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June 19, 2024 11 mins

We are shaking in our little Swiftie boots. Joe Alwyn finally broke his silence on his breakup with Taylor Swift after 6 years and dropped a huge bombshell. We honestly can’t believe this but Joe has confirmed that The Black Dog from The Tortured Poet’s Department deemed to be about him, is actually not. We reveal what he said and who we now think the song could actually be about and why.  

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Episode Transcript

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Speaker 1 (00:01):
It sits in with Kate Riki podcast.

Speaker 2 (00:05):
Welcome to Educate another edition.

Speaker 1 (00:08):
Welcome Jazz. Thank you Lizzie.

Speaker 3 (00:11):
I feel as though I've missed you. We've had a
little bit of a stopdown. Yeah, long time, no educate.

Speaker 1 (00:16):
As we say in the biz.

Speaker 2 (00:17):
Well maybe it means we just know everything? Yeah, but
what can I say to stop you there?

Speaker 3 (00:24):
No? Okay, because you messaged me when you were off,
because you've been off for two weeks.

Speaker 1 (00:28):
This was serious branding thing. Yeah, no, no, no, because
I received that one. Yes, we got who is Gabriette?
Who is you know?

Speaker 3 (00:35):
Maddie Healy sponsor? But on top of that, I wrote
back and said, oh, some songs on t TPD are
making sense.

Speaker 1 (00:41):
Kate wrote back and said, what is t TP?

Speaker 3 (00:44):
I know you, which is of course the Tortured Poet's deplotment.

Speaker 1 (00:47):
So maybe we need to go back to the beginning
in reality.

Speaker 3 (00:50):
Maybe I was in a different time zone, or I
didn't really know what was going on. I didn't have
my Taylor Swift brain on.

Speaker 1 (00:58):
Taylor Swift Girls.

Speaker 4 (00:59):
Yeah, so our brains are permanently just tail us with.

Speaker 2 (01:02):
Brains they are, And I feel very worried for you.

Speaker 1 (01:07):
You mean lucky to be here.

Speaker 3 (01:08):
Yeah, okay, all right, so let's get to it. While
I was away, I did send through a picture of
Matt Healley, who seems to be engaged to a woman
who well I don't know who she is, and I
want to know who she is and what's going on.

Speaker 4 (01:24):
Gabriette love her. I personally love her. I'm obsessed with her.

Speaker 1 (01:29):
Who is she?

Speaker 4 (01:29):
She's the coolest she's It's interesting because she's Charlie XX
just released her new album called Bratt and Gabriette is
one of the girls in the video clip.

Speaker 1 (01:40):
But she's like an.

Speaker 4 (01:41):
Influencer, a model. She does a lot of things with
food and cooking. She's like a food blogger as well.
She's super cool. Is she British?

Speaker 3 (01:49):
Oh?

Speaker 4 (01:49):
I don't actually not sure. I'm pretty sure she's American.
But the whole joke with Gabriette being in Bratt the
album in the music video was music video was released,
someone made a meme that Charlie XX and Julia Fox
and all those people retweeted and it said this is

(02:09):
like the Bad Blood but for girls who do cocaine.
Griette posted that, so it was like, was that a
bit of a dig.

Speaker 3 (02:18):
Well, we also know that from this week apparently there
is a little bit of drama between Charlie XX and Taylor.
A lot of people saying, so, remember when Taylor released
the like deluxe version with the voice memo notes in
the US and blocked I think Billy from going to
number one.

Speaker 1 (02:33):
We cover that on the show.

Speaker 3 (02:35):
She's done the exact same thing with Charlie XCX on
BRAT has blocked her. So Charlie's gone I think number two,
Taylor's back at number one.

Speaker 2 (02:41):
And why is Taylor back at number one?

Speaker 4 (02:44):
Well?

Speaker 3 (02:46):
What did she released that same thing, you know, with
the voice memos in the UK Solie Harley British.

Speaker 2 (02:54):
Market.

Speaker 4 (02:55):
But there's a song apparently on BRATT that's about Taylor
from Charlie because Charlie actually opened for Taylor on the
Reputation Stadium tour and the two were like very close
buddy buddy, bestie vibe. She would bring out Charlie along
with Camilla Cabo during shake it Off and that she

(03:16):
would sing shake it Off with her like it was
very she was part of the squad so to speak.

Speaker 3 (03:20):
Do you think that's how Taylor met Matt Heally? Like
who introduced Taylor to Matt.

