April 4, 2025 • 48 mins
This week, we’re talking all things sales—breaking barriers, building wealth, and securing the bag. Mandi is joined by two powerhouse guests: Chantel George, founder of Sistas in Sales, and her brother Alex Woodruff, Sales Director at Fiddler, an AI software firm. They dive into the unique challenges women of color face in the sales industry, why representation matters, and how to carve out a thriving career in this space.
Chantel shares how Sistas in Sales is creating opportunities and support systems for women navigating the field, while Alex drops gems on career growth, negotiating compensation, and navigating corporate spaces as a Black professional. Plus, we get into personal finance tips, the perks of entrepreneurial ventures, and why understanding your worth is non-negotiable.
If you’re in sales, thinking about jumping in, or just looking for advice on making strategic money moves—this episode is for you!
What You’ll Learn:
💰 Negotiating compensation like a pro
📈 The power of financial planning
🚀 Why entrepreneurial moves might be your next big step
Links + Resources:
📲 Follow on Alex Instagram -https://www.instagram.com/alexjwoodruff/
📲 Follow on Chantel Instagram -https://www.instagram.com/chantelmedia/
🎙️ Stay connected with Brown Ambition → @brownambitionpodcast
Plus, we get into:
If you're in sales (or thinking about it), this episode is packed with insight to help you thrive!
Timestamps:
📌 00:00 - Intro + Meet Our Guests
📌 01:05 - Challenges for Women of Color in Sales
📌 03:43 - The Current Market & Opportunities
📌 06:30 - Career Growth & Overcoming Barriers
📌 10:34 - Personal Career Journeys
📌 19:06 - Sales Strategies & Success Tips
📌 26:49 - Managing Money in Sales
📌 27:37 - Breaking Down Compensation Structures
📌 32:01 - Why Living Below Your Means Matters
📌 32:49 - Smart Financial Planning for Sales Pros
📌 38:04 - Sisters in Sales: Building a Movement
📌 44:41 - The Power of Networking in Sales
📌 47:28 - Embracing Entrepreneurship
Hit play and get ready to level up! 🎧✨ #BrownAmbition #SalesSuccess #WomenInSales
See omnystudio.com/listener for privacy information.
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Transcript
Episode Transcript
Available transcripts are automatically generated. Complete accuracy is not guaranteed.
Speaker 1 (00:04):
All right, va fam.
Speaker 2 (00:06):
This has been a very long time coming, but I
am excited to introduce y'all to my co host for
this day, my guests, little combination of both. I have
the brilliant, the gorgeous, the talented, the intelligent, Chantel George. Everybody, Oh,
(00:27):
that's so weird, Alex, did you think.
Speaker 1 (00:28):
That was about awkward?
Speaker 3 (00:30):
Yeah? It was.
Speaker 4 (00:31):
It was really building up and I felt like it
was coming toward me. But that's fine, that's.
Speaker 2 (00:34):
Fine, that's fine. Uh, It's in our contract as siblings
that I'm not allowed to compliment you. First, I was
gonna take I was gonna go, like in the most
exquisite natural hair to really like stick the knife in,
but I didn't curls as popin. But I have Chantelle George, y'all.
She is a founder of Sisters and Sales. And I
(00:57):
also have my brother Alex Woodruff, who is a award
winning legendary filmmaker but by day is an AI sales
director for a company called Fiddler. And I wanted to
have you all on the show because this theme has
come up a lot for me and I know Chantelle
when I met you at Afrotech. It's something that we
(01:17):
bonded over was the idea of women of color, people
of color in sales as a career path and what
that can look like. So separately, Alex, you and I
had talked about the dearth of women and especially women
of color in sales and how even you, you know,
as you're working your way up, you're conscious of that,
(01:38):
you're conscious of the lack of diversity. And then Chantale,
you founding sisters in sales. I mean that was a
direct answer to what you perceived to be like, where
are we at? Where are we and this career path
that can be really lucrative, like I've seen how great
it's been for like my brother, and I want to
start by just asking, I guess both of you all
(01:59):
start with you, Chantelle, at the time that we're in now,
how do you feel like what do you think are
the biggest barriers for women of color breaking into sales
as a career path? Today?
Speaker 5 (02:14):
Thank you first of all for having me. I'm super
excited to be here, and I'm so happy that we
met last year.
Speaker 1 (02:21):
Oh thanks me too.
Speaker 5 (02:22):
I love that and I feel like we're gonna have
a great conversation today. I think that sorry to have
a hot take on this already. But my organization has
been around for eight years and it'll be eight years
this fall, and so in our ethos our philosophy is
that there are are less and less barriers to enter sales.
(02:46):
Not to say just because we are around, but I
do believe that from an organ from a company standpoint,
there have been so many companies that are rolling out
the red carpet or really trying to candidates where they're at,
showing up and sponsoring our events, showing up at afrotech,
showing up, you know, and partnering with with all kinds
(03:08):
of conferences at organizations. Sometimes I think that there's a
bit of misconception in our community, and we're working really
hard to change perception on both sides. So sales is
not what you may think it is, and we're saying
that to our community and then to our organization. We're
saying that there's some really incredible talent that you need
(03:30):
to find. But all Black History Months and all Women's Month,
we have been putting on events every week with companies.
Speaker 2 (03:37):
I've been busy. I'm bet getting the email busy. I've
been forwarding them too. I'm like go, go yes.
Speaker 5 (03:43):
So there has been so much appetite to hire women
from our network, and so it's sometimes it's just understanding
what it means to excel in sales, getting out of
your own way, really finding a mentor finding a community.
Because the job a hot, you're in a I mean,
a lot of the of the media says that the
(04:04):
market is in trouble, and I can understand that. You
know that does exist somewhere. But I don't know if
you feel the same way, Alex, but the need for
commercial roles right now feels like an all time high.
And that's coming from where we're sitting and the company,
the conversations that we're having.
Speaker 1 (04:20):
So I just think we need to get out there
and get that work.
Speaker 2 (04:24):
Well, thank you for correcting my perception. Yeah, I want
to hear more about Alex. What does it feel like
for you. I mean, you're in one of the hottest
fields right now AI.
Speaker 4 (04:33):
Well, I think for me, I'm at a startup right
So in my career, I've worked at big companies like
IBM and Salesforce, but for the last several years I've
been at startups, particularly in the AI space, and I
definitely feel as though the the intent for hiring diverse candidates,
(04:54):
particularly black candidates, for me, is really high because we
really want people on our teams that look like our
customers because it's a relationship business at the end of
the day, Like you want people who can connect with
your customers, and that means you need to be able
to have every type of person on your team, because
all of our customers are every type of person. And
I say that particularly for black people and recruitment right now,
(05:15):
because there is like, to me, there's this dearth when
I look at who's applying to roles, like it's ninety
nine percent not people who look like us. So I
think that there is there's definitely a you know, as
I'm hiring, I see that gap, and so I have
to like go to places and find the nooks and crannies.
(05:35):
And I don't have a big organization behind me like
Salesforce does or IBM does. You both from my perspective,
do really great work. I see, Chantell, you got a
Salesforce logo behind you. Like from my perspective, they did
really great work when I was there. They had you know,
activation groups within the company like Bold Force at Salesforce.
Speaker 3 (05:51):
And Black at IBM, and IBM.
Speaker 4 (05:53):
But when you're at a startup, you got to bootstrap
it a little bit and you don't have those big
machines behind you to help find where talent is and
that makes it harder. So for me, doing that search
itself is tough, but it's definitely work that's warranted because
if you don't, then you're going to miss out on,
you know, building better relationship with your clients. And at
(06:14):
the end of the day, that's what it's about.
Speaker 2 (06:16):
Oh, I low key kind of feel like systters in
sales is a great organization.
Speaker 1 (06:20):
For you to know about.
Speaker 4 (06:21):
Then I was yet before you got on, and I
was asking and I was like, what, so, hold on,
how does this work?
Speaker 3 (06:25):
Exactly?
Speaker 2 (06:26):
Yeah, I did that on purpose totally. All right, Well,
let's talk about the career of sales. And one thing
I did want to note when I was talking about
sort of like the dearth of women of color, people
in color and sales roles. For me, it's like people
in Alex's roles. So you're like, on a management level,
you're making hiring decisions. And I know you said in
prior interview, Chantelle, just how as you got into sales
(06:48):
you would see us at the entry level. You would
see us getting in the door, but it was not
necessarily us who was raising through the ranks. Do you
feel like that has changed as well? Are you seeing
more opportunities for growth in that way the women that
are getting recruited are they getting to the top.
Speaker 1 (07:05):
That's a good question, so two answers.
Speaker 5 (07:11):
If they come in as entry or early mid level,
it does require corporate finesse to get to the top.
And I think that this is a challenge for our community.
Because Alex and I were talking right before this podcast started.
Speaker 2 (07:27):
I had a whole interview.
Speaker 1 (07:29):
I was in here.
Speaker 2 (07:31):
Save it for me, all right, fine.
Speaker 1 (07:34):
Catch me up.
Speaker 5 (07:34):
We'll talk about and really kind of thinking about what
is your what what were you exposed to growing up?
What type of career paths you know are you familiar with,
and that will help guide you when it's time to
ask for promotions. Like if you had a parent that
worked in sales, they may have done role playing with
(07:55):
you about this when you were growing up. One time
I spoke on a podcast us about the language of
business and how that's not involved in your day to
day you know, upbringing, it can be challenging to insert
that when you need it in your twenties or your
early thirties as you're looking to get up the corporate ladder.
And so it's really those unspoken rules and the lack
(08:18):
of mentorship and connections internally that can prevent you from
getting to that next level, which is what we do
insis we do help kind of unpack that and add
clarity to what you need to do, how you need
to handle it. We need to ask to have a conversations,
you need to have et cetera. So that's one thing, yes,
that does exist, and it's happening as we speak. There's
(08:39):
challenges moving up internally when you start low when you're
trying to get high. But the other on the other side,
if you are already senior and you're trying to go
laterally or just one step up, you can also encounter
issues because getting a job when you're senior to like,
(09:00):
for example, if you're a VP and you're trying to
be an SVP or your VP and you're just trying
to get in the door as a VP, that's a
whole other level of networking to get in the door.
There's a whole other level of how to play the
game and how to present yourself. And it is another
level that I think that women of color are starting
(09:21):
to really think through with their career choices and decision making.
For example, heb be two examples. There are a lot
of industry events that happen all over the world and
all over can see Yes and Dreamforce for example, as
if you spoke about Salesforce. And historically even vps that
were not on the budgets to attend would not attend
(09:43):
if their company did not give them authorization to. Nowadays,
women of color are paying out of pocket to go
to these industry events so that they can make their
own paths, so that they can establish and secure their future,
especially as mentioned if their senior level looking for another
senior in and that's just required. And I think that
for a while we were shy to do that, and
(10:06):
we are no longer shy about paying our own way
if it's what it's, if what we need to do,
and going to the places where we can meet the
right people to help us shepherd us up the ladder,
you know, from where we are to where we need
to be. So hopefully that answers your questions in two parts.
It's both an internal struggle and the external struggle depending
on where you are in your career.
Speaker 2 (10:26):
I think you explained that so well, and I am
also reminded of how special and unique you each are.
Speaker 1 (10:34):
Alex.
Speaker 2 (10:34):
I've obviously watched you just I mean, I think that
you and I both approached our careers in similar ways,
which is that we were never necessarily loyal to one employer.
