January 26, 2025 • 44 mins
Looking for unique travel ideas in France? In Fall in France Beyond Paris, host Annie Sargent chats with guest Steve Weaver about an unforgettable trip to the Aveyron region. Steve, a traveler from California, shares his experiences exploring this stunning and less-touristy area of France. If you’ve already visited Paris or want to venture off the beaten path, this episode is for you.
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Steve describes staying at a beautifully restored 16th-century Château in Balsac, complete with breathtaking countryside views, friendly goats, and even a hot tub for stargazing. He raves about the peaceful walks through the Aveyron landscape, where ancient stone buildings and vibrant vineyards create postcard-perfect scenes. Wine lovers will enjoy hearing about his impromptu wine tastings in Clairvaux, where he met winemakers eager to share their craft.
The conversation also highlights iconic spots like the Millau Viaduct, the world’s tallest bridge, and La Couvertoirade, a medieval Templar village that feels frozen in time. Steve’s journey includes dining at the Michelin-starred Émilie et Thomas near Conques, exploring Rodez’s modern stained-glass cathedral, and rediscovering the charm of Paris without the pressure to check off famous landmarks.
Join Annie and Steve for practical tips, engaging stories, and plenty of inspiration for your next French adventure. Whether you’re dreaming of sipping wine in a quiet village, marveling at modern engineering, or strolling through quaint towns, this episode will spark your wanderlust. Listen now and discover why fall in France is a season like no other.
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Annie (00:15):
This is Join Us in France, episode 530, cinq cent trente.
Bonjour, I'm Annie Sargent, and Join Usin France is the podcast where we take
a conversational journey through thebeauty, culture, and flavors of France.
Today, I bring you a trip report withSteve Weaver, where we dive into the
untapped beauty of France beyond Paris.
(00:39):
Discover the rustic charm of the Aveyronarea, hear tales of a refurbished
chateau, and find out why exploringthe French countryside can offer a
more relaxing and authentic experience.
This episode is a treasure trove of travelinspiration, especially if you're looking
to venture off the beaten track in France.
(01:01):
Tune in for insightful stories andtips on experiencing the serene
landscapes, historical sites, andlocal flavors that you will not
find in the typical tourist areas.
This podcast is supported by donorsand listeners who buy my tours and
services, including my ItineraryConsult Service, my GPS self-guided
(01:22):
tours of Paris on the VoiceMap app,or take a day trip with me around the
Southwest of France in my electric car.
You can browse all of that at myboutique: joinusinfrance.com/boutique.
Patreon supporters get new episodesas soon as they are ready and ad-free.
If that sounds good to you, be likethem, follow the link in the show
(01:44):
notes or browse to patreon.com/joinus.
There won't be a magazine part of thepodcast today because I was away in Paris
all week and I'm on the TGV heading backright now, and I do not recommend trying
(02:04):
to do anything important on the TGV Wi Fi.
But I do want to send my thanks to AlecKoo for his one time donation using
any green button on joinusinfrance.comthat says 'Tip Your Guide'.
Enjoy my conversation with Steve and I'llbe back with more updates next Sunday.
(02:35):
Bonjour, Steve Weaver, andwelcome to Join Us in France.
Steve (02:38):
Bonjour, Annie.
This is great to be with you.
I'm looking forward totalking with you today.
Annie (02:44):
Yes, we have a great conversation planned about, well, the topic you sent
me, I liked it because it said (02:48):
Enjoying the Fall in France, beyond Paris.
Why did you pick that title?
Steve (02:56):
Well, we've been fortunate enough to travel to France three previous
times and have stayed in Paris, and sowe've seen all the famous sites, we've
strolled the streets, we've done yourVoicemaps of the Marais and so forth.
And we really wanted toexperience France itself.
(03:17):
So we wanted to have anexperience rather than seeing
and visiting sites, so to speak.
And we were fortunate enough thatwe have friends that live out in the
countryside, near the city of Rodez.
And they've refurbished a chateau thereand we really wanted to go out and
(03:38):
see what they have accomplished andenjoy just the scenery, and the people,
and the culture outside of Paris.
Annie (03:46):
Yeah.
Refurbishing a château.
Now that's a task, that's a job!
Did they survive the ordeal?
Steve (03:55):
Yeah, they, it's funny because they had the impression that, Oh,
we'll get there, and they've done homeremodeling in the Bay Area, we're from
California here in the Bay Area, andthey thought, Oh, it'll take six months.
Well, two years into it...
Annie (04:14):
Yeah.
Steve (04:15):
Maybe their estimate was a little off, but they're fine and up and running
now and they've been up and runningfor a few years, several years now.
So, but it was definitely alonger task than they thought.
Annie (04:27):
A challenge.
Now, Rodez area, the Aveyron,is absolutely gorgeous.
And we have talked about it some on thepodcast, but not quite enough, I think.
We need to bring more people to theAveyron because if you want something
bucolic, and gorgeous, and peaceful, Iguess, it's a peaceful vacation, isn't it?
Steve (04:47):
Oh, it is.
And it's such a fun opportunityfor people because they can go into
Paris and kind of experience that.
But it's only an hour and 20 minuteplane flight from Paris, from Orly.
So you don't even have to go throughCharles de Gaulle to get to Rodez.
(05:07):
And the airport there is so smallthat when you land the plane
makes a u turn on the tarmac thereit comes back to the terminal.
But it has everything you'll need there.
Every rental car agency you'reused to in the States is there,
Avis, Hertz, and so forth.
And so they have all the facilitiesthere, and it really is just a
(05:29):
short trip from Paris to get there.
Annie (05:32):
I didn't realize you could fly into Rodez.
What company was this that was doing this?
You remember?
Steve (05:39):
Yes, it was Amelia International.
So not an airline I've ever heard of.
But I believe that the governmentmust subsidize them so that they're,
they ensure that there's someflights coming in and out of Rodez.
So it makes two flights a day, I think itstarts in the morning in Rodez, flies to
(06:01):
Paris, picks up passengers, flies back,and it might do an afternoon flight too.
Annie (06:05):
Wow, that's surprising.
I've never heard of them either.
Was it a teeny plane?
Steve (06:12):
It was a smaller Embraer jet.
Annie (06:16):
Birdjet, okay.
Steve (06:17):
Yeah.
So not a prop plane.
And full service.
It was just fine.
Much better than a Ryanairflight, that's for sure.
Annie (06:26):
Anything is better than a Ryanair flight.
That's great.
All right.
Tell me about some of the things thatyou enjoyed the most on this vacation.
I'm sure there are many, but onceyou got there, you mentioned the
car rental, you rented a car, right?
Because you can't do much inthe Aveyron without a car.
Steve (06:42):
That's, that's right.
Yes.
In fact, we picked up ourrental car and then drove off
to our friend's chateau Balzac.
We really enjoyed staying with them,they did a fantastic job remodeling,
and they are out into the countryside.
The first thing that I enjoyed somuch was just walking through the
(07:02):
countryside there because it's sopeaceful and bucolic and you'll see
cows, and goats, and vineyards, andbuildings made out of stone, and we just
don't have that in California, really.
Annie (07:17):
It's very different from California.
Yeah.
Not the Bay Area anymore.
Steve (07:21):
Definitely, definitely not.
You're not going to see famousmuseums, although Rodez has
a nice museum, but anyway.
Annie (07:29):
The Soulages Museum in Rodez.
Steve (07:32):
Thank you.
They have a wonderful cathedral therewith just beautiful stained glass.
And you've talked about that before.
Annie (07:39):
Those stained glass in Rodez Cathedral, especially the modern one.
What am I saying?
I prefer the modern stainedglass to the old one.
What's wrong with me?
Steve (07:49):
We were just so surprised with that when we walked in there.
So it's not like any othercathedral you'll see in France.
But just that the beautiful scenery,and it's so easy just to find an area
to go and walk out into the countryside.
So a much different walkingexperience than if you're in
(08:10):
Paris or any other major city.
And it's very easy to navigate, youknow, they're smaller roads, you're
not going to encounter any freeways,but we didn't have any trouble.
Annie (08:21):
There is one, the one that takes you to the Millau.
Steve (08:24):
Yes, yes, yes, exactly.
Annie (08:27):
Not many, there's one, just that's it.
Steve (08:29):
No.
And I'm glad you brought up the Millau,because I'm kind of a architectural
engineering nerd and I've seen picturesof the Millau, the Viaduct Millau and
that was one of the bucket list thingsI wanted to see while we were there.
And we were able to gothere and drive across that.
Annie (08:50):
Yeah.
But before you get to Millau,you'll tell me about this restored
chateau, the 16th century chateau.
What sort of a chateau is it?
Steve (08:57):
So, this chateau has actually, there's actually been a form of a
chateau since like the 11th century.
And the main chateau that they livein and that they've refurbished
it dates back to the 16th century.
And so, you can imagine, kind of a castlesetting where you walk up kind of a
(09:22):
winding staircase up to your rooms, andthey've fully furnished the rooms in
modern style, I mean, modern accoutrementsand decorations, and it's just gorgeous.