Speaker 4 (03:27):
Taylor and Maddie were well established back in the nineteen
eighty ninety right, yeah.

Speaker 1 (03:30):
Back in twenty fourteen. So this is the song. It's
called Sympathy is a Knife from Charlie XCX.

Speaker 4 (03:36):
So.

Speaker 3 (03:36):
I don't know if you've said this, but Charlie's dating
George from the nineteen seventy five Yes, I.

Speaker 2 (03:41):
Know you didn't say I did. Okay, Oh but that's important.

Speaker 1 (03:43):
Yes, so's Maddie's band mate.

Speaker 3 (03:45):
And this is the lyric, don't want to see her
backstage at my boyfriend's show, fingers crossed behind my back.

Speaker 1 (03:50):
I hope they break up quick.

Speaker 2 (03:52):
Oh so she never liked Taylor.

Speaker 3 (03:54):
Well, I don't know why she wouldn't. Taylor gave her
that huge opportunity on nineteen eighty nine, So obviously something
has gone down. If those lyrics are in fact about her,
they're very they're very polar opposite girlies.

Speaker 4 (04:03):
Though, to be fair, yeah, it feels as though when
I look to be mean to each other.

Speaker 3 (04:10):
No, Taylor is more pristine reputation. It feels like the
girls we're talking about now have more of an edge
to them. Would I be correct in saying that I'm
saying that, well, if they're saying them, yeah, if they're
saying it's almost it's almost like I'm sitting here looking
at the two different groups.

Speaker 1 (04:28):
Is that right?

Speaker 2 (04:28):
Which one am I?

Speaker 1 (04:30):
I don't want to say legally?

Speaker 2 (04:31):
Okay, okay, what else do I need to know that?

Speaker 1 (04:34):
Okay? So the other thing that we've got to dive
into is this article that Joe Owen did.

Speaker 3 (04:38):
We cover it on The Fit A Kate Show this week,
but Lizzie has uncovered a little bit more simply by
paying the subscription fee to read on. So Lizzie, please
talk us through what else you found that own money?

Speaker 1 (04:50):
Did you own? You can change that.

Speaker 3 (04:54):
So this is the first time that Joe's spoken about
Taylor since they broke up, and you know, we.

Speaker 1 (05:00):
Never thought that he would. But can I say he
hasn't said too much.

Speaker 3 (05:03):
I feel and I never cared much for Joe either way,
Like he's fine, he was there whatever, some great songs,
but I think he has remained a gentleman like I
just feel if her and Travis break up, we'll be
getting a podcast, sit down, newspaper tell Whereas Joe hasn't
really given us too much.

Speaker 4 (05:20):
That's actually really true, and thank you for raising that.

Speaker 1 (05:23):
Because I thank you for being an understanding order.

Speaker 2 (05:25):
I hadn't even thought about that, to be honest. But
it does seem as though he has just continued the
way the relationship unfolded, really as it happened for not
six and a half years. They I think he has
said has anty that we didn't talk about it. This
wasn't a public this wasn't in the public domain when
we were together. Why on earth would I now come

(05:48):
out and start And I think.

Speaker 3 (05:50):
That shows that he's true to his character and that
maybe all along he just never did like the media.

Speaker 1 (05:56):
He never overly liked the fans. He didn't like all.

Speaker 3 (06:00):
Is a consistent beep, very true. You know, all right,
talk us through this extra little bit that you found.

Speaker 4 (06:06):
So this crazy bit as you read on which a
lot of the other publications that were reposting what he
was saying left out, which I'm like, no, no, if
you guys were swifties, you would realize that this is
the biggest part of the entire article. So one of
the songs on TTPD is called the Black Dog, which
is everybody since she released that was like this is

(06:28):
one hundred percent about Joe. Couldn't be more about Joe,
along with so long London.

Speaker 1 (06:34):
As you work in somber called.

Speaker 4 (06:40):
Beautifuls and you forgot.

Speaker 3 (06:44):
But the thing is so that the point of that song,
well part of is that perhaps Taylor or some person
has a partner who is choosing going to the pub
and being somewhere else over being with them and quite
possibly having an affair or spending time with somebody else.

Speaker 1 (07:03):
I took it to be.

Speaker 4 (07:04):
That after they broke up, they hadn't yet finalized some
things on the phone, like turning each other's locations off.
And so she's seen that he's going on a date
or he's going to this pub where it's most likely
he's going on a date, and he's moving on, and
so that feels sad for her to realize that she's
seeing him walk into this bar when she maybe doesn't
feel ready to go do that herself, and just being like.

