HR2: Roster Review continued

After focusing on the offensive side of the ball, King and Starks focus on the defensive side of the roster in the second hour.

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Episode Transcript

Speaker 1 (00:12):
Max, you want to do the honors.

Speaker 2 (00:16):
That's right. It's Optimist and you know what that means.

Speaker 1 (00:18):
It's the power Hour.

Speaker 3 (00:20):
Indeed, our number two here inside the locker room with
Gingham Starks and yeah, I mean optimist is just he's
delivering all over.

Speaker 2 (00:29):
Man.

Speaker 3 (00:29):
He's just a rumbling, tumbling and bumbling down those freeways
and those highways and byways across America. You know he'll
be barreling towards of course. Week one at MetLife Stadium
in East Rutherford, New Jersey. I had to think about
the city name for a second. Almosta at Newark. But
that's the airport we fly into, it's not where the

(00:51):
stadium is. Yeah, Now, I always love that sounder.

Speaker 2 (00:56):
I'm glad. I'm glad me and Wolf came up with
that idea.

Speaker 1 (00:59):
It's it is.

Speaker 4 (01:01):
It is a good one man. So Max, we are.
We still need to clean up on the offense and
I am I for one, am very happy that they
kept the the nine offensive lineman. And I think that
it's a group that you know, we've talked about this.

(01:22):
You know, everybody's talking about the receiver group. You know,
I laid out in our one and I've tried to
lay out throughout the course of the of the offseason.
Why I think they're fine at the receiver group. I
think they've got a lot of different options. I understand
the consternation. I understand, is there an absolute number one

(01:43):
in waiting to step up should an injury happen. Knock
on wood. Okay, I get all that, But I think
you're fine there. And I think the other one, the
other group that people are concerned about is the offensive line.
And I will I guess I'll say it like this,
If your young first round tackles perform in a way

(02:05):
that you expect them to perform.

Speaker 1 (02:07):
Then I think it's a good, solid deep group.

Speaker 4 (02:11):
If you need to recall, if you need to call
on Andrews Pete, this guy's got.

Speaker 1 (02:16):
A Pro Bowl on his resume.

Speaker 4 (02:17):
If you need to call on Calvin Anderson, well, your
internal evaluation is that this guy is worthy of a
two year deal. He's your swing tackle. We've seen McCollum,
with our own eyes, come in and be able to
start games for a C center position. We've seen Spencer
Anderson come in and be able to start games for
you at the guard position. So I think that there

(02:40):
is you know, there's a lot, there's a lot to
like there, there's you know, again, you still need those
guys to sort of be the guys. But I think
that if they can be what you drafted them to be,
this is uh has a possibility to be a group
with some upside.

Speaker 2 (03:00):
No, it definitely is.

Speaker 3 (03:02):
I mean, and like I said, you know, there are
not nine offensive linemen for every team out there to
go around and say that this is this is the group,
and this is everything that we're going to need. No,
I'm not saying that by any stretch of the imagination.
But at the same time, you know, I challenge and

(03:23):
I push back and say, where are you going to
find two hundred and eighty eight offensive linemen in the
on the planet? Right on the planet where you find
two hundred land mammals. Where you're gonna find two hundred
and eighty eight land mammals that all.

Speaker 2 (03:41):
Are at the top of their It's it's tough. It's tough,
you know.

Speaker 3 (03:45):
I mean not to say it's a needle in a haystack,
but it's it's it's a lot tough to try and
find that many guys. That's how many guys essentially you
would have on thirty two teams nine offensive linemen per
team on your active roster, that that number comes up
to two hundred and eighty eight. Where are you gonna
find two hundred and eighty eight? Just you're not You're
not right, you know, I mean a lot of teams

(04:08):
struggle to find five. And so when I look at this,
I say, if we're going with what we have, that's
a that that that's a that's a pretty darn good nine.
I mean I and I was sitting there splitting hairs
about eight and there's nine guys available to you. That
that that is that is a surplus warehouse of guys

(04:31):
essentially when you look at that, because at least seven
are going to dress every week, and we could we
we could talk about what that looks like. Is that
Spencer Anderson, Calvin Anderson? Is that Ryan McCollum Spencer Anderson?
Or is this a Spencer Anderson Andrews Pete Like, I mean,
you know, however, you want to skin that cat, you know,
you you could you you can get into how that is.

(04:53):
But what it does offer you is flexibility and guys
that have starts under their belt that are in that
that are at your key backup positions. Ryan McCollum started
games last year, started games before he got here, you know,
in service of Zach Frazer when he got injured. You know,
Spencer Anderson, like I said, he's mister Swiss army knife.

(05:14):
He can play all five positions down the line. That
is invaluable. That is a priceless piece. You don't you
don't find the Magna carta or the Rosetta stone of
offensive lineman that often. Okay, this is that. That that's
just that's a special gym. And then you throw on
Andrews Pete like you said, you know, I watched this guy.

Speaker 2 (05:35):
You know the guy. He's actually from out here at Arizona.
He's a he's a Corona del soul kid. Uh.

Speaker 3 (05:42):
And you know he he he's been to he's been
to two Pro Bowls and I mean he started over
one hundred games in the NFL and can play garden tackle.
And he's that that larger of a human, that is
a very large land mammal like we talked about Darnault Washington,
Andrews Pete is a it is a lumberjack of a man.
Like you know, you talk about thick legs thick arms,

(06:05):
thick trunk.

Speaker 2 (06:06):
Like he's he he's he's a humongous person to deal
with him.

