testified. I didn't know,

(02:10):
you know, what to expect or how I was gonna
go but by now I've done it probably dozens of times,
so I'm like, oh, okay, yeah, another one of these.

Speaker 1 (02:17):
I can't wait till we can all vote for you.

Speaker 3 (02:19):
Oh no, no, we're not doing that.

Speaker 4 (02:22):
You know.

Speaker 2 (02:22):
It's funny.

Speaker 3 (02:23):
I always when I was growing up, I always thought like, oh,
maybe I'll do local politics, And now that I work
in local politics or like adjacent to it, man, it's
like when you see how the sausage gets made, right
is that the phrase? Yeah, you like know the inner workings,
And it's so fin petty, like everybody is petty LaBelle.
It's so annoying. You cannot deal with a person who's

(02:46):
not having ulterior motives or some other motivation or some
selfish thing or some other agenda. It's like, bro, are
we here for what we're here for? But the issue
is at hand or always some type of high school drama.
This person didn't vote for my last bill, so I
don't care if I like this bill, I'm not gonna
vote for it just out of fight. And it's like
that kind of stuff is so incessant. I'm like, no, no, no,
I can't be involved in this mess.

Speaker 2 (03:08):
Well, good to know that the lower levels are just
like the White House. I'm sorry, sorry, I'm not here
to provide any top of hope. No, we're getting some hope.
The hope is that you can relate that back to
us so that we don't stop the good work that
we're doing here. And we understand and they get they
do it for like no pay too. That's why you
got to be a gajillionaire to afford to be a

(03:29):
congress person or a lawmaker.

Speaker 3 (03:31):
That is the sad truth. But at the end of
the day, they do have a lot of power and
it is on us to hold them accountable. Yes, you know,
we vote for them. Both elections are the most important
and at the end of the day, their email addresses
and their Twitter accounts are there.

Speaker 2 (03:43):
She is there, she is she found the brown ambition inside.

Speaker 3 (03:48):
Yes, always, it's just that it's not going to be
mess but you know somebody.

Speaker 2 (03:51):
Else, Yes, absolutely, yeah, I mean While on a brighter note,
this morning on YouTube, I did get to watch the
beginning of the Oscars. Well, I missed my girl Cynthia
and Ariana Grande did like the prettiest opening, I mean,
the most exquisite. Have y'all watched it yet?

Speaker 1 (04:13):
I missed it. I did watch the Oscars, but I
came in a little late.

Speaker 2 (04:17):
Oh man, you really did. You gotta go back and
watch it.

Speaker 3 (04:20):
Watch it.

Speaker 4 (04:21):
They killed it.

Speaker 3 (04:21):
I mean Cynthia of course obviously did the did her thing,
but Ariana too. I mean they just it was beautiful.

Speaker 2 (04:25):
I mean like the Internet ruined it. They like spoiled
it for me. By the time I watched it, I
knew what was coming. But if I had been caught
off guard and Cynthia came out singing home from the Whiz,
I would have.

Speaker 1 (04:36):
Been kr I was gonna say, Queen Latifa did a
great tribute to the Whiz for the Quincy Jones I heard.

Speaker 2 (04:43):
She did move on down the Road. I haven't watched
that yet.

Speaker 3 (04:47):
That's awesome little shorts from it.

Speaker 2 (04:50):
I'm glad Queen still out here, just in all the categories.
Yan Ellie, our girls, Zoey South. I can claim her
as my girl because you know, I'm raising Dominican boys.
But her speech was so well, how did you feel?

Speaker 3 (05:08):
I'm so glad that she said that, And her passion
is just so palpable, like when she's Meeks, it's so
she's fired up. It's like you can tell. It's so authentic,
right and she I mean, it's been a long time
coming for her.

Speaker 2 (05:20):
She's so talented way back.

Speaker 3 (05:22):
But also I mean major films that a lot of
technical awards were granted for were given out for, but
never like her acting like Avatar. I mean obviously people
know from Avatar, but like this was just I mean,
she put everything into it. The fact that she spoke
in Spanish and said that and made the you know,
ow to her grandparents and to the immigrant struggle. I'm
so glad she said all the things that she said

(05:42):
because we were all so here for it. And she's, yeah,
the first Dominican actress to receive an Oscar Award, and
that's true for any award of cross, like any producer
and other awards that which is sad but also just
incredible that she had that ability to go up there
and represent in that way. But yeah, it was beautiful,
beautiful moment. We love her, We stand zone.

Speaker 1 (06:03):
She was the best thing about that movie About a
Million Birds. She carried that movie.

Speaker 2 (06:08):
Another highlight back to Wicked. Paul Tazewell, the costume designers,
first black man to ever win in that and.

Speaker 3 (06:19):
He said it when he won his award.

Speaker 2 (06:20):
Yes, let him know.

Speaker 3 (06:22):
Let him know.

Speaker 2 (06:23):
Sometimes you gotta let him know because people need to
be reminded how rare we are in the building, let
alone on the stage, and the.

Speaker 3 (06:30):
Fact that we're trying to roll back the EI left
and right and now we're finally getting some firsts for
black people up on this stage. Right like after Latina
was like Zo, we like Paul Tasle's work, Like, why
are we just now getting these firsts and people are
still not putting two and two together that we need
these DEI programs to allow for this. We're still making
history of the first black blank. That's embarrassing.

Speaker 1 (06:52):
It's twenty twenty five and he did an amazing job.
But the costume design and Wicked was a bubble dress
you were It felt to me it felt better than
I love the live musical. But I feel they did
a justice the world they created with that. It was
he did a great job with the cast and design.

Speaker 3 (07:12):
Yeah, but you noticed also like how he has just
leveled up in his career. I first found out about
his work when I watched In the Heights. It was
like two thousand and nine, eighty nine. I watched it
with Cordon Blue and Jordan Sparks cast I saw that phenomenal.

Speaker 2 (07:28):
Wait, so he did the costume design for the play?

Speaker 3 (07:30):
Yes?

Speaker 2 (07:31):
Oh, did he also do it for the film, don't.

Speaker 3 (07:33):
I don't know if he did it for the film.
I know for sure he did Hamilton as.

Speaker 2 (07:35):
Well, because that would be the connection between him and
John Chu, the director of In the Heights the musical.

Speaker 4 (07:41):
Yes.

Speaker 3 (07:41):
Yeah, but back then I mean In the Heights and Hamilton,
and of course Wicked, I mean I and he'd obviously
whiz live. I feel like he has been just slowly
elevating to this point where it's like it was a given.
It was just amount of time.

Speaker 2 (07:55):
It was nice to see it not go to like
fucking like Renaissance queens and kings, like no offense to
the Europeans, but like, god damn you, you're Elizabethan. Corsets
and stuff is all very impressive. But did you see
the bubble dress? I'm sorry, did you see the munchkin Land?
Like the way that every character was so unique? And

(08:17):
I know because I had the coloring book and I'm like, ooh,
I'm gonna do yeah, I'm named literally, this is what
I do when I'm stressed sometimes the wicked. My mommy
got me this for Christmas, I'm not even ashamed, And yeah,
and I'm just that was amazing. Did you guys do
boycott Friday? By the way, I did too.

Speaker 4 (08:36):
It was.

Speaker 3 (08:39):
A lot easier for me than I thought it was
going to be, I gotta say, because it was a Friday,
and so I just feel like I wasn't necessarily like
I was able to just like enjoy my Friday. I
wasn't really online that much, which I think helped me.
But if it's a start of the week, if it's
a Sunday, or if it's like a Monday, I find it.
I'm ordering stuff more. I'm like like in my beginning
of the week mode, where like I'm looking ahead and
planning ahead. But like the fact it was a I

(09:00):
was whining down, I was not doing work. It just
for me. I felt like it was going to be
so difficult and it ended up being much easier.