Speaker 1 (07:26):
What is happening?

Speaker 2 (07:27):
So it's post relationships, post relationship.

Speaker 3 (07:30):
Oh when I read it, I thought it was within
the relationships, and I think a lot of people did,
which is why he has come out and said this
line in the article. It's so crazy so basically everyone's
thinking this is about Joe, and the interviewer kind of
asked him about it and he.

Speaker 4 (07:48):
Said, I've never been to Vauxhall and does like a
little bit of a wry smile when he says that,
So he's essentially saying, I've never been to this bar
or this pub called the Black Dog, thereby shutting down
all of all the Swifties theories that this song is

(08:08):
about him. So then we're kind of like, Okay, please
God not again. Is this about Matti Heally? And now
that WHI.

Speaker 1 (08:17):
Chessa and I have done some more digging this morning,
we think that.

Speaker 2 (08:21):
It is another song about him. So Matti Heally has
got form being at the black Dog.

Speaker 4 (08:26):
The Black Dog and it's one of the most heart
wrenching songs, and she's given it to the rodent Man again.

Speaker 3 (08:32):
And can I point out one other lyrics so fresh
out the Slammer, which again is supposedly about leaving the
relationship with Joe and knowing who your first call is
going to be. It's going to be Maddie. One of
the lines in that is swelled you into all my poems.
Now we're at the starting line. I did my time,
and we hear that starting line reference there, and then
we hear it in the black Dog referenced again.

Speaker 1 (08:53):
You know, does she jump up and sing the starting line?
She does it.

Speaker 4 (08:56):
So the starting line, Maddie here.

Speaker 2 (08:59):
The starting line as in the starting line of the song.

Speaker 1 (09:02):
No, No, a starting line is a band.

Speaker 2 (09:04):
Yeah, oh my goodness, Now I never thought it was
a running turne.

Speaker 3 (09:09):
No, you are obviously a lot fitter than we are.
So then we did more digging this morning.

Speaker 4 (09:17):
Maddy Healy has covered multiple songs by the starting Line
on tour. Yeah, so this song is one hundred percent
about Maddi Heally And it's just like we've spoken about
this before. We spoke about this, I think after one
of our records. They obviously are just more of a
fling kind of relationship. But how do actually know?

Speaker 1 (09:37):
I get it?

Speaker 4 (09:38):
Songs that are so heartbreaking and heart wrenching coming out
of something that was so situation shippy. But I guess
that is kind of where you get the most in
your feels, right.

Speaker 1 (09:49):
I think.

Speaker 3 (09:49):
So we've always known her to exaggerate a feeling or
an emotion like, think of but Daddy, I love him?
You know, the whole song and the lyrics are all
about getting married to this guy. We know that that
didn't happen, So it's like she just takes one moment
and runs with it in order to make you know,
these beautiful, tortured poems.

Speaker 4 (10:05):
Yeah, and what's that Nruda line? It's like loving loving
is so hard, but forgetting is so long.

Speaker 1 (10:11):
I think you mean, what is it? Loving him is
red ed? Oh that's a different song. Okay, So have
you caught up?

Speaker 3 (10:22):
Do you feel like I don't really need to be here.
I think I could have just like slunk out. And
it was the first moment out of all these educate
podcasts that I was looking at.

Speaker 2 (10:39):
The two of you thinking they have lost that much.

Speaker 1 (10:41):
Well, we've missed you. We've needed you here.

Speaker 4 (10:43):
Because I've been coming in every morning to Jess going
Jesse thing, and we've needed you here to talk to you.
So we're so glad you're back.

Speaker 3 (10:51):
Okay, Well, and I'm glad I'm back too. But you
still haven't answered the question about the fiance. I know
that you kind, but how did they meet?

Speaker 4 (11:00):
Oh? I don't know, because she's hot, probably over Instagram
hot attracts Hedo musician.

Speaker 1 (11:06):
Does it so me?

Speaker 3 (11:07):
For example, yeah, all right, I'm watching a musician.

Speaker 1 (11:15):
All right, well, I guess everyone's caught up.

Speaker 3 (11:17):
I'm going to put all of this in dot points
in an email so you know what the hell is
going on. I mean, don't push yourself. Maybe the end
of the week. Today, Oh glad you're back. It's so fine,
Thank you, guys.

Speaker 4 (11:28):
Sits In Whippa with Kate Ritchie is a Nova podcast
walk great shows like this. Download the Nova Player, find
the app store or Google Playing.
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