Speaker 3 (06:10):
And you know, like I said, working into football shape,
he'll be fine by the time the season starts. And
then Calvin Eniser and Calvin Ensrer you brought in the offseason.
You identified him as a guy that could be a
good swing tackle for you and did well up until
he got injured in Friday Night Lights. And uh, you
know it is on the end and obviously they feel
comfortable enough about him to put him on the active roster.
So I have no problems with that. And we already

(06:31):
know what the front line is. You know, a lot
of potential. I think projerc quitted himself very well in
the preseason and left tackle looks like he just picked
up like riding a bike. And you know, for Troy Fought,
I know Troy one job a year ago and injury
set him back. So you have insurance policies for your
two young tackles on the edges. And then Mason McCormick
came in service of James Daniels getting injured a year ago,

(06:53):
and all he did was get better together him him
with the Morgantown mauler aka Zach Frasier is you know
Frick and Frack. You know what I'm saying, Like they
just they go Together's Mudd and Jeff, It's it's you know,
Ren and Stimpy, whatever duo you want to call it.

Speaker 2 (07:09):
Batman Robin. I mean, you could you just insert.

Speaker 3 (07:11):
Name here and that's Mason McCormick and Zach Frazier and
then Isaac Ciamolo. That's just the Vetman. That's just the
Vet Steady. Oh, Steady Eddie, Steady Eddy with the long hair.
He's a tried, tested and true dude. He's a leader
of that group. And uh yeah, so I feel great
about the offensive line personally, and that makes Max yeah.

Speaker 2 (07:30):
I mean, and you know, you scour the waiver wires.

Speaker 3 (07:33):
I mean, yeah, there's a couple of names out there,
but they still got to learn the system. They still
got to come and inundate themselves. And they also build
that chemistry. So if I'm talking about, you know, the
evil I know, rather than the evil I don't know.
I'm going with the evil I know.

Speaker 4 (07:46):
Okay, that's good stuff. So I think we have wrapped
up the offense. We have wrapped up the special teams guys,
as far as the snapper Coonts, the punter Williamson, which
has already done before yesterday' show, the great Chris Boswell
as your kicker.

Speaker 1 (08:02):
So let's move on now to the other group.

Speaker 4 (08:05):
Of land mammals across from those offensive linemen as you
like to call them, and that is the defensive line.
So you know, I will say this first of all,
eight guys kept that is one more than I thought November.
I thought there was going to be seven. And you
do wonder is this something?

Speaker 1 (08:27):
Are you know?

Speaker 4 (08:27):
Are they do they just really like the group of eight?
Are they hedging their bets with Derek Harmon? Do they?
You know, we talked about this sort of one ir
position that's available, you know, could you use this? I
don't think they want to use it for Harmon, but
we at least need to to bring up the possibility

(08:48):
for fans that might be thinking in that direction. But
let's let's run down the group of eight. Here they are.
It's Harmon, Benton and Hayward, Louder Milk a Quality and
Black loganle and Oda Maywell. So your your general thoughts
on that group of eight guys?

Speaker 2 (09:10):
I was very surprised about Says.

Speaker 3 (09:15):
I think the other ones you showed in and we
kind of highlighted, especially with with Isaiah, the ability to
play the special teams was a I think I think
probably a.

Speaker 2 (09:27):
Differentiator for him.

Speaker 3 (09:29):
And what what gave people a lot of well I'm
saying I shouldn't say a lot of people, It gave
us a kind of pleasant surprise knowing that that was
something that that was as desirable and as skilled as
he was. It definitely surprised me seeing him in there

(09:51):
and I was like, oh, okay, all right, this is
what we're doing.

Speaker 2 (09:55):
Uh.

Speaker 3 (09:56):
And I think that was one that I think for
because he was probably one of those guys that was
that was on the fringe. And I think also with
with the Sayse, I think that burst that he provided
at the end of that at that Carolina game, you
remember that sequence of plays Kinger where he kind of
ran down and and and ran down a guy latterly

(10:18):
down the sideline, you know, for a no gameplay, the
chase in the pursuit. I think that was something that
kind of popped off the film when you talk about
leaving a lasting impression, I think that was the one
thing that probably differentiated him and that decision making. I
felt good about the top six, and I said, you know,
I was like, hey, if.

Speaker 2 (10:36):
We're going with six, we're going lean cool.

Speaker 3 (10:39):
You know seven would be great because I felt like,
you know, when we lay out this frontline group, right,
it's Keanu, Cam and Iron Harmon. Obviously Harmon gets injured.
That kind of changes the way you look at it
a little bit and you're like, Okay, this is not
going to be as great as I think it is,
but you know it's not the perfect world. But then

(11:01):
Ya Black comes on, right, your second wave guy who
you know is gonna be there, Aquale you brought him
in free agency. A quality is gonna be here. He's
going to be a guy that can play that nose position.
He's played games and you know he played well in
New England, so.

Speaker 2 (11:15):
You knew he was there.

Speaker 3 (11:16):
Then it was like, oh man, this is a Logan
Lee versus Isaiah louder Milk.

Speaker 2 (11:20):
Kind of kind of showdown.

Speaker 3 (11:23):
And I felt like Logan Lee kind of had a
little bit of an edge, especially the way he worked
with Ya Black. So now we've got our six, right,
But Isaiah showed you something, right, He showed hey, I
could play special teams too, Like this new kickoff rule,
this Boom advantaged me, Like I don't have to run
the additional thirty yards down the field. All I gotta
all I gotta do is run about ten to fifteen

(11:43):
and stand my ground and pursuit. No different than running
off the edge at defensive end and then having to
retrace because they threw a check down. Okay, now, Boom,
we can use bigger body types.

Speaker 2 (11:55):
I think Oda.