But they've also left the natural woodbeams and you'll feel like you're in a
(09:43):
kind of a little, all in enchanted place.
Annie (09:45):
Yeah, I could, because you sent me some photos, it looks they
also left the inside shutters.
Which, is something they did alot in chateaus because, well,
you know, if you're too high, it'sreally hard to close the shutters.
And this also, this particularchateau also had like, defensive
(10:06):
grills in front of the windows,so the shutters are inside.
It's lovely.
It's a beautiful place.
Steve (10:12):
Oh, it is.
And for us, it was just so much funbecause you could step out and be
greeted by their goats that they haveroaming around the property, and my
wife was out there with her staff,kind of herding the goats around.
They have a little sheep dog thathelps herd the goats around and so
that was definitely an experience youwon't have in Paris, that's for sure.
Annie (10:36):
Yeah, so because they are friends, you were eating with them, but does
the chateau have a restaurant as well?
Steve (10:42):
They will set up breakfast for travelers, and then they
can also cook meals there.
They set up their kitchen soit's more like a restaurant-style
kitchen than just a regular home.
And in fact, throughout the yearthey'll have like culinary events
where they'll have local chefs come in.
(11:05):
And they'll have people come stayfor a week where they can learn
how to cook in the French style.
If you go to their website, you canfind out information about that.
And they also do, in the past they'vealso had photographers come in, and so
you have like a week long photo sessionswith professional photographers to...
Annie (11:26):
To work on your photography skills.
Oh, I should talk tothem about the bootcamp.
We could do an outing on thebootcamp, for the bootcamp there.
Steve (11:34):
Oh, yeah, that would be perfect.
Annie (11:35):
But do they, how many rooms do they have?
Steve (11:38):
They also have a gîte, too.
Annie (11:40):
Okay.
Steve (11:41):
So that they can accommodate large families.
And it's not as, you know, modern,but it's definitely functional.
Annie (11:49):
Very nice.
Very nice.
Okay, let's move on to the next thingyou listed, which is wine tasting.
You went
to Clairvaux d'Aveyron.
I am not familiar with thiswine, tell me more about that.
Steve (12:04):
Yes, and, you know, we're Californians, so we look for a wine
experience, and what was really niceis that we were able to walk from
the chateau and take a hike, and cameinto town to the little village there.
Wine Taste in California, they'llhave people there to kind of help you
through the tasting, but when we wentthere, we were with the winemaker.
(12:28):
And Jean-Luc Matha, he's the winemakerat one of the wineries that we went to,
and he was just so accommodating for us.
Because we didn't plan ahead andcall, we just kind of at the spur
of the moment decided let's walkin and see what they have to offer.
And it was like we were instant friends.
(12:50):
And he brought us in, and it's areally interesting winery in that,
it's kind of like a cave when youwalk into their tasting room, but
decorated modern, so you're not goingto find bats or anything like that.
But, it's just...
ok, sans bats.
Yes.
(13:10):
So, you'll walk in and do a tasting there.
And they have interesting wines thatwe've never experienced in California.
They're all local and kind of biodynamic.
They try to grow and treat theirvineyard with kind of biodynamic process.
Yes, processes and so forth.
Annie (13:31):
Right.
Steve (13:32):
And then we walked from there into town and went to another winery and
it was the same thing where it was thelocal winemaker giving you the tasting
experience and not just some, one ofthe workers or something like that.
So, that was truly amemorable experience for us.
Annie (13:52):
Yeah, so this is one of the things that's wonderful about doing
wine touring in the Southwest.
It's, whether it's this winery or manyothers, this is not a super famous wine.
I mean, Aveyron has an AOC,but it's not the sort of wine
that you will find in the US.
It doesn't export, it'snot big productions.
(14:14):
And so when you go, I mean, obviously it'sbetter to call and make an appointment,
you know, but they are very availableand very open to discussing their work
and what they do and, you know, do atasting with you, and most of them,
they just, they hope to sell a fewbottles and get a little notoriety.
(14:35):
You know, that's what'sin it for them, I guess.
Steve (14:37):
And it worked because we did come home with some bottles, and unfortunately
we left them at the chateau, but that'sokay, our friends were able to enjoy them.
Annie (14:47):
Right.
right.
I do day trips now with some customers,and I did one to Gaillac and we did find
one chateau where they were willing toship some wine, six bottles to, but the
guy said, okay, I'm going to get a bid,I won't sell you the bottles right now.
He took his email address.
(15:07):
He's going to bid it with UPSand then send him a proposal.
And if he's okay with that,he'll pay and off they go.
So it's not a fast process,but you can get some shipped.
And also most people will, areable to take a couple of bottles
in their suitcase, I guess.
And there are suitcasesmade just for wine.
(15:30):
They are very, very heavy.
Steve (15:33):
It's definitely a great experience.
So I would recommend that toanyone traveling in this area to
find a little winery to visit.
Annie (15:42):
Yeah.
With a couple of phone calls, you canfind some really interesting people,
you know, the locals know them,I'm sure your friends, is it your
friends that recommended this one?
Yeah.
Steve (15:53):
They did.
Annie (15:53):
The fourth thing that you list is sitting under the
stars in the chateau's hot tub.
Ha Ha!
Steve (15:59):
That was amazing.
And it's definitely an experience thatyou won't have in Paris, that's for sure.
And sitting in the hot tub outin the rural France was just
such a wonderful experience.
You know, they provided the bathrobes,and the slippers, and we were able
to just sit under the stars there.
(16:19):
And luckily, we were traveling in October,it was warm enough to go out there and the
scenery with the trees, and the moonlight,and the stars was just exceptional.
Annie (16:32):
Yeah.
Steve (16:33):
I will definitely remember that for sure.
Annie (16:36):
One of the nice things about being in rural areas is that, you
know, you have experiences like that.
That's fantastic.
Driving over the Millau viaduct bridge.
Okay, we got to talk about the bridge.
We both love it.
Steve (16:49):
Yes, yes.
yes.
And I would say, if you're travelingwith a family, I think going to the
little visitor center with the models,and they have some interactive displays,
it would be a fun little outing.
And then just, you know, to the go intothe observation area where you can get
(17:11):
some beautiful pictures of the span.
It's definitely worthwhile.
And you know, the Eiffel Tower isa masterpiece of engineering, but
this is a masterpiece of the, youknow, the 21st century engineering.
And I was just thrilled driving across it.
Annie (17:29):
So did you drive it going south or going north?
Steve (17:32):
From the visitor center going south, I believe.
Annie (17:35):
Yeah, the visitor center is on the North end.
Steve (17:38):
Yes, yes.
And from there, we went to kind of likea templar village out in the countryside.
Annie (17:47):
La Couvertoirade.
Steve (17:49):
Thank you for saying that.
Annie (17:52):
I think that's what it is.
I think that's what it is.
Let me look again.
La Couvertoirade, I think.
Steve (17:57):
Yes, exactly.
I know you've done episodes onthe Templars and to see this in
person, and see how they built thesedefensible castles was just amazing.
And again, I think, if you were makingthis a family trip, the kids would just
(18:17):
love climbing around an ancient castle.
We were traveling in the fall,so there was hardly anyone there,
but they did have a little cafethere, so you could have lunch.
And it's not a very big location,and so it's something that you can
do, you know, in an hour or two.
Annie (18:40):
I intend to do an episode about this because it's very different.
It's out of the way, you know,it's not something that you can
easily go to unless you plan to.
But they do have eventsevery now and then.
I need to keep an eye on the events, seeif they have any events going on soon
and go when there's an event going on.
Because I've, I was there kindof late afternoon, it was getting
(19:01):
windy and chilly and it was dead.
I mean, it was, there was nobody there.
But it was still beautiful.
Like even empty, it's interesting.
Steve (19:10):
It is.
And we were fortunate in that they hada local craftsman still had a shop open
and he was kind of a person that dealtwith metal and making things out of
metal and we ended up coming home witha couple little sheep that he made, just
to have a memory of, of going there.
Yeah.
Yes.
And it fit in our luggage too.
(19:31):
So.
Annie (19:32):
That's good.
Yeah, La Couvertoirade, it's asmall town that the Templars used
a lot, it's a medieval place andit's still walled in, you know.
Steve (19:44):
Yes.
Annie (19:45):
It's a Plus Beau Village de France, but it's walled in.
And outside of it, there's notmuch, there's nothing much.
So sometimes these walledcities have outgrown themselves,
but this one really hasn't.
It's just sitting there in themiddle of the landscape by itself,
much like it would have, you know,it has for centuries, for you
(20:07):
know, since the, they probablybuilt it in the 1300s or the 1400s.
Steve (20:12):
Right.
Yeah, it just transport you back intime when you're walking through there
so you can really visualize history.
And again, if you havekids, they can run around.
There's, there's not going to bepeople telling you don't touch this
or don't touch that type of thing.
Annie (20:27):
No, it's great.
Beautiful place.
La Couvertoirade.
If you can say it, you get extra points.
You had dinner at Émilie et Thomas, oh,Michelin star, just outside of Conques.
Oh, do tell!
(20:47):
I haven't tried that one.
Steve (20:49):
Yes.
