September 14, 2025 • 57 mins
In this episode of the Join Us in France Travel Podcast, Annie Sargent shares the Bootcamp 2025 Report with guests Janet Boyd, Beth Hall, Mary Piltch, and Jeanne Powanda. Together, they look back on a week in Toulouse and the southwest of France filled with language, history, food, and friendship.
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Bootcamp isn’t a packaged tour. It’s a flexible way to explore France in the company of fellow Francophiles. Each person chooses what to do each day, but the group also gathers for shared adventures. That balance of independence and connection makes Bootcamp special.
Janet, Beth, Mary, and Jeanne describe language classes at LangueOnze in Toulouse and share stories of excursions with Elyse Rivin. They talk about unforgettable visits to Albi, Carcassonne, Foix, Bruniquel, Pech Merle, Saint-Cirq-Lapopie, and Cahors. They also mention smaller experiences like wine tastings, a canal ride, and museums such as the Toulouse Resistance Museum and the Musée Saint-Raymond.
Not everything went smoothly. There were rainstorms, illness, and the occasional missed outing. But those hiccups became part of the story, a reminder that real travel is unpredictable. What matters most is the camaraderie, the discoveries, and the laughter along the way.
Bootcamp 2025 shows what it feels like to experience France beyond the tourist trail. It’s about castles and caves, local food, and the joy of connecting with people who share the same passion for French culture.
Subscribe to the Join Us in France Travel Podcast to hear more stories like this one. Each week Annie Sargent brings you real France, from big cities to hidden villages, told by travelers and locals who know it best.
Table of Contents for this Episode
Episode Transcript
Available transcripts are automatically generated. Complete accuracy is not guaranteed.
(00:16):
This is Join Us in France, episode563, cinq cent soixante-trois.
Bonjour, I'm Annie Sargent and Join Usin France is the podcast where we take
a conversational journey through thebeauty, culture, and flavors of France.
Today, I bring you the Bootcampreport with Janet Boyd, Beth Hall,
(00:36):
Mary Piltch, and Jeanne Powanda.
And they share theirexperiences at Bootcamp 2025.
We chat about what it's like hangingout with a group of fellow Francophiles,
the visits we enjoyed, French classes atLangueOnze in Toulouse, I mean, the whole
thing, you know, the whole experience.
I've also launched the salespage for Bootcamp 2026, and I
(01:01):
received four reservations already.
That was fast!
Patrons get first dibs, then in a fewdays, I'll send an email to all the
people who subscribed to my newsletter,and I'll share the URL of the sales
page here on the podcast next week.
But just to put a bug in your ear,it will be early October 2026.
(01:23):
Maybe you can join us inFrance for real in 2026?
This podcast is fueled bychocolatine, coffee and the
generosity of listeners like you.
You book itinerary consults, take myVoicemap tours, join the Bootcamp, hop in
my electric car for a day trip, or chip inon Patreon, and I am so grateful for that.
(01:48):
Want to keep me going and skipthe ads, there's a link for
that in the show notes as well.
You'll find all of my tours andservices at joinusinfrance.com/boutique.
And merci beaucoup.
For the Magazine part of the podcast,after my chat with boot campers,
I'll update you on the strike andblockages situation, today actually,
(02:13):
September 2025, and problemswith over-tourism in Montmartre.
Did you know that this podcastgets transcribed and spell-checked?
French spelling can be a bit mysterious,but you'll find the show notes
including links to the transcriptsat joinusinfrance.com/episodes.
(02:35):
It's mighty helpful when searchingthe website for gold as well.
You pan the website for gold, I guess.
And if you remember what episodenumber you want to check out, you
can always type joinusinfrance.com/and the number of the episode.
So in this case, todaywould be 563, the numeral.
(02:56):
And that episode will pop up.
And in my weekly newsletter,I send you a summary of the
conversation with all the places wementioned and all the useful links.
So I do recommend that yousubscribe to the newsletter at
joinusinfrance.com/newsletter, becauseit is the best way to stay in the loop.
(03:25):
Bonjour, Janet Boyd.
Welcome to Join us in France.
Bonjour, Annie.
I'm happy to join.
Lovely to see you.
We haven't seen each otherfor a few months now.
So I want to talk to you aboutyour Bootcamp experience.
It's August by the time we recordthis, so you've had time to think
about it and reflect upon it.
So I'd love to hear how it went for you.
(03:48):
Well, it was everything I'd hoped for.
I'm not a group traveler typically,but I said, "Oh my gosh, these are
going to be my people. They areFrancophiles. They want to travel."
it always felt like a small groupeven though we were, like, 30 to 35.
It never felt that way.
I mean, we needed a properbus for certain things.
My husband feels like he now knows some ofthe people because I would ... You'd wind
up going into smaller groups and it'd belike, "Oh, the group where we had the, you
(04:11):
know, the retired pediatrician. Oh, thatgroup who," you know, blah, blah, blah.
And as we took the tours and thedifferent, you know, after the
language classes, which they were veryaccommodating to us knowing that we were
there for the week, rather And also thestudents, when we went into the class, a
lot of students had been there for months.
But going to Albi and Carcassonneand ... I knew at some point that I
(04:32):
was going, it was going to blur after,like, which city... which was which
because there's so many gorgeous places.
And so I don't remember specificallyunless I look at my pictures.
But I do remember Elyse'sdescriptions, it was just so much
richer with Elyse telling us.
Like, if I went to ... "Oh yeah,here's a nice castle." But I have
(04:54):
a real sense of the history, and itwasn't facts and figures, not at all.
One of the things I remember was a placethat we went to that had the it was a,
not a catapult, what's the other catapult?
Oh, that was Foix.
That was the defensive in Foix.
So that was in the Ariege area.
So she said to us, I said, "I want youto look, here we have a round tower,
(05:16):
right? Which is built, you know, inwhatever century. And on the other side,
we have a square tower, and I want youto know that the difference between the
two is that the round ones were builtafter the invention of the cannonballs
because they deflect cannonballs."
And you know, it just, it was a funfact that you walk away going, I
never would have thought of that."
(05:37):
Right.
I never would have noticed that.
And it's really kind of ... it'sinteresting, and there were just, there
were so many things that, you know,and she was just fabulous in making...
Oh, she has a knack for bringingit all together, like, in a way
that honestly I can't do that.
I would like to.
(05:58):
I try to learn from her,but she just has a knack.
Because sometimes people have challengedher on specific dates and things and she
will get a detail here and there wrong.
That's fine, but the overall imagethat she builds is just extraordinary.
So yeah.
I just think she gives a fantastictour, whether it's the Bootcamp or
(06:18):
outside of the Bootcamp, she does,you know, she's a great tour guide.
And with no notes.
She does it with no notes.
That's right.
I was like, how does she do that?"
Yeah.
And her excitement is kind of infectiousbecause when they were doing excavation
and they found another piece of aRoman wall, and it's just, you know,
a piece of a construction site.
And we walked over there and shewas telling us all about this.
(06:41):
Yeah.
She's so excited about these things.
And you know, I've known about theseplaces forever, and I kind of tried
to talk her out of taking us there.
She's like, "There's not thatmuch to see." And she's like,
"Well, this is really important.
This is really important." Okay.
So yeah.
The whole thing about thelike-minded people is also a big one.
We realized we were a self-selecting groupin the end, and that just made for lots
(07:03):
of friendships and fun conversations,which is one of the things you hope for.
And it really, you called it aBootcamp, and it was just in terms,
like, falling into bed every night andgoing to sleep and being glad I didn't
have any homework for the school.
But the morning when I got up, I was soenergized, you know, and for the variety
of things that we did, you know, justbreaking up, and so there are people
(07:24):
who didn't do the class, of course, andthey found all kinds of things to do.
Oh, sure.
The trip took place during mywork year where so I couldn't
extend, you know, on either end.
I couldn't take that much time awaybecause... United States, you know.
But my plan is to goback and spend more time.
I would go back, and I know one ofthe Bootcampers is going back to
Toulouse for a month in October.
(07:45):
Yes.
Oh, Toulouse is fabulous ... We'revery lucky because it's still low-key
enough.... but there's so much you can do.
Even if you don't go to the morninglanguage classes, which I think people
who want to learn the language should.
They should avail themselves ofthat, because it's really a good
way to cram in, you know, quickly.
(08:07):
What level were you at?
I was A2, which was good forgetting kickstarted again.
Yeah.
And I continued the French with iTalkisince I've been back, and now I'm B1.
Yay.
Finally.
Finally.
It takes a long time to learn a language.
But really, it's always a privilegeto see how close people get to one
(08:32):
another, because a lot of peoplecome without their significant other.
You know?
Yeah.
And so you come by yourself.
You're like, "Oh, am I going to belonely? Am I going to be bored? Am I
going to find people to hang out withafter the visits are done, or after
the classes are done?" I don't thinkanybody had any problems with that.
Oh, no.
(08:52):
Yeah.
And we have a fabulous...Every time, we have some really
nice, really classy people.
Like, you know, I mean, twoof the people who were at the
Bootcamp own private planes.
Oh, really?
Really.
I was surprised.
I was like, "Wow."
And one owned a vineyard.
Yes, that's right, one owned a vineyard.
(09:14):
You're an academic.
I can't remember what you do.
I'm a dean at a college.
There you go.
A lot of really interestingpeople to talk to.
We've had an opera singer.
We've had an eye doctor.
We had a pilot, You know, wehave really, really interesting
people, a bit of all ages as well.
Which is kind of refreshingto have a bit of everything.
(09:35):
It skewed more... I thinkit was more people my age.
I mean, I'll just say I'min my 50s, my later 50s.
But that was also interesting, becausepeople, it was all over the United States,
and we had Australia and the UK too.
Yeah.
But it was... And it was a lot of solotravelers you know, who, whether they
were paired up at home or not, allwho had the same loves and interests.
(09:58):
And the variety of the trips, I thinkit was really, it was paced well in
terms of we didn't go to, like, amedieval town three days in a row.
We went to a vineyard one day, and then wewent, you know, it was broken up in ways.
We mix it up.
Did you have a favorite?
Did something stand out in your mind?
Now, I do remember someone counting,I guess it was Foix, walking up
(10:22):
the cobblestones, the hill was 28flights, equivalent to 28 flights.
We all felt very accomplished.
But maybe it was also there, is thatwhere we had the storm, the thunderstorm
?Ah, no, that was Bruniquel where we had the thunderstorm.
Okay.
And Bruniquel is interestingbecause it has two chateaus.
(10:42):
It has a new chateau and an old chateau.
And the new one, of course,is, you know, 800 years old.
I think that's the one withthe two different towers.
Oh, okay.
That's the one, Bruniquel.
Yes.
Yes.
A lot of people really liked Bruniquel.
It was our first time going there.
I think we'll have to go back,because it's really scenic, and
it was really atmospheric becausewe had the storm, you know?
(11:03):
Yeah.
Well, that was fun.
And for the people on the podcast,it was beautiful when we got there.
A squall came in in about 20 minutes,and we're all standing in the castle,
and all of a sudden the lightsgo out, and everyone was, "Whoo."
But it was funny because you don'trealize how dark a castle really is,
until the lights go out.
Yeah.
That's right.
(11:24):
That's right.
You don't realize that without...You know, now we understand better
that they lived with the sun.
The people in the Middle Ages,they had to live with the sun.
Otherwise, it was too dark to doanything, you know, the rest of the time.
And even on an overcast day, like awinter's day or something where it's
overcast and you don't get a lot oflight in the room, there's a lot of
things you cannot do because no light.
(11:47):
Yeah.
So it's fun.
And it's the mix of just language,and culture, and you know, a lot
of these people, a lot of thesetours, they just say context, you
know, we give it context, whatever.
Of course, that's what we do.
We both, both Elyse and I live in France.
I'm French born and raised, inmy case, and so we want people to
come and enjoy the South of France.
(12:09):
And especially having people not all go tothe same places, that's a biggie for me.
Like, you know, go spread it around a bit.
Go see the rest of France, it's lovely.
Yeah.
These were places I would loveto see, but I don't know that
I would've done it on my own.
Yeah.
So that was another big plus for me.
Yeah.
You couldn't get to these,most of these places without a
(12:30):
vehicle, you have to have a car.
And not everybody ishappy driving in France.
Although driving in Franceis statistically a lot safer
than driving in the US.
I live in New Jersey, so if you can drivein New Jersey, you can drive anywhere.
Wonderful.
Wonderful.
Well, Janet, thank you somuch for talking to me.
Oh, thank you.
Any hints about the next Bootcamp?
(12:52):
Well, yes.
We are going to do this inOctober next time, because
May, it's too many days off.
It's really hard to find atime that works for everybody.