Speaker 3 (11:56):
Maewo as well showed you something that hey, I could
go chase two guys. Hey, look at me, Look at me,
you know, and I think that's a guy that you
could say, maybe we can use him on the core
for special teams, right, we could use him on the
kickoff kickoff return squad. He can be a frontline guy,
you know that plays one of the l's of the rs.

Speaker 1 (12:14):
He can do that.

Speaker 3 (12:15):
And I think that was what made it so intriguing.
So to go from your top six and say we
need eight those two body types.

Speaker 2 (12:23):
Thank you.

Speaker 3 (12:23):
Dynamic kickoff rule has now created a space for those
guys on special teams.

Speaker 1 (12:27):
Yeah, it sure has.

Speaker 4 (12:28):
And I think that you know, as we were evaluating,
we began this evaluation with the group of wide receivers
and you know, again to recap for people who are
just tuning in.

Speaker 1 (12:39):
You know, Dk Metcalf.

Speaker 4 (12:40):
You have Roman Wilson, who I think has become kind
of a there's an undercurrent of excitement about him, beginning
with really beginning with what he started to do last year.
He appeared to be a guy in the rise before
he got hurt last year. But you know, going through
the offseason, going through the OTAs in mini camps, going
through the camp in Latrobe, the preseason, he looks like

(13:01):
he could be a playmaker. That's kind of you know,
moving up for you. And we talked about, you know,
you don't have that fourth round pick that you're going
to keep, it's going to edge a guy off the roster. Well,
in a way, Roman Wilson is that guy who was
a third round of a year ago. The difference is,
I think he's going to be starting, much like you
talk about with Derek Harmon. Okay, he's a first round

(13:21):
pick this year. Well, you expect him to start. But
I do think this is a position in which it'll
be interesting to me, very interesting to me to see
how they kind of carve up this playing time because
I think why a Black who? Of course, you know,
everybody's remembering his dominance at the end of the preseason
game on Thursday.

Speaker 1 (13:42):
You know, look, he did word of caution.

Speaker 4 (13:44):
Maybe is that the fact that that was coming against
second and third teamers. We get that, we understand that.
But as you look at the depth of this roster,
Black is a guy and Logan Lee is another guy.
Who are guys that I think you you know, you
want on this roster. Clearly, I don't think there was
any question Black was gonna make it, But Logan Lee

(14:05):
maybe more of that guy that you think, hey man,
there's some upside here, and so let's keep a veteran
or two around and let's see what this Let's see
how this guy can develop. You know, not every position
has that, but I think Logan Lee is a guy.
And again we talk about undercurrents of excitement Max, he
was beginning to create that last year. He was beginning,

(14:28):
you know, to become a guy toward camp. By the way,
I kind of thought Ryan Wats was becoming that guy
a little bit at the safety position. He had the
neck injury and had to retire in the offseason, But
I think that Logan Lee is a guy that I've
got my eye on. I'm really intrigued by what he
might be able to become for this Steelers defense.

Speaker 3 (14:50):
Yeah, I think he has that he gives me and
I'm gonna make this comparison to my era. So so
bear with me here, guys. Uh, Travis Kirsky he gives
me kirshk vibes he gets. He gives me nine O vibes,
And I I love Kirsky, man. I mean Travis Wi

(15:11):
was those guy, like a big physical he had the
body dimensions, He looked the part, and you know, you
know he had he had that physicality. And you know,
Logan League gives me wreck at Ralph vibes. You know,
and so he has the big broad shoulders, big arms,
and he likes to destroy things. So you know, I
look at Logan Lee and and I say, man, this,

(15:32):
this is this is a guy that you know has
You know, he went from being a very stiff type
of guy to a more fluid guy, like like you know,
his ability to bend, his ability to pass rush has
improved so much from last year to this year, and
his ability to be crafty split double teams in the
run game and be able to fall off into plays

(15:55):
and a hole that a running back might see one
second then gets swallowed up by him the second they
make that decision. Like and I like the way he
plays off of ya, like like that that that's college buddies,
we grew up as young men together, type of type
of instinct that that he's showing. And it goes well
and then the man can long snap, you know what
I'm saying, Like like you picked up a skill set,

(16:17):
you know, you know, it's like it's like you would
you didn't you You toiled in in your in in
in your injury last year and you figured out a
new skill set for yourself. And so I think with that,
I mean, you see the tremendous script. I think he's
gonna be I think it's gonna be a great compliment
and addition to the defensive line and he I think

(16:37):
he's gonna be productive. But I think the fact that
he showed that verstilia in a pinch, I can I
can get you out of a game if we lose
a long snapper.

Speaker 2 (16:46):
I thought that that.

Speaker 3 (16:46):
I thought that went huge and and to do it
almost the entire game. Remember that injury happened early in
the Tampa Bay game to Christian and and Logan Lee
just said, okay, we're gonna get that now. I mean
they had one bad you know play essentially, which was
the which was the Bensals kick, the one that kind
of went wide right, but once again.

Speaker 2 (17:08):
No warm up, no real practice, and you're in the fire.

Speaker 3 (17:12):
You're doing fifteen yard snaps, you're doing five, you know,
seven yard snaps, Like that's not easy to do. And
there's a guy who actually did compete in high school
for a scholarship to long snap. You know, the different
ways that they put you through. I was actually funny enough.
I was at the University of Michigan's football camp. I
was at Lloyd Carr's football camp, and they had they

(17:33):
had an open competition for a long snapping scholarship there
when I was there, and I jumped in the line,
not knowing that this is only good for this year.
And I was a junior, and you know, we get
to the and I did a really good job. Maybe
I got to the finals and they're like, okay, you
know class year like class of two thousand, They're like, oh,
oh no, no, no, this.

Speaker 2 (17:53):
For class of ninety nine. I was like, oh, okay,
he's like a.