Speaker 5 (09:07):
Yeah.

Speaker 2 (09:07):
I can't wait to see the quarterly results from Target,
which are I was just thinking, I was like, when's
the quarter over?

Speaker 1 (09:14):
So much we should see it is a quarter march.

Speaker 2 (09:19):
I want to see because they got to tell they
got to tell the shareholders. Shareholders are already suing Target
right because they pissed at Apple. I haven't gone to
Target since well since before they announced it because I
just hadn't. I just happened to not have. But it's
been great financially truly, and and I do think the

(09:42):
seductive marketing, the way the store is set up, like psychologically,
to give you these like little dopamine hits based on
like the products they sell, it really is all seductive.
And to break ourselves of that that sort of like
spell that they had us under, I feel like there's
nothing but good from that.

Speaker 3 (10:01):
Target has had suburban moms in a choke hold for.

Speaker 2 (10:04):
Years listen and I and I was one, but no longer.
I feel like I woken up at the end of
Barbie like America. Frea just came to me and gave
me a pep talk, and I'm like, you're right, I
hate Target. Powerful shoulders, yes, but I can't. I can't
front though, y'all. Okay, so what I happen. I did

(10:26):
end up at the mall on Friday. But here's what happened.
What happened was my good friend and of all the days.
But anyway, in the evening, I'm recuperating. I get an
emergency call my friend Jess. She needs a gown for
an event, Jack and Jill. Jack and Jill is an
iconic nonprofit that you know does all kinds of increble work.

(10:47):
You can talk about the very blackly black but black. Okay,
she's going to the gala. The dress doesn't fit. Okay,
we need to go to Nordstrum. She wants to know
if I want to ride with her. I haven't seen
her in a while, y'all. I miss my friend Jess.
So of course I say yes, let's go on the
way there. I'm like, holy what where are you taking me?
We're not supposed to be doing this. She's like, yeah,
I know, but the event is tomorrow. I gotta go.
But I was like, well, I'm not spending any money.

(11:08):
But I went with her and watched her. And technically
she didn't spend money either, because she just exchanged she
had already bought. It was just a little even exchange.
But wouldn't you know, the checkout girl recognized me. She's like,
are you on Instagram? Money?

Speaker 4 (11:29):
No?

Speaker 2 (11:29):
No no no no no no no no no no
no no no. I carry a pocket NDA. Don't you
know that? So I was like, you need to sign
this or I'm just kidding. It's just a little like,
you know, a little electronic signature right here, Thank you very.

Speaker 3 (11:45):
Much, put her phone and recorded no, no.

Speaker 2 (11:48):
No, no no. She was so sweet, but she yeah, she
was so sweet. I was like, please, don't tell anybody else.
But I didn't spend any money. I did not, but
it was yeah, so that was my.

Speaker 3 (11:59):
Nobody really spent any money. I would just run in
an errand. And it happened to the mall, Okay, you
know what.

Speaker 2 (12:03):
I support this and all the staff are women of color,
as we typically do hold up the companies that are
run by a billionaire white guys. So and they were
so sweet. It was actually kind of fun being at
I haven't been to the mall on a Friday night.
When's the last time y'all went to the mall on
a Friday?

Speaker 5 (12:17):
Period?

Speaker 3 (12:18):
Was the mall period? I'm in there a long time period?

Speaker 2 (12:20):
But was it like crowded?

Speaker 3 (12:22):
Because I feel like everybody was assuming that because it
was black on Friday, or everybody was gonna do the
boycott and it wasn't gonna be anybody in stores. But
then there was a post being like and that doesn't
really always work out that way because the people who
actively are against this stuff double down and show up
to shop. So is that like what was the vibe
in person?

Speaker 4 (12:39):
Was it?

Speaker 2 (12:39):
Like?

Speaker 3 (12:39):
What were the numbers like?

Speaker 2 (12:41):
Well, at nord Stream, it was kind of popping. I
mean there was probably like a dozen people shopping, which
it was eight pm. I mean it was close to
closing time. I don't know. But it's also I think
but there were like mothers of the bride, you know,
brothers of the groom. They were getting their dresses for
their springtime wedding. So I didn't have fault them. But
also it's I live in Westchester. It's not a lot
of us out here anyway. It's pretty white, honestly them all.

(13:02):
I don't know. The people at the perfume counters. I
could tell they were all like really wanting people, like
please come buy something, you pot some pants, you want
some crystal, you want like a thousand dollars Chanel bag. No, no, no,
thank you. But it was nice to walk around with
a friend. We did see We saw one group of

(13:23):
young girls, maybe like teenage girls, like four of them
in a pack kind of like hanging out and that
was cute. But it's just no, I didn't have friends,
and I was called no, maybe I didn't to my

(13:43):
childhood trauma. Yeah, it took me right back. No, I
didn't have friends.

Speaker 3 (13:49):
Well, they want to be friends with you now.

Speaker 2 (13:51):
Don't think I didn't peak too soon. I made all
my friends in college. I moved a lot. It was
hard to make friends, you know. Just whatever.

Speaker 3 (14:00):
But if we're chatting, we should mention the sixtieth anniversary
of Ployee Sunday, which is coming up.

Speaker 2 (14:07):
Oh, thank you early March.

Speaker 3 (14:09):
And you know, I just I keep thinking it was
like maybe twenty fifteen. Yeah, twenty fifteen was the fiftieth,
twenty five sixtieth that makes sense mathematically, twenty fifteen that
picture of Obama, you know, Michelle and Barack holding hands
with John Lewis and crossing the bridge and just like
obviously Amelia Boytman was there too, and their daughter Sasha

(14:31):
and Melia and just like that whole line. I just
have that picture in my mind, that photo of them
holding hands crossing that bridge fifty years later, and the
fact that Miliebourne was still alive at that time. She
died later that year.

Speaker 2 (14:42):
But like John Lewis too, and John Lewis too, let
me just google. Let's see if Trump is on the
Edmund Pettist Bridge at all. He ain't going nowhere near
see you gonna Yeah, nope, nothing, couldn't couldn't, couldn't see
it interesting. But let's we will pull up that picture

(15:02):
of the Obamas.

Speaker 3 (15:04):
So beautiful, y'all, and the fact that all of the
important people that needed to be there were there, and
it was fifty years and that, and it's just sad
now to think that just ten years later we have
gone backwards.

Speaker 2 (15:14):
It feel like in some ways. In some ways, but
I do want to call out, you know, ten years ago,
what wasn't around was this news organization called the Nineteenth
which I've had Aaron Haynes, one of the they called them,
says the founding mothers, the founding mother of Aaron Haynes
something on the show a couple of times. I'm going
to post the link to this article that I just
thought was beautiful, a beautiful way to honor the women

(15:37):
behind the movement as well. So the Nineteenth News dot
org is where you can find it. They have an
article called flowers for the unsung Black women of Bloody Sunday,
black women fed, protected, and housed the activists who traveled
to Selma, Alabama in March nineteen sixty five to demonstrate
for voting rights. Here are their stories. And that was

(15:58):
written by threejournalist Alexis Frey, Eden Turner, Sabrine Da Wood
Da Wood. Sorry mispronounce that And this article just came
out when we're recording this show. But it's it's a
beautiful It reminds me like why I got into journalism
is to tell stories like this and some of the
archival photos they shared beautiful.