And so, what's really unique,it's right along the river.
And I think they also have a little smallplace that you can stay overnight too.
And so, as you leave Conques and headtowards Rodez, you can stop there.
They have sittings where youhave multiple courses, they can
(21:10):
also pair wines with that too,depending on what you choose to do.
The food was all local,whatever's in season, food.
So, it's not going to be thesame, I think, depending on
the time of year you go there.
And they're just very friendly, weended up going back into the kitchen.
(21:32):
And we were late at night, or we hadthe later seating and it was also
the fall, so it wasn't very busy.
So, they brought us back intothe kitchen to see the kitchen.
But I would imagine it would be beautifulif you were there during the daytime, so,
I just thought it was a great experience.
Annie (21:50):
Beautiful.
I'm looking at the photoswhile you're talking about it.
It's a gorgeous building,gorgeous river running by it.
It looks like it's an old property.
Steve (22:01):
Yeah, so it's Moulin...
Annie (22:03):
Moulin de Cambelong.
Steve (22:06):
So, it must have been a mill at some point.
Annie (22:08):
Yes, yes, yes, it was a mill.
Steve (22:11):
Mm hmm.
Annie (22:12):
Lovely place, lovely place.
Just really scenic andthe food looks good.
Was it a one star?
Steve (22:18):
I think so.
I think so.
I didn't, I'm sorry I'mnot that big a foodie.
Annie (22:23):
So one of the other things you did is that you also went to Conques.
You didn't just go tothe restaurant, did you?
You also went to the beautiful village.
Steve (22:31):
Yes.
And I know you've done an episode onConques, but it's just magical when
you go to this little village and itlooks like Walt Disney village, where
you would find Belle running around.
It's just so, so quaint, and becausewe were there in the fall, there
(22:52):
wasn't any crowds, there wasn't anytour buses, and we could just stroll
the streets, and not have to bumpinto people or anything like that.
I don't think it gets, youknow, extremely busy there.
Annie (23:06):
Some days, probably, but most days it's very pleasant.
You know, if it's a holiday weekend,if there's something special going
on, it's going to be very busy.
There are always some people inConques because you know, it's
gorgeous, it has a lot of stories.
It's a major pilgrimage site, sothere are always people, but yeah.
(23:26):
So the church is Romanesque andhas been there for a long time.
And there's a beautiful story abouthow one of their monks stole a
relic and brought it back to makeConques more popular and it worked.
Steve (23:41):
We have kind of a funny story in that we were standing in front of the
church and the priest had just finished,I think, given a little tour to some
people, and there's a little cafe rightout in front and we were sitting down.
And he just decided to sit down with usand we had a conversation and I asked,
(24:02):
you know, can we buy you something?
And he said, Oh, I'll take a whiskey.
Annie (24:06):
Wow.
Steve (24:11):
And so it turned out that he was kind of an Irish priest from England,
and he comes there and spends the summerin Conques as the local priest, and then
he returns home in the fall and winter.
Annie (24:26):
And charms the tourists in the summer and the fall.
That's cute.
Steve (24:32):
So he was quite the character.
Annie (24:34):
That's great.
We love a priest with a personality.
You know, we kind of like them betterthan the ones who are mumbly and sad.
Steve (24:43):
Right.
He definitely was not that.
Annie (24:47):
That's great.
Yeah.
I highly recommend Conques.
If you're in the area, that's a must see.
And it doesn't take very long, youknow, you can see it in two hours.
Steve (24:55):
Oh, it's a perfect day trip.
You know, Rodez is such a greatbase just to go out every day.
You can go each direction on thecompass and find something interesting.
Annie (25:07):
Yes, when I did this last year, actually, no, it was this year, it
was earlier this year, we decided tostay in Rodez and we rented a modern
apartment, and it was very handy.
But in any direction you go, it'sgoing to, you know, it's a big
area, you usually can't put threeor four things in the same day.
You usually, maybe one or two andthat's it, or the day is too long.
Steve (25:31):
Yeah.
And that's good because you're not packingthings in and rushing, you can just
experience it and enjoy the scenery too.
Annie (25:39):
Yes.
Your number eight is having lunchwith me and my husband, David.
And yes, that was lovely.
You invited us to lunch when you wereon this trip and we got to meet you
and have lunch with you and Diane.
It was lovely.
Thank you very much.
I really, you know, I often getasked, but I can rarely say yes,
but that time it worked out.
You know, we were available, both of us.
Steve (26:01):
Oh, and it was just a wonderful experience for the both of us.
And the brasserie that we hadlunch at was just wonderful.
The waiter was kind of a character and,it's so nice to be with a local too.
So I really appreciate you and Davidmaking the time to have lunch with us.
Annie (26:20):
Yeah, it was great.
So we went to Le Pyrénéen, in thecity center of Toulouse, a great
brasserie where they do fish.
And then we had a walk throughthe Jardin des Plantes and I
have a few photos of us that day.
I'm going to have to lookthrough my photos, but it was
a very enjoyable encounter.
I always enjoy spending a coupleof hours with listeners when I can.
Steve (26:42):
Yes, and the gardens were just lovely.
There was some fountains in the gardens,and we probably would have missed it
if we hadn't been walking with you.
Annie (26:53):
Well, yeah, because I mean, I don't guide in Toulouse like
Elyse does, but I do know the city.
I mean, I've been here my wholelife pretty much, except for the
16 years in the US, but the restof the time I was in Toulouse.
That's great.
Then you enjoyed theVoiceMap tour of the Marais.
That's one of my VoiceMap tours of Paris.
(27:14):
What did you think?
Was it your first timeusing the technology?
Steve (27:18):
It was.
And it was so interesting in that wehave been in Paris before, but a lot
of times you walk through and you'reon your way to go see something.
And this really helped us to just followalong your tour and get the history of
so many different places, and we wouldhave walked by so many different places
(27:42):
and not had an appreciation for them.
And then the history andthe background of it too.
We really enjoyed the VoiceMaps.
In fact, wherever we go traveling throughEurope now, we're trying to find, oh,
is there a VoiceMap for this city?
You know, we've been to Verona,Italy, and there was one for that.
But I would definitely recommend anybodygoing to Paris using your VoiceMaps
(28:06):
because it just brings the city alive.
And as I said, you would walkby something and not really
have an appreciation for it.
Annie (28:15):
Yeah, and it's different things, so I'm going to put in a little bit of
about the food culture, a little bitabout the religious heritage, you know,
about famous houses, famous museums.
There's some of everything.
And I really think that you get a lotout of them just because you don't have
to think about where am I going next?
Steve (28:35):
Exactly.
It's so easy to follow along.
Annie (28:38):
Yeah, you just follow along.
Just go this way now.
Steve (28:42):
And, I have to put a plug in for Elyse's tour in Toulouse,
we were using it and then abouthalfway through the rain came down.
And so we had to stop and pause itthere, and then we just came back
the next day and continued on.
You know, if we had done a, likea traditional tour, we might not
(29:04):
have been able to complete it.
Annie (29:06):
Yeah.
Yeah.
No, Elyse wrote a fabuloustour of Toulouse, it's called
the Glory of Occitania.
And you can find it on theVoiceMap app the same way.
I keep, because I wrote six tours,well, actually, I have seven tours
because one of them I translated intoFrench, the Eiffel Tower one you could
do either in French or in English, thisis full speed French, it's not like
(29:29):
French for visitors, so don't get thatone if you don't really speak French.
But Elyse, I've told Elyse,come on, make some more.
Because she knows, she could do so manythemes like Albi, she would be perfect,
Carcassonne, she would be perfect.
She just needs to do them.
Ha ha ha ha ha ha.
ha.
ha.
Yes.
Yes.
I really like, and like you, wheneverI go somewhere I look for the VoiceMap.
(29:53):
Because if there is one, sometimes Ifollow a voice map and I think, Oh,
come on, that was a bit like light.
But I tend to do mine a bit more indepth, you know, like I will talk
about a lot of things that otherpeople will just not even mention.
But if it interests me, I thinkit should interest you as well.
(30:15):
That's my problem in life, I thinkeverybody has the same interest I do.
Steve (30:19):
Right.
And you know, when your vacation'sover and few months down the line
you can just replay it and itbrings back all those memories, too.
And I've done that before with yourMarais tour where it's like deep
December and I'm wishing I was travelingagain, and I could put that on.
Yes.
Annie (30:39):
That's great, that's fantastic.
Another thing you list is enjoying Pariswithout having to see the famous sites,
because this was your third visit.
Steve (30:48):
Yes, yes.
I know when you're a tourist and youmaybe you only get one trip to Paris,
you want to see all the famous sites, andyou feel like you have to see something.
But on this trip we've already done,you know, the Louvre, we've already
seen the Eiffel Tower, we've alreadygone to, you know, this and that.
(31:10):
So we just walked and kind of followedwherever we thought was interesting.
So when we first landed, we walked downthe middle of Ile Saint Louis and just
strolled and not had a care in the world.
And so it's just nice to be able toexperience Paris that way because
(31:31):
that's the way everybody else does it.
You know, if they're living there,they're not running to go see the
Moulin Rouge or something like that.