Speaker 3 (17:56):
Good job making it all the way to the finals.
So you know, it was so so I mean, so
it is not something that I'm unfamiliar with, and for
him to do that thought, I thought that just showed,
you know, balls and then once again to go out
snap on special teams the very next play, make a
play the very next play on the defensive line. I

(18:17):
mean that that dude, you can't you can't script that
any better. For a young guy trying to make this
team and trying to differentiate yourself, I thought that was
that was that was that moment when you take a
snapshot and say why did this guy make the team?
That's the moment right there, king you know, long snap
as a defensive lineman and then go make a play
on the d line the very next play. Just put

(18:39):
that little you know, it's a snippet of maybe ten
seconds on the highlight reel, but in his mind it
lasted forever. That snippet right there, says okay, when we attach, hey,
what what's the credentials? What was the thing that stook
out for you on why Logan Lee's on the active
roster that's the one for me.

Speaker 1 (18:56):
Love it, absolutely, love it, totally agree.

Speaker 4 (18:59):
And the upside there the potential as a defensive lineman,
you know, maybe stepping in and sooner rather than later
becoming an integral part of that defensive line rotation. We'll see,
but the opportunity is there for Logan Lee. We are
glancing over actually diving into these Steelers initial fifty three
man roster again, a waiver wired deadline coming up in

(19:21):
just about thirty five minutes or so, so that you
know this fifty three may change a little bit. We
may have some revisions come tomorrow. But we have still
not gotten to the linebacker group. The one surprising cut
I think happened before. We'll dive into that, and the
really the one that probably turned the most heads was
the defensive back group. We're going to get to that

(19:42):
as well when we continue inside the locker room with
King and Starks, presented by our neighborhood, Ford Stoor on
the Steelers Audio Network, and we welcome you back inside
the locker room with King and Starks. Was any of
our neighborhood a Ford store here on There's audio network?

Speaker 1 (20:04):
How are you?

Speaker 2 (20:05):
Max? I am wonderful Robert, how are we doing.

Speaker 1 (20:09):
I'm doing well and we are going.

Speaker 3 (20:12):
To drink some water, so I'm definitely My vocal cords
are now more more sooth because I trying to run
through all this stuff because I know we only get
two hours to really break this down.

Speaker 4 (20:23):
So yeah, yeah, keep the water handy, stay hydrated, right,
very important. So the linebacker group, you know, we talked
about this yesterday. I don't think it's a huge surprise, right.
You know, the big competition, it seemed to me, in
the inside linebacker position was Mark Robinson versus Carson Brunner.

(20:44):
They'd made that decision by the time we came on
the air yesterday and discussed that they've decided to go
with Brunner, and then would an Echo Liota be a
guy that could stick around at the outside linebacker position.
The answer ultimately was no, as the Steelers decided to
go with TJ. Watt, Alex high Smith, the rookie Jack Sawyer,

(21:05):
and Nick Herbig.

Speaker 1 (21:07):
So initial reactions before.

Speaker 4 (21:09):
We get to something that I think should also be
pointed out, your thoughts about that group of linebackers that
the Steelers are going to be bringing in, And again
I should mention the inside linebackers. Since we're going to
talk about this now as a finalized for now group
initial fifty three, Queen Wilson, Malik Harrison, Cole Holcomb, and

(21:30):
Carson Bruner. We touched about touchdown Malik maybe being that
upgrade at the fourth linebacker position. And for people that think, well,
who cares about an upgrade at the fourth linebacker position,
Malik Harrison over Mark Robinson, that was the decision that
was made.

Speaker 1 (21:44):
That's the upgrade, one of the upgrades.

Speaker 4 (21:47):
Just go back to a couple of years ago when
they're calling Miles Jack and Week eleven or whatever it was. Hey,
Miles couch and lighter, right, come off the couch and
come play linebacker for us. So, uh, your thoughts on
the depth and quality of those two positions?

Speaker 2 (22:05):
Oh gosh? Okay?

Speaker 1 (22:07):
Uh?

Speaker 2 (22:08):
Where to begin? Where to begin? How do I want
to do this?

Speaker 1 (22:11):
Outside?

Speaker 2 (22:13):
Uh?

Speaker 3 (22:14):
You know, my daughters loved the movie Inside Out, so
we'll go inside then out.

Speaker 4 (22:17):
Okay, So that is for for for college football fans.
That is Blanchard, Blanchard and Davis from Army mister inside
and mister outside. Uhlans Doc Blancherd was the mister inside.
So we're gonna go mister inside.

Speaker 3 (22:32):
Yeah, and and for and for those of you that
are in the Disney Pixar era age like myself or
never really grew out of it. My daughter's favorite character
was Anui in the Yeah, yes, exactly.

Speaker 2 (22:48):
So uh so, you know, going with that, with that.

Speaker 3 (22:51):
Vein, I'm going to say inside back, this was surprising
for the fifth in Carson Brunner, But I get why.

Speaker 2 (23:00):
We knew what Patrick Crean was right.

Speaker 3 (23:02):
We went and we acquired him, big, big splash, signing
last year for the and bringing him in division and
red rovering him over from Baltimore and Pat was, you know,
essentially a day one starter for this squad. Peyton Wilson
drafted him a year ago. You know the capabilis. We

(23:24):
were down in Carolina and you know, I was talking
with my buddy Anie Shroff, who's the who's the play
by play for the Carolina Panthers, and he was like, yeah, man,
you know I had some NC State games man and
this kid first round potential. But the health is what
allowed us to get him later in the draft, right
to make him a third round pick. That was a
health issue. I think he's gotten over the health bug

(23:46):
with how well he played, how health he was a
year ago. You know, he's only taken leaps and bounds
of progress. You know you want to see the jump
from year one to year two.