Speaker 3 (16:20):
It's so important, it's so important to keep telling the
history because obviously some people are fighting to not include
it at all. So we have to tell it. Eight
men that part retell it and retell it and tell
it again. Yeah, but you know the beautiful thing that
came from even though there's so much bloodshed and heartbreak
on Bloody Sunday, which was early nineteen sixty five. Later

(16:40):
that year, the civil rights movement had a huge win
with the Voting Rights Act of nineteen sixty five. So
while we're here to celebrate something that obviously had a
lot of stain, and it was really hard and negative.
Later in I think September August, the Secember of that
same year was the Voting Rights Tack, which probably most
people would would say it's probably the crown jewel, biggest

(17:00):
win of the Civil Rights Act, of the Civil rights
like era, but really fighting for everybody to be able
to get in particular every black person in America to
be able to get egal rights to vote. But you know,
I don't mean to be a Debbie downer, but just
thinking about a couple of years ago when I first
started doing this legislative work with financial literacy being in schools,
there were like three hundred different bills, if not more,

(17:21):
that we're trying to introduce, like rollbacks, like pulling back
like basically not allowing people to register early, not allowing
people to vote, to do voter registration on the day of,
taking away like the fact that if you have if
you don't have a photo ID, then you can't vote,
Like just all kinds of shady shit that it's like,

(17:42):
this is literally what the Voting Rights Act was.

Speaker 2 (17:45):
History rhymes, history rhymes truly, My.

Speaker 3 (17:49):
Goodness, it's so frustrating to see so that when I
say like, oh, we're it feels like oftentimes like we're
moving backwards. Like not to be negative, but it's just
so frustrating that the not just fight the good fight,
get a big win, but then keep fighting, keep fighting
that same fight while fighting new fights. It's like rock
come on. It's so frustrating, especially with legislative wins like that.
You would think, Okay, that's the law, that's it, but

(18:11):
amending it.

Speaker 2 (18:13):
Ro v Wade sounded like it was forever as a
little girl growing up, and I do not little girl.
I didn't really think about it then, but yeah, like
you think those kinds of things are just etched and stone.
I actually find it very I find it very and
and you can. It's not about not being negative too.
It's like being real. We got to call a spata
s babe. This is the times we're in. People need

(18:35):
to understand the severity of the situation. And I also
think it's like I said before on the show, our
generation we were really taught like they did it. You're
this post racial you know Gen X to millennials and
Gen Z and like you know, you're the next generation.
You're gonna get to celebrate the fruits of our labor,

(18:58):
and you know that's not the case. And I think
that we need to quickly understand that the fight continues
and we have never I'm you know, I think the
policies that we were hard fought and won back in
the sixties and seventies, like now we're gonna have to
re like go to battle again to protect them and
in some ways after this challenge, when they survive, because

(19:22):
I fully believe that they will and that we can
in some shape or form way shape shape or form
or fashion fight back against this, that they'll be even
stronger because we have. They have been tested, battle tested,
you know. And I do feel like, yeah, so I
I feel not so much like I'm I'm reading a

(19:44):
story about people that are so far removed, and it's
more like I'm want I'm reading and I'm like studying, like, oh,
so this is how they organized and this is what worked.
And you know the fact that the Voting Rights Act happened.
You think about the March on Washington being that like
pivotal moment, but that was bloody Sunday was two years later,

(20:05):
and I bet the people who marched on Washington thought, well,
didn't we do it.

Speaker 3 (20:08):
Didn't we just deal with this?

Speaker 2 (20:09):
Yeah, yeah, back again, but it's back again in this brutality,
and that led to the Voting Rights Act. And we
I love Stacy Abrams podcast Assembly Required and really listening
to her as like a voice of comfort in times
like this. Tasty comes back. Come back to Brannon Bish.
We miss you. She's so great, and her whole you know,
mission to for voter against voter suppression in Georgia where

(20:34):
she tried and failed to become the first woman and
first African American woman governor, was really eye opening and like, yeah,
I'm just glad you brought that up you in Ellie,
because I feel like those basic rights that we can
take for granted are so flimsy in reality.

Speaker 3 (20:52):
Ye, stay vigilant.

Speaker 1 (20:57):
It just shows how important it is to vote right
and why it's so significant that we make sure we
turn out for all elections, the small ones and big ones,
because if it wasn't important, they wouldn't be trying to
find all these ways to reduce it and take away
the right and make it as difficult as possible. Like
why why is voting day election day not a national holiday?
Why doesn't everyone have that day off of work, Like
if it wasn't so important, they wouldn't be trying to

(21:19):
make it so difficult. So I think it's just even
more encouragement to make sure you're on it, know what's
going on locally, and turn out for those things, because
like both of you were saying before, like you know,
barely one shows up for those elections, so your vote
really matters in those. You have so much more weight
when you show up to even the small ones that
can make an impact on your local community.

Speaker 3 (21:36):
That's right, And some of them are coming up real soon.
So y'all need to check check your local elections and
see what's happening and tune in and show up because
this is the only way. Like, if they know that
you're not paying attention, that's when they pounce, right, So
we have to be real, real vigilant.

Speaker 2 (21:54):
What else is happening? Oh, you know this morning I
had I was kind of like super sad this morning
and I had to journal about it and I couldn't
figure out why. One. I think because I'm sleep deprived.
Last night was rough with with the kids were just
like not having it. We ended up sleeping like survivors
of a catastrophe in the same bed, just like me
and my husband clinging to one side. Anyway, So sleepy

(22:17):
being sleep, sleepy, being sleepy sleep. Oh god, it's not
well mourning for you. I'm still on it at two
pm Eastern time. Yeah, anyway, I had to. So I
have been in this group therapy that I've been doing
every Thursday since last May. It's called dialectical behavioral therapy

(22:37):
if you'll ever heard of it. It's like the sister
to CBT, which is like the typical cognitive behavioral therapy
where you try to change the thoughts that are causing
you distress. But DBT and DBT was something that was
new to me, and I also group therapy was like
new to me in general. Yeah where you at and

(22:58):
I was. I always thought of it as like you
sort of see like alcoholics anonymous they're in a group together,
but then you don't know each other. It's anonymous, right,
so you don't but it's in a group. And anyway,
doctor Joy from Therapy for Black Girls opened me up
to that idea that you could be in a group
and actually find that useful speaking with other people. And
so anyway, long story short, I got into this weekly

(23:20):
therapy DBT, but it's meant to be temporary. It's meant
to be like, I think, four months at a stint,
and so I had renewed it, so I went through
like eight months and I graduate March thirteenth, and so
my yeah, my graduation.

Speaker 4 (23:35):
I'm sad.

Speaker 2 (23:36):
I'm gonna miss it, you know, genuinely, because it really
gave one. There's like people in the group of a
small group is like six of us, but it really
it just humanizes people who are struggling with certain you know,
just challenges. I mean, the world is really freaking hard
to cope with. And when you're someone who feels things

(23:56):
really deeply at a time like this, pray for your
impaths in life. And I just really found the tools useful.
And so if you're someone out there who's really struggling
with like really big feelings and it's causing you like anxiety, depression,
it's interfering with your life, it's interfering with your relationships.

(24:18):
I can't recommend DBT group therapy enough, honestly. So, and
it's widespread, so you could find, you know, a group
that probably meets near you that the person who runs
the group told me that I need to get my
together and get my get my one on one individual
therapists set up. I've been dragging my feet because my

(24:44):
therapist who I work with for like four or five years,
she went back to work at a hospital. She's working
with recovering mothers postpartum, which is amazing. I tried out
another therapist. It didn't work. I wasn't a fan like
it was weren't bang. I don't know. So I've been
therapists therapist lists for two months now, which is the

(25:10):
longest I've gone in a long time.

Speaker 1 (25:12):
I got well.

Speaker 2 (25:15):
I've always had DBT, so they've been my support.

Speaker 3 (25:19):
But I feel like you need like a therapist be dating.

Speaker 2 (25:22):
I know, it's it's I haven't been in this position
in a while, like where you've had to shop for
your therapist. So I have a consultation on Thursday.

Speaker 3 (25:31):
Okay, we take a step.