And April, it's a bit too rainy still.
So, we thought, you know, we hesitated.
We hesitated.
By the time you listen to this interview,
(13:14):
I'll announce the date and all of that.
But I think it's going to be October.
Not 2025, 2026.
Okay.
Oh, no.
We just do this once a year.
And Elyse has told me again shemight not, this might be her last
one, but she said that last time.
Right.
We'll see.
We'll see.
Hopefully, she'll feel goodenough to continue, because
she, you know, she's a trooper.
(13:34):
It's hard work.
So thank you very much, Janet.
It's lovely seeing you again.
Thank you so much.
Looking forward to the next one.
Take care.
Au revoir.
Bonjour, Beth Hall.
How are you?
I'm good.
Bonjour, Annie.
Welcome to Join us in France.
So, you were one of the Bootcampers,for this May 2025, and we want
(13:58):
to hear about your experience.
Why you came, where you'refrom, how it was, everything.
My name is Beth Hall.
I am from Kentucky.
I was the only person from Kentucky.
I think there was another personfrom the Midwest, but I was able
to meet people from all overthe world, Australia, England.
It was wonderful getting tomeet the different people, a
(14:21):
lot of like-minded people thatlove to travel and love France.
I was able to get away, because I havea little bit of a flexible schedule.
My husband was very, very jealousthat he had to stay behind and work,
but he gets to come in Septemberwhen we come back, so we get to go do
some of the same things we did on mytrip, because I loved them so much.
(14:42):
So yeah, that's right, because wewere just chatting a while back
about you redoing part of this tripand showing your husband, right?
Yes, yes.
I was very surprised byhow lively Toulouse was.
It was a wonderful place in Francethat some of the books don't even
include anything about Toulouse,and it just was wonderful.
(15:03):
Lots of interesting things interms of architecture, and again,
the city was just very lively.
Yeah.
And I really enjoyed that aspect.
We have a lot of students inToulouse, so of course it's
lively, and people like to go out.
People in Toulouse, Imean, just ask Elyse.
She will just get on the metro andgo into downtown Toulouse just to
(15:24):
be in downtown Toulouse becauseshe likes hanging out there.
Right.
Yeah, just people out and about, andI don't ... I can't think of in the
United States where you really havethat as much as I saw in Toulouse.
Yeah, yeah.
Well, wonderful.
Did you do also the language classes?
I did not.
I am at the very beginningof trying to learn French.
(15:46):
Felt it might be a little overwhelmingto come, I had some family issues with
my dad, so it wasn't until last minutethat I made the decision that I could
truly come because of his health.
So, just felt like wanted thatfree time to explore on my own.
And I think I would liketo do that on the next one.
(16:06):
I'd like to come back to the Bootcampand try the language class this time.
Yeah.
No, they're really fun, but it's truethat you don't have to take them.
It's just optional, and the good thingabout not taking them is that you
have every morning to yourself, well,every weekday morning to yourself.
The weekend mornings are ... Well, thewhole day, you know, we do ... This
(16:27):
year we started on a Saturday andwe ended a Sunday a week later.
I don't think we're goingto do that again, honestly.
I think we'll be doingSaturday to Saturday going
forward because it was long.
It was ... It felt, especially forElyse and I, every day you have
to be on, and for you guys, too.
I mean, it's a very packed-in ... Evenif you don't do the language classes,
(16:48):
you ... Did you ever feel bored?
Oh, no, no.
The first Monday, I had come from Paris,so I kind of took it easy that Monday
morning and just relaxed, but no, Ifound plenty to do, out and about.
Yeah, there's a lot to do in Toulouse.
Yeah.
So, Beth, you don't come across asthe most outgoing person in the group.
(17:09):
There are some people that werelike super talkative and all that.
You're a bit more reserved, aren't you?
Sometimes.
I like more one-on-one thana big group situation, so...
Yeah.
That's probably it more than being shy.
I feel like I'm not shy.
I'm just, you know ... I don't ... Whenit's a group, sometimes I kind of
step back and just kind of observe.
Yes, yes, yes.
And so did you make connections?
(17:31):
Did you make friends that you'restill in touch with at this point?
I did.
I am ... Been bad aboutstaying on the WhatsApp.
There's a WhatsApp that continues,and I had a lot to come back
to, so I've been pretty busy.
Right.
But no, I intend to keep in contact witha lot o... keep in contact with people.
What sort of work do you do?
I stayed home with my kids, so-
Oh, you ... But that keeps you very busy.
(17:52):
Yeah, right now, you know,I'm helping with my father.
Had to find out what wasgoing on with him, but...
Yeah, that's ... Yeah, andhe's hanging in, isn't he?
Yeah.
He's still hanging in there.
That's good.
Good for him.
I'm sure your help isinvaluable, at this point.
So tell me about the, some ofthe attractions we went to that
you are most interested in, theones that you want to go back to.
(18:14):
I loved Albi.
We plan to go back to the church,actually with you, I think we're
doing a day trip to go there.
I ended up with a stomach bugone day, so I didn't get to see
Pech Merle, or was it Cord...?-
It was Saint-Cirq-Lapopie.
And also, we ... On thatday we stopped in Rodez.
So I didn't get to do that, soI plan to do those things on-
(18:35):
Not Rodez, not Rodez, sorry.
I can't remember.
Mm. Brain fart.
Anyway, there's three thingswe visited that day, and I
can't remember the third one.
I really enjoyed Elyse'sdifferent tours that she did.
She's like a walking encyclopedia withso much information and so knowledgeable.
The bus trips were fun, even the singingeven ... even though I don't like to sing.
(18:59):
Yeah, some groups ... I always testthis, some groups love to sing.
This one this year, they were like,"Eh, not so into it," so, we'll see.
But I'll keep trying it becausesome groups really get into it, so
...No, that was kind of fun.
So yes, that day, that we go toPech Merle and Saint-Cirq-Lapopie,
we also go to Cahors.
We just go to the bridge because wedon't really have time for much else,
(19:21):
but ... So you missed that day, okay?
Yeah.
Because you were sick.
Sorry.
Yeah.
No, it's ... I wish I couldhave gone, but you know.
Yeah.
I really love Bruniquel.
Oh, Bruniquel, yes, yes.
The medieval town, the architecture,just... so quaint and beautiful.
(19:41):
I wish I could live there.
It's very hilly.
You'd get legs of steel, woman.
Yeah.
But no, it's justbreathtakingly beautiful.
You just stand there and look andthink, do places like this really exist?
They do, so
...Yes.
And that day we raninto a pretty big storm.
It was crazy.
(20:02):
Like, all of a sudden, it juststarted thundering and lightening.
Were you in the chateauwhen we lost the power?
Yes.
I didn't take my rain gear because itdidn't say it was going to rain, and then
all of a sudden you see all these blackclouds coming and then... didn't power go
out for a short time too in the chateau?
I was in the chateau.
A lot of us were in the chateau,and all of a sudden, boom, you know,
(20:23):
the lightning hit a substation.
So it took a good long timefor the power to come back, but
it did eventually come back.
But it made it very atmospheric.
We were in this medievalchateau, very medieval chateau
with no power, I'm like, "Ooh."
Carcassonne was another place that Ireally, really enjoyed, and to ... my
(20:46):
husband and I are going to go backalong with a cousin to Carcassonne.
How did you like the food in Toulouse?
I went out a few times with the group.
It was good.
I'm not a big foodie.
Uh-huh.
I did a lot of sandwiches, ham sandwiches.
A lot of pastries in themorning, the chocolat croissants,
pain au chocolat, I believe.
Pain au Chocolat, yes.
(21:06):
Or chocolatine, as wesay in the Southwest.
No, I wasn't as I guess I didn'texplore as much with the food.
Yeah, yeah, yeah.
You're not super food motivated.
No, the people were really nice aboutincluding me, because I was by myself.
So several times people had askedme to come to dinner, and sometimes
I was just kind of worn out andchose to go back to the room.
(21:28):
But that was really nice, being bymyself, that was one of the things
I was a little nervous about coming.
I remember sending a message, "Hey,will there be other people that
are going to be solo?" There were.
There were a lot of people that were soloand they were very kind to include me.
That meant a lot ofwonderful people on the trip.
Yeah, that's one of the nice thingsabout being in a group, is that you can
(21:51):
travel solo to places that you probablywouldn't by yourself, or maybe you
would, but in this case, you know, youmight feel a bit intimidated to come to
a place like this by yourself, but thenyou have a group, and you had us leading
the way and showing everybody around.
I guess it makes it easier....
Lot of learning curves along the way.
We've traveled, my husband andI have traveled quite a bit, but
(22:13):
he usually navigates, so I'vehad to do all the trains, buses,
airplanes, all of that by myself.
I almost ended up going thewrong direction on the train.
I figured it out at the last minutebecause when it the platform, on
the screen it told me to go to thespecific platform, and I got there
and got on the train and my seatassignment wasn't anywhere to be found.
So luckily, I figured out thatI was on the wrong train, but I
(22:36):
hadn't seen that where there'stwo trains on the same platform
going in two different directions.
Yeah, that's ... They mighthave different platform numbers?
But I would think so.
Yeah, the other train wasliterally on the other side.
My husband would have made the samemistake too, but I figured it out
and ended up on the right train, so
Yeah, lots of learning curves, butI am so glad I did it on my own.
Why do you want to comeback to the Bootcamp?
(22:57):
I mean, I'm glad, but why?
I had so much fun.
I really enjoyed it.
You pick out fabulous things to do,and I'm getting to meet the different
people from all over, was a lot of fun.
And a lot of people that love totravel, again, love France, and
getting to talk to them and hearing,you know, travel ideas or places
(23:18):
they've been, that kind of thing, so
...Yeah.
That's fantastic.
Well, thank you verymuch for talking to me.
I think I need to get some otherpeople on, but it's going to be a
delight to see you again this October.
You're coming back in...
Back in September, yes.
September, September, sorry.
Yes.
I have other bookingsin October, but yeah.
So September, and it will bewonderful to meet your husband and
(23:40):
your cousin and we'll have a goodtime, and then perhaps you'll come
back to the Bootcamp next year.
That's wonderful.
If the timing works out,I definitely plan to come.
Wonderful.
Thank you very much, Beth.
Au revoir.
Au revoir.
Bonjour, Mary Piltch.
Welcome to Join Us in France.
Thank you.
Thank you very much, Annie.
Wonderful to see you again.
(24:01):
You were at the Bootcamp and I wantto hear what your experience was like.
Tell us a little bit about yourself andwhat decided you to come to the Bootcamp?
Okay, great.
Well, I've been listening to Join Usin France since the pandemic actually.
And I've continued to listen to it.
I listened to all the old episodes, youknow, that you recorded before there.
It's so interesting andyour guests are great.
(24:23):
And you and Elyse dosuch a nice job together.
I live in Cape Cod in Massachusetts.
I'm retired.
I'm a grandmother, and I have threekids who live in the Boston area
too, so that's pretty much me.
Right, right.
And you, I remember you were a littlebit hesitant, you were like, "Oh, I'm
coming by myself. Is this going tobe a problem?" I don't think it ended
(24:44):
up being a problem at all, did it?
No, I don't know, I've traveled bymyself, you know, I've done it many times.
And I also, you know, do a group tourwhere I'm alone, so that's usually not
a problem, and I was able to meet acouple of other gals from Massachusetts.
And we met together.
I met one of them on Cape Cod andwe had coffee at a French cafe which
(25:04):
was on the cape, which was nice.
So I knew, you know, having that Zoomcall ahead of time was really good
because you could find out if otherpeople are around you and meet them
on Zoom, so that was very helpful.
Yes.
Yes.
Yes.
So what did you enjoy about the Bootcamp?
Did you do the language classes as well?
I did do the language class, yes.
Yeah.
Okay.
(25:24):
Well, we started everything off greatbecause the gals from Massachusetts
got together with you the day beforeand did a great trip to... I don't
remember the name of the area.
Yeah.
We did a day trip, I can't remember.
I remember some of it, itwas all the Tarn-et-Garonne.
There we go, yes, yes.
I can't get enough of cuteFrench town, so it was lovely.
We had a great lunch.
(25:45):
We found a nice place,that we all enjoyed.
So that was a great way to start it off.
And I was very impressed by Toulouse.
I did not expect it to be such a vibrant,thriving historical city, not knowing
that it was the fourth largest in France.
Is that correct?
Yes.
We're edging to third largest now, but
(26:05):
Wow, oh, okay.
And when I arrived, I was so impressedwith how many young people there were.
I didn't realize it was a university town.
So that was off to a good start.
It was a great group of people.
Again, like I said, havingthe Zoom was very helpful.
I did take the French language class.
I have to say, I did playhooky a couple of days.