Speaker 2 (23:55):
Well, this is a.

Speaker 3 (23:55):
Guy who made that very very very much leap into being.
And he was a green dot most of his preseason,
you know, to give him some reps as Patrick Queen
was already had been there, done that guy, and Peyton
performed amazingly. His blitz capability from the inside, I mean
he made he was making TFLs.

Speaker 2 (24:16):
He was he was hit, he was hit, he was hitting.

Speaker 3 (24:18):
He was hitting the gaps exactly how how you would
want to see him play fast, hair on fire sideline,
the sideline Erlacker esque, right, I'm not gonna say Erlacker
because that you know, Brian, Brian was his own special beast,
but erlackeresque capabilities to be able to run with running

(24:39):
backs out of the backfield, be able to run with
those move guys, or when a guy you know displaces
himself from the backfield and goes out wide to create
a five white situation.

Speaker 2 (24:49):
Peyton Wilson could do all of that.

Speaker 1 (24:51):
Yep.

Speaker 3 (24:52):
So you knew who your two starters were, right, and
then you look at that. Okay, well what's the second
line going to be? You know, we bring in Malik Harrison,
another guy from ball t Moore has familiarity with Deshaun
and Patrick. So that was a buddy system type of
move and a guy who's a huge body, and that
will kind of lead me to my outside next thing. Right,

(25:13):
he's a guy we're just gonna we're gonna set him
aside for a second, and then you get to Okay,
Cole Holkom Cole we knew two years ago, you know,
was a guy when you talk about the last man
standing with him in the Landon Roberts and like you said,
the whole Miles Jack experiment and everything, you wanted to
bring a guy in who is going to help you

(25:34):
be in that rotation. Remember we also brought in Kwan
Alexander remember that name absolutely right. So, but but Cole
and then Landing were those guys, and Cole gave you
that kind of Peyton Wilson vibe. Right, He's a guy
who could play all over, plus he could play special teams.
He was great in the punt coverage game. Right, he
was good in punt return, and you know he had

(25:56):
he had a capability to give you more than just
line back, but was smart enough, fast enough and could
pull the trigger in the open field and make that play.
He wasn't the guy that was gonna get put in
a spin cycle with a running back in the open field.
And he comes back healthy after a year and a
half hiatus, and he was looking every part of the

(26:17):
guy that we remember from two years ago, and it
was like, okay, man, that's gonna be a long jam.

Speaker 2 (26:22):
And then you had Mark Robinson.

Speaker 3 (26:23):
Right, you had Mark Robb who we knew and I
kind of detailed yesterday a lot. So if you go
in the podcast or you know you hear the show
from yesterday, I really broke down, you know, kind of
Mark Robinson's journey, and you know, there's a guy former
running back in college, only had one year linebacker, seventh
round draft pick based off of his potential and what

(26:44):
you kind of saw. And this was also very key
when Mark rob was here and we brought in Miles Jack,
that was what we were hoping for, right because remember
Miles Jack.

Speaker 2 (26:53):
Had a very similar story. He was a two way guy.

Speaker 3 (26:56):
He was a running back, slash linebacker, you know, takes
the injury and you know, the setback, but then comes
back and has a very good career, settles in a linebacker.
So you hope that that was going to be kind
of the arc for him, and there was a lot
of potential there. Very physical at the point. Coverage skills
was probably the one minus.

Speaker 2 (27:13):
Of the two.

Speaker 3 (27:14):
But as far as his ability to pull the trigger
and go and go be dynamite.

Speaker 2 (27:18):
He was dynamite. He was going to blow you up.

Speaker 3 (27:21):
He was he was going to make your day be very,
very uncomfortable if he hits you. And you said, okay, well,
you know that's really what it's going to come down to.
How do these guys break in because we were thinking
four and then Carson Bruner, obviously the son of Mark
Brunner and the kid who you know, had been heavily scouted.

Speaker 2 (27:39):
We knew what he was capable of.

Speaker 3 (27:41):
Good instinctive linebacker, maybe you know, a little bit behind
the rest of this group, but what can he do
on special teams?

Speaker 2 (27:46):
Well, he showed up in special teams.

Speaker 3 (27:48):
Making tackles every week and allowed the opportunity for himself.
The name and the work and the consistency is what
really got him an opportunity, and I think he's going
to be more of your score core for especialties. I
don't expect to see him really much in games in
the defensive down position, but he presented that. And I
think when you're talking about the differentiators, you still have
that bottom of the roster forty nine or you know

(28:11):
through fifty three that you're saying, these are guys are
gonna be dedicated special Teams guys, and so that's where
you get in Ben Scaronic, right, Scotty Miller especially, that's
where they fall in. This is where Myles killer Brew
falls in as well, which we'll talk about I'm sure
probably next segmenthen we get to the secondary, and I
think Carson Bruner is kind of one of those other
guys is going to be that core for guy. And

(28:33):
then you know Connor Hayward as well. So that's kind
of the core of your Special Team's guru class. And
I think he's the youngest guy in that group, and
he's the guy that's going to be the newest addition
to that, and that's what you want.

Speaker 2 (28:45):
I think I lack.

Speaker 3 (28:46):
Crink Clint Kreewald if you're early two thousands officionados h.
I think that's what you kind of fit him into
that type of mold, and you need that type of
young guy and that vigor and tenacity to be able
to go into that position. And so that's what made
it tougher for Mark robb to kind of find a
space for himself because you've got a thumper and Malik
Harrison as well, who's a humongous body, and he's further along.