Speaker 1 (25:33):
Okay, I mean it is like dating trying to find
a therapist, right, you don't know, you like that personality,
You you got stuff that you can talk about. They
can relate and connect to what you're talking about in
your life. It's it's work.

Speaker 2 (25:47):
I did not you know, I'm just like the last
guy he was a white dude. I did not enjoy it.
I don't think I can. I don't. I mean, I
didn't want it to be like that because he actually
wrote a book that I found at the library and
I found did the book really fascinating? And I found
him interesting and he lived locally to me, so I
went and found him and I was like, I'm a fan.
Beg my therapist. He's like, WHOA three people have read

(26:10):
this book, and like anyway, but yeah, I don't know,
it was I thought, and this is the thing, like you,
I don't know, Chris, do you mind saying if your
therapist is.

Speaker 1 (26:22):
A guy or woman, it's a woman. My current therapist, Okay,
how is that for you?

Speaker 2 (26:28):
She a woman of color, white lady.

Speaker 1 (26:31):
She is a white woman who was recommended to me
originally was a man. But my therapist passed away.

Speaker 4 (26:37):
He was.

Speaker 1 (26:39):
I didn't know, because you know obviously that gona tell
you everything about their own lives. But I could tell
he was dealing with something, and I remember he had
missed a couple of appointments and then he sent me
this this long message about like how he's in hospice care.
So what ended up happening was he connected me with
the other therapist who was in his office, So that's
how I ended up with her. But she's been great
cause she was written. My original recommendation from someone was her.

(26:59):
She was fool so she recommended me to him and
then he balanced me back. But that's how I ended
up with that. But she's she's amazing. She's she's also
a podcaster, so she understands this life that I'm living Okay,
really great. I've been with it for probably what I
don't even know, two three years something.

Speaker 2 (27:13):
Like that, though, talkid that gives me hope. Maybe it's
not just because he was a dude. I just kept
looking at him and being like, well, no, I just
don't feel like being my full authentic self here and
it probably has to do with me, but anyway, I'm
on that journey.

Speaker 3 (27:29):
The cause of it doesn't matter. It's the existence of.

Speaker 2 (27:31):
It that matters. Yeah, And he totally understood that, and
like we kind of like touched on it because I
was like after the election, I was like, you got
to tell me who you voted for because I don't
think I can talk to you. I know it shouldn't matter,
but it matters. He's like, he's like, okay, yes I
voted for Kamala and I was like, okay, but it
wasn't enough. So I'm on that journey, y'an, Ellie. Do

(27:51):
you have any have you ever been in therapy or yeah?

Speaker 3 (27:54):
I was doing therapy for like six years right after undergrad.
It was rough transitioning back home home from being like
independent and then being back under my parents' roof. And
they had all these expectations and I was like, uh,
I got multiple degrees. Now, don't tell me what this.
Oh yeah, so I had Yeah I did that about
six years of therapy, but I haven't had a therapist
in a few years now.

Speaker 5 (28:13):
Yeah.

Speaker 3 (28:14):
Just write a lot and just go to the gym.

Speaker 2 (28:16):
That's my therapy.

Speaker 4 (28:17):
You know.

Speaker 2 (28:17):
What I never really grasped as a concept is that
therapy is not meant to be permanent. Yeah, it's just
meant to be for a long term thing.

Speaker 3 (28:25):
Though, because I was trying to do it for like
two or three years, I ended up doing it for
six years. And I do not regret that. I think
I really needed it to go into my thirties like
I was not. I was not capable of doing that
on my own without like really having a place to
go release and just honestly getting so much advice about
how poorly I was doing at communicating. That was my
biggest thing that I got from therapy, was like, you know,

(28:47):
I would I don't know, like dumb shit too. Like
I remember that I was planning this girl's trip and
I had a friend and she was like going through
something and she loves the job. She was going through
a lot of stuff, and so I was planning this
girl strip I just felt so bad. I didn't want
to like tell her, Hey, I know you just lost
your job, but like we're plying this girl's trip, you know,

(29:08):
if you get swinging like and so I just didn't
mention it to her. And then she found out through
another friend that I was planning this girl's trip, and
then she wasn't invited. And it's like, dude, if that
was happening to me right now, I would literally just
message her and be like I do not want to
be insensitive at all, but I want you to feel
welcome and invited. So if you can swing it calm,
you're definitely invited. We want you there, but if not,
I totally understand as well. Because I know what's going
on with you personally, no pressureable like that is. All

(29:30):
you have to do is just communicate, and I wasn't
doing that. You avoid, Yeah, so I think therapy helped me. Yeah,
and something that we don't teach too, Like I feel
like when you're in school, or even when you're in college,
no matter enough, nobody teaches you how to communicate clearly
and effectively. So that was a huge takeaway from me
for therapy.

Speaker 2 (29:51):
It was like it was me.

Speaker 3 (29:52):
The root of it was me. I wasn't communicating well,
I'm them seriously.

Speaker 1 (29:58):
I have a measure. There's like because you know, let's
do a good job getting personal finance into schools. Imagine
if there's like a semester of like therapy, like group
therapy for real life skills. That's the stuff you need,
right because a bunch of unlike adults who can't function
because we don't know how to do this stuff and
we're out of struggling and scrambling, that'd be great to
at least get a little something under a belt before you.

Speaker 2 (30:19):
Yeah, there actually is some DBT curriculum in schools, Like
there is a movement to get yeah, to teach young kids.
And you know what's crazy is like all of the lessons.
When I say big feelings, that's commonly you'll hear that
phrase among parents, and like parents, psychologists or kids psychologists
for everyon want to call them about how to help
kids manage their big feelings. And that's all DBT is.

(30:41):
It's literally for adults, and I too need to learn
how to take some deep breaths and learn how to
cope with big uncomfortable. It's just that the feelings and
the stakes are so much higher when you have grown
up problems. Yes, you know, I can't have a melt
down in the middle of target. I you know, it's
it looks different for me and a bigger and so yeah,

(31:04):
I'm learning so much and it's making me a better
mom and I'm I'm learning. I'm like, oh, I was
never I really was never taught. I was like, you
had to I'm gonna say, please, don't sing, please don't
sing frozen, don't do it, don't do it, don't concealed,
don't feel I didn't sing it. I just said it
conceal the feelings. And it was really hard and to

(31:26):
be strong and to like and nothing ever bothers her
and like that kind of thing, and that was a
good tool. We learned that it was a good tool
for them, but not so much for now. And anyway,
it makes me excited because I'm like, oh man, I'm
giving this kid the best shot. It's not just about
giving him money, and you know, yeah, loving household is

(31:47):
important too, but like really preparing them to be humans
in this kind of world. I just am so proud
that I'm gonna hopefully it'll stick, hopefully he'll take it
with him. Like that's the.

Speaker 3 (32:00):
Proudest thing that you can feel as an adult who
raised children. Whether like for me it's I'm in an
antique capacity, I'm like the favorite thea, but it's really
like showing them what emotional regulation looks like and sounds
like and feels like and being a role model for
them in that way, because the worst people who have
been the most toxic in my life have been people

(32:21):
who just did not have any emotional regulation skills, Like
they just could not cope with emotions, they didn't know how,
they take it all out on other people or just
you know, let it fester until they exploded. And that's
just horrible to be around. And also I'm sure it
feels horrible to be that person too, so I'm sure
they want to relieve from it. They you know, we
just don't. We don't have a way. And I don't

(32:41):
know when that transition happens. I was gonna say earlier,
like at some point like you're like, oh, you're young,
you're young, you could get away with this or that,
and then all of a sudden, one day you wake
up and Nope, you're not young anymore. And now anything
you do is like the expectation is that you're a
grown ass adult and you're supposed to have that you
figured out?

Speaker 2 (32:57):
Yeah when?

Speaker 4 (32:58):
Like when?

Speaker 5 (32:58):
And how?