We got what we could get out of it, and
we were not afraid necessarily. I know some of your
choices were not your own to be moving on, but
some of them were. And also you chantelle like you've Alex,
(10:56):
you've worked at eight PM and Salesforce where else Mule
something or other and Fiddler, which I had learned today
has an e in it, and chantel you have worked
at Yelp and LinkedIn and Salesforce?
Speaker 3 (11:10):
Right?
Speaker 2 (11:10):
Am I wrong?
Speaker 3 (11:11):
Tonight?
Speaker 1 (11:11):
Get that Twitter? Twitter, Twitter minor.
Speaker 2 (11:15):
So y'all are the exceptions to this? This this sort
of like you know, glass wall or whatever you want
to call it, that we can oh, I believe the
phrase is like broken wrong So you get on the ladder,
but it can be hard to move up. So can
y'all each kind of tell me your career stories and
what how you approached and how you were able to
make moves and raise through the ranks. Alex want to start.
Speaker 4 (11:38):
Yeah, I think in sales, the first thing you have
to wonder is do you want to rise up the ranks?
I think particularly in sales, and I'll explain why. So
there's like an old trope in sales, like sales management.
Sales managers typically make less money than a really great
sales rep. However, because of the commission, if you've exactly right,
(12:00):
Like let's say if your let's say you're a sales
manager and you have seven people on your team. In
order for you to hit your number and actually hit
your potential accelerators and your best commission you can get,
all seven people on your team need to hit their numbers, right,
or your seven people need to accumulate enough revenue that
matches your overall quota for that for that seven person
territory that you own, right. But if you're an individual contributor,
(12:23):
you only have to focus on your own territory.
Speaker 3 (12:26):
Right.
Speaker 4 (12:26):
It's let's say your your quota is one seventh of
what your managers is. And now if you blow it out,
maybe your manager doesn't get that big bump because the
other folks on your team didn't, but you will, right,
And so there's this there's there's certainly a lot of
extremely talented sales reps who could have gone into management
(12:47):
a long time ago but have chosen not to because
they're like, why, I don't want to just manage a
spreadsheet all day and have to like talk to seven
other people and do my job through those people. There's
a there's like a there's a there's questions about that
and whether it's like the right thing to do in
that particular, in this particular, you know job. And I
don't think that that is the same for other careers.
I could be wrong, but I think it's I think
(13:09):
it's unique about sales. For me, it was like waiting
for the right opportunity to want to be a leader,
and also to get that opportunity. It was kind of
a they both happened at the same time. So I
think as I was at IBM, I had become a
high performer there, but I felt like the ceiling was
a little bit lower, you know, candidly, because IBM is
a really big company and there's always this this trope
(13:32):
you never get fired for buying IBM, And so if
you never get fired for buying IBM, then it's kind
of easier.
Speaker 3 (13:39):
To sell, right. So as you grow in.
Speaker 2 (13:42):
Your kids, it's like, yeah, and.
Speaker 4 (13:45):
As you grow in your career, you kind of want
to sell things that maybe they're a little bit more
challenging and also more cutting edge. And so I went
to a smaller company at that time, Mealsoft, which ended
up being acquired by Salesforce, and I started to cut
my teeth there and like learn how to actually do
this job at a company where not everyone knows that
company's name or had a grandfather who worked at that company. Right,
(14:06):
But it still got pretty big because Salesforce was the
you know, acquired them, and they put their own stamp
on things. So I eventually decided I wanted to go
smaller because for me, I love the entrepreneurial side of things.
Speaker 3 (14:18):
I love being autonomous.
Speaker 4 (14:19):
I love building my own schedule and finding my own
clients and all that kind of stuff and not necessarily
feeling like a cog in the machine.
Speaker 3 (14:26):
So I did well at.
Speaker 4 (14:27):
A couple of startups over the last couple of years,
but when I got to Fiddler, it felt like the
right time because my performance was high, but what the
team needed and what the company needed at the time
kind of matched where I was in my career. And
not only that, they took sort of a bet on me,
you know, being younger, being someone that doesn't look like
(14:49):
every head of sales. They did, you know, promote me
to that role and gave me a chance to deliver
there and we're doing pretty good so far. So I
really appreciate it for the opportunity, but it also kind
of met me at a time in my life where
I was. I was performing high enough to try it
because it was a new challenge, and also I knew
the company well. I believed in the leadership. It's a
(15:11):
great culture. I felt like if I was going to
take this leak, this would be the place to do it.
Speaker 2 (15:21):
For someone who's mid level, early career, who may be
super intimidated by speaking and presenting yourself and getting to
know the higher ups who may decide that they're worth
taking a bet on, how did you build rapport with them?
And if you have any advice for people who may
feel a little bit intimidated by.
Speaker 4 (15:40):
That, I think as long as you as long as
you deliver and exceed what it is that set out
in front of you, it becomes a lot easier. Right, So,
if I was underperforming, or if I was like just
meeting performance, then it'd be harder for me to feel
very confident walking into a room where I'm talking to
somebody who's a CEO or one of our board members
(16:01):
or something like that. But if I know that I'm
coming in as a high high performer, and that's that's
my floor.
Speaker 3 (16:06):
My floor is high performer, right, So.
Speaker 4 (16:09):
No matter what happened in this meeting, no matter if
they give me a promotion or tell me to kick
rocks or whatever, I'll just go back to being a
high performer. I think it gives me a little bit
more confidence to to just try it and take that
risk and take that leap and say, hey, here's what
I would do if given this opportunity.
Speaker 3 (16:24):
Here's my plan.
Speaker 4 (16:25):
I've never done it before, but I think this plan
feels sound and I'm facing it off of things I've
seen before. And let's you know, what's the alternative. The
alternative is taking this path. And do you think this
path would be more lucrative for us?
Speaker 3 (16:40):
I would say no. So this is why I'm presenting
this plan.
Speaker 4 (16:43):
But again, I had the confidence to do that because
I felt very solid in my in my belief in myself.
The culture of my company is a really great one
where they reward internal folks or folks internally who are
performing really well. So I kind of just felt like
this is a I had no reason not to be
confident going into those rooms, because ultimately, the worst that
(17:03):
could happen is I just go back to what was
already working for me.
Speaker 2 (17:07):
So it sounds like, just be really freaking good at selling.
That can help, well, be like good at your job.
Speaker 3 (17:15):
I've been doing it for ten years.
Speaker 2 (17:16):
I asked the hard hitting questions.
Speaker 4 (17:18):
You get better at it over time, if you if
you're really double in learning and like you and you
and you, you know, listen to your mentors and you
start to grow in your role and growing your profession
and you're discipline like, you get better eventually and you
start to hit those you start to hit those milestones
for yourself. Yeah, you've earned the right to be confident,
So don't don't don't take that away from yourself.
Speaker 5 (17:41):
I agree with that, John, I just want to say
I agree. That's actually one of the best things about
working in sales, like, the better you are, the easier
it is to navigate internally, the easier it is to
gain visibility. Obviously, the more money you make. And I
just think it makes you a better conversationalist. So even
outside of work, you communicate more effectively. You communicate with confidence.
(18:07):
You know, we're selling most of the time just with
our voice. At least back in the day when I
first started sales, I was a telesalesperson. I sold with
my voice, So my voice became my instrument, and the
way that I talk and the way that I listen
and the way that I construct sentences was how it
was my superpower. But I definitely want to chime into
(18:27):
Alex's point. Another tip would be leveraging your first ninety days,
Like if you're new, you can get away with a
lot of things. You know, you can go to the
top per former and say, I just want to listen
to your calls and see how you do things.
Speaker 1 (18:40):
You know, that's when I'm not a threat yet. Yeah,
that was a perfect time for me.
Speaker 5 (18:45):
I soaked up and made a lot of connections because
people remember what it's like to be new, and you
can just get away with being that curious person, and
no one is going to tell you no. You know,
you run into someone in the elevator. You don't even
know who that person is. It could be on the board,
that could be the COO, CFO whatever, and you introduce
yourself because you're new. And funnily enough, you actually can
(19:08):
use that even in a sales call. For example, if
you're working in like an account management role and you're
taking over accounts, that's also a really great time to
add your own I guess flavor, but also a great
time to get information out of people because you're new
and so I just took over this account. I don't
know much about what's going other than what Sally told me.
(19:30):
I would love to learn everything. Let's start from the beginning. Also,
why aren't you signing this contract? I'm just curious. I'm new,
so you know a lot of things that you get
with being new and that we should be taking advantage of.
I've seen white counterparts really take advantage of the new card.
Speaker 4 (19:48):
Okay, no, yeah, agree, It's like the best thing to
do is just play dumb in sales.
Speaker 3 (19:55):
You learn so much when you just played domb In.
Speaker 4 (19:57):
Fact, to say, I know you're joking, but no, I'm not.
Speaker 2 (20:02):
But you've told me that before, and I've seen you
do it, So I.
Speaker 4 (20:05):
Think it is a skill when you're in text, when
you're in tech sales and you're not technical. I did
not go to school for technology. I did not grow
up tech as a technologist. But I have a curiosity
about technology and I have I think, good common sense.
So if I just go in and ask reasonable human questions,
not technical questions, I will learn really important technical things,
(20:27):
and I can write those things down and I can
tell someone smarter than me who will be like, oh,
here's how we should interpret that, and then we go
back to the customer and provide a proposal that meets
what they not only what they want, but also you know,
what they really got to have right now. So I
think playing dumb and learning from your customers, I suppose
like walking in and thinking you need to like present
(20:48):
them with the perfect you know elevator pitch, every you know,
every first call.
Speaker 3 (20:53):
I think that that gets you a lot first.
Speaker 5 (20:54):
Grade, and people like to know that you are approaching
their business with humility.
Speaker 1 (21:01):
It makes them feel comfortable.
Speaker 2 (21:02):
And trusting them that they know what their biggest issues
are and what problems they need solve a little bit,
and then giving them the reassurance that you're listening to
them and you care about what they're going through and
like you're going to find the best fit if you
can for them through your product.
Speaker 4 (21:18):
Yeah, that's consultative selling is like learning from them, reassuring them,
and yeah, it's the best way to own the fact
that you're young in sales or you're black in sales
and you may not be like everyone else that you're
talking to is to kind of just own it and
ask questions and not try to go in Let's say
(21:39):
I'm younger, I'm half the age of the person I'm
trying to sell to, and they've been working in AI
since before I was born, Right, I can't go in
there and try to pretend like I know AI better
than them, or try to like surprise them with an
interesting fact Like I'm not going to do it. It's
very unlikely that I'm going to be able to shock
this person with my AI knowledge. I won't, So instead,
(22:00):
just be like, really, you know, be myself, be a
good person to them, ask them questions, tell them that
I'm their conduit to whatever it is that their challenge,
and solution that they have in mind. Is that gets
me a lot further than trying to go in and
assume that like I have to present some you know,
killer fact, right, But then by the time I learn
all those things now, I do probably know toward the
(22:22):
later stages of the sales cycle what it is that's
going to make this person you know, really successful.
Speaker 3 (22:26):
And then best when you pitch, I wanted.
