May 30, 2025 • 34 mins
Pro Swimmer, Author, Screenwriter, Becca Mann's journey redefines what it means to be a swimming prodigy who grows beyond the confines of early success. At just 10 years old, she completed the 15K Maui channel, becoming the youngest to do so. By her teens, she was a seven-time US National Team member and two-time national champion. But after narrowly missing Olympic qualification three times, Becca made the courageous decision to step away from competitive swimming altogether.
What happened during those five years away from racing forms the emotional core of our conversation. Becca speaks candidly about needing to discover who she was beyond the lane lines. She pursued her passion for writing, earning a BFA in screenwriting from USC and working on hit shows like "The Morning Show." She traveled solo, climbed mountains, and experienced the unstructured life she'd never known during her regimented swimming career.
Her path back began unexpectedly through Masters swimming at West Hollywood Aquatics, where she jumped into lane one and "almost died that first practice." Becca reveals. "I was always swimming the 1500 at Olympic trials." That return to the water sparked a realization: "How did I not swim for two years? This is what I love. This is who I am."
Becca opens up about her experiences with OCD, describing how intrusive thoughts affect her and the tools she's developed to manage them. Rather than seeing her mental health challenges as obstacles, she explores how neurodivergence shapes both her athletic career and creative pursuits. Her memoir "Outside the Lanes" documents this journey with raw honesty.
Now training in North Carolina with Olympic swimmer Ashley Twitchell, Becca has her sights set on qualifying for the national team and potentially even the 2028 Olympics. At the end of our conversation, when asked what word comes to mind when she's in the water, her answer is immediate and profound: "Peace."
Ready to dive deeper into stories of athletic resilience and transformation? Subscribe to Champions Mojo and join our community celebrating comeback champions and lifelong swimmers.
Email us at HELLO@ChampionsMojo.com. Opinions discussed are not medical advice, please seek a medical professional for your own health concerns.
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Transcript
Episode Transcript
Available transcripts are automatically generated. Complete accuracy is not guaranteed.
Speaker 1 (00:00):
Hello friends, welcome to the Champions Mojo
podcast, the podcast thatcelebrates comeback champions,
lifelong athletes and thetransformative power of swimming
.
I'm your host, kelly Pallas.
Today we're diving in with aguest who has truly lived
outside the lanes, literally andfiguratively.
Becca Mann is a swimming phenom, a seven-time US national team
(00:23):
member, two-time nationalchampion and the first person to
complete the epic 40-mile21-hour Maui Nui tri-channel
crossing between three Hawaiianislands.
She made her mark early bybecoming the youngest swimmer to
complete the 15K Maui channelat just 10 years old, and the
youngest athlete to place top 10in four events at a single US
(00:46):
Olympic trials.
But Becca's story doesn't stopat elite competition.
After narrowly missing Olympicqualification three times, she
took a bold step back fromracing and into rediscovery.
In that time she wrote herpowerful memoir Outside the
Lanes, sharing her honestjourney through mental health
(01:06):
challenges, the identity shiftof leaving high-level sport and
what it means to redefinesuccess on her own terms.
And now this is where it getsexciting for master swimmers.
Becca is making her return tocompetitive swimming after a
five-year hiatus, a journey thatincluded training with master
swimmers.
That's right.
She found her groove again inthe master's community, proving
(01:29):
that her passion for swimming istruly lifelong.
Becca is also a gifted writer,with a BFA in screenwriting from
USC, and has worked on hitshows like the Morning Show and
the Wilds.
Whether she's penning novels,crushing open water feats or
diving back into the pool, beccaMann embodies the spirit of
resilience, reinvention and, yes, mojo, welcome to Champions.
(01:54):
Mojo, becca Mann, thank you somuch for having me.
Kelly, I'm so happy to be here.
Oh, it's so great to see you.
Like I said before we recorded,I'm a big fan.
You know all my listeners knowthat I love distance swimming
and you're a prodigy from such ayoung age, and it's just so
great that you have done all thethings you've done and you
(02:15):
still have so much more ahead inyour swimming career.
What I wanted to start off withAfter competing at this high
level and narrowly missingOlympic qualification multiple
times, you took this five-yearbreak from racing.
What did stepping back fromcompetition teach you about
yourself?
And tell us about those fiveyears?
(02:36):
And maybe, if Masters played arole in that?
Speaker 2 (02:39):
Yes, so, masters definitely played a role in that
.
But the first two years after Iquote unquote retired, when I
decided to take a break, Ididn't touch water Because I had
spent my entire life, from whenI was probably younger than
five years old, just in thewater all the time and I hadn't
really experienced life withoutit and I wanted to make sure I
(03:01):
was going to be okay without itbecause I knew nothing else.
I had never been a normalperson I never, well, normal
whatever.
You know the definition thatsociety has of normal Because I
hadn't gone to high school.
I hadn't, I mean, I'd gone tocollege, but I was swimming when
I was in college and focusingmore on swimming, and also was
(03:21):
in this major that was taking upa lot of my time, so my social
life had to take a backseat.
So the first two years werereally just me, you know, honing
my writing, figuring out who Iwas without swimming, who I
wanted to be, what I wanted todo, and just discovering a lot
of new things, which was reallyfun.
But after that two-year mark, Iremember I was working a job on
(03:43):
a TV show that I felt like Ihad no power whatsoever and I
felt like I didn't have anycontrol over my life and in that
moment I started.
I also like starting to havethis recurring dream about
swimming, where I was alwaysswimming the 1500 and I was like
at Olympic trials and I justreally every day, every day, I'd
wake up and I would missswimming.
(04:04):
I was like I wish that thatdream was real, like I missed
the 1500.
And then I was like, why notswimming?
Like swimming is the way that Ihave control over and also I
want to.
I clearly want to be doing itif I'm dreaming about it like
every other night.
Um, so from there I I joined amaster's team it was, uh, the
West Hollywood Aquatic Club andwe h2O, as they're called and I
(04:26):
just showed up, jumped into laneone, made some friends, almost
died that first practice.
And then, after practice, I gotout of the pool and I was like,
how did I just take?
How did I not swim for twoyears?
How did I not do that?
Why haven't I been doing?
This is what I love.
This is who I am.
Speaker 1 (04:48):
Yeah, so it definitely opened my eyes in a
lot of ways.
That's so beautiful and we hearthat from so many people, like
many, many of the people that weinterview.
How did I not swim for 10 years?
How did I not swim for 20 years?
So you're really lucky that itwas only two years, really lucky
(05:08):
that it was only two years.
So so I I love the fact thatyou were tired in a master's
practice right out of the gate.
Speaker 2 (05:12):
Like that's crazy.
I like remember thinking.
I'm like I have to win thispractice.
I have to beat all of these menthat I'm swimming with, and if
I didn't, I I like almost diedtrying.
But it's like, okay, I need toget back in shape so I can win
the practices.
I'm just really competitive.
Speaker 1 (05:29):
So did this five years?
I didn't say in the intro andI'm not sure if everybody,
unless they've read the book, ortruly I'm not using the word
loosely, in fact I don't thinkI've ever used it on the show
before you were truly a prodigy,this 10-year-old doing
(05:51):
incredible feats and 12-year-oldNational Age Group records, and
your family homeschooled youand went around to accommodate
your swimming, both with findingthe right coaches and the right
meets.
And then when you went tocollege you're still in college,
you're still in a verystructured program.
Were those five years?
Did they feel like?
(06:11):
That was kind of like thefreedom that you just hadn't had
historically.
Speaker 2 (06:14):
I wouldn't say it was freedom.
It felt like I didn't.
I like having structure and soI, I, I struggled a little bit
with not having the structure.
I was like what do I like I getto pick when I wake up?
I need to know when I'm wakingup.
I want someone to tell me thatI have to do this at this time
so I know to wake up at thistime.
And, yeah, I really likeadventure, like I love adventure
(06:37):
and spontaneity, but I alsolove when I'm home to have my
routine.
So I had to build my routinemyself and that was hard and
like no one was holding myroutine accountable or me
accountable for my routine.
So that was like a little bitstrange.
And then, in terms of freedom, Inever felt like I didn't have
freedom in my training because Iwas the one making all the
(06:58):
decisions.
I was the one who decided okay,like I'm not going to stay up
past 10 pm because I care aboutswimming more than I care about
anything else.