(26:25):
Because there was just other thingsI wanted to do and see in Toulouse.
I was thinking, "Oh, you know, I'll doenough with the day trips that we do in
the afternoon." But there was really somuch more to see, so... and my French is
so poor anyway that, you know, five daysof French isn't going to help mine at all.
So I made the right decision.
Yes, yes, yes.
Well, it is true that there's a lot todo in Toulouse and the Bootcamp is... I
(26:48):
mean, we call it a Bootcamp because wetry to do a lot and you just get the half
a day on your own, during the Bootcamp,which for some people is not enough.
Yes.
Yeah, for sure.
So, one of the things I did on myown was to go to the Museum of the
Resistance, which was very good.
And subsequently, Elyse was kind enoughto give us a little talk about the
(27:11):
Resistance, which was very helpfulbecause I personally didn't know
that much about it, and I've watcheda couple of documentaries that she
suggested and read more about it.
So that, you know, to me thatwas very interesting, you know,
I'm interested in the history.
I also do a lot of long distance walkswith friends usually, but we've walked
part of the Camino de Santiago and partof the Via Francigena in Italy, and I
(27:34):
was very interested to find that partof the Camino goes through Toulouse.
Yeah.
So I went back to... What's the church,the cathedral there in Toulouse?
The cathedral is Saint-Etienne,and the basilica is Saint-Sernin.
Okay.
It was the basilica then.
It's the basilica, I think, yeah.
Yeah.
And, you know, learned more about that.
And I took, on one of myhooky days, I took Elyse's
(27:58):
audio guide and walked around.
And even though she had taken us beforeand, you know, we had seen a lot of
Toulouse, there were things that Ihadn't noticed before, had learned
so much more, and that was great.
You and Elyse just do such a fabulousjob of keeping everybody in line as
well as so many interesting things abouthistory and culture and people and food.
(28:20):
It's really a great combination.
I really enjoyed it.
Thank you.
Thank you.
Yes.
We have a good time as well becausewe get to meet new people and it's
always just, you know, it's fun.
It's fun.
Well, I'm glad it's funfor you too, as well.
Well, it's a big responsibility becauseI do feel like I'm in charge of a large
group and I'm always on the lookout forthings that might go possibly wrong.
(28:42):
But so far, we've been lucky.
We've had really... I shouldrelax a little bit is the reality.
No, I'm the same way.
You have to have like a plan Bready just in case, you know?
Yeah, yeah, yeah.
Did you have a favorite excursionor two, perhaps, that we did?
Well, as I said, you know, I can'tget enough of the little French towns.
And I'm sorry, I shouldhave looked this up before.
(29:03):
I don't remember the namesof some of the places.
But on Sunday, we wentto that other cathedral.
On Sunday, we went to Albi.
Albi, yes, that was it.
Yep.
So I loved Albi.
That is really a highlight, I think.
The only drawback was that itrained quite a bit on that day.
And we also went to theToulouse-Lautrec Museum.
Okay, okay.
It rained on that day?
(29:23):
I don't remember the rain.
Maybe it did.
Yeah, it was rainy.
Okay, it happens.
And the only other thing is becauseit's Sunday, a lot of things
aren't open, so it was very quietin Albi, probably a combination
of the rain and it being Sunday.
That's true.
And I guess one suggestion I would...Maybe you could do the caves on a
Sunday, and do Albi on a weekday,but that's just a suggestion.
(29:47):
That's a great suggestion.
We'll see if we can do that.
The thing is, Albi takes a full daybecause Elyse really gives a great tour of
the museum, the Toulouse-Lautrec Museum,and the cathedral, and the basilica.
And so, we need time, but yes,that's an excellent suggestion
that we will take into account.
And of course, Carcassonne isbeautiful, and I actually had
(30:07):
been there before, and it rainedwhen I was in Carcassonne before.
But it was beautiful when we went.
So I think I'll go backagain because it was raining.
It was really windy andraining when I went, and so
we didn't really do that much.
But again, Elyse did amazinghistory information about the
church that's there, which ofcourse I don't remember the name of.
Saint-Nazaire.
(30:27):
Yes, and I had seen it before andthought it was, you know, amazing, but
knowing all this information is justso, it really adds so much to the trip.
Yeah.
Yeah.
Do you have any tips for anybody who'sconsidering doing this things that you
want to tell them about to prepare?
Well, definitely do it.
I really enjoyed it.
You really have to flyto Toulouse, I think.
(30:47):
I had gone to Avignon from Charles deGaulle, and that's super easy to take by
the train, but Toulouse is not as easy.
So, I would say to take a flight.
And I don't know, just be readyfor d- uh, different experiences
that you may not be aware of.
And you meet some great people, and youguys really set it up for success, having
the WhatsApp and having Zoom calls before.
(31:08):
It's more than just going on atrip with people you don't know.
You kind of know them ahead oftime, and you all have the same
objectives and love of France.
So, it's a great trip to go on.
Yep, yep.
All right.
Thank you very much, Mary.
You're wonderful to talk to.
It was a delight havingyou on the bootcamp.
Thank you.
My pleasure.
Who knows?
You might come back toToulouse one of these days.
(31:28):
Yes, I might, but I may nottake the French language
course, but that's just me.
But I know a lot of people lovedit, you know, especially the ones
who were better French speakers.
Yeah, there's nothingwrong with the school.
It's just that, yeah, I think ifyou come with some French under your
belt, it makes it more challenging.
If it's just learning the verybasics, maybe in any language, a week
(31:51):
isn't going to make any miracles.
You know what I mean?
Correct.
Yeah.
It takes longer than that, so.
The people who were, you know, fairlyfluent in French, I think they really
got a lot out of it because theywere able to converse with other
people in French, which you don'talways have the opportunity here
in the United States, especially,you know, native French speakers.
So I think for that level,it's really a good course.
Where were you staying?
(32:12):
Was it a hotel or an Airbnb?
No, I stayed at a hotel.
I can't remember.
I should have researchedthis, like I said.
I stayed, oh, in that there's a circleand there's a fountain in the middle.
It's right down the streetfrom where we got the bus.
Okay, so probably the Place Wilson,the big... was it the Novotel?
Yes,
it was.
Yes, yeah, yeah, that's it.
(32:33):
Okay, Novotel in Place Wilson.
Okay.
Yeah, that's a good one.
You know what?
My room, it was not loud at all.
I must have faced inward instead ofoutward, because when I got there,
I thought, "Oh my gosh, it mightbe really noisy," but it wasn't.
The hotel wasn't too lively.
You know, it didn't have agreat restaurant, but of course,
everything's right around there.
And I was so close to thebig square and everything.
(32:53):
So it was really, it wasa convenient location.
I know, the other gals from theCape stayed at an Airbnb that
they found noisy, and the airconditioning wasn't working that well.
So you never know.
But I was very happy with where I stayed.
Did you like the food in the area?
Did you have a favorite?
I have to say, I'm not a big foodie,and I've had the cassoulet, and I'm
(33:14):
just not a big fan of cassoulet.
Yeah, yeah, yeah.
I can't say anythingthat really stuck out.
But the food is lovely.
Yeah.
Yeah, you didn't go hungry.
No, definitely not.
No, no.
How about the wine?
You came to the wine tasting with us.
That was a highlight too.
What a lovely couple, andyou know, what a lovely spot.
They did an amazing job.
Yeah, that was a lot of fun.
I love a wine tasting.
In fact, I went with two of the otherbootcamp participants, and we did a little
(33:37):
wine tasting on our own, with a guide.
And I think there were six peoplein total, and we went to that, the
one that has all the wines that youpour from the little spout in the
machine, and you put your card in.
Le Cinq, perhaps?
Do you know what I'm talking about?
Number five?
Yeah, Le Cinq.
That was cool to see that.
(33:58):
That was fun.
I know some other people wantedto go back, but I think it was
closed that day or something.
Yeah.
All right, we got to keep it short,but wonderful to see you again.
Wonderful to talk to you.
Thank you.
You too.
Thank you very much, Mary.
Okay, take care.
Enjoy the rest of your summer.
Thank you.
You too.
Au revoir.
Au revoir.
Bonjour, Jeanne Powanda.
Welcome to Join us in France.
(34:19):
Bonjour, Annie.
It's good to see you.
Good to see you, too.
So we want to talk about yourtime at the Bootcamp 2025.
Have you recovered?
I have recovered.
And my bank account'srecovered, thank goodness.
Yeah, yeah.
It takes a little bit for that too.
Did you do just the Bootcampor also the language classes?
(34:40):
I also did language class.
All right.
And what level of French were you at?
They put me in A1, I believe.
Okay.
So you're starting out.
I was... Well, I had some French inhigh school and a little bit in college.
I think I was put in a classthat was a little too easy.
Uh-huh.
(35:00):
And the teacher acknowledged that.
But, you know, it's only fivedays, a couple of hours, it
was still... It was okay.
Yeah.
Would I do it again?
No.
Mm-hmm.
You wouldn't do the language class again?
I would not.
A conversational French class wouldhave been, I think more helpful.
Oh, because... So this waskind of more like you spent
(35:22):
time doing grammar and things?
We were doing the alphabet,and then we did countries,
and then we did numbers and...
Ah, too simple.
Too simple.
Uh-huh.
Uh-huh.
Well, that's good to know.
That's good to know, because thereare people who might want to...
Because, I mean, the language classesare completely separate, you don't
have to do the language classes.
(35:43):
I think that people who are more advancedfind them very useful, but perhaps
for a beginner, it's not as good.
Yeah.
The good part was my class began at8:45 AM and so I had to get moving.
Yes, yes.
I couldn't lounge in bed.
I had to get up.
(36:04):
There's no lounging.
So, that was a good thing.
It is a Bootcamp.
So besides that, how wasthe Bootcamp experience?
Did you make some good friends?
Did you see some cool stuff?
I loved it.
It was an experience forme because I was alone.
My husband didn't want to go.
And so I learned a lot aboutmyself and what I can do.
And now I can do anything.
(36:26):
I'm brave.
It empowered you, I guess.
It empowered me.
There you go.
It empowered me.
That part of it was the best partfor just, personally, for me.
And meeting you and Elyse was a highlight.
I loved Toulouse and this was my fourthtrip to France, and I'm really happy
that I got to see that part of France.
(36:47):
You know, I've been to Paris, I'vebeen to the Normandy, Loire, Alsace,
I've been to Nice, you know, and soI hadn't been to the Southwest and so
now I've kind of covered everything.
A lot of places, yeah.
I mean, the Atlantic, perhaps.
The Atlantic Coast, thecentral parts of France.
You have a few thingsyou haven't seen, but...
A few things.
A few.
But it was good to kindof cover most areas.
(37:11):
Yes, yes.
Anything surprised you aboutToulouse or the places we went?
I was surprised by how flat Toulouse was.
Very, very, very, very walkable.
When I got there, I bought a metropass for ten rides and I only used five
(37:31):
because everything was so walkable.
Yeah.
I didn't really need the metro pass.
I actually gave it... It was a paper pass,so it's... I don't think they do that now.
They already eliminated paper passes.
And I gave it to a young woman, youknow, college students or whatever.
That's nice.
I was surprised, Toulouse... Ithink I was mostly surprised by
there's all the stores and the shopsand how high-end everything was.
(37:55):
Very high-end.
No cheap T-shirt shops.
The jewelry stores, there was a Hermeswatch that was over 10,000 euros.
Yeah.
That's high-end all right.
That surprised me.
But I did find my 2 euros storeto buy a few things that I need.
That's right, there's the 2euros, magasin de 2 euros.
Yeah.
Of the places we visited,did you have a favorite?
(38:18):
Yes.
My favorite was Bruniquel.
I just love the ruins.
The view was, you know, overthe river, was breathtaking.
I loved the
fact that was kind of funny,the old castle, the new castle.
When the new castle is still, you know,600 years old instead of 900 years old.
Yeah.
I just love walking through allof that, the town, walking through
(38:40):
that beautiful town and thesteep alleyways and the flowers.
That was the favorite of mine.
Everybody liked Carcassonne.
Carcassonne is very, verynice, but it's so touristy.
Bruniquel just felt like a place I couldjust stay for a day and relax and...
That's true.
That's true.
I did like that the best.
Every place was won- Foix was wonderful.
(39:00):
Everything was wonderful.
I loved it all.
Yeah, yeah.
I think Albi is also magnificent.
Albi, yes, yes.
Yeah.
Did you skip any days on accountof being unwell or something?
Yes.
I missed the caves.
Ah, Pech Merle.
Yeah.
I don't know.
I just had a... I just... I don'tknow, just woke up at... I don't
know if I had like a little bug.