Speaker 3 (32:58):
I just yeah, so much pressure?

Speaker 4 (33:00):
So I do.

Speaker 3 (33:01):
I love that you're doing that with your kids, Mandy,
because that's like probably the most important thing you could
give them. Money comes and goes. You know, success is
defined differently, it's all subjective, but that emotion regulation and
the ability to cope with what you're dealing with emotion
inside of yourself and treating and just being a good
human being who can manage that is literally the best
gift you can give them.

Speaker 1 (33:20):
Yeah, it's because life is nothing but a serious of relationships, right,
and you got to know how to manage that and
relate to people and deal with conflict constantly. It never
stops happening, and setting their kids up.

Speaker 3 (33:33):
And trying so hard and so dobly important.

Speaker 2 (33:38):
I truly feel the weight of responsibility to create a
Women's History Month, especially to create boys who are not toxic.
And I've said that before, but I genuinely like it's
so much I try to put just like they have
to love themselves and be strong and be proud to
be Dominican, but also know they have a black from
the South mama, and also like understand like my culture

(34:00):
and their culture and speak Spanish but you know, also
be able to speak. And it's just as a lot,
a lot. I'm doing my best, so thank you for
giving me. It's a it's a big responsiblit, but hey,
I had these kids, so that's what I signed up for,
is how I feel. That's right.

Speaker 3 (34:14):
Well, the mom was out there listening. We know it's
a lot, but that's what you signed up, what.

Speaker 2 (34:18):
We signed up for, literally creating the future.

Speaker 3 (34:23):
That's right.

Speaker 2 (34:26):
Well, Chris, what's your update over there? How's things going?

Speaker 1 (34:29):
No, it's going well. I gotta say I'm trying to
be healthier. Now, I've been in San Francisco, so I'm
doing a ton of walking. I didn't bring my car
with me. I'm living that you took over to the gym.

Speaker 3 (34:38):
Hard life.

Speaker 1 (34:39):
She went to the gym. I've been walking. I was
walking like eighteen thousand steps past two days. I remember
during the pandemic, I was the heaviest I'd ever gotten.
She didn't get to see that face. She skipped out
on all that will no way.

Speaker 2 (34:53):
Picture those hybernating bears. Fifteen. Well, I had COVID plus
a newborn. I can't even I'm like unrecognizable to myself.
I'm on that journey too.

Speaker 4 (35:07):
You know.

Speaker 2 (35:08):
I just started the GPL gp L one injections, the
weight loss medicine, like I just started one. It's the
megalitudegalitude that everything that you would work for me before
no longer works postpartum, two babies in I guess, and
being in my late thirties now, so I have admitted

(35:29):
that I needed a little extra boost, So I'll let
y'all know how that goes. I just did my first
little injection on Saturday. So this is fresh, okay, we
very fresh for you? Well fingers crumb, but I will
be walking and eating right too, not just taking that
doing the shots. Yeah, all right, Well should we take

(35:53):
a little break and come back with brown boost, brown break.

Speaker 1 (35:56):
Let's do it?

Speaker 2 (35:58):
Just do we? All right? Be right backba fams, All right,
we are back. We're gonna do brown boost brown break.
And I don't need to tell y'all what that's all about.
If we're boosting, we're happy about it. If we're breaking,
we could use less of it. Like we're done, we're
fed up. Who wants to go first? Oh?

Speaker 3 (36:21):
I can go first. I mentioned a little bit about
what I'm doing this week for work, but the brown
boost for me is I am hopping on a plane
to go to Denver, Colorado, to testify and support of
a bill there that is proposing that we require financial
literacy in every public school in the state of Colorado.
And the cool thing about the Colorado specifically is that
Denver Public Schools is a really large urban district and

(36:42):
they've already done this. So like a lot of the
people who are like, oh, we can't do it, it's
gonna be too difficult, the scheduling, the this, the that,
and then it's like, well, actually, just take a look
at Denver public schools. They've already been doing it. So
you have a model for how to do it right here.
So there's really no excuse and that has really been helpful.

Speaker 2 (37:00):
Good for you, you getting miles for all this traveling.
You could tease your.

Speaker 3 (37:02):
Own I love my old job. I had to book
with the company.

Speaker 2 (37:06):
But this is that's annoying putting it all on my car.
I think they get that now. They want you to
like get the points. Yes it's so great, but yes,
also your your public advocacy and all that work is amazing.

Speaker 3 (37:18):
It is all of it great.

Speaker 1 (37:19):
It's incredible.

Speaker 2 (37:22):
All right, Chris, I'm putting you in the hot seat
because my break is going to be a little bit longer.

Speaker 1 (37:26):
Okay, well mind beah. So uh, you know it's gonna
be a boost this week. And one of the things
that kind of led me to move it up here
to San Francisco was to be in a more like
social environment. I feel like at home so isolated because
you know, and like everything so far. So people are
like I might find to sit in traffic to come
hang out with you, and I'm like, I don't want
to drive an hour and a half it comes to you,
so you just don't do it like terrible. But here

(37:48):
everything is so much easier to get around. People end
up doing things together a lot more often. And so Berna, Berna,
and that who you've had here, Hey Berna. Yeah, she
I don't know if she wants me to talk about
this mo I'm talking. But anyways, she was in a
sketch writing program and so she because Berna's hilarious somebody.

Speaker 2 (38:06):
She is that makes me so happy.

Speaker 1 (38:08):
Yes, the funniest people I've ever met. And so she's
in this program and at the end of this course,
they actually write these, uh, these sketches and then they
get performed by actors at a local little comedy spot here,
and so it's like down the street, went over there
and we got to meet up with her, her boyfriend,
some of her friends and I know too, I've become
friends with and we all got together and we watched

(38:30):
her some of her skits, and then our sketches and
some of the other sketches of the other people in
the program get performed. And it was hilarious, let me
tell you, because you know, I was nervous going in.
You know, you go, I'm going to support a friend,
but you don't know it. Yeah, you don't know what
you're getting into.

Speaker 2 (38:43):
It really could.

Speaker 1 (38:44):
It was so good. It was so good.

Speaker 2 (38:46):
Murna's did she performed or she wrote the sketch?

Speaker 1 (38:50):
Yeah, performed? Men done this. But they had this really
great group of this like improv group that was up
there that they just got the scripts that day and
like right before they got there, and they had the
scripts out obviously because they didn't memorize them, and we're
going through performing the one by one and they were
killing it. The sketches that they wrote were so hilarious
that it was Bernard had had us dying up there.

(39:10):
So I was that's my boots because that was so
fun to get to support a friend. But I also
get to see their work and it'd be like amazing,
like because of course it would be amazing if bern
is doing it. But yeah, that was my boost because
I had a great time. It was It was a
lot of fun.

Speaker 4 (39:23):
Love.

Speaker 3 (39:24):
Yeah, I love that you make me want to doing
the work to build your own community.

Speaker 2 (39:28):
I love it and moving to where you have that
community support because yeah, I missed those days. It was
so much easier. I can still get down to the
city and see people. But yeah, it's definitely it's just easy,
easy and free, and I'm happy that you got to
be there to support her. We love you Berner the best.

(39:51):
I will say, Chris, I don't compliment you often, except
I did compliment your shirt. I do like it.

Speaker 1 (39:55):
I was shocked. I was waiting for the inside.

Speaker 2 (39:57):
I don't think it was the first time I noticed
dudes to wear like something besides a T shirt or
like a button down. I do notice, and I'm like,
oh interesting. I'm always like plucking out little ideas for
for bay. But what was I gonna say nice about you?

Speaker 1 (40:11):
Clearly mean it. You already forget like a well.