There was never anyone tellingme that I couldn't do that and I
think that, because it was allfrom myself, I never felt like I
wasn't free, but those fiveyears for sure, like I, I
(07:20):
remember I I made a list of allthe things I wanted to do and I
just started checking them off.
I was like, okay, I'm going togo on a five-day hiking trip
with no service and I'm going toclimb a 14er and I'm going to
learn how to skateboard and I'mgoing to learn how to brew
kombucha and I'm going to startgoing to concerts and I'm going
to see what the party scene isthat everybody talks about.
(07:42):
I just wanted to do everythingthat I hadn't done and it was
really fun.
It was very, very fun.
I traveled a ton too.
I just went on a bunch of solotrips with my backpack and it
was so much fun and I like my myperspective broadened.
I learned a lot about like theworld and myself and people, but
(08:05):
at the same time, there wassomething that wasn't fully
fulfilling about it, becausethere was no goal in mind.
Like it was just like a periodof growth which I really needed.
Like I think that I did needthose two years with not
touching the water because Ineeded to again like just make
sure that I could thrive withoutswimming.
And then, yeah, so just like,seeing everything made me
(08:26):
appreciate how fulfillingswimming is and how, like having
a goal and having havingsomething that you do every
single day that brings you alittle bit closer to the goal uh
, really, just like makes lifefeel purposeful and meaningful.
Speaker 1 (08:41):
Yes, that that's yeah , that's so true.
That's one of the beauties ofswimming.
So I want to come back to thisfun travel year in conjunction
with your mental health and howthe mental health fit into those
years where there was not a lotas much structure.
But I do want to say in goinginto this, that in your book,
(09:05):
which was beautiful, honest, raw, beautifully written, you're
incredibly open about livingwith OCD and for listeners that
may not understand what thatreally feels like, can you share
, like how OCD impacted yourjourney as an elite swimmer, as
a creative artist, and how itmanifested or didn't?
Speaker 2 (09:25):
on this open five-year period, yeah, my OCD
I'm mostly like it's mostlyobsessional for me.
I don't have many like outwardcompulsions, especially now.
Now it's like mostly, you know,the compulsions are me just
thinking about a thought overand over and over again and
trying to convince myself thatthere's something in there that
either makes it true or untrue.
So it's basically for me justintrusive thoughts that I can't
(09:49):
stop thinking about, so like themost disturbing things that my
brain can think about, and thensomething in my head won't let
me let them go, because I'mconvinced that if I do, they'll
either happen, won't happen, orthey're just so disturbing that
I can't stop thinking about them.
So, yeah, it's not most fun, uh, most fun thing to have.
(10:12):
But I mean, I've been in therapyfor a long time, so, uh, and
like in and out of therapy andI've learned the tools to, to
basically how to cope with itand how to not allow it to have
so much power, and I'm reallyhappy with how far that I've
come.
I'm very proud of that actually, because now, like I've noticed
that I usually like it's up anddown, like sometimes like I'll
(10:35):
have no OCD, no intrusivethoughts, for months, or
potentially like up to years,and then sometimes then, I'll
like suddenly go into a spiralwhere, like, I'll have several
months where my OCD is just likespiraling.
So now, whenever I do go intothe spiral, I feel like I have
the tools that I need to eithermake it shorter or not as
(10:56):
powerful.
Speaker 1 (11:07):
OCD is so overused.
People will say to one anotheryou know if you make your bed
every morning?
Speaker 2 (11:10):
oh you have OCD.
Speaker 1 (11:10):
Or if you straighten out something you know in the
pool, you know like, oh, if youline up your equipment, you have
OCD.
And I think the thing thatpeople don't realize as much is
it is kind of the hallmark of itare scary thoughts, are okay, I
would say obtrusive thoughts,you know, thoughts that maybe
they're scary, maybe they'reweird, and be like why am I
(11:33):
think horrible this, the threeis, or what, or both?
Yeah, like, why am I thinkingthis tree is gonna fall on me or
whatever, when people don'tunderstand that I, I read the
book and if you haven't read thebook Outside the Lanes, I
highly recommend it and so itmade me realize.
You know, like we all are soneuro diverse that it just that
(11:57):
made me feel like, ok, well, youknow, this is just, I have
intrusive thoughts.
I, you know, I remember thefirst time when I was four years
old and I I was afraid that Iwas going to sleepwalk into the
street and get killed, like Ikept, like I couldn't get that
out of my mind and so I wouldjust lay.
I had similar things to thattoo, like, like this started
when I was four and I think we,we have these tools.
(12:20):
Now we can recognize these andwhat.
What are some of your tools?
What are some tools?
Speaker 2 (12:25):
for you.
So whenever, like it getsreally bad and I start having a
panic attack about my intrusivethoughts, I've found that the
best thing to do is intensecardio, like right in that
(12:47):
moment, because I haveadrenaline and my brain usually
it's not going to be able tofocus on anything else.
So if I can work my body sohard that my brain just kind of
shuts down and can only thinkabout, like focus on doing that,
doing that exercise, then thatwill like be a good, a great
short, short term solution forme.
So that's one tool that I have.
I've also found that, just likeyou know, regularly swimming,
it's very helpful.
And then, like in terms of how Ilike deal with it on like a
(13:08):
regular basis when I'm like no,that it's been, it's acting up,
now I just really let them be,like I let my thoughts be and I
let myself think them.
I try and I try not to react.
I try to just let them be, andI also have gotten really good
at, you know, recognizing.
(13:28):
Ok, this isn't real, this is myOCD, this is not a real thought
, this isn't true, this isn'tgoing to happen and that that's
OK that I'm thinking this.
It doesn't mean anything about,like, who I am as a person.
It doesn't mean anything aboutthe world, it doesn't mean
anything about the future, itjust is and that's fine.
(13:52):
And then I try to distractmyself.
Yeah, writing also really helpsme.
I found that, like, when I getlost in my writing, I'm
generally like pretty, I'm verycalm in that moment.
Speaker 1 (13:58):
Have you heard the term sticky thoughts?
I think I have.
They found in research thatpeople do who have OCD have
sticky thoughts and so they'veliterally done tons of research
that everyone has intrusivethoughts.
Everyone has weird, scary,disturbing intrusive thoughts
and like the thought of you'restanding at the Grand Canyon and
(14:22):
you go up to the edge andyou're thinking, oh no, I might
jump off of here.
A person that has OCD willthink about that thought for the
rest of the day, maybe the restof the week.
I really think that it's greatthat you brought this forward
and talked about it honestly,because I feel like sometimes
(14:42):
high level swimmers and peoplethat have these sticky thoughts,
high-level swimmers and peoplethat have these sticky thoughts,
they also work with ruminationin the opposite way, where when
you're going after a record, Ilove the story where you said
you missed a National Ice Grouprecord on an 800 by one-tenth of
a second or less than one-tenthof a second 0.05.
(15:03):
You were crying but it's thesame rumination.
I know you did an interview, awritten interview, with Eni
Jones, who I love.
Eni's a friend of mine.
You said that you didn't getanything good out of your OCD
and I say I would push back onthat and say the same ruminating
, sticky thoughts that drive youcrazy sometimes are the same
(15:25):
ones that drive you high level.
Where you you're, it's stickingin your mind.
You got to go, you know 853 or850 or whatever do you agree
with?
Speaker 2 (15:35):
that I don't see it's hard for me to.
I also have autism and I hyperfixate on a lot of things and I
think that my hyper fixationsare like the good, like the good
side of OCD, like it's thething where I love something so
much that I think about it allthe time.
So I found a way to reallyseparate the two.
Where I'm like OCD is like theintrusive bad thoughts, while
(15:58):
like hyper fixations are likethe, the ones that don't cause
me any harm but also I thinkabout, but I think about so much
that I can achieve more or Ican like be hyper-focused.
So yeah, I'm not exactly sure.
I don't know where the line is.
Speaker 1 (16:16):
Yeah Well.
So again, I love that you'veopened up this topic of just
mental health and we're talkingabout a different mental health.
We've talked about depression alot.
We've talked about anxiety andperformance anxiety, and I love
it.
Somebody is talking about adifferent mental health.
We've talked about depression alot.
We've talked about anxiety andperformance anxiety, and I love
it.
Somebody is talking aboutsomething new, which is OCD.