(39:21):
There were a couple of people onthe bus that... You know, nobody was
really sick-sick but a little unwell.
You know, it is a Bootcamp.
I mean, every day like that it adds up.
I think next year we're probablygoing to do just seven days instead
of nine, because it is kind of taxing.
And we can probably fit in almost asmuch in, if we reorganize and rearrange
(39:43):
a little bit, is what I'm thinking.
But honestly, you're the second personI've talked to that missed Pech Merle day
because of not feeling well, you know?
It happens.
Yeah.
It may have been exhaustion.
I couldn't put finger onit, the... how I felt.
I just didn't want toreally get out of bed.
Yeah, yeah.
So tell me, if you were going to giveadvice to people considering going
(40:07):
to the Bootcamp next, one of theseyears, what would you tell them?
How would you help them prepare?
I think I was fairly prepared.
Google Maps, I did a lot of researchand... Like, when I was going to
my residence, I had an apartment.
I already knew what to look for.
You know, when I got out of themetro, I knew which way to turn,
left or right, or where to go.
Where did you stay?
I stayed at Tour Croix Barione.
(40:29):
Okay.
And it was such a great location.
I was two blocks from the8- 8 3A and Carme metro.
Yeah.
And a block from Langones.
It's a quiet, safe area.
I was a block from Rue deMetz and a block from Alsace
Lorraine, so I could get anywhere.
(40:49):
Yeah, it's a great location.
That's definitely a great location.
I had a two-story apartmentthat I could have lived in.
I just loved it.
And you found this... Was it one thatwas recommended on my website or?
It was not.
It was not.
I found it on booking.com, and then theowners actually reached out to me...
Oh.
(41:09):
... and said, "Hey, why don't you justbook directly through us?" And I
said, "Oh, okay, I can do that."
How did they know thatyou were interested?
I guess through booking.com,because I had some questions.
And I guess just went to themand then they reached out to
me, and that was perfectly fine.
They were wonderful hosts.
And there was a lot of steps.
It was 36 steps to my place, butI have a big old house and it's
(41:33):
already 18 just to get upstairs.
So...
So you're used to it, yeah.
Steps don't bother me.
Yeah.
But I loved the apartment.
It was quiet.
I just... I loved it.
All right, maybe you should send me theaddress and the contact for this person
and I can recommend it for somebodywho wants to stay there next time.
I can do that.
I can do that.
(41:53):
Wonderful.
Anything else you want to discuss, youknow, about the Bootcamp that you...
I was... I had a lot of time on myown, because I got there on Tuesday and
then stayed afterwards until Thursday.
There was a lot of things that we didn'tdo as the group that I got to see.
And things that I would recommendto people that have time would
definitely be a canal ride.
(42:14):
Yeah.
It's not exciting, but it's justso pretty at that time of year.
I went to The Resistance Museum.
Oh yeah, that's a good one.
I went to the Hotel d'Assézat.
Yes, exactly.
That's a beautiful one.
I assume you went intothe Bemberg Foundation?
Yes, that one... That's what I mean, yeah.
(42:36):
For me, the highlight was the Escherexhibit, down at, what was that called?
The old pal...
Le Bazacle.
I was an Escher fan since I was ateenager, so that was a highlight for me.
Uh-huh, uh-huh.
I saw that one too.
I liked it.
It was very good.
I loved it.
I loved it.
I had a massage.
Oh, wow.
(42:56):
And then I went to St. Raymond,Musee Saint-Raymond, which I loved.
It was... I loved that.
It's a very good one.
There's just so much, you know,and you see so much as it is with
the group and then all these...
There's more.
Oh yeah.
We definitely don't doeverything you can do.
You know, there's a lot morethat you could do in Toulouse.
There is.
There is.
And the library was beautiful.
(43:17):
And I got to meet people from, you know,Australia, and New Zealand, and Hawaii.
Have you stayed in touch with any of them?
Actually, not really.
Not really.
Well, so many of them were going offto other European locales, you know?
I was taken back to the States,but many of them were headed
off to various ports of call.
(43:38):
Yeah, different places, yeah.
Right.
Did you like the fact that weused WhatsApp to communicate?
Was that handy dandy oryou would rather not?
It was perfect.
And we could privately connectwith each other, if we had to.
I took a wine tour and met JessicaHammer, who I believe you guys know.
(43:59):
Yeah.
And so I'm from Pittsburgh.
She is a big Sidney Crosby fan,who's a Pittsburgh Penguin.
And I had some Pittsburgh Penguin hatswith me that I brought over and I gave
her some hats and she was so happy.
That's great.
That's great.
All right, Jean, thank you so much for...we need to keep it short because we have
(44:21):
other people who are going to be on thisepisode, but thank you so much, Jean.
It was wonderful having you onthe Bootcamp and it's lovely to
see you again, and I hope youcome back to France at some point.
Thank you very much.
Thanks to Elyse and I'lljust keep on listening.
Awesome.
Merci, au revoir.
Thank you.
(44:46):
Again, I want to thank my patrons forgiving back and supporting the show.
Patrons get several exclusiverewards for doing that, you can
see them at patreon.com/joinus.
A special shout-out this week to my newJoin Us in France champions, Theresa
Watkins and Carol F., with whom I'veexchanged many lovely messages already.
(45:08):
I love talking to my patrons.
Would you join them too?
You can do it for as little asthree dollars a month, but if you
can afford it, I would love tohave you pledge more so you can
have access to more of the rewards.
Go to patreon.com/joinus.
And to support Elyse, goto patreon.com/elysart.
(45:35):
And thank you, David Griffin, foryour one-time donation using any
green button on joinusinfrance.comthat says, "Tip your guide."
Somebody left this review of my Ilede la Cite VoiceMap tour this week.
This person wrote, "Very informative tour,lots of interesting insights, easy to
follow." Well, that's what I like to hear.
(45:56):
That was short and sweet, but, you know,those short and sweet reviews also help.
Podcast listeners get a bigdiscount for buying these
VoiceMap tours from my website.
It's best for me as well, because I getto keep more of what you pay instead
of giving it to Apple or Google.
So, go to joinusinfrance.com/boutiqueto get your own codes.
(46:18):
If you're planning a trip to France,your vacation is precious, and you
do not want to waste time chasingbad tips or outdated information.
That's where my ItineraryConsults come in.
You can run your ideas by me.
I'll help steer you in the right directionso you spend less time researching,
worrying, and more time just enjoyingthe thought of your trip to France.
(46:43):
Again, to book this service, yougo to joinusinfrance.com/boutique.
I want to update you on thepolitical situation in France.
Today was the Bloquons Tout day.
They've been talkingabout this for a month.
And yes, they did block a few places andthey're all over Instagram, but I swear
(47:04):
to God, they blocked maybe a fraction ofa percent of important infrastructure.
So it was a bit of a dud, and I suppose itmight, ... I don't know, you never know.
Are they going to keep this up or not?
When it's a real strike, like if it'san official strike from the train
people or teachers or whatever, theydon't get paid while they're on strike.
(47:27):
And so they tend to be a littlebit careful with how much time
off they take for striking.
The people who participate in theseblockages and things like that,
they have less to lose usually,and so it might go on for a while.
With the Gilets Jaunes, the YellowJackets, several years back, it had
all started with a sudden, well,to them, increase in the price
(47:53):
of taxes that we pay on gasoline.
And they really upset a lot of people.
I don't like taxes any more thananybody else, but I think we should
be using less gasoline, becauseit is destroying our planet.
So to me, the only way to reallyincentivize people to use less gasoline
is to make it more expensive, and so Idid get behind that particular movement.
(48:16):
But on this one today, not that I'mever going to go block anything, but
I do understand that people are upsetbecause the French government has a
lot of debt, they've been spending likedrunken sailors since the pandemic.
Emmanuel Macron is not the only presidentwho took the country in that direction,
but he's definitely made it worse.
(48:37):
He hasn't had a majority inthe Parliament, and ours is
a parliamentarian system.
So if the president doesn't have theParliament, well, his prime minister
can't get anything passed, and thelatest prime minister has fallen,
he didn't get the votes he needed topass his budget, so we have a new guy.
(48:59):
I can't even remember his name.
He was the minister of Defense,and he's well liked and whatever,
but he is a right winger.
And so my fear is that he's goingto do like the previous ones.
He's going to say, "Well, we can savemoney by not reimbursing this, in the...
you know, national healthcare thing.We can cut off this program, give less
(49:19):
money to the handicapped," or whatever.
I'm not sure what all they'replanning, but I think they're
looking for money in the wrong place.
French people are very, veryprice sensitive, and they
are going to put up a fight.
And the money really lies with a fewthousand very rich people in France,
just like everywhere else these days, andI think they need to go find the money
(49:43):
where it is and not where it is not.
But that's just me.
I've never voted left wing inFrance, but I might have to do that,
because they're just annoying me.
Why do they keep hitting the peoplewho can least afford it, you know?
They need to find a way to taxthe super wealthy, and we do have
a lot of super wealthy in France.
I'm not saying tax the dentistwho spends 12 hours with his
(50:07):
hands in people's mouths.
I mean, he's earned it, right?
But just the people who investand the private equity crap
and all that, ugh... yeah.
Anyway, I'm not a political scientistand this is not a political podcast but
I think there are reasons for peopleto get excited over these things.
But we have a new prime ministeralready, hopefully, this person will
(50:30):
be able to pass a budget that won'tannoy people so much, might get a little
bit reasonable and then we'll see.
We'll see where we go from there.
But it wasn't as bad as I had feared.
Let's talk about the Montmartreand the growing tensions
between residents and tourism.
I've mentioned this inprevious episodes as well.
But this time it's about the buses,because every day, dozens of large
(50:53):
tour buses roll into Montmartre.
They often park illegally, doubleparking, blocking crosswalks or stopping
in areas where they're not supposed to.
For the people who live there,it's become a real problem.
One resident, Julie Menard, who haslived in the neighborhood for 10
years, has launched a petition backin 2023 and she calls it an invasion.
(51:15):
She's not just talking aboutinconvenience, but about what she
sees as both visual pollution andair pollution, and she has a point.
Paris welcomed more than 36million visitors in 2024, bouncing
back to pre-pandemic levels,and that's a lot of people.
Its hotspots like Montmartre, theEiffel Tower, the Champs-Élysées
(51:36):
feel the pressure most.
The deputy mayor in charge oftourism, Frédéric Ocard, says the
city needs to regulate tourism inorder to limit the negative effects.
In his words, "We need to stabilizethe number of tourists." The buses
are at the heart of the issue here.
Between 500 and 600 tour buses,coaches, enter Paris every day, and
(52:02):
95% of them still run on diesel.
That's a lot of exhaust and, you know,in an already congested neighborhood,
the city is considering cuttingback access to tour buses in central
Paris for a long term solution.
And then they could make people justpark outside, take the RER, you know?
(52:23):
But not everyone agrees, of course.
Tour guides argue that buses are themost practical option for groups.
And it's true that big buses, you know, ifyou work it out, it's less gas consumption
per head than an individual car.
Public transportation isdifficult with a large number
(52:43):
of people, so I understand this.
And the bus industry, they point out thatcoaches are essential for international
tourism and that the big problemis the lack of designated parking.
Well, where are you goingto put it in Montmartre?
Like, I don't know.
The drivers feel stuck.
Some say they have no choice but parkillegally and drop people off, even
if it means risking 135 Euro fine.
(53:06):
But the city says they won't turna blind eye to those practices and
are preparing stricter measures.
This is not a brand new debate.
When Paris introduced its lowtraffic zone in the city center in
2024, tour buses were almost banned.
Banned outright from certain districts,and they were given a reprieve but
(53:27):
the question is still on the table.
How do you strike a balance betweenwelcoming millions of visitors
and preserving the quality oflife for the people who actually
live in these neighborhoods?
The conversation is ongoing andMontmartre, with its steep streets
and postcard views has become thefrontline in this clash between
mass tourism and local life.
(53:49):
Now, I use tour buses for theBootcamp, sometimes you have to.
But we stay well away from Paris with theBootcamp, and as a matter of fact, guiding
in Paris would be actually much easierfor me than guiding in Toulouse, because
I don't guide in Toulouse that much.
Elyse takes all these jobs.
(54:10):
I mean, I do a little bit,but really, not very much.
I take people outside ofToulouse on day trips.
But really, nobody needs meto bring more buses to Paris.
If I ever did a Bootcamp inParis, it would have, we would
use public transportation.
And as far as I see it, the solution toover-tourism is to spread people around.
(54:31):
There are so many greatplaces to enjoy in France.
I encourage you to get out andenjoy it all, not just Paris,
Normandy and Provence, right?
Many more places that we explorehere on this podcast every week.
That's it.
