November 8, 2024 • 18 mins
In this episode, we sit down with Chris Stevenson, an Olympian (Greece) and world and national holder in Masters swimming, chemistry professor, and long-time volunteer for U.S. Masters Swimming. Chris opens up about his recent return to swimming after a long hiatus due to personal and professional challenges, including the loss of his parents and a demanding role as the Chemistry department chair at the University of Richmond. He discusses how he navigated his time away from the pool, including recovering from a shoulder surgery, and the physical and mental hurdles of getting back into shape after being out of the water for so long.
Chris delves into his reputation for outstanding underwaters, sharing insights on how to develop a strong dolphin kick and improve performance off the walls. He provides practical tips for swimmers of all levels to strengthen their legs and breath control. Chris also reflects on the joys and struggles of balancing swimming with life, emphasizing the importance of setting realistic goals, finding enjoyment in the process, and re-connecting with the social aspects of the sport.
Show Notes:
- Introduction to Chris Stevenson, a celebrated Masters swimmer, volunteer and chemistry professor at the University of Richmond.
- Chris’ journey back to the pool after a long break due to family responsibilities, career demands, and injury recovery.
- Challenges of returning to swimming after years away, including fitness, feel for the water, and breath control.
- Discussion on developing a strong underwater dolphin kick, with tips for swimmers at all levels.
- Reflections on goal-setting, training with a group, and finding motivation in the process.
- How swimming can still be fun and fulfilling despite the inevitable challenges of aging and time away from the sport.
- Chris' passion for chemistry and how it connects to everyday life.
Mentions:
- Anna Lea Matysek, US Masters Volunteer
- Heather Stevenson, US Masters Volunteer
- David Berkoff, Olympic Medalist
- Matt Barany, University of Richmond Swim Coach
Whether you're intimidated by swimming, chemistry, or both, this episode is a celebration of curiosity, perseverance, and the importance of finding joy in pursuits old and new. Join us for a heartwarming and inspiring listen that promises to leave you motivated and enlightened
Email us at HELLO@ChampionsMojo.com. Opinions discussed are not medical advice, please seek a medical professional for your own health concerns.
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Transcript
Episode Transcript
Available transcripts are automatically generated. Complete accuracy is not guaranteed.
Speaker 1 (00:01):
All right, I am on deck with an on-deck interview
after practice at SwimRVA withone of my I'm just going to say
it one of my true heroes that Ihave been wanting to get on the
podcast for so long nationalrecord zone records, lmsc
(00:22):
records.
But Chris and I have beenfriends.
We go back all the way to ourdays when you were at UNC and I
was at NC State.
We didn't cross over much there, but we do have that little
rivalry but we've been friends.
But really, chris has so manyunique things.
I don't just admire you, chris,for all your great swimming,
but you have been anunbelievably dedicated volunteer
(00:44):
in US master swimming and doneso much just for me.
I, you are the Virginia, for me,anna Lee Matisak.
Everybody knows who Anna Lee is.
So you are the Virginia, annaLee.
You and Heather, your wife, doso much for the sport of
swimming and and just before westart talking because I got I
just there's so much that I Iwant to talk with you about.
(01:05):
You are also we got to get outof here after morning practice
because we got to get you.
You are a full-time chemistryprofessor at the University of
Richmond, the Spiders, in fact.
We're looking over at a signthat says water may contain
spiders here in Richmond, whichI love Anyway and so, chris,
(01:25):
you've got all these balls inthe air.
I think the first thing Ireally wanna talk with you about
is, you know, you kind ofdisappeared here recently from
the master swimming scene, andthat was a disappointment to me
personally, because I love tosee you swim, I love to see you
break records.
So tell us where you've been,what's been going on and why you
(01:47):
are now back training.
Speaker 2 (01:48):
Right, right.
So, and actually one thing Iwould say is that we I
disappeared from the swimmingpool, but we still kept on being
involved in the volunteer, justbecause volunteer efforts in
Virginia, just because we feellike we can give back.
So I guess what happened isthat part of it was sort of
personal.
Both my parents passed away.
(02:10):
I'm sorry.