Speaker 2 (40:14):
Rounded dude, I will say, like you do. You're doing
the work, You're like getting well rounded. You're getting the
health and lifestyle, you got the mental health aspect, and
you recognize the importance of friends and relationships and those
are not things that you know we can't like take
for granted. Just men. That's your prioritizing. I mean, and

(40:41):
you could just answer for answer for all of them.
It's Women's History Month. What can I say and march
just say yes, ma'am, yes, ma'am, yes, that's the energy.
I really did, your highness, I thank you because I

(41:02):
am so high on a pedestal. Oh god, I want
to get to my boost because this is going to
be a special one. I have a book here, can
you see it? I have my blur thing on. So
this book is called Flip the Table, speaking of activists,
Yan Elliott. No it's not here. Yeah, I'll put it

(41:23):
on the screen because that's so annoying. So this is
called Flip the Table, The Everyday Disruptor's Guide to finding
courage and making change. It is by Alencia Johnson, whose
name y'all may not recognize, but who has been behind
some of the you know, most consequential elections and election
campaigns of our time. I am going to roll right now,

(41:46):
even though you and Chris you're not gonna be able
to hear it. I'm going to do a quick little
interview with the author, Alencia Johnson, and air that so
that y'all can hear about this book. You can't plan
when to have books like this get published, but I
just can't think of a better time because this is
like probably four years in the making, and for it
to come out right now, it's just such good timing
and she's going to be on tour. So if y'all

(42:07):
want to go to flipthetablesbook dot com.

Speaker 3 (42:11):
I love it. I'm so excited to read this. I'm
just adding into my book list right now, Flip the Tables.

Speaker 2 (42:17):
Love it, can't wait, can't wait to have her on
And you guys are going to hear a little bit
from her now and then go run out and get
the copy of her book because it is so important
to support our writers who actually get on the shelves
because they don't often look like us. All right, the
a fam. I am really excited to share this week's

(42:38):
Brown Boost with you. I've never done this before. This
is a brown ambition. First, my boost is here. I
brought my boost to work today and her name is
a Lindsia Johnson and she is fabulous. She has a
new book that I have been reading and deeply enjoying,
especially at a time like this. The book is called
Flip the Tables, The Everyday Disruptor's Guide to Finding Courage

(43:02):
and Making Change. And it's here and I need y'all
to go pick up your copy.

Speaker 5 (43:07):
Now.

Speaker 2 (43:07):
Why we were just talking a little bit about this,
Elencia just because it's the message that we need right now.
But let me tell you about my new friend, slash
human boost Me. Lincia Johnson is an award winning social
impact advisor and cultural commentator. She founded ten sixty three
West broad which is a media and social impact consultancy,

(43:28):
which basically means she has had her hands in many,
many consequential campaigns over the years, including advising the presidential
campaigns of Vice President Kamala Harris. Should have been President
Kamala Harris, I'll say President Joe Biden, Senator Elizabeth Warren. Oh,
we stand Lizzie Warren over here. Yes, I love her. Oh,

(43:50):
the CFPB her baby, I'm just distraught, all right, Focus
Mandy and President Barack Obama. In addition to her work
with leading advocacy group, she's regularly seen on MSNBC, CNN, ABC,
She's been featured all over the media, and she's a
proud member of the Delta Sigma Theta. So we're already.
I'm not gonna lie. If I could go back and pledge,

(44:14):
I think I'd be a Delta. I think I'm old
enough now to choose. I wasn't sure in college. Yeah,
choose when all my favorite. I mean no offense, but
like I'm not even I can't do it. I'm gonna
get in trouble. All my favorites are Delta's. Is that
why you're so amazing? I just something about y'all. You're
just I mean, I don't want to like create a monolith,
but just genuinely approachable, kind, good hearted, but still badass.

(44:41):
You know what I mean. Yeah, it's about that business. Well,
welcome to the show, Alensia. Thank you so much for
joining on Brown Ambition and being my boost.

Speaker 5 (44:50):
Thank you for having me and reading the book and
being like creating the space for me to have this conversation.

Speaker 2 (44:56):
Can you believe it's out in the world.

Speaker 4 (44:58):
Oh my gosh, it is my baby that came to me.
We were talking a little bit about the pandemic. It
came to me in that early pandemic haze and it
is finally here, which is so wild.

Speaker 2 (45:10):
What I like about the book as you start by
talking about how we can be, how we need to
learn how to disrupt ourselves.

Speaker 5 (45:16):
Yeah, you know, it's interesting.

Speaker 4 (45:17):
In all of my career from presidential campaigns to working
for a planned parentheads national office, and I was constantly
getting the question of how do I create more impact
in the world and how do I have more courage
like you and be brave like you? And I was like, hmm,
I actually don't see myself as this way. I just
have found myself moving through the world and the way

(45:40):
that God has led me to. But I was also
feeling a bit stuck, like having all of these accolades
and all these positions, and I was like, well, then
why do I feel so stuck If I'm this person
that people are looking to for guidance and courage, but
me myself, I can't get out of my own way.
What's happening here? And who am I holding back in

(46:01):
myself and others by not really living out my dreams?
And then I realized that it is so connected to
our community and advancing our community, and so look, Mandy,
I had to sit with myself and really sit with
the things that I had been running from, the things
that I talked about in therapy, the things I had
like all the theory for I'm a virgo in four houses,

(46:22):
like I can theorize everything.

Speaker 2 (46:24):
Okay, nobody knows they're signed like a virgo knows their
sign exactly.

Speaker 4 (46:30):
And I said, oh, Hey, girl, you got to feel
these things, you got to go through these things, and
how connected the going through was connected to me living
and my purpose.

Speaker 5 (46:39):
And so it really showed me that in order for
us to show.

Speaker 4 (46:43):
Up in our community is the way that we're supposed
to to do the thing that God has called us
to do in the world, We've got to actually first
be who were called to be. And in order to
get there, we got to face the mirror quite a bit,
and we got to, you know, acknowledge sometimes the red
flag is you, but also sometimes we have to figure
out how to answer the question. There's a whole chapter

(47:06):
in there, and I love it so much because it
reads me for filth, but it pushes you to answer
the question who are we? Unattached to our resumes and accolades,
Like literally, who are we?

Speaker 2 (47:17):
I think it's pretty clear, you know, as I'm writing
my book to my editor and I have been working
closely on like just making sure that I'm oozing off
the page, which is not hard to do because I
love just writing with my authentic voice. But something that
really is apparent to me is your faith, and your
faith is so grounded in this book. I mean, you
open up the book talking a little bit about your faith.

(47:38):
And then the epilogue again you acknowledge, you know, if
Jesus can get up and keep moving, then so can we,
And can you talk a little bit about Well, do
I want to skip to faith yet?

Speaker 4 (47:49):
No?

Speaker 2 (47:49):
I want to backtrack because I'm the boss, because I
want to know what were those things in therapy that
you were battling and what do you mean you were stuck?
Do you mean like career wise?

Speaker 1 (47:57):
Yeah?

Speaker 4 (47:58):
It was a combination of things, right, it was so
on the personal front. I was in the middle of
a move at the beginning of the pandemic. It was
right when Senator Elizabeth Warren ended her presidential campaign and
the beginning of this global pandemic.

Speaker 5 (48:12):
Senator Elizabeth Warren's campaign was my last.

Speaker 4 (48:15):
Like actual like W two job, And so I was
sitting there kind of fun employed, as I called it
that after like the Obama campaign when I was in
my twenties, but in your thirties it's fun?

Speaker 5 (48:27):
Is that as fun? It's not as cute anymore?

Speaker 4 (48:28):
Right? Yeah.

Speaker 5 (48:29):
So after about a few weeks of like, okay, what
are we doing?