What advice might you give toathletes who do feel different
mentally, emotionally,neurologically, but still want
(16:38):
to chase those, the big dreams?
Speaker 2 (16:43):
I would say that it could be your superpower, like
if maybe you're a little like,if you're different from other
people, that doesn't mean thatyou're worse, it doesn't mean
that you are strange, it justmeans that you're different.
And I think thatneurodivergence, just being
different in any way, isbeautiful and it's what makes
the world so special.
And just to recognize that, andjust to recognize that, yeah,
(17:06):
absolutely Well.
Speaker 1 (17:13):
So you are now that elite athlete on this new path
which I'm really excited to talkabout.
So you take this time off, youcome back to master's practice.
You now are definitely not inmaster's practice because you
were training with AshleyTwitchell in right.
Yes, oh my gosh.
Speaker 2 (17:28):
I'm in North Carolina right now.
Speaker 1 (17:29):
Yeah, how did you ramp from master's practice to
where you are now, what you'retraining for and what some of
these things are that you'reshooting for?
Speaker 2 (17:38):
Yes, okay.
So about six months after Istarted swimming masters, and I
was swimming masters like threetimes a week, just for an hour,
15 minutes, 15 minutes.
It was great.
I felt like that was all Ineeded.
Then Ashley actually texted meand she's like hey, do you want
to like come out of retirement,move here and, uh, come swim
with me.
And I was like, no, I don'twant to do that, I'm not gonna
(17:59):
do that.
And she's like are you sure?
And I was like, yes, and she'slike I really need someone to
train with.
You should really think aboutthis.
And I was like, no, I'm notdoing that.
I was in between jobs, becausein Hollywood, like, the show
only lasts for six months eachseason and then you just hope
that it doesn't get canceled andthen, if it does, you look for
your next thing.
So I was like in this inbetween, and I think that this
(18:22):
was, this was October, novemberof 2022.
I remember I was, I was on afamily vacation in Hawaii and I
was walking with my mom and Iwas like this is ridiculous.
I don't want to like make acomeback.
That wouldn't be fun.
Blah, blah, blah.
And I was like, well, I'm notreally doing anything right now
except for writing and like Ikind of do miss structure and I
(18:46):
guess maybe, like I could kindof think about it.
So, anyways, I like I stilltold Ashley no, but I started
training a little bit more.
And uh, and started trainingactually with team Santa Monica
and, uh, my friend, ivanPuskovich, who was the open
water Olympian in 2024.
I just texted him and was likehey, can I come swim with you?
(19:06):
And he's like, yeah, sure, butagain, like it wasn't super
serious, I was skiing, I waswriting, I was only doing
singles and I would take randomdays off in the week when, like,
I was up late, so it wasn'tsuper serious.
And then I ended up in anotherwriter's room and that was
taking up all of my time.
But I think Ashley had textedme again and said something
(19:26):
about like hey, can you cometrain with me for this month,
because I need someone for thismonth.
And I was like, okay, yeah,sure, like I'll come, I'll come
stay with you and do that.
Like why not?
Because my, my writer's roomwas remote.
So then I had to amp it up alittle bit more because I had to
keep up with her.
So it's just like a small, asmall like every time.
I just stepped it up justslightly more.
(19:47):
And I was also still trainingwith masters because I loved all
my masters friends, so like I'dhalf train with, I've been half
masters.
And then I showed up at Ashley'sand I had to go a nine 57,000
free If I wanted to qualify foropen water nationals.
And when I was there actuallyit was like, well, you may as
well just qualify for open waternationals at the end of these
(20:10):
three weeks.
And I was like, ok, so Itrained with her and had so much
fun, I missed it.
I was like this is the life, Ilove this.
I ended up going a 10.03 in my1,000.
And then after that I came backtwo weeks later and tried again
and then missed it again andthose were the two most painful
thousands of my life because Iwas not in good enough shape to
(20:32):
be going that fast.
I just basically was like, ok,I've won 1,000 that I have to
basically go all out for, and ifI don't make it, then I don't
make it, like I'm just giving itmy all and leaving no stone
unturned here and yeah.
So after that I was kind oflike, okay, like this was fun,
(20:52):
but I'm done with this for now.
I need to just go back tomaster swimming.
I don't want to do the thousandagain, I don't care this much.
So then after that, I went backto master swimming, swam across
Tahoe in 2023.
I did like the Tahoe solocrossing, which was fun.
But again, like I was like, okay, I'm good with just being a
master swimmer.
And also then I startedtraveling a lot because that was
(21:12):
like right after, like duringthe writer's strike, I like I
went on strike for a bit andthen I like traveled a bit and
was just, you know, living mylife and swimming didn't need to
be a focus in that moment.
It and was just, you know,living my life and swimming
didn't need to be a focus inthat moment.
So I didn't let it become afocus.
And then the big turning pointfor me was I started writing.
There were two big turningpoints, but it was when I
started writing, outside theLanes, my swimming book.
(21:39):
And as I was writing it, I waslike, wow, I miss this.
Like I miss going to practice,I miss waking up early, I miss
this was so much fun.
I was writing about like thingsthat were traumatic for me in
some ways, but also they werethe most fun that I've ever had.
And you know the hard thefeeling after a hard practice,
when you've just done reallywell and worked yourself as hard
as possible.
There's no feeling quite likeit, just like the mixture of
endorphins adrenaline, like thatfeeling of pride knowing that
(22:01):
you're excellent at something.
Adrenaline like that feeling ofpride knowing that you're
excellent at something.
So I was writing this book andI was like, oh, I miss this
excellence.
But I still kind of was justlike whatever, like it's fine,
like I'll just go, I'll swim alittle bit more, I'll train a
little bit more and do more, domore channel crossings, do do a
master's meet or two.
But then the big shift, the onewhere I was like okay, I can't
ignore anymore was I was workingthe Olympics as a researcher in
(22:24):
Connecticut at the NBC office,and I remember I was working the
night shift.
I would work from 11 pm to 11am and I just remember like it
was 5 am one day and I wascovering prelims.
So I like had like the camerathat isn't broadcast but like
just that I'm basically gets tosee where, like the all their
(22:45):
random camera angles.
I was just like watching allthe swimmers and I was like
watching people warm up and Iwas watching them stretch.
And then, like I watched theready room and watched the
warm-up pool and I was like I'mstretching, I'm swarming up, I'm
all of these things.
It was like the same feelingthat I had as I was writing my
book, only it was like morepronounced, because I was like
(23:06):
this is what's happening rightnow and I'm right here in the
middle of the night in this dark, windowless room and I want to
be swimming right now.
So I like spent like three daysjust like watching that and
feeling that way.
And then I uh, I texted Ashleyactually, and it was like I
really think I want to make acomeback and she's like do it,
move here, do it.
(23:28):
I was like I don't know.
And she's like Becca, this iswhat you want.
No one loves swimming as muchas you do.
Just do it.
I was like, yes, this is what Iwant to do.
I don't care if I'm ever asgood as I was before again, I
just want to be doing it anddedicating all of my time to it.
And yeah, then, like a fewmonths later, I moved out to
North Carolina and have beentraining ever since.
(23:48):
What are you training for?
So I had Open Water Nationalstwo months ago, and so to make
the national team you have toget top six of the Americans at
Open Water Nationals, and thenyou have to go 1644, I believe
in the 1500.
So I got fifth at Open WaterNationals, which was my goal to
get the top six, and now I justhave to go the 1644 in a meet
(24:15):
which I'm excited for, like Ifeel like I can get it.
I have a meet in three weekswhere I'll try for the first
time.
So I'm feeling really goodabout it.
It's going to be here at TAC.
Oh nice, I'm feeling reallygood about it, it's going to be
here at TAC oh nice yeah, homemeet yeah.
Speaker 1 (24:24):
Well, you know, I know that distance, especially
distance, women do the best intheir 30s Exactly Without a
doubt.
And so I'm just like what proswim series Did you just see
there was a 39-year-old woman inthe final from was it Colombia
or Brazil?
Oh, Crystal Kobrich.
Yes, there was a 39 year oldwoman in the final from.
Was it Colombia or Brazil, Idon't know.
Speaker 2 (24:43):
And Crystal Kobrich yes, she's been swimming forever
.
This was her sixth Olympicssushi wait.