Yeah, there was a time when,you know, my mother went first,
my dad needed a lot of help andyou know, you know how all that
is too.
People, our age, you know we'retaking care of our parents.
And then I became departmentchair at UR for six years and
that was just.
It took a lot of my time, letme just put it that way a lot of
(02:31):
my time and energy andemotional energy as well.
And so I actually, you know,for a while I stayed in and and
swam, although I didn't competemuch because I wasn't, wasn't
regular enough, if that makessense, but then then I just
couldn't even do that, you know.
So for a couple years I wasbasically out of the water.
(02:52):
I walked to and from work as totry to get my heart rate up,
and that was about all I couldmanage to do.
Speaker 1 (02:58):
Yeah, did you?
Did you have any injuries?
Because I think we talked likeI would ask people where's Chris
, and I think he's injured.
Speaker 2 (03:06):
But Right, I did actually.
Yes, I had one of my.
So what would happen is I wouldbe away for a while and then I
would start back up, and that'sprobably a recipe.
Plus, getting older is probablya recipe for injuries as well.
But yes, I had shoulder surgeryright before COVID hit, so, and
actually my PT happened duringCOVID, so that was kind of
(03:30):
difficult too, and then, ofcourse, a lot of swim pools were
closed down after that, so so,yes, I did have that to recover
from as well.
Throwing that into the mix yeah, yes.
Speaker 1 (03:41):
So so now you've been back since June and this is,
you know, late September thatwe're talking and how, how is it
going and what are some of thedifferent feelings that you have
?
Like, just just how's it goingand what does it feel like at
this point?
Speaker 2 (03:57):
Right.
Well, it's been interesting,because this is the longest by
far that I've been out of thewater and a lot of things you
take for granted your field,your cardiovascular fitness, but
also things like your feel forthe water.
You know how you can, you cantell when someone has a swimming
background.
You know when you see lapswimmers or whatever, and when
they don't, because of you knowthe way they move, the
(04:19):
efficiency of their strokes andthings like that.
Well, you lose some of that, inaddition to just fitness, I
mean be able to stay underwater,your your legs not being strong
, so when I first started, Iprobably could barely do a
thousand, and so it took like adifferent mindset.
Right, you're used to.
I swam on my own because Ididn't want to burden other
(04:41):
people with my slowness.
So you go in and it's like,okay, I'm going to do, you know,
eight, 100s on such and such.
You know you come up with theseideas and it doesn't survive
contact with the water, as theysay.
Is that a chemistry term?
No, no, it's like that war.
Right, it doesn't survivecontact with the enemy, and the
(05:02):
water's not your enemy, ofcourse, but but you do find
yourself like you do a littlebit.
You get out of breath.
You're like, well, maybe Idon't need to do eight, I can do
four, my interval can be, youknow, such and such.
But what I realized is that Ihad to sort of scale back
expectations and be morerealistic.
And also I used to, you know,bike and lift, and I realized,
(05:25):
okay, just get back to basics,just take care of the swimming
first, you know, try to get backto the, where it's enjoyable
again, because that's the otherthing is that exercise isn't.
When you've been out for awhile, you don't get quite that
endorphin rush anymore, at leastnot initially.
You get pain and so, and so youhave to kind of overcome that
(05:46):
before you start feeling goodand then you start to see the
improvement and that motivatesyou to go do more and get faster
and so forth.
Speaker 1 (05:54):
So you did just mention your underwater.
So you are famous in the masterswimming community even decades
ago for being incredibleunderwater.
You were doing theseunderwaters.
Okay, maybe David Berkoff wasthe originator, but I would say
Chris Stevenson was the second.
(06:15):
You know, you were the one thatis has been doing them.
How did you get into thoseamazing underwaters?
And also, how are they feelingnow at this?
Speaker 2 (06:26):
point.
So, yeah, it's interesting youmentioned David Berkoff because
he's slightly younger than meand so I've always had good
dolphin kick and I actuallyremember in high school that one
of my first.
We lived overseas for a while.
We came back and moved toRaleigh, which is where I met
(06:47):
you Actually and I have tocorrect you one thing oh, yes,
correct me.
So the first time I ever metyou was when I was in high
school.