Speaker 4 (48:33):
I was like, do I want to go out of
my own do I want to go back and house somewhere,
Do I want to take this job on the Biden campaign?
Like what do I want to do for myself? But
I was also still conflicted with feeling as though I
had to do what everyone else measured success to be.
At the same time, Mandy, I was still dealing with

(48:55):
a lot in my personal life. I was I picked
up some weight and some unhealthy habits on a campaign,
I was cycling through situationships that there were some like
friendships I needed to really reevaluate. There was some family
stuff that like I was just kind of putting in
the back of my mind and not really realizing how
it was impacting me. And so all of these things

(49:15):
were just bubbling up, and I took the time and
that's a privilege to have the time at the beginning
of the pandemic, and then to start working for myself
to really work through those things and realizing that not
working through those things and those feelings is what was
making me feel stuck, is what was making me feel
like I had to chase success on other people's terms

(49:35):
when I didn't want to be on the booked in
busy hamp Surreel anymore. I wanted to be in a
position to where I work the way that I wanted to,
but also, you know, set myself up well financially as
well as most importantly, really tending to my personal life
in a way that I'm not even gonna say I
was ignoring. I was running from. And so that's why

(49:57):
I was feeling stuck. It was a combination of so
many things, and some of it really started with me
having to stop being so much of a people pleaser,
right because even when I announced my consultancy, I got
tons of people like, Oh, You're gonna build this big agency,
and I was like, I don't really like managing a
lot of people, Like I like being creative.

Speaker 2 (50:16):
Ah, that's right, the magical entrepreneur we must all become
when we launch our own business. Yeah, talk about that,
like oh are you using this?

Speaker 5 (50:24):
Who are your clients?

Speaker 2 (50:25):
And I'm like, whoa seed funding?

Speaker 4 (50:27):
You want?

Speaker 2 (50:27):
A VC?

Speaker 4 (50:28):
Like what?

Speaker 2 (50:31):
I just got the domain? Like what do you want
for me? Like Alsie Lindsay Johnson dot com. You know
that's what I want for now.

Speaker 5 (50:37):
I'm good with my like three or four clients, Like
we're good.

Speaker 4 (50:41):
So that's the moment like being stuck and those places
that overlapped and you know, impacted each other.

Speaker 2 (50:48):
It's interesting that that whole expression stuck. I hear it
all the time because I do a lot of work
with women in their careers, and that's even a phrase
I use a lot. And it's almost like, sometimes it's
not that you're stuck, it's that you're kind of like
on a conveyor belt that you don't know how to
get off of, and it feels like like one of
those walking runways and you're just stuck, like you may
want to stop at the Starbucks, but you're just passing

(51:09):
by it, and like you're on the train already versus
like getting off, and it takes maybe longer, and it's
more grueling, especially if you're at JFK or Atlanta Airport,
you know, if I can take the analogy further, And yeah,
but that walking conveyer belt, it's nice, you know where
you're going, you know where the endpoint is, but it
can be seductive. And yeah, I think honestly, your thirties

(51:31):
is the era of getting off that conveyor belt for
a lot of people and choosing the stops that you're
gonna make. Okay, so you've taken us to the pandemic
and now bringing it back to the book. So you're
starting to disrupt yourself, and you're starting to disrupt sort
of the vision that you had for yourself in your career.
And then what's the next step after that? Once we

(51:52):
sort of like get to a place where we're not
afraid to shake things up personally, what's the next step
for folks?

Speaker 4 (51:58):
Well, and that's why I figured, if we start with
ourselves and you built this courage and confidence to be
who you want to be, live your own vision, that
kind of confidence exudes everywhere, then you're not as scared
to do the interventions that are every day. So you know, obviously,
in my career, I've met so many people who quit
their jobs and say they're rent for office or start

(52:18):
an organization. And I don't think change has to be
all of that. And plus I don't think everybody should
do that. There are some people who have and it's great,
like teachers who have become elected and things like that.
But quite frankly, Corey Bush is amazing, right, But then
there are some people who quite frankly, they should probably
stay CEOs with.

Speaker 2 (52:37):
These big firms, don't you wish they would stay ninety five,
you know what I mean. Some people should just stay
in your glass castle, out of our.

Speaker 5 (52:47):
Way, and so and so, if you're staying in your lane,
what can you do? Can you figure out a way
to spend your privilege?

Speaker 4 (52:54):
Can you figure out a way to expand your capacity
for understanding humanity? And so then you're gonna look get
like the immigration fight differently. You're going to look at
the labor movement differently. You're going to look at these
things as not necessarily huge movements that you're never going
to be able to unpact, but you'll see yourself as
a small part of this larger movement, right, like a

(53:15):
small part that is necessary understanding that a thousand people
doing small acts of disruption is so much more impactful
than everybody sitting around waiting for that one person to
take that one mantle and do everything themselves, right, and
so it allows you to have the courage to in
your daily life figure out ways that you can disrupt
at work, with your family and with resources that quite frankly,

(53:39):
don't cost money. It might cost you some position or privilege,
or some even just discomfort, but it actually doesn't cost
you a lot to actually intervene and be those daily disruptors.

Speaker 2 (53:51):
So you talk about in the third part of your book,
Disruption of Community. I really like the part where you
talk about spending your privilege. Can you talk a little
bit about that.

Speaker 4 (53:59):
So I spent a lot of time at Plan Parent
had I worked at Plan Parent's office.

Speaker 5 (54:02):
For six years.

Speaker 2 (54:04):
How are your colleagues, your former colleagues, how are they?

Speaker 5 (54:07):
They are going through it?

Speaker 2 (54:09):
They've been going through it, but even now.

Speaker 5 (54:11):
Yeah, they have been.

Speaker 4 (54:12):
But working at Plan Parent and the Reproductive Freedom movement,
I worked with a lot of white women right, and
there were a lot of conversations and I talk about
it in the book, a lot of conversations about how
white women can use their position and power and privilege
to expand the table and make sure that women of
colors voices were not only just listened to, but resourced

(54:32):
right and leadership positions that were that were supported. And
so I share that those stories, stories about Cecil Richards
and Senator Warren.

Speaker 5 (54:41):
Because I think when people hear in peace, I know,
my goodness.

Speaker 4 (54:44):
I'm actually going to a memorial for her tomorrow talk
about when she almost got us arrested one time.

Speaker 5 (54:50):
At a rally at Texas.

Speaker 2 (54:54):
Right, it's very on brand for her, what about what
about as?

Speaker 4 (55:00):
And God rest her soul? And I'm so grateful to
have worked with her so closely. And so I think
when people here spend your privilege, you think about white women, right,
using their privilege being white women, to intervene or to
be part of these movements. But I had to step
back and say, well, all of us, depending on the setting,
we have a certain privilege, right, whether it's socio economic,

(55:21):
whether it is education, whether it is I don't know,
whatever religion you are. I'm a Christian and that is
the dominant religion in the United States. That is a
privilege in certain settings, right, I should speak up for
other faiths. Whether you are heterosexual, and there's conversations around
what's happening to queer and trans.

Speaker 5 (55:38):
People, that is a privilege.

Speaker 4 (55:39):
And I break it down that all of us, at
some point in our lives do have some privilege that
we could spend to build a better community and show
up for folks who don't have the privilege of position
that we do.

Speaker 2 (55:51):
And that's a really important point. When you say minority
so often, it kind of loses its meaning but literally,
we are like this big compared to the majority. We
can't do it alone. It's just it's nonsense. You can't.
The ninety two is of what of thirteen percent? You
know of seven percent if you look at women. So yeah,

(56:11):
it's just very I just appreciate that, yeah, very much so.