I have a funny story once uh,it was at yeah, 2014, pan Packs
I was doing the 800 and theannouncer thought that I was
Crystal Kobrich the whole timeand I loved it because I was 16
and I think that she was likeyou know, she was in her 30s
already at that point and Ithought it was the funniest
(25:05):
thing ever, and I've been such abig Crystal Fulbridge fan ever
since, ever since I impersonatedher that one time.
Well, I think that it'sridiculous that we tell female
athletes that they're going topeak when they're 18.
Speaker 1 (25:15):
They're not, it's so ridiculous.
Speaker 2 (25:16):
They're not, I think.
Actually, I think that thereare two peaks.
I do think that one of them isat 18, where, like you, have
like your first peak at 18,because it's hard to know your
body has changed and yourrecovery rate has changed and
it's hard to figure out how toadjust to that in your 20s.
I feel like 20s, like your 20s,are just such a weird period in
life in general.
So I think that, like the firstpeak is 18.
(25:38):
And then the 20s is likefiguring it out, and then like
late 20s, early 30s, mid 30s,that's the second peak and that
is the better peak than the 18year old one.
That's my theory that is notbased in science.
Speaker 1 (25:50):
yeah, I totally agree with that I.
That's a really exciting goaland I'm going to be following
that.
Thank you for exciting.
You're going to be faster thanyou ever were.
Period, that's what I thinkthat's.
Speaker 2 (26:00):
That's what I'm telling myself.
Yeah, so 1644 is easy.
Yeah, and whether or not it'strue, I'm just gonna enjoy
getting seeing if I can do it.
You shouldn't just enjoy trying.
You know, I'm gonna enjoywatching.
Speaker 1 (26:11):
So I'll think there.
In addition to being a swimmerand an author, you're also a
screenwriter.
How does your creative processas a writer compare, maybe, to
your process as an athlete?
Speaker 2 (26:22):
did you ever mirror those my no, I don't think so,
because with swimming it's sostructured, you know.
You know when you get in, youknow your times.
You know like somebody's comingup with your plan, while
writing is very like a lot ofthinking time goes into it.
I find that most of my writingis done in my head like I'll be
right, I'll be writing as I'mswimming.
(26:42):
I writing is done in my headLike I'll be right, I'll be
writing as I'm swimming.
I'll be writing as I'm likewalking.
I'll be writing as I'm watchingsomething.
I'll be writing to someone'stelling me an inspirational
story.
Like I just get inspired by theworld around me.
Like if I'm drafting something,then I'll try to write like
1500 words every day, but if I'min like the world building
phase, then that doesn't have atimeline.
That just kind of needs tohappen on its own.
Speaker 1 (27:05):
So when you're talking about your worlds.
I know that you love writingabout dystopian worlds.
Yeah, Is that what you'retalking about there?
Speaker 2 (27:12):
The dystopian yes.
So, I have this book, unruly,which I published the same time
as Outside the Lanes, and that'sa young adult dystopian which
is like very Hunger Games,bridgerton-esque, also like
Parent Trap a little bit.
So that is, I think, myfavorite thing that I've ever
written.
It's a twin swap in a dystopianworld where, when you're 17, so
(27:36):
it's post-apocalyptic the worldhas been destroyed and human
population is down.
So this country.
In order to bring thepopulation back up, when kids
like around, when they're 17, 18, they get paired with someone
to go procreate with.
But based on how well behavedyou are before that, you get
more options of people to choosefrom, and then, if you're not
(27:57):
well behaved, you just getassigned someone.
So it's about these identicaltwins, twins.
One of them has the most, she'sbeen the best behaved of anyone
ever.
She has all the options in theworld, and that's because every
time she messes up, she pretendsto be her sister who is about
to be assigned someone, and it'sabout their relationship.
And the one who has all theseoptions has terrible anxiety and
(28:19):
like pressure from society, tothe point where, like she's just
chasing perfection and doesn'tlike want, she doesn't know what
else to do except be perfect.
So then, like when it comestime for her to like step into
her role, she panics and tradesplaces with the other twin, who
has decided to exile herselffrom this nation and go to this
island where nobody really knowswhat happens.
(28:40):
Just that.
That it's bad.
I love that.
That sounds fantastic.
It needs to be a.
Hollywood movie.
I hope so one day.
Speaker 1 (28:48):
So you know the obvious question that I know
everybody is at home screamingout are you going to write a
swimming screenplay?
Speaker 2 (28:57):
I actually have a pilot.
I have a pilot called Prodigy.
Actually that is my main sample, but I would love to shop that
at some point once.
Speaker 1 (29:06):
The once the time is right in the market is looking a
little bit different, you knowbeing a swimmer for 50 years, I
I just there's just never been asatisfying competitive swimming
movie.
Pride, pride, that is about thePDR swim team with the first
black swimmers and it's a true.
(29:27):
It's based on a true story.
I want to watch that.
It is I haven't heard of it Agreat.
Oh my gosh, it's a greatswimming movie.
It's called Pride, yeah, yeah,oh, I guess we have Nyad.
I like that.
I like that.
I mean how, yeah, how did youlike it?
I liked it too.
I mean, yeah, how did you likeit?
Speaker 2 (29:42):
I did like it.
Oh my goodness, I was watchingit with my older sister and
every time Diana said somethinglike you guys are my crew, like
I am the chosen one who's goingto swim across the ocean, and
you people like, at one of thosemoments, yeah as well.
Her sister just turned to me.
She's like sounds familiar.
Speaker 1 (30:06):
We just watched our whole women's master's group.
We have a group, of us have abook club, but we watched the
Young Woman in the Sea.
What did you think of that?
Speaker 2 (30:14):
I haven't seen it yet .
I need to watch it.
I know, I know, oh, you'rekidding it's wonderful, I know.
Speaker 1 (30:22):
Oh, my gosh Becca, you need to treat yourself and I
will, I will.
Speaker 2 (30:26):
I'm having a book kick lately so that's been
fading, though I'm starting toget back into like TV movies.
Speaker 1 (30:31):
So well, the second to last question.
Before I ask, the last questionis other than what you're
trying to do with your 1500 tomake the national team.
What else is next for BeccaMann?
Speaker 2 (30:47):
so from a swimming perspective, I'll hopefully like
assuming that I make thenational theme.
I've noticed that in this timearound I like to do really small
short-term goals where I'm likeall right, this is this
three-month period, so I'mhoping that the three-month
period after that will be aWorld Cup in Sardinia and then
maybe two LEN Cups.
(31:07):
Right before that, do a littleEurope trip and get some 10-pay
raising in.
So that's on my agenda.
I also I mean, speaking of theEnglish Channel I would love to
do an English Channel crossinglike early June of next year and
try to get that record, which Iknow it's a very, very fast
record.
I think it's like six hours 20minutes in 2000, from 2006.
(31:28):
So I need like I would needeverything to be going my way
and be perfect, but I think thatcould be kind of fun to try.
Speaker 1 (31:39):
Well, so is 2028 out as far as the Olympics.
Speaker 2 (31:43):
No, definitely not.
I just can't think that farahead right now.
Right, but don't you have?
Speaker 1 (31:47):
to as a 10K.
Don't you have to do thecircuit and get points to get
into the trials, or what are?
Speaker 2 (31:53):
the like doing something different.
They haven't announced it yet,but I think it's going to be
based on, like your, world Cupranking, but I think that that
won't start until like 2026,whatever 2028 might hold.
Speaker 1 (32:04):
Yeah, I think that's a really great plan right now.
Yeah, all right, and the lastquestion before we do a sprint
around is there anything that Ihaven't asked you that you want
to share?
Speaker 2 (32:16):
I don't think so.
This has been such like anamazing interview.
I've had so much fun.
Speaker 1 (32:21):
Well, me too, me too, it's always nice to meet my
heroes, so, all right.
So this is just to get to knowyou a little better, and we're
looking for like one wordanswers here.
Okay, favorite sandwich Turkey.
What do you own that you shouldthrow?
Speaker 2 (32:34):
out.
I feel like my pots and pans Ineed.
I need new ones.
They're getting old, Celebritymost like to meet.
Speaker 1 (32:42):
I feel like Lady Gaga would be fun Hardest swimming
event in the pool 1500.
Speaker 2 (32:49):
Favorite movie Wicked , part one.
Speaker 1 (32:52):
Nice Favorite smell, oh, interesting.
The ocean, oh, that's a goodone.
Do you make your bed in themorning?