I went to an NC State swim campand you were one of the helpers
Don Easterling's helpers forfor that camp.
Speaker 1 (07:01):
I remember that, so, gosh we didn't get you to come
to NC State no, no.
Speaker 2 (07:07):
Well, the funny thing is again sorry for the aside
here, but when we first moved toRaleigh my parents had heard of
Don Easterling and tried to getme to to swim with him because
I think at that time he had some, some USA swimmers and I.
I was coming off of a lot ofinjuries then and and he, at
least famously for me, said, nowell, we have girls swimming
(07:29):
faster than that.
Probably you he was talkingabout.
So I was not, yeah, and so Iwas not fast enough to swim at
that time, to swim for NC State,which changed, you know,
shortly afterwards.
Speaker 1 (07:40):
Which boy?
He really regretted that oneand you made him regret it.
Speaker 2 (07:44):
Anyway.
So back to the the Burkoffthing.
I don't think it wasn't incollege when I started.
Yes, I took underwaters morethan most at the time, but you
know, for for the what wasnormal at the time, I would take
like three or four underwaterkicks and I would do it on
freestyle as well, which was alittle unusual at the time.
(08:05):
But it wasn't enough to trulytake advantage of it.
And once, berkhoff, you know, Ishould have put the pieces
together.
I knew my kick was as fast asmy swim, you know, and and
that's on top of the water, sounderwater even faster.
But it was probably in Masterswhen I first started working at
it.
And that's the thing is, it issomething you have to work at
because it doesn't people seesort of the finished product and
(08:28):
think that, oh well, I cannever be like that.
You know I can't.
I don't have that dolphin kickor those underwaters.
But it made me realize comingback that I didn't have them
then either my legs would gettired after 25.
You know I was kicking with akickboard so I didn't have to
worry about holding my breath.
Holding your breath issomething that also takes a lot
(08:50):
of practice.
So my underwaterers are betternow than they were a couple
months ago, that's for sure, andthey're probably better than
most people's, but they're notwhere I used to be, you know.
So I still have a lot to workon.
But that's the thing is that youhave to have a plan, like you
know, okay, if I'm swimming whenyou have a set, you say, okay,
(09:11):
I'm going to take sixunderwaters off of every wall if
you're doing a backstroke orwhatever.
So there's a definite plan.
It's not just doing whateverrepeats on whatever intervals.
It's how many underwaters totake.
Same thing with races, you knowyou have to know how hard you
can push it early on, becauseotherwise you go into oxygen
debt too fast and can't do it.
So yeah, it's definitelysomething that's very deliberate
(09:33):
.
But yes, having a, I've alwayswas a good kicker, so I had that
kind of natural.
I don't know if it'sflexibility of ankles and knees
or whatever, but I do think it'salso something that can be
trained and worked on.
Speaker 1 (09:46):
Oh, I love that and this is just the kind of gem
that our listeners will benefitfrom.
So, if you're just so, ifyou're talking to kind of an
average kicker off the wallwhich I'm going to raise my hand
here and say that is me.
So what would be other thanhaving a plan?
If I can, right now I can doone dolphin off my walls one,
(10:08):
and I try to do that in practice.
But what might be a step upthing that I could do to maybe
get two.
Speaker 2 (10:14):
So I would say that there are two things you have to
do.
One is you just have tostrengthen your legs and core,
all right, and that can be outof the water but also in the
water.
A lot of people don't believein kickboards, but I'm not one
of those people, so I guessdouble negative.
I do believe in them, just inthe sense of, because sometimes
you don't want to have to worryabout trying to hold your breath
(10:34):
, you just want to strengthenyour legs, strengthen your core,
and dolphin is different thanflutter kick right.
So you have to work on dolphinkick.
I've never liked a lot of peoplenowadays do dolphin kick on
their back on the surface andI've never liked that.
Because you're stronger, isyour down sweep with.
(10:55):
You know, when you're facingdown or right, so you're up,
sweep if you're on your back,and when you're on the surface
you don't have much to pushagainst.
You know if you kick reallyhard, you just push water up,
you know.
So you need to either beunderwater or with a kickboard.