(29:07):
He's Mark Robinson two point zero, so he's a been there,
already made guy where you still have potential and growth
there on the Mark Robinson side of things. And that's
how we kind of get to this group. You know,
we say, okay, well there we go. There's five.

Speaker 2 (29:22):
We were thinking four.

Speaker 3 (29:24):
And Carson Brunner was my guy that was on the outside,
probably a practice squad guy, but I think he did
enough and made enough noise that other teams like, man,
well if you don't take him, we're gonna take him.
And I think you kind of pressed yourself said hey,
we got to keep this young guy, and we drafted him.

Speaker 2 (29:37):
And you always love to see your.

Speaker 3 (29:39):
Draft picks kind of grow in this system as opposed
to just kind of shoving them off.

Speaker 4 (29:43):
Okay, So so that that's exactly what I wanted to
get to you before we get to the defensive backs.

Speaker 1 (29:47):
By the way, Love, we got Kreewalt and Kirsky in
the show Love.

Speaker 3 (29:51):
It exactly got two of my boys in there. Buddy Lee,
that's what we are. So Quint Creewall's nickname was Buddy Lee.
Can't bust him and and so that so you know
that that's where that's where we get.

Speaker 2 (30:03):
Clint in that. So, I mean it's a phenomenal group.

Speaker 1 (30:07):
So there you go.

Speaker 2 (30:08):
There's my inside assessment.

Speaker 1 (30:09):
Okay, what do you think?

Speaker 4 (30:10):
So I just you mentioned draft picks, and I really
wanted to get to this, and I'm gonna get to
this and then we're going to take a break and
we're going to talk about the defensive backs.

Speaker 1 (30:18):
These are the drafts outside too.

Speaker 3 (30:20):
By the way, we forgot outside Okay, Well I thought
you already had that handle.

Speaker 2 (30:24):
Well, no, we were going there.

Speaker 1 (30:25):
I was just okay, so we'll do that.

Speaker 4 (30:27):
We'll do that briefly because it includes a guy that
I'm gonna mention in this list. So these are the
three drafts under Omar Khan and Andy Widem. You know what,
should we get to this tomorrow? Yeah, let's get let's
get I think let's just do that tomorrow. Let's get
to this tomorrow because it is, it is impressive, and
I don't You're right, I don't want to rush it.

(30:48):
So let's get to the outside linebacker group instead, which
includes three no brainers.

Speaker 1 (30:54):
Right, Watt gets the contract extension.

Speaker 4 (30:57):
High Smith, who's been uh, you know, very very good
for this team.

Speaker 2 (31:02):
The perfect, the perfect, Robin TJ's batman.

Speaker 4 (31:05):
Yep, you got her, big who all he does when
he gets in is make plays and excel. And then
you have now the rookie Jack Sawyer as a guy
that can probably be one of those more developmental guys
and hopefully helping you on special teams.

Speaker 3 (31:23):
Yeah, and once again a lot of potential. There has
a lot more wiggle than I thought. I mean, I
saw him in college, but once again against college competition.
You know, it's one thing to do it against grown
men's another. And I thought Jack is really showing some
nice pass rush skills, some good ability to ball search
and and and trace the ball when he's out of

(31:44):
position to get back into position. I thought he showed
some good fight. He has some nice little pass They're
very subtle, but very sudden. I call it the Paul
Pierce game.

Speaker 1 (31:53):
Right.

Speaker 3 (31:54):
It's not flashy, it's not whirling dervish, it's not all
over the place. It's just one of those things where
he kind of sets you up with a little slow
man game and then boom comes to the inside and.

Speaker 2 (32:05):
It's like a killer crossover.

Speaker 3 (32:07):
You know, it's like you don't expect it and then boom,
he hits you with it and you're like, where'd the
guy go? And he's behind you. I thought that's what
Jack really saw. And when you're talking about trying to
find that fourth guy to rush the passer, to give TJ,
to give Alex a break at times, this is a
young guy who I think has a lot of potential

(32:28):
and a lot in the tank, and I think he's
gonna be really good for us and he's.

Speaker 2 (32:31):
Gonna learn a lot.

Speaker 3 (32:32):
I think he's gonna get a lot of a lot
of burn this season, but he's shown he can handle
he can handle the challenge, and I think that was
something that was really excited about what Jack did not
know and wondered, and especially when you think about like Echoleota,
the guy who's been there, done that. Ye had great
pursuit skills from the backside. I mean, that was one
thing I saw in the preseason, Like it was like

(32:53):
man Echo Leota, this dude is chasing down dudes and
he is hawking, and so I look at that and
then you know, and then also Julius Welshoff. I thought
Julius made some leaps and bounds. Is an international guy
coming into this and getting that exemption. The growth that
he showed, I mean, heck he had he had to
put his hand on the pile last season until he

(33:13):
got injured. So there was a youth for him, and
you saw the growth at him. And there's still a
lot of I think untapped potential with Julius, and he's
only going to grow the more that he plays this game.
But but you know, but I think when you talk
about it, only keeping four and you could have probably
made the argument for the fifth to be on the outside.
And that's where I say, I remember I put Malie
Harrison in a little box off to.

Speaker 2 (33:35):
The side and the inside.

Speaker 3 (33:37):
This is the guy I think that if you do
get injuries, he can bump down to the outside because
he's big enough. I mean, he's sixty four two sixty right,
that's an outside linebacker as well playing inside. So he
gives you that versatility to be able to bump down
in a pinch, and he has pass rush moves. So
that's where I think you kind of hedged your bet,
you know, with keeping that kind of fifth linebacker for both.

(33:59):
He's just a fifth utility linebacker. He's an inside outside linebacker.
And that's what allowed you to go with the four
that you did, because you got this fifth guy that
can play inside and outside as well as be on
your special team.