No, kickboard, I don't havethat type of OCD.
There you go.
It says, there you go.
Kickboard or no kickboard,kickboard.
If you had to listen to onesong for the rest of your life,
(33:13):
what would it be?
Pink Pony, club Window or aisleAisle.
Describe your life in fivewords.
Speaker 2 (33:25):
Do they have to be related?
Or should be a sentence.
It can be anything you want,okay, fulfilling, fun, exciting,
evolving and freeing Freeing.
Speaker 1 (33:35):
I like it.
Yeah, all right.
This last one is more of aspiritual question, not
necessarily when the gun goesoff.
What word comes to mind whenyou're in the water?
Peace, that's beautiful.
Speaker 2 (33:49):
I love that I had that one ready.
Speaker 1 (33:52):
Yeah, that's really a great one.
All right, becca, this has beenso wonderful.
This has been so much fun, yeah, so thank you for being on the
show.
Yeah, thank you for having me,kelly, I loved this interview
the best podcast.
Awesome Thank.
Hello friends, welcome to the Champions Mojo
podcast, the podcast thatcelebrates comeback champions,
lifelong athletes and thetransformative power of swimming
.
I'm your host, kelly Pallas.
Today we're diving in with aguest who has truly lived
outside the lanes, literally andfiguratively.
Becca Mann is a swimming phenom, a seven-time US national team
(00:23):
member, two-time nationalchampion and the first person to
complete the epic 40-mile21-hour Maui Nui tri-channel
crossing between three Hawaiianislands.
She made her mark early bybecoming the youngest swimmer to
complete the 15K Maui channelat just 10 years old, and the
youngest athlete to place top 10in four events at a single US
(00:46):
Olympic trials.
But Becca's story doesn't stopat elite competition.
After narrowly missing Olympicqualification three times, she
took a bold step back fromracing and into rediscovery.
In that time she wrote herpowerful memoir Outside the
Lanes, sharing her honestjourney through mental health
(01:06):
challenges, the identity shiftof leaving high-level sport and
what it means to redefinesuccess on her own terms.
And now this is where it getsexciting for master swimmers.
Becca is making her return tocompetitive swimming after a
five-year hiatus, a journey thatincluded training with master
swimmers.
That's right.
She found her groove again inthe master's community, proving
(01:29):
that her passion for swimming istruly lifelong.
Becca is also a gifted writer,with a BFA in screenwriting from
USC, and has worked on hitshows like the Morning Show and
the Wilds.
Whether she's penning novels,crushing open water feats or
diving back into the pool, beccaMann embodies the spirit of
resilience, reinvention and, yes, mojo, welcome to Champions.
(01:54):
Mojo, becca Mann, thank you somuch for having me.
Kelly, I'm so happy to be here.
Oh, it's so great to see you.
Like I said before we recorded,I'm a big fan.
You know all my listeners knowthat I love distance swimming
and you're a prodigy from such ayoung age, and it's just so
great that you have done all thethings you've done and you
(02:15):
still have so much more ahead inyour swimming career.
What I wanted to start off withAfter competing at this high
level and narrowly missingOlympic qualification multiple
times, you took this five-yearbreak from racing.
What did stepping back fromcompetition teach you about
yourself?
And tell us about those fiveyears?
(02:36):
And maybe, if Masters played arole in that?
Speaker 2 (02:39):
Yes, so, masters definitely played a role in that
.
But the first two years after Iquote unquote retired, when I
decided to take a break, Ididn't touch water Because I had
spent my entire life, from whenI was probably younger than
five years old, just in thewater all the time and I hadn't
really experienced life withoutit and I wanted to make sure I
(03:01):
was going to be okay without itbecause I knew nothing else.
I had never been a normalperson I never, well, normal
whatever.
You know the definition thatsociety has of normal Because I
hadn't gone to high school.
I hadn't, I mean, I'd gone tocollege, but I was swimming when
I was in college and focusingmore on swimming, and also was
(03:21):
in this major that was taking upa lot of my time, so my social
life had to take a backseat.
So the first two years werereally just me, you know, honing
my writing, figuring out who Iwas without swimming, who I
wanted to be, what I wanted todo, and just discovering a lot
of new things, which was reallyfun.
But after that two-year mark, Iremember I was working a job on
(03:43):
a TV show that I felt like Ihad no power whatsoever and I
felt like I didn't have anycontrol over my life and in that
moment I started.
I also like starting to havethis recurring dream about
swimming, where I was alwaysswimming the 1500 and I was like
at Olympic trials and I justreally every day, every day, I'd
wake up and I would missswimming.
(04:04):
I was like I wish that thatdream was real, like I missed
the 1500.
And then I was like, why notswimming?
Like swimming is the way that Ihave control over and also I
want to.
I clearly want to be doing itif I'm dreaming about it like
every other night.
Um, so from there I I joined amaster's team it was, uh, the
West Hollywood Aquatic Club andwe h2O, as they're called and I
(04:26):
just showed up, jumped into laneone, made some friends, almost
died that first practice.
And then, after practice, I gotout of the pool and I was like,
how did I just take?
How did I not swim for twoyears?
How did I not do that?
Why haven't I been doing?
This is what I love.
This is who I am.
Speaker 1 (04:48):
Yeah, so it definitely opened my eyes in a
lot of ways.
That's so beautiful and we hearthat from so many people, like
many, many of the people that weinterview.
How did I not swim for 10 years?
How did I not swim for 20 years?
So you're really lucky that itwas only two years, really lucky
(05:08):
that it was only two years.
So so I I love the fact thatyou were tired in a master's
practice right out of the gate.
Speaker 2 (05:12):
Like that's crazy.
I like remember thinking.
I'm like I have to win thispractice.
I have to beat all of these menthat I'm swimming with, and if
I didn't, I I like almost diedtrying.
But it's like, okay, I need toget back in shape so I can win
the practices.
I'm just really competitive.
Speaker 1 (05:29):
So did this five years?
I didn't say in the intro andI'm not sure if everybody,
unless they've read the book, ortruly I'm not using the word
loosely, in fact I don't thinkI've ever used it on the show
before you were truly a prodigy,this 10-year-old doing
(05:51):
incredible feats and 12-year-oldNational Age Group records, and
your family homeschooled youand went around to accommodate
your swimming, both with findingthe right coaches and the right
meets.
And then when you went tocollege you're still in college,
you're still in a verystructured program.
Were those five years?
Did they feel like?
(06:11):
That was kind of like thefreedom that you just hadn't had
historically.
Speaker 2 (06:14):
I wouldn't say it was freedom.
It felt like I didn't.
I like having structure and soI, I, I struggled a little bit
with not having the structure.
I was like what do I like I getto pick when I wake up?
I need to know when I'm wakingup.
I want someone to tell me thatI have to do this at this time
so I know to wake up at thistime.
And, yeah, I really likeadventure, like I love adventure
(06:37):
and spontaneity, but I alsolove when I'm home to have my
routine.
So I had to build my routinemyself and that was hard and
like no one was holding myroutine accountable or me
accountable for my routine.
So that was like a little bitstrange.
And then, in terms of freedom, Inever felt like I didn't have
freedom in my training because Iwas the one making all the
(06:58):
decisions.
I was the one who decided okay,like I'm not going to stay up
past 10 pm because I care aboutswimming more than I care about
anything else.
There was never anyone tellingme that I couldn't do that and I
think that, because it was allfrom myself, I never felt like I
wasn't free, but those fiveyears for sure, like I, I
(07:20):
remember I I made a list of allthe things I wanted to do and I
just started checking them off.
I was like, okay, I'm going togo on a five-day hiking trip
with no service and I'm going toclimb a 14er and I'm going to
learn how to skateboard and I'mgoing to learn how to brew
kombucha and I'm going to startgoing to concerts and I'm going
to see what the party scene isthat everybody talks about.
(07:42):
I just wanted to do everythingthat I hadn't done and it was
really fun.
It was very, very fun.
I traveled a ton too.
I just went on a bunch of solotrips with my backpack and it
was so much fun and I like my myperspective broadened.
I learned a lot about like theworld and myself and people, but
(08:05):
at the same time, there wassomething that wasn't fully
fulfilling about it, becausethere was no goal in mind.
Like it was just like a periodof growth which I really needed.
Like I think that I did needthose two years with not
touching the water because Ineeded to again like just make
sure that I could thrive withoutswimming.