You know you have to be alittle careful if you have
shoulder issues with a kickboard, but it does help just to build
(11:15):
up strength.
So that's one thing thing.
And the other is is the breathcontrol.
If you do one, go for two nexttime.
You know that sort of thing,but it has to be something,
something that you're deliberateabout, and you have to.
Sometimes you have to say, okay, I'm not going to worry about
my time, I'm going to do thisset of whatever.
And my main goal is to do twoor three or whatever dolphin
(11:38):
kicks off of every wall and tomake them count.
And because that's another thingis, a lot of times kicking sets
are a recovery set, an afterthought for a lot of people.
And actually I got this.
You know, some summers I'veswum with the coach, matt Barony
, and one thing that he did thatyou know you're still learning,
even at our age, right, onething he did that I thought was
(12:01):
interesting.
Well, two things.
One is he often had warmups asa hard kick set, and not just a
rinky dink kick set, but whereyou're really pushing yourself,
you're trying to do good, goodtimes or tough repeats or
whatever.
And then the other thing issometimes the main set is a kick
set.
Right, don't do it after themain set, do it as your first
(12:22):
main set and look at your timesand try to make them get faster,
because that's once you'rekicking.
If you don't have a good kick,you're not going to have good
underwaters.
Right, that's just the way itis.
You have to also have to havegood breath control, but you to
have a fast kick.
Speaker 1 (12:38):
So oh I'm.
I'm loving this.
This is just like you're.
You're.
You're talking to the personthat needs it, and I know a lot
of our listeners will.
So, uh, you've been back in thewater since june.
We established that.
What are some of your goalscoming up and how are you
planning to deal with this timeout of the water and what might
be ahead?
Speaker 2 (12:56):
well, it's gonna be a challenge in the sense that I
know the first I'll eventuallygo back to a meet, probably next
winter or spring, and it'll bea challenge because I'll be slow
, right, even if I'm in goodshape.
You know, if I'm happy with myshape, it'll have been I don't
know ten, eight, ten years sinceI last competed seriously, you
(13:17):
know so.
Even if I had swum that wholetime, I would have been I don't
know 10, 8, 10 years since Ilast competed seriously, you
know so.
Even if I had swum that wholetime, I would have been slower.
So that'll be a challenge,right it, the clock doesn't lie,
and so it's kind of hard right.
And there's the other sayingit's like the older we get, the
faster we were you know so youkind of misremember how fast you
were and forget the strugglesyou know, know.
So, um, but I guess you justhave to, um, push forward.
(13:40):
It's nice to have something toshoot for, um, I I spent a
couple months on my own, like Isaid, but now I'm swimming with
the group and that's good too,because they push you and plus,
you get the social interactionsand you know you can forget how
hard, how badly you're hurtingif you have someone to joke
about with it.
Speaker 1 (13:56):
So yeah, you're hurting if you have someone to
joke about with it.
So, yeah, yes, yes.
Well, yeah, as we haveestablished on the podcast, the
swim rva masters group uh, thismorning group are they're?
They're beasts, they're young,they're fast and you are already
at the front of a lane anddoing really well.
Is there anything that youmight be ahead of where you
thought you were?
Speaker 2 (14:19):
I don't know.
I'm a pretty harsh critic ofmyself, so I don't.
I guess it doesn't hurt as muchas I thought, but mostly I see
the places where I'm missing,like on Friday we had to do some
fast swimming and I was slowerthan I wanted to be, you know.
So I don't think and I wouldn'tsay I'm at the front of the
(14:41):
lane, I'm in the fastest lanes,but there are still people who
are quite a bit faster than me,especially on the sprint part,
which I have not gotten.
One of the things you lose whenyou get older is the ability to
get your heart rate way up there, right.
So the difference between myhold this pace for a while and
(15:01):
my all-out speed is much lessthan I would like it to be, and
so that's why I'm a littleworried about racing, because
I'm like, oh, that's not muchfaster than I go in practice.
But, um, so I I guess that'snot a good answer, um, I guess,
I guess my underwaters and mybreath control is better than I
expected it to be at this point,but I still have a ways to go.
Speaker 1 (15:26):
And is it as fun as you remember it?