Speaker 4 (56:15):
And to that point too, Mandy, speaking of the ninety
two percent of the seven percent, right can't do everything.
It's also why we have to be okay with taking
care of ourselves. There's a lot of talk about how
self care what, as Audrey Lord said, is an act
of political warfare, right, and words that really the words
that got me out of bed two days after Vice

(56:36):
President Harris lost the election were Alice Walker's words that said,
you have to keep a healthy soul to face constant oppression,
and that I think sums up the grace and permission
that we are giving ourselves as black women to say
it's actually okay for me to take care of myself
because this is a constant state of oppression that I'm in,

(57:00):
and we are the pillars of our community. So if
we are not okay, and I talk about this a
lot in the book, if we're not okay, the work
that we're doing in our communities will not be the
work that it needs to be right, and so it's
so imperative that we take care of ourselves also knowing
that we can't save everyone. And so at the end
of the day, I think we got to save ourselves

(57:20):
first before we even try to figure out a solution
that saves other people.

Speaker 5 (57:25):
And I'm in a place right.

Speaker 4 (57:26):
Now getting in deep, deep, deep community with people. And
as long as we can ride together and work together,
and I think those small communities begin to create bigger communities.

Speaker 5 (57:38):
That's how we get through this.

Speaker 4 (57:40):
But we have to be okay first, and part of
taking care of ourselves also allows for us to treat
each other better.

Speaker 2 (57:45):
I will bring it back to your faith that I'm
thinking about how you pray for and love as a
Christian for people that you don't agree with, that do
things that you don't agree with. Then it's like we
got to you know, do you so? Do you love
the eight percent? Are you just like cool with that?

Speaker 5 (58:01):
You asked me, like very directly, and now you are
challenging me. I mean I did name the books and
my favorite story of Jesus in the Bible flipping over tables.

Speaker 2 (58:10):
How is that a story in the Bible. I'm a heathen,
so you got to you gotta educate me.

Speaker 4 (58:14):
Yeah, no, it's it is a story in the Bible.
It's in the Bible three times a month.

Speaker 2 (58:18):
Not the lady from Real Housewives.

Speaker 1 (58:19):
No, that's not it.

Speaker 5 (58:20):
It's not. But I love Real Housewives. And so that's
also why this works, right.

Speaker 2 (58:24):
Either one, either one, you're kind of like getting it.

Speaker 5 (58:26):
Either way, you get it.

Speaker 2 (58:27):
You see the Jesus, sir Teresa, whatever her datement is. Yeah,
keep going, that's exactly it.

Speaker 4 (58:32):
That story kept coming to me, and I kept asking
myself what got Jesus so crunk that he was flipping
over tables? Like, that's the Jesus that I'm so interested in,
that's the red text Jesus that actually like aligns with
my political ideology. And then I like scaled back and
I said, oh, what are the proverbial tables that we

(58:53):
have to.

Speaker 5 (58:53):
Flip over in our communities, in our in our own lives.
And my faith is such a big part of me.

Speaker 4 (58:58):
My dad's a pastor, and I honestly know, and I
talk about a lot in the book, it is because
of my faith that I'm able to do all the
things that I do, and I realize me talking about
my faith so boldly is disruptive in the political space
because conservatives and rights well sit the other side, doesn't

(59:19):
they do Jesus feel like they make us feel like
Jesus is this like really judgmental person when the reality
is he would probably be deported if he.

Speaker 2 (59:28):
Was living on earth right now, sister friend wouldn't make
it through airport security. Let's just say listen.

Speaker 4 (59:35):
And so it was really important for me to talk
about my faith in a way that felt natural to me,
because just by doing that, it disrupts this notion of
what a person of faith who has these strong.

Speaker 5 (59:47):
Beliefs on social justice and politics could look like.

Speaker 2 (59:50):
Yeah, I mean sometimes I am jealous of people who
have such deep faith because it is a it's a
talisman or I don't know if that's sacrilegious to say,
but it is something that burns within you and gives
you that hope and you kind of are able to
give it away to a higher power. I'm not saying that.
And I think religion period, just all the various kinds

(01:00:10):
of religions my family, I grew up my aunt and
great uncle or Baptist preachers in Georgia, and my mom's
side is Irish Catholic.

Speaker 4 (01:00:20):
So one of the things, Mandy, that I've been thinking
about that I want to study or just get deeply
rooted in is the stories and the lessons of how
our ancestors got through the civil rights movement reconstruction during
the period of enslavement, because I feel as though there
were so many, so much of the solutions, so many
of the solutions that we're looking for, we could actually

(01:00:42):
find from our ancestors. And one of the things that
I realized is in order to get through all of
that required a very deep faith, whether in God or
through Christianity or something else, that there was a very
deep spiritual practice and a very deep faith that you know,
people are constantly saying, well, we're not our ancestors, we

(01:01:03):
may not be built like our ancestors, And I said, well,
it first starts with having a spiritual fortitude. And that
is the reminder for me to continue to like deepen
my faith. And as you're saying, you know, whether or
not you are a religious person or what you believe in,
just having that spiritual connection is so incredibly powerful, and
it keeps you anchored when everything looks like chaos around

(01:01:26):
you and quite frankly, you don't see.

Speaker 5 (01:01:27):
A way forward.

Speaker 2 (01:01:29):
I simply just think about the word love, like just
believe in love. For me, God is love. And my
friendships have become I mean, I was really, to your point,
tending to my friendships in the past few years and
really nurturing them. And it's that to me is like
something that I can really root some faith in. Is
that this power of community? And I just I love

(01:01:51):
I don't think there's a single person who's joined me
on the show since the New Year and hasn't mentioned
community and connection in some way. And I just think
if there's one great thing to come out of all
this chaos that we are in the middle of, it's
that I'm finding other people who are on the same
wavelength and I'm opening my arms. And I thank you
for opening your arms to me and to be a

(01:02:12):
fam and for sharing this wonderful book with us. Alencia,
I'm going to see you in New York. I got
I reserved my spot for your talk. Where is it
going to be a I don't know. I didn't even check.
I was just like sign me up, Oh my go,
thank you so excited.

Speaker 4 (01:02:25):
It will be at the Barnes and Noble Upper West
Side with Abby Phillip.

Speaker 2 (01:02:29):
Oh that's the one that's going to be great. Congratulations.
I'm so glad you're doing like a real proper and
you're gonna be in DC. I got I have a
lot of I have a community called the Mandy money Makers,
and I know I have a lot of d MB makers.
So I posted it in our slack and like three
or four of them already said that they bought tickets
to see you and enjoy in in DC.

Speaker 5 (01:02:50):
So it's going to be great. And those tickets are
like they're almost sold out.

Speaker 2 (01:02:54):
So no, of course it was really it was really
cool of her to go through all that drama and
get you know, her name even more in the press
to like drive up your sales.

Speaker 5 (01:03:04):
I mean, I was nice.

Speaker 4 (01:03:05):
I text her the morning all the news drop, you know,
we were talking. But then a few days later I
was like, here's some good news for you. We've got
over three hundred RSVPs.

Speaker 2 (01:03:14):
Like that's incredible.

Speaker 4 (01:03:15):
I want to see her in love on her and
she's she's a disruptor her. Yeah, Cabby and I'm going
on tour with Lovey and Chicago and Jessica Nabango and Detroit,
all disruptors, amazing dope women.

Speaker 2 (01:03:26):
Thank you, ba Fan for listening. Don't forget to go
pick up Alynsia's book here, it is right here. I'm
just gonna imagine I'm putting it on the screen. And also,
your website is flipthtables book dot com.

Speaker 3 (01:03:37):
Perfect.

Speaker 2 (01:03:38):
Congratulations. Thank you for sharing your light with us. Well,
I hope you enjoyed my conversation with a Lindsaya Johnson.
Thank you to jan Ellie and Chris for joining me
for another Brown Table and ba Faan, don't forget to like.
If you're on YouTube, like and subscribe. Don't just be
watching our stuff and not give us that little thumbs
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(01:04:00):
and Mission Podcast where we at oh on Instagram at
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If you want to check us out, submit a question
for the show, or just say hello and until next time, Bye,