Annie (31:40):
Yeah, you're right.
You're right.
And there are neighborhoods of Paristhat where you can definitely do this.
There are some neighborhoods wherethere is so much of interest that
you're bound to run into somethingthat's going to catch your interest.
There's some neighborhoods of Pariswhere I wouldn't do that, you know.
Steve (31:59):
I must say, we took your advice when we landed, we went ahead and
took a taxi to get into town becausewe're, you know, when you're jet
lagged you don't want to necessarilywant to do public transportation and
it's worth the extra euros to do that.
And also staying in the city center,particularly like in the Marais,
(32:23):
there's not, like big hotel chainsthere, and so your accommodations
are going to be simple, but it'sgreat to walk out the door and you're
right in the middle of everything.
Annie (32:35):
You are in the Marais, definitely.
Steve (32:37):
Yes.
Annie (32:38):
It's very lively.
It's a very lively neighborhoodand a very pleasant neighborhood.
Yeah.
Okay.
We already talked about theCathedral of Rodez and the
modern stained glass windows.
Yeah.
If you're in Rodez, if you're in theAveyron, stop, go in the Cathedral.
Spend, I don't know, an hour,just look around, it's beautiful.
(32:58):
You like Toulouse as well.
I was going to say it in French.
You'd like Toulouse aussi.
I'm just franglaying my waythrough this conversation.
So you also enjoyed Toulouse.
Steve (33:09):
We really did.
And, you know, Toulouse kind ofreminded me of my hometown, San Jose,
California, where, you know, everybodyin California or visitors want to
go to either LA or San Francisco andtotally miss anything in between.
And Toulouse is just, it's a city wherepeople live and go about their business.
(33:31):
And so you get a real sense of whatFrance and French culture and people
are like, it's very easy to navigate.
There's a great train station andyou can take the metro into town.
Lots of places to walkaround, eating there.
I don't know, maybe we got lucky,but every place we went to, the staff
(33:54):
was very friendly and accommodating.
We were not French speakers and peoplewere kind and gave us their best
interpretation of what, you know,we thought we would like to eat.
Annie (34:07):
Yeah, you're not picky eaters, are you?
Steve (34:09):
We're not, not at all.
Annie (34:11):
Yeah, the only time this might be a problem is if you know, you
absolutely do not want this, or youlike this on the side, or whatever,
then that's a bit more difficult.
But when you...
Steve (34:20):
Yeah, and we tended to go for whatever the meal of the day was.
And so I think you can't really go wrong.
And the other thing, too, is thattake advice from your hotel staff
there, because they'll know thearea and they won't steer you wrong.
So, it's always good to ask, youknow, what's good around here?
Annie (34:42):
So you stayed, so let's talk about the places where you stayed.
You stayed at two hotelsone chateau and one B&B.
Steve (34:49):
Right.
So the hotel in Toulouse, the Balcon.
Annie (34:55):
Yeah l'Hôtel des Grand Balcon.
Steve (34:58):
What a great find that was.
The rooms are nice and modern and you'relike steps away from the city center.
Nice, modern rooms, and the price was, Ithought, very reasonable, friendly staff.
Annie (35:14):
And the location is fabulous there.
Steve (35:17):
Yes, and you're steps away from like, the major
site in Toulouse, the capitol?
Annie (35:23):
Yeah, la Place du Capitole.
Yeah.
Steve (35:26):
You're right, we didn't eat dinner, but we sat there in the square
and had an Aperitivo in the square.
And it was just a beautiful evening.
And so, I would recommend doingthat while you are in Toulouse.
Annie (35:38):
Yeah, people like to chill.
People like to just hang out on thatplaza and have a drink or, you know,
a meal sometimes, but it's beautiful,yeah, it's a beautiful, pleasant place.
Steve (35:49):
Yeah.
And then in Paris, as I mentioned,we stayed in the Marais, at the...
Annie (35:54):
Le Compostelle is what I see.
Steve (35:57):
Yes.
yes.
Very small hotel.
There's somebody on staff there,they know the area, they were
super friendly, gave us some greatrecommendations for restaurants close by.
But it's not a fancy place, therooms aren't going to be big.
In fact, our room had two twinbeds, but the bathroom was totally
(36:21):
refurbished to modern standards.
And so, I would say, you know, if you'regoing to want to experience the Marais
or Paris, you know, you don't want tonecessarily stay at the chain hotels
outside on the periphery, you know, alittle boutique place was just perfect.
Annie (36:39):
Right, and sometimes some of these small hotels, sometimes they are very
fancy and very expensive, but you can findsome that are not as expensive, you know.
Steve (36:48):
And this was not.
We thought it was really reasonable.
So would definitely recommendit, but don't expect like, you
know, the top of the line linensor, you know, fancy things.
Annie (37:01):
Yeah.
You rarely get top of the linelinens in France, honestly,
unless you pay a premium.
How did you find driving, and also usingtrains in France since you did both?
Steve (37:11):
Yes.
So I love the trains in France.
Everywhere you can get on the trains.
And we've made multiple trips toFrance and gone in different directions
from Paris and so forth, and we'vealways found it very convenient.
For this trip, we wanted to getto Rodez as quickly as possible,
(37:32):
so we didn't take the train there.
But we did take the trainto Toulouse from Rodez.
Absolutely, no problems at all.
And it's great to be able to watchthe countryside as you're going along.
My wife loves to read and it's justso comfortable to be able to do that.
(37:53):
And then, as far as driving, we usedyour episode from driving and I think
David contributed to that episode.
Annie (38:02):
Yes, episode 16.
Steve (38:04):
And that's definitely a must.
It's different enough, you know,California, we're used to driving on
freeways and so forth, but it's a littlebit different driving in kind of rural
France, you do have some freeways.
But it was, I would say beyond the adviceyou gave, my piece of advice would be
to have a navigator, because my wifedid a great job of keeping track of the
(38:29):
different changes in the speed limits.
Because they do have the speed camerasthroughout France, and I think that
saved us from getting any ticketsor fines, because she was, you know,
letting me know, okay, the speed is nowgone down or it's back up and so forth.
And then getting used to roundabouts.
(38:51):
I think they're wonderful.
I wish we had more here in the States.
But just, you know, getting throughthe roundabouts and then the toll
roads, it's good to know if yourcredit card is going to be accepted
before you drive up to them.
So that was, I know the very first oneI went to my heart was racing just a
little bit because it isn't going to work?
(39:12):
But no problems at all.
Annie (39:14):
Yeah.
Yeah.
And if you can do contactless,it's more likely to work.
Sometimes for some reason...
I don't understand how credit cards getaway with this, but if you insert it,
it's one method, if you tap it, it'sanother method, if you use Apple Pay or
Google Pay, it's another method again.
So, I have found that tapping your creditcards, if you can do contactless...
(39:38):
since the pandemic, that'swhat everybody does.
Steve (39:41):
Yes.
Yes.
And that was helpful too,when we were going out, most
restaurants, no problem at all.
Annie (39:50):
Is there anything you did on this trip that you did not enjoy, that you
would recommend people stay away from?
Steve (39:55):
I think, probably, and this isn't a knock on the restaurants
along the capitol there in Toulouse.
We had breakfast there and thecroissants weren't very good, you know.
But it's, you know, it's kind ofone of those things where you're
in a tourist area and, you know,it's not going to be the freshest.
Annie (40:17):
It wasn't your favorite.
Steve (40:19):
Yeah, yeah.
So, yeah, don't eat in the touristzone, I guess would be the one
thing that I would not recommend.
And then I think one of the places thatwe had planned to go to was Albi, and
it was too bad, it was kind of a rainyday when we were transferring from Rodez
(40:41):
to Toulouse, and we didn't want to dragour luggage off the train into Albi
to go to the Toulouse Lautrec Museum,but that was our call to not do that.
You always have to leavesomething to go back to anyway.
Annie (40:55):
Yeah, it's difficult to stop somewhere when you
have your luggage with you.
Like, what are you goingto do with the luggage?
And especially if it's raining, I can, Iprobably would have made the same call.
Although the Albi Cathedral and ToulouseLautrec Museum are very well worth it.
So...
for another trip, I guess.
Steve (41:13):
That's it.
Yes.
Yes.
Annie (41:15):
So, do you recommend people go visit the Aveyron?
I would really like to go stay at thechateau where your friends are, and I
might try and have them on the podcast.
You had suggested it,but it never happened.
But I would like to go and try it andthen we can have them on the podcast.
Steve (41:32):
Yes.
Yes.
I absolutely recommend that.
And for all your listeners, youknow, please do go to Paris and
enjoy that, but go out into the...
to the rest of France.
The Aveyron, absolutely is gorgeous,there's lots of day trips you can
do, very family friendly place,and you're not going to run into,
(41:56):
to the huge crowds and you canactually relax on a vacation there.
Annie (42:01):
What a thought, actually relax on a vacation.
Steve (42:05):
Yes, yes.
Annie (42:07):
Thank you so much, Steve.
It's been a delight to talk to you andwell, my regards to Diane and I know
you guys have a anniversary comingup, so happy anniversary to you.