And then, yeah, so just like,seeing everything made me
(08:26):
appreciate how fulfillingswimming is and how, like having
a goal and having havingsomething that you do every
single day that brings you alittle bit closer to the goal uh
, really, just like makes lifefeel purposeful and meaningful.
Speaker 1 (08:41):
Yes, that that's yeah , that's so true.
That's one of the beauties ofswimming.
So I want to come back to thisfun travel year in conjunction
with your mental health and howthe mental health fit into those
years where there was not a lotas much structure.
But I do want to say in goinginto this, that in your book,
(09:05):
which was beautiful, honest, raw, beautifully written, you're
incredibly open about livingwith OCD and for listeners that
may not understand what thatreally feels like, can you share
, like how OCD impacted yourjourney as an elite swimmer, as
a creative artist, and how itmanifested or didn't?
Speaker 2 (09:25):
on this open five-year period, yeah, my OCD
I'm mostly like it's mostlyobsessional for me.
I don't have many like outwardcompulsions, especially now.
Now it's like mostly, you know,the compulsions are me just
thinking about a thought overand over and over again and
trying to convince myself thatthere's something in there that
either makes it true or untrue.
So it's basically for me justintrusive thoughts that I can't
(09:49):
stop thinking about, so like themost disturbing things that my
brain can think about, and thensomething in my head won't let
me let them go, because I'mconvinced that if I do, they'll
either happen, won't happen, orthey're just so disturbing that
I can't stop thinking about them.
So, yeah, it's not most fun, uh, most fun thing to have.
(10:12):
But I mean, I've been in therapyfor a long time, so, uh, and
like in and out of therapy andI've learned the tools to, to
basically how to cope with itand how to not allow it to have
so much power, and I'm reallyhappy with how far that I've
come.
I'm very proud of that actually, because now, like I've noticed
that I usually like it's up anddown, like sometimes like I'll
(10:35):
have no OCD, no intrusivethoughts, for months, or
potentially like up to years,and then sometimes then, I'll
like suddenly go into a spiralwhere, like, I'll have several
months where my OCD is just likespiraling.
So now, whenever I do go intothe spiral, I feel like I have
the tools that I need to eithermake it shorter or not as
(10:56):
powerful.
Speaker 1 (11:07):
OCD is so overused.
People will say to one anotheryou know if you make your bed
every morning?
Speaker 2 (11:10):
oh you have OCD.
Speaker 1 (11:10):
Or if you straighten out something you know in the
pool, you know like, oh, if youline up your equipment, you have
OCD.
And I think the thing thatpeople don't realize as much is
it is kind of the hallmark of itare scary thoughts, are okay, I
would say obtrusive thoughts,you know, thoughts that maybe
they're scary, maybe they'reweird, and be like why am I
(11:33):
think horrible this, the threeis, or what, or both?
Yeah, like, why am I thinkingthis tree is gonna fall on me or
whatever, when people don'tunderstand that I, I read the
book and if you haven't read thebook Outside the Lanes, I
highly recommend it and so itmade me realize.
You know, like we all are soneuro diverse that it just that
(11:57):
made me feel like, ok, well, youknow, this is just, I have
intrusive thoughts.
I, you know, I remember thefirst time when I was four years
old and I I was afraid that Iwas going to sleepwalk into the
street and get killed, like Ikept, like I couldn't get that
out of my mind and so I wouldjust lay.
I had similar things to thattoo, like, like this started
when I was four and I think we,we have these tools.
(12:20):
Now we can recognize these andwhat.
What are some of your tools?
What are some tools?
Speaker 2 (12:25):
for you.
So whenever, like it getsreally bad and I start having a
panic attack about my intrusivethoughts, I've found that the
best thing to do is intensecardio, like right in that
(12:47):
moment, because I haveadrenaline and my brain usually
it's not going to be able tofocus on anything else.
So if I can work my body sohard that my brain just kind of
shuts down and can only thinkabout, like focus on doing that,
doing that exercise, then thatwill like be a good, a great
short, short term solution forme.
So that's one tool that I have.
I've also found that, just likeyou know, regularly swimming,
it's very helpful.
And then, like in terms of how Ilike deal with it on like a
(13:08):
regular basis when I'm like no,that it's been, it's acting up,
now I just really let them be,like I let my thoughts be and I
let myself think them.
I try and I try not to react.
I try to just let them be, andI also have gotten really good
at, you know, recognizing.
(13:28):
Ok, this isn't real, this is myOCD, this is not a real thought
, this isn't true, this isn'tgoing to happen and that that's
OK that I'm thinking this.
It doesn't mean anything about,like, who I am as a person.
It doesn't mean anything aboutthe world, it doesn't mean
anything about the future, itjust is and that's fine.
(13:52):
And then I try to distractmyself.
Yeah, writing also really helpsme.
I found that, like, when I getlost in my writing, I'm
generally like pretty, I'm verycalm in that moment.
Speaker 1 (13:58):
Have you heard the term sticky thoughts?
I think I have.
They found in research thatpeople do who have OCD have
sticky thoughts and so they'veliterally done tons of research
that everyone has intrusivethoughts.
Everyone has weird, scary,disturbing intrusive thoughts
and like the thought of you'restanding at the Grand Canyon and
(14:22):
you go up to the edge andyou're thinking, oh no, I might
jump off of here.
A person that has OCD willthink about that thought for the
rest of the day, maybe the restof the week.
I really think that it's greatthat you brought this forward
and talked about it honestly,because I feel like sometimes
(14:42):
high level swimmers and peoplethat have these sticky thoughts,
high-level swimmers and peoplethat have these sticky thoughts,
they also work with ruminationin the opposite way, where when
you're going after a record, Ilove the story where you said
you missed a National Ice Grouprecord on an 800 by one-tenth of
a second or less than one-tenthof a second 0.05.
(15:03):
You were crying but it's thesame rumination.
I know you did an interview, awritten interview, with Eni
Jones, who I love.
Eni's a friend of mine.
You said that you didn't getanything good out of your OCD
and I say I would push back onthat and say the same ruminating
, sticky thoughts that drive youcrazy sometimes are the same
(15:25):
ones that drive you high level.
Where you you're, it's stickingin your mind.
You got to go, you know 853 or850 or whatever do you agree
with?
Speaker 2 (15:35):
that I don't see it's hard for me to.
I also have autism and I hyperfixate on a lot of things and I
think that my hyper fixationsare like the good, like the good
side of OCD, like it's thething where I love something so
much that I think about it allthe time.
So I found a way to reallyseparate the two.
Where I'm like OCD is like theintrusive bad thoughts, while
(15:58):
like hyper fixations are likethe, the ones that don't cause
me any harm but also I thinkabout, but I think about so much
that I can achieve more or Ican like be hyper-focused.
So yeah, I'm not exactly sure.
I don't know where the line is.
Speaker 1 (16:16):
Yeah Well.
So again, I love that you'veopened up this topic of just
mental health and we're talkingabout a different mental health.
We've talked about depression alot.
We've talked about anxiety andperformance anxiety, and I love
it.
Somebody is talking about adifferent mental health.
We've talked about depression alot.
We've talked about anxiety andperformance anxiety, and I love
it.
Somebody is talking aboutsomething new, which is OCD.
What advice might you give toathletes who do feel different
mentally, emotionally,neurologically, but still want
(16:38):
to chase those, the big dreams?
Speaker 2 (16:43):
I would say that it could be your superpower, like
if maybe you're a little like,if you're different from other
people, that doesn't mean thatyou're worse, it doesn't mean
that you are strange, it justmeans that you're different.
And I think thatneurodivergence, just being
different in any way, isbeautiful and it's what makes
the world so special.
And just to recognize that, andjust to recognize that, yeah,
(17:06):
absolutely Well.
Speaker 1 (17:13):
So you are now that elite athlete on this new path
which I'm really excited to talkabout.
So you take this time off, youcome back to master's practice.
You now are definitely not inmaster's practice because you
were training with AshleyTwitchell in right.
Yes, oh my gosh.
Speaker 2 (17:28):
I'm in North Carolina right now.
Speaker 1 (17:29):
Yeah, how did you ramp from master's practice to
where you are now, what you'retraining for and what some of
these things are that you'reshooting for?
Speaker 2 (17:38):
Yes, okay.