The rant is over.
(54:51):
My thanks to podcast editors Anneand Christian Cotovan, who produced
the transcripts and the audio.
Next week on the podcast, anepisode with Elyse Rivin of Toulouse
Guided Walks about the town ofSaint-Lizier in the Ariège Department.
... Saint what, you say?
Saint-Lizier.
And that's exactly my point.
(55:12):
This is one of these hidden gems thatyou need to hear about so perhaps
you'll consider not spending all yourtime in France in Montmartre, but
rather go down to the foothills ofthe Pyrenees, where it is beautiful.
Thank you so much for listening,and I hope you join me next time so
we can look around France together.
(55:32):
Au revoir.
The Join Us in France travelpodcast is written, hosted, and
produced by Annie Sargent, andCopyright 2025 by AddictedToFrance.
It is released under a CreativeCommons attribution, non-commercial,
no derivatives license.
This is Join Us in France, episode563, cinq cent soixante-trois.
Bonjour, I'm Annie Sargent and Join Usin France is the podcast where we take
a conversational journey through thebeauty, culture, and flavors of France.
Today, I bring you the Bootcampreport with Janet Boyd, Beth Hall,
(00:36):
Mary Piltch, and Jeanne Powanda.
And they share theirexperiences at Bootcamp 2025.
We chat about what it's like hangingout with a group of fellow Francophiles,
the visits we enjoyed, French classes atLangueOnze in Toulouse, I mean, the whole
thing, you know, the whole experience.
I've also launched the salespage for Bootcamp 2026, and I
(01:01):
received four reservations already.
That was fast!
Patrons get first dibs, then in a fewdays, I'll send an email to all the
people who subscribed to my newsletter,and I'll share the URL of the sales
page here on the podcast next week.
But just to put a bug in your ear,it will be early October 2026.
(01:23):
Maybe you can join us inFrance for real in 2026?
This podcast is fueled bychocolatine, coffee and the
generosity of listeners like you.
You book itinerary consults, take myVoicemap tours, join the Bootcamp, hop in
my electric car for a day trip, or chip inon Patreon, and I am so grateful for that.
(01:48):
Want to keep me going and skipthe ads, there's a link for
that in the show notes as well.
You'll find all of my tours andservices at joinusinfrance.com/boutique.
And merci beaucoup.
For the Magazine part of the podcast,after my chat with boot campers,
I'll update you on the strike andblockages situation, today actually,
(02:13):
September 2025, and problemswith over-tourism in Montmartre.
Did you know that this podcastgets transcribed and spell-checked?
French spelling can be a bit mysterious,but you'll find the show notes
including links to the transcriptsat joinusinfrance.com/episodes.
(02:35):
It's mighty helpful when searchingthe website for gold as well.
You pan the website for gold, I guess.
And if you remember what episodenumber you want to check out, you
can always type joinusinfrance.com/and the number of the episode.
So in this case, todaywould be 563, the numeral.
(02:56):
And that episode will pop up.
And in my weekly newsletter,I send you a summary of the
conversation with all the places wementioned and all the useful links.
So I do recommend that yousubscribe to the newsletter at
joinusinfrance.com/newsletter, becauseit is the best way to stay in the loop.
(03:25):
Bonjour, Janet Boyd.
Welcome to Join us in France.
Bonjour, Annie.
I'm happy to join.
Lovely to see you.
We haven't seen each otherfor a few months now.
So I want to talk to you aboutyour Bootcamp experience.
It's August by the time we recordthis, so you've had time to think
about it and reflect upon it.
So I'd love to hear how it went for you.
(03:48):
Well, it was everything I'd hoped for.
I'm not a group traveler typically,but I said, "Oh my gosh, these are
going to be my people. They areFrancophiles. They want to travel."
it always felt like a small groupeven though we were, like, 30 to 35.
It never felt that way.
I mean, we needed a properbus for certain things.
My husband feels like he now knows some ofthe people because I would ... You'd wind
up going into smaller groups and it'd belike, "Oh, the group where we had the, you
(04:11):
know, the retired pediatrician. Oh, thatgroup who," you know, blah, blah, blah.
And as we took the tours and thedifferent, you know, after the
language classes, which they were veryaccommodating to us knowing that we were
there for the week, rather And also thestudents, when we went into the class, a
lot of students had been there for months.
But going to Albi and Carcassonneand ... I knew at some point that I
(04:32):
was going, it was going to blur after,like, which city... which was which
because there's so many gorgeous places.
And so I don't remember specificallyunless I look at my pictures.
But I do remember Elyse'sdescriptions, it was just so much
richer with Elyse telling us.
Like, if I went to ... "Oh yeah,here's a nice castle." But I have
(04:54):
a real sense of the history, and itwasn't facts and figures, not at all.
One of the things I remember was a placethat we went to that had the it was a,
not a catapult, what's the other catapult?
Oh, that was Foix.
That was the defensive in Foix.
So that was in the Ariege area.
So she said to us, I said, "I want youto look, here we have a round tower,
(05:16):
right? Which is built, you know, inwhatever century. And on the other side,
we have a square tower, and I want youto know that the difference between the
two is that the round ones were builtafter the invention of the cannonballs
because they deflect cannonballs."
And you know, it just, it was a funfact that you walk away going, I
never would have thought of that."
(05:37):
Right.
I never would have noticed that.
And it's really kind of ... it'sinteresting, and there were just, there
were so many things that, you know,and she was just fabulous in making...
Oh, she has a knack for bringingit all together, like, in a way
that honestly I can't do that.
I would like to.
(05:58):
I try to learn from her,but she just has a knack.
Because sometimes people have challengedher on specific dates and things and she
will get a detail here and there wrong.
That's fine, but the overall imagethat she builds is just extraordinary.
So yeah.
I just think she gives a fantastictour, whether it's the Bootcamp or
(06:18):
outside of the Bootcamp, she does,you know, she's a great tour guide.
And with no notes.
She does it with no notes.
That's right.
I was like, how does she do that?"
Yeah.
And her excitement is kind of infectiousbecause when they were doing excavation
and they found another piece of aRoman wall, and it's just, you know,
a piece of a construction site.
And we walked over there and shewas telling us all about this.
(06:41):
Yeah.
She's so excited about these things.
And you know, I've known about theseplaces forever, and I kind of tried
to talk her out of taking us there.
She's like, "There's not thatmuch to see." And she's like,
"Well, this is really important.
This is really important." Okay.
So yeah.
The whole thing about thelike-minded people is also a big one.
We realized we were a self-selecting groupin the end, and that just made for lots
(07:03):
of friendships and fun conversations,which is one of the things you hope for.
And it really, you called it aBootcamp, and it was just in terms,
like, falling into bed every night andgoing to sleep and being glad I didn't
have any homework for the school.
But the morning when I got up, I was soenergized, you know, and for the variety
of things that we did, you know, justbreaking up, and so there are people
(07:24):
who didn't do the class, of course, andthey found all kinds of things to do.
Oh, sure.
The trip took place during mywork year where so I couldn't
extend, you know, on either end.
I couldn't take that much time awaybecause... United States, you know.
But my plan is to goback and spend more time.
I would go back, and I know one ofthe Bootcampers is going back to
Toulouse for a month in October.
(07:45):
Yes.
Oh, Toulouse is fabulous ... We'revery lucky because it's still low-key
enough.... but there's so much you can do.
Even if you don't go to the morninglanguage classes, which I think people
who want to learn the language should.
They should avail themselves ofthat, because it's really a good
way to cram in, you know, quickly.
(08:07):
What level were you at?
I was A2, which was good forgetting kickstarted again.
Yeah.
And I continued the French with iTalkisince I've been back, and now I'm B1.
Yay.
Finally.
Finally.
It takes a long time to learn a language.
But really, it's always a privilegeto see how close people get to one
(08:32):
another, because a lot of peoplecome without their significant other.
You know?
Yeah.
And so you come by yourself.
You're like, "Oh, am I going to belonely? Am I going to be bored? Am I
going to find people to hang out withafter the visits are done, or after
the classes are done?" I don't thinkanybody had any problems with that.
Oh, no.
(08:52):
Yeah.
And we have a fabulous...Every time, we have some really
nice, really classy people.
Like, you know, I mean, twoof the people who were at the
Bootcamp own private planes.
Oh, really?
Really.
I was surprised.
I was like, "Wow."
And one owned a vineyard.
Yes, that's right, one owned a vineyard.
(09:14):
You're an academic.
I can't remember what you do.
I'm a dean at a college.
There you go.
A lot of really interestingpeople to talk to.
We've had an opera singer.
We've had an eye doctor.
We had a pilot, You know, wehave really, really interesting
people, a bit of all ages as well.
Which is kind of refreshingto have a bit of everything.
(09:35):
It skewed more... I thinkit was more people my age.
I mean, I'll just say I'min my 50s, my later 50s.
But that was also interesting, becausepeople, it was all over the United States,
and we had Australia and the UK too.
Yeah.
But it was... And it was a lot of solotravelers you know, who, whether they
were paired up at home or not, allwho had the same loves and interests.
(09:58):
And the variety of the trips, I thinkit was really, it was paced well in
terms of we didn't go to, like, amedieval town three days in a row.
We went to a vineyard one day, and then wewent, you know, it was broken up in ways.
We mix it up.
Did you have a favorite?
Did something stand out in your mind?
Now, I do remember someone counting,I guess it was Foix, walking up
(10:22):
the cobblestones, the hill was 28flights, equivalent to 28 flights.
We all felt very accomplished.
But maybe it was also there, is thatwhere we had the storm, the thunderstorm
?Ah, no, that was Bruniquel where we had the thunderstorm.
Okay.
And Bruniquel is interestingbecause it has two chateaus.
(10:42):
It has a new chateau and an old chateau.
And the new one, of course,is, you know, 800 years old.
I think that's the one withthe two different towers.
Oh, okay.
That's the one, Bruniquel.
Yes.
Yes.
A lot of people really liked Bruniquel.
It was our first time going there.
I think we'll have to go back,because it's really scenic, and
it was really atmospheric becausewe had the storm, you know?
(11:03):
Yeah.
Well, that was fun.
And for the people on the podcast,it was beautiful when we got there.
A squall came in in about 20 minutes,and we're all standing in the castle,
and all of a sudden the lightsgo out, and everyone was, "Whoo."
But it was funny because you don'trealize how dark a castle really is,
until the lights go out.
Yeah.
That's right.
(11:24):
That's right.
You don't realize that without...You know, now we understand better
that they lived with the sun.
The people in the Middle Ages,they had to live with the sun.
Otherwise, it was too dark to doanything, you know, the rest of the time.
And even on an overcast day, like awinter's day or something where it's
overcast and you don't get a lot oflight in the room, there's a lot of
things you cannot do because no light.
(11:47):
Yeah.
So it's fun.
And it's the mix of just language,and culture, and you know, a lot
of these people, a lot of thesetours, they just say context, you
know, we give it context, whatever.
Of course, that's what we do.
We both, both Elyse and I live in France.
I'm French born and raised, inmy case, and so we want people to
come and enjoy the South of France.
(12:09):
And especially having people not all go tothe same places, that's a biggie for me.
Like, you know, go spread it around a bit.
Go see the rest of France, it's lovely.
Yeah.
These were places I would loveto see, but I don't know that
I would've done it on my own.
Yeah.
So that was another big plus for me.
Yeah.
You couldn't get to these,most of these places without a
(12:30):
vehicle, you have to have a car.
And not everybody ishappy driving in France.
Although driving in Franceis statistically a lot safer
than driving in the US.
I live in New Jersey, so if you can drivein New Jersey, you can drive anywhere.
Wonderful.
Wonderful.
Well, Janet, thank you somuch for talking to me.
Oh, thank you.
Any hints about the next Bootcamp?
(12:52):
Well, yes.
We are going to do this inOctober next time, because
May, it's too many days off.
It's really hard to find atime that works for everybody.
And April, it's a bit too rainy still.
So, we thought, you know, we hesitated.
We hesitated.
By the time you listen to this interview,
(13:14):
I'll announce the date and all of that.
But I think it's going to be October.
Not 2025, 2026.
Okay.
Oh, no.
We just do this once a year.
And Elyse has told me again shemight not, this might be her last
one, but she said that last time.
Right.
We'll see.
We'll see.
Hopefully, she'll feel goodenough to continue, because
she, you know, she's a trooper.
(13:34):
It's hard work.
So thank you very much, Janet.
It's lovely seeing you again.
Thank you so much.
Looking forward to the next one.
Take care.
Au revoir.
Bonjour, Beth Hall.
How are you?
I'm good.
Bonjour, Annie.
Welcome to Join us in France.