Steve (42:17):
Oh, thank you so much, Annie.
This has been such a pleasure.
I've listened to you and El yse for somany years now, and I'm always drawn to
France, and you make it so accommodating.
Annie (42:30):
Thank you.
Thank you.
Pretty soon, you'll get to hear you,yourself, on the podcast as well.
Steve (42:35):
Yes!
Yes!
Annie (42:37):
Thank you, Steve.
I hope to see you soon.
Steve (42:40):
Au revoir, Annie.
Thank you so much.
Annie (42:49):
The Join Us in France travel podcast is written, hosted, and
produced by Annie Sargent, andCopyright 2025 by AddictedToFrance.
It is released under a CreativeCommons attribution, non-commercial,
no derivatives license.
This is Join Us in France, episode 530, cinq cent trente.
Bonjour, I'm Annie Sargent, and Join Usin France is the podcast where we take
a conversational journey through thebeauty, culture, and flavors of France.
Today, I bring you a trip report withSteve Weaver, where we dive into the
untapped beauty of France beyond Paris.
(00:39):
Discover the rustic charm of the Aveyronarea, hear tales of a refurbished
chateau, and find out why exploringthe French countryside can offer a
more relaxing and authentic experience.
This episode is a treasure trove of travelinspiration, especially if you're looking
to venture off the beaten track in France.
(01:01):
Tune in for insightful stories andtips on experiencing the serene
landscapes, historical sites, andlocal flavors that you will not
find in the typical tourist areas.
This podcast is supported by donorsand listeners who buy my tours and
services, including my ItineraryConsult Service, my GPS self-guided
(01:22):
tours of Paris on the VoiceMap app,or take a day trip with me around the
Southwest of France in my electric car.
You can browse all of that at myboutique: joinusinfrance.com/boutique.
Patreon supporters get new episodesas soon as they are ready and ad-free.
If that sounds good to you, be likethem, follow the link in the show
(01:44):
notes or browse to patreon.com/joinus.
There won't be a magazine part of thepodcast today because I was away in Paris
all week and I'm on the TGV heading backright now, and I do not recommend trying
(02:04):
to do anything important on the TGV Wi Fi.
But I do want to send my thanks to AlecKoo for his one time donation using
any green button on joinusinfrance.comthat says 'Tip Your Guide'.
Enjoy my conversation with Steve and I'llbe back with more updates next Sunday.
(02:35):
Bonjour, Steve Weaver, andwelcome to Join Us in France.
Steve (02:38):
Bonjour, Annie.
This is great to be with you.
I'm looking forward totalking with you today.
Annie (02:44):
Yes, we have a great conversation planned about, well, the topic you sent
me, I liked it because it said (02:48):
Enjoying the Fall in France, beyond Paris.
Why did you pick that title?
Steve (02:56):
Well, we've been fortunate enough to travel to France three previous
times and have stayed in Paris, and sowe've seen all the famous sites, we've
strolled the streets, we've done yourVoicemaps of the Marais and so forth.
And we really wanted toexperience France itself.
(03:17):
So we wanted to have anexperience rather than seeing
and visiting sites, so to speak.
And we were fortunate enough thatwe have friends that live out in the
countryside, near the city of Rodez.
And they've refurbished a chateau thereand we really wanted to go out and
(03:38):
see what they have accomplished andenjoy just the scenery, and the people,
and the culture outside of Paris.
Annie (03:46):
Yeah.
Refurbishing a château.
Now that's a task, that's a job!
Did they survive the ordeal?
Steve (03:55):
Yeah, they, it's funny because they had the impression that, Oh,
we'll get there, and they've done homeremodeling in the Bay Area, we're from
California here in the Bay Area, andthey thought, Oh, it'll take six months.
Well, two years into it...
Annie (04:14):
Yeah.
Steve (04:15):
Maybe their estimate was a little off, but they're fine and up and running
now and they've been up and runningfor a few years, several years now.
So, but it was definitely alonger task than they thought.
Annie (04:27):
A challenge.
Now, Rodez area, the Aveyron,is absolutely gorgeous.
And we have talked about it some on thepodcast, but not quite enough, I think.
We need to bring more people to theAveyron because if you want something
bucolic, and gorgeous, and peaceful, Iguess, it's a peaceful vacation, isn't it?
Steve (04:47):
Oh, it is.
And it's such a fun opportunityfor people because they can go into
Paris and kind of experience that.
But it's only an hour and 20 minuteplane flight from Paris, from Orly.
So you don't even have to go throughCharles de Gaulle to get to Rodez.
(05:07):
And the airport there is so smallthat when you land the plane
makes a u turn on the tarmac thereit comes back to the terminal.
But it has everything you'll need there.
Every rental car agency you'reused to in the States is there,
Avis, Hertz, and so forth.
And so they have all the facilitiesthere, and it really is just a
(05:29):
short trip from Paris to get there.
Annie (05:32):
I didn't realize you could fly into Rodez.
What company was this that was doing this?
You remember?
Steve (05:39):
Yes, it was Amelia International.
So not an airline I've ever heard of.
But I believe that the governmentmust subsidize them so that they're,
they ensure that there's someflights coming in and out of Rodez.
So it makes two flights a day, I think itstarts in the morning in Rodez, flies to
(06:01):
Paris, picks up passengers, flies back,and it might do an afternoon flight too.
Annie (06:05):
Wow, that's surprising.
I've never heard of them either.
Was it a teeny plane?
Steve (06:12):
It was a smaller Embraer jet.
Annie (06:16):
Birdjet, okay.
Steve (06:17):
Yeah.
So not a prop plane.
And full service.
It was just fine.
Much better than a Ryanairflight, that's for sure.
Annie (06:26):
Anything is better than a Ryanair flight.
That's great.
All right.
Tell me about some of the things thatyou enjoyed the most on this vacation.
I'm sure there are many, but onceyou got there, you mentioned the
car rental, you rented a car, right?
Because you can't do much inthe Aveyron without a car.
Steve (06:42):
That's, that's right.
Yes.
In fact, we picked up ourrental car and then drove off
to our friend's chateau Balzac.
We really enjoyed staying with them,they did a fantastic job remodeling,
and they are out into the countryside.
The first thing that I enjoyed somuch was just walking through the
(07:02):
countryside there because it's sopeaceful and bucolic and you'll see
cows, and goats, and vineyards, andbuildings made out of stone, and we just
don't have that in California, really.
Annie (07:17):
It's very different from California.
Yeah.
Not the Bay Area anymore.
Steve (07:21):
Definitely, definitely not.
You're not going to see famousmuseums, although Rodez has
a nice museum, but anyway.
Annie (07:29):
The Soulages Museum in Rodez.
Steve (07:32):
Thank you.
They have a wonderful cathedral therewith just beautiful stained glass.
And you've talked about that before.
Annie (07:39):
Those stained glass in Rodez Cathedral, especially the modern one.
What am I saying?
I prefer the modern stainedglass to the old one.
What's wrong with me?
Steve (07:49):
We were just so surprised with that when we walked in there.
So it's not like any othercathedral you'll see in France.
But just that the beautiful scenery,and it's so easy just to find an area
to go and walk out into the countryside.
So a much different walkingexperience than if you're in
(08:10):
Paris or any other major city.
And it's very easy to navigate, youknow, they're smaller roads, you're
not going to encounter any freeways,but we didn't have any trouble.
Annie (08:21):
There is one, the one that takes you to the Millau.
Steve (08:24):
Yes, yes, yes, exactly.
Annie (08:27):
Not many, there's one, just that's it.
Steve (08:29):
No.
And I'm glad you brought up the Millau,because I'm kind of a architectural
engineering nerd and I've seen picturesof the Millau, the Viaduct Millau and
that was one of the bucket list thingsI wanted to see while we were there.
And we were able to gothere and drive across that.
Annie (08:50):
Yeah.
But before you get to Millau,you'll tell me about this restored
chateau, the 16th century chateau.
What sort of a chateau is it?
Steve (08:57):
So, this chateau has actually, there's actually been a form of a
chateau since like the 11th century.
And the main chateau that they livein and that they've refurbished
it dates back to the 16th century.
And so, you can imagine, kind of a castlesetting where you walk up kind of a
(09:22):
winding staircase up to your rooms, andthey've fully furnished the rooms in
modern style, I mean, modern accoutrementsand decorations, and it's just gorgeous.
But they've also left the natural woodbeams and you'll feel like you're in a
(09:43):
kind of a little, all in enchanted place.
Annie (09:45):
Yeah, I could, because you sent me some photos, it looks they
also left the inside shutters.
Which, is something they did alot in chateaus because, well,
you know, if you're too high, it'sreally hard to close the shutters.
And this also, this particularchateau also had like, defensive
(10:06):
grills in front of the windows,so the shutters are inside.
It's lovely.
It's a beautiful place.
Steve (10:12):
Oh, it is.
And for us, it was just so much funbecause you could step out and be
greeted by their goats that they haveroaming around the property, and my
wife was out there with her staff,kind of herding the goats around.
They have a little sheep dog thathelps herd the goats around and so
that was definitely an experience youwon't have in Paris, that's for sure.