So about six months after Istarted swimming masters, and I
was swimming masters like threetimes a week, just for an hour,
15 minutes, 15 minutes.
It was great.
I felt like that was all Ineeded.
Then Ashley actually texted meand she's like hey, do you want
to like come out of retirement,move here and, uh, come swim
with me.
And I was like, no, I don'twant to do that, I'm not gonna
(17:59):
do that.
And she's like are you sure?
And I was like, yes, and she'slike I really need someone to
train with.
You should really think aboutthis.
And I was like, no, I'm notdoing that.
I was in between jobs, becausein Hollywood, like, the show
only lasts for six months eachseason and then you just hope
that it doesn't get canceled andthen, if it does, you look for
your next thing.
So I was like in this inbetween, and I think that this
(18:22):
was, this was October, novemberof 2022.
I remember I was, I was on afamily vacation in Hawaii and I
was walking with my mom and Iwas like this is ridiculous.
I don't want to like make acomeback.
That wouldn't be fun.
Blah, blah, blah.
And I was like, well, I'm notreally doing anything right now
except for writing and like Ikind of do miss structure and I
(18:46):
guess maybe, like I could kindof think about it.
So, anyways, I like I stilltold Ashley no, but I started
training a little bit more.
And uh, and started trainingactually with team Santa Monica
and, uh, my friend, ivanPuskovich, who was the open
water Olympian in 2024.
I just texted him and was likehey, can I come swim with you?
(19:06):
And he's like, yeah, sure, butagain, like it wasn't super
serious, I was skiing, I waswriting, I was only doing
singles and I would take randomdays off in the week when, like,
I was up late, so it wasn'tsuper serious.
And then I ended up in anotherwriter's room and that was
taking up all of my time.
But I think Ashley had textedme again and said something
(19:26):
about like hey, can you cometrain with me for this month,
because I need someone for thismonth.
And I was like, okay, yeah,sure, like I'll come, I'll come
stay with you and do that.
Like why not?
Because my, my writer's roomwas remote.
So then I had to amp it up alittle bit more because I had to
keep up with her.
So it's just like a small, asmall like every time.
I just stepped it up justslightly more.
(19:47):
And I was also still trainingwith masters because I loved all
my masters friends, so like I'dhalf train with, I've been half
masters.
And then I showed up at Ashley'sand I had to go a nine 57,000
free If I wanted to qualify foropen water nationals.
And when I was there actuallyit was like, well, you may as
well just qualify for open waternationals at the end of these
(20:10):
three weeks.
And I was like, ok, so Itrained with her and had so much
fun, I missed it.
I was like this is the life, Ilove this.
I ended up going a 10.03 in my1,000.
And then after that I came backtwo weeks later and tried again
and then missed it again andthose were the two most painful
thousands of my life because Iwas not in good enough shape to
(20:32):
be going that fast.
I just basically was like, ok,I've won 1,000 that I have to
basically go all out for, and ifI don't make it, then I don't
make it, like I'm just giving itmy all and leaving no stone
unturned here and yeah.
So after that I was kind oflike, okay, like this was fun,
(20:52):
but I'm done with this for now.
I need to just go back tomaster swimming.
I don't want to do the thousandagain, I don't care this much.
So then after that, I went backto master swimming, swam across
Tahoe in 2023.
I did like the Tahoe solocrossing, which was fun.
But again, like I was like, okay, I'm good with just being a
master swimmer.
And also then I startedtraveling a lot because that was
(21:12):
like right after, like duringthe writer's strike, I like I
went on strike for a bit andthen I like traveled a bit and
was just, you know, living mylife and swimming didn't need to
be a focus in that moment.
It and was just, you know,living my life and swimming
didn't need to be a focus inthat moment.
So I didn't let it become afocus.
And then the big turning pointfor me was I started writing.
There were two big turningpoints, but it was when I
started writing, outside theLanes, my swimming book.
(21:39):
And as I was writing it, I waslike, wow, I miss this.
Like I miss going to practice,I miss waking up early, I miss
this was so much fun.
I was writing about like thingsthat were traumatic for me in
some ways, but also they werethe most fun that I've ever had.
And you know the hard thefeeling after a hard practice,
when you've just done reallywell and worked yourself as hard
as possible.
There's no feeling quite likeit, just like the mixture of
endorphins adrenaline, like thatfeeling of pride knowing that
(22:01):
you're excellent at something.
Adrenaline like that feeling ofpride knowing that you're
excellent at something.
So I was writing this book andI was like, oh, I miss this
excellence.
But I still kind of was justlike whatever, like it's fine,
like I'll just go, I'll swim alittle bit more, I'll train a
little bit more and do more, domore channel crossings, do do a
master's meet or two.
But then the big shift, the onewhere I was like okay, I can't
ignore anymore was I was workingthe Olympics as a researcher in
(22:24):
Connecticut at the NBC office,and I remember I was working the
night shift.
I would work from 11 pm to 11am and I just remember like it
was 5 am one day and I wascovering prelims.
So I like had like the camerathat isn't broadcast but like
just that I'm basically gets tosee where, like the all their
(22:45):
random camera angles.
I was just like watching allthe swimmers and I was like
watching people warm up and Iwas watching them stretch.
And then, like I watched theready room and watched the
warm-up pool and I was like I'mstretching, I'm swarming up, I'm
all of these things.
It was like the same feelingthat I had as I was writing my
book, only it was like morepronounced, because I was like
(23:06):
this is what's happening rightnow and I'm right here in the
middle of the night in this dark, windowless room and I want to
be swimming right now.
So I like spent like three daysjust like watching that and
feeling that way.
And then I uh, I texted Ashleyactually, and it was like I
really think I want to make acomeback and she's like do it,
move here, do it.
(23:28):
I was like I don't know.
And she's like Becca, this iswhat you want.
No one loves swimming as muchas you do.
Just do it.
I was like, yes, this is what Iwant to do.
I don't care if I'm ever asgood as I was before again, I
just want to be doing it anddedicating all of my time to it.
And yeah, then, like a fewmonths later, I moved out to
North Carolina and have beentraining ever since.
(23:48):
What are you training for?
So I had Open Water Nationalstwo months ago, and so to make
the national team you have toget top six of the Americans at
Open Water Nationals, and thenyou have to go 1644, I believe
in the 1500.
So I got fifth at Open WaterNationals, which was my goal to
get the top six, and now I justhave to go the 1644 in a meet
(24:15):
which I'm excited for, like Ifeel like I can get it.
I have a meet in three weekswhere I'll try for the first
time.
So I'm feeling really goodabout it.
It's going to be here at TAC.
Oh nice, I'm feeling reallygood about it, it's going to be
here at TAC oh nice yeah, homemeet yeah.
Speaker 1 (24:24):
Well, you know, I know that distance, especially
distance, women do the best intheir 30s Exactly Without a
doubt.
And so I'm just like what proswim series Did you just see
there was a 39-year-old woman inthe final from was it Colombia
or Brazil?
Oh, Crystal Kobrich.
Yes, there was a 39 year oldwoman in the final from.
Was it Colombia or Brazil, Idon't know.
Speaker 2 (24:43):
And Crystal Kobrich yes, she's been swimming forever
.
This was her sixth Olympicssushi wait.
I have a funny story once uh,it was at yeah, 2014, pan Packs
I was doing the 800 and theannouncer thought that I was
Crystal Kobrich the whole timeand I loved it because I was 16
and I think that she was likeyou know, she was in her 30s
already at that point and Ithought it was the funniest
(25:05):
thing ever, and I've been such abig Crystal Fulbridge fan ever
since, ever since I impersonatedher that one time.
Well, I think that it'sridiculous that we tell female
athletes that they're going topeak when they're 18.
Speaker 1 (25:15):
They're not, it's so ridiculous.
Speaker 2 (25:16):
They're not, I think.
Actually, I think that thereare two peaks.
I do think that one of them isat 18, where, like you, have
like your first peak at 18,because it's hard to know your
body has changed and yourrecovery rate has changed and
it's hard to figure out how toadjust to that in your 20s.
I feel like 20s, like your 20s,are just such a weird period in
life in general.
So I think that, like the firstpeak is 18.
(25:38):
And then the 20s is likefiguring it out, and then like
late 20s, early 30s, mid 30s,that's the second peak and that
is the better peak than the 18year old one.