So, you were one of the Bootcampers,for this May 2025, and we want
(13:58):
to hear about your experience.
Why you came, where you'refrom, how it was, everything.
My name is Beth Hall.
I am from Kentucky.
I was the only person from Kentucky.
I think there was another personfrom the Midwest, but I was able
to meet people from all overthe world, Australia, England.
It was wonderful getting tomeet the different people, a
(14:21):
lot of like-minded people thatlove to travel and love France.
I was able to get away, because I havea little bit of a flexible schedule.
My husband was very, very jealousthat he had to stay behind and work,
but he gets to come in Septemberwhen we come back, so we get to go do
some of the same things we did on mytrip, because I loved them so much.
(14:42):
So yeah, that's right, because wewere just chatting a while back
about you redoing part of this tripand showing your husband, right?
Yes, yes.
I was very surprised byhow lively Toulouse was.
It was a wonderful place in Francethat some of the books don't even
include anything about Toulouse,and it just was wonderful.
(15:03):
Lots of interesting things interms of architecture, and again,
the city was just very lively.
Yeah.
And I really enjoyed that aspect.
We have a lot of students inToulouse, so of course it's
lively, and people like to go out.
People in Toulouse, Imean, just ask Elyse.
She will just get on the metro andgo into downtown Toulouse just to
(15:24):
be in downtown Toulouse becauseshe likes hanging out there.
Right.
Yeah, just people out and about, andI don't ... I can't think of in the
United States where you really havethat as much as I saw in Toulouse.
Yeah, yeah.
Well, wonderful.
Did you do also the language classes?
I did not.
I am at the very beginningof trying to learn French.
(15:46):
Felt it might be a little overwhelmingto come, I had some family issues with
my dad, so it wasn't until last minutethat I made the decision that I could
truly come because of his health.
So, just felt like wanted thatfree time to explore on my own.
And I think I would liketo do that on the next one.
(16:06):
I'd like to come back to the Bootcampand try the language class this time.
Yeah.
No, they're really fun, but it's truethat you don't have to take them.
It's just optional, and the good thingabout not taking them is that you
have every morning to yourself, well,every weekday morning to yourself.
The weekend mornings are ... Well, thewhole day, you know, we do ... This
(16:27):
year we started on a Saturday andwe ended a Sunday a week later.
I don't think we're goingto do that again, honestly.
I think we'll be doingSaturday to Saturday going
forward because it was long.
It was ... It felt, especially forElyse and I, every day you have
to be on, and for you guys, too.
I mean, it's a very packed-in ... Evenif you don't do the language classes,
(16:48):
you ... Did you ever feel bored?
Oh, no, no.
The first Monday, I had come from Paris,so I kind of took it easy that Monday
morning and just relaxed, but no, Ifound plenty to do, out and about.
Yeah, there's a lot to do in Toulouse.
Yeah.
So, Beth, you don't come across asthe most outgoing person in the group.
(17:09):
There are some people that werelike super talkative and all that.
You're a bit more reserved, aren't you?
Sometimes.
I like more one-on-one thana big group situation, so...
Yeah.
That's probably it more than being shy.
I feel like I'm not shy.
I'm just, you know ... I don't ... Whenit's a group, sometimes I kind of
step back and just kind of observe.
Yes, yes, yes.
And so did you make connections?
(17:31):
Did you make friends that you'restill in touch with at this point?
I did.
I am ... Been bad aboutstaying on the WhatsApp.
There's a WhatsApp that continues,and I had a lot to come back
to, so I've been pretty busy.
Right.
But no, I intend to keep in contact witha lot o... keep in contact with people.
What sort of work do you do?
I stayed home with my kids, so-
Oh, you ... But that keeps you very busy.
(17:52):
Yeah, right now, you know,I'm helping with my father.
Had to find out what wasgoing on with him, but...
Yeah, that's ... Yeah, andhe's hanging in, isn't he?
Yeah.
He's still hanging in there.
That's good.
Good for him.
I'm sure your help isinvaluable, at this point.
So tell me about the, some ofthe attractions we went to that
you are most interested in, theones that you want to go back to.
(18:14):
I loved Albi.
We plan to go back to the church,actually with you, I think we're
doing a day trip to go there.
I ended up with a stomach bugone day, so I didn't get to see
Pech Merle, or was it Cord...?-
It was Saint-Cirq-Lapopie.
And also, we ... On thatday we stopped in Rodez.
So I didn't get to do that, soI plan to do those things on-
(18:35):
Not Rodez, not Rodez, sorry.
I can't remember.
Mm. Brain fart.
Anyway, there's three thingswe visited that day, and I
can't remember the third one.
I really enjoyed Elyse'sdifferent tours that she did.
She's like a walking encyclopedia withso much information and so knowledgeable.
The bus trips were fun, even the singingeven ... even though I don't like to sing.
(18:59):
Yeah, some groups ... I always testthis, some groups love to sing.
This one this year, they were like,"Eh, not so into it," so, we'll see.
But I'll keep trying it becausesome groups really get into it, so
...No, that was kind of fun.
So yes, that day, that we go toPech Merle and Saint-Cirq-Lapopie,
we also go to Cahors.
We just go to the bridge because wedon't really have time for much else,
(19:21):
but ... So you missed that day, okay?
Yeah.
Because you were sick.
Sorry.
Yeah.
No, it's ... I wish I couldhave gone, but you know.
Yeah.
I really love Bruniquel.
Oh, Bruniquel, yes, yes.
The medieval town, the architecture,just... so quaint and beautiful.
(19:41):
I wish I could live there.
It's very hilly.
You'd get legs of steel, woman.
Yeah.
But no, it's justbreathtakingly beautiful.
You just stand there and look andthink, do places like this really exist?
They do, so
...Yes.
And that day we raninto a pretty big storm.
It was crazy.
(20:02):
Like, all of a sudden, it juststarted thundering and lightening.
Were you in the chateauwhen we lost the power?
Yes.
I didn't take my rain gear because itdidn't say it was going to rain, and then
all of a sudden you see all these blackclouds coming and then... didn't power go
out for a short time too in the chateau?
I was in the chateau.
A lot of us were in the chateau,and all of a sudden, boom, you know,
(20:23):
the lightning hit a substation.
So it took a good long timefor the power to come back, but
it did eventually come back.
But it made it very atmospheric.
We were in this medievalchateau, very medieval chateau
with no power, I'm like, "Ooh."
Carcassonne was another place that Ireally, really enjoyed, and to ... my
(20:46):
husband and I are going to go backalong with a cousin to Carcassonne.
How did you like the food in Toulouse?
I went out a few times with the group.
It was good.
I'm not a big foodie.
Uh-huh.
I did a lot of sandwiches, ham sandwiches.
A lot of pastries in themorning, the chocolat croissants,
pain au chocolat, I believe.
Pain au Chocolat, yes.
(21:06):
Or chocolatine, as wesay in the Southwest.
No, I wasn't as I guess I didn'texplore as much with the food.
Yeah, yeah, yeah.
You're not super food motivated.
No, the people were really nice aboutincluding me, because I was by myself.
So several times people had askedme to come to dinner, and sometimes
I was just kind of worn out andchose to go back to the room.
(21:28):
But that was really nice, being bymyself, that was one of the things
I was a little nervous about coming.
I remember sending a message, "Hey,will there be other people that
are going to be solo?" There were.
There were a lot of people that were soloand they were very kind to include me.
That meant a lot ofwonderful people on the trip.
Yeah, that's one of the nice thingsabout being in a group, is that you can
(21:51):
travel solo to places that you probablywouldn't by yourself, or maybe you
would, but in this case, you know, youmight feel a bit intimidated to come to
a place like this by yourself, but thenyou have a group, and you had us leading
the way and showing everybody around.
I guess it makes it easier....
Lot of learning curves along the way.
We've traveled, my husband andI have traveled quite a bit, but
(22:13):
he usually navigates, so I'vehad to do all the trains, buses,
airplanes, all of that by myself.
I almost ended up going thewrong direction on the train.
I figured it out at the last minutebecause when it the platform, on
the screen it told me to go to thespecific platform, and I got there
and got on the train and my seatassignment wasn't anywhere to be found.
So luckily, I figured out thatI was on the wrong train, but I
(22:36):
hadn't seen that where there'stwo trains on the same platform
going in two different directions.
Yeah, that's ... They mighthave different platform numbers?
But I would think so.
Yeah, the other train wasliterally on the other side.
My husband would have made the samemistake too, but I figured it out
and ended up on the right train, so
Yeah, lots of learning curves, butI am so glad I did it on my own.
Why do you want to comeback to the Bootcamp?
(22:57):
I mean, I'm glad, but why?
I had so much fun.
I really enjoyed it.
You pick out fabulous things to do,and I'm getting to meet the different
people from all over, was a lot of fun.
And a lot of people that love totravel, again, love France, and
getting to talk to them and hearing,you know, travel ideas or places
(23:18):
they've been, that kind of thing, so
...Yeah.
That's fantastic.
Well, thank you verymuch for talking to me.
I think I need to get some otherpeople on, but it's going to be a
delight to see you again this October.
You're coming back in...
Back in September, yes.
September, September, sorry.
Yes.
I have other bookingsin October, but yeah.
So September, and it will bewonderful to meet your husband and
(23:40):
your cousin and we'll have a goodtime, and then perhaps you'll come
back to the Bootcamp next year.
That's wonderful.
If the timing works out,I definitely plan to come.
Wonderful.
Thank you very much, Beth.
Au revoir.
Au revoir.
Bonjour, Mary Piltch.
Welcome to Join Us in France.
Thank you.
Thank you very much, Annie.
Wonderful to see you again.
(24:01):
You were at the Bootcamp and I wantto hear what your experience was like.
Tell us a little bit about yourself andwhat decided you to come to the Bootcamp?
Okay, great.
Well, I've been listening to Join Usin France since the pandemic actually.
And I've continued to listen to it.
I listened to all the old episodes, youknow, that you recorded before there.
It's so interesting andyour guests are great.
(24:23):
And you and Elyse dosuch a nice job together.
I live in Cape Cod in Massachusetts.
I'm retired.
I'm a grandmother, and I have threekids who live in the Boston area
too, so that's pretty much me.
Right, right.
And you, I remember you were a littlebit hesitant, you were like, "Oh, I'm
coming by myself. Is this going tobe a problem?" I don't think it ended
(24:44):
up being a problem at all, did it?
No, I don't know, I've traveled bymyself, you know, I've done it many times.
And I also, you know, do a group tourwhere I'm alone, so that's usually not
a problem, and I was able to meet acouple of other gals from Massachusetts.
And we met together.
I met one of them on Cape Cod andwe had coffee at a French cafe which
(25:04):
was on the cape, which was nice.
So I knew, you know, having that Zoomcall ahead of time was really good
because you could find out if otherpeople are around you and meet them
on Zoom, so that was very helpful.
Yes.
Yes.
Yes.
So what did you enjoy about the Bootcamp?
Did you do the language classes as well?
I did do the language class, yes.
Yeah.
Okay.
(25:24):
Well, we started everything off greatbecause the gals from Massachusetts
got together with you the day beforeand did a great trip to... I don't
remember the name of the area.
Yeah.
We did a day trip, I can't remember.
I remember some of it, itwas all the Tarn-et-Garonne.
There we go, yes, yes.
I can't get enough of cuteFrench town, so it was lovely.
We had a great lunch.
(25:45):
We found a nice place,that we all enjoyed.
So that was a great way to start it off.
And I was very impressed by Toulouse.
I did not expect it to be such a vibrant,thriving historical city, not knowing
that it was the fourth largest in France.
Is that correct?
Yes.
We're edging to third largest now, but
(26:05):
Wow, oh, okay.
And when I arrived, I was so impressedwith how many young people there were.
I didn't realize it was a university town.
So that was off to a good start.
It was a great group of people.
Again, like I said, havingthe Zoom was very helpful.
I did take the French language class.
I have to say, I did playhooky a couple of days.
(26:25):
Because there was just other thingsI wanted to do and see in Toulouse.
I was thinking, "Oh, you know, I'll doenough with the day trips that we do in
the afternoon." But there was really somuch more to see, so... and my French is
so poor anyway that, you know, five daysof French isn't going to help mine at all.
So I made the right decision.
Yes, yes, yes.
Well, it is true that there's a lot todo in Toulouse and the Bootcamp is... I
(26:48):
mean, we call it a Bootcamp because wetry to do a lot and you just get the half
a day on your own, during the Bootcamp,which for some people is not enough.
Yes.
Yeah, for sure.
So, one of the things I did on myown was to go to the Museum of the
Resistance, which was very good.
And subsequently, Elyse was kind enoughto give us a little talk about the
(27:11):
Resistance, which was very helpfulbecause I personally didn't know
that much about it, and I've watcheda couple of documentaries that she
suggested and read more about it.