Annie (10:36):
Yeah, so because they are friends, you were eating with them, but does
the chateau have a restaurant as well?
Steve (10:42):
They will set up breakfast for travelers, and then they
can also cook meals there.
They set up their kitchen soit's more like a restaurant-style
kitchen than just a regular home.
And in fact, throughout the yearthey'll have like culinary events
where they'll have local chefs come in.
(11:05):
And they'll have people come stayfor a week where they can learn
how to cook in the French style.
If you go to their website, you canfind out information about that.
And they also do, in the past they'vealso had photographers come in, and so
you have like a week long photo sessionswith professional photographers to...
Annie (11:26):
To work on your photography skills.
Oh, I should talk tothem about the bootcamp.
We could do an outing on thebootcamp, for the bootcamp there.
Steve (11:34):
Oh, yeah, that would be perfect.
Annie (11:35):
But do they, how many rooms do they have?
Steve (11:38):
They also have a gîte, too.
Annie (11:40):
Okay.
Steve (11:41):
So that they can accommodate large families.
And it's not as, you know, modern,but it's definitely functional.
Annie (11:49):
Very nice.
Very nice.
Okay, let's move on to the next thingyou listed, which is wine tasting.
You went
to Clairvaux d'Aveyron.
I am not familiar with thiswine, tell me more about that.
Steve (12:04):
Yes, and, you know, we're Californians, so we look for a wine
experience, and what was really niceis that we were able to walk from
the chateau and take a hike, and cameinto town to the little village there.
Wine Taste in California, they'llhave people there to kind of help you
through the tasting, but when we wentthere, we were with the winemaker.
(12:28):
And Jean-Luc Matha, he's the winemakerat one of the wineries that we went to,
and he was just so accommodating for us.
Because we didn't plan ahead andcall, we just kind of at the spur
of the moment decided let's walkin and see what they have to offer.
And it was like we were instant friends.
(12:50):
And he brought us in, and it's areally interesting winery in that,
it's kind of like a cave when youwalk into their tasting room, but
decorated modern, so you're not goingto find bats or anything like that.
But, it's just...
ok, sans bats.
Yes.
(13:10):
So, you'll walk in and do a tasting there.
And they have interesting wines thatwe've never experienced in California.
They're all local and kind of biodynamic.
They try to grow and treat theirvineyard with kind of biodynamic process.
Yes, processes and so forth.
Annie (13:31):
Right.
Steve (13:32):
And then we walked from there into town and went to another winery and
it was the same thing where it was thelocal winemaker giving you the tasting
experience and not just some, one ofthe workers or something like that.
So, that was truly amemorable experience for us.
Annie (13:52):
Yeah, so this is one of the things that's wonderful about doing
wine touring in the Southwest.
It's, whether it's this winery or manyothers, this is not a super famous wine.
I mean, Aveyron has an AOC,but it's not the sort of wine
that you will find in the US.
It doesn't export, it'snot big productions.
(14:14):
And so when you go, I mean, obviously it'sbetter to call and make an appointment,
you know, but they are very availableand very open to discussing their work
and what they do and, you know, do atasting with you, and most of them,
they just, they hope to sell a fewbottles and get a little notoriety.
(14:35):
You know, that's what'sin it for them, I guess.
Steve (14:37):
And it worked because we did come home with some bottles, and unfortunately
we left them at the chateau, but that'sokay, our friends were able to enjoy them.
Annie (14:47):
Right.
right.
I do day trips now with some customers,and I did one to Gaillac and we did find
one chateau where they were willing toship some wine, six bottles to, but the
guy said, okay, I'm going to get a bid,I won't sell you the bottles right now.
He took his email address.
(15:07):
He's going to bid it with UPSand then send him a proposal.
And if he's okay with that,he'll pay and off they go.
So it's not a fast process,but you can get some shipped.
And also most people will, areable to take a couple of bottles
in their suitcase, I guess.
And there are suitcasesmade just for wine.
(15:30):
They are very, very heavy.
Steve (15:33):
It's definitely a great experience.
So I would recommend that toanyone traveling in this area to
find a little winery to visit.
Annie (15:42):
Yeah.
With a couple of phone calls, you canfind some really interesting people,
you know, the locals know them,I'm sure your friends, is it your
friends that recommended this one?
Yeah.
Steve (15:53):
They did.
Annie (15:53):
The fourth thing that you list is sitting under the
stars in the chateau's hot tub.
Ha Ha!
Steve (15:59):
That was amazing.
And it's definitely an experience thatyou won't have in Paris, that's for sure.
And sitting in the hot tub outin the rural France was just
such a wonderful experience.
You know, they provided the bathrobes,and the slippers, and we were able
to just sit under the stars there.
(16:19):
And luckily, we were traveling in October,it was warm enough to go out there and the
scenery with the trees, and the moonlight,and the stars was just exceptional.
Annie (16:32):
Yeah.
Steve (16:33):
I will definitely remember that for sure.
Annie (16:36):
One of the nice things about being in rural areas is that, you
know, you have experiences like that.
That's fantastic.
Driving over the Millau viaduct bridge.
Okay, we got to talk about the bridge.
We both love it.
Steve (16:49):
Yes, yes.
yes.
And I would say, if you're travelingwith a family, I think going to the
little visitor center with the models,and they have some interactive displays,
it would be a fun little outing.
And then just, you know, to the go intothe observation area where you can get
(17:11):
some beautiful pictures of the span.
It's definitely worthwhile.
And you know, the Eiffel Tower isa masterpiece of engineering, but
this is a masterpiece of the, youknow, the 21st century engineering.
And I was just thrilled driving across it.
Annie (17:29):
So did you drive it going south or going north?
Steve (17:32):
From the visitor center going south, I believe.
Annie (17:35):
Yeah, the visitor center is on the North end.
Steve (17:38):
Yes, yes.
And from there, we went to kind of likea templar village out in the countryside.
Annie (17:47):
La Couvertoirade.
Steve (17:49):
Thank you for saying that.
Annie (17:52):
I think that's what it is.
I think that's what it is.
Let me look again.
La Couvertoirade, I think.
Steve (17:57):
Yes, exactly.
I know you've done episodes onthe Templars and to see this in
person, and see how they built thesedefensible castles was just amazing.
And again, I think, if you were makingthis a family trip, the kids would just
(18:17):
love climbing around an ancient castle.
We were traveling in the fall,so there was hardly anyone there,
but they did have a little cafethere, so you could have lunch.
And it's not a very big location,and so it's something that you can
do, you know, in an hour or two.
Annie (18:40):
I intend to do an episode about this because it's very different.
It's out of the way, you know,it's not something that you can
easily go to unless you plan to.
But they do have eventsevery now and then.
I need to keep an eye on the events, seeif they have any events going on soon
and go when there's an event going on.
Because I've, I was there kindof late afternoon, it was getting
(19:01):
windy and chilly and it was dead.
I mean, it was, there was nobody there.
But it was still beautiful.
Like even empty, it's interesting.
Steve (19:10):
It is.
And we were fortunate in that they hada local craftsman still had a shop open
and he was kind of a person that dealtwith metal and making things out of
metal and we ended up coming home witha couple little sheep that he made, just
to have a memory of, of going there.
Yeah.
Yes.
And it fit in our luggage too.
(19:31):
So.
Annie (19:32):
That's good.
Yeah, La Couvertoirade, it's asmall town that the Templars used
a lot, it's a medieval place andit's still walled in, you know.
Steve (19:44):
Yes.
Annie (19:45):
It's a Plus Beau Village de France, but it's walled in.
And outside of it, there's notmuch, there's nothing much.
So sometimes these walledcities have outgrown themselves,
but this one really hasn't.
It's just sitting there in themiddle of the landscape by itself,
much like it would have, you know,it has for centuries, for you
(20:07):
know, since the, they probablybuilt it in the 1300s or the 1400s.
Steve (20:12):
Right.
Yeah, it just transport you back intime when you're walking through there
so you can really visualize history.
And again, if you havekids, they can run around.
There's, there's not going to bepeople telling you don't touch this
or don't touch that type of thing.
Annie (20:27):
No, it's great.
Beautiful place.
La Couvertoirade.
If you can say it, you get extra points.
You had dinner at Émilie et Thomas, oh,Michelin star, just outside of Conques.
Oh, do tell!
(20:47):
I haven't tried that one.
Steve (20:49):
Yes.
And so, what's really unique,it's right along the river.
And I think they also have a little smallplace that you can stay overnight too.
And so, as you leave Conques and headtowards Rodez, you can stop there.
They have sittings where youhave multiple courses, they can
(21:10):
also pair wines with that too,depending on what you choose to do.
The food was all local,whatever's in season, food.
So, it's not going to be thesame, I think, depending on
the time of year you go there.
And they're just very friendly, weended up going back into the kitchen.
(21:32):
And we were late at night, or we hadthe later seating and it was also
the fall, so it wasn't very busy.
So, they brought us back intothe kitchen to see the kitchen.
But I would imagine it would be beautifulif you were there during the daytime, so,
I just thought it was a great experience.
Annie (21:50):
Beautiful.