That's my theory that is notbased in science.
Speaker 1 (25:50):
yeah, I totally agree with that I.
That's a really exciting goaland I'm going to be following
that.
Thank you for exciting.
You're going to be faster thanyou ever were.
Period, that's what I thinkthat's.
Speaker 2 (26:00):
That's what I'm telling myself.
Yeah, so 1644 is easy.
Yeah, and whether or not it'strue, I'm just gonna enjoy
getting seeing if I can do it.
You shouldn't just enjoy trying.
You know, I'm gonna enjoywatching.
Speaker 1 (26:11):
So I'll think there.
In addition to being a swimmerand an author, you're also a
screenwriter.
How does your creative processas a writer compare, maybe, to
your process as an athlete?
Speaker 2 (26:22):
did you ever mirror those my no, I don't think so,
because with swimming it's sostructured, you know.
You know when you get in, youknow your times.
You know like somebody's comingup with your plan, while
writing is very like a lot ofthinking time goes into it.
I find that most of my writingis done in my head like I'll be
right, I'll be writing as I'mswimming.
(26:42):
I writing is done in my headLike I'll be right, I'll be
writing as I'm swimming.
I'll be writing as I'm likewalking.
I'll be writing as I'm watchingsomething.
I'll be writing to someone'stelling me an inspirational
story.
Like I just get inspired by theworld around me.
Like if I'm drafting something,then I'll try to write like
1500 words every day, but if I'min like the world building
phase, then that doesn't have atimeline.
That just kind of needs tohappen on its own.
Speaker 1 (27:05):
So when you're talking about your worlds.
I know that you love writingabout dystopian worlds.
Yeah, Is that what you'retalking about there?
Speaker 2 (27:12):
The dystopian yes.
So, I have this book, unruly,which I published the same time
as Outside the Lanes, and that'sa young adult dystopian which
is like very Hunger Games,bridgerton-esque, also like
Parent Trap a little bit.
So that is, I think, myfavorite thing that I've ever
written.
It's a twin swap in a dystopianworld where, when you're 17, so
(27:36):
it's post-apocalyptic the worldhas been destroyed and human
population is down.
So this country.
In order to bring thepopulation back up, when kids
like around, when they're 17, 18, they get paired with someone
to go procreate with.
But based on how well behavedyou are before that, you get
more options of people to choosefrom, and then, if you're not
(27:57):
well behaved, you just getassigned someone.
So it's about these identicaltwins, twins.
One of them has the most, she'sbeen the best behaved of anyone
ever.
She has all the options in theworld, and that's because every
time she messes up, she pretendsto be her sister who is about
to be assigned someone, and it'sabout their relationship.
And the one who has all theseoptions has terrible anxiety and
(28:19):
like pressure from society, tothe point where, like she's just
chasing perfection and doesn'tlike want, she doesn't know what
else to do except be perfect.
So then, like when it comestime for her to like step into
her role, she panics and tradesplaces with the other twin, who
has decided to exile herselffrom this nation and go to this
island where nobody really knowswhat happens.
(28:40):
Just that.
That it's bad.
I love that.
That sounds fantastic.
It needs to be a.
Hollywood movie.
I hope so one day.
Speaker 1 (28:48):
So you know the obvious question that I know
everybody is at home screamingout are you going to write a
swimming screenplay?
Speaker 2 (28:57):
I actually have a pilot.
I have a pilot called Prodigy.
Actually that is my main sample, but I would love to shop that
at some point once.
Speaker 1 (29:06):
The once the time is right in the market is looking a
little bit different, you knowbeing a swimmer for 50 years, I
I just there's just never been asatisfying competitive swimming
movie.
Pride, pride, that is about thePDR swim team with the first
black swimmers and it's a true.
(29:27):
It's based on a true story.
I want to watch that.
It is I haven't heard of it Agreat.
Oh my gosh, it's a greatswimming movie.
It's called Pride, yeah, yeah,oh, I guess we have Nyad.
I like that.
I like that.
I mean how, yeah, how did youlike it?
I liked it too.
I mean, yeah, how did you likeit?
Speaker 2 (29:42):
I did like it.
Oh my goodness, I was watchingit with my older sister and
every time Diana said somethinglike you guys are my crew, like
I am the chosen one who's goingto swim across the ocean, and
you people like, at one of thosemoments, yeah as well.
Her sister just turned to me.
She's like sounds familiar.
Speaker 1 (30:06):
We just watched our whole women's master's group.
We have a group, of us have abook club, but we watched the
Young Woman in the Sea.
What did you think of that?
Speaker 2 (30:14):
I haven't seen it yet .
I need to watch it.
I know, I know, oh, you'rekidding it's wonderful, I know.
Speaker 1 (30:22):
Oh, my gosh Becca, you need to treat yourself and I
will, I will.
Speaker 2 (30:26):
I'm having a book kick lately so that's been
fading, though I'm starting toget back into like TV movies.
Speaker 1 (30:31):
So well, the second to last question.
Before I ask, the last questionis other than what you're
trying to do with your 1500 tomake the national team.
What else is next for BeccaMann?
Speaker 2 (30:47):
so from a swimming perspective, I'll hopefully like
assuming that I make thenational theme.
I've noticed that in this timearound I like to do really small
short-term goals where I'm likeall right, this is this
three-month period, so I'mhoping that the three-month
period after that will be aWorld Cup in Sardinia and then
maybe two LEN Cups.
(31:07):
Right before that, do a littleEurope trip and get some 10-pay
raising in.
So that's on my agenda.
I also I mean, speaking of theEnglish Channel I would love to
do an English Channel crossinglike early June of next year and
try to get that record, which Iknow it's a very, very fast
record.
I think it's like six hours 20minutes in 2000, from 2006.
(31:28):
So I need like I would needeverything to be going my way
and be perfect, but I think thatcould be kind of fun to try.
Speaker 1 (31:39):
Well, so is 2028 out as far as the Olympics.
Speaker 2 (31:43):
No, definitely not.
I just can't think that farahead right now.
Right, but don't you have?
Speaker 1 (31:47):
to as a 10K.
Don't you have to do thecircuit and get points to get
into the trials, or what are?
Speaker 2 (31:53):
the like doing something different.
They haven't announced it yet,but I think it's going to be
based on, like your, world Cupranking, but I think that that
won't start until like 2026,whatever 2028 might hold.
Speaker 1 (32:04):
Yeah, I think that's a really great plan right now.
Yeah, all right, and the lastquestion before we do a sprint
around is there anything that Ihaven't asked you that you want
to share?
Speaker 2 (32:16):
I don't think so.
This has been such like anamazing interview.
I've had so much fun.
Speaker 1 (32:21):
Well, me too, me too, it's always nice to meet my
heroes, so, all right.
So this is just to get to knowyou a little better, and we're
looking for like one wordanswers here.
Okay, favorite sandwich Turkey.
What do you own that you shouldthrow?
Speaker 2 (32:34):
out.
I feel like my pots and pans Ineed.
I need new ones.
They're getting old, Celebritymost like to meet.
Speaker 1 (32:42):
I feel like Lady Gaga would be fun Hardest swimming
event in the pool 1500.
Speaker 2 (32:49):
Favorite movie Wicked , part one.
Speaker 1 (32:52):
Nice Favorite smell, oh, interesting.
The ocean, oh, that's a goodone.
Do you make your bed in themorning?
No, kickboard, I don't havethat type of OCD.
There you go.
It says, there you go.
Kickboard or no kickboard,kickboard.
If you had to listen to onesong for the rest of your life,
(33:13):
what would it be?
Pink Pony, club Window or aisleAisle.
Describe your life in fivewords.
Speaker 2 (33:25):
Do they have to be related?
Or should be a sentence.
It can be anything you want,okay, fulfilling, fun, exciting,
evolving and freeing Freeing.
Speaker 1 (33:35):
I like it.
Yeah, all right.
This last one is more of aspiritual question, not
necessarily when the gun goesoff.
What word comes to mind whenyou're in the water?
Peace, that's beautiful.
Speaker 2 (33:49):
I love that I had that one ready.
Speaker 1 (33:52):
Yeah, that's really a great one.
All right, becca, this has beenso wonderful.
This has been so much fun, yeah, so thank you for being on the
show.
Yeah, thank you for having me,kelly, I loved this interview
the best podcast.
Awesome Thank.
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