Oh yeah, definitely.
Well, the last question, whichis just is there anything that I
have not asked you that youmight want to share with our
listeners about anything?
Master swimming chemistry.
Speaker 2 (15:44):
I guess both chemistry and master swimming.
You know they can beintimidating for people from a
distance, from the outside, butit's not.
I mean, there's alwayssomething that's your speed.
You can show up in a group.
It's nice to have people toswim with and have someone else
tell you what to do, rather thancome up with your own workouts.
But yeah, just give it a try.
(16:06):
You know you'll find someoneyour speed and people to talk to
.
So before you know it, thehour's gone and you've had a
good workout.
Speaker 1 (16:14):
And how can you make me like chemistry, chris?
And how can you make me likechemistry?
Speaker 2 (16:18):
Chris, I guess I've always liked things based on
what they can explain or whatthey can do for you.
So chemistry is the centralscience, as they say right,
everything around us is matter.
So how?
Why things behave the way theydo?
I just it's interesting to knowhow the world works, including
chemistry.
Speaker 1 (16:38):
I love it.
Thank you so much for joiningme today, my pleasure.
All right, I am on deck with an on-deck interview
after practice at SwimRVA withone of my I'm just going to say
it one of my true heroes that Ihave been wanting to get on the
podcast for so long nationalrecord zone records, lmsc
(00:22):
records.
But Chris and I have beenfriends.
We go back all the way to ourdays when you were at UNC and I
was at NC State.
We didn't cross over much there, but we do have that little
rivalry but we've been friends.
But really, chris has so manyunique things.
I don't just admire you, chris,for all your great swimming,
but you have been anunbelievably dedicated volunteer
(00:44):
in US master swimming and doneso much just for me.
I, you are the Virginia, for me,anna Lee Matisak.
Everybody knows who Anna Lee is.
So you are the Virginia, annaLee.
You and Heather, your wife, doso much for the sport of
swimming and and just before westart talking because I got I
just there's so much that I Iwant to talk with you about.
(01:05):
You are also we got to get outof here after morning practice
because we got to get you.
You are a full-time chemistryprofessor at the University of
Richmond, the Spiders, in fact.
We're looking over at a signthat says water may contain
spiders here in Richmond, whichI love Anyway and so, chris,
(01:25):
you've got all these balls inthe air.
I think the first thing Ireally wanna talk with you about
is, you know, you kind ofdisappeared here recently from
the master swimming scene, andthat was a disappointment to me
personally, because I love tosee you swim, I love to see you
break records.
So tell us where you've been,what's been going on and why you
(01:47):
are now back training.
Speaker 2 (01:48):
Right, right.
So, and actually one thing Iwould say is that we I
disappeared from the swimmingpool, but we still kept on being
involved in the volunteer, justbecause volunteer efforts in
Virginia, just because we feellike we can give back.
So I guess what happened isthat part of it was sort of
personal.
Both my parents passed away.
(02:10):
I'm sorry.
Yeah, there was a time when,you know, my mother went first,
my dad needed a lot of help andyou know, you know how all that
is too.
People, our age, you know we'retaking care of our parents.
And then I became departmentchair at UR for six years and
that was just.
It took a lot of my time, letme just put it that way a lot of
(02:31):
my time and energy andemotional energy as well.
And so I actually, you know,for a while I stayed in and and
swam, although I didn't competemuch because I wasn't, wasn't
regular enough, if that makessense, but then then I just
couldn't even do that, you know.
So for a couple years I wasbasically out of the water.
(02:52):
I walked to and from work as totry to get my heart rate up,
and that was about all I couldmanage to do.
Speaker 1 (02:58):
Yeah, did you?
Did you have any injuries?
Because I think we talked likeI would ask people where's Chris
, and I think he's injured.
Speaker 2 (03:06):
But Right, I did actually.
Yes, I had one of my.
So what would happen is I wouldbe away for a while and then I
would start back up, and that'sprobably a recipe.
Plus, getting older is probablya recipe for injuries as well.