I'm looking at the photoswhile you're talking about it.
It's a gorgeous building,gorgeous river running by it.
It looks like it's an old property.
Steve (22:01):
Yeah, so it's Moulin...
Annie (22:03):
Moulin de Cambelong.
Steve (22:06):
So, it must have been a mill at some point.
Annie (22:08):
Yes, yes, yes, it was a mill.
Steve (22:11):
Mm hmm.
Annie (22:12):
Lovely place, lovely place.
Just really scenic andthe food looks good.
Was it a one star?
Steve (22:18):
I think so.
I think so.
I didn't, I'm sorry I'mnot that big a foodie.
Annie (22:23):
So one of the other things you did is that you also went to Conques.
You didn't just go tothe restaurant, did you?
You also went to the beautiful village.
Steve (22:31):
Yes.
And I know you've done an episode onConques, but it's just magical when
you go to this little village and itlooks like Walt Disney village, where
you would find Belle running around.
It's just so, so quaint, and becausewe were there in the fall, there
(22:52):
wasn't any crowds, there wasn't anytour buses, and we could just stroll
the streets, and not have to bumpinto people or anything like that.
I don't think it gets, youknow, extremely busy there.
Annie (23:06):
Some days, probably, but most days it's very pleasant.
You know, if it's a holiday weekend,if there's something special going
on, it's going to be very busy.
There are always some people inConques because you know, it's
gorgeous, it has a lot of stories.
It's a major pilgrimage site, sothere are always people, but yeah.
(23:26):
So the church is Romanesque andhas been there for a long time.
And there's a beautiful story abouthow one of their monks stole a
relic and brought it back to makeConques more popular and it worked.
Steve (23:41):
We have kind of a funny story in that we were standing in front of the
church and the priest had just finished,I think, given a little tour to some
people, and there's a little cafe rightout in front and we were sitting down.
And he just decided to sit down with usand we had a conversation and I asked,
(24:02):
you know, can we buy you something?
And he said, Oh, I'll take a whiskey.
Annie (24:06):
Wow.
Steve (24:11):
And so it turned out that he was kind of an Irish priest from England,
and he comes there and spends the summerin Conques as the local priest, and then
he returns home in the fall and winter.
Annie (24:26):
And charms the tourists in the summer and the fall.
That's cute.
Steve (24:32):
So he was quite the character.
Annie (24:34):
That's great.
We love a priest with a personality.
You know, we kind of like them betterthan the ones who are mumbly and sad.
Steve (24:43):
Right.
He definitely was not that.
Annie (24:47):
That's great.
Yeah.
I highly recommend Conques.
If you're in the area, that's a must see.
And it doesn't take very long, youknow, you can see it in two hours.
Steve (24:55):
Oh, it's a perfect day trip.
You know, Rodez is such a greatbase just to go out every day.
You can go each direction on thecompass and find something interesting.
Annie (25:07):
Yes, when I did this last year, actually, no, it was this year, it
was earlier this year, we decided tostay in Rodez and we rented a modern
apartment, and it was very handy.
But in any direction you go, it'sgoing to, you know, it's a big
area, you usually can't put threeor four things in the same day.
You usually, maybe one or two andthat's it, or the day is too long.
Steve (25:31):
Yeah.
And that's good because you're not packingthings in and rushing, you can just
experience it and enjoy the scenery too.
Annie (25:39):
Yes.
Your number eight is having lunchwith me and my husband, David.
And yes, that was lovely.
You invited us to lunch when you wereon this trip and we got to meet you
and have lunch with you and Diane.
It was lovely.
Thank you very much.
I really, you know, I often getasked, but I can rarely say yes,
but that time it worked out.
You know, we were available, both of us.
Steve (26:01):
Oh, and it was just a wonderful experience for the both of us.
And the brasserie that we hadlunch at was just wonderful.
The waiter was kind of a character and,it's so nice to be with a local too.
So I really appreciate you and Davidmaking the time to have lunch with us.
Annie (26:20):
Yeah, it was great.
So we went to Le Pyrénéen, in thecity center of Toulouse, a great
brasserie where they do fish.
And then we had a walk throughthe Jardin des Plantes and I
have a few photos of us that day.
I'm going to have to lookthrough my photos, but it was
a very enjoyable encounter.
I always enjoy spending a coupleof hours with listeners when I can.
Steve (26:42):
Yes, and the gardens were just lovely.
There was some fountains in the gardens,and we probably would have missed it
if we hadn't been walking with you.
Annie (26:53):
Well, yeah, because I mean, I don't guide in Toulouse like
Elyse does, but I do know the city.
I mean, I've been here my wholelife pretty much, except for the
16 years in the US, but the restof the time I was in Toulouse.
That's great.
Then you enjoyed theVoiceMap tour of the Marais.
That's one of my VoiceMap tours of Paris.
(27:14):
What did you think?
Was it your first timeusing the technology?
Steve (27:18):
It was.
And it was so interesting in that wehave been in Paris before, but a lot
of times you walk through and you'reon your way to go see something.
And this really helped us to just followalong your tour and get the history of
so many different places, and we wouldhave walked by so many different places
(27:42):
and not had an appreciation for them.
And then the history andthe background of it too.
We really enjoyed the VoiceMaps.
In fact, wherever we go traveling throughEurope now, we're trying to find, oh,
is there a VoiceMap for this city?
You know, we've been to Verona,Italy, and there was one for that.
But I would definitely recommend anybodygoing to Paris using your VoiceMaps
(28:06):
because it just brings the city alive.
And as I said, you would walkby something and not really
have an appreciation for it.
Annie (28:15):
Yeah, and it's different things, so I'm going to put in a little bit of
about the food culture, a little bitabout the religious heritage, you know,
about famous houses, famous museums.
There's some of everything.
And I really think that you get a lotout of them just because you don't have
to think about where am I going next?
Steve (28:35):
Exactly.
It's so easy to follow along.
Annie (28:38):
Yeah, you just follow along.
Just go this way now.
Steve (28:42):
And, I have to put a plug in for Elyse's tour in Toulouse,
we were using it and then abouthalfway through the rain came down.
And so we had to stop and pause itthere, and then we just came back
the next day and continued on.
You know, if we had done a, likea traditional tour, we might not
(29:04):
have been able to complete it.
Annie (29:06):
Yeah.
Yeah.
No, Elyse wrote a fabuloustour of Toulouse, it's called
the Glory of Occitania.
And you can find it on theVoiceMap app the same way.
I keep, because I wrote six tours,well, actually, I have seven tours
because one of them I translated intoFrench, the Eiffel Tower one you could
do either in French or in English, thisis full speed French, it's not like
(29:29):
French for visitors, so don't get thatone if you don't really speak French.
But Elyse, I've told Elyse,come on, make some more.
Because she knows, she could do so manythemes like Albi, she would be perfect,
Carcassonne, she would be perfect.
She just needs to do them.
Ha ha ha ha ha ha.
ha.
ha.
Yes.
Yes.
I really like, and like you, wheneverI go somewhere I look for the VoiceMap.
(29:53):
Because if there is one, sometimes Ifollow a voice map and I think, Oh,
come on, that was a bit like light.
But I tend to do mine a bit more indepth, you know, like I will talk
about a lot of things that otherpeople will just not even mention.
But if it interests me, I thinkit should interest you as well.
(30:15):
That's my problem in life, I thinkeverybody has the same interest I do.
Steve (30:19):
Right.
And you know, when your vacation'sover and few months down the line
you can just replay it and itbrings back all those memories, too.
And I've done that before with yourMarais tour where it's like deep
December and I'm wishing I was travelingagain, and I could put that on.
Yes.
Annie (30:39):
That's great, that's fantastic.
Another thing you list is enjoying Pariswithout having to see the famous sites,
because this was your third visit.
Steve (30:48):
Yes, yes.
I know when you're a tourist and youmaybe you only get one trip to Paris,
you want to see all the famous sites, andyou feel like you have to see something.
But on this trip we've already done,you know, the Louvre, we've already
seen the Eiffel Tower, we've alreadygone to, you know, this and that.
(31:10):
So we just walked and kind of followedwherever we thought was interesting.
So when we first landed, we walked downthe middle of Ile Saint Louis and just
strolled and not had a care in the world.
And so it's just nice to be able toexperience Paris that way because
(31:31):
that's the way everybody else does it.
You know, if they're living there,they're not running to go see the
Moulin Rouge or something like that.
Annie (31:40):
Yeah, you're right.
You're right.
And there are neighborhoods of Paristhat where you can definitely do this.
There are some neighborhoods wherethere is so much of interest that
you're bound to run into somethingthat's going to catch your interest.
There's some neighborhoods of Pariswhere I wouldn't do that, you know.
Steve (31:59):
I must say, we took your advice when we landed, we went ahead and
took a taxi to get into town becausewe're, you know, when you're jet
lagged you don't want to necessarilywant to do public transportation and
it's worth the extra euros to do that.
And also staying in the city center,particularly like in the Marais,
(32:23):
there's not, like big hotel chainsthere, and so your accommodations
are going to be simple, but it'sgreat to walk out the door and you're
right in the middle of everything.