Speaker 4 (34:12):
And again, as we talk about roster versatility, so we're
talking about making the team, eventually we're gonna be talking
about playing in the games, being active. Not all fifty
three guys are gonna be active. We understand one or
two offensive lineman okay, you know, a couple quarterbacks, okay,
as your as your roster's you know, constituted at present,

(34:34):
But then who are those last three guys who aren't
going to be dressed? And if you have that versatility,
maybe it gets you dressed. And so you're an interesting
guy for sure. And as we mentioned, you know, the
guys that are cut down. Liota and Demarvin le Aaled
made strong cases with themselves. But we're gonna get to
this next group coming up, in which there were some
guys that were cut that I think, really, I think

(34:58):
this was the most surprising group. We're gonna get to
that when we continue inside the locker room. If King
and Stark's presented by your neighborhood Fords are here on
the Steelers Audio Network. Welcome back inside the locker room
with Kenyan Stark is presented by your neighborhood Fords Store.

Speaker 1 (35:19):
And this is the There's Audio and Network, Max Starks,
What time is it?

Speaker 2 (35:23):
It is the bell?

Speaker 3 (35:28):
Oh, that was the early lunch warning system for all
of you out there in Steelers Nation. Make sure you
go out and grab your lunch. Obviously on podcast, adjust accordingly.
But for everybody else there listening live on terrestrial radio,
we give you that option to make sure you know.
It is an eleven twelve minute, twelve minute, almost eleven
minute warning before we hit the neon o'clock hour. And
of course also that is also the waiver deadline hour.

(35:51):
But most importantly it's foraging time.

Speaker 4 (35:53):
Yeah, it is, it is foraging time, and I have
to tell you that, you know, I laughed despite myself.

Speaker 1 (36:03):
I always said, I'm.

Speaker 4 (36:03):
Not gonna laugh at King in the Castle anymore, and
I laughed at King in the Castle every week.

Speaker 1 (36:07):
I think I'm gonna laugh at Bell. We take craspy.
That doesn't make me laugh.

Speaker 4 (36:13):
So we we wanted to get to the defensive backs.
And I'm gonna you know, we've started with who's on
the initial fifty three man roster. I want to start
with who's not on the initial fifty three man roster
when it comes to the defensive back position, because to me,
I was surprised at how few defensive backs the Steelers kept,

(36:33):
and I was surprised because of the quality of guys
that aren't on the roster. So Beanie Bishop led the
team in interseas in interceptions last year at four not
on the roster.

Speaker 1 (36:45):
Chuck Clark, veteran safety. He's been a good player.

Speaker 4 (36:47):
I know he had an injury a couple of years ago,
but you know one of those guys when you sign
and you think, well, this is a good football player.
James Pierre, who's been a very good special teams player
and a guy you can come in and play that
backup corner spot, and I think probably it was he
and Eccles basically fighting for the same position, much like
Willie Harrison and Mark Robinson. I think it probably came

(37:10):
down to Eccles and Pierre and you know, again looking
for those those upgrades, guys who are going to be
on special teams and who can also come in and
be a quality player for you as a fourth cornerback.
That's what Eccles, I think is going to be. Sebastian Castro.
He's a guy that was I think had Steelers had

(37:34):
a grade on him as a draftable player.

Speaker 1 (37:37):
Showed up big.

Speaker 4 (37:38):
In mini camps and OTAs, had a solid preseason camp,
had a solid performance in preseason games, but just got
caught in the number crunch.

Speaker 1 (37:48):
That surprised me.

Speaker 4 (37:49):
I thought they would keep another defensive back and maybe
even two more than the ones they kept. And the
reason is because those guys don't forget to Cordy Trice
on injured reserve. There's another guy. Now he will be
back with the team. You would assume after four weeks
and then the you know, the three weeks sort of
window to bring him back. But to me, this was

(38:10):
the most competitive position if you lump him together corner
and safety on the team. And I have to say
I was surprised by some of the cuts.

Speaker 3 (38:23):
Uh yeah, I mean it was it was one that,
like you said, it was very tough, and I mean
it was made apparent very early on top three is
the top three?

Speaker 2 (38:30):
Don't touch him?

Speaker 1 (38:31):
Oh yes, yeh.

Speaker 4 (38:33):
By the way, so I should, I should get to
who's on the team. So it is Slay, Yeah, it
is Slay, Ramsey and Porter with Eccles and Dante Kent,
the rookie who's been injured has been nicked up. They
kept him. Uh that is that is your cornerback selection.
Then it's Deshaun Elliott, Juan Thornhill and Miles Kilibroot safety.

(38:58):
That's it. Eight to defensive backs. I thought they'd keep ten. Uh,
but that your eighth they've kept and maybe a leaner group.

Speaker 1 (39:06):
But boy, there's some there's some quality there.

Speaker 3 (39:10):
Yeah, yeah, there is there is. And like you said,
Sleigh Ramsey, Joey Porter Jr. Said it, forget it. We're
not touching the crock pot and we're gonna let them cook.
And you know, we did, we did have a little
taste test. We did open the lid a little bit
and you know, dip the tasting spoon in there and
just make sure the broth is going good in the
crock pot. And uh, Jalen Ramsey did not want to

(39:32):
leave the field once he got a taste of Once
he got a taste, He's like, I'm ready for the meals.

Speaker 2 (39:36):
Like no, no, no, no, no, got another two weeks
to simmer.

Speaker 1 (39:38):
Yeah, that was he was the primer there.

Speaker 4 (39:40):
But that was a preseason game when when Mike Tomin
wanted him, get him out there a little game action
for communications purposes, and Jalen Ramsey was, uh uh what
did Romonte Foster say, big footing around?