Speaker 5 (22:29):
To add to what you said, Alex, because it sounds
like we're talking about like the discovery get to know
you face. There are also some technical things that you
can bring in from a communications standpoint, like mirroring, so
pretty much repeating back what the prospects said so they
feel like they're here, you're hearing them. Similarly when someone
says their name and you say their name back to them,
(22:50):
so that really helps. And then obviously like framing questions
with empathy. For example, if like you said, you can't
shock them within AI fact, but you can use something
about AI to empathize with them. It seems like there's
a lot going on in the world of AI in
your world that must be overwhelming. Can you tell me
(23:12):
about how you feel about this particular thing or what
you know that must be overwhelming or that must be
a lot to handle it, that must be a lot
on your plate. So creating those empathetic connections and then
you know, there's there's so many communication tips and tricks
that you can use and to how you talk to
people that can give you so much information and really
(23:36):
allow you to be that detective in that conversation. And
I think another misconception about sales. The sales is mostly listening.
It's really like getting information and trying to understand what
is this person dealing with?
Speaker 1 (23:50):
What is your problem? Do they even know their problem?
You know? And how?
Speaker 5 (23:54):
And then how can you help guide them towards your solution.
So yeah, I love what you said out just wanted
to add some of those technical pieces there and.
Speaker 4 (24:02):
What you said earlier about how you can use some
of these things in your regular life, Like where you're
talking about, you know, just listen or repeat back to
people what they've said to you. That is really helpful
in sales, and it's also great in my personal life
because a lot of times you misunderstand things, especially when
you're in sales. At the end of the day, I
am selling something, right, so if I sell this thing
(24:23):
I make money, so that means in my head, I
want to sell this thing. And so if I go
into the call thinking like that, which I typically do,
everything sounds like something I should try to pounce on
to sell the thing I want to sell. But you
got to relax yourself and ask questions, because if you
do that and you start to like say, well, hey,
did you just say this? Or am I understanding correctly
(24:45):
that this? Now, you might find out that the thing
that you were about to pounce on is actually a
red hearing. It actually isn't something you should have pounced on,
and if you did, you would have come off looking
you know, to salesy or not listening to the person,
or you know, having a misconception.
Speaker 3 (24:59):
And that also is very.
Speaker 4 (25:00):
True in regular life where you're talking to your partner,
or you're talking to a parent or family member and
if they say one thing that really like triggers you
and you want to be upset, maybe it's better to
just like.
Speaker 3 (25:13):
What hold on, are you saying this or did you
mean that?
Speaker 4 (25:17):
And then you end up finding out that the thing
that they were even you know, indicating, is not what
you were thought it was. So yeah, all of those
things I think they matter both professionally and personally, and
I definitely learned that in sales.
Speaker 2 (25:30):
Yeah, having never triggered you in my entire life, I
don't exactly know what you mean, but I can imagine.
I can imagine. All Right, I want to talk about Monday, honey,
because I think, Chantelle, one of the things that we
talked about at afro Tech was sort of like just
the conversation around compensation. And I have seen Alex, you know,
(25:55):
celebrate them big wins, those big page tecks. Honey. We
love that, But you are kind of, you mean it,
basically a solopreneur. When you're in sales, you are kind
of like running your own little business, and I relate
to that now, being a full time solo preneur, the
ebbs and flows of that income can be challenging. So
can y'all talk about how you've learned to navigate your
personal finances while pursuing this career path. I know, chantal Val,
(26:19):
you are full time with systems and sales, but still
any advice on how to handle We.
Speaker 5 (26:25):
Actually just had an a vement about this yesterday with Gusto,
the VP of compensation, was on the line, and so First,
I think it's most important to understand what actually is
your compensation. I know sales can be tricky, and some
companies make it actually trickier on purpose, But there are
a lot of variables to consider when looking at a
(26:49):
compensation plan.
Speaker 1 (26:50):
Your percentage to quota accelerator.
Speaker 5 (26:53):
We talked about your equity that's available to you depending
on the kind of company you're working for, paid time off, vesting, schedule,
so many things, and so it can help to know
what exactly are you getting paid for a holistically outside
of your base salary. Also, how is it broken up,
and which one of these things are going to impact
(27:13):
your personal life short term, medium, a long term. For example,
when I worked for LinkedIn, I was getting Microsoft stock.
That's a long term financial planning like facet of my portfolio.
That's nothing to do with what I'm getting paid.
Speaker 1 (27:29):
Every two weeks.
Speaker 5 (27:31):
Also, depending on how frequently you get paid your commission
can also determine your short term, medium and long term goals.
I went from getting commissioned monthly and some jobs to
quarterly to annually. And I think that depending on your
personal lifestyle, you should pick roles that obviously match up
(27:52):
with how you like to get paid and what makes
sense for you, and then I think taking a step back,
some of this can be also negotiated at the offer stage.
So for example, I've had colleagues that have negotiated parking,
free parking, all kinds of perks and things that are
actually have cash value that you can negotiate and get
(28:12):
under control. And I think lastly would be the way
that we spend our money is something that you really
become very aware of working in sales. Our jobs are
very stressful. Some of us splurge a lot in our
careers working in sales because we're waiting for so long
(28:34):
to get this commission and we've already made this wish
list of things in our mind we're going to buy
with it, because that's what keeps us motivated day after
day after day. And so it's really important of a
financial advisor that can kind of bring you back to
earth when you finally get this crazy commission check. These
commission checks can be six figures lumpso just landing in
your bank account. And so even though you have all
(28:56):
this time to kind of think about all the things
you're going to buy between those commission check bumps, you
should also be talking with the financial advisor about what
you're going to invest in and how you're going to
do those things. And so there were financial advisors that
used to be passed around that the companies I worked
at that different salespeople would trust and so that was
(29:16):
a huge benefit. So there's a few things, right, it's
the offer, just to recap the offer, It's about understanding
your compensation structure and if it works for you on
a personal level. And then it's about really monitoring your
own spending habits because we get paid in such a
lumpy way and if we don't hit quote, we don't
get paid at all. So mind over matter when it
comes to what to do when that money hits your account.
Speaker 4 (29:37):
Yeah, and I'll say, from my perspective, I'll just speak.
I'll speak specifically to people who have a base salary
plus variable compensation jobs otherwise known as ote on target earnings.
So this means you work at a company, they pay
you a base salary and then you have a variable
that is also contractually obligated or is contractedly stated in
(29:59):
your contract. If you hit your number to the number
you hit exactly your number, you will be paid this
much in a variable bonus right throughout the year. So
to those people, let's say your base salary is one
hundred K and your variable as one hundred K, so
you have a two hundred k on target earnings. That
does not mean you will make two undred K that year.
That means that if you hit your quota exactly, you
(30:21):
will make two under K. If you miss your quota
by half, you'll make one hundred and fifty K. If
you miss your quota by seventy five percent, you'll make
one hundred and twenty five K.
Speaker 3 (30:29):
Hopefully that makes sense.
Speaker 4 (30:32):
My philosophy is to live on my base and play
on my commissions, right like that, That's kind of how
I think about it. I don't I like to live
below my means because even if I'm having a great year,
I'm killing it in sales. Whenever those big commission checks
come in, they sit in my checking account for less
than twenty four hours. I got to get it out
of there, like I put it immediately into like a hy.
Speaker 3 (30:55):
Old savings account.
Speaker 4 (30:56):
And then when it's in there and it's safe and
it feels like harder to access, then I started thinking
about what to.
Speaker 3 (31:01):
Do with it.
Speaker 4 (31:02):
Okay, do I want to put it in a wrath
or do I want to go and like make this
investment in a home, or do I want to go
on a vacation with this much?
Speaker 3 (31:11):
And then I want to go on and do this
with that much? Like a financial planner?
Speaker 1 (31:15):
Yeah, have you had a planner before?
Speaker 3 (31:17):
No? I had.
Speaker 2 (31:23):
I remember talking to you when you got maybe one
of your first big commissions at IBM, and I was like, wait, what,
It's a lot of money. And I was like, I
just wasn't aware that was what it was like. And
we were first Yeah, we were talking about four one
k's and stuff, and like then you bought your condo.
So I mean, I think that you made some savvy choices, Alex,
(31:44):
you know, with your your money, and what were you
using as your source of like knowledge? There was it
just like going off of what other folks were doing.
Were you reading books? Were you listening to your big sister?
You know?
Speaker 3 (31:59):
Well, I definitely was listening to you with respect.
Speaker 4 (32:02):
I never knew what a high old savings account was,
and I feel like that a high old savings account
is definitely the secret for me. I'm not saying this
works for everybody. The reason it works for me is
because if the money is sitting in my checking account,
it will feel like mine and I will want to
do things with it. When it goes into somewhere else
where I have less access to it, or maybe it
takes a couple of days for it to get back
to me, it feels more strategic. Now I'm like, Okay,
(32:24):
what do I want to do with it? And while
it's over there by the way, it's you know, it's
making me money. It's earning me three to five percent interest,
depending on what the rates are at the time.
Speaker 3 (32:33):
So like to me.
Speaker 4 (32:34):
That that's that's what my little secret weapon is because
once it's there, I can start to be strategic and
I can start to think about what it is I
want to do. So at the time, like you mentioned,
I bought a condo I need. I needed a place
to live, and it felt like a good idea to
buy as a poster to rent. That's a good time
to go into myiold savings account, pull out a deposit
and buy that condo, right And then when I decided
(32:56):
I wanted to build my house, I had built up
enough money in my high you old savings account to
get me through that initial deposit for building the house,
and then luckily I had a really good year of
sales wise, and I was able to get through that
build like those. But all of that wouldn't have been
possible if I had just, like you know, left that
money in my checking went and bought a car, did
whatever the crazy thing I wanted to do at the time.
(33:18):
But I needed to like put it somewhere else so
I could look at it and like get strategic about
what makes sense for me right now. I think at
some point I definitely will get a financial planner, But
at this time in my life, I don't have any kids.
I am doing, you know, quite well for myself, and
I have some unusual things I do splurge on, like
making movies. I don't really want to talk to a
(33:38):
financial planner about making movies.
Speaker 3 (33:41):
There's nothing financially advisable about what.
Speaker 2 (33:43):
I'm doing aresting. Do you invest now or is it
just okay you do.
Speaker 4 (33:48):
I put some things in stocks, I put some things
in index funds, like you taught me some years ago,
but like a lot of my money goes into making films,
and that is not financially advisable. I don't want to
have to explain that to somebody, maybe that's short sighted
in me and I should get one. But for now,
it's proba going pretty well without having a financial planner.
And I'm kind of like, let me get to a
point where maybe I have more complications in my life,
(34:10):
like I have children, for instance, or I need to
like think about a different type.
Speaker 3 (34:15):
Of property I want to own, like things that aren't
as straightforward.
Speaker 2 (34:18):
That's a fair point, I really, I mean, I think
that makes sense. I also feel like with financial planners,
they certainly I think it's so smart Chantelle to give
that tip because with a big windfall, they can help
you like save yourself, save yourself from yourself. And those
periods in my life where I have been where I
have also gotten windfalls, I mean in different ways.
Speaker 3 (34:41):
It's yeah for me, I guess Alex, you have like a.
Speaker 2 (34:45):
Much stronger mind for creating like mental barriers with your money.
And like for me and a Highel savings account isn't enough,
I need it to be like locked up in a
vault pushing now that to my mom. I tell you
hot wheels, like I just didn't. I need to buy
stock and whatever company owns them, because like maybe it
is so expensive keeping my son in with the latest
(35:06):
wheels and yeah, So anyway, financial planners are great. I
know that BA FAM has you know, knows where to
find them. National Association of Personal Financial Planners x Y planning.