So that, you know, to me thatwas very interesting, you know,
I'm interested in the history.
I also do a lot of long distance walkswith friends usually, but we've walked
part of the Camino de Santiago and partof the Via Francigena in Italy, and I
(27:34):
was very interested to find that partof the Camino goes through Toulouse.
Yeah.
So I went back to... What's the church,the cathedral there in Toulouse?
The cathedral is Saint-Etienne,and the basilica is Saint-Sernin.
Okay.
It was the basilica then.
It's the basilica, I think, yeah.
Yeah.
And, you know, learned more about that.
And I took, on one of myhooky days, I took Elyse's
(27:58):
audio guide and walked around.
And even though she had taken us beforeand, you know, we had seen a lot of
Toulouse, there were things that Ihadn't noticed before, had learned
so much more, and that was great.
You and Elyse just do such a fabulousjob of keeping everybody in line as
well as so many interesting things abouthistory and culture and people and food.
(28:20):
It's really a great combination.
I really enjoyed it.
Thank you.
Thank you.
Yes.
We have a good time as well becausewe get to meet new people and it's
always just, you know, it's fun.
It's fun.
Well, I'm glad it's funfor you too, as well.
Well, it's a big responsibility becauseI do feel like I'm in charge of a large
group and I'm always on the lookout forthings that might go possibly wrong.
(28:42):
But so far, we've been lucky.
We've had really... I shouldrelax a little bit is the reality.
No, I'm the same way.
You have to have like a plan Bready just in case, you know?
Yeah, yeah, yeah.
Did you have a favorite excursionor two, perhaps, that we did?
Well, as I said, you know, I can'tget enough of the little French towns.
And I'm sorry, I shouldhave looked this up before.
(29:03):
I don't remember the namesof some of the places.
But on Sunday, we wentto that other cathedral.
On Sunday, we went to Albi.
Albi, yes, that was it.
Yep.
So I loved Albi.
That is really a highlight, I think.
The only drawback was that itrained quite a bit on that day.
And we also went to theToulouse-Lautrec Museum.
Okay, okay.
It rained on that day?
(29:23):
I don't remember the rain.
Maybe it did.
Yeah, it was rainy.
Okay, it happens.
And the only other thing is becauseit's Sunday, a lot of things
aren't open, so it was very quietin Albi, probably a combination
of the rain and it being Sunday.
That's true.
And I guess one suggestion I would...Maybe you could do the caves on a
Sunday, and do Albi on a weekday,but that's just a suggestion.
(29:47):
That's a great suggestion.
We'll see if we can do that.
The thing is, Albi takes a full daybecause Elyse really gives a great tour of
the museum, the Toulouse-Lautrec Museum,and the cathedral, and the basilica.
And so, we need time, but yes,that's an excellent suggestion
that we will take into account.
And of course, Carcassonne isbeautiful, and I actually had
(30:07):
been there before, and it rainedwhen I was in Carcassonne before.
But it was beautiful when we went.
So I think I'll go backagain because it was raining.
It was really windy andraining when I went, and so
we didn't really do that much.
But again, Elyse did amazinghistory information about the
church that's there, which ofcourse I don't remember the name of.
Saint-Nazaire.
(30:27):
Yes, and I had seen it before andthought it was, you know, amazing, but
knowing all this information is justso, it really adds so much to the trip.
Yeah.
Yeah.
Do you have any tips for anybody who'sconsidering doing this things that you
want to tell them about to prepare?
Well, definitely do it.
I really enjoyed it.
You really have to flyto Toulouse, I think.
(30:47):
I had gone to Avignon from Charles deGaulle, and that's super easy to take by
the train, but Toulouse is not as easy.
So, I would say to take a flight.
And I don't know, just be readyfor d- uh, different experiences
that you may not be aware of.
And you meet some great people, and youguys really set it up for success, having
the WhatsApp and having Zoom calls before.
(31:08):
It's more than just going on atrip with people you don't know.
You kind of know them ahead oftime, and you all have the same
objectives and love of France.
So, it's a great trip to go on.
Yep, yep.
All right.
Thank you very much, Mary.
You're wonderful to talk to.
It was a delight havingyou on the bootcamp.
Thank you.
My pleasure.
Who knows?
You might come back toToulouse one of these days.
(31:28):
Yes, I might, but I may nottake the French language
course, but that's just me.
But I know a lot of people lovedit, you know, especially the ones
who were better French speakers.
Yeah, there's nothingwrong with the school.
It's just that, yeah, I think ifyou come with some French under your
belt, it makes it more challenging.
If it's just learning the verybasics, maybe in any language, a week
(31:51):
isn't going to make any miracles.
You know what I mean?
Correct.
Yeah.
It takes longer than that, so.
The people who were, you know, fairlyfluent in French, I think they really
got a lot out of it because theywere able to converse with other
people in French, which you don'talways have the opportunity here
in the United States, especially,you know, native French speakers.
So I think for that level,it's really a good course.
Where were you staying?
(32:12):
Was it a hotel or an Airbnb?
No, I stayed at a hotel.
I can't remember.
I should have researchedthis, like I said.
I stayed, oh, in that there's a circleand there's a fountain in the middle.
It's right down the streetfrom where we got the bus.
Okay, so probably the Place Wilson,the big... was it the Novotel?
Yes,
it was.
Yes, yeah, yeah, that's it.
(32:33):
Okay, Novotel in Place Wilson.
Okay.
Yeah, that's a good one.
You know what?
My room, it was not loud at all.
I must have faced inward instead ofoutward, because when I got there,
I thought, "Oh my gosh, it mightbe really noisy," but it wasn't.
The hotel wasn't too lively.
You know, it didn't have agreat restaurant, but of course,
everything's right around there.
And I was so close to thebig square and everything.
(32:53):
So it was really, it wasa convenient location.
I know, the other gals from theCape stayed at an Airbnb that
they found noisy, and the airconditioning wasn't working that well.
So you never know.
But I was very happy with where I stayed.
Did you like the food in the area?
Did you have a favorite?
I have to say, I'm not a big foodie,and I've had the cassoulet, and I'm
(33:14):
just not a big fan of cassoulet.
Yeah, yeah, yeah.
I can't say anythingthat really stuck out.
But the food is lovely.
Yeah.
Yeah, you didn't go hungry.
No, definitely not.
No, no.
How about the wine?
You came to the wine tasting with us.
That was a highlight too.
What a lovely couple, andyou know, what a lovely spot.
They did an amazing job.
Yeah, that was a lot of fun.
I love a wine tasting.
In fact, I went with two of the otherbootcamp participants, and we did a little
(33:37):
wine tasting on our own, with a guide.
And I think there were six peoplein total, and we went to that, the
one that has all the wines that youpour from the little spout in the
machine, and you put your card in.
Le Cinq, perhaps?
Do you know what I'm talking about?
Number five?
Yeah, Le Cinq.
That was cool to see that.
(33:58):
That was fun.
I know some other people wantedto go back, but I think it was
closed that day or something.
Yeah.
All right, we got to keep it short,but wonderful to see you again.
Wonderful to talk to you.
Thank you.
You too.
Thank you very much, Mary.
Okay, take care.
Enjoy the rest of your summer.
Thank you.
You too.
Au revoir.
Au revoir.
Bonjour, Jeanne Powanda.
Welcome to Join us in France.
(34:19):
Bonjour, Annie.
It's good to see you.
Good to see you, too.
So we want to talk about yourtime at the Bootcamp 2025.
Have you recovered?
I have recovered.
And my bank account'srecovered, thank goodness.
Yeah, yeah.
It takes a little bit for that too.
Did you do just the Bootcampor also the language classes?
(34:40):
I also did language class.
All right.
And what level of French were you at?
They put me in A1, I believe.
Okay.
So you're starting out.
I was... Well, I had some French inhigh school and a little bit in college.
I think I was put in a classthat was a little too easy.
Uh-huh.
(35:00):
And the teacher acknowledged that.
But, you know, it's only fivedays, a couple of hours, it
was still... It was okay.
Yeah.
Would I do it again?
No.
Mm-hmm.
You wouldn't do the language class again?
I would not.
A conversational French class wouldhave been, I think more helpful.
Oh, because... So this waskind of more like you spent
(35:22):
time doing grammar and things?
We were doing the alphabet,and then we did countries,
and then we did numbers and...
Ah, too simple.
Too simple.
Uh-huh.
Uh-huh.
Well, that's good to know.
That's good to know, because thereare people who might want to...
Because, I mean, the language classesare completely separate, you don't
have to do the language classes.
(35:43):
I think that people who are more advancedfind them very useful, but perhaps
for a beginner, it's not as good.
Yeah.
The good part was my class began at8:45 AM and so I had to get moving.
Yes, yes.
I couldn't lounge in bed.
I had to get up.
(36:04):
There's no lounging.
So, that was a good thing.
It is a Bootcamp.
So besides that, how wasthe Bootcamp experience?
Did you make some good friends?
Did you see some cool stuff?
I loved it.
It was an experience forme because I was alone.
My husband didn't want to go.
And so I learned a lot aboutmyself and what I can do.
And now I can do anything.
(36:26):
I'm brave.
It empowered you, I guess.
It empowered me.
There you go.
It empowered me.
That part of it was the best partfor just, personally, for me.
And meeting you and Elyse was a highlight.
I loved Toulouse and this was my fourthtrip to France, and I'm really happy
that I got to see that part of France.
(36:47):
You know, I've been to Paris, I'vebeen to the Normandy, Loire, Alsace,
I've been to Nice, you know, and soI hadn't been to the Southwest and so
now I've kind of covered everything.
A lot of places, yeah.
I mean, the Atlantic, perhaps.
The Atlantic Coast, thecentral parts of France.
You have a few thingsyou haven't seen, but...
A few things.
A few.
But it was good to kindof cover most areas.
(37:11):
Yes, yes.
Anything surprised you aboutToulouse or the places we went?
I was surprised by how flat Toulouse was.
Very, very, very, very walkable.
When I got there, I bought a metropass for ten rides and I only used five
(37:31):
because everything was so walkable.
Yeah.
I didn't really need the metro pass.
I actually gave it... It was a paper pass,so it's... I don't think they do that now.
They already eliminated paper passes.
And I gave it to a young woman, youknow, college students or whatever.
That's nice.
I was surprised, Toulouse... Ithink I was mostly surprised by
there's all the stores and the shopsand how high-end everything was.
(37:55):
Very high-end.
No cheap T-shirt shops.
The jewelry stores, there was a Hermeswatch that was over 10,000 euros.
Yeah.
That's high-end all right.
That surprised me.
But I did find my 2 euros storeto buy a few things that I need.
That's right, there's the 2euros, magasin de 2 euros.
Yeah.
Of the places we visited,did you have a favorite?
(38:18):
Yes.
My favorite was Bruniquel.
I just love the ruins.
The view was, you know, overthe river, was breathtaking.
I loved the
fact that was kind of funny,the old castle, the new castle.
When the new castle is still, you know,600 years old instead of 900 years old.
Yeah.
I just love walking through allof that, the town, walking through
(38:40):
that beautiful town and thesteep alleyways and the flowers.
That was the favorite of mine.
Everybody liked Carcassonne.
Carcassonne is very, verynice, but it's so touristy.
Bruniquel just felt like a place I couldjust stay for a day and relax and...
That's true.
That's true.
I did like that the best.
Every place was won- Foix was wonderful.
(39:00):
Everything was wonderful.
I loved it all.
Yeah, yeah.
I think Albi is also magnificent.
Albi, yes, yes.
Yeah.
Did you skip any days on accountof being unwell or something?
Yes.
I missed the caves.
Ah, Pech Merle.
Yeah.
I don't know.
I just had a... I just... I don'tknow, just woke up at... I don't
know if I had like a little bug.
(39:21):
There were a couple of people onthe bus that... You know, nobody was
really sick-sick but a little unwell.
You know, it is a Bootcamp.
I mean, every day like that it adds up.
I think next year we're probablygoing to do just seven days instead
of nine, because it is kind of taxing.
And we can probably fit in almost asmuch in, if we reorganize and rearrange
(39:43):
a little bit, is what I'm thinking.
But honestly, you're the second personI've talked to that missed Pech Merle day
because of not feeling well, you know?
It happens.
Yeah.
It may have been exhaustion.
I couldn't put finger onit, the... how I felt.
I just didn't want toreally get out of bed.
Yeah, yeah.
So tell me, if you were going to giveadvice to people considering going
(40:07):
to the Bootcamp next, one of theseyears, what would you tell them?
How would you help them prepare?
I think I was fairly prepared.