Speaker 2 (39:52):
Uh yeah, I want to game. Yeah.

Speaker 3 (39:55):
He he was stomping around asking for a little bit more.
And let me tell you what we got in the
pre It was like, holy crap, Okay, let's put this
guy on ice is give him some bubble wrap and
give him some flower season a hat, take his helmet
from him, give him just a regular hat so he
can't physically go into the game. He will be in
violation because he was explosive.

Speaker 2 (40:15):
He was sudden.

Speaker 3 (40:16):
And when we talk about you know, and I would
have said it would have been a dominating performance. If
I got more than one series from him, that would
have been my number one dominating performance was what Jalen
Ramsey did in that one series out there on the field.
He was all over the place. I think he had
like three tackles in the game, right, you know, So
so that was one. So that group is settled, right,

(40:37):
you know who your top three are. And the fact
that you have Jalen Ramsey, who can play corner, nickel, safety, right,
he can play anywhere. He's a defensive back almost like
Malie harrisy we said, could play inside, outside, like the
versatility of positions. Jalen Ramsey gives you all of that.
And so you set those three. Now you're saying, okay, well,
who's gonna be the fourth guy? Right, Who's gonna be

(40:59):
the fourth defensive back in that group? And it was
Brandon Eckles versus James Pierre. And we saw it all
of training camp, all of the preseason, and Brandon just
kept showing up, right, and both of them played special
teams as well. You know, James Pier is one of
those guys we always use at the gunner position. He
was always a great gunner and you know, but there
was always a little bit of susceptibility from past experience

(41:22):
at the defensive back position when he gets in one
on one man press situations to it his liability.

Speaker 2 (41:27):
Brandon Eckles didn't have that problem.

Speaker 3 (41:28):
And I think that was really what came down to
the differentiator is when we need a guy in a pinch,
if there's an injury that happens, who's a guy that
we trust at corner Because both of them, all things equal,
can both play special teams and give you something of
special teams. That's what I feel was a differentia that
really separated Brandon from James that in that situation and
why you ultimately went with him.

Speaker 2 (41:49):
You know, for for the secondary.

Speaker 3 (41:52):
Obviously, Deshaun Elliott got paid in the offseason, so guess
what another set.

Speaker 2 (41:56):
In and forget it. Guy. We know he's a hammer,
he can bring it.

Speaker 3 (41:59):
He could play box safety, he could also play the field,
and so we got him. Well, you read Rovert and
brought jan Thornhill over Super Bowl champion. Been there, done
that guy. He's gonna be the compliment. Once you made
the trade for Minka, you knew kind of wan Thornhill
was cemented in that position, so you didn't really have
to go far to kind of think about what he

(42:19):
was going what he was going to bring to you.
And so you know, now we get to what we
get to where are the others? Where are the other
guys on this? And you know, for for dot, I'm
sorry not done. Miles Killer Brew. We knew what Brew
brought Pro Bowl pedigree, Special Teams Ace a guy who
blocks punts just about every single year. It feels like

(42:42):
he's a key guy. He has a nose for the football.
He's a captain of that special teams. He controls the
co Core four. He is your Core four captain, and
so you knew you had to figure out a space
for him. Plus also a guy get you out of
a pinch. At one point it was him and Terrell
Edmonds that were the only healthy safeties on this roster
a few years ago. And you know, Miles president service

(43:04):
and did an excellent job as an army guy.

Speaker 2 (43:05):
So guess what.

Speaker 3 (43:06):
He knows how to take orders and he knows how
to accomplish a task, so you don't worry about him.
The interesting one, Dante Kent injured a lot of potential.
You know, he had punt return capability. Maybe as Cayl
Austin's role expands, Roman Wilson's role expands, maybe this is
where you use a Dante Kent and he can kind
of work his way up into being that guy. We

(43:28):
know he has a potential at the safety position. We
just don't know what it looks like because he's been injured.
But the Steelers felt comfortable enough to say, hey, there's
a lot of potential there, and I want to just
see this thing through before we just end this experiment
once again, another draft pick and making this roster initial,
but making the roster thus far with a lot of potential.

(43:51):
So you now you have two guys who you drafted
down the line that you think have something for you,
and a Will Howard and now with Dante Ken who
didn't who didn't give us any specialty, didn't give us
any film to.

Speaker 2 (44:04):
Watch in the preseason.

Speaker 3 (44:06):
But you see where they're kind of going with this,
and you also have to secure the future. That's also
the youngest guy in that secondary right, you know everybody
else a little bit older.

Speaker 2 (44:15):
Joey Porter Junior is.

Speaker 3 (44:16):
Your next youngest out of all those defensive back guys.
So you want to make sure that you're also keeping
the youth blood flowing through that defensive secondary and uh yeah, no,
I mean that's my assessment.

Speaker 2 (44:30):
Yep.

Speaker 1 (44:30):
Well, listen, we don't know if it's set.

Speaker 4 (44:34):
The keyword here is right there are guys breathing a
sigh of relief right now that might not be breathing
a sigh of relief three minutes from now, you know,
as we get to as we get to the end
of the waiver wire pickup uh period which concludes today
at noon, and then we'll you know, well, the stories

(44:56):
will start leaking out, and then they'll begin to compile
the the practice squad and guys to get back to work,
and next thing you know, we'll be turning the corner
and getting into game.

Speaker 1 (45:07):
We can't wait.

Speaker 4 (45:09):
Max, thank you very much, our thanks to Justin Miller
as well back in our iHeart Studios for Max Starks,
I'm Rob King. Thank you for being with us inside
the locker room with King and Starks, presented by your
neighborhood Ford Store here on the Steelers Audio Network