But yes, I had shoulder surgeryright before COVID hit, so, and
actually my PT happened duringCOVID, so that was kind of
(03:30):
difficult too, and then, ofcourse, a lot of swim pools were
closed down after that, so so,yes, I did have that to recover
from as well.
Throwing that into the mix yeah, yes.
Speaker 1 (03:41):
So so now you've been back since June and this is,
you know, late September thatwe're talking and how, how is it
going and what are some of thedifferent feelings that you have
?
Like, just just how's it goingand what does it feel like at
this point?
Speaker 2 (03:57):
Right.
Well, it's been interesting,because this is the longest by
far that I've been out of thewater and a lot of things you
take for granted your field,your cardiovascular fitness, but
also things like your feel forthe water.
You know how you can, you cantell when someone has a swimming
background.
You know when you see lapswimmers or whatever, and when
they don't, because of you knowthe way they move, the
(04:19):
efficiency of their strokes andthings like that.
Well, you lose some of that, inaddition to just fitness, I
mean be able to stay underwater,your your legs not being strong
, so when I first started, Iprobably could barely do a
thousand, and so it took like adifferent mindset.
Right, you're used to.
I swam on my own because Ididn't want to burden other
(04:41):
people with my slowness.
So you go in and it's like,okay, I'm going to do, you know,
eight, 100s on such and such.
You know you come up with theseideas and it doesn't survive
contact with the water, as theysay.
Is that a chemistry term?
No, no, it's like that war.
Right, it doesn't survivecontact with the enemy, and the
(05:02):
water's not your enemy, ofcourse, but but you do find
yourself like you do a littlebit.
You get out of breath.
You're like, well, maybe Idon't need to do eight, I can do
four, my interval can be, youknow, such and such.
But what I realized is that Ihad to sort of scale back
expectations and be morerealistic.
And also I used to, you know,bike and lift, and I realized,
(05:25):
okay, just get back to basics,just take care of the swimming
first, you know, try to get backto the, where it's enjoyable
again, because that's the otherthing is that exercise isn't.
When you've been out for awhile, you don't get quite that
endorphin rush anymore, at leastnot initially.
You get pain and so, and so youhave to kind of overcome that
(05:46):
before you start feeling goodand then you start to see the
improvement and that motivatesyou to go do more and get faster
and so forth.
Speaker 1 (05:54):
So you did just mention your underwater.
So you are famous in the masterswimming community even decades
ago for being incredibleunderwater.
You were doing theseunderwaters.
Okay, maybe David Berkoff wasthe originator, but I would say
Chris Stevenson was the second.
(06:15):
You know, you were the one thatis has been doing them.
How did you get into thoseamazing underwaters?
And also, how are they feelingnow at this?
Speaker 2 (06:26):
point.
So, yeah, it's interesting youmentioned David Berkoff because
he's slightly younger than meand so I've always had good
dolphin kick and I actuallyremember in high school that one
of my first.
We lived overseas for a while.
We came back and moved toRaleigh, which is where I met
(06:47):
you Actually and I have tocorrect you one thing oh, yes,
correct me.
So the first time I ever metyou was when I was in high
school.
I went to an NC State swim campand you were one of the helpers
Don Easterling's helpers forfor that camp.
Speaker 1 (07:01):
I remember that, so, gosh we didn't get you to come
to NC State no, no.
Speaker 2 (07:07):
Well, the funny thing is again sorry for the aside
here, but when we first moved toRaleigh my parents had heard of
Don Easterling and tried to getme to to swim with him because
I think at that time he had some, some USA swimmers and I.
I was coming off of a lot ofinjuries then and and he, at
least famously for me, said, nowell, we have girls swimming
(07:29):
faster than that.
Probably you he was talkingabout.
So I was not, yeah, and so Iwas not fast enough to swim at
that time, to swim for NC State,which changed, you know,
shortly afterwards.
Speaker 1 (07:40):
Which boy?
He really regretted that oneand you made him regret it.
Speaker 2 (07:44):
Anyway.
So back to the the Burkoffthing.
I don't think it wasn't incollege when I started.
Yes, I took underwaters morethan most at the time, but you
know, for for the what wasnormal at the time, I would take
like three or four underwaterkicks and I would do it on
freestyle as well, which was alittle unusual at the time.