Google Maps, I did a lot of researchand... Like, when I was going to
my residence, I had an apartment.
I already knew what to look for.
You know, when I got out of themetro, I knew which way to turn,
left or right, or where to go.
Where did you stay?
I stayed at Tour Croix Barione.
(40:29):
Okay.
And it was such a great location.
I was two blocks from the8- 8 3A and Carme metro.
Yeah.
And a block from Langones.
It's a quiet, safe area.
I was a block from Rue deMetz and a block from Alsace
Lorraine, so I could get anywhere.
(40:49):
Yeah, it's a great location.
That's definitely a great location.
I had a two-story apartmentthat I could have lived in.
I just loved it.
And you found this... Was it one thatwas recommended on my website or?
It was not.
It was not.
I found it on booking.com, and then theowners actually reached out to me...
Oh.
(41:09):
... and said, "Hey, why don't you justbook directly through us?" And I
said, "Oh, okay, I can do that."
How did they know thatyou were interested?
I guess through booking.com,because I had some questions.
And I guess just went to themand then they reached out to
me, and that was perfectly fine.
They were wonderful hosts.
And there was a lot of steps.
It was 36 steps to my place, butI have a big old house and it's
(41:33):
already 18 just to get upstairs.
So...
So you're used to it, yeah.
Steps don't bother me.
Yeah.
But I loved the apartment.
It was quiet.
I just... I loved it.
All right, maybe you should send me theaddress and the contact for this person
and I can recommend it for somebodywho wants to stay there next time.
I can do that.
I can do that.
(41:53):
Wonderful.
Anything else you want to discuss, youknow, about the Bootcamp that you...
I was... I had a lot of time on myown, because I got there on Tuesday and
then stayed afterwards until Thursday.
There was a lot of things that we didn'tdo as the group that I got to see.
And things that I would recommendto people that have time would
definitely be a canal ride.
(42:14):
Yeah.
It's not exciting, but it's justso pretty at that time of year.
I went to The Resistance Museum.
Oh yeah, that's a good one.
I went to the Hotel d'Assézat.
Yes, exactly.
That's a beautiful one.
I assume you went intothe Bemberg Foundation?
Yes, that one... That's what I mean, yeah.
(42:36):
For me, the highlight was the Escherexhibit, down at, what was that called?
The old pal...
Le Bazacle.
I was an Escher fan since I was ateenager, so that was a highlight for me.
Uh-huh, uh-huh.
I saw that one too.
I liked it.
It was very good.
I loved it.
I loved it.
I had a massage.
Oh, wow.
(42:56):
And then I went to St. Raymond,Musee Saint-Raymond, which I loved.
It was... I loved that.
It's a very good one.
There's just so much, you know,and you see so much as it is with
the group and then all these...
There's more.
Oh yeah.
We definitely don't doeverything you can do.
You know, there's a lot morethat you could do in Toulouse.
There is.
There is.
And the library was beautiful.
(43:17):
And I got to meet people from, you know,Australia, and New Zealand, and Hawaii.
Have you stayed in touch with any of them?
Actually, not really.
Not really.
Well, so many of them were going offto other European locales, you know?
I was taken back to the States,but many of them were headed
off to various ports of call.
(43:38):
Yeah, different places, yeah.
Right.
Did you like the fact that weused WhatsApp to communicate?
Was that handy dandy oryou would rather not?
It was perfect.
And we could privately connectwith each other, if we had to.
I took a wine tour and met JessicaHammer, who I believe you guys know.
(43:59):
Yeah.
And so I'm from Pittsburgh.
She is a big Sidney Crosby fan,who's a Pittsburgh Penguin.
And I had some Pittsburgh Penguin hatswith me that I brought over and I gave
her some hats and she was so happy.
That's great.
That's great.
All right, Jean, thank you so much for...we need to keep it short because we have
(44:21):
other people who are going to be on thisepisode, but thank you so much, Jean.
It was wonderful having you onthe Bootcamp and it's lovely to
see you again, and I hope youcome back to France at some point.
Thank you very much.
Thanks to Elyse and I'lljust keep on listening.
Awesome.
Merci, au revoir.
Thank you.
(44:46):
Again, I want to thank my patrons forgiving back and supporting the show.
Patrons get several exclusiverewards for doing that, you can
see them at patreon.com/joinus.
A special shout-out this week to my newJoin Us in France champions, Theresa
Watkins and Carol F., with whom I'veexchanged many lovely messages already.
(45:08):
I love talking to my patrons.
Would you join them too?
You can do it for as little asthree dollars a month, but if you
can afford it, I would love tohave you pledge more so you can
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Go to patreon.com/joinus.
And to support Elyse, goto patreon.com/elysart.
(45:35):
And thank you, David Griffin, foryour one-time donation using any
green button on joinusinfrance.comthat says, "Tip your guide."
Somebody left this review of my Ilede la Cite VoiceMap tour this week.
This person wrote, "Very informative tour,lots of interesting insights, easy to
follow." Well, that's what I like to hear.
(45:56):
That was short and sweet, but, you know,those short and sweet reviews also help.
Podcast listeners get a bigdiscount for buying these
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It's best for me as well, because I getto keep more of what you pay instead
of giving it to Apple or Google.
So, go to joinusinfrance.com/boutiqueto get your own codes.
(46:18):
If you're planning a trip to France,your vacation is precious, and you
do not want to waste time chasingbad tips or outdated information.
That's where my ItineraryConsults come in.
You can run your ideas by me.
I'll help steer you in the right directionso you spend less time researching,
worrying, and more time just enjoyingthe thought of your trip to France.
(46:43):
Again, to book this service, yougo to joinusinfrance.com/boutique.
I want to update you on thepolitical situation in France.
Today was the Bloquons Tout day.
They've been talkingabout this for a month.
And yes, they did block a few places andthey're all over Instagram, but I swear
(47:04):
to God, they blocked maybe a fraction ofa percent of important infrastructure.
So it was a bit of a dud, and I suppose itmight, ... I don't know, you never know.
Are they going to keep this up or not?
When it's a real strike, like if it'san official strike from the train
people or teachers or whatever, theydon't get paid while they're on strike.
(47:27):
And so they tend to be a littlebit careful with how much time
off they take for striking.
The people who participate in theseblockages and things like that,
they have less to lose usually,and so it might go on for a while.
With the Gilets Jaunes, the YellowJackets, several years back, it had
all started with a sudden, well,to them, increase in the price
(47:53):
of taxes that we pay on gasoline.
And they really upset a lot of people.
I don't like taxes any more thananybody else, but I think we should
be using less gasoline, becauseit is destroying our planet.
So to me, the only way to reallyincentivize people to use less gasoline
is to make it more expensive, and so Idid get behind that particular movement.
(48:16):
But on this one today, not that I'mever going to go block anything, but
I do understand that people are upsetbecause the French government has a
lot of debt, they've been spending likedrunken sailors since the pandemic.
Emmanuel Macron is not the only presidentwho took the country in that direction,
but he's definitely made it worse.
(48:37):
He hasn't had a majority inthe Parliament, and ours is
a parliamentarian system.
So if the president doesn't have theParliament, well, his prime minister
can't get anything passed, and thelatest prime minister has fallen,
he didn't get the votes he needed topass his budget, so we have a new guy.
(48:59):
I can't even remember his name.
He was the minister of Defense,and he's well liked and whatever,
but he is a right winger.
And so my fear is that he's goingto do like the previous ones.
He's going to say, "Well, we can savemoney by not reimbursing this, in the...
you know, national healthcare thing.We can cut off this program, give less
(49:19):
money to the handicapped," or whatever.
I'm not sure what all they'replanning, but I think they're
looking for money in the wrong place.
French people are very, veryprice sensitive, and they
are going to put up a fight.
And the money really lies with a fewthousand very rich people in France,
just like everywhere else these days, andI think they need to go find the money
(49:43):
where it is and not where it is not.
But that's just me.
I've never voted left wing inFrance, but I might have to do that,
because they're just annoying me.
Why do they keep hitting the peoplewho can least afford it, you know?
They need to find a way to taxthe super wealthy, and we do have
a lot of super wealthy in France.
I'm not saying tax the dentistwho spends 12 hours with his
(50:07):
hands in people's mouths.
I mean, he's earned it, right?
But just the people who investand the private equity crap
and all that, ugh... yeah.
Anyway, I'm not a political scientistand this is not a political podcast but
I think there are reasons for peopleto get excited over these things.
But we have a new prime ministeralready, hopefully, this person will
(50:30):
be able to pass a budget that won'tannoy people so much, might get a little
bit reasonable and then we'll see.
We'll see where we go from there.
But it wasn't as bad as I had feared.
Let's talk about the Montmartreand the growing tensions
between residents and tourism.
I've mentioned this inprevious episodes as well.
But this time it's about the buses,because every day, dozens of large
(50:53):
tour buses roll into Montmartre.
They often park illegally, doubleparking, blocking crosswalks or stopping
in areas where they're not supposed to.
For the people who live there,it's become a real problem.
One resident, Julie Menard, who haslived in the neighborhood for 10
years, has launched a petition backin 2023 and she calls it an invasion.
(51:15):
She's not just talking aboutinconvenience, but about what she
sees as both visual pollution andair pollution, and she has a point.
Paris welcomed more than 36million visitors in 2024, bouncing
back to pre-pandemic levels,and that's a lot of people.
Its hotspots like Montmartre, theEiffel Tower, the Champs-Élysées
(51:36):
feel the pressure most.
The deputy mayor in charge oftourism, Frédéric Ocard, says the
city needs to regulate tourism inorder to limit the negative effects.
In his words, "We need to stabilizethe number of tourists." The buses
are at the heart of the issue here.
Between 500 and 600 tour buses,coaches, enter Paris every day, and
(52:02):
95% of them still run on diesel.
That's a lot of exhaust and, you know,in an already congested neighborhood,
the city is considering cuttingback access to tour buses in central
Paris for a long term solution.
And then they could make people justpark outside, take the RER, you know?
(52:23):
But not everyone agrees, of course.
Tour guides argue that buses are themost practical option for groups.
And it's true that big buses, you know, ifyou work it out, it's less gas consumption
per head than an individual car.
Public transportation isdifficult with a large number
(52:43):
of people, so I understand this.
And the bus industry, they point out thatcoaches are essential for international
tourism and that the big problemis the lack of designated parking.
Well, where are you goingto put it in Montmartre?
Like, I don't know.
The drivers feel stuck.
Some say they have no choice but parkillegally and drop people off, even
if it means risking 135 Euro fine.
(53:06):
But the city says they won't turna blind eye to those practices and
are preparing stricter measures.
This is not a brand new debate.
When Paris introduced its lowtraffic zone in the city center in
2024, tour buses were almost banned.
Banned outright from certain districts,and they were given a reprieve but
(53:27):
the question is still on the table.
How do you strike a balance betweenwelcoming millions of visitors
and preserving the quality oflife for the people who actually
live in these neighborhoods?
The conversation is ongoing andMontmartre, with its steep streets
and postcard views has become thefrontline in this clash between
mass tourism and local life.
(53:49):
Now, I use tour buses for theBootcamp, sometimes you have to.
But we stay well away from Paris with theBootcamp, and as a matter of fact, guiding
in Paris would be actually much easierfor me than guiding in Toulouse, because
I don't guide in Toulouse that much.
Elyse takes all these jobs.
(54:10):
I mean, I do a little bit,but really, not very much.
I take people outside ofToulouse on day trips.
But really, nobody needs meto bring more buses to Paris.
If I ever did a Bootcamp inParis, it would have, we would
use public transportation.
And as far as I see it, the solution toover-tourism is to spread people around.
(54:31):
There are so many greatplaces to enjoy in France.
I encourage you to get out andenjoy it all, not just Paris,
Normandy and Provence, right?
Many more places that we explorehere on this podcast every week.
That's it.
The rant is over.
(54:51):
My thanks to podcast editors Anneand Christian Cotovan, who produced
the transcripts and the audio.
Next week on the podcast, anepisode with Elyse Rivin of Toulouse
Guided Walks about the town ofSaint-Lizier in the Ariège Department.
... Saint what, you say?
Saint-Lizier.
And that's exactly my point.
(55:12):
This is one of these hidden gems thatyou need to hear about so perhaps
you'll consider not spending all yourtime in France in Montmartre, but
rather go down to the foothills ofthe Pyrenees, where it is beautiful.
Thank you so much for listening,and I hope you join me next time so
we can look around France together.
(55:32):
Au revoir.
The Join Us in France travelpodcast is written, hosted, and
produced by Annie Sargent, andCopyright 2025 by AddictedToFrance.
It is released under a CreativeCommons attribution, non-commercial,
no derivatives license.
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