We talked about I like chan tell you said, like
you just learned from your colleagues, Like who were you using.
Speaker 3 (35:24):
To add something real quick? I forgot one.
Speaker 4 (35:27):
One place I definitely learned a lot was when I
joined IBM. And I'm guessing this is that a lot
of big companies they had this program called money.
Speaker 3 (35:35):
Smart I think it was what it was called.
Speaker 4 (35:37):
But basically it was like somebody within IBM or like
a like a third party that they contracted that was
there to advise IBM ors on how to set up
their four oh one K, which one to pick, what's
their risk profile, what year they wanted it to go
until things I still fully don't understand, but like that
at that time I probably knew more than I do
now because that person was I was able to call
(35:57):
that person instead of meeting with them anytime they were
like not helping me navigate what types of retirement accounts
were important for me. So I believe Salesforce had this
as well when I was there, but I'm not. I
can't say for sure, but I don't think IBM's the
only company that has this. So if you do work
at a company that's you know, large, maybe look into
that too, because there's folks within that company that are like,
(36:18):
you know, they're providing you a four one K. They
want to see you, you know, leveraging that to your success.
Speaker 2 (36:24):
Good point, Chantell, Can you tell us about sisters in sales?
I want to give you a moment to just talk
about the journey that you've been on these past eight
years and what that has been.
Speaker 1 (36:36):
Like, how are you How is cistis in sales?
Speaker 5 (36:38):
Oh, I'm doing okay. I think it's been the journey
of entrepreneurship. I was a entrepreneur for the first six
years building this while I was working as a sales professional.
I realized that I didn't have any mentors or connections
in the industry, and I just felt like, you know,
taking myself back. I just didn't feel like the work
(37:00):
that I was doing was sales like it was it
was porting me. Obviously, cold calling, cold emailing, appointments, pitching
and closing these are all things that were important, but
when I would look at other professionals who had a
sales background, their jobs seemed much more interesting and cooler
and unique, and I just felt like the road I
(37:23):
was on wasn't leading me there. And much more, their
job seem much more strategic, much much more I suppose
important to the company because we're doing the enterprise deals.
And so I made it my mission to understand the
evolution of a sales professional, but specifically in tandem and
in partnership with women that look like me. And so
(37:45):
I would have these interviews with these women and I
would write their stories and they would tell me about
all of the things that they're doing and the private
jets and these salaries and the lifestyle. And I was like,
I don't think that I'm on the path to get there.
So we got to start this from the beginning. You know,
I love that I'm getting good at the job. How
do I play the game? And so that was really
(38:06):
the biggest pivot. And so our first public event actually
was at Salesforce. They were our first corporate partner, and
they opened up the doors for us at the New
York City Tower and they allowed us to have our
first event. And this was the first time that New
York City saleswomen of Club I were able to meet
each other. We didn't have a website, and we didn't
have I didn't have a business card. But one of
(38:27):
the adp there, Amy Frank. Can never forget her because
we honored her at our gala last year. Excuse me
the year before she was our sponsor. And it wasn't monetary.
It was just here's some space space to do your event,
don't mess anything up. I was like fine, And it
was life changing. People that have been in sales for
(38:47):
twenty years, two years that didn't have connections, that were
able to meet valuable connections and answer important questions that
were on everyone's mind. So I feel very thankful of
the journey, you know, from that event now to twenty
thousand globally and a thriving virtual community.
Speaker 2 (39:05):
Twenty thousand. Let me update my notes. I had twelve
that's outdated.
Speaker 3 (39:08):
Intel that's incredible. I think a twenty thousand. That's amazing.
Speaker 5 (39:13):
Yes, and we have an amazing team and we are
all literally all over the world. We're in Denver next week,
and in New York and in London and just so
so many events and so much support and so much
visibility and transparency.
Speaker 1 (39:30):
That's the biggest thing.
Speaker 5 (39:31):
You don't have to go into your job and work
in sales and not know anything anymore. You can hang
someone in our app and get connected to someone who
can answer your questions. And if you don't have any
job prospects, come to our events. They are looking for you.
So that's what we're solving for. It is invigorating. It
brings me joy, brings me, it makes me bright, and
I'm super excited to be doing this work.
Speaker 4 (39:53):
You know, to ask your question, Oh yeah, sure, go ahead.
I was going to say, do you what about for
entry level? Do you have programs or you know, anything
that you do specifically for people trying to get into
sales for the first time.
Speaker 5 (40:04):
We have a whole program. It's called the Aspiring Sellers
for people looking to get into sales for the first time.
So yeah, we have an annual event called the Aspiring Sellers.
We have coaching and training for aspiring sellers. They are
a part of our community. Definitely, that's great.
Speaker 4 (40:21):
I hear people all the time asking me how do
I get into sales, and like, I only know the
way I did it, which was like go to a
big company and be like one of you know, ten
fifteen thousand salespeople or so. And I did learn a
lot there. But yeah, that's really awesome to start pointing
people towards you.
Speaker 2 (40:36):
Thank you business model wise like you were. Also, you're
not like you do so much good for us, right
for people of color, But you're not a nonprofit and
I want to point that out right, Am I wrong?
You're a for profit?
Speaker 1 (40:51):
No, you're membership.
Speaker 2 (40:52):
You know, people pay a membership fee. I just want
to I want to acknowledge that because I do feel
like there is especially women of color, like we tend
to think when my business is going to do good,
some kind of community good or you know, help in
some way, that it needs to be a nonprofit for
some reason, and then you're chasing grant money and like
you know those types of funding sources. What was the
(41:15):
decision behind that and how has that been, Like how
have you been finding it taking that approach.
Speaker 5 (41:21):
I did what I'm good at, which is closing contracts,
and so I am not a nonprofit guru. I never
even considered it at the beginning. I knew that if
I had a great product and great connections, I could
walk in and I can make business happen, and it's
easier for me. And we're faster because we don't have
(41:43):
those types of restrictions and hurdles. And because we're faster,
we are able to serve our customer as a And
when I say that in this case, I'm talking about
the B to B corporate partners and sponsors in inventive ways.
And so we have a board, an advisory board with
excellent saleswomen, and they support us and they give us
(42:05):
direction and they give us ideas. But this is a
structure that.
Speaker 2 (42:09):
Works for us wonderful. So how close are you to
that private jet?
Speaker 1 (42:12):
How's that going? I know, hopefully soon?
Speaker 2 (42:18):
What sorts of secrets have y'all unlocked? In terms of,
like I know, Chantell, I think it's so relatable that
idea that like you're looking at other people and you're like,
what am I missing? How do I get on that
conveyor belt over there? What was it that you found
you were missing? Was it just connections?
Speaker 1 (42:35):
Did you have?
Speaker 2 (42:35):
Does everyone need to go find assistance in sales to
then make the context that they need.
Speaker 1 (42:40):
To succeed everything?
Speaker 5 (42:43):
Number one, Even as an entrepreneur, connection brought capital to
me everything like professional services, legal marketing, like connections are
so so important and sometimes and the sales professional, Yes,
join an organization, hopefully join mine if you're interested, but
(43:04):
join any organization because it's curated connections. You don't even
have to go out and seek these people cold. They're
c rated, delivered to you on a stick.
Speaker 3 (43:13):
Here you go.
Speaker 5 (43:15):
But as an entrepreneur, connections are so important because there's
so many situations that you're going to get yourself in,
so many challenges you're going to get yourself in. You
need to know people who know what to do, who
know who to call, who know how to help you,
know how to support you as completely uncharted territory. There
are similarly organizations for entrepreneurs too, of course, but I
think that you know, for both sides of the coin,
(43:37):
you have to know people.
Speaker 1 (43:39):
You just have to.
Speaker 5 (43:40):
It's all requirement for you to get through the ebbs
and flows of life. So hopefully people get out of
their shell if they're shy or introverted, and you don't
have to go to everything every time, but you should
have an organization, you know, in the back burner that
you could tap into.
Speaker 2 (43:55):
I love that, Alex, do you are you part of
any like sales organization speak for the men's what y'all
doing out there?
Speaker 3 (44:01):
No, I'm not, and I want to learn more about them.
Speaker 4 (44:05):
I yeah, assistant sales is the first time I've heard
of anything like this before, and I'm like, now that
I'm learning about it, I'm like, I'm sure there's something
like this for guys, or something like this for black
people in general, or something like this for people in
AI or what you know.
Speaker 3 (44:18):
So I need to look into that because especially as as.
Speaker 4 (44:21):
Someone hiring, Yeah, like having some having a place to
just reach out and ask like, hey, is anyone looking?
Is anyone interested? Here's the rec like that would be awesome.
So yeah, I need to look into this for sure.
Speaker 3 (44:33):
Yeah.
Speaker 2 (44:34):
And one quick question for you, Chantelle on that is, like,
with this whole mission from the current administration to do
away with Wolke policies and DEI, have you seen that
impacting your business yet? Or are you still getting the
same interest from corporations who recognize the value in a
diverse salesforce.
Speaker 5 (44:50):
People still recognize the value. They are, of course, are
doing their due diligence as they should with anything, whether
or not they are for or against you administration. They
have to do as a business, do their due diligence
and organizations. But we're pushing forward. Our theme for this
year is called Redefine your revenue. Revenue and income can
(45:11):
come from multiple things. One is a nine to five,
the other is your independent work. You know, we are
encouraging our sales professionals to be consultants, to be fractional
sales leaders, to not wait for a large brand to
take interest in you all the time. But you may
have something to offer an entrepreneur who's looking for their
first sales hire or a company that is looking to
(45:31):
create structure, and you know, bring on a bunch of people.
You have skills that you've learned from these companies, it's
time to monetize them. So that's what our whole year
is about, and that's what our summit in September is
going to be really double tapping on. So one way
or the other, we believe in our community or rive.
Speaker 2 (45:48):
Yeah, how to leverage your skills and sales to then
become a consultant and bring in an independent source of income.
Do you find in contracts that you sign with companies
do they often prohibit outside.
Speaker 1 (45:58):
Work like that now.
Speaker 5 (46:00):
Future forward companies actually are very encouraged. They encourage that
because they know it's going to happen anyways, and they'd
rather make find their talent. And you know, it's as
simple as signing a moonlighting form to let.
Speaker 1 (46:12):
Them know that you will be doing any additional work.
Speaker 5 (46:15):
And the studies have shown there's a Forbes article out
that talks about if you give your employee the opportunity
to be entrepreneurial, they will be more likely to stick around.
And everyone knows it's expensive to hire people, so you
don't want to leave them just because you told them
they can't do a side gig.
Speaker 2 (46:30):
Yeah, I mean, it makes so much logical sense. And yet,
and yet I've heard lots of situations where sometimes it's
the leadership they get. They're like a little too mature too. Yeah,
just get emotional about it when they find out an
employee is getting sharing their talents outside. But that's that's
great to hear. I'm glad that's such a great focus
for the year. Yes, all right, ba fam, I really
(46:51):
want you all to check out systems and sales And
I just feel like Chantel, I think your approach is
so thoughtful and so well rounded and you truly care.
And I just see the incredible work that Citist in
Sales is doing. And I'm I know that everyone who
comes through my coaching community and it's interested in getting
into sales. I'm like, go check out Chantell, Go checkout Chantelle.
(47:12):
I did that recently with a Mandy money Maker and
she was nervous. She's like, right now she's selling for
a furniture store and she just feels I think she
feels intimidated, like as if joining And then I'm like,
but that's the point of Sisters in Sales, is it?