Annie (32:35):
You are in the Marais, definitely.
Steve (32:37):
Yes.
Annie (32:38):
It's very lively.
It's a very lively neighborhoodand a very pleasant neighborhood.
Yeah.
Okay.
We already talked about theCathedral of Rodez and the
modern stained glass windows.
Yeah.
If you're in Rodez, if you're in theAveyron, stop, go in the Cathedral.
Spend, I don't know, an hour,just look around, it's beautiful.
(32:58):
You like Toulouse as well.
I was going to say it in French.
You'd like Toulouse aussi.
I'm just franglaying my waythrough this conversation.
So you also enjoyed Toulouse.
Steve (33:09):
We really did.
And, you know, Toulouse kind ofreminded me of my hometown, San Jose,
California, where, you know, everybodyin California or visitors want to
go to either LA or San Francisco andtotally miss anything in between.
And Toulouse is just, it's a city wherepeople live and go about their business.
(33:31):
And so you get a real sense of whatFrance and French culture and people
are like, it's very easy to navigate.
There's a great train station andyou can take the metro into town.
Lots of places to walkaround, eating there.
I don't know, maybe we got lucky,but every place we went to, the staff
(33:54):
was very friendly and accommodating.
We were not French speakers and peoplewere kind and gave us their best
interpretation of what, you know,we thought we would like to eat.
Annie (34:07):
Yeah, you're not picky eaters, are you?
Steve (34:09):
We're not, not at all.
Annie (34:11):
Yeah, the only time this might be a problem is if you know, you
absolutely do not want this, or youlike this on the side, or whatever,
then that's a bit more difficult.
But when you...
Steve (34:20):
Yeah, and we tended to go for whatever the meal of the day was.
And so I think you can't really go wrong.
And the other thing, too, is thattake advice from your hotel staff
there, because they'll know thearea and they won't steer you wrong.
So, it's always good to ask, youknow, what's good around here?
Annie (34:42):
So you stayed, so let's talk about the places where you stayed.
You stayed at two hotelsone chateau and one B&B.
Steve (34:49):
Right.
So the hotel in Toulouse, the Balcon.
Annie (34:55):
Yeah l'Hôtel des Grand Balcon.
Steve (34:58):
What a great find that was.
The rooms are nice and modern and you'relike steps away from the city center.
Nice, modern rooms, and the price was, Ithought, very reasonable, friendly staff.
Annie (35:14):
And the location is fabulous there.
Steve (35:17):
Yes, and you're steps away from like, the major
site in Toulouse, the capitol?
Annie (35:23):
Yeah, la Place du Capitole.
Yeah.
Steve (35:26):
You're right, we didn't eat dinner, but we sat there in the square
and had an Aperitivo in the square.
And it was just a beautiful evening.
And so, I would recommend doingthat while you are in Toulouse.
Annie (35:38):
Yeah, people like to chill.
People like to just hang out on thatplaza and have a drink or, you know,
a meal sometimes, but it's beautiful,yeah, it's a beautiful, pleasant place.
Steve (35:49):
Yeah.
And then in Paris, as I mentioned,we stayed in the Marais, at the...
Annie (35:54):
Le Compostelle is what I see.
Steve (35:57):
Yes.
yes.
Very small hotel.
There's somebody on staff there,they know the area, they were
super friendly, gave us some greatrecommendations for restaurants close by.
But it's not a fancy place, therooms aren't going to be big.
In fact, our room had two twinbeds, but the bathroom was totally
(36:21):
refurbished to modern standards.
And so, I would say, you know, if you'regoing to want to experience the Marais
or Paris, you know, you don't want tonecessarily stay at the chain hotels
outside on the periphery, you know, alittle boutique place was just perfect.
Annie (36:39):
Right, and sometimes some of these small hotels, sometimes they are very
fancy and very expensive, but you can findsome that are not as expensive, you know.
Steve (36:48):
And this was not.
We thought it was really reasonable.
So would definitely recommendit, but don't expect like, you
know, the top of the line linensor, you know, fancy things.
Annie (37:01):
Yeah.
You rarely get top of the linelinens in France, honestly,
unless you pay a premium.
How did you find driving, and also usingtrains in France since you did both?
Steve (37:11):
Yes.
So I love the trains in France.
Everywhere you can get on the trains.
And we've made multiple trips toFrance and gone in different directions
from Paris and so forth, and we'vealways found it very convenient.
For this trip, we wanted to getto Rodez as quickly as possible,
(37:32):
so we didn't take the train there.
But we did take the trainto Toulouse from Rodez.
Absolutely, no problems at all.
And it's great to be able to watchthe countryside as you're going along.
My wife loves to read and it's justso comfortable to be able to do that.
(37:53):
And then, as far as driving, we usedyour episode from driving and I think
David contributed to that episode.
Annie (38:02):
Yes, episode 16.
Steve (38:04):
And that's definitely a must.
It's different enough, you know,California, we're used to driving on
freeways and so forth, but it's a littlebit different driving in kind of rural
France, you do have some freeways.
But it was, I would say beyond the adviceyou gave, my piece of advice would be
to have a navigator, because my wifedid a great job of keeping track of the
(38:29):
different changes in the speed limits.
Because they do have the speed camerasthroughout France, and I think that
saved us from getting any ticketsor fines, because she was, you know,
letting me know, okay, the speed is nowgone down or it's back up and so forth.
And then getting used to roundabouts.
(38:51):
I think they're wonderful.
I wish we had more here in the States.
But just, you know, getting throughthe roundabouts and then the toll
roads, it's good to know if yourcredit card is going to be accepted
before you drive up to them.
So that was, I know the very first oneI went to my heart was racing just a
little bit because it isn't going to work?
(39:12):
But no problems at all.
Annie (39:14):
Yeah.
Yeah.
And if you can do contactless,it's more likely to work.
Sometimes for some reason...
I don't understand how credit cards getaway with this, but if you insert it,
it's one method, if you tap it, it'sanother method, if you use Apple Pay or
Google Pay, it's another method again.
So, I have found that tapping your creditcards, if you can do contactless...
(39:38):
since the pandemic, that'swhat everybody does.
Steve (39:41):
Yes.
Yes.
And that was helpful too,when we were going out, most
restaurants, no problem at all.
Annie (39:50):
Is there anything you did on this trip that you did not enjoy, that you
would recommend people stay away from?
Steve (39:55):
I think, probably, and this isn't a knock on the restaurants
along the capitol there in Toulouse.
We had breakfast there and thecroissants weren't very good, you know.
But it's, you know, it's kind ofone of those things where you're
in a tourist area and, you know,it's not going to be the freshest.
Annie (40:17):
It wasn't your favorite.
Steve (40:19):
Yeah, yeah.
So, yeah, don't eat in the touristzone, I guess would be the one
thing that I would not recommend.
And then I think one of the places thatwe had planned to go to was Albi, and
it was too bad, it was kind of a rainyday when we were transferring from Rodez
(40:41):
to Toulouse, and we didn't want to dragour luggage off the train into Albi
to go to the Toulouse Lautrec Museum,but that was our call to not do that.
You always have to leavesomething to go back to anyway.
Annie (40:55):
Yeah, it's difficult to stop somewhere when you
have your luggage with you.
Like, what are you goingto do with the luggage?
And especially if it's raining, I can, Iprobably would have made the same call.
Although the Albi Cathedral and ToulouseLautrec Museum are very well worth it.
So...
for another trip, I guess.
Steve (41:13):
That's it.
Yes.
Yes.
Annie (41:15):
So, do you recommend people go visit the Aveyron?
I would really like to go stay at thechateau where your friends are, and I
might try and have them on the podcast.
You had suggested it,but it never happened.
But I would like to go and try it andthen we can have them on the podcast.
Steve (41:32):
Yes.
Yes.
I absolutely recommend that.
And for all your listeners, youknow, please do go to Paris and
enjoy that, but go out into the...
to the rest of France.
The Aveyron, absolutely is gorgeous,there's lots of day trips you can
do, very family friendly place,and you're not going to run into,
(41:56):
to the huge crowds and you canactually relax on a vacation there.
Annie (42:01):
What a thought, actually relax on a vacation.
Steve (42:05):
Yes, yes.
Annie (42:07):
Thank you so much, Steve.
It's been a delight to talk to you andwell, my regards to Diane and I know
you guys have a anniversary comingup, so happy anniversary to you.
Steve (42:17):
Oh, thank you so much, Annie.
This has been such a pleasure.
I've listened to you and El yse for somany years now, and I'm always drawn to
France, and you make it so accommodating.
Annie (42:30):
Thank you.
Thank you.
Pretty soon, you'll get to hear you,yourself, on the podcast as well.
Steve (42:35):
Yes!
Yes!
Annie (42:37):
Thank you, Steve.
I hope to see you soon.
Steve (42:40):
Au revoir, Annie.
Thank you so much.
Annie (42:49):
The Join Us in France travel podcast is written, hosted, and
produced by Annie Sargent, andCopyright 2025 by AddictedToFrance.
It is released under a CreativeCommons attribution, non-commercial,
no derivatives license.
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