(08:05):
But it wasn't enough to trulytake advantage of it.
And once, berkhoff, you know, Ishould have put the pieces
together.
I knew my kick was as fast asmy swim, you know, and and
that's on top of the water, sounderwater even faster.
But it was probably in Masterswhen I first started working at
it.
And that's the thing is, it issomething you have to work at
because it doesn't people seesort of the finished product and
(08:28):
think that, oh well, I cannever be like that.
You know I can't.
I don't have that dolphin kickor those underwaters.
But it made me realize comingback that I didn't have them
then either my legs would gettired after 25.
You know I was kicking with akickboard so I didn't have to
worry about holding my breath.
Holding your breath issomething that also takes a lot
(08:50):
of practice.
So my underwaterers are betternow than they were a couple
months ago, that's for sure, andthey're probably better than
most people's, but they're notwhere I used to be, you know.
So I still have a lot to workon.
But that's the thing is that youhave to have a plan, like you
know, okay, if I'm swimming whenyou have a set, you say, okay,
(09:11):
I'm going to take sixunderwaters off of every wall if
you're doing a backstroke orwhatever.
So there's a definite plan.
It's not just doing whateverrepeats on whatever intervals.
It's how many underwaters totake.
Same thing with races, you knowyou have to know how hard you
can push it early on, becauseotherwise you go into oxygen
debt too fast and can't do it.
So yeah, it's definitelysomething that's very deliberate
(09:33):
.
But yes, having a, I've alwayswas a good kicker, so I had that
kind of natural.
I don't know if it'sflexibility of ankles and knees
or whatever, but I do think it'salso something that can be
trained and worked on.
Speaker 1 (09:46):
Oh, I love that and this is just the kind of gem
that our listeners will benefitfrom.
So, if you're just so, ifyou're talking to kind of an
average kicker off the wallwhich I'm going to raise my hand
here and say that is me.
So what would be other thanhaving a plan?
If I can, right now I can doone dolphin off my walls one,
(10:08):
and I try to do that in practice.
But what might be a step upthing that I could do to maybe
get two.
Speaker 2 (10:14):
So I would say that there are two things you have to
do.
One is you just have tostrengthen your legs and core,
all right, and that can be outof the water but also in the
water.
A lot of people don't believein kickboards, but I'm not one
of those people, so I guessdouble negative.
I do believe in them, just inthe sense of, because sometimes
you don't want to have to worryabout trying to hold your breath
(10:34):
, you just want to strengthenyour legs, strengthen your core,
and dolphin is different thanflutter kick right.
So you have to work on dolphinkick.
I've never liked a lot of peoplenowadays do dolphin kick on
their back on the surface andI've never liked that.
Because you're stronger, isyour down sweep with.
(10:55):
You know, when you're facingdown or right, so you're up,
sweep if you're on your back,and when you're on the surface
you don't have much to pushagainst.
You know if you kick reallyhard, you just push water up,
you know.
So you need to either beunderwater or with a kickboard.
You know you have to be alittle careful if you have
shoulder issues with a kickboard, but it does help just to build
(11:15):
up strength.
So that's one thing thing.
And the other is is the breathcontrol.
If you do one, go for two nexttime.
You know that sort of thing,but it has to be something,
something that you're deliberateabout, and you have to.
Sometimes you have to say, okay, I'm not going to worry about
my time, I'm going to do thisset of whatever.
And my main goal is to do twoor three or whatever dolphin
(11:38):
kicks off of every wall and tomake them count.
And because that's another thingis, a lot of times kicking sets
are a recovery set, an afterthought for a lot of people.
And actually I got this.
You know, some summers I'veswum with the coach, matt Barony
, and one thing that he did thatyou know you're still learning,
even at our age, right, onething he did that I thought was
(12:01):
interesting.
Well, two things.
One is he often had warmups asa hard kick set, and not just a
rinky dink kick set, but whereyou're really pushing yourself,
you're trying to do good, goodtimes or tough repeats or
whatever.
And then the other thing issometimes the main set is a kick
set.
Right, don't do it after themain set, do it as your first
(12:22):
main set and look at your timesand try to make them get faster,
because that's once you'rekicking.