Not like you're supposed to feel safe? Go? And I
saw that you even offer what do you call it?
(47:32):
So like if you can't afford the price for one
of your events, you can apply to have a what
are you like, a scholarship or something?
Speaker 1 (47:38):
Then yeah, I love that.
Speaker 2 (47:41):
Well all right, Chantelle George of Sisters in Sales, Alex Woodruff,
what's your title? Head of Sales Fiddler? Ai fairdis for me,
Thank y'all so much for joining and you know, teaching
me a lot about the career path in sales and
what's happening in today's marketplace. Is there anything y'all want
to say before I let you go, anything on your mind,
anything I left out for.
Speaker 1 (48:02):
The opportunity, means a lot.
Speaker 3 (48:04):
Thank you.
Speaker 2 (48:05):
Thanks for showing up twice and chatting with me anyway.
Speaker 3 (48:09):
I think I covered everything hopefully we did, but thank you.
Thanks a lot, Mandy. This is awesome.
Speaker 2 (48:14):
Thank you Mandy, Love you, Alex, thank you so much
for taking the time. Brother Chantelle, thank you.
All right, va fam.
Speaker 2 (00:06):
This has been a very long time coming, but I
am excited to introduce y'all to my co host for
this day, my guests, little combination of both. I have
the brilliant, the gorgeous, the talented, the intelligent, Chantel George. Everybody, Oh,
(00:27):
that's so weird, Alex, did you think.
Speaker 1 (00:28):
That was about awkward?
Speaker 3 (00:30):
Yeah? It was.
Speaker 4 (00:31):
It was really building up and I felt like it
was coming toward me. But that's fine, that's.
Speaker 2 (00:34):
Fine, that's fine. Uh, It's in our contract as siblings
that I'm not allowed to compliment you. First, I was
gonna take I was gonna go, like in the most
exquisite natural hair to really like stick the knife in,
but I didn't curls as popin. But I have Chantelle George, y'all.
She is a founder of Sisters and Sales. And I
(00:57):
also have my brother Alex Woodruff, who is a award
winning legendary filmmaker but by day is an AI sales
director for a company called Fiddler. And I wanted to
have you all on the show because this theme has
come up a lot for me and I know Chantelle
when I met you at Afrotech. It's something that we
(01:17):
bonded over was the idea of women of color, people
of color in sales as a career path and what
that can look like. So separately, Alex, you and I
had talked about the dearth of women and especially women
of color in sales and how even you, you know,
as you're working your way up, you're conscious of that,
(01:38):
you're conscious of the lack of diversity. And then Chantale,
you founding sisters in sales. I mean that was a
direct answer to what you perceived to be like, where
are we at? Where are we and this career path
that can be really lucrative, like I've seen how great
it's been for like my brother, and I want to
start by just asking, I guess both of you all
(01:59):
start with you, Chantelle, at the time that we're in now,
how do you feel like what do you think are
the biggest barriers for women of color breaking into sales
as a career path? Today?
Speaker 5 (02:14):
Thank you first of all for having me. I'm super
excited to be here, and I'm so happy that we
met last year.
Speaker 1 (02:21):
Oh thanks me too.
Speaker 5 (02:22):
I love that and I feel like we're gonna have
a great conversation today. I think that sorry to have
a hot take on this already. But my organization has
been around for eight years and it'll be eight years
this fall, and so in our ethos our philosophy is
that there are are less and less barriers to enter sales.
(02:46):
Not to say just because we are around, but I
do believe that from an organ from a company standpoint,
there have been so many companies that are rolling out
the red carpet or really trying to candidates where they're at,
showing up and sponsoring our events, showing up at afrotech,
showing up, you know, and partnering with with all kinds
(03:08):
of conferences at organizations. Sometimes I think that there's a
bit of misconception in our community, and we're working really
hard to change perception on both sides. So sales is
not what you may think it is, and we're saying
that to our community and then to our organization. We're
saying that there's some really incredible talent that you need
(03:30):
to find. But all Black History Months and all Women's Month,
we have been putting on events every week with companies.
Speaker 2 (03:37):
I've been busy. I'm bet getting the email busy. I've
been forwarding them too. I'm like go, go yes.
Speaker 5 (03:43):
So there has been so much appetite to hire women
from our network, and so it's sometimes it's just understanding
what it means to excel in sales, getting out of
your own way, really finding a mentor finding a community.
Because the job a hot, you're in a I mean,
a lot of the of the media says that the
(04:04):
market is in trouble, and I can understand that. You
know that does exist somewhere. But I don't know if
you feel the same way, Alex, but the need for
commercial roles right now feels like an all time high.
And that's coming from where we're sitting and the company,
the conversations that we're having.
Speaker 1 (04:20):
So I just think we need to get out there
and get that work.
Speaker 2 (04:24):
Well, thank you for correcting my perception. Yeah, I want
to hear more about Alex. What does it feel like
for you. I mean, you're in one of the hottest
fields right now AI.
Speaker 4 (04:33):
Well, I think for me, I'm at a startup right
So in my career, I've worked at big companies like
IBM and Salesforce, but for the last several years I've
been at startups, particularly in the AI space, and I
definitely feel as though the the intent for hiring diverse candidates,
(04:54):
particularly black candidates, for me, is really high because we
really want people on our teams that look like our
customers because it's a relationship business at the end of
the day, Like you want people who can connect with
your customers, and that means you need to be able
to have every type of person on your team, because
all of our customers are every type of person. And
I say that particularly for black people and recruitment right now,
(05:15):
because there is like, to me, there's this dearth when
I look at who's applying to roles, like it's ninety
nine percent not people who look like us. So I
think that there is there's definitely a you know, as
I'm hiring, I see that gap, and so I have
to like go to places and find the nooks and crannies.
(05:35):
And I don't have a big organization behind me like
Salesforce does or IBM does. You both from my perspective,
do really great work. I see, Chantell, you got a
Salesforce logo behind you. Like from my perspective, they did
really great work when I was there. They had you know,
activation groups within the company like Bold Force at Salesforce.
Speaker 3 (05:51):
And Black at IBM, and IBM.
Speaker 4 (05:53):
But when you're at a startup, you got to bootstrap
it a little bit and you don't have those big
machines behind you to help find where talent is and
that makes it harder. So for me, doing that search
itself is tough, but it's definitely work that's warranted because
if you don't, then you're going to miss out on,
you know, building better relationship with your clients. And at
(06:14):
the end of the day, that's what it's about.
Speaker 2 (06:16):
Oh, I low key kind of feel like systters in
sales is a great organization.
Speaker 1 (06:20):
For you to know about.
Speaker 4 (06:21):
Then I was yet before you got on, and I
was asking and I was like, what, so, hold on,
how does this work?
Speaker 3 (06:25):
Exactly?
Speaker 2 (06:26):
Yeah, I did that on purpose totally. All right, Well,
let's talk about the career of sales. And one thing
I did want to note when I was talking about
sort of like the dearth of women of color, people
in color and sales roles. For me, it's like people
in Alex's roles. So you're like, on a management level,
you're making hiring decisions. And I know you said in
prior interview, Chantelle, just how as you got into sales
(06:48):
you would see us at the entry level. You would
see us getting in the door, but it was not
necessarily us who was raising through the ranks. Do you
feel like that has changed as well? Are you seeing
more opportunities for growth in that way the women that
are getting recruited are they getting to the top.
Speaker 1 (07:05):
That's a good question, so two answers.
Speaker 5 (07:11):
If they come in as entry or early mid level,
it does require corporate finesse to get to the top.
And I think that this is a challenge for our community.
Because Alex and I were talking right before this podcast started.
Speaker 2 (07:27):
I had a whole interview.
Speaker 1 (07:29):
I was in here.
Speaker 2 (07:31):
Save it for me, all right, fine.
Speaker 1 (07:34):
Catch me up.
Speaker 5 (07:34):
We'll talk about and really kind of thinking about what
is your what what were you exposed to growing up?
What type of career paths you know are you familiar with,
and that will help guide you when it's time to
ask for promotions. Like if you had a parent that
worked in sales, they may have done role playing with
(07:55):
you about this when you were growing up. One time
I spoke on a podcast us about the language of
business and how that's not involved in your day to
day you know, upbringing, it can be challenging to insert
that when you need it in your twenties or your
early thirties as you're looking to get up the corporate ladder.
And so it's really those unspoken rules and the lack
(08:18):
of mentorship and connections internally that can prevent you from
getting to that next level, which is what we do
insis we do help kind of unpack that and add
clarity to what you need to do, how you need
to handle it. We need to ask to have a conversations,
you need to have et cetera. So that's one thing, yes,
that does exist, and it's happening as we speak. There's
(08:39):
challenges moving up internally when you start low when you're
trying to get high. But the other on the other side,
if you are already senior and you're trying to go
laterally or just one step up, you can also encounter
issues because getting a job when you're senior to like,
(09:00):
for example, if you're a VP and you're trying to
be an SVP or your VP and you're just trying
to get in the door as a VP, that's a
whole other level of networking to get in the door.
There's a whole other level of how to play the
game and how to present yourself. And it is another
level that I think that women of color are starting
(09:21):
to really think through with their career choices and decision making.
For example, heb be two examples. There are a lot
of industry events that happen all over the world and
all over can see Yes and Dreamforce for example, as
if you spoke about Salesforce. And historically even vps that
were not on the budgets to attend would not attend
(09:43):
if their company did not give them authorization to. Nowadays,
women of color are paying out of pocket to go
to these industry events so that they can make their
own paths, so that they can establish and secure their future,
especially as mentioned if their senior level looking for another
senior in and that's just required. And I think that
for a while we were shy to do that, and
(10:06):
we are no longer shy about paying our own way
if it's what it's, if what we need to do,
and going to the places where we can meet the
right people to help us shepherd us up the ladder,
you know, from where we are to where we need
to be. So hopefully that answers your questions in two parts.
It's both an internal struggle and the external struggle depending
on where you are in your career.
Speaker 2 (10:26):
I think you explained that so well, and I am
also reminded of how special and unique you each are.
Speaker 1 (10:34):
Alex.
Speaker 2 (10:34):
I've obviously watched you just I mean, I think that
you and I both approached our careers in similar ways,
which is that we were never necessarily loyal to one employer.
We got what we could get out of it, and
we were not afraid necessarily. I know some of your
choices were not your own to be moving on, but
some of them were. And also you chantelle like you've Alex,
(10:56):
you've worked at eight PM and Salesforce where else Mule
something or other and Fiddler, which I had learned today
has an e in it, and chantel you have worked
at Yelp and LinkedIn and Salesforce?
Speaker 3 (11:10):
Right?
Speaker 2 (11:10):
Am I wrong?
Speaker 3 (11:11):
Tonight?
Speaker 1 (11:11):
Get that Twitter? Twitter, Twitter minor.
Speaker 2 (11:15):
So y'all are the exceptions to this? This this sort
of like you know, glass wall or whatever you want
to call it, that we can oh, I believe the
phrase is like broken wrong So you get on the ladder,
but it can be hard to move up. So can
y'all each kind of tell me your career stories and
what how you approached and how you were able to
make moves and raise through the ranks. Alex want to start.
Speaker 4 (11:38):
Yeah, I think in sales, the first thing you have
to wonder is do you want to rise up the ranks?
I think particularly in sales, and I'll explain why. So
there's like an old trope in sales, like sales management.
Sales managers typically make less money than a really great
sales rep. However, because of the commission, if you've exactly right,
(12:00):
Like let's say if your let's say you're a sales
manager and you have seven people on your team. In
order for you to hit your number and actually hit
your potential accelerators and your best commission you can get,
all seven people on your team need to hit their numbers, right,
or your seven people need to accumulate enough revenue that
matches your overall quota for that for that seven person
territory that you own, right. But if you're an individual contributor,
(12:23):
you only have to focus on your own territory.
Speaker 3 (12:26):
Right.
Speaker 4 (12:26):
It's let's say your your quota is one seventh of
what your managers is. And now if you blow it out,
maybe your manager doesn't get that big bump because the
other folks on your team didn't, but you will, right,
And so there's this there's there's certainly a lot of
extremely talented sales reps who could have gone into management
(12:47):
a long time ago but have chosen not to because
they're like, why, I don't want to just manage a
spreadsheet all day and have to like talk to seven
other people and do my job through those people. There's
a there's like a there's a there's questions about that
and whether it's like the right thing to do in
that particular, in this particular, you know job. And I
don't think that that is the same for other careers.
I could be wrong, but I think it's I think
(13:09):
it's unique about sales. For me, it was like waiting
for the right opportunity to want to be a leader,
and also to get that opportunity. It was kind of
a they both happened at the same time. So I
think as I was at IBM, I had become a
high performer there, but I felt like the ceiling was
a little bit lower, you know, candidly, because IBM is
a really big company and there's always this this trope
(13:32):
you never get fired for buying IBM, And so if
you never get fired for buying IBM, then it's kind
of easier.
Speaker 3 (13:39):
To sell, right. So as you grow in.
Speaker 2 (13:42):
Your kids, it's like, yeah, and.
Speaker 4 (13:45):
As you grow in your career, you kind of want
to sell things that maybe they're a little bit more
challenging and also more cutting edge. And so I went
to a smaller company at that time, Mealsoft, which ended
up being acquired by Salesforce, and I started to cut
my teeth there and like learn how to actually do
this job at a company where not everyone knows that
company's name or had a grandfather who worked at that company. Right,
(14:06):
But it still got pretty big because Salesforce was the
you know, acquired them, and they put their own stamp
on things. So I eventually decided I wanted to go
smaller because for me, I love the entrepreneurial side of things.
Speaker 3 (14:18):
I love being autonomous.
Speaker 4 (14:19):
I love building my own schedule and finding my own
clients and all that kind of stuff and not necessarily
feeling like a cog in the machine.
Speaker 3 (14:26):
So I did well at.
Speaker 4 (14:27):
A couple of startups over the last couple of years,
but when I got to Fiddler, it felt like the
right time because my performance was high, but what the
team needed and what the company needed at the time
kind of matched where I was in my career. And
not only that, they took sort of a bet on me,
you know, being younger, being someone that doesn't look like
(14:49):
every head of sales. They did, you know, promote me
to that role and gave me a chance to deliver
there and we're doing pretty good so far. So I
really appreciate it for the opportunity, but it also kind
of met me at a time in my life where
I was. I was performing high enough to try it
because it was a new challenge, and also I knew
the company well. I believed in the leadership. It's a
(15:11):
great culture. I felt like if I was going to
take this leak, this would be the place to do it.
Speaker 2 (15:21):
For someone who's mid level, early career, who may be
super intimidated by speaking and presenting yourself and getting to
know the higher ups who may decide that they're worth
taking a bet on, how did you build rapport with them?
And if you have any advice for people who may
feel a little bit intimidated by.
Speaker 4 (15:40):
That, I think as long as you as long as
you deliver and exceed what it is that set out
in front of you, it becomes a lot easier. Right, So,
if I was underperforming, or if I was like just
meeting performance, then it'd be harder for me to feel
very confident walking into a room where I'm talking to
somebody who's a CEO or one of our board members
(16:01):
or something like that. But if I know that I'm
coming in as a high high performer, and that's that's
my floor.
Speaker 3 (16:06):
My floor is high performer, right, So.
Speaker 4 (16:09):
No matter what happened in this meeting, no matter if
they give me a promotion or tell me to kick
rocks or whatever, I'll just go back to being a
high performer. I think it gives me a little bit
more confidence to to just try it and take that
risk and take that leap and say, hey, here's what
I would do if given this opportunity.
Speaker 3 (16:24):
Here's my plan.
Speaker 4 (16:25):
I've never done it before, but I think this plan
feels sound and I'm facing it off of things I've
seen before. And let's you know, what's the alternative. The
alternative is taking this path. And do you think this
path would be more lucrative for us?
Speaker 3 (16:40):
I would say no. So this is why I'm presenting
this plan.
Speaker 4 (16:43):
But again, I had the confidence to do that because
I felt very solid in my in my belief in myself.
The culture of my company is a really great one
where they reward internal folks or folks internally who are
performing really well. So I kind of just felt like
this is a I had no reason not to be
confident going into those rooms, because ultimately, the worst that
(17:03):
could happen is I just go back to what was
already working for me.
Speaker 2 (17:07):
So it sounds like, just be really freaking good at selling.
That can help, well, be like good at your job.
Speaker 3 (17:15):
I've been doing it for ten years.
Speaker 2 (17:16):
I asked the hard hitting questions.
Speaker 4 (17:18):
You get better at it over time, if you if
you're really double in learning and like you and you
and you, you know, listen to your mentors and you
start to grow in your role and growing your profession
and you're discipline like, you get better eventually and you
start to hit those you start to hit those milestones
for yourself. Yeah, you've earned the right to be confident,
So don't don't don't take that away from yourself.
Speaker 5 (17:41):
I agree with that, John, I just want to say
I agree. That's actually one of the best things about
working in sales, like, the better you are, the easier
it is to navigate internally, the easier it is to
gain visibility. Obviously, the more money you make. And I
just think it makes you a better conversationalist. So even
outside of work, you communicate more effectively. You communicate with confidence.
(18:07):
You know, we're selling most of the time just with
our voice. At least back in the day when I
first started sales, I was a telesalesperson. I sold with
my voice, So my voice became my instrument, and the
way that I talk and the way that I listen
and the way that I construct sentences was how it
was my superpower. But I definitely want to chime into
(18:27):
Alex's point. Another tip would be leveraging your first ninety days,
Like if you're new, you can get away with a
lot of things. You know, you can go to the
top per former and say, I just want to listen
to your calls and see how you do things.
Speaker 1 (18:40):
You know, that's when I'm not a threat yet. Yeah,
that was a perfect time for me.
Speaker 5 (18:45):
I soaked up and made a lot of connections because
people remember what it's like to be new, and you
can just get away with being that curious person, and
no one is going to tell you no. You know,
you run into someone in the elevator. You don't even
know who that person is. It could be on the board,
that could be the COO, CFO whatever, and you introduce
yourself because you're new. And funnily enough, you actually can
(19:08):
use that even in a sales call. For example, if
you're working in like an account management role and you're
taking over accounts, that's also a really great time to
add your own I guess flavor, but also a great
time to get information out of people because you're new
and so I just took over this account. I don't
know much about what's going other than what Sally told me.
(19:30):
I would love to learn everything. Let's start from the beginning. Also,
why aren't you signing this contract? I'm just curious. I'm new,
so you know a lot of things that you get
with being new and that we should be taking advantage of.
I've seen white counterparts really take advantage of the new card.
Speaker 4 (19:48):
Okay, no, yeah, agree, It's like the best thing to
do is just play dumb in sales.
Speaker 3 (19:55):
You learn so much when you just played domb In.
Speaker 4 (19:57):
Fact, to say, I know you're joking, but no, I'm not.
Speaker 2 (20:02):
But you've told me that before, and I've seen you
do it, So I.
Speaker 4 (20:05):
Think it is a skill when you're in text, when
you're in tech sales and you're not technical. I did
not go to school for technology. I did not grow
up tech as a technologist. But I have a curiosity
about technology and I have I think, good common sense.
So if I just go in and ask reasonable human questions,
not technical questions, I will learn really important technical things,
(20:27):
and I can write those things down and I can
tell someone smarter than me who will be like, oh,
here's how we should interpret that, and then we go
back to the customer and provide a proposal that meets
what they not only what they want, but also you know,
what they really got to have right now. So I
think playing dumb and learning from your customers, I suppose
like walking in and thinking you need to like present
(20:48):
them with the perfect you know elevator pitch, every you know,
every first call.
Speaker 3 (20:53):
I think that that gets you a lot first.
Speaker 5 (20:54):
Grade, and people like to know that you are approaching
their business with humility.
Speaker 1 (21:01):
It makes them feel comfortable.
Speaker 2 (21:02):
And trusting them that they know what their biggest issues
are and what problems they need solve a little bit,
and then giving them the reassurance that you're listening to
them and you care about what they're going through and
like you're going to find the best fit if you
can for them through your product.
Speaker 4 (21:18):
Yeah, that's consultative selling is like learning from them, reassuring them,
and yeah, it's the best way to own the fact
that you're young in sales or you're black in sales
and you may not be like everyone else that you're
talking to is to kind of just own it and
ask questions and not try to go in Let's say
(21:39):
I'm younger, I'm half the age of the person I'm
trying to sell to, and they've been working in AI
since before I was born, Right, I can't go in
there and try to pretend like I know AI better
than them, or try to like surprise them with an
interesting fact Like I'm not going to do it. It's
very unlikely that I'm going to be able to shock
this person with my AI knowledge. I won't, So instead,
(22:00):
just be like, really, you know, be myself, be a
good person to them, ask them questions, tell them that
I'm their conduit to whatever it is that their challenge,
and solution that they have in mind. Is that gets
me a lot further than trying to go in and
assume that like I have to present some you know,
killer fact, right, But then by the time I learn
all those things now, I do probably know toward the
(22:22):
later stages of the sales cycle what it is that's
going to make this person you know, really successful.
Speaker 3 (22:26):
And then best when you pitch, I wanted.
Speaker 5 (22:29):
To add to what you said, Alex, because it sounds
like we're talking about like the discovery get to know
you face. There are also some technical things that you
can bring in from a communications standpoint, like mirroring, so
pretty much repeating back what the prospects said so they
feel like they're here, you're hearing them. Similarly when someone
says their name and you say their name back to them,
(22:50):
so that really helps. And then obviously like framing questions
with empathy. For example, if like you said, you can't
shock them within AI fact, but you can use something
about AI to empathize with them. It seems like there's
a lot going on in the world of AI in
your world that must be overwhelming. Can you tell me
(23:12):
about how you feel about this particular thing or what
you know that must be overwhelming or that must be
a lot to handle it, that must be a lot
on your plate. So creating those empathetic connections and then
you know, there's there's so many communication tips and tricks
that you can use and to how you talk to
people that can give you so much information and really
(23:36):
allow you to be that detective in that conversation. And
I think another misconception about sales. The sales is mostly listening.
It's really like getting information and trying to understand what
is this person dealing with?
Speaker 1 (23:50):
What is your problem? Do they even know their problem?
You know? And how?
Speaker 5 (23:54):
And then how can you help guide them towards your solution.
So yeah, I love what you said out just wanted
to add some of those technical pieces there and.