If you don't have a good kick,you're not going to have good
underwaters.
Right, that's just the way itis.
You have to also have to havegood breath control, but you to
have a fast kick.
Speaker 1 (12:38):
So oh I'm.
I'm loving this.
This is just like you're.
You're.
You're talking to the personthat needs it, and I know a lot
of our listeners will.
So, uh, you've been back in thewater since june.
We established that.
What are some of your goalscoming up and how are you
planning to deal with this timeout of the water and what might
be ahead?
Speaker 2 (12:56):
well, it's gonna be a challenge in the sense that I
know the first I'll eventuallygo back to a meet, probably next
winter or spring, and it'll bea challenge because I'll be slow
, right, even if I'm in goodshape.
You know, if I'm happy with myshape, it'll have been I don't
know ten, eight, ten years sinceI last competed seriously, you
(13:17):
know so.
Even if I had swum that wholetime, I would have been I don't
know 10, 8, 10 years since Ilast competed seriously, you
know so.
Even if I had swum that wholetime, I would have been slower.
So that'll be a challenge,right it, the clock doesn't lie,
and so it's kind of hard right.
And there's the other sayingit's like the older we get, the
faster we were you know so youkind of misremember how fast you
were and forget the strugglesyou know, know.
So, um, but I guess you justhave to, um, push forward.
(13:40):
It's nice to have something toshoot for, um, I I spent a
couple months on my own, like Isaid, but now I'm swimming with
the group and that's good too,because they push you and plus,
you get the social interactionsand you know you can forget how
hard, how badly you're hurtingif you have someone to joke
about with it.
Speaker 1 (13:56):
So yeah, you're hurting if you have someone to
joke about with it.
So, yeah, yes, yes.
Well, yeah, as we haveestablished on the podcast, the
swim rva masters group uh, thismorning group are they're?
They're beasts, they're young,they're fast and you are already
at the front of a lane anddoing really well.
Is there anything that youmight be ahead of where you
thought you were?
Speaker 2 (14:19):
I don't know.
I'm a pretty harsh critic ofmyself, so I don't.
I guess it doesn't hurt as muchas I thought, but mostly I see
the places where I'm missing,like on Friday we had to do some
fast swimming and I was slowerthan I wanted to be, you know.
So I don't think and I wouldn'tsay I'm at the front of the
(14:41):
lane, I'm in the fastest lanes,but there are still people who
are quite a bit faster than me,especially on the sprint part,
which I have not gotten.
One of the things you lose whenyou get older is the ability to
get your heart rate way up there, right.
So the difference between myhold this pace for a while and
(15:01):
my all-out speed is much lessthan I would like it to be, and
so that's why I'm a littleworried about racing, because
I'm like, oh, that's not muchfaster than I go in practice.
But, um, so I I guess that'snot a good answer, um, I guess,
I guess my underwaters and mybreath control is better than I
expected it to be at this point,but I still have a ways to go.
Speaker 1 (15:26):
And is it as fun as you remember it?
Oh yeah, definitely.
Well, the last question, whichis just is there anything that I
have not asked you that youmight want to share with our
listeners about anything?
Master swimming chemistry.
Speaker 2 (15:44):
I guess both chemistry and master swimming.
You know they can beintimidating for people from a
distance, from the outside, butit's not.
I mean, there's alwayssomething that's your speed.
You can show up in a group.
It's nice to have people toswim with and have someone else
tell you what to do, rather thancome up with your own workouts.
But yeah, just give it a try.
(16:06):
You know you'll find someoneyour speed and people to talk to
.
So before you know it, thehour's gone and you've had a
good workout.
Speaker 1 (16:14):
And how can you make me like chemistry, chris?
And how can you make me likechemistry?
Speaker 2 (16:18):
Chris, I guess I've always liked things based on
what they can explain or whatthey can do for you.
So chemistry is the centralscience, as they say right,
everything around us is matter.
So how?
Why things behave the way theydo?
I just it's interesting to knowhow the world works, including
chemistry.
Speaker 1 (16:38):
I love it.
Thank you so much for joiningme today, my pleasure.
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