Speaker 4 (24:02):
What you said earlier about how you can use some
of these things in your regular life, Like where you're
talking about, you know, just listen or repeat back to
people what they've said to you. That is really helpful
in sales, and it's also great in my personal life
because a lot of times you misunderstand things, especially when
you're in sales. At the end of the day, I
am selling something, right, so if I sell this thing
(24:23):
I make money, so that means in my head, I
want to sell this thing. And so if I go
into the call thinking like that, which I typically do,
everything sounds like something I should try to pounce on
to sell the thing I want to sell. But you
got to relax yourself and ask questions, because if you
do that and you start to like say, well, hey,
did you just say this? Or am I understanding correctly
(24:45):
that this? Now, you might find out that the thing
that you were about to pounce on is actually a
red hearing. It actually isn't something you should have pounced on,
and if you did, you would have come off looking
you know, to salesy or not listening to the person,
or you know, having a misconception.
Speaker 3 (24:59):
And that also is very.
Speaker 4 (25:00):
True in regular life where you're talking to your partner,
or you're talking to a parent or family member and
if they say one thing that really like triggers you
and you want to be upset, maybe it's better to
just like.
Speaker 3 (25:13):
What hold on, are you saying this or did you
mean that?
Speaker 4 (25:17):
And then you end up finding out that the thing
that they were even you know, indicating, is not what
you were thought it was. So yeah, all of those
things I think they matter both professionally and personally, and
I definitely learned that in sales.
Speaker 2 (25:30):
Yeah, having never triggered you in my entire life, I
don't exactly know what you mean, but I can imagine.
I can imagine. All Right, I want to talk about Monday, honey,
because I think, Chantelle, one of the things that we
talked about at afro Tech was sort of like just
the conversation around compensation. And I have seen Alex, you know,
(25:55):
celebrate them big wins, those big page tecks. Honey. We
love that, But you are kind of, you mean it,
basically a solopreneur. When you're in sales, you are kind
of like running your own little business, and I relate
to that now, being a full time solo preneur, the
ebbs and flows of that income can be challenging. So
can y'all talk about how you've learned to navigate your
personal finances while pursuing this career path. I know, chantal Val,
(26:19):
you are full time with systems and sales, but still
any advice on how to handle We.
Speaker 5 (26:25):
Actually just had an a vement about this yesterday with Gusto,
the VP of compensation, was on the line, and so First,
I think it's most important to understand what actually is
your compensation. I know sales can be tricky, and some
companies make it actually trickier on purpose, But there are
a lot of variables to consider when looking at a
(26:49):
compensation plan.
Speaker 1 (26:50):
Your percentage to quota accelerator.
Speaker 5 (26:53):
We talked about your equity that's available to you depending
on the kind of company you're working for, paid time off, vesting, schedule,
so many things, and so it can help to know
what exactly are you getting paid for a holistically outside
of your base salary. Also, how is it broken up,
and which one of these things are going to impact
(27:13):
your personal life short term, medium, a long term. For example,
when I worked for LinkedIn, I was getting Microsoft stock.
That's a long term financial planning like facet of my portfolio.
That's nothing to do with what I'm getting paid.
Speaker 1 (27:29):
Every two weeks.
Speaker 5 (27:31):
Also, depending on how frequently you get paid your commission
can also determine your short term, medium and long term goals.
I went from getting commissioned monthly and some jobs to
quarterly to annually. And I think that depending on your
personal lifestyle, you should pick roles that obviously match up
(27:52):
with how you like to get paid and what makes
sense for you, and then I think taking a step back,
some of this can be also negotiated at the offer stage.
So for example, I've had colleagues that have negotiated parking,
free parking, all kinds of perks and things that are
actually have cash value that you can negotiate and get
(28:12):
under control. And I think lastly would be the way
that we spend our money is something that you really
become very aware of working in sales. Our jobs are
very stressful. Some of us splurge a lot in our
careers working in sales because we're waiting for so long
(28:34):
to get this commission and we've already made this wish
list of things in our mind we're going to buy
with it, because that's what keeps us motivated day after
day after day. And so it's really important of a
financial advisor that can kind of bring you back to
earth when you finally get this crazy commission check. These
commission checks can be six figures lumpso just landing in
your bank account. And so even though you have all
(28:56):
this time to kind of think about all the things
you're going to buy between those commission check bumps, you
should also be talking with the financial advisor about what
you're going to invest in and how you're going to
do those things. And so there were financial advisors that
used to be passed around that the companies I worked
at that different salespeople would trust and so that was
(29:16):
a huge benefit. So there's a few things, right, it's
the offer, just to recap the offer, It's about understanding
your compensation structure and if it works for you on
a personal level. And then it's about really monitoring your
own spending habits because we get paid in such a
lumpy way and if we don't hit quote, we don't
get paid at all. So mind over matter when it
comes to what to do when that money hits your account.
Speaker 4 (29:37):
Yeah, and I'll say, from my perspective, I'll just speak.
I'll speak specifically to people who have a base salary
plus variable compensation jobs otherwise known as ote on target earnings.
So this means you work at a company, they pay
you a base salary and then you have a variable
that is also contractually obligated or is contractedly stated in
(29:59):
your contract. If you hit your number to the number
you hit exactly your number, you will be paid this
much in a variable bonus right throughout the year. So
to those people, let's say your base salary is one
hundred K and your variable as one hundred K, so
you have a two hundred k on target earnings. That
does not mean you will make two undred K that year.
That means that if you hit your quota exactly, you
(30:21):
will make two under K. If you miss your quota
by half, you'll make one hundred and fifty K. If
you miss your quota by seventy five percent, you'll make
one hundred and twenty five K.
Speaker 3 (30:29):
Hopefully that makes sense.
Speaker 4 (30:32):
My philosophy is to live on my base and play
on my commissions, right like that, That's kind of how
I think about it. I don't I like to live
below my means because even if I'm having a great year,
I'm killing it in sales. Whenever those big commission checks
come in, they sit in my checking account for less
than twenty four hours. I got to get it out
of there, like I put it immediately into like a hy.
Speaker 3 (30:55):
Old savings account.
Speaker 4 (30:56):
And then when it's in there and it's safe and
it feels like harder to access, then I started thinking
about what to.
Speaker 3 (31:01):
Do with it.
Speaker 4 (31:02):
Okay, do I want to put it in a wrath
or do I want to go and like make this
investment in a home, or do I want to go
on a vacation with this much?
Speaker 3 (31:11):
And then I want to go on and do this
with that much? Like a financial planner?
Speaker 1 (31:15):
Yeah, have you had a planner before?
Speaker 3 (31:17):
No? I had.
Speaker 2 (31:23):
I remember talking to you when you got maybe one
of your first big commissions at IBM, and I was like, wait, what,
It's a lot of money. And I was like, I
just wasn't aware that was what it was like. And
we were first Yeah, we were talking about four one
k's and stuff, and like then you bought your condo.
So I mean, I think that you made some savvy choices, Alex,
(31:44):
you know, with your your money, and what were you
using as your source of like knowledge? There was it
just like going off of what other folks were doing.
Were you reading books? Were you listening to your big sister?
You know?
Speaker 3 (31:59):
Well, I definitely was listening to you with respect.
Speaker 4 (32:02):
I never knew what a high old savings account was,
and I feel like that a high old savings account
is definitely the secret for me. I'm not saying this
works for everybody. The reason it works for me is
because if the money is sitting in my checking account,
it will feel like mine and I will want to
do things with it. When it goes into somewhere else
where I have less access to it, or maybe it
takes a couple of days for it to get back
to me, it feels more strategic. Now I'm like, Okay,
(32:24):
what do I want to do with it? And while
it's over there by the way, it's you know, it's
making me money. It's earning me three to five percent interest,
depending on what the rates are at the time.
Speaker 3 (32:33):
So like to me.
Speaker 4 (32:34):
That that's that's what my little secret weapon is because
once it's there, I can start to be strategic and
I can start to think about what it is I
want to do. So at the time, like you mentioned,
I bought a condo I need. I needed a place
to live, and it felt like a good idea to
buy as a poster to rent. That's a good time
to go into myiold savings account, pull out a deposit
and buy that condo, right And then when I decided
(32:56):
I wanted to build my house, I had built up
enough money in my high you old savings account to
get me through that initial deposit for building the house,
and then luckily I had a really good year of
sales wise, and I was able to get through that
build like those. But all of that wouldn't have been
possible if I had just, like you know, left that
money in my checking went and bought a car, did
whatever the crazy thing I wanted to do at the time.
(33:18):
But I needed to like put it somewhere else so
I could look at it and like get strategic about
what makes sense for me right now. I think at
some point I definitely will get a financial planner, But
at this time in my life, I don't have any kids.
I am doing, you know, quite well for myself, and
I have some unusual things I do splurge on, like
making movies. I don't really want to talk to a
(33:38):
financial planner about making movies.
Speaker 3 (33:41):
There's nothing financially advisable about what.
Speaker 2 (33:43):
I'm doing aresting. Do you invest now or is it
just okay you do.
Speaker 4 (33:48):
I put some things in stocks, I put some things
in index funds, like you taught me some years ago,
but like a lot of my money goes into making films,
and that is not financially advisable. I don't want to
have to explain that to somebody, maybe that's short sighted
in me and I should get one. But for now,
it's proba going pretty well without having a financial planner.
And I'm kind of like, let me get to a
point where maybe I have more complications in my life,
(34:10):
like I have children, for instance, or I need to
like think about a different type.
Speaker 3 (34:15):
Of property I want to own, like things that aren't
as straightforward.
Speaker 2 (34:18):
That's a fair point, I really, I mean, I think
that makes sense. I also feel like with financial planners,
they certainly I think it's so smart Chantelle to give
that tip because with a big windfall, they can help
you like save yourself, save yourself from yourself. And those
periods in my life where I have been where I
have also gotten windfalls, I mean in different ways.
Speaker 3 (34:41):
It's yeah for me, I guess Alex, you have like a.
Speaker 2 (34:45):
Much stronger mind for creating like mental barriers with your money.
And like for me and a Highel savings account isn't enough,
I need it to be like locked up in a
vault pushing now that to my mom. I tell you
hot wheels, like I just didn't. I need to buy
stock and whatever company owns them, because like maybe it
is so expensive keeping my son in with the latest
(35:06):
wheels and yeah, So anyway, financial planners are great. I
know that BA FAM has you know, knows where to
find them. National Association of Personal Financial Planners x Y planning.
We talked about I like chan tell you said, like
you just learned from your colleagues, Like who were you using.
Speaker 3 (35:24):
To add something real quick? I forgot one.
Speaker 4 (35:27):
One place I definitely learned a lot was when I
joined IBM. And I'm guessing this is that a lot
of big companies they had this program called money.
Speaker 3 (35:35):
Smart I think it was what it was called.
Speaker 4 (35:37):
But basically it was like somebody within IBM or like
a like a third party that they contracted that was
there to advise IBM ors on how to set up
their four oh one K, which one to pick, what's
their risk profile, what year they wanted it to go
until things I still fully don't understand, but like that
at that time I probably knew more than I do
now because that person was I was able to call
(35:57):
that person instead of meeting with them anytime they were
like not helping me navigate what types of retirement accounts
were important for me. So I believe Salesforce had this
as well when I was there, but I'm not. I
can't say for sure, but I don't think IBM's the
only company that has this. So if you do work
at a company that's you know, large, maybe look into
that too, because there's folks within that company that are like,
(36:18):
you know, they're providing you a four one K. They
want to see you, you know, leveraging that to your success.
Speaker 2 (36:24):
Good point, Chantell, Can you tell us about sisters in sales?
I want to give you a moment to just talk
about the journey that you've been on these past eight
years and what that has been.
Speaker 1 (36:36):
Like, how are you How is cistis in sales?
Speaker 5 (36:38):
Oh, I'm doing okay. I think it's been the journey
of entrepreneurship. I was a entrepreneur for the first six
years building this while I was working as a sales professional.
I realized that I didn't have any mentors or connections
in the industry, and I just felt like, you know,
taking myself back. I just didn't feel like the work
(37:00):
that I was doing was sales like it was it
was porting me. Obviously, cold calling, cold emailing, appointments, pitching
and closing these are all things that were important, but
when I would look at other professionals who had a
sales background, their jobs seemed much more interesting and cooler
and unique, and I just felt like the road I
(37:23):
was on wasn't leading me there. And much more, their
job seem much more strategic, much much more I suppose
important to the company because we're doing the enterprise deals.
And so I made it my mission to understand the
evolution of a sales professional, but specifically in tandem and
in partnership with women that look like me. And so
(37:45):
I would have these interviews with these women and I
would write their stories and they would tell me about
all of the things that they're doing and the private
jets and these salaries and the lifestyle. And I was like,
I don't think that I'm on the path to get there.
So we got to start this from the beginning. You know,
I love that I'm getting good at the job. How
do I play the game? And so that was really
(38:06):
the biggest pivot. And so our first public event actually
was at Salesforce. They were our first corporate partner, and
they opened up the doors for us at the New
York City Tower and they allowed us to have our
first event. And this was the first time that New
York City saleswomen of Club I were able to meet
each other. We didn't have a website, and we didn't
have I didn't have a business card. But one of
(38:27):
the adp there, Amy Frank. Can never forget her because
we honored her at our gala last year. Excuse me
the year before she was our sponsor. And it wasn't monetary.
It was just here's some space space to do your event,
don't mess anything up. I was like fine, And it
was life changing. People that have been in sales for
(38:47):
twenty years, two years that didn't have connections, that were
able to meet valuable connections and answer important questions that
were on everyone's mind. So I feel very thankful of
the journey, you know, from that event now to twenty
thousand globally and a thriving virtual community.
Speaker 2 (39:05):
Twenty thousand. Let me update my notes. I had twelve
that's outdated.
Speaker 3 (39:08):
Intel that's incredible. I think a twenty thousand. That's amazing.
Speaker 5 (39:13):
Yes, and we have an amazing team and we are
all literally all over the world. We're in Denver next week,
and in New York and in London and just so
so many events and so much support and so much
visibility and transparency.
Speaker 1 (39:30):
That's the biggest thing.
Speaker 5 (39:31):
You don't have to go into your job and work
in sales and not know anything anymore. You can hang
someone in our app and get connected to someone who
can answer your questions. And if you don't have any
job prospects, come to our events. They are looking for you.
So that's what we're solving for. It is invigorating. It
brings me joy, brings me, it makes me bright, and
I'm super excited to be doing this work.
Speaker 4 (39:53):
You know, to ask your question, Oh yeah, sure, go ahead.
I was going to say, do you what about for
entry level? Do you have programs or you know, anything
that you do specifically for people trying to get into
sales for the first time.
Speaker 5 (40:04):
We have a whole program. It's called the Aspiring Sellers
for people looking to get into sales for the first time.
So yeah, we have an annual event called the Aspiring Sellers.
We have coaching and training for aspiring sellers. They are
a part of our community. Definitely, that's great.
Speaker 4 (40:21):
I hear people all the time asking me how do
I get into sales, and like, I only know the
way I did it, which was like go to a
big company and be like one of you know, ten
fifteen thousand salespeople or so. And I did learn a
lot there. But yeah, that's really awesome to start pointing
people towards you.
Speaker 2 (40:36):
Thank you business model wise like you were. Also, you're
not like you do so much good for us, right
for people of color, But you're not a nonprofit and
I want to point that out right, Am I wrong?
You're a for profit?
Speaker 1 (40:51):
No, you're membership.
Speaker 2 (40:52):
You know, people pay a membership fee. I just want
to I want to acknowledge that because I do feel
like there is especially women of color, like we tend
to think when my business is going to do good,
some kind of community good or you know, help in
some way, that it needs to be a nonprofit for
some reason, and then you're chasing grant money and like
you know those types of funding sources. What was the
(41:15):
decision behind that and how has that been, Like how
have you been finding it taking that approach.
Speaker 5 (41:21):
I did what I'm good at, which is closing contracts,
and so I am not a nonprofit guru. I never
even considered it at the beginning. I knew that if
I had a great product and great connections, I could
walk in and I can make business happen, and it's
easier for me. And we're faster because we don't have
(41:43):
those types of restrictions and hurdles. And because we're faster,
we are able to serve our customer as a And
when I say that in this case, I'm talking about
the B to B corporate partners and sponsors in inventive ways.
And so we have a board, an advisory board with
excellent saleswomen, and they support us and they give us
(42:05):
direction and they give us ideas. But this is a
structure that.
Speaker 2 (42:09):
Works for us wonderful. So how close are you to
that private jet?
Speaker 1 (42:12):
How's that going? I know, hopefully soon?
Speaker 2 (42:18):
What sorts of secrets have y'all unlocked? In terms of,
like I know, Chantell, I think it's so relatable that
idea that like you're looking at other people and you're like,
what am I missing? How do I get on that
conveyor belt over there? What was it that you found
you were missing? Was it just connections?
Speaker 1 (42:35):
Did you have?
Speaker 2 (42:35):
Does everyone need to go find assistance in sales to
then make the context that they need.
Speaker 1 (42:40):
To succeed everything?
Speaker 5 (42:43):
Number one, Even as an entrepreneur, connection brought capital to
me everything like professional services, legal marketing, like connections are
so so important and sometimes and the sales professional, Yes,
join an organization, hopefully join mine if you're interested, but
(43:04):
join any organization because it's curated connections. You don't even
have to go out and seek these people cold. They're
c rated, delivered to you on a stick.
Speaker 3 (43:13):
Here you go.
Speaker 5 (43:15):
But as an entrepreneur, connections are so important because there's
so many situations that you're going to get yourself in,
so many challenges you're going to get yourself in. You
need to know people who know what to do, who
know who to call, who know how to help you,
know how to support you as completely uncharted territory. There
are similarly organizations for entrepreneurs too, of course, but I
think that you know, for both sides of the coin,
(43:37):
you have to know people.
Speaker 1 (43:39):
You just have to.
Speaker 5 (43:40):
It's all requirement for you to get through the ebbs
and flows of life. So hopefully people get out of
their shell if they're shy or introverted, and you don't
have to go to everything every time, but you should
have an organization, you know, in the back burner that
you could tap into.
Speaker 2 (43:55):
I love that, Alex, do you are you part of
any like sales organization speak for the men's what y'all
doing out there?
Speaker 3 (44:01):
No, I'm not, and I want to learn more about them.
Speaker 4 (44:05):
I yeah, assistant sales is the first time I've heard
of anything like this before, and I'm like, now that
I'm learning about it, I'm like, I'm sure there's something
like this for guys, or something like this for black
people in general, or something like this for people in
AI or what you know.
Speaker 3 (44:18):
So I need to look into that because especially as as.
Speaker 4 (44:21):
Someone hiring, Yeah, like having some having a place to
just reach out and ask like, hey, is anyone looking?
Is anyone interested? Here's the rec like that would be awesome.
So yeah, I need to look into this for sure.
Speaker 3 (44:33):
Yeah.
Speaker 2 (44:34):
And one quick question for you, Chantelle on that is, like,
with this whole mission from the current administration to do
away with Wolke policies and DEI, have you seen that
impacting your business yet? Or are you still getting the
same interest from corporations who recognize the value in a
diverse salesforce.
Speaker 5 (44:50):
People still recognize the value. They are, of course, are
doing their due diligence as they should with anything, whether
or not they are for or against you administration. They
have to do as a business, do their due diligence
and organizations. But we're pushing forward. Our theme for this
year is called Redefine your revenue. Revenue and income can
(45:11):
come from multiple things. One is a nine to five,
the other is your independent work. You know, we are
encouraging our sales professionals to be consultants, to be fractional
sales leaders, to not wait for a large brand to
take interest in you all the time. But you may
have something to offer an entrepreneur who's looking for their
first sales hire or a company that is looking to
(45:31):
create structure, and you know, bring on a bunch of people.
You have skills that you've learned from these companies, it's
time to monetize them. So that's what our whole year
is about, and that's what our summit in September is
going to be really double tapping on. So one way
or the other, we believe in our community or rive.
Speaker 2 (45:48):
Yeah, how to leverage your skills and sales to then
become a consultant and bring in an independent source of income.
Do you find in contracts that you sign with companies
do they often prohibit outside.
Speaker 1 (45:58):
Work like that now.
Speaker 5 (46:00):
Future forward companies actually are very encouraged. They encourage that
because they know it's going to happen anyways, and they'd
rather make find their talent. And you know, it's as
simple as signing a moonlighting form to let.
Speaker 1 (46:12):
Them know that you will be doing any additional work.
Speaker 5 (46:15):
And the studies have shown there's a Forbes article out
that talks about if you give your employee the opportunity
to be entrepreneurial, they will be more likely to stick around.
And everyone knows it's expensive to hire people, so you
don't want to leave them just because you told them
they can't do a side gig.
Speaker 2 (46:30):
Yeah, I mean, it makes so much logical sense. And yet,
and yet I've heard lots of situations where sometimes it's
the leadership they get. They're like a little too mature too. Yeah,
just get emotional about it when they find out an
employee is getting sharing their talents outside. But that's that's
great to hear. I'm glad that's such a great focus
for the year. Yes, all right, ba fam, I really
(46:51):
want you all to check out systems and sales And
I just feel like Chantel, I think your approach is
so thoughtful and so well rounded and you truly care.
And I just see the incredible work that Citist in
Sales is doing. And I'm I know that everyone who
comes through my coaching community and it's interested in getting
into sales. I'm like, go check out Chantell, Go checkout Chantelle.
(47:12):
I did that recently with a Mandy money Maker and
she was nervous. She's like, right now she's selling for
a furniture store and she just feels I think she
feels intimidated, like as if joining And then I'm like,
but that's the point of Sisters in Sales, is it?
Not like you're supposed to feel safe? Go? And I
saw that you even offer what do you call it?
(47:32):
So like if you can't afford the price for one
of your events, you can apply to have a what
are you like, a scholarship or something?
Speaker 1 (47:38):
Then yeah, I love that.
Speaker 2 (47:41):
Well all right, Chantelle George of Sisters in Sales, Alex Woodruff,
what's your title? Head of Sales Fiddler? Ai fairdis for me,
Thank y'all so much for joining and you know, teaching
me a lot about the career path in sales and
what's happening in today's marketplace. Is there anything y'all want
to say before I let you go, anything on your mind,
anything I left out for.
Speaker 1 (48:02):
The opportunity, means a lot.
Speaker 3 (48:04):
Thank you.
Speaker 2 (48:05):
Thanks for showing up twice and chatting with me anyway.
Speaker 3 (48:09):
I think I covered everything hopefully we did, but thank you.
Thanks a lot, Mandy. This is awesome.
Speaker 2 (48:14):
Thank you Mandy, Love you, Alex, thank you so much
for taking the time. Brother Chantelle